#🤔｜theories

1 messages · Page 109 of 1

cerulean crypt
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Adoulus?

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They are with him in boat

azure bay
cerulean crypt
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But i can calculate their head height

azure bay
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& Crow is a charachter to have a different sprite almost in every game

stable wigeon
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so btw what is up with their professions

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u think it has any significance

azure bay
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It kinda has

stable wigeon
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and is it presumed they live amongst humans

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i never considered where they came from before i thought they just lived in hotel

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but i remember them arriving

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from where tho lol

cerulean crypt
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From the shore

stable wigeon
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thats not what i mean lol

azure bay
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It shows that they have changed since being Eilanders. Probably, lost their memories during rebirth.

Than Pheasant & Rabbit indicate that there are many more people of asur kind as they have to somehow stay in showbis.

Boar could indicate that there are at least one more country inhabited by asurs

prisma monolith
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Well, their careers kinda foreshadow the respective methods of execution

stable wigeon
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yea

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so thats the thing

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its of "asura kind"?

cerulean crypt
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Actualy Harvey is intenacional criminal

stable wigeon
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their own place? not amongst humans?

cerulean crypt
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he killed dyplomat

prisma monolith
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Mr. Deer - Chemist, was poisoned
Mr. Rabbit - Magician, killed in a trick "gone wrong"
Ms. Pigeon - Electrical engineer, electrocuted
Ms. Pheasant - Actress, suicide in front of camera
Mr. Boar - Ambassador, not entirely sure (culturally ignorant?)

stable wigeon
#

ik they have their own realm in hinduism and buddhism but im talking strictly RL

azure bay
stable wigeon
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if they had their own realm of existence

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i would think we would have been hinted of it by now

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it seems like just speculation does it not? RL never references different dimensions

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or another location

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that could be this place

azure bay
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We have almost nothing on them. I'd wait at least for another game about asurs before setting up some expectations

stable wigeon
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yeah just weird how where came feom

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the whole boat thing recently tripped me up like i said and the professions i forgot about

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before presumed asura land was just the hotel but thats obv not the case

azure bay
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The theater seems to be time to time. If the same theater is mentioned on the posters of Pheasant & Rabbit

stable wigeon
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hmm but different one than what dale visits i presume? (seeing as it was a past memory)

azure bay
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I assume it was the same. It just serves different races in different times

stable wigeon
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it seems the real theatre he visited was completely different from what it changed to after he revisted the memory

azure bay
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I guess not too different

stable wigeon
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idk thats how it seemed to be just a common theatre where he met bob (initially)

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seeing as

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he hasnt been affiliated with RL before the events of case 23

azure bay
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But the original Theatre took place during case 23

stable wigeon
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yeah but i mean

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i meant i didnt think the theatre was truly the RL theate

azure bay
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Even tho I don't think that everyone should be affiliated with RL in order to visit the theater

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Posters seemed to be pretty common in TWD

stable wigeon
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ig but then he was aware of them?

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hmm

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but this goes back to my hypothesis on paradox which is seeming to be more and more flawed lol

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so he could have still potentially discovered RL even if case 23 (Laura's death) didnt happen...?

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i guess my presumption that Laura was his sole means of discovering the lake is incorrect then

azure bay
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You mean he could become interested in the theater & use it to find the lake?

stable wigeon
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not that "Rusty Lake" didn't exist to public eye

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yeah basically

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but the only other connection to the case is via bob

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but was he at RL institute at that time?

azure bay
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At what time?

stable wigeon
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the time dale is investigating case 23

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specifically the theatre memory

azure bay
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Bob's got into the institute after his escape from the PD

stable wigeon
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Ah that makes alot of sense

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again weird

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makes me think events changed since at theatre he killed himself there

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and at PD he was still a human

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so it seems the timeline changed

azure bay
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I don't think that exactly this event was changed anyhow

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Let me explain

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I see 2 possibilities of Bob staying alive

stable wigeon
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but real quick

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just dont forget

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im not as much talking about his death as us witnessing him turn into a CS both times

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thats the important part

azure bay
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  1. this kind of shots is not that lethal. Thay are possible to survive + that could explain his memory loss. He could spend the time before being arrested in a hospital. (the only problem - there was no scar left after that)

  2. the shot could be an illusion, be reversed, be magically healed etc. by Mr. Owl.

stable wigeon
#

again though........

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in PD he seems human then suddenly something happens and we see him turn CS

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but in theatre we witness him turn CS too

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and i dont think they would apprehend a CS as a suspect

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especially if he shot himself

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then he would in no way be in questioning

cerulean crypt
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PD?

stable wigeon
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police department

azure bay
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I'm not that sure if his corruption in Theatre wasn't an alteration. It was used there as an example for Dale's lesson

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& even if it actually took place there, Bob is the one to go corrupted & back too often

stable wigeon
azure bay
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Theatre, PD & Day 5 are all examples of his corruption

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& each time he seemingly turns back into human

stable wigeon
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yes but

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i dont think he actually was

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this is from his prespective

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i dont know what to make of how he perceives himself

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i just assumed

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he was, or a part of him was

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a CS the entirity of TWD

azure bay
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There was a clear change of perception after his corruption

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So I tend to believe it

stable wigeon
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hmm so he literally changes to and fro

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weird

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i perceived that as a rather unlikely possibility but youre right

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there would be no point of change of perception if it didnt mean anything

azure bay
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It could mean that Bob finally realises his form

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& the perceived reality is mostly what you believe in

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That's what I can come up with, according to you

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I think it would be interesting to further investigate this idea

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See how it works with other games

stable wigeon
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unreliable narrator always throws a wrench in theories tho lol

azure bay
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Personally, I tend to believe most of TWD events. Its narration is the clearest of all games & Bob's memories are too important to be much altered by TWD

stable wigeon
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what i meant to say ig with the perception thing

