🤔｜theories

[pine oak]

I think this might be a transfer prove

[grave temple]

Hey I’m a new comer

[azure bay]

dude, I'm telling you. It was never about a transfer.

Cubes contain timelines. In TPW such cube contained The Future in name but it wasn't THE future, it was A future.

Another possibility, Caroline was saying the same thing "my memories are key to your future" but it wasn't even literal. The just made Jakob's future happen. The were used for the elixir. And so were William's memories if the golden cube is an elixir too

[azure bay]

hi

[grave temple]

How can I do to open this door. Since 20min don’t arrive to open the level one I think

[pine oak]

Yeah you might be right but it’s a problematic issue

[azure bay]

there's a designated channel for such questions https://discord.com/channels/319613669438914560/705020455614021704

[pine oak]

Yup good luck

I never liked very much samsara honestly

[glossy belfry]

is dale becoming an animal immortal being

[azure bay]

at least we have a handful of reasons to believe that

[azure bay]

they aren't immortal per se though

[glossy belfry]

oh i thought they became that way from the elixir

[azure bay]

they did to some extent

but the elixir's effects wear off if you don't continuously drink it

[glossy belfry]

is that why they keep milking people's cubes

[azure bay]

no, that's why they keep "milking" the dog

[glossy belfry]

OH is that what the poop in cube escape cave's for

[azure bay]

"feeding" the lake seems the end goal for everything

[azure bay]

yep. And that's the reason why the elixir wears off. You slowly poop it out but you can reconsume it and it will work again

[glossy belfry]

how come the dog doesn't have to do that either

[azure bay]

I think it will

[glossy belfry]

it'd be hilarious if the dog had perfect immortality

[azure bay]

it just drank the elixir the last

[glossy belfry]

Ah

so they have to do it from the newest immortal

which makes it more potent i guess?

[azure bay]

not sure. So far it looks like they are just preparing the successor

[glossy belfry]

the successor to what?

[azure bay]

to feeding cubes to the lake, I guess

[glossy belfry]

aren't they immortal though?

if they keep eating the poop of newer immortals

or are they just tired

[azure bay]

It looks like Owl is ready to die

maybe he doesn't care about living

[glossy belfry]

maybe after his revenge was finished he didn't have anything to live for anymore

[azure bay]

I'm not even sure he was for revenge. He killed the guests to get a prophecy about his potential successor

[glossy belfry]

oh yeah how did his family become animals as well?

[glossy belfry]

there's a prophecy?

[azure bay]

the 5th dinner is the white cube about Dale arriving at the hotel in the future

[azure bay]

they sacrificed the 1stborn on the day of the lake and the lake enlightened them

[glossy belfry]

oh so there are other ways to become like that besides the elixir

[azure bay]

I guess

unless the lake can make some form of elixir

the devs could pull that out

[glossy belfry]

also I wanted to ask is the consensus on the blue cube is that it doesn't change the past but just the memories of the owner?

[honest brook]

I think that it does rewrite the timeline the blue cube is used in

[azure bay]

The Past Within was more or less clear that memory cubes and reality aren't that different

I even think they are all the same

and yes, work like timelines

but even before that idea blue cubes did exist in the supposed "reality"

and I've never seen reasons why they wouldn't work if "memories" are copies of "the reality"

[glossy belfry]

oooh that's interesting

wonder how that's going to play out

anyway thanks for the rich lore

[azure bay]

you're welcome

[azure bay]

I can share a video about The Past Within and cube timelines

[glossy belfry]

sure

might watch it if i want to know some more

[azure bay]

https://youtu.be/B5PpTlsH9Ms?si=-19eNL7ENcTaAScS

[vivid bridge]

unbelievable

I come in here just to see you corrupt another young lad with your theories

tsk tsk tsk

[rancid slate]

Someone stop this man
Someone make a "Nowherenest's Situation is Rusty" video

[vivid bridge]

He won't stop talking about "timelines" 😭

[main badge]

yall think laura struggles with gender dysphoria?

[vivid bridge]

it's possible

i've seen people discuss it in both directions

Though I doubt the games would touch that subject, especially with UB essentially codifying her issues as mommy issues

[main badge]

tw for the next wild theory

rose has to know she’s basically a product of a date rape, right? also her moms body must still be on the island, no way albert dug their graves off the island

[rancid slate]

I remember the devs saying Rose does not know how she was born

[vivid bridge]

What island do you mean? All the vanderbooms are buried near the chapel

[rancid slate]

And the graveyard basically shows Ida only having one bone I think

Puzzle or not

[main badge]

ohhhhh yeaaaaaa!!

[vivid bridge]

no I think thats just a puzzle

[main badge]

but the first part?

[vivid bridge]

I would imagine Albert would tell Rose a false story

[azure bay]

normally people don't remember their past lives and Laura isn't an exception. She was depressed because she missed her mother

[main badge]

but she got that ouij board telling her truths

[vivid bridge]

I mean, William/Laura's situation is kinda special

[main badge]

but when she dies in case 23 there’s a lot alluding to the old man

[azure bay]

it wasn't the boead, it was a certain ghost that conveyed only the info it needed

[main badge]

someone help me with his name, i’m so bad at names

[rancid slate]

• The devs are not sure if anyone told Rose her mom was Ida. also, Ida may show up again in another game!

