game-update

[winged mantle]

Iron would be some of the reasons a lot of the positive changes have been made in recent years/ why there's been a direction of specific content. It's been both healthy and well recieved

[tacit pendant]

Phosanis kill time going down 20% is a geat change, its not overhanded like tripling rates overnight

[meager flame]

basically free loot cannot die with a scout probably not solid game design

the ones in multi though actually have risk

so i can respect that

[tacit pendant]

Boss has mantained great gp per hour, more so than most pieces of content, with horrible normal loot

[obsidian venture]

Some folks using scouts are IE but ye

[rare grotto]

it's not healthy but it is well received. Ironman catered updates generally make stuff significantly easier to get and thus devalues the drop for mains

[chrome nova]

Needing a scout is very stupid

[winged mantle]

You could argue any content irons engage with is catered

[sand gazelle]

Huey change is good too. Making wand stronger will make it more valuable. Making it more common drop will make it less valuable. Balances out nicely

[chrome nova]

Also anything where you can be PK'd at is honestly kinda dumb

[meager flame]

the wand change is a bit frustrating

[winged mantle]

Perhaps original content was not good in the first place/ healthy for the players?

[meager flame]

everyone knew it sucked its weird that it released how it did

[rare grotto]

risk/reward 🤯

[austere mulch]

Goes down by a bit over 20% doesn’t it, bc the last phase is so fast

[obsidian venture]

Thankfully its only the wildy

[chrome nova]

Part of why I don't like revs. But mostly because it's a money printer made by mod Jed so his clan could have somewhere to get free loot

[tacit pendant]

Huey should have been atleast muspah gp, not 2m an hour

[austere mulch]

Compared to the preliminary phases

[minor whale]

Please God I'm begging for a link

[chrome nova]

At least the VW pieces are tradable

[tacit pendant]

Its a group boss. It being dead is extra bad

[tender harness]

VW pieces shouldnt be tradable or VW shouldnt exist

take your pick

[rare grotto]

thankfully that hasn't been the case in general

[tacit pendant]

Vw pieces have to be tradeable stop

[tender harness]

no they do not

[meager flame]

i kinda suspect they're going to replace vw one day with a pvm spec weapon drop

[obsidian venture]

@minor whale

[chrome nova]

Making pieces of a weapon untradable is absolute garbage game design loooool

[meager flame]

and just disable that weapon in pvp

so that the vw is actually just a pvp item finally

[chrome nova]

This is why SRA is such an aids weapon to get

[meager flame]

like they wanted

[obsidian venture]

Also why it holds value

[winged mantle]

The gear progression had so many gaps and it was awful to grind to get there prior to a couple years ago

[tender harness]

coming from someone who has done no content outside of leagues
christ stop talking

[chrome nova]

No it holds value because it's also good

[obsidian venture]

Gear prog is even more fucked nowadays tbh

[austere mulch]

It’s also why SRA is 430m. The components being untradeable doesn’t impact irons at all either

[obsidian venture]

It actually isn’t that good lmao

[tacit pendant]

Vw is in line with other spec weapon prices

[chrome nova]

So? That's what gives me fun, stop being toxic lol

[obsidian venture]

Don’t compare leagues to main game

[tacit pendant]

Sra is good but not 500m good like it has been

[winged mantle]

How so

[chrome nova]

It's 2nd to bis at most places

[tender harness]

that means you dont have any valid opinions on the main game
they are not the same

[chrome nova]

I didn't even take melee on leagues

[rare grotto]

yes but this is exclusively an ironman issue. Mains can buy stuff with gp. And whenever they release an item that bridges/closes a gap in gear progression they devalue the items that precede it (or the items they replace it with)

[tacit pendant]

Sra could stand to be 200-300m

[tender harness]

so stop spouting literal shit for fuck sake

[meager flame]

i kinda wish SRA was just different mechanically

[austere mulch]

1. Objectively not true
2. On paper dps does not equate to practical dps

[winged mantle]

Not every piece of gear needs to be useful

[meager flame]

i think its a really good swing at a weapon with real downsides and stuff but

[chrome nova]

OK where is it not 2nd to bis? That isn't a demon? And you use melee at?

[meager flame]

nothing else asks you to deal with any of that shit

i end up being a bit annoyed by it eventually

[obsidian venture]

Newer content outdoing old ones. Like PM to bandos and now oath to bandos/PM. Virtus. Masori from a midgame raid

[true talon]

he didnt? lol

[chrome nova]

This is where it would be with tradable components

[rare grotto]

yes but u end up with weird situation where moons gear is better than bandos

[obsidian venture]

He did because he knows we are right lmao

[chrome nova]

Stop gatekeeping content

[austere mulch]

TOB is the most relevant case that comes to mind where it’s practical dps is far less than its “on paper dps”

[rare grotto]

when the former is like 5x less of a grind

[winged mantle]

I would argue that mains and irons benifit from the new accessibility

[minor whale]

SRA is really not that good
Tradeable components would push it to Saeldor cost because it's really ass to use

[tacit pendant]

Sra has the benefit of being able to "pre-fire" blood fury procs, yay

[rare grotto]

i don't see how shitting on gear progression is a good thing for the game

[obsidian venture]

Dumb comment. Hes not gatekeeping anything

[chrome nova]

The tob bosses have so much health that for the most part it is?

[tender harness]

nobody is gate keeping anything
people are telling you that when you havent done anything dont pipe up about it

[minor whale]

Even people I know who have the money for sra don't buy one

[winged mantle]

The game feels better being able to have more options

[sand gazelle]

I have made 2 soulreaper axes and those grinds got me my first and second mega rares

[meager flame]

SRA would be worth like 10 gp if the next item wasn't the scythe

[rare grotto]

might as well spawn in the game with t80 gear etc

[meager flame]

its just taking that next step is such a huge investment that allows it to live

[true talon]

He just neber answered as he was busy, he defaulted to saying that i was pushed back on by some of you with faulty calcs lol. which i later showed to be false.

[obsidian venture]

Options are good. Progression isn’t

[chrome nova]

Forcing people to do other bosses to get an item

[meager flame]

the downsides are real downsides

[tacit pendant]

Bonds have entered the chat

[obsidian venture]

Engaging with the game

[rare grotto]

that's just not what ended up happening, u don't have more options you have the same (or even arguably less). They're just replaced with gear that is too accessible

[tacit pendant]

What change is actually being debated here?

[tender harness]

heres the beauty of it. you aren't being forced. its also called engaging with the game to see if you like stuff or not

[meager flame]

like if jagex ever puts an item between scythe and SRA

[rare grotto]

like if i make an ironman i'm legit running to perilous moons

and facerolling the game

[meager flame]

SRA is dead af

[obsidian venture]

You aren’t forced to grind for a shit weapon in the first place. You can get the rings and leave

[chrome nova]

OK that's true

[true talon]

Dont think this is really possible lol

SRA is barely worst than a scythe

[meager flame]

brother they made saeldor after tent whip

[winged mantle]

Idk, it looks like you have so much more now then 6 years ago where it was bandos, bp and sang

[meager flame]

anything is possible

[sand gazelle]

Yeah they are very close in power level

[obsidian venture]

You didn’t show anything mate

[tender harness]

and yet salad blade is barely better if at all compared to tent whip

[meager flame]

yeah thats the point

[true talon]

really now? i didnt show magic being 25% weaker??

[sand gazelle]

On 2x2 or smaller enemies*

[civic ginkgo]

It's gonna be interesting to see what raid 4 is gonna bring mega rare wise

[rare grotto]

wym u go from bandos bp sang to moons/atlatl/trident

[winged mantle]

So many convos rn

[austere mulch]

Maiden, bp and tbow are better
Bloat, blade and nox are better considering ramp and tick limitations on bloat down
Nylo blade is better considering ramp, ticks gained for bp fills, and veng hp
Sote fang is better, as is blade with oath now, considering ramp, veng, and “safe” hp
Xarp tbow and bp are better when you spec like you’re supposed to
Verz p1 billion things are better
Verz p2 blade is better
Verz p3 Nox is better in practice

[meager flame]

if they ever do something like that to SRA it is over over for that item lol

[rare grotto]

can do any content with those three

and build from there to megarares

[solid jay]

Honestly loving the blog post today.

