game-update

[meager flame]

No idea why they don’t just have you use the item on the npc to pay no parchment required and no influx of gold

[true talon]

ok so above 30 it will be 500k

[meager flame]

Way more simple too

[ashen yarrow]

avernic will always be 600k after change since cannot parchment it

[sacred oracle]

It seems to create three tiers of items, and it's not entirely clear what happens to the second tier items (ones that break below level 20) if you go higher than 20

Some untradeable items that currently break will continue to break whether below or above level 20 Wilderness, but will no longer be lost. You'll instead receive their 'broken' version and can repair them at Perdu for a small fee. The items in this category are:

Does that mean high-tier and lower-tier items all get mangled above 20?

[gaunt minnow]

well parch is already in the game now, so they have to give it some use. Also if there was no cost then people would be ragging in full untradables and the wildy would be 1000x worse than it is now

[brisk hill]

Ye

[sacred oracle]

I strongly dislike the complexity of what happens to items in wildy, but again, it is an improvement

[brisk hill]

They aren’t lost

[minor whale]

I think low-tier remains just broken, high tier becomes mangled

[ashen yarrow]

if it doesnt need trouver parchment it works same way above and below 20 wilderness

[true talon]

high tier will be mangled and cost 500k when above 30 similar to how losing a parchment item is now

[sacred oracle]

I think people will be happy they don't lose graceful any more

[meager flame]

Yeah but they even admitted they would rather remove parchment but then invented other reasons to not remove it

[true talon]

dunno if 500k + its current break fee though

[brisk hill]

Yes you just don’t have to pay for the parch again afterwards

[minor whale]

Whenever it comes into the game I'm waiting a fat minute before trying any of them just in case Jagex oopsied

[meager flame]

Also if it really must stay

[ashen yarrow]

just 500k i think, since it breaks different way

[sacred oracle]

I would be hesitant to trust the items-lost-on-death screen on update day for sure

[brisk hill]

I’m going out day 1 with my infernal & avernic, gl me

[meager flame]

He could just sell you the parchment

[true talon]

thats a discount to current cost then lol

[brisk hill]

Yes

[sacred oracle]

Yeah, atm it's the fee plus a new parch

[brisk hill]

You don’t have to buy the parch again

[sacred oracle]

A barrier to irons, a nuisance to mains

[true talon]

Basically an ironman update

because only irons have to grind parchments

[brisk hill]

Helpful for mains

Time & go to buy a parch talk to perdu et

[gaunt minnow]

no because it's annoying for mains to have to buy parches too

[brisk hill]

Just clunky

[ashen yarrow]

yeah i will love to actually have a decent mage weapon with me in wilderness as ironman

[gaunt minnow]

irons can just buy them with lms points

[sacred oracle]

I wonder how this will affect the current meta of trading vorkath heads for cash

[true talon]

Will protect skill specs from having to buy new infernal capes

[sacred oracle]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/hi83x8/cash_for_spare_vorkath_heads/

It's actually worth a lot more now than when this was posted

[brisk hill]

Woah BUY??

[ashen yarrow]

options currently are any elemental staff or nothing for mage weapon in wildy. after trouver change can bring ice sceptres to wildy

[gaunt minnow]

id ratehr just keep them for wildy pvm,. 70k is almost nothing

[sacred oracle]

It's 250k now

[gaunt minnow]

hmm that changes everything

[sacred oracle]

It's quite lucrative atm

I did it before the change, and I had 320+ assemblers or so to do it with

[brisk hill]

Such a pain in the rear parching that thing when I die

[sacred oracle]

Okay, I've procrastinated long enough: time to hop offline and be productive

have fun fellas

[brisk hill]

Cu gamer

[oblique stratus]

Does Rubium Splinters or Rubium Geodes give a chance at getting the mining pet?

[nocturne hull]

we would love to know

[ashen yarrow]

Update seems to have broken flat armour on boats. Any mob can hit through rune/dragon keel now

[nocturne hull]

scary if true

[ashen yarrow]

great whites hit 15 to any keel, eagle rays with max hit of 3 hit 3 on rune keel that has +8 flat amour

[south void]

Woohoo! Bugs! 🐛

[glass fog]

im trying to do new quest but after repairing dredge spence is not there to talk to. i go back up and he just wants me to go back down and he is still not there. world hopping doesnt seem to fix it. is there anything else i can do to fix it?

[meager flame]

tbh after doing the quest im confused that this was delayed

[nocturne solstice]

since it was the ship v ship that was removed Id assume that caused the delay

[meager flame]

ya its just that its like

half a quest lol

[hard axle]

If they're going down this route of a 1-time use, it really should just be "mangled" be default.

Trouver could still be used to reduce the fee down to 0 or as a consumable you can keep in the bank to repair the item, which gives it value if you don't want to go to Perdu each time.

[ember token]

all the assets for the quest have been in the game for months as well btw

some have been in the game since sailing launched, some have been in the game since the beta

i think the quest was probably just waiting on artwork and possibly some engine work too (they said there's a new engine command used in the quest)

but was otherwise complete for a long time

like there's been the red rock port tasks in the cache since launch as well

[meager flame]

Tbh I think the jarring part of the quest is that you kind of

Don’t do anything

Usually quests have a point and also additional stuff that would lead to further quests this one is you getting to the halfway point of a normal quest and then it’s like

Congrats here’s some exp

[ember token]

i havent played it yet but based on what ive heard, i already know everything that happens from all the stuff thats been in the cache lol

[meager flame]

Would be like doing cooks assistant except when you found an egg the quest autocompleted and you could make the cake in cooks assistant 2 later this year

Lmao it’s a littleee awkward

[loud ivy]

Waiting on some concept art to come in so that folks can visualise bits more clearly, but we have a proposal more-or-less ready and hope to put it in front of you guys in June. West's already left a comment on TOA's abnormally long development cycle, suspect TFA back and forth should feel more rapid-fire, stuff for TFA is still looking very much on-track and it's shaping up wonderfully!

just saw goblin post this on reddit an hour ago

pleasantly surprised

turmoil 🙏

[tacit wharf]

seems like we'll have a lot of blogs in june

[winged mantle]

Finally

Some non sailing non temp game mode blogs

Pleae

[chrome lantern]

Based on Jagex feedback, Venators were never really initially at least intended to be a primary source to farm ||undisclosed item||, they were more just bringing up a lore inconsistency with the fact that ||undisclosed ammunition variety|| are canonically talons from ||draconic|| creatures

They were not specifically saying, “hey kill these to get a ton of ||ammo ingredients||” explicitly

They later said that they would consider how many it would actually give and how often

[tacit pendant]

Thats fair but atp i dont want to summon him saying "dragon arrows"

[chrome lantern]

I can delete it if you want ;)

[quartz anchor]

did someone say dragon arrows?

[obsidian venture]

oh no

[winged mantle]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-nose-sniff-gif-26423046

[chrome lantern]

Ok I edited it to avoid words ;)

[meager flame]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-gif-24737144

[winged mantle]

Smeel the transgression arrows

[narrow folio]

lore inconsistency shouldnt gatekeep those guys from dropping dragon arrows

[ember token]

dont think it is going to stop it

think it was suggested by one of the jmods that they could be renamed to talon arrows or something

[winged mantle]

gl if someone is colourblind with the unpolled steel cannonball recolour

[ember token]

yeah i thought how close it was to granite cballs was a bit questionable

[winged mantle]

it's so bright

such a weird way to go about asking if a colour should be changed

[austere mulch]

did my daily doom run and saw that

was hella confused

[chrome lantern]

I don't know what 2 types of cballs are here

[austere mulch]

this is just so weird to me lmao. It basically reads as "we know we made them inconsistent in bad - should we make them consistent and good?"

like, why is that even a question

yes. they should obviously match their appearance elsewhere in game

[winged mantle]

steel and granite

[hard axle]

They should just put the divine potion sparkles on granite balls

[meager flame]

i mean tbh

realistically how do you even fuck that up lol

#1 are the colors not available for basically every steel/iron item in the game making it easy to choose the correct one?

and #2 do they not have eyes to realize it wasn't right to begin with

i can see how maybe they just got a slightly too bright color from maybe looking at a certain item like maybe a steel platebody but the sanity check of your own eyes should still have you covered after that

[austere mulch]

I just want to know if there was any level of thought along the lines of “idk man… this color is different from every other item in the game made from the same metal. Maybe we should make it match every other item in the game made from the same metal instead”

And if not, then why lmao

And even if there was, still why. What brought them to this conclusion

[earnest light]

Why were dragon cannonballs excluded from chainshot and incendiary

[warm epoch]

gotta have a reward for the next quest

[meager flame]

ngl the reward spaceification of every problem in the game is pretty rough atm

stuff like the bosuns bench being released as a quest reward and something to build rather than the obvious way repairing your ship should work by default is a good example

[ember token]

it's also just super tacked on to the quest

[meager flame]

ya the quest just abruptly ends and they put it in my inventory randomly lol

[earnest light]

I'd prefer to have to do some sort of necessary repairs against the pirates to justify that reward

