game-update

[meager flame]

aerial fishing is so bad that the game would be better if they deleted it so any change is probably good

although tbh idk if they should really be working on it lol like

its bad but its also kinda irrelevant theres probably several other things that a lot of people actually get involved with that could use some changes

[dawn jackal]

im not sure what the use case for ariel would ever end up being

unless it just become meta for xp

[chrome lantern]

If drift nets didn’t exist would aerial technically be meta? Or no

I say technically in the sense that very few people ever touch it for purposes of ehp

[dawn jackal]

i believe you'd do 2t swords and black chins

before arial at current rates

never calced it though but i'm pretty confident

you could move some fish offcuts there for secondaries i guess

[chrome lantern]

Yeah for fishing sure

But I’m basically wondering if the added hunter xp puts the total ehp close enough like it does with drift net

[dawn jackal]

It would not

[chrome lantern]

I suspected as such

[dawn jackal]

At the current arial rates its quicker to do the skills seperately is what i was attempting to communicate

drift net is just mega broken

[chrome lantern]

If it weren’t such an unpopular method I would say they should just make drift nets untradeable to balance it out

But so few people do it anyway

[dawn jackal]

yea thats kinda the shame of the whole thing for a small niche community DN fucked the game sideways and for the vast vast majority of players its irrelevant content

thank goodness for sep or we'd still be swimming too

[chrome lantern]

Sepulcher is very fun but
-There are usually other things I’d rather do during active play
-I only like doing it for like a couple hours at a time

[dawn jackal]

sure, to each their own

But swimming was agi ehp before sep and that was dog ass content

[chrome lantern]

I did like half my
maxing agi cp at sepulcher and like 3m of it at Wyrm course during last leagues, but I didn’t enjoy that method at all it was just something I could second-client

I think swimming is fine content that just has a few things that make it feel really bad

Part of it is the spam clicking with uncertain outcomes and some intricacies to breath management that just get annoying, part of it is the currents feeling very inconsistent and annoying

[dawn jackal]

firing up the scouting alts took years off my serotonin receptors

[hard axle]

its hybrid xp, same reason why you would still do barb fishing sometimes

or defensive cast post 94 barrage

[dawn jackal]

i understand that but there's just strictly better hybrid xp for hte same 2 stats

so it lacks any niche

[hard axle]

cogslop ig

[dawn jackal]

yea the only thing i could think of to justify it's existence is making those fish offcut secondaries you get from one of the sailling adjacent activities live in ariel fishing

but thats just moving around rewards and thats a dumb fix to a problem

[chrome lantern]

The lesser offcuts aren’t even useful unless you’re clogging the low tier trawling

Low-level trawling fish are so far beyond dead content

17 heal krill that have a 55% burn rate at the level you unlock them

And have more attack delay than karambwans

[dawn jackal]

also why is there some kinda dumbass delay when you cut the fish

makes it awful to do

[ashen yarrow]

you mean the delay when you sent bird out and cannot do anything for 1 tick

[hard axle]

dont get me started on how worthless the new foods are

not a single food was a hp regen type of fish similar to prayer regen

[ashen yarrow]

sailing has new highest healing fish and higher healing karambwan

[dawn jackal]

when you cut a haddock it doesn't interact the same as when you cut a leaping sturgeon

to make those fish offcuts you use for something

it feels bad

[hard axle]

yes and lmk how often u use fish in general

[ashen yarrow]

I think it is you issue if you never use hard food

[hard axle]

ye, it means they're not good and content just doesn't need em

anglers are used more for prepot than anything else

[ashen yarrow]

just remove everything from the game that is not used in the 4 end game content where you use mainly brews, so the people only farming those are happy with things that are brought to the game as better versions

[hard axle]

Or, hear me out, make it a niche that is actually worth using and make it more than a 2 hp jump when hard food is already notoriously shit

marlin could be 26-28 hp and anglers would still see just as much use

[ashen yarrow]

yeah next fish is 44 heal with no stat reduction to replace brews then next one after that is 60 hp heal to replace that fish

[hard axle]

[hard axle]

stat drain isn't nearly as bad as the attack delay if u didn't know

[ashen yarrow]

3 tick delay instead of lowered dps or drinking 1-2 brew dose at a time just to repot stats back up again instantly

[hard axle]

Yes, swinging on reduced stats is not as bad not swinging at all

[ashen yarrow]

yep losing 5 dps instead of 8 dps

[hard axle]

sometimes 0 dps loss if u brew-abrew, brew-scb

[ashen yarrow]

but sadly the whole game is not made around top 1% players

[hard axle]

idk what ur even arguing against at this point when marlin is underwhelming and is balanced around you spam clicking as you're chasing around a puddle

[ashen yarrow]

Like we got people saying sailing brings nothing to the game because training methods are useless after max and there is no bis end game gear from it

[chrome lantern]

My biggest gripe is that they designed them presumably with an intent to reward high cooking level but really what they did is made them mostly useless at the level you actually unlock them, and that goes for all sailing foods, since you practically need a cooking cape to have reasonable burn rates

[hard axle]

and was discussing with etube previously that the spam clicking being the meta is not great, especially when mfers are complaining about 3t barb

[hard axle]

lemme check the burn rates of non-sailing fish against them

[chrome lantern]

I can do you better let me
link a thing

[hard axle]

lol 40% at lowest possible level for marlin, reminds me of the old lobster/swords in f2p days

[chrome lantern]

https://discord.com/channels/324132423636090880/1449875287058677833

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1449875287058677833/1449877919924097276/image.png?ex=69ff0049&is=69fdaec9&hm=f165795a09a3c02619fc91e94cfe9796f8bbdebe0b8aabd0033acb79804ca2f5&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1449875287058677833/1449876949773324459/image.png?ex=69feff62&is=69fdade2&hm=8cdd0e1cd8f838a6bd6a103005a21bc68cf2b307906410a30a6729ab269ce159&

Not in order on that second one I just threw them all together

[ashen yarrow]

closest thing to those rates would be karambwan which is also similar catch per/h

[chrome lantern]

Karambwan burn rates are still astronomically better

Err lower

[[Cooked karambwan]]

[ornate wolf]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Cooked_karambwan

[chrome lantern]

I guess specifically, at the level you unlock cooking them sure it’s low

But that’s also like 30 cooking so it’s not really comparable

If you have 65 fishing to catch them surely your cooking is at least that high as well

But even if we go off 30 cooking the burn rate is still lower than every sailing food xd

[hard axle]

yeah, either they make the food more worthwhile or adjust the burn rates

kinda funny how sunlight antelopes are still technically the superior heal

moonlight*

[chrome lantern]

And as a reminder again, cooked karambwans, compared to giant krill,
-Require a lower fishing level and cooking level
-Have lower burn rates
-Heal more
-Impose less attack delay

-Are afk to fish

-Can be 1t cooked

[hard axle]

ye, its like 15 fish an hour if u giga afk

with badman's method

even that method is weak now because no longer 6 hour afkable

[chrome lantern]

I have done 30min afk krill fishing before on my snowflake and yeah it’s pretty bad even sitting on a double spot (I haven’t seen his method but it’s probably similar)

And if you logout or time out without emptying your net then it’s all lost anyway

[hard axle]

mhm, he used a bird to stop logout

[chrome lantern]

ic

[hard axle]

and then they hotfixed it

[chrome lantern]

lol

[meager flame]

i mean this is a bit true

a lot of sailing content is pretty much slop

like you could go out there and interact with a lot of it but lol

tons of it is like irrelevant in the sense that theres actually no reason to do it if you dont want to sail

[ashen yarrow]

95% of game is not end game, so same can be said about that

[meager flame]

or in some cases just flat out worse than content we've been running for years already

so like realistically if you dont want a specific wc method or some marginally better fish

you could just be level 1 sailing comfortably and not care that it exists

[ashen yarrow]

yes and if you dont want to do raids you dont have to do them

[meager flame]

yeah but the good skills generally aren't like that

like i can't stay level 1 con forever i cant be just 1 prayer

like i could do that but its a terrible idea

[ashen yarrow]

there is not a single skill that is must do

[meager flame]

yes there are if you want to play the whole game and do stuff a lot of the skills are like

extremely beneficial

[ashen yarrow]

you can play lvl3 skiller if you want to

[meager flame]

to the point that you're just self trolling if you dont do them

[chrome lantern]

I agree with both sides but Jagex also went out of their way to give absurdly disproportionately high xp rates specifically so that people would minimize their interaction with the skill if they didn’t want to do it but felt obligated to do it to max and entitled to high xp rates

