game-update

[finite tapir]

errrr

which one

[minor whale]

Holy
I didn't even think about some of these

[chrome lantern]

Like I’ve done excessive amounts of flicking across my PvM and I can tell you I still use a lot of prayer over time

[minor whale]

Imagine Akkhas shadows following you around lmaoooo

[chrome lantern]

Man I love Unstable Orbs

[hard axle]

[hard axle]

man I love white blob phase

[chrome lantern]

Akkha final phase is the only phase that would move potentially

[hard axle]

All of them

[chrome lantern]

Since the shadows are different IDs that never walk

[hard axle]

give folks epilepsy

[hasty shard]

i cant imagine akkhas shadows walking

they dont turn to you do they?

[chrome lantern]

No

[hasty shard]

id presume noon or w/e would start moving about

the blue one..

[chrome lantern]

Hydra p4 walking is kinda irrelevant but sure maxhit concern

[hasty shard]

dawn

[winter hearth]

for anybody interested, without the global damage cap, the theoretical max hit of the blue moon spear at Yama would've been 704,999

take that Grid Master

the real Leagues experience was at Yama the whole time

[hasty shard]

🥹

[finite tapir]

hmm

[tacit wharf]

my biggest gripe is the limitations placed on what they can do with prayer down the road

[chrome lantern]

Ok but what if we just real quick turned that cap off for a few minutes.

I have a few contracts

[carmine junco]

Does this overflow the borders of the hit splat or does it make one very big hit splat

[finite tapir]

i only have clips of normal firebwan i fear

i have a video of decant barblore though

or double manip + alching + crafting infernal shale

[hasty shard]

i dont think it'd display higher than 1250 since you cant overkill npcs iirc

dusk does what

[carmine junco]

Ah yeah, good point... Still! I'm Curious what happens. I guess third option is the text gets very small

[hard axle]

Guys, don’t say the obvious phrase, it’s a 1 hour mute

Pyro wanted to let you guys know

[sturdy brook]

so how many ticks was the stun 😭 or do we have to calc

[hasty shard]

did you guys set it to -1 like noita

moral of the story is:
not the first time something surrounding moons and specials has been broken

im pretty sure the underlying bug of burn damage affecting root npcs hasnt been fixed

[small anvil]

i think its funny that npc dont move is just implemented as root of infinity duration

[hasty shard]

like you can probably true kill judge of yama if you only use scobo miss specs

[obsidian venture]

Folks mentioning prayer flicking as op probably don’t have fingers to click the same 😭

[hasty shard]

theres possibly a way to kill duke whilst he's sleeping but its leagues only iirc

[carmine junco]

Famously video games love cheating with things like that. Why develop entirely new logic when existing behavior can be made to work. See Bethesda train hat

[finite tapir]

i mean it's worth noting that "op" is relative

[hasty shard]

cause delayed hits after he carks it will damage the actual duke npc hp

[small anvil]

and that the global dmg cap was what saved it from being instakilled

[finite tapir]

osrs is built around prayer inherently

[marsh hedge]

oh calc just ends up being 15K

47 max hit

[sturdy brook]

ty

[finite tapir]

wouldnt this be 1.5mil or

[small anvil]

i'd imagine some power of 2 - 1

[vernal valve]

so surely if you stall in yama p3 for like 3 hours he'll unbind

[small anvil]

its 1% per tick right

[finite tapir]

yea

[marsh hedge]

oh yh ur right

[hasty shard]

can we get khazard to do this

[small anvil]

1.5 mil

ticks

[hasty shard]

or gnomonkey
as punishment

[small anvil]

its 250 hrs

not doable

[hasty shard]

[vernal valve]

tragic

[sturdy brook]

is it some clean number

[finite tapir]

sadly no

well at least the division isnt

[small anvil]

its 15k slightly rounded down

[sturdy brook]

...

[hasty shard]

tom clancys the division

[finite tapir]

you mean rounded up

705000 would be a clean division

[chrome lantern]

I only round sideways

[winter hearth]

999,999 ticks

[finite tapir]

whar

what the

[small anvil]

uhm

[chrome lantern]

At least 3 ticks

[finite tapir]

you could get a max hit of 70?

[chrome lantern]

[[blue moon spear]]

[ornate wolf]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Blue_moon_spear

[vernal valve]

answers unclear, gonna need you to uncap it on main game 30 minutes for science

[shadow wave]

704,999 max hit

[sturdy brook]

thanks

[finite tapir]

i might have brain damage but how does 1499998% come from 999999 ticks

[small anvil]

yeah thats what's not clear

[hasty shard]

yknow whats nice
704999 max didnt mean you always hit 200

[austere mulch]

But how fun would it have been if the failsafe weren’t there

[hasty shard]

imagine if it was like zulrah or w/e 😭

[small anvil]

that woulda been almost guaranteed 200s

if it was a clamp after dmg roll

rather than on the calculated max hit cap

[marsh hedge]

plz man

[austere mulch]

Don’t think the dmg nerf was necessary but is good enough as a middle ground.

Also, the damage was the bonus side effect of the method. Not the unbind.

The unbind was the intention (blog words it the other way around)

[shadow wave]

Seems they clamp the max to 200 then roll 1-200

[small anvil]

yeah

[hasty shard]

make it 200 because 200 is cooler >:(

[small anvil]

thats what i was saying

[hasty shard]

or at least equal to scy swing

[sturdy brook]

so is blue moon spear secretly 1.5% dmg per bind tick @finite tapir

[small anvil]

is goblin working off 1.5% per tick?

[finite tapir]

oh no

[small anvil]

wiki says 1%

[sturdy brook]

special attack tooltips have been wrong in the past 💀

[finite tapir]

imagine the blog post saying 1% is actually 1.5% but because they round down floats...

[sturdy brook]

isn't msb spec still wrong

[small anvil]

wiki says the bonus is capped at 75% dmg bonus which would be an 82

but the blog post and goblin said close to 100 max (97?)

[austere mulch]

Now that this got “fixed”, can we also get Soulflame to work with dragon claws as they were polled and blogged, since it also got a knee jerk reaction that took away half of its already extremely niche use case

[sturdy brook]

yeah tooltip is wrong on that 1

[meager flame]

still no idea why they changed the damage

[carmine junco]

They explain their reasoning in the post

[meager flame]

that doesn't mean it makes sense

[small anvil]

it wasn't super problematic for yama

[marsh hedge]

i mean tbf thats kinda too strong as is

[carmine junco]

So you do know why, you just don't agree

[small anvil]

it might be problematic for other minions using that mechanic

[finite tapir]

"it doesnt make sense" is a bit different from "i dont think i agree with how they put it"

it does make sense

[marsh hedge]

U dont even need to utilize the strategy to benefit from that

[finite tapir]

like quite literally

[small anvil]

you can just finishing hit with the blue moon

[chrome lantern]

My biggest takeaway from reading the video description is that he doesn’t know how to use “role” instead of “roll”

[marsh hedge]

u could legit just do donofly and then spec at 100hp and just have a new op spec wep

[meager flame]

yeah but reading that literally would lead you to think something other than what i was saying

[marsh hedge]

I more mean if the spec still hit 200

[austere mulch]

But then roboBob hits a 34 and can’t muster the clicks to finish the remaining 66

And all hell breaks loose

[meager flame]

tldr i dont think the expected damage in the situation was anywhere near out of hand

tbh i'd say it was pretty great

[small anvil]

did you miss the part about this being a bit of future proofing

[marsh hedge]

unluck

[meager flame]

it was part of the increase you'd like to see for doing something well and losing inventory space

[small anvil]

and potentially other use cases being absolutely busted

[sturdy brook]

capping the % dmg is completely fair and falls in line with literally every other thing in the game

[small anvil]

they're leaving in the cooler part which is the unbind

[shell smelt]

Exactly, if the damage cap of 200 wasn’t there then 700k+ damage would’ve absurd

But the damage cap of 200 is there for a reason right??

