🤔｜theories

[covert wyvern]

@azure bay English only goes for images too ;)

[azure bay]

I thought you knew this meme from film where Schwarzenegger plays soviet detective

[covert wyvern]

Ahaha I have not seen it!

[distant relic]

one, two rabbits kneel before you
that's what i said now
rabbits, rabbits who adore you
just go ahead now
one has flowers in his pockets
that's some bread, now
this one said he had to kill your family
ain't in his head, now

[floral mauve]

[red geyser]

Did you write this? Or is it from somewhere else?

[distant relic]

i wrote it based off "two princes" by the spin doctors

[sage token]

Dang it now I wanna play Lego Rockbands

Theory: Dale played with legos as a kid in preparation for him to solve the puzzles of Rusty Lake

[late canyon]

He could have. Seems they were invented back then

[sage token]

Yup

[azure bay]

"Never forget the past within yourself"

I can't help thinking about Laura and her past-life memories about making the elixir

[covert wyvern]

ah that's actually a really good point

I just assumed it was a reference to the past within lmao

[azure bay]

It seems to be. I just noticed that this idea may not be that new and TPW works well with already established lore

TWD didn't do it that well

another Mental Health & Fishing seemed a big retcon caused by soft worldbuilding

talking of which

that's the reason why some games are better to play in chronological order

references in TPW could give TWD background it lacks

[azure bay]

I've realized a giant hole in our collective knowledge

Why the hell did Owl let Laura win the contest (if he really did ofc)?

Why did he need her at Rusty Lake?

[peak knot]

which contest?

[azure bay]

the one in newspaper

a trip to RL

[peak knot]

ahh yes

that's a good question yes

Maybe it was not his choice, just a normal contest

and people connected to the lake seems to have a "need" to go to it

[azure bay]

you seem to forget how important Laura is to Owl's plans

her memories were used to create a cube form of elixir

because they contained William's formula

[delicate atlas]

I personally think it's an easter egg/foreshadowing for the events that takes place at the end of hotel and in birthday later on rather than there being two rabbits.

[red geyser]

Hmm probably you are right, otherwise I think we would have got a bit more of information

[floral mauve]

@azure bay This makes sense to me somehow, what do u think

[azure bay]

I think it goes even further and implies an interesting and tragic story of Mr. Rabbit

[floral mauve]

yeah...because if it is that simple, he wont be special

because he is the only CS somehow restored the memories and did some extreme actions about it

plus, his appearence is different than other CS even though u keep rejecting this idea from our past convos

he is the only CS that maintains a normal head (?)

but there is still a conter argument about it,

in Birthday, when we use the steam to draw a tree, he scared us in the CS form includes his head I believe?

yes indeed

plus in the cave we also see him in a regular CS form

which is another counter argument somehow

I am counter arguing my own statement

[azure bay]

I call it inner discussion

[azure bay]

continuing it, it's fair to say that not every CS-ish image is a CS

take, for example, Leonard's flashbacks

or extract instruction in The Cave

[floral mauve]

Emmmm

Makes sense

[delicate atlas]

Oh yeah, I think it's more of a sad memory caused by an unfortunate death

[azure bay]

The thing is, we don't know

[delicate atlas]

Idk I think that when a character dies through murder or suicide or an accident they turn into a cs or get their memories corrupted (aka black cubes), but if the opposite happens, where they die a peaceful death, their memories are happy memories (aka white cubes)

Maybe I'm just reading too much into it 🗿

[azure bay]

Black cubes are just bad memories, and white are bright ones

[royal notch]

Recently in my head has popped in a question i never asked myself, and i hope you can answer.

Can corrupted souls have memories?

[bronze prism]

I think yes. Dale was half corrupted and he was literally diving around his memories.

[royal notch]

I'm saying corrupted souls, not corrupted people.

[azure bay]

What's the difference?

[royal notch]

Corrupted people are still alive. Corrupted souls are basically ghosts.

[azure bay]

I see no other difference to diversify them

[royal notch]

Yes.

[azure bay]

William preserved his memories

[royal notch]

I know, but the question is: can he create more? After death, i mean.

[azure bay]

Laura's corrupted in memories both of fall and winter

Why not?

[royal notch]

I'm not saying that's wrong. I asked this exactly for this reason: Season. Assuming that Laura won't revive someway, this means that fall and winter memories derive from her corrupted soul.

[azure bay]

I see no reasons for CS not to produce memories

They are nothing different from living creatures from samsara pov

[royal notch]

That's what i think too. But i put myself in discussion.

And if we "confirm" this, another question raises.

Are those memories extractabile?

[floral mauve]

but... themselves are memories somehow?

CS is basically black cube

vice versal

[azure bay]

I could agree with the 1st statement but not with the last one

Otherwise we'd have a CS for every extracted balck cube

[floral mauve]

I should probably phrase it better

[azure bay]

Which we don't witness

[floral mauve]

hotel CSs are based upon black cubes

and Caroline as well

[azure bay]

Caroline wasn't

She acted pretty independently from her cubes

[floral mauve]

emmm

[floral mauve]

well, she may has a cube in her

like hotel CS

[royal notch]

Caroline herself said to have hidden it in a safe place.

[azure bay]

What I'm trying to say, there must be something more than just memories to form a soul corrupted or not

[royal notch]

You think a violent death?

[floral mauve]

lake power involved?

[floral mauve]

this as well

[azure bay]

I'm speaking about souls in general

[floral mauve]

Mr Owl must did something to the corpse somehow to summon the CS

from the guest

but why would he want that

to extract the big white cube?

so that we can see the future

[azure bay]

Some, let's say, soul essence. And memories are to form its identity

[royal notch]

What's your opinion, guys? Technically, they don't even have a body. So not brain.

[azure bay]

Owl did extract something from guests

[royal notch]

But he potentially did it from their brains. All their skulls where with him.

[azure bay]

Ok, other example

Caroline has left memories about her own burial

[royal notch]

I assumed it was for the fire.

[azure bay]

I'm talking about the coffin one

[royal notch]

Oh. Good catch.

But how...

[azure bay]

CS in general seem to lose memories easily

The Lake, Arles, Harvey's Box, Case 23

[royal notch]

But that would mean they "forget" it.

So Caroline would have forgot that one.

[azure bay]

Why not?

She remembered her plan at least

[royal notch]

All the others, in fact, were of when she was still alive.

The point is that if corrupted souls are suffering this form of amnesia, William's one would have got great difficulty to remember what to do in order to come back (unless, of course, he get some weekly secret visits from his good brother.).