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was the whole game seemed to be emphasizised

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in his mind

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as you said acceptance

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the whole game is about this

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he is mentally tormented as laura is and we see her hallucinate in seasons etc etc

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im saying with both of these people they're mind isnt

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or spirit or whatever isnt

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stable

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and it is hard to determine whether the scary things they experience are happening in their mind or in "reality" because the game itself seems to blend the two together

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idk just with CS's and stuff i never know what it means when like dale sees himself a CS in the mirror i always thought that was more of a mind thing.... maybe "perception" isnt the right term but

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"reality" I mean shared reality i.e. observable to the outside

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anyway

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gn

azure bay
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How hard is Rusty Lake worldbuilding, according to u, guys?

vague imp
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Where do we start?

azure bay
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Where can we?

covert wyvern
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what do you mean with world building?

azure bay
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an author can build the world 1st & fit his story in there

or vise versa - build the story & bend the world to fit it (fer example, by introducing new rules).

covert wyvern
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right. okay.,

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I dunno it;d argue with the latter for RL

azure bay
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excuse me?

covert wyvern
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ye, I'm saying, I assume Rusty Lake wrote a story first and came up with the world after.

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but like

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I have nothing to base that on.

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was that not what you were asking? lmao.

azure bay
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yeah, that's it I just had some troubles with understanding

covert wyvern
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Don't we all crowgiggle

azure bay
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however, I'd like to see some evidence

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if possible

covert wyvern
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crowgiggle maybe one day. I'm much too busy being depressed.,

azure bay
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do you want to talk about that? elsewhere ofc

covert wyvern
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Not at all Cool

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but thanks for your offer.

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sometimes life just be like that it'll get better

azure bay
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ok, brace yourself then

nocturne yarrow
azure bay
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Caroline was kinda referenced back in Case 23

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so did Pheasant

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& fetus going dark & leaving a heart behind looks a lot like William

nocturne yarrow
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I’d say those things inspired later designs, not the other way around

azure bay
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Probably except for Pheasant. Mr. Owl was introduced the very next game

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& Pheasant the game after that

stable wigeon
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the entirity of hotel guests are so mysterious arent they

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the only one whose story i kinda understand is rabbit

small sigil
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anyone here thinks that dale's grandfather is actually mr.crow too?

azure bay
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many think so

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there are alternative opinions tho

small sigil
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thats what mr.rabbit fail too

stable wigeon
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again

azure bay
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  1. Crow could just impersonate him inside the memory in order to watch Dale
  2. That could be just an asset reuse
stable wigeon
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i am under impression

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that rabbit wanted to be killed by dale

azure bay
stable wigeon
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maybe not but i think its equally likely

small sigil
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hm interesting

stable wigeon
small sigil
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thats what i think too

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like the eilanders --> guests --> examples like killer mr.rabbit

stable wigeon
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like the fetus is more of a symbol

small sigil
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and maybe they have the past lifes' mind as well

stable wigeon
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not that she needed a literal fetus

azure bay
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It's hard to say for sure for now. The only fact is that he's taken that pistol & mentioned a substance of his past life

stable wigeon
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but she needed that part of her life

azure bay
stable wigeon
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eilander right

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no wait

azure bay
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Pheasant's role

stable wigeon
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not eilander

small sigil
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what i believe is killer rabbit's past life (or inside his black cube) = mr.rabbit's next life

stable wigeon
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someone pointed out that that was a vanderbloom hat

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i forget who it was

small sigil
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what

stable wigeon
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whoever the first Mother was

azure bay
small sigil
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mary

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no its emma's? u mean in the wedding photo

stable wigeon
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originally?

small sigil
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ye?

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wait let me find

stable wigeon
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wasnt emma before Hotel

azure bay
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Roots came out after Hotel

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that's what I mean

stable wigeon
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not all of it

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oh

small sigil
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nah its mary

azure bay
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I mean the release date

stable wigeon
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im talking chronilogically

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ok

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i c wym

small sigil
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but that hat is black

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instead of white

stable wigeon
small sigil
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but both of them have a blue ribbon

stable wigeon
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not mary

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and doesnt she wear it in family band

small sigil
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this one?

unknown.png
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mary's one is similar

azure bay
stable wigeon
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oh

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maybe im dumb

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i just remembered someone saying that lol

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yeah maybe it was the hat when she was younger

azure bay
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either way

small sigil
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when she first met james

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oh ye

stable wigeon
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yea that one

azure bay
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Pheasant's hat was the 1st to be associated with the one on the stage. before Roots even came out

small sigil
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wait but no

stable wigeon
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doesnt mean it's unrelated

small sigil
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wheres that blue ribbon lol

unknown.png
stable wigeon
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if they already established the hat as an importatant detail

stable wigeon
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i think i was wrong

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just remember someone saying that

azure bay
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There are many more connections between Pheasant & the songstress

small sigil
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sorry guys i think of something, so mary bleed after she smells the rose right?

stable wigeon
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yeah i agree with that

small sigil
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so technically she was a bloody mary herself

stable wigeon
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but im talking a different life

azure bay
stable wigeon
small sigil
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ba dum tss lol

stable wigeon
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oh

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hahahahahahahahahah

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ha

small sigil
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sorry my jokes r terrible

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forget bout it

azure bay
small sigil
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no dont lol

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i regret thinking this

stable wigeon
# azure bay wdym?

nevermind i now realize she couldnt be both since emma was alive at the same time as pheasant

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i am curious though

azure bay
stable wigeon
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the only asura we know anything about are the eilanders

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yeah well i thought

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that WAS pheasant

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visiting her past memory

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in the lake or in the forest

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like i said i thought the purpose of balancing past lives

small sigil
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the pheasant is elizabeth right?