[austere mulch]

Also completely went over the head that verzik p2 is a moveable npc because of the transition lol

[small anvil]

is there any stationary minion thats lower hp

that you could have 1 shot

[sturdy brook]

cap

[small anvil]

200 is the fail safe

it's not supposed to be hit unintentionally

[austere mulch]

Blog implies that p2 could’ve become unbound

[sturdy brook]

i know

[austere mulch]

Bc it uses the same type of bind as Yama

[small anvil]

like the cool thing about robo spear is less the dmg splat on blue moon

[sturdy brook]

it's speculation

[meager flame]

they were strangely cagey about what npcs this would have affected

[small anvil]

because some things hit above 100

and they like that

keris partisan

dharoks

[marsh hedge]

anyone have clears of sensory clouding+ contracts (another contract + unleashing yama). bloodied blows would be kinda crazy

[hasty shard]

yeah 100 safety cap might mess with some boss mechanics lol

[vernal valve]

to be clear, from the wording of the blog, they don't seem to have actually changed anything like that. they're just worried that it might be possible.

[small anvil]

changing the global safety cap would be tremendously stupid

[hasty shard]

imagine it fucks up nightmare and now you have to do 30 phases 😭

[small anvil]

for this

random nerf to dharoks would be silly

[winter hearth]

it is the kind of panicked thought that you might have at 10pm as a developer when called out for a hotfix at least yeah

[small anvil]

the implementation they chose is totally fine

[marsh hedge]

Or ig the like shard/pizza or oath acq but i imagine another radiant one an easier start

[austere mulch]

Yeah, all I’m saying is I considered p2 stationary in the way that maiden is stationary

Which isn’t the case

[split pelican]

I gotta say, the amount of 👎 reactions on the newspost is concerning. I appreciate people don't typically like nerfs, but this is literally preventing gamechanging metas from a midtier Armour set... Lol

[vernal valve]

right, just clarifying that I don't think they've done anything to prevent further "unbinds". if you test it ingame right now and it doesn't work on p2, it probably didn't work on p2 yesterday either.

[hasty shard]

i think a large part of the badgering is that there wasn't a quick like 'we are aware of the spearfly and are disabling it temporarily to evaluate the impact this has on other content' message

[sturdy brook]

i'm saying.... anyways is spear spec 1% or 1.5% dmg per stun tick

[small anvil]

people bout to blue moon smack everything they can find

[obsidian venture]

Not too surprising considering the playerbase

[meager flame]

tbh it seems like they should just support this directly

[austere mulch]

Would’ve loved to have dragged p2 (if possible) near a wall to see how bounce interaction would’ve worked

But as Kanye once said, I guess we’ll never know

[marsh hedge]

They are very much supporting this directly lol

[small anvil]

they didnt remove unbind

[hasty shard]

actually is it fixed on other npcs already or can i go unfreeze dawn rq

would be funny...

[small anvil]

or wait they might have changed how stationary works on some minions

[meager flame]

pull a list of all npcs this would actually work on and then apply a modifier for how hard it can hit them

[winter hearth]

it does look like it's 1.5%, will relay to the Wiki folks and take back to the team

[finite tapir]

so is blue moon spear actually 1.5% per tick and not 1%

im oops

[hasty shard]

eoop

[marsh hedge]

big

[sturdy brook]

ignore her

[finite tapir]

i am too speedy

[vernal valve]

It looks like the only change they made was preemptively gutting the damage to prevent potential other use cases. I don't think they touched its ability to unbind NPCs; it's likely that it doesn't actually work on most, if not all of them, and never did. The concern was that it could do that.

[winter hearth]

Oh you beat me to it!

[vernal valve]

goblin can correct me if I'm wrong, but that's what I'm getting from the post

[winter hearth]

Will take it back to the team

[small anvil]

Similarly, we'll take a safety pass at other NPCs that are bound in this way to make sure there aren't scenarios where thing like Verzik P2 suddenly starts walking around.

this sounds like not yet done

[wanton goblet]

wait so is the 100 dmg cap live rn and it wont hit 0s anymore?

[split pelican]

I just wanna say,

I wanna drive the boat

[meager flame]

im mostly just curious to see if anyone actually finds another npc it works on

[vernal valve]

Right, yeah

[small anvil]

@austere mulch test now while you can!

[austere mulch]

So there’s still time…

[marsh hedge]

i think a decent amount was hit already

[hasty shard]

i have a hydra task..

[austere mulch]

Goblin gimmi like 15 mins

😭😭😭

[winter hearth]

Odds are that you won't hit with it in the first place, but I think the team have already had a look around and don't suspect that it'll behave the same elsewhere. Also in fairness I can't think of many places where this would be beneficial

[finite tapir]

anyone wanna check with me to see if you can smuggle yama stun to bloat

[small anvil]

15 mins to get to verzik, slooooow

i expected more from you tm smh my head

[hard axle]

[meager flame]

yeah i honestly couldn't really think of many places that it might work and i wouldn't be surprised if none of them worked in the end

[vernal valve]

I'm pretty sure it unbound even on 0's anyway iirc, so I don't think that's a big deal.

[austere mulch]

15 mins to get a snack, get my pc ready on, send an entry mode

[vernal valve]

But yeah, just curious, I doubt it'd really be useful

[austere mulch]

Pls forgive

[marsh hedge]

guess like p3 verzik would just be a decent dmg spec? Though ig running webs around that corner verzik would move which would be problematic

[vernal valve]

Ye, Yama's bind seemed very unusual, particularly with the fact it's announced in chat for some reason

[shell smelt]

Might not be beneficial, but could be fun to mess around with

[marsh hedge]

ig you could pogtank then

[winter hearth]

If more does prop up then imagine the team will likely just make further changes

[small anvil]

i thought the accuracy roll was unbound

[austere mulch]

You can manual path and make it work without having her shift that tile

Just annoying

[marsh hedge]

ok

[winter hearth]

at Yama, yeah, for this initial discovery

[small anvil]

oh, so it was changed elsewhere

[winter hearth]

effectively 'if yama then accuracy go big else accuracy cap'

[small anvil]

whats the cap on accuracy elsewhere, same 75%?

[finite tapir]

can u type that out but instead of typing it out in english can you copypaste the appropriate runescript

[small anvil]

or rather 75 ticks*

[winter hearth]

no

[finite tapir]

i tried

[vernal valve]

what if we say please

[winter hearth]

y'all already know far too much about the game's proprietary coding language and it unsettles me

[finite tapir]

i know nothing

[small anvil]

lily lives inside the machine

[finite tapir]

no that's bea5's job

[austere mulch]

In exchange for 100 blue moon max hits, I think it’s fair we get Soulflame + claws

Wws

Pretend I use that one meme

[chrome lantern]

I definitely know Bea5’s name but I can’t remember why

[livid latch]

Good afternoon Team! I'm currently working on a potential submission for the Player Island contest. Where would I go to find out any restrictions/limitations to potential design ideas? I'm super excited for the project and want to set my bounds correctly.

[finite tapir]

bea5 is known for many things

[hasty shard]

ok is hydra meant to move p4

[chrome lantern]

Yeah but something in particular in my mind that I can’t place

[hasty shard]

i dont remember

[tacit wharf]

when they actually announce it

[austere mulch]

You can drag p4 yeah

[hasty shard]

nodders

[shell smelt]

Leagues relic: remove 200 damage cap

[chrome lantern]

I feel like Hydra has a drag p4 yeah

[chrome lantern]

Leagues already does

[small anvil]

someone go smack yama in grid rn

oh wait they fixed already

[chrome lantern]

lmao

[small anvil]

sad

[finite tapir]

i wonder if the damage cap was added because jmods saw people 1shot olm in ruinous powers beta

[shell smelt]

Goes to show I haven’t done leagues in a while lmao

[sturdy brook]

mostly positive

[small anvil]

revert the patch for grid goblin!

we want big numbers

[finite tapir]

of course ... mostly ...

[meager flame]

i wouldn't be surprised if a cap of some sort always existed just because someone was trying to head off any future accidents

[chrome lantern]

Wait a sec I think I know what I was thinking of and if correct it might be one of my favorite things

[winter hearth]

it's existed since at least a little after CoX release

rubies on release definitely hit for more than 200 in some scales I think

[finite tapir]

interesting

i forgot rubies were capped somehow 😭

[winter hearth]

then rubies got capped and a global cap got added, if memory serves?