[ashen yarrow]

yes sailing also has content you cannot do without doing sailing

[chrome lantern]

I think a better way to phrase what Turkey is trying to say is that nothing from Sailing feels compelling

Like I can look at a crystal halberd and say, “wow that has significant changes for me as a pvmer, I should go skill and quest and diary and get that,” but nothing really does that for Sailing

[ashen yarrow]

yes to players who only want new bis gear/items

[chrome lantern]

It doesn’t even have to be bis tbh but the balance of Sailing rewards is such that nothing is really useful at the level you unlock it tbh

Go train up for a rosewood blowpipe that’s worse than throwing rune or amethyst darts at a target, not to mention the toxic blowpipe

Go train high sailing and 99 cooking and 90 whatever fishing to reasonably obtain marlins on an iron (or buy on ge at 1 fishing/cooking/sailing) that are still less healing per slot than brews or even moonlight antelope

[ashen yarrow]

yes rune/amethyst darts are 0-1 max hit over rosewood blowpipe with addy darts at lower range and less accuracy

[chrome lantern]

Not even less accuracy if you just use an offhand like antler guard

[kind surge]

+1 max hit is also quite a lot for a 2t weapon

[ashen yarrow]

with antler guard is +1 max hit in most cases, -13 att and -2 tiles

[grave tinsel]

aquanites compelled me for 73, didnt see much else really in sailing

[ashen yarrow]

but i really dont get why you are expecting to fletch toxic blowpipe at 84 fletching from fishing drop

[chrome lantern]

Not really the main point, the main point is that it doesn’t really have a use case

[chrome lantern]

And yeah it’s abysmal how irrelevant the hopper is

[ashen yarrow]

hopper useless for end game yes

[kind surge]

hopper doesn't even work on shcb so it's not even good for mid

[grave tinsel]

oh yeah no that was for the seeds as an iron

[meager flame]

tbh i think their main issue with a lot of content they dont intend to be bis in 2026

[chrome lantern]

The hopper isn’t good at any stage at all

[kind surge]

antler guard is better than hopper

[meager flame]

is that the game is full of basically low tier drops and methods and items to use

so tossing more in there basically doesn't accomplish anything anymore

like even though this isn't bis

you see it a lot with things like moons

just kinda swooped in and deleted barrows and kinda sorta bandos too

easy to get very good for the level and it just kinda yeets content out of the game to make space for itself

and if they dont do that

we're like

[ashen yarrow]

in most cases hopper is better

[meager flame]

its cool that its new but its worse than what we already had so whats the point

its a pretty big problem that will only get worse

[ashen yarrow]

yes it is issue for end game players if they cannot get better gear from every update

[meager flame]

if you actually read what i was talking about you'd notice the example had nothing to do with end game lol

[ashen yarrow]

you have issue with mid game items being stronger than other mid game items because they lose purpose in end game

[kind surge]

every response to sailing criticism has to be that it's obviously not good for endgame players

[meager flame]

yeah this is talking to a wall

[ashen yarrow]

end game items being stronger than old end game items does the same thing

[meager flame]

it does but it has the benefit of an endless ceiling

you can keep progressing that way

if you just keep pumping similar items in at a target power level of level 70 though

your updates start either doing nothing or just only replacing things we already have

until you aren't actually making new fresh content/ideas for items

and instead just recycling what everyone uses at level 70

like

[chrome lantern]

It’s not even about endgame, it’s not good for my early/midgame account either, and even on my snowflake account where some of those items are bis they’re like, 0.5% more dos than the next best alternative, or the rosewood bp for special attacks only, and that acc has pretty trash gear

[meager flame]

a good example of a midgame upgrade was royal titans prayers and the staff

that was an open lane to do something in

they're just running out of those

[kind surge]

yeah titans has 0 bis stuff for endgame (ig discounting cheaper prayer cost of mystic vigour) but the items are still useful

[ashen yarrow]

which made all other staff useless in mid game

[meager flame]

all other staves were already useless mid game

thats why it was an open lane

[kind surge]

I mean a twinflame won't really beat the utility of having any spellbook while using a trident

[meager flame]

ya its for the like

ibans blast tier of gaming

or elemental weaknesses

its not directly trying to compete with tridents

[kind surge]

ye it has a niche and it's good there

[ashen yarrow]

so its fine to add mid game items that replace other mid game items but only when it benefits you

[chrome lantern]

“All other staffs” is also a bit reductive

You basically just mean battlestaffs and mystic staffs that are already like

Negligibly low tier items

[kind surge]

where the hell did this even come from lol

ragebait

[ashen yarrow]

every other normal spellbook casting staff got replaced until you are using surges

[kind surge]

what normal spellbook casting staves

the elemental staves like etube said?

[chrome lantern]

Yeah and as Turkey said, that’s not really a thing anyone was doing before twinflame

[kind surge]

those are day 1 items you get

of course they'll be replace, what the hell

[chrome lantern]

If you mean like SotD then that’s still the best demonbane staff before purging

[ashen yarrow]

smoke, iban's, god staves

[chrome lantern]

Kodai is best for barraging

Oh no not god staffs!!!

[kind surge]

who tf is using god staves

[chrome lantern]

Smoke staff was already useless

[kind surge]

ibans is just ironmeme

[meager flame]

i did (in 2004)

[kind surge]

idk how smoke staff compares when using surge but we have dhw now

[ashen yarrow]

smoke staff with fire spells is stronger than dhw

[meager flame]

the question is if thats strong enough for people to actually do that

[ashen yarrow]

basically you are fine with it because it become best mid game item

[meager flame]

because what twinflame did was actually be strong enough to hold down the niche for itself

so it expanded what players would actually do

[chrome lantern]

I don’t think that’s true considering they both provide 10% mdmg to standard spells

[meager flame]

i mean thats just the basic idea of horizontal progression you can create a million niches but its only a practical reality when those niches are something you'd actually use

theres a minimum threshold for how powerful they have to be

[kind surge]

smoke staff still beats twinflame with surge spells so idk why you used that as an example

[meager flame]

and if they cant do that they're just kinda in the game but not doing anything

[kind surge]

for elemental weakness

[ashen yarrow]

smoke is +10% damage and accuracy. dragon hunter wand just 10% damage, wand still better for dragons

[ashen yarrow]

yes, smoke is better at surge like i said twinflame replaces all other staves before surges

[kind surge]

that's fine since there's basically no staves before smoke bstaff and trident

[chrome lantern]

I’ll be honest, I didn’t know that, but again that’s more a reflection of the fact that smoke staff was already completely dead content even before twinflame

[kind surge]

I still don't understand why replacing a mystic air staff is considered something of a detriment

[ashen yarrow]

that is like saying replacing bronze dagger is not issue for melee

[kind surge]

I mean yeah

that is exactly what it's like

[chrome lantern]

Mystic air staff requires 40 magic and 40 attack but twinflame staff requires 60 magic with no attack requirement, this is unacceptable that the twinflame would replace the mystic air staff

[chrome lantern]

Are you trying to support your point or argue against it?

[ashen yarrow]

just used the logic that was used for magic

[kind surge]

thankfully the melee str reflects that, mystic air staff bashing stays winning

well you do get both an air staff and a bronze dagger day 1

[chrome lantern]

I don’t follow or know what logic you thought you were using or how this is supposed to reflect on why the twinflame staff is bad

[kind surge]

it's just ragebait

[ashen yarrow]

i have never said twinflame is bad. just that you are fine with new* mid game items as long as they become best mid game items

[chrome lantern]

I do think the twinflame staff is bad but that’s more because elemental magic is still bad overall when we consider that powered staffs and thralls exist

[kind surge]

twinflame isn't even the best mid game staff

[chrome lantern]

I do think that if the twinflame staff were useless then it would be bad to add it, yes

Earlygame staff*

[kind surge]

yeah exactly

you use trident for midgame

then go for eye

[chrome lantern]

Can even skip trident nowadays tbh

[kind surge]

twinflame will be more relevant for midgame once jagex expands on ele weakness and the gear for it

but like powered staves are still the best for the freedom of spellbook choice

and their damage is better anyways

[chrome lantern]

I think elemental weaknesses was a poor way to attempt to address the fundamental flaws of spellbook magic not scaling with your magic level beyond just unlocking spells

[kind surge]

not for trident since that's weaker than twinflame sometimes, ye

[chrome lantern]

And I don’t think it will ever be in a reasonable state tbh but I would not be surprised if project rebalance and raids rewards made it temporarily stronger than it should be