[meager flame]

it gives me minor wow vibes where i used to laugh and tell people the fix to whatever problem they kept complaining about would be sold to them in the next expansion instead of hotfixed

[earnest light]

We got chainshot and incendiary shot, i think the pirates should have used that against us and forced repairs

[meager flame]

tbh i wish i could talk to them about boat healing in general

i kind of think it just sucks the way they did it and it could be a lot better if you just

instead of assigning crew or anything

could manually click the hammer icon to heal yourself

idk if trying to automate everything with crewmates is really something they should've been doing

and i dont really think they needed to waste one of our facility slots either

[earnest light]

I got the bosuns bench but didn't install it because i'd have to take a keg or important station out for something i could do myself. I'll take the bonus xp, invisible boost, and extra fish on my trawler, and the bonus xp and invisible boost and higher % of ocean encounters on my salvager.
The one ship i might consider it on is the combat ship but with talk of a possible higher tier of ship being introduced i'm hesitant to dump millions into core boat facilities to have it become obsolete

[meager flame]

theres also the angle that its probably long term

pretty unwise to tie basic functionality to facility slots

all thats really doing is lowering the ceiling for how many future facilities we can actually have

since you'll be losing several of those slots for core functionality already

each time they do that what they can do in the future is definitely being reduced

[ember token]

nah i'm sure they'll do upgraded combined facilities at some point as a reward

[meager flame]

they actually already messed it up by adding that one

for a combat/trawling ship you used 100% of your facilities already

so now i guess you're gonna be stuck losing a keg and having to change the other one back and forth based on activity

[sacred oracle]

i didn't build it because i have nothing else to fight on the sea

already finished all sailing combat clog

i think there should be more than enough slots left on a combat boat though

the problem comes when people try to make one boat do everything instead of simply building boats specific to each purpose

[meager flame]

building multiple boats is a problem on its own

[earnest light]

Well even there, 2 facility spots are purely for nets or hooks, and 2 are purely for cannons or ballistic attractor

[meager flame]

even with the buffs i would certainly never make two sloops

it would be drastically more efficient to forever just bottle everything and recustomize my ship every single time lol

which is insane

but its not even close to being smart to make a second ship unless you can use the ge

[sacred oracle]

well, yeah

i don't really consider irons for these things

[autumn marten]

Sorry to interrupt lads,

Has anyone tried to redeem a bond and not been able to? I’m getting a message saying “you are not eligible for this package”

I tried making it tradeable and still same thing

[meager flame]

and even for a main

its probably not very smart for most of them

like if you have absolute max though and can just dump another 100m or whatever its fine

[sacred oracle]

boats aren't that expensive to make unless you put the very expensive things on them

so making multiple boats is pretty straightforward and sensible

[earnest light]

Try #1391372405066301550

[autumn marten]

Thank you

[sacred oracle]

unless you need your trawler boat or your teleport boats to, for some reason, have a dragon keel, it's not expensive to make several

[meager flame]

why would you make multiple inferior boats instead of just bottling to use the good stuff

[sacred oracle]

easier and more convenient

why swap when you can build once

[earnest light]

Salvager doesnt see much combat

[meager flame]

yeah but then you're wasting time while you actually do content

instead of using a few seconds to bottle facilities

[sacred oracle]

not really following you

[meager flame]

so its not even more convenient you're just choosing to lose time somewhere else

[sacred oracle]

i just have several boats and swap between them per activity

seems a lot easier than continuously modifying a single boat by using facility bottles

[earnest light]

Eventually all that swapping will cost you more than what it's worth to have another boat entirely

[sacred oracle]

not really inclined to swap everything on my combat boat every time i want to trawl, and vice versa

[meager flame]

in 20 years maybe lol

[sacred oracle]

let alone when i want to barracuda trials

think you're thinking like an iron on this one

[earnest light]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[meager flame]

nah its just how it works the boat does less damage, takes more damage and/or moves slower

and so on

thats the cost of not using the better stuff

[earnest light]

Think about uims then

Their cargo is finally uncapped

I'm sure they love having all that fish stored across possibly multiple boats and cargos

Someone somewhere is gonna find a reason of their own to do what they do and if what they do is build a new boat are you going to stop them?

I aint sacrificing bank space for facilities that can be kept on the boat

[meager flame]

nah im just saying time wise its probably not in most people's best interest to actually make a second boat

they can of course do whatever they want

[earnest light]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[earnest light]

Bosuns workbench can't even be found unless you're in the "all" menu for the facility

[tender harness]

I see red reef is really well liked

[nocturne hull]

I had no personal problems with it, it was shorter than I’d have liked but that is all.

[tender harness]

First real update in months and its shorter than a seasonal event

[hasty shard]

have you seen the last like 2 years of seasonal events

[ember token]

its not shorter than a seasonal event at least because it would be really hard to do that lol

2 minute run around varrock is already quick as it is

[tacit void]

i did not like the boat to boat combat

[nocturne hull]

Did you use cannons or just attack the pirates with your own weaponry?

[tacit void]

own weapons, dont have a combat ship. i tried to use a spec but i was perma out of range even though i was next to the other boat etc

[nocturne hull]

I think that most players given the history of the game went about it all the same. I’m wondering how much better of an experience it would be to have utilized cannons during that encounter

[tacit void]

Maybe it wouldve felt better. i started working towards a combat boat now, so maybe i will enjoy boat combat some day with cannons

[ashen yarrow]

for me the boat to boat combat was over too quickly with cannon, but the quest isnt meant for late game gear. rune cannonballs with almost max ranged easily 2 shot the pirate ships

[nocturne hull]

The proof is in the pudding here.

Sounds like using cannons was absolutely the play assuming there’s not any exaggeration happening in that explanation.

[brisk hill]

Will do the homework for whichever jmod releases trouver update for the next 4 years on god

[tacit void]

dont think a steel cannon with bronze balls would be that quick

[nocturne hull]

Tough obstacle to try to make that intuitive when we only have know one way to attack npcs. With our weapons.

[nocturne hull]

Well the sailing level required for the quest means you could have built better cannons for it technically

[tacit void]

ye but that was what i got

[ashen yarrow]

the boats had something like 120-140 hp, rune cannonballs can max hit 102 in my gear

[tacit void]

so i decided to use eclipse moon gear instead, but that was awful with distance

[tacit void]

will cannonballs be affected by ranged gear?

[ashen yarrow]

elite void, ranged str gear (not weapon or ammo) and rigour all affect cannon

[tacit void]

oh damn, thats good to know! thanks

[ashen yarrow]

also ranged lvl, so potions

[tacit void]

gonna note that down for when i start boat combat

[placid shuttle]

lmao, just did the new quest. wtf was that? Also I hope they rework the bench into not being a facility (also getting a clog form completing a quest feels off). I don't understand why they are trying to push everyone to have multiple boats for different actives, its just tedious. It's like saying I need a separate poh for my item and pet storage and another for my teleports

[vivid ruin]

Didnt you know? Tedious is just another name for runescape

[true talon]

Ikr lol a single max boat is crazy amount of investment, both money an time.

It took me 16k frost dragons to make a single max boat

[tender harness]

Blame the users for voting yes to a stupidly ambiguous question the lead to the facility being shoe horned in instead of a proper fix

[obsidian venture]

Waiters always win

[warm epoch]

lots of people trying to defend their yes vote with "if we voted no, we wouldnt have anything"

[tender harness]

I voted no

Voted no to their proposed sailing cape buff too

[tender harness]

And tbh
Jagex has the track record of late
If we vote no they just dont do anything

So jagex skirts the polls by asking stupidly ambiguous questions making it impossible for most people to decipher what the fuck. And then we have shit like bosuns

[old shadow]

Wtf

Why on earth would you vote no on teleport to boat

[chrome lantern]

Polling is so bad

Like not the concept

The execution

[tender harness]

They'll just bake it into sailors amulet instead

Make the cape and 99 even more fucking useless

[tender harness]

As of late? Yes

[chrome lantern]

Has been for a while

[tender harness]

Red reef coming out in the state it has is diabolical

Nevermind getting a clog from a quest reward

😭

[chrome lantern]

Questions structured and blocked such that even just the population not reading blogs carries the entire poll result

[tender harness]

Intentional probably

So jagex can shoe horn in bad shit

I want to give them benefit of the doubt but some of the poll questions and structures are just bad

Genuinely

[tacit void]

getting the clog from quest reward was wrong. let us talk to paxton or something to get it instead

[tender harness]

I love being charged more for less

😭

[bronze kernel]

I don't have anything against multiple boats. I think that's fine. Especially given how limited the space is. The bigger issue is how expensive it is just to fully upgrade one. And not to mention how rare materials are.

[vivid ruin]

Yeah i dont see a problem with multiple boats

[bronze kernel]

It's mostly sloops TBH you're using multiple of

[placid shuttle]

yeah fair point. I like the idea of multiple boats, its the execution thats annoying. even the whole boat management plays into the tedium of it

starting a sailing sesison/getting to my boat, etc

[bronze kernel]

Although with facility bottles

You could just stick with one and swap out stuff as needed

Which honestly are just the hooks and nets

[tender harness]

The quest in general was just rushed out but hey first update since cow

[placid shuttle]

Was thinking about this yesterday, what did we have prior to sailing release?