[azure bay]

I think this assumptions isn't based on anything

[floral mauve]

yes

[azure bay]

@floral mauve btw

[floral mauve]

[stark oriole]

go study

[azure bay]

yeah. Basically, what he says

[floral mauve]

we are facing a sort of dilemma, I believe you cant extract memories from CS since themselves are in a form of memories

I think the formation of CS has to do with lake

[azure bay]

I think 20K BC game would be about the lake's origins.

while CSs are expected to exist alongside Samsara

E.g. for eternity

And even if I'm wrong here, there literally no need to connect CS to the lake

Pretas are to explain ghosts in samsara framework

I'm not buying the lake being responsible for every ghost in the book

And souls are not just memories

There's more to them

Otherwise any separated memory would create a soul which is not the case

Memories are to form personalities

And souls are vessels for them

I assume, the guests turn into cubes because souls are not materialistic and can turn invisible revealing their contents

[floral mauve]

But remember the preta and CS are slightly different

I think CS in RL universe doesn’t really follow the property of preta except they are powerful and suffering

[azure bay]

I'm speaking about ghosts

CS seem to be a good ghost analogue just like pretas are in mythology

Caroline's book calls them ghosts and even Rose communicates with one via ouija board

and if "ghosts" exist in RL universe, it's fair to assume that some of ghost reports are true

and it's fair to further assume that just a tiny fracture of them can be related to the lake

the fact that we don't see them in this lake-centered story doesn't mean that they don't exist

lack of evidence is nothing but a weak evidence of lack

what's more, Bob has never been to the lake

how on Earth his corruption is supposed to be connected to it?

[royal notch]

Some says that the only "life purpose" of corrupted souls is regain their memories, but why they should?

[azure bay]

I'd say it's rather rebirth

because they don't always loose their memories

[royal notch]

I was trying to give an explanation of the guests' retirement.

They got staying at the bottom of the Lake, but why?

[azure bay]

1. they didn't lose their memories, as seen in Hotel
2. where would they go?

[royal notch]

1. Yes, their memories got extracted to create the future cube and then put them in the Lake. It was again asking for them.
2. I don't know, but maybe trying to kill for revenge their traitors. If not, i definitely wouldn't go in a place that, as Samsara stays, is literally hell.

[azure bay]

1. in Hotel guests seemingly were memories. That's why straynut speaks of them like they are

2. Their aggression doesn't seem targeted. And, speaking of hell, they either don't understand it or it's not literally hell (I see no hellish traits)

[royal notch]

So you think they killed Harvey just because he poppep in the wrong place at the wrong moment?

[azure bay]

I don't know. I just see them being aggressive towards Dale

and occasionally Crow's submarine

aggro of other CS isn't always targeted

Laura, for example, tries to kill Harvey twice

kills the old lady and the cow

[royal notch]

Wait, when was the second?

[azure bay]

Seasons

[royal notch]

She did it without malicious intent there.

[azure bay]

how do you know?

[royal notch]

She just needed the photo piece.

[azure bay]

this photo piece makes no sense and seems to be just a gameplay element

[royal notch]

She allow to make him live lately.

[azure bay]

we kill Harvey mostly because Laura was "afraid she would do something horrible"

we don't know about the photo piece

neither I see any reason for her to know about it

[royal notch]

Effectively... I've read that message exactly for that reason. I thought she was like:- I need that piece, so i'm afraid i'll have to kill my dear parrot! .- There's no reason for her to know it though.

[azure bay]

I think she actually meant her suicide

[royal notch]

That's also good.

Gotta go now. See you later.

[azure bay]

cya

[floral mauve]

where is this

you meant Birthday? Or the bottom of the lake

[azure bay]

I mean Case 23 and The Cave

[floral mauve]

Oh you meant CS in general

[azure bay]

I meant guests

[floral mauve]

then I am confused

oh

u mean the deer

damn

[azure bay]

And all the others that don't let Dale to get to the big white cube

[floral mauve]

btw what do u think of the giant white cube

do u think its just a underwater room designed by Owl and paint it white and make it transparent somehow

or its something more magical

[azure bay]

Idk

It seems to be present in Paradise

[floral mauve]

?

where

I dont remember

[azure bay]

There was a giant cube when Jacob went into the grrat depths

[floral mauve]

Someone probably extracted my memories

[floral mauve]

really?

which great depth

[azure bay]

The lakr

[floral mauve]

the time he goes down in the well?

or when he got burned

[azure bay]

And deeper

[floral mauve]

emmm

let me look it up

well

maybe

[azure bay]

May I ask why such uncertainty?

[floral mauve]

How Jakob dive that deep

there is no much uncertainty

It also reveals that there are many cubes down in the lake

which means the lake didnt absorb them but keep the cube in it?

or lets say the shape of the cubes are still maintained in a normal way

[azure bay]

We've never seen the lake absorbing cubes

[floral mauve]

but I assume it should

I thought it is consuming the memories to maintain the balance

[azure bay]

Then Crow wouldn't be able to get out Laura's cubes in The Cave

[floral mauve]

thats why

it seems very....weird

[azure bay]

And Owl wouldn't be able to control the guests to save Dale

[floral mauve]

because if the lake wants the fresh memories

why it allows ppl to take it back

[azure bay]

I assume the memory income is greater than outcome

[floral mauve]

emmm

does that mean Owl kidnapped more ppl and fed the lake more memories

[azure bay]

Maybe

[floral mauve]

so he is able to take back Laura's memories

since Lake is satisfied

[azure bay]

I'm not sure if the lake is so all-controlling

[floral mauve]

?

[azure bay]

I'm not even sure that it understands its need

[floral mauve]

lmao

so it is unconsicous?

[azure bay]

We don't know

Btw

Continuing our Paradise talk

Why don't we see plagues anymore?

[floral mauve]

FOCK

here we go again

but sorry

I gotta go back to study

today is the last day

[royal notch]

Maybe the Lake is still satisfied. We actually don't know how much and often it requires cubes.

[sage token]

I think Harvey wrote Harvey's song

[royal notch]

In reality, it's an already existing song, but who knows in RL universe.

[bronze prism]

Lets keep our conversation @sage token ?

[sage token]

So Paradox is Dale's dream

[bronze prism]

The intension was still there

[floral mauve]

I would rephrase it

[bronze prism]

Like he still killed her

[bronze prism]

Please, we all understand what she mean

[floral mauve]

Paradox happened in Dale´s mind

thats better

[sage token]

So Dale is trapped in his mind

[bronze prism]

We are simplifying for better understanding

[floral mauve]

yes

[floral mauve]

doubt

[bronze prism]

Again, intention was there

He killed her because yea

[sage token]

He had no choice

[floral mauve]

????

[sage token]

And in the end, he sacrifices himself

[bronze prism]

That's a good point..

[floral mauve]

debatable

according to where the current CE Birthday and Theatre is going

Dale didnt

[bronze prism]

Nowhere looking us invade his space 👁️ 👁️

[azure bay]

well. Paradox is actually about the choice. Either Laura dies or Dale sacrifices himself to save her

[floral mauve]

yes

[bronze prism]

Dale sacrificed himself at the end... 😔

[floral mauve]

.

He got the golden cube and proceed in the elevator

which means

[covert wyvern]

This.

[floral mauve]

he didnt sacrifice himself

[sage token]

I don't like this channel because everything always turns into a debate. So I'm out.

