anyway dcb is really nice if u dont have a shadow, cba tridenting twice while dodging fremmies and flicking double souths
#game-update
plush gull
but without double death charge or lightbearer+surge i cant do it every wave 😭
even with lightbearer+surge and no other specs i sometimes run out if i get a wave 4 skip
why isnt double death charge tradeable???
tacit pendant
Yeah, seems not worth over freezes imo. But pretty cool nonetheless
plush gull
and why does arclight take 30 hours to get while being deleted if you upgrade it 🤔
tacit pendant
Slight buffs to dcb spec could actually make it relevant at places that guarantee max hits
Just take the permanent upgrade and call it a day
Gotta look at it like you are corrupting quiver
plush gull
well like I said i just wanna do inferno, sell my range gear for SRA, and do colo with SRA+double death charge
i cant even afford a sra alreaday, what am i gonna do to get an extra 90m for it if i buy emberlight and dont sell it
tacit pendant
Just get a purging staff
Where are you getting 90m btw?
Synapse is 55m
52 is the low today
plush gull
cant wait to head to the lithkren glove machine 2 more times
and forget my hammer 3 times so 5 times
when are they going to fix that
tacit pendant
Fix that you need a hammer to craft an item? Thats not a fix
plush gull
just make ferocious gloves tradeable like double death charge should be
chrome lantern
More things should be untradeable
plush gull
like void? why?
jagex attracted thousands of new players with colo, idk why they seem to want to alienate them by adding a bunch of hundred hour grinds necessary to do any other content in the game
plush gull
i mean stats dont really matter, but fun game mechanics that enhance other content should not be locked away
chrome lantern
They're not, go get it
tacit pendant
New players dont care about collo.
plush gull
literally lower requirements than moons
vivid ruin
Who cares
plush gull
They're not, go get it
im too bad, ive barely made it to enrage like 3 times. yama is too hard, i just want the upgrade so I can go back to doing earlygame content like colosseums
vivid ruin
A fraction of those who can do p moons would be able to do colosseum
Inferno has a fairly low req bar as well
plush gull
yeah colo and inferno are both reasonable to do on a level 8 and not that hard if u dont care about limiting xp gains
i wish they would make more accessible earlygame content like them
chrome lantern
Guess we should just delete all quest and stat requirements for everything too
plush gull
sounds great
chrome lantern
Enjoy delusion
vivid ruin
Does this dude ever stop typing away on oscord
plush gull
cant wait for perma beta worlds if not gonna do zanaris
vivid ruin
No wonder why he struggles with every boss
jovial sentinel
Just another person who has no friends to talk to about the game, so has to come here and complain about everything
vivid ruin
Im amazed they havent been banned for it
Its also amazing that people continue to reply lol
jovial sentinel
Yeah, theres always more people to bait though
Like i play devils advocate on topics a bit to explore ideas, but theres that and just outright trying to troll people.
plush gull
its amazing that contracts are still in the game and the best way to get them is by afking demons with sara sword, hope they address contract acquisition next week
maybe id be less poor if i didnt have to spend 10m to try bloodied blows for fun on release
vivid ruin
Delve
tacit wharf
val pt 3 and project
plush gull
hopefully something besides demonbane and megas work on delve boss
jovial sentinel
Project seems like a nerf
chrome lantern
And idk, crush demonbane doesnt seem useful
That was dropped
chrome lantern
Eye
plush gull
the replacement is buggy gauntlets that force u to splash for an accuracy buff that doesnt work with blue moon spear for no reason
jovial sentinel
Guess ill have to look
plush gull
and another powered staff, powered staves should be removed imo
bad xp gains and only useful at places where ur forced to use magic
jovial sentinel
Oh, yeah, the wiki just lists the magic stuff. Thought they were alongside the mace
Guess those are kind of major
I remember them ignoring them buffing shadow, and promising to solve later
vivid ruin
rain fulcrum
And idk, crush demonbane doesnt seem useful
It was probably going to be good for delve but ppl cried
So I'm guessing they won't even make crush good at delve since they removed it
jovial sentinel
Tbh drops that solve the fight it drops from is bad
chrome lantern
I mean I think the trend of making an item and making it good at exactly the place it comes from sucks
rain fulcrum
Yes but
chrome lantern
See also nightmare
rain fulcrum
That's straight out of jagexs handbook
jovial sentinel
Yeah, idk about the devs
rain fulcrum
Everything has to be bis at the fight it comes from
jovial sentinel
Its like, they look good from the outside
But when you really pay attention
Theres some good situations for it though in armour, like oath being sick for yama is good.
chrome lantern
It's more fine if it's something like a 3% dps upgrade from oath yeah
But like Fang and Shadow at ToA are egregious
warm storm
they made a very conscious decision to make shadow bis at toa too, since there was a backlash for tbow being bis at wardens at release
jovial sentinel
Shadow is BiS everywhere though
warm storm
i mean not everywhere
jovial sentinel
Everywhere.
warm storm
it's by far the most ubiquitous mega though
warm storm
Everywhere.
i'm sure you're exaggerating intentionally so no need to argue
it's real good, no doubt
chrome lantern
I don't even use my shadow outside raids
I'm also without a heart though
And finished muspah and whisperer before I had a shadow
And had full arma before ToA came out
rain fulcrum
Everywhere.
It's not bis on akkha baba or zebak tho?
jovial sentinel
i'm sure you're exaggerating intentionally so no need to argue
Yeah, im also like.. 24 hours no sleep, i tend to get a little loopy, sorry.
jovial sentinel
It's not bis on akkha baba or zebak tho?
Those fights dont exist.
warm storm
go to bed
chrome lantern
Not with that attitude
jovial sentinel
Nah, i need to drive SO to appointment, so you guys can babysit me.
warm storm
outside of raids i use shadow at
thermy
yama
nm/pnm
zulrah
muspah
kq
barrows
DKs
colo
mole
kraken
whisperer
jovial sentinel
Richy rich here.
But yeah, its pretty unnecessary at a decent amount even if it is bis
In some
meager flame
I mean in theory you can use shadow at a lot of places the problem is like
Am I actially going to thermy
Actually*
slender vapor
We just needed the new gloves to work with shadow, and then people would shadow nex /s
warm storm
it is bis at all the places i listed except arguably yama if you're doing melee methods
oh actually i think harm beats shadow at pnm on paper. but dc + thralls surely make shadow better overall
meager flame
Ya its like scythe where it's bis in tons of places but people kinda pad the lists out a bit
Tbow honestly needs content though at this point
jovial sentinel
On thralls, its actually crazy how much of a problem they are
How can you have other spellbooks compete?
slender vapor
0.6 dps throws hands
jovial sentinel
Like, im not even sure 50% ele AND the dragonbane weakness matches it
meager flame
Tbf idk if thralls are even that much of a problem I feel like they just tuned magic pretending like they dont exist
warm storm
double dc hurt harm even more
meager flame
And that's why it's a problem
jovial sentinel
They are only a problem tied to a spellbook
gaunt kestrel
it takes an absurd amount of weakness for harm to pull ahead
meager flame
Well
gaunt kestrel
iirc someone said like 140% or smth?
i dont remember exactly
anyways its definitely a tunable thing if they really wanted harm to be juiced
slender vapor
They either need to let harm die, or make the orbs less rare and less of a 'flex' item
meager flame
Harm probably isn't intended to beat megarares
minor whale
Pet hunters rejoice
warm storm
that + double dc + new boot goofin' + no consequence death is going to make PNM grind way better
gaunt kestrel
double dc will be so cracked at that boss
and you can surge once a kill ig as well
warm storm
shame that i'm disincentivized from going there rn since i know it's going to get buffed so hard
jovial sentinel
What even is the kill speed on pnm?
warm storm
~7m in max
slender vapor
modest = non scythe
jovial sentinel
Probably
warm storm
mace is barely worse than scythe with full inq
jovial sentinel
Talkin about gear from the boss
fair solstice
whats the official word about playing any type of RS on steam deck i bought one and just opened it can i play osrs/rs3 on it like i can mobile with no problem?
jovial sentinel
ts sick
warm storm
no idea ab rs3 but you have to install a workaround to get jagex launcher working on linux (which your steam deck is running)
jovial sentinel
Yeah, im happy to help with both
It runs really well.
