game-update

[brisk hill]

No ecosystem!

Only for pk!

Small fish needed

Ty Ted talk

[restive storm]

ironically wildy agil is the most active area in the entire game

on that world precisely cuz there is no pj timer

[brisk hill]

“I have 2k people with me who can bolt the aggressor off of me; I am safe”

[narrow folio]

Ill just say for pvmers, all these different rules and zones is insanely hard to keep track of

[restive storm]

agreed remove the weird rules

[oblique mesa]

https://tenor.com/view/no-yes-giga-chad-giga-chad-gif-23156898

But we all know that doesn't stop RoT from macing people at the entrance to the course

So many VLSes lost

[brisk hill]

My b

Back to lms tho

[restive storm]

"but if people can pj me than im doomed to die" as if the venezuelans didnt mass an army to farm black chins and fight back before it existed

[brisk hill]

Those fights in multi were hella fun!

[restive storm]

godspeed chloe maxer wherever you are

[minor whale]

They went into the design reasoning for it well before the changes went live

https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/wilderness-changes?oldschool=1

Big ass blog post with their reasoning for it

[restive storm]

thats gr8 and all but the problem is that it didnt work

[minor whale]

It worked for the design purposes they intended it to, for the problem they thought there was

[brisk hill]

Which of the following best describes the main reason you enter the Wilderness:

Fighting other players - 23.73%
Completing Clue Scrolls - 45.03%

[restive storm]

"long term success of the wilderness" anyone update on this?

[brisk hill]

This is why the wildy is died because updates are catered to the 45%

👍

[minor whale]

They thought singles should mean singles and not big teams - so they changed it

[restive storm]

im not saying they didnt think they had a reason, i'm saying they had a bad reason, and it did not work out AT ALL

[brisk hill]

Yeah I think this issue of fall ins on pvmers is so rare

Now you just get megatron on you

Gl lol

[minor whale]

I mean
Surely if you think the wilderness was healthier with the PJ timer disabled and that it let pking thrive, those words shouldn't be dead, right?

[oblique mesa]

Its only 2 worlds

[brisk hill]

What draws pkers there?

[oblique mesa]

The ecosystem isn't there

[brisk hill]

There’s no ecosystem

Do you know why I pvm in that world @minor whale

Becuase I hav friends waiting to log in when I get attacked

Doesn’t happen very often lol

[minor whale]

Yeah and those 2 worlds if it's "healthier" and "more fun" then it should be booming
It just seems the majority of people disagree and avoid those worlds

The 24% want one thing and the majority don't and Jagex caters to the majority typically
This isn't shocking news

[restive storm]

that only makes sense if you have literally no clue in the world how food chains work

u ever heard of #savethebees

[minor whale]

Your arguments are based around you thinking it's more fun to pk with those settings

But clearly the majority of people who go to the wilderness don't and that's why it's not more popular

[brisk hill]

Does that mean my opinion is void?

Does that mean every update should take away from me?

[restive storm]

yeah if you remove the bottom rung of a food chain man it kills the entire rest of it

idk how to articulate that any better

[brisk hill]

That’s pretty good

👍

I got it

[restive storm]

ty 4 coming to my TED talk

[minor whale]

Void, no
But when there's 2 opinions and the majority want one thing that Jagex thinks is more in line with their design process then I wouldn't expect them to really cater to the minority opinion

[restive storm]

what happens when making decisions this way routinely makes less and less people engage w/ the content for years at a time?

is it time to rethink that approach

[brisk hill]

Now the majority gets to die by crystal bowfa max

Glhf I guess lol

[restive storm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d86lrvYSwyw i DO NOT belong in this set man

its crazy that after 2.5 years ive never died in it. cuz i am hotdogwater at pking

[brisk hill]

If the game worked this way for all updates ok. 70% I thought was threshold

If they polled this content to pkers it would’ve failed

Both pj timer & multi rev removal

👍

[scarlet dawn]

Missing 25k tricks rn

[minor whale]

Versus dying to piling by a team in singles
Dying is dying either way and people would prefer dying to a single good player than teams trading attacks and having to tank 7 people in a fight you thought was gonna be 1v1 like the name of the area suggests

I genuinely do feel bad that a way you enjoyed playing the game was taken away from you, but at the same time the majority of people were having less fun due to that. I don't think it's the wrong decision to prioritize the majority.

[restive storm]

i dont even think your second paragraph is true tbh lol

Who is even currently enjoying the wilderness

[brisk hill]

Everything before but is bullshit anyways

[minor whale]

Pkers aren't the only people to enter the wilderness though
That's not an equivalent thing to shit like UIM only polls

[oblique mesa]

Ironmen ruining their progression with blighted supplies 🙁

[restive storm]

disgusting cheaters

[oblique mesa]

Its too free to pass up

[brisk hill]

If you polled pvpers about UIM changes what do you think the result would be?

[restive storm]

i could make a 1750 total iron in two weeks with how easy they made the gamemode these days

[brisk hill]

I’ll give you a better example @minor whale

[minor whale]

If you polled everyone about everything most shit would pass because most people don't care about things that don't effect them
But the rules of the wilderness have an effect on every account that would enter the wildy

Oh Brother the second you start pulling out Nazis as a rebuttal your shit is not worth arguing against anymore lmao

[brisk hill]

Almost like the majority could be wrong :v

[dawn jackal]

very dicey example not sure this beneifts you in any way to bring up

[minor whale]

Just makes you look stupid lmao

[ember grove]

lmfao jumping straight to "pvmers are the equivalent of nazis for not wanting to die as easily when pk'd"

[restive storm]

honestly most people see "wilderness" and insta vote no, because theyre trained by people who have no idea how it works to be afraid of it

[brisk hill]

LOL

Lurkers amass

[scarlet dawn]

haha

[brisk hill]

It was an example

[dawn jackal]

i been here that was just a crazy pull

[brisk hill]

Yes maybe extreme

[dawn jackal]

its not even comparable though

[oblique mesa]

You just have to convince gnomonkey and the pvmers will vote yes

[brisk hill]

It’s not comparable at all??

[dawn jackal]

no

[brisk hill]

I don’t wanna get off subject

[dawn jackal]

its kinda sick to do so

[brisk hill]

My point was

The majority can believe something & be wrong lol

[dawn jackal]

not sick in like ripping a tech deck out

[brisk hill]

If you got anything else out of that reflect on your own

[oblique mesa]

Better example @brisk hill was the castle wars crate update

People voted yes then had a tantrum about it after

[dawn jackal]

i get it you didn't intend a direct comparison but its just a pretty unhealthy thing to compare a polling system in a video game to

[restive storm]

true, people got mad they removed that

[oblique mesa]

Who could have ever seen that one coming

[dawn jackal]

doesn't help your argument, which i think i'm largely for!

[limber creek]

Add multi revs.
Add 1t tele delay below 30 wilderness

[restive storm]

the thing is when you have jmods who are so disassociated with the game, that they pull out opinions like this in public. they just MANUFACTURE fear for people when it comes to thew wildy

[brisk hill]

L0l

[oblique mesa]

Allow ironmen to enter other player's houses. I have to tell other people when I scout someone doing con a pvp world. 😭

[restive storm]

like i promise you dying in the wildy is NOWHERE NEAR the heinous crime that is being implied

[dawn jackal]

yea thats a pretty terrible thing to say

[minor whale]

And that JMod got fucking clowned on by every single person who read that

Because it's dumb as shit

[restive storm]

but that isnt the only person to think that way

and spread it

[dawn jackal]

wildy changes have to be unpolled to have any value

because for 98% or whatever number of players their experience would be better with no wildy so thats how they'll vote

[brisk hill]

No, wildy changes need to be discussed with those who actively participate in the wildy

[limber creek]

bro thats a jmod? lmfaoooo

[restive storm]

yes

that is how pking is seen within jagex

[dawn jackal]

yea they need to be discussed and implemented like nerfs

not sent to the polls to fail every time

[brisk hill]

Agree my b

[oblique mesa]

Huh they were pretty receptive of stuff in the recent podcasts

[brisk hill]

Just ask those who are actually participating

[limber creek]

I mean people like that... this all makes a lot more sense now.

