game-update

[meager flame]

and it might not feel as bad

[atomic cosmos]

I just want my character to stay on the hook when he's there, so he can resume the action as Cabin Boy Jenkins. Increase the experience value of salvagin cleaning, or if you keep it as it is, increase the action speed by 1 tick. Increase the extractor to 400xp, or reduce its activation from 4tick to 2tick. Just that.

[tacit wharf]

so many clogs to get

[reef laurel]

i have 31 dragon nails and 1 dragon sheet in 1,000 frost dragon kills

[tacit wharf]

that to do a frost dragon task, sure why not

[icy relic]

it's bad right now but I'm sure there will be other slayer monsters worth hunting in the future

[reef laurel]

didn't know had to kill on task tho

[icy relic]

it'll just be another thing to add onto the rotation

I've accepted, until they give me a reason to max my boat I'm just not going to agonize over the last upgrades

[meager flame]

i think jagex needs the preferred slayer thing from rs3 i unknowingly suggested the other day

[icy relic]

it's too much

[meager flame]

where you can kinda increase the weight on certain tasks that you want

[icy relic]

RS3 slayer is really fun

[meager flame]

because putting the frost dragon bait in then giving it a weight of 3 is like

[icy relic]

you get 2 choices of tasks

[meager flame]

honestly its kind of mean lmao

[icy relic]

and at 120 slayer you have a 20% chance to just be able to choose your task

[tacit wharf]

remember all them people complaining cuz they added frost dragons to slayer tasks to start with

now they want them to be weighted more

[icy relic]

they are a good task because they go fast

[reef laurel]

nerfing sorting rates was also kinda bad they could have just made it so only 1 guy can salvage at a time. as it currently stands idek if it's worth to sort if ur just going for xp but obv u wanna sort for clogs

[tacit wharf]

im just saying

little funny

[austere mulch]

i wasnt planning on building rosewood hull since like 90% or more of my xp is from salvaging

[tacit wharf]

the swing in opinion

[austere mulch]

but im considering it just to knock out these last 3 levels

[icy relic]

I mean I didn't think they would stick so many important drops on frost dragons

[meager flame]

it also wouldn't nearly be as large of a problem is some psycho didn't decide we should kill like 20k of them

[icy relic]

I thought it would just for their bones

right

[oblique mesa]

thats what the promotional material made it sound like

[hasty shard]

almost 93 sailing 🫡

[reef laurel]

well the bones thing is nice but most ppl are banking 99 from hydra or doom or osmething anyways

[meager flame]

well you kinda do a ton of things to bank 99

over the long arc of playing the account

but

[icy relic]

was gonna throw a max party on my boat but this update made me so salty I just got 99 sailing and decided f it

[reef laurel]

yh between those nd wildy bosses and just slayer in general etc

[meager flame]

frost dragons and sailing neatly solved that

you now just go way past 99 prayer

[hasty shard]

frost dragons replace blue dragon grind 😭

[meager flame]

like obliterate it

[oblique mesa]

Varlamore also gives you bone shards for sneezing in the continent lol

[icy relic]

I dropped all the bones to my main but it was only 10m gp for 2k bones

[meager flame]

im pretty sure if you somehow got to frost dragons at 1 prayer

you would go over 99

[icy relic]

just hitting them witih bonecrusher now

even more reason not to leave nowadays if you want to keep your spot

[tacit wharf]

what is leaving, i already set up a tent

[hasty shard]

could unironically

mfw safespots

[meager flame]

tbh sailing rates in general just need a good solid sanity check from someone that didn't make the content

[hasty shard]

its so wild how easy it is to safespot them lmao

[icy relic]

it'll be 2 magic stones and 5 cupronickel bars to build that tent my friend

[hasty shard]

why is there just an alcove to safespot in

[meager flame]

i feel like they might be a little attached to their work and someone without that bias

might be needed lol

[icy relic]

I'm gonna play devils advocate here a bit

[meager flame]

its a recurring theme that someone likes kind of psychotic rates

[icy relic]

they want sailing to feel like it's always been in the game 5 years from now

[hasty shard]

whoever designed infernal shale 100% did trawling balance

and didnt learn from that

[icy relic]

but like we're all speedrunning the content trying to do "years of content" in two weeks

[meager flame]

idk i mean

[icy relic]

it would be bad years of content but they probably expected we would give them more time before rioting

[meager flame]

i've done just about every skill like that

at some point

sailing kinda fits in but

its the stuff around the edges thats crazy

like your dragon cannon barrel or expected frost dragon kc

[winged mantle]

They could have put the blog out a day prior to get feedback first

[icy relic]

yeah

the endgame is really bad

honestly everything else has been fun

I don't want this to color my feelings about sailing too much

[meager flame]

thats actually why i was so confident i'd finish it in about 2 weeks

it was a little faster than that but

[winged mantle]

It just sets to tone of "we want people to engage with the skill the way we designed"

[meager flame]

its basically how long almost all 99s take me

[icy relic]

it was a fast 99

[meager flame]

outside of the outliers

[icy relic]

but the post-99 is really really bad right now

[winged mantle]

Some skills are ok to be fast

[hasty shard]

it feels about the same as the cooking grind imo

[icy relic]

I like how engaging sailing was

that is why I am not 99 thieving still

[hasty shard]

its a bit too padded out with absurd clogs and has a lack of integration

i made a sailing proposal cause i kind of expected it to be missing integration stuff like new weapon drops etc.

[meager flame]

the best way to describe sailing right now

[hasty shard]

let me scrounge it up

[winged mantle]

Speaking of clogs - I got pushed into sailing because of elite and master steps.

[icy relic]

the integration would not be as bad if they did not lock it behind bottled storms

[meager flame]

is the entire game feeds into sailing as if sailing is the ultimate end game

but it kind of doesn't give back yet much at all

[icy relic]

the tele to boat being so giga gated is weird

[hasty shard]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1mtlnl8/adding_more_depth_to_sailing_with_elemental/

[winged mantle]

Should have been a quest reward

[meager flame]

i do think they were crazy about boat tele

[hasty shard]

gale catcher existing at all is weird

[meager flame]

like i just dont have it and dont care because honestly

[hasty shard]

why did they decide to nerf wind catcher from how it was in the alpha lmao

[meager flame]

i can tele myself everywhere and use a basic tele to get my boat to that dock

[icy relic]

what was it in alpha?

[meager flame]

so the big boat tele is like

i really wanted to chop rosewood the facility

[hasty shard]

literally just what gale catcher is which is that it holds 3 charges

[icy relic]

it's hard to go hunt things right now

[hasty shard]

also it gave a lot more xp

[icy relic]

if you want to load up your ship with repair kits

[meager flame]

i kind of think ship teleports should just be in the game

and not a facility

[icy relic]

you can't bank and tele to your boat

[hasty shard]

it feels like the alpha wind catcher got split into the gale catcher and crystal extractor for basically zero reason

[icy relic]

you gotta run from the bank and park near your bounty

it's not the end of the world but it just feels needlessly gatekept

[hasty shard]

i think the whole loop of needing to haul your stuff back only kinda works for trawling

[meager flame]

there are a bunch of awkward things where you can kinda tell things aren't really finished

[hasty shard]

because you get to actually stay for a decent length of time

combat genuinely needs like a loot crate item to hold monster drops

[meager flame]

like the inoculation station

[icy relic]

having to throw your net out to loot monsters gives me an aneurysm

it's such regressive game design

[hasty shard]

like i wouldnt mind having to take some time to bank if you could stay fighting things for more than a few minutes

[meager flame]

why does that get its own custom spot in our boat and look like its going to be super important

and then we use it in one small area and its just there forever

[hasty shard]

a crewmate should 100% be able to net stuff for us

[icy relic]

^

[hasty shard]

also why can you assign a crewmember to disable wind catcher 😭

[austere mulch]

Being limited to oceans where ports are the only access point is a huge miss as well imo. When sailing was pitched, they said “imagine sailing down river lum”

Why can we not build canoes or makeshift rafts to cross lakes/rivers without needing to port and have sailing actually be part of the world instead of its own world

[icy relic]

3 deckhandiness to disable gale catcher btw

[hasty shard]

LOL

[muted knoll]

any game updates lately?

[meager flame]

this is why i was sitting there before sailing came out and saying they should let us build like a magical port in our house

and put down waypoints in the ocean

[hasty shard]

rafts need more use cases

not needing dragon stuff to make a rosewood raft is nice but like insanely niche

[meager flame]

doesn't even have to be a lot but like

thats a lot of ocean for so few teleports

[hasty shard]

its really just for the few charting tasks that you need raft for

[icy relic]

My really unpopular opinion before sailing dropped... RS3 ports was good enough + eastern islands being directly explorable on foot

[meager flame]

it would be nice to be able to drop into some generally large sections

[icy relic]

RS3 has generated islands and shit

[hasty shard]

serpent isle not having a port is zzz

fairy ring there would be nice

[icy relic]

time to colonize that island

we will build a port there

[hasty shard]

god 1h afk is so unethical

i get to salvage my whole cargo hold instead of like 80 things!