[meager flame]

its already not really worth it a lot of the time as the game is right now

if anything starts creeping on it

that thing is done

[true talon]

Flat armor is gonna destory blow pipe for sure lol

[tacit pendant]

Game could use a few end game 1x1 or 2x2 encounters tbf

[sand gazelle]

I bet eye of ayak drops as 3 eye pieces and a staff piece from the doom

[tender harness]

untradable pieces

[austere mulch]

I’d be really surprised if they added flat armor to tob

[tender harness]

[chrome nova]

5% DPS increase that initially takes 400 hours to get, then increased to 1000 hours when HLC complains that the drop rates are "too high"

[austere mulch]

But that said, it can also wildy benefit pipe too 🤣

[chrome nova]

The fact that it's almost what shadow was originally polled at is nice

[meager flame]

did you check out the spreadsheet for flat armor

i think its cool they're trying with it but lol

how did they even think to add it to most of those npcs

[obsidian venture]

No one would complain for it to go up. Stop arguing with random info

[winged mantle]

Zaxe - moons - tds - oathplate - torva (optional)
Twinflame - trident - sang - eye of ayak - shadow
Msb/ rcb - Atlatl - bowfa/ bp

[chrome nova]

They had one for that? :O

[meager flame]

yeah

[austere mulch]

Bis spec weps for each style, prayer upgrades for each style, and a reskin of Gambit from ruinous prayers - 7 total rewards

I’d be very happy with that tbh

[winged mantle]

Before there was so few options of progression

[chrome nova]

They wouldn't? Because that's exactly what happened with Yama, and is exactly what some people are pushing for with Toa

[obsidian venture]

Hlc is the main folks who wanted pnm/nex rates to lower lmao. In regards to yama it doesn’t make sense for its ttc for how good it is

[winged mantle]

People have way more ways to engage with the content + moneymakers are plentiful

[obsidian venture]

That’s why it needed the nerf

And can still be nerfed further

[tacit pendant]

This just being "part 1" kinda crazy. Excited for part 2+

[obsidian venture]

While Torva could be sped up

[chrome nova]

It doesn't? Because I've seen people here instead say it's cope and not even good

[austere mulch]

Yama being faster TTC than bandos but being better than Torva in most content is a clear problem that Jagex recognized and even still says is still a problem

[tender harness]

because;
TOA Purple rate is/was too high
Yama is shitting out oathplate

how is that not a problem good lord
again people talking who shouldnt be

[civic ginkgo]

I don't know, I think they should release the shadow of twisted vitur

[meager flame]

yeah like i want pnm fixed because

im running out of bosses to grind

if they could add that one to the list that would be great

[tacit pendant]

Pnm gettin fixed

[obsidian venture]

Inb4 necromancy

[rare grotto]

moons -> oathplate instead of bandos -> torva
trident (or eye) -> shadow instead of just sang
atlatl -> bp instead of just bowfa -> bp
Is what is best to do

like half the stuff u mentioned u just skip

cause they're either worse or marginally better

[chrome nova]

It's not faster TTC than Graardor (bandos is the god not the guy you fight, that's the general of the god), and isn't better at most content if you use defense reduction

[meager flame]

after pnm

[winged mantle]

That's for the player to decide tho

[minor whale]

"the HLC wanted Yama rates to be nerfed they must want everything to be 1000 hours to complete" is so fucking funny and wrong

[meager flame]

i want them to make a better corp with sane loot rules

[civic ginkgo]

Summoning first, I want to summon a goblin army

[chrome nova]

Wait TTC sorry read as time to green log

[obsidian venture]

This is wrong lmao. It’s better than bandos and 2 pieces of torva

Please stop
Talking

[civic ginkgo]

Guys I don't know the terminology, what's HLC

[true talon]

Its insane how overlooked twin flame is as a progression item atm. that wep is absolutely bonkers on a mid game iron for zulrah or other bosses with elemental weakness.

[minor whale]

They're a theoretical gamer

[obsidian venture]

Hungry little cannolis

[rare grotto]

yeah but we're talking optimal gameplay here no? if ppl wanna take detours and grind something else that's something else entirely

[tender harness]

it literally is. stop talking when you have zero fucking idea what you're talking about.
you are trolling at this point

[chrome nova]

I've literally seen spreadsheets that say besides verzik, it isn't at tob

[civic ginkgo]

Thank you kind person

[rare grotto]

i just wanted to highlight that the amount of routes didn't really increase

u just do different stuff

and it's faster

[obsidian venture]

Please post them

[austere mulch]

1. No need for the parentheses lmao. Everyone knows that. The colloquial name for the boss is bandos - that’s what the vast majority of player refer to him as. Similar to Zammy = Kril
2. Yes, it was faster TTC than bandos prior to the nerf and now it’s just slightly slower

[rare grotto]

by a mile

[winged mantle]

We have different opinions. My perspective is from learning the game as a hc - to learning the game as an iron and getting to endgame with almost everything now.

The game is better now than it was 6 years ago for progression/ options and engagement

[true talon]

Fat fedora wearing sweat balls who need to touch grass and opperate their IRL on ticks instead of seconds.

[tender harness]

"cant find them but source is trust me bro"

[cinder pagoda]

Any eta for OSRS HD?

[meager flame]

i mean some things definitely improved routing

[civic ginkgo]

Oh so redditors?

[rare grotto]

i think you're confusing better with faster, but you're allowed to have an opinion

[meager flame]

like bowfa for sure opened up the game

[winged mantle]

Not optimal no. Just what options there are as a whole

[chrome nova]

It took us like 10 hours to get bandos top + bottom + bgs and we weren't even spooned. Multiply that by 3 for solo. Yama is what 80 hours in a solo?

[austere mulch]

Also, it is better at most content even with def reduction because of the plethora of def reduction caps and.,, as you might be surprised… a key def reduction weapon is… a slash weapon

💀💀💀

[minor whale]

Also it's literally at worst equivalent to Bandos armor because it has no offensive negatives
It being at the very least on par with Bandos while oftentimes being better than Torva and having same ttc as Bandos is so bad for the game lmao

[winged mantle]

Different parts of the whole convo

[obsidian venture]

Use the mirror if you can because you still to this day can’t argue anything back with wrong info. Don’t project too much

[minor whale]

But yeah this one person has single handedly make me recant my "everyone has valid arguments" take

[obsidian venture]

Yep

[true talon]

Found one right here.

[meager flame]

well of course everyone doesn't have valid arguments

[obsidian venture]

I barely play as is so gl

[austere mulch]

Ok and someone compelled oathplate in 22 kc on release, that’s 1 hour of duos. RNG doesn’t mean TTC

[civic ginkgo]

I was gone 5 minutes

[meager flame]

you do have to make sense for the argument to be valid

[winged mantle]

Can we chill gang

[obsidian venture]

This tbh

[true talon]

Ya, because you burned out from saving to many ticks at TOB speed runs.

[obsidian venture]

I don’t speed run tob

Again don’t project

[winged mantle]

Would love to discuss the 🔥of summer sweep up

[minor whale]

Tassili being wrong

[chrome nova]

We green logged in 300kc. That's not exactly spooned lol.

[rare grotto]

i'm pretty sure i've seen the name in rs3 discords saying the same insane stuff

[obsidian venture]

I’d love to discuss stuff without bottom barrel pvmers chatting

[minor whale]

300kc not exactly spooned?

[austere mulch]

Yes, that is. Lol

[obsidian venture]

And folks who use leagues to fund their arguments

Like wwd

[minor whale]

That's the drop rate of 1.5 pieces

[civic ginkgo]

I only use leagues to say that echo kq is better

[minor whale]

That's absolutely spooned

[chrome nova]

Rates for all the items are 1/384. That's barely spooned

[winged mantle]

The ignore button is there

[obsidian venture]

Goat statement

[winged mantle]

Just saying

[minor whale]

???

[meager flame]

oh no

[quiet plank]

Will the new ring be better than berserker ring at moons?