[restive storm]

like 99% of the stuff they talk about there is all content creator events... I.E you and i dont get to play the content

then for the wildy they said "yeah thatd be kinda cool to work on sometime"

[limber creek]

They get a resident evil jumpscare when a pker is on them...

https://tenor.com/hSn43ulZKYQ.gif

@ember grove feels this way

[ember token]

this person hasn't worked for jagex for 4 years now, and they never worked on anything wilderness related

[restive storm]

yeah like how people legitimately have nightmares about going in the wildy, when you can just not risk much is beyond me

[brisk hill]

They’re just lurking lol

[sacred oracle]

this channel is so fiesty today

[quasi glade]

jmods have nightmares lol

[main kestrel]

[restive storm]

started yday when they pulled the random afk timer out of nowhere for multi and has just gone on since then

they havent even responded yet 🙁

[sacred oracle]

i genuinely skimmed that part of the update

[brisk hill]

Great

[limber creek]

noone asked for it.

[restive storm]

tl:dr nobody asked, nor wanted it but for some reason theyre putting it in unpolled?

[limber creek]

Not a single person.

[dawn jackal]

i hate the wildy never go in there but i've learned a lot in this channel its been mostly good (if not insular) discussion

[quasi glade]

1 of mankeds friends did lol

[minor whale]

And they have an actual pvp JMod
Very weird comparison to make like that JMod has had any sway since before the PJ timer was added lmao

[limber creek]

think they just meant that homie in particular lol

[restive storm]

we havent had pvp content put out in a year and a half man, there is no PvP jmod any longer

they just occaisionally work on pvp

[limber creek]

he put his whole foot into dmm.

[restive storm]

and probably 95% of their time is elsewhere

[oblique mesa]

It got voted down thats not the jmod's fault

[brisk hill]

“Manked” world boss only PvP suggestion since he started innit

[dawn jackal]

if the issue can be boiled down to saying there isn't enough loot crates in the wildy to foster a pvp ecosystem i don't really have a great idea at a solution though

other than just reverting the rev caves that seems like it'd be good

[restive storm]

you're forgetting 1 more piece

the second KEY piece

[limber creek]

Multi revs is plenty of loot for everyone.

We all eat

[dawn jackal]

probably more ignorance than forgetfulness

[sacred oracle]

i was much more interested in the nexus changes

[dawn jackal]

i don't know enough to know enough

[limber creek]

we figure most people are

[restive storm]

we gotta stay on topic here

[oblique mesa]

Ice Plat teleport nexus finally 😍

[brisk hill]

Listen you guys get to riot in fally

[sacred oracle]

ikr?

been waiting so long for this

[brisk hill]

We get 4 ppl typing in discord

Let us own

[sacred oracle]

clues are gonna be less annoying now

[brisk hill]

No, more actually lol

Rot is the only clan capable of taking advantage of this

Thanks I guess lol

[restive storm]

whtad it take 2s to grab a tab outta bank?

[sacred oracle]

i'm talking about the nexus changes

i don't really care about the wildy changes

[brisk hill]

I read as clans don’t mind me

[restive storm]

i mean nobody here cares ab the nexus changes this j ust been pvpcord lately

[brisk hill]

Yes

[sacred oracle]

there were a lot of proposals in that blog post covering so much stuff

it was kind of a lot tbh

[brisk hill]

Thanks for joining would do you like to pk

[restive storm]

but it was all kinda irrelevant

except the multi pk changes

[quasi glade]

This is whats currently what we have got for pvp for the next year

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1458852791941468160/1459273101652132086/image.png?ex=6962ad7b&is=69615bfb&hm=82da0f148cf442526dcdea6b396c57e61b3f527e82a4e0a5f1c6d003e5d533c5&

[tender harness]

this channel has been unusable since the same 3 people have been whining about pvp

[quasi glade]

I seem REAL hopeful

[ember token]

WBR?

[limber creek]

lol zombie p irates....

[restive storm]

man PLEASE tell me this isnt real

[quasi glade]

It is

lol

[brisk hill]

😔

[oblique mesa]

This channel is always a mess

[restive storm]

omg

WBR?

its been a disaster since release

[limber creek]

wilderness bot rework

[brisk hill]

I’m here for good unless you get me banned love

[limber creek]

go hop in on 330 right now

[ember token]

ive never heard of that

[limber creek]

tell me those are humans

[restive storm]

how many ppl does it take to delete the eescape caves?

[brisk hill]

lol

[dawn jackal]

i mean it sounds to me like jagex is just snap implementing a fix to a problem that doesn't exist and their fix just makes everyones experience worse while, as previously mentioned, not fixing any issue that exists

so seems fair to discuss

[floral blaze]

Holy fuck 😂 😂 😂 😂

[brisk hill]

Thanks tubu what a guy

[restive storm]

bro who at jagex do we talk to about priorities

[limber creek]

to busy on seasonal game modes trying to act like wow

[restive storm]

last dmm was 1.5 years ago

[ember token]

(saves time, inventory space, and bank space and is generally just more convenient to have it in the nexus with all the other teleports)

[sacred oracle]

I don't have any opinion on the merits of the proposed wilderness changes, but as long as people are discussing it respectfully, this is a fine place to talk about them

[restive storm]

still working on dmm

[tender harness]

bro doesnt understand what dev cycles are

[restive storm]

0 changes to wildy in that time span

[ember token]

manked worked on royal titans didnt he

cant remember for sure

[restive storm]

yes

[sacred oracle]

I wonder if his wiki page would show

[broken flame]

Spaghetti for lunch

[restive storm]

what a waste of time that was

[sacred oracle]

[[manked]]

[ornate wolf]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Mod_Manked

[floral blaze]

I asked Manked in his stream if there were more plans for future wildy updates months after zombie pirates release, and his reaction was "oh we just released pirates?". One and a half year later, the energy is still the same lmfaoooo 😂 🤣 🤣 🤣

[limber creek]

yay lets give pures a budget rigour and augury.

[broken flame]

But a melee prayer and you’re crossing the line

[limber creek]

can everyone else get a wilderness update

[brisk hill]

Yayyy let’s gatekeep them from budget piety

😂

Silly stuff

[restive storm]

the fact we've had no content for 2 years, and the upcoming content, is working on the originally "reworked" cuz its so bad is such a spit in the face

[sacred oracle]

Is it really gatekeeping for a special account type not to have access to things that require it to be a different account type?

[tender harness]

if it bothers you so much just quit

[dawn jackal]

on the official jagex podcast they discuss how, primarily due to the specificity of the tools that they have, jagex is not really beholden to a regular dev cycle and can pump out content much quicker

[broken flame]

Yes

[brisk hill]

I got more spades to pk beast

👍

[limber creek]

i could care less about peoples self imposed restrictions on themselves whenever the game is supposed to apply for everyone.

[restive storm]

i will not be talked down to by an unmaxed andy

[dawn jackal]

yea huge aura drain with the name there i hate to agree

[broken flame]

lmk when you finish maxing

then you can typer

[brisk hill]

It’s gatekeeping if it’s proposed & then voted down because Reddit

Ty Ted talk

[tender harness]

pvpers trying to gate keep

[broken flame]

what are pvpers gatekeeping mr troll

[restive storm]

nobody is gatekeeping you told us to quit

[limber creek]

classic goalpost movement.

[tender harness]

if you dont like how the dated and frankly lost in design pvp is
then dont do it?

not hard logic

[broken flame]

if you dont like talking to us in the update channel then dont do it

:p dog

[limber creek]

Do you pvp mana?

[restive storm]

i dont really, im trying to change

[sacred oracle]

It's not gatekeeping to me for a special exception for an account type not to pass, but your mileage may vary.

[restive storm]

the way it works

[floral blaze]

This game is cooked. All the time they've had... and this is where their minds are at still. Its FUCKING OVER

[restive storm]

and youre telling me to quit lol

[brisk hill]

Yeah I thought this was a place for the exchange of free ideas

[broken flame]

it is, if its pvp its wrong

[analog crow]

finally someone gets it
this is the year pvp dies

[broken flame]

thats the only rule

[restive storm]

no if you dont think the game is perfect as is please quit rn

[limber creek]

Nope nope. We're gonna attack each other over things we have no clue about.

As is law.

[brisk hill]

If you’re mad we are discussing a game update come back when the next update is talked about

👍

[tender harness]

exchange for free ideas
ideas that are undertones of bashing the company and devs and anyone who applies basic logic to how bad pvp is

[scarlet dawn]

surely polls /s

[brisk hill]

Who’s bashing?

