then dmm
#game-update
round lintel
which i hate cuz i gotta get that damn crystal kit
why do they only give the good kits to dmm and everything else is meh in leagues
and the gridmaster was horrible
tacit wharf
because gridmaster was just to test their bingo system
chrome lantern
Gridmaster rewards were meh but I’m glad they did the event
Hopefully it shows people you can have a good limited gamemode without region locking again
And we can stop having boring leagues
round lintel
id say they can give you a 4th region if you get dragon rank
or maybe 85% of your 3 regions tasks
chrome lantern
I don’t think there should be a limit
Leagues 3 was by far the most fun
Because 4 and 5 were just 2 again but slightly different relics and tasks
round lintel
I had fun in shattered relics
but i was kinda still noob for how long i had been playing then
chrome lantern
but i was kinda still noob for how long i had been playing then
To be clear I loved Leagues 2 and that’s how I feel about leagues 2
Leagues 3 I actually had game experience and had fun
chrome lantern
Leagues 4 and 5 were just the same with slight variance and as it turns out, limiting regions and locking to a single combat style
Just kinda sucks
Especially when we’ve already done it 3 times
round lintel
what i liked from shattered relics was getting god items to power your cb
i remember rocking some bandos stole boots and tassets
chrome lantern
It was novel but I wouldn’t use that exact system anymore
round lintel
going off melee like a truck
i liked the raging echoes
but i finished it too fast
that i ended up going dragon rank in 2 accts
and rune rank in other 2
hasty shard
forcing misthalin every time is ughh
round lintel
i hated to my guts kandarin region
hasty shard
if we actually had a choice of starting region itd fare better
id probably pick kandarin over misthalin
round lintel
thermy echo boss was the most horrible echo boss ever
the clues had sherlock steps that most of the times u couldnt complete even with the clue relic
and i didnt pick the clue relic there so i dropped 85/100 clues
everytime
hasty shard
i swear clue drops were nerfed
round lintel
thermy fight only became easy till you had range 6
which was stupid cuz you get a mage upgrade there
but mage sucked at thermy
chrome lantern
i liked the raging echoes
4 and 5 I got tremendously bored after having done Leagues 2 already and quit at rune, after dragging myself to even get to that point, despite dragon in 2/3
And yes I did try playing alts
chrome lantern
My alt did wildy yeah
But really it just isn’t fun when there’s fun content but there’s a 0% change I pick a whole region for just 1 content
Or you have content you want to do but now 0 overlapping raids with your friends
chrome lantern
I picked zeah and regretted it
hasty shard
i took desert in 4 and hated it
chrome lantern
I picked ToA and Asgarnia based on gear in leagues 4 and realized I hated both Nex and ToA and had no recourse
chrome lantern
The fact that they’re still soft-locking to one combat style in leagues is still wild to me as well
As someone that personally did 5/5/0 in 5
hasty shard
they REALLY needed to give you an extra mastery point
chrome lantern
It’s not comparable to actually being able to switch styles
chrome lantern
They just need to actually balance stuff properly so that we don’t get something like “ranged t6 = use everywhere” lmao
hasty shard
you just arent using the sub style
round lintel
i liked toa in l4 because mage was strong
hasty shard
especially when yknow
chrome lantern
Then you could just get all styles
hasty shard
ranged
round lintel
and u got purples 100% doing 600s
hasty shard
they need to fucking actually hotfix bugs
round lintel
and the sage's axe made it quick
hasty shard
mage was a pisstake in 4 and slayer relic was in 5
like oh my god stop screwing people over for picking blatantly wrong vs insane buffs
chrome lantern
Leagues 3 I think it was a bit too easy to unlock everything, but you could do so and not make decisions that locked you out of anything
hasty shard
Leagues 3 I think it was a bit too easy to unlock everything, but you could do s...
reddit moment
chrome lantern
Initial unlock balancing felt good then they just gave everyone hundreds of renown for no reason
Honestly feels like 1-30 Sailing discussion tbh
ember token
like oh my god stop screwing people over for picking blatantly wrong vs insane b...
on one hand people are picking relics based on how theyre expected to work, but on the other hand, it's a temporary game mode and there's no balance that needs to be maintained
chrome lantern
People just chose a trash method to get 1-30 Sailing and instead of trying anything that wasn’t a port task they complained and Jagex buffed it
Fine to start slow
round lintel
i mean from 1-30 what else was out there to try? port tasks were it and at the start nobody knew much about charting
so everyone thought it was slow including myself
the buff was a bit too overreacted
but it was reeeeally slow and tedious
hahahaha
i blurred the word cuz it was not nice
true talon
facts
chrome lantern
i mean from 1-30 what else was out there to try? port tasks were it and at the s...
Even before release charting was the one most obvious thing that stood out to me to want to do
round lintel
Even before release charting was the one most obvious thing that stood out to me...
couldnt tell i did the alpha and i didnt even pass lvl 5
didnt know what to do
and after 5 mins i gave up on it
now that ive been slowly hunting soup on my main after 99 i really like port tasks when xp doesnt really matter to me
been going off lunar isle to piscarilius back and forth
or priff and port tyras
sometimes i get confused and choose piscatoris
that slows me down
but def a better skilling pet than being at amethyst all day for rock golem
eventhough ive made close to 100m gp
skilling pets are waaaay to rare
the rate buff shouldnt come after 200m xp
meager flame
i mean in the sailing stuff they let us test
honestly the final product didn't really change my mind about anything except i guess salvaging was better later on than i thought it would be
i feel like they basically let us test what it was going to be and then kinda shipped it
sort of makes me question why we even got a beta
its not even like its all bad either its just weird the good stuff stayed the same as did all of the bad stuff it just seems like it was kind of a waste of time
icy relic
I guess like
at the end of the day they were very explicit that they didn't really want to shake up any metas
which is just an awful thing to say for the release of a new skill
and honestly I don't know what the overall sentiment about sailing is but as an RS3 refugee who likes the progression system here better, you still need to have a baseline quality for skills in terms of integration with the rest of the game
and no RS3 skill has ever failed to clear this bar so spectacularly
round lintel
im a firm believer port tasks should be improved
a little more xp
and the rapids placed in important areas rather than areas that are useless
analog crow
It’s fine to shake up metas
round lintel
bro tf is wrong with jagex making dragon keel part part of the falo items?
meager flame
That’s pretty easy at least but kind of in poor taste
meager flame
Well time to get smithing levels to boost
I just don’t know why it isn’t the hopper or something
round lintel
im 89 🙁
meager flame
You know an item you don’t consume
round lintel
and i dont even need a keel part rn lucky ive had 2 frost dragon tasks
so i got 3 sheets
chrome lantern
I do think 94 is very out-of-line with other clue items though
meager flame
Tbh I should probably go get a hopper
There’s no way they don’t buff it or something
ember token
the closest thing is probably the infernal axe step which realistically needs 91 slayer
analog crow
Dragon keel is rough yeah
I feel like rosewood hull parts or something would be better
chrome lantern
Even that would still be 84 con + 92 wc
"At least" keel parts is "only" one non-Sailing skill
79 Sailing + 84 Con + 92 WC for rosewood, vs 87 Sailing + 94 Smithing (or literally thousands of krakens/great whites)
Hard to say which is more demanding
analog crow
I feel like 92 wc isn’t as demanding since there is already a 90 wc Sherlock step
So realistically rosewood hull parts is a 84 con + 79 sailing step in my head
chrome lantern
I suppose
round lintel
"At least" keel parts is "only" one non-Sailing skill
Rosewood is still better, imagine having to kill 700 frost dragons off task to make it cuz is gonna be sitting in ur bank at least the rosewood u can drop it and make it at any time you wish as long as u have the lvls
blissful topaz
when is the left click bury bone ground object coming?
ember token
there hasn’t been an answer the first 15 times you’ve asked that
and there still isn’t one
nocturne solstice
Probably never, as it should.