[chrome nova]

No actually is the drop rate for 2.5 uniques. 1/128 for a unique

[civic ginkgo]

Echo KQ was so refreshing

[obsidian venture]

Please stop talking

Ffs

[austere mulch]

I really hope this is sarcasm lol

[winged mantle]

I would love an echo version to come to the game for ggs, kq, cg

[frail bough]

On the other hand, we know that big changes can engender big feelings, so we invite all of you to let us know how you feel about what we’re proposing today

Nailed it!

[tacit pendant]

Ggs need more

[chrome nova]

OK the armor pieces are 1/381 my bad

1/127 for any piece, coming straight from wiki, from graardor

[frail nebula]

Green logging in 300kc, just to be clear, is a huge spoon

[chrome nova]

Also consider that minions have a chance for drop too

[frail nebula]

Objectively

Even counting all of that

[chrome nova]

OK we didn't green log we don't have the boots

[rare grotto]

same person had very passionate opinion on pnm (has only done it once on leagues)

[frail nebula]

It takes around 600kc on average

Yeah so you got all that about twice as quickly as average

That's a spoon

[chrome nova]

Y'all are extremely toxic and I hope you realize you represent less than 1% of the playerbase

[minor whale]

All those 1 shot mechanics...hitting 70s...

[frail nebula]

I don't think I'm being toxic here

[chrome nova]

You aren't but some others are

[tender harness]

Oh no im being hit with reality. they must be toxic

[chrome nova]

Crying for items to be nerfed because they change the meta and devalue your 10 sets of torva is toxic.

[indigo tinsel]

Y'all doing okay?

[true talon]

We are ok for sure

[obsidian venture]

If I generally spouted misinformation I’d be understanding of folks being toxic to me

[meager flame]

its actually great in here

better than okay

[obsidian venture]

Thankfully I’m not on that end

[chrome nova]

And if you only have 1 set of torva why tf would you care about it losing value?

[tender harness]

people piping up about things they have no business piping up and diluting conversations
other than that yeah its good

[winged mantle]

Lots of strong feels today it seems

[obsidian venture]

Daily with some chatters

[chrome nova]

It's the whole mindset of "I had to suffer so you do too"

[minor whale]

Being correct doesn't mean being toxic
It's just really not worth saying "I did this fight in leagues, here's my opinions on the main game version of this"
Or just having misinfo or trying to spread weird bad calcs of ttc and expected drop rates and getting hit with pushback and crying toxicity at that

[winged mantle]

We all need to remember it's just a game. Love this community and how much we care

[chrome nova]

Can we also talk about how people are complaining about new content power creeping content that is so old it can literally vote is considered a bad thing?

[indigo tinsel]

What criteria are we using to determine if someone is allowed to "pipe up" about a subject?

[slender vapor]

Having done the content non leagues

[quiet plank]

They're literally just saying that you got spooned. That's not even a bad thing

[meager flame]

i think realistically its just if what they're saying actually makes sense or not

[tender harness]

this is objectively wrong and
the reality and mindset is - if you haven't experienced it and leagues does not count why are you speaking up about something when it is completely different

[minor whale]

Preferably they've attempted the content at least once in main game, not just done 1 kc in leagues and deigning yourself the expert on the fight

[chrome nova]

Yama is also much harder than graardor even if you're mage only

[true talon]

Btw guys, lemme know what you think of this system to fix awakener orbs and contracts
https://discord.com/channels/324132423636090880/1377990203351896125

[obsidian venture]

Sending content that you’re talking about and or providing just information using recognized charts or calcs

[tacit pendant]

Nobody is attacking your character here. Genuinely any other games forums or chats would have gone to the name calling and actual toxic behavior

[rare grotto]

i don't think they even got the kc on leagues

[chrome nova]

That's not what I'm saying is toxic

[rare grotto]

but i dont wanna be a dick

😂

[minor whale]

If someone did Zuk in Leagues and then said "I have ideas for fixing this in main game" I'd take literally none of their opinions at any value

[obsidian venture]

Because it literally means nothing

Congratulations on Mickey Mouse osrs gameplay

[tender harness]

I did tob in leagues I know how to fix it;
make every single fight maiden but dont allow tendy specs to work

[chrome nova]

Tendy specs?

Wtf is a tendy spec

[quiet plank]

What is then? Only other thing they did was make objectively correct statements proving you got lucky with your drops

[meager flame]

im ngl sote was kinda fun with bankers note

i haven't gotten to double eat that often since i mostly stopped pking

lmao

[chrome nova]

No they were also saying that oathplate power creeping bandos is bad

[frail nebula]

Bankers note really was great and I feel bad for everyone who went recall

[minor whale]

I did 5 melee only leagues cape where my Zuk weapon was a rune crossbow (no ranged relics)
I have 1 main game kc
The 1 main game kc is SO much more useful for discussing the content than any leagues experience

[tacit pendant]

So nex mages are getting fucked up by blowpipe holy shit

Thats gonna feel good

[chrome nova]

Gwd being bad content is fine. It's literally like 18 years old at this point

[indigo tinsel]

I mean I feel leagues can still provide understanding to content. Not to the extent of main game experience but still better than not experiencing the content

[minor whale]

Oathplate Powercreeping Bandos isn't the issue
Oathplate being on par with Torva while having the same time to complete as Bandos is bad

[meager flame]

yeah i was sort of giving that the side eye

[obsidian venture]

Leagues content is afking awakened vard

[rare grotto]

oathplate is so good it has powercrept on torva lmao. Which is wild considering all u need is demonbane weapons and ur good to farm it out

[obsidian venture]

How does that help any discussion

[meager flame]

when i was checking the sheet for flat armor

[minor whale]

Legit

[frail nebula]

It takes significantly longer to complete than Bandos

[meager flame]

i was wondering if bp with like amethyst darts would pass up tbow etc

when i was looking at it

[quiet plank]

How is that toxic? It isn't targeting anybody it's just an opinion that many people share already

[tender harness]

thats not what was said
oathplate being basically diet torva while having a similar TTC to bandos is objectively bad

[chrome nova]

Yep, this. Colosseum was not free on leagues for instance. If you didn't learn the waves you still died. Just got infinite supplies

[frail nebula]

Like several times longer

[meager flame]

seems like a pretty big meta shift though actually

[indigo tinsel]

That being said, leagues can be detrimental to learning as the strategies will be different.

[chrome nova]

No, it's saying "none of you deserve any content that speeds up the game"

[meager flame]

makes attacking nex with super awful gear way more on the table if bp is that good

[rare grotto]

How can experience on league translate to mains when ur doing 20x the damage and rares are practically guaranteed

[tacit pendant]

Its gonna be nuts

[finite tapir]

on a midgame iron you have swamp trident

so like, not that great

although ig its still decent in some niche cases

[tender harness]

want to hear something beautiful? it doesnt translate

[finite tapir]

just not "absolutely bonkers" like you put it

[minor whale]

Nobody said that
But asking for armor to be bis but drop 5x faster is just insane

[tacit pendant]

Its much better than +2 max hits which already puts bp up there

[chrome nova]

If you aren't doing 20x the damage? It's more like 5x

[obsidian venture]

5x 🤣

Get me out

[chrome nova]

And that's assuming you had a tbow

[true talon]

? you dont have 87 slayer and magic fang to kill zulrah as a mid game. twinflame offers dps comparable to 95 magic + shadow lol.

[slender vapor]

Rune knives

[chrome nova]

Tbow was around 5x higher dps on leagues yes

[frail nebula]

Bandos probably took me around 20-30 hours to finish on my iron and I got pretty unlucky (over 900kc for my first armor drop). Even that's around 1/3-1/4 the time expected to finish Oathplate.