[dawn jackal]

how does having the stupid titan prayers but not a piety equivalent hurt the pure scene

[broken flame]

we are gatekeeping polls? i think we are gatekept from polls

[brisk hill]

Some may

Not I

[dawn jackal]

does it just make the combat styles imbalanced?

[brisk hill]

It’s not bashing to say “pvp is in shambles”

[restive storm]

well ya see man, when all you've done for 4+ years straight is make the wilderness worse and worse, peoplee are probably gonna bash it a bit

being unable to take that criticism is not good

[limber creek]

Why do people not want me to be able to tb bots.

🤔

[restive storm]

theyre the bot owners

[brisk hill]

Get better lol

[broken flame]

because they want the economy to die

[limber creek]

https://tenor.com/jJDegA1ir0p.gif

[brisk hill]

You must be ass at killing a defenseless pvmer lol

Just work harder lol

[limber creek]

Poor defenseless 4 item keeping pvmer.

[broken flame]

that he owns!

[brisk hill]

Not to mention one of the items is a literal DOOR JAGEX

[restive storm]

#rebuffblackdhide

[ember grove]

skill issue that you need clan backup to kill a bot in the rev caves

[limber creek]

Give it 6 months and they'll have brew flasks so they're truly impossible to kill without a combo.

[broken flame]

give black dhide magic offensive bonus and magic % bonus because im being tbed in full black dhide anyways

viva la venezuela

[brisk hill]

Vzla rng is different

[restive storm]

pvmers insta vote yes cuz now they can make it to wave 52 in the inferno

[limber creek]

Lets see your kills bro.

[broken flame]

when luis comes running at you in full black dhide and lands a 5 minute tb on you something aint right

[zenith pike]

No, it was less impactful than dead eye and a bit more than mystic vigor

[restive storm]

my favorite part is that even their clienters suck, and i cant tell if its ping or what

[tough nacelle]

It’s not that crazy that adding pvm content to the wildy isn’t fun

No one enjoys being interrupted 50x in 2h

[restive storm]

nobody is asking for pvm content in the wildy

keep up

[tough nacelle]

PvP is fun

[limber creek]

not asking for new pvp. just fixing what we have already.

[tough nacelle]

Really? Because the last multiple pvp failed polls involved pvm in wildy

[restive storm]

it aint what we been asking for tho

its just jagex being jagex

[ember grove]

why would I do pvp in runescape of all things

I'd play like, rust or tf2 or whatever if I wanted to kill people

I'd even rather do more pvp in WoW lol

[tough nacelle]

But what is even being asked for

[limber creek]

Lil harder on botters while not changing anything for a legitimate player (even though yall keep crying about real pvmers)
And bringing back the most active pvp ecosystem there ever has been in the game.

[restive storm]

largely its just streamers wanting more whales to kill

[tough nacelle]

Outside loose arguments

[restive storm]

no pj timer, multi revs

and we have a real game again

[limber creek]

Then truthfully your opinion means nothing. You have no clue what you're talking about and are just parroting your favorite streamer or reddit post.

[ember grove]

they want multi revs back because they liked clan fights

and they want single clans back

[fresh forge]

Revs isn’t PvM?

[ember grove]

I vote just the same as you :)

[restive storm]

no

revs is afk brainrot gp printer

[tough nacelle]

Aren’t pj timers there because it was hella toxic

[limber creek]

What a terrible thing.

[tough nacelle]

In 1 on 1

[broken flame]

yay we got some new reddit enjoyers joining the chat

[restive storm]

no its cuz streamers wanted to bully noobs in 1b of gear with 0 risk on their end

[tender harness]

just ignore all the shady shit that went on with multi revs
add multi revs back because they dont think

[restive storm]

hence why theres no pkers anymore

[tough nacelle]

I distinctly remember 2017

And it was so annoying

People would PJ mid fight

[brisk hill]

4 years later they changed singles btw lol

[analog crow]

Polling is also pvp
gg ez no re

[limber creek]

what. total worlds being held by protection clans? You know what we're evolved to nowadays bro? lol.

[tacit wharf]

best way i can put it is, it may be better for 1 on 1, but not consentual 1 on 1's

[restive storm]

all im sayin rn is that there was WAY more pking action back then

now theres none

[tough nacelle]

But is that because of pj timers

Or mentality changes

[restive storm]

yes

[tough nacelle]

I disagree

[restive storm]

feel free, just know that you are wrong

[broken flame]

imagine arguing with a cat

[tough nacelle]

Most players struggle to do vorkath let alone pvp

[broken flame]

dudes not even human

[restive storm]

iim down atrocious rn tbf

wish i could go pking

[tough nacelle]

Gear also costs more

[analog crow]

feel free. I'll allow it

[restive storm]

mystics is more expensive than it used to be?

[brisk hill]

Ahrims is cheaper now than then

[broken flame]

ever

?

[brisk hill]

Lol

[tough nacelle]

Zenytes were BIS

Occult was 10%

Bowfa didn’t exist

[limber creek]

idk bro salad robes water stick dds rune crossbow black d'hide aint all that expensive beast.

[restive storm]

would rather not just waste my time hopipng

[limber creek]

if you're down that bad yeah probably dont pvp

[tough nacelle]

Ragging in salad robes

[analog crow]

sounds like you're mental griefing yourself with that attitude

[tough nacelle]

Is a vibe I guess

[broken flame]

oh so now salad robes is ragging?

[restive storm]

i just pk regularly and theres not really anybody out there

[limber creek]

oh so you're just upset you can't afford to use the best set?

[restive storm]

every 2-3 hours maybe i find 1-2 people

[limber creek]

sounds like your broke not my problem

[restive storm]

waste of time

[tough nacelle]

No? The difference in price between 30b bank and 3b bank is pretty significant now for PvP

[brisk hill]

You get more bees with hunny than salt

[broken flame]

no

[limber creek]

dang you use 3b sets?

[tough nacelle]

Plus there’s little incentive for the aging player base

[limber creek]

ill fight you all day long bring a 3b set.

[tough nacelle]

People just don’t enjoy scape PvP as much

[tough nacelle]

It’s like you’re being intentionally stupid

[restive storm]

classic argument to ignore the actual issue

as if we werent pking all the same literally 4 years ago at extremely similar age

[limber creek]

https://tenor.com/bvwWY.gif

[tough nacelle]

How is pj timers the reason people don’t PvP as much

[restive storm]

cant get noobs into it, way less fun playing the game alone

[quasi glade]

You cant pk with friends in single

How do you learn pvm? Doing it with friends...

[brisk hill]

If I go out in mystic & run into Jimmy bowfa max I’m fucked lol

[limber creek]

im gonna die tryin

[broken flame]

Well pj timers single handedly destroy single clans which obviously means people quit the game and dont pk as much because the way of pking they enjoyed is gone dumby

[restive storm]

memories are made with friends not sitting alone in disc while nobody plays cuz theres no reason to have friends anymore

[broken flame]

https://tenor.com/view/lizard-lizard-lizard-button-lizard-tom-the-lizard-pixar-gif-17194109322617058326

[quasi glade]

You learn pvm by doing it with friends... You should be able to learn single pking by doing it with friends

[tough nacelle]

Sounds like you’re just wanting more multi spots

[broken flame]

we also want multi spots as well yes

😄

[restive storm]

this is not at all what i personally want

[analog crow]

why do you think you'll have more people to pk in singles if they remove the timer though

[restive storm]

but i do want that tooo

[quasi glade]

Well yeah but multi pking and single pking is two different things

[limber creek]

Well weve been saying multi revs. So thanks for catching up.

[restive storm]

cuz thats how it worked for 15 years

[brisk hill]

Because of the night & day difference between before & after

????

[broken flame]

it will revive the clans that were closed via the update? hello?

[restive storm]

before they changed it and it died?

[quasi glade]

40 single clans closed in 1 day

[tough nacelle]

Revs is toxic and realistically shouldn’t exist

Same with zombie pirates

[broken flame]

are you actually stupid or just pretending to be stupid because im voting the former @analog crow

[limber creek]

They're in here intentionally to troll at this point. They have no clue of the wilderness and are only promoting discourse in the discussion.

[analog crow]

if you want clan on clan then I think we established earlier that there are worlds without the pj timer you can go on for that

[restive storm]

yea seems like bad faith argument

[brisk hill]

Is

[quasi glade]

Only pking that like current pj timer are those without friends and streamers

lmfao

[narrow folio]

I'm still confused how people want multi in singles by piling on one hapless individual

Just make it multi then

[restive storm]

cuz it was 100x more fun

and youre not all attacking at once what?