[bronze kernel]

150K to swap your hooks for nets. And that's assuming you want to do trawling

[placid shuttle]

Was it valamore pt3 or was there something inbetween that and sailing?

[tender harness]

A lot more than a rushed quest and a meme boss

[bronze kernel]

I feel like there was going to be more with the pirate encounters

But that got put on hold so we got only the husk

[tender harness]

By June of last year we had yama and yama tweaks

Half way through the year we have nothing

Just a meme and a rushed quest

[bronze kernel]

Ship combat right now is the bane of sailing

[tender harness]

Oh and a price hike

[vivid ruin]

Ermmm but leagues

[tender harness]

Leagues isnt content

[placid shuttle]

tbf, 2026 will be saved if they deliver with blood moon rises and raids

[bronze kernel]

Price hike I wouldn't really count as an update.

[placid shuttle]

a lot of presusre tho, and with how things have been going recently i wont hold my breath

[tender harness]

There is no shot in hell raid 4 is this year
BMR was delayed to summer and already has had shit reworked or scrapped

[bronze kernel]

Blame Sailing

[placid shuttle]

Hate to say it, but platinum era did end with sailing

[tender harness]

Bmr delayed literally for leagues

[placid shuttle]

they're going through growing pains atm, it will get better

they just gotta make sure the game doesn't die via death by a thousand cuts. Small negatvity here and there just compounds over time

[vivid ruin]

Theres too many loyalists for that

[tender harness]

Reddit

[vivid ruin]

Same reason rs3 hasnt disappeared

[placid shuttle]

People have swallowed the price increase by now, but it just leaves a bad taste in peoples mouths

[placid shuttle]

Yeah agree, but no one wants osrs to go the way rs3 went

[tacit void]

i think a lot of people stopped sub on their 2nd account (like me) so they mightve lost money with the price increase tbh

[vivid ruin]

I stopped subbing a second acc with the $10 - $14 increase

This last one wasnt anything compared to that lol

[placid shuttle]

I cancelled my 2nd sub too, but more thna likely our cancelled subs were a drop in the ocean compared to ALL the increased subs

[tacit void]

that is also true

[placid shuttle]

They brought on themselves tbf. if you raise prices, people will hold you to a higher standard. The issue is, we haven't even seen consistent standard let alone a higher one

The standard quite literally dropped lol

inb4 raids 4 will be delayed to 2027

(or not and we'll see a similar release pattern to sailing)

[brisk hill]

Shout out to the pvp enjoyers who will still pay membership despite 0 updates in years lol

[vivid ruin]

Battle royalscape wen

[winged mantle]

"you pay, we say" angle

[south void]

First time it was from 6 to 3 yearly subs, then this last price increase I went from 3 to only 1 yearly sub.

Realized it didn't even feel worth the rollover costs fun factor to play on my alts concurrently anymore.

Other than that, if there's no content now I want to engage with I'll just buy mems once I see 6 months later all the bugs are fixed for BMR and Raids 4.

[hard axle]

They also killed a lot of reason to passively keep membership running since no legacy packages left

[south void]

Indeed. My main was on the 5 dollar footlong subway premium for a long time, and when they did the snake oil of removing the grandfathered rate when you went to yearly from monthly, I didn't realize what happened until it was too late.

So then I just put all my accounts on the $89/year plans thinking whatever on it, they usually overlapped within 2 months of each other.

Now it's bond when playing, forget osrs exists when not.

[brisk hill]

Offering 40 hours unpaid labor to the jmod who release trouver parch update

Please

[obsidian venture]

Fr fr

[obsidian venture]

Surely surprise update tmrw

[uneven knot]

@vague viper I’m still seeing flickering when on mobile when using fairy rings even after updating the client on iOS.

[vague viper]

Hey, we have put a fix out for this but it's in client number 238.4, which doesn't seem to have made it to iOS yet 🙁 we are looking into why!

[nocturne hull]

can confirm

[uneven knot]

Okay awesome thanks for the response, I guess it seems to take long for the App Store to accept updates to their apps?

[nocturne hull]

I'm still wearing my invisibility cloak

[vague viper]

Not usually this long but we're looking into it!

[harsh herald]

still waiting to see Aunt Irah enter the game (hopefully)

[nocturne hull]

I sooooooo badly want cherry blossom tree

[harsh herald]

same and having my own island would just be really cool. its what initially hyped me for sailing

[remote ruin]

I think there might be a bug with the bosun's workbench, operating a cannon, and your boat's armor. just saw an orca hit me a 13 on my rune keel sloop. testing more but they only seem to be able to ignore it when I'm operating a cannon

[minor whale]

I've seen some people suggesting flat armor in boats might be bugged when auto retaliate is on

Try disabling that and seeing if your flat armor returns to normal?

[nocturne hull]

Did the bullsharks surrounding Pandaemonium always try to aggro onto you while at the bank? I feel like I would have noticed that before

You can completely kill them from land and loot them safely literally 1 tile away from the bank

[remote ruin]

ya, been like that from day 1

[nocturne hull]

Odd lol. Never noticed it I guess

[carmine junco]

I had a very funny interaction while showing a new friend of mine the game where someone was doing exactly that

[austere mulch]

Boat autoretaliate disabling your flat armor is 10/10 peak

[quartz anchor]

we love spaghetti here

[austere mulch]

https://tenor.com/view/will-smith-eating-spaghetti-will-smith-spaghetti-ai-gif-12546117032276153065

[true talon]

to think this was AI 3 years ago

[winged mantle]

Idk still looks like todays ai slop

[true talon]

what not even close lol

[winged mantle]

Slop is still slop

[true talon]

If its slop, its because the prompter was slop XD

[bronze kernel]

When Will Smith eating spaghetti is the benchmark

[hard axle]

them ears 😭

[quartz anchor]

What movie is this from. I thought i saw all his movies

[south void]

"Old School RuneScape Coding" behind the scenes edition, featuring Will Smith

[idle rapids]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TT9UTqn0HAw
there was pretty convincing AI 6 years ago tbf

[zenith pike]

You’ve clearly never seen diddy vs island man battle

[hard axle]

yeah that one is insane

[hasty shard]

draco have you heard

[hard axle]

https://tenor.com/view/mahoraga-advogado-mahoraga-jujutsu-kaisen-gif-4477872237994946027

[hard axle]

Go on… need details

[hasty shard]

idk insert current drama i wasnt thinking of anything

did you uhh see that reddit post being an ape about the afk rubium smithing

30 gp/xp which is really expensive for afk! ignoring that rubium is like a day old

and will utterly crash because its the best mining method

[hard axle]

I heard of it and trust the calls to nerf more than calls to keep as is

just based on my understanding of this playerbase

[hasty shard]

i dont trust jagex to not overcorrect

[hard axle]

there’s very little difference between 45 and 48

Even 68 for geodes

[tender harness]

Did they keep the beta rates for rubidium

[hasty shard]

yes

[tender harness]

How in the fuck

They literally knew about it.

Also i like how fucked Marlins are

[hasty shard]

this is why i said they should give more xp

balancing something new around player driven economic values is like

stupid methinks

[bronze kernel]

I think rubium cannonballs are fine

[hasty shard]

also idk why it took so long for people to realise you could do this

[bronze kernel]

No need for a nerf or anything

[hasty shard]

it was very obvious 😭

[minor whale]

I think since you don't have to bank at all and it's as afk as darts but more XP is a tiny bit overtuned

I feel like rubidium shouldn't stack natively and it'd solve all problems

Make it 1 tick breakable deposits or something to get the stackable part

[hasty shard]

eh nerf it to like 90-110k/h

dont make the actual loop worse lol

[bronze kernel]

I say leave it in

[minor whale]

Yeah that'd also work
Going from 30 XP per ore to 25

Would be completely balanced

Would make native XP 100k/hr and 120k/hr with both boosts

[hasty shard]

unironically think this is an update mining needs its just been completely unpolled lol

[bronze kernel]

Sometimes, it's okay to let old methods go

[minor whale]

Unpolled new methods that are easier and more profitable is pretty wild

[hasty shard]

part of me does think leave it as is but idk man

bit too much

^

[minor whale]

Especially since Jagex has like never done that and has actively enforced the opposite

[hasty shard]

like granite makes no gp, and these are objective upgrades to ammo that will always have usage

[bronze kernel]

Technically, they were polled. Because of the content they come from

[minor whale]

The XP rates and expectations were not, which is explicitly something they do poll

It's why they're polling leechfin as being the new best fishing method

[bronze kernel]

Sometimes it's hard to gauge XP rates

[hasty shard]

leechfin isnt the best

[minor whale]

Is it?
1.5 ticking has been well known forever

[bronze kernel]

Because either Jagex overlooks something or players get creative

[hasty shard]

its less ehp than drift nets and 2t swords are still better pretty sure

i think 3t barb is still more ehp cause of the str/agil

[minor whale]

Yeah it's only better than Barb but even then they said they're polling it at those rates

It took not even 1 day for a 133k XP/hr route to be found

[quartz anchor]

am i reading right that the new rubium is 100kxp/h afk?

