leagues-general

[meager mango]

i just dont see how u get to that number

[cursive edge]

will be about 38 dps in my planned setup

with 100% accuracy

so scales down from there based on tankiness

most things will be 90%+ accu tho

but you can go to like 42 dps maybe without doing the thorns stuff

and with kandarin

[meager mango]

ur maxing mage but you dont have any prayer bonus

[cursive edge]

why do i need pray bonus?

[meager mango]

penetration I mean

my bad

[cursive edge]

yeah ive ignored that stat tbf

whats it useful for?

just some echo bosses potentially?

[meager mango]

hitting stuff through prayer

[cursive edge]

yeah but what has prayer

[tacit oyster]

prayer pen mainly for desert, hunleff and echo bosses

[cursive edge]

right

well not going desert or tiranwn

so its just down to echo bosses

[sterile pewter]

dinny b is a heavy weapon and a shield right? so it could proc blind bag and you could get crazy burst damage with the scythes. You could have four scythes (one charged, one uncharged, and two with the kits charged and uncharged) and do a boat load of damage while being unkillable

[cursive edge]

not all have prayer either right

tbf tho i was gonna go frem, and they do have prayer

[cursive edge]

well you can do DFS + a 1h heavy weapon too

but imo the light weapon stuff with echo dagger is better dps than blindbag, from my calculations

[meager mango]

Dont know echo dagger yet

[sterile pewter]

Yeah it might do more dps. But i'm also going for survivability. I want to not have to use the safe spots and just stand in the middle of the waves in inferno and not die and just self heal off everything lol

[meager mango]

Can calc d claws if you like

[meager mango]

Did you calc this with wiki dps calc

[cursive edge]

so 123 magic from +10 on pact and saturated heart

Gives sang a 40 base max hit, add 2.3 from the fire regen stuff. Subtract 8 from the pact node, so 34.3 max hit.

Then with my BiS gear + 1% dmg nodes on tree, I reach 28% magic damage. Add 4% from augury

So 34.3 * 1.32 = 45

So 45 max hit at 1 tick speed is

(45/2)/0.6 = 37.5 dps

[cursive edge]

yes, but had to manually account for the +2.3 'max hits' from fire regen

and the battlehat

[meager mango]

Wiki dps calc says 38dps?

[cursive edge]

assuming its 5% magic dmg

wiki dps calc says 35.838, but again its not factoring in the fire rune regen node and a battlehat

[meager mango]

I mean sounds like ud be better off just maxing sang instead of bothering w thorns ngl

[cursive edge]

I was initially just maxing thorns, but

i mean sang

but adding in thorns seems better

its not even many extra points

and it means i swap from kandarin to wildy

which is more fun

all wildy content will be insane with thammarons

[meager mango]

Adding full tank will fuck up your accurracy too much you'll be relying purely on the 50% tile

[cursive edge]

the thorns adds lets say 8dps vs a typical 4 atk speed boss

not full tank

wearing full mage gear

battlehat + arcane shield adds a lot of the tank

and fury

Imbued god cape, fury, arcane shield, confliction gauntlets, avernics, magus ring, virtus top/bottom, battlehat

[meager mango]

Thats wildy desert fremmy right

[cursive edge]

Nah mory

Wildy Mory Fremmy

[meager mango]

No god cape then

[cursive edge]

Mory for sang of course. Also theres the GG echo powered staff

which could be insane

Err, god capes are from wildy right?

[meager mango]

Wait you said wiley mory fremmy

What dt2 boss is in mory

[cursive edge]

Duke in Fremmy, Vard in Varlamore

[meager mango]

Right

[cursive edge]

admittedly both are not weak to magic at all

but ill manage

with thammaron and ayak specs

[meager mango]

Vard in kourend tho iirc

[cursive edge]

1t sang and 2% spec recovered per attack

means i get full spec every 30s

nah vard is 100% varlamore

[meager mango]

Stranglewood boat is kourend access no

U still have duke anyway

[cursive edge]

theres some other way to get there

[meager mango]

Doesnt matter

[cursive edge]

vard is for sure varlamore

says on wiki

i went varlamore last league

[tacit oyster]

mountain guide took you to strangle wood previously and vard is listed under varlamore again

[lapis flax]

vard is varla ye

stranglewood is in varla but you can get there by going south of cox but its not part of kourend

[meager mango]

Ic

[cursive edge]

can you get duke/vard as slayer tasks?

[meager mango]

Yeah boss slayer

[lapis flax]

yes but not awakened

[cursive edge]

ok neat

looks like im still gonna do like 28 dps to vardorvis with magic lmfao

if thammaron spec lands

[meager mango]

Doesnt matter

Always reduces def

[cursive edge]

wiki says

'upon a successful hit'

[meager mango]

Wait really

Man

[cursive edge]

spec will have 74% accuracy tho

and i can spec twice per kill cause i refill full spec from 2% per hit

man i cant wait for this shit lol, gonna be so good

[meager mango]

Oh its the ether that gets consumed whether it hits or not mb

[cursive edge]

lel

but that should get refunded eh

regenerated

[meager mango]

I think im gonna max out hunters crossy with echos

[shadow badger]

Does iban's staff recharge charges?

[sterile pewter]

It should have a chance too

It says any weapon charges. So it should give charges back for that

[shadow badger]

And will it trigger fire rune pacts?

I assume not

[tacit oyster]

its spell that consumes fire runes so it would trigger fire rune regen pact, not counting as fire spell though

[sterile pewter]

I dont think so. I dont think its a fire spell. It was for like one day. But people did horrible things to the money snake

[shadow badger]

Wasn't that flames of Zamorak?

[sterile pewter]

You're right

my bad lol

my memory is going. im cooked chat

[shadow badger]

Dementia invocation

[fluid sail]

Are Jagex information releases generally at the same time each day?

[shadow badger]

Yea

[fluid sail]

Which is?

[cursive edge]

should be in like 20 mins

[fluid sail]

Oh pog

[cursive edge]

some1 told me 15:00 UTC

wait

its 13:38

so 1h 20

oh god its 12:38 UTC?

[shadow badger]

It's 2h 20 min

[cursive edge]

daylight savings got me

[cinder cedar]

Do we exactly know how we will get the 40 spendable points?

[tacit oyster]

https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/demonic-pacts---overview?oldschool=1 has list for each regions pact point unlock tasks

[tacit oyster]

basically depends on which regions you choose and when you can complete all the tasks for pact points

[cursive edge]

Hmm so I'll unlock wildy first, rush a Thammarons, need like 9 points or so on the tree for 1 tick speed, 80% charge regen, and tons of healing from water regen

And be op as hell day 1

nevermind the part where I have to kill thousands of revenants in potato gear 🙂

yeah nvm gotta get tier 4 to start going for drops

[tacit oyster]

from what i understood region unlocks come later this league compared to before

even karamja would be multiple hours of gameplay

[shadow badger]

I think Karamja is locked behind 80 or 90 tasks

[cursive edge]

yooo hold up

since trident requires fire runes to charge

does it give fire regen bonuses?

[tacit oyster]

you can add charged stave regenerate 1 fire rune per shot. wont regen from rune usage

[cinder cedar]

ty boss

[smoky raft]

good morning chat. I just dreamt it was the day immediately before leagues rather than the 5 days before leagues

[cursive edge]

yeah rip, doesnt seem like it would

[smoky raft]

shit was fucked

[cursive edge]

fire runes are spent to charge it, not to cast the spell

[smoky raft]

you will regen staff charges though, so at least you won't have to worry about charging nearly as much

80% chance to save = x5 longer without charging

[cursive edge]

ye

gonna get 110%

wonder if the 50% chance to roll max accuracy gets rolled twice via confliction gauntlets

lol magic does full dmg to corp beast, how convenient

[toxic vortex]

what else should I be looking at for relatively easy 2hs for blindbag

[smoky raft]

regions?