[floral mauve]

how so

[bronze prism]

I was already out lmao

[azure bay]

that only means that we are currently focusing on the timeline where Dale decides to carry on

[floral mauve]

we are discussing in a more logical base

[floral mauve]

yes

thats what devs sort of confirmed

[bronze prism]

You mean we not logical or...

[floral mauve]

multiple timeline

[azure bay]

Lynn, isn't it actually a good thing?

[bronze prism]

No

[floral mauve]

in a rational base

calm down

and analyse

and think in different perspective

[sage token]

I'd like to feel like I'm having a chill conversation instead

[floral mauve]

its what theories about

[bronze prism]

It's like our opinion, we don't really need to deal with debating

[bronze prism]

Yes

Like "hey what your opinion"?

[floral mauve]

I really dont see the problem of my perspective

[bronze prism]

There is no problems in your perspective

It's our opinion

[azure bay]

in that case, I agree. Now it's better to hear you out before responding (BTW Dale killing Laura in a certain way is my headcanon)

[bronze prism]

So I'm out for real now

[azure bay]

maybe you'd rather indeed explain your opinion?

@sage token would you?

[sage token]

Dale is essentially trapped in a loop that resets every time Laura dies. When he sacrifices himself, that's what Owl wants, he wakes up in the weird white cube room, and starts his journey in the elevator.
Since we know that he does travel in the elevator, I think it's safe to say that Dale did eventually sacrifice himself in Paradox.

[azure bay]

what exactly did straynut oppose here?

[sage token]

.

[royal notch]

Actually, Straynut didn't even let her finish...

[floral mauve]

hold up

I have something

to say

I appologise for this

but there is a flaw

When he sacrifice himself

he wont get the golden cube right?

[floral mauve]

this

or am I being stupid

[azure bay]

@floral mauve would you please let me continue from here? @sage token would you like to hear that out?

[sage token]

Sure, go on

[azure bay]

(waiting for straynut)

[floral mauve]

I let u

completely

[azure bay]

thank you both

[floral mauve]

I am not a great talker as you know me for a long time

take over from here

me go

[azure bay]

so basically we have 4 endings

2 for each chapter

a regular one and a secret one

regular ones clearly start a new loop iteration

secret ones don't

so I assume that 2 secret endings are true endings. E.g. they end the story

In one of them Dale dies and somehow saves Laura and in the other one he takes an elevator trip with the golden cube

the second one is also reflected in The Cave

notably, Dale was still sleeping back then so I assume he continued dreaming and saw ch2 secret ending along the way

the other ending saves Laura in a way that Dale effectively kills her killer e.g. his future-self (at least in Paradox context)

it's not that certain whether it translates to reality or not

currently we're focusing on that version of the story where Dale decided not to sacrifice himself

but In my eyes it doesn't make it the only canon

I think the other choice would just happen in a parallel timeline (devs have recently confirmed them)

and, who knows, maybe we'll get focused on that one day

I'd really want to see what happened next

[royal notch]

Maybe Season is part of that one.

[azure bay]

maybe

@sage token what do you think?

[sage token]

I'll admit, I have not yet found the secret ending of Chapter 2

[azure bay]

sorry for spoilers?

[floral mauve]

I guess there is a misunderstanding between us

I appologize for behaving rude

since u didnt know the golden cube ending

thats probably why u dont understand what I was saying

[sage token]

I'm sorry

It's my bad for not knowing all of the information and I suppose jumping to conclusions

[azure bay]

I think you don't have to be sorry

[floral mauve]

take ur time and have a look at chapter two secret ending

its worth while

[royal notch]

Nah, don't worry; it's impossible jumping to conclusion here!

[azure bay]

unfortunately, when you get known everything you turn biased and it's harder to produce new ideas. Some of them get debunked by new info but some can withstand and create a new interesting set of views

[slow ridge]

Hey guys! I came up with an idea! What about making a blog or smth (maybe in blogspot) about Rusty Lake and it's lore? We could add theories, and/or information about characters or events (as I did myself so many time ago with an entry in my personal blog about Harvey). We all could participate, and the blog could update every week or something.

[delicate atlas]

There's a reddit thread for that I think

And also there's the wikifandom page

[azure bay]

Wiki is moderated by a single guy who doesn't want theories on his site despite some things that he considers "obvious" are actually theories.

Talking about reddit, @slow ridge is already aware of it. It's currently the best place to post articles but it's not quite good in general.

[covert wyvern]

The best place to post extended theories could very well be Tumblr or something

(when looking at the big social media platforms)

[azure bay]

I don't think it's easy to conquer some new platform. Dragging fans at least from here requires quite an effort

[azure bay]

Is Tumblr so popular indeed?

[covert wyvern]

Ahaha I mean not extremely but if I personally had to list social media platforms it would be pretty high on my list. You make a good point though; you obviously want your theories to be read and I'm unsure if making a blogspot or whatever would attract people to read your work

[azure bay]

Reddit pretty much fulfils my personal need of notoriety.

This platform is good for posting, discussing and than sharing here. It's just not for theories only and they tend to drown under memes and vibe-posting

As far as I can tell, theories is not that popular type of content in this community in general

It's great to have this channel as a stronghold

[covert wyvern]

Fair enough

[high talon]

Someone from tumblr here there is a largeish community there for RL oddly enough the site isnt as active anymore due to many reasons but ppl still stuck around

[azure bay]

Any theorists out there?

[high talon]

oh well yes but i dont focus on that much (too overwhelming for me) i stick around for the fanart parts

[azure bay]

Maybe you can at least name some?

[high talon]

i will have to check but sure???

speedy-dino, dale-eats-cubes (lmao), fimawari have made some from what i see from a quick glance
draculablood theorises that the RL series (in universe) will end up w a solar eclipse

[azure bay]

Wdym by that?

[high talon]

unless you wanted me to state some theories then i have 0 lmao

[high talon]

figured you wanted me to name some ppl on rl tumblr that made theories

[azure bay]

No, you did well, I just didn't get the eclipse part

[high talon]

i dunno mang ask them not me ??

[azure bay]

Couldn't find anything on finawary and draculablood

Except for unrelated stuff

Can you guide me a bit more?

[high talon]

i dmed you the link to draculabloods tumblr acc

[red geyser]

So, what exactly happens at the end of Rusty Lake Roots? What I understood is that Rose decided to help William with his resurrection. She used the 10 sacrifices with herself, Leonard and Frank??? And then Rose is somehow alive again and she cares for the baby with William's soul who then becomes Laura?? Why does Rose decide to help him?

I'm not sure I'm understanding correctly...

[glacial totem]

i know rose did it bc she first saw william at a young age 🐾

[covert wyvern]

I'm assuming the entire family was sorta in on it? And also she probably raised laura bc it's her daughter lmao

[red geyser]

How? Did I miss something or is that revealed in later games?