[honest brook]

William

[azure bay]

there was no old man back then the devs invented her origin story only the following year

[main badge]

MORE IDAAAAAAAAA

[rancid slate]

That one tumblr post

[main badge]

in the clock?

[azure bay]

there's nothing that says it's special in that specific way

[rancid slate]

The only evidence is

[vivid bridge]

I don't think that's even the topic here. You can speculate/headcanon about Laura's level of transness without her having memories of being William

[rancid slate]

She remembering the bb

Yeah

In the TWD

She says

Bob

[azure bay]

potential memories of being William are the only thing that would give evidence against statistics

[rancid slate]

I think my pronouns may not be she/her

[vivid bridge]

again, I don't think this is about actual evidence and storytelling, its just "hey what if Laura was trans wouldn't that be fun in the context of her being a reincarnation of a dude"

[rancid slate]

Said Laura, being dubbed by Rafferty

Guys

Paradox Laura

She was consuming testosterone

[vivid bridge]

Laura's VA changes based on her own perception of her gender

[rancid slate]

😱😱😱

Top 10 Rusty Lake facts you never noticed!

[azure bay]

another thing, the Vanderbooms never lived on an island. And they buried their dead onshore. In the graveyard by the iconic chapel

[rancid slate]

New life without sorrow 🏳️‍⚧️

[rancid slate]

And the Eilanders also put Caroline's bones in a box

[azure bay]

it's still possible they were taken from her casket. Where they were under water

[rancid slate]

🤫

[vivid bridge]

how come nobody in rusty lake has taxidermied anyone yet

you'd think thats the kind of weird thing they'd love to put into their games

[rancid slate]

They forgor

[azure bay]

when did human taxidermy become popular? After Lincoln died?

[vivid bridge]

🤷‍♂️

[main badge]

the vanderbooms don’t live on the island? im confused by that. i thought the house and tree was planted there? help

[vivid bridge]

nope

you can see the lake from the house

[rancid slate]

Only the hotel is in the island

[main badge]

thank you.

god send boy

okkkkkayyyyyyyy

[azure bay]

there was Paradise island with a different family. Then the hotel was built there, seen from the Vanderboom's house

[main badge]

i get it now

yea i know about the E fam

[vivid bridge]

the graveyard is near the chapel (the one from Case 23), which you can also see in the image

[main badge]

i haven’t played case 23 since i was young, i forgot that that’s the map you gotta draw on. thank you guys for helping!!

[azure bay]

a good excure to binge play the series

[vivid bridge]

yeah, that's true. The big background painting in Roots is based on the map from Case 23

[main badge]

i like the way you think

did bob die a virgin?

[vivid bridge]

also they totally retconned the cabin later on lmao

[vivid bridge]

Bob isn't dead

[main badge]

but would he yknow with anyone that’s not lura

i should have clarified

[vivid bridge]

probably eventually once he's recovered and over her

but also we don't know if he had any relationships prior to laura

[main badge]

look at the man.

[vivid bridge]

true

[azure bay]

I think it's still on an island, it's just closer to the shore. I swear I see water between the chapel and the far forest

[vivid bridge]

ehhh

[rancid slate]

I was about to say that

[azure bay]

go to the left

[vivid bridge]

why

also

[azure bay]

I see water behind the chapel

[rancid slate]

Im pretty sure some moving islands exist

[vivid bridge]

that's not water, thats just grass

[main badge]

yea the lil place lura goes and fights the courted soul

that is the most scary part of any of the games.

the timer? horrifying.

[rancid slate]

Sarah White Door will prevent that

[main badge]

that’s totally an abuse in power tho. she 100% tops

[vivid bridge]

oh, definitely

i've been saying this for years, bob's a bottom

[main badge]

honestly bob a bottom

rusty minds think alike

[rancid slate]

Ride or die

[main badge]

important theory, most attractive character. can’t be harvey cuz he’s a bird and that’s weird

[vivid bridge]

no

what

[main badge]

did you have that in your gallery waiting for this moment?

ALBERT AND DALE.

[azure bay]

yes

[rancid slate]

no..

[main badge]

ALBERT IS FINE IDC

[vivid bridge]

most attractive character in Rusty Lake is me, since my name is in the telephone book in Paradox, making me a canonical character

[main badge]

lucky bi…

[rancid slate]

Nah

Its Dio

[vivid bridge]

yeah you're right...

[main badge]

@covert wyvern is technically a character right?

if so him.

final answer.

[covert wyvern]

No.

[main badge]

damnit…

[rancid slate]

Damyt

[main badge]

back to albert

[vivid bridge]

albert is not fine

[main badge]

WHERE

WHERE IS THE NOT FINE?

[azure bay]

Yeah, Damy is too smart to be an RL characters. They die like botflies

[vivid bridge]

this is your man?