[chrome lantern]

https://youtu.be/vJfVFbKIxRk?si=0icGjqHUvrXz07CD
Yes I was remembering correctly

This might be my favorite video

[vernal valve]

I believe people speculated it was with the SRA bugfix, iirc. Rubies got specifically capped

[meager flame]

its mostly just a good idea in general although with how power creep has been going

that cap might need to go up eventually lol

[austere mulch]

Sure did lol

[chrome lantern]

@sturdy brook When are we getting Northeast Only Ironman #3

[inner plover]

I hear he's a master at merching meow

[sturdy brook]

no way this is what u knew...

[chrome lantern]

It was Dharokgility

But also watched that one

[austere mulch]

Allow us to attach blue moon spear to zcb for ultra zcb spec that adds +100% bolt effect instead of +10%

[finite tapir]

@sturdy brook whats the server the shesright emoji is from

...

[sturdy brook]

i made it for uhhh..... a community server for uhh.... the thing tanner works on

[finite tapir]

i see i see

[marsh hedge]

i still dont know how to do glyphic attenuation as intended i could probably do some unhuman emaul 1:1 if i didnt want to learn nofly though

[small anvil]

will it shoot out blue moon spears that have a chance of breaking?

[meager flame]

nah you gotta attach zcb to the heavy ballista first

then add the spear

[hasty shard]

one of my favourite methods is 1t cure me araxytes

[chrome lantern]

When are they adding the Dark Bow attachment

[hasty shard]

what do you mean rubies used to not have a cap 😭

[small anvil]

they need to give us weapons that shoot out weapons that shoot javelins

[meager flame]

probably rubies just had a % and since no npcs had enough hp to make them really think about that

it just was what it was

[finite tapir]

they were "fine" in rs2 (citation needed)

[austere mulch]

Ruby coated spears yep

[inner plover]

I mean in like 2006 they were useless, what were you gonna spec? guthan?

[hasty shard]

qbd 🥀

[small anvil]

25 rubies, chisel, blue moon spear needed to make

[hasty shard]

sorry i dont know rs2 bosses

[meager flame]

by the time qbd came out they were fully on the insane people bandwagon anyways

[small anvil]

vork woulda been like 140 max for first hit? ish

[meager flame]

dreadnips were in the game by then

[small anvil]

is ruby 20% i dont even remember

[finite tapir]

for max ehp barrows i zcb spec guthan for the free 11 guaranteed damage because its more dps than using my adamant scimitar

[hasty shard]

wrong

[finite tapir]

yeah

[sturdy brook]

p_delay necklaces

[hasty shard]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1ok58ij/today_i_got_these_extremely_specific_drops_at/ @finite tapir

goddamnit you beat me to it

[finite tapir]

that's not my thread

but it is very funny

i have this image for when i want to make fun of stupid people

yoooo?? THREE 1/100mil drops b2b2b??? that's Crazy

[meager flame]

i kinda hope robospear type shit isn't the future for osrs though ngl

[hasty shard]

why did it take me this long to remember the blue moon spear comparison i was trying to make

how is the spear an issue if its midgame when people fucking bone dagger 500s 😭

[finite tapir]

in your Dharok Agility video did you use the interface prayer overflow method to use piety at 0 prayer points

[meager flame]

like its interesting but it would be sort of weird if people just built out perfect sim tiles for avoiding everything and rather than people thinking and reacting to bosses and then your average player was just like

only running to labeled tiles and not really understanding what they're doing

just that it works

[chrome lantern]

I mean there are only two options there

Make a boss without cycles

[finite tapir]

b5 ego'd me this is so sad

[chrome lantern]

Or make a way for cycles to not be best which is extremely hard

[meager flame]

i think theres probably more options than that

[hasty shard]

yeah this is the worst thing about yama for me

like it is cool and all but holy fuck its kind of boring too

[chrome lantern]

I guess it doesn't have to be "extremely hard"

[meager flame]

you can slightly randomize things so people have to actually see and react

[sturdy brook]

you're either optimizing methods yourself, following a guide, or playing suboptimally in every encounter 😭

[meager flame]

rather than know in advance

[chrome lantern]

But it's a lot more involved

[hasty shard]

can pvm not be 'click the same tile sequence 5000 times'

[finite tapir]

i mean a lot of things are just "people click without knowing why"

[hasty shard]

can we have a pinch of reactionary mechanics

[chrome lantern]

So making it not a cycle then

[meager flame]

it could still be a cycle

[finite tapir]

like 99.9% of people who do tick manip do not know why it works they just do the clicks

[meager flame]

take yama

you know how its built to dodge the fire waves

[chrome lantern]

Yama does already "slightly randomize" the fireball patterns

[hasty shard]

trying to formulate the most wrong definition of tick manip to ragebait

[meager flame]

they could just appear with some variance on location

same timing

[sturdy brook]

ahh, the avg reddit commenter

[meager flame]

but no tile would be correct without reacting

[chrome lantern]

Why do we let these skillers get away with doing actions in half-tick increments? 1.5 ticking?

[hasty shard]

tick manip works by overriding the current skilling timer with another higher priority timer
depending on the manip you will roll twice because you caused the action to roll twice in the same tick

[sturdy brook]

what did bro just say

[finite tapir]

i read your messages in the wrong order

and i almost got got

[austere mulch]

Like Maiden crab spawns

[hasty shard]

i shouldve inserted arrive_delay randomly in there

[austere mulch]

Best boss (by accident) in game as far as depth goes

[sturdy brook]

p_arrivedelay

[hasty shard]

hot take one of the few bad things about tob is that maiden is the first boss

[finite tapir]

tick manip works because phoenix necklaces stall you for 3 ticks which means you get 4 rolls, sadly you lose 2 tick because of mod jed

[sturdy brook]

pdelay necklaces

[hasty shard]

its like kind of an immediate gate to the content cause xarp/bloat/soteg are so much simpler than freeze roles lmao

[meager flame]

ya thats also a bit of criticism i have for doom tbh

most of the thinking is really about when and should i clean the floor

the car parking etc is just tiles and people do what they're told

rather than understanding it

[chrome lantern]

If we think about it

Nylocas Matomenos are ticks

Freezing ticks prevents them from doing what they want to

Freezing in Maiden is Tick Manipulation

[hasty shard]

if you eat karambwans you can catch fish faster

[finite tapir]

@hasty shard can u explain how the 2.615t willows method works

[hasty shard]

no but im assuming its f2p because of the irrational fraction

reindeer hat 🥀

[finite tapir]

what is an irrational fraction

[hasty shard]

not what 2.615 is

[sturdy brook]

barb assault defender is a lot like yama... in that optimizing the content is a difficult game but performing the content is a game of memorizing specific sequences

[hasty shard]

*ignoring doing tob well

[chrome lantern]

Spoken like a true world recorder

[hasty shard]

like you can just bp xarpus instead of meleeing you can do this
its not faster but you can

you cant yolo maiden as much i feel

[meager flame]

oh no like when tob was new i basically had to learn to freeze to do anything

[austere mulch]

Bloat is no fun if going for rec where you only take enough necks to live specific walk durations 😭

[meager flame]

theres a lot of depth like nylos for example is a lot of memorization but you can half ass nylos and get out of the room

[austere mulch]

Be interesting what ppl would do if they could reorder tob, with the exception of verz

Bc verz would always be first lol

[meager flame]

if you mess up freezing though the raid can end in that room lol

[finite tapir]

i would put p3 verzik first

and then p3 bloat

that's a free skip

[hasty shard]

p4 bloat:

[finite tapir]

ur true actually there are 4

[hasty shard]

p5:

[chrome lantern]

P3 verzik, nylo boss and bloat same time, Sotetseg and maiden same time, p1 verzik and Xarpus same time, nylo waves p2 verzik same time

[hasty shard]

p5 royal:

[meager flame]

tbh if i were jagex i probably would've made bloat the first boss

i'd have been trying to order the bosses from easiest to hardest

[austere mulch]