[covert wyvern]

The how I'm unsure off. But I think offering up an organ to get a family member reborn is probably a vanderboom tradition

(at least here I'm assuming the family was willing, I obviously can't know that)

[red geyser]

I assumed Rose somehow carries Albert's will when she is created??

Also at the end of the story we get a flashback of Aldous and William at the lab. Was William's death part of the plan, to get the seed? Also, what is the seed for? Sorry I made a lot of notes during my playthrough and I'm reading them now hahaha

[covert wyvern]

Im unsure if Aldous and William were aware of the elixir killing one of them

Basically; Aldous and William r like let's live forever chug a potion and William fucking dies. Aldous probably grieving is like lmao fuck this one branch of the family in particular I'll help my brother's ghost outto make sure they end up giving him a new body

I'm assuming the seed is either an alchemical concoction or simply a super natural one.

This is my interpretation of the roots events either way^

[red geyser]

I see, yeah, probably somethink of the sort

Aldous/Mr Crow says :"The fate of Rusty Lake lies on this seed" So... there is something greater at play right? more than the story of the Vanderboom

Oh so Laura is just William, or did William's soul slowly took over her?

Ok no more quentions, sorry hahaha

[azure bay]

I also see no reason to kill Frank and Leo

[azure bay]

It was written on their journal page. Their transformations were predicted on the gate

[azure bay]

People get reborn all the time. There is no explicit reason to consider William as a separate entity

[red geyser]

So, they just were part of the ritual? I'm talking about the part when the 3 siblings are taken by the roots of the tree.

[azure bay]

I think so

[red geyser]

So there never was a "Laura", just William?

[azure bay]

There was a looooooong sequence of lives

William and Laura are just the 2 recent ones

Laura was built on William like William was built on someone else

[red geyser]

Oh god hahaha, I need to replay the rest of the games

[azure bay]

It's not directly told

It's implied by samsara

Which is explained the best in Theatre

[red geyser]

Thanks for the explanation!!

[peak knot]

hey!!! i had a "theory" in mind (more or less a headcanon) :
will Mr Owl disapear completely once Dale will become the new ruler of the lake?

[sage token]

I think he's just after retirement lol but maybe

[peak knot]

LMAO

[covert wyvern]

I think the concept of Mr owl either dying or fading into obscurity after Dale takes over would be pretty likely.

[peak knot]

yeahh same

that would be so.. tragic and beautiful

[azure bay]

I don't get why you don't take his future shown in Paradox ch2 literally

[high talon]

Adios-Mr.Owl

[azure bay]

if Jacob is his past life, if Mr. Owl is his present life then it's only fair to think that a fish is his future life

[sage token]

I forgot that lol

So what's up with fishy boi in Harvey's Box?

[azure bay]

I think nothing special. Just a weird-looking lake dweller

I suggest you making an underwater exploration in The Cave submarine

visit the hotel, the cabin and the chapel

you'll be rewarded with exciting stuff

[peak knot]

Omg a talking fish...

[azure bay]

Hopefully not a flying fish god

[floral mauve]

yessss

u still remember lol

[azure bay]

@slow ridge do you have theories of your own?

[sage token]

I do believe that Rusty Lake could be a pocket dimension of sorts

[covert wyvern]

yes this is what I headcanon

a lake surrounded by mountains with simply a lot of ways in and out.

[sage token]

The other policemen knew that Dale was obsessed with Rusty Lake. He even mapped out an easy route. So when he goes missing why don't they go knocking on Mr. Owl's door? Crow had to chauffeur Dale to the Lake in a fashion that was reminiscent of how Death takes the dead to the underworld in Greek mythology. Mortals can't simply enter the underworld. Maybe normal people can't simply enter the Lake.

[covert wyvern]

I wouldn't be surprised but im also slightly doubtful. I think an important aspect of RL "Mental health and Fishing"

Im assuming people can go there to just like, fish, but maybe the lake is specific about it.

[sage token]

🤔 Yeah I kinda have a theory but I'm having trouble wording it

[covert wyvern]

that's far! it's sometimes hard to find the words.

im very simple in my RL believes to be fair. I believe in the existence of multiple timelines, branching of the main timeline (the different endings in the games) and the Lake being a sentient entity that rules its own lil sub space bubble that has many entrances and exits (mostly based on the cubes scattered across the globe in the arg)

[sage token]

You know how in Stranger Things, there's a dimension that mirrors ours?
Like, what if the Lake, exists in our dimension as just a normal lake. But it's in another dimension where the weird stuff happens.

Kinda

Idk

[covert wyvern]

ye so the lake would have an upside down lake attached to it.

Like how the lake turns red when night falls in hotel

[sage token]

Yeah

[sage token]

And yes I was also thinking that the Lake is sentient and only lets certain people in

[floral mauve]

I agree with the first part

but from where did you get the second part

let certain people in

[sage token]

Again, why don't the police come knocking on Owl's door? Maybe because the Lake isn't letting them.

[covert wyvern]

or the police are in Owls pocket

[sage token]

:O

Omg

[covert wyvern]

nah I doubt Owl's some criminal mastermind

[sage token]

Also, anyone else notice that Dale's office in Case 23 is lacking a door?

[covert wyvern]

but I would like to propose the following; whose to say the police believe Dale at all? a woman gets her throat slit and suddenly Dales blabbering about magical animal people and cubes.

ye I think it's been brought up before, could be anything. could be bc the thing you play is a memory so you don't "need" a door. could just be its a point and click game and a door is just extra space they didnt wnat.

[sage token]

Yeah but he goes missing and since he had been rambling about a lake for ages, I think the logical step would be to see if he wandered off to the lake

[covert wyvern]

mhm fair but whose filing a missing persons report? does Dale even have any loved ones left

[sage token]

Don't you think his police buddies would be like, "Say, Dale hasn't come in to work in a while. Hmmm."

[covert wyvern]

I honestly don't know.

like id have to know his relationship w/ people on the force

[sage token]

True I suppose

[azure bay]

What about James, Mary, Ida and Leonard being able to leave and return to the lake? Aren't they mortal?

[floral mauve]

Maybe its too far away from the populated region?

which made it hard to trace

[covert wyvern]

I don't think "special people" necessarily means "immortal" to be fair.

[floral mauve]

like mountainous areas

[covert wyvern]

but taht's also a good point^ if someone goes missing in vast mountains or forests its likely their body simply will not be found lmao

[floral mauve]

like a theory I made a while ago, The lake is situated in a mountainous area with small village near

this can explain where Caroline and Mary and Ida come from

[covert wyvern]

also @azure bay I saw someone translated a piece and posted it to the reddit have you seen it yet?

[azure bay]

1. People don't know about the lake
2. People don't know about Owl
3. Owl has resources to legally keep people captive

[covert wyvern]

seems like your cup of tea

[floral mauve]

you like it, do u

[azure bay]

Sure thing I did

[covert wyvern]

I haven't read it at all haven't had time, but figured I'd let Crafter know lmao.

anyway my food is at the front door

[floral mauve]

I shall make part 2 soon

[floral mauve]

enjoy ur food!