[tacit wharf]

most diverse skill with the amount of weakness and different spells u can use

but jagex just slaps that, powered staves best label on it all

[ashen yarrow]

main issue with elemental spells is that they are balanced around 2 items. buffing breaks the balance

[chrome lantern]

%dmg scaling, powered staffs, imbued -> saturated heart, and shadow are all symptoms of not fundamentally addressing spellbook magic only scaling with unlocking more spells

All of the issues we have now with magic balancing, elemental weaknesses, etc. all stem from the fundamental lack of proper spellbook damage scaling

[ashen yarrow]

yeah the scaling comes from twinflame and harm staff

[chrome lantern]

And are only exacerbated by things like raids overloads/salts

Harm also has a stranglehold on elemental magic yeah but they continue to treat it as a “flex item”

[minor whale]

If elemental spells buffed along with level it'd make magic much more fundamentally balanced
Things with elemental weakness will become much weaker to elemental spells, things without powered staves will still reign supreme

Or, just accept that the extremely strong normal spell book isn't gonna be bis for most things at all because it's just insane utility as well

[tacit wharf]

that'd be like them just completely ignoring stab for melee in light of slash (which they've done), which just limits gameplay

or putting a crush style on a weapon that has no right/reason to have it on the weapon, making it BIS not only in that sytle but also in another, and then wondering why other crush weapons dont get used in comparison

[ashen yarrow]

people also do not want new crush weapons because they could devalue scythe and there is "no crush content" to use crush weapons at

Like the logic that jagex has to add a lot of crush weakness content before they can add crush weapon sounds so weird

[thick beacon]

i feel like eye solved a lot of magic gaps feel like melee/range need better gap fillers and more focus imo

[queen galleon]

you know what i think, is that, they should have never put a limit on pact resets

and let us change our build anytime we want

just always make the reset button active

because i have no more resets, and im stuck on a build that doesnt work

or at least give us 2 demonic pacts at a time instead of 1 at a time and let us have more points to spend

so we arent put in a rut complaining that theres not enough resets, or that we were limited in the first place

just make it free bro

i legit am having the worst time of my life trying to kill echo thermy

i bet jmods dont even read what we say in here do they

there's no way im the only one who wants the resets to just not cost anything and be free

[ember token]

right now the jmods are sleeping after a long time at the pub and getting ready their weekend

[restive siren]

they do read this and reddit thats why they gave more resets

[hasty shard]

have you considered not sucking

[restive siren]

they just disagree with infinite resets and from the threads ive seen people are split on that too

[tacit wharf]

we were given plenty of resets

[queen galleon]

oh i far from suck at the game

ive completed all jad challenges

even the leagues one

and inferno

and everything else under the sun

numerous grandmaster challenges

[ember token]

they give infinite resets and the complaints move on to not having loadouts for pact trees

[queen galleon]

they also removed some of the tasks that would have gave us resets

9 isnt enough

in most games that have trees like this, there is a REASON for why they dont lock down the trees

because we need time and access to swap things around freely in order to find out what works and what doesnt

[ember token]

yeah well this is leagues, you make your choice and stick with it

[tacit wharf]

well aware of poe, jagex gave us way more than enough resets

[queen galleon]

poe, diablo, destiny 2, elder scrolls online, etc etc

you can have that opinion

it is what it is

it just kinda sucks

(not you) the locked down aspect

[tacit wharf]

it doesnt, its peoples indecisiveness

[queen galleon]

i just wish it was better some how

it could be better

[tacit wharf]

i mean, no matter how good it is, there is always going to be that person that just isnt happy

[restive siren]

why am i getting a thumbs down

[ember token]

i didnt react to your message so i dont know how that happened

[queen galleon]

lool

it wasnt me

(caught you on the counter) wasnt me

[ember token]

idk thumbs down is one of my quick emotes so maybe thats what happened

[restive siren]

hate the double tap on mobile

[tacit wharf]

its pretty easy to do when u click over from another screen

[hard axle]

I don't think he realizes that a bunch of the content that came with Sailing is functionally not worth to go out of your way to get and he's just blindly defending it because it's "not endgame content"

Due to how easy it is to get Zombie Axe, Folly was considered unbalanced and they changed it by buffing the rate by 33%.

Same with the fish, most of the time it's just not worth it to get because they don't really change much or aren't significantly better, and existing methods are more convenient or better to get food.

It's like if Moons Armor were 5x as rare and it was still better to skip over it.

[queen galleon]

folly is almost as good as fang

its most definitely worth having

all the moons gear as well

since blood moon is basically bandos with less defensive

blue moon best in slot at yama

[hasty shard]

i feel like halibut are free since they swap out for karams

but other than that eh

[austere mulch]

Can get marlins quicker than anglers for irons too but everyone just afks anglers so it’s not like it’s gonna make a diff lol

[chrome lantern]

Yeah similar with karambwans vs. halibut

[hasty shard]

halibut are at least an upgrade, anglerfish overheal i refuse to pass up

so marlins are like, a pvp upgrade ig cause moonlight antelope exists

[hard axle]

I would double check the math on this, but the hours wise to get a task and hit rate at bird at that level is much slower than just camping zombie axe for a while, which is why its basically used as a whip substitute on every iron that endgame players start

[hard axle]

@chrome lantern its only faster if u spam click net and follow, and slower if you end up burning through the diabolic worms from yama grind

[chrome lantern]

Ah yes worms

(I don't think I got a lot of those tbh I spooned

[hard axle]

yup, the worms that should've been on doom table

like bruh

even if it was a severely reduced amount

shark lures \

[chrome lantern]

Shark lure are such a joke

Even if you pretend sharks are useful they're a joke

[hard axle]

they would've been useful if they properly multiplied pet rate like initially mentioned

[chrome lantern]

Or at least xp to make shark fishing a viable xp

[meager flame]

I wish they would do something about trawling lol

Even though it’s brand new I honestly have a hard time calling it like

Good content

The fish are good but it’s pretty painful

[tacit wharf]

nuke it, move the fishing outfit elsewhere

[meager flame]

Nah deep sea trawling

[nocturne solstice]

Deep sea does feel a bit odd. Low XP, not afk, good money which balances but feels weird.

[meager flame]

If I were really comparing it to something it’s like rooftop agility and alching

[nocturne solstice]

I can see that

[meager flame]

You pay enough attention to basically be clicking all the time but man you’re just going in circles lol

[nocturne solstice]

I dont mind the circle bit but the low xp and how much clicking feels bad

[meager flame]

Yeah it’s the element of paying attention to nothing basically

If it were a little less intense as far as clicking it would be an improvement but lol

You’re reallyyyyy encouraged to spam click

[minor whale]

It feels bad being such bad XP when it's brand new content and the only of its kind for sure

[chrome lantern]

Just eliminate the spamclick method entirely and rebalance output accordingly

[nocturne solstice]

I would like the shoals to stay a while longer and make it a bit more afk and more xp 😅

agreed on removing spamclick

[chrome lantern]

I think that's fair too

[nocturne solstice]

I wouldnt mind if they kept a weird method for spamclick fans though. Like I know you can rod fish em so if you can 3t do that then sure idc.

[chrome lantern]

The rod fishing is so beyond awful but that's a different discussion xd

like idk why it's even an option tbh

Because it basically isn't

[nocturne solstice]

im not sure either but it encourages more co-op in an mmo so im fine with it

[chrome lantern]

No I mean like you might as well just not be fishing instead of trying to rod fish them

[nocturne solstice]

oh for sure, but now you can have a buncha dumb friends on a fishing trip and they can have something to do even if its minimal

this is assuming 3+ peeps and the nets are occupied

[hard axle]

shooting stars tech

[nocturne solstice]

huge

[meager flame]

its just weird because i know a lot of people really don't like a lot of the stuff that deep sea trawling is mechanically

like

its basically a skilling method designed in a lab for me to not like it lol

[nocturne solstice]

for me the most annoying was having to change the net depth for npcs

cause i kinda thought the whole point of NPCs was that THEY do it

[meager flame]

and im not entirely sure how it turned out the way it is because jagex is on record talking about stuff like rooftop agility being pretty bad

i guess maybe they felt like it was a little different because the shoal stops

[hard axle]

Make the food better

Hate that they removed the one continuous use of Leechfin and there's no new physical rewards from the new method.