[rancid slate]

Albert is too dangerous

[main badge]

yuuuuuhhh

[rancid slate]

He can do it on command

[main badge]

😫😫😫😫

[rancid slate]

He doesnt need the actiob

[vivid bridge]

Male rusty lake characters are either awful old men or the lamest weenies

[main badge]

i could be his butterfly just saying

DALES GRANDPA

not awful or lame

and fine

[rancid slate]

Santa Dale

[azure bay]

Nikolas isn't that bad tbh

[vivid bridge]

that's Mr. Crow, so awful

[vivid bridge]

both awful and lame

[rancid slate]

https://tenor.com/view/nicholas-eilander-gacha-life-get-real-rusty-lake-cube-escape-gif-11186518956606586775

[main badge]

is that cannon?

[vivid bridge]

ehh its speculated

[main badge]

cuz if so does that mess with my lura and dale ship?

[vivid bridge]

no no he's not related

[azure bay]

cousins are legal

[main badge]

ahhhhhhh

bad

spray bottle

[vivid bridge]

the theory is that the grandpa is Mr. Crow observing Dale or helping him out with the gun but he's not actually his grandpa

[azure bay]

there are all kinds of theories

[vivid bridge]

I know

[main badge]

that’s just a theory

[azure bay]

including being the actual biological grandpa that stole the pistol from his workplace

[main badge]

a deeply perturbed theory!

[rancid slate]

Aldous is the grandma

[main badge]

thanks for watching

[vivid bridge]

people will come up with crazy theories, like that cubes contain whole worlds

[azure bay]

https://tenor.com/8NbR.gif

[rancid slate]

Aldous is the grandpa but not biological

[azure bay]

cybernetic grandma!!!!

[rancid slate]

😭

[vivid bridge]

Aldous is pretending to be Dale's grandpa to observe him/help him out

[main badge]

but the arg clarified the cubes?

the arg was so funnnnn

[rancid slate]

I was not active in any of the args 😔

[main badge]

aw 😭

ewwww

that’s not the emoji i used

: (

it autocorrected my emoji

[rancid slate]

You can disable it on the settings

[main badge]

tell me how please.

i’m very discord dumb

[rancid slate]

Im not on pc but I know theres one option that disables it

[main badge]

i just realized that when you reply to a chat you can see the message in grey above it lol..

i did it!!

:(

:)

[azure bay]

:з

[rancid slate]

゜)))彡

[main badge]

fish?

[rancid slate]

Fish

[main badge]

can i get some help understanding the corrupted souls?

how many are there?

was albert the first?

is he the one that attacks lura, aka his grand daughter?

[vivid bridge]

First corrupted soul we see chronologically is Caroline

[main badge]

who killed the police officers?

does that get fixed when she fuses with her son like gay rocks?

(steven universe reference)

[vivid bridge]

yeah I got that

well, its debatable

[rancid slate]

Bob

[vivid bridge]

probably

[main badge]

corrupted?

i think i need to replay case 23

[rancid slate]

Its herself

[main badge]

whattttt

[rancid slate]

When the game was released

[vivid bridge]

Bob is like half-corrupted during the events of Case 23, he's the suspect in that game and he morbs out and kills the police officer

[rancid slate]

It represented her depression

In the end, you open the mirror and you see that you are the cs

And when the beam goes to it, it reveals to be Laura

[vivid bridge]

for the other CS that attacks Laura in The Lake, that's uhhhhh some dead person I guess

they don't matter

[main badge]

yea

that’s what i mean

[vivid bridge]

but yeah, the one that "kills" Laura, that's just herself, its a metaphor

[main badge]

the freaky one that craws out of the lake

[vivid bridge]

yeah

[rancid slate]

Some believe she didnt fused but rather died fr

[vivid bridge]

I don't think they really had the lore all figured out back then so this one doesn't really matter

[rancid slate]

People that believe its Mrs. Pigeon 🫡

[vivid bridge]

chronological list of CS:
-Caroline (fuses (?) with Jakob)
-William (turns into Laura)
-The weird bird one from Roots who isn't really explained
-The five guests
-Van Gogh (?)
-Albert (got his body back)
-the zombie one from The Lake (idk whats up with this one)
-Laura pre-death? (maybe, maybe not. Might just be a metaphor)
-Bob (he's not dead but he's randomly turning into a CS at random moments, though that's been fixed)
-Laura post-death (gets corrupted in The Mill)
-Dale (he's, like, half corrupted maybe? Idk, we haven't seen him in 6 years)

The one from Harvey's Box could be anyone's guess.

[rancid slate]

Theres also the Mammoth

[vivid bridge]

no

[rancid slate]

🦣

[vivid bridge]

Also David, who in my opinion is seperate from the five guests

[main badge]

thank you so much!