[floral mauve]

Owl has his own network (TWD), convincing his employers is not a big deal I believe

[sage token]

Wow four pings in one channel. 😅 Give me a moment to catch up

[sage token]

Like Damy said, special people doesn't have to mean immortal. My head cannon is kinda hard to explain I'm sorry.
Maybe this will help: I have a homebrew Jedi temple that's very mazy, but the temple can allow certain people to navigate it. If it doesn't want someone to enter, they'll get lost in the maze.
I imagine the Lake is similar to that.

[azure bay]

Only Ida is special among them

[sage token]

That is possible, but Dale did have a map sketched out. Surely someone could go in his office, see the map, and decide hey, let's check out that church. Or that mill. Ect.

[azure bay]

having a map and knowing the region are 2 different things

[sage token]

I suppose

[sage token]

That's true

[azure bay]

@sage token can you imagine a special trait that would lead people to the lake?

[sage token]

Well Dale is supposedly the chosen one, right? At least, Owl thinks that. To be chosen means that someone does the choosing. I think it's up to if the Lake sees potential in someone, I suppose. Certain families are drawn there. Maybe it has something to do with bloodlines.

[azure bay]

Dale technically didn't find the way to there

it was Owl to teleport him

Let's speak of James 1st

He not only came there on foot but someone wanted him to be there

[cerulean crypt]

What about Ida

She just arrived there

[covert wyvern]

did she

or was she meant to.

[high talon]

tbh i recall it was never like

revealed?

[sage token]

Is James Mr. Owl? I'm tired sorry brain no work
Oh wait the Vanderboom guy from the beginning of Roots?

[azure bay]

Ida was a legit fortune teller

[covert wyvern]

The threads that weave fate are fickle and I have a feeling the lake might be pulling the strings.

[azure bay]

the last 1

[sage token]

Well he received a letter from either William or Crow, didn't he?

[azure bay]

yes but how did he find his way if it's hidden?

[high talon]

dumb luck?

Altho if im being honest James sounds sorta dumb

[azure bay]

bare in mind that a whole plan of the alchemists relied on James's arrival

[high talon]

True i meean i doubt they had any tools to point out an exact place back then (gps.etc)

so

maybe landmarks?

[sage token]

Well here are some ideas.
A. The Lake allowed him to enter.
B. Once you enter the Lake, you can call others in. (Like the Sylvan Glade in Sims 4. This is kinda how I imagine Crow was able to bring Dale, if the Lake didn't actually choose him, since Owl pretty much manipulated things thinking that Dale was the chosen one.). And by receiving the letter, he was allowed in. (...?)
C. B, but maybe he was also given a map that we're never told about, or directions of some kind. I think it would make sense to give someone directions if you expect them to go somewhere they've never been before.

[floral mauve]

that map didnt specify the town or anything specific isnt it, its only a map of that area

plus, he didnt use it anyway since he got teleported unwillingly

[floral mauve]

which could be anywhere (geoguesser moment)

[sage token]

Didn't he find the church? 🤔 Or did he just wake up there? I can't remember...

[floral mauve]

The mill

he got teleported by Mr Owl

he passed out in his office

possibly kidnapped by Mr Owl

adultnapped

[sage token]

Then where did Crow canoe him from?

[floral mauve]

From the church

to cabin

Lynn u might want to replay The mill and case 23

If u love Dale u gotta remember what he experienced

[sage token]

At last, I was close to Rusty Lake. Although I did not understand what happened, after a deep sleep I found myself on the floor of the mysterious chapel I knew from the pictures.

I'm confused. He wasn't in the mill in case 23, was he?

[floral mauve]

No

oh gosh

[sage token]

???

[floral mauve]

The Mill has a clip

about Mr Owl teleporting Dale

during the storm

[sage token]

The T pose thing?

[floral mauve]

yes

[covert wyvern]

ye

[sage token]

I thought Dale was having an out of body experience or something at the time. Ohhh. Wait. So I think when I was playing it at first, I thought I was playing as Dale and not Crow. Then I read later that it was Crow. I think my wires got crossed or something. 😅

[floral mauve]

[high talon]

huh fdmkfd i got confused reading that?

[floral mauve]

exactly

[sage token]

._.

[floral mauve]

you make it so complicated

but its fine

[sage token]

I'm gonna attempt to clarify

[floral mauve]

if you understand whats going on now

[sage token]

When I was playing The Mill, I thought that I was playing as Dale, and not Crow.
So when Owl T posed over Dale's body, I thought Dale was having an out of body expirience. Like, his consciousness was in the Mill but his body was outside. And that whatever Owl was doing was causing said out of body experience.
Because of my misinterpretation, I didn't understand the timeline correctly.
Does that make more sense? Again, I'm sorry, I'm tired.

[floral mauve]

Ü

u dont need to be sorry for that

I just want to help you to have a clear view of subjective plot

[sage token]

No worries, I'm gonna read the wiki to refresh my memory, after a nap

[floral mauve]

good luck with that

[covert wyvern]

take care Lynn!

[azure bay]

we were working on the version of the lake being a pocket dimention

[high talon]

oh yeah lmao a lot of ppl think that

[azure bay]

Lynn explained by that no one being able to find the lake except for certain people

[high talon]

hmm i see

well i can see that working tbh

[azure bay]

why the question mark

?

[high talon]

force of habit

sorry

[azure bay]

The biggest problem I see in heavy isolation of the lake is Vanderboom's lack of sustainability

Eilanders could survive without society

unlikely Vanderbooms

they had good clothing, they were rarely seen doing any kind of work etc.

they seem pretty rich nobles with a family crest and some kind of passive income

[high talon]

hmmm

[azure bay]

that would be impossible with that income couldn't reach them through spatial bubble

[high talon]

well i do HC theres a village of people near the vanderboom house we just havent seen it

[azure bay]

how exactly would they generate money if the place were isolated?

[high talon]

hmm i have tried thinking of that hmmm

[sage token]

I don't think they were trapped in the pocket dimension. They could probably come and go as they pleased.

[azure bay]

it's not just about them

it's also about the others

[sage token]

What others are you referring to?

[azure bay]

for example, someone has to deliver newspaper

[sage token]

Oh dang I never thought of that

[high talon]

i wish i could explain it lol hmm like i could throw stuff @ the wall n hope it sticks but i dunno

[sage token]

So that area that's mapped out in Paradox with the hotel and chapel and mill and other places. Where is the Vanderboom house in relation to that?

[covert wyvern]

I think the map in paradox is dangerous anyway

feels more like a "mindmap" then a real one

if that makes sense.