Bloat sote, chest, nylo, maiden, chest, verz

Would prob be the best for resetting after thinking about it for a whopping 30 sec.assuming verz must be last

Xarp after nylo *

Or before

[finite tapir]

i would order it like it's done in this quest imo

[meager flame]

although honestly it depends on how i was looking at the raid to begin with

usually when you think boss to boss you want easiest to hardest because you wouldn't want like randomly the second boss to be a brick wall and then people immediately kill the next 3 after they figure it out

[hasty shard]

why tf would you do this over just putting rewards chest first

[meager flame]

but if you were thinking of the raid as one long singular encounter its usually best to make the early phases the hardest so it doesn't feel like you just fought for 20 mins only to run into some insane wall

and it just soaks up infinite time from people

[austere mulch]

From a speedrunning perspective, going from highest Inventory load > highest RNG > most consistent

[meager flame]

as they try to even get back and learn it

[austere mulch]

I think is ideal

[hasty shard]

imagine all the cabbages you could claim from having 0 mvp points

[austere mulch]

You’d rule the earth kingdom by winter’s end

[meager flame]

tbh i think i know what i want the next osrs raid to do

i want them to make a raid where each boss is a big enough deal to drop loot on its own

so they can justify making bosses in depth and hard enough that you might not really be expected to clear the entire raid immediately

and people might really struggle for awhile

they might need to call something like that by a different name though

raids in osrs are more like dungeons i guess for other games

[austere mulch]

I just want another hard raid

[hasty shard]

bloat + doom mechanics

[austere mulch]

Or at least another raid with depth and clear defined roles (not necessarily that are forced by Jagex, but figured out and settled on by players)

[austere mulch]

Bloom or doat

[hasty shard]

like unironically i think this would be interesting

[meager flame]

i just hope they dont do the tob full wipe thing again

i'd rather the bosses be hard and just kill you rather than like

[hasty shard]

but also dont just do bloat + doom 😭

[meager flame]

im clearing the entire raid to attempt learning the last boss

only to do it again

[austere mulch]

I think it’s fine personally, even if they add like a 0 death fee for first 25 kc or whatever

[meager flame]

they're really just artificially wasting everyone's time doing that

[austere mulch]

Death fee stops being a primary concern after the learning phase

[meager flame]

tbh i dont even really think death fee is a concern unless the person is like

for some reason broke or very very new to doing raids

the part that sucks is the time you lose just to get back and try to learn again

[austere mulch]

Well if you look at toa even, you can get rid of total wipes entirely by not using the invos

But almost everyone and their mother used the hardcore invo

Granted there’s incentives bc raid level and whatnot

[meager flame]

yeah i think thats fine because its optional you probably weren't running hc when you didn't know anything

but enabling it later for slightly increased rewards once you're confident i think is fine

also im ngl the death fee thing is a bit funny

i guess at least its a pretty good gold sink probably but lol we make so much gp now

[chrome lantern]

I’m what sense? Doom is an endurance boss

I don’t really understand how any of its mechanics or concepts would work with bloat at all

[hasty shard]

being forced to move vs restricted movement

[chrome lantern]

You’ve lost me

[hasty shard]

leviathan

its leviathan lmao

now its not interesting

[chrome lantern]

What about leviathan

[hasty shard]

enrage

you flick and there are boulders and you move around the room in a circle

[chrome lantern]

So you just want a raid boss to be leviathan?

I don’t really see the bloat part

[hasty shard]

because i realised its just leviathans mechanics and it is now not interesting

[chrome lantern]

Oh

Leviathan is a great boss though

[minor whale]

Leviathan's mechanics are solid

[hasty shard]

it is its just i wouldnt rehash it

[chrome lantern]

Yeah I get what you meant by less interested

[small anvil]

i wonder if bloat down is a root

its not infinity duration tho so not worth blue mooning

[hasty shard]

reddit comment reframed the spear stuff for me

this is literally just webweaver at levi lmao

[minor whale]

Imagine ragging bloat by unstunning him first tick

[small anvil]

thats a thing you can do in cox with mut

[sharp cave]

has anyone got an image of the rough sizes of boats for sailing?

[green pewter]

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Sailing#Ships

[sour kelp]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/269673599554551808/1433725432955539507/RuneLite_odfrhAQHjI.gif

i hope when the new renderer finally comes they keep thi

s

[spice nacelle]

callisto lair is bugged on my iron for some reason. where I click with my mouse my character goes a few tiles short of it for some reason

[tacit wharf]

is anyone else's ring of suffering (ir) using charges when its disabled?

[torn hinge]

the poll update broke the steam achievement since i can't get it any more

[idle rapids]

use a steam achievment unlocker

[desert gust]

Any news on the invisible myreque hideout trapdoor glitch? Of course I start the quest and run the full maze just to find out it's knackered 🙄

[true talon]

Never heard of this

Did you use the knife on the painting to open the trap door

It’s like a ? I think near the entrance you need to use a knife on

[worldly valve]

It might be a glitch caused by recent Z-buffer updates

[restive storm]

now that its been almost a month at this point, i didn't miss them talking any more about this right?

[minor whale]

Yeah it's a known bug

[tacit wharf]

ahh good to know, thx

[worldly kraken]

Let me off-hand golden tench

[sacred oracle]

double tench

i'm into it

I was about to suggest creating a suggestion thread, but apparently there's one already: #1344714146868101231

[real plank]

Is anyone else lagging on mobile?

[plucky canyon]

Probably z buffer related. There is a large amount of ground entities that are broken.

[bronze kernel]

I want the Merfolk Trident to be a one handed weapon instead of 2H. Let me wield my pitchfork and torch, damn it!

Will add even more value to that trident since increased demand as rioting fashionscape

[meager flame]

i do kinda wonder what went on behind the scenes

the whole z buffer thing seems so

unplanned

[plucky canyon]

If this is how bad pre-release is 3 weeks away then I hope they delay sailing

[tacit wharf]

?

[plucky canyon]

This is impacting olm and verzik leading to unavoidable damage, among other issues

[tacit wharf]

that probably another reason they are doing this 3 weeks out and not when sailing launched, to get these bugs fixed before

[plucky canyon]

https://discord.com/channels/324132423636090880/1433839807930433676 they said it’s going to take several weeks to fix

Seems very rushed

[dusk shore]

There are more Zbuffer issues than are shown there for sure. Phosani's grasping hands are invisible as well. Player feet are rendering in the floor world wide.

[tardy oasis]

yeah

they are just straight up lying or shortening the list and not updating it

demonics area is broken when you first enter have to re log before it works

entire wall is missing

like probs 2/3 of transparent objects are broken

from what ive seen

[warped oasis]

Anyone else have Z buffer issues in TOA Ba-ba room? Shockwave is half-cut for me, but haven't seen a single post regarding it

[tacit wharf]

because we'd rather have it now, then in 3 weeks when sailing releases

[tardy oasis]

ive had this

yeah literally everything transparent has a stroke, or anything with that sort of shading

[tardy oasis]

levi floor is also lifted and you can't see boulder shadow

[last onyx]

Is there a pinned thread to post Z-buffer issues?

Anyhow, Grotesque Guardians are pretty scuffed. Falling boulder shadows are beneath the floor and the purple/yellow portals are also beneath the floor with the activated animation appearing above it

[hard axle]

Found another issue:

Bosses with shadows underneath them no longer render.

Specifically Kree Minions + Kree.

[ember token]

would rather they have dropped this update now so they can fix things up until launch rather than drop it with sailing

[hard axle]

Yeah, not an issue for the most part, since the click box isn't negated.