stable wigeon
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was to escape hell

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and you see all CS's in hell in cave

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that could be same reason Rabbit as well

azure bay
stable wigeon
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maybe happened at same time; when dale was in lake

small sigil
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one things interests me is that the pheasant isnt blind anymore

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like the rabbit is still a magician

fossil wren
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anymore?

small sigil
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ye coz elizabeth is blind

azure bay
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The songstress is also real. She was the main selling point of tickets, according to posters

stable wigeon
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still could be pheasant

azure bay
stable wigeon
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i believe

small sigil
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yes but with no similarities with past life's

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like

stable wigeon
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after songtress is reborn

small sigil
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at least mr.rabbit is still a magician xD

stable wigeon
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pheasant CS goes away

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mr rabbit

small sigil
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so do rabbit

stable wigeon
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is a tree

small sigil
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oh fk right

azure bay
stable wigeon
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lmao

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i dont know about that

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yeah i ger ir

small sigil
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lol

stable wigeon
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i dont think he literallt turned into a tree tbh

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but good meme

small sigil
#

rabbit CS tree is the same with the tree in the seasons right?

fossil wren
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ok so there’s Brown Rabbit (Hotel), Brown Rabbit (Theatre), and White Rabbit (Birthday), right?

azure bay
small sigil
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actually im still confused about samsara

stable wigeon
azure bay
fossil wren
stable wigeon
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the thing is u see the white rabbit in hotel

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White one

fossil wren
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where?

stable wigeon
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was a CS

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a jumpscare

azure bay
stable wigeon
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out the window

small sigil
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i think the past within will explores dale's journey towards the hotel OR harvey's past

stable wigeon
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wasnt that white rabbit

azure bay
small sigil
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lmao

fossil wren
small sigil
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i dont know lol

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how can u guys know?

fossil wren
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trailer

small sigil
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well

fossil wren
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and the steam page iirc

small sigil
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ok i guess i will watch it the 3rd time

azure bay
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@stable wigeon returning to substance of Pheasant's past lives

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I know one interpretation both for fetus & heart

small sigil
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wait a minute is that ida's voodoo doll

azure bay
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maybe
maybe not
not that interested before we discover more

small sigil
#

ok albert confirmed then

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who i hate the most among all the characters :)

azure bay
small sigil
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mistake?

azure bay
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his death

small sigil
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of reincarnating william?

azure bay
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no, killing him by Frank's hands

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he broke the 4th wall on the new year

small sigil
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hm

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in the devlog 1?

azure bay
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nah, the devlog is recent

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there was an announcement much earlier this year

small sigil
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ok im scrolling up now

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xD

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so his message is the past within

stable wigeon
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nevermind my theory of rabbit going back in time doesnt make sense

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cuz for him to go back he needs to have existed then

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but at that time of dale birthday he was already a CS

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couldnt have been him going back

azure bay
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Disagree

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why not?

stable wigeon
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Hotel already happened

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he isnt an asura by the time of dales birthday

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i dont think you can go back in time in the sense of your physical self

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only back to a previous life

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and as i said the time i suspected him of going back was when dale was in lake

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but he had already been a CS for what 70 years

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including in that timespans 1949 (?) the year of birthday

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so hence i believe birthday was not a result of time travel

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i still believe the same rabbit but not back in time as i suspect phwasant

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maybe that is wrong too maybe she actually did balance her life the "first" time the event took place

azure bay
stable wigeon
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did they

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as was mentioned here

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wait not even that

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oh wait

azure bay
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the CS is seen in the mirror, Laura is seen outside

stable wigeon
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i dont think those are real

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it doesnt make sense

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u also see a CS outside

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it could be a "vision" as was mentioned here before

azure bay
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the CS outside could be a different one

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since there are more suspects

stable wigeon
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idk the room she is in is so surreal its hard for me to imagine it a physical place

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especially the strange part where it disappears when dale arrives

azure bay
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It was depicted in Case 23, in The Mill, in The Cave

azure bay
stable wigeon
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ok u right

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u think

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all the games of the cube escape

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are literal escaping their cubes?

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i thought that really applied only to seasons

azure bay
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not all of them apparently

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but definitely the most

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Harvey's box

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Arles

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ch 3 & 4 of Case 23

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both chapters of Paradox

stable wigeon
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no wait what

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how was 3 and 4 past memories

azure bay
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no

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I mean a different thing

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the games are mostly about someone escaping a room

stable wigeon
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oh no i meant literal cubes

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like in the game

azure bay
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all the rooms are cubes

stable wigeon
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lol but

azure bay
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not black or white

stable wigeon
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in RL cubes has its own special meaning

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i could hardly believe thats a coincidence

azure bay
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ok, I can go deeper

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every room in the series is shaped in a cube form

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exiting them is either the final goal or completely impossible

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usually there is even no doors

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even in the games that seem pretty real

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outside the lore it's explained by the genre

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inside the lore it may have none

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but there is one possible

stable wigeon
#

yeah im not disagreeing that cube escape describes the games

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i agree

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but i think it is an interesting title considering the entire RL universe is about cubes

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and i think the name could check out in their first game seasons

azure bay
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you may consider it as evidence

stable wigeon
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yes that too u see that in the brain puzzle

azure bay
stable wigeon
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yea i dont think that is necessarily the case

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still i think it shows that the 9 games may represent 9 important memories

azure bay
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Not sure

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I'd expect more of Case 23 then

floral mauve
azure bay
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that what I was saying

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not directly implying Dale tho

floral mauve
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and the spring to autumn seasons are likely to be real

floral mauve
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(if you can differentiate the shape of the corrupted)

azure bay
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I wouldn't consider this clue because CS have experienced multiple redesigns

floral mauve
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true

small sigil
#

guys is it possible that dale is the reincarnation of one of the vanderbooms?