[pine oak]

There is theory that animals from hotel aren’t the Eilanders

Because of Caroline’s plan

And protection of Jacob with elixir substrates that makes them Mr. Owl

Mr. Owl is not a vindictive person

Mr. ellesian likes this one theory

And my last theory also was similar

[azure bay]

this theory is pretty much dead

[rancid slate]

The past is never dead 👽

[azure bay]

after a Mr. Rabbit was confirmed to be David there's no use denying it

[vivid bridge]

now you're just saying things specifically to make me mad

[azure bay]

I agree that the Eilanders don't look like the guests

and they are better of characters

and it pains me that they weren't retconed into existence better

but the reality is, David had only 1 chance to become Mr. Rabbit and he shared it with the rest of his family

[vivid bridge]

well in my theory he didn't become mr rabbit

that's just a stage persona

[pine oak]

Everything is about that are you recognizing retconing or not

[azure bay]

what do you mean?

[rancid slate]

What if they are the parents

And

Each one

Had a baby

[vivid bridge]

He uses his real name in the advertisement/on the phone

which doesn't strike me as something an asura would do

Mr. Owl never calls himself Jakob

the only time David calls himself Mr. Rabbit is in the letter

[pine oak]

Because Mr. Owl = Jakob + Caroline

[vivid bridge]

which might just him callinmg himself that so Baby Dale knows who the letter is from

[rancid slate]

Thats because the devs were like "Bro how are they not understanding that the guests are the eilanders??" So they made Mr Rabbit say his name is David

/speculation

[azure bay]

David Eilander is a long dead nobody. The use of the name was deliberate on the devs' behalf

[honest brook]

Mr. Crow was also called Aldous

[vivid bridge]

that's true

Owl called him that

[pine oak]

Mr Owl ≠ Jakob

[azure bay]

and Mr. Rabbit calling himself such of all the people is indicative

[honest brook]

And in Paradox as well

"My name is Aldous Vanderboom"

[rancid slate]

Dead name ✊️

[azure bay]

and this is wrong at least technically. Owl doesn't know the elixir formula and he identifies himself exclusively as Jakob

[pine oak]

He is connected with Caroline’s corrupted soul

Caroline’s mainly know the recipe

But not all of the recipe

And this is issue

[azure bay]

that's what it may look like. But that doesn't make sense from the samsara viewpoint where every soul is a constant that never dies, not fuses with others, nor splits

[rancid slate]

They only fuse with themselvess

[azure bay]

Caroline knew everything. She made the elixir in the ending

[rancid slate]

Rose

Bob

Me

[azure bay]

Bob didn't fuse

Rose somewhat fused but preserved both faces

[pine oak]

So you think that the scene when Caroline is fusing with Jakob is like: “it looks nice but don’t makes sense”?

[rancid slate]

Jakob didnt absorved her

You clearly see her particles floating up

Its more like Jakob bodyslammed her /j

[pine oak]

So

What did he done?

To her

[rancid slate]

+Her own book says that one dies and the other gets enlightened

[pine oak]

If not fused

[rancid slate]

He got enlightened

[azure bay]

yes, because it's Rusty Lake. With all the gameplay, lore and symbolism you take it literally only with caution.

The elixir was never about soul fusion. One is to be sacrificed, the other is to be enlightened

[rancid slate]

She dieded

[rancid slate]

Like Lake and HB corrupted souls

[pine oak]

The same thing is a scheme of elixir. What if it means 50/50?

I will die, and other will be enlightened

What if it’s random?

Not a trade, barter or something

[azure bay]

no, because Laura says "one of US will die, the other will be enlightened"

[pine oak]

So, if someone drinks an elixir and lives, there is 100% chances to a scenario when any other person that will drink the same elixir will die?

[vivid bridge]

I guess so

[honest brook]

probably

[vivid bridge]

usually we see the person who drinks it first die

[azure bay]

not sure the developers know themselves

[vivid bridge]

like

[pine oak]

Nuh uh

Doggy

[vivid bridge]

true

though James and the player doesn't know about the duality of it at that point

from this point onwards, whoever drinks it first is narratively doomed to die

[pine oak]

Mhm. So if theory with Death of Caroline, and enlightenment of Jakob alone is true, that means that rusty lake fandom wiki is false 🥲

[vivid bridge]

that wiki is in dire need of being overhauled

[pine oak]

I’m overhauling it sometimes

But yeah, your right

[rancid slate]

The wiki has a page for William and Laura

[vivid bridge]

well thats fine

[rancid slate]

David/=Mr Rabbit David and Mr Rabbit

But not one for Aldous

[pine oak]

Yeah I paid attention for that

[rancid slate]

Even Jakob and Mr. Owl 💥

[vivid bridge]

I mean, that makes sense. Aldous and Mr. Crow are essentially synonymous. While even if you believe that the Eilanders are the guests, that's still a theory

[pine oak]

Yeah

I edited this article today by the way

[rancid slate]

So Mr. Owl is not Jakob

Cuz

Its a theory

[vivid bridge]

yeah that part should be overhauled

those two should be the same article

[rancid slate]

Nuh uh

[pine oak]

There are so many signs that it's almost certain

[vivid bridge]

Tbh I hate that the wiki's character pages are split into game segments

instead of just general history

[floral veldt]

It makes sense

otherwise you could get a bro, drink the elixir, be enlightened and broski just leaves

no deaths + sick animal head

[vivid bridge]

Pretty much

I think it could work in one specific case

And that is Dale and Laura

If Laura drinks it first and gets enlightened, Dale would still drink the deadly elixir because he's aware of the rules, thats what Paradox was about

Which I think would be quite interesting as a finale

[pine oak]

But why in CE: Cave Aldous and Jakob just drunk it and no one dies?