[minor whale]

And it's not even perfect

Nah it's like 60k/hr afk

[quartz anchor]

still double shooting stars

[minor whale]

It's also like

Not actually afk

[quartz anchor]

you know what would solve this ?

More dragon arrows 👀

[bronze kernel]

I say just leave it in.

And are these rates are at what mining level?

[hasty shard]

3 over granite

68 for geodes

[minor whale]

Geodes are bad

Not worth doing really at all

[meager flame]

tbh im surprised people are even mad at marlin

i dont really think i want to play this game if skilling is so bad it actually holds value

lmao

kind of the brutal truth but skilling takes more or less nothing so everyone can do it

if thats profiting big then jagex has likely fucked up it means the gameplay must be absolutely brutal

otherwise more people would be flooding the market

[hasty shard]

it is brutal

it is literally spam clicking

implying people enjoy that in the blog is a fucking joke

[meager flame]

nah i mean the price crashing on it

its going where it belongs honestly

i think trawling gameplay wise is absolutely terrible but it does have the more afk option that i assume a lot of people end up doing anyways despite the huge nerf

honestly the fact that they were so confident that people like the gameplay blew me away

im certain that if more players actually tried trawling they would tell jagex that its garbage

[sacred oracle]

marlin isn't exactly unprofitable

it's still quite profitable

it's just fallen in price by 40% or so

[meager flame]

because essentially if you were trying to compare it to a very similar activity

[sacred oracle]

i think the real problem with skilling is that it's balanced to be either efficient for xp, good at xp, or afk

[meager flame]

its like making darts while you do rooftop agility

im sure someone out there thinks that is fun

but im also sure most people dont

[sacred oracle]

lucrative skilling is not good xp and since pvm is better gph, there's no reason to do it

i think it's just kind of doomed

the people want contradictory things for it

let's say that doing blood runes was 4m gph

that's great for skilling, but it's so bad compared to pvm that you wouldn't do it if you actually wanted money

[meager flame]

it just cant be because everyone can make blood runes

thats the part that they cant figure out

[sacred oracle]

and it's bad xp, so you wouldn't do it for xp either

[meager flame]

they want skilling to be the low skill kind of easy gameplay and want that to make the big bucks

and it never will

because the second it starts to get that way all of them will do it

and destroy its market lol

the only way skilling will be profitable is if its difficult for people to learn and takes time and effort to do

so it can filter out many of the players

[sacred oracle]

the only example i can think of where skilling was good xp and good gp is sepulcher

which it isn't any more

[meager flame]

yeah and most of those people that want to skill for profit can't do sepulchre

at least not the final floor

so it was filtering people

in the end it turned out that things like the unique from it were garbage but it kind of has to be gameplay like that

where its just above the effort level that many people are willing to put in

[austere mulch]

There is a demographic out there that would that I’d imagine is reasonably large, since there are plenty players who have vorkath as the height of their pvm experience (and maybe even goals)

BUT I still agree with you

I unironically think a skilling raid could be interesting. Throw demonic spade on the reward list and let people go at it

[vivid ruin]

You mean cox

[hasty shard]

that is because ring of endurance is a meme item

doubles stam dose for the cost of one stam dose

utterly game breaking item

15% drain reduction passive after you sink 1000 doses you cant uncharge

except it doesnt work when you use a stam because lol???

[kindred crescent]

so people don't want rubium to be nerfed?

I think them disabling tick manip would be enough

[winged raptor]

going for 3-6 rolls from single rock is crazy nerf, currently it frequently goes for 10+ at my 98 mining (idk if mining lvl matters rn)

[oblique stratus]

If Rubium Mining were to remain the best Mining XP method in the game, Rubium Splinters would inevitably become far less valuable over time due to the sheer volume of them entering the game

But then your proposed splinters goes up to a minimum of around 6,300 versus the current 2,100

This makes no sense to me

[winged raptor]

can we stop balancing the game around degen 3 ticking things?

[oblique stratus]

To me it sounds like y'all just want to keep granite 3t meta and used the Rubium as an excuse

[kindred crescent]

yes

remove degen tick manipulation from the game entirely

[winged raptor]

its funny, because right now its like -7m per hour if you go for afk great smithing exp, if they go with x3 splinters whats gonna happen to prices? lol

[oblique stratus]

Don't get me started on the smithing "suggestion"

They didn't even provide any numbers for the changes

[quaint oar]

they gave an example of a divine potion so it'll be like 10xp

honestly smithing needed some diveristy and this was giving it to us, now your butchering it entirely. feels bad man

[old shadow]

Not mining until 2027

[sacred oracle]

somewhat concerned that the nerf is presented as a consultation

[solid trout]

Note to self: interrupt leagues grind to do Rubium before its nerfed into the ground, got it

exploit early, exploite often, unless its rendi in what case roll back immediatly

[sacred oracle]

that makes me think they're open to shifting the numbers around a bit, but game balance/integrity really shouldn't be this open to people with 10 minutes to game a week complaining about sweats on reddit and demanding higher rates

[solid trout]

tbh i dont dislike it being adjusted but just removing the ability to 1.5t it at all? thats a misstep

[quaint oar]

balancing towards tick manipulation is a slippery slope. dont cater to the sweats

[solid trout]

it already happened at salvaging than there was outcry than it was properly adjusted

literally the same thing just happening again

[placid canyon]

Gagex forcing me to go mine splinters all weekend before they nerf smith exp sadge

Weather is nice 🙁

[solid trout]

i wanted to do raids with some boys on a lan event im gonna be at, rip

[ember token]

frankly i dont think the smithing experience should have been that high for what it really is

i think the mining experience could just be toned down a bit (~20%) but leave everything else as is

and then on the smithing side, token xp is definitely the way to go, this shouldnt have been an actual training method in the first place

[solid trout]

tbh i dont think anyone is really complaining about the smithing exp, the mining stuff that peoples are rightly upset about

[dry pond]

genuine question though, what actual testing did you do on this quest + rubium because it seems like there was literally zero

[solid trout]

the exp rates where literally calced out and known for a year

now suddenly its: ohwo we had no idea of knowing it would be THIS good

[winged raptor]

wont it take like 10 hours to mine enough splinters for 1 hour of afking? and if you buy them you burn money like crazy

[dry pond]

i dont understand how you can spend 7 months on this quest, with the rates being out for a year and go "oh well shit we didnt see this coming"

[solid trout]

no they spend like a month on this quest and 6 months on dmm, sailing reworks, leagues and gridmaster

[hasty shard]

how do they miss this stuff when they have this many people on the qa team

[pine juniper]

I just want better skilling methods that doesn’t involve tick manipulation. Whether it be a boss or just minigame. I love foundry and I want something like that for most skills. I hate that my mining options are 3 tick or be sad that I’m not good at 3 tick

[dry pond]

mickey mouse company honestly

[pine juniper]

They probably didn’t think about the game economy or something. Who knows

[solid trout]

what i really dont get about the nerf is it hits both player types
sweats and casuals

for 3tickers it just isnt possible anymore
for casuals the exp is nerfed

why??

[limber sequoia]

can we just stop making mining slower arbitrarily? it's nice to have a 60-70k xph method that isn't mlm. just implement anti-tick manipulation stuff. i don't want more shards nor do i want to go back to mlm. fucks sake

[quaint oar]

they arent thinking about it now.

If Rubium Mining were to remain the best Mining XP method in the game, Rubium Splinters would inevitably become far less valuable over time due to the sheer volume of them entering the game

yet the blog suggest more are coming into the game per hour if people do the mining method lmao

[pastel skiff]

nah man, they should protect the max cape for ever /s

[limber sequoia]

oh boy i can go back 27k an hour at stars woooo, blow me

[limber sequoia]

they can protect dn

[solid trout]

i didnt even consider that lmao

[quaint oar]

6300 is larger then 2100 jagex.

[humble heath]

mining changes are absolutely sound and deserved.

[solid trout]

its 3 times larger infact lol

[pastel skiff]

i was joking man ;p, maxed twice and i think alot of skills deserve faster xp rates

[sturdy zephyr]

Why is it that any kind of xp/h buff to these TERRIBLE skills are always said to be "unhealthy" for the game.

We have agility sitting at SUB 100k/hour after all these years even when doing an insanely click intensive method and Mining sitting barely over with granite.

I don't understand why we can't just buff xp rates on these skills by double and still have a healthy environment. I believe its the complete opposite and would say that rates this low is flat out unhealthy. Could easily have changed the resources gathered rather than the rates

[true talon]

I dont think the smithing exp is a problem. rune hull parts were profitable and 320k exp/h

before the parts crashed

IT will balance out in the price area quickly

[oblique stratus]

Cause if they increase XP rates

1. People who already 99'd will complain, because that's all we 'scapers like to do
2. Jagex doesn't get that extra money for the speed. The longer it'll take you to 99 the longer you'll be subscribed to OSRS

[limber sequoia]

lmao same it wasn't directed at you, it was directed at jagex and turbo dorks who think a max cape should take a billion hours on outdated skills - i'm fairly close to max and like...what's the point of a couple hundred hours at stars because i cba to do mlm or a ton of blast mine. i like the charred dungeon. i like a method where i can click every 20-30 seconds and get 60-70k xph and actually make a tiny bit of gp.

perhaps consider that people won't be burned out as fuck once they get to the higher levels if it doesn't blow ass to be there

[true talon]

Those people with 200m who poop themselves getting it, will be sad.

