game-update

[true talon]

I was a sand casino junkie, so having an iron with max gear was nice as it prevented me from staking it. because it was a lot of hardwork to actually get the items lol.

[chrome lantern]

tyvm I’m insanely spooned and still not even on rate for elixir lol

[subtle merlin]

i hope at some point we just get 5t hallys across the board...

[slender vapor]

Normal accounts don't understand the actual value of a fang

[chrome lantern]

arcane was 46kc so even more wild to see the ely

[slender vapor]

They don't do toa without it

[fair comet]

That’s awesome. I’m sure you were unlucky in other areas to make up for it.

[true talon]

good boss to spoon tbh, im missing ely at like 1620, ive had 1 arcane an 2 spectral.

[fair comet]

I have not yet received a PvM pet. I’m not spooned at all in that category.

[chrome lantern]

Fortunately I’ve actually not been unlucky on any huge timesink stuff aside from 2.6x hydra claw and like 4x (still going for) masori chaps

[true talon]

corp is like 10 kph in absolute max. such a shit boss.

[chrome lantern]

But like insanely spooned all cox megas, one item from green at Nex on rate for 4.5 items

[fair comet]

And the pet is what, 1/5k? HA! Agreed.

[true talon]

the ely is 1/4k

its 1/527 or something to even hit the tablelol

at 10 kph

[fair comet]

I don’t understand why Corp pet and GWD pets are 1/5k

[true talon]

on average it takes 50 hours to even go on rate for a single roll.

[chrome lantern]

Arcane 46, Elysian 113, now at like 135 just going for elixir then probably not touching for the long future

[fair comet]

I remember when people used to use Blessed Spirit Shields

[true talon]

in b4 1.5k for elixer

you need exiler for the ely right

arcane can be made without it

using elidinis ward

[chrome lantern]

I got the arcane like within a couple days of getting Elidinis’ ward on two weeks after ToA release too lol

[fair comet]

Should I sell my Ultor & Magus Ring to buy Ancestral & Masori (f) back?

Currently using Virtus and don’t have range gear lol. I bought all three mega rares and Torva

or should i just buy Masori regular and keep Virtus and the magus and Ultor

[chrome lantern]

Depends on the content you’re doing

No need for ranged gear if you ride the highs on Yama prices a while longer

[true talon]

atleast im enjoying yama. i do wish p3 had more mage impact. the mage dance is a lot of fun and there is some bad overlaps that is pretty hard to deal with in quick succession.

[fair comet]

yama, theatre of blood, Araxxor, other Slayer bosses. i use ranged gear for fight caves…trying to secure the jad pet

[true talon]

Wonder why they dont make demonbane 4 tick, the spell isnt used anywhere already XD

and both the range/melee weps are 4 tick

[chrome lantern]

The first step to demonbane is baking Mark of Darkness effects into all the spells that it benefits, outright, and deleting the spell

[true talon]

ive died so much because mymarkfell off

stupid flares

[fair comet]

i just feel like i can buy the dagganoth king rings and then buy Ultor, magus, bellator, venator later

idk

[true talon]

like dark demonbane is less dps by quite a bit on yama vs emberlight

[chrome lantern]

I don’t see a problem with that?

Melee is way more complex than maging

[true talon]

I do, because we havnt had mage content in very long time.

[lament peak]

demonbane is very chill though I can watch a show and barely pay attention except for 20 seconds during p3

[true talon]

melee just skips over the waves and falling fireballs for free

mage has to skip waves an positon the fireballs correctly to utilize the 3 tick casting

sometimes it all happens at once and its really fun

[lament peak]

it's sooo simple to dodge fireballs though after like 10 kc

[true talon]

dodge fireballs, perfect wave skip and change your prayer while also hitting the astral flares with spec

[meager flame]

fireballs only seem interesting until you realize its the same thing every time

[true talon]

few fireballs overlap with wave skip timing

[meager flame]

also that doesn't really happen the flares spawn during a fireball set with no waves

[lament peak]

I just camp pray range in mage gear. Rarely I'll have to eat 1 bwan 🤷‍♀️

[meager flame]

the worst thing that can happen is

north/south fireball line when you skip wave

but thats literally a tile marker 2 away from the tile you would've usually stepped back to

so idk

its not that deep

[true talon]

Mage just feels underwhelming, when it shouldnt. esp for its cost.

[meager flame]

but yeah assuming you're solo

[nocturne solstice]

I'm having a great time with mage 👀

What kinda uhh time to kill would you want to have?

[meager flame]

all you do when you wave skip assuming you're skipping on the same tiles im using

[lament peak]

we don't have a shadow and saved like 800k souls from zeah so lol

[meager flame]

is step forward on the north/south one during wave skip

and then click on the tile thats 2 tiles east of the tile you started on

would be easier with a ss but im not in game atm

you'll always dodge the north south and diagonal in one move as long as you pause a tick

[fair comet]

pingu help me

[nocturne solstice]

Wazzup

[fair comet]

I’m trying to decide if i should sell my Ultor & Magus rings to buy Masori (f) & Ancestral (currently rocking regular Masori and Virtus) and just use the Dagganoth Rings until I get some more GP

[nocturne solstice]

I wouldnt go for masori F until rich rich since its just some nice def stats

magus isnt really great unless you have shadow

[fair comet]

I do indeed have a shadow

[nocturne solstice]

hmmmmm

[fair comet]

true

[obsidian venture]

Would base it around content you’re doing

[nocturne solstice]

Id keep the ultor, get masori regular

if you can afford ancestral then get that over magus imo. They're 3% dps over magus 2%

but also magus is only 82m so if you're too poor for one piece of ancestral but can afford magus then get that

[fair comet]

Yama, ToB, Fight Caves (for jad pet hopes), Araxxor and all the other Slayer bosses, ToA, GWD

[nocturne solstice]

oh if tob then for sure keep ultor

[obsidian venture]

Then yeah ultor is solid

If using shadow then magus has value

[fair comet]

I’ll prob be using that for ToA

[obsidian venture]

Could sell melee gear for anc if needed

[nocturne solstice]

maybe but also youll be fine without magus in toa

[fair comet]

I’m rocking Virtus right now, thats fine for Yama, ye?

[nocturne solstice]

I personally bring it but it can be a little annoying with swapping lightbearer

[lament peak]

it can get a bit hectic but 99% of the time in a mage duo you won't even see the enrage waves, like you need to miss an abnormal amount of hits

[nocturne solstice]

since you really want that spec regen for warden p2 core

[obsidian venture]

Yeah unless you’re doing donofly p3

Then mage is barely needed at that point

[fair comet]

I’m just doing duo max mage

[nocturne solstice]

I think virtus should be more than fine especially if you go purging staff 🤔

[fair comet]

Yeah I think you guys answered my ?

I’ll just buy regular Masori with what little gold I have left

And keep Ultor and Magus?

[nocturne solstice]

Gl on the grind

[obsidian venture]

Non issue really. Magus for zebak if no tbow, akkha and warden p3/p4

[nocturne solstice]

Yeah thats fine tbh

[obsidian venture]

Yeah keep rings

Can sell melee gear for anc if not sending higher invo toa

[nocturne solstice]

Oh yeah for sure, its just a very tiny minor thing.

It sucks when you try for a 2d and it becomes 3down instead

[green mulch]

Yo they broke the trick where you could harvest and deposit into a compost bin at the same time 😦

My UIM is hurting

[nocturne solstice]

F

[obsidian venture]

It isn’t above a certain threshold. Don’t know why that’d affect the rings you use. Camp lb till the end of p2

Even if double zcbing p1, you’d get enough for a 2d

Also if the threshold is close, bring a proper 4t like vw or tent

[nocturne solstice]

My brain is too small for such things. I forget about lightbearer and just swap it accidentally lmao.

hmm ive never tried zcbing p1...

does it hit often and do you go for a full range switch?

[obsidian venture]

Yeah full switch ideally

Move rings around

[nocturne solstice]

damn that'll be rough

Ive been using gnomemonkey's 500 invo setup with bowfa haha

[obsidian venture]

🤮

[nocturne solstice]

I'll swap to a proper build when I finally get sun keris

For now, I chug

[chrome lantern]

Speccing p2 core is kinda bait unless you’re going for a speedrun or literally need it to 3down

Only time I even use my lightbearer in ToA is when my adrenaline is popped for zcb specs in zebak and warden, and for p1 warden

That said regening spec during p2 definitely nice if you don’t need zeroer/ultor to 3down

[nocturne solstice]

Seems pretty standard strategy to dds spec p2 core for a 2-3 down though. What are you normally doing instead?