[meager flame]

but because spam click is so heavily rewarded you're just there not taking a break anyways

because you gotta spam click lol

also as kind of a selfish ask i think a low key annoying part about it maybe because you're also spam clicking

is that the shoals dont match your boat for speed and aren't consistent themselves they go faster and slower

so sometimes the better boat feels worse than having a boat maybe a tier lower

[nocturne solstice]

With rosewood you can always match their speed but that's also a LOT of gp investment for a fishing method

[meager flame]

nah like with halibut you're almost always either slightly slower which is fine or quite a lot faster

so you do a bit of slowing down to not leave it behind

[nocturne solstice]

soz i only do marlin so that'll be what my takes are on

[meager flame]

i think they didn't really think it through entirely

because if you do come back for some of the lower level fish it can be awkward and make you almost want multiple trawlers or something lol

[chrome lantern]

Go kill a few hundred more rays

Or I guess just facility bottle them

On that note

Man am I glad they screwed up the ray barb drop rates

[meager flame]

oh yeah same i went and finished my max fishing/trawler boat a few days ago

and had to kinda go through and kill stingrays albatross and some narwhals

it was somehow worse than i remembered lol

like

my boat can't take damage nothing is happening we're killing these random creatures looting is slow etc

definitely reminded me to never ask for any sailing bosses lol

and if the rates weren't bugged originally

i would've been out there all day

[nocturne solstice]

They did buff the whole looting thing a while ago, did you do the whole pvm before or after?

Marlins make you go through krakens so my ship still gest chipped, feels bad man

[chrome lantern]

I killed 3900 vampire krakens under the old system

Fired 100k or so iron cannonballs because that's all that was in stock at the time

Used a single cannon for most of it because Jagex patched double cannon spots

Fired my tbow with rune arrows at 27% power or whatever it was

Didn't even get all 5 bottled storms I wanted

[nocturne solstice]

I have no idea what my KC on them is but I got a few drops haha

It was pretty slow though, I used the uhh mermaid safespot method

[chrome lantern]

I did that initially

[meager flame]

ya i afked there and got 1 bottled storm i think i went 2x drop rate on it though

[meager flame]

both im talking about looting being slow like 3 days ago though in this case

[nocturne solstice]

i think i got annoyed with how slow it was and moved to great white sharks cause there was a double spot I could use.

double safe spot

[meager flame]

if its close enough to the part of the ship you're on its fine it just happens asap

[nocturne solstice]

Yeah ngl the drop rates were.... brutal

Are brutal actually

i remember them being buffed but probs still harsh

[meager flame]

but when you start running across the boat before your character will pick stuff up or will actually throw the net you just watch pull stuff in

or have to cast telegrab

its like

slow and clunky compared to just playing the regular game

[nocturne solstice]

That would be a nice change, just have em throw immediately

[meager flame]

the actual drop rates on the stuff like ray barbs is actually super generous and easy

[nocturne solstice]

if you're out of range then just send a message in chat "you are too far!"

oh yeah normal stuff like that is fine

[meager flame]

but just doing the content and watching your character take business days to do anything is pretty brutal

[nocturne solstice]

just the dragon stuff is a bit brutal especially with how many we need

[meager flame]

they even tried to like

make it so your character stayed on the cannon if you use telegrab

[chrome lantern]

Does that not work?

[meager flame]

but its involved in the attack delay so you click to telegrab something and just sorta wait for your character to get it together

[chrome lantern]

I haven't tried obviously

[nocturne solstice]

i thought it worked like that

[meager flame]

no it "works"

[chrome lantern]

Ah yes

[meager flame]

its just like you're playing a turn based strategy game

[chrome lantern]

Sailing combat is flawless

[nocturne solstice]

ive only been deep sea trawling lately haha

[meager flame]

and you're kinda just lol

waiting to see things happen

like if you could actually move as smoothly as you do on land

[nocturne solstice]

In the recent update they added the "telegrab and stay on cannon" ye

i dont blame ya for missin that

[meager flame]

it would be faster to just jump into the ocean and swim back sometimes

[nocturne solstice]

but its good that was added

[meager flame]

its interesting because a lot of the jmods apparently are like me

or at least rice is

[nocturne solstice]

big brain idea, TFA reward can be faster telegrab scroll

[meager flame]

where he really wants actions to happen quickly and smoothly if you decide to click on stuff

unless they really cant allow that

but in sailing that's just out the window tons of stuff is just delayed and weird

[nocturne solstice]

Maybe, I imagine the tick system plays a big role it making things feel delayed and clunky.

[meager flame]

yes and no like

im sure everyone has taken some agility shortcut where your character runs up to it then stops and walks back to a specific spot

then you watch the animation play out

then you're allowed to play again

[chrome lantern]

Yeah and I mark the tile I actually want to stand on

[meager flame]

i forget what its called but thats actually something jagex used to do when they were very afraid of players doing something while something else was happening

so they were locking you down

thats actually not necessary almost ever and they've been removing them

and just letting you fly through obstacles basically

the tick it registers you're trying to do it

[sly basin]

the baiter award goes to........

[kind surge]

ancient cavern whirlpool and the fence jump south of varrock come to mind

[meager flame]

apparently older iterations of jagex were really worried about things happening so it was seen as best practice

[kind surge]

it feels really bad when it does happen

[meager flame]

to just do that a lot

especially in old old quests you can see it

hopefully one day they take a pass over the boat and stuff like looting though to just make it all snappier

[tacit wharf]

@steel bobcat

oh it doesnt open one

[chrome lantern]

Yeah gotta go DM it

[balmy tapir]

not an agi shortcut but: Talking to Snowflake in Weiss is like this.

[ashen yarrow]

my favorite in leagues is trying to use shilo village stepping stone from bank and character starts running to the other side of the river to use it

[kind surge]

lmao

[median oxide]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7LJcJqzSYs

When will this be fixed? Akkha orbs got bugged at the same time with Zebak waves.

[south void]

Dang, they just shifted to right on top of you, that's crazy 🤣

[median oxide]

Yeah, threw me off a bit 😄

[final frigate]

nice clicks

[true talon]

Teleporting orbs lmao

[chrome lantern]

Make it an invocation and I’m in :p

Continual reminder that ToA bad though fr

[fluid veldt]

When are the trouver parchment changes supposed to happen?

[hollow pumice]

man all these bugs look so much more fun than the normal raid

[lilac blaze]

oof, a 700 solo ToA isn't a guaranteed purple?

[minor whale]

No expected date, but I think a jmod said some of the updates from that blog are starting next week

I REALLY hope the trouver one comes next week

It'll atleast be SOMETHING for content main-game

[lilac blaze]

gem bag was supposed to get an update last week iirc

which it didn't haha

[hearty pivot]

Is it just me who feel like skilling matters less and less the more time passes?

I feel like u get way way more resources from combat than the actual skilling themselves, like woodcutting, u get 1000x more bird nests from killing a mole boss than just cutting trees.

Ores, coal (especially), logs, herbs, food, runes, everything really, combat/slayer gives u all of it and in higher quantities. Only reason for skilling is getting 99 or requirements for like quests or diaries.

Why is this the state of the game? Like I'd get if u would get less resources per hour doing combat only, but it seems to always be more per hour through combat than the actual dedicated skills themselves, no?

[ember token]

yeah youre like 12 years late on this one

[thick beacon]

i feel birdnests is like one of the best ones where the integrity is still there tbh

like they removed bird nests from basically all bosses and best way to get them really is through hunter

and mole isint really a passive boss either on progression

its not just cmb either shops are also insane

dont really think they should change it itd be to hard and i think many ppl like the current state

theyd have to nerf like all bosses drop tables and shops and then also buff existing skilling methods to fill gap itd be a nightmare imo and a lot of time

[hearty pivot]

1 hour of combat = ~100 birdnests, 1 hour of hunting using redwood birdhouses = ~10 birdnests, mole is relatively afk as combat goes.

[thick beacon]

in terms of realtime though ur getting 10nests in 2mins

feel like most irons built a very good chunk of their stack through bh or rumors

rather then mole

[dawn jackal]

irons do birdhouses and uims do mole

there's just not a good solution to the skilling issue you described. The resources themselves aren't super useful, and getting them is tedious outside of pvm

skilling as the downtime between questing / pvm is pretty adequate at this point

[thick beacon]

feel like u really dont have to go out of ur way tbh outside early/midgame

[hearty pivot]

i hate birdhouses :p

[thick beacon]

so much of everything just feels passive/free like 0 effort

[hearty pivot]

anything "farming"/time-gated i try to avoid like the plague

[thick beacon]

biggest brickwall isint even having supplies its just planting infinite stack of seeds imo

[hearty pivot]

for me it's literally just it feeling like a chore

[thick beacon]

and u still get enough raw herbs from pvm to where u dont really have to do that much either

[hearty pivot]

i gotta do this every 1x hour, this every 3.5x hours, that 6x hours, that 24x hours, that 72x hours, etc.