[misty zodiac]

What was all the backlash about for the recent update? I didn’t look too much into it

[hasty shard]

less xp

thats basically it

[misty zodiac]

For the salvaging?

[hasty shard]

yes, up to like 60% for merchant

key word up to

[icy relic]

factional world PvP for the different gods over control of remote ports y/n

[hasty shard]

would this influence what port we could teleport to

[misty zodiac]

Hmmm interesting. If it’s an afk method, shouldn’t it be lower xp though?

[icy relic]

no idea, just thought it'd be a fun thing to do like that old WC3 custom game where you could either be a trader and run supplies

or fight people all day

like, some piracy action

[muted knoll]

yes

just your average redditor with 6 wifes and 17 kids complaining

i spent my whole work day baiting everyone malding about it was very fun LOL

went by quick

[misty zodiac]

People just complain way too much 😂 That’s a great way to spend a work day though

[hasty shard]

considering you just like drop your salvage and then leave the game on for an hour and come back

[icy relic]

It's bad until they remove dragon cannon from salvaging

[hasty shard]

unironically best afk in the game cause you cant get booted off after 20 minutes like combat

[muted knoll]

all it took was “W update” and they were hooked

infinite clown reacts

[icy relic]

once they remove dragon cannon barrel I don't care if salvaging is 30k xp/hr

[hasty shard]

maybe id be more mad if i didnt get cannon honestly l0l

[misty zodiac]

Okay hold the flip up. What is this???

[hasty shard]

hidden bushido sailing technique

[misty zodiac]

Erm whatttttt

That’s insane 😭

I gotta try that one out

[muted knoll]

thats been around forever i think i used to do that on rs2 while chopping ivy cuz my pc was such a potato

[misty zodiac]

That sounds like such a vibe

The good ol days

[hasty shard]

im just telling people to get the babies back to suckling their thumbs ngl 😭

gets them their effective xp/h not playing back

sorry people dont understand what effective xp/h not that i guess

despite this being a common talking point for birdhouse xp and herb run gp/h

[quartz locust]

hey so the removed vamp kraken safespot basically made killing them almost impossible on uim now

[icy relic]

sucks that this entire discussion is about xp/hr

when it really should be on the stupid ass clogs

[small anvil]

clogs that are chase items are fine imo

they need something to keep the cloggers busy

dragon cannon is a bit more ehhh

cuz its arguably needed

[icy relic]

I would prefer the nails be kept more to sailing activities too

grinding 28k frost dragons is not like... an intuitive part of the sailing progression

[small anvil]

(i do imagine there'll be secondary drops of the cannon barrel sometime later when it becomes necessary for sailing pvm)

yeah, frost dragons was a miss too

[muted knoll]

do you use hespori death thing

[hasty shard]

freeze park under

[icy relic]

if you got 10 d nails an hour from high efficiency uber eats

[hasty shard]

you dont need to worry about deathbanking sailing pretty sure

[icy relic]

I think that would be fairly healthy and then you don't have to buff those xp rates either

[hasty shard]

cant really die

[icy relic]

hold my beer

[hasty shard]

unless you're that one uim who forgot what overheads are

[quartz locust]

of course, it's part of the game mode 🙂

[icy relic]

saw someone nearly die in gwenith today

[small anvil]

i agree some sailing related drops from port tasks woulda been nice

just being straight cash is kinda weird

[icy relic]

their crystals were ticking for 5

[hasty shard]

there were other drops on port tasks in the alpha is the thing

they took them off 😭

[small anvil]

lol

dragon nails being the choke point is so odd

tho i did pull like ~20? from salvaging

[muted knoll]

W update then

[silent peak]

L update for me

[sacred raft]

uim isnt real

sorry bud

neither is sailing

revert extractor before all uk citizens flashmob jagex hq

[meager flame]

i honestly think this is the answer for cannonballs and nails etc

at least part of it anyways

i also think they need to be honest about some of the material costs

im pretty sure if you have to kill 65 frost dragons for 10 nails

they probably shouldn't be asking you for 600 in one go

[tacit wharf]

always free to de-UIM matey

[icy relic]

"you signed up for this" is fair game for older content but let's be honest here

jagex gave irons the biggest fattest middle finger with these rates

maybe we deserve it but it is what it is

[tacit wharf]

always main life

[gleaming horizon]

Random complaint but can we make it so stepping off boat opens inventory tab instead of uselessly the combat options tab

[hasty shard]

clogscape

4 new imbued heart tier grinds

[quartz locust]

maxed uim on non maxed uim violence wtf @sacred raft

[sacred raft]

exposed

stop it

[hasty shard]

oh my god im realising how stupid crewmates nerfing wind motes is

you can just unassign them from helm

[quartz locust]

[narrow folio]

How dare crewmates give full wind mote xp

[quartz jasper]

W on the crystal nerf and salvage nerfs, the skillls called sailing not salvaging

[quartz locust]

anyway, another day another message to say restricting the cargo hold for UIM isn't in line with the mode and limiting the core function of a skill has never been done before because it's not what the mode is and doens't fall in line with the modes restrictions

[tacit wharf]

be lucky u get cargo space

[quartz locust]

The cargo not counting towards CARGO hold storage count also is quite clearly a band-aid fix that thematically makes no sense and doesn't address any of the actual other issues raised by the uim community other than fixing the initial issue that nin raised being that we were unable to do cargo tasks. actual communication with the team in the server would be nice 🙂

[tacit wharf]

at least thats my stance

[quartz locust]

respectfully, if you dont play the mode you dont get to voice an opinion on what we should and shouldn't have access too

[narrow folio]

The cargo slots being restricted to sailing themed items to begin with makes it fine already imo

No need to screw over uim trying to engage as intended with the skill

[muted knoll]

yep W good comms

W jagex W update

[quartz locust]

restricted to a whitelist of items
lost on death etc so it isn't a safe storage either

[narrow folio]

Not being able to properly pvm with normal repair kits is crazy

Yep

[reef laurel]

austin we are part of the pack which means we must stick together

and i don't support this current state

[narrow folio]

I hope top end salvaging gets back to 100k an hr with the buffs tomorrow

[muted knoll]

listen i just think UIMs should get 28 cargo slots and thats it

[quartz locust]

my favourite part is the removal of safe spots without it being in the blog, so now vampire krakens are just a no go until rune keel+ and after that point that's when using several repair kits per kill, we can store at most 10 with the rosewood hold

[muted knoll]

and salvaging should be 20k an hour tops

hope you understand logan

[narrow folio]

Tf 💀

[reef laurel]

i mean this is clearly the largest issue to me. current state of combat, healing ship, supply requirements, and drop rates.

i didn't need to grind 150 hrs for a dragon axe

[narrow folio]

Salvaging is intended and part of sailing

[reef laurel]

or a dragon harpoon

[narrow folio]

It is intended to have reasonable xp rates

[flint willow]

I wish more content was unlocked for pures , you get to 67 then all the ports past that are locked (until you do song of the elves) Big L

[quartz locust]

my largest issue right now is not having access to a wide chunk of the skills features because of an arbitrary restriction :')

[narrow folio]

Siiix seven

[muted knoll]

with how afk it is you should be locked to angler or shooting star xp rates imo

[narrow folio]

Sailing is supposed to be one of the faster skills

[muted knoll]

not on my watch

[narrow folio]

And being insanely slow like that wont fly for the first new skill ever

[quartz jasper]

35k an hour max for Salvage

[reef laurel]

i kinda agree, it's nice to have an afk option. 60-80k seems reasonable. 90-150k was NICE but doesnt rly fit the theme of runescape

especially when sailing was meant to be an engaging skill

[narrow folio]

Fair opinion but that was not the intention from the start

[reef laurel]

ppl be getting 99 with 0/370 charts

[long blade]

Once you realize this skill was meant to be interactive and not just idle boat simulator you’ll get it.

[quartz jasper]

Only maxed people should have been allowed to vote on a new skill

[narrow folio]

Sailings for all types

You can afk or be sweaty

[reef laurel]

boating combat is an afk simulator with how long kills are

[narrow folio]

Thats why salvaging rates were what they were

[long blade]

Yes afk is fine, then you get less xp

[narrow folio]

And the xp was less than trials by a lot

I dont see the issue

[reef laurel]

bcuz u need to compare to other afk skills

redwoods prior to ironwood were like 60k/hr

there

[muted knoll]

jagex saw an issue tho checkmate

[long blade]

Boat combat is shit and should be thrown away.