[toxic vortex]

MT so far

but i'm thinking like, early on

M might be my last region

[void jewel]

It is just me or is there very little healing outside of ancients?? No red shark either

[toxic vortex]

there are other healing methods on the board

[smoky raft]

Dual Macuahuitl,
The three nagua dual wields,
Dragon Halberd,
Dharok / Torag / Guthan weap

[toxic vortex]

Yeah I guess the boppers

[void jewel]

Bossing is going to be annoying with such little healing pacts

[smoky raft]

1. They confirmed the last T6 relic will be oriented at defensive combat
2. It really depends on your build

[fluid sail]

Oh boy do I have a relic for you

[smoky raft]

The only healing pact I'm taking is +2 health and prayer whenever I get hit a 0

[tacit oyster]

healing pacts are thorns, melee and water mage

2hp and 2 prayer from getting hit 0 does work on any build though if you reach it

[smoky raft]

(does require a shield though)

[shadow badger]

Doesn't work for halberds

[tacit oyster]

for ranged im probably relying on onyx bolt (e) healing

[old tapir]

do you mean t8? because only t8 relics are combat related

[toxic vortex]

hespori bow is supposed to heal

[smoky raft]

I believe they said T6

but it might be T8

[shadow badger]

Well they said T6 was defensive so up to them

[old tapir]

that would be weird

[smoky raft]

it was on the stream somewhere

[tacit oyster]

t6 is defensive relic

[smoky raft]

I mean culling spree is effectively a combat relic

[old tapir]

not really

[shadow badger]

Grimoire too

[tacit oyster]

t8 will be something that also works in gauntlet like the other 2 options

so probably last 2 are both something that affect combat

[void jewel]

I need to see how good the hespori bow will be before i make final decisions

[old tapir]

i would call grim and culling like... auxillery combat things

[shadow badger]

Hope it's good because hespori's penar was ass

[old tapir]

they give you something you could have gotten yourself

[smoky raft]

Alright weird question time

• While the effects that occur on rune regen specify that they only happen during combat, the regen effect itself is worded to include all spells
• Trnasmutation will cost 1 nature rune, and an infinite source of nature runes is provided

will casting transmute provide free extra nature runes

[old tapir]

they don't revolutionize things

[shadow badger]

Defense is the same thing

[smoky raft]

nobody's saying the last T6 will revolutionize things either

[toxic vortex]

I mean

Husky did

[old tapir]

so what's a cool thing you could have gotten yourself

[smoky raft]

He called it a "banger"

so yeah ig

[smoky raft]

Defenders? Justiciar? That one spirit shield?

[old tapir]

passive justi doesn't seem like enough for a whole relic

[fluid sail]

Yes it will

They mentioned it on stream yesterday that with regen you can actually profit by alching nature runes

[smoky raft]

lmao

infinite money glitch but it takes 4 years

[old tapir]

golden god but its that one invincible meme

[toxic vortex]

Apparently the wiki dps calc has been updated btw

[potent quail]

whats the easiest powered staff you can get?

is there one in varlamore?

[toxic vortex]

Dont think so

[bleak depot]

Easiest powered staff is probably trident but that’s 87 slay

Or trident from zulrah

[meager mango]

Eye of ayak in varlamore but thats kinda ehhh to get

[bleak depot]

Think imma just take mory first and do tob

[meager mango]

Not that difficult not that east

[bleak depot]

Sang probably go burr

[meager mango]

Cant really go in with trash gear

[bleak depot]

Tob? You absolutely can

[vapid silo]

is the warped trident available?

[meager mango]

Im not talking abt tob

[bleak depot]

Warped is misthalin ain’t it ?

[vapid silo]

should be K unless the quest isn't completable

[meager mango]

Its kandarin

[smoky raft]

if you're taking kandarin you can just rush for trident though

[vapid silo]

87 is quite a lot

slayer i mean

[bleak depot]

Oh I’m taking kandarin so sceptre it is lol

[meager mango]

Not that much

[bleak depot]

Where the hell is it n kandarin for warped sceptre

Been awhile for me

[smoky raft]

Poison waste sewers

[vocal plover]

how good is earth / air mage dps in this leagues? any basic calcs done for items?

[smoky raft]

needs Path of Glouphrie to be completed though

[vapid silo]

should be completeable as far as I can tell

[bleak depot]

Air is % to max hit and earth is flat damage based on defense but i think earth has highest possible max i could be wrong.

[vapid silo]

if u want really early charged staff

[smoky raft]

The wiki dps calc now supports demonic pacts

[vocal plover]

ooooo ty

[tacit oyster]

zulrah would probably have fastest access charged staff

[bleak depot]

I’m going blood and ice though because ice converted to water with 90 percent over heal is gonna hit hard as well

[potent quail]

spam defence lvls
big max hit with earth standard spellbook spells

free prayer regen from air rune regen

air amstery will not work at all

[vapid silo]

oh right it would drop completed

[smoky raft]

would it though? Since it can be combined with 2 different items

[bleak depot]

Why you say air mastery wouldn’t work ?

Yeah sheep it’s confirmed to drop as a whole

[tacit oyster]

not sure if konar has 100 cb requirement in leagues, if no then could get slayer level for warped sceptre pretty fast too

[potent quail]

the question cam from the idea:
6 points to get the powered staff node and be instantly op witha good one

[cursive edge]

Yeah I was looking into that. If Kandarin then warped sceptre. But I'm going Wildy + Frem + Mory. So either Thammarons, or the GG Echo boss staff for me I think.

[potent quail]

but with just 6 points its kinda hard killing zulrah/doom early

[tacit oyster]

zulrah drops trident of the swamp since cannot get equipable version of drop in just tiranwan

[cursive edge]

GG echo boss staff should be easier to get than Trident, at least slayer lvl wise

[smoky raft]

Have they specifically confirmed that it will drop as a trident though?

Upgrade drops will become their lowest usable form but that item has 2 lowest usable forms- swamp trident and toxic staff of the dead

[cursive edge]

Thammarons easiest, but realistically you'll want tier 4 for 5x drop rate, and perhaps the slayer relic too for the on-task boost

[tacit oyster]

all item drops in region are in equipable version if the region cannot make them into equipable item

[smoky raft]

again, that item has 2 equippable forms

[bleak depot]

I didn’t read that part but we’ll see i suppose. Maybe i should take Tiranwynn first then

[smoky raft]

it presumably will not drop as both

[tacit oyster]

yes last time toxic staff of the death was not available at all

[bleak depot]

What’s the benefit of Asgarnia for mage ? I assume max treads and sotd but i can’t think of any other benefit unless hybrid

Anyone going full mage and which regions? I’m thinking mory tir and kandarin

[tacit oyster]

mory tiranwan kandarin is good mage gear but not really any mage content

[bleak depot]

I like tob and pnm

Rax as well

[meager mango]

If ur going pnm u might aswell go elemental honestly

[tacit oyster]

it would be pretty easy league points and easy to max skill points

[smoky raft]

twinflame staff, for one

it's a HUGE dps increase over other standard staves when using elemental spells, though with the pact system you have to keep in mind that you won't always be able to cast the element you want thanks to its passive effect

[ember wyvern]

Can you endless harvest the gemstone crab?!?

[cursive edge]

is it not a dps loss lol?

when you subtract 2 ticks from spells

[smoky raft]

I suppose I haven't really measured them against eachother

[cursive edge]

going from 3 tick to 4 tick

3t is 33% more damage than 4t

[vocal plover]

also cant surge with twinflame

[smoky raft]

right. Hm

[cursive edge]

and according to wiki twinflame adds 28% dmg

so yeah a straight up dps loss, even worse when considering alternative stsaves will have 10-15% inc dmg on em

its worse than a plain wooden stick lmao

tragic

[calm jacinth]

Varlamoon bring us your varlamore wisdom 😔 🙏

[junior violet]

I remember last leagues ToA would spit out purples for high invocation 8 player runs. How does purples work for cox again? how farmable? thinking zeah for a mage build compared to desert.

[cursive edge]

ahah

it is my home turf

[simple tapir]

Last bit of this is interesting. We will be Varla/Karamja locked for a while it seems.