If you learn the trackpad, pvm is pretty conpetitive with pc
fair solstice
no idea ab rs3 but you have to install a workaround to get jagex launcher workin...
cant i just install OSRS directly off steam?
plush gull
they made a very conscious decision to make shadow bis at toa too, since there w...
why tho
what were people mad about exactly and why, and why at that timing
jovial sentinel
If you want runelite, you kind of have to use a 3rd party jagex endorsed client
plush gull
can they remove the impregnation mechanic with the pnm pass
surprised i dont get automodded from talking about it
warm storm
what were people mad about exactly and why, and why at that timing
idk how else to phrase it
fair solstice
If you want runelite, you kind of have to use a 3rd party jagex endorsed client
as long as i can play it on steam deck with very little problem i can probably find a work around
jovial sentinel
idk how else to phrase it
Just ignore em
jovial sentinel
as long as i can play it on steam deck with very little problem i can probably f...
Yeah, jagex endorsed 3rd party
I could tell you the client, but you're better off goggling it yourself, and seeing the devs say it yourself, that way you can trust it fully.
Im just a random guy
plush gull
idk how else to phrase it
was just wondering what the community was mad about with the backlash, i didnt play at that time
toa was after tob release so its not like tbow was the only megarare
💀
slender vapor
Gnome says he has something like a 70% win rate on those contracts now
plush gull
i bet if i tried harmony contracts id have an under 50% winrate and maybe even die within 3 minutes sometimes, making it cost over 100m per hour just to play the fight. i hope they add the mechanic to pizza contract next week... oh no, jagex successfully shifted the goalpost to adding new expensive contracts to fix expensive contacts 😱
they cant keep getting away with this
narrow folio
Shadow isnt even close to being bis everywhere 
jovial sentinel
You take that back
plush gull
yama is cursed. i just remembered gearscape find setup exists and apparently im supposed to chop on accurate with a warrior helm equipped
except probably not usually because def reduction exists
🤷♀️
restive siren
you can add def reduction into gearscape
warm storm
i would grab at least one synapse before yama personally
ember token
they do not want to do WGS
analog crow
Oh I see
restive siren
scroll up a bit, good read
analog crow
Same person that was complaining about oathplate contract price despite not having any yama kc at the time? 
restive siren
yes
final frigate
@winter hearth what causes the 400s to get nerfed so much harder than any other raid level for shadow chances? is there an exception in the formula (in which case how about 395s, 405s etc) and is it based on the clear time data you showed that appears to be strongly biased?
i know you have the numbers but just to state, 350s need 4% more raids for shadow, 400s need 24% more, 450s 19%, 500s 16%, same case when looking at the flat raid # diffs
i hope the current average clear time data isn't directly used for the formula as 450s are skewed due to mog runs and 500s by kit runs
i assume the <=350s are long due to budget gears and irons running them, and i'd guess 400s are on average faster due to shadowers doing casual runs there
while you're here (hopefully) it would also be nice to know the numbers for 545s as well, since that's the highest typical money run raid level
and would love to hear your thoughts on whether the very very few 540/545 farmers that produce maybe <1% of total purples getting a 50% nerf on purple chance is necessary for the economy and healthy on an individual satisfaction/reward level
minor whale
The bump in chances was scaled super poorly
From the get-go
The bump from 350 to 400 gave you a drastic jump in the chances of a purple
A reduction in the denominator of 140 between 350 and 400
Meanwhile 400 to 450 and 450 to 500+ gave significantly smaller bumps in your chances
Just in the spreadsheet above you can see that 400s time per purple was less than every raid level above or below it
final frigate
it being faster than <400s makes sense and being faster than 450s and 500s is due to mog/kit runs
there are very few people doing 450+s already i can see it being easily skewed by those one offs
nocturne solstice
I mean, it makes sense doesn't it? The changes only affect 300+ raids and the changes also increase the chance of a shadow the higher you go. 400 is just the middle ground where it suffers the most from the nerfs and benefits the least from lowered fang/lightbearer drop nerf.
final frigate
nerfs hit higher invos more
the counter benefit also just scales on raid level
so it's middle nerfs and middle buffs
nocturne solstice
You're talking specifically about shadow rates though, and even if purple rates get nerfed, shadow drop chance increases since the lightbearer and fang are less likely to drop.
Ward too has lowered drop chance
final frigate
from their bar graph it seems they giga nerfed the base purp chance at 400s
this thing
see the drop at 350 vs 400 vs 450
nocturne solstice
Yes
final frigate
you get the giga drop at 400 then it smooths out again for 450
why
once again asking jagex for more and better data
nocturne solstice
What do you mean it smooths out again
I put the height difference for 400, 450, 500 next to each other with the bottom starting from the new rates so you can see more clearly what the drop is. It still looks exponential.
final frigate
i mean the drop at 400 compared to 450s and 500s, similar to these diffs in shadow rates (350 400 450 500)
hi goblin
any plans on reducing zebak's defense and mage lvl/defense or does jagex believe the boss's stats are healthy as is especially with the unavoidable enrage healing in mind
winter hearth
and would love to hear your thoughts on whether the very very few 540/545 farmer...
~5% of all Fangs and Lightbearers from 540+, ~1.5% of all Masori pieces/Ward, ~1% of all Shadows, from roughly 0.2% of total raid completions at being at Raid Level 540+
final frigate
holy my fucking goat
winter hearth
Am focused on other work today but would add, the drop at 400 feels disproportionate because the jump in live from 350 to 400 is also disproportionate
climbing 350 -> 400 isn't an expontential enough difficulty increase to feel like an exponential loot increase
final frigate
yeah i noticed that too, so would make sense if the new formula was done just ground up instead of some % off of current
winter hearth
It's not a % off of current, that's just in the table for us to visualise
final frigate
yep
winter hearth
any plans on reducing zebak's defense and mage lvl/defense or does jagex believe...
When Arcane's back in office I'll be chatting about whether or not some bits like this might fit well. Changes to defence scaling are spooky because there's a risk of speeding the raid up and winding up in the exact same spot. But I think you could make the argument that if it's getting a good chunk harder to obtain a shadow (particularly if you don't already have one) then maybe adjusting Magic defence/levels might suit
Though it might also be alleviated somewhat by the Eye of Osto-Ayak
final frigate
only rough calcs atm but iirc eye seems pretty underwhelming/similar compared to existing specs like seercull and zcb
would it be possible to touch on making the enrage blood barrages flickable? currently can't do in lv0 1 and 4+
winter hearth
only rough calcs atm but iirc eye seems pretty underwhelming/similar compared to...
I mean for mdps if you're fussed about maging in the raid etc.
final frigate
which is a lot of the current feelsbad for zebak
aside from the awful accuracy on all 3 styles even in max gear
winter hearth
would it be possible to touch on making the enrage blood barrages flickable? cur...