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like samuel died in 1904 but got buried in 1932

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its kinda sus for me

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and for albert, frank cut off his head to get his brain, for dale in the paradox, he cut off his head as well to change his mind

ebon aspen
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Maybe, considering the deer symbolism and stuff (it would link him with nicholas too)

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Im waiting for tpw to get more clues, for now its kinda far fetched to dwell on the reincarnation stuff bc dale doesnt seem to have any trace/similarity from other characters besides the deer head

vague imp
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Isn’t mr rabbit one of Dale’s other lives?

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iirc the rabbit was the weird brother in Paradise, right?

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Though that doesn’t necessarily translate

azure bay
#

As soon as Albert started talking about us undoing his death (could be misunderstanding), I've been a little bit scared of Albert being reborn as Dale.

Not because I hate Albert but because I don't want Dale being anyhow related to Vanderbooms. Otherwise RL becomes more & more like a soap opera so Nicolas is no better for me.

#

I wouldn't even connect Nicolas to Dale in the 1st place for being reborn in the past (currently Nicolas is a CS & in order to become Dale he'd have to go back in time) isn't clearly a thing yet, so Albert is more likely to be connected to the detective in my eyes.

small sigil
#

i dont think nicolas have any connection to dale, they have no similarities

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imo albert's message makes me feel like he affected dale's birth

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maybe its albert to make the killer rabbit to kill his parents?

azure bay
#

Rabbit needed the pistol

small sigil
#

to shoot himself?

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like van gogh?

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and pheasant?

azure bay
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I think no

small sigil
#

speak of pheasant, i have no idea why she committed suicide

azure bay
#

whatever it means

cerulean crypt
#

Maybe it will explain in one of futurem games what are conection beetwen Mr.Rabbit and Pistol

small sigil
#

i hope so

azure bay
#

I see this connection even now

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this seems to be the same pistol Pheasant shot herself with. & they used to work together

small sigil
#

we need to know how to balance the past life

cerulean crypt
#

Actualy maybe there was some king of relacion beetwen them

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We actualy don't know if something else connect them

azure bay
small sigil
#

they r trying to escape their state?

small sigil
azure bay
#

Laura was corrupted

small sigil
#

ok then dale

cerulean crypt
#

To xhange the state you need to balance the past lifes

azure bay
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& Dale also goes toward changing his state

small sigil
#

dale is the only person changed without being corrupted?

cerulean crypt
#

And he changes his memories

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But Dale is partial corupted

small sigil
#

but not fully corrupted at least

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thats why mr.owl wants him to become the ruler?

azure bay
small sigil
#

he have the potential

azure bay
#

It makes me think that you have to be corrupted in order to be able to memory hop

small sigil
#

like dale holding that golden cube

cerulean crypt
#

Changing memories are thing that makes corupted

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Removing them

azure bay
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every other manipulation is safe

azure bay
#

it's clearly seen in The Cave

small sigil
#

ik

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the cave

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oh wait i forgot what we got after entering dale's birthday in the box

azure bay
#

the content was changed for CE Collection

small sigil
#

ah alright

azure bay
#

originally, it was a link

cerulean crypt
#

link to what?

azure bay
#

I know for sure that there was the second timeline overview. There also could be a contest, but I'm not that sure

small sigil
azure bay
#

I know that. I'm just not sure if it was the case back then

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I haven't witnessed that

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I know for sure just about the timeline image

cerulean crypt
#

Off topic: I am not 100% sure but Vincent could be pacient of RL:MH&F

azure bay
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(Also got that idea. No strong evidence tho)

cerulean crypt
#

He was IRL menthal ill

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We see ferryman from his window, that mean he stacioned near RL

azure bay
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since CE Collection we can see the hotel out there

small sigil
#

theres no way the sky outside would be the starry night

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maybe all we see is his creation in the RL cubes

azure bay
cerulean crypt
#

But we don't know in what state Vincent was in that game

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he might be CS

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This memory can takes place after his suicide

small sigil
cerulean crypt
#

And to go to next state he need to face his past demons

azure bay
#

the memory itself is before. But recalling it likely to be after

small sigil
#

so van gogh died in 1888 in RL universe right

cerulean crypt
#

So he prodably is "facing his past demons"

azure bay
small sigil
#

at least its before 1900s

cerulean crypt
#

Why?

small sigil
#

actually in arles we see him become a CS already

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which means he died already...?

cerulean crypt
#

This is just a memory]

small sigil
#

but hes corrupted anyway

cerulean crypt
#

But he is corupted when thinkingg about it

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and two memories can become one after some time

floral mauve
small sigil
#

or maybe theres some mysterious reasons

floral mauve
#

some ppl also claimed that Van Gogh might reincarnated as Dale

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In my opinion, the 5 guests(animals) are symbolised around the lake

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like the deer figure

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it does not necessarily represent Nickolas

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or link to him

cerulean crypt
#

Nickolas wasn't chemist

floral mauve
#

but still, it is still possible for the reincarnation theory

#

as claimed by nowherecaw

floral mauve
#

they Eilanders reborned

#

after enlightment

royal notch
#

I think that the Beedroom in Arles in the third game could be the Paradox room for Van Gogh.

cerulean crypt
#

I think it is more like Dale's elevator ride

#

He is changing his past memories

royal notch
#

I don't think so, he Is not revisiting any memory.

small sigil
#

ok so the golden cube is the chance for an elevator ride i guess?

#

a.k.a chance for changing the past memory

cerulean crypt
#

golden cube changes future

small sigil
#

but that doesnt make sense

azure bay
small sigil
#

dale changed his past in the elevator

cerulean crypt
#

To change memory you need black or white cube

small sigil
#

and his golden cube disappeared

royal notch
cerulean crypt
#

to change Past you prodably need blue cube

azure bay
small sigil
#

then how

#

he waked up in the elevator and 'used' the golden cube????