[reef laurel]

is nothing in this game u can click once for and get 100k xp/hr

[narrow folio]

Thats not how salvaging works

[muted knoll]

you dont know how to salvage then bud

gnomemonkey aint make a guide?

[reef laurel]

make the drop rates 1/4 of what they are, or make monsters 1/4 as tanky. allow both cannons to fire at once. make cannons more impactful. allow gangplanks to be built on ships to allow crossing from one boat to another or connection of multiple boats on seas

[narrow folio]

110k an hour actively salvaging yourself + processing + extractor every minute

If you actually afked it was nearer 70-80k

[reef laurel]

i was literally 100% afk salvaging clicking once every 5 mins and getting 100k/hr

[long blade]

It should be that for mains but for irons should be at least 20x more rare.

[narrow folio]

Thats just wrong

[muted knoll]

110k for 60 clicks an hour

seems reasonable ye

[reef laurel]

fuck man

[narrow folio]

60 clicks + processing + using the hook

[south void]

Salvage was meant to be sorted. Those supplies make a huge difference in playstyle for new and mid level accounts.

Manually salvaging and sorting should be higher xp than crewmates. Dropping salvage for higher xp is a bad design.

Going in fast circles, or going from point A to B to A is not fun imo. Combat isn't working properly, also not fun imo.

The new double ship spawns being near aggressive mobs, requiring more moving around and less actual double ship wreckages active, is a bad design.

[quartz jasper]

Increase drop rates for irons, they chose that path

[reef laurel]

idk i find the trials fun. 2 tick salvaging should not be promoted or emphasized when there is already a 1 tick training method which is trials

[tacit wharf]

what

[narrow folio]

I bet 80% of sailors are just salvaging, which speaks to how unfun the other methods are, so jagex cant nerf salvaging too hard. They recognize this so theyre going to buff it again tomorrow.

[long blade]

Going fast in circles is fun when you have the hellcat rosewood boat at a 20% apr.

[narrow folio]

High intensity is already more rewarding by a lot

[nocturne solstice]

Why is it bad design? Dropping stuff for faster XP rates has been a thing for decades. Powermining Iron and Barb fishing are examples people are still doing now.

[reef laurel]

i dont think people are salvaging bcuz the trials are boring

i think they are salvaging bcuz the xp rates were so similar for the effort required

[long blade]

🤝

[muted knoll]

thinks its less bad design and more so that rs player base is super lazy lol

[narrow folio]

Trials were over double salvaging rates

[nocturne solstice]

I was salvaging cause I cbf trials sometimes
and the XP was busted of course.

[thorn gate]

No you werent

[reef laurel]

it's bad design relative to the dragon cannon drop rate. people wouldn't complain if the drop rate was 1/5,000 or 1/8,000. the xp rates of sorting are indeed pretty bad for feeling forced into sorting even if dropping is better xp.

[warm storm]

it feels different since there is a bis item on the line instead of, y'know, iron ore or useless fish. but you're not wrong

[long blade]

People only like salvaging cus they can’t handle boat racing.

[steady brook]

If you think trials are super click intensive you clearly spent too much time afk salvaging. You can afk 2-3ticks between each click. Bro the boat just goes straight till you tell it to turn.

[narrow folio]

You can only reach 100k hitting extractor and thats at least 1-2 minutes one click

Not to mention once storage fills up

U have to take care of it

Lot of clicks to drop items

[quartz jasper]

Lies

[south void]

The difference being the actual usefulness in JUST iron or JUST barb fish usefulness to the rest of the skills in the game. Are you seriously comparing iron ore and barb fish which aren't useful for more than 3 things at most to the planks, nails, tar, rope, food, alchables, and collection logs you get from salvaging?

[tacit wharf]

its max 85k with 2 crew + extractor pre-nerf

[nocturne solstice]

I dont think that has any relation to the current discussion of dropping being bad design but your point does make sense separately. I do think the drop rate is a bit nutty there.

[narrow folio]

I meant actively, with crew obviously u take a hit

[muted knoll]

i could easily clear you with my raft you slow ass mf

gramps 😹😹😹

[long blade]

I have a hellcat boat now

[muted knoll]

phew cant say that one

[narrow folio]

If u were 20 minute afking then it was what, 50k an hour?

[long blade]

On the real though can jagex stop fucking with the hitboxes on crates they make it worse every time.

[quiet canyon]

Crystal extractor is literally free exp. Why the hell people raging lol.

[nocturne solstice]

People are still dropping the planks, tar, rope, food and other stuff. When sailing came out everyone was posting screenshots of their map covered in items cause of this.

The collection logs and uniques are fair

[steady brook]

90-95k

[tacit wharf]

i mean 85k - 34k with extractor would be just call it 50k, ya

[narrow folio]

Which is pretty reasonable

Now all jagex had to do was make crewmates timeout after 5 minutes or something

[muted knoll]

90k is not reasonable for clicking once a few times every 20 mins man 😹

[narrow folio]

Instead rates got nerfed across the board, afk or not

Except 90k was unrealistic

[steady brook]

What do you mean reasonable? Do you think Khaldin afkd his training? No bro he and bridge 4 didn’t afk. Afk should not be more then stars

[warm storm]

50k is about right for full-on afk

[long blade]

Extractor shouldn’t be nerfed if the boat is moving

[tribal hornet]

there is 0% chance u were getting 90k per hr by 20min afking lol

[narrow folio]

Sailing and mining are different skills

[warm storm]

people talking about 90k were not leaving their computers

[narrow folio]

Yeah

[reef laurel]

all i want is to feel that i can reasonably acquire items such as greater teleport focus' for multiple boats for easier traveling, and eventually reach dragon skiff/sloop without spending several hundreds of hours doing so. the xp rates and everything else i agree with - i think a lot of the changes even if unappreciated were probably for the better in terms of game design. we should be able to easily max a singular boat but struggle to max out multiple boats.

[muted knoll]

thats the best ironman take in here all day

god bless

[south void]

As a main I have zero reason to interact with sailing. On my ironmen accounts the loot is actually useful to level ALL the skills related to sailing.

You can see the difference in account progression when you actually interact with the salvaging as it was intended.

Blanket stating "everyone" was posting pictures of them dropping loot they deemed not worthwhile "at the start" of sailing is because they were also rushing for uniques for gp or upgrades having their skills maxed in every other aspect, not needing the supplies.

[nocturne solstice]

I think that's a separate issue then. I agree with you on your points here though about better drop rates cause some of these are kinda crazy.

[narrow folio]

You should be able to easily max 1 boat on the way to 99 yes

I dont want to take a 200 hr detour at frost dragons which isnt even sailing content

[steady brook]

200hrs at frosts? Brother please.

[quartz jasper]

Dont play ironman mode then

[reef laurel]

i will say that in 1,000 frost dragons i have 31 dragon nails which is just inevitably bad rng but it did kill my vibe a bit.

the prayer xp is nice

[warm storm]

200 hours is bronze dagger numbers but i get ur point

[remote portal]

@quartz jasper bad take

[steady brook]

Yeah that’s just bad rng lmao.

[reef laurel]

and it's nice to know you can reasonable acquire dragon sheets on task

if it was 1/200 i would definitely be angry with how many you need in total for keel parts etc

but 1/55 on task is nice

[south void]

I play all game modes, so when I speak it isn't from a one-sided perspective on one game mode.

[quartz jasper]

https://tenor.com/view/fishing-vara-gif-18734754

[steady brook]

Too much movement in this gif for salvagers

[nocturne solstice]

As a main you could say this about anything. What was the goal with that statement?

I feel like you're kinda doing things wrong then? Mainly because you dont get that much supplies and aside from the stackable stuff its not really worth keeping in your inventory.

You can get a LOT more fish from trawling or just afking bwans if you're an iron. The odd swordfish I got while salvaging was an instant drop. I dropped the planks too unless I remembered my plank sack and after like, 2 hour long trips I think I'd only have like 30-60 addy nails or something. Ropes are also extremely plentiful from other places for an iron. Keeping that stuff is just hindering yourself.

[reef laurel]

the merchant salvage is definitely a bank-occasionally angle on an iron due to topaz drops but it's next to sunbleak which is fine. could dock 2nd boat there and teleport away from salvage, bank, recover, tp boat

[warm storm]

i'm an iron that dropped almost every non-unique while salvaging fwiw (alched frem helms ofc)

[nocturne solstice]

Helms good

[reef laurel]

everything else is a drop angle unless you are early game iron but sailing as is, is currently too expensive at like lvl 80 for most mid game irons

[nocturne solstice]

nice money there

[long blade]

You don’t know the struggle of the game mode I chose to play man.

[nocturne solstice]

It was interesting to see merch ships drop platinum coins

[narrow folio]

Its cool but takes away an invent slot unfortunately

[muted knoll]

i wonder if they’ll do a fishing trawler rework now

[nocturne solstice]

Like, the minigame?