Might be, also serves as a bit of a factor for maybe reconsidering when you run him depending on path level, which afaik was always sort of the 'intent' with path levelling and to encourage some on-the-fly decision-making
final frigate
or entirely new mechanics such as some interaction with jugs throughout the fight other than just the roar solve
final frigate
When Arcane's back in office I'll be chatting about whether or not some bits lik...
very much appreciated
final frigate
~5% of all Fangs and Lightbearers from 540+, ~1.5% of all Masori pieces/Ward, ~1...
just double checking this one quickly, it seems with the purple weightings in mind around 3.5% of total purples come from 540+s. as in 500-535 are 2.8% of completions with 3.5% purps, and 540+s are 0.2% completions with 3.5% purps when subdividing the 500+ category? even with some rounding this doesn't seem right, am i reading the data wrong?
even accounting for the lack of data on team scales
winter hearth
just double checking this one quickly, it seems with the purple weightings in mi...
Might have been reading from the dashboard wrong, I'll try and come back to you on it next week - I don't have time to focus on this conversation today beast, have got other work to be getting on with and neither of the devs working on the project are in office for me to back and forth with
final frigate
no problem man i know you're all insanely busy nowadays with the massive changes recently and coming
winter hearth
was indeed reading from the wrong dashboard, those %s are 'what % of 540 raids result in this drop%
final frigate
the comms are second to none
winter hearth
will see if I can pop them into my sheet for next week to poke around
final frigate
cheers and have a good weekend 
slow agate
did the updates of summer sweep already happen? or is it like pending
minor whale
Pending
velvet token
i can see it as we will mostly likely get a couple of these changes on a weekly basis during the summer
gaunt kestrel
Might have been reading from the dashboard wrong, I'll try and come back to you ...
if you're too busy to respond to this, totally understandable!
just wondering if there's any timeline in place for delve and summer sweep-up?
as i know, varlamore p3 is stated for sometime in July (no idea if i read this or where I did)
but would there a chance if we could get some of the summer sweep-up updates rolled in incrementally asap?
as it is with some changes incoming there's little reason to do content like phosani from now until however long it comes into the game
winter hearth
if you're too busy to respond to this, totally understandable!
just wondering if...
There is, but they've not been shared publicly yet so I'm not going to be able to share them here
gaunt kestrel
i understand its always going to be difficult to juggle talking about content qol and giving a release date
winter hearth
And if they've not been shared publicly, it's because they're still subject to small changes - so even saying 'this will for sure come before this' isn't something I'm confident doing
gaunt kestrel
oh 😮
even without confirming anything i think you've basically communicated that it's on the table (which is what i wanted to hear) so i will remain hopeful 
thank you goblin
velvet token
can we please let us finally go into menaphos next year 😂
cursive vector
And if they've not been shared publicly, it's because they're still subject to s...
Ty for all ur hard work sir!
Offtopic: are there plans to fix claws to work with horn as intended/polled/advertised?
If not, may I ask why/whats the concern about that?
rain fulcrum
~5% of all Fangs and Lightbearers from 540+, ~1.5% of all Masori pieces/Ward, ~1...
How does the 540s give a higher percentage of fang and lb vs shadow when the distribution between purples is the same at every raid level today? Wouldn't that just imply they are getting either exceedingly lucky on fang/lb or exceedingly unlucky on shadow?
winter hearth
was indeed reading from the wrong dashboard, those %s are 'what % of 540 raids r...
@rain fulcrum
rain fulcrum
Oh
austere mulch
Ty for all ur hard work sir!
Offtopic: are there plans to fix claws to work wit...
Added context from another conversation around this:
“…meaning in order to benefit from it [horn + claws]:
- You have to fail the first attempt and
- You have to also have failed the second attempt
In an instance where your base accuracy is 55%, your net accuracy (chance to land a successful attack in the first two rolls) for the 2nd hit is 80%. Meaning you have a 1/5 chance roughly that the horn even did anything. In cases where your base accuracy is higher, this of course decreases proportionally
And the damage delta between passing the third check and passing the second check is so minor, that this change effectively makes horn never worth using with claws at all”
mellow pond
@winter hearth I know yall got a lot going on rn but was curious if there are any plans for potential wildy updates in the future? I know manked has some ideas with wrathmaw and stuff but it doesn’t seem like it really went anywhere
velvet token
I know they talked about gamejam wildy expansion a few years ago with a red dragon boss and other wildy content, but far as I know nothing else was discussed after it
ember token
<@958735975754903594> I know yall got a lot going on rn but was curious if there...
i can take a guess and say that with how much they have going on atm, there's no plans for stuff outside the roadmap they gave at runefest
quiet plank
<@958735975754903594> I know yall got a lot going on rn but was curious if there...
Sailing pvp ig
ember token
last they discussed wildy/pvp stuff, I believe they were seeing how people felt about a wildy resource area rework
analog crow
resource area feels private servery like nmz, it def needs a complete rework
mellow pond
i can take a guess and say that with how much they have going on atm, there's no...
Yea this is my guess as well. Just seems wierd they had all of these ideas and they just vanished
Wasn’t there talks about a rev island or something like that too. A new multi spot
ember token
that was a game jam project for sailing
ember token
Yea this is my guess as well. Just seems wierd they had all of these ideas and t...
well they didnt exactly vanish, wrathmaw failed the polls
by a big margin
for the wildy resource area, they said they'd only follow up on it if there was enough interest expressed in the survey it was mentioned with
so there mightve just been not enough interest
analog crow
I'm still waiting for that survey btw
ember token
they did the survey
analog crow
I mean the results
iirc they said they would report on the results
But it's been radio silence
ember token
We'll use the results of this survey to sit down as a team and carve out a plan for PvP updates in 2025 and beyond. We’ll report back with our findings once we feel we're able to share what we've learned.
analog crow
Yeah and it's been 6 months now
frail bough
What we've learned: pvp is still not that popular
analog crow
That's what I'm wondering. If the results were so negative that they can't spin it into anything actionable
It's the only way it makes sense to me
frail bough
Seems that way at the moment at least
small anvil
i think regular players prefer the wildy being basically dead
less likely to get caught
ember token
understandably to a lot of people, that's what it feels like
frail bough
It's very easy to be bored and just go poke someone with your crossbow in effectively zero risk.
I haven't been to bounty hunter but seems that's been the best solution so far for pking updates.
Not really convinced it would be possible to revitalize wildy without making some truly broken shit that wouldn't be healthy for the game.
small anvil
there's plenty of broken stuff
hard axle
You need to be forced to put up some risk at minimum so everyone is worth hunting
small anvil
most people just dont enjoy the pvp aspect of wildy these days
they keep trying to revitalize it but like... do people want it revitalized?
hard axle
like, craws and wildy weapon did a good start, but they over pumped the game with ether
frail bough
You need to be forced to put up some risk at minimum so everyone is worth huntin...
yeah, and this will literally never happen for base wildy.
hard axle
And the minimum is too fucking low
frail bough
they keep trying to revitalize it but like... do people want it revitalized?
also this
hard axle
if everyone had to risk 500k, it would be good 
small anvil
people would rather pkers got funneled together
i dont think anyone who's doing pvm in the wildy says "wow this is so much more fun because of the risk"
meager flame
i dont think anyone who's doing pvm in the wildy says "wow this is so much more ...
i mean yeah of course they dont
lol they were always dreaming with that stuff and im sure someone thinks that way but in general
they were appealing to a bunch of people who are not interested in pvp whatsoever
small anvil
incentivising people to do things they dont enjoy (being prey for pkers) is just not a great design
pkers should want to fight pkers
meager flame
its no surprise most of them ended up not being interested in pvp
since that was their default state
small anvil
when they should instead be trying to funnel pvpers closer together
meager flame
i agree
frail bough
which i think they actually did with bounty hunter things
meager flame
they actually have a very good pvp update waiting to happen with their arena
frail bough
but yeah the question just comes back to "do people want wildy updated"
meager flame
but they basically got shut down by the community and left it half done
austere mulch
There are a few ppl that enjoy anti-pking. Much smaller population of people that enjoy being attacked and trying to escape. Though I’m sure there are a few… maybe 5 or 6 tops
meager flame
the pvp arena needs to be an integrity change and something that is only for people who pvp
analog crow
And there's a hard limit on the kind of content you can put in the wildy since you also have to factor in crashers and pkers coming in
So for the most part you're left with afk content that you can't afk because you have to be ready to react to pkers
That's a recipe for frustration
meager flame
ranked gameplay in any competitive game is usually great jagex's support of it is just like
nonexistent
austere mulch
I think another issue with PvP is that generally, pvpers as a whole got a lot better. So it’s easier and fun(for them) to attack someone who doesn’t
small anvil
then you could reward higher performance
meager flame
they actually made a lot of that for the arena
they just didnt actually include pvp only rewards that are compelling or anything cool to show off with
analog crow
I think another issue with PvP is that generally, pvpers as a whole got a lot be...