Bone crusher exists so that already fills that want
narrow folio
I think it was mentioned before by jagex sometime but no specific date
Left click bury still needs you to click on the bone on the ground while bonecrusher is automatic
hard axle
Left click bury still needs you to click on the bone on the ground while bonecru...
Wear the bonecrusher necklace and lose dps 
narrow folio
Based I suppose
meager flame
tbh i dont really see why they would make that change but i also dont see what it would hurt if you could left click bury on ground
the way they've designed prayer basically means you're basically dumb and wasting your time if you bury so im not sure if changing that to like
teach new players to do the wrong thing makes sense lol
honestly it would make more sense if they removed burying bones as an option
not that i think its really worth their time to do any of this but at least that would push people to learning how the game actually works
just allow them to use any bones on low level altars or something for much reduced exp
narrow folio
In a lot of cases you need to bury because banking takes too long or something
meager flame
so they get an idea of whats really supposed to happen
it is kinda interesting though that the original way of interacting with that skill just
is a super terrible idea most of the time and a super micro decision where maybe you get a hundred exp or something if you really want to bother with it at best
narrow folio
There could be a toggle option and a warning to new players
meager flame
like basically everything is tuned assuming you're gonna take these bones to an altar somewhere and get giga buffed exp
and the bury option is mostly a noob trap like
they're making a mistake most likely and dont even know it
im sorta surprised they dont let them go to like lumby church or something and use whatever bones for some increased exp just so they know what they're really intended to do later
chrome lantern
Pretty sure it's just for f2p
icy relic
Prayer has so many options
I had to get turmoil doing shitty PoH open altars and there was not even an unnoter back then
fresh forge
Carrying normal bones to an altar is in almost all cases dumb
Maybe for dragon bones it could be not left click
round lintel
Do u guys think next league will be around June or Nov 2026?
meager flame
no idea honestly idk how they even have the bandwidth to do a league
so maybe its just not coming
like idk how they're gonna do
big grandmaster quest
rewards
raids 4
continue with sailing
dmm
whatever else they plan on a smaller scale for the year
and a league
round lintel
narrow folio
@opaque oracle hey lets not encourage rsps in here
round lintel
who thought it was better to have the herb drops from shamans unnoted?
ember token
tbh kinda balances out that you can take 0 damage from them with the setup
hard axle
who thought it was better to have the herb drops from shamans unnoted?
No herbs should be noted unless raids 
Expand herb sack massively
narrow folio
It was to make it better for herb sack
chrome lantern
who thought it was better to have the herb drops from shamans unnoted?
It’s so much worse for telegrabbing, I was very upset
round lintel
Yup
And picking them up is not worth anymore
Getting jumped like 20 times trying to
analog crow
Telegrab costs like 100gp and doesn’t delay your attack
Surely it’s fine
chrome lantern
Telegrab costs like 100gp and doesn’t delay your attack
Surely it’s fine
Yes but the difference is that you now have to telegrab several times more often and if you stay there for a long time you overflow your herb sack
analog crow
Given that you’re close to a bank (farming guild) and (presumably) go out frequently to recharge prayer anyway, is that a real issue?
chrome lantern
What
The farming guild is really far away and you don't leave to recharge prayer
Shayzien is a lot closer bank but I wouldn't go there either
Not very close
mint stratus
Herb sack should let you unnote herbs highkey
nocturne solstice
why would you want that
tacit wharf
red-x shamans shouldnt be the thing
icy relic
don't make shamans worse
analog crow
The farming guild is really far away and you don't leave to recharge prayer
Thought you were in the temple mb
dry birch
Anyone have this issue on mobile where you can only see “walk here” when right clicking people?
chrome lantern
Thought you were in the temple mb
Even if I were, both of those statements would be true
torpid delta
Anyone have this issue on mobile where you can only see “walk here” when right c...
check your settings to see if you've toggled "disable player options"
dry birch
Thanks flant,
The game toggled it for me, on both my phones lol
narrow folio
Gonna be honest, I don't think the unnoted herbs thing was well thought out, and hope it gets revisited at shamans.
viscid zephyr
??? Use an Herb Sack if you want to keep the herbs
analog crow
Even if I were, both of those statements would be true
You do you 
true talon
Gonna be honest, I don't think the unnoted herbs thing was well thought out, and...
Herb sack should be buffed if they want unnoted herbs
narrow folio
Yeah like autopickup or something
tacit wharf
so now i gotta drop the herbs and remove placeholders for crappy herbs cuz ya'll lazy to pick up yr non-noted herbs?
the herb sack is fine, it doesnt need to auto pick up herbs
nor do monsters need to drop noted herbs unless they are balanced around doing so
narrow folio
The issue for shamans specifically is it used to drop multiples of notes herb which only needed one pickup/telegrab action. Now its unnoted, it takes more effort to pick it all up. And it requires an herb sack or you got a nerf for no reason. Even with a sack, it takes more effort to pick them all up individually.
winged mantle
Why did they change it?
nocturne solstice
to let people use the herb sack more
https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/summer-sweep-up-slayer--more?oldschool=1
According to the wiki it was from this patch, link if you want to read the rest. It doesnt name lizard shaman specifically but a bunch of mobs got the change.
dire mango
tbh it was annoying to own a herb sack and have to use multiple inventory slots for herb drops still because they were noted and low quantity
narrow folio
Looked it up and shamans drop 2-3 so imagine needing to pick up 3
analog crow
Still it’s fine
There are shamans close to banks if you want to empty the sack
narrow folio
Space isnt the problem but needing to hit telegrab more times feels worse. Ultimately not the biggest deal but pointing out there are downsides to this 🤷
true talon
to let people use the herb sack more
herb sack ammount is to small, needs to be like 100 herbs
nocturne solstice
Do we even have 100 types of herbs? Cause in the general sense, it holds 450 herbs.
Holding more varieties would be nice though for sure
true talon
Do we even have 100 types of herbs? Cause in the general sense, it holds 450 her...
i mean 100 of each hrb
idle rapids
If you don’t want to pick unnoted herbs, then don’t
narrow folio
Weird how it's a certain number of each, not X amount of any herb total
true talon
They should also buff the gem bag to allow you to store all uncut gem types
dunno why it excludes red topaz, opal and jade
narrow folio
I like to imagine those came out later and was forgotten about
nocturne solstice
It was also an issue with gem stone mining
but people didnt really do that a lot
100 of each might be a bit much for Jagex since itll impact herb runs too but im not too worried about that personally
We already have leprechauns there to note so it aint a big deal
analog crow
losing 2k+ red topaz, opals and jades was 🙁
Just bring imp boxes
Ez
narrow folio
Its a minor timesave for a lot of qol and u cant clean them first on the way. Worthy tradeoff.
?
winged mantle
Weirdo
narrow folio
Not clicking that shit
nocturne solstice
suspicioyus
idle rapids
Uh oh
narrow folio
Genstone mining also has a depo box right there you can loop around to
analog crow
Hey party people click my link virus dot biz /s
narrow folio
So like, what gives
analog crow
Gemstone you just tele in and tele out to bank
winged mantle
to let people use the herb sack more
Idk I'm more likely to pickup a herb if it's noted vs single unnoted
Exception is ranarrs
warm epoch
makes it more worthwhile to pick them up for others
nocturne solstice
Idk I'm more likely to pickup a herb if it's noted vs single unnoted
I am not, my likeliness is dependant entirely on the type of herb.
chrome lantern
Still it’s fine
There are shamans close to banks if you want to empty the sack
I still wouldn’t say any are even close to a bank, you’re still spending over a minute banking
analog crow
1 minute to bank is nothing
narrow folio
Just wondering if u actually end up filling the sack in a typ trip?
chrome lantern
I’ve done very long trips at shamans that well exceeded herb sack capacity yes
Was just worse with unnoted
The worse part is casting several telegrabs when one would have done
hard axle
Just wondering if u actually end up filling the sack in a typ trip?