[chrome lantern]

3 down is good but it’s not worth forcing a 2 down for pts/hr

Warden is the best points room, similar to Olm, but downs after 3 have diminishing returns and unnecessarily stall the fight

3 down is meta for pts/hr, 2 down is meta for speed, and by not speccing on core you also get to save for either keris heals or dps on p1 obelisk (which is huge supplies save especially solo) or p3

[nocturne solstice]

Ah well that'll do it, no sun keris yet for me. My whole strat for ToA is gunna change when I get it

[chrome lantern]

I mean spec dumping p1 can be huge too, especially BGS can miss often enough p1 if no shadow, or dps specs

Depends on team size as well for e.g. bgs aspect

I personally double ZCB the obelisk p1 with adren

Since I solo that usually save me another keris spec/ppots by giving me a very high chance of only getting one set of orbs

Even in a 500

[hard axle]

They said 30% had an iron, but no breakdown if they generically looked that up, if actively playing it or not, or anything like that, so we can only base it off of high scores in limited samples

[hard axle]

Ranarr Weed pvm sun Keris spec only raids

[meager flame]

yeah but i mean its super obvious that tons of people actually doing the content for any length of time are* irons

like when we talked about yama the other day it was like just under 50% of the players in the top 1k of yama were irons lol

and thats not including things like gim or whatever

odds are there were more restricted accounts than actual mains

[slender vapor]

Irons engage with more of the game for longer

[hard axle]

Be the pet hunter you can be

[compact flicker]

Restricted gameplay has truly become quite popular

[upbeat marten]

@ancient ember any hints what the update will be?

stackable clues maybe?

[sudden bane]

Yama fix update #?

[fossil epoch]

My gues its something to do with yamama, fixing the contract fights? the different clog problems it has etc
hopefully some of the backlogged stuff from polls

[upbeat marten]

personally kinda done with all the yama stuff.
update didnt quite hit it for me, fight itself is amazing but everything around it just sucks.

so i really hope this can be the last we hear about this "little" demon.

[fossil epoch]

You being done with it doesnt really matter for the fixes it needs though.
Splashing mage on the void flares when its expected to be one hit below 15 dmg seems wrong.
Also D chain being on the clog, dossiers having the wrong picture, yami not being on all pets, oathplate shards not being on the clog aswell

[upbeat marten]

oh yeah but i mean after the fixes

most fixed are alrdy stated in the last blog right?

[fossil epoch]

i have yama greenlogged, so im also done with it, cuz im prop not touching contracts

[analog crow]

Maybe they are gonna touch up the contract fights, maybe they want to tweak the drop rates, who knows. The former will probably take some more time

They will also release cas at some point

[fossil epoch]

With the community feedback so far, i would be surprised if there was no touching up in some way

And true, CA's should release soon

[upbeat marten]

im gonna return for the ca's but thats it really.

[analog crow]

I hope at least one gm ca requires contract Yama

[upbeat marten]

i wish them luck with that

[upbeat marten]

idk about that one

[analog crow]

It’s the hardest fight in the game
You don’t deserve zuk helm if you can’t beat it

[shadow wave]

They've already confirmed there will be a CA which is complete any contract

[upbeat marten]

not gonna comment on that one

[upbeat marten]

where?

[shadow wave]

In the Yama Q&A on Reddit a couple days before launch IIRC

[upbeat marten]

ah okay

[fossil epoch]

Should be "Complete 1 oathplate equipment contract"

Gotta pay up if you want a zuk helm

[upbeat marten]

bloody blows is really easy

its basically perfect yama with 2 extra steps

[hasty shard]

bloodied is rng, you just send forfeit breath imo

[shadow wave]

I mean as I understand it some of the Radiant ones are the easiest contracts

The acquisition ones are the hardest currently (but presumably those will be nerfed otherwise the contracts may as well cost 1 GP, only maybe 10 people in the world can complete them

[fossil epoch]

i didnt add a /s, but i was joking, thats for sure

Yeh i do think they will change some things in that regard

[fair comet]

I just want to find another person with max mage for a duo

=[

[rustic goblet]

I watched JRaze (one of THE best) attempt horn acquisition for maybe 10 hours yesterday. Countless tries, Pb was maybe 20% hp Yama (only 10% into P3 which is the insane part). It's absolutely overtuned.

Not to mention that all of the Acquisition contracts are the same so the one with 250 worms/2000 catalyst as a reward is equaly difficult.

[meager flame]

im ngl i have a hard time really getting their thought process around yama contracts in general

im going out on a limb here but im assuming you aren't expected to do all of the hardest fights for the zuk helm because they recognize the content is basically insane

but why release it if you deem it not acceptable to ask players to do it

and by insane i mean both hard and extremely problematic in general

idk to me you'd think the "we cant ask players to complete this for gm" would be a huge neon flashing red flag when it comes to putting it out there to begin with

[fossil epoch]

Probably a mixture of not enough time, so the final product got a bit rushed, and therefor not as much testing went into it.
And the fact that the HLC has cried for years basicly not getting hard stuff, especially after the release of yama, they cried about how easy the fight was.
We know they were changing the contract fights between yama release and contract activation

[meager flame]

yeah but if it were simply about difficulty it should be required for gm

but they know its not just that

its also about quality

[fossil epoch]

I think they wanted to deliver, the problem is that at one point, the players become better than the jmods at the game, and testing for stuff that only players can complete gets harder at that point

[meager flame]

basically

they knew these fights sucked and that's why they weren't going to require you to complete the radiant oathplate for gm

they already knew it

[slender vapor]

What really makes me laugh

Is we finally had a boss where Mega rares weren't required

And they just said fuck it, mega rares required

[fossil epoch]

well to be fair, every boss so far only requires that awakened form to be completed once, yama is the first one to have mulitiple

[fossil epoch]

It really comes down to this fight was for the HLC, not for anyone else

It sometimes seems like if the content isnt exclusive enough, then its not good enough

[meager flame]

blood torva is 4 different fights and each one is a ca

and jagex did say each one of these was its own bespoke fight

[fossil epoch]

Yeh but its 4 different bosses, each with their own CA page

[meager flame]

yeah and jagex said this is 5 different bosses

[fossil epoch]

pretty sure they havent said its 5 different bosses?

its the same boss with 5 different requirements

[meager flame]

yeah they said they're each their own bespoke fight

tldr

that implies is a unique event

[fossil epoch]

gonna need a reference on that one

[meager flame]

but still theres no reason to even like lawyer the language they used to begin with

nowhere else in the game do you get to skip out of the intended hardest difficulties

[fossil epoch]

Thats not saying its 5 different bosses?

https://i.imgur.com/wzdGEZQ.png

[meager flame]

yeah they're saying they're each unique boss fights

[fossil epoch]

its just 7 different custom made fights

on the same boss

at most they are saying that you need to approach the fight in fundamentally different ways

[gentle badge]

bespoke means unique, the fights are not unique

[fossil epoch]

And i dont think they are fundamentally changing the yama fight tbh

[meager flame]

it depends on how you use the word but yeah

how they used it is implying custom/tailor made/unique etc

[gentle badge]

generally speaking, that's how it's used

[meager flame]

i just think its unfortunate because

its really unfortunate that they're making challenging pvm cosmetics and achievements and rewarding you for doing them

but not including them for gm

so they're just making what is supposed to be the ultimate reward for doing all of that

not the ultimate reward

[gentle badge]

I think the access requirements are the most unfortunate, but definitely

[meager flame]

and yeah i mean i would change contracts immediately if i were them

i'd just be like yeah my bad this is ass and delete them lol

and just let people do the fights

[gentle badge]

I wonder if that's something they've even remotely considered

[meager flame]

i wonder too because its super weird for them to be like

"this is something we'd probably never do again"

[gentle badge]

right?