oh yeah any dream of reviving 2004 edge pking is dead in the water
meager flame
which is the main reason people usually grind ranked in any game
idk like
they kinda just totally missed the concept
small anvil
yeah i feel like they still dream about people just hopping into wildy to fight cuz they were bored
and it just isnt that anmore
austere mulch
Like I don’t think most pvpers are looking for other pvpers in the wildy. They’re just looking for other players to attack and usually try to escape when a better geared pvper or team shows up
small anvil
there's SO much more end game to take up peoples time
austere mulch
oh yeah any dream of reviving 2004 edge pking is dead in the water
The glory days
small anvil
in the old days pvp was basically most of the end game
meager flame
wilderness pkers aren't even like
frail bough
there's SO much more end game to take up peoples time
More game in general
meager flame
idk how to say this nicely but most of them aren't even actually interested in anything competitive
frail bough
and more knowledge of the game makes it easier to stay on track and not just be like "meh idk what to do im gonna go kill people"
meager flame
they want to kill players cosplaying as free loot
meager flame
because that's all that jagex made the wilderness
analog crow
And multi is just the worst, you can't do anything if a team catches you
small anvil
it's just the risk they deal with
meager flame
the people who actually pvp now are on pvp worlds and bh a lot of the time
an occasionally they'll fight each other at revs
small anvil
it incentivised people turning themselves into loot pinata npcs
floral blaze
Multi revs
small anvil
like if they wanna "revitalize" the wildy they need to just do some king of the hill sorta thing where pvpers get a reward for locking down an area
meager flame
if they actually want the wilderness to be what it was
they have to delete pvp worlds bh and lms
otherwise its over
small anvil
that too
like if they want the wildy better for pvpers they need worlds where you cant go wildy
so that people are funneled together
floral blaze
like if they wanna "revitalize" the wildy they need to just do some king of the ...
Multi revs
analog crow
and a separate problem is that pvp and pvm can't really coexist with the same gear
Every time we get a cool pvm item, it needs to get convoluted exceptions and special rules for pvp
surge potions are the latest example
meager flame
i think the main reason that people were fighting in the wild being that it was the only place to really fight each other like that back in the day goes right over their head
it was that or i guess setup a duel arena thing
small anvil
yeah most of it was edge fights
which is just pvp world GE these days
there was also clan stuff
which did kinda disappear
meager flame
well yeah
we did spend most of our time on osrs making sure they had the worst time possible
until they quit playing
thats also something they'll never fix
small anvil
as much as ROT was loathed, them locking down revs was a neat thing in history
analog crow
surge potions are the latest example
Like, this is ridiculous.
austere mulch
Dw they make convoluted rules for them in pvm too
floral blaze
The pvp scene thrived on this game on the release of multi revs and died upon its removal
austere mulch
Like how surge pots don’t tick down between rooms and don’t reset on death in 2/3 raids but resets on death in the other and ticks down as expected
ember token
you mean pvp clans thrived with multi revs
austere mulch
For literally 0 benefit and only drawbacks
meager flame
listen it makes total sense that you cant tick down in certain rooms or die to reset only in certain raids but not others
wait that makes no sense at all
my bad
lmao
austere mulch
I think as a whole, dev team has just been lacking in maintaining a quality feedback loop with player base
And instead see 4 or 5 reactions on Reddit / twitter and say “fine we’ll do this”
analog crow
Dw they make convoluted rules for them in pvm too
yeah but this is a pattern
anglers don't overheal
blowpipe is a tick slower
etc etc
austere mulch
And instead see 4 or 5 reactions on Reddit / twitter and say “fine we’ll do this...
Rather than “ok, let’s have a bigger discussion around this and look at it objectively”
rain fulcrum
Pve and pvp are inherently different
It's impossible to make content that is balanced in both without adjusting it in pvp
analog crow
yeah of course
analog crow
spell book becomes tiny again
this is the silliest thing
austere mulch
spell book becomes tiny again
Things like this are so weird lol
meager flame
its because they think its about the skill cap of clicking your icons
frail bough
back in my day, we couldn't use the spec orb because that was too op even though it was objectively worse!
floral blaze
Why are accounts that have never engaged in wilderness content or participated in pvp allowed to vote for wildy/pvp polls 
meager flame
and ignore that you can stretch the game and play at different resolutions
and they're really just fucking people playing on higher resolutions
small anvil
skill should not be expressed via fighting the UI
austere mulch
Sure, bp being 2t in PvP would be insane (it was on release). But not allowing spellbook changes to remain consistent? Wwd
meager flame
yeah its brain dead honestly but it makes sense if you like
dont actually think about it too much
like face value it seems reasonable then you think about it for another 2 seconds and realize its not
frail bough
Why are accounts that have never engaged in wilderness content or participated i...
cause most of the time its in regards to things that could affect them
austere mulch
All the complaints on Reddit about “I don’t want to have to feel like I need to wait between each room at tob for surge pot to reset”
And literally 0.01% of them even take surge pots into the raid because they have almost no benefit if not in a coordinated team
But one dev reading that in being like “good point. We’ll remove that functionality in this content” as a reaction
Is crazy to me imo
And they do the same with PvP a lot of the time
meager flame
i feel like they're just too pressed for time
i get that impression a lot where it seems like they're just in this situation where like
we have to get feedback today and i have like 24 hours to think about it then its gone forever
hard axle
Like, this is ridiculous.
Nah, trust me when I say shit like this is better to exist than not because your asscheeks will be on chopping block more often than not.
small anvil
just look at the turnaround time from sweep up blog to finalizing things
analog crow
Nah, trust me when I say shit like this is better to exist than not because your...
I'm not saying it's not needed
hard axle
Reason I say this is because 4-way shadow in pvp would dominate as hard as 8-9 way in pvm.
Travel time is a rat bastard of a mechanic for pvp
frail bough
just look at the turnaround time from sweep up blog to finalizing things
I mean to be fair, most feedback worth taking will be provided in the first day or two
or at least, worth taking without waiting an eternity
hard axle
Casually 115-0 because you hit a 50-65
meager flame
sometimes though the problem is that they take feedback in that time frame
even when its not good feedback
and then dont think about it
its people doing too many things in a short period
frail bough
I don't really know anything where they didn't seem to think thing through
other than removing the digger
austere mulch
Horn with claws
floral blaze
Surge pot needed to be nerfed in pvp though
austere mulch
Contracts
hard axle
@zenith pike Yes I finished the whiteplate
meager flame
surge pot needed to not exist im ngl
floral blaze
It probably has its niche uses
austere mulch
I would’ve voted no, as would have a lot of people I know, had it been polled as it was released
And it barely passed as is
hard axle
DC was relatively fair because you have to have monsters to kill
meager flame
they kinda drop some crazy logic on a bunch of pvp stuff too
hard axle
they kinda drop some crazy logic on a bunch of pvp stuff too
The dumbasses saying “it’s just 1 zcb ever 15 minutes” need to be shot down and never talk about game balance again
meager flame
like pretty much all of the ui related features that dont work only when in the wild basically
that shit is insane they need to stop
hard axle
Stupid fucks I stg
small anvil
thats usually pvpers gatekeeping tho
hard axle
It’s like saying thralls are only 0.675 dps
small anvil
i learned to click the tiny ice barrage icon and everyone else should too! it's skill!
hard axle
But you literally take them 99% of spots
floral blaze
If you removed all that you're taking away a lot of the skill gap
hard axle
i just learned what stretched mode does
Hear me out. We bring back Runelite functionality from 2017
small anvil
people being unable to do what they intend to do is artificial barriers
it's a bigger skill gap if you're forced to play without a keyboard, should we disable f keys?
meager flame
the official jagex client also has ui scaling
frail bough
Yeah that's the same kind of logic of not being able to reorder your shit or rebind things
🤦♂️
meager flame
which is actually way better than stretched mode
hard axle
Yeah that's the same kind of logic of not being able to reorder your shit or reb...