[cursive edge]

I'm a varlamore locked uim

[smoky raft]

damn the dps calc doesn't account for the earth spell capstone

[tacit oyster]

cox purple is same system as before, except now toilet papers are less common in challenge mode

[old tapir]

why won't they give guaranteed purples on cm cox

i don't understand

technical reasons? it has to be

[tacit oyster]

they said not possible without adding a separate reward room to cox like in toa/tob

[junior violet]

ty! did a few small man teams in main game for cox. Hows the group dynamic for raid teams? like is it mass usually and everyone gets a purple or based on points?

[old tapir]

they should do that then

[glacial geyser]

does anyone have info on how the echo hits roll dmg?

I'm looking at dps calc for the xbow build and it seems to think echo hits always max hit too

[calm jacinth]

Id love a server that always had Leagues seasons open. Imagine getting to do multiple runs with a run summary at the end or roguelike where besting bosses opens new relics for the next run

[tacit oyster]

it doesnt think they always max hit, max hit does show them max hitting since your max hit is normal max hit + echo maxhits

[old tapir]

permanent league server would take away all the excitement of it being once every few years

but if there was one, it would need to wipe periodically

[smoky raft]

damn

honestly was not expecting the mystic smoke staff to be my strongest early-mid autocaster

[tacit oyster]

everything below that large spike is echo hit that dealt below max hit

[mint cargo]

Mory, Kandarin, Zeah

[glacial geyser]

this is rcb with diamond bolts + rigour

[old tapir]

chat its not zeah, its kourend

zeah is the whole continent

[glacial geyser]

i cant post the img

[smoky raft]

I was planning asg/kan/wil but now idk

[glacial geyser]

but it shows 75 max hit with no echoes

and 339 with echoes

[smoky raft]

in leagues contexts kourend is still regularly referred to as Zeah so it can be shortened to Z instead of K

[old tapir]

we start the league in zeah

just the southern half of zeah

[calm jacinth]

I would would have agreed in the past but the complexity has reached a critical threshold imo to make it fun multiple playthroughs

[tacit oyster]

yes and melee can max hit 2500 with echoes + blindbag in 0.001% chance, actual dps is 29

[glacial geyser]

right I see that is assuming all echoes trigger and they all max roll

but in general is an echo hit jsut another accuracy/dmg roll of the same weapon?

not reduced in any way

[tacit oyster]

doesnt proc weapon specific effect like bolt procs and always max hit but rolls with same max hit and accuracy if i understood correctly

[glacial geyser]

yeah the max hit thing specifies crossbow hits and I guess these count as echo hits

it might still inherit 2x accuracy as that is on crossbow attacks

[cursive edge]

this is without the 1t powered staff node I assume?

[smoky raft]

none of those are powered

that's accursed's autocast form

[cursive edge]

ah ok

[smoky raft]

worth noting that the earth capstone pact is NOT accounted for by the wiki rn and that's where most of my dps comes from lmao

[maiden cliff]

Surely this is where the relic idea came from

[languid mauve]

Morning

https://tenor.com/view/awake-woke-elmo-i-has-awoken-wake-gif-16298489

[cursive edge]

im doing powered staves too, but looking at like 37 dps with sang

Wildy + Fremmy + Mory

with thorns capstone as well

which would make it like 45dps vs a 4 tick enemy

[potent quail]

in what region are the echo boots?

[manic prairie]

Is the livestream info available easily? If they announced anything?

[smoky raft]

varlamore

they drop instead of echo crystals

[potent quail]

huh ok the wiki doesnt have them listed

[smoky raft]

they aren't an echo item lmao

that's just what they're called

[manic prairie]

They are in the base game

Sol is a base game echo boss

[fickle jasper]

Is there any guides about how we can make gp right off the start in varlamore?

Assuming no Abundance relic

[manic prairie]

Abundance

Larceny

Pickpocketing wealthy citizens

[potent quail]

ohXD

[manic prairie]

Idk many uses for money tho

Outside of crystal crafting or construction

[crimson topaz]

Run wines or craft some the buy gems, cut, and resell in aldrin. Follow some base Ironman stuff for it

[smoky raft]

some skills can be sped up with it

[meager mango]

https://dps.osrs.wiki?id=LinenMaggotsBriefcase this adds up to 28.2dps apparently
also you'd have to pick grimoire for augury

[potent quail]

jsut con

[maiden cliff]

Not sure there is any guides, but one can rush hunter and get it from rumours. Entirely depends on your relics whats good though

[wide veldt]

yeah what zeus said, just pickpocket things lol

[potent quail]

stealing valuables/rich citizens will be the baseline
abundance of course solves it
Mining ore and selling it may also give a bit /smithing it and HA

[tacit oyster]

abuncance best moneymaker, hotfoot into wyrm agility course is also decent. Later on transmutation or duping onyx bolts (e) with over 100% ammo regen

[maiden cliff]

People really rushing 50+ thieving that early without a relic for it?

[fickle jasper]

I'm trying to plan out how to get some gp super early on to buy some gear and supplies

Probably will just go with thieving then I guess

[maiden cliff]

whats your tier 1-4 relic plan? that matters quite a bit

[cursive edge]

you have to manually add in the +10 magic levels from the early magic tree node, and you have the wrong corp shield on

also yeah the dps numbers im quoting are assuming 100% accuracy, just because its easier to compare things that way

but between thammarons/ayak specs being abundant with 1t speed and 2% spec recharge on attack

and the 50% chance to basically guarantee a hit if im at 9 tiles

I think vs almost anything the effective accuracy will be 90+

[fickle jasper]

I've only decided on 1 (endless harvest) and 4 (transmutation)

[cursive edge]

even shit like vardorvis

[tacit oyster]

34 thieving can do death on isle to reach 50 thieving (assuming t2 relic unlocked)

[meager mango]

up to 33

[cursive edge]

9 tile range on longrange

so 5 + 9*5 = 50% chance to roll max accuracy

[meager mango]

also vardorvis is always 1 tile away

[cursive edge]

ok yeah vard will be rough

i mean not that rough

[fickle jasper]

I'm leaning towards hot foot for 2 though

[copper gorge]

I am going EH, hotfoot, evil eye, transmute.

[cursive edge]

but not as fast as builds made for it, of course

not that ill even do much vard, can just farm my gear off duke

[maiden cliff]

yeh, i see. Im going Endless Harvest, Woodsman and Transmutation, so that means that hunter is already buffed for me in tier 2, or i can make some decent money because of transmutation in tier 4, depending on how fast we get those tiers

[cursive edge]

want magus anyway

[fickle jasper]

And for 3, its either the map or evil eye

[copper gorge]

Thats my starter. Woodsman is drawing me in because of the hunter buff

[fickle jasper]

Woodsman is really tempting just because of how fast you can potentially get points

[meager mango]

36dps on whisperer

[fickle jasper]

But I really don't know if I can pass up the agility solve

[toxic vortex]

Yeah I'm still undecided on woodsman

[maiden cliff]

I have a good smithing solve, so for me, hotfoot is less good. While i gain the benefit of all the woodsman solves

[cursive edge]

yeah though i wont have occult, so 31 ish vs mole with no specs. Then add in 8 dps from thorns, slayer task bonus (i know everything can add that, but builds with lower accuracy benefit dispropritionately more)

[maiden cliff]

Woodsman solves way more than Hotfoot, but i get "i dont like agility" which only matters if you are also going for max, while not liking agility

[meager mango]

thats just accounting for fremmy helm

[shadow badger]

I'm picking woodsman since I can solve smithing with crystal seeds

and crafting

[brazen crest]

I finally decided on HF because my usual metric is “make things afk which aren’t”

[brave oracle]

Meleeing the inferno with the bluetooth hally build is possible but only from the middle right? So it would be doable, don't know how easy though

[meager mango]

also ur not getting slayer task bonus because you are going grimoire

[smoky raft]

ok so it looks like using Twinflame will still give me the best DPS after manually plugging in the earth capstone numbers.