[limber creek]

Thats not how it works at all

[broken flame]

you know what,i agree with the actually stupid as heck bird

make everything multi

[limber creek]

Fuck it

yeah

[quasi glade]

I'm fine with that

[tough nacelle]

Make it multi or make it single

[quasi glade]

Lets do it

[analog crow]

See this is why many people won't give pkers the time of day. You're unwilling to even engage in the discussion.

[limber creek]

go to bh for singles

[broken flame]

make BH multi

[dawn jackal]

i think the part that people don't really get is that having fair fights is not the goal

[broken flame]

😄

[restive storm]

man idk if u read or not

[narrow folio]

My point is piling in singles bypasses the point of singles

[restive storm]

but we been discussing for 2 days

[dawn jackal]

if i understand what the outcasts want they just want a sandbox to fuck around in and get into antics

[tough nacelle]

Reality is people just don’t like unfair fights

[quasi glade]

I mean i wouldnt engage in high level pvm discussions because im dogshit at pvm

[oblique mesa]

If you wanted fair 1v1 fights you can just go to emirs arena

[restive storm]

correct it isnt

[limber creek]

Okay just to let you know. You can still escape a clan fall in.

[restive storm]

cuz thats boring

[narrow folio]

And singles piling is unfair

[limber creek]

Since you don't know.

[tough nacelle]

And now there’s way more enjoyable PvP games with friends

[restive storm]

this is also correct but infinitely more fun

[broken flame]

I think you all dont understand what the WILDERNESS is and it shows

[dawn jackal]

to pull a game to game comparison out its like invading in dark souls

[quasi glade]

Your talking to us w.o any knowledge of pvp asking us to spell everything out for you

[dawn jackal]

invading should be unfair

[broken flame]

The wilderness isnt supposed to be FAIR

[dawn jackal]

thats part of the whole experience

[narrow folio]

I know you can escape but the point if singles isnt to allow people to trade off speca. Jagex knew this hence pj timer.

[restive storm]

is it fair that a med can hit my pure in the wilderness?

[tough nacelle]

But the invader is at a disadvantage

[broken flame]

THANK YOU this

[tough nacelle]

Invader typically fighting more than one player

[narrow folio]

Thats what the levels are intended for

[quasi glade]

Wilderness isn't meant to be fair

lol

[tough nacelle]

And it’s still fun

[narrow folio]

Wildy levels

[broken flame]

You are supposed to go into the wilderness and die THAT IS THE POINT

[analog crow]

If you think I'm reading 2 days worth of rage in here you're dead wrong
But if you're unwilling to explain then fine

[quasi glade]

It's the WILDERNESS

[restive storm]

but it isnt fair

[brisk hill]

looooool

[floral blaze]

Runescapes pvp shouldn't be fun because there are other pvp games that you can play!

[restive storm]

so should we change it

[limber creek]

Its the wilderness. Cry more if you dont like dying. Or kill the people attacking you.

[floral blaze]

Just play a different game DEWD

!!!

[ember grove]

lmfao of this entire conversation this is the worst take of them all

[tough nacelle]

I think they just ignore that people don’t enjoy it

[quasi glade]

yes lets do that for every person with 0 knowledge of pvp lol

lmfao

[dawn jackal]

of course the issue here is no one wants to sign up to be the pinata so jagex has to add external incentive to get people in

and theyve just failed to do that

[quasi glade]

its like asking woox to explain how to do cox to every single person individually

[restive storm]

our problem is that the people who didnt enjoy it b4 the pj timer STILL dont enjoy it, meanwhile they made all the pkers quit

and for what (kermit voice)

[quasi glade]

woox is a nice guy but he'll probably tell you to shut the fuck up too

[brisk hill]

You say this even though you saw my take earlier? Respect tbh

[tough nacelle]

Reality is the wildly won’t ever be full of pvmers unless there’s incentive for them to go in

But they don’t enjoy it

So they don’t go

[restive storm]

man NOBODY is asking for that

[broken flame]

@ember grove

[tough nacelle]

Who are you going to kill then?

Other pkers? Make it multi

[limber creek]

Anyone who is there bro holy shit you're dense.

[restive storm]

the little timmys trying to kill ppl at revs or w/e

[tough nacelle]

Aka bots

[restive storm]

or the little timmys killing green dragon bots

[quasi glade]

The bots that jagex allows

[limber creek]

Yes we kill bots to tf

[quasi glade]

NOT US

[restive storm]

no bro the people trying to kill the bots, youre getting closer tho

[ember grove]

discord pings worked the first time

I know it can be hard to understand the chat program, but you'll get there, I promise

[quasi glade]

They make it like this

NOT US

[limber creek]

we dont just off people because they're a bot or pvmer. We eat wtf is your misunderstanding.

Oh no he hit me yeah because i saw you bro. I wouldve hit woox if he was there.

[tough nacelle]

You’re complaining people don’t want to enter the wildy

[indigo tinsel]

Boutta drop an @ everyone asking you all to tone it down

[tough nacelle]

But people don’t enjoy that content

[quasi glade]

?

Did you pk 6 years ago

[tough nacelle]

And blame pj timers

[limber creek]

Hes never pked lol

[tough nacelle]

I did yeah

[quasi glade]

They've taken content out of the game people wanted

[restive storm]

people enjoyed it pre pj timer, and now they dont

so whats changed there lol

[quasi glade]

Now people quit

[limber creek]

Show acc kills

[tough nacelle]

I’m just old and have less time lol

I’m in my 30s with a kid

[ember token]

it would be better to incentivize people to learn and get more comfortable with pvp than it would be to put more money printing monsters out there

[quasi glade]

We've all suggested these things btw

Jagex just puts bot farms in the wilderness

[limber creek]

best we can do is sailing locked frost dragons buddy.

[restive storm]

sry bro you WILL go out there and you WILL have to tank westham in a bofa max set

[quasi glade]

WBR, rogues , zombie pirates

Revs

[indigo tinsel]

And it WILL be fun right

Right?

[tough nacelle]

Pj timer change would suck but multi in the wildy

Would be fun

And removal of gp farms

[quasi glade]

They literally invented single wbr for bot farmers

Who else

lol

[restive storm]

you heard it here, delete corp, nex, cox, tob, toa etc

[tough nacelle]

Pj timer is a pain if you do want a 1vs1 fight

[limber creek]

Add multi revs back. Entire ecosystem 24/7 unlocked.

[restive storm]

nobody wants to do this man,m thats why nobody is out there rn

[ember token]

wilderness has too many different rules from the rest of the game, first step would be to not change up the controls when in the wilderness - allow spellbook resizing, shift click under players, etc

[quasi glade]

Yes 0 rules in the wildernes

[tough nacelle]

You mean the thing pvpers vote against

[quasi glade]

as it should be

[ember grove]

cat person is arguing that y'all having more pkers isn't the same as having more potential victims because making it more dangerous to do pvm or non-pking actually incentivizes less people to enter the wildy overall

other people are arguing that having more pkers via reverting pj timers to bring back singles clans literally means more pkers and that's what matters

this is melting my brain you people aren't even disagreeing

[limber creek]

hes cooking.

[restive storm]

remove pj timer too, weird rule

[quasi glade]

nobody asked for pj timer changes nobdy asked for all these subset rules inside the rev caves

nobody asked for timers all this

they've just decided

hmm this will be good

[restive storm]

point 2 is the real point

[quasi glade]

and added it

[limber creek]

i doubt any of us would've voted against this. These are all perfectly good things to add in due time to make in line w/ real game. Shit i like shift clicking etc.

[quasi glade]

jagex opened the can of worms with all of these rules

not us

[tough nacelle]

But its failed every time, so the majority of the community disagrees

I agree with you

[restive storm]

there wasnt anywhere near as many weird rules before

[tough nacelle]

Its annoying opening a wiki page

[quasi glade]

it is

[limber creek]

Because a majority of the community do not engage in pvp conflicts.
They only engage in victimhood.

[quasi glade]

there shouldnt be all of these rules

[tough nacelle]

To understand what items you’ll lose

[quasi glade]

jagex makes these rules because

manked has friends

or ayiza has friends

that tell him oh

this will be good

and act like they are doing it in good faith

[limber creek]

You dont need a wiki page to see items kept on death.
It tells you on the kept on death screen and has 4 options to change the scenario in which you die.