[muted knoll]

yeah

[nocturne solstice]

I dont think its worth the effort tbh

[reef laurel]

should allow angler pieces to be acquired from trawling on boat too maybe, that way people have an afk or a more active option

but idk about trawling on boat maybe it's afk already

[torn tendon]

I genuinely think they will in the near future with sailing updates

It was teased as a running joke that sailing was always going to be next skilling feature

I roughly remember joking about that in 2007-08

[nocturne solstice]

Haha definitely not.

[narrow folio]

You know what I like that idea

[nocturne solstice]

I dont want minigame rewards stolen and put to random skilling stuff

[icy relic]

...what

[narrow folio]

It got put to falcon fishing

Btw

[reef laurel]

most of my feedback also assumes that sailing will play a part in raids 4.

[ember token]

they've said that raids 4 will not be a sailing raid

[nocturne solstice]

Another minigame so we'

re good

[long blade]

Yep raids 4: salvaging

[south void]

On one of my ironman accounts I'm lvl 48 sailing and got up to 45 construction, entirely from salvage loot. Other skills too but alas I'm not online atm to check what else.

My point was salvaging is meant to be sorted to progress other skills on new and mid level accounts.

You saying I'm salvaging "wrong" is your opinion, and I respect that but the core aspect of salvaging is for the loot.

Penalizing the xp rate for sorting the loot in my opinion was uncalled for.

[narrow folio]

Kind of a weird line to draw but ok

[steady brook]

Relax settled. The land is far better to progress your account then the seas

[echo trail]

just catching up, but looks like the players made enough noise (super happy to see the response) - do we think we will get SOME xp back?

[quartz jasper]

Bro didn't even make it to the good salvaging

[narrow folio]

Probably buffing processing xp back at least

[muted knoll]

they are gonna make salvaging top out at 20k xp an hour and buff everything else

[narrow folio]

No they arent

[echo trail]

that honestly would be huge haha

[narrow folio]

Yep

[muted knoll]

yes they are

(i am insane)

[south void]

As much is true, but we aren't discussing land activities in the newest update

[nocturne solstice]

I think the loot (aside from alchables and stackables) are like a neat bonus and not the primary focus of the activity. This falls in line with other activities where people drop stuff for efficiency.

People losing out on loot/gp in exchange for more xp has been a mainstay in the game for decades was my point so I think dropping salvage for more xp is also pretty normal.

I respect your opinion though and understand why you'd want things to be different but I think this might just be a difference of opinion thing

[quartz jasper]

I just want boatless bounties back tbh

[icy relic]

I want them to remove dragon cannon barrels from salvaging and make it craftable from sheets, that is the hill I am dying on

don't care how bad the xp rates are if they make that change

[south void]

Yea I accept that. Thanks for the discussion ❤️

[reef laurel]

i dont think it should be craftable from sheets. i do think that more than just the dragon cannon should give max hits to mithril ammo which, without an ava's device, is the only sustainable ammo.

i just think it should be closer to 1/5,000

[muted knoll]

yeah but u cant expect sailing to solve all ur low level ironman problems man lmao

[narrow folio]

Avg non salvager sailor (joke)

[south void]

Wasn't it a lore type thing that you couldn't make dragon metals a long time ago?

[reef laurel]

there are a lot of bosses that drop planks

i have 99 con banked and have not made a plank outside of camphor/ironwood a single time

[south void]

I wasn't expecting it to, my point was it does and can if you engage with it as it was intended.

[reef laurel]

and b4 i had 83 banked i just used ferox enclave

as ferox enclave is basically a poh with a couple ticks extra of moving

[icy relic]

I mean 1/5000 is an easier grind than what I'm proposing, I just want to get bad incentives out of salvaging if they are that concerned about people afking

[long blade]

I just hope raids 4 is more like tob or cms

[quartz jasper]

Cms plz

[echo trail]

yeah 1/20k for the cannon barrel is wild

[nocturne solstice]

Id prefer tob 🤔

People seem really fond of the boss rush style with no puzzles.

[ember token]

they also said raids 4 is gonna be more like tob, boss rush style

[nocturne solstice]

winning

[icy relic]

You can't slap a 1/20k drop on an afk activity that people need to spend hundreds of hours doing, then act shocked that people are trying to sweeten the grind by low-efforting it

[reef laurel]

i think 1/5,000 is reasonable. that's about 1m xp per cannon. you probably want 2 cannons. and that's for 1 of 5 boats, who knows what the future holds. i think bottled storm should be something along the lines of like 1/200, albatross feathers 1/50, dragon salvage hook 1/400 or 1/500

[muted knoll]

once again

ive been saying this all day

W jagex

W raids 4

W update

[reef laurel]

if the rates are any higher tahn that, you are expected to hit 99 sailing before being able to use anything

assuming you also chart, complete the trials, and it leaves room to grind for paints and etc without going to 100m sailing xp

[long blade]

I’m fine with boss rush style tbf, as long as it’s not invo styled I’ll be happy

[reef laurel]

it's bcuz it keeps people engaged throughout the raid imo

[quartz jasper]

Hopefully raids 4 has pb like cm, no more 13min pbs that take 45mins to get

[narrow folio]

I like how tob and toa u dont need to prep pots like cox

[icy relic]

I want a lore heavy raid if it's going to be in the cursed archipelago

[reef laurel]

puzzle rooms are repetitive

people want to solve the boss not the puzzle

[narrow folio]

And tobs better in that u can control what pots u get

[icy relic]

give me that blackstone shit, inject it into my veins

[narrow folio]

Doesnt hurt how irons can profit pots either

[icy relic]

I love the lovecraftian horror going on

[nocturne solstice]

I dont mind the invo style but the Entry/Normal/Hard style from tob works too imo. I think its easier to implement as well.

[muted knoll]

u dont have to prep in cox once u properly learn it

[reef laurel]

tob is very nicely designed in that it is entirely profitable to run at any level assuming you meet some minimum requirements of gear

[narrow folio]

Well thats a bit too tryhard for me

I did it a couple times but didnt like it

[nocturne solstice]

I dont think its profitable at entry right? You only get blood vials

[reef laurel]

well ya

all 3 of the raids are decent in their own ways at least for irons

toa for seeds, cox for supplies, tob for herbs/supplies

[muted knoll]

need to get void on iron so i can start tobbing

[quartz jasper]

Raids 4 for gear only with high drop rates to keep the prices high

[muted knoll]

i no longer want to collect zammy wines

[reef laurel]

just go kill nex 1,600 times

you will have a lifetime supply of wines

[narrow folio]

Tob shits out wines too

Oh nvm

[muted knoll]

yeah thats a no from me dawg

eventually

[nocturne solstice]

Nex do be rough

[narrow folio]

Tob pumps out so many herbs im surprised it escaped a nerf

[reef laurel]

bcuz its really just a break-even amount

[nocturne solstice]

Probably not enough people doing it to impact the economy that much. Peeps be scared.

[narrow folio]

You can even smuggle out pots from the supply chests

[icy relic]

tob is pot positive

[reef laurel]

and everything else is xp that just gets banked cuz aint no way ur making 20,000 super defences

[nocturne solstice]

Impact compared to other sources of course

[narrow folio]

Probably more due to popularity than not being broken

[warm storm]

me too

[icy relic]

as a learner you can bring more hard food

and just buy brews

start with more brews than you had

[reef laurel]

imo the snapdragon nerf was like kinda eh cuz the only place i get snapdragons from ever is toa or tob occasionally

[long blade]

The invos never feel like they ever have a good balance, Toa was just add more annoying stuff and hp and def into the raid. Colo is just trying to pick the least worst invo.

[icy relic]

colo was better before they ruined totemic

[narrow folio]

I think snap and torstol supplies are a real concern

[long blade]

Cox probably overall best raid for like gear progression wise

[narrow folio]

Nah gotta be toa

[long blade]

Sucks that everything from tob minus scy and avernic are pretty devalued for gear progression.

[reef laurel]

i think it's nice but idk if i'd call a hard mode of raids 4 "hard mode" bcuz people at tob see "hard mode tob" and think it's pinnacle endgame, go buy infernal and full torva then end up griefing half the raid. which doesn't rly happen at toa for example where people see "540" and shit themselves

[nocturne solstice]

I felt like some did add some variety/difficulty well via new mechanics but a lot were kinda filler and didnt do much yeah.

[narrow folio]

I think metas get rigour then off to toa

[long blade]

Nah no way, prayer scrolls, anc bow etc

[narrow folio]

Anc isnt a big deal until shadow anyway

[icy relic]

anc good for ayak too

[narrow folio]

Tob is just almost useless

[icy relic]

tob is quite sad

[nocturne solstice]

True, but its hard to deal with player expectations especially if they set those themselves.