I hate that you can’t reorder and resize spellbook to your preference
meager flame
it just sucks at almost everything else so people dont even know
small anvil
i hate getting rune drops at bosses and suddenly there's more options to click
and the options moved
hard axle
i hate getting rune drops at bosses and suddenly there's more options to click
Yooo
Fuck that
frail bough
If they polled to remove pvp today would it pass or nah
hard axle
Pick up law runes at Yama?
small anvil
i drop my other rune drops back on the floor
meager flame
please no
hard axle
Shifts 4 fucking slots down
meager flame
i actually moved it
hard axle
i drop my other rune drops back on the floor
Don’t have enough prayer? Everything shifts
meager flame
lmao running around alching in random game modes early game and being in danger
hard axle
fuck me mate
meager flame
of accidentally teleporting
ember token
If they polled to remove pvp today would it pass or nah
i would guess no but it would be closer than people might think
ember token
like i could see at least 50% of people voting yes to remove pvp from the wildy
frail bough
yeah id say the same, it would be like "dangerously" close imo
frail bough
true
floral blaze
If they polled to remove pvp today would it pass or nah
They should pull the plug on it if its going to be left in the dogshit state that its been in for the last 5 years
frail bough
I'd agree tbh
meager flame
i kind of agree with that im ngl
i think their vision for the wild is so ass i'd rather they just stop
but idk maybe a bunch of people like it
hasty shard
still think there should be a low risk world
frail bough
but i also can't see any solution to making it "good" enough to justify it existing in the firs tplace
hard axle
The community is honestly entitled as fuck when it comes to wildy 
They want the rewards without the risk
same for high level raids
zenith pike
<@613941171302957056> Yes I finished the whiteplate
👍
small anvil
people dont enjoy being prey
zenith pike
then go to the gym
hard axle
people dont enjoy being prey
You will be hunted
small anvil
i will hide in my safe zones!
hard axle
U will be lured to high risk pvp worlds
floral blaze
Antipking is easier than ever, with anti skull prevention and 4iteming
small anvil
ah but i will haev banked everything first
floral blaze
If you're an ironman, suck it up
meager flame
yeah i prefer my safe haven areas like artio where i can loot infinity drops with no risk for the small cost of a bond to my main
lol the wild is so ass
frail bough
yeah i prefer my safe haven areas like artio where i can loot infinity drops wit...
🙃
its so true it hurts
small anvil
like im not in the camp of advocating for removing pvp from wildy or anything silly like that
but it's completely understandable that people want it
floral blaze
yeah i prefer my safe haven areas like artio where i can loot infinity drops wit...
People have the gall to complain about pkers at wildy bosses when they just let you scout like this and its a free escape every time
small anvil
i dont have a bonded alt for that
frail bough
like im not in the camp of advocating for removing pvp from wildy or anything si...
I'm on the opposite-ish side in that I can appreciate people wanting to kill other people but the way the game has it working just doesn't justify its existence IMO
small anvil
i just do suicide trips and accept death when it happens
people wanting to kill people who fight back is fine
people wanting to kill pvmers who dont fight back
frail bough
I legit dont even pick up my rev loot so i don't feel like im giving pker money
small anvil
is bad design
analog crow
i just do suicide trips and accept death when it happens
I mean yeah
If you risk more than 100k you're trolling yourself
small anvil
wildy weapons
i think the ether risk is higher than that
also people doing afk bear strats
hasty shard
and doing pvp content with like 100k risk is just sorta boring
small anvil
risk a lot more in runes
hasty shard
rags is rat content
small anvil
like the goal should be trying to make pvpers find each other
or have pvmers turn on each other
but the incentives are skewed towards rags and acceptable risk
meager flame
i mean that was their master plan
look at every wilderness update
at no point did they say lets get pker on pker action its always
floral blaze
like the goal should be trying to make pvpers find each other
Yea I sort of agree with that
meager flame
lets create free loot pve players and maybe if we're lucky they'll accidentally run into each other while killing them all
its a haven for people who want to pvp but cant actually pvp
so they can go kill people that wont fight them
analog crow
They are coping that pkers will fight each other when they run into each other at pvm spots
small anvil
for self evident reasons
the pvm person has more loot to grab than the pker in rags prob
simply from the boss or whatever activity
analog crow
and the pvm person is mid trip and low on food a lot of the time
small anvil
idk, i think jagex just has this fantasy of going back to the old days
and those days arent coming back
meager flame
lol i just hate it because
small anvil
and they've gone about trying to do it in the absolute wrong way
meager flame
most of them aren't old enough to even know about the old days now
if they were they would know there was almost nothing to do in the wild and generally everyone there was just trying to kill each other
small anvil
i've always believed the old wildy was what it was largely out of boredom more than anything else
floral blaze
lets create free loot pve players and maybe if we're lucky they'll accidentally ...
Being a loot pinata is entirely a choice though
meager flame
i mean it wasn't exactly being bored
floral blaze
Getting ragged while pvming is the annoying part
meager flame
it was that it was really the only outlet for pvp to begin with
so you didnt need to fill it up with tons of bs for no reason
analog crow
idk, i think jagex just has this fantasy of going back to the old days
tbf even in 2001 the wildy model was kinda the same as now
You could only mine runite in deep wildy for example
meager flame
if you wanted to pvp you just ran out there
frail bough
You just recorded killing someone for their ags
You find the most dope three days grace song to put at 800% volume in the background
You upload the youtube video in 240p quality
and remember that it's now the year 2025
warm storm
it was also bc there was no pvm endgame
small anvil
i think the wildy is too large and too many worlds for the current population
yeah, i mean that it was the endgame. People had not much other progression to do so they went to the wildy
zenith pike
Getting ragged while pvming is the annoying part
choice is an illusion
when you enjoy paint chips on the reg
floral blaze
A lot of people cry about being "free loot" when they dont even bother to do the bare minimum for tanking
I remember a reddit post with 3k upvotes and the guy was crying about getting killed at spindel
His invy and gear was absolute garbage
hard axle
A lot of people cry about being "free loot" when they dont even bother to do the...
Yeah, this shit gets so fucking annoying
meager flame
they're not complaining about being free loot they're complaining about the huge waste of time
at least i'd hope
hard axle
Reminds me of shitters crying about how they can’t be completing bosses easily in rune scimitar
meager flame
because the reason they're "free" loot is because we all figured out a long time ago you can simply risk just about nothing and still have a very effective setup
floral blaze
Like you take avernic, ferocious gloves over a DFS and another plus1? no rcb to bolt back, rest of invy is full off anglers, no brews, no restores.
meager flame
so the only thing that you're really losing is the time to gear up and teleport back
floral blaze
Its bare minimum. Basic shit.