[azure bay]

the mapS in Paradox are rather symbolic

if you speak of the globe

in ch1 it depicts Laura's storyline

in ch2 the one of Dale

[high talon]

this is why i asked for that "slice of life" (as Damy called it not making fun of you or anything) anime

so we could have answers

[azure bay]

on the map from Case 23, Roots and The Cave the Vanderboom's house is out of boundaries

[sage token]

Well then the map in Case 23 with the same layout

[azure bay]

There is everything that we can see on the Roots landscape

and Vanderboom's house is just a little further to the south

another thing, I'm pretty sure that this house wasn't even a thing back in 2015

even if Vanderbooms were at least approximately thought through at the time, their concept might've been not very detailed before Roots

[sage token]

Could it be that their house is also out of the boundaries of Rusty Lake?

[azure bay]

well

as I think about it

it's more plausible in that way

[sage token]

Like, if it is a pocket dimension, they can still get the morning paper because the delivery boy doesn't need to pass through the barrier or anything.

[azure bay]

I don't think this would anyone from finding the lake tho

like

I prefer more the idea of the lake being accessible from multiple locations

but that's not what you're talking about, isn't it?

[sage token]

Well here's picture.

I don't think this would anyone from finding the lake tho
Again, I think it might be similar to the upside down from Stranger Things where there's a version of the Lake (and chapel, ect) in our dimension that isn't so weird, for lack of a better term

[azure bay]

I recall a bit similar idea I heard once

but it was rather about Samsara realms

[sage token]

I'm gonna be honest, I'm having trouble following the conversation. 😅 I still haven't napped. I'm stuck at work.

[azure bay]

do you want to continue?

[sage token]

I think it'll be best if i come back later

[azure bay]

ok good luck out there

[high talon]

well i guess we can see these (circled) places containing something like a small village/town after all we havent seen every part of the lake (yet)

[azure bay]

maybe

[high talon]

you really cant tell the details from so far away

[azure bay]

maybe not

maybe not yet

[high talon]

i have no proof sadly.XD but thats why this channel exists..

[floral mauve]

I dont think so, since incest is always a problem

As I stated before

there must be some sort of small villages nearby

[floral mauve]

like dis

[azure bay]

or not that nearby

[floral mauve]

Otherwise, where do Mary, Caroline, Ida come from

u can explain Ida by her prophecy of her fate

[high talon]

that came outta nowhere but yes

[floral mauve]

but the other two are quite normal

[azure bay]

I completely agree

yet it's a nice exercise trying to rationalize other pov's

[floral mauve]

yes

have u guys heard of Shangri-La

a quite old classic novel I love

[azure bay]

what is it about?

[floral mauve]

its like RL

[high talon]

but yeah i hc/theorize theres a small village nearby we just havent seen it yet

[floral mauve]

a village in Himalaya region

[high talon]

again i have no proof but i think it could fit??

[floral mauve]

(Hopefully Damy wont beat me up for this)

[high talon]

is it Game Of Thrones Jamie n Cersei weird?

[floral mauve]

that is isolated from the society, the only way they communicate with the outside world is depending on locals who have to climb several mountains

to reach the village

their newspaper arrives once a month

[azure bay]

it seems to be even more to that

cigars and pilsner are named after RL

[floral mauve]

yes

well

[azure bay]

however

[floral mauve]

I mean it is possible that

Mr Owl invented the brand

and he grew his own weed

[azure bay]

Theatre is also named after the lake yet it seems to be located in Dale's city

[floral mauve]

I mean the ingredient

[high talon]

mr.owl getting lit lmaooooo

[ripe barn]

just finished roots, does that mean laura is the reborn william?

[high talon]

yes

[junior jungle]

ahaha i think i might be a bit late to this convo, but i think there is, as we pass by a town in the globe in paradox

[azure bay]

Paradox globe is metaphorical. You could at least compare it to all the other maps and landscapes of Rusty Lake. It contradicts all of them

[floral mauve]

Yes

The paradox map is a summary of Dale and Laura’s life

However

There is a theory

Saying the Laura map is also Harvey map

[vague imp]

I haven't read anywhere about this but I have found another source of inspiration for Rusty Lake. Yesterday I watched Matrix and exactly like Mr Crow and Dale are sitting in armchairs facing each other are Morpheus and Neo. Morpheus even uses an old TV to show Neo "the real world". Thoughts?

[azure bay]

I think it's a trope rather than inspiration

[sage token]

There is the whole "take the red vial/pill or the blue vial/pill thing"

[azure bay]

the meaning is different tho

[sage token]

But the concept is the same. Red or blue. Just sayin' :P
I definitely got some Matrix vibes from Rusty Lake along the way

[azure bay]

considering the whole unreality of Paradox, I see what you mean

[junior jungle]

true, could it possibly be dale's own version/mindmap of the lake?

[azure bay]

In ch1 it depicts Laura's storyline

in ch2 the one of Dale

[scarlet badger]

Hi

Rusty Lake universe about past, present, future and enlight. To understan game's story you need to learn bases of buddism.

Samsara Room about englighten or rebirth of William.

But william can't enlight in both of the enfings

Samsara(sansara) from buddism this is a circle of rebirthings to escape from this circle human need to englight. Mr.Crow Mr.Owl Mr.parrot is asuras they like demons with Gods power but they are mortal. To save they live they need to drink elixir of life and death from the gold cube(philosophy rock).

[ebon aspen]

Yeah, william rebirths as laura, he just wasnt meant to get enlightened

[azure bay]

funny enough I've got to know one good theorist by presenting him almost the same info when I was new

[scarlet badger]

I just reed abput buddism and i see same thiks with rusty lake😅 😅 😅

[azure bay]

I only want to say that RL seemingly didn't just ctrl+c ctrl+v the mythology of Buddhism and Hinduism

They seem to redefine the concept of enlightenment

[scarlet badger]

Yeah, i meant with reading about buddism i could understand rusty lake's story

That concepts are make me feel like i missing one detail, and i like it

[azure bay]

what detail?

[scarlet badger]

Which of endings of Cube Escape: Paradox is true?

It has 4 endigs

[azure bay]

well

I'd say just 2 of them are true

not because they are canon or not but because they truly end the episode

but if you ask me about the canon ending, I rather prefer to see a splitting timeline here

especially after devs recently confirming multiple timelines to be a thing

however we're currently focusing on a single one of the timelines

[scarlet badger]

I thing th on that time line Laura killed herself, right?

[azure bay]

what is the alternative for you?

[scarlet badger]

@scarlet badger i thing this is truely time line because, if laura don't herself, dale can't searching her house

[azure bay]

to be clear for both of us, you think that in one of the timelines Laura killed herself. What happens in the other one?

[scarlet badger]

In other timeline, she killed by dale's dark soul

On the episode Cube Escape: The Lake

[azure bay]

aha

I get what you mean

but what exactly indicates that a corrupted soul in The Lake belongs to Dale?