[quasi glade]

without consulting the rest of the community

and put it in as an unpolled change

because wiggled told him so

or dino told him so

[restive storm]

good (for my stream/income)

[brisk hill]

I’m not biased about changes made to my livelihood

[quasi glade]

What's good for their stream isn't good for the wilderness

[tough nacelle]

Until you factor in untradeables,

[limber creek]

thats not cool.

[dawn jackal]

yea that person had to be blocked lickety split

not the first dm they sent!

[restive storm]

woah relac o

[nocturne solstice]

Imma delete that for obvious reasons

[tough nacelle]

High risk worlds

[quasi glade]

You shouldnt be taking advice from people that make money off the game

[ember token]

lmfao

[restive storm]

these still show?

[limber creek]

Untradeables are also outlined and clearly state whether lost or not as well.

Literally try opening the screen man....

[quasi glade]

lol

bro has never pked

in his life

L0L

[kind surge]

that dm really isn't bringing people to your cause

[drifting merlin]

imagine

[ember grove]

I'm laughing really hard at how aggro that dude got

[drifting merlin]

@brisk hill

l000000l

[dawn jackal]

man the discord alternative accounts arriving

just hurting the case

[brisk hill]

It only melts brain if you have no experience doing any of it before the changes

[limber creek]

so many people have never pked at all.. and are trying to change how it works... for the love of god talk about ironmen or 2t fishing or some shit that i don't know about.

[drifting merlin]

i just dont partake in osrs dogwater server

[dawn jackal]

don't ping me

[drifting merlin]

2 late

[limber creek]

i wont

[ember token]

i dont think the rules on what you lose are all that complex, but it would be nice if you choose what items you want to protect instead of it being automatic

[dawn jackal]

you can you seem more reasonable

[ember grove]

no the part that was making me feel insane is that people were arguing past one another for like 10 minutes when neither of the arguments were in disagreement

[drifting merlin]

i just joined and dudes already upset over nothing besides me being a new user

[brisk hill]

There is an argument happening. We aren’t saying the same thing

[drifting merlin]

[tough nacelle]

Until you’re higher than level 20 wildy

[limber creek]

this could be really cool.

[tough nacelle]

And if it’s a PvP death

And if you used a scroll

[restive storm]

theres a button specifically for that

[limber creek]

theres a box to tick this.

Once again please open the menu

hold on i got you

[tough nacelle]

And it changes based on GE value

So certain items fall apart

[drifting merlin]

the cat doesnt even know how to play the game itself let alone knows how the wilderness mechanics work

[tough nacelle]

Which fluctuates

[drifting merlin]

😭

[brisk hill]

I get what you mean. You’re talking about untradeables

[quasi glade]

just click

the death thing...

and it all tells you

[drifting merlin]

@tough nacelle if you click buttons you find out information

[brisk hill]

But then you have free rag sets if everyone returns in castle wars tops lol

[tough nacelle]

It’s not accurate lol

[restive storm]

now i cant tell if the cat is just ragebaiting or what

[drifting merlin]

no you just dont know how to use it

[tough nacelle]

It’s misleading once you factor in untradeables

[brisk hill]

Don’t take items when they first come into the game into the wildy!

[tough nacelle]

Oh I’m very familiar

[drifting merlin]

youre not familiar

at all

[quasi glade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1458852791941468160/1459283709047079107/image.png?ex=6962b75c&is=696165dc&hm=168476ad144f1f166c5537d182ecb6372f7fb69e05b4c1525bf64843b56b6bc1&

[limber creek]

dang i cant post images thats terrible

[quasi glade]

It literally tells you.

[limber creek]

i was gonna show you the death screen

[brisk hill]

How can you be familiar and say this 😔

[quasi glade]

Like what

[drifting merlin]

idk man this seems so complicated that i can see why a cat doesnt understand how it works

[quasi glade]

You are just arguing in bad faith now lol

[drifting merlin]

l0000l

[tough nacelle]

If you die with 3 items that are untradeables as your highest value you don’t protect the next 3

[scarlet dawn]

same, some roles can apparently

[quasi glade]

Tryna rage bait people

[drifting merlin]

please learn how the game works

[quasi glade]

Yes and it tells you......

[tough nacelle]

If you die with 3 items that are worth more than untradeables you keep the untradeables

[restive storm]

ragebaiting the already oppressed class (pkers) not a good look

[tough nacelle]

It doesn’t work

[dawn jackal]

you just gotta be in here long enough so you cant fire off the alternative account army

[drifting merlin]

try learning how the game works

[brisk hill]

l00000l

[tough nacelle]

Then it also doesn’t apply to all untradeables

[limber creek]

the untradeables literally have an outline around them bro ffs put shit in ur inventory and look and click the options.

try reading

[tough nacelle]

Things like infernal cape aren’t treated the same as virtous with a recolour

[tacit wharf]

its not, its a great way to prevent spam bots from posting some mrbeast/steam scam link

[quasi glade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1458852791941468160/1459284135347753061/image.png?ex=6962b7c2&is=69616642&hm=6dd41f964c74c149fcf851b63ee03a8b7f7d87d1188ce910f1eb958bd2c20ff3&

im confused

[drifting merlin]

I want to be nice to everyone here but its hard when everyone is being mean and aggressive please everyone take a moment to breathe

[brisk hill]

Rage bait in osrs official discord is FIRE

[quasi glade]

what are you saying

[limber creek]

i promise ill do that as soon as you give me permissions

[tough nacelle]

Different untradeables are kept vs lost

And it’s not the same

[quasi glade]

yes it is

[drifting merlin]

im a cat, please can you explain in meows and purrs

[restive storm]

when these people try to tell me THEY know the solution to wilderness problems it just 🤦‍♂️

[tough nacelle]

Recolour kits are not treated all as equal

[brisk hill]

l0000l

[tough nacelle]

And things like infernal capes are different again

And things with darts or scales in them are also different

[brisk hill]

If you can’t figure out what you keep in death do you think you should be able to vote in PvP changes

My answer is no

[quasi glade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/958523634278883329/1459284476986392700/image.png?ex=6962b813&is=69616693&hm=16fd46331f4c277eed48faef7b8f045d32642cbe88ddff13472631fbb9d4c061&

what....?

[restive storm]

#somevotesdontmatter

[quasi glade]

im so confused

lol

[brisk hill]

Just rage baiting lol

[floral blaze]

These people have the same voting power....

[brisk hill]

Rly bad rage bait lol

[floral blaze]

#NotAllVotesAreEqual

[tough nacelle]

I don’t think you understand how the game works lol

[brisk hill]

I don’t lol

[quasi glade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/958523634278883329/1459284594225582222/image.png?ex=6962b82f&is=696166af&hm=5a2f65da0b38ea1998547024e3dddd5c531dca06fb55712da50e00f01bfa0d23&

what are you saying

[brisk hill]

Eggsplain

[tough nacelle]

Take 3 items that are untradeable

[quasi glade]

all of those

[tough nacelle]

Make them your highest value

[brisk hill]

???

[quasi glade]

are untradeable

[brisk hill]

??????

[limber creek]

theres 4 there and an anglerfish

[quasi glade]

and i did

[brisk hill]

LOOOOO

[limber creek]

go on

[quasi glade]

i put anglers

[brisk hill]

?????

[quasi glade]

are u trolling me?

[brisk hill]

LOKooaoao

[tough nacelle]

Then take 3 items that are lower in value and untradeable

[drifting merlin]

Bro i told you its a cat

[tough nacelle]

Normal deaths you keep those but you don’t in PvP

[restive storm]

thats it! add him to the next PvP allstars discord discussion

[tough nacelle]

However the guide won’t show you

As keeping them

[brisk hill]

LMFAO

[tough nacelle]

IE blowpipe recolour

[limber creek]

have you tried paying attention to if you're above 20 wilderness or not brother?

[quasi glade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/958523634278883329/1459284909821788286/image.png?ex=6962b87a&is=696166fa&hm=606609ef810f62569af89701a79cb8253fb513586040ab577f08c3bc6af675e0&

pretty sure those 4

are the most expensive

lol

[restive storm]

god bless ur patience man honestly

[tough nacelle]

I think you’re being intentionally dense

[quasi glade]

L0L

now he's flaming he's been

[limber creek]

a whole crew of people think that about you but cook.

[quasi glade]

called out

on his troll

your stupid lol

[tough nacelle]

It’s like you’ve ignored every message I’ve sent

[quasi glade]

i just did

exactly

what you said

[tough nacelle]

No?