Takes less than 5 minutes to learn how to gear up right off a youtube video
meager flame
so the whole thing is a silly game where people figured out they can manage risk by simply having no risk
floral blaze
If you're doing revs and go in 2-3m barrows risk (skulled) a pker needs 200m risk to get the rng to even kill you. You can tank a half so easy. Even with a dinhs and much less risk non skulled, its so easy to get away.
meager flame
like yes its somewhat easy to bring a couple mystic pieces or whatever and catch a freeze to log almost anywhere in the wild
but its also easy to just risk nothing do no thinking and profit forever
deaths included
floral blaze
But people dont want to do the bare minimum, people dont want to invest 20 minutes into learning optimal setups. They want to gear in shit, spaz out when attacked then cry about muh loot pinata
analog crow
but its also easy to just risk nothing do no thinking and profit forever
honestly, less time wasted tanking and running
You'll have to regear before going back anyways
small anvil
it's easier to justify being in minimal risk
meager flame
ya its solved
small anvil
than having moderate risk for the chance to survive
meager flame
fundamentally its reward and no risk
analog crow
Tanking is xp/gp waste
meager flame
you just risk for ego in the wild
small anvil
I'm not necessarily saying that people are "justified" in how they feel
meager flame
the actual increase from risking anything is very low compared to the increase in your profits
small anvil
just saying it IS how they feel
hasty shard
why would you risk 2m when literally all of the pvm in the game is cheaper
small anvil
and being prey isnt fun
meager flame
it would be different if going from a 200k risk to a 15m risk was like
a 5000% increase in output
small anvil
also thats why bots tend to fill that role of farming the wildy
meager flame
but its not even 40%
analog crow
Yeah it's not hard to understand why people feel the way they do about the wildy
It's just... boring I guess
floral blaze
So if you're risking piss and shit everytime you die why would you cry about being loot pinata
When you dont risk shit
Its obvious they die with loot and cry
small anvil
again, I'M NOT CRYING
floral blaze
I didn't @ you mate
small anvil
i'm saying WHY people dont like it
meager flame
because they recognize the game they're playing is stupid i'd assume
its not even risk v reward
analog crow
they realize they're wasting their finite time on this Earth
meager flame
its reward v minor annoyance
austere mulch
The dumbasses saying “it’s just 1 zcb ever 15 minutes” need to be shot down and ...
The most egregious part of this is that like… for the vast majority of the game, at least regarding relevant content, dps isn’t the value that’s relevant for things like this, because dps doesnt reflect the value of burst damage
meager flame
dying in the wild doesn't matter to begin with its just annoying to some people to regear
floral blaze
Its literally no risk all reward if you risk nothing and people still cry about dying then? Lol
austere mulch
When gnomonkey put that video, he made like 2-3 reasonable points, but that part in particular was like… come on man
analog crow
Its literally no risk all reward if you risk nothing and people still cry about ...
they risk their time
it's not hard to understand
small anvil
refuse to even do suicide runs in the wildy
literally cant convince them to walk out there with 0 items
hasty shard
people who refuse to suicide run are creatures
hard axle
The most egregious part of this is that like… for the vast majority of the game,...
Yep, it’s like saying sage’s axe wasn’t busted because it only does 20% of max health
hasty shard
i probably died less than 40 times to 99 prayer
floral blaze
You're not forced to engage with the content though. Yes it sucks being ragged but.. just don't do it if you cant put it up with it
small anvil
i died to pkers like 6 times? or something 95-99 prayer
meager flame
yeah i think i got pked less than 10 times getting 99 prayer
small anvil
and iwas straight afking it on mobile
hard axle
yeah i think i got pked less than 10 times getting 99 prayer
My alt saved 100m gp to 99 prayer
analog crow
You're not forced to engage with the content though. Yes it sucks being ragged b...
be careful what you wish for innit
hasty shard
yeah this is the outcome of people not engaging with the content
is asking for engaging content wild or something
small anvil
yeah most people dont bother cuz it's not fun
hasty shard
the only real reason i'd want to interact with revs is because of the clog slots and even then its a stupid long grind
small anvil
bots bother because as you said, the risk/reward is worth it
and they dont have emotions to worry about
hasty shard
i just have better avenues for gp that are far less risky
meager flame
yeah revs grind is one of the last things i haven't done on my iron
its not even a big deal i just never actually feel like doing it
so it just keeps getting pushed back
warm storm
revs are fairly safe now and the imbue refund helped a lot
small anvil
revs last is funny cuz you did all of wildy without wildy weap
hasty shard
hell even in the scope of wildy content now i could just like send rogues chest or agility for similar gp i'd assume
meager flame
ya idr what i even used for vw bowfa and like
hasty shard
and that is literal rags content in comparison where there's zero reason to skull up
meager flame
SRA? maybe
small anvil
i did rogues chests with 3 prayer items and suicide banking
meager flame
it was easy though there was really no reason to get a rev weapon
warm storm
i would only want the wildy weapons for their niche uses. webweaver is nice at levi obv but also good for 10tiles 3t attack speed
meager flame
i mostly just want the bow for minor pvm convenience and a cope mage spec weapon
warm storm
sceptre spec sometimes good, mace spec good at... specifically huey tail
analog crow
i did rogues chests with 3 prayer items and suicide banking
This is what I might do to get my thieving up also
floral blaze
they risk their time
What are they risking? 60 seconds of regearing and running back to their spot?
small anvil
like we KNOW there's ways to not really lose anything much in the wildy
austere mulch
Mace good for low combat inferno 🤣
small anvil
it doesnt change that it doesn't feel great
floral blaze
2 minutes an hour spent regearing, big deal
analog crow
2 minutes an hour spent regearing, big deal
You not agreeing doesn't make their experience less valid
floral blaze
If you dont enjoy the content, its not for you
analog crow
I think you should try to think about things from other perspectives sometimes 
small anvil
we're just talking about why jagex's design of the wilderness has failed
obviously there are ways to do well within the wilderness
but it doesn't change that jagex has failed to make the wilderness enjoyable content for a vast majority of people
hasty shard
shouldnt make things for like a handful of people when they can be for more without sacrifice
cough cough contracts cough
analog crow
At least they are doing well lately to give players viable alternatives
Libation bowl for instance makes chaos altar dead content for me.
small anvil
chaos altar is so free, wildy is SO dead
analog crow
I believe it, I've never seen anyone there when I do hard/master clues
zenith pike
but it doesn't change that jagex has failed to make the wilderness enjoyable con...
unless they offer some kind of pity mechanics, that's probably because you can never make losing feel good.
red scroll
chaos altar is so free, wildy is SO dead
i did chaos altar for hours and saw ONE person
small anvil
yeah, basically making people be the losers is the problem
zenith pike
well losers are self made
small anvil
i mean the design is that pvpers hunt the pvmers
hasty shard
unless they offer some kind of pity mechanics, that's probably because you can n...
literally one low risk world
disable crabs/chaos altar/agility/chests there and let people go ham with void n shit competing
analog crow
unless they offer some kind of pity mechanics, that's probably because you can n...
for sure
We saw the same with pnm. Not being able to get back into the action quickly made people just not do it, or it was a significant factor
warm storm
you have to die literally half the time you go to chaos altar for it to be a net loss
zenith pike
The design is more do what you want and what you can
small anvil
you can get like comparable price efficiency as chaos altar with libation bowl in varlamore i believe
zenith pike
it's just not a lot of people can do alot
hasty shard
tbh i think the only change pnm needed there was dying putting you outside the instance
small anvil
for like ~2/3? the xp rate
hasty shard
feels very much like reddit crying if 1/100 is too much of a grind
small anvil
it's a punishing run to learn
meager flame
i just think that jagex should try an experiment
warm storm
tablet change good
analog crow
you can get like comparable price efficiency as chaos altar with libation bowl i...