[meager flame]

and then you're just staring at it still in the game like and so? lol

[gentle badge]

lol

[meager flame]

expecting them to tell you how they're going to fix it

[gentle badge]

let's hope they sincerely address it before dropping the content and moving on 🤞

[rustic goblet]

It's super funny because they said that basically IMMIDIATELY after rolling out the update lmao

Like not even a day after

Just few hours

[meager flame]

i mean they had a week to know what was going to happen watching everyone try to like

theorycraft how it could possibly not be terrible

while we were all coping and waiting to see how it really worked

[rustic goblet]

Acquisition contracts were also a terrible idea

Just delete them

[meager flame]

then it released and it was basically 1:1 what people thought it was

and jagex was allowed to admit it sucked

[slender vapor]

Toa scaling is also a terrible idea, delete that

High defense+ super high hp isn't fun for anyone

More mechanics, less stat sticks

[meager flame]

that part scares me more than anything

thats like the essence of why people dont like toa

scaling to the point it takes forever and minor mistakes instantly kill you

so they make a bunch of contracts where that seems to be the only design goal they all share

[gentle badge]

I just honestly want to know why/how they believed contracts were materially different to orbs/invocations

they were so sure of this

[analog crow]

Otoh toa is meant to do many times while these contracts are mostly 1nd

[meager flame]

tbh i can only imagine

the difference they were really fixated on

was that you can afk farm demons to get some contracts

[slender vapor]

Toa scaling seems like the Arcane special

[meager flame]

and that "fixed" the acquisition

and i guess they just assumed that was the only real problem with orbs

otherwise i have no idea how they could say what they said

[slender vapor]

Uber tanky 1 shot bosses shouldn't be the future of osrs pvm

I'd take hp sponges packed to the nuts with mechanics any day

[gentle badge]

They need to hire some full time, high level pvmers for QA then

can't just rely on a single mod to fill that function

or not in this case lol

[meager flame]

i think their real problem is that they dont seem to have time or ideas on some level

like

i raided on wow for too many decades lol to think they've somehow hit rock bottom and cannot come up with challenging mechanics

but they just keep coming back to the same stuff

its always like

do this little move tick perfect or turn on your prayer at the right time

they basically come at the base mechanical skill of players almost at all times

but they dont really challenge you to think

[analog crow]

What do you have in mind that they could explore?

[meager flame]

i mean they have buffs and debuffs on yama right

they can really do anything they want with that

make you figure out how to efficiently move around the room gathering the right kinds of buffs or whatever

move the boss into runes to phase him or debuff him

like

[gentle badge]

wasn't colosseum supposed to have buffs and such?

[analog crow]

Oh that’s hype actually

[meager flame]

they don't do a lot of strategy basically

[slender vapor]

My idea for awakened Yama was just put him into p3 from the start. And slap on new mechanics

No need to stat stick him to 4k hp

Just make the fight legitimately challenging through mechanics

[meager flame]

you can destroy people with the most simple of things too

[slender vapor]

Let him drop meteors and fire on you non stop

[meager flame]

like you know how on olm you each get a certain color of teleport and have to find your guy

if its in a big enough group

imagine if they did that but if you touched the wrong guy you would blow up the group

that boss would be hard as fuck for people lol

[gentle badge]

you just wanna watch the world burn lmao

[slender vapor]

There's so many ways to make Yama hard without toa scaling him

[meager flame]

you'd get people talking about which section of the room people went to with which color etc

they've also never really done anything like

people are fighting two different npcs but they need to die together for one reason or another

or if one is significantly ahead of the other the boss starts doing bad things so you're trying to kill them but also trying to keep the hp mostly equal

for the whole boss

so people have to actually talk to each other

although i guess thats scary

[true talon]

They were both XD

[meager flame]

also ngl

[true talon]

p2 now only has shadow glyphs, you must now properly skip all meteors and waves come 24/7

[meager flame]

my bad if they read this and one day we get star augur in osrs

[true talon]

they need to go steal mechanics from somewhere else and not poe.

[gentle badge]

https://tenor.com/view/so-true-gif-24068595

[true talon]

Personally stuff from lost ark is pretty enjoyable

[meager flame]

but yeah i cant believe they didnt do something like pulling yama himself into runes

[true talon]

The type test mechanics are pretty neat

[meager flame]

and just having that do totally new and unexpected things

that one seems like really low hanging fruit

[gentle badge]

woulda been cool to use grasp spells to trap him or something

[true talon]

I will give them credit despite what the HLC says or what the .000000001% players in giga max say. YAMA is a great boss. and its a much more enjoyable grind than nex.

[meager flame]

i think the base fight with no context is actually pretty great

[gentle badge]

yea everyone seems to love the base fight

[true talon]

Fight is unique in its own ways. i do wish it had a bit more prayer swaps and less about the flares.

[meager flame]

its just everything else around it kinda blows my mind in the wrong way

[shut dew]

If they did that, you would complain all they did was reskin alch hydra

[true talon]

Also for the love of god make him transition at the correct hp lol.........

Id be losing my shit if the other bosses of osrs transitioned when they were within 5% of the threshold

[meager flame]

im actually kinda curious because its like when you would push wow bosses during casts because you know they're spell queued

[true talon]

Imagine verzik phasing at 25 or 22% instead of 20

[meager flame]

to get some extra damage in

except its osrs and you're not even thinking about that

you're just wondering why he wont go away

and you're still dealing with mechanics

[true talon]

ya and its clearly coded to teleport you, because burning claws deal 0 damage

when hes below 66 and 33

but hes just hanging out dropping metors and waves on you

Or your rying to dps skip flares

and he hits 33% with 6 ticks left on flares, but he isnt phasing an they blow up an kill you

[meager flame]

the sad part about it

is even if people did intentionally try to take advantage of it which could be interesting

they put the 50% dr on him based on his hp

so you cant even really do that lol

[true talon]

They also went all in on demonbane, which isnt a bad thing. but you cant really deal with flares at all unless you have purging staff

[meager flame]

like if he took full damage

you would have people trying to dump a claw spec or something right on the transition

trying to burn him while they do the adds

[hasty shard]

i wanna note something that i've not seen anyone touch on yet; forfeit breath is essentially the same thing as the more prayer drain one because of vile vigour

[meager flame]

and that could actually be fun

[true talon]

yea vile vigour is really good

my favorite spell in chambers

[meager flame]

but idk its hard to get too mad at them for not always having the most interesting changes on bosses

[true talon]

Been times were i forgot a stam and just did CM olm with vile vigour

[meager flame]

like in wow you have the entire encounter design team actually spending a lot of time on raids

and idk if osrs really works like that

i feel like a couple of dudes just get shipped off to complete the whole project

[true talon]

Its because its very difficult to make something unique and new, while also having it be fun an engaging. an then the player base/jagex shot themself in the face by trying to make it cater to duo's and solos. as we seen the shit show with contracts.

[meager flame]

i mean they could do a lot of new to osrs stuff but

[true talon]

Coulda utilized the royal titan mechanic at yama to

were he slams the ground and only 1 spot in the entire room is safe

[meager flame]

they'd maybe have to go play those other games enough to really expand the way they think about boss mechanics

[true talon]

and you need to switch to mage gear an dps him

[hasty shard]

id say glyphs are (very ineffectively) doing this

[meager flame]

like conceptually can think of so many different things and ways for fights to go because at some point or another

i played a game that showed me something i'd never thought of

[true talon]

Glyphs coulda been used better for sure

[hasty shard]

like if you cranked up the glyph damage a fuck ton you incentivise duo positioning way more

[true talon]

Like there is ways to bypass p2 fireballs, but the shadow one you cant do anything

[hasty shard]

but no they hit like 6's and basically just make up for yama not doing chip damage himself lol

and im not even sure if the shadow glyphs drain your prayer its so unimpactful lol

[meager flame]

i sorta think thats what they intended

melee guy tanks stands in the middle

mage guy rotates around them doing glyphs

[true talon]

if only mage did any damage

Also half the time he picks the tank at random

so you cant even take advantage of the -30 magic defense when hes on a melee guy

[meager flame]

that part confuses me

[hasty shard]

doing mage+melee is just fundamentally fucked rn until they fix some stuff

[meager flame]

you can kinda force it with the add intermission

but idk if they meant for that or not

[hasty shard]

like

• guarantee aggro p1
• have void flares give contribution or just have yama always drop 50/50 loo

[true talon]

and on the kills i tried to mage, even with -30 magic defense and duoing with my friend whose max hit is 55 with emberlight. with his mid game gear. he still did more damage than me l0l

[meager flame]

i really want to make a push for them to start doing equal loot chance as long as you pass a minimum contribution

because for them to do really interesting stuff group wise

[hasty shard]

like it kinda just feels more smoother to do the fight with donofly as it stands :v

[meager flame]

people are going to do very different amounts of damage

and you dont want to like

have people doing the shitty job that cant mvp or only gets like 40% contribution instead of 50/50

[hasty shard]

i think they got wayyy too scared about boosting with yama for some reason

[true talon]

and i have max mage with virtus so im only missing 3% magic damage for absolute max and he is using d boots, d defender, emberlight, torture, blood moon helm/top and a fire cape. the boss has -30 magic def and im still not able to out dps him?? + hes 96 str 91 attack.