[narrow folio]

verzik and xarpus shadows were looking like a fidget spinner

[tacit wharf]

jav colossus was like that too today, took a bit to get use to

[tardy oasis]

OH FUCK, cant imagine that

genuinely zero testing as always

[tacit wharf]

no, its understand that when u fk with renderers that you're going to get visual bugs and for us to understand that its better for them to do that now, then in 3 weeks when they're launching the first skill in osrs in 13+ years

[static cliff]

why are u still at kree u rat

[tacit wharf]

or next week when they put most of the assest into the game for sailing to make sure that their arent bugs with that before launch

to say zero test like its some simple cut apple thing is, honestly, stupid as hell

[hard axle]

📹

[edgy portal]

the exploding scarab and bombs at kephri also are fucked, specifically on the edges of the arena

ignore the name/can you change it to just "Stinky"

[ember token]

https://tenor.com/view/tedlasso-yikes-gif-27201348

[paper imp]

seems like house wall mounted amulets and charts are going inside wall (atleast i have seen them) + royal titans ice/fire lines and the patches under them in phase 2 is flickering

[meager flame]

I mean I don’t think this is really a case of “ I’d rather this happen now instead of later” tbh

There are just way too many issues its more along the lines of I wish they spent another month in qa before we even saw this change

Kinda looks like a panic change where the players are the qa team on this one

And it was nowhere near ready lol

[ember token]

presumably its necessary for sailing

[nocturne solstice]

I dont think this is what you would call a "panic change" at all

The robospear patch? Yeah thats a panic change

[dusty nebula]

is the floor glitches at toa (assuming everywhere else) getting looked into <@&385422009930219520>

[indigo tinsel]

We don't work for Jagex so we don't know.

[final frigate]

us chat mods don't handle in game bugs, i recommend submitting a bug report in game

[indigo tinsel]

[sullen parrot]

[dusty nebula]

@distant night thanks for telling me to at them xD

[slate kestrel]

So do yall think it would make sense to have a rare chance for Abyssal Orphan to drop for the Sire on kill and then the better rate from unsireds as is? I am 9.6k kills in without pet, and only have 71 unsireds. Insanely unlucky to be the literal rate for pet from unsireds dry with 25 under the rate. On top of that I'm over 500 kc dry for an unsired drop. With other bosses having the "harvest/sacrifice" mechanic, why cant the Abyssal Sire?

[chrome lantern]

I wish they never added a sacrifice mechanic in the first place, so that people wouldn’t ask for every boss to have it

[slate kestrel]

Yeah and i wish they never added the unsired mechanic and just got the pet from boss

[chrome lantern]

Statistically it doesn’t make a difference

You’re just dry whether there’s unsired or not and there is effectively just a droprate of the pet from every time you kill the boss that is a subset of the unsired drop rate

An unsired is just “rolling the drop table” and “drop tables” are only convenient ways to group things if you just consider the drop rate of each individual outcome by themselves

[slate kestrel]

Except everywhere else you get the loot roll and a pet roll on top of it no?

[chrome lantern]

It doesn’t matter

Every kill you do at sire is effectively a 1/2560 chance to get the pet

Whether you’re specifically lucky on unsired or not doesn’t matter for the effective drop rate from the boss since every single kill you do and every unsired you turn in is an independent event

[ionic tartan]

Statistically, I think unsired reduces variance so you are less likely to spoon or go dry.

[chrome lantern]

Nah

Unsired doesn’t change that, but bludgeon pieces change that for bludgeon

[ionic tartan]

Ohh right, mixed it up with the pieces.

[slate kestrel]

I always thought i was out here 2500 kills without a chance at the pet

[chrome lantern]

So it’s a bit misleading because you can analyze your drops so far and see that they were more unlikely to occur than you might think but as far as the pet itself goes, you’re “just” 3.something times dry on it

[slate kestrel]

well thanks for the info, regardless, being in th 0th percentile for unsireds and pet sucks lmfao

[ionic tartan]

The calc on the wiki is nice (https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Calculator:Dry_calc)

Going 3x is ~1/20, 4x ~1/50. Which is to say going 7500 or 10k on unsired will happen to 1/20 or 1/50 sire pet hunters.

[slate kestrel]

thats me, im the 1/50 XD

[icy relic]

Unsired is basically identical to hitting a 1/100 unique table but instead of giving you the loot on the spot you have to cash it in yourself

[meager flame]

i mean panic as in "well we have to have this for sailing and no we didn't test this well enough at all but we're not delaying sailing so we're just going to let the players do the testing for us and hope we can fix it in the next few weeks"

which is pretty crazy in its own way lol they were probably really thinking the renderer itself was going to be enough until not too long ago

tbh i think they do have a couple of compelling reasons to have delayed and i probably would have if i were them

but i dont know what kind of pressure they're under to get this out like right now

i also dont know if internally they might have already delayed and wouldn't be permitted another

[silent shuttle]

well whatdya think the betas have been for

[plucky canyon]

On the flip side, why are they only releasing it 3 weeks before sailing? There’s almost no chance they fix all of them in time.

Seeing new visual bugs every day. The official list is maybe half of the known ones

I know they won’t delay sailing at this point, but it’s probably a mistake not to if we’re already getting this many bugs

[tacit wharf]

90%-95% of them arent bugs that make the game unplayable, they are mearly cosmetic (basically looks like someone messed up on what plains an npc or area is suppose to inhabit, or atleast thats what it looks like to me)

[minor whale]

They're adding in the stuff now so they have 3 weeks to see if there's a pattern as to what is causing the issues, and fix them
Waiting until after sailing releases just means they content later down the line would have issues instead of being able to fix them beforehand

[meager flame]

several months in advance on test servers to help spot issues is somewhat different than dropped on live servers with less than a month to get it in working order and a confidence level that makes you tell hardcores to essentially not play the game doing anything dangerous

somewhat different situations lol

[humble heath]

Jagex aware of a graphic bug with characters feet clipping underground?

[tacit wharf]

yes

[plucky canyon]

Sure but it’s impacting the final boss for 2/3 of the raids

That in itself is not acceptable

[plucky canyon]

Exactly it’s clear this is rushed and probably should be delayed

[sharp cave]

Give them some slack! Hiring a dev to go around in godmode to check the hardest content has no visual issues is way too much work

[magic moth]

i noticed this recently yesterday night

[frail bough]

To assume no testing was done because there are bugs is wild.

Imaging testing every piece of content in the game on every piece of hardware.

Very feasible yep.

[plucky canyon]

They clearly didn’t even check raid bosses

The one place ground indicators is super important

[frail bough]

🤦‍♂️

[hard axle]

I'm surprised the yellows at hmt still flicker through the z-buffer tbh

wouldn't be surprised if it was outright buried

[strange cipher]

Is there a place to submit bugs related to the z-buffering? I saw #zbuffer-known-issues but i noticed a bunch of issues with shadows and layering that aren't listed

banshees (+twisted banshees) have broken shadows, the Kroy fight in SOTF has a poison pool attack which is layering, the edges of the platforms on the run to dagannoth kings are flickering, and the poison waste dungeon tar is really flickering

broken glass under broken tables in Kroy's lab in SOTF are also flickering

been reporting what i can in-game but if there's a better way to bulk report issues i'd love to know 🙂

[wind lichen]

Please add presets @sullen parrot

[nocturne solstice]

Did you think that was Jagex Ash? 👀

[tacit wharf]

didnt even mention what kinda presets

[nocturne solstice]

interesting pitch

[vivid ruin]

Still waiting on the presets pitch, as well as if guy knew if that was a rando or jmod ash?

[wind lichen]

Yes, I did. I figured this if this is the official Discord for OSRS then it was him lol

And I meant bank loadout presets

[tacit wharf]

horrible idea to add

but also already posted in #1022203837265756231

[nocturne solstice]

yeah we got like 6 threads, probs enough there

plus it was in a gamejam iirc

[meager flame]

i am pretty surprised we don't have presets already tho

like lol that's definitely one of those obvious things that we should have in the game even though some people might yell that its not oldschool or whatever

[tacit wharf]

we should not

[meager flame]

like prayer reordering or icon resizing or any number of other great qol features

that people would kinda go crazy about then when they get it realize its way better and not mention it again

[nocturne solstice]

Its not that surprising, most other MMOs ive played dont have bank presents and we have bank tag plugins

[meager flame]

yeah i wouldn't really want to compare it to other mmos though

you play inventory jenga like to an insane degree in osrs

[nocturne solstice]

Then what makes it surprising if its not the norm?