[tender harness]

1tick knives entered the chat

[chrome nova]

Rune knives were 20x main game but that does not count

[meager flame]

thats what we were missing today

[indigo tinsel]

1t knives were fun

[chrome nova]

Also with those you lost ticks from literally anything

[meager flame]

time to debate where midgame is

[minor whale]

Dude I was afking echo Sol with a rune crossbow

[obsidian venture]

Please no

[true talon]

1 tick d darts, killed awakened vard in 15 seconds lol

[slender vapor]

midgame starts with max cape

[civic ginkgo]

Please don't

[meager flame]

lmfao

[tacit pendant]

Please summer sweep up talk

[minor whale]

It's not comparable at all

[tender harness]

respectfully please stop

[frail nebula]

Midgame starts when you get off tutorial island and ends when you get your zuk helm, clearly

[chrome nova]

Highly doubt lol. Unless you were spamming bankers note like your life depended on it or already had bracers

[minor whale]

You just can't compare "I literally don't have to click my mouse to kill Sol" dps to "Main game max melee Sol"

[meager flame]

anyone out there reading this

just go fight sol on the sim

[rare grotto]

we shouldn't even be entertaining this. Just disruptive for 0

[frail nebula]

You could dodge like all the damage at echo sol

[meager flame]

its fun

[chrome nova]

Or unless "afk" means "I wasn't having to do switches"

[rare grotto]

cba playing devil's advocate

[minor whale]

I mean I got a few hundred kc in a day
It's just not even comparable to use for anything

[obsidian venture]

First time here?

[true talon]

Sol is such a great fight, hands down my favorite boss in this game.

[chrome nova]

I did just that to practice, agreed it is fun :3

[frail nebula]

And ranged was absurdly busted last league

[civic ginkgo]

Zapdos, you have never been the devil's advocate

[frail nebula]

Sol is quite cool tbh

[rare grotto]

i haven't built up my ragebait tolerance as much as u veterans have

i'm lacking.

[tacit pendant]

Any new places for harm staff looking at the sheet guys?

[true talon]

Echo bosses were all pretty good. i liked echo dk's

[obsidian venture]

Stay for a bit and you’ll notice a trend

[tender harness]

Echo KQ

[frail nebula]

Echo DKs felt weird to me tbh

[obsidian venture]

[finite tapir]

maybe not, you have bowfa as midgame iron for sure though

[minor whale]

If we want to discuss the merits of echo bosses being reasonable to add to main game then that's a convo where leagues kc actually is useful

[chrome nova]

Echo dk's was like flicking a manticore except it had super reentry

[frail nebula]

Echo KQ is just an infinitely better fight

[meager flame]

echo dks was actually like kinda spicy

[chrome nova]

What was echo KQ exactly?

[meager flame]

it wasn't that hard but it would hurt you for messing up a bit

[true talon]

I only faced echo dk and echo sol, echo gg.

Echo GG didnt get to do anything, because tbow deleted it.

[tacit pendant]

Can granite cballs be made tradeable ffs

[minor whale]

Echo KQ was great, Echo DKs were unique and pretty fun
Echo Sol was a major disappointment
Echo Hespori is what real Hespori should be

[frail nebula]

All damage was avoidable with proper play

[civic ginkgo]

Echo KQ was if you're good enough, you can take 0 damage

[minor whale]

Echo GGs was really good too

[tender harness]

Echo DKs but give them medic if you miss a flick

[meager flame]

yeah i honestly thought i would regret not going varlamore then i saw echo sol

and knew i made the right play

[frail nebula]

Echo GGs went kinda hard

[minor whale]

Echo Sol made me sad

[frail nebula]

I liked it

[meager flame]

that was the one echo boss that actually just looked like it sucked lol

[tacit pendant]

I didnt even cannon anything post 90 slayer, just let people sell granite dust and make money as an early game boss to fund champions capes

[minor whale]

Yup

[velvet token]

Echo thermy was very difficult

[minor whale]

It was fast, boring, and your main thing to kill you was your camera not seeing a totem

[tender harness]

wouldnt know. only like 3 people took Kandarin

[true talon]

he was just normal sol with the ability to kill totems. he didnt do enhanced damage or anything. he wasnt very punishing.

[frail nebula]

For the 2.1 people who took Kandarin

[velvet token]

I picked kandarin

[tender harness]

I am so sorry

[tacit pendant]

Olm getting 50% earth weakness though

[meager flame]

i liked all of mine i had ggs, cg and dks

it was a good league

[chrome nova]

Also leagues not teaching you anything is cope. My pvm ability improved significantly in general. It teaches you the skills if you are willing to learn them.

[frail nebula]

I hope you and the other Kandarin player got along

[velvet token]

It was my fav region of the 3

[chrome nova]

Let's goooo, wand actually useful at the main place it should have been!

[obsidian venture]

Echo sol was the most boring one

[frail nebula]

Leagues absolutely is a decent jumping off point for pvm, but not the be all and end all

[tacit pendant]

Leagues gives u confidence and lets you see mechanics so that a guide will be useful. Yeah dhw not being the budget cox weapon was crazy

[civic ginkgo]

Isn't olm water weakness?

[meager flame]

i still really think the echo ggs should be in the main game

[tender harness]

hear me out;

its almost like there exists another game mode that doesnt have modifiers or buffs that give you 10,000 training wheels so you can still learn

I wonder what that is.

[velvet token]

Kandarin was bis for meds hard n elite clues and thermy

[meager flame]

i can understand not having a lot of them even if i liked them

but that one is actually just better

[chrome nova]

Which game mode are you referring to?

[obsidian venture]

You can use leagues to reduce your nervousness from approaching content

[meager flame]

out of the ones i did

[frail nebula]

Seeing boss mechanics yourself is more helpful than watching them in a YouTube video IMO

[obsidian venture]

But besides that it doesn’t teach much else

[rare grotto]

Main upside of leagues is that because everyone is so stupidly strong, devs are able to add a bit more intensity to fights and experiment with 1t stuff

[obsidian venture]

Can familiarize yourself with content

[tacit pendant]

Lets not talk about hax' pvm xp anymore we are all on the same page

[chrome nova]

I went from not knowing how to do prayer switches or gear switches even to being able to do demonic gorillas with leagues 4

[meager flame]

i still think we low key probably already tested the next megarare

we just dont know it yet

[tender harness]

[tacit pendant]

Sunlight spear

Everyone knew

[meager flame]

ya that or the khopesh

[chrome nova]

Also what "training wheels" are you referring to main game

[meager flame]

that spec would be so fun

[chrome nova]

🙏

[frail nebula]

Let's be real the spear was the most fun weapon I have ever seen in osrs

[tender harness]

the fact you didn't realize I was shitting on leagues

[velvet token]

I was 2 weeks late to leagues because I wanted to max 1st

It was my 1st leagues aswell I really enjoyed it

[tacit pendant]

The spear was goated

[indigo tinsel]

Yeah but which game mode are you referring to?

[frail nebula]

Leagues are damn good fun manaleds

[meager flame]

if they wanted a megarare spec weapon khopesh would be pretty fire

basically super vw

probably turn it off for pvp tho

lol

[frail nebula]

I'm kinda expecting something khopeshy

[tender harness]

its that one game mode. you know

[chrome nova]

So the thing with leagues is everyone enjoys it and has fun except for the people who are constantly sitting at tob

[indigo tinsel]

I dont

Tell me

[chrome nova]

Beta worlds?

[frail nebula]

If only so there's a VW alternative for pvm that is actually from pvm

[civic ginkgo]

People seem to forget that bosses (not echo) are exactly the same on leagues then they are main game

[velvet token]

I loved drygore bp

[chrome nova]

This

[tacit pendant]

Surely there is a better channel to discuss leagues after jagex dropped a bombshell sweep up post

[tacit pendant]

Burning claws

[civic ginkgo]

It makes it easier yeah, but it can still be way to get familiar with the mechanics

[frail nebula]

Not quite comparable imo

[chrome nova]

OK that is cope

[frail nebula]

I say with my 10 burning claws

[chrome nova]

VW always hits

Claws always hit 0 1 0 1

[tacit pendant]

It is though? Burning claws became bis in several places knocking down vw

[chrome nova]

I mean anywhere that they will hit yes it's better

[frail nebula]

VW and burning claws aren't the same niche, even if they have some overlap

[tacit pendant]

And if its the accuracy youre looking for, horn is here (pls buff jagex)

[chrome nova]

^

[chrome nova]

Oh true

[frail nebula]

That overlap is mostly due to burning claws having the option to spec in stab

[tacit pendant]

In practice, burning claws do alleviate the pain of not having claws.