[icy relic]

but avernic is nice

[hazy linden]

so gagex, you make a dragon cannon barrel , and boat paints a 1/20k drop rate from salvaging, and your upset a lot more people are salvaging , so you think lets nerf xp , so we stop salvaging.. 3 years of dev work and not a single thought of why that might be , caused yall to fk up the skill in only 2 weeks??? gj

[narrow folio]

Tho masori isnt as impactful until u get off crystal

Its still kinda insane

[long blade]

Wish they could add more in depth mechanics with invos that made a fight more fun/gave incentive

[nocturne solstice]

Same, i can sympathize with the difficulty in coming up with several good ideas let alone like, 40+ for invos though.

[long blade]

Toa/cox best for gear wise like @icy relic said tob is just dead sadly

[narrow folio]

On the cox end, dhcb, buckler, dinhs arent that useful, claws are nice but pretty niche, kodais only 5% over dragon wand

[rare frost]

Oh no I can't 30mins afk for 85k/hr.....anyways

[narrow folio]

Augurys just 1% over yellow pyramid

[reef laurel]

i don't run tob on the iron for the drops. i run it because it's genuinely fun, engaging, and has a lot of depth. it's not required, scythe is a pain to keep charged anyways, avernic is kinda meh. rune ore is a pain to smith, but it's a good raid

[hazy linden]

56k for afk for 30 mins, moron

[reef laurel]

cox is the best raid for overall progression but it's very boring to run all day imo chasing certain drops. i really only ever do cox with friends.

[rare frost]

Imagine training sailing by I dunno, sailing around

[hazy linden]

85k is with crystal extractor , and thats not afk , thats clicking once a minute... use your tiny little brain

[long blade]

Yeah kinda run into a bottleneck with probably how far they can go with current combat system.

[icy relic]

I only solo cox

olm solo is legit fun as hell

I would run it all day if I could skip the other stuff

[reef laurel]

could make contracts, but for raids

[steady brook]

Must be rough clicking once a minute with your 17 kids and 4 wives.

[icy relic]

you are going to get thrown overboard for this

[nocturne solstice]

Very much not a fan of that haha.

[reef laurel]

LOL

[hasty shard]

😭

[rare frost]

Be real, if you are super annoyed about xp rates then you cared more about racing to 99 then the actual health of the gameplay loop

[reef laurel]

learning solo olm was annoying bcuz of everything that comes before and once you go in if you die it's just kinda all messed up

[narrow folio]

I think you can care about both at the same time

[icy relic]

If you are concerned about the health of the gameplay loop you would remove dragon cannon from salvaging

[reef laurel]

like learning 12-0 shadow is hard without being able to just reset the room or have an entry mode

[narrow folio]

U can reset

[hasty shard]

i would just remove dragon cannon

[rare frost]

I can get behind that ngl

[hasty shard]

dragon cannonballs are so stupid 😭

[icy relic]

baaaaased

[narrow folio]

Tho p3 is rng which side

[rare frost]

But salvaging was too strong, it just was.

[narrow folio]

But based on drop rates etc, 100% better to rush toa before cox after dex

[nocturne solstice]

Merchant salvage is lvl 87 maybe they can just add some more types between 88-99 to get back to old rates 🤔

[icy relic]

toa prints uniques and is so easy right now

esp for an iron, fang and lb are so massive

[muted knoll]

20k seems a lil more reasonable imo

oh for 30 mins

10k man

tops

[reef laurel]

nah man you said 20k

[hard axle]

remember that folks were throwing a tantrum about duke mining 10k/hr 6 hour afk lol

when they patched it

[steady brook]

30 mins means man afkd 5 mins of his 25 min afk time

[nocturne solstice]

afkers be very demanding

[muted knoll]

yeah and now they are mad about their 100k an hour wcyd

[narrow folio]

Lv 95 salavage spot

[rare frost]

It's weird that having to click to train a skill is controversial in 2025

[narrow folio]

What we thinkin

[hard axle]

time to release everything like nm release now

[icy relic]

tick manip for a 1/20k drop is bad too

remove dragon cannon

[hard axle]

we add a sailing boss

and fix the fucking cannon bullshit

[rare frost]

Combat needs a proper rework

[icy relic]

yessir

d cannon comes from a sailing boss

[rare frost]

Just changing one drop rate won't fix it

[icy relic]

not from afk salvage

[nocturne solstice]

How would you rework it?

[reef laurel]

i mean just reduce it to 1/5k or put the cannon on the monster table and put the salvaging hook on the 1/5k merchant table since you are literally salvaging and it would make sense to find a hook at the botttom of the ocean

[muted knoll]

they'll have some sort of sailing bosses in the future im sure that fixes a lot of the supply issues

[rare frost]

Boat prayers, no for real a prayer to reduce incoming boat damage

[muted knoll]

so much cool shit they can do with it

[hard axle]

bounties went from 70k/hr to 40k/hr after the slayer-sailing on land nerf and redditors didn't bitch and moan cuz they didnt do it

[nocturne solstice]

New sailing prayer book? 🤔

Forget ruinous powers we getting ship powers

[reef laurel]

yeah i agree

[hard axle]

god i miss slayer-sailing

best... 2 days?

[rare frost]

I'd also wanna ship facility that works like an avas

For cannonballs

[icy relic]

can't believe they didn't make CE 1-tickable

shit is underpowered

[hard axle]

another thing

I hate how wind devices stall natural trim sailes

thye should be separate timers

[icy relic]

It is insane to me that CE is supposed to make you faster but it doesn't

it just prints EXP

[reef laurel]

can we get a gangplank facility that allows me to board my friend's boat in the middle of the ocean or raid long lost pirate ships for loot

[hasty shard]

crewmate wind motes lasting like 5 ticks is trolling

you gotta unassign, use mote, then reassign to get full boost

so dumb

[rare frost]

All I know is I'm running starboard frz when boat Tob drops

[icy relic]

getting ambassador in osrs would be grazy

[hard axle]

give me a combat-based shit

[reef laurel]

sailing combat?

[hard axle]

and give me ability to take on duplicate tasks

[nocturne solstice]

Ye they were talking about sailing combat

[hard axle]

and a way to scout all boards

at once

[nocturne solstice]

Duplicate tasks would be nice. I think its a problem with the system though and itll just bug out and complete both if you get enough materials for one.

[icy relic]

1. cannonballs should be saved by avas 2) cannon range needs to be way longer 3) damage reduction feels terrible 4) no way to mitigate incoming damage

5. looting monsters in the ocean feels terrible

[hard axle]

fuck the avas dude

idgaf as long as it DOES damage

[reef laurel]

I mean you could go a lot more in-depth with it but I don't know exactly how it would translate into community approval. You could create instances where players are hunted by pirates based on current loot or monster kills who are looking to plunder your ship, if you wanted to make it more engaging or interactive beyond just killing something dead.

But other than that, rebalance health/damage rates.
Or add sailing group bosses in the seas similar to wildy bosses where you need to navigate your boat to mitigate damage effectively (or could afk but go through more repair kits).

[hard axle]

like holy hell

that shit was basically useless unless u managed to double hit

[radiant heart]

Well it needs both tbh

Its not good in its current state in general

[icy relic]

there is a lot of damage if you're funkslinging double dragon cannons

but like... that's kinda cost prohibitive even at addy/rune levels

[nocturne solstice]

1. I think the ship should have its own Ava's of some kind so we arent forced to use ranged.
2. I think its fine as it is now but honestly wouldnt complain
3. Agreed, but I think added mechanics to improve it would be good. Like better cannon angle = 100% dmg, bad angle means less dmg
4. Hard to change this one imo. We can sail away of course to mitigate damage or get better ship parts to increase armor. We have safespots too rn so its hard to implement anything without it being too "not runescape".
5. Yeah agreed, i love the animation but it needs to be faster.

[hard axle]

as of rn, u might as well make it 3t shooting and it woulnd't be busted

[radiant heart]

Yea, damage to my coinpurse

[fringe rivet]

I'm legit starting to think cannon is bugged if you wear a ring of wealth.
I got 3 of these shield left halves and no cannon

[radiant heart]

😂

[icy relic]

and beyond that, I really just wanted a basic sailing boss

[fringe rivet]

I know, bad rng is a thing, but, sharks were bugged, and ray barbs don't match the rates they claim

[icy relic]

just as a proof of concept to see what jagex has in mind for what an endgame sailing encounter might look like

not having that means I fear for the worst

I grind all these boat upgrades

[reef laurel]

Also monster damage should not affect ship actions if you have a crewmate on the helm, like using crystal extractor, accessing cargo hold, etc.