Take a recoloured zenyte and die in pvm

[limber creek]

just ignoring him back to the discussion.
Add multi revenants
Add 1t tele delay below 30 wilderness (not for players quit crying)

[tough nacelle]

It would be worth more than the other items

[restive storm]

facts lock back in

remove pj timer

[quasi glade]

what the fuck

ye he's getting blocked

[tough nacelle]

And not count as another item

[quasi glade]

LMFAOO

[brisk hill]

l000l

[ember grove]

I think you're failing to explain what you mean because like

there's literally a box in the UI to check for all these things, and I'm not aware of it being at all wrong

[restive storm]

weve gotten too far offf topic

[quasi glade]

He's rage baiting so hard

[brisk hill]

Stop lol

Don’t get baited

[quasi glade]

Never pvped a day in his life

[brisk hill]

Stay away!

RUN!

[limber creek]

Homie runs from random events hes so scared.

[quasi glade]

probably does like 1 lms a month

im pro pvper

lol

[brisk hill]

Just to humor him

Why would you take a cosmetic zenyte to wildy

& risk it

?

You’re just dumb

For that

Tbh

[restive storm]

cuz i dont suck so bad at the game id ever die w/ it

[limber creek]

Because he is uber pvmer and cannot die to filthy pker.

[scarlet dawn]

Its okay if you're in singles, chances are low you would die

[ember grove]

its true the demon sergeant guy's gains are intimidating

[tough nacelle]

If you have re-colored items, they typically in a PVM death will be protected, however, if those re-colored items which are considered untradeable are the highest value items they have they will replace your three items that you save when normally items that are recalled are protected in addition to the top three items you have unless they are at the top three value then you have certain items that are re-colored that will be protected in PVM deaths that don’t show up then there’s the fact of if you die above level 20 wilderness then certain items aren’t treated the same if they’re untradeable and you can lose them whereas you wouldn’t lose them below level 20 wilderness and then there’s a complex parchment system that most players won’t understand how to use and now you’re adding more and more difficult rules to understand for players trying to get into PVP

[brisk hill]

I don’t really understand the argument other than to rage bait

[brisk hill]

Sorry that happened to you

[floral blaze]

https://tenor.com/view/wesker-albert-albert-wesker-resident-evil-resident-evil-4-gif-5143688443782660001

[quasi glade]

ye nobody reading all that

from a troll

[tough nacelle]

The reality is just because you don’t understand how a lot of the death mechanics work

[limber creek]

https://tenor.com/bUKAX.gif

[quasi glade]

never pvped a day in his life

[tough nacelle]

Doesn’t mean that they’re not complicated

[ember token]

that is a biig run on sentence

[restive storm]

the button shows u all of this btw

[oblique mesa]

Death mechanics aren't complicated, you click on the button that tells you what you keep in difference scenarios

[limber creek]

try putting the items in your inventory and checking the death screen bro. oh great we got slowmoded, thanks jagex you can do that ig. Hope you're reading chat too.

[tough nacelle]

It literally doesn’t work in the situation I described

[sacred oracle]

Let's try to keep it civil in here. There's a lot of passionate discussion in here—which is great!—but we're also seeing a lot of insults and unkind things being said to each other, and that's less great 🙏

[ember token]

wasnt jagex that applied slowmode

[dawn jackal]

jagex aint reading all this about pvp

[limber creek]

Its a joke. Just like the mode lol.

[restive storm]

yea idk why we didnt just time out the rage baiter and move on tbh. been fine the last 2 days

[tough nacelle]

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Death please take a look at the wiki and tell me this isn’t insanely complex vs keep 3 most valuable unskulled

[brisk hill]

You should use specific examples @tough nacelle

[scarlet dawn]

Im open to testing with you, Stella, in the wildy

[nocturne solstice]

One specific example I can think of for a confusing pvp loss item is the fighter torso with BH orn.

The fighter torso is not protected when normally you only lose the BH orn for the other orn'd items.

[quasi glade]

Sure but yuo'd just check on the death screen

[nocturne solstice]

True, and thats what I do and it's accurate (The items lost on death menu).

But it's an outlier and I understand people getting confused since it doesnt work that way for any of the other BH orn'd items.

[quasi glade]

I don't know the death mechanics of every item in the game. If it's something i'm not sure of i check the death screen and it's usually correct. The death screen isn't confusing at all

[frail bough]

Just let people pick and it doesn't matter.

[quasi glade]

There hasnt been a time where it hasnt been correct in the 15 years i've played Runescape*

[limber creek]

If you can't operate the death screen i get why you have a problem in pvp. And im sorry. I can help you though.

[tacit wharf]

pick when though? before or after they die and what happens when they forget to pick, do they lose everything then or the default?

[tough nacelle]

The ornament kits make everything much more complicated on death because they function differently than other untradable’s then there’s also the parchment mechanic that isn’t incredibly well-known by players, the page also doesn’t work the way that you’re describing when you start with factoring ornament kits on items with fluctuating prices. For example, when I was doing doom, the toxic blow pipe with a blazing kit, was being protected above the scorching bow but at the time when I went into the tool, it didn’t display the same information

[frail bough]

A lot of smart folks in here. I have faith we could figure it out.

[quasi glade]

We can jagex cant

[restive storm]

no picking, too convoluted, only an ironmeme problem. not worth the time

[limber creek]

Brother respectfully we're talking about the wilderness here. Its none of our faults you didn't read the death screen and still were able to pick back all of your items for 500k max. If the screen was wrong please provide real evidence and not just a story.

[ember grove]

I feel like checking the death screen before going into the wildy in anything but rags is just like

obvious to do?

and if it's not the wildy just get to your grave and pay the 500k or whatever it is, the death screen does not matter

[dawn jackal]

i guess back to the original point is this niche death mechanic stopping a single soul from engaging in wildy content?

[tacit wharf]

we should all know, most people are infact stupid, not smart

[frail bough]

Maybe the reason pvp gets ignored is because there is an assumption that nothing will ever get done but then not enough good ideas being shared in a way that's helpful.

Or maybe it's just because pvp just isn't that interesting to today's player base.

[quasi glade]

Original point is the 2 minute timer btw

[zenith pike]

3 items + tradable kits outside of wilderness, 3 items in wilderness and pvp (and pre 20 just breaks untradables) the end

Latter after an update was made to stop people kitting out void and effectively owning a free armor set with no big loss assuming deaths

[limber creek]

Moreso because it gets overshadowed by people who never played it and just have to chime in their 2c and derail any conversation there is about it anywhere. That and jagex only takes streamers inputs.

[tough nacelle]

My point is complicated death mechanics, unique wildy mechanics, clan man mode, constant interruptions don’t encourage the andys to go into the wildy. If the central argument is there’s not enough noobs to pk and ganging up on noobs is too hard with pj timers in singles, the. Primary issue is there’s no enough people engaging with wildy content for you to pk. Ironman mode is also WAY more popular than it ever was in the past

[quasi glade]

There was an entire pvp discord where none of the suggestions got used. So let's not say there is not enough good ideas. That's just a straight lie

[restive storm]

this is exactly it, the updates to it are made by people who dont lik eit, and dont intend to interact with it. So it killed off the playerbase that used to love it

[frail bough]

I wasnt aware of this, that's my bad.

[limber creek]

Once again someone chiming in without being a part of the scene.

[restive storm]

Sooo many hours/ideas run through that discord only to ignore it entirely and ask streamer friends what the updates should be instead

[frail bough]

Just like how clans get ignored i suppose. I can get that.

Just because I'm not in the scene doesn't mean i can't have an opinion.

We play the same game, just differently.

[quasi glade]

I dont go through pvm discords deciding what i want then never interact with it

[tough nacelle]

I didn’t die and lose items in the wildy because the screen was wrong. Im saying the mechanics are beyond complicated for something that doesn’t function this way in any other area of the game because void was too powerful of an item

[limber creek]

but you came in here and had to chime in with a take that was completely wrong and off base. Hence the entirety of the experience as a pvper whatsoever.

Most of its just crying they lost their spade though so i definitely enjoy speaking with you more.

[quasi glade]

Imagine when there's pvm discussions and some random whos only just killed zulrah starts saying want they want for raids 4 lmao. It derails the entire conversation because they do not know how to pvm. This is what the equivalent happens in PVP.

[frail bough]

Yet i gave an example showing how i understand the sentiment.