[frail nebula]

That's true

[obsidian venture]

It’s also due to it being 30% to spec 3x

[frail nebula]

Yep

[obsidian venture]

Which makes it better than d claws and close to vw in some cases

[chrome nova]

Wait it can do that? I thought it always rolled spec off slash def like DDS

[civic ginkgo]

You know, after all this chat, no one has discussed the best part of the sweep up

Cerby teles being tradable

[frail nebula]

Nope, it uses its current attack style

That's why it sees some use in toa

[tacit pendant]

And more common. Cerb eating good

[chrome nova]

Oh huh, interesting

[civic ginkgo]

Can't wait to get the hellpupper

[meager flame]

those cerb changes probably get me to go back for a smouldering stone on my iron at some point

[tender harness]

rip zulrah

[meager flame]

kind of annoying not having that for masters

[frail nebula]

Okay I've never actually done cerb on a main and I've assumed this whole time that they were tradeable

Wtf

[chrome nova]

Wtf

[tacit pendant]

Mana is that in the blog?

[chrome nova]

How do they expect you to get manta rays 😭

[tacit pendant]

I must be dumb

[meager flame]

it is

[civic ginkgo]

Unfortunately not friendo

[tender harness]

its the spreadsheet

yes

[meager flame]

its a spreadsheet link

thats not even the interesting page

click the herb one

[chrome nova]

They really said "you're gonna have sharks only and you're gonna like it" 💀

[tender harness]

more contentious ones are runes and seeds

[frail nebula]

Herb/seed rates look like they're getting kinda nuked

[true talon]

The overlooked part of this blog, you can now nox hally kree, who rolls off your ranged defense for magic attacks. meaning you will smash the shit out this boss with a nox hally XD

[chrome nova]

Yep. "Won't affect irons much" my ass

[frail nebula]

Which makes me want to grind out a ton of ToA on my iron asap

[meager flame]

thats gonna sting for quite a few irons i know lol

that never ever want to farm

[tender harness]

wildy bosses are being hit from orbit
muspah is beint hit again

[frail nebula]

Not even that

[tacit pendant]

Please GGs tradeable granite dust

[frail nebula]

This is awful for every single iron

[tacit pendant]

Thats all the boss ever needed

[frail nebula]

How do you farm without seeds

[meager flame]

im glad that oziris built me differently when i first started playing irons

i always farm way more than im supposed to

[minor whale]

Stop stop I'm already excited for this update as it is

[tender harness]

NGL aetherrune catalyst on sire is kind pog

[obsidian venture]

This is good yeah

[frail nebula]

There's a lot I'm excited about in there too

[tacit pendant]

Wait isnt sailing getting a cannonball ammotype rework?

[obsidian venture]

Also good for
Skillers

[civic ginkgo]

DeIrOn

[chrome nova]

Speaking of which why is it still the first guide that comes up when you search "iron guide"? Hasn't been updated in several years lol

[tender harness]

but why are we buffing giant mole

[frail nebula]

But the changes to seeds are fucking scary to see as an iron

[true talon]

Maybe this is a step towards allowing us to have processable herb patches on a farm or something.

[minor whale]

I think the seeds will still be viably farmed
But probably not from content that is just "oh also you get seeds here"

[obsidian venture]

Kinda deserved tbh

It’s been too easy to sustain on an iron

[meager flame]

its probably a step towards telling people to teleport to the farming guild

[true talon]

Maybe you can convert a large sum of seeds at an increased time rate at the cost of getting no exp/agold cost.

[frail nebula]

This is an example of toxicity that shows up here

But that aside

[chrome nova]

Yep, this is the type of stuff I was talking about

[minor whale]

Levi getting 1k Aether is huge

Gonna bump its profit way up

[obsidian venture]

This isn’t toxic what. It’s moreso healthier for main game mode and irons utilizing the farm guild more

[true talon]

Its to easy to make gold on a normie, all methods need to be brought down to 500k max per hour.

[frail nebula]

There being reliable sources of seeds for irons means you can actually play the game

[austere mulch]

That’s kinda juiced ngl lmao

[chrome nova]

Lmao they said "aether runes will be easier to get" and put them at leviathan and sire

[meager flame]

i want to try it just to do it

[obsidian venture]

It really is too easy true

[meager flame]

i need to melee kree down one time

[minor whale]

I think ToA dropping so many at once was just a big mistake that irons got used to

[meager flame]

just to know

[tender harness]

why are we giving kraken earth weakness though

[minor whale]

Muspah as well

[frail nebula]

Destroying seed rates just means you get to play the game less

[obsidian venture]

Drop a rock on the head no?

🤭

[minor whale]

There should definitely be point farming available for the seeds

[true talon]

I remember my days in the flax fields as a young normie. back when flax was an actual money maker XD.

[minor whale]

But

[chrome nova]

Oh my god yes

[austere mulch]

Well. Kree has pretty high melee typing def bonuses

[minor whale]

It shouldn't also be at a place you're going to farm already for other drops

[frail nebula]

I think it's a combo of that and other things just not dropping enough before

[ember token]

kree has pretty high all defenses

[meager flame]

what we need

[still sundial]

water based monsters get earth weakness because it dirties the water or something

[meager flame]

is an elder maul attachment for our halberd

[civic ginkgo]

I mean, it is toxic, because the way you said it is just wanting irons to suffer, if you said what you said there, that's not toxic

[meager flame]

thats the next niche

thank me later jagex

[true talon]

when i did the salamander CA i just meleed it in full torva with a salamander, it was way easier than mage/ranging it.

[tender harness]

no it is not.
Irons just being too used to easy supplies when it clearly wasnt intended isn't toxic

[meager flame]

i mean supplies are still easy

they just have to do farming contracts

[chrome nova]

Any piece of content you should be able to sustain supplies at though

[meager flame]

instead of begging at toa and muspah basically

[austere mulch]

Oh yeah, I guess I forgot that kree also has 200 range def typings for all 3 lol

[meager flame]

the challenging part for people is having the routine

[indigo tinsel]

I think Bane's statement is less toxic in content but could have been worded better.

[austere mulch]

Which is higher than the 180 melee types

[civic ginkgo]

Yeah it was toxic lmao, they way it's said is toxic, you don't want to admit it because you also just hate irons

[true talon]

No mention of dragon arrows in the sweep up 😦 im in shambles

[meager flame]

you'll generate way more than you can use

[chrome nova]

Yes kree is very dumb when soloing

[frail nebula]

Problem is target farming seeds

[obsidian venture]

Could’ve elaborated sure

[tender harness]

supply cost is not an issue and hasn't been in years

[chrome nova]

For mains

[true talon]

This. current known methods to obtain seeds are TOA,Callisto,Muspah

[austere mulch]

Classic chins or shadow are fine. Kph is pretty solid

[obsidian venture]

But the supplies from bosses is way too much in general

[chrome nova]

Also being real getting secondaries is the real slog

[obsidian venture]

And this is a much needed change

[meager flame]

target farming seeds isn't really a problem though

[frail nebula]

I'm gonna hit you with a bombshell here

[meager flame]

thats only a problem if you didn't do contracts regularly to begin with

they're telling you to farm ultimately

it will fix the problem

[frail nebula]

As a main, you aren't allowed to comment on irons

[meager flame]

people just dont want to do it

[chrome nova]

Supplies at bosses usually come from the ones with a lot of chip damage!