[meager flame]

its really important for the next raid

if what they said is true anyways

where they want it to be more like tob

the reason tobs loot is so good is because it basically is what i described

[hasty shard]

is it bad i want something like cms

[meager flame]

its not perfect but

generally just being there and doing your job is a very solid chance at loot

if they're worried about boosting they should just tune the minimum contribution well

it doesn't even have to be too crazy

[hasty shard]

you could also just check to see if a player is interacting with mechanics and set flags as such

think of invisible checkpoints in a racing game to validate your lap

[meager flame]

it seems generally easy enough to come up with a number that says "i genuinely tried to do some shit and maybe it didn't go well but i was inside of the room fighting the boss"

and if you're gonna punish people for playing bad just make deaths be the thing that causes their % to go down

[true talon]

???????? make it make sense. even if we could get the tank on the melee guy. the dps is still far worst by a large margin.

and in enrage its pathetic lol

[hasty shard]

check accursed spec/seercull

i assume osto-ayak will bridge the gap a tooon

[true talon]

Even if you did 200 seercull damage which isnt possible. it still cant touch the emberlight lol

[meager flame]

i was also half expecting for the contracts

[slender vapor]

Ember shaves off over a minute

[meager flame]

for the little version of yama to like

come out of the throne and get involved in the fight

and thats why if you tag him you can see the tile under the throne lol

but sadly nothing cool happened

[gentle badge]

He should summon some of his demon minions

[true talon]

Changes id make for yama in a duo.
Hes -30 magic always or its possible to pick a tank based on set conditions.
Dark demonbane is now 4 tick spell (cant be abused or use literally anywhere else and is only good on demons)
He no longer gains magic defense in enrage (its clear this was meant to be you dodging waves/prayers/astrals/fireballs) its not intended to melee, which is why he spawns flares and hits for 30s.

[gentle badge]

Especially that sweaty imp

[true talon]

It should be a even playing field between the styles, not melee being 30% better.

[hasty shard]

granted they release a new spell called darker demonbane

and you have to cast that alongside dark demonbane

hope this helps

[meager flame]

can they just

delete mark of darkness

lmao

pls god

[true talon]

Well mage demonbane is only demon weakness that isnt 4 tick

[hasty shard]

apparently not

[gentle badge]

YES

[true talon]

So if you mage you get -1200gp per cast and do 30% less damage.

with melee you get more dps and no cost lol

[hasty shard]

ok you know for a fact if they got rid of MoD they'd actually forget to buff demonbane spells

[slender vapor]

At least it's not 12 fire runes per cast anymore

[true talon]

2 souls and 7 fire runes. souls are now 300 each lol.

[meager flame]

we need the true soul altar to exist

[slender vapor]

Menaphos probably

[meager flame]

they could also not troll with the scar essence stuff but

it is what it is i guess

[true talon]

Also even if i was good enough to do contracts, i stll dont got enough catalyst to make it XD

[hasty shard]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1kwi5ak/saturated_heart_qol_suggestion/ 😌 reddit iq test happening again

[gentle badge]

Okay but have you considered this for soul runecrafting?? https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/s/RubWfehwh7

[hasty shard]

it annoys me so much that you cant like wipe the sat boost easily and just have to wait for it to tick down

[meager flame]

one day in a better future

they will just make forgotten brews not troll players

[meager flame]

lmao i remember reading this

he's like i did this in one day (after months of gathering the blocks)

[true talon]

How can he be like its 300k exp an hour, but it took me 2 months to gather the blocks....

[gentle badge]

Bro I was dying 😂

[true talon]

thats like saying i got 3b an hour in 1 day after doing chambers for 3 years.

I was actually looking at aether runes for GOTR, since it was the very first catalyst combo rune. but then i remember we dont have a soul altar in there.

but i think you can still make them with cosmic altar right?

[gentle badge]

Yep

[true talon]

So youd do aether rune combo for catalytic points an then other elemental combos for elemental points.

But making combo runes is so convoluted already, you need binding necklace, magic imbue, then the other type of rune that your comboing with the altar.

[gentle badge]

Yea they really need to release a better binding necklace at the very least

[true talon]

It is sad about mage yama, soon as we get a slash monster update were scythe is good it goes to 1.8b, but we get a magic update were shadow is not even bis and is beaten by a emberlight. the price dont change at all even though shadow is needed for the contracts.

Lemme put these in death's coffer soon XD

[prime cypress]

is purging staff spec bugged for spec glyph contracts?

[true talon]

Probably

I heard you can just camp zcb or sra an it coded as a spec wep to kill the spec contract

shocker the one purging staff mage spec meant to kill demons isnt working.....

[winged mantle]

the insert yama thing here isn't working

[true talon]

Atleast the fight somewhat works lol

[winged mantle]

true

[true talon]

the fght didnt have to many issues.

all the extra mechanics they tried to add did (contracts)

Fight just needs some tuning were magic is not swamp ass and boss properly transitions at correct %, maybe some astral flare adjustments.

Overall the fight is good. id just surprised we are on week 3 and they havnt really changed much.

[tender harness]

Where have i read this before

[obsidian venture]

“Cried for years” when endgame was basically a dried up well till awakened. Folks want hard content, but not content that takes the stuff we don’t want (high hp, medic, long fights) and puts it all together. It’s not too much to ask for folks that want a challenge to get a fun and mechanically challenging fight

[prime cypress]

ive a feeling the kill while bound glyph doesnt work with the scorching bow spec binding effect either

outside of the obvious, remove the glyph system entirely, there should probably be some kind of visual notifier that shows youve fulfilled the glyphs conditions, or more appropriately, that the devs have coded each condition correctly

[fossil epoch]

Whats endgame is a blurred line, that for sure changes whenever new harder content gets released.
As i also said in another comment, there for sure is a problem with the players requesting content at such a high difficulity that the jmods cant beat it themselves, making it very hard to test how good it is.

I am certain the yama contract fights were easier before yama release, but because of how the HLC reacted to base yama, they spend the 10 days leading up to contracts getting released pumping up numbers and changing things for the worse, trying to not get backlash, which just failed even more.

[obsidian venture]

Thing is, Kieran made the inferno and has never completed it. He talked about how he just designed the fight and the process behind that. Majority of folks agreed Yama's base fight is nice, doesn't really have that feeling of "endgame" till p3. Is that enough reason to make something "endgame" that no one wanted? Doesn't make sense

Especially when folks already talked about what's ideal in content and what didn't work over the years. All thrown out the window

Also when they created a perfect type of boss, awakened vard, unfortunately stuck behind a shit system called awakeners orbs

I would have rather them delay these contract bosses, as most endgame pvmers would agree, to release something tested and engaging enough

[fossil epoch]

I think we are arguing towards the same thing really, besides me adding in that the HLC have cried for years about not getting hard enough content

I'm by no means saying that the yama contracts were good

[obsidian venture]

I guess but it's also a weird comment as we generally do not get updates

[fossil epoch]

they were terible

[obsidian venture]

So we are used to getting nothing, meanwhile early and especially midgame was buffed a fuck ton (which does make sense)

[neon gate]

73636328 greater demons amazing update as usual

[fossil epoch]

I dont think its a weird, comment.
I think that the exact reason that the contract ended up being this bad, is because the HLC cried about yama being too easy, which made the jmod panic which resulted in these buggy contracts

[neon gate]

Irons and bots as usual

[fossil epoch]

Also contracts and orbs are just dumb

[obsidian venture]