[zenith pike]

Yeah that’s basically par for the course here

[brisk hill]

Can we get slow mode removed @nocturne solstice / @sacred oracle ? Everyone relaxed etc

[restive storm]

and when we ask fora space where we can actively discuss wildy/pking things, we get told "yeah thatd be a cool idea we'll discuss it" for 2 years

[tough nacelle]

I think the PvP base just doesn’t want to admit that the appeal of osrs to most players isn’t the wildy anymore, and as frustrating as that is, I’m not sure any update will fix that

[limber creek]

"Just like how clans get ignored" isn't much of an example beast. But its fine everyone should get to partake in pvp thats what its about. I hope you whoop me one day for real, because its just a game were here to vibe and have fun lol.

[dawn jackal]

i don't think anyone in the pvp space is deranged enough to think that people want to stroll through the wildy except maybe that guy n-bombing in dms (+1 friend request!)

[quasi glade]

The PvP based hasnt had a pvp update that they've wanted in years. We literally got the emir's arena rammed down our throats and nobody wanted it. We all said it'd be dead content and it is.

[restive storm]

honestly this is just a straw man argument made by people who dont understand the wilderness. They dont understand that it wasn't dead before the pj timer and there was plenty of fights out there. Chalking it up to "well we're old now" and ignoring that there was a specific update that killed it, doesnt make any sense when we all actively want that back

[kind surge]

don't think it's fair to completely dismiss pvp like that, no matter your opinions or enjoyment of pvp you should admit that they don't get any love in updates

[tough nacelle]

You mean the update to delete gambling?

[quasi glade]

We were all literally force fed the pvp arena, 0 choice it in nobody wanted it and it got rammed down our throats and we were told to like it. You can remove the duel arena w.o giving 5months of dev time to it btw

[frail bough]

The comment was after the "osrs pvp server got ignored" which was a reply to my statement.

The entire clan discord also got ignored.

Hence me saying "i get it". It sucks but the unfortunate reality is that its just not a interesting to most of the player base as a majority of the pvpers want it to be.

[restive storm]

dont forget theres no rewards except imbues for irons to boost, those got taken out last minute too

[oblique mesa]

I love the PvPers and UIMs get the same treatment from the wider community. People chirp in when they don't engage or have any experience with the content but just think they know whats best for them

[quasi glade]

Which got made obsolete now that you dont lose imbues on death and get full refunded points lol, which is a good thing btw

[zenith pike]

Ok most of the rewards looked awful, except the claws and elder chaos robes

[limber creek]

i support losing the duel arena. But i dont support the lame system they added at all lmao. Straight wasted dev time because someone had mentioned it to them in passing more than likely.
@frail bough that there is an example now. Thats fine. People can be uninterested but shouldn't the content at least be viable for the people that do wish to engage in it?

[restive storm]

tru but would they release a raid with no rewards at the last second cuz people didnt like them? wouldnt the replace the items

[frail bough]

You're simply not reading, or I'm not explaining well enough, or we are both victims to slow mode.

[quasi glade]

Yeah but nobody wanted the update in the first place bro, we all literally cried for months in the pvp discord about it and they still did it. They listened to nobody, i can give you the invite link to that discord so you can see for yourself, we all literally said this would be DOR

[ember grove]

the pvp base in question is actually saying "hey I think this would make the wildy more alive because it'd mean more pkers are there", and maybe jagex might disagree but taking any time at all to talk about it would be nice for people who gets handed 1 targeted update per year at most

I think no one's arguing that pvmers who don't want to risk anything and are just there for clue steps are going to suddenly want to do so (except maybe jagex in their annual wilderness revitalizations)

[tough nacelle]

I think the issue here is if you make the PJ time more loose, it hurts the pvmers engaging in content in single areas which isn’t popular as they will be even less likely to tank and survive

[restive storm]

one update a year is being generous to jagex at this point

[brisk hill]

I think we are able to admit that just fine.

But maybe ask us what we think could incentivize pvp’ers who have quit to come back or what we’d actually want out of the wilderness

[limber creek]

I'm just tryna help kill the botting problem. Literally 😈

[zinc galleon]

what's wrong with "hurting pvmers"? I want to hurt everyone >:)

[kind surge]

if pvmers chose to engage in wildy content then they also chose to accept the risks tbh

[viscid vapor]

The Cult is coming to the wildy. Soon.

[quasi glade]

Pvmers want a safer wilderness so they can do content without dying lol

[oblique mesa]

The PJ timer wouldn't affect the vast majority of PvMers. Most of them already say how they just "don't fight back because its quicker to die and return".
They already have wilderness player alert and 1t teleport ready. The wilderness being actually dangerous would be a change

[brisk hill]

You know what’s funny about that? PvPers have to engage with the rest of the game in order to PvP. Fascinating huh

[tough nacelle]

I mean there’s last man standing which is fairly popular

[zinc galleon]

questing at least, I suppose

[tacit wharf]

the amount of people running around in 100m+ risk up in 30+ is wild

[ember grove]

I took a very cheap shot at a dude for calling for multi revs because I'm nothing if not angling for an opportunity to make fun of people, but all jokes aside I really do get why people are annoyed

jagex consistently does not even bother talking to anyone besides streamers about pking, and the updates they do put out are rarely relevant to anyone or get obliterated by bots like LMS

and they can't even settle on a coherent approach to the wildy or non-gimmicky pvp stuff in the first place

[oblique mesa]

:^) Enjoy getting your 81 herb for your surge pots and royal titans for your prayers

[brisk hill]

Gz, you’ve just taken another pker out of the wild. Effectively solving nothing.

[limber creek]

Add multi revenants.
Add 1t tele delay below 30 wilderness.
Dont lecture me about pvp minigames like lms or castle wars.
Dont change the wilderness outside of this cause it's obvious you'll mess it up.

[quasi glade]

God forbid the wilderness is actually dangerous right. Infact lets just make it a safespace maybe more people will go there 😂

[restive storm]

remove pj timer

[tough nacelle]

It comes down to what’s fun for them. I’m all for wildy updates, but if we’re going to keep with the historic take that the wildy is supposed to provide high gp opportunities for increased risk, it incentivizes an unfun gameplay loop for half the people engaging

[quasi glade]

People are genuinely confused that the wilderness is meant to be a dangerous place and its funny

[dawn jackal]

wow work day is over thanks everyone except whomever made it slow motion. good luck to the wilderness enjoyers hopefully your cause isn't as doomed as it appears thanks to everyone who helped explain concepts to me

[limber creek]

Thank you brother.

[tacit wharf]

adding a 10 second timer between hopping worlds while in the wilderness, would be another

[floral blaze]

Wildy got neutered to death now and its still not enough for some people

[tough nacelle]

If there’s no incentive to go, people won’t go in

[zenith pike]

Oh god please not again, I couldn’t stand that when I started

[quasi glade]

There are 800 worlds what. It would take me 2 hours 10minutes to go through the full list of worlds 😂

[zinc galleon]

people have different ideas of incentive though, like for me danger is an incentive

[brisk hill]

I started off the con o this morning with this:

Wilderness was supposed to be worth the risk. In the past couple of years it’s anything but. When multi revs was a thing it was worth going to for some because it was one of the best money makers in the game. Simply put, wilderness activities for ppl who don’t engage in pvp aren’t lucrative enough for their occasional death

[scarlet dawn]

Well in some way the pj timer helps pvmers in such way you cant be spec dumped anymore

[floral blaze]

#MakeWildyGreatAgain

[limber creek]

Please keep this to yourself. This is not a good opinion. We already have 950 worlds to scout, bots that 1t tp if you do find them so you cant actually ever kill them.

[tough nacelle]

And I get that, but the problem is it makes it very lucrative for exploitation and gold farmers if that becomes the case. It’s a no win situation

[ember grove]

maybe jagex should put effort into finding ways to attract people who like the challenge and the pkers

instead of throwing their hands up, saying it's impossible, saying "uh, here's more alchs" and swinging wildly between "oh no people die in the wildy" and "oh no, not enough people die in the wildy" like a kid on the world's saddest seesaw ride

it's difficult but they should try

[restive storm]

also makes the entire wilderness a safe haven due to being able to freeze log anywhere

[quasi glade]

Bro nobody has falled in on pvmers ever. Comon man. Lets not lie to ourselves and make up fake scenarios that happened once in a blue moon.