Herb runs on iron
You have to plant 3 types or deal with overflow
narrow folio
Context is shamans
narrow folio
Yes that would be good
hard axle
420 🥬
nocturne solstice
You keep those thoughts to yourself 
zenith pike
You keep those thoughts to yourself <:pepegiantclub:1217530269943332984>
Still a bad change
nocturne solstice
That thought is fine to share 
true talon
All because the gem bag dont work 🙁
merry verge
All because the gem bag dont work 🙁
price of the red topaz would crash so hard if gem bag would work.
I think it's fine to let the gem bag not work for red topaz and leave some space for incentive to bank salvage and sort salvage near bank later, as an optional method for more gp.. (of course at the expense of way less afk and way lower exp/hr)
true talon
price of the red topaz would crash so hard if gem bag would work.
I think it's ...
even as an ironman banking salvage is not an option lol
analog crow
not sorting on your boat is trolling yourself
true talon
but it was kinda painful to lose all those red topaz
it would be more than id use my accounts life time
merry verge
even as an ironman banking salvage is not an option lol
I've actually been doing it, partly because I don't even have herb sack and I like that extra gps (main btw)
true talon
I've actually been doing it, partly because I don't even have herb sack and I li...
Crazy the GP is not worth the effort of banking lol
merry verge
not sorting on your boat is trolling yourself
I know, horrible exp/hr but I keep thinking of all the gp I'd need to drop
winged mantle
i banked 3k salvage for the topaz tbf
analog crow
That's why imp boxes are bis
merry verge
Crazy the GP is not worth the effort of banking lol
I know, the META of parking boat is so dominant cuz it's so much better, we know
winged mantle
merry verge
That's why imp boxes are bis
they're not stackable tho, so you can only bring a certain amount right
true talon
id much rather just some gem rocks than bank salvage
analog crow
they're not stackable tho, so you can only bring a certain amount right
You can store them in your hunter kit
merry verge
You can store them in your hunter kit
ohhh really, that does make it kinda viable I guess
analog crow
This discovery changed my life
true talon
i banked all the ironwood repair kits and this fish bits
narrow folio
Lemme know how many imp boxes an hour you get
winged mantle
if you can catch a lot per hour i may do that tbh
analog crow
Lemme know how many imp boxes an hour you get
there's a house in varla where you can get a good amount
merry verge
I think birdhouses are better for the hunter exp considering all the birds nests from it
good thing about banking salvage is you get to do birdhouse runs every hours while salvaing 😄
narrow folio
Oh damn ill consider it
analog crow
It's the dungeon in Kastori
meager flame
All because the gem bag dont work 🙁
ya they should let us hold some of them in the gem bag
doesn't even have to like be a shit ton but its sorta weird that they just drew the line like no you cannot possibly hold these other types of gems for no real reason
we'd still be dropping the vast majority at salvage
but getting a few would be nice
ember token
its funny its been like that forever but people only care now because an overpowered afk method drops them
meager flame
its more like because a method that isn't 2 tiles from a bank produces them
its not really op
it would be way better to go smack gem rocks if you were actually trying to get them
it just feels bad when you're sitting in the ocean dropping thousands of items constantly
idle rapids
its not really op
Not OP for topaz collection but it’s an OP method in the grand scheme of skilling
Even other 30 minute afk methods are nowhere near the exp/hr of salvaging, and you can afksalvage for more than 30 mins
craggy radish
I banked 5k salvage when the XP was nerfed. Wasn't so bad from north of Pisc to Pisc docks. U can bank cargo with ur helmsman
winged mantle
I banked 5k salvage when the XP was nerfed. Wasn't so bad from north of Pisc to ...
aldarin spot is a straight line basically
it's nb to bank there
chrome lantern
its funny its been like that forever but people only care now because an overpow...
To be fair there have been mentions of it as a change long before Sailing released but yeah there was like a 100x resurgence
ember grove
iirc it was bad coding that led to them not being included in the first place
that said, much of osrs is built on bad programming leading to weird edge cases, so
tender peak
I, for one, love spaghetti
proud coral
99 sailing and it was a waste of time, don’t bother
velvet orchid
whats the update? any downtime?
warm axle
^^^^
somber musk
no downtime
fickle cairn
i would assume some kind of maintenance?
thorny gale
5 hour rollbacks :/
rancid ruin
From the status page : Game worlds will reboot today at 11:30am UTC, with a 45 minute countdown beforehand. Once the timer expires, you'll be able to log back in within a minute or two!
keen wraith
probaly cause jagex not working on the 31st so they restarting today is what im assuming
quaint shadow
zuko the goat
keen wraith
richaye the goat
round lintel
probaly cause jagex not working on the 31st so they restarting today is what im ...
there wasnt w restarted on the 24th
so probably it was cuz of that
keen wraith
we might never know
edgy stone
we might never know
wyd here
undone basin
Should have done port tasks pre99
meager flame
tbh
meager flame
the smart play is to simply continue not doing them
undone basin
meager flame
they're going to make port tasks worth actually doing eventually
should just wait until then
round lintel
i dont think improvements will be related to pet rate
meager flame
yeah they'll be related to you actually getting anything worthwhile
and its probably not going to be exp
they basically have placeholder rewards atm lol
round lintel
idk what else they can improve besides the random tasks in the board
besides im just camping the ez tasks
meager flame
it gives you an irrelevant amount of gp
round lintel
and they r always there
meager flame
its probably going to be things like cannonballs eventually
a lot of sailing is like that currently tbh
definitely one of those times where its probably better to just not play
round lintel
Hopefully is not like biever for me
meager flame
and do something else
round lintel
took me 40m xp
meager flame
hopefully everyone enjoyed their 30 seconds at the cannonball npc though
meager flame
i usually go grab them if im online for the reset because like
its basically a free 5-10k cannonballs
its just funny
bc every time i do it its like
me and every other maxed player to exist somehow manage to all be online and clear out the game
instantly
silver steeple
No update post on the site or anywhere? Or was this just a server restart?
round lintel
normal cox
meager flame
just a restart
edgy stone
Clanchat system is down
meager flame
working for me
round lintel
ye working for me
dusty sphinx
Can’t log in via Jagex launcher for some reason, but can log in on mobile no issues 🤷🏽♂️
round lintel
Can’t log in via Jagex launcher for some reason, but can log in on mobile no iss...
close launcher
and reopen it
dusty sphinx
Tried that a couple of times, third time lucky 🙏🏽
Got further than before, got a “loading please wait” box pop up this time 🙃
round lintel
weird i didnt have any problems
just logged before timer finished
closed launcher
and then just reloaded it
dusty sphinx
I’ll try a different world this time maybe
round lintel
all g for me after
chrome lantern
hopefully everyone enjoyed their 30 seconds at the cannonball npc though
Just woke up, would’ve if I knew :/
icy relic
I've been able to find multiple worlds with full 8k stocks these days
true talon
I've been able to find multiple worlds with full 8k stocks these days
Probably because most people don’t care about ship combat.