I truly doubt that is the reason

[fossil epoch]

Atleast they said they wont be brining in those again

[obsidian venture]

You might be confusing "crying" with criticism

As the base boss was good

[fossil epoch]

FWIW i dont think there is a single type of player who doesnt cry when they dont get updates towards them, be it early/mid/late/end game players.
The difference is just that the HLC are very invested in the game and wont just quit, when they dont like whats coming, like an early player might be more inclined to do

No i think there is not "type" of player demographic that hasnt gone over critiscism into crying

A single person might not have

but the group in its entirety has

[obsidian venture]

Funny you say that but a good amount of folks in endgame generally play other games when there's nothing in game to do. Folks just comeback for updates per usual. Yeah folks do complain sure, but there wasn't much negative about the base yama besides casual players malding about droprates being nerfed, which it should some more

[hasty shard]

i have critiques personally but I can't in good faith say its worse than whisperer

[austere mulch]

If Yama was just actually duo focused and had a little more engagement p1 and p2 (p3 is great), HLC would generally be very happy with it

[neon gate]

Melee is good

Mage is red whisperer

[fossil epoch]

I guess we are just in different circles, because god have i heard people complain about how easy base yama was, and people feeling entitled to a much harder degree of gamecplay

[austere mulch]

Contracts just took the worst difficulty modifies that not a single person enjoys and added them to Yama

[hasty shard]

it reminds me a lot of whisperers flaws but more in the sense of 'this is like if they fixed whisperer sucking shit'

[austere mulch]

So yes, it’s hard and that’s great. But it’s not the hard that anybody wants

[viscid kayak]

"shardss"?

[neon gate]

He said that pre release you just didn't read it

[true talon]

You don’t like medic that kills you and heals the boss to full of you fail to kill 140 hp mob in 12 ticks while being able to splash.

Imagine if swarms had 200 hp and you could miss lmao

Add mechanics are only good if you benefit from dealing with them. Currently your only benefit is you die if you ignore them.

Imagine phosani sleep walkers with 50 hp and enough defense to possibly hit 0

[hard axle]

Nah, contracts were just poorly designed and were always planned to be released on their schedule

Blaming a buggy release on the players is nonsensical. Had nothing with them panicking because players wanted release and they could’ve delayed until properly tested.

[tender harness]

the fuck am I reading

[tender harness]

no no you dont get it. its the HLCs fault they got the update they wanted its skill issues clearly

[fossil epoch]

I do indeed think the playerbase is crying too much, and that updates reflect this

[tender harness]

that is a wild ass take

[bleak crag]

So last of poll 84 this week yeah? Surely?
Waiting for bonfires update and ether chiseling 🤓

[tender harness]

it is perfectly valid to criticize poorly designed and balance contracts, to call that crying when nobody asked for stuff like that? is beyond bonkers

[hard axle]

Nah that’s players crying too much so now you won’t get bonfires

[tender harness]

thats crying for saying someone else is crying so no contract fixes this week

[fossil epoch]

wait when did i say that contracts were player requested?
I have been saying multiple times that contracts are bad

[fossil epoch]

I had no intention of making you mad, am sorry

[bleak crag]

Lol oh? I haven't paid attention. Crying about bonfires, or yama?

[tender harness]

you quite literally are generalizing peoples disdain for the Yama update as bitching and moaning when its people who have repeatedly asked for none of what they got. and instead its people harping its an HLC update why are you guys mad.

[hard axle]

Nah, I’m memeing about it

I have no idea about when bonfires are coming

[fossil epoch]

No worries, they are mostly reacting to me saying that the playerbase is crying.
Bonfires will come, there is a backlog of multiple things from polls we are missing

[bleak crag]

That's my concern lol. The backlog being forgotten 🤣

[fossil epoch]

Yeh, Yama is currently the priority for updates, so i wouldnt be surprised if the updates are getting postphoned until they have manpower free to complete it

Hopefully we get it this thursday though

[austere mulch]

Delve and sailing in the next 6months btw

What could possibly go wrong

[fossil epoch]

possibly sailing adding extra max lvls to other skills

[gaunt kestrel]

oh god please bin either or so you can give both adequate time i BEG

[tacit pendant]

Var p3 already delayed to summer btw

[neon gate]

I don't understand the bonfire buff myself

I already used bonfires to afk fm

They are quite strong

Didn't really need a buff

[minor whale]

They're worse XP/log and worse XP/hr by such an amount that if you use bonfires you're actively trolling yourself
5 minutes of active FM or just a game of afk WT and you're by far better than doing bonfires

That's why you almost never see anyone using them lmao

[fading maple]

Yeah 1/3 of the xp is horrendous. Its pointless currently

[minor whale]

I've seen hundreds of people training doing lines, I've legitimately seen 1 person training via bonfires and it was a level 3 in Draynor doing forestry so pretty sure it might have been a bot

[hard axle]

It’s being buffed because it’s underwhelming and no one is using it because cost per log is too prohibitive from a rarity or cost perspective.

Wintertodt not only shits out supplies, but was substantially better XP and bonfires actively remove resources from the game. If it caters to afk players, I don’t see an issue.

[hard axle]

I’ve seen like maybe 2 at crafting guild so it was just ultra rich fucks.

[kind sail]

borderline unfair/bs =/= HLC

12 minute sponge + 1 shot mechanics + failed invos rolled into an "endgame" mechanic is NOT what anyone asked for

its just about the laziest thing they could have possibly done

WHY are they still trying to push medic

for the love of all thats holy

[prime cypress]

for the "target farmable contracts" im getting half as many forfeit, glyphic and divine contracts. spec glyph doesnt feel like its 10x rate in comparison to something like bloodied blows and bind glyph seems buggy too.

in 2k black demons im at
25 bloodied
20 sensory
9 forfeit
8 glyphic
5 divine

Terrible gameplay loop, lots of items that seemingly dont work when they should do and no update on any of this until Thursday?

[fossil epoch]

No idea why they are trying to push mechanics the community have shown displeasure to, and just added more TOA mechanics, when Toa mechanics arent well liked

[kind sail]

exactly

[gaunt kestrel]

yea idk if contracts are defendable in any way

[kind sail]

they have a WHOLE discord full of amazing feedback

and they constantly shit on it

[gaunt kestrel]

maybe the prayer damage scaling one is interesting

but honestly yea they are difficult but through tedium

[fossil epoch]

Hopefully they decide to make contracts a 1 time activation this thursday, but idk if they are willing to adress the backlash that one will have aswell

[gaunt kestrel]

its like they looked at awakened dt2 bosses, and thought whisperer was the best of them

even then whisperer is just tanky - not tanky and cringe

[prime cypress]

even at 2k black demons in, if they were to say rip all your effort grinding black demons, purging contracts are a 1 time use, id still see it as a positive update, contracts, glyphs, and pretty much everything surrounding yama has been absolutely terrible. Yama base fight is super fun and repeatable though

[slender vapor]

Whisperer is pretty cringe without a shadow

[gaunt kestrel]

absolutely

[tender harness]

"Whisperer is pretty cringe" fixed

[prime cypress]

whisperer is one of the more interesting dt2 bosses, it only falls short because of the average kill times

if you dropped its hp by like 500 it'd be absolutely fine

[hard axle]

Please, please, please, just make them 1t-able

[tender harness]

medic but it kills you

is peak game play

HLC just needs skill

[kind sail]

its such a joke

dude

p3 contracts could be SO dope

have this MF run at you so you cant dono or mono, and have to flinch

THATS strategy, thats fun

have judges on both sides pissing fire at you the entire time

simply adding more orbs is NOT skillful

its fucking annoying

excuse my language but my good GOD this is ridiculous

[gaunt kestrel]

yea idk the design process behind this release

[kind sail]

could have made it like a full on osrs bullet hell like gungeon on BOI

[gaunt kestrel]

but i'd really like to hear the vision

[kind sail]

i dont understand

I think arcane needs a break for a bit

[tender harness]

have judges actualy judge you, if you use the wrong prayer they smite you and you lose protection prayers for 10 game ticks

[gaunt kestrel]

in no universe should we have recreated medic but worse

maybe they're conflating tedium w difficulty

but then, tedium can be difficult, difficulty doesnt have to be tedious

wcyd

[tacit pendant]

Its psychologically difficult.