Maybe because it was their second time?

[azure bay]

Most definitely

[pine oak]

Or because it wasn’t full elixir

Just extract from dogs …

[azure bay]

It's the same elixir that killed James

[honest brook]

Yeah, probably because they’d already been enlightened

[azure bay]

And their anatomy changed

[pine oak]

Interesting

[azure bay]

guys, I'm trying to recall plot holes of Rusty Lake, any help?

[lost thorn]

Does Harvey's death in seasons count?

[azure bay]

depends

[lost thorn]

Seasons is about time travel I'm well aware

[pine oak]

There is Mr. Rabbit in RE: Paradise in Rabbit hole

[lost thorn]

But if harvey is supposed to be dead in 1971, how come is he there in other games

[azure bay]

that's more of a reference than a plot hole

[lost thorn]

Laura was still a corrupted soul meaning the time travel hadn't occurred yet

[pine oak]

It’s a hole if you agree with theory that Eilanders are in hotel

[honest brook]

A lot of achievements don't make much sense

[azure bay]

It doesn't mean the devs were telling us "here was totally Mr. Raabit"

personally I take it as a weak "David is Mr. Rabbit"

[lost thorn]

I don't know if it's a retcon or adding into a story but
The role of mr rabbit

Mr rabbit was a random shooter who barged in and shot the vandermeers with an automatic

But in paradox it was shown that he was invited as a magician

So which one was it

And in paradox he gestured a pistol and shot the Vandermeers, contrary to the automatic he sprayed everyone in the room with

Does that count as a hole?

[honest brook]

I feel that that scene in Paradox was like how Dale perceived that day when he was young

[lost thorn]

Can't the same be said about birthday?

[azure bay]

Paradox is a vision, and the Bday part is a pantomime

[lost thorn]

I feel it would have to be very exaggerated to have him break the door the way he did

[honest brook]

But Birthday is a genuine cube with the actual events, with some changes made by Mr. Owl

[lost thorn]

Yeah so why would paradox show him calling to a magician when he was reflecting on the past

If we go by the idea that the cube was the actual event
Then based on what you said, dale would be reimagining the guy who barged into his home as a magician
It makes little sense

Why would dale do that

Unless he originally was in fact a magician that was invited

[honest brook]

Maybe it's him "facing his darkest memories"

[lost thorn]

...but why envision him as a magician

[vivid bridge]

remind me, in birthday the parents are confused by who could be ringing the bell, right?

[honest brook]

Oh yeah, "who's there?"

[vivid bridge]

so him being the birthday magician feels like a retcon

thus plot hole with that line of dialogue

and while memory cubes could be seen as less reliable, I don't think it would add dialogue like that

[pine oak]

Maybe they really ordered a magician but they pretended to confused in front of Dale.

[vivid bridge]

hmm maybe but they don't sound like that

[honest brook]

Maybe so that it makes sense why the parents would ask Dale to call him

[lost thorn]

I just thing that regardless of how reliable the memories are when it comes to small details
I'd say that it wouldn't gloss over huge information
If mr rabbit was truly a magician who was invited, then him breaking the door and barging in must be a retcon if he was simply invited

[pine oak]

I think they were just pretending surprised in front of dale

[vivid bridge]

well he can be invited in but still break down the door

but yeah

[pine oak]

But they were really suprised about the gun thing

[lost thorn]

@azure bay would you consider art design changes as Retcons?

[vivid bridge]

I think Birthday's events are more accurate

[azure bay]

depends

[lost thorn]

I don't know about you but if someone breaks my door I would be slightly hesitant to let him in to perform magic tricks heh

[pine oak]

Rather, they don't particularly change the plot

[vivid bridge]

Albert being turned into a CS is a retcon/plot hole since we see his grave and one of his bones, even though its revealed in TPW/UB's DLC that he was turned into a CS

[azure bay]

The devs said they had TPW and UB planned in 2016 and I believe them

[vivid bridge]

bro we see his grave and bone

[lost thorn]

Dale's beard is black in theater and case 23
But it's grayish in the white door when it shows him in the same timeperiod

[rancid slate]

They had ideas

[azure bay]

and we'd see William's bones if they were there

and we've definitely seen Caroline's

[honest brook]

A lot of the colours changed, like Bob's hair

[rancid slate]

If they really had everything planned, TPW wouldnt begin as a singleplayer imo

[lost thorn]

We also saw his entire body when we were playing as hid corrupted soul

[rancid slate]

Tho, Caroline has too

And shes also a cs

[vivid bridge]

it's inconsistent

William and Caroline are ghostly CS where the soul is seperate from their body. Albert is like Laura after The Mill, where the corpse is the CS except later, when its in the tube and it needs a physical body

[rancid slate]

We dont really know if the bones in Roots even belong to the graves they were in

[vivid bridge]

okay but that's a stretch. Any plot hole can be filled that way

[azure bay]