[limber sequoia]

i have an actual business degree and do value optimization stuff for work - making something arbitrarily worse is actually bad for sustaining your customer base over time, it turns out

"hey gang the sweaty nerds broke the intended design and instead of just restricting that we're gonna make sure it's worse xp AND worse profit"

i usually can defend jagex but this is just stupid lmao

[hasty shard]

'we had a year to address this and its your fault actually'

[sturdy zephyr]

Granite at max eff is the definition of physically unhealthy but so be it

[tender harness]

So rubidium turned into abuse early i see

[limber sequoia]

yep, i'll go fuck myself and spend dozens of more hours at stars since i can't play much this weekend i guess

cba man

[tender harness]

Tbh it's their fault for leaving in the beta rates. People told them was fucked

[hasty shard]

i swear they keep nerfing every skilling method because theres some mythical future skilling update they want to do that will never come out like the rest of the things they imply theyll do in the future

[solid trout]

im really wondering why we have the beta worlds in the first place

[tender harness]

They want to preserve 1.5t integrity

[hasty shard]

emergent new 3t method thats marginally less ass? nope shouldnt exist AT ALL now 😭

[limber sequoia]

once again they can 1.5t dn

[tender harness]

Allowing tick manipulation to stay has only been a detriment to design for the game

Hot take

[winged raptor]

dont worry, current roadmap is already outdated with things binned, added, delayed and switched around, but they will surely do mining and smithing rework next year, suuurely

[limber sequoia]

"hey we didn't realize the new mind goblin boss with boosted melee rates was gonna make it slightly less ass to level combat, our bad"

[limber sequoia]

i think there's certain parts of the game where it's fun and enjoyable, none of those parts of the game have higher apm than most boss fights for significantly less benefit/reward

[hasty shard]

also @hard axle i told you

frickin

[limber sequoia]

"well you don't have to worry about desert heat because we put granite on the great conch" like...jagex i need you to understand i have the elite desert diary and would rather put my balls in a vice than 3t granite to 99 mining

[pine juniper]

tick manip was cool for when i was on a LOA and needed 96 range so i was hunting chins but i dont think tick manip needs to be the standard for rates lol

[minor whale]

Let's gooooo Jagex

[smoky light]

did anyone watch the video example of the 133k mining xp method? lmao.. way more complex than mining granite, tick perfect rate, requires stamina pots - BETTER NERF IT IMMEDIATELY

[pine juniper]

like yeah every skill doesnt need an afk rate of salvaging + extractor
but if im clickin pretty consistently lemme get some sweet xp gah damn

[limber sequoia]

aight i've been on my bullshit about this longer than i intended to be - take care everyone!

[restive siren]

you have a link?

highly doubt it was more complex than granite

[smoky light]

https://youtu.be/wpQ9s8E7MsE?si=3Wz3PDhGsyT7hMHf

[restive siren]

ty

yeah thats not more complex than 3t4g wdym

not even close

[smoky light]

the fact a tiny minority of people complained about this being competitive with granite and they rushed out to change it is kinda embarrassing imo

[bronze kernel]

Incredible.

[bronze kernel]

The people of EPH holding back skilling methods forever

[pine juniper]

gen question, how do you know its a tiny minority?

[bronze kernel]

Like how they nerfed Horn of Plenty from being able to be a 1-click tick manipulation tool

[hasty shard]

horn was silly

do you mean soulflame cause that was more reasonable and shouldnt have been nerfed

plenty let you 2t barb

[bronze kernel]

Yeah, Soulflame

[hasty shard]

soulflame let you 3.5t

which ????

[bronze kernel]

It was one of them

[hasty shard]

their excuse was future reward space which is genuinely psychotic

[bronze kernel]

Abuse early, abuse often

Every

[patent magnet]

anyone actually mining granite for xp in current year should not have a say in the game’s future imo. They’re all the worst type of players that look down on casuals

[bronze kernel]

Single

Time

[stark wadi]

Can jagex stop knee jerk reacting and actually think about things. Can’t see any reason to engage with the cannonball content post nerf

[bronze kernel]

Their excuse of "We can't let players get XP from both making the balls and then upgrading them"

That's honestly pathetic

And shouldn't that have been something you should have seen from the start?

[hasty shard]

the thing is they already do let you double dip xp

giants foundry exists

god forbid we stray from minigamescape 😭

[patent magnet]

Cball thing is also so insanely laughable, requires 90 smithing, less exp than higher intensity methods, probably highest cost smithing method, but oh no it’s afk but you make a useless item

[hasty shard]

wait it requires 90 smithing???

???

[patent magnet]

for rune yeah

[hasty shard]

jagex... jaaagex...

[patent magnet]

[bronze kernel]

Rune ones, yeah.

It's not that much more XP per hour than just regular smithing

Like making platebodies

Just you don't need to run to the bank

[patent magnet]

it’s like 50gp/xp or something

I don’t even think prayer is that high

[quaint oar]

29.3gp/hp

[minor whale]

Jagex said in the Reddit post both of these things were mistakes that despite being brought up in the beta they just...forgot to fix

[quaint oar]

its funny because the cannonballs are indeed useless, especially when 90% of the sea creatures are immune to burn

[hasty shard]

jagex

[minor whale]

I mean
The cost of making them was going to tank regardless
Splinters were so unbelievably easy to get

[ember token]

everything but the birds is burn immune

[stark wadi]

Ironically they’re making splinters easier to get now? But just making them pointless lol

[quaint oar]

6300 an hour over 2100 yeah

[hasty shard]

jaaaaagex

$21

[patent magnet]

future sailing content the balls will be bis guys, we need to fix it asap so the balls don’t get devalued too much…

[tender harness]

Price hike inc. But we remove burn immunity on sailing creatures

$20/month and we fix sailing

[patent magnet]

also with the chainshot…. There’s literally 0 enemies it’s useful for right now. Why was it even added

[tender harness]

Because it was clearly meant for ship to ship

Which is in the bins

And people voted yes to a stupidly ambiguous question

[hasty shard]

isnt chainshot basically undead grasp or w/e

[quaint oar]

it binds

[hasty shard]

i recall it not binding for like any decent amount of time

[quaint oar]

oh it doesnt bind

it just halves movementspeed for 8 ticks

[hasty shard]

which like :clueless: they nerfed cannon speed before adding it so it just inherently does not work with current balance

[tender harness]

Chainshot is dead content
And incendiary is basic dead content with shit being immune to burn

Like congrats we added dead content to a new skill

[bronze kernel]

Introducing content for ship v ship

But then not introducing ship v ship

[hasty shard]

tale as old as time

[bronze kernel]

Ship combat has been the bane of sailing since launch

[brazen tundra]

why are they nerfing mining xp?

[tender harness]

I mean it doesnt take much to see they rushed red reef out the door

[tender harness]

Because people complained
Also this is the rates from beta. They knew and were aware it was broken

[patent magnet]

don’t worry raids 5 in 2038 will have a single ship v ship encounter and you’ll need some clever use of different ammunition to take it down effectively

also tbow is just bis dps

[bronze kernel]

People who keep fucking up making herb tar made the XP too high

Duh

[brazen tundra]

how much is osrs game tested before being released

[tender harness]

If its like wow? 0

Dont remember a year with such bad content in awhile and here we are

Two main game updates one is a rushed mess
One is a meme

[brazen tundra]

so elitist skillers are to blame ?

[patent magnet]

just grind the guam leaf!!!! What’s taking so long EHPMaxxer420???

yes

[tender harness]

I mean the rates had no business being this good anyway

People reported it in the beta

Repeatedly

[patent magnet]

It’s always hlc throwing a tantrum

[brazen tundra]

bro i know you maneless

[patent magnet]

yeah but why not just make tick manip not work so normal people playing the game don’t also get punished

“This doesn’t look like a good place to chop a teak log”

[brazen tundra]

😭

[minor whale]

They did
They also needed the normal rates nerfed because for an afkable resource gathering method you didn't even have to bank the resources it was high as shit

They accidentally added it in with the rates it had

Because people tested it in beta

And they just didn't fix it since then

[bronze kernel]

"We forgot"

Sailing related releases have been nothing but a disaster

Disaster after diaster

[tender harness]

"Accident"

Mfers tried to slide in a method to disrupt the ehpers and they screeched because it wasnt granite

[bronze kernel]

Honestly

Can we just delete tick manipulation?

[brazen tundra]

not wrong i wouldnt mind

[bronze kernel]

Would laugh my ass off if an essential engine update actually did do this inadvertently

And they can't exactly change it back because the rest of the game would break

[vivid ruin]

A majority of people do not and will not tick manip anything and the fact that xp rates are based on it somehow sucks bhole

[bronze kernel]

Or would require too much effort to actually accomdate

[tender harness]

Just stop designing around tick manipulation. Let people do it if they want but that shouldn't be something to push people to do, design for anything. If they cant do that then yeah delete tick manipulation.