[scarlet badger]

Dale has been on the Paradox's room about 100 times and he drinked different elixirs, once red tjan he sacrifising his body, for the lake and he transformating to rhe dark soul

[covert wyvern]

but the events of paradox take place after Laura visits the lake

[scarlet badger]

Next he drinking green and he dead

[azure bay]

that could be a memory

the past is never dead

[scarlet badger]

Yeah but that room don't have any time

[azure bay]

Let's hear him out 1st

[covert wyvern]

fair enough.

[scarlet badger]

That room not on time or place is that not, how can you explain dale, rebirthing

?

[azure bay]

we'll get to that later

but you didn't answer my question

[covert wyvern]

I find it difficult to parse, but I suppose perhaps Dale can end up corrupted and flung back in time after the cave too, if the past is never dead haha.

[scarlet badger]

I'm answering

[azure bay]

@scarlet badger once again what does indicate The Lake CS to be Dale?

[scarlet badger]

Next dale drink's blue elixir and he is tranformating at corrupted soul again, and he kill laura

I think

Corrupted souls on the lake have any imbalance in the time they can exit from lake in past present or future

[azure bay]

but there is no cabin in Paradox

while in The Lake a CS clearly cornered Laura inside one

[scarlet badger]

It's like abstracting situation

[azure bay]

ok, I take that as a possibility

here are some more :

[scarlet badger]

What happens in cube escape series it's exam for dale when he pass he ce to asura and he will more powerful than Mr.Owl Because he can change fate

[azure bay]

Paradox takes place in Dale's mind. It was directly said so several times. The final scene is a paradox that gave title to the game: Dale sees another-self killing Laura and everything starts again.

[scarlet badger]

Teue end can be secret end

[azure bay]

Possibility 1:
this paradox is a metaphor of Dale and Laura being unable to coexist since they are bond by elixir and one of them has to die

Possibility 2:
the ending situation could to some extent reflect the reality. Like there was a real paradox of corrupted Dale from the future or another timeline killing Laura so our Dale starts his investigation

now about the endings

2 secret ones are exits from the paradox

Dale either saves Laura by killing the killer (himself)

or he accepts the consequences of his actions and takes an elevator ride

[scarlet badger]

I think he' s takes elevator eide because all cube escapes about Dale's recreations, of fate

[azure bay]

that's what I meant by focusing on a certain timeline

we focus on the one where Dale takes the ride

nevertheless I consider the other ending not less canon and really want to get its sequel

a question

could you please place some games in the chronological order?

Case 23, Birthday, Theatre, The Cave and Paraodx

from Dale's pov that is

[covert wyvern]

@ivory river for questions go to #samsara-room-help

[scarlet badger]

The Lake=Harveys Box,Seasons, Case 23=Meal, cave, paradox,theatre, birthday

[azure bay]

why is Theatre before Birthday?

[scarlet badger]

Exuse me i make mistake😅 😅 😅 😅

[azure bay]

well, I was just curious

some can indeed justify this choice

can you tell me more about The Cave and Paradox?

[scarlet badger]

After Dale,s first riding on elevator, he came to the white cube under the lake,Mr Crow give himgold cune and he riding on elevator to Paradox room

[azure bay]

the problem is, Paradox, unlike Bday & Theatre, doesn't start with elevator. Only ends

just like The Cave

[scarlet badger]

I know, but he can forget that moments

[azure bay]

another thing seems to me more likely

both Paradox and The Cave also end with the golden cube

if they went one after another, it would be weird that Dale got the cube for the second time

Paradox takes place inside Dale's mind

literally

Even Bday and Theatre are technically outside

in cubes floating around the lake

and if we pay more attention, we may also see that Dale is still sleeping in The Cave

I'm sure that the ch2 secret ending of Paradox is what Dale sees in The Cave ending while that sleep

and the rest of Paradox is seen while he's still chained to a chair

[scarlet badger]

Yeah, it can be true

[azure bay]

there is some other evidence

but it rather indicates that Bday & Theatre take place after The Cave

and doesn't directly touch Paradox

I mean

right after The Cave

[scarlet badger]

Yes you're right.

But he can't going to Asura

Because his heart hasn't revenge and he don't know life and dead elixir's recept. And we understand, he's exams don't end. He's last mission he need to find elixirs recept

I think

[azure bay]

didn't you say before that the golden cube IS the elixir?

[scarlet badger]

Yes

And he need to find how make elixir from golden cube

[scarlet badger]

And i can proof it

Golden cube simbolisming of philosophy rock

[azure bay]

I have some strong suspicion

that strongly smells Igrarium

[scarlet badger]

Who is it?

[azure bay]

ok nevermind

[scarlet badger]

Or what is it

Ok

[azure bay]

carry on

[scarlet badger]

Philosophy rock is a iroccional elment. But ancient people think it is key to being immortal

[azure bay]

I know what it is

I don't know why people think it's related to the elixir of RL

[scarlet badger]

If this key to being immortal, this is a key to life and death elixir

[azure bay]

a drink granting immortality is a common trope in human culture. There are many of them. What makes you think that RL were inspired by this specific one?

[scarlet badger]

Yes it can be not real, but rusty lake's concept full of peoples thinks or culturues and religions

[azure bay]

at least samsara terms are being mentioned all the time

we have Sanskrit writings for Pretas, Asuras humans and so on

but not a single mention of rubedo

The theory of Philosopher's Stone I call after The Great Work

which consists of corresponding 4 cube types to the 4 stages of the elixir

this theory is beautiful and can be considered as fundamental to the universe as the one of samsara

if not for lack of mentions

samsara is common, the great work like doesn't exist at all

[scarlet badger]

Do you know, in first version of samsara room the soul is enlighted, and it can be exam for corrupted souls, but william can't pass it

[azure bay]

the OG Samsara Room is uncanon

it's not in the RL universe

and doesn't indicate its laws

enlightenment could and pretty much seems to be different in SR and RL

[scarlet badger]

And Last question

What happens wit corrupted soul of Laira?

[azure bay]

at what point?

[scarlet badger]

At Seasons

[azure bay]

depends on point of view

I'm sure she changes the past because "why would the notes lie?"

however many think that Seasons is as unreal as Paradox and Laura just finds a peace at best

[scarlet badger]

I'l find answer

[azure bay]

Why Floppa?

[scarlet badger]

I don't know 😅 😅 😅 😅 😅

William's soul going to samsara again adn again,do you see secret ending of Samsara? It's like ending of Seasons. But on samsara he back to point when he should find an egg i think the same can being on Seasons

[azure bay]

despite recurring vibes SR and Seasons have not much in common

SR is a purgatory

Seasons is a sequence of memory travels

they are in different plains for me

[scarlet badger]

Oh that's right

Ok, i'm going to sleeping

[azure bay]

gn

[scarlet badger]

Bye and good night

[azure bay]

btw

congrats for figuring out samsara

not many people do it on their own

[floral mauve]

I am slightly late for this convo

but thats pretty impressive

[floral mauve]

because if you look it up, Elixir is philosophy stone in different culture

[azure bay]

dude I know

my problem is the lack of obvious connections

like the ones to samsara

[scarlet badger]

Thalnks

[floral mauve]

also

The Dale's ending in the current focused timeline is the one with the golden cube

However, when did he turn into Deer headed Asura

My question is

Is Deva in RL universe Asura with golden cube

[floral mauve]

maybe when he arrive hotel after the end of his elevator journey?

