F-45A - Remove manual engine tilt in favor of only VCAP for vertical operations

[icy rampart]

just don't sustain it for too long

[mighty fable]

damage builds up
the more G, the faster it build up

[icy rampart]

I noticed if I held a long barrel roll for a long string of missiles rather than split pulling them, I would take damage

it also feels like the rudder has a bit more authority but maybe that's just me now using rudder pedals rather than speedrunning carpal tunnel with twist stick

[mighty fable]

hold 11 for long enough and the wing breaks
but hit 15 for short enough and you wont get visible damage

[leaden zephyr]

Better yet, snipe off the avionics computer!

[rigid knot]

slams desk
THANK YOU

How many times can Bahamuto really reinvent the friggin' Big Mac before it gets old or isn't as good at the first time? Just give us different aircraft that provide some variety.

Also, on the topic of the thread:

[shy rune]

we're gonna run out of new features eventually
Not for several years at least

[elder yacht]

we still have transport heli, maybe scout heli, cargo aircraft/big wing, bomber (sorta)

At one aircraft a year that's good for 3-4 years

[still barn]

There's also always the option to remove features to make new aircraft, an aircraft with no computer systems at all would be new to VTOL...cough cough please give us a WWII era fighter with VTOL's amazing VR experience. It's all I would play lol

[frigid ferry]

combined scout + trainer helo would be neat. rotary wing tyro

[elder yacht]

dont really see it being used as a trainer tbh

[leaden zephyr]

from what ive heard the heli is the most difficult to fly (tho cant say myself as i dont have it), so a trainer heli could be useful. or to be precise a trainer + sth else, cuz trainer itself might not be

[elder yacht]

Good point. If only we had a two seater helicopter in the game 😔

[mental parrot]

Only difficult bit is counter rotation with tail rotor imo, which just needs some trim

[leaden zephyr]

ah. well, idk how important heli trainer would be then, since ive never flown one

[patent fossil]

https://discord.com/channels/319915885575798785/1297088813427982401
Don't make me tap the sign!

[still barn]

I've been getting shit on for wanting this for a very long time lol

[still barn]

#vtolvrdev message
Im tapping my sign now lol

[patent fossil]

I could see it as a separate game or eventual DLC

[icy rampart]

ranked bvr would be hilarious because I know damn well chase would put the P-56 Mustache on the server against the F-45A

[still barn]

No because then it will get the Jetbourne treatment 😦

I would non-stop host WWII Guns only dogfighting. It would be wonderful. It'll probably never happen though so all I can hope for is that Aces of Thunder is actually good

[covert cedar]

agreed 100%

[sacred quartz]

Unless baha himself comes out and says that, probably not happening

[jade spire]

true

[lost ruin]

just found out that this is actually true to real life

which once again reinforces my belief that alot of the things that make the f45 OP in PvP are unrealistic

because realistically, the 45 should have
180 rounds in the gun
7.5 glimit
VCAP only, no viffing

and yet people will use the argument that the f45 being the best is realistic and "Its a 5th gen its meant to be OP"

not to mention the fact that it can missile tank because fuck you ig

[unreal prairie]

I mean, the g-limit also applies to the f-16 and f-18 last I checked

Also, the amount of ammo and viffing aren't what makes the F-45 OP, what makes it OP is the stealth and situational awareness, both of which are nerfed relative to reality (probably)

[lost ruin]

the f15 can have it turned off

[lost ruin]

stealth and SA can only take you so far against most players

[unreal prairie]

True, but also the fact that g-pulling even works is kinda unrealistic

[lost ruin]

most good players will dodge all of your amraams, so its going to come down to 9x and guns

[unreal prairie]

It's not even about amraams, just chuck a 9x from an off angle, especially mid bank

Realistically, you shouldn't be engaging unless you're already at advantage anyway

[lost ruin]

800 25mm guns (most seconds of fire of any fixed weapon btw) and viffing make the 45 unrealistically powerful

[unreal prairie]

No, the fact that good players can dodge all your amraams makes it unrealistically weak 🤣

Also the fact that it doesn't have an LPI radar

[lost ruin]

without a G limiter it would be theoretically possible, seeing as it is possible on lower speed missiles irl

[unreal prairie]

Lower speed isn't a terminal aamram

Certainly not one that just appeared out of nowhere in the middle of pitbull

[lost ruin]

lower speed missile are gpulled IRL, thats why you crank and beam, so if it gets too close and all else fails, you can pull it

[unreal prairie]

Which has nothing to do with how in VTOL people g-pull missiles head on

And no, you crank and beam to drain energy so you don't need to g-pull

There's a point between falling out of the sky and unable to be g-pulled, but it's pretty redundant, and is nothing like being able to g-pull missiles while fully offensive

[shut echo]

Just a reminder than an f45 without viffing also wins in a dogfight

[unreal prairie]

^

[shut echo]

The main issue with the f45 is the close range dogfighting performance

[unreal prairie]

And frankly, if you're in a "dogfight" and not just driving a 9x up someone unsuspecting T-55's rear that's a skill issue

[shut echo]

No cause the f45 wins in dogfights too which means you are never in a losing position

[unreal prairie]

True I guess

But yeah, talk about balance all you like, but realistic F-35 is just leagues better than the 45 in game

The F/A-26 is also kinda rediculous as a plane

[lost ruin]

f15 with an engine upgrade

[jade spire]

???