[kind sail]

not even

[gaunt kestrel]

yea i guess

[kind sail]

i would put that as like 3rd on the list tbh lol

[gaunt kestrel]

it's only psychologically difficult by merit of being overtuned

its not like 1st cape tier psychologically difficult

[kind sail]

not even a little bit

my friends that im watching do bloodied blows and those tier contracts

like they make a 1 tick mistake on some bs and they just die, complete wipe

ridiculous

[tacit pendant]

Im imagining they nerf the contract fights a bit on thursday

[kind sail]

they need an entire reworkl

genuinely

this is rushed garbage

[tacit pendant]

Unsure if drop rates are changed again

[kind sail]

complete "endgame" slop

[gaunt kestrel]

the dream update would be fight rework and shards to untradeable

[tacit pendant]

We will get a 10% defense decrease ans 20% hp reduction and thats it

[kind sail]

got banned for calling out the idea of contracts last week stupid and got banned for a week on the osrs reddit

[gaunt kestrel]

but alas, even i can't cope forever

[kind sail]

and here we are

its worse than stupid

[gaunt kestrel]

you must've used some very flavorful language to get banned LOL

[tacit pendant]

I doubt anything besides tuning numbers happens, and after a few weeks of it being out were locked in cuz others had to suffer and its a cosmetic

[kind sail]

"theres no way you guys would do something so stupid right"

[slender vapor]

Just saying though, p3 the entire fight and some added mechanics, chop down on the stats and the bulk, hardmode yama could be a really great fight

[kind sail]

stupid was the only "bad" word I used 💀

actually I said fing stupid but alas

god bless them

they coped incredibly hard and now this is what we get

[gaunt kestrel]

i dont mean this to be said in like a malicious way

but i wonder if nox regrets not testing contracts

[kind sail]

after that big reddit post he made

[gaunt kestrel]

he is working on delve

[kind sail]

the most professional crashout ive ever seen

[gaunt kestrel]

so the cope lives on

[kind sail]

i would bet he would have been there to test in hindsight

[obsidian venture]

Will probably send contracts Thursday if they fix the rates

[kind sail]

no one at jagex can even sniff what nox can do which is incredibly telling

nothing we can do man other than cope

all we can hope for is going forward, they actually listen to people

[gaunt kestrel]

i mean apparently no one at jagex can sniff human solo times

so actually wcyd

[kind sail]

when I said 8 minutes is going to be way too long, people called me stupid

inb4 6 minute kc solo within 1 hour of release

[tender harness]

good thing stackable clues of 5 will solve this

[tacit pendant]

Whatever testing they do, they should just cut the number they come up with by 30%

[gaunt kestrel]

i'm still curious how the disparity between the "team avg time" and the player time by end-day 1 was so radically different

[kind sail]

incredible skill issue

[gaunt kestrel]

i mean, even bar skill issue

you just plug monster stats in a calc

and run your dps against it and see an expected ttk

[kind sail]

tbf

i dont think jagex expected anyone to figure out melee immediately

or efficient mage strats

[tacit pendant]

The boss does not stop you from attacking very much so yeah, dps calc works wonders here

[tender harness]

nobody asked though for a 10 - 15 minute TTK boss

[kind sail]

which is more telling than anything

[tender harness]

like who the fuck wants a boss that long

where P1 and P2 are

[kind sail]

they need to look at PNM

if its longer than PNM, they need to rework that shit

PNM should be the absolute bar

[tacit pendant]

This boss is perfect phone lunch break gaming

[kind sail]

for length

[tacit pendant]

Thats about it

[gaunt kestrel]

well even so you could just run 5t max shadow for p3 (no atk cd reduction)

and get a significantly better time than 8mins

[austere mulch]

Just don’t forget that they said they would never revisit invocations because of how bad the were implemented and, by extension, received

Only to proceed with copy pasting literally the worst aspects of toa’s invocation system into contracts

[gaunt kestrel]

honestly in hindsight the colo ones are chiller

[tacit pendant]

Collo does it mostly right. (Rip totemic)

[kind sail]

this 1000%

theyve known for YEARS. no excuses

we shouldnt give them even an inch anymore

[slender vapor]

Enough toa scaling

[dusty shore]

they need to make the oathplate aquisition contract give yama +10% health and drop the complete set

[austere mulch]

I think a lot of the issue is them being afraid to communicate with the community because of how toxic it can be. But also, by not communicating with the community, you end up with stuff like contracts which only makes things worse

[slender vapor]

They really just need to tone down the tank stats, and crank up mechanics

[kind sail]

Also, please everyone keep in mind that Goblin said they will not do an orb/contract based system again

hold them to account

[gaunt kestrel]

i mean kieren said they wouldnt do invos again

so

[kind sail]

ugh

idk why they do this to themselves

[austere mulch]

Like they surely know contracts were cooked from the jump

[kind sail]

they give into the toxic positivity from 1500 totals

and then this is what happens

[tender harness]

I think we should add kephri medic with re-entry on one more boss just to validate the communities hatred

[tacit pendant]

1500s literally dont even know they dont have the quest reqs done

[kind sail]

a level 70 farming 1500 total got demonic digger removed from delve

anything is fucking possible with this community

[tender harness]

demonic digger wasnt even an issue

which is wild

[kind sail]

insane

[austere mulch]

Hard mode content would see a significant quality improvement if the base content was released, they allowed players to get in there and work out metas, and then took feedback from those metas and/or from players to make adjustments to make the harder version

[kind sail]

still the best self gaslighting Ive ever seen in my life. Jagex masterclass

[austere mulch]

As opposed to “we did this before and that was hard, so let’s slap it on here too”

[kind sail]

the actual base yama fight is actually solid, like a 7 or 8/10

literally EVERYTHING else about it, the duo aspect, contracts, drops is complete garbage

[slender vapor]

Free my digger

I want it so bad

I'm actually still so mad they removed it

[kind sail]

yo lmao

[tacit pendant]

Fuck it, thursdays update adds mind the gap

[hard axle]

Yeah, I’d argue that hmt and cm are examples of this

even though hmt also has additional bs mechanics, its miles better than awakened bosses and contracts

[tender harness]

Cms but the drop rates are worse

[slender vapor]

And it trains bad habits for normal tob

[hard axle]

donofly is the one reason I don’t lose my mind at Yama and contracts largely killing it is awful

[hard axle]

Yeah rewards balance is bad for both imo

The harder version should be better

Per hour

[hard axle]

Yep, but contract Yama also gives you ptsd for normal Yama if you go back

[slender vapor]

Please sir, more toa 600 scaling

[hard axle]

I found myself flicking prayers way too fucking early because contracts is all 2 prayers change

[gaunt kestrel]

i still cope that one day they'll tune the toilet paper rate from cm to be lower

[kind sail]

thats why the base fight is good

[gaunt kestrel]

but they gave cox a touchup last year

so we wont revisit until like 2030

[slender vapor]

2026 the year of fixing all the shit they leave behind

[hard axle]

Ancestral 2.0 is coming and it’ll eat up ancy cloths to upgrade. That’ll fix ancy for irons since dupes are good.

[slender vapor]

[austere mulch]

Nofly/3t p3 is super free to learn with visual metronome tbh

After you do it 5 or 6 times, the timing is second nature kinda. Since it’s similar to p3 verz

[slender vapor]

They did irons so dirty with virtus

[austere mulch]

Being 7t*

[hard axle]

Readjust the times for bonus points and double or triple the 5k to 15k a person.