But rates regardless of tick manip were too high. It was reported jagex just didnt address it, and here we sit

[thick beacon]

tbh i dont think they really have been pushing tick manip with alot of their recent skilling releases. some of them had it but also many that dont

like gotr/mixology dont rrly have manip afaik

[tender harness]

Gotr had the mining problem for the longest time in masses

[ashen yarrow]

no, everything needs to be balanced to never power creep 20 year old tick manipulation methods

[thick beacon]

ye but wasint that the oppsite problem ppl were just afking ragging gotr games

[tender harness]

Mixology is.. a separate problem that needs help across the board

[thick beacon]

like idk how ur gona tick manip leechfin if its designed to be like moons fishing either

vale totems as well

[tender harness]

Some random train enjoyer will find a way to tick manip leechfin

[sly venture]

Removing this message because it comes off as retaliatory

[bronze kernel]

A fish on every tick

[vivid ruin]

Train enjoyer lol

[ashen yarrow]

but it is funny how the fix to balance rubium because tick manipulation was good xp and made small amount of gp was to remove tick manipulation and make rubium worthless at the same time

[chrome lantern]

I do think that tick manip can be fun but I’m still not going to do it all the time or for extended periods. I think a “best” answer would be to let tick manipulation work, but if you’re using it (e.g. detect a double-roll or something), lower the output xp/reward a bit so that it’s still good, but isn’t as powerful as the raw mechanics would do

[austere mulch]

Why do current tick manip methods have be viewed as the xp ceiling anyways?

The obsession over that is strange to me

[chrome lantern]

I just find mining normal rocks as incredibly boring

And not really active nor afk

[patent magnet]

because of the loud minority of players that actually care about xp records I guess

[chrome lantern]

Yeah in general I’m all for active engagement methods that aren’t tick manip

I don’t think Moons/Leechfin fishing does that in a good way though

The Neypotzli net fishing kinda just sucks to interact with

[austere mulch]

Imagine we’re 10 years from now and tick manip granite is still the xp ceiling

That’s just insane lmao

[thick beacon]

ye sep is one of my favrioute methods with 0 tick manip

[chrome lantern]

I also think it’s fine that there’s an active way to trawl, but spam clicking the net is also awful

[hasty shard]

thats because its bugged and they havent fixed it because lol

[covert cradle]

same reason agility/rc are still god awful, cuz the whiners

[ashen yarrow]

that or they add lvl60 mining requirement method that also gives useless item that has to be dropped while giving 15% more xp

[thick beacon]

imo i kinda accept that not all methods will cater to my playstyle

[chrome lantern]

I don’t think RC is awful tbh

I like everything except ZMI well enough

[austere mulch]

Just so weird lol. They don’t care about pvm records when they release new gear. So those are moving targets, and speed times are tracked by era as a result in the speedrunning disc

[bronze kernel]

Lava runes forever!

[chrome lantern]

Well, I say “everything”
but a lot of the altars just suck

[ashen yarrow]

essence runners have to get their money somehow

[chrome lantern]

But combo runes, true blood, zeah are all good at a minimum

Library passable as a raw xp method

[bronze kernel]

I remember when you could hire runners and all you had to do was pay them in the runes you just crafted

[covert cradle]

now i know your lying

[thick beacon]

what makes zmi bad in ur opnion?

[chrome lantern]

Actually I forgot GotR somehow, I kinda dislike GotR a lot

[bronze kernel]

And everyone came out happy

[austere mulch]

Aethers are -100k xp/hr and boat tele astrals are ~72k

Rc really isn’t all that bad these days all things considered

[bronze kernel]

I like GotR a lot

[chrome lantern]

Not remotely active but interspersed with concentrated periods of a lot of clicks to bank/craft

[patent magnet]

What’s weirder is how jagex always bends the knee to these players like they are the voice of the entire player base.

Probably more than half of us are on mobile or at work getting afk grinds in

[chrome lantern]

GotR also sucks because it’s not active nor afk

[bronze kernel]

It's the middle ground

[chrome lantern]

I could see myself enjoying small teams more but not really interested

But yeah a lot of people like ZMI and will do stuff like multiskilling but I don’t care for it

I can’t stand ZMI

[hasty shard]

rc to me is one too many bank skills

[bronze kernel]

ZMI I think is fine.

[thick beacon]

im not really looking forward to leechfin fishing either tbh but maybe some ppl will like it

[covert cradle]

ZMI is the only one i can tolerate

[hasty shard]

stop making me bank for things

[minor whale]

Make everyone bank more

[hasty shard]

i got 99 afking fishing because they wont balance it ever

[minor whale]

It's the only way to win against the UIM horde

[hasty shard]

and that makes me really mad

[austere mulch]

3t granite and 2t swords has been meta for over a decade now, I think it’s okay to add in new competitive/better methods, that obviously still require effort and are balanced on the resources side

[thick beacon]

isint driftnet ehp now for mains atleast

for fish/hunter

[hasty shard]

yeah but its also had like multiple qol fixes for a reason

[austere mulch]

Yeah ^ though I can name on one hand the number of players I’ve met personally who did any amount of driftnet outside of leagues 😂

[thick beacon]

ye tbh idk anyone either only person i saw do it was jcw/hebox in their main speed runs

method looks annoying to do

[ashen yarrow]

I just hope that making Incendiary wont be nerfed to 2xp per action. At least keep at a xp value that makes cannonballs same xp as making rune items in total... currently making cannonballs is 66% of the xp you get from smithing items

[tender harness]

Agility isnt even as bad as people make it out to be

[thick beacon]

tbh idk anyone that even does 3t either

[covert cradle]

ur high af

[austere mulch]

I tried it for an hour or so and probably enjoyed it as much as I’d enjoy uim runecracting

[thick beacon]

prob know more ppl that do vm then that

[chrome lantern]

Yeah I don’t have an issue with this either, I think fundamentally the issues are:
-Unpolled significant shift to meta
-Rewarding significant xp in multiple skills
-Contrary to the tenets of xp/reward/activity balance they discussed in Leechfin discussions

Personally, I do disagree with their statement on “getting xp twice” for cannonballs because the xp on smelting cannonballs is pretty low compared to alternatives

[minor whale]

Sure, I agree
But they should be polled first with the XP rates known

[hasty shard]

i 3t for like, leagues

[minor whale]

Not just haphazardly added in with no balancing at all

[hasty shard]

and i didnt do this league

[covert cradle]

They should gut mining and leave the smithing xp plz

[minor whale]

They added a meta shifting XP method that was easier and didn't need to bank and was profitable

[hasty shard]

theres a difference between nerfing xp and removing manip altogether

[thick beacon]

i think its really hard for them to have a accurate estimate

[hasty shard]

and they did both

[thick beacon]

ppl will push stuff way further then they expect

[austere mulch]

Oh yeah I mean I think it’s clear rubium needs to be adjusted

[minor whale]

They said on Reddit they could just math it but forgot to change the rates since beta

It's absurd to think they couldn't math this one

[chrome lantern]

I think Agility is good in that it has enjoyable methods (mostly Sepulcher), but it could do with more depth to the actual engagement methods and is too broadly reliant on boring lap-courses. Colossal Wyrm was initially proposed and polled as “exploring the caves beneath the remains of the Colossal Wyrm” in an Agility dungeon, but we got a boring lap course instead. I would love for more engaging alternatives that sit somewhere between the boring lap-courses and the high focus/activity of Sepulcher

[austere mulch]

I just think the over protection on specifically 3t4g and similar has gone too far

[minor whale]

30 XP x 2 every 3 ticks is 120k/hr
That's math and doable for everything in the game

[austere mulch]

Like, at least with WC, a new method came about in the form of 1.5t teaks

[ashen yarrow]

same was with sailing woodcutting, but it didnt involve tick manipulating so it wasnt affecting the tick manipulation meta so there was no crying that it is op

[chrome lantern]

I do think they went way too high with ironwood xp rates

For what it is

[hasty shard]

didnt they nerf rosewood log fm

even though it was literally a post 99 method

[ashen yarrow]

yeah since it had a bug where using bow on it gave almost double xp

[chrome lantern]

lmao how does that even happen

[bronze kernel]

LMFAO. What?