[icy relic]

and there is no meaningful content for it

there is no guarantee raids 4 incorporates sailing combat in any meaningful way

[reef laurel]

I think if anything if raids 4 decides to go a puzzle route there could be a sailing puzzle but I doubt there will be ship combat based raids 4.

[icy relic]

like is jagex going to expect us to do cannonball swapping? how do we mitigate damage if we can pack our cargo holds with 240 repair kits

[nocturne solstice]

I think its been said a few times that raids 4 will have no sailing 🤔

[icy relic]

how is food going to be balanced

[nocturne solstice]

I mean, maybe sailing to get there

[muted knoll]

think they've already said raids 4 will not be sailing related but i agree with they should've released a basic sailing boss to at least let people test the waters with how it'll be for the big combat sailing updates

[reef laurel]

surely it's at the cursed area at the bottom right

[icy relic]

there are a lot of mechanics in sailing that are contradictory to the rest of the game

like being able to pack 50*240 HP of healing

• your inventory

[radiant heart]

Ye it was definitely an incredibly weird choice to release the skill with very little chase for the game as a whole. We're really just chasing ways to be better at doing sailing...things. Everything else is pretty mid.

[reef laurel]

there should be sailing bosses where you need to navigate your ship while damaging something

[radiant heart]

Truthfully it really only seems like we got better food and the arma pot

🤔

[icy relic]

I just want to see what they have in mind for what an endgame sailing boss looks like

[nocturne solstice]

Who knows, could be the spooky area top right or weird waters at the far left

[icy relic]

I don't expect perfect but I think we all have held OSRS to a high standard over the years for a reason

[radiant heart]

A big circle like barracuda trial where you sail and dodge and weave between rocks and whirlpools while your crew fires cannons at a colossal kraken and if you crash the attacks the kraken is firing at you hit you. Could be a mini boss or something

Nascar sailing kraken

[icy relic]

while collecting things to throw at it from the sides of the arena? :D

[radiant heart]

Shure

[reef laurel]

ya i was kind of thinking along those lines but it's a hard subject bcuz sailing is really runescape's first 'skilled' skill to be efficient in

like driving a boat is not the equivalent of completing an agility lap where you just click 10 times

[fringe rivet]

that sounds like tempoross but, on the water (damn that's weird to write out)

[radiant heart]

Also, I've gotten 5 mouldy dolls and no cannon barrel

:C

[fringe rivet]

you dodge waves and fire and throw fish at it

[icy relic]

don't worry, you salvage every 5T now, that'll make everything better

[fringe rivet]

I got 3 of these things

no cannon

I took off the ring of wealth cuz I believe it's cursed at this point

[icy relic]

it's depressing in here man

1/159 my ass

[abstract agate]

Well thank jagex .

[brazen tundra]

I thought it was 1/2 drop rate

[fringe rivet]

I'm convinced the drop tables are bugged

the official rates for Ray Barbs are 1/100
wiki reports based on data are 1/16

[brazen tundra]

Isn’t the whole games drop table just 1/2 ?

[reef laurel]

think it's just bad rng. it just feels really bad because the drops aren't worth much and the kills are equivalent of killing something like araxxor.

[icy relic]

it is bad rng

but it still feels bad

killing these things is expensive

[brazen tundra]

Why thumbs down ?

[reef laurel]

and you're also chasing upgrades or items that you don't know whether it's smart to use them now or later when theycome out with more content

[radiant heart]

Sailing combat does feel really bad cause of the looting times and kill speeds. It also just doens't make sense our damage is gimped with magic and ranged and feels very weird

[ancient nebula]

absolutely insane they fixed safespotting while simultaneously admitting boat combat sucks

[radiant heart]

Just use the ale station for +1 damage

fixes all of it

trust me

[ancient nebula]

lol

i thought "well since theyve destroyed salvaging maybe ill go try and get some bottled storms through tasks".. and i cant even safespot the kraken anymore

[fringe rivet]

you shouldn't be able to kill krakens with a bronze keel

[radiant heart]

i decided to kill a few hundred frost dragons today for the first time just cause the price of nails is ridiculous

got like 15 nails

[fringe rivet]

I just spent my day afk salvaging and doing chores

[radiant heart]

Thats just nuts to me

[icy relic]

what's the price?

[radiant heart]

like 180k per

[reef laurel]

i mean you certainly wouldn't want safespots to exist once combat is fixed and if it can be permanently safe spotted then what's the point, you are just afking for a drop like it's spindel

[icy relic]

oh they were 300k when I was doing them on day 2

[fringe rivet]

kind of nutty how they're staying consistent

[ancient nebula]

yeah but atleast leave the safespots in until they atleast THINK they've fixed boat combat. they even admit its trash while taking away the method that makes it bearable

[chrome lantern]

It is kinda wild to make zero buffs to ship combat but remove the only viable ways of ship combat

Like not even a stopgap buff

[fringe rivet]

most people wouldn't know about the safe spots

[radiant heart]

with how little the benefit dragon and rosewood give, and considering its just level 60 metal at the end of the day the sailing scaling feels like smithing V2 to me, I think they really shoulda made the final boat components like dragon be around the 70s max and left space for future materials

[chrome lantern]

Even something like doubling combat xp to make up for the fact you just lost 70% of the extractor, giving cannons higher accuracy/hits, etc.

[fringe rivet]

It may be lvl 60 metal, but dragon has always been "rare" to obtained. It's just annoying cuz we need a lot of it for a sloop

[reef laurel]

dragon is the only cannon that gives max hits to mithril. salvage hook is a direct upgrade. boat armor upgrade guarantees 1 less damage taken in all instances. rosewood hull is an entire mine timesave on gwenith course. if you make rune a lvl 60 req you bar ppl behind lvl 90 smithing at only lvl 60 sailing.

[radiant heart]

Also its really out of place seeing Fremmy dudes driving a player boat in the ocean when they have nordic looking ships

Where are other themed hulls?

Lol

[fringe rivet]

placeholders

soon we'll get sea goblins

[icy relic]

rosewood hull is crazy good

[chrome lantern]

The fact that we even have to talk about Mithril cannonballs with the BIS cannon just shows how awful of a state ship combat is in

[icy relic]

but it's also 300/600 nails lul

[reef laurel]

but with that being said it shouldn't take 30 hrs to upgrade a boat to save urself around 5 hrs.

[fringe rivet]

Yea I ain't got the 80mil for a rosewood hull

but it's hardly a factor

[reef laurel]

yeah but that's just the sustainability of cannonballs really. you go thru like 2,400 cannonballs an hour on a ship. you'd be lucky to make that many rune cballs in an hour

[fringe rivet]

It's been 2 weeks and I'm more than half way to 99

[ember token]

npc fremmys sailing around? dont think ive seen that yet

[fringe rivet]

yea they got boats

you can find pirates to

[chrome lantern]

Yeah my point is that it's dumb to talk about where dragon cannon sits as if any of ship combat makes sense or is remotely balanced

[fringe rivet]

they don't do anything tho, mostly just set dressing

[ember token]

ive seen all the other npcs ships I think, just not the fremmy one

[icy relic]

Just farm your own dragon nails

[reef laurel]

like if i used all of my rune ore from 400 hours of tobbing, i think i'd get enough cannonballs to last me 4 hours on the seas.

[radiant heart]

I saw the hook was only functioning like 2k better by player reports so i dunno about that being worth it and even if it is 10%, to me that isnt enough but w/e the cannons are hella expensive and cb is terrible right now anyways, not to mention the damage difference isnt going to be night and day so again not a really big difference. Really the only one I agree with you on is the time saving with trials

[icy relic]

hook is 4k xp/hr

[fringe rivet]

rune c-balls are like, 1.5k each rn

[icy relic]

difference between bronze and rune isn't even that big

salvaging hooks are weird

[fringe rivet]

it's a profit loss to make rune c-balls

[radiant heart]

and it costs a load more so not good enough to me but hey if that tickles your tummies, buy it and go nuts

[tender peak]

I've been thinking a lot about ship combat recently to work on a game suggestion of mine

and the more I look into the technical details the more my head hurts. Why is it designed like this

[fringe rivet]

cuz they want people to actually use the cannons, most likely

[reef laurel]

there's a lot of cool things you can do with sailing combat

it's just not that effective

[icy relic]

we're not done yet my friend

[reef laurel]

you can tick manip cannons fire every 4t and alternate your boats positioning to get double hits on any monsters but it literally uses 200 cballs/monster

[icy relic]

are you ready to combine 2 cannonballs into one chainshot

[fringe rivet]

nice balls

I prefer to rub hot sauce on mine

[icy relic]

I love the graphics for the incendiary balls

it's so lazy lmao

scuffed = stuff

[fringe rivet]

we got chains and hot sauce for our balls, from the wiki

[radiant heart]

Oh yea, thats totally the intention but it comes at the cost of not feeling natural. So imo it wasn't executed right. I think a good compromise in letting us still feel our skills would be introducing seafaring weapons or mods, like a mod for the ballista to turn it into a harpoon gun. Just anything really.