[obsidian venture]

We can as it affects the economy

[tender harness]

nylos changes holy

[frail nebula]

Sorry you aren't allowed

[obsidian venture]

So you’d have a point if it didn’t

But you don’t have a point per usual

[frail nebula]

FWIW I don't actually think that

But that is why you come off as toxic

Because it's that kinda stuff

[frail bough]

keep in mind we are also getting skilling changes so maybe seeds and stuff will be better to get via skilling 🤷‍♂️

[obsidian venture]

I stand by what I say when it relates to arguing content when you haven’t engaged

[chrome nova]

Not really? Like you said supplies always have been and always will be negligible for mains. Resource choke is a TERRIBLE game mechanic. Look at Path of Exile for what happens when you resource choke basic necessary resources. Game completely fell off a cliff the time they tried it

[frail nebula]

I hope so

[meager flame]

seeds are already amazing if you do the skilling

[obsidian venture]

It does due to dupes/ certain updates

[meager flame]

contracts are cracked

[frail nebula]

Contracts are nice but they don't give you any way to really target serds

[meager flame]

you just gotta actually do them

[frail bough]

contracts are dumb as hell

[true talon]

also its werid they hit the ice moon at PM over the dreaded blood moon

[obsidian venture]

If irons weren’t allowed to do that, then it’d be a different story

[true talon]

Blood moon is the reason PM sucks on mid game acc lol

[meager flame]

yeah instead of targeting a specific one its basically spray and pray of getting everything

[chrome nova]

Then rollback the game when there is dupes? Lol

[frail bough]

no lie, id actually rather spam click master farmer

[meager flame]

and it actually outputs so many

that it actually does work lol

[obsidian venture]

That would do more harm than good at this point

Which is why this summer blog is needed

Or change rather

95% of it is solid

[chrome nova]

Supplies need to be basically free and anyone who does not realize that needs to really think about it for a moment

[austere mulch]

Eh changes nothing outside of meme normie spellbook runs in leagues

[meager flame]

just think towards the future

[obsidian venture]

But I’d want them to add baboon thralls to the list of static hp, zebak as a whole due to its high variance in ttc in high invo toa

[meager flame]

when they finally unveil the plan to massively buff harm and they've added elemental weaknesses to all of tob

[austere mulch]

Be really insane if they added FA to nylo tho lmao

[idle summit]

fang needs to be switched with ward, theres no point in it sharing the same dr as lightbearer considering how much of a spike it gives. Also lightbearer shouldn't sit at the bottom of loot table, a ward<light<fang drop rate would represent their power more accurately imo

[meager flame]

we'll see them in their final form

[chrome nova]

Also the thing about dupes with any sort of consumables is that it fixes itself over time unless a really really fast dupe is found. In which case the solution is to rollback the game the moment it's discovered. Like literally every other game does.

[frail nebula]

I think it's pretty fair to point out here that they really are kinda just... eviscerating access to supplies for irons with these changes

And that's a pretty massive change for ~30% of the playerbase

Which I don't think is particularly warranted

[chrome nova]

This is coming from someone who used to play on games with rampant duping, and the seemingly endless supplies ran out quickly once dupes were no longer a dime a dozen

[frail nebula]

Nerfing certain key sources? Sure

[meager flame]

they're just spanking people that dont really do contracts

[frail nebula]

But it's not remotely balanced out

[obsidian venture]

Not those type of dupes? I’m saying from content. Like 2x bandos tassets for example

[chrome nova]

Yes

[meager flame]

which i mean you could argue about it saying thats bad

[obsidian venture]

Unless that’s what you mean

[meager flame]

but its not like irons will actually struggle

[frail nebula]

Contracts don't even remotely make up for it IMO

[chrome nova]

Also are these unpolled? This seems like a massive change that needs a poll

[frail nebula]

Yeah they're gonna be unpolled

[chrome nova]

Ohhhhh

[indigo tinsel]

I mean I would hardly call contracts a method of getting seeds. Maybe now?

[meager flame]

they could reduce seed drops to 0 and you could make contracts work

[restive sapphire]

who is this

[meager flame]

it would get somewhat annoying at that point

[indigo tinsel]

It didnt feel like enough on its own

[ember token]

royal titan

[chrome nova]

Yeah I noticed that too lol

[meager flame]

but they're not dropping a nerf like that in the first place

[frail nebula]

you don't know good old eldrich?

[meager flame]

its a 20-50% nerf depending on content

[frail nebula]

I think they really should try to better balance out the huge nerfs to seeds

[chrome nova]

If that's what it's meant to be the name is misspelled lol

[true talon]

Its more Snapegrass/h to pick it up at waterbirth over actually farming seeds.

lol

[chrome nova]

For real. At least redistribute them elsewhere

[chrome nova]

Yepppp

[meager flame]

potentially true but

you dont need that much snapegrass and you can do something better with your time while it grows

[chrome nova]

Especially with reagent pouch

[meager flame]

tldr

seeds are much better

[civic ginkgo]

Tithe farm supremacy

[chrome nova]

Wdym? You need a shit load of it, seemingly never have enough

[still sundial]

I will say, doing contracts on UIM is absolute ass lol. it's something you do like once during your account during which you're completely inventory locked from doing most content

[idle summit]

yeah the answer isn't to just nerf boss materials, they need to level the ground between skilling for materials and bossing for them imo

[frail nebula]

just plant some in your always safe hosidius allotment patch each time you do an herb run

[meager flame]

lmao what

[frail nebula]

And you'll have tons of snape grass

Assuming you have seeds

[obsidian venture]

What’s the current meta?

[civic ginkgo]

I mean, if they do nerf seed rates, make tithe farm viable

[obsidian venture]

Master farmers or

[chrome nova]

Master farmers 😂😂😂

[meager flame]

okay nah that one was egregious do you know how much snape grass you get from one run of allotments lol

[chrome nova]

On a UIM?

[meager flame]

lool you can't possibly plant enough ranars to outpace that shit

[true talon]

False lol. you use a fuck ton of p pots on ironman if your not 1 ticking.

[frail nebula]

worst part about farming snape grass is how many times you have to run to the leprechaun to note it each harvest /s

[winged mantle]

What if they made it so the longer you let your herbs grow the higher chance of a bigger harvest?

So you need less seeds

[frail nebula]

ehhhh

[winged mantle]

Just an idea

[meager flame]

no you do not use that many prayer pots

[chrome nova]

OK true. I'm used to being the one person in the gim who gathers supplies so really it's 3 peoples worth

[frail nebula]

nah you do use that many prayer pots

[meager flame]

you get hundreds of snape grass per run

i could literally leave my prayers on for 12 hours a day

[obsidian venture]

The avg Andy ain’t 1ticking shit

And you’ll still have plenty

[winged mantle]

Snape grass seeds are an issue of acquiring

[meager flame]

lmao

[chrome nova]

Every time I put 100 ppots in storage the next day group members ask for more lol

[still sundial]

I believe you still do contracts but only like once and then hopefully never again and hope to sustain through raids and bossing

[frail nebula]

yeah I usually get them from contracts and...

honestly, basically nowhere else

[chrome nova]

OK might be exaggerating slightly but still

[winged mantle]

Mole is bis sadly

[civic ginkgo]

Nerf the seeds, buff tithe farm

[vivid ruin]

Use more food less prayer?

[chrome nova]

Tormented demons moment

[meager flame]

i mean thats kinda making the point

you're supplying everyone with prayer pots and making it work lol

[frail nebula]

Curious how you think that works

[chrome nova]

Also should note they are nerfing food too

[chrome nova]

Yep

[idle summit]

buff tithe in general

[civic ginkgo]

Yes

[chrome nova]

And we are not all 1 tick flicking prayers

[civic ginkgo]

Tithe is basically dead content

[chrome nova]

Yes

[meager flame]

but yeah idk

[winged mantle]

Tithe is not fun

[vivid ruin]

Depends on the context. Not everything requires prayer

[civic ginkgo]

This could be what it needs to rework it

[meager flame]

i have like 10k prayer pots currently if i made everything

more snapegrass than i need to complete that

[frail nebula]

can you name any serious pvm content that doesn't require prayer

[meager flame]

and like 700 snape seeds

[frail nebula]

because that's the big drain

[meager flame]

its pretty solved im ngl

[chrome nova]

True. Some of it is definitely some people stupidly using it for random slayer mobs :P

[chrome nova]

This tho

[obsidian venture]

Folks can learn to lazy flick if anything

[frail nebula]

not really practical depending on the encounter, though

[vivid ruin]

Well this is my point

[civic ginkgo]

Goblins

[strange ingot]

Regarding the summer sweep, 2 things id like to see that aren't included are

1. Kephri puzzle changes: how many people dont "do" the puzzles because they just let the plugin tell them the answers? The puzzle is still not fun to engage with on mobile/vanilla without the plugin, so it'd be nice the puzzles were tweaked to be friendlier without the plugin