[thick beacon]

i didint mind ironwood as much felt like alot of ppl wanted redwoods pre 90 and they gave them that

[covert cradle]

ya i keep hearing about how good sepluchre is, just got to 92 and tried it out, it just feels so click intensive for such a small xp gain

[chrome lantern]

Yeah I just don’t think that’s a positive change personally

[ashen yarrow]

somehow barbarian firemaking rosewood was giving barbarian pyre fm xp

[bronze kernel]

Get 200M FM first before going to WT for maximum Phoenix pet chances

[winged raptor]

i did last floor once and dipped, cba doing this for hours

[austere mulch]

Sep has a pretty high learning curve to do without much effort

[thick beacon]

im guessing ur not a fan of bonfire buffs etube

[chrome lantern]

Part of this is also due to the fact that, as previously mentioned, Sepulcher is also the best agility moneymaker as well, and Jagex carefully considers the levers of activity, xp, and reward when balancing activities

[covert cradle]

ya i really dont understand the hype behind it, and its everyones fallback for why agility shouldnt be changed haha

[austere mulch]

But it feels great when you get to that point

[chrome lantern]

I don’t really care because fm is irrelevant and it’s still way slower

[ember token]

the xp is still bugged, you still get extra xp when using the new logs for pyre ships

[bronze kernel]

Honestly, the only bad part about Floor 5 is the final stretch. For me that is. And Floor 4 final obstacle that's the Sword/Crossbow/TP pads

[chrome lantern]

Oh, Pyre ships? That’s irrelevant too

[pine juniper]

prlly bc they have more time in the day to allocate to playin and learning

i be at work 8 hours

[bronze kernel]

It's the fact the entire thing is one obstacle and if you mess up, you get sent all the way back. No checkpoints

[chrome lantern]

I don’t think it was a necessary method in the first place but I do think it’s healthier to make it lower xp/hr rather than both lower xp/hr and also lower xp/log

[hasty shard]

kinda wish agility had anything decent before you unlocked floor 5

[winged raptor]

i mean, doing sepulcher is better exp than ardy rooftops, but its not that much better for me to sweat it

[ashen yarrow]

the bug they fixed was using bow to light up rosewood was giving 420 xp instead of the normal 268

[covert cradle]

ya and i dont mind the higher effort training methods, if they give reasonably higher xp rates, but it just doesnt

[ember token]

yes but im saiyng they didnt fix it for pyre ships

[pine juniper]

jagex hates skillers i dunno

[covert cradle]

I think skillers hate themselves tbf

[austere mulch]

Ardy is like 70k ain’t it? So sep is about a 40% increase

The obstacle is learning it to the point that it becomes reasonably low effort

[pine juniper]

idk im fw deep sea trawling rn, i just keep misclicking the keg and not the extractor

[austere mulch]

But that was a big enough increase for me to learn it

[pine juniper]

i like sep but its not that good at 80

[chrome lantern]

I mean saying Sepulcher isn’t significantly higher xp is also just kinda wrong, too, it’s a fairly notable gap, and if you consider the effective gp/hr from just the looting actions, that’s really high too

[austere mulch]

Yeah pre 92 sep is … not great 😂

[pine juniper]

id like a buff but i guess im fine with relleka til 92

[covert cradle]

idk man theres a lot going on for it to ever be low effort

thats like the calling zulrah afk

[chrome lantern]

Well that’s kinda the point of it

It’s higher reward for being active

[covert cradle]

yee i get that

[chrome lantern]

It doesn’t get less active, just less brainpower to do the activity as you get more proficient

[pine juniper]

the xp should be higher, i do agree. the only time skilling has good xp is with tick manip which is gross

agi doesnt have that option tho LOL

[chrome lantern]

It does, at sepulcher

[pine juniper]

isnt there some minigame coming for some skill?

[chrome lantern]

Sepulcher is not only significantly more xp, but also not tick manipulation and gives some gp as well

[pine juniper]

yeah at 92

[chrome lantern]

Even before that I would still much rather do it than laps

[pine juniper]

i shouldnt be half way to 99 to get good xp

[chrome lantern]

And I did

Not all the way

But as much as I wanted to

[ember token]

mining/smithing update next year 🤔

[covert cradle]

70k completely mindless afk to 98k only if ur perfect dodging everything idk doesnt seem that significant to me

[pine juniper]

god willing

[sacred oracle]

it's really not. people will click boss for hundreds of hours, but you ask them to intermittently click a rooftop and they lose their minds

[austere mulch]

I hate to give the analogy because it’s not that serious imo, but it’s like, it’d take more effort for me to make a 3pt shot than a professional basketball player

It’s the same task but the experience changes the effort relative to each other

[sacred oracle]

agility is way overhated

[chrome lantern]

Oh boy I love waiting two years for when they actually release any information on this probably

[chrome lantern]

If you don’t think 40% more xp is significant then this conversation won’t really go anywhere. But again, it’s also just not freaking soul crushingly boring laps and has other rewards as well

[dark token]

Noobs

[sacred oracle]

also, importantly, some people play the game for fun, and active/engaging/challenging content like sepulcher is more fun than clicking static rooftops

[covert cradle]

Ya im not tryna change ur mind, just putting my opinion out there lol

[pine juniper]

some of yall must not be doing things outside of osrs i dunno man. also its not "hate" when you ask for something to be better lol. i dont hate my wife when i ask if she could clean her car better.

[austere mulch]

Yeah for me, I hated rooftops more than I hated the process with learning sepulcher and the early frustration that came with it

[dark token]

Ok

[pine juniper]

not really a big deal to me tho, ill get the levels eventually

[minor whale]

It's weird to just lump anyone who doesn't want ezscape as unemployed
Some people don't have a ton of time to play the game and also don't want the game to be turned into afk slopfest

[sacred oracle]

i don't think that the grindy game continuing to be grindy, like it always has, means you can't have a life

[dark token]

Imagine if you can tick manip sepulchre

[pine juniper]

not sure you know what "ezscape" is

[sacred oracle]

i think the people who want to get high xph for little or no effort are way worse for the game than so-called sweats

[covert cradle]

I've never seen someone like agility that's not already 99 though

[hasty shard]

you can alt manip for faster floor times

[sacred oracle]

the effect is destroying the game just because their lives are busy but they still want to progress

[dark token]

I guess

[minor whale]

Half of Reddit asking for every new content to have a new bis afk 200k XP/hr skilling method seems pretty ezscape to me

[pine juniper]

acting like we asking for low intense xp/h when we're asking for some other methods than this

[pine juniper]

"half"

[dark token]

Why always crying :/

Aren't you guys maxed

[thick beacon]

im a big fan of afk methods think its a core part of skilling

[vivid ruin]

Ew lol

[pine juniper]

afk methods are fine but they shouldnt be high xp

[minor whale]

There's afk methods for like every skill just go click resource if you want the 99 I dunno man

[covert cradle]

Im all for 200k/hr xp methods, thats still like 65+ hours per skill, could just be a casual though

[pine juniper]

zalcanos xp is trash for what you do imo

but thats just bc mining rates are ass in gen

[dark token]

Firemaking is all you get

[pine juniper]

agi needs sometimes better than just roof or sep

more skills need a middle ground for regular peeps

[hard axle]

POH Agility for full afk

[austere mulch]

It’s also not just a one way or the other situation

You can acknowledge that sep is a significant step up in xp and rewards while also agreeing that the skill as a whole can see more love and be better fleshed out, especially at the lower levels

[dark token]

Are you guys going for postmax

[pine juniper]

once ur 92...

[austere mulch]

Also, literally most people who I play this game with are employed and have families/soon to be starting their own families

[austere mulch]

Literally read the second half of the message lol

[dark token]

Ok

[austere mulch]

especially at lower levels

[hard axle]

Yup. Most people agree that Sep is worth the XP and the step up is justified

110k/hr cap could be raised to 120-130k/hr and it would still be justified.

[thick beacon]

i think loot makes up for it but like xp is not nearly that good imo. like doing tick manip teaks is over 2x xp of afking bedwoods. 3t 4g is like 2x xp of vm or 4x shooting stars

[covert cradle]

yeee especially when thats the afk rates of some skills haha

[thick beacon]

rooftops definitely require more effort then most things though

[hard axle]

The problem is too many people mald about afk rates being too low or when Jagex adjusts unintended rates downward.

[austere mulch]

3t4g is for sureee not 2x better than vm

Vm is 90+k in the 90s

[thick beacon]

its not ye but im mostly using stars/mlm as reference

[austere mulch]

Fair yeah , I’m also a major mlm hater

As it’s by no means “more afk” than vm

😭

[covert cradle]

I wish they took a shooting stars approach to everything

[pine juniper]

yeah but when thats brought up, people say "well i suffered and so should you"

[thick beacon]

vm is so good but somehow dead now

[covert cradle]

that was such a nice chill 99 that still took quite a while

[sacred oracle]

it's not about suffering

it's about achievements meaning something because they were a grind

the grind is why we're all here

[chrome lantern]

Shooting stars are pretty bad, I don’t think we should encourage people to just not play the game. Stuff like bwans and anglerfish already more than afk enough, 5+min afk is way too much

Or at the least, the existing turbo afk methods are too rewarding for the zero input

[covert cradle]

I guess i dont really see skilling as playing the game in my mind

[sacred oracle]

that does not really make sense

[hasty shard]

they fucked with stars enough to make them bad

[chrome lantern]

I think that’s a fundamental issue that could be better addressed by proposing and creating more methods that people want to engage with

[ashen yarrow]

The main issue with the changes after players cry about xp being too high is that jagex nerfs the xp rates and gp/h at the same time every instance when it happens. you get less xp, you spend more money per xp and/or end result makes significantly less money because the speed is buffed to "compensate"

[covert cradle]

i enjoy playing pvm, the skilling is like a chore i guess

[sacred oracle]

that makes more sense

it's a part of the game you don't like as much

[chrome lantern]

Mining had 8+ viable training methods before stars, and people would try power mining iron and doing mlm, then decide they “hated” mining and whined for stars so they could get mining xp without playing the game

Instead of trying other methods or proposing new ones

[austere mulch]

I think there’s a fine line between protecting past accomplishments and inadvertently not allowing the game to progress in the way that it probably should

And Jagex, understandly errs on the side of caution regarding the past achievements part. I think think they overdo it

[pine juniper]

im personally here bc i like the game. your achievements mean nothing to me lol. id like the game to get better and not cater to old heads

[austere mulch]

Again with pvm speed records, these are tracked by era for the sole reason that we know metas will shift

So pre-toa cox/tob/inferno recs still hold

[sacred oracle]

i also want the game to get better

just making the game easier is not better

[hard axle]

I hate this so much.