[tender harness]

ancestral 2.0 is tied to bloody blows 2.0

[hard axle]

Trio would be 150k points instead of 120k points

[austere mulch]

Still waiting for those new/rotating toa invos and drop rate revisit

And infinite waves colosseum

[slender vapor]

I'd like to see another visit of toa, with like a legitimate intent to fix the criticisms

Fix the absurd 8 man scaling, cut down on the stat bloat
Add more invocations

[neon gate]

626262626389 lesser demons

[gaunt kestrel]

waiting for inq 2.0 to drop and sink inq pieces and for irons to mald

[slender vapor]

God forbid something besides fang and shadow want to do anything in toa

[gaunt kestrel]

scaling at toa is just kinda crazy across the board imo, not limited to high scales

[slender vapor]

High scaled is definitely the biggest offender for driving the prices down the way they are

[gaunt kestrel]

yea i'd prefer dealing with the entire problem as opposed to just 1 part of the problem is what i meant :p

like a 400 takes 3 whole braincells to complete

[slender vapor]

I assumed a sweeping change of scaling

Solo and group

[gaunt kestrel]

and you get a better rate than like a cm

but that's what you get when you want to make the raid "worth doing" at lower invos

[slender vapor]

The raid also sucks so much ass pre fang/shadow

[gaunt kestrel]

what capped defence drain does to a human being

[remote flint]

Hopefully update will bring the Rev Emblem Breakdown into the game this week……

[slender vapor]

I just hope they stop scaling difficulty like that

It's kind of the lazy approach

[icy relic]

I find ToA so goddamn frustrating

[slender vapor]

Stats bigger does not make a better fight than more mechanics

[icy relic]

I can't do more than a run at a time but I can sit down and do colosseum all day

[slender vapor]

You play perfectly the whole time, or you just get immediately killed while just being too tanky of a fight. The exact reason people hate contract yama

[icy relic]

You're not expected to farm contract yama a billion times though

[slender vapor]

Uhhh, that's what the extra loot contracts were for

People want to farm it

[icy relic]

the acquisition one looks good though

[gaunt kestrel]

1nd content is waste of dev time

[slender vapor]

It's just needlessly frustrating currently

[icy relic]

it's what people asked for, p3 all the time with firebombs ragging the arena like a wow raid

[gaunt kestrel]

which is why people complain that awakened dt2 bosses are gatekept by orbs

cause they're fun

contract yama

is actually not even fun

so its 1nd AND bad

[sacred skiff]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/768445850958823424/1376913051655340153/image.png?ex=68370db5&is=6835bc35&hm=877aa9d85654a2c63df8d166e2b0c1bfab2b89217f22ed9e95d810fa416970b8&

Such an accurate update post name lol

[kind sail]

calm before the rushed shit storm

[slender vapor]

Truly prophetic

[icy relic]

at some point you run out of "fair" ways of killing players when the game is so understood that people have completely scripted base yama within a day

[kind sail]

hella need to go back to basics

[icy relic]

but there's a broader question about what difficulty is even supposed to mean in a game like this

I heard from plenty of folks that they wanted to see content gnomemonkey would die to repeatedly and they got their wish, at what cost

[gaunt kestrel]

ik you're probably not referring to this as to why contract yama is bad

but that's definitely a cop out

[slender vapor]

It was painful watching that tbh

I was getting tilted for gnome

[hard axle]

Bro please. If ToA could be reduced to 0 defense, scythe would be used at Akkha, Zebak, and Baba at minimum.

[gaunt kestrel]

like there's definitely some semblance of jagex being able to cook

[hard axle]

fang would still be relevant in solos

because you can’t reduce down consistently by yourself

but teams should be better than 8 people soloing separately

[hard axle]

It’s wild that mains are saying this more often than irons lol

[kind sail]

when a B/C tier pvmer with a large following tries actual hard content

[gaunt kestrel]

yea toa reward scaling is just in the bin

[gaunt kestrel]

like im shit at toa so i will have to defer to the boards of gamers

but zebak has literally like

4 mechanics

theres no way it should be 5min long

[hard axle]

Yeah, I tapped out at a few 540s so I’ll let them argue why for 5 minutes is acceptable with no change

[gaunt kestrel]

honestly i think the bosses just need to be shorter

for the methods they give you to interact w them

[tacit pendant]

One and done is not a waste of dev time, as clearly no dev time was put into this one and done

[slender vapor]

Stop bloating the hp/defense and that gets fixed

[icy relic]

I hate Akkha so much

[slender vapor]

I legit hated kephri more

[icy relic]

(no shadow)

[slender vapor]

Undergeared iron

[icy relic]

I didn't know I hated kephri until I did it with my friends

that shit makes one not have friends quickly

[gaunt kestrel]

imo the play is to reduce hp scaling/bloat to speed up the raid, and then adjust scaling to reflect similar pph

but alas

not a toer so will defer

[icy relic]

just cap the drop rates earlier

[unreal plover]

would be cool to hear from jagex today

[icy relic]

idk if this is an unpopular opinion but like I am okay with the raid being easier as long as you put in the hours, plenty of vanity items from 500+ for people to grab if they want

[tacit pendant]

Kephri might actually be the most team oriented boss in all of toa, would vastly prefer more of toa ask teams to coordinate.

[icy relic]

but we can't have this shit where the god gamers are getting purps every 5 raids

[kind sail]

4 kephris would unironically be a goated raid

[slender vapor]

8 apes together in a room, it's gonna get wild

Teamwork? What's teamwork

[tacit pendant]

Zebak could like actually make teams use multiple rocks and have to work a small amount for shockwave puzzle

Baba could switch tank and make people actually do the boulder mechanics instead of 1 guy red xing the whole fight an 7 guys going afk

[icy relic]

You would have to make Baba not melee for a billion damage through prayer

[gaunt kestrel]

baba peak boss fight

no way to prevent getting slammed 20s through melee prot

great content

[icy relic]

it's not fun teamwork anyway where everyone has a responsibility like in tob

[tacit pendant]

Simply bring justi

[icy relic]

it's just fall guys shit where you frag your teammates

and there's very little way to communicate it due to the randomness of where boulders fall

[gaunt kestrel]

i feel like thats just a byproduct of trying to make content that caters to all

[tacit pendant]

Genuinly if we couldnt red x. Blood fury + torva/justi would be play

[gaunt kestrel]

otherwise you'd have to literalyl design like multiple different bosses

theres a universe out there where toa is not made for billybobs

(ig that means theres also a universe out there where toa is made only for billybobs )

[icy relic]

I'm just mad about shadow existing in its current state

how people complained about magic being too strong in rs2 while we have this abomination

[gaunt kestrel]

they did say the would "look at shadow"

during the summer

so

[slender vapor]

They at least said, before the next mage upgrade, after delve, they will fix shadow

[icy relic]

and how it forces me to do ToA even though I hate it so much it makes me not want to play the game

[slender vapor]

We made such a shit storm about that

They actually broke their silence on shadow

[icy relic]

I think osto-ayak will smooth out whisperer kill times a bit but idk if it'll accomplish anything beyond that

shadow just breaks all the rules by allowing you to mage things that aren't mageable otherwise

let's just give it 80k acc

versus trident's what, 25k?

[hard axle]

I still think ayak should be 100% accuracy on its spec

It’s not broken because it only reduces down to 0 bonus magic defense at the very most

[tender harness]

you know what fixes kephri?

medic

[tacit pendant]

Shadow isnt that crazy up against other megas, it also does the intended thing of filling your inv up with mage gear.

[small anvil]

Shadow is crazy vs other mage weapons mostly

And on the accuracy front

[slender vapor]

The issue is magic gear sucks ass, needs to be adjusted and shadow is the stick up the ass preventing actual change

[austere mulch]

It’s just a 8/10 everywhere

Where tbow/scy is like 10/10 or 0/10 depending on the content

[slender vapor]

Shadow isn't that bad, YET

[small anvil]

Shadow prevents them from making more gear yeah

[slender vapor]

But to unfuck magic gear, you'd make shadow a tactical nuke

[small anvil]

Any change just increases the gap between shadow and not

[tender harness]

@kind sail guess that 1500 total doesnt exist

[kind sail]

where even is that lol

[tender harness]

its on reddit

[kind sail]

link me

because the post that blew up

was from a 1500 total

[tender harness]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1kwp60m/this_community_baffles_me/

[kind sail]

theres no way theyre gaslighting their way out of it

[pastel cairn]

a cool mechanic would be a boss that when hitting you with a spell, you are dealt damage each time you increase the distance/number of tiles away from the tile you were originally on when hit.

[tacit pendant]

This is strictly not true. Shadow prevents them from making gear for trident and sang

Very very simple to add stuff like virtus for standard spells, harm and twinflame will ofc go crazy with something like that. A permanent upgrade for shadow and smoke spells or veng would be cool.

[small anvil]

i think you mean not strictly true?