As an iron you just need to kill a few kraken and great whites
icy relic
yeah, people are realizing it's not worth doing
true talon
Don’t even know if I’ll go get dragon hook, I’m already 99 sailing lol
The bottled storm from krakens is nice, I’m hoping they make cannon barrels reusable fact that you need so many on an iron is crazy at 1/20k rate
For retrospective I got one from 87-99 sailing some people get 0
chrome lantern
I installed two on my boat
If they ever make a new ship variant that uses more I’ll be screwed
I got 3 by 91 and no additional after
meager flame
I’ve been afking my old main to 99 and my iron is already 99 and it’s looking like I’ll have 3 between both accounts
It’s ridiculous lol already more total exp than 2 99s would take by a couple million
vivid ruin
I have 0 by 94 :p
true talon
If they ever make a new ship variant that uses more I’ll be screwed
they gonna add a pirate ship that needs 8
vivid ruin
they gonna add a pirate ship that needs 8
Are you saying my requests shall be fulfilled after all?
final frigate
@winter hearth could we get an update on how the toa unique loot changes went in terms of new stats by raid level and overall purple influx as well as whether they meet the original expectations of the changes?
strange idol
they should add spice boat salvaging so you can get spices for stews but also have some sort of leaf secondary and a thing on the boat to break down the leaf in to the goop for the herblore minigame
tacit wharf
sorry yr spices got all wet and moldy, now they spoiled
nocturne solstice
They do not stack and do not fit in the cargo hold
meager flame
<@958735975754903594> could we get an update on how the toa unique loot changes ...
Tbh idk if we really want them to think about this lmao
I’m afraid the numbers would come back and tell them to nerf it again
Although they probably already knew they weren’t nerfing hard enough
It’s pretty obvious toa is just wildly rewarding in terms of purples to time spent
At least relative to the raid that’s the most healthy atm
icy relic
Buff tob
final frigate
I’m afraid the numbers would come back and tell them to nerf it again
they should if they wanted to lower purple rates
cause <400s are barely changed afaik
where most of the purples come from
while 500s and above got nuked when the least purples come from there
the 400s nerfs were good though
narrow folio
nerf it further and you get an even more unrewarding raid as prices wont rise to offset
lose lose decision
final frigate
it's quite rewarding
zenith pike
There’s a win somewhere, since everyone deserves less
final frigate
according to mmg 300s are around vork/slayer bosses, 450s around dt2 and colo (colo should be way higher but rip), 545s between cox and cms with tob being the one standout profit raid
so i'd say the profit levels are pretty decent
obviously mmg isn't really max efficiency but gives a good idea
hasty shard
nerf it further and you get an even more unrewarding raid as prices wont rise t...
how i feel imo
'how i feel imo' why am i braindead
final frigate
how i feel imo
what makes it feel unrewarding
hasty shard
if you nerf it
narrow folio
prices of masori and shadow have crashed since being made rarer
hasty shard
unfun raid i dont want to be there even longer getting purples
like oh boy 20 minutes of afking baba to roll an 8% chance to get 500 lightbearers
final frigate
not targeting you specifically since idk how you run them but in my experience most people running toa choose the most awful methods possible and then proceed to call the raid unfun
hasty shard
oh god lightbearer is basically the same price as an augury scroll 😭
final frigate
so that's more on the players imo
narrow folio
sure raid was made a little easier and ayak released but who was gaining anything
hasty shard
what methods
narrow folio
300 and below runners?
hasty shard
you literally stand still and stab baba
final frigate
mostly the 300-400 runners
od, ps, ovl notably
running invos that you either never run ever (ps) or only for 530/545s (od, ovl)
at 300s
hasty shard
raid is like fundamentally scuffed and invos don't actually change up mechanics enough imo
gun to my head i couldnt tell you why blood thinners exists
or why blowing mud is a free invo solo
narrow folio
the prices tanked, raid became more brainoff, purple chance was lower
true talon
prices tanked, because ayak fucked shadow's domiance.
final frigate
kephri and akkha became more fun and overall better design after summer, baba is practically unchanged for most people doing 6:0 since it's brain off either way
which in the case of baba is also a player choice to do 6:0 and go slower than optimal
narrow folio
fang's decently pricier than before but literally everything else has gone down and LB doesn't even matter
hasty shard
why would you 6:0 anymore is it just so baboons spawn slower
final frigate
not now i mean before summer
people who did 6:0 made a choice to actively make the boss more of a slog and more boring so
not much sympathy for them if they didn't enjoy toa
meager flame
nerf it further and you get an even more unrewarding raid as prices wont rise t...
nah it wouldn't be more unrewarding
true talon
if you wanna talk about end game content that has been destroyed, look at colo.
meager flame
the problem is that jagex is filling the game with uniques in the first place which doesn't allow them to be rewarding in the first place
true talon
barely 7m an hour
meager flame
and like
narrow folio
in gp/hr
final frigate
if you wanna talk about end game content that has been destroyed, look at colo.
yeah this is criminal
narrow folio
not for irons or power level
icy relic
Colo not having sunlight spear is silly
hasty shard
me when tonsils are a meme weapon
meager flame
basically the real fix would be lol unfortunately for toa lovers
hasty shard
cox mass and maiden are not utilities and i refuse to hear otherwise
true talon
Colo not having sunlight spear is silly
splinters not having a sink and not being removed from wave 1 is criminal
hasty shard
i have zero clue why they kept splinters being guaranteed lol
final frigate
it recovered a tiny bit but colo used to be the same money as araxxor 🥀
meager flame
the whole problem is jagex went way down the rabbit hole with scaling from the raid to the rewards
when it just does not work
hasty shard
remove invos 
meager flame
unironically yeah
you can have multiple difficulty modes right but the problem is that toa has like
so many theres no way to balance them all
hasty shard
a colo style system might work better
meager flame
they basically have to choose between scaling up not mattering after a point
or making the rates absolutely insanely bad
on the low end
and they obviously cant do that since thats where most players are at
hasty shard
a colo style system might work better
something like being offered set invos/scaling per boss, and it changes after each one
so u could be offered medic kephri vs everything else and not pick that, then when you come back its overlords or multiple others instead
tiny epoch
toa is good actually 
baba changes ruined that boss but akkha & kephri changes were a rly good shakeup
icy relic
I actually think invos are fine, the issue is jagex did not expect people to be running 400+
tiny epoch
arcane change + scarab defense
amber dune
oh yeah
narrow folio
revert some of the purple rate nerf and reverse rooom changes
tiny epoch
being able to swarm p2 consistently since u can jump the arcane on demand
hasty shard
keph changes were reasonable
hasty shard
i think everything else is like ??
meager flame
and balance them appropriately
tiny epoch
& kerising the scarabs is fun i like hitting 105s
meager flame
than it is to making a sliding scale of optional difficulty and figure out how to scale rewards up and down that scale
amber dune
didnt croc room tree get its health nerfed so croc chomp does nothing basically
in teams
final frigate
didnt croc room tree get its health nerfed so croc chomp does nothing basically
useful for unorganised teams so that's whatever it's chill
final frigate
yeah unaffected if you're good solo
but 350-400 ish yeah
amber dune
what is a community ambassador
tiny epoch
and 500 is the new 545 
final frigate
pretty name
narrow folio
what is a community ambassador
Community Ambassadors is our way of recognising the standout members of our Discord community - whether that’s from their sense of community spirit and going the extra mile to helping others, or their dedication to the server through hosting events, reliably reporting incidents through ModMail or always striving to keep our server a safe, inclusive and welcoming space in chats. Basically they’re really good eggs!
forgot what channel that is from
amber dune
but peekays is weird and he likes toa
final frigate
hey i did a tob too
obsidian venture
not targeting you specifically since idk how you run them but in my experience m...