Albert's corruption in TPW is an altered memory. We don't know how he's corrupted in UB

[vivid bridge]

coins

[azure bay]

altered memory

[vivid bridge]

no

[rancid slate]

A memory of what hapoened

[vivid bridge]

that's before the memory is altered

[azure bay]

the very fact of Roses contacting one another IS an alteration

just like Owl left an extra present for Dale in Bday

[rancid slate]

They removed all Albert's bones

[pine oak]

We don't know the dates or the exact chronology of events from Robert's dreams at all

[rancid slate]

And what in see in TPW is just a pile of flesh

/j

[honest brook]

That doesn't make it a plot hole

[rancid slate]

7
1
2
3
4
5
6

[azure bay]

the ones we have no reference whatsoever are the 1st 2 and the final

[pine oak]

It’s rather a theory not a fact

[rancid slate]

😃

[azure bay]

now, after UB it's definitely a fact

[lost thorn]

So I just looked up a video about that level
I don't know if it's a plot hole or an error
But the dates of when some characters die don't match the time when they actually died

[honest brook]

I remember they did try to fix that, but they're still a little off because of the puzzle with the months and days

[pine oak]

Okay so maybe, why Aldous sometimes had to have his mouth sewn up (as I think to hide the form of a crow) and sometimes he didn't have to, for example, in CE: Theatre.

[rancid slate]

Maybe sonething like using the memories of Caroline (if they werent purged somehow) or just extracting Mr. Owl's own memories to get the Elixir

[honest brook]

Maybe the woman from The Mill did that

[rancid slate]

"Shut up"

[lost thorn]

Yeah because Albert died in fall 1926
But the date in the grave is 3-2-1926

February isn't fall

[vivid bridge]

why did they make the solution to that number puzzle be 2233

thats such a stupid number

maybe the dumbest number there is

[rancid slate]

CE Lake: 1422
CE Cade 23: 1421

[pine oak]

“with a woman it's bad, without a woman it's even worse” ahhh moment

I think she was his next (or first) wife

[rancid slate]

His last one

[pine oak]

Maybe he has a rizz

[rancid slate]

He literally can swap his head into crow and human

Thats the asura rizz

[honest brook]

In Case 23 Aldous transforms into Mr. Crow by having the crow head come out of his mouth, but we never see it happening like that again; is that a plot hole?

[rancid slate]

Nah

[visual coral]

If you can alter cubes without BC why didn't Owl\Crow\Harvey enter the cubes with the elixir's recipe and recreate it?
Like Nicolas in Paradise or in that one hypnosis video by Mr Owl

[rancid slate]

Not sure if they have a cube with the Elixir recipe

Before Cave

[visual coral]

Aldous was making the elixir with his brother
He could've just read his diaries or smth

[honest brook]

Isn't there also Caroline's book on the Elixir?

[rancid slate]

I think they dont really want the Elixir for them

And if they do, I would explain with "James used one of the ingredients that cannot be obtained anymore, so thats why they needed William's memories again.. and also Dale"

[visual coral]

there is in Paradox
the alchemist brothers must've created their liquid elixir based on her formula

[visual coral]

but they have to drink dog shit

[rancid slate]

If you think enough, anything becomes a plothole if you consider the rules of Rusty Lake and all the "time travel" stuff

[visual coral]

and I feel like it's gonna run out eventually too

[pine oak]

He literally said: “find the elixir” so he was just standing and he didn’t do anything I guess

[rancid slate]

But they need to continue the story, so they might ignore some of these stuff in order to continue it

[pine oak]

And that’s why Mr owl and Aldous are searching of memories with elixir recipe

To live forever

[visual coral]

he was closing his eyes the entire time I guess

[rancid slate]

"Aldous are you paying attention?"
"Uh uhuh"

[honest brook]

It was probably for Dale

[pine oak]

Because of Aldous laziness now he and Mr owl must to drink dogs sh*t

Nice

[rancid slate]

https://tenor.com/view/funny-man-laughing-no-teeth-bald-funny-face-gif-18269197

[visual coral]

adhd Aldous confirmed

[rancid slate]

Aldous ☝️

[pine oak]

Maybe but I think that Aldous likes living forever

[rancid slate]

He wants to date more women

[visual coral]

but on a serious note it does sound like a plot hole to me
Crow and Owl need to drink literal shit and we saw that you can enter and exit cubes, and even alter it a little without creating a new timeline, so it doesn't make logical sense why would they don't just go down the memory lane

[honest brook]

But probably not Mr. Owl, since in Paradox he was saying all that about his time being limited and hinting at transforming himself into an animal fish

[pine oak]

Aldous All his life he was a minion of Mr. Owl and was rizzing women

[floral mauve]

not sure about minion more like cooperative

collegues

[pine oak]

Bro is literally in reception

Serving cocktails

[rancid slate]

He also works at many jobs

[floral mauve]

Harvey is literally delivering roomservices

[pine oak]

/j

[visual coral]

harvey always was servin'

[rancid slate]

Meanwhile William watching Emma getting depressed

[pine oak]

He works when Mr owl is smoking cigars and occasionally doing T-pose

To do rain

[pine oak]

And painting her hanged

👍

[rancid slate]

https://tenor.com/view/chair-spin-creepy-gif-9830927

William when hes bored

[pine oak]

William was just smarter brother but Aldous was that handsome brother

And this lucky guy

[azure bay]

I think Aldous was preparing the tree rebirth ritual while William was busy with the elixir

[pine oak]

He created and buried timepices?