[dawn jackal]

unless you're an iron birdhouses aren't even efficient past like 45 hunter or smth anyway

[hearty pivot]

i am iron :p

[dawn jackal]

and if you're an iron and you don't like hourlies you picked the wrong game mode

[hearty pivot]

xdd

i mean i get enough seeds from contracts anyweays

i have more than i'll ever probably plant

[dawn jackal]

there's ways around birdhouse runs but they'll just be slower than griding out your hourlies

[hearty pivot]

i mean it's just the birdnests ig that im missing out on in reality

[dawn jackal]

its just good herb xp yea

[hearty pivot]

and that i can get more than enough from just killing the mole for an hour or two

[hearty pivot]

herb xp -> misc and slayer

im rarely farming, maybe once a week if even that, maybe once a month xd

[dawn jackal]

you are allowed to play your account however you like

[thick beacon]

think u legit just detour to catch chins and then go back to bh runs

[hearty pivot]

i mean, i have enough lol

[dawn jackal]

you do DN from whenever you unlock to 200m hunter if you want to be efficient.

[thick beacon]

drift net is efficent on iron?

[hearty pivot]

drift is hard to get on iron, no?

cause u gotta farm the things to craft them

[thick beacon]

ye and no birdnests

[hearty pivot]

is ur discord LIGHT MODE

[dawn jackal]

yea sorry my eyes are stronger than your

[hearty pivot]

they are

im jealous af

[thick beacon]

this is temple iron ehp

[dawn jackal]

yea, one thing to remember with EHP is the goal is 200m all

so iron stuff gets a little hard to keep track of

[thick beacon]

but i also feel like most ppl dont care for 200m only 99s

or post 99 xp in general

[hearty pivot]

drift net will always be higher total xp/hr, cause it mixes fishing AND hunting

with insanely good rates

[dawn jackal]

same diference though from 99 to 200m for the most part

yea drift net is some of the most broken skilling rates they've ever made

[thick beacon]

ye but not even temple reccomends it for 99+

[hearty pivot]

but if ur looking for specifically fishing, or specifically hunting, standalone are better

[thick beacon]

and temple is pretty accurate with methods

[dawn jackal]

correct you do not do any drift netting on an iron

getting and spinning jute does not make sense

[hearty pivot]

im guessing that's cause ur limited and gate-kept by jute farming

[thick beacon]

guess i misunderstood

[hearty pivot]

and getting 200m in one skill vs 2 skills at the same time are two completely different goals

[thick beacon]

its efficent on main 100%

[dawn jackal]

even if you could though, the time save getting black chins (range xp) would outweigh the xp of drift net on an iron

[thick beacon]

but i think iron like theres to much hurdles to make it worth even with how good it is for mains

[hearty pivot]

if ur looking to get both fishing and hunting, yes

if just fishing or just hunting, no

faster methods

[dawn jackal]

yes temple ehp assumes that you have a reasonable cash flow and your goal is 200m all

so if that is not your goal or you do not play alt accounts to fund your main accounts training then you can adjust

[thick beacon]

temple is kinda outdated in someways though but idt drift has changed for irons really

mixology is a minor buff to herb ehp afaik for reg irons

[dawn jackal]

uh im not sure temple has been updated with rates but coral just fucked the whole herb skill sideways

i don't think you do much mixology on an iron

[thick beacon]

ye that to

[dawn jackal]

UIM for sure

coral was a lockheed martin nuke on the whole game mode honestly

[thick beacon]

u can bank like easily 99herb from pvm alone

[dawn jackal]

so much of the cool macro planning on irons got ruined by coral

[hearty pivot]

wats coral

[thick beacon]

umbra coral arma brew spam

[meager flame]

dont worry

what comes next is worse

[hasty shard]

and people still complained 😭

[dawn jackal]

people as we are well well aware are morons

[meager flame]

i've been sitting here asking what im going to do about it when the haemostatic dressing ends up being really good/required

and the answers are all really bad lol

[tacit wharf]

a lot of the time, people just have to understand, u dont have to do something just because its off cooldown to do it, or u dont have to stick to one thing till its finished

most of my grinds, herb runs in the morning, 10 herbies a day, 10 barrows chests a day, 6 cg chests, x amount of agility laps, a bh run

[meager flame]

and its because of cotton seeds specifically

[hasty shard]

cant wait for maggot king to just start the fight by applying a 1000 DoT bleed

and it never uses bleeds the rest of it

[meager flame]

ya like the coral part is easy i got like 148 coral from one plant earlier but lmaoo

the cotton just bricks everything

[hasty shard]

and people complained about coral despite this

[meager flame]

tbf i think it used to basically just die and not provide nearly as much

[hasty shard]

no it was still 100+ and you just paid protection

it didnt die if you yknow, interacted with the gameplay loop they set up 😭

[meager flame]

ya i'll never struggle with that part since i had 99 crafting banked in seaweed

then got it from gems from cox and other pvm instead

idk how they even avoid the crash honestly though assuming they want people to use that item

[dawn jackal]

i would imagine the large majority of the playerbase does not understand why coral is problamatic

so idk

[meager flame]

maybe if the content somehow provides the seeds so that you can actually get into the loop of crafting your own but lol

it really looks like afk killing birds or afk salvage simulator for like

honestly an absurd length of time

this is one of those times where they didn't do a good job integrating sailing basically

if it were anything else we'd be getting them via playing the game like normal people from seed packs or something along those lines

or they'd be on a bunch of drop tables out in the game where you might actually kill the stuff

[novel sonnet]

o ho

[hasty shard]

corals easy to understand but crab farming is a cryptid that nobody has touched

i presume its like net traps if they were good

[meager flame]

ya coral is literally just farming

[dawn jackal]

coral changed like 6 skills on irons lol

[hasty shard]

for all i know crab paste probably stacks 😭

[meager flame]

i just mean the gameplay of it

there is no mystery you cant use compost

[dawn jackal]

i be watching someone farm crabs in real time ?

[meager flame]

and otherwise 1:1

[hasty shard]

i did coral farming early on because it was kinda nutty gp for no effort

[dawn jackal]

or is this not what you are referring to

[hasty shard]

then redditors complained and ruined that

[meager flame]

this is what pain looks like though

thats it for cotton seeds

[hasty shard]

its a mix of like, people refusing to interact with sailing and ive also just literally not seen anyone do it lol

[dawn jackal]

hmm i feel like there are different discussions go on

my point is coral is way too broken for herb xp on an iron

and kinda fucks the gamemode up

[meager flame]

i mean

idk

herblore is easy on irons i know everyone acts like its not

but like

[dawn jackal]

you gotta play your account with herb in mind though

[meager flame]

im well beyond 99 herblore on my iron and i've only ever made potions to actually use

[hasty shard]

sure

[dawn jackal]

you had to have specific slayer lists and farm certain herbs

aren't you doing some varlamore only account

[hasty shard]

yes im memeing

[meager flame]

i never had a slayer list for herblore and i did farm certain herbs but

they're just to make potions to kill stuff with

like supercombats range pots brews prayer pots and super restores

to 99 and beyond

its not like i could've opted out of making those pots i need them lmao

[thick beacon]

feel like its been solved since farming contracts were introdcued tbh

dont know how irons dealt with herb b4 that sounds like a nightmare

[meager flame]

i mean i imagine a lot of people just did what i did

when i didnt want to use potions or had to save them i just did

i'd flick or whatever to stretch everything as far as i could

[tacit wharf]

or instead of trying to fight people at catacomb nechrael's, guess what, they drop a ton of herb seeds

[meager flame]

but like in the remotely modern game im talking like cox until now

stuff just drops everything you'd need and as long as you keep going back to where you got seeds you can't run out

[tacit wharf]

so does huey

[meager flame]

i imagine they probably went to like spectres and nechs back once upon a time

[thick beacon]

masterfarmer rouge outfit is pretty cracked

think its like 20+ranarr seeds an hour

thats been out for long time

[true talon]

Going dry at chambers

[frozen lion]

Can there be at least small chance for huge leechfin which would be clog?

I like clogs in different activities, shows you acutally did some content.

[ember token]

sorry that would add a reason to actually do the content so we cant have that

[chrome lantern]

Yeah it’s crazy that it requires cotton and not like linen

Lowest tier coral requires cotton from seeds that are turbo awful to get

Makes it a joke to pretend it’s a viable potion to train herblore with and even more of a joke to pretend any ironman will ever use it

[chrome lantern]

On release the coral was really bad. At 99 farming I got 2, 3, or 5 coral from my first like 9 plants, then a single one that would give 57

[chrome lantern]

Yeah, this. Herblore was never a problem.