So true
icy relic
People asking for more impactful invos is such a monkey's paw curling moment
obsidian venture
Invo system should have had new invos added at least every few months
there's so much you can mess around with
to avoid folks choosing easy invo to push higher, they can choose a soft cap on how many
icy relic
Free invos are good, enemies just have too much def and HP so even free invos just make the raid more of a slog while every boss has a chance to 1shot you if you misclick
obsidian venture
there's just a lack of updates which results in the current state of it
icy relic
Nobody wants to relearn new invos every few months lmao
They'll just do better content
obsidian venture
That's on them then
Think they just overcooked with high invo nerf while keep billybobs the same + having a faster raid post change
icy relic
Better remove everyone's fang kits too and attach a little tassel that says which season of ToA you got your 500 clear in
obsidian venture
I'm down
meager flame
i just think its a lot more reliably good when you make standard variants of content than giving people a million options
because making as many invocations as they did is basically just like
providing a million options with no clear direction
so it turning out good or bad is mainly luck
icy relic
I don't even see a problem with the options, it's moreso the same problem with doom
meager flame
but if they tried to make 3 different modes of difficulty
icy relic
They put the cutoff too low
meager flame
each one would have a direction and be filtered for what actually makes sense
icy relic
Shadow dropping at 150 is funny
You barely even need to see any mechanics to access the entire table
meager flame
that part honestly doesn't matter that much its probably the smallest sin from toa
icy relic
I just mean
meager flame
just because we know even though its weird that it can happen
it just doesn't actually happen too often
icy relic
The standard 425 invo should just basically be the baseline in terms of boss mechanics and insanity
meager flame
i mean that wont really be happening lol thats way harder than tob and cox baseline
icy relic
It would be a lot more forgiving in terms of damage output and HP/defense
meager flame
they actually talked about that super recently where basically tldr
icy relic
Less things one-shotting you
meager flame
raids are going to be created to be played by the playerbase
not the end game players
but everyone
they were comparing it to content thats kinda substantially harder where they feel like they can do that
but said raids are not that content basically
i do kinda think there might be some sort of
icy relic
I mean you said you wanted a more unified experience
meager flame
backlash maybe when raids 4 comes out and people realize that a guy in void with weapon swaps is actually very capable
icy relic
I feel like the mechanics should always be present more or less
meager flame
and stuff like that
icy relic
but the bosses should not have so much HP and defense
meager flame
yeah im just saying if they made a unified experience it would be like doing regular tob or cox
not a 425 toa
they could make a harder mode like cms or hm though
and actually make it good
icy relic
right now you are always pushing invocation up just to make each raid closer to 35 minutes
even if you have mastered all the mechanics
you still are incentivized to push the raid level up until it's annoying and unfun
meager flame
invocations just don't really work because its too many variables + scaling
so they're destined to either continue ramping up reward rates as your level increases in the raid
or
they'd cap rewards at some point and people would say its pointless
its just kind of incompatible with their goals at the end of the day where they're going to want to reward people for doing reasonable levels of the raid but also reward you for pushing further
and the end result is just way too many uniques coming into the game
they kinda just cant have all three of reasonable rewards for the masses, scaling rewards and a healthy economy for those items at the same time
one of them has to go
icy relic
tob tests so many more things than toa does and yet it doesn't give me neck pain
meager flame
thats because at a base level tob is just easier and most of the difficulty is truly optional
icy relic
toa is just so fucking long for no reason
doing the same thing over and over because you can only reduce def by 20
meager flame
almost all of the hard parts of tob are actually player created to be optimal
you could just choose to not do whatever it is
and be fine
where for toa thats like
not true at all mostly lol
final frigate
that part honestly doesn't matter *that* much its probably the smallest sin from...
shadows at 150 sure that's a meme but more ~60% of shadows are coming in from less than 150-399s
meager flame
like in toa you're always seconds from disaster
chrome lantern
ToA has similar issues to Trials imo for sailing where it’s mostly just a memorization test and very little actually changes
final frigate
nerfing low invos would have a significant (good) affect on lowering purp rates
meager flame
there is a mechanic incoming that if you do it slightly wrong
you're going to get obliterated
in every room
and the hard part is staying consistent for lengths of time and not letting that happen
where for tob thats usually not happening
and you're just pushing your limits to do more dps
on an individual level
icy relic
that's not healthy design for a game like this
where you are expected to put 500+ hours into a single piece of content
and jagex has acknowledged this
final frigate
most of the "one shots" of toa aren't random sudden boss moves that require high skill
final frigate
most if not all of them give you ample time to prepare or you have a way to panic survive
hasty shard
Shadow dropping at 150 is funny
part of me feels its somehow less egregious than dooms drops
largely just because invocations don't super change what you do much outside of specific ones
meager flame
i wouldn't even say its really hard its just punishing which i think jagex conflates the two a lot
especially with toa
its hard to be perfect even when its easy over a large amount of time
icy relic
I can forgive doom a little bit
meager flame
so they just sat there ready to destroy you in that one moment of imperfection
icy relic
because the first few days wave 8 seemed so fucking hard
hasty shard
really should be 4/5/6
hasty shard
i'd still love to know how you are actually meant to do car phase flawlessly without sidewalk
meager flame
tbh
icy relic
and waves 3-4 should be changed a little bit
meager flame
i think doom starting you at wave 1 is just a huge mistake
1-7 should be learner mode that you graduate out of ever doing again
hasty shard
wave 3/5 annoy me more than 1/2 i feel
meager flame
by proving you can do it a few times
final frigate
right now you are always pushing invocation up just to make each raid closer to ...
well for most people no
meager flame
the real boss is 8+
hasty shard
forced braindead shield and orb phase
meager flame
so they should've just focused on teaching people
icy relic
but like we didn't know pre-release
final frigate
most people chill at lower invos and go slow and happen to end up around 30-35 min runs
meager flame
then starting them at 8 every time
icy relic
the skip item should have been added
meager flame
with rates that make that make sense
icy relic
it would be a reason to claim
final frigate
most people do not push high invos nor bother trying to be optimal
hasty shard
you may as well make waystones the skip item considering their price 😭
icy relic
that's what waystones were supposed to be
meager flame
i dunno why they wanted it to be an item
icy relic
but jagex yoinked them
meager flame
it should've just been "hey i dont suck now" and then you start at 8
final frigate
450+ were literally 7% of completions pre-summer
hasty shard
its like 18m/h effective to use waystones who tf
final frigate
the "toa is a slog" "the bosses are tanky" do not apply to majority of players
hasty shard
WHO is using these
meager flame
odablock
hasty shard
zrue
hasty shard
loll
meager flame
because he was just bricking perfect doom for like
hasty shard
ok that makes more sense
meager flame
a week
icy relic
the "toa is a slog" "the bosses are tanky" do not apply to majority of players
then the rates are too shitty if this is true
if I am capable of doing 450s in my gear but I'm doing 300s it's 15 hours between purples
meager flame
it was pretty enjoyable seeing him miss perfect on wave 8 bc his tbow stopped working
that reaction is worth a watch
not the rest of it
icy relic
I see this as one of those scenarios where too many uniques are coming into the game because anybody can just send a 150-300 and have a chance of getting rewarded especially if they go in a mass
hasty shard
i swear my tbow actually turns off sometimes lmao
not in the sense of hitting 0's just like actually not attacking
icy relic
and across the entire community this creates a problem
but individually it might not be that big of a problem
meager flame
ya he just hit like multiple 8s and stuff like that when doom had like
idk maybe 50 hp
hasty shard
also dead clicks 
i once clicked claim and nothing happened and that tilted me far more than it shouldve
meager flame
in car phase
final frigate
if I am capable of doing 450s in my gear but I'm doing 300s it's 15 hours betwee...