[kind surge]

no not bank presets, but other mmos have character presets

[meager flame]

where in most mmos you basically take the same thing everywhere or maybe have a couple of sets

and yeah

[nocturne solstice]

I do kinda remember that in FFXIV but it feels kinda different

[meager flame]

wow etc has gear loadouts

[kind surge]

ffxiv has class presets, gw2 has build presets

[meager flame]

speaking of since im just randomly online atm

looks like this

[kind surge]

that's because other mmos don't have the same system as osrs/rs3

[meager flame]

just click equip on any of those options and your saved gear loadout is equipped

[kind surge]

class presets are the equivalent of bank presets in here/rs3

[nocturne solstice]

Very true, not a lot of games like osrs

where you switch gear and inventory a lot

[kind surge]

main difference is that we have limited inventory

[nocturne solstice]

There are a few games with limited inventory, I think they just dont have the need for gear switching so a preset isnt very useful for them.

[kind surge]

so I wouldn't say adding presets is out of the norm for mmos

[tacit wharf]

at that point might as well allow protection prayers to be key bound as well

[nocturne solstice]

Stuff like GW2 I've played I just dump stuff in the bank

Gear stays the same

[kind surge]

this is not even equivalent

[tacit wharf]

no?

[meager flame]

yeah most of the provide a convenient swap for any system where you would customize it a lot regularly

so gear or talents or stats or whatever

just depends on the game

most games try to not get you stuck on spending a lot of time fiddling with the ui

rather than playing

[nocturne solstice]

I dont want every game to be the same and I feel like the fiddling with UI is a unique aspect of OSRS that some new devs are even trying to bring back into fashion

inventory management that is

[meager flame]

i mean i think our limited inventory is fine

[obsidian venture]

Not a fan of presets tbh

[meager flame]

the part where you stand at the bank and manually fill it up though is kind of unnecessary i'd say

[obsidian venture]

Think bank tag layouts or inventory loadouts are more than enough

[nocturne solstice]

I dont find it that troublesome or unnecessary but thats personal opinion of course.

I also sort my bank to make it easier to do

It just becomes muscle memory

[obsidian venture]

I think it’s a skill thing to gear up quicker tbh

[meager flame]

i mean yeah most of us have layouts so we're really just discussing clicking every item every time

or clicking one button to get the same effect

[nocturne solstice]

For sure. Even for just skilling, managing bank UI affects your xp/hr

In a way its kinda fun seeing how fast and efficient you can be to get the highest xp/hr number

[meager flame]

i mean we also already do things

that you guys probably wouldn't have liked if they werent already that way

[tacit wharf]

lived through it when rs3 did it, i hope to all hell it does come to osrs

[meager flame]

for example

[austere mulch]

Inventory management is legit one of the best restrictions in OSRS

[meager flame]

menu entry swapper and shift click customization reduced your banking clicks significantly

so logically you guys should be mad that we aren't clicking shark 17 times to fill out the inventory

or having to right click withdraw etc

[nocturne solstice]

I wouldnt be upset if those didnt exist. I would do things differently.

[obsidian venture]

I mean that’s a withdraw all angle

Idk who would click a shark 17 times

[meager flame]

yeah but still thats harder than a nice shift withdraw all whenever you like

[nocturne solstice]

Menu entry swapper I cant think of a place I "Need" it.
For shift click well I would just go fish somewhere I can bank.

Or not need fish to drop like tempoross

[obsidian venture]

I think Jagex should focus on keeping certain things separate and this is one of them

[nocturne solstice]

Funny enough im training fishing right now and its karambwans (banking) and tempoross

[meager flame]

menu entry swapper is probably the best plugin we've ever had lol

like

it does so much

[nocturne solstice]

Its pretty impactful for skilling yeah

But it has its up and down sides

For example its probably affected profit significantly for pkers at the chaos alter

its probably also significantly increased the amount of thieving or construction capes

[tacit wharf]

imagining thieving w/o left click to pickpocket....

[meager flame]

ya i did both before and after modern plugins

[nocturne solstice]

foot pedal sales in shambles

[kind surge]

playing without menu entry swapper is actually unbearable

[meager flame]

con qol the plugin is so good its cheating

no idea why jagex allows it

but im down

i hate con so

i was glad

like lol

it literally changes your 1 button to whatever other number you want it to be only when the construction interface is open

so you can just hold 1 to build and talk to butler etc

[austere mulch]

The thought induces ptsd from blackjacking back in the day

Kinda crazy that the devs let ahk go for as long as they did early on

[meager flame]

like the first time i got 99 con with oak dungeon doors i had to do it the real way

[tacit wharf]

well only partly, u still cant fullly automate blackjacking

[meager flame]

on my iron i just absolutely blasted mahogany tables reclined holding 1

it went from the worst to the best

[austere mulch]

Pretty sure they just were like “fine” bc they’re considering the mobile player base

Still never thought I’d see the day

[meager flame]

yeah lol because like

its cheating theres no way around it

they just allow it so its good

they wouldn't let us do this with most things

[last onyx]

any links for those i kinda wanna try one

[meager flame]

i can kinda see their logic for other reasons though too

[nocturne solstice]

I dont have any affiliate links so i dont have any to recommend

[meager flame]

the traditional con methods that are fast involve a lot of like

i guess rsi inducing activity would be the best way to describe it

[last onyx]

ah ok i also just realised you probably can't send links due to mod rules

[meager flame]

same with real blackjacking

so i guess its not too surprising they both got killed by plugins

and they let it happen

[last onyx]

like advertising would be a no no

[nocturne solstice]

It is what it is

[last onyx]

its ok still love you

[pseudo seal]

Hi people. Does anyone know if there is already a report for this bug? https://www.reddit.com/r/ironscape/comments/1ojxy5k/callistoartio_cave_bugged/

[nocturne solstice]

If you encounter bugs in game you can report them by right clicking the red report button and selecting "Report game bug".

[nimble chasm]

Any other people having a visual bug during the nightmare/phosani nightmare fight? The grasping claws barely render in and some render in late or even not at all. One of my friends also had this bug and it seems rather dangerous for any hcim out there

[ember token]

#zbuffer-known-issues

oh they havent updated the list and its not in there lol

[nimble chasm]

Thanks. Disabling GPU fixes it but that really isn't an enjoyable way to play 😄

[normal temple]

There’s a GPU (legacy) plugin available in the plugin hub, that should work too

[ember token]

I've also heard 117 fixes it

[sand lichen]

Huey on Mobile is basically undoable with those ground render problems

Or is there anything to change those settings or something

[true talon]

As a main this would be tragic 🙁 fell 1.1b since i last logged in

[ember token]

mine is down over 100m

[vivid ruin]

The beauty of it is that you still own the items. But yeah it does sort of suck

[true talon]

Yea i know but this is what it must feel like to be rich irl an see the stock market crash XD

your still so rich that it dont matter, but it feels like you lost something

Also i saw jagex say they removing sunfire splinters from doom, because it had an impact on their price? lol surely they joking right.

its the wave 1 bots that destory splinter prices or even if its gold farmers, wave 1 splinters was a really good low entry money maker. that combined with no actual sunfire splinter sinks have ruined the money at colo.

• the uniques being trash and not gotten any QOL since they released.

doom producing 500 splinters at a 1/102 rate was not crashing the price lol

[true talon]

Ya it was a 1 month ago, but why would they do that when it wasnt even the issue

splinters was sub 200 before doom released

[dire mango]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1nv3x9d/comment/nh64wq2/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

[true talon]

that 10% number sounds fake as hell lol

[dire mango]

We have no better source than that so there are no evidence-based grounds for claiming it's faked.

[true talon]

true i guess

I used to see 100s of void vene bow splinter farmers

when they were around 500 ech

i spent a good bit of time at colo

when i spawned outside there was always tons of people with minimum wave 1 stats

Splinters need a sink tbh, they arent used in anything.

Maybe sailing can add a new use

I green logged colo this year and i dont plan to go back unless splnters have a relvent use, which is a shame. because its good content and fairly good to get d arrows (these should be way more common at later waves)

They had a whole glory system designed an then didnt do anything with it.