[azure bay]

I think Dale is to become a deva not because of supper-duper-mega-archi-uber-elixir but rather because of a hard work he's done in Bday and Theatre

a spiritual work

[floral mauve]

yes

but

if thats about mental health

why cant Owl do the same

[azure bay]

not health

but level of conciousness

effort put into it

[floral mauve]

but apparently, Owl guides him

if he can guide Dale, he must already knew it

[azure bay]

it's too late for him

[floral mauve]

thats one explaination

I can think of

[scarlet badger]

I said, Dale xan be more powerdull than Mr.Owl

[floral mauve]

from where can you see it

in the current situation

maybe in the future when he is deva or golden cube deer Dale

he is indeed stronger

[scarlet badger]

Dale can change fate how he doit in Theatre.an Birthday

[floral mauve]

oh

em

[floral mauve]

if it happens in his mind

plus

He didnt

his parents are still dead

[azure bay]

Memories*

Memories that can bend the reality, according to Seasons

[floral mauve]

from the reality

[floral mauve]

.

this didnt change

at the moment

[azure bay]

you can't know for sure

[floral mauve]

true

but that requires too much interpretation

which is more fan creation

[azure bay]

In Laura's case all the changes were instant

cactus, fungi, Harvey

[floral mauve]

if she changed it

Case 23 will not exist

since she changed everything

at the beginning

Spring

[azure bay]

and here we're back to timeline splitting

[floral mauve]

yep

as I stated

for me

during Dale's elevator journey

its about his mentalstates

Birthday is to overcome his childhood trauma

Theatre is about higher consciousness

[azure bay]

it is but it doesn't have to be limited to them

[floral mauve]

it also stated in paradox

he needs a new brain

[azure bay]

there he needs it over and over again

[sage token]

Maybe the way time travel works in Rusty Lake, you can save others (Laura saved Harvey...kinda), but you can't save yourself. Which is why Dale needs to save Laura...? I'm just throwing an idea out there, don't yell at me xD

[floral mauve]

the problem with time travel, it will extend many...many problems

[azure bay]

I think that Dale has created a separate timeline where his parents live

[floral mauve]

maybe

[azure bay]

he could become a part of it or just take his alternative experience from it

[sage token]

Look, Avengers Endgame pretty much threw time travel logic out the window so I don't know what's going on any more

[floral mauve]

I dont think he will be a detective after that change

[azure bay]

they did not, they enhanced a certain theory of it

[floral mauve]

I dont think it fits here but in Loki, the timeline manager indicates that this suppose to happen as a part of the timeline plot

oop

spoilers

[azure bay]

it's a subject to debate.

[floral mauve]

yep

But many things will certainly be different

will he still be qualify as a chosen one?

or in a different way of saying

is he still worthy?

[azure bay]

he's not just a product of the new timeline he created

he's a synthesis of 2

[floral mauve]

my brain doesnt follow

oh

yes

if you mean that

but that makes it more complicated

[sage token]

It doesn't make sense to me

[floral mauve]

merge timeline

[floral mauve]

wait a minute

[azure bay]

are you familiar to the grandfather's paradox?

[floral mauve]

something is wrong

He cant revive his family because once he did, he is no longer him

in terms of experience

[azure bay]

I'm telling that he gets both

[floral mauve]

thats not possible

[azure bay]

"My past isn't what it seems to be"

he still has traces of his old experience

[floral mauve]

there is a paradox in it

I just need to remember it

[azure bay]

I'm sure he still remembers reliving his painful past and replacing it with a new one

[floral mauve]

so he merges with a Dale

of a muliverse?

with both parents been alive

[azure bay]

Kinda I think

[floral mauve]

because if he saves his parents back in that day, his parents will have the memories of what Dale is going to be like

in the future

thats a lot more information

[azure bay]

I also tend to like an idea of local reality bending

[floral mauve]

it will extend to global

[azure bay]

not necessarily

in some fiction it works as a bubble

[sage token]

Are you referring to Dales grandfather or is that a time travel theory, because my knowledge of time travel only comes from movies and I don't actively seek out theories, no

[floral mauve]

this is getting to complicated

plus

the existence of Dale's grandpa is still unknown

[floral mauve]

I think he is talking about someone killed the grandpa in timetravel paradox

[bronze prism]

Um

[sage token]

I just wanted to throw a theory into the mixing pot and now y'all dragged me in 😅

[bronze prism]

Whoa, we should do a study about grandfather...

Like, some kind of document or something like that, so all people can put their observations and theories

[sage token]

My head cannon is that the grandfather is Crow and birthday is an altered memory

[floral mauve]

I do agree with this actually

[bronze prism]

For me grandfather = mr crow

[azure bay]

no. Let me present it to you then. Imagine a situation.
You time travel to the past and kill your grandfather before your father was conceived. Your father isn't born, therefore you aren't born, therefore you didn't time travel and didn't kill the grandfather, therefore you were born and could time travel... and so on

[floral mauve]

yes

[sage token]

Okay then

[bronze prism]

But- the reaction is stopped at the moment I kill the grandfather

[floral mauve]

for me, to make it simple and no overread, its just an illusion

[bronze prism]

Because he doesn't exist anymore

This is not a paradox

[floral mauve]

then how can you kill you grandpa

it is

a paradox

[bronze prism]

I don't because he doesn't exist anymore

[high talon]

you actually cant go back in time that far

[azure bay]

no, in this model the time is continuous and reaction doesn't stop there. Therefore, a paradox

[floral mauve]

then he is still alive

[high talon]

you can only go as far as your birth year

[sage token]

I'm too tired for paradoxes 😅

[bronze prism]

Well, if I killed the grandpa then me and he don't exist anymore

[sage token]

Quantum Leap?

[azure bay]

this paradox is resolved by branching timeline

[floral mauve]

time to introduce kill myself theory

[bronze prism]

Both of us are ded (and the dad too)

[bronze prism]

Ah yes ↑

[sage token]

My head cannon is that when a new timeline branches off, the old timeline collapses

[azure bay]

but why?

[floral mauve]

why cant they exist at the same time?

like parallel

[late canyon]

[sage token]

Welp. There's a theory thing that I can't quite remember atm. I learned it in my worldview class.

But since I can't remember it, I'm going with "That's what happened in this show called Continuum"

Also kinda happened in Loki but that was the Timekeeper agency's doing

[azure bay]

then you either cancel the whole ongoing Dale's story from the very beginning or accuse the devs of lying to us

[sage token]

I think Birthday was an altered memory. Therefore, no time travel was really involved and his story didn't change, only his memory

[azure bay]

I'm speaking of Seaasons

[sage token]

Laura didn't save herself