the problem is when people are capable of doing 450s but do 300s instead while also only being like 2 minutes quicker because they're fundamentally inefficient at the raid
final frigate
and then they're still rewarded decently cause low invos aren't nerfed
icy relic
the problem is when people are capable of doing 450s but do 300s instead while a...
the old system rewarded you for doing 400+ though because the purp rate shot up to 9%
now there's barely any incentive to do high invo
final frigate
yeah the old 400s were busted and rightfully nerfed
icy relic
doesn't this just exacerbate the problem
now you not only have more reddit 150 shadows
there's also no reason to do high invo
final frigate
they can incentivise pushing by nerfing lower invos and buffing 500+
icy relic
and I think we're seeing this play out
with high invo toa being not really worth doing what is the point of the shadow?
meager flame
250 and ~350 as the two starting modes no invocation selection
and drop rates designed for both
so that people would focus on how to go faster and do more dps
rather than how do i keep adding invocations forever
icy relic
even losing 0 ticks the shit still takes forever
and it's not like it takes insane tech to not lose ticks in toa
hasty shard
something something remove defense scaling
meager flame
bc ultimately thats what cox and tob turn into
a relatively easy baseline difficulty where players find more and more optimal ways to do things faster
final frigate
pre-summer: 300s are ok, 400s not much harder but giga op, 500+s quite a bit harder and rewarding
post-summer: 300s are ok (unchanged), 400s ok (giga nerfed), 500+s still quite a bit harder but giga nerfed
my biggest gripe is how hard they nerfed 500+s without actually tackling the issue
or well only tackling half the issue
final frigate
and it's not like it takes insane tech to not lose ticks in toa
you'd be surprised
how many ticks people lose
+1 to 2 minutes every boss
not that people don't lose ticks at the other raids too
meager flame
idk how much jagex has even really thought about it but
final frigate
but for how "simple" and "brain off slog" toa is, people are very inefficient at it
meager flame
all three of their raids actually make mistakes with how to punish players
icy relic
I wouldn't even say it's brain off
it's more of the constant conflict where I want to go brain off
meager flame
like take cox
icy relic
but then I die
icy relic
and I do not get rewarded for not being brain off
meager flame
then in tob they just reset the raid if you fail so a bunch of people get turned off and dont even try it
and in toa they just delete you for minor mistakes
hasty shard
not being able to tele out of tob easily is so toxic
i do not count 75k crystal as easy
icy relic
I mean I think maidens is just so successful as a boss in that sense
if everyone is on point it is incredibly easy but stretch the fight out by a minute and everyone starts dropping like flies
meager flame
its just interesting that they struggle with that aspect so much that every raid kind of has a problem with it in different ways
i kinda think fundamentally they don't understand that the player that sucks and dies or has to do rooms in multiple attempts already took a huge L
just in wasted time
so you dont really have to do a lot more after that to punish them
because they're punishing themselves by being bad lol
one caveat being cox should definitely reset rooms when you fail
instead of letting people reenter them
icy relic
they don't want people suiciding but yeah
punishing people for deaths does create bad behavior
meager flame
its mostly just that as long as they make you defeat the bosses from full hp
icy relic
like all the people sitting by the fremmy loading up their worldbearer with salve eels back in the DG days
meager flame
its mostly fine to let people keep trying
they're already getting a raid that takes an hour and a half or whatever
so their gp/hr is horrible lol
true talon
To think ive spent over 100m on kingdom XD
analog crow
30% ROI poggers
heady kernel
When are updates coming back btw?
warm epoch
When are updates coming back btw?
we have an update coming on jan 30th, but i wouldn't expect anything anytime soon
i assume most jmods would be back in office on jan 5th and on
ember token
next game update should be on the 7th
it will be the 25th anniversary of runescape and 10th anniversary of zeah/kourend so theoretically there should be a holiday event
true talon
Next big update is probably dead man mode
true talon
Was there ever a winter summit?
When they go over roadmap and stuff
Or did they just not do one this year
ember token
25th
true talon
Normally it was in December
true talon
Oh cool
ember token
the first one in 2022 was in december
and then there was no 2025 summer summit or 2024/25 winter summit because of runefest 2025
true talon
Jan 25th nice can’t wait to see what’s being cooked up
restive storm
I reckon its birthday event
honestly thank god i need my candle dagger on like 5 accounts
ember token
still 2 more months for the bday event
ember token
DMM's happening 5 days after the summit just so they can dedicate a roadmap spot to it i bet
restive storm
thats honestly what i was thinking and was pretty sad about it lol
thats our "PvP focused" spot on there for another year
ember token
my current roadmap prediction is: DMM - Sailing - Vampyre finale - Sailing - Free space (something new or another summer sweep-up type thing) - Sailing again - Raids 4
and then I'm also gonna guess we don't get any dates for HD and API stuff, so we get a "& Beyond" section that is largely the same as runefest
restive storm
my current roadmap prediction is: DMM - Sailing - Vampyre finale - Sailing - Fre...
i hate how much ur probably right
chrome lantern
2025 was pretty solid in terms of at least having a major release every quarter
Suuuurely
restive storm
ehhh
chrome lantern
No I just mean their roadmap was fleshed out
Not commenting on the content itself
restive storm
oh yeah
ember token
definitely not more than 3, but almost definitely there will be 2 spots on the roadmaps that are sailing
restive storm
it was definitely like planned, content was just very meh
chrome lantern
But there was Yama, Varla p3, something I'm forgetting, and Sailing
ember token
vampyre finale will be in march, ocean expansion in autumn, raids 4 just "winter" and then it changes to early 2026 later down the line
restive storm
ugh man im wishing i didnt even listen to those podcasts lmao, it literally just made me feel like they have even less idea of what theyre doing with PvP than before
chrome lantern
I haven't looked/listened to any of their podcasts at all tbh
restive storm
theyre ok, if you have any interest in PvP id advise not listening lol
chrome lantern
I didn't even know they did one related to PvP
restive storm
like 90% of PvP talk is doing more exclusive events for content creators to "draw support" for PvP
when they just havent updated actual pvp within the game for like a year and a half, and the showcases they do do not reflect the game in the slightest lol
chrome lantern
Being real though
obsidian venture
Are these the osrs podcasts?
restive storm
Are these the osrs podcasts?
yea the solomission/boaty ones were the ones i was listening to earlier
chrome lantern
Just looking at historic PvP/wildy updates should make you know they don't know what they're doing with PvP though
obsidian venture
I see
chrome lantern
Like they thought the solution to PvP was to add Zombie Pirates as bot alch farming content
restive storm
Just looking at historic PvP/wildy updates should make you know they don't know ...
yea true, trying to remove it and put it into limited time game modes
restive storm
Like they thought the solution to PvP was to add Zombie Pirates as bot alch farm...