#

even b4 ce: birthday?

azure bay
#

We either just don't see the cube or it's temporary given to Mr. Bat

royal notch
# small sigil then how

Dale goes in the elevator incouscious, because he was in the Paradox room in his mind, where he learns how to "collaborate" with his past memories. Then he woke up, and saw the birthday and Theatre (and, for me, every else own memories) modified by the Lake.

azure bay
#

I tend to think that it's rather modified by Owl & the crew

royal notch
#

It could be, i tought that It has been the Lake because Dale lose them in the incident at the cabin, and we don't really know if the enlighteneds catched them and modified them later.

small sigil
#

but like dale is also holding the golden cube after paradox chp2

azure bay
small sigil
#

i mean putting the diamonds to the deer skull

royal notch
#

Paradox Is in his mind.

small sigil
azure bay
royal notch
#

It doesn't happen really.

small sigil
#

like things happen in paradox can become dale's past eventually

royal notch
small sigil
#

i believe that once dale drinks the green vial, paradox become reality for dale

azure bay
small sigil
#

green vial is probably the elixir or sth like that

azure bay
royal notch
#

Agree.

#

But it's only a test.

azure bay
royal notch
#

But Laura Is already dead.

small sigil
#

so u mean the green vial can let him avoid to become a pair with laura?

cerulean crypt
#

He never know LAura

small sigil
azure bay
cerulean crypt
#

they never met

small sigil
#

they still can be a pair.

#

there must be some connection between dale and laura we dont know

azure bay
small sigil
#

the photo in the paradox could tell

royal notch
small sigil
azure bay
small sigil
#

ritual?

#

u mean the elixir pair?

azure bay
#

Dale explisitely writes that they are not familiar to each other

azure bay
small sigil
royal notch
#

Anyway, i think that the Beedroom in Arles is the Paradox room for Van Gogh.

small sigil
#

that make sense too

#

he faced his CS at last and escape to the starry night too

azure bay
small sigil
#

arles is just too less connection to the RL and CE series

#

we dont know much about it

royal notch
small sigil
#

it is sensible to say arles is paradox

royal notch
#

If it's not Paradox, almost It must be a modified One.

azure bay
royal notch
#

We could Say the same for Birthday...

small sigil
#

then is it means that once he step out of the cube door, he died?

royal notch
#

Not immediatly.

small sigil
#

but like we dont know what after arles

azure bay
#

I think that he leaves the room as a free soul ready to be reborn

small sigil
#

we cant jump to the conclusion that soon

#

there must be a reason arles' appearance in CE series

azure bay
small sigil
#

i think van gogh is the reincarnation of someone

small sigil
royal notch
#

But he dies One year After.

azure bay
small sigil
#

reincarnation is not an immediate action sometimes

#

maybe he used 1 year of time to reincarnate??

#

well right now, arles is just too less connection as i said

royal notch
#

I mean, It would be the only case.

azure bay
small sigil
#

guys every consumption r possible at this state actually

azure bay
#

True

small sigil
#

coz arles is too clueless for now

azure bay
#

Another thing is that Arles may not fit that well into the newer lore

small sigil
#

maybe van gogh is still alive lmao

azure bay
small sigil
#

living as a CS, probably

#

or just reincarnation

azure bay
#

I tend to think that he destroyed his corruption. Only then he could leave the room

royal notch
#

Yeah.

small sigil
#

agree too.

#

b4 he shot himself, his hand was not yet corrupted

azure bay
small sigil
#

which possibly means his body is slowly corrupting at the time

azure bay
#

There's possibility to try shooting while he's normal

small sigil
#

ye

#

but he cant get a pistol

azure bay
#

He can

#

You just need to take the blue door

small sigil
#

oh alright

#

i forgot some little details actually

floral mauve
floral mauve
azure bay
#

It also could be both or none

#

Please separate in-lore info & the out-lore one

#

They are usually independent

royal notch
# floral mauve corrupted with a damn body (I think thats neither dead or alive)

She's dead, and then her body got corrupted. What i wanted to say Is that Dale can't sacrifice himself for the enlightement of a dead and corrupted person, and my idea Is that Is only a test, to see the real altruism of Dale, a virtue that an enlightened must have. Also, if it's possibile that Dale can enlighten Laura, why Mr Owl doesn't allow that?

azure bay
# royal notch She's dead, and then her body got corrupted. What i wanted to say Is that Dale c...

In The Cave it was confirmed that Laura has preserved her past-self. There she was able to go back to normal for seconds. So there could be a way to completely reverse her corruption. Alternatively, some interpret the whole story in a way that the past is not predetermined & one is able to change it with enough of effort. You'd better consider this way as well instead of strictly opposing it. Ability to change perspective on a go brings much freedom.

Talking about Owl, we don't know if he allows Laura being enlightened or not. Even if he's against that the choice is still for Dale to make.

royal notch
#

OK. Let's assume that it's possible that Laura can become uncorrupted, then how to revive her?

#

Ping me when you'll answer.

cerulean crypt
mossy imp
#

Does that mean that William is becoming another person for the second time?

#

If she gets a new body

cerulean crypt
#

But we don't know when she will has a new body

#

and what body

mossy imp
#

In paradox she says "one of us will die" , so maybe she would get a new body if Dale would have died?

#

However, I don't have any proof of this

azure bay
# royal notch Ping me when you'll answer.

Plenty of possibilities.

We can assume that corruption also heals the body. I'm pretty sure that Bob's got corrupted in the theater, as his fever dream while taking place inside his head shares much in common with Theatre game. Afterwards there was no bullet hole nor scar left. Laura aslo seems not to have her throat sliced anynore.