2. phosani: i think the tablet should be a guaranteed 1kc drop. The gameplay loop of learning that boss is probably die -> do a 2 minute run to your gravestone -> tele to bank to regear -> 2 minute run back to try again. Whole lotta nothing going on during that time and learners die a lot so it's still a pretty high barrier of entry to keep the tablet at 1/100 or guaranteed at 100

[chrome nova]

At least lazy flicking piety and we have been doing this less

[vivid ruin]

Preserve prayer for actual content and not lazy slayer tasks

[chrome nova]

Recently it was literally just tormented demons

[meager flame]

oh also

i meant to ask this earlier

you know when they talk about the mining puzzle

[obsidian venture]

They also made royal titan prayers for afk stuff. Considerably less drain

[chrome nova]

We have been doing this for a while now but yeah before it was that lol

Yep

[meager flame]

when did you have to boost above 99

[obsidian venture]

Don’t need augury at some thresholds

[chrome nova]

I think for 1 downs in a solo

[strange ingot]

When u were carrying a noob friend thru 1 downs

[meager flame]

like what situation are they actually talking about

[strange ingot]

Solo 1 downs were 85 mining

[meager flame]

nah 1 down solo is nowhere near 99

[austere mulch]

here but, bandos has a 90sec respawn timer, 900 kc is 22.5 hours of respawn time alone

That said, TTC for ehp bandos (solo) is ~25 hours or so in complete max, with yama being <40hr on release in complete max

That said, you can get closer to ehp Yama in moons + arclight/emberlight than you can bandos with bowfa (being the next best thing)

So it was a lot closer in reality

[restive siren]

Dont think you had to, prob just typo

[meager flame]

yeah thats what i thought i read that and i was like

am i in the twilight zone wtf does this mean

[chrome nova]

Also the level 1 prayers are good for stuff like slayer. Just camp them and you will fill up your inventory by the time only like 1/5 your prayer is gone

[strange ingot]

It might be >99 if u dont get the early first hit

[meager flame]

yeah i thought that too

[civic ginkgo]

You have been rereading everything

[meager flame]

but like

just get the first hit

[frail nebula]

correct that my ~1000kc was mostly respawn time

that's expected for Bandos

You kill graardor much faster than he respawns

[restive sapphire]

is akkha a nerf if u can butterfly

[obsidian venture]

ATM yeah

[meager flame]

i kind of think it is a nerf for people doing higher invos

[austere mulch]

I just clicked my mentions and doom scrolled while waiting twiddling my thumbs WFH lmao

[obsidian venture]

With the changes provided

[meager flame]

its probably easier if you were like

doing it the dumb way

[obsidian venture]

As it will switch

[restive sapphire]

def easier if u did it the intended way

[chrome nova]

They should reduce respawn timer by a bit. Or better yet have a button to respawn the boss instantly

[winged mantle]

Yeh the nerf is gaurenteed swap style at special

[meager flame]

i honestly feel like its just attack of the dev that tried to remove butterfly v2

i'd rather they just not do all of that

maybe look at last phase if they must

but honestly im fine with akkha just being hard

[frail nebula]

just reducing respawn timer too signficantly would make Bandos much less accessible

[chrome nova]

They should have removed butterfly from yama. That's a bug not intended mechanics

[restive sapphire]

sucks
honestly the only thing i'd care to change about akkha is getting shadow diffed even in max mage

[frail nebula]

how is it a bug though?

[civic ginkgo]

They've already said that if they kill butterfly, they will change other things

[frail nebula]

it's just basically advanced flinching

[tacit pendant]

Adjust chivalry drain rate

[chrome nova]

I guess. It just feels so incredibly unintended, along the same lines of red x or 6-0 graardor

[slender vapor]

Everything about how people do olm is unintended

[meager flame]

i honestly think it feels better than doing akkha the "right" way in the first place

[restive sapphire]

for solos i think ba-ba changes make red x completely unnecessary?
killing le baboons seems like less time loss than being 6t

[frail nebula]

this is the case for a lot of older pvm

[austere mulch]

Not really inline with redx since that is literally an unintended mechanic for players to take advantage of

[meager flame]

yeah killing baba is just going to be the most free room to ever hit toa

[chrome nova]

Please. Also pures should get it, they've wanted it for a while. Only problem is every time this has been polled piety also is

[meager flame]

with the stated changes

like

[frail nebula]

I'm not sure I can think of a single solo gwd boss strat that's intended

[restive sapphire]

yeah let's go back to the gwd days of standing and hitting and eating when you get low

[frail nebula]

at least that was intended

[meager flame]

just dont forget protect melee and its kinda over

[chrome nova]

Yes and olm is poorly designed as well :P

[restive sapphire]

sara was absolutely intended to be kited

[chrome nova]

Kree'arra

[tacit pendant]

Pures getting it is too controversial at this time. Atleast adjust the rates standalone so it will pass

[plush gull]

10m now 💀

10m to fight a boss

[austere mulch]

Oh boy

[obsidian venture]

Can still 5:1 and not pray for the most part

[frail nebula]

what, the strategy of suffering?

[austere mulch]

Some OPINIONS today

[obsidian venture]

Horrible take

[chrome nova]

Yes, that's intended (I think)

[meager flame]

olm is also goated

[tacit pendant]

Olm is great, as someone who is shit at cox

[restive sapphire]

the unintended fun is better than the intended unfun

olm is the goat

[chrome nova]

What I mean is that being able to just dodge attacks is

[meager flame]

i think there are some bad things about it like how everything you're doing is kind of like

not visually apparent its really old school old school runescape

in that regard

but still once you get it

[chrome nova]

Yep

[obsidian venture]

That’s called emergent gameplay and it’s not like you’re taking no dmg at all lmao

[tacit pendant]

Its visually janky yes

[meager flame]

its a great boss

[civic ginkgo]

Don't need to dodge attacks if you don't do the content

[austere mulch]

Overly scripted fights = less skill expression = lack of content depth = longevity has to be artificially boosted by rewards

[frail nebula]

whoa I just ran out of filled plant pots for the first time ever on my iron

damn I never thought that would happen lol

[chrome nova]

Woah

[restive sapphire]

imo like top 5 bosses for me no particular order
verzik
olm
zulrah
vard
artio
sol is like an honourable mention

[chrome nova]

That's almost as rare as running out of eye of newt

[obsidian venture]

Respectable

[tacit pendant]

I wish yama would rotate between fire special types in all phases

[austere mulch]

Which is why Olm is generally considered one of the best single fights in the game. Kieren said “look at all these cool things” and let the players figure out how to deal with it efficiently

[meager flame]

i like olm and sol a lot

[tacit pendant]

Artio and zulrah over sol is spicey

[restive sapphire]

like i said no particular order

[tacit pendant]

Hm is less than non hm

[restive sapphire]

but it says something that people still enjoy zulrah after 10 years

[tacit pendant]

Zulrah is actually ass though

[meager flame]

i think if yama were only p3

[restive sapphire]

good to do when broke + in max gear

[meager flame]

it might actually approach being kind of like an olm fight

[frail nebula]

gonna be honest zulrah's just a "we threw a bunch of shit at the wall because there was no hard content" boss

that's trivialized nowadays by new gear

[meager flame]

those other phases though take it way down the list

[tacit pendant]

Sure dps is good at all levels, but people dont like that the fight is chart reading sim

[obsidian venture]

What chart

[restive sapphire]

i never forgot

[obsidian venture]

It’s been my afk boss for years ngl

[meager flame]

you just gotta get past the into stage where you actually think in rotations

[restive sapphire]

also pre-wildy rework the problem with the bosses is that they're so stacked against the player if a pker arrives ur prob gonna die

[tacit pendant]

I mean if u havent memorized shit, its just look at plugin for which rotation ur in, brain off

[restive sapphire]

unless u safespot

[chrome nova]

Calling zulrah AFK is crazy lol

[obsidian venture]

Muscle memory is brazy

[meager flame]

after about 10k kc you're just locked in and know what is going to happen without actually thinking

it goes beyond memorizing eventually

[chrome nova]

If you're clicking more than once every 30 seconds that is not "AFK"

[austere mulch]

Zulrah on release was insane bc bis was rcb and Ibans

[meager flame]

like lol

[restive sapphire]

but with artio i like that when a pker enters he's a threat to everyone in the room