im ngl i dont even know how to save multi other than just revert revs back to old multi. Multi is just such a weird place
singles just remove the pj timer that killed the activity in the first place and itd at least be more active
chrome lantern
I feel like multi is just people that want huge clan wars or people that want to gang up on bots, so nobody is really interested in starting to get involved with it
And it largely just becomes pvmers and gold farmers/bots that get dragged into it and is a larger symptom of the poor balance they have of predator vs. prey
restive storm
yea my friend and i went on a multi romp yesterday and it was just like, literally why are we doing this lol. every1 in multi is like an auto tele bot in the slayer cave, or risking like 200-300k then we gotta run thru the escape caves doing slayer bosses
was just boring across the board lol
old multi revs had enough variety so that like you could get a little pure unit together to hit pvmers, and pick off the occaisional med from bigger teams
but nothing like that really exists anymore
chrome lantern
Like if you look at the reaction to doing multi content and getting pulled up on by 15 people
It's just "Wow these guys are losers I hope they enjoy 10k each"
It's not like, "Whoa that's cool I should try that"
restive storm
yea, which is why revs used to be good cuz teams would hop around it. Now i guess you'd have to wait like, at the exits of escape caves? if youre trying to hit other teams
its just kinda a janky setup thats so spread out
chrome lantern
I'm obviously biased as someone that plays iron predominantly but I don't really think any of hte multi content at all is in a good place nor can it be
obsidian venture
I liked when worlds had teams piling on folks in singles
Was fun to tank or to coordinate specs
chrome lantern
And everyone that was doing things in singles hated it xd
restive storm
I liked when worlds had teams piling on folks in singles
i miss it man, there used to actually be people killing each other out in the wildy
instead of just people killing bots
obsidian venture
Yeah
restive storm
now none of the pkers fight each other cuz they dont have to
obsidian venture
Surviving a pile was a feelsgood
oblique mesa
BH worlds are still active around mage bank pretty often, still see fall ins there
restive storm
getting a box on a pure teammate thats getting destroyed by a med team
then just jajaja'ing at them was priceless
obsidian venture
Yeah but that’s like 2 worlds and gg as it’s just clan camped
restive storm
BH worlds are still active around mage bank pretty often, still see fall ins the...
also forced to play a main up there 🙁
no more pvp brackets
obsidian venture
So it’s zzz for folks not in a pk clan
oblique mesa
So basically what you just said you wanted to come back 
restive storm
yea, when its 1-2 worlds max there's 1-2 teams total
not like 50 different groups of people running around
obsidian venture
I’m not a full on pker mind you, I mainly pvm
restive storm
so its less fun
obsidian venture
But I had so much fun with the lads doing this
I pk from time to time now but it’s just hop sim
restive storm
yeah its horrificly bad rn lol
obsidian venture
Also dding in singles to a target in multi was fun too
restive storm
i hit hop limit the other day in rev caves
i was like this is so bad for the game lol
restive storm
im skull tricking so its like ok, but yeah agreed id never bother to go singles pk there
u need 1b of gear to kill a guy risking 2m
chrome lantern
I feel like "bad for the game" is slightly inaccurate. It just clearly shows that Jagex doesn't really care about the relatively small subset of PvP. The game itself is thriving
restive storm
only gets smaller the more they ignore it
altho half the time they make changes they make it worse by not understanding it like the pj timer, so who knows
chrome lantern
I think the core issue is that they're trying to make PvP more active the wrong ways, like you said before
restive storm
id love to hear their actual philosophy on it sometime though in like a stream, like is this what they want that you're basically immortal in singles if you have a brain?
chrome lantern
They're focusing on just throwing more people into PvP areas and hoping things stick
restive storm
or is that unintended
restive storm
They're focusing on just throwing more people into PvP areas and hoping things s...
yea agreed
i also think pvmers shoot themselves in the foot by not really understanding the pj timer makes them even MORE of the primary targets than they were before cuz pkers cant hit each other off
Which really doesnt help matters lol
chrome lantern
I mentioned before I wasn't a fan of multi-on-one in singles but I do think Jagex has taken it to extremes where it's hard to know how PvP really even works unless you write a dissertation on it
restive storm
yea, i mean i can understand people not being a fan of it, but its hard to argue that its done any good for PvP activity having it in the game
when the wildy is in as bad a state as it is
true talon
my current roadmap prediction is: DMM - Sailing - Vampyre finale - Sailing - Fre...
I’d toss shadow rework in there probably.
true talon
im ngl i dont even know how to save multi other than just revert revs back to ol...
No do not bring back the rev cartels
restive storm
that mightve been the most blown out of proportion problem ive ever seen dealt with in this game lol
"oh NO, 8 of the 400 worlds are locked down for ironmen who paid, make the content worse so they cant!"
and instead of that now, we have 24/7 bot/gold farmers at every rev spot using prayer scripts with like 12 brews... which is very fun
nocturne solstice
That feels like a misrepresentation of history. Wasn't the rev cartels locking down worlds for large amounts of bot/gold farmers hence the crackdown? Even if we still have a bot/goldfarmer problem, them having less protection is a good thing.
restive storm
That feels like a misrepresentation of history. Wasn't the rev cartels locking d...
they dont need protection anymore because its nearly impossible to kill them anyway unless you're risking way too much gp or sweating it out lol
its easily 100x worse now than it was before and not remotely close
almost nobody even bothers to attack them tbh lol
also most customers were absolutely ironmen lol
ember token
I’d toss shadow rework in there probably.
that would be part of a summer sweep up as mentioned, it wouldn’t be getting its own spot on the roadmap
restive storm
the cartels were just rwting the gp they made so it had to be shut down i guess
obsidian venture
also most customers were absolutely ironmen lol
This
obsidian venture
Yep
restive storm
best content this game ever offered and they were too lazy to just ban the people rwt'ing 😢
vivid ruin
I wish there was a better way to depict who is rwting other than "player trades player x, player banned"
restive storm
jagex has better methods they aren't dumb, but it was just an excuse to make the content easier for ironmen
nocturne solstice
I imagine the "better" methods are a lot more invasive, require a lot more human effort, or not enough of a guarantee to action.
restive storm
for sure, plus that was before they were down with the whole "just ban the entire cc" approach like they did with ROT lol
obsidian venture
best content this game ever offered and they were too lazy to just ban the peopl...
Should have set the standard and yeeted people with bought capes
restive storm
Should have set the standard and yeeted people with bought capes
fax, grazy they just allow cape/quiver sales nowadays
obsidian venture
Game integrity has been in the bin unfortunately
restive storm
everything just seems to "not be a priority" that its kinda hard to tell what the priorities even are these days
obsidian venture
Unlucky
Rather them focus on existing parts in game over the influx of new items and gear for a bit
Last year had so many meta changes almost every 3 months
restive storm
it has been kinda a bit of overload the last 1-2 years
obsidian venture
Like bro, folks aren’t logging in to pot and when they do, it’s inv/bank simulator
For endgame pvmers*
Pvp meta is nasty
chrome lantern
I can confirm I haven't done pvm in like a month before Sailing released
Other than like 1 tob session
restive storm
when i was listening to the podcast before i think it was the solomission one where they were talking about how annoying losing untradeables in the wildy is, and it took an ALARMING amount of time for ayiza to just say, why not just make everything break
like thats the freest ez change ever just change values on stuff and dont make it lost lol
restive storm
moons for the most part is alright, atlatl i think may need to be looked at a little bit
chrome lantern
I mentioned before I wasn't a fan of multi-on-one in singles but I do think Jage...
One of the many things I was mentioning. Untradeables and different behavior of items in general in the wildy
floral blaze
DMM being the PVP update slot for Winter Summit would be brutal 😂
restive storm
DMM being the PVP update slot for Winter Summit would be brutal 😂
it def is gonna be lol
floral blaze
Bh raggers are a sin
I paid BH a visit last month, first target - spec and run claw rusher. Did barely any damage to me then skips me immediately. 30 seconds later new target, morri jav rusher and same thing spec and run.
All under 2 minutes
It's been a cesspit for a while now
obsidian venture
I paid BH a visit last month, first target - spec and run claw rusher. Did barel...