Alternatively, Laura & Dale could retroactively switch roles. The reality could reconstrust itself in a way that it was Dale to die in the 1st place & Laura to take his path.

royal notch
#

I don't know, i'm not sure that for the reincarnation it's necessary only a new body. William needed 10 sacrifices from his descendants being ansorbed by the life tree powered with 3 timepieces! I mean, it's a tons of complicate processes, It seems too easy solve the problem in this way. But anyway, The Past Whitin will surely explain more ways of reincarnation, since Albert can't have done the same things of William.

azure bay
#

We don't know for sure what Albert has in mind

royal notch
#

Yeah, idk, but there has been a period of time where he could have be really chilled out, since there was only a little boy in the whole house with him. But it's also true that Frank killed him only 2 years later coming out of the well, so maybe Albert planned something in case of problems.

azure bay
#

Coming of the well does not mean returning home

#

I expect Rose to hide him until he gets his strength back

#

That would also explain why he did not shave before killing Albert

royal notch
#

Uhm, It could be, but i don't know if Frank would have agreed. He's been in that goddamn well for 33 years, if i were him i wouldn't have really apreciated the idea to wait more. 😂

azure bay
#

He was hell weak. And Albert could be not that old at the time

royal notch
#

Yeah, you're right. Albert should had had 57 years, if i'm not wrong.

floral mauve
#

Laura's case is different

#

very different

#

she is dead

#

then she just become corrupted on her died body

#

which means it should be like a corpse wearing a black skin of corrupted

#

whereas other ppl who returned back to normal after being CS are still alive at the moment when they become corrupted

#

like Dale and Bob

#

they are like human wearing a black layer of corrupted

#

(reverse Michael Jackson)

royal notch
floral mauve
#

Laura is the real walking dead

#

she is solid!!

#

unlike the guests

cerulean crypt
#

Laura is a walking corrupted dead body?

floral mauve
#

yes

#

which means that she may not need to gather other ppls part to revive

#

again

#

also! Her body was made of other ppls part isnt it!!!

#

holy shit

#

thats why she doesnt abandon the dead body

cerulean crypt
#

William was outside his body

floral mauve
#

but Laura isnt

#

she is William

cerulean crypt
#

but how he phisicaly interact with things

floral mauve
#

ah you see the rabbit can hold a damn gun

#

you dont need to doubt more

#

corrupted can interact with things physically

royal notch
#

Yes.

cerulean crypt
#

Without body

floral mauve
#

yes

cerulean crypt
#

and unssen

floral mauve
#

in this universe yes

cerulean crypt
#

POLTEGHEIST

floral mauve
#

corrupted can secretly collect body parts

#

like a freak

cerulean crypt
#

Secretly killing family

floral mauve
#

yes

#

which means corrupted is a new specie

#

strength +100

#

health+100

cerulean crypt
#

Homo novus

floral mauve
#

invisibility +MAX

royal notch
#

No, wait, that wasn't what i mean.

floral mauve
#

corrupted can still be conscious though

cerulean crypt
#

Like Dale

floral mauve
#

depends on the quantity of memory left

cerulean crypt
#

Dale is partialy corupted

floral mauve
#

like Laura barely has any memory left

#

which makes her crazy in The Mill

#

but Caroline

#

and William

#

are able to move with their will

cerulean crypt
#

William is really concius

#

And powerful

floral mauve
#

thats the script from the zombie series

cerulean crypt
#

From what?

floral mauve
#

when zombies got the memories back, they become human

#

bruh

covert wyvern
#

is this still about RL?

royal notch
#

But not for Laura.

#

Because she's already dead.

floral mauve
#

yes

small sigil
#

hey wait didnt the phone call made laura uncorrupted for a while?

floral mauve
#

but others as well

#

wtf

cerulean crypt
#

Phone destroy her corrupt

floral mauve
#

unlike others

royal notch
#

Yes.

floral mauve
#

I think its because she bulids different

#

she is probably inmortal already

floral mauve
#

she was builded by the entire Vanderboom

#

she is not normal at the begining

#

thats why she cant die normally

floral mauve
royal notch
#

If She was Immortal, then She wouldn't have died.

cerulean crypt
#

Harvey was immortal and died

floral mauve
#

she has a body

#

and moving

cerulean crypt
#

And will

floral mauve
#

and no wound on the throat

#

I mean you guys can continue with this

#

I amma gonna study

#

@royal notch leave your explaination

#

I will check later

royal notch
royal notch
royal notch
azure bay
#

in order to keep their powers they have to drink extract

#

& that option is also limited

mossy imp
#

I think Laura tries to reach enlightement in paradox, because we have never seen her having an animal face

azure bay
#

even in Paradox Owl acknowledges that "his time is limited"

azure bay
mossy imp
#

The limited time could be the reason why mister Crow and Owl need the full exiler in cave

royal notch
azure bay
royal notch
#

What i wanted to say Is that the enlighteneds can be killed.

mossy imp
#

I don't think Bob has much to do with becoming enlighted, because he doesn't have a relation to the lake, exept for Laura

azure bay
#

she may have some minor knowledge

mossy imp
#

I don't know if Bob even knows about the whole rusty lake thing

cerulean crypt
#

William forgot about elixir when become laura?

azure bay
cerulean crypt
#

But Adoulus know about it

royal notch
mossy imp
#

In her letter to Bob in theater, she presents the lake ad a quite normal place, but it seems more like she doesn't want to talk about it

azure bay
royal notch
# cerulean crypt But Adoulus know about it

I don't think Aldous would remember, for me the scene has been that William found the recipe on his own, then he called his brother and, whithout thinking twice, they drank It.

azure bay
mossy imp
#

But mr Crow wasn't surprised when his brother died

azure bay
royal notch
mossy imp
#

I think there's always one who dies and one who gets enlighted, but maybe it's just me

azure bay
royal notch
royal notch
azure bay
#

I assume, William's input was crucial

#

this explanation is much simpler than the universe removing specific memories

royal notch
#

Yes, and i think he was the real genius behind the elixir's creation.