[plucky canyon]

This is being disabled when sailing drops

It’s a bandaid but it does work

[plucky canyon]

Hc really shouldn’t pvm at all right now unless they’re using GPU/117HD

[meager flame]

i honestly don't really think this should happen

its true that we dont use enough of them for them to hold much value but

i kinda dont really like the entire concept

like

should we really be creating one off resources just so a certain piece of content can maintain value and then take that resource and make it required for other things you would actually care about

the whole loop seems slightly annoying like how many times can you do that

before all we're doing is circling back through content we're otherwise done with just to maintain the use of various items

i think the goal they would have in mind when they try to do that is probably good

but i think the practical reality of what everything would look like if they continued to use that idea would be a pretty not great video game

they already do this a lot in various forms so theres really only so much bandwidth that people have there before it just gets kind of insufferable

[sacred skiff]

Splinters shouldn’t have existed in the first place honestly. I don’t need to charge my infernal cape

Admittedly blessing quiver on an iron was fun and made me actually learn it, but I didn’t get spooned toenails or pet so I’m grumpy

[plucky canyon]

Never ending chargescape will give us the same bad vibe rs3 has with dailyscape

Recharging stuff just becomes a chore

[hard axle]

Good thing we have the bank to auto recharge items now so that chore is non-existent - just have the items.

[velvet orchid]

I held this opinion for a while but as I did more and more colos I slowly loved the idea.

[thick beacon]

charge it only if u have scy*

[chrome lantern]

Yeah it’s also especially bad because the moment that resource falls off in value the entire activity collapses. Look at ancient essence, it had value for like a short time then plummeted hyper rapidly

[thick beacon]

i think its fine to have sinks but actually make them sink zulrah scales work great imo for mains/irons

[chrome lantern]

I don’t really like scales either but they’re fairly reasonable

[thick beacon]

even if they made it constant upkeep only ppl that really would struggle are tbow users

[chrome lantern]

Like he said above though, how many zulrah scales can we pile on

Before it just sucks

[thick beacon]

thats totaly fair not everyone likes it

i think that was their orignal plan to keep colo somewhat profitable long term cuz they didint want to release uniques into colo

but then they made it corruptable so idk

[hard axle]

Chargescape is fine

If you told me to sacrifice 4M tokkul for an extra 1 str and 18 melee accuracy bonus, I’d do it in a heartbeat

[chrome lantern]

It’s okay when balanced appropriately

Like Muspah is an example of where it was done wrong because the essence might as well not exist

[hard axle]

Yeah lmaooo

[thick beacon]

muspah situation is simlar to splinters though no use after u corrupt quiver/heart idk

[hard axle]

What is it, 1 hour of Muspah for 70 hours of use?

[chrome lantern]

I would believe it

[meager flame]

this is kind of the thing though

they are reasonable

but how many reasonable requests does it take to stack up until as a whole they're unreasonable

that's what jagex is flirting with long term and why you cant just keep doing it

this is also why they started adding the corruption mechanic to more items

they have to let you kind of graduate out of needing certain resources otherwise it'll just continue to pile up until its actually a huge problem

[hard axle]

Corruption is what I call a bitch move

Now that the bank auto charges items for you, the only complaint should be having to grind out the resource or making sure you have enough.

It already wasn’t an issue to have to charge your stuff yourself, but at some point, people will run out of shit to complain about and move onto things that has been around for ages, like magic using runes.

[meager flame]

well yeah that is the problem though

using the resource on the item isn't the hard part

its having the resource to use on the item

[hard axle]

We’ve seen mfers complaining about having to use food at content

[hasty shard]

i wanna say ideally they should aim for like a 1:3 i/o for most things but it depends on how much shit you have to grind out

dust is lol

splinters are also lol because quiver doesnt consume anything and has nothing to consume shit with

and tonsils are a meme weapon for 2 scenarios

[meager flame]

like you dont want them to have you using 11 different resources just because you're wearing gear and attacking with a weapon on top of potions and food

[hard axle]

Yep, 1:3 was non-stop scythe:blood runes iirc and mfers were complaining even if it was closer to 1:6

[meager flame]

because what that actually means is a never ending cycle of just doing things you've already finished

just to keep playing

[hard axle]

And that’s fine

Welcome to iron man mode

[meager flame]

its really not that gameplay is enjoyable to nobody

and its not how the game works currently

[hard axle]

I’d rather bloods be 400 gp each than 200 imo

[meager flame]

but it is what it would be if they continue

like

they just have to be smart about how they use the idea

if they want to replace your bp with a new bp that uses a different resource thats fine its just trading 1:1

its not like you'd then need to do zulrah and the new content

but if they add a new defender that takes items from something then a helm then boots then gloves and so on

eventually it will just be too annoying and you'll be spending ever increasing amounts of time doing things you already did

rather than progressing

[inner garnet]

Lava runes de-lava'd by zbuffer issue 😄

[hard axle]

Fucking demon tears man

Why bother adding them if you have an alternative in runes + make it easy to gather via woodcutting lmao

[chrome lantern]

To screw over ironmen that die in deep delves and/or don't get enough tears to use their drops

[hard axle]

[hasty shard]

20 minute afk woodcutting at that

[chrome lantern]

I've claimed far less than half the loot I've seen

[hard axle]

I think i've only gotten like 80k demon tears total

Also because I send until dead or unique

[chrome lantern]

Yeah

I only claim if I'm at like 0 supplies left lmao

And my pb run was death on 42 with 0 supplies

And I hadn't had any restore doses in like 3 floors

[true talon]

All ive claimed in 2734 delves

went till death or unique

i claimed till 44k demon tears for the unique empowerment

but after that we went to die or unique

Base loot was just god awful

[chrome lantern]

The base loot isn't even bad though

Aether alone

But also other stuff like cballs and dart tips

Spirit and Celastrus seeds pretty big too

[true talon]

yea they just werent really anything meaningful to me

Woulda loved to see some d arrows

Esp since i wasted a ton there

Also the sun kissed bones was kinda dumb

[tacit wharf]

then use amethyst

[true talon]

i did use amethyst

[tacit wharf]

sounds like you were just using d arrows

[obsidian venture]

[icy relic]

Using scobow so amethyst arrows it is

Busting out d darts for car phase but the scobow sections of the fight don't care about 1 max hit that much

[hard axle]

basically, the amount of demon tears if you did collect all would be massively excessive

and is only offset by the fact that we didn't collect all

[chrome lantern]

I almost think I should just do like 1-10 and claim but man deep delves are the fun part

[hard axle]

even if u had 0 cooldown on ayak, it would still be 2k charges an hour, which is nothing, and is nothing because death rune/chaos rune

why endgame gear uses up such little amounts of early game runes is beyond me

[winged mantle]

I got like 40k free demon tears for going dry on the boots just by having an eye of ayak and using it (3901 delves)

[hard axle]

[winged mantle]

Doesn't count lost items from deaths

[chrome lantern]

I am glad that I got eye early to accumulate charges

[winged mantle]

Same

[icy relic]

I want to go back to doom but still stuck in drift net hell

97 now

[analog crow]

Dunno if it was mentioned already but the new renderer is also spazzing out at the dryad forestry event

[chrome lantern]

I just want to know if we’re taking on the scale of thousands is planks and bars or what scale we’re talking about

I’m maxed and cba making like 10k planks if 500 will suffice and I already have them. Same with rune bars etc

[restive siren]

There is an excel sheet floating around with estimates

Think its linked under the newest sailing vid

[chrome lantern]

Based on very arbitrary guesses

[restive siren]

Well them just telling us the numbers would kinda lame imo

Also depends on how you train ig

[chrome lantern]

I just want to know order of magnitude to get facilities

[restive siren]

i dont think the facilities will be the majority of expenses

[tacit wharf]

i think mos tof the thing in the spreadsheet are fine, i went with less addy/rune nails though, but made enough bars that if i need more nails, i can make them

[restive siren]

thats from the video, looks like facilities are more like construction things

majority of planks will prob be used for repair

[chrome lantern]