[tacit pendant]

Sure, i feel like you may have understood what i meant

[small anvil]

flipping the words changes the meaning totally lol

[pastel cairn]

or the tone rather lol

[small anvil]

didnt mean to nitpick on wording, just tryign to figure out which you meant

[tacit pendant]

I mean, its completly and fully untrue.

In every way.

[small anvil]

oh then you said it the way you intended

[tacit pendant]

Even if they make 4% ancestral, they are allowed to do that still

[small anvil]

and i disagree with your claim of totality

[tacit pendant]

And they have other options

[small anvil]

the gauntlet shows that they are handcuffed by shadows scaling

and that they're trying (and failing) to work around it

[gaunt kestrel]

honestly powered staves are just giga cracked

[small anvil]

virtus and what, twinflame? is basically the only things that they did to try to avoid the shadow's scaling

[gaunt kestrel]

we even got an arceus buff with double dc

[small anvil]

part of the problem is the normalization of % dmg

melee/ranged have flat bonuses

meaning faster weapons can scale at a rate closer to the mega

[tacit pendant]

They have both percentage and flat str for other comabat styles. They have elemental weaknesses, they can powercreep ward.

[small anvil]

there's no % str gear

only the prayers

or like a set bonus i guess with void/slayer helm

SRA is inherent to the weapon

[tacit pendant]

Sorry

[small anvil]

inq is a set bonus as is void

[tacit pendant]

Sra, inq, void

[small anvil]

and those percents are tiny

the main scaling is flat str

[gaunt kestrel]

the humble each piece 0.5%!

[small anvil]

fast weapons scale better with flat str

[tacit pendant]

It still exists, and inq is by piece. If those can be exceptions to melees "rule" mage CAN make exceptions

They just havent done that

And might not

[small anvil]

i mean they could make % str gear sure, but the vast majority of gear is flat str based

[tacit pendant]

Im not even fully saying shadow isnt problematic entirely. But jagex has options

[small anvil]

and there's a catchup mechanic that makes the scaling less egregious of an advantage for the megas

based on that

[slender vapor]

Ngl, occult caught massive shit for doing what strength ammy does, just for magic instead

[small anvil]

scythe scales at 175%, but is 5 tick

[tacit pendant]

Tbow also scales crazy but so does bp so its fine

[small anvil]

tbow scales at 350% total, but is 5 tick while bp is 2tick and scales at 100%

shadow scales at 300% whle all other magic scales at 100% with no advantage from ticks

[tacit pendant]

Imagine if eye could cast like shadow barrage at 3t instead of being a powered staff. Bam virtus goes nuts

[slender vapor]

Take it off the little ones drop table, and 10% magic is fine on a necklace, i'd argue ancestral could have its damge % doubled and be just fine

[small anvil]

the scaling differential is insane

if you normalize bp's scaling to 5t, it's 250% scaling

[tacit pendant]

It is insane, 2x and 2.5x in raid would have been better

[small anvil]

SRA scales at 130%

and melee 4t when normalize to 5t dmg scaling would be 125%

[tacit pendant]

Jagex can make elemental armor sets and problem solved for like 1-4 mid game boss releases. But then they have to address harm being non-existent to irons

[small anvil]

the gap is insane and it makes making any gear upgrades have to be incredibly contorted to NOT benefit shadow

otherwise shadow just leaves every other mage option in the dust

[gaunt kestrel]

i feel like at this point, its less work than to just tune shadow

[small anvil]

cuz otherwise you get shadow owners whining about buffs not helping shadow

[tacit pendant]

Tuning shadow is pretty hard though tbf

[small anvil]

(dont gauntlets add a lot for shadow simply by having more mage % str?)

[tacit pendant]

Yes

[gaunt kestrel]

ye, gaunt + boots were like 4 maxes iirc

[small anvil]

like it maintains the gap from other weapons

even tho it doesnt even benefit from the passive

[tacit pendant]

Im literally putting off getting fang kit for this summer because fuck toa and 10% more shadow dps in raid is gonna rip

[small anvil]

like they go through so many hoops to make shadow not benefit, and it just scales better anyway

[tacit pendant]

Like this idea for example still has you bringing a bunch of gear everywhere and isnt overly complicated/wordy as far as reading it and understanding what it does. But its not 100% clean, nothing is.

[small anvil]

to match other megas in terms of the gap between them and the 2nd best option, shadow would need to benefit with like only 50% extra

and have its base power bumped up to compensate

[tacit pendant]

Retrospectively, 2x scaling was the most that could ever be appropriate

[small anvil]

or like make it only triple accuracty benefit and not be as crazy a multiplier on mage str

[tacit pendant]

Yeah that would have been good too

[small anvil]

which would make it bad as a 1 way switch still i think?

cuz so much gear has negative magic bonus

[slender vapor]

Super accuracy is fine

[tacit pendant]

Not for collo/yama

[slender vapor]

It's a tank breaker

But it's damage AND super accuracy is too much

[small anvil]

guaranteed max hits not what i'm concerned about haha

i dont think the absolute dps of shadow is too insane

[tacit pendant]

It would change metas anywhere u guarantee a max hit. Whether you are ok with that or not up to u.

[small anvil]

the problem is the gap between shadow and option #2

[tacit pendant]

Eye will actually be cracked as hell

[slender vapor]

The new magic blowpipe does help

Even using it 4t it beats sang

[small anvil]

ya they just made the new weapon cracked baseline

[slender vapor]

You can not be tick perfect and still out damage sang

[tacit pendant]

Sangs healing should benefit from bloodbark or virtus more imo

Atleast it becomes like an afk / nooby sustain weapon

[gaunt kestrel]

2018 weapon wcyd

[hard axle]

Sang healing shouldn’t be so damn weak if it’s only +1 over swamp

[gaunt kestrel]

where 1max hit and healing was enough upgrade

[hard axle]

God

[gaunt kestrel]

[hard axle]

[gaunt kestrel]

honestly ik some people don't care about sang and trident and whatnot being left in the dust because the 3t wand is coming into the game

but i'd like for them to be reasonably adjusted

[tacit pendant]

Idc about trident. But sang is from tob. Pleaseeee

[gaunt kestrel]

magic just needs a looking to

the redistribution of mage dmg% was barely a rebalance

[tacit pendant]

Tbh, damage shouldnt be the focus, i wish theyd focus more on utility. The Heka had some fun utility and team stuff that would have been cool as individual rewards or spells

Functionally, whisperer is the only boss where you don't have a great alternative to shadow as of today. Bofa and shadow are just both accurate damage sticks with pretty long range that do work at toa and gwd.

[slender vapor]

ToB needs a look at, justicar sang and rapier are unreasonably weak for coming from the hardest raid

[tacit pendant]

Vampire final quest line give us an untradeable sang upgrade ornate handle or some shit to make it 3t or like double the healing, idk jagex

I think ripping the bandaid off worked well for Elder Maul. Were some people let down by missing the merching window or whatever, sure. But I think the majority of players today feel like it was worth it.

[compact flicker]

5t elder maul when

[hard axle]

I want the ultimate afk machine

Let me fuse sang passive with shadow

[hard axle]

Why justi deserves more

If shitty ass perilous moons gear gets +4 str

Justi should be +4 as well

And defense reduction

[slender vapor]

Bandos can afford to take a small price hit

[hard axle]

It won’t because it’s tied to Torva always

and if anything

We fuse Bandos and justi

Then fuse it with Torva

[compact flicker]

Then you sell all your brews because you will never take damage

[tacit pendant]

Remove phosanis p1 and p2 (-1/3 inq ttc), add a forge in blood moon rises to fortify inq+justi into tank crush armor, harm is now accesible to irons, make elemental bosses where shadow isnt bis. Problem solved

[hard axle]

Justi doesn’t work on so many damage mechanics

People don’t realize this but Christ is justi useless because it’s core effect is just fucked over if it’s not a direct attack

[compact flicker]

So stuff like mutta stomp wont be reduced?

[austere mulch]

Add 1 str to each Torva piece gets to the exact threshold needed with treads to be 52 scythe scb max, making it more competitive with oath

[cursive vector]

If were adding scy maxhits can we also please get back the 1minhit that was originally proposed instead of this 0->1 bs? 😭

[hard axle]

Yep yep

[hard axle]

Wasn’t that with a new necklace though

[obsidian venture]

This tbh. Tired of “aspirational” content being like this. People should aspire to progress and get better.