Yeah it’s cringe
There was some folks in another channel pushing for it
restive storm
yeah BH is a nightmare lol
zenith pike
They could fix rushing relatively easily in BH
obsidian venture
Risking like 50k and using javs
restive storm
but ive always hated bh style tbf
restive storm
good thing we turned nhing into pseudo bh fighting w/ spec tabbing or freeze logging
very pog
obsidian venture
🥲
zenith pike
Legitimately, lock in targets to fighting for a minimum amount of time (let’s say 2:00 minutes for example) if one person attacks the other. Afterward, create an artificial barrier that if someone stays out of for a period of time is forced to walk for the remainder of the duration so they can’t kite you to run the timer down.
restive storm
they did such a bad job updating PvP in OSRS that now we're pitching RS Classic ideas to try and fix it 🤦♂️
the ol just lock em in for 3 hits
restive storm
have to to counteract the 13 brew andys
that just afk in full torags w/ pray mage up
zenith pike
That would be countered either through limiting player freedoms or to find a way to lessen defenses over a period of time so they can’t draw it out.
You can pick, I’m not picky
Probably just create a cooldown where each successive use of drinking sara/arma brews just decrease in effectiveness, by halve after the first two - three sips.
To what end you’d need to tune it so people don’t get Rambo’d with zero counter play vs dissuade rushing -> tanking is probably around the 16-20s range but I’d need to talk to someone more experienced on that
restive storm
this is just so convoluted rather than just removing the pj timer lol
zenith pike
this is just so convoluted rather than just removing the pj timer lol
How does that stop them from rushing you and camping the door?
restive storm
Oh you’re talking about bh I was talking about nhing lol
BH is just cooked I think idk if there’s really any bringing it back to what we once knew people too good now
zenith pike
I mean this is a step in the right direction, giving up is for Ironman ain’t no future update gonna save you
restive storm
ehh i mean ive never really enjoyed BH, i used to NH pk in the bh worlds back in the day, which was fun, but like hail marying a triple maul to try and hit 99 is not for me lol
sage ice
Hear me out: A boss that, instead of unequipping your equipped armour and weapons, it rearranges the items in your inventory randomly. Like the Chaos Elemental spell, but for your inventory. I think it would make for an interesting special attack from a dust devil boss. The Tornadic Dust Devil perhaps?
chrome lantern
I think everyone would hate it and it would just become minimizing how few switches you can bring
nocturne solstice
It would be interesting but extremely annoying. Yeah I imagine people would find a way to minimize annoyance.
It wouldn't be an enjoyable boss I feel.
sage ice
That would sort of be the point. The Chaos ele can be countered with a full inventory, this one could be countered with an empty inventory, or an inventory of identical items
hasty shard
honestly sounds like a good swap trainer
restive siren
sounds like dogshit
why take the most annoying boss mechanic in the game and make it even worse
sage ice
One guy in the GE described the idea as "space aids" so you're not alone lmao
zenith pike
honestly sounds like a good swap trainer
Yeah, it’ll help me swap to classic wow faster
hasty shard
😭
zenith pike
Don’t cry
sage ice
What if this special attack were an avoidable AoE? Then it's more a matter of reflexes than crap luck. Perhaps in the form of a coloured twister. Idk, I live in a part of the world where tornadoes are common. They throw things around
restive siren
id rather a boss oneshots me than scramble my inventory on a mistake
quiet plank
sage ice
"My rune pouch isn't in Kansas anymore"
chrome lantern
id rather a boss oneshots me than scramble my inventory on a mistake
This just in - player research indicates people want to be one-shot by bosses more!
Jagex has heard you and the next boss will do 0 damage until it does 150 damage
austere mulch
Easiest immediate fix for pvp is to stop being afraid separating items from being used in pvp vs pvm.
As we get stronger gear meant to be used for pvm, the power creep in PvP is way more intense because of hp limits
It’s inevitable anyways
And way easier than making weird rules like variable healing for brews sipped in x-time
Or further complicating pj timer and trying to add special anti-run mechanics
true talon
Easiest immediate fix for pvp is to stop being afraid separating items from bein...
Bingo, I would do PvP on an iron if I got anything out of it.
Was sad the abyssal dagger imbue was not permitted outside of bh
Woulda been a sick core item at toa instead of dds
And ahhka
chrome lantern
Bingo, I would do PvP on an iron if I got anything out of it.
Didn't you just say the opposite of what he said
How is that "Bingo"
nocturne solstice
It prefer it as well but it makes sense why gear gets nerfed/unusable in regular pvp. It's just too OP.
true talon
Didn't you just say the opposite of what he said
I meant the first part, they keep limiting PvP items to PvP only and having no use in the broader space of the game
If they let PvP items Into PVM then it would be a reason to go out and do it.
restive storm
Bingo, I would do PvP on an iron if I got anything out of it.
cant really do that cuz then irons would just boost using their mains
nocturne solstice
Id say people generally don't want that cause then they feel "forced" to go into the wilderness.
If it's a minigame it might pass though but from what Squinttz has been saying, sounds like a lot of pvpers want Wilderness to improve not just minigame after minigame.
restive storm
yea id really rather not just keep firing loot pinatas out there and saying "surely this is the one that keeps activity going"
and like you said, dont really want just temp game modes that we get to play 1-2 weeks a year
nocturne solstice
I think overall the wildy needs a... ideological? rework although wether its appropriate or not for OSRS is another question.
Something like:
- Rework all gear as a whole for consistency between PVM and PVP with clear distinction for what works where. I.E BH weapons should work in all PVP context not just BH and Castle wars/Soul wars. If its too powerful then nerf it.
- Rework the PJ timer and Wildy mechanics so that there is the clear predator/prey mentality going on and remove safeguards for both predator and prey (remove item teleports for escapes completely)
- Change wildy rewards to be less cash cow and more gear focused (imo)
There's been a lot of games since OSRS that have popularized the "Extraction" category and taking a few ideas would be good to really revive wildy imo.
restive storm
heavy agree with all but point 3 (sorta) theres gotta be some cash cow sort of content to start the food chain, but i dont think it needs to be anything crazy
nocturne solstice
I think the cash cow should be the gear drops like farming for voidwaker as an example. Not just straight up alchables and GP drops like we get now from like rogues arena or zombie pirates.
restive storm
ahh reworking those, i guess i can see what you mean, might be sorta pointless because itd just be the same problem where if you DO get the drop, theres about 3 seconds for people to hit you, and otherwise you're gonna insta bank it
i think itd still honestly be better than what we have rn, but that isnt saying much
nocturne solstice
We could work around that by removing loot announcements or some changes around the escape/combat mechanics so its not an instead death for you.
An instant tele out is way too easy but future items like a "Thaw potion" that could help you escape would make things more interesting imo.
Like, more items to encourage the running and escaping would have use in wildy, would shake up what you'd bring to the wildy (impacting builds and risk), as well as open up more skilled gameplay possibly? Even moreso if we get some movement based specs to close/open gaps.
Now you risk have to decide dps over positioning
restive storm
I'm saying more the opposite - if you were to get a drop, unless someone is already attacking you, you're just gonna go instantly bank
like you'd never stay and risk anything youd just msb black dhide risk til you get a drop
then go bank the second you got what you were there for since there isnt other loot
nocturne solstice
Thats true, I was thinking that without instant teles, you can't "instantly bank". You'd have to run to a location and you'd be at risk of PK during that journey to a safespot.
This way you'll find more players just "roaming" around the wilderness with loot rather than just at hotposts before they world hop/tele immediately
restive storm
yeah i mean that location is anywhere under 30 line lol, which is a pretttty big line
depending on where they put stuff, which things being yeeted solely into 40+ wildy while pj timer is in the game is already one of my complaints. Since it killed off pking brackets
nocturne solstice
There's a bit too many ways out up paste 30 i feel, or atleast during my treks to the wildy.
Running down from the gate doesnt feel too risky or far from 30 and above the gate there's the lever and the mage bank to tele out.
moving better loot much further up would be good too. Zombie pirates and the baby wildy bosses being sub 30 is a bit too rewarding I feel
It is something I take advantage of though 