Oh so if I never mess up I’m fine ez

But yeah I have like 80k teak and mahogany logs cba making them into planks

Blast furnace is also ugh, got enough of that maxing (and made almost all my rune bars into 2h as well back in January)

(And addy into platebodies but I have like 17k more addy ore)

Oh also even with doubled cball production speed cballs are cancerously bad to make and this new forge isn’t going to change that

[meager flame]

tbh my logic with that spreadsheet and why i just went ahead and did all of it

its not like im doing anything before sailing releases anyways

im pretty sure its an incredible amount of overkill

the only part of it that i think actually makes sense is the 15k mith nails and planks to go with it part

since that's just giving you access to what basically amounts to decent but not great sailing food

so you're not gonna need to think about it later or stop and go chop new trees for just that

but

if i were guessing

i bet that salvage ends up being a great way to get nails and stuff like that

so we're probably playing not exactly efficiently rn with how we prep but we dont have anything else to do anyways

tbh the whole process circus around making boat food is a little bit to extreme to believe its just like that

theres gotta be somewhere that some of those processed materials like nails are coming from to supplement otherwise its just going to be a built in error where they swoop through with qol later

lol like the whole chain of events is absurd

mine and wc then sawmill and make bars and smith bars into nails then get paste then take it all to your house and put it together repeatedly banking

[chrome lantern]

I mean it's more that I'm planning to not play much before Sailing releases so menial work is just about the last thing I really want to do while trying to unburn a bit

[median wing]

hello what is the update for toomorow

[tacit wharf]

adding sailing resources to the game

not that we'll be able to get

#game-news

[true talon]

Damn it got worst, F's people liquidating everything to train sailing lol

1.6b gone since doom 🙁

[tacit wharf]

feel like thats what always happens though
they sell their items cuz prices drop before new update, new update causes prices to drop cuz everyone sells their items cuz new update

[true talon]

Yea

Everyone buy the dip!

[tacit wharf]

basically just one big self fulfilling prophecy

[true talon]

Hope normal and oak logs arent used much

they arent exactually that easy to get on iron lol

[tacit wharf]

oak is common kraken drop though

[true talon]

the logs?

or you mean planks

[tacit wharf]

planks

[true talon]

planks is pretty easy to get, i got lots from vetion

[tacit wharf]

oh didnt even see u type logs there

[meager flame]

It’s easy enough just go chop like 300 of each but remember to wear your kandarin diary helm if you chop normal logs

Otherwise pick them up on top of lumby castle

[true talon]

ya im hoping you dont need many

i have like 2 years of kingdom i can dum on teak/maho logs if i need them

[tacit wharf]

i just cuz normal/oak south of seers til i hit 500 of each

cut*

[winged mantle]

You can cheese the roots at the bottom of the hunter guild - grab 3 logs and drop - repeat till have enough for your log basket + invent and pickup all to bank - repeat

[chrome lantern]

I just did infected roots while playing other game

[hasty shard]

you should also use ritual mulch

because that is a thing

you also want to not use forester rations i think cause you'll lose logs

[winged mantle]

Did not know this existed... Actually pog item

[weary copper]

anyone happen to know how dragon nails are made?

[warm storm]

from dragon fingies

[weary copper]

having to decide which boat 'food' to sustain

[chrome lantern]

Probably some dumb exclusive drop like dragon sheets

[weary copper]

the sailing prep sheet made by figment put 16 for amount needed on dragon keel parts, which require 25 dragon sheet each already for 400 total dragon sheets

if dragon sheets are like 1/100 from wyrms, that's already 40000 wyrms

[hasty shard]

40k wyrms holy peak

[chrome lantern]

I mean we heard Mod Husky

He literally in the most direct way possible said they were explicitly designed to suck

And compared them directly to grinding Radiant contracts on demons on an ironman

[warm storm]

it is tradition for consumable dragon items to be turbo ass for irons

wcyd

[nocturne solstice]

de-iron

[chrome lantern]

Artificially-induced price on release too

It sucks for mains too

"Let's promote doing the worst content in the game to make money for short periods of time that won't have lasting benefit for the game"

[nocturne solstice]

I havent caught up to all the recent news, whats the "worst content in the game" you're talking about?

[warm storm]

wyrms it sounds like

[chrome lantern]

I mean in this case I'm referring to Radiant contracts

But that's the closest parallel we have to dragon plates, from Mod Husky directly

[nocturne solstice]

what? dragon plates are locked behind contracts?

[chrome lantern]

No

[nocturne solstice]

That sounds confusing

man I really do gotta read up

[chrome lantern]

Hence the word "parallel"

He said that grinding them would suck and directly compared the grind to killing tens of thousands of demons for radiant contracts

I think that's a pretty awful design objective

[nocturne solstice]

ooooh

I feel like the way you phrased it was misleading lmao

[grim river]

literally read up above

[weary copper]

I would understand 40k wyrms for the 'best in slot' ship for irons, but as a healing food surely we can craft dragon nails a different way

[nocturne solstice]

I thought you meant doing contracts, not farming for contracts

I see now

[chrome lantern]

From Mod Husky: "If you're an account that's grinding out all your Dragon sheets for yourself, it's probably going to take quite a while"

"I'm that ironman that... I don't care that I had to grind 12 thousand demons for my Radiant oathplate, I just sat there and grinded the content."

[chrome lantern]

Sheets are for construction, we don't know where nails will be from

[nocturne solstice]

nah i just misunderstood there

[chrome lantern]

But I don't have high hopes

[nocturne solstice]

mb mb

[warm storm]

what if the first craftable dragon item is nails

[nocturne solstice]

that would be funny

[weary copper]

dismantling dragon meds would be an option

[warm storm]

pipeline to melting down dragon gear for ammo

i'm in

[weary copper]

it would technically be a buyable if they allowed dragon weapons like daggers/longswords and battleaxes

[warm storm]

god that would be so sick

i've been keeping my dragon drops banked juuuuuust in case

[hasty shard]

idk man you should kinda care when people said they didnt want to do this shit before it came out 😭

mfw 18x increased droprate from original

[chrome lantern]

I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to say

[ocean wing]

Some suggestions for official client. I don't see a feedback area so no idea where to put it

[warm storm]

#1022203837265756231

[ocean wing]

Huh, had to add it to my channel list to see that channel. Didn't know that was a thing

ty

[warm storm]

yeah discord is weird

np :)

[ocean wing]

I can only post there if I use the OSRS server tag apparently

[kind surge]

he meant that to your quote from mod husky, not you yourself

contracts were so abysmal they had to buff the droprates a ton, so husky's example of radiant was piss terrible

[chrome lantern]

Yeah also not sure why Husky would say that it's a good thing he's comparing something to farming contracts, after Jagex said, "We're not doing Awakener orbs again, don't worry!" and then proceeded to introduce a system almost universally hated at least as much if not more than Awakener orbs

That they then buffed like 3 times and is still horrible

[hard axle]

To the point it's not even worth existing

[winged mantle]

There's a reason I haven't gone for it yet on my iron

[hard axle]

I was initially okay with the transfer of GP from Orbs/Contracts as a concept and in practice, but after 2 times, and each cosmetic costing me 300-500m in orbs/contracts/supplies/death fees due to inflated costs, I think I'm over it now

[winged mantle]

Just not a fun way to go about attempting a cosmetic

The fights should only cost death fees 🤷🏼‍♀️

[hard axle]

I still think Yama should have a Hard Mode above base and it should be a fusion of Pet Contract + Bloodied Blows

[winged mantle]

That would be pog

[hasty shard]

i want them to do an unbound yama event like original phosanis

where its just every contract at once

[hasty shard]

you'd bonk him with maul spec for like a guaranteed 140-150 cause of pet contract + bloodied + glyphic

dmace would probably be higher value for dps though

[wind galleon]

Question: Can I use my Granite cannonballs for Sailing, or do I need to get regular cannonballs?

[ember token]

i believe they said granite cannonballs will fall between mithril and addy cannonballs damage wise for sailing

[tacit wharf]

thought it was 1 lower, between steel and mith

[round lintel]

Alright so Javelins and atlalt cant be stored in quiver

nice one