[chrome lantern]

Yeah I also completely skipped like all aberrant specter tasks, closest I came to herbs from slayer tasks was like barraging dagannoth and getting seeds, or herb sack during barrage tasks

Never even did tower nechs

[ashen yarrow]

yeah before buffs i was getting 3-90 per coral run*

[chrome lantern]

I don’t think the quantity was necessarily an issue just the one harvest life made it feel horrible especially if you got unlucky multiple times in a row

But yeah I will say that on my snowflake ranged-only iron (atk/str/magic = lvl 1 only restriction), coral has been absurdly strong and all I’m doing is making thousands of potions I will never use ever

And now I can make arma brews that replace having to get wines of zamorak on that acc

[true talon]

Gonna be awful if it’s ever Meta

[ashen yarrow]

time to sit afk salvaging low tier shipwrecks for hours for cotton seeds

actually seems like killing narwhals would be best source of cotton seeds after the combat changes

[true talon]

Narwhal is def better than salvaging

[meager flame]

problem is then that you're doing sailing combat

there aren't really any good solutions because no matter which way you turn its never passively part of something that's actually worth a person doing and its going to be slow with varying levels of attention being paid to it

[ashen yarrow]

can get like 100 seeds while getting collection logs from salvage but other than that you grind them with no other benefits

[meager flame]

its one of those times where you can tell sailing isn't integrated with the rest of the game

yeah and also there are 0 benefits to getting clogs

[ashen yarrow]

5k xp lamp

oh the fremmenik one gives 15k lamp

[meager flame]

idk why they didn't but they really should've included sailing seeds with farming contracts and npcs outside of sailing

[ashen yarrow]

watch them add cotton seeds to raids 4 drop table and mains will riot because it drops worthless seeds

well honestly cotton seeds would make sense as drop from content that uses haemostatic dressing

[meager flame]

nah they'd just say its not thematic

because that matters for drop tables now apparently

[zenith pike]

you can't make me pick cotton, I aint opening that chest

[meager flame]

i do think there is a pretty hilarious but also horrific set of memes waiting to be born if everyone is locked away somewhere farming cotton seeds wishing for freedom

hopefully they get over the thematics if they want us to use the dressing for the maggot king and he drops the seeds if nothing else

[ashen yarrow]

I will still probably grind some more cotton seeds before maggot boss just in case. only 180 cotton yarns in bank on iron currently

[chrome lantern]

Way more than I have

No seeds

[round lintel]

Whats all the conversation about the cotton about? Did I miss sny blog?

[ashen yarrow]

there has been talk about maggot king maybe having mechanic that require haemostatic dressing. If they do that then only way to get cotton is seeds from 2 different salvage at 1/300-1/500 rate or narwhals 1/35 rate

[round lintel]

I see sounds like u just gotta eat the bleed up

[ashen yarrow]

if there is a bleed that hits hard it might waste a lot of food/brews without the dressing

[mint stratus]

The unfortunate part of status effects 😔

Either its strong enough that you need to mitigate it or you dont care and just eat through it

[meager flame]

i mean there wouldn't be a problem if actually making the thing wasn't complete nonsense

like lol

im pretty sure you have to afk salvage for significantly longer than it takes the seeds to grow and fighting narwhals likely cant overcome that gap either but i dont have numbers on how many narwhals you can slay per hour

so they're going to be so unavailable that its probably just unplayable for people without immense amounts of time and effort if they end up being required

so they really need to like

add more sources or require fewer seeds per patch or increase yield significantly or something if they're ever intended to be used

its fine right now because you only ever really need to plant a few patches in the lifetime of your account but actually supporting regular use of cotton for anything is a nightmare

[ashen yarrow]

narwhals would probably be able to barely drop enough for all hops patches if you are in late game gear

[meager flame]

yeah you'd need to kill i think something like 225 narwhals per 100 minutes to keep all patches actually rotating while you're playing

assuming you're like

exclusively a narwhal slaying gamer

[ashen yarrow]

from what im seeing in gearscape average TTK on narwhals would be 20-30sec depending on gear and which tier cannonballs

[meager flame]

ya basically you'd have 6 minutes to spare for travel

if it was 25s per kill

what a gameplay loop

[ashen yarrow]

oh wait it doesnt include cannons for TTK, so slightly better

[hard axle]

New stream?

[ashen yarrow]

no idea how cannons work for ttk in gearscape. dps goes up by 70% but ttk stays same

[meager flame]

the funny thing is that after this insane cycle you'd be doing it all for 83 pots an hour

that might kinda get you somewhere depending on how many you actually use

well

i should say 83 pots a cycle

since its 100 mins

[hard axle]

Eventually they’ll let a npc loot for you so sailing/bounty tasks becomes fully automatic

just need to sail there each task

[meager flame]

id be cool with them just backing down on ship looting

and having it just appear in my inventory

lmao it honestly feels really bad to loot at sea still

[hard axle]

nah, make it require a crewmate

That’s better than spawning it

2 firing at will, 1 looting, 1 steering, u shadowing

[meager flame]

nah when they're done with us i'll be some barnacle encrusted clown wearing my heavy cannon at sea only range gear

[hasty shard]

its 100% ending up here and its just like

why was it ever added

[hard axle]

To make crewmates relevant, and thus higher sailing levels relevant

Big fan of progression over just giving shit by default

[hasty shard]

i meant combat

salvaging reskin how enthralling

[bronze kernel]

Ship combat would be better if we had more powerful ship weapons and options

Like turning your mast into a giant powered staff

And firing magical blasts at the enemies

And 1-tick cannons. Or a ballista that fires a massively powerful shot with huge AoE

Let me turn my boat into a dreadnought, Jagex

[nocturne solstice]

I dont think that'll make it better, just make it bigger numbers 😅

I'd lean into focusing on mobility (we're on moving ships after all) and crew v crew combat. So more skillshots, less click and forget like what we have now for cannons, traps like sea mines being deployed, and the ability to board ships.

[hard axle]

that's for the galleon boat

5 fucking cannons

and 1 shadow ofc

[chrome lantern]

The remaining time is coral farming and getting frags

[spark agate]

Why do we get information 24 hours before tuesday maintenance about the maintenance, but nothing until an hour before the wednesday updates?

[kind surge]

during leagues we won't get any big updates, it's mainly updates following recent qol polls

likely we'll get the untradables and parchment changes this week

[minor whale]

Wednesday updates also have no downtime

You don't need to tell people the game is offline for a 45 minute period every game update, and the ones that do need downtime they usually tell us

[tough nacelle]

Don’t worry we won’t get big updates this year either

🙂

[tender harness]

Sailing buffs but no sailing cape buff?

Jagex please

[solar dirge]

"Polling an auto-retaliate feature for cannons while you're on them." wait what is that seriously not a thing?

[tender harness]

Also

We're no longer proceeding with Pirate Encounters

no buffs to sailing cape. Pirate encounters got binned probably for obvious reasons
Crewmates are turning sailing into full automation

[solar dirge]

wow, snuck that one in there didn't you. think maybe that might have been worthy of mentioning in the overview

are the rewards getting redistributed or what

[tender harness]

They didnt say

They just snuck that in at the bottom of the blog

In typical we hope nobody sees

[restive storm]

this was a BUG?!@? LOOOL\

[brisk hill]

Maybe trouver changes before the end of the year

[tender harness]

6 months to fix that

And yeah it was

Obnoxious ass bug too

[restive storm]

i would never in my life have admitted that lmao - thats actually so embarassing

i woulda just said "we changed our mind"

[tender harness]

They're turning sailing into such a weird skill
Crewmates are basically bots with extra steps

[bright ocean]

Really sad they're pushing back the combat changes, that should be priority number one. Needs to be broken and put back together correctly before it's too late to fix

[restive sapphire]

They need to buff gryphon task rate to 15 bc of frost dragons

[tender harness]

Nah I agree with this atleast. They need to do it and do it right. They fucked it up the first time as it is. It will take time and its something people need to accept. Id rather combat comes when it comes and just get updates to sailing

Because they truly have no idea what they want combat to be

And rushing it makes no sense

And im shocked to basically see them flat out say how useless dragon cannons are

[brisk hill]

“Crew mates” for all skills when?