[azure bay]

possibly

at least created

who hid them is a different matter

[vivid bridge]

it was me

I hid them

[pine oak]

Wouldn't it be easier if instead of drinking an elixir together and having a 100% chance that one of them will die, give an elicir to a random person with the hope that he will die and then there would be a chance that both will survive? And so they both did so many unethical things later that it doesn't matter in their case.

[rancid slate]

It was the Thief

His

Parent

He created the Grandfather clock

Thats why the Thief loves clocks

Hes also the 3rd Vanderboom Brother

👽

[pine oak]

Maybe just James is son of Aldous. We all know about Aldous ultra rizz

[rancid slate]

I think the effect only happens when the two drink, but for gameplay sake, it happened in the exact moment William drinked

[pine oak]

But let's assume Aldous would drink and survive, and instead of giving it to William, who would be 100% dies, he would give a random person to drink.

[rancid slate]

Would look weird if both happened at the same time, so one happens before the other

[azure bay]

as I said, I'm not sure the devs themselves pondered so much

they have simply shown 2 different cases

in one the 1st drinker died

in the other, the 2nd one

[pine oak]

We don't need devs to make excellent theories 👽

[pine oak]

It’s pretty random

[azure bay]

they agree

[rancid slate]

Wait until the 3rd drinker appears

Thats the poop elixir

[azure bay]

in what way?

[pine oak]

We don't know which of the two people consuming the elixir will die

[azure bay]

should we? should anyone?

a risk is a good narrative device

[pine oak]

I agree

[honest brook]

I think one plot hole is in Roots, with World War 1 being declared and Samuel and Ida's deaths, events that happened a decade apart, being covered in a newspaper called "The Daily Herald"

[rancid slate]

Does the phrase one die and the other blah blah blah in Caroline's book imply there was someone else before that also managed to do it?

[azure bay]

I tend to agree

[azure bay]

maybe? I wouldn't be surprised if some medieval court alchemist succeeded.

If not, if you are cool enough with a theory, you don't need experiments.

Like Albert Einstein

[honest brook]

And another thing is the cabin supposedly being on an island in Case 23, while the Roots painting depicts it as being connected with the chapel

[vivid bridge]

oh yeah

that is the most obvious retcon

[azure bay]

how would you illustrate the retcon in 1 image?

[rancid slate]

Nah it

It is a floating island

[vivid bridge]

show the two maps in comparison

plus the game description that says the cabin is on an island

[azure bay]

I think I have an idea how to adapt it to my needs

[honest brook]

Dale calls it "a small island in the middle of the lake" in Case 23

And that map is used again in The Cave, even though the Roots painting appeared in the intro

[vivid bridge]

well in case 23 its still an island

[rancid slate]

I mean, Dale could be the one who drew the map

[vivid bridge]

the change probably happened with Hotel, when the Hotel took the island spot and the change was shown to us in Roots with the painting

[pine oak]

And what do you think about sewing up case with Mr. Crow?

[azure bay]

more of an artistic choice

[pine oak]

I think it's a bit inconsistent. It is rather clear what these seams were for

[azure bay]

I don't feel it would be anything particularly significant

[rancid slate]

He was on his edgy phase

[vivid bridge]

the games were simply built differently back in the day

sigh

[azure bay]

they still put such random things

[vivid bridge]

idk they haven't had that specific vibe in forever

[pine oak]

Little over a hundred years old Aldous starts to grow up

[pine oak]

Yes but I miss old graphic style so much

It’s too nostalgic

[rancid slate]

Like what?

[pine oak]

Like seeing up lips of poor Aldous

I guess

[rancid slate]

I think the Hand will never be creepy again

[pine oak]

The hand will never play for us again on the piano anymore [*]

[rancid slate]

Or never look good

[vivid bridge]

the games haven't really had that twin peaks vibe in years

oh no

[azure bay]

"You don't get the kind of sun now that you used to get, " said one of the oldest mayflies.

"You're right there. We had proper sun in the good old hours. It were all yellow. None of this red stuff."

"It were higher, too."

"It was. You're right."

[vivid bridge]

okay but the modern games are very different

and it takes like a bajillion years longer for them to come out

so the experience is different

[azure bay]

oh I agree

[vivid bridge]

you can't really use the mayfly comparison when its been 7 years since we saw Dale, our protagonist

outside of cameos

[azure bay]

It wasn't so much about the time span

it's was about changes in general

I wouldn't say that the red sun is objectively worse than the yellow one

[vivid bridge]

I couldn't care less about the artstyle change if it didn't take 2 years for a new game to come out

[rancid slate]

I miss the normal colors, rooms with more things, actual wallpapers or wall textures and characters that didnt had weird stand poses

[azure bay]

sounds like you are looking for extra excuses to justify your frustration about the actual problems

[vivid bridge]

ehh

I would complain if it took like a year between each cube escape game

but in reality they came out like every month

so its a way different experience

[rancid slate]

They werent like the paid games

[vivid bridge]

💀

[azure bay]

I mean, a long wait is a valid point. But it's as if you've admitted that you don't mind the art style all that much but other times you criticize it. Am I wrong?