#

Aldous just gave an hand.

azure bay
royal notch
#

Also.

azure bay
#

I really don't want seeing Aldous talentless

#

I admit, that's subjective

mossy imp
#

Maybe this question isn't important, but I wonder how they got the idea of making this potion

royal notch
azure bay
#

however, that doesn't explain why the elixir formula was lost

royal notch
#

Or Maybe, they found the cave where Caroline wrote It.

mossy imp
#

Aldous isn't talentless, he always knows what to do :)

royal notch
azure bay
#

no, he doesn't, he says so just to seem smarter :з

royal notch
mossy imp
#

I think that's something smart people do

azure bay
#

"I have no idea what on Earth u should do but I'll pretend that it's obvious for me so I could take credit for your solution"

mossy imp
#

Exactly

royal notch
azure bay
#

Just kidding

royal notch
mossy imp
#

Someone said they coud be hired by mr Owl... I think that would explain why mr Crow is working at the hotel, I never understood seeing him there

azure bay
#

they seem to share the cause

mossy imp
#

Yes, otherwise it would mean they are willing to give theire live just for a job

azure bay
#

there's also a theory making them relatives

mossy imp
#

I don't know... mr Crows famely is almost entirely killed

#

In roots

astral frost
azure bay
azure bay
mossy imp
#

So mr Owl could be their dad for example?

azure bay
#

Uncle, according to that theory

#

at least Jacob would be

#

in case you lose your DNA while being enlightened

royal notch
#

Explain, i'm interested! poggersdale

mossy imp
#

So, sacrificing relatives was a normal thing from the beginning

#

It could explain why mr Crow seems to consider killing his family normal

azure bay
#

they did not have to kill a single person

#

everyone could die on their own

#

Alchemists just had to wait

mossy imp
#

Could be, but I thout roots was about William influencing theire lives

azure bay
#

They invited James

#

They made sure the grandchildren would finish the plan

azure bay
#

I'll finish the current discussion 1st

mossy imp
#

It's still a stange coincident, all these lost bodyparts

azure bay
covert wyvern
#

I don't see an issue, the lake has probably received numerous bodies

mossy imp
#

How could mr Crow predict someome losing a leg for example

azure bay
royal notch
azure bay
#

they could cut the leg of a dead person

cerulean crypt
#

Granade do it for him

mossy imp
#

Well, in that case it's a little less messed up than I first thought

azure bay
#

ok then

#

the theory of Eilanders & Vanderbooms being related

#

We'll start with Theatre & its 1st play

#

The Lady of The Lake songstress is believed either to be or portray Ms. Pheasant

#

We've got the substance of her past lives

cerulean crypt
#

but Lady of the lake looks like Caroline

#

In painting

astral frost
#

He's talking about the play

azure bay
cerulean crypt
#

But Lady of lake stiil could be Caroline

azure bay
cerulean crypt
#

But her black drees looks like this Rose wears

azure bay
#

or just pretend to be her

azure bay
#

but that's not the topic I'd like to discuss for now

#

so the substance of her past lives: a shell, a fetus, a heart & a hat

mossy imp
#

The hat mrs Pheasant wears in hotel is also in the play, but she doesnt looks like her

azure bay
#

a hat is just another connection to Pheasant, so that's clear

astral frost
azure bay
mossy imp
#

The lady says "my former lives". Could it mean that mr Pheasant did reincarnate seversl times?

#

It could be the reason why they don't look alike

azure bay
#

the sequence is finished by Pheasant's hat, so I guess Pheasant was the most recent one

#

& the others belong to more early ones

mossy imp
#

In that case, she's very old

azure bay
#

the samsara is about infinite amounts of rebirth both in the past & the future

#

I'd like to focus on the other pieces of substance

mossy imp
#

I think William was the first Vanderboom to reincarmate, maybe the Eilanders have been doing this for ages

azure bay
#

all 3 of them have already been seen together in the chapel of Case 23

#

I have no idea what would the shell mean as a substance of someone's life but fetus & heart currently have at least 1 explanation

astral frost
azure bay
#

after retrieving a key from its beak we've discovered a jar with the very same fetus

#

then in order to proceed we need to drop ink there

#

the fetus gets covered in its blackness & then it's replaced with the heart

#

the fetus could represent a child

mossy imp
#

Could it mean that the baby was a sacrifice?

azure bay
#

the ink covering it could be corruption

#

& the heart could be the thing left behind

#

the only person to get corrupted & leave a heart behind was William

#

he could be a son to one of previous incarnations of Pheasant

mossy imp
#

A fetus is quite interesdting, because it doesn't have memories, could this influence the corruption?

azure bay
#

a child that went corrupted & left a heart

#

a child being William

mossy imp
#

I don't know wheter it has to be William. It seems to me that the Eilanders sacrifice people quite often, so it could be everyone

azure bay
#

that's not about sacrifices

#

that's about corruption & leaving a heart behind

#

the only person applicable is William

mossy imp
#

The baby was in the same jar as the sacrifices in roots

azure bay
mossy imp
#

That's true, and I don't say it isn't William, I only mean that we can't be sure it's him

azure bay
#

we never can

#

however there's more

#

Elisabeth is a good candidate to give birth to the alchemist brothers

#

Aldous' date birth is 1799

#

a few years after Paradise

#

Assuming that Eilanders did not become enlightened right away, she could go on with her life & even give birth