[ember token]

there's 260 members worlds, which is quite far from 800

[oblique mesa]

But those people aren't required to enter at all. I've done tons of wilderness content on the iron and while it sucks to die I understand that the content is juiced because sometimes you die. You die for like 200k but make mills / get tons of crazy drops that would take you much longer if you didn't have the risk of dying for a miniscule amount of what you gain.
Sometimes a PKer gets you and you die. But its more an attention check like a old random event. Wilderness player alarm has basically made anything under 30 wilderness completely safe.

[tacit wharf]

could see a directed correlation to when you could stop quickhopping worlds and the decrease of pvmers at wilderness hotspots, due to how quickly the worlds would be cleared

[zinc galleon]

yeah the only time I can think of falling in on a pvmer is if they are skulled with rev weapon, or they have some weird +1

[tough nacelle]

It’s not the cost of death to be honest, it’s the interruption that’s frustrating

[quasi glade]

Ok 43 minutes assuming i spam hopped down the list.

[limber creek]

Can you please show us an example of you hopping every single world a single time for us? And also let me know when you get logout timer. You know since we're being pedantic.

[restive storm]

people arent gonna start spam attacking bots cuz that locks u in for like 3 minutes to run them outta food for like 200-300k, timer is just griefing

[brisk hill]

Please remove slow mode everyone has relaxed @nocturne solstice @sacred oracle

[winged mantle]

Doesn't look like it

[ember token]

not saying it wouldnt take time to hop every world, im just saying 800 is a huge exaggeration

[quasi glade]

It is an exaggeration but thats what it feels like hopping everyday lol

[restive storm]

"no timer removal until pvp talk dies "- mods

[winged mantle]

You hit world hop limit at like 400

[limber creek]

So we do agree that its exaggeration, but at the same time its extremely to many.

[quasi glade]

IK jagex plans to add more worlds aswell

[meager flame]

jagex just needs to realize their approach to the wilderness is self destructive especially when combined with whoever it is at jagex that decides whats worth working on due to engagement

[brisk hill]

Thanks for removing slow mode

[limber creek]

Ty for no slow mode.

[tacit wharf]

10 seconds to log into the next world after logging out of another, not exactly sure what yr talking about

[meager flame]

they basically chase players away and make people not want it to be updated then decide they shouldn't focus on fixing it because not enough people are engaging

they can't just stay in that cycle

[quasi glade]

There is more than enough pvmers in the wilderness

[tough nacelle]

I think having dedicated worlds for the wilderness would make way more sense, you can’t teleport and if you log out you lose all loot earned in the wildy

[restive storm]

this just.... arbitrarily wastes pkers time for no reason

[quasi glade]

It's just that all the content in the wilderness benefits pvmers more than it does the pvpers.

[limber creek]

Ik one update that would bring pvmers and new pkers back into the wilderness just saying.

[meager flame]

well not if they want to fix it anyways

[quasi glade]

Lets keep making the wilderness annoying

[brisk hill]

Logging is an escape that’s the only issue with this

[quasi glade]

The escape caves, freeze log,scouts outside of wbr, insta teleing the list goes on

[restive storm]

prayer scripting and jagex lack of ability to deal w/ it in a reasonable fashion

[quasi glade]

The horrible pathing at slayer caves and revenant caves

[brisk hill]

The horrible pathing since sailing

[quasi glade]

The single to multi interactions

[brisk hill]

But that’s a whole different issue ..

[tough nacelle]

I think, though that the wildy should have less escapes, reduce the damage taken by the pvm bosses, and force people to fight back

[restive storm]

this is what they said singles+ was for, and guess what nobody fights back still

[quasi glade]

Right now if you jump on a pvmer with bulwark and tank gear and all he does is pray mage. He will escape you unless you have 800m in gear

Why is that healthy

[winged mantle]

When pvming if you want to fight back you have half the supplies to do so

[tough nacelle]

But the reality is, you have to be geared completely differently for the PVM content versus the PVP content

[meager flame]

they should probably also stop and realize that these people they're luring to the wild that hate to be there

will never fight back or want to pk

it wont happen

[brisk hill]

Welcome risk reward

[restive storm]

yo do not whatsoever, thats why the wildy weps do 50% more dmg

[winged mantle]

You're saying you want pvmers to fight back but this is the reality

[restive storm]

idc whether pvmers fight back or not, what i do care about is i wanna hit the pker thats hitting the pvmer

[brisk hill]

I’m aware. I’ve anti pk’d in wildy. I tele if I’m low

[meager flame]

thats the whole problem with filling the wilderness with people that have 0% interest in pvp

[brisk hill]

And I’ve also stayed too long & died

It happens lol

[ember token]

sure and i said earlier that ive suggested reducing the amount of worlds the wilderness is available on in the past

[minor whale]

What's that

[winged mantle]

Irons won't risk more than 3 items and only stay for the bosses. It's a seperate issue of irons wanting the boss loot/ wildy drops and not being equipped to deal with pvp - pvpers want fights but there no incentive

[frail bough]

If there weren't 500 other ways to make money, this would work.

[winged mantle]

So do i

[quasi glade]

Irons should have their own server they can play

[limber creek]

Thanks for asking.
Add multi revenants.
Add 1t tele delay sub 30 wilderness (this wont affect most normal players only bots)

[winged mantle]

Fuck off with multi revs

[quasi glade]

Game shouldnt be around ironmen

[restive storm]

wildy reworks should not be focusing on bringing irons in there

[tough nacelle]

Multi revenant just turned into clan man mode with bot farmers paying clans to protect them

[meager flame]

they just need to understand the demographic of players they're trying to convince to enter the wild

[oblique mesa]

The pure salt you would get PKing on that server would be amazing.

[brisk hill]

That’s what got us slowmoded

[meager flame]

a large amount of them will not pvp under any circumstance

[quasi glade]

What's the issue about that

[winged mantle]

I agree

[restive storm]

yes please relax w/ the language

multi revs comeback for sure

[quasi glade]

It created an ecosystem

[restive storm]

no pj timer

[limber creek]

Those of you saying multi revs was just clans protecting obviously have never logged into a non total level world.
Please don't let your limited knowledge cloud the truth of the ecosystem it created.

[floral blaze]

Multi revs was freaking awesome

[limber creek]

Go back to zulrah men are talking.

[restive storm]

none of this absolutely nuts multi teleport timer (for why?)

[winged mantle]

Multi revs is for bots and toxic clans. Fish in a barrel to the extreme

[quasi glade]

and single revs is just bots then yeah?

like huh

[restive storm]

im sorry what do you think rev caves is right now?

[limber creek]

Okay so ellie is another pvm bot who shouldn't even be in the discussion.

Good to know

[floral blaze]

Teaming up with randos and going out fkin shit up together 🔥

[brisk hill]

Now it’s just tick perfect robots in singles unless attacked by odablock in 2b gear lol

That’s healthier

[quasi glade]

and bot

s

lol

[meager flame]

yeah the bots are an automatic result of 0 requirement infinite loot private server gameplay that jagex just loves to put in the wild in recent history

[tough nacelle]

Genuinely I ask who are you hoping to fight in the wild and don’t answer with anybody, are you wanting people to fight back or are you wanting people to try to run?

[winged mantle]

You either have to remove any reason for irons to want to go into the wildy or fully rework the wildy to allow for fights. How do irons benifit from wilderness and pvp? That's your avenue

[meager flame]

like

[brisk hill]

Fight back

[meager flame]

of course that gets suicide botted

[quasi glade]

Who cares about what irons benefit

[restive storm]

irons dont need to go there wdym

[quasi glade]

lol

[brisk hill]

But not pvmers

Ppl there for PvP

[quasi glade]

You arent forced to go to the wilderness

[winged mantle]

Healthier than it was pre changes

[quasi glade]

what

[restive storm]

by healthier do you mean dead?

[brisk hill]

😭

[quasi glade]

Is it because you dont die dying it?

[tough nacelle]

I think if you want that, then you have to remove the incentive of loot from pvm content

[restive storm]

please be honest

[quasi glade]

Not dying doesnt mean more healthier btw

[meager flame]

be real though for a second

[winged mantle]

Irons do for webweaver for awakened leviathan, orher wildy bosses

[tough nacelle]

So the only people that enter want to PVP

[meager flame]

revs shouldn't even exist

[ember token]

irons don't have access to the grand exchange, which means the only way to obtain items such as the voidwaker is to enter the wilderness, and it's absurd to say that irons don't have to go into the wilderness

for mains i agree they dont have to enter