Yeah, sure, 1 tick slower, but the doubled up flat damage makes that shit go wild. Min hit of 32 lmao

[cursive edge]

ah ok fair enough, tho it was 5% dmg in gridmaster, vs 2% of virtus mask, so youre a little over i guess. Tho theres also a bit more magic atk on the frem helm

[tacit oyster]

im really just thinking if i want to go for flow state or reload into grimoire

[cursive edge]

intending to reload and take both currently. But grimoire i may not even take tbh

[meager mango]

thats really bad for points are u sure abt that

[brave oracle]

Does the dps calc have a leagues version? I couldn't find it

[brazen crest]

I’m going flow state and transmutation purely because they’re cool

[cursive edge]

Don't think ill be using ancients, or need piety/rigour

and augury isnt a massive dps boost vs mystic might

[maiden cliff]

With this being the 6th League, surely its time for Jagex to allow us to build 2 league rooms to show off all 6 trophies

[cursive edge]

i just want t8 and 40 pact points, and bis gear

[tacit oyster]

if i dont do grimoire i would probably take zeah but zeah is pain if i want to do min-max crossbow only

[smoky raft]

I want to stress that I mean this in the absolute nicest way possible

but holy shit dude why

[cursive edge]

im hoping the other t6 is better than grimoire for me. They said its defensive, so perhaps it can boost my thorns dps lol

[brazen crest]

gz on the hunter xp

[tacit oyster]

I guess can do cox almost fully before i respec into crossbow only

[meager mango]

I have a feeling this build will struggle a bunch with everything not weak to ranged and close range bosses

[maiden cliff]

Why i need 2 rooms? because i can only have 3 trophies per room, and jagex caps it at 1 room per house

[cursive edge]

also there's the flat 2.3 max hits to account for from the fire rune regen

[meager mango]

its taken into account

[shadow badger]

Buy a second house brokie

[maiden cliff]

🙁

True

[cursive edge]

oh how'd you do that?

[dull nacelle]

Scritic video when?

[meager mango]

dps calc does it by itself

[smoky raft]

no I mean just having that many dragon trophies in the first place lmao

it's impressive to the point of being concerning. Like that time my friend got 500 completions of getting over it

[cursive edge]

it didnt seem to, when i ticked and unticked the node, nothing changed

[tacit oyster]

did they update wiki dps calc to work on mage nodes?

[cursive edge]

maybe it works for proper spells, but not powered staves?

[brazen crest]

I decided my route finally. WZA.

[meager mango]

likely

[cursive edge]

are you referring to my build?

[maiden cliff]

Leagues is my favorite part of runescape, even when i didnt play for 3½ years, i returned for the leagues

[meager mango]

could invest those points on more accurracy/prayer pen

[meager mango]

yeah

[cursive edge]

i suppose you meant mage

[tacit oyster]

[meager mango]

yeah lol my bad

too much varding messes brain up

[smoky raft]

consider yourself lucky! my main dps pact isn't supported but doesn't even get a warning

[meager mango]

but yeah ur going mory with this build

[smoky raft]

the earth capstone just. doesn't work

[meager mango]

and idk if it will be that good on tob

[cursive edge]

but nah I think it wont really struggle, i mean even vs vard 1 tile away, with slay task its 27.8 sang dps with 1 accursed spec landing

+another 8 from thorns

so 35 dps vs vardorvis with magic lmao

[cursive edge]

only bloat is resistant to magic

[tacit oyster]

range only olm hands seems fine if i reach max build

[cursive edge]

and hes a potato boss anyway

i suppose nylo boss I wouldnt have as much output as a hybrid/tribid build

but oh well

[cursive edge]

I think i have all the accuracy nodes dont i

[meager mango]

I dont think thorns takes into account all ur defensive bosses but rather just the defense against the type

we'll find out I guess

[meager mango]

yeah I could only really get 2% more magic dmg and 15% more pen

[cursive edge]

the wording does explicitly say total

would be very misleading if it didnt mean total

[smoky raft]

ok so my region choice is really going to depend on how good the echo trident is

[cursive edge]

what did you drop for it?

[meager mango]

nvm lol i forgot to take thorns hold on

[smoky raft]

because currently twinflame is my best dps weapon but it's also the only major upgrade I get from asg

[cursive edge]

oh right you mean the fire rune stuff

https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-10-100-11-12-133-135-136-139-140-141-145-44-46-47-53-54-55-56-57-58-59-6-60-68-69-7-71-8-81-82-83-84-85-86-88-9-93-98-99

this is my tree

[smoky raft]

womp

[cursive edge]

did you screenshot my tree

[smoky raft]

yea

[cursive edge]

or are you doing the same thing?

ah ok

lol

[cursive edge]

but its worse than a wooden staff, no?

[meager mango]

https://dps.osrs.wiki?id=LantadymeHeirloomThrall

[smoky raft]

here's my tree

[smoky raft]

earth capstone gives it +30 min AND max hit

since it double dips on flat damage

[meager mango]

its still a 7tick staff

[smoky raft]

it's 4t

as opposed to the 3t most staves will be

[cursive edge]

hmm i see, so you get the extra flat twice?

are you sure?

that would be even more broken on fire surge then

[meager mango]

twinflame 4t earth wave + earth tome vs harmonised 2t earth surge + earth tome

harmonised wins

[tacit oyster]

currently im thinking of going asgarnia desert zeah. echo bosses probably changing my plans

[smoky raft]

yeah but then I have to get harmonised lmao

I'm not picking mory

fuck tob

[cursive edge]

howd you get to 30

its 1 min and max per 12 def

[meager mango]

15 flat x 2

[cursive edge]

ok right, but then its 15 min and max hits

or 30 max hits

equivalent statements basicaly

not 30 min and max tho

[smoky raft]

180 def/12 = 15
15 x 2 = 30

[meager mango]

no 15 flat dmg addition

[cursive edge]

yeah, its 30 max hits worth of damage

but 30 min AND max hits worth of damage would be 60 max hits worth of damage

[meager mango]

not 30 max hits worth of dmg

[cursive edge]

requiring 360 defence

[meager mango]

straight up 30 dmg

[cursive edge]

no?

15 damage

is equivalent to 30 max hits worth of damage

[meager mango]

flat dmg is just added after

[smoky raft]

twinflame deals two hitsplats, each hitsplat gains +15 flat damage

[cursive edge]

ok yes, in the case of twinflame

didnt realise you were expressing it in that way

but ok yeah i can see twinflame doing well with that

but yeah doesnt fire surge gain 15 flat + another 12 flat

and burn

tho the def/magic reduction on earth is nice

[tacit oyster]

scritic's echo boss reveal stream started 5min ago

[cursive edge]

oh shit

ty

[meager mango]

fire also requires more sustain

[smoky raft]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oa76FJ7vh08

[cursive edge]

yeah for sure. the dps can get crazy but the self dmg seems annoying

I think vs 50% fire weakness with the kandarin echo thing, fire surge is doin like 70 dps lol

40 something without weakness

[meager mango]

tome of fire is the way to go

[toxic vortex]

https://tenor.com/bzio4.gif

when reveal

[meager mango]

but that reqs kourend

[cursive edge]

doesnt come close to doubling the weakness effect tho

[meager mango]

also gives access to ancestral tho

[cursive edge]

when there is weakness

[meager mango]

most relevant bosses dont have weakness anyway

[tacit oyster]

delayed because of twitch stream is getting lagged by upload

[meager mango]

unless quadent applies weakness its just ignored

[cursive edge]

yeah youre probably right, more consistent

[meager mango]

did they give scritic echo item stats or?

[toxic vortex]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6BaYBWJiq8

[cursive edge]

VID OUT

[smoky raft]

scritic was playtesting the items lmao

[meager mango]

nvm

[toxic vortex]

ooof 3.6kg

"comes with demonbane"

blessing works with mage

[cursive edge]

LMAO the crystal blessing applies to powered staves specifically

and gives the armour magic accuracy...

back to the drawing board

[copper gorge]

This changes everything!

Mage build op

[toxic vortex]

magic damage percentage too

[copper gorge]

Kandarin tiranwynn

Damn when do you expect summary of this stuff to be posted to wiki?