[fringe rivet]

what did jagex mean by this?

[radiant heart]

Just being like, naw that sea bird is too powerful for your god staff is just weird

[main kestrel]

use dragon harpoon on a light ballista

[fringe rivet]

I just pretend it's hard to focus/aim cuz you're swaying on deck a bunch

[reef laurel]

what a great way to utilize ballistas

[fringe rivet]

I want them to bring back the Dwarf Hand Cannon personally

[icy relic]

dragon harpoon on a rope

[radiant heart]

But then see I think of the agility skill and that goes out the window

Mai immersion

[main kestrel]

oh yeah or you just lose the harpoon 😭

[fringe rivet]

cardio doesn't give you sea legs

[radiant heart]

Ok what about the combo of higher sailing and agility

[ember grove]

we have water agility already, might as well continue the analogy

[radiant heart]

😜

[fringe rivet]

I think you do more damage the higher sailing you have

[radiant heart]

well i just got done killing some sharks and im 93, best i saw was like an 8

[reef laurel]

they should just add diesel engines and machine guns to boats

as a reward from raids 4

[main kestrel]

mechscape

[radiant heart]

flintlocks when?

[fringe rivet]

Dwarven. Hand. Cannon.

[icy relic]

I am shooting granite cannonballs at krakens

cuz I have like 30k and am never going to use them

[radiant heart]

actually a great time to reintroduce the handcannon

LOL

[icy relic]

they hit pretty good

inbetween mith and addy

[fringe rivet]

fits thematically

since cannons have ocean resistance or something

[reef laurel]

same but im still afraid to use them cuz once they're gone they're gone and that's my nex retirement

been trying to avoid using much til i see if anything changes anyways. prepped few thousand ironwood repair kits worst case scenario

which is actually not very afk to do since you can only do 8 at a time

[icy relic]

I mean by the time I shoot up all my granite cannonballs I'll have 5-digit rune cannonballs

[reef laurel]

what in god's name are you killing o.o

[icy relic]

krakens

and frosties

[spice drum]

Anyone know if they have commented on the sailing cape perk? Its like.. horrible and no mention of changing it in updates yet that I know of?

[kind surge]

"it's fine because it's old school to have useless skillcape perks"

[icy relic]

whaddya mean? you don't like being able to rename your boat and save 1 law rune for a worse summon boat?

[kind surge]

unironically people will tell you that

[spice drum]

Doesn't even save you runes when it can only summon your boat to pandemonium lol

[icy relic]

9/10 of a law rune then

[spice drum]

And honestly Fierokk, it makes sense

[kind surge]

[icy relic]

you know what would be a great 99 perk

1 tick crystal extractor

[spice drum]

id do unimaginable things for this

[icy relic]

I know you would

[supple bough]

99 sailing should be a free unlimited tele to any boat so i never have to sail again

[icy relic]

it honestly should

but nope go kill more krakens, go

[spice drum]

Then it would kill the bottled storms use :[

[icy relic]

jagex doesn't even have the decency to let you bind your cape to ONE ship

[spice drum]

^ now thats a good middle ground

[supple bough]

similar to how house tabs are dead with a con cape?

[spice drum]

I mean an expensive/rare mob drop in the sea vs a bunch of tablets you can mass produce

id say thats a bad comparison

[fringe rivet]

I literally heard someone say house teleports are "free" cuz con cape exists over in #sailing-chat

[icy relic]

jagex chose to make the the teleport gated behind a really expensive item

and only for the ship it's built on

they did not have to do this

[supple bough]

ive used over 4k house tabs since osrs has came out and thats just since ive been keep track of the 5k i bought in bulk, i might have a messed up opinion in cost

[icy relic]

sailor's amulet also just devalued the shit out of crafting cape

[supple bough]

lol deepfin port is op for sure

[dry shore]

Man they really ruined saling with this update. destory salvaging and dont even fix the QOL stuff like moving facilities, fix the sails hitbox or put a bank at the boat building area

[feral wedge]

dw we got some vague corporate doublespeak about fixing it, it's all good

[dry shore]

does Jamflex even check here? how do we give them feedback?

[ancient nebula]

i think they know, lol. go ahead and unsub though to make sure they know >:)

[icy relic]

No my friend you must slay the Avernic Kraken for a 1/1000 dark magic stone that enables you to build this bank chest at the shipwright

[feral wedge]

also, avernic dragons for a 1/20k chance of a slightly better cannon

[dry shore]

yeah I'm probably going to cancel and go back to counterstrike. game felt cool for the first time in a while and they wrecked the very few good things about the skill. I already did my 400 barracuda circles, let me AFK

[icy relic]

The way they try to spin it is so nasty too

Oh sorry you guys love AFK so much and don't care about the health of the game, I guess we'll compromise

like nah you CHOSE to put a 1/20k drop on an AFK activity

and then act offended when people AFK for it

[feral wedge]

it's a marketing psychological trick, they come back with a "better offer" and we feel compelled to take it

but the better offer wont be what we want

[dry shore]

I was using salvaging to make money on my iron, so doing a ton of alching made it not THAT afk. then they go and NERF the salvaging station so dropping is better. literally the opposite of what their stated goal is

[icy relic]

I am not settling for anything less than removal of the dragon cannon from merchant salvage

I don't care about the exp rates

don't force us to sit there

[feral wedge]

they could add it to another npc

which would be the wise choice

[icy relic]

add it to the first sailing boss

[feral wedge]

2 ways of getting it > one

[icy relic]

yeah I think a tempoross/wintertodt situation is fine

for the 1/10k dragon tool drop

but it needs to come from a boss

[dry shore]

I was pumped to have a low intensity way to earn GP on my iron, something other than giants foundry or god forbid the agility pyramid

but they halved gp/hr with the crewmate tick changes

[chrome lantern]

Yeah the change in loot is insane for cloggers, anyone going for a cannon, or just anyone looting in general

[warm storm]

promoting botting in the official discord is a bold play

[acoustic drift]

LOL

[main kestrel]

idea, dropping salvage back into the ocean is unsalvaging and removes sailing xp

[tender peak]

pollution skill when

[main kestrel]

back to iron rocks to train my polluting skill

fire up coal trucks

blast mine

[thick beacon]

hallowed teles have always been slept on

[icy relic]

I got 5k of those puppies

Sepulchre enjoyer

[thick beacon]

deepfin tele is pretty strong though

[icy relic]

For how accessible it is

It's grazy

[thick beacon]

just some testing i only have to move 2-3ticks to reach bank at hallowed sep 4-5ticks for deepfin

[tender peak]

Can't mount sailors ammy in a poh

[ember token]

as is the case with most amulets yeah

[tender peak]

Just saying that the crafting cape can

[ember token]

the cape holder thingy isn't in a particularly good spot though

plus it takes time to teleport to house

[icy relic]

Yeah I was gonna say

Why would you want to mount your bank tele when jewelry box exists

[chrome lantern]

Deepfin is like 1 tick further than craft cape

[thick beacon]

depending on where u spawn after tele sometimes deep fin can be 5ticks i think

or 4ticks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGWL41vVRBA in this video guy seems to take 4ticks for crafting cape but idk if spawn changes slightly to with cape

[reef laurel]

for how early you can access it yeah it's very nice qol. probably shouldn't be changed either. it basically replaces the need for castle wars teleports which allows you to primarily use duelings for ferox.

and the sailing qol is insane

[thick beacon]

think ppl hype up crafting cape its never even been best tele option for a while

and alot of things have competed it with to or are very close

[reef laurel]

yh i mean ring of dueling is all around op with menu entry swaps

you just need a new one every 8 uses

but it's 1 tick bank tele

[warm storm]

the "big" thing cape has going for it is putting you on the same tile every time

also being directly next to depo box

[thick beacon]

is that useful though being next to a depo box? i didint even know about that ppl always only talk about cracked banking

[warm storm]

useful any time u are gathering stuff to bank

used it a lot afk bwanning

[chrome lantern]

Went back to going for imbued heart hoping to get some tasks on the way, got a task

[thick beacon]

ye thats a good one

[chrome lantern]

Hopefully I get enough tasks to make this worthwhile, but I really have little to no motivation to actually do Sailing stuff right now with the last set of changes

[icy relic]

Solid drops

Yeh just wait for the dust to settle

This was a major stinker

I'm not touching sailing until they address the rates

[chrome lantern]

I don't really have anything better to afk, only skill not 99

[icy relic]

1/20k, 28k frost dragons, 2500 krakens

[chrome lantern]

30k xp/hr xd

[icy relic]

Not acceptable

[chrome lantern]