[shut echo]

And your complaints about BVR apply to other planes even more so too, they aren't f45 exclusive

[jade spire]

the F-45A is the best dogfighter in the game

well

second best

second only to the 42C

[lost ruin]

which can rip its engines off if it pulls to hard

[jade spire]

oh shit i forgot about that

[unreal prairie]

It's not F45 exclusive, but it does mean that compared to an IRL F-35 the 45 is just really weak

[jade spire]

the F-45A right now is simply the best plane in most categories.
best stealth
best bvr wise
best bfm wise
best in an A2G wise

[unreal prairie]

I'm not saying it should be realistic, but making arguments based on realism isn't really a good idea if you want it nerfed

[lost ruin]

which, imo, it should only take first 2

[jade spire]

fr

[lost ruin]

it shouldnt be the best at EVERYTHING

[jade spire]

actually

[shut echo]

Shouldn't compare it to the irl jet, that's apples to oranges comaprison it's better to think of relative plane power in game

[lost ruin]

which, balance wise, it shouldnt do everything better than everything

realistically, it shouldnt do everything better than everything

hence, why we dont ONLY have F35s

[jade spire]

i mean the f35 isn't a superiority air fighter, it's a multirole strike platform

[unreal prairie]

Which it still loses, random missiles undodgeable missiles out of nowhere is what is does to IRL planes IRL

[jade spire]

shouldn't be the best at bvr

[unreal prairie]

It's an air-superiority fighter for every military that has it save the US

Multirole means multiple roles, that includes air superiority

[lost ruin]

right now it should be, but there should be something better

[jade spire]

yeah

[lost ruin]

but at the same time, if something was added that is better, it would be completely unfun to play against

an F22 would be absolute bullshit in PvP

[jade spire]

baha should add a blimp with 100 AIM120D hardpoints

[unreal prairie]

The problem with it being the best at BVR is like... you kinda just have to hope the other guy fails a g-pull

[lost ruin]

the only way i could see the f22 being balanced is if it was realistic

meaning NO HMCS

[unreal prairie]

I mean it has a HMCS now

[lost ruin]

not all of them

they are getting them over time

[unreal prairie]

Also, a realistic F22 has a LPI radar, and that's just no

Noooooooo

[lost ruin]

LPI would be the least fun shit on the planet to play against

[unreal prairie]

I agree

But it is realistic

[jade spire]

just add a fastpack to the 26B that allows it to carry internal missiles

there we go

[lost ruin]

The only LPI implementation i would be down with if it was like a 10% chance to pop up on RWR

[jade spire]

theres your stealth superiority fighter

[lost ruin]

if it was just straight up invisibile it wouldnt be fun

baha just adds a F-26X that gets slight stealth and 5th gen sensors but no A2G

[unreal prairie]

I just want an IRST

[jade spire]

maybe there's ways to make it possible to see it. Like think of the EM circle on the EF24, or maybe some bs where you turn your radar off to use the radar antenna in passive mode for improved sensitivity

[unreal prairie]

Even if it's just one like the harrier's FLIR system

[lost ruin]

https://discord.com/channels/319915885575798785/1362915245709852682
so true king

[jade spire]

we should just return to vtol 1.6

magical gun piper appearing on anyone near you even with radar off

[lost ruin]

didnt 1.6 remove that?

i thought 1.6 added the tyro

[jade spire]

oh

might've been 1.5 then

[shy rune]

Irl the f16 has a 9 g limit

[shy rune]

The f15 has no g limiter

[unreal prairie]

Sure, just mean in contrast to VTOL where people regularly pull 12gs

[lost ruin]

Not even later versions like the E or EX?

[shy rune]

EX might because it’s fbw, the E does not

[unreal prairie]

It's also less about the actual g-limit and more about the fact that no having a g-limit lets you g-pull in wildly unrealistic ways

[lost ruin]

Just because it’s not done doesn’t make it unrealistic

The F15 could do what the 26 does, albeit with less thrust, but not by much

[unreal prairie]

But it is insanely unrealistic

[lost ruin]

Elaborate

[frigid ferry]

no, the F-15 could not just pull 14g

[unreal prairie]

IRL missiles just pull way too many gs to be pulled by doing a 12-g spiral

If g-pulling worked like it does in VTOL people would actually make planes to do them

[leaden zephyr]

it could, just not without desintegrating 😉 (actually idk if it could physically do that, but i assume thats the case, albeit probably not easily)

[shy rune]

The f15 has been recorded to pull 12-13 in multiple cases

[frigid ferry]

but it completely rights off the airframe

[icy rampart]

Crew chiefs hate this one simple trick

[lost ruin]

Yeah but the airframes in vtol are the price of a Toyota Carola and we hate ground crew so fuck em

[shy rune]

No

G limits are about maintenance and lifespans, will you break things much faster and require repairs, it won’t write it off

[frigid ferry]

im pretty sure if you pull 12g on an F-15 that airframe will never be flown again. It happens to pull out of a dive and save your life, but the airplane gets scrapped.

[shy rune]

Iv personally seen a f15 that has pulled 12 and its still flying around

[frigid ferry]

ok

bet you haven’t seen them expect to pull 12g to g pull missiles in combat lol

[lost ruin]

No one wants to pull 12gs unless they want an increased risk of strokes and a shorter spine

[unreal prairie]

Does also depend on if you have anything on your wings

[hard blade]

Yes

F-16 for example can only pull 7.5g's in Cat III (used in a2g config) mode

Plus extra weight makes it harder to pull anyway

[small drift]

Dafuq

[minor quarry]

The f15 had aura