[bright ocean]

As much as people complain about sailing being standalone and not integrated in the game, it's actually a good thing here so they can mess around with numbers at will. Try swinging the pendulum in the other direction and make canons giga OP, see what happens. Nothing in main game is affected (yet)

[tender harness]

New mtx
Skilling mates who skill for you at 50% reduced rates

[ashen yarrow]

dont worry cannons will have their identity once boat pvp comes

[brisk hill]

PvP

Boat combat will be the straw that breaks the PvP back on God

[tender harness]

But man jagex refuses to acknowledge the absolute shit state sailing cape is in

[bright ocean]

Yes, the dragon cannon should out dps the shadow

Idk why they're so protective of the shadow lmao

Cannot balance the game around that thing

[lament ridge]

I think it’s probably the best option for now but jesus does it suck that we’re finally getting a main game update again next month and still parts of it have been stripped to rework for later

[tender harness]

Stripped? They flat out binned pirate encounters

[bright ocean]

This too, I really just want it to have both teleports as a nice qol so you can be on other spellbooks

[lament ridge]

I understood it as stripped until they get a better idea of ship to ship combat, but maybe I misinterpreted?

[bright ocean]

Yeah so not this year

[brisk hill]

Jagex doesn’t put any time into PvP already. How could you even believe a statement like this?

[restive storm]

yeah trying to add sailing pvp would be the dumbest thing jagex could possibly do l ol

[neon anvil]

would the proposed frost dragon weighting change be toggleable?

[ashen yarrow]

you would need to pay slayer points to unlock the better rate. most likely losing points if you disable it

[remote eagle]

Seems kind of redundant to need 2x unlocks for one creature

[lament ridge]

I was referring to the pirate encounters, not boat pvp. I really don’t have any expectations for that coming out anytume soon

[tender harness]

well good news its not. they scrapped it

[solar dirge]

well we've just been told it is actually not coming out at all.

[tender harness]

they may salvage it at some point but its not coming at all for now

[neon anvil]

ye agreed, esprcially if you need to respend 200 points every time you change it to grind different things

[ashen yarrow]

it is same for multiple different tasks too. pay to unlock, pay more to extend

[remote eagle]

How is the medallion not a full replacement to underwater equipment at this point

[tender harness]

because like most things with sailing its half baked

[fringe rivet]

something something balance

[neon anvil]

does anything else have an unlock that changes weighting after already bring unlocked?

[ashen yarrow]

no, because other tasks like that are not available from certain slayer masters before you unlock them

[fringe rivet]

I am happy to hear about more XP for courier runs (desperately needed), but I am a little underwhelmed by the proposed Loot Sacks, feel like it could be more.

[bronze kernel]

Loot sacks I think are fine.

[fringe rivet]

Gonna need to know more about what those "thematic drops" are

[tender harness]

I mean loot sacks are better than what courier runs are at all

[bronze kernel]

Depends on the drop rate of the stuff too

[tender harness]

which is insulting GP

[bronze kernel]

But I think they'll be fine

[wheat mirage]

Great that we can change the facility order in the Side panel, but it's not very flexible that you have to go to a shipyard to make this happen. I think many players will have a combined fishing/combat boat for example and this will mean you will have to take your boat to the shipyard before swapping activity (without the need to to actually build/swap positions on any facility on the boat). In my opinion this should be possible to edit in the ui without going to the shipyard (this works great with RL)

[bronze kernel]

The sailing only accounts will also love this too

[tender harness]

also the TLDR for pirates basically gone but open to bringing them back
new cannonballs are coming atleast but again with how fucked cannons are right now those are basically dead

[lament ridge]

Pirate encounters or pvp? Because further down in the blog it says they want to revisit pirate encounters later (but like someone else mentioned, that wont be this year)

[restive storm]

new cannonballs

[fringe rivet]

One of the core issues with sailing is it doesn't provide much loot for other skills, sheets and nails just cycle back into sailing

But if Loot Sacks give other loot, like monkfish, runes, other random stuff, then it could be handy

[tender harness]

read the mod response they pirate encounters are not coming

[bright ocean]

New cannonballs with nothing to shoot them at

[bronze kernel]

Let me make my boat the next Yamato or Bismarck

[ember token]

As we prioritise improving combat foundations, Pirate Encounters will no longer be launching as part of the Red Reef update. Boat-to-boat combat will still feature within the quest, and we're keen to hear your feedback once you’ve had a chance to try it. Pirate Encounters remain something we would like to explore as standalone content in the future.

[lament ridge]

for now which is what I said?

[fringe rivet]

Give us a Sailing specific slayer master and we'll be rolling in profit

[bronze kernel]

Sail up with like 10 cannons and blast the poor seagull to Kingdom Come

[ashen yarrow]

that is called bounty tasks which will get huge buff if they follow through with the blog

[fringe rivet]

No I mean like, we get both slayer and sailing xp for this

[bright ocean]

Time for colossal ships with 10 cannon spots

[fringe rivet]

bounty tasks are just whatever rn

and most of the loot you get from killing sea creatures just feeds back into more sailing

ain't no one going to kill krakens for water battlestaffs

If anything, it's weird that sailing as a skill has the more expensive activities rewarding less XP and loot, while the cheaper activities give more XP and more loot

[brisk hill]

It’s so funny that they’re doing boat to boat combat while (I assume) paying no mind to boat pvp l0l

How can you do one but not the other

[fringe rivet]

Most people prefer pve over pvp

[brisk hill]

That’s sick but there are still plenty of ppl who pvp

[fringe rivet]

yes, but that'll come later, the balance is very different

[brisk hill]

Regardless, boat to boat combat suggests PvP (in my peanut brain)

[tender harness]

Adding a rare chance (1 in 800,000) to get Soup from sorting Salvage.
was this needed though lol

soup was already fast through tasks

[fringe rivet]

people want to feel rewarded for doing their afk salvage methods, I guess

[tender harness]

if people want to be rewarded do courier tasks then? its a fast pet through courier tasks

[fringe rivet]

Jagex already screwed up with salvaging

[tender harness]

We also picked up a pesky bug where Courier tasks using the same cargo type are currently not able to be taken together. This is unintended behaviour and it will be resolved in a future Sailing update!

mfers this bug was reported 6 months ago

that wasn't "picked up"

[fringe rivet]

give people a no effort, decent loot and decent xp method, and you can never take that away without them complaining

[brisk hill]

Now I just want npc’s for all skills

[velvet orchid]

Can we park near valamore and get keys? It would solve one of the areas lacking in sailing

[fringe rivet]

I would have preferred a point shop for port tasks tbh, kind of like Mahogany Homes.

[jaunty oriole]

I just want it so when i leave the salvage hook to go to the salvage station that homeless jim would auto take over the hook again.

[tender harness]

why are we just automating an entire skill

that seems like genuinely detrimental to the game

[jaunty oriole]

I gave jim an order tho

[tender harness]

I mean more of it sets precedent for
people want more skill automation so they can afk like 800 hours while the skill does itself and not actually interact with anything

[brisk hill]

Automate every skill omg

[jaunty oriole]

We should disable auto retaliation

[tender harness]

auto looting from crew mates
auto clean salvage watch this happen
auto salvage on hooks

[analog crow]

As expected (d sheets)

[jaunty oriole]

I hope so crew is slow anyway

[tender harness]

fuck rewarding lazy behavior

I play a game I want to interact with it. I afk to chill

[languid tundra]

Can we get the option of a drop down list when right clicking facilities of the crew members, this way when hoping onto the hook yourself and then going to sort salvage, its easier to get your crew back onto the hook, instead of having to go through the clunky menu every time, this means you could set up menu entry swaps to 1 click your crew onto facilities on RL

[fringe rivet]

I blame star mining

[jaunty oriole]

I mema when vines came out after i got 99wc lol

[tender harness]

vines arent in OSRS

[jaunty oriole]

Sweet!