[frail nebula]

swap sides when zulrah moves to the center from the side

that's like 90% of the fight tbh

[obsidian venture]

Can alt tab out and be fine for a few attacks 🫡

[meager flame]

when i do zulrah if you asked me what the next spot is going to be i couldn't tell you anymore

but as soon as zulrah goes down i swap gear and run to the right place without thinking

[chrome nova]

For a few attacks 😭

[slender vapor]

Zulrah is afk, people overcomplicate the hell out of it

[meager flame]

its hilarious

[tacit pendant]

Zulrah is not fun though, for me

[chrome nova]

People forget what "AFK" means

[austere mulch]

Cox release though… what a time lmao. Everyone going in with different barrows sets doing 50+ scale raids before any of the qol hit

[frail nebula]

I do not personally enjoy zulrah

Even if zulrah isn't difficult

[obsidian venture]

Osrs term, people use it a lil more openly

[chrome nova]

AFK means "away from keyboard". Means you can get up, take a snack break, and content will still be going in the background

[obsidian venture]

But if being pedantic sure

[tender harness]

Wheres the corp rework in summer sweep up

like holy

[austere mulch]

People don’t forget, they just don’t use it in a literal sense

[frail nebula]

Even in OSRS it's a wildly inconsistent term

[restive sapphire]

the same day zosani's nex comes out

[austere mulch]

Afk is generally “low apm/low attention”

[obsidian venture]

Yeah

[meager flame]

the corp rework is locked behind the moment where we assemble exodia and pnm rates are finally within the realm of logic and reason

[obsidian venture]

Which applies to a lot

[frail nebula]

I don't like that usage in OSRS since there is literal AFK content too

[austere mulch]

Only thing that is actually afk these days is redwoods

[chrome nova]

Everyone I know uses it only for stuff that you can do while like doing raids on your other account

[frail nebula]

shooting stars, karambwans with fish barrel

there's other stuff too

[chrome nova]

Sulphur naguas, shooting stars

[tacit pendant]

Can we as a comunnity pls spam corp loot rework. Please

[austere mulch]

Oh yeah, stars is a good one

[chrome nova]

Well the former is a bit less afk

[chrome nova]

Oh my god please

[frail nebula]

Stars is the go to afk example

[meager flame]

i found the bone shard mining to actually be pretty decent afk when i was maxing my iron

its slow but like

its actually pretty afk

[chrome nova]

Yeah, it's like stars but prayer instead of crafting xp

[frail nebula]

it's wild that there hasn't even been a peep about at least giving it the nex/nm loot distribution method

[tacit pendant]

Are we allowed to ask goblin directly if corp is p2 or p3. I dont wanna be annoying

[plush gull]

nvm i need my coffee, i checked shard acq price, harmony is still up by 10% to 6.6.m tho

[austere mulch]

I thought he said there were only 2 parts, next being slayer skilling misc

[chrome nova]

I think Corp never should have been added. Doesn't belong here lore wise, they just gave us the same stats without the skill it was designed around, and stopped good mage progression for almost a decade

[tacit pendant]

Im ignorant to how parts exist

[frail nebula]

Corp without the quests was certainly a decision of all time

[chrome nova]

Or if it had to be, that the drop rates and stats were fine and the price wasn't so high that people back in the day would veto anything better offensively than arcane

[meager flame]

idk why they're even holding back with corp

[chrome nova]

Similar era as Zulrah. Just "idk throw shit at the wall and see what sticks"

[meager flame]

that content is actually ass in so many ways its pretty crazy

[chrome nova]

Also without divine too

[wet smelt]

am i crazy or is the granite ring change the exact same as it was?

[meager flame]

the divine thing is just a fragment of how dumb the osrs community can be

[chrome nova]

Yeah they made a mistake

[meager flame]

mathematically the divine and ely are almost the same shield but they were absolutely convinced

divine was insanely op

[wet smelt]

have they said what its meant to be?

[austere mulch]

Corp, horn, and surge pots probably left for the 2029 summer sweep up unfort

[chrome nova]

Yeah turns out "all incoming damage is praying Smite" is a very real downside

[meager flame]

which is funny but yeah

[frail bough]

it's green, it's obviously OP

[tacit pendant]

Making a new bis 1h mage weapon while leaving corp the way it is, is just

[chrome nova]

Saw someone in here a while ago still coping that no it's actually still insanely OP

[frail nebula]

wait was divine seriously green this whole time

I know I'm colorblind but this is a crazy revelation

[meager flame]

yeah

i miss it just because it looked cool

[chrome nova]

Meanwhile we have dinhs bulwark and justiciar

[frail bough]

and now that you know this, you're obligated to vote no to any future green shield

sorry, thats the rules

[chrome nova]

Also tragic how PKers nerfed the bulwark mage def not once but twice

[true talon]

Pkers didnt, vene's did lol

[chrome nova]

As if the effect not working in PvP wasn't good enough

[chrome nova]

Vene's?

[tacit pendant]

Eh dinhs angle is pray mage anyways not a massive deal

[meager flame]

tbf

[frail nebula]

they're the same picture

[chrome nova]

I always thought it was pkers

[meager flame]

that shield is probably still too good in pvp

[true talon]

Ya gold farmers and bots was slapping on dinny B and becoming unkillable

[meager flame]

jagex just thought that having defensive sets was a good idea

[chrome nova]

Which one dinhs or divine?

[meager flame]

then the reality of pvp sunk in and they realized that people actually being tanks sucks

a lot

[tacit pendant]

The problem with ely and justi is not that they arent strong. Its that nothing in the game tests you for damage reduction

[meager flame]

for people who really pvp

pvm is the same way too

[tacit pendant]

Needing justi + scythe switch for a boss phase could be meta if they designed a boss that way

[chrome nova]

Divine is very balanced in PvP. Huge risk taking that in wildy, you're very likely to get smited for a +1 and if skulled it's probably the divine

[meager flame]

just think about what the boss would have to do to you to make you wear justi and an ely

the crying would be endless

[frail nebula]

technically they did design a boss that way

[true talon]

it would have to kill you or else youd just eat though it or tick it eat lol

[frail nebula]

well, not "needing"

[tacit pendant]

Its just moons

[frail nebula]

but where they're very good

yeah

[chrome nova]

Perilous moons moment

[frail nebula]

more moons-style content incentivizing defense would be cool tbh

[tacit pendant]

Yamas tank should get hit harder 🙂

[true talon]

Not a fan, mainly because bloodmoon is poorly balanced.

[meager flame]

yeah the content they just blogged about nerfing because it sucks :p

[chrome nova]

I mean in a group, it's nice for anything that you mass where one person is the tank

[austere mulch]

Ely is waaay better than divine in current game state where pvm trips are generally defined by how long your prayer lasts (since divine drains it and most damage is avoidable or minimal)

Divine just a PvP item at this point

[chrome nova]

Wait they're nerfing moons? How so

[frail bough]

it really is just as simple as doing something like this

[chrome nova]

Yeah exactly

[meager flame]

they want to punish people less when they fail the checks because its too unfun

[chrome nova]

And a risky one at that

[meager flame]

when rng goes the wrong way

[true talon]

Adding elemental weakness to nylo's is werid.

[meager flame]

yeah this was always pretty true

people were just dumb basically but

just in terms of damage mitigation

they're extremely similar

[chrome nova]

Yeah don't you always hit them? And always kill them too?

[tacit pendant]

Justi being flat armor instead of percent would also be giga strong some places

[chrome nova]

Also I just looked at their stats, magic acc and damage is very funny, all to balance out the 1 level

[tacit pendant]

Flat armor might fix the pvp power creep problem

[chrome nova]

OK this is true

[tacit pendant]

So much would need reworked

[frail bough]

am i just dumb, is there a way to lock the headers for these spreadsheets

[chrome nova]

Anyone got a link to the flat armor one?

[frail bough]

or do i legit just have to copy paste somewhere

[wet smelt]

i think giant bones should be called bigger bones

[tacit pendant]

Its on the far right of the defense changes from blog

[chrome nova]

Holy shit they should

Also they should maybe add blue dragon bones back to rune and addy dragons :/