once you're set up libation bowl is like 800k+/hr
small anvil
and like people get discouraged easily
hasty shard
like fuck me dread one piece of content require you to run there
analog crow
but the setup can take some time
meager flame
where they make one item have an identical rate between the wilderness and somewhere outside of it
small anvil
i mean the overall xp rate including blessing/chiseling the bones
meager flame
and just watch to see how many people actually enjoy the wilderness
once they feel bad for ever asking people to go to the wild in the first place
analog crow
i mean the overall xp rate including blessing/chiseling the bones
cut it in half maybe idk
meager flame
they can reconsider
warm storm
well it will be optimal to go for it in not-wild so everyone will do that...
meager flame
they can give it a minor advantage to account for a death
they'll quickly learn that almost nobody is in the wild because they enjoy it though
red scroll
in before they make pvp opt in like in rs3
analog crow
I don't think that's happening anytime soon
meager flame
i dont even see why they would
they should just make pvp content for people who want to pvp
small anvil
like i dont want things to be easier just to be easier, but i do think jagex need to acknowledge their design of the wilderness has not achieved the goals they have
and putting more lucrative opportunities out there is not the solution
meager flame
all of the friction from the very start was just people that dont like being in the wild having crazy resentment for anything involving it
because jagex designed them into the wilderness for one reason or another
hasty shard
like i dont want things to be easier just to be easier, but i do think jagex nee...
if they're polling shit like 30x alching I really don't think they are close to this realisation any time soon
meager flame
and they hated it
analog crow
and putting more lucrative opportunities out there is not the solution
and as they keep putting comparable or superior alternatives outside the wilderness it turns from high risk/high reward to low risk/mid reward
red scroll
people start to be okay with wildy then they add some stupid shit like zombie pirates making 50000 bil an hour and people hate it again
warm storm
god i wish there was a bulk alch spell
meager flame
thats how it was at first kind of
used to just automatically alch the next item if they were a stack
red scroll
god i wish there was a bulk alch spell
leagues moment
meager flame
im really surprised they never went back on that one
imagine you just had to make sure you didnt log out to alch your stack of 6000 bolts
graceful yew
my only problem with wildy is clue scroll steps being there. Everything else is risk vs reward, but for pvm players who dont want to engage in pvp content it just means they have to drop their clues and start again.
analog crow
im really surprised they never went back on that one
honestly, just make it a 7 tick cycle like with enchants
small anvil
just go out in rags and use the juggle timer to save the clue
warm storm
i'll just keep shop hopping to sell until they do i guess. scar essence was created to stop the rc shopping problem
small anvil
pker gets on you, drop clue and come back later
hasty shard
im glad i literally never have to do zombie pirates at least
red scroll
my only problem with wildy is clue scroll steps being there. Everything else is ...
if i could pay 50 mil to block wildy clue steps i would
graceful yew
just go out in rags and use the juggle timer to save the clue
but my point is that pvm players shouldnt have to use a workaround to avoid a pvp mechanic
hasty shard
praise be that f2p zombie key bug
analog crow
my only problem with wildy is clue scroll steps being there. Everything else is ...
you have 1 hour to go get your clue back if you drop it
red scroll
the most annoying part of wildy steps
hasty shard
clue boxes exist for no reason now :3c
small anvil
yeah thats why i enjoy having juggling
analog crow
yeah it's bad
small anvil
i group up my wildy steps on multiple clues
graceful yew
if they had a separate tier of wildy clue scrolls it would make more sense
warm storm
bank tag tabs helps alleviate the regearing problem
or just stay in rags the whole time you do hards
small anvil
i like having some gear for masters
red scroll
i run around geared for masters yeh
small anvil
killing brassicans faster or wizard trio
analog crow
wizard trio in wildy is such a pain though
warm storm
through karambwan all things are possible amen
small anvil
oh yeah in wildy esp the chaos altar spot
small anvil
i end up having to use food
analog crow
escape caves wizards you also get to have poison spiders rag you while fighting them
small anvil
mostly cuz i bank my claws
zenith pike
my only problem with wildy is clue scroll steps being there. Everything else is ...
yeah u right, fuck clues i wish they became dead and buried
graceful yew
i dont mind clues, i just think the wildy clues should be separated from the pvm clues
would also make more sense for stuff like cape of skulls to be on that loot list
zenith pike
i think the system is high key garbage for doing a whole lot of nothing
graceful yew
luckily its optional 🙂
zenith pike
Given that they tied a cheeky little pair of boots to (albeit it dog shit) towards actual progression
tacit wharf
ngl, just seems you salty u dry on rangers
zenith pike
ngl, just seems you salty u dry on rangers
I think I have a toddlers age in mediums completed
obsidian venture
Useless for the most part but will be consumed(?) for the new boots
Would disagree on the wildy being dead tbh. Just the simple addition of the agility and rogues chest helped. The vw is there for irons, and wildy bosses are great gp and amazing for clues
Wildy slayer is generally better than regular slayer for the xp/points
Revs rates were improved a lot
Chaos altar has been the same but still competitive in xp
If we were discussing this 3 years ago I’d agree with it being dead
But even when I step out to do clues, I see people all the time
red scroll
for anyone interested dragon bones are at a 3 year low if you need to level prayer
gl 😛
zenith pike
ngl, just seems you salty u dry on rangers
regardless, one would think a see arrow click boxes activities wouldn't be considered sacred, but here we are
sacred oracle
i don't mind wildy steps
i can't remember the last time i saw a pker, and i do thousands of clues
the only place you're in danger is the chaos altar step in the middle of the room
and you just do that one naked and drop clue if attacked
the real annoyance is finding that balance between ungearing for wildy steps and risking
i used to just risk for master clues, but now clogcord setup recommends doing naked, and i'm not sure it's faster, even though the gear that allows you to wear for other steps lets you destroy everything with a double claw spec
small anvil
i think wildy steps is more healthy than the constnat pumping of rewards hoping people get lured into wildy for pkers to eat
sacred oracle
tacit wharf
the last time i saw a pker was rogues and he went after the bots
sacred oracle
i use the previous version, which is torso instead of oath
tacit wharf
just dhide/diary stuff like most do
deposit like 5 items to do a wildy step that are in yr inventory
and risk like 40k
small anvil
thats what i do, deposit a few items
and rune pouch
still annoying
but like i think wildy steps are healthy enough
tacit wharf
pouch music achivement ecto (though i could just keep) bp (use on trio) and i forgot the last
sacred oracle
nah that's way too slow if you do a lot of clues
or at least too slow for me
i need clues to be very fast
i'm almost ready to swap back to the setup where i was risking 5m or so for wildy steps, but at least i did not have to do anything but bank two items
obsidian venture
I’m just quick to de-gear and re-gear
If I need to do certain wildy steps I use a vw or bp
sacred oracle
Maybe I just gear/ungear too slow
tacit wharf
well its great then that they decided to leave that 1hr timer for ya so u can do all yr wildy clue steps at the same time and not have to worry about yr clues despawning
sacred oracle
Or maybe I'm just underestimating the time-save that killing everything a would double claw spec is giving me
sacred oracle
well its great then that they decided to leave that 1hr timer for ya so u can do...
Yeah, that's one unintended side effect of the 1h timer I wouldn't mind nerfing
Don't get me wrong, I love that I don't have to use clue boxes
obsidian venture
Maybe I just gear/ungear too slow
sacred oracle
I just don't think rendering clue boxes completely useless is great
obsidian venture
I have a bank tab so it’s quick
sacred oracle
Maybe I just need to click more faster
I remember I used to watch people do videos of nex quickbanking for duos, and I was like I could never
tacit wharf
ill just say, i was a big fan of at least nerfing the 1hr timer into the ground (back to original - 5mins)
obsidian venture
I remember I used to watch people do videos of nex quickbanking for duos, and I ...