[cursive edge]

oh shit boys

devils blessing

[toxic vortex]

here we go

staff

[cursive edge]

forces ele weakness on everything

GG

[toxic vortex]

damn

[cursive edge]

air spells back on the menu

[shadow badger]

Holy I was right again

[tacit oyster]

so kandarin + priffd would be mage meta now

[toxic vortex]

oh shit

[silent depot]

So powered spells only. No normal spell casts from wands?

[toxic vortex]

that staff looks good

[cursive edge]

wait what lol

the staff picks what element to use

thats not good

what if youre specced into air and then it picks fire for you

[copper gorge]

Auto hits weakness

[smoky raft]

ok so I'm not picking asgarnia lmao

[shadow badger]

Quadrant has twinflame effect and applies to surge spells

[cursive edge]

ok the fremmy helm is disappointing

[shadow badger]

Yeah pretty ass

[glacial geyser]

dookie doodoo

[shadow badger]

Okay so my choices haven't changed

Lithic sceptre looks cool

[cursive edge]

okayyy the GG staff seems neat

[glacial geyser]

mage looks more interesting now

[cursive edge]

hope the max hit isnt shit

[meager mango]

looks like ur going tiran instead of fremmy

[potent quail]

this seems insane

[shadow badger]

Sceptre spec does typeless dmg so could be used in nylo room

[shadow badger]

Kandarin stonks up

[potent quail]

devils element jsut giving a 30% damage increase is jsut insane lol

[copper gorge]

Can autocast from all spellbooks!!!

[cursive edge]

lmao yeah possibly

[potent quail]

that doesnt matter lol

[shadow badger]

So echo amox for melee demonbane and quadrant for demonbane spells

[cursive edge]

think the V helm slayer helm thing doesnt really replace the need to take the slayer relic

[glacial geyser]

mage with kandarin/tiran gna slap

[cursive edge]

so its just a waste

[tacit oyster]

amoxiatl echo weapon is also demonbane for doom

[potent quail]

earth surge for insane max hits
free prayer regen
80%-130% more damage from elemental weakness on ALL enemys

[potent quail]

and jsut a blindbag weapon later on

[shadow badger]

Is there ranged demonbane?

[shadow badger]

Yeah

[potent quail]

scorching bow?

[smoky raft]

there is with extended melee distance lmao

[smoky raft]

no tormented demons

they're in misthalin

[shadow badger]

lol I meant for doom

[potent quail]

ah yeah

[rich rune]

MTK looking real nice for powered staffs

[potent quail]

anyways doom will be easy af either way

[shadow badger]

I guess I have prayer pen so shouldn't be too bad

[empty pagoda]

And Misthalin is on fire, so I guess the tormented demons are having a good time.

[toxic vortex]

is the blog post updated for this?

[potent quail]

yes

[flint cloud]

rune

[warped turtle]

are echo drops guaranteed after a certain amount of kills?

[toxic vortex]

gib

[toxic vortex]

they were last year

[shadow badger]

I think 50 kc

[smoky raft]

it was double drop rate, right?

[warped turtle]

I remember I went dry on cerb got after like 30 kills guaranteed or something

[cursive edge]

hmm weird, so the GG echo staff does damage of:

• (Magic Level/3) - 10

Sang is Magic Level/3 - 1

[latent magnet]

What does v helm mean, 0 chance to take damage

[shadow badger]

I went the full 50 kills to get the drop

[cursive edge]

But it says the staff does minimum damage of 10 i think

[smoky raft]

minus an additional 8 with the 1t pact

[cursive edge]

yeah sure, just comparing sang to the staff

[copper gorge]

So did i, for all regions

[cursive edge]

i think the min hit of 10 on the staff means

its actually 1 dmg better than sang

[copper gorge]

For both the orb and the drop

[cursive edge]

not accounting for the spec thing every 5 hits

[old tapir]

i kinda dislike elemental magic because its 3 ticks

very awkward attack speed

but its not bad

[tacit oyster]

it is weak since 1handed staff, its hit with -8 flat damage from pact

[warped turtle]

I wanna try the dagger but just dont see myself taking asgarnia

[cursive edge]

certainly not weak

[tacit oyster]

18 max hit at 108 magic

[smoky raft]

ok so scritic just confirmed that you still get elemental bonuses for the spell you cast rather than the spell that it turns into

that's good

that's REALLY good

[cursive edge]

yeah but it has 10 min hit

and i should reach 122 or 123 magic

[shadow badger]

Das grazy

[tacit oyster]

highest magic boost in league is saturated heart

[twin jolt]

Wait so, attack something with an earth spell that originally has fire weakness, converts it's weakness to earth?

[modest kiln]

Does flow state work for essence blocks in zeah rcing?

[twin jolt]

I took it initially as it'd just auto cast the type it's weak to, not convert. That's really nice

[smoky raft]

it attacks with a fire spell but it counts as an earth spell and regens earth runes

[cursive edge]

so if 123 magic, its 23 max hit, 10 min hit, so effectively 33 max hit

[twin jolt]

I see, I like that

[old tapir]

so there's no demonbane at a distance?

[smoky raft]

demonbane spells, for one

[shadow badger]

Amox

[latent magnet]

Hepsi bow looking like soul split omg

I love it

V helmet looks mid

[old tapir]

2 range aint exactly at a distance

[shadow badger]

How does the hespori weapon compare to bowfa?

[smoky raft]

I feel like V's helm is good if you're picking fremmy anyway but I wouldn't pick fremmy for V's helm

[latent magnet]

Not that good.

[shadow badger]

Get halberd and use blindbag

[shadow badger]

Bowfa is better?

[latent magnet]

Much better

[old tapir]

that seems like a bad thing to rely on when you need demonbane for that phase of doom or something lol

[latent magnet]

This is worse than scobo at a glance

[shadow badger]

Okay then I get to camp crystal blessing in my ammo slot for the whole league

[latent magnet]

Might be boosted with range relics but I'm not holding my breath

[shadow badger]

I don't really see where hesp bow is useful

[latent magnet]

Lithic Sceptre is a crazy barrage solve, no need for grimoire

[toxic vortex]

I missed the bit about Vs helmet also being an inbued slayer helm

[latent magnet]

It's 2 tick fyi

If you use the bow relic

[cursive edge]

Ok yeah Mory + Wildy + Tirannwan Lithic Thorns build is gonna be nuts

50+ dps I think

[latent magnet]

And I think echoes can proc the heal

[plain pasture]

Where is post for items release

[toxic vortex]

https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/get-ready-for-leagues-vi-demonic-pacts---april-15th?oldschool=1#echo

[potent quail]

Infernal tecpatl:
everyone gets them, tons of flat damage and demonbane for doom, solid pick for everyone amazing for blindbag

Fang of the Hound
does not consume/regen fire runes which SUUUCKS
2 tick attackspeed and aoe damage chance is solid though
but seems to me to be the weakest of all of them

Drypipe
we already know this one, very good with the thrown pacts, dont see much synergie here otherwise.
fast consistent damage

Vs Helm
amazing for all Spec builds

Shadowflame and Devils element
seems the most busted to me.
every monster will grant 80-130% more elemental damage no matter your element
and twinfire effect
Fire surge: big damage and burn chances
Earths urge: insane flat hit increases that get multiplied
Water surge: tons of healing
all of them regen Prayer.
so by far the easiest solve to afk stuff with infinite prayer and health regen
the most versatile Echo Weapon

Natures Recurve
the easiest solve to infinite prayer and health regen

Lithic Scepter:
1 tick speed
spec available every 5 ticks therefore
big aoe every 5 ticks
need the math to actually calc dps but a very active weapon

Crystal blessing
great for all mellee and powered staff builds

Kings barrage
8 tick insane max hit always and free healing with water mastery
probably **the boss killer **in the league thanks to double accuracy rolls
sucks for slayer because overkill damage

[shadow badger]

Don't really wanna change my build for it

I'll just stick with bowfa and tbow

[latent magnet]

You're not making me pick kandarin!

Aaaaaa

[old tapir]

[latent magnet]

It's not gonna work...!