I bring up werewolf course a lot because prio to Wildy Agility massive buffs, and Wildy Agility itself, 66k/hr at Lv60 Agility is not bad at all.

But the problem is the bitches complaining haven’t tried either or make up excuses why 66k/hr isn’t the afk rate.

[thick beacon]

wilderness has no balance tbh all those methods should be nerfed imo

esp loot

[hasty shard]

wildy agility shouldve just been removed not buffed

[hard axle]

it’s too safe

[hasty shard]

who decided to have the skill where you wear and have nothing have a method in the pvp area

[brisk hill]

Wilderness agility is pog. It’s one of the last competing methods for the wildnlmfao

[ashen yarrow]

need loot so loot piñata come to wilderness

[pine juniper]

making mining better in anyway wouldn't make the game "easier". its still mining not the most enjoyable gameplay here. if im clicking rocks with a decent amount of clicks per hour, i should get good xp regardless of tick manip

[brisk hill]

One of the last things “worth” dying for if you’re a normie that despises wildy

[pine juniper]

i cant think of any use you get from mining/smithing

[brisk hill]

You wearing nothing is your choice. It’s singles for a reason, very easy to escape

Don’t wanna derail but don’t flame my wildy

[hasty shard]

what

im talking prebuff

[pine juniper]

i never cared about rc xp rates bc you get a shit ton of usable runes

[hasty shard]

and agility in general

[pine juniper]

df i get from mining

[hard axle]

Problem is you could say this about any content and at some point, you gotta accept we’re balancing around a time sink.

[hasty shard]

not ragging

[austere mulch]

Always blew my mind how little awareness there was on the werewolf course lol

More so when people came in and said “we’d like more active agility similar to Yama stones”

Because…

[hasty shard]

probably because old agility stuff is psychotic

[austere mulch]

That’s literally werewolf course

[pine juniper]

rn mining/smithing arent super useful tho. the only incentive i can think of is amythest

[hasty shard]

dorg course 😭

[thick beacon]

smithing pretty useful on iron atleast

[sharp cave]

I dont understand why we are allowing tick manip in new content

[thick beacon]

most skills are useless on a main to begin with

[austere mulch]

They were in the lab HEAVY when they made this lmao

[hasty shard]

i tried doing dorg course leagues 4 and immediately noped

[ashen yarrow]

no, they dont want to use brain. They want to click every tick, there is big difference

[pine juniper]

i occasionally make darts so i can see that

[covert cradle]

sounds like bug abuse to me

[thick beacon]

processing gp is really strong and ye rune darts

[pine juniper]

bc old heads cry

[sharp cave]

Why does the most active training methods have to revolve around fucking about with logs and knives or some shit?

[pine juniper]

it just has very lil utility is what im gettin at

[sharp cave]

Like sure leave in the old tick manips on stuff like barb fishing and teaks

But god damn why

[pine juniper]

id rather have better skilling content lol

[thick beacon]

i guess but i think utility holds up highly even if its low

[hasty shard]

am i in a parallel world didnt they say they are removing manip at this

[austere mulch]

Smithing used post-99 for creating Torva and oathplate

It’s a minor space that it fills but it has a use at least, which is positive

[thick beacon]

like firemaking is buns after early game

rather have perpetual endgame use like smithing

firemaking is a low blow though

[sharp cave]

Its useless at all stages of the game

[thick beacon]

but even crafting i think smithing has more use long term

[hasty shard]

honestly early firemaking suuucks

[pine juniper]

not a good argument due to not being very useable mid game

[ashen yarrow]

has use for elite clues from shades of morton

[hasty shard]

wintertodt is at least like, ok

[chrome lantern]

Addy bolts on iron idk

[austere mulch]

It’s not an argument at all, just an observation that the skill is still used post 99 which all skills should have some real use cases at that point imo

[hard axle]

CAs are a good example - optional and yet, they keep making it easier and easier.

I mentioned way back when they changed it from tiers to points, that they would keep doing this easyscape shit, and they have.

Blorva was 4 CAs, Radiant isn’t required, Demonic Brutus isn’t even on CAs, solo ToB isn’t on CAs despite numerous powercreep making it much easier, they shifted down GM rewards to Masters, etc.

Anytime something gets mainstream and popular, it just gets catered to the laziest denominator and this includes clogging too (clog literally missing about 50+ viable items since 2020).

[austere mulch]

Otherwise there’s no point in training them outside of getting 99

[pine juniper]

but if agi rates for sep were buffed from 82, and there was more shit like totems for skills, i dont think anyone would complain. totems made fletching fun for me

[covert cradle]

i think the only things i smith just to smith are like rune bars into alch items, cant really think of any other time i use it, except to train it

[hasty shard]

dw they adding random quest rewards to clog now

[thick beacon]

i think they could make lower tier smithing more interesting they just gutted addy darts which was big thing before. processing addy for gp is always good though still

[hard axle]

I swear to god, new JMods don’t even know Werewolf Course exists and confuse it for Skullball.

[pine juniper]

and it does seem like that is slowly happening every year or

[ashen yarrow]

sailing schematics are weird, you only know about them if you wiki and you have no way to find what to wiki unless you search collection log

[sharp cave]

But then you have 30 different clogs for the medallion peices lol..

[hard axle]

Funny how schematics are on clog, but not fucking literal Yama contracts

[sharp cave]

Should have just been 1 clog when its put togethrr

[sacred oracle]

they are one of the very few actual mysteries in the game, something an npc doesn't straight-up tell you how to get/do

i think it's intentional

[austere mulch]

Sep has plenty effort involved to allow the ceiling to be 120-130, and you can add the additional xp at a rate of like 30% 40% 30% to the 92, 82, 72 breakpoints

Eg of that ~20k increase, 6k goes to f5, 8k goes to f4, 6k to f3

*my opinion

[ashen yarrow]

i guess skill interface lists to facilities so that is option outside of clog

[hasty shard]

theres zero chance they add them now, crabs in a bucket and all

[sacred oracle]

what is and isn't clog appears to be up to each individual content designer, which is why it's wildly inconsistent

[hard axle]

Gotta love how people are like “oh it’s too late to change now!!” when it “negatively” impacts them

[sacred oracle]

the longer a piece of content has been in the game, the less likely it will be edited to be clog if it isn't currently

[hard axle]

Which is dumb as fuck ngl

Clog is clog

[sacred oracle]

i would make a lot more things clog personally

[pine juniper]

see i feel like thats fine. i also think something like blast mine should be more xp. anything with a decent amount of clicks but everything is compared to 3t

[sacred oracle]

nearly everything in fact

[chrome lantern]

Reminder huasca seeds are in clog despite multiple sources

[ashen yarrow]

i dont care if hard to get items are in clog. It only affects clog hunters

[hasty shard]

i think blast mines issue is that it isnt terribly iron friendly

[pine juniper]

has anyone even completed the clog lol

[chrome lantern]

Eh it’s not very hard to get dynamite

[ashen yarrow]

a lot of people competing for highest amount of clogs

[hasty shard]

your options are the insane process of actually making dynamite, grind tbow, or dailyscape

[hard axle]

I say we buff it to 150k no looting, 120k looting imo.

Non-sepulcher agility haters will be like “wtf is no looting”

[chrome lantern]

Buy, diary, cox, heck even make it

[restive siren]

not even close no

[sharp cave]

So? Just do other methods as an iron?

[hard axle]

Very close numbers wise, but hours wise fuck no

[hasty shard]

im saying that affects the popularity

[ashen yarrow]

i think someone is like 15 3a clogs away

[hasty shard]

no shit other methods exist

[pine juniper]

not many great mining methods that arent 3t. i think powermining iron is aight, cant remember

[sacred oracle]

because people in good faith will grind a piece of content to completion and then move on: if after the fact, you go back and add contracts to clog, now yama greenloggers are heading back to potentially do thousands more kc of a boss they've already finished

[pine juniper]

oh gl to them

[sacred oracle]

i don't think if a thing is wrong it should stay wrong forever, but man that would suck

[covert cradle]

I think we can grasp the concept of not looting 🤣

[sacred oracle]

i do think radiant should obviously be clog

it doesn't make sense that it isn't

[hasty shard]

dming lily this btw