Other than the 131 these were all off-task

Was kinda looking forward to grinding these out to cut into the dragon parts grind too but they're completely unviable now

[fringe rivet]

What I've learned from all the posts is 90% of sailors are salvaging

[chrome lantern]

Safespots gone and no changes to fill the gap

(Plus 200 more on mobile)

[fringe rivet]

boats in bronze keels shouldn't be killing end-game sea monsters

[thick beacon]

salvaging was op i remember when they nerfed 30min shooting stars

[icy relic]

Active salvaging was 115k

Hardly OP

[chrome lantern]

But now it doesn't even remotely feel worth trying it even with a rune keel

[warm storm]

honestly it's still rly strong (jagex pls ignore me rar ra we are angry, don't nerf until i'm 99)

[thick beacon]

i feel like if they give back some of the sort xp or alot of it will be pretty fair but idk

[chrome lantern]

Like I have a rune keel and two dragon cannons and I'm not even willing to touch sea combat at this point

Not to mention it's garbage xp

[fringe rivet]

maybe redistrubute some of that towards charting lol

[icy relic]

I'm 99 and I still fight for you all to have a good strong meaningful extractor and fair rates

[chrome lantern]

Charting ends too soon, can't really make it reasonable part of the balance of xp at 80+

And finishing all the charting puts you at like 80

[fringe rivet]

extractor should only be used while the boat is moving, it's a movement focused facility first and foremost

[icy relic]

I replied to your post already

Extractor should actually do something other than print XP

It should uncap speed and make you better at trials and Uber eats

[fringe rivet]

where's my cannonball extractor?

[icy relic]

And give no XP by itself

[nocturne solstice]

Imo the extractor feels most useless because the npc's helming it makes the boost last barely any time at all.

[fringe rivet]

I mean it does already do that

it generates motes

[icy relic]

You do not need the mote

[fringe rivet]

If I want better uber eats times I do

gimme that 33 seconds of speed

[reef laurel]

I mean that’s why I had a pretty strong stance on drop rate changes OR monster changes to help with combat, which will inevitably take a while to round out

I was doing regular armoured krakens and using way more repair kits and cannonballs than I felt comfortable using for what I was expected in return

[chrome lantern]

wym, you can keep the ship sailing while you interact with the extractor you know right

[reef laurel]

It’s fine if it pays for itself but when it doesn’t it just feels tiring

[chrome lantern]

The boost lasts the same time

It's just a wind mote

[nocturne solstice]

The duration of wind mote boost is less for npcs compared to player

[icy relic]

The fact that it doesn't uncap speed limits its use significantly in GG

[nocturne solstice]

like the speed boost itself

[chrome lantern]

is it

[nocturne solstice]

am i just going nuts based off vibes? cause it feels like it lasts super shorter on npcs

[chrome lantern]

Wiki seems to agree I just never really noticed

I didn't really do trials because I hate them as a long-term training method

Wiki specifically just says "trimming boost" though which can be assumed to imply the wind catcher boosts as well

[nocturne solstice]

Yeah wiki says 30% shorter but it feels like only 30% duration tbh

[chrome lantern]

And extracted

[fringe rivet]

maybe it's cuz of my plugins but I get a timer telling me how long it lasts

[chrome lantern]

Do you have the highest tier helmsmen

[fringe rivet]

I never noticed any difference between doing it myself and having a crew do it

[nocturne solstice]

its like, 2 seconds when if I do it the boost lasts like 4

[nocturne solstice]

Yeah i have uhh the spotter tempoross chick on it

[fringe rivet]

crew just gets me less exp is all

[chrome lantern]

It should be like 30 ticks shouldn't it

[nocturne solstice]

True, I just see it as free passive xp tbh

[chrome lantern]

Not 4 seconds

[nocturne solstice]

The plugin definitely says that but it doesnt feel that long

[fringe rivet]

I do notice sometimes the "wind" visual effect ends early

[chrome lantern]

I mean it's a literal statistic the game gives us

Ironwood sloop

[nocturne solstice]

but i havent timed it all and most of my experience with it has been during barracudas which are affected by rapids. During regular charting it didnt feel like 30t

[reef laurel]

Imo old extractor was just broken, made sailing the 2nd auto clickable skill and the first that requires no input yet gives a reward. Could get like 900k exp and 300 crystal shards in a day.

[fringe rivet]

I would test it tomorrow, but I got a feeling I'm going to be stuck here pointlessly debating sailing balance to no avail again

[icy relic]

Sure, still does nothing about the 1/20k cannons or the endgame parts grind

Numbers don't just exist in a vacuum

[chrome lantern]

What do you mean, Jagex did a lot about the cannon grind

Now you get salvage slower

:)

[icy relic]

Thank god I get to enjoy more post 99 content

The XP rates discussion is completely missing the point

[chrome lantern]

No, it's more AFK now because you just get less xp and loot!~

[icy relic]

Jagex shifted the bulk of the grind to the rosewood upgrades while the XP rates are definitely on the fast side

Other skills do not have this kind of dynamic

[chrome lantern]

wym shifted to rosewood upgrades

[icy relic]

PoH upgrades are not gated behind mega fuck you grinds

[icy relic]

Dragon/rosewood tier

[chrome lantern]

1.) You never need rosewood or dragon anything
2.) Their explicit design intent was just for it to be a money sink flex

I think it's bad design but it definitely fits intent

[reef laurel]

They will surely fix the 1/20k and all of the other drop rates given time. Most likely they were just set high originally so that no bugs or further issues could crash the market.

[chrome lantern]

Grinding dragon or rosewood doesn't save you any time maxing if that's what you want

And nothing really benefits from it post-max other than clogging or hull for trawling

[icy relic]

When has that ever been a compelling argument for upgrades in this game though

[chrome lantern]

It's not

[icy relic]

Like oh don't grind ultor ring

You don't need it for anything

[chrome lantern]

I'm just telling you what the explicit design intent has been since like

5 blogs ago

That nobody has been talking about

[icy relic]

I know what you are referring to

[chrome lantern]

Like fully at least half a year before sailing we knew about all the resources

[icy relic]

The comment that we can do all content with the ironwood tier

Which is true

[warm storm]

camphor even

[chrome lantern]

And in Q/As we've had many many times where they made it very explicitly clear that the grinds were intended to be awful

[icy relic]

But asking the OSRS community to leave 40s off the table on GG and 13 max hits on the cannon

It is strange to say at the least

[chrome lantern]

People just never raised enough concern about it, and when they did Jagex's response was just "nah the meme grind means it's cool," at least from Husky

[reef laurel]

I think it’s just the point that as irons we have access to lots of dragon equipment but that it’s relatively significantly easier to acquire. And I’m not saying that should be the same for sailing but I am saying that its current state is not the best. You couldn’t compare farming dragon tier boat to anything else in the entire game in turns of input vs output

[icy relic]

If it is in the game people will grind it

Did they not learn this from cloggers existing

[thick beacon]

feel like half ppl that care also just arent even doing trials to begin with they might now

[reef laurel]

It’s pretty much on par to the old PNM grind

[icy relic]

You can't play innocent and be like oh it's just a luxury grind

[chrome lantern]

They were never subtle about making explicit statements like, "All of our discussions about xp rates don't apply to deep-sea trawling, those methods are bad for both sailing and fishing xp"

"I'm the kind of gigachad ironman who just grinds out tens of thousands of demons for oathplate contracts"

[icy relic]

The difference between rosewood and ironwood hull on GG is night and day

[chrome lantern]

Paraphrased slightly but mostly exactly as stated

[icy relic]

It is just so much better

[warm storm]

is jagex responsible for people feeling compelled to collect things? honest question

[icy relic]

Yes

[thick beacon]

this is unironically a signifcantly bettert system then awakenr orbs though its not ideal

[warm storm]

i don't think this game is meant to be completable for most people

[chrome lantern]

I do think they've played a bit too heavily into colleciton logging

[icy relic]

This is a game that competes for our time and attention

[chrome lantern]

They've catered way too heavily into balancing things around clog imo, I don't really even have any issues with the ttk Sailing grinds as-is but I do think the issue comes in when it's all just from slop mindless content and doesn't really add any meaning to the activities

[reef laurel]

Most irons with decent PvM knowledge could expect to acquire radiant or do 4/5 contracts before running out of what they got from the Yama grind, especially if they have a main.

[icy relic]

They know exactly what they are doing when they do these kinds of engagement treadmills

Never absolve devs of their responsibility when they choose to put things in the game and dangle them in front of people

[chrome lantern]

I'm telling you verbatim what a Jagex Mod said about how he felt the grind should be during Dev Q&As

[icy relic]

There are not cosmetic upgrades

They are performance upgrades

You do not get to say oh well there's no content that REQUIIIIIIRES these upgrades