[restive saddle]

little confused by shadowflame wording

[cursive edge]

crystal armour accuracy might just suck too much ass tho

[shadow badger]

Come to BA, little sonny

[cursive edge]

if the 30% accuracy is additive with all the stuff on the pact tree

[latent magnet]

Gotta get my fighter torso before I fight Yama for my oathplate

Ofc ofc

[toxic vortex]

I mean it is weird

[latent magnet]

Megamind

[copper gorge]

Im picking kandarin

[plain pasture]

Is it confirmed both hits will count as bolts damage or like a barrage maxhit on second

[copper gorge]

Dammit

[restive saddle]

"This staff will always apply the spell your target is weakest to regardless of the spell you cast. Allowing you to benefit from any elemental pact"

Do they mean it would be good no matter what spell build you use or
You get the demonic pact effect of what you cast regardless of the spell that actually comes out

[wary egret]

Jagex cooked with these echo weapons. It’s so hard to decide where to go

[toxic vortex]

the second bolt is a magic effect

[shadow badger]

These 2 pacts worth having or nah

[tacit oyster]

if target is weak to air it will only cast air and give air pact benefits, unless you manually use different spell

[latent magnet]

Echo kbd cbow requires a range mage synergy to be good? :(

[plain pasture]

Yes but does dame roll off ranged strength + which bolt

[restive saddle]

I also do like how many of these echo weapons are good in hybrid builds

[latent magnet]

It looks like I need to spec into ice spells to get most out of kbd cbow

[empty pagoda]

If you got a lot of worn prayer bonus you can get, yeah, that second one would be pretty good.

[smoky raft]

man now I'm really lost on my regions lol

[tacit oyster]

yeah on yesterday's stream they said both bolts would be crossbow shots, description says other one is ice spell

[smoky raft]

still definitely going kandarin and probably going wilderness but idk about the third

[plain pasture]

Depends how damage is calced on freeze hit.
If it rolls range str nd bolt type then it's huge

Maxhit in excess of 300

[wary egret]

Seriously. I wish we could pick like 1 more

[plain pasture]

I'm sad blessing isn't ranged based

[tacit oyster]

kings barrage would be sligthly better than zcb if 2nd bolt doesnt benefit from crossbow things

[wary egret]

Echo weapons seem > mega rares

[old tapir]

it is very weird that it doesn't make you stronger

it just makes it apply to all styles

[plain pasture]

Yeh we need clarity on kbd second hit

I mean crossbow as it is already close to bis/is bis but second hit for clarity

[wary egret]

So max mage build - zeah, kandarin… what? Asg?

[plain pasture]

Mage looks quite op with twinflame staff echo

[potent quail]

infernal tecplatli are worse then blood moon weapon

[tacit oyster]

the thing is i dont want to take wilderness as a region because it is so dead content, same with fremmenik... but i also do not want any echo from any other region

[wary egret]

Just buy it off the ge

[plain pasture]

Frem is huge disappointment.
It's stats are just a waste of code

[shadow badger]

So which one do I pick if I'm going Kandarin

[plain pasture]

They overthought power creep way too much when they did stats on v helm

[tacit oyster]

its fine for non powered staff and non tirannwn choosers but it is just so dead content in that region

[toxic vortex]

that staff is wild, you'd be dumb to not take the -2t on the regular staff

[old tapir]

i don't remember if i managed to get any pets last league

maybe sire

[plain pasture]

Well I'll check in when I get to office.
Hopefully some full information

[toxic vortex]

I got zuk pet

lmao

[copper gorge]

I got lil zik and rocky

[old tapir]

maybe olmlet?

[fluid sail]

So that Kandarin staff…I’m assuming if it auto switches to another element, you lose the pact bonuses of the spell you were initially trying to cast?

[mint cargo]

How does echo staff compare to harm staff?

[warped turtle]

its gonna be fun pet hunting this league

[copper gorge]

And because after last league i decided to go ironman mode i gotta do it all again 🤣

[copper gorge]

Says otherwise

[old tapir]

harm is probably better dps

[tacit oyster]

half dps probably, unless desciption had mistake of saying -10 instead of +10

[old tapir]

but only barely

[wary egret]

Kandarin probably better than mory just for torm and occult

[old tapir]

since echo is 1.4 hits every 3 ticks and harm is 1 hit every 2 ticks

[wary egret]

Torn and occult I assume tips shadowflame over harm

[fluid sail]

Oh?

[tacit oyster]

GG sceptre has only max hit of 18 at 108 magic while sang has max hit of 27

[plain pasture]

Devils element took a slight nerf in some cases this time.
Previously double weakness so 40 >80.
Now it adds flat 30

So it's win/lose.
But still op

[mint cargo]

I just hope we can turn off the auto spell switching

[cursive edge]

it has a min hit of 10

[fluid sail]

Won’t matter if it just benefits from all pacts as stated above

[cursive edge]

which makes it equivalent to 28 max hits of damage

[tacit oyster]

doesnt clarify if max hit is minimum of 10 or actual minimum hit is 10

[cursive edge]

ohhhhhhhh

true

[wanton arrow]

Thats my whole goal haha. I got 9 last league which was my first one

My 3 areas are based on how many pets they have

[cursive edge]

tbf its probably the max hit

is at least 10

so 1 to 60 magic has same max hit of 20

yikes then

staff is crap if so

23 max hit at 123 magic, vs 32 of sang

[brave oracle]

Ok I changed my mind

TZM

Endless harvest, Woodsman, Map, Transmute, Larcenist, Culling, Nature's Accord

I'd think all skills are covered, I wanted to reload into clue relic for points but oh well

[wanton arrow]

Did they post detailed stats on the echo weapons anywhere or is it just the video with how they look?

[old tapir]

what do you suppose you'd do as a water mage if you're not doing thorns or crossbows

with the rest of your points that is

[brave oracle]

all stats

[tacit oyster]

demonic pact blog was updated, need to click on the icon to see

[cursive edge]

the special effect, assuming it doesnt delay your normal attacks, works out to 130% of your max hit every 5 attacks so 30 damage every 5 attacks, 6 damage per attack

but thats 6 flat dmg

not 6 max hits

so its 12 max hits worth.. hmm

[wanton arrow]

Ahh gotcha. Ill check the blog when im back on pc lol. Doesn't look like I'll be changing from the kings barrage though

[cursive edge]

makes it 35 effective max hit vs 32 of sang!

[wary egret]

https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-100-107-108-109-112-113-114-117-118-119-122-127-128-129-135-44-45-46-47-48-55-56-57-58-59-60-61-62-63-67-68-69-70-92-93-94-96-97-99

am I trolling myself with this?

[mint cargo]

Could pump regen points to get extra hp & prayer sustain

[potent quail]

if you dotn want to go ionto another style: more accuracy (check ranged tree)
prayer pen
overheal nodes

[potent quail]

yes you will never cast air spells

and you choose either fire or earth

[old tapir]

is there a reason to go over 100% regen

[potent quail]

yes check the rune regen nodes

[wanton arrow]

Yes lol

[wary egret]

But you use air runes and can regen them

[plain merlin]

finally devil element is not useless anymore gg

[potent quail]

yes but you can drop the air mastery and the 3 nodes before that as these only trigger on air spells

[old tapir]

they read to me as if its every instance of generation not the amount

[potent quail]

ypou 100% keep the "on air regen regen prayer points

[cursive edge]

I do think the spec effect adds 12 max hits worth of dps, if I'm understanding its mechanics correctly.

[long pulsar]

They say whether or not over 100 regen can get multiple ranged echo procs?

[old tapir]

so say you cast water surge, spent 10 water runes, regenerate 10 water runes, does that node heal you for 10?

[cinder remnant]

Hmmm which regions now

ZKT maybe

[potent quail]

so with 100% you regen 7 air runes
so the node triggrs 7 times

if you have 200% rgeen you regen 14 air runes triggerin the node 14 times

[brave oracle]

feelings and thoughts

[cinder remnant]

Or ZWT

[tacit oyster]

they did say you can proc extra times with excess regen

[potent quail]

yes

[mint cargo]

Yes. If you have 150 regen you heal 15 on average

[long pulsar]

Holy

Hmm

[weary drift]

Was thinking the same thing, doing mage with bowfa/ range and some type of melee

[potent quail]

this would be my fix
https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-10-100-101-11-112-113-114-12-122-127-128-129-135-44-45-46-47-48-55-56-57-58-59-6-60-61-68-7-70-8-87-9-92-93-94-96-97-99
you swithc to water spells when you need healing
can replace earth route with fire

[left terrace]

Is todays reveals out yet? Where do they actually drop them?