I just came back

[tender harness]

we have redwoods but nothing like ivy in RS3

and I dont think ivy has been good in that game in like? years

[jaunty oriole]

I have not played in like 8 years lol

[fringe rivet]

yet

[tender harness]

tbf we have ironwood with sailing

which is its own

[jaunty oriole]

I just bought members yesterday to try sailing

[fringe rivet]

Low-key all these questionable changes makes me reconsider Project Zanaris

[tender harness]

sailing is.. a thing. its far better than launch sailing but

its a thing

[jaunty oriole]

I think sailing is pretty fun opens the world up alot

[fringe rivet]

O the actual act of sailing is fun af

[tender harness]

ehh

[fringe rivet]

going out into the blue, exploring

finding cool new islands, lands, little random events

sailing past the dangerous sharks and krakens in the early levels

[jaunty oriole]

What you guys think about them maybe adding normal fishing from boats

[tender harness]

the world isnt as open as people thing
basically the entire left side and right side of the map are inaccessible

[fringe rivet]

I think that's fine

and honestly expected

[tender harness]

90 - 99 sailing is also kinda? pointless

[analog crow]

Good

[ashen yarrow]

raft only

[fringe rivet]

I wonder if we can take our rafts to the normal karabwan spot and fish with the land homies

[jaunty oriole]

I think they should remove the wall towards the wild near GE so we can lure bots into the wild. 😂

[ashen yarrow]

i wonder if the sailing fish crates even work with non-sailing fishes

[fringe rivet]

of course they don't lmao

that'd require development foresight

[jaunty oriole]

I’m trying to get the plank sack

[fringe rivet]

it'll be a second poll question 7 months from now, don't worry

[jaunty oriole]

I need to find a better way to store stuff from salvaging. Dropping so much stuff

[tender harness]

the movable facilities UI

seems clunky as fuck

[analog crow]

seems fine to me

[fringe rivet]

you can like, go to port and drop it off

and sort your salvage later

[tender harness]

oh thats a re order UI

so its still boat bottles to move and

[fringe rivet]

Literally lots of people do this and sort their salvage at the tempoross location

and you keep 100% of the loot

[tender harness]

they cant recreate what you can do for POHs for facilities? ffs

[timber drift]

is jagex just gonna rework hopper altogether? really hard to make it meaningful without powercreeping dfw, odium or buckler

[tender harness]

short answer? its under suggestion
long answer probably not

[timber drift]

maybe it should buff 1h thrown instead

[tender harness]

hopper is like dead as fuck

[carmine junco]

They obviously do not want to, they clearly intend for facility placement to be important.

[timber drift]

yeah idk why ppl voted yes on that

[timber drift]

you can just plan ahead or cop the 75k loss it aint that deep

[tender harness]

doesnt matter when they opened that can of worms with bottles to move facilities. in the most clunky as fuck way

[ashen yarrow]

you were meant to bring the salvage to docks and sort there next to deposit box but everyone is afking in sea and dropping instead

[fringe rivet]

I remember when javelins were hand thrown

[carmine junco]

It's very simple actually, just have the facilities where you want them

[analog crow]

hopper buff is good, but it's a bandaid. What we really need is a enchanted bolts rework

[tender harness]

alternative to the hopper was like a ranged fury atleast RS3 aquanites* but we have like far better necks already
as stated enchanted bolts are just .. a mess

[solar dirge]

how about they actually poll the heavy ranged armour they literally said they were going to poll

[timber drift]

they can buff it because it would creep much harder to get items

cant

[fringe rivet]

Agreed. We literally bring our ship to a ship facility to be built. They can hold our spare cannons ffs

[timber drift]

needs a complete rework

[analog crow]

if that would creep masori it would have to be a raids reward
and it still doesn't address that there is like one useful bolt enchantment in the game

[tender harness]

its very simple just make facility movement easier and not the mess that it is.
dont know why people defend it so much.

[carmine junco]

Because the point is to encourage multiple boats. You obviously disagree with that, but that's the intent.

They don't want you swapping facilities out like gear for your character.

[tender harness]

what the fuck do you think you do in a ship yard?

you swap shit and repair

[fringe rivet]

I have multiple boats and I still want to be able to swap out my stuff

the benefit is convenience

[solid trout]

im sorry.

delayed till next year!?

YEAR!?

[solar dirge]

what is?

[carmine junco]

So? This sort of logic could be applied to a million things in the game. It's built on game logic, not reality.

[solid trout]

next Barracuda trial and Pirate encounters

[solar dirge]

wait barracuda trial is next year now????

[solid trout]

yeah: my reaction exactly

[tender harness]

pirate encounters are binned for now. they'll revisit them if the demand is there
the trial im not shocked about

[jaunty oriole]

What do barracuda trials even do?

I only salvage lol

[night vortex]

shinx is such a cute lil fella too bad he kinda sucks

[timber drift]

i love trials but they're clearly not popular enough among the general playerbase to warrant them now

[solar dirge]

ok yeah I'm actually so done. my sub dropped a couple of weeks ago and I was just hoping maybe something would change in this travesty of a dev team. fuckin byyye

[timber drift]

since they left salvaging as OP as it is theres also not much merit to doing them

[carmine junco]

Fast but high click intensity xp

[carmine junco]

Thanks for the update

[serene lodge]

more of an activity for people that value their time to quick burst through the sailing levels

[fringe rivet]

all Barracuda Trials should damage your boat to, like the first one does

[tender harness]

lets see how that road map is doing

so far theyve delivered on? nothing

[restive storm]

dont worry deadman mode all stars is coming :3

[fringe rivet]

we're still in spring

[ashen yarrow]

ah yes, lets ignore the boat combat changes they have done because you do not like them

[tender harness]

and how are those boat combat fixes?

[carmine junco]

Except for some of the boat combat fixes, and the fact that we're still in spring.

[solid trout]

we will definetly have the player designed island soon

[carmine junco]

You can say that you don't like them but you can't say they didn't do them

[tender harness]

they fixed nothing

shadow is still BIS for combat

cannons were 7 tick for some fucking reason

stop deluding yourself to think the fixes actually fixed combat they did not

[solid trout]

but hey. Temporary gamemodes dont take dev time away from the main game... nono definetly not

[tender harness]

and the summer combat update was pirate encounters

that is binned

[carmine junco]

Okay. I think they generally improved it, but obviously didn't resolve all the issues I have with it.

[tender harness]

cuda trial is delayed

theyve hit basically nothing on the road map

[carmine junco]

Nothing on the roadmap has even happened yet, it is still spring.

[tender harness]

nothing? are you sure? nothing like the combat fixes that happened a month and two ago?

[minor whale]

I mean they did say they're removing one of the parts of the roadmap which is a bit disappointing lmao

[jaunty oriole]

Idk guys i came back after 8 years and there so much shit idk where to even start lol

[carmine junco]

Nothing past spring, obviously.

[tender harness]

wtf do you mean

they flat out removed part of the road map

that happened

its in the blog

[carmine junco]

You keep complaining about things that haven't even happened yet

Lol

[tender harness]

like fuck

stop being obtuse

[carmine junco]

Lmao

[carmine junco]

Yes, obviously they said as much, and also said they're working on other things that have taken priority.

[jaunty oriole]

Who needs pirates when you can be like me and crash into swamp water get stuck and sink

[tender harness]

saying summer didnt happen when they blanketly state pirate encounters are removed you are either dense, or willingly being obtuse

priorities like delaying a baracuda trial
priorities like a quest that adds basically nothing?
a player designed island that adds nothing or will get absolutely gutted during development?

[carmine junco]

Like. It's not as though they've just not delivered on things in the roadmap, they've clearly stated what they are working on.

[ashen yarrow]

it is impossible to make players happy since they can just say they did not like the change and that means jagex did not do anything

[carmine junco]

Yes, you're acting like they just failed to deliver on things in the roadmap. What I'm saying is that they're clearly changing priorities

It's not hard

[tender harness]

they could you know. not have rushed a skill out the door before holiday and now end up in the spot theyre in

[jaunty oriole]

Idk but after coming back after 8 years it looks like they did alot. Enough that i bought members again

[minor whale]

There is absolutely no difference between "failing to deliver" and "they've removed them from the roadmap"

[carmine junco]

My advice is go play the game for fun, and if you stop having fun find something else to do.

[minor whale]

By removing them from the roadmap they've failed to deliver

[tender harness]

no no you dont get it by removing from the road map its just "shifting priorities"

[carmine junco]

In a literal sense, yes, but you do understand that this sort of thing happens all the time, right?

[tender harness]

and they get the rightful flak for it

[jaunty oriole]

So far it’s scratching that itch! I have not found a game i have really liked since i quit years ago!

[tender harness]

dont put shit on a road map if you arent delivering

said content

its simple

[ashen yarrow]

easy, just dont make a road map so players cannot know what is in store

[carmine junco]

My actual job is developing software. Sometime shit happens. You tell the stakeholders and you readjust things.

The game we play is especially community driven, things happen because of feedback from the player base. I don't see why this is so hard to understand.

[tender harness]

people put jagex on some pedestal that "its okay they can cut or remove content they can do no wrong"
while lambasting literally anyone else who does the same shit.

[carmine junco]

No, I'm just especially understanding of the job they are doing because I do a similar one.

[minor whale]

Guys it's ok they removed 2 things from the total of 6 things promised this year, it happens all the time, give poor Jagex a break 🥺

[ashen yarrow]

players did not like the pirate encounter and they removed it from summer. Now players are mad that they listened to player feedback

[carmine junco]

Thanks for the strawman