#

I have 2 reasons to assume so

#
  1. Eilanders' way to be enlightened wasn't via elixir
#

so it doesn't have to work the same way

#

there could be no instant rebirth

#
  1. there was some info on the guests. Their ages don't correspond the Eilander's ones in any way
#

The boar is the eldest

#

so we can assume that they all got their enlightenment one by one on death

mossy imp
#

That could explain a lot

azure bay
#

& according to that, Elisabeth is the last to die

mossy imp
#

I have a theory, but I don't know if it makes sense

#

I think the Eilanders sacrifice members of the family in order yo reincarnate others

azure bay
#

you mean themselves?

mossy imp
#

In a circle that keeps going forever

#

Yep

azure bay
#

I agree on the 1st part but not the last one

#

they wanted enlightenment in exchange of sacrifice indeed

#

but the only rebirth it could affect was their reincarnation into future hotel guests

#

however, this kind of rituals could be performed by their predecessors for centuries

mossy imp
#

I think they were their own acestors using several rebirths

azure bay
#

that's unlikely

mossy imp
#

But in that case they should sacrifice something, just like in roots

#

Yes, maybe it sounds a little to stange, even for rusty lake

azure bay
floral mauve
#

I have question

azure bay
#

& Eilanders wanted to get higher forms

floral mauve
#

what is enlighted anyway

#

become unlimited life expectancy?

mossy imp
floral mauve
#

bruh

mossy imp
#

And maybe immortality

floral mauve
#

what if William is enlighted already even he died

#

like I mean the ppl who drink the elixir will get enlightment

#

even he die

#

thats why Laura builds different

#

am I high?

azure bay
# floral mauve what is enlighted anyway

In RL the meaning of this word seems altered. It either means being reborn as an asur or dev or being reborn just in a little bit higher form (considering William searching for enlightenment in Samsara Room).

floral mauve
#

like in buddism (samsara)

azure bay
#

no

#

in buddhism enlightenment is about stopping rebirths & leaving samsara

#

for samsara is a constant suffering in one way or another

mossy imp
#

I don't think William is enlighted, the deal seems to be: one dies, the other finds enlightment

floral mauve
#

nah

azure bay
mossy imp
#

Maybe enlightment is a way to stay alive for ever and avoid samsara

azure bay
#

He's a part of this ritual once again but he's Laura now

azure bay
mossy imp
#

Enlighted people do live longer, so maybe not forever, but still a bit longer

azure bay
#

originally, even asurs & devs are mortal. They also suffer in their own ways so they are still a part of samsara

mossy imp
#

Enlightment is indeed a part of the circle of life

#

But it's certainly one of the better states

azure bay
#

originally, enlightenment is about leaving the circle

#

getting free from it

#

& from suffering

mossy imp
#

Maybe it's different in the rusty lake universe

azure bay
#

that seems to be the case

#

that's the reason for us being unable to define it for sure

#

he have little to no knowledge about asurs

#

all we got is just a surface scratch

mossy imp
#

In the circle of life, there's a questionmark, do you think it's a way to escape the circle?

azure bay
#

there is a deer on its version of Paradise-Paradox that also corresponds Dale's expected form

mossy imp
#

Could it be possible there will be two mister Deers? Or is Dale a reincarnation of mr Deer?

cerulean crypt
#

That questinmark is human that consume full elixir

#

Deva?

azure bay
azure bay
mossy imp
#

I think that's the best theory, however, it could also mean: there's no chance of dying by drinking it

azure bay
#

the rule 1:1 is still announced

#

Laura is expected to be sacrificed for Dale

mossy imp
#

I think they don't know already who's the sacrifice

azure bay
#

I think it's Dale to choose

#

2 secret endings represent 2 contradicting choises

#

& then we see what happens if Dale is the one to be eventually enlightened

#

in The Cave, Birthday & Theatre

mossy imp
#

That seems unfair towards Laura, if Dale is the one to chose

azure bay
#

it's clearly seen in the movie

mossy imp
#

But in charpter 2, she seem quite cinfident when she sais that one of them will die

azure bay
#

yeah, & Dale can willingly sacrifice himself

mossy imp
#

She must believe there's a chance that Dale saves her, but why?

azure bay
#

I have no idea what is Laura in the future mind to begin with

mossy imp
#

Does Dale have a reason to give her enlightement?

azure bay
mossy imp
#

There's a different between being a goid person and sacrificing yourself

azure bay
#

ok, he's also depressed

mossy imp
#

Maybe they both don't mind being dead, if there's a chance to reach enlightement

azure bay
#

Laura's soul clearly minds being dead

#

even since it was William's soul

mossy imp
#

Then why would she participate in paradox? She must be very desperate

azure bay
#

We don't know if she had a choice

#

it could be either a chance for her to get what she wanted

mossy imp
#

It doesn't seems to me like she's forced to

azure bay
#

or she was forced by Owl

azure bay
mossy imp
#

He wakes up in paradox, we don't know what happend before

azure bay
#

they both were kidnapped, chained to the chairs & kept unconscious while the machine was operating

mossy imp
#

Yeah, that's true

azure bay
#

even if he has willingly entered this state he was kidnapped from his office in Case 23

mossy imp
#

Maybe the game is a paradox because mr Owl makes him do paradox over and over until he makes the right choice

azure bay
#

I think he has to do paradox over & over until he understands this choice & effectively makes it

#

he has to either accept the consequences of his actions

#

or sacrifice himself instead

#

& prevent them

mossy imp
#

What exactly are the consequences? I never understood that part

azure bay
#

one of Dale's versions inevitably picks up the blue vial & kills Laura

#

in order to stop it Dale has to be no more

mossy imp
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But why don't we see him getting a deer head

azure bay
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I think timeline splits here

mossy imp
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But he must get enlighted in at least one timeline

azure bay
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yes, just according to the prophecy

mossy imp
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I think there's something strange about the Deers. For example: who's skull is hanging in mr Deer's room in hotel?

azure bay
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no idea at all

mossy imp
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I have to go now