[brave oracle]

blog post

[smoky raft]

the echo weapons were revealed via youtube; they're now available on the blog

[potent quail]

website already updated

we jsut got all echo weaposn today

[wary egret]

My attention span is minimal. I am now thinking about a kandarin wildy build

https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-10-100-11-112-113-114-122-127-128-129-15-17-2-21-24-29-30-31-4-44-45-46-47-48-55-56-57-58-59-60-61-62-63-68-7-70-8-93-99

[twin ermine]

Is a blind bag thorns build relevant mainhanding a dinhs? I think it would be cool but it would lock me into both zeah and probably mory to get access to nox hally. And then probably Tir for blessing + chally

My alternative would just be kandarin tir mory fun stuff, but then no thorns

[potent quail]

if you go for echo wildy weapon 100% take "ice spells count as water" to heal with the crossbow

[weary drift]

Yall think smth like MKP would be good? Specing into melee, bow, and water??

[cursive edge]

that echo dagger looks absolute shite on first glance

5% chance to proc the effect is so negligible

and 20 str bonus

low accuracy

[potent quail]

here the question is
whats the point of the earth spell?
you want to switch between crossbow and earth spells?

[weary drift]

Yeah I made me wanna not go asgarnia

[cursive edge]

50% spec cost

as well

shouldve been 25

[tacit oyster]

yeah if i go for it im not using zcb so i can remove spec pacts and just go into water mage tree

[cursive edge]

when youre attacking at 2t, specs costing 50% mean it adds such little dps

you run out of specs in 4t

[wary egret]

Just extra defense. I could swap to fire. But shadowflame auto swapping is a little weird

[weary drift]

The melee tree does get lots of spec regen and avoiding spec costs

[cursive edge]

I guess its a free hit every 30s or so

dps wise thats pretty bad

[potent quail]

same question with fire

do you use crossbow and switch to fire spells for prayer regen?

[glacial geyser]

you get your spec back in like 12s

[cursive edge]

ah right yeah double hit so

so 4% per 1.2s

[potent quail]

also small routing improvment:
https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-10-100-101-11-112-113-114-122-123-127-128-129-15-2-21-24-29-30-31-4-44-45-46-48-55-56-57-58-59-6-60-61-68-7-70-8-87-9-99

[cursive edge]

no wait thats still 30s

[wary egret]

lol good questions. Is it worth dropping to just water and then going for a melee tree for tribrid?

[cursive edge]

ok 30s for 100% spec

15s for 50%

[tacit oyster]

echo releases made me not want to go into any region with crossbow build

[cursive edge]

so every 15s, you get 1 free hit, so from 12.5 hits to 13.5 hits

8% dmg boost effectively

[potent quail]

well you can take this node
but thats quite a active gameplay style

[weary drift]

That’s not accounting the 20% not to use spec right?

[glacial geyser]

you also need to take the fire spell boosts in the mage tree

[weary drift]

Or surge pots

[cursive edge]

sure, i guess not

[glacial geyser]

to make the spec hit harder

[wary egret]

Oh man lol

[cursive edge]

but all of these things are costing skill points and investment

the dagger itself just pumps out shitty dps

[weary drift]

It does but I think I could be okay, mainly because I PRAY the last t8 is spec related

[shadow badger]

So do both the blessing stats and armour bonuses combine?

[cursive edge]

i think the 2% magic dmg bonus is not additive with the crystal armour bonus

the crystal armour 15% dmg should be its own separate multiplier

[river quarry]

Wording of the Shadowflame quadrant is confusing. "will always use the elemental weakness which your target is weakest to", does that break water spell healing if the target is weak to fire?

[glacial geyser]

no

[potent quail]

https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-10-100-101-11-112-113-114-122-123-14-15-16-2-21-24-29-30-31-4-44-45-46-55-56-58-59-6-60-64-65-68-7-8-87-9-99
Could do something like this
and switch between Echo Cbow
and Quadrant/devils with Water spells

[glacial geyser]

it picks a weakness not a spell

and uses the % of that weakness

regardless of your spell type

[cursive edge]

so its 60 magic attack, 6% magic str, and then a separate 15% damage multiplier. The only thing that isnt clear to me is if the 30% accuracy is additive or multiplicative with all the %accuracy we get on the pact tree

[river quarry]

Sweet, thanks

[weary drift]

damn

[weary drift]

Yeah I think kandarin is amazing

[river quarry]

Wish Devil's Element was a shield though

[glacial geyser]

yeah I think air/fire build will be cracked using smoke barrage

[potent quail]

here is the thing that worrys me a bit about a mage build -> quadrant league starter build

a jmod mentioned: unlocking your second region will take LONGer then usual
and yiou need a slayer req for thermo so likly t7

how good is the Magic build PRE quadrant/Devils element?

[weary drift]

Ayak is doable so spec range still bow ticks do doom then spec powered staves, if going transmute the level shouldn’t matter

[cursive edge]

so with shadowflame, if you cast fire surge and the enemy has a 30% air weakness, that air weakness will apply to your fire surge?

But then what about with devils element in the mix, will it become a net 60% weakness? or will devils element add 30% fire weakness, and then the shadowflame arbitrarily picks one

[potent quail]

but thats nota mage starter build
thats a range starter build

[wary egret]

I love it

[weary drift]

Yeah it isn’t unless you are going range and mage, using rerolls to make late game builds work isn’t bad

[brave oracle]

thoughts?

[potent quail]

in general quadrant allows you to choose your favourite mastery and be able to use it everywhere
so i can totally see a fire mastery build

OMG

[weary drift]

Plus specing into range that little isn’t that bad either

[potent quail]

AIR BALLISTA all max hit all the time is back

i jsut relaized

[weary drift]

Air ballista?

[potent quail]

50 prayer bonus on a air weak enemy with air mastery = air spells always max hit
Cbows always max hit
combine with above node

[smoky raft]

ok so. Probably going kandarin + wilderness for my mage tank build. Currently debating between desert and fremmy for the remaining slot

[glacial geyser]

I suspect it will be 30% in that case

[cursive edge]

so hold on, i think fire surge is gonna be like 70 dps or some shit no?

vs anything

27 flat damage added to both hitsplats...

or maybe not 27 to both ok

[glacial geyser]

I'm looking at smoke barrage

its the only ancient barrage to use 2 ele runes

so you get air and fire effects

27 base max hit +4 from fire runes

so 31 base really and its an air spell so you build around pray bonus to always max

[mint cargo]

Wait does devils element mean you always get double max hit chance

[glacial geyser]

yes

so you only need 50 pray bonus

[tacit oyster]

This will NOT change your spell to the cast the creature is weak to, it will use whichever spell you select and calculate damage/accuracy as if the enemies highest weakness IS the spell you just cast.

so the kandarin mage weapon will not change your spell to different spell, it will just add enemy weakness to your selected spell

[bleak depot]

With that kandarin trident it says when using normal spells it applies a second hit.

Does this affect work with ancients if we choose nodes that count ancients as basic elemental spells ?

[glacial geyser]

hmm good question

[mint cargo]

No its only standard spellbook

[glacial geyser]

SAD.

[potent quail]

Which means if you're casting an air spell you're still getting all your benefits of air pacts even against targets that are weak to earth, fire or water.
omg air ballista confirmed

omgomg

[tough finch]

devil's element + echo dagger IS cool

[potent quail]

i think that will be the build of the league

[cursive edge]

5% proc rate tho

[bleak depot]

Guess that means the trident is gonna be better than nightmare staff even if using ancients guy?

Huh*

[cursive edge]

rather an antlers guard

[plain merlin]

isnt this dagger 1 tick at some point?

so 1 tick dagger + devil element 30% buff

[glacial geyser]

its 2 hits every 2t

[cursive edge]

no oits 2t

[smoky raft]

is virtus a reasonable goal with only access to levi and vard, as a mager?