Stand in front of the bank and switch
I have shift click on to equip
tacit wharf
shift click equip is so nice at bank
obsidian venture
Then when you do bossing/raiding, that’s good practice as well to not be as lazy, and learn while doing content
So a 6-8 way could be little to no effort with practice
sacred oracle
maybe my clicks are just bad, i just feel like whenever i click as fast as people do in those videos, half my gear is still not on
maybe i have too much latency
or my clicks are, again, just bad
tacit wharf
anti-drag?
sacred oracle
i don't know much about anti-drag, but this is my current value for it
apparently default is 30, so i just reset it for that
tacit wharf
then maybe it is just lag or needing more practice
sacred oracle
could be
i'm sure once i get to greenlogging lms, i'll plenty of switching practice!
sacred oracle
holy shit i just realize
this new loadout gives a use for salad blade
i knew i made it for a reason!!
fair comet
30 was too much for my anti-drag. I set it to 8 and haven’t had any undesirable outcomes such as taking too long to move an item over. Now I just click when doing switches and don’t need to worry about dragging an item rather than equipping
hard axle
okay 30 is definitely too much
12 was the best anti-drag setting
earnest marsh
what happend to wrathmaw?
pretty waste to shelf it
when the mechanic was so bad
also any news on resorces centre in wildy? where is scorpio uniqe?
also what are you guys plannign to do aginast wildycctw?
sacred oracle
us? nothing
jmods are only active here on update days typically, so it is unlikely (but not impossible) that one will respond
it's just us chickens
earnest marsh
ye
earnest marsh
it's just us chickens
idk should i expect anything from wildy, they make like changes every 5 years maybe
sacred oracle
scorpia is coming eventually (don't know when)
earnest marsh
been like 2 years soon?
sacred oracle
wrathmaw has been dead for months, and it's doubtful it will return in any form
earnest marsh
since they promised a scorpio uniqe
sacred oracle
we might get an overworld group boss, but it definitely won't be in wilderness
the community pushed back too hard on that
earnest marsh
ye idk why they broguht world boss as similar mechanic to brech
no one would liek a boss that has 10 clans to pker, and even if you dont die, its liek 2-3 m an hour
rain fulcrum
They just need to poll wrathmaw as a package deal
Should we add raids 4 and wrathmaw
sacred oracle
earnest marsh
Should we add raids 4 and wrathmaw
eeh, i think wrathmaw would pass if they dint try ot make it the most aids mechanic as possibol
but not sure
like you couldnt made it worse
i guess you could make it 1 spawn per day on one owrld
or bette ryet, make it spawn once a year
xD
rain fulcrum
I just found the people complaining jagex is forcing them into the wildy funny
The boss had tons of problems
jovial sentinel
eeh, i think wrathmaw would pass if they dint try ot make it the most aids mecha...
it wouldnt ever pass now
rain fulcrum
But people crying it was going to force them into the wildy was so funny
sacred oracle
i understood the complaints partially, because i, too, would have had to do the boss for clog, and i hate wildy
jovial sentinel
the people raging on that stream werent willing to even listen
sacred oracle
it wasn't so much being forced into wildy though
rain fulcrum
Wouldn't you only need to kill it like once for clog
sacred oracle
i hated being forced into the wildy in a timegated fashion at the same time as everyone else, so you couldn't even try to take advantage of off-hours or something
earnest marsh
ye
sacred oracle
and of course i could have just not done the content
jovial sentinel
in the stream they said they'd remove timegating, were looking into one outside as well, and would only take 1 kill max for clog
rain fulcrum
But like people were acting like just because they were a pvmer they HAD to go into the wildy for the boss
jovial sentinel
and all items were designed to not be useful in pvm
sacred oracle
assuming it had a pet, you'd have to do a lot more than 1 kc
earnest marsh
ye they, gotta make some content thats not predator
rain fulcrum
ye they, gotta make some content thats not predator
I mean the point was for pvpers to fight for control over the boss more so than predator
jovial sentinel
it wasnt really a boss.
earnest marsh
im sorry, but makeing a excuse for not adding wildy stuff for clog
rain fulcrum
So it was actually not predator vs prey
jovial sentinel
it was a pvp activity that happened to be a boss
earnest marsh
i guess its similar to sailing
sacred oracle
predator v predator
earnest marsh
40% of 2100+ players voted no to sailing
rain fulcrum
That's a very good analogy actually
earnest marsh
it passed with like 70,9% right
jovial sentinel
yeah, exactly
earnest marsh
2100+ total elvel players
sacred oracle
i would not call that close to 40%
jovial sentinel
ohh, 2100
sacred oracle
do we have the stats breakdown of what level players voted which way?
jovial sentinel
all that says to me is that people who likely might not play the game, dont want more content
sacred oracle
it may have been in a blog post somewhere i simply don't remember
jovial sentinel
because they dont want to play
rain fulcrum
2100+ likely don't play the game?
jovial sentinel
not all of them.
rain fulcrum
I'd say they're more likely to than 1200 totals
sacred oracle
i can easily imagine a ton of burnt players who are just jaded and full of toxic nostalgia voting against sailing
earnest marsh
ye, i mean boat gameplay looks insanely bad
sacred oracle
boat gameplay looks to me like we don't know what content it will be in yet or how it will feel in that content, except for the trials which we got to do a little of in demo, right?
jovial sentinel
i was honestly a doubter, but i played beta
quiet plank
boat gameplay was decent
jovial sentinel
boat gameplay is pretty good
rain fulcrum
I am still a sailing hater
jovial sentinel
I am still a sailing hater
why?
sacred oracle
i don't know why people have such high expectations for sailing or they don't want it
we have fletching, smithing, agility
jovial sentinel
out of curiosity
sacred oracle
it's for sure better than those
quiet plank
when we level up and get faster boats it'll be really fun to cruise around
sacred oracle
i don't need a new skill to be perfect, i just want content
earnest marsh
and like why do we need the boat if they jsut going to make teleports to the isalnd anways
sacred oracle
i'd love it if they added a new skill every couple years
jovial sentinel
and like why do we need the boat if they jsut going to make teleports to the isa...
there will likely be plenty between the islands. most sailing gameplay wont be getting to places, it will be either the journey between, or things on the water
quiet plank
New skills are inherently not very integrated into the world
that's why sailing is having a huge area expansion
jovial sentinel
New skills are inherently not very integrated into the world
maybe, but imo thats not a good reason to not do it.
quiet plank
also it should be integrated in a few quests at least
dragon slayer, bone voyage etc
jovial sentinel
by that argument, we may as well not add anything new that changes anything old.
rain fulcrum
No it's the fact that they won't change anything old
sacred oracle
if we approached new quests the same way some people are approaching new skills, we'd vote down every single new quest by picking apart every single piece of it
quiet plank
No it's the fact that they won't change anything old
they are though
theyve said some quests will get updates
jovial sentinel
why would you want old things changed, though?
unless its broke
like, trawler i think is a good example here?
rain fulcrum
Because otherwise you have 300 quests that require level 1 sailing
jovial sentinel
they arnt changing trawler. but we're getting something similar iirc
sacred oracle
i have no nostalgia
earnest marsh
im a guy that mostly wants +90 skilling content or uniqes to help wih progression
jovial sentinel
yeah, trawler sucks. but that doesnt mean it should change.
earnest marsh
we dont need the 50th mining method
jovial sentinel
but iirc we are getting a vaguely similar thing
rain fulcrum
They didn't do a good job with Hunter in quests for example
earnest marsh
midlevel
rain fulcrum
Look at the set of quests that need hunter
quiet plank
They didn't do a good job with Hunter in quests for example
chompies should give hunter xp
hunter xp i mean
jovial sentinel
they are.