[potent quail]

i dobnt know math on ancient staffs but yes trident is insanely strong

[cursive edge]

yeah id say so

[plain merlin]

rip thought 3 tick weapons would be rounded down to 1 tick

[cursive edge]

Well nightmare staff going from 3t to 2t is a 50% dmg boost, while trident adds 40% dmg from that 2nd hit

[idle pivot]

If the ice projectile from kbd crossbow counts as an ice spell, if you take the pact that makes ice spells count as water spells will its damage get boosted based on current HP by that water spell pact?

[potent quail]

and it uses fire runes so can icnrease the max hit

[bleak depot]

Sheep i haven’t run calcs but after watching the video i think the full crystal w blessing might be better than virtus

[potent quail]

yes

[cursive edge]

but trident can take better advantage of elemental weaknesses, and doesnt require you to take mory

[glacial geyser]

yh thats the idea. you get air and fire regen bonus

[idle pivot]

Does it still count as a crossbow then for max hit?

[shadow badger]

I think it's better than ancestral lol

[plain merlin]

ah i see under 1kg reduces atk by 1 tick

[potent quail]

its only 4 air runes though
which is really not much

[cursive edge]

yeah it should be. Only vs maybe some shit like sol heredit it wont be

because of the accuracy loss

[mint cargo]

And also grind pnm

[glacial geyser]

you have 50 pray bonus 4 air runes is plenty to upkeep prayer

[potent quail]

oh right

[wary egret]

Explain this to me like I’m 5

[cursive edge]

unless the 30% accuracy from crystal armour is multiplicative with everything else

[tough finch]

Air spell capstone is max hit chance increased. Crossbow also does max hits. You can take the node for 25% damage after max hitting when using a different style. Bigger max hits.

[potent quail]

https://tools.runescape.wiki/demonic-pacts/?n=1-10-107-108-109-111-112-113-114-123-15-2-21-24-29-3-30-31-44-45-47-55-56-58-59-6-60-64-65-67-68-9
my build idea
its a swapping build between smoke barrage and KBD echo crossbow

[molten gust]

Just trying to remember for it. For toa, whenever you get a purple. Everyone in the raid gets one?

[glacial geyser]

idk if its worth it unless you can full 1t switch your set

[potent quail]

you woudl onyl switch your weapons

[potent quail]

you ahve so many accuracy nodes

[glacial geyser]

but what is my xbow max hit?

[tough finch]

You have way more than 1t. But it's probably a late game build you might respec into

[glacial geyser]

if its less than the spell by 25% then whats the point

[cursive edge]

the crossbow is 8t too

you have forever to switch back lol

[bleak depot]

I mean, Crystal gives accuracy and damage right

[potent quail]

the switch from magic to ranged is only 2 tick though

[glacial geyser]

sure but why am i switching

[cursive edge]

yeah. I'm quite sure the 15% damage is a separate multiplier, but the 30% accuracy could be its own multiplier, or additive with all the %accuracy we get on the tree, making it not that strong

[bleak depot]

I think that’s better than virtus with blessing

[potent quail]

this node

[idle pivot]

Crossbow should be 7 tick on rapid I think right?

[bleak depot]

You’re not taking it for accuracy you’re taking it for the damage lol

[potent quail]

also air will prayer regen which is neat

[cursive edge]

looking at bowfa with crystal armour in the dps calc, it does seem like the accuracy is a separate multiplier

[cursive edge]

yeah but im looking at the dps it gives vs shti thats mega resistant to magic

ofc vs anything with reasonable defence it blows virtus out of the awter

[dull tusk]

not sure if its true at lower invos, but it definitely is at higher invos

[tough finch]

Because you want to have fun on an off "meta" build in leagues? Nobody is saying its top tier, its just a fun idea

[cursive edge]

but the question is like, vs vardorvis or sol heredit, what is best

[glacial geyser]

just seems like more effort when I can keep casting the same spell for more dmg

[bleak depot]

So for vard, you can use fire spells to stack burn, and we’ll have cgaunts as well.

[dull tusk]

technically hitting one larger hit consistently has helpful interactions such as boss phase-skipping

[main vector]

why is echo sol the only one they're not bringing back
that was my favorite one

[dull tusk]

its typeless so it wouldnt work well with the tree

[blissful fiber]

crap, the cerberus dagger only scale on fire weakness...

[bleak depot]

Also if you take mory, the special attack is typeless for the staff

[dull tusk]

the whole echo sol weapon i mean

[glacial geyser]

it also benefits from the burn node because its a fire spell

[tough finch]

They really want you to pick kandarin to go with it. Kind of lame

[bleak depot]

Echo sol weapon was busted af i loved that

[main vector]

so much fun at nylos

[cursive edge]

its not typeless to the main target, only the surrounding ones

[bleak depot]

Is that confirmed ?

[tough finch]

They want you to offhand the devils element on dagger but thats two whole regions so idk

[cursive edge]

it says it explicitly

[dull tusk]

yeah its what they said

[cursive edge]

on the website

[bleak depot]

Ahh i just watched the video im nerding out on break on lunch and talking to you guys. What regions you going for you think @cursive edge

[molten gust]

Yeah I didn’t touch desert last leagues. And barely during gridmaster.

[bleak depot]

Desert was a whole lot of nothing and toa. I regretted it.

[dull tusk]

i think the magic attack on the dagger is actually relatively immaterial to scale - you want it to proc fire spell effects, and to deal a little extra damage to compensate the items low melee strength. Given the wealth of range strength they hand out to you here with the prayer and 20% of str level nodes, the melee effect is simply strong enough with the faster attack speed to be worth using. Think outside the box and use it to fuel a different spec, instead of its own

[blissful fiber]

I guess i can do that then with fire dagger

[molten gust]

Mainly asking for my brother since I don’t plan for desert.

[bleak depot]

For what style @molten gust

[dull tusk]

while it does say it deals 10 max it is also counted as a fire spell which means it can also burn for 6% of your hp and deal double that in damage, and it can also burn the enemy for passive damage over time which doesnt take much to cap out

so realistically it will be hitting higher consistently in effective damage, completely unscaled

[stone prairie]

No echo sol so sad 🙁 was such a fun echo boss
Hope there’s a Yama or something to use all our power on!!

[bleak depot]

If you’re stacking fire for dagger there’s three nodes that stack 30% hp for even more damage

[cursive edge]

Ok great news! Using the DPS calc on the wiki, they are calculating accuracy assuming the crystal armour accuracy is multiplicative with the up to 195% incr accuracy we can take on the pact tree

[tough finch]

Yeah but good luck filling the bonus hp up using just melee and center healing options

On 2t self burn

[bleak depot]

Oh true I’m going mage with ice/blood

I didn’t think about that

[cursive edge]

which would make crystal armour actually more accurate than virtus as well

[blissful fiber]

i still question the implications of yama letting us fight him during the league

[blissful fiber]

I know we can, but i wonder what he has to say about it

[cursive edge]

by a little bit

[tacit oyster]

im so confused... multiple new users in leagues discord keep saying king's barrage splits 1 max hit into 2 hit splats and that jmods confirmed it but there is no post from jmods about it

[cursive edge]

about 4-5% more accurate

[bleak depot]

Yeah it seems I’m sold on TMK hbu varla

[copper gorge]

Ktm

[tough finch]

Tirannwyn might be the best support region and a solid enabler of multiple styles with that set bonus

[copper gorge]

Kandarin first to get mage gear early, t to get crystal, mory for end

Mage melee hybrid

Have not built tree out yet

[glacial geyser]

can you actually get mage gear early tho?

[bleak depot]

Take Kandarin first ?

Moons is mage gear

[glacial geyser]

the echo boss needs mad slayer

[copper gorge]

Early enough yes. Thermy needs high slayer tho yes.

[potent quail]

Faus league plan BEFORE echo weaponw as released
is actually busted with the echo relics
it has QUadrant and devils
powered staff
and crystal armor for the powered staff build