[rancid slate]

https://tenor.com/view/godfather-massacre-sad-gif-16810633

[vivid bridge]

well, in ye olden days the artstyle changed every two games. If UB came out with a shitty artstyle and then half a year later the next game looked like Paradox, I probably wouldn't mind the artstyle that much

the artstyle is my least important problem with UB

[azure bay]

I see

[rancid slate]

I dont mind the time cuz developing things take time depending on how you are feeling
And rushing people to do things faster even when "back then" they were fast, doesnt usually results in good things

[vivid bridge]

I'm not trying to insult the devs here

if this is the pace they're comfortable with, be that as it may

[rancid slate]

*Like what?

[vivid bridge]

UB really doesn't have that much random stuff. It has the classic hand here and there, it has the weird adverts in the first level but thats pretty much it besides the ending

[azure bay]

I liked the heavily breathing fish

and could you consider male nipples random at this point?

[rancid slate]

They were needed for a puzzle

Wouldnt call them random

[azure bay]

they were the puzzle

but why a puzzle can't be random?

[rancid slate]

They can be

Like uuhh that waterdrops from Cave that look like you are making an icecream?

[vivid bridge]

its a good point actually. The artstyle switch corresponds to the degree of randomness. The old games were random but in like a creepy and ominous way while the new games are just kinda like "haha isn't this random? Look, a nipple xD"

[rancid slate]

TWD and UB are just too calm

SR too Ig

[vivid bridge]

SR is fine

its very zen

[rancid slate]

Yeah

[vivid bridge]

which makes sense for the setting

[azure bay]

so do you consider Roots a new game?

[vivid bridge]

no because Roots uses the nipple in a good way

its weird and creepy when you enter William and take his heart

[rancid slate]

Real

[vivid bridge]

in UB its ultimately a comedic thing

[rancid slate]

Things were more rough

[vivid bridge]

also its a reference to an older game which feels... fanservice-y

Roots: Setting the mood of the game as macabre and weird
UB:

[rancid slate]

Mr Boar poop 🍔
Laura poop 😐

[vivid bridge]

🤨

what

[rancid slate]

Baby Laura in UB

[vivid bridge]

oh yeah

well thats different

that's a baby

though I don't think a puzzle involving blowing up a trashcan with a diaper would appear in a game like Case 23

[azure bay]

Bob poop 💩

[rancid slate]

They should do another contest of puzzles

UB has some stations that seem to lack puzzles

Like

School Street

[vivid bridge]

yeah

its like two puzzles

one is pretty elaborate but still

wish we did more with the kids

[rancid slate]

Placed some bookshelves

Oh, its still metro station

[vivid bridge]

its almost as if the metro station setting is kind of limiting

without adding much

[rancid slate]

Maybe also to not add too many puzzles dont contribute in nothing to the plot?

There are many, but they help making the setting feel complete

UB just have the "enough quantity"

And this is considering that one entire side of the room has the nothing besides clock most of the time

[azure bay]

funny enough, the original position is based on the map from Roots

[vivid bridge]

what?

[rancid slate]

Original?

[vivid bridge]

Roots?

[rancid slate]

Map?

[vivid bridge]

funny?

[azure bay]

Position?

[rancid slate]

Enough?

[azure bay]

yes

[rancid slate]

Could you rephrase your message

[azure bay]

this is the retcon illustration I end up with

it's based on the Roots map

[vivid bridge]

what do you mean "map from roots"

there's no map in roots

[azure bay]

pigeons

[vivid bridge]

oh

oh yeah I forgot

[azure bay]

and the cabin was offshore

[rancid slate]

https://tenor.com/view/drake-laptop-drake-gif-21716481

[vivid bridge]

Huh

weird

I feel like that was just them reusing assets without thinking since at that point the Hotel was an established point

but good catch

[azure bay]

I suppose

[vivid bridge]

like

Roots has the painting

where the cabin is at the shore

which is where they have it in the updated map

so at that point they had it figured out but they didn't update the map in the game

[azure bay]

except it still uses the island+cabin icon

[vivid bridge]

hm?

what icon

[azure bay]

like in the picture I've just shared

[vivid bridge]

oh

well yeah thats what I meant

they had already retconned the cabin's location but didn't update the map

[rancid slate]

Wait until they retcon it again

Btw, does the Mill orientation matches the map?

[azure bay]

deep in the land?

[vivid bridge]

you mean its location?

or literally its orientation as in rotation

[rancid slate]

Orientation

Aldous is able to see an angle of the Chapel

[vivid bridge]

uhhh

i think so

yeah

though the painting's mill doesn't match up with the actual in-game building

[rancid slate]

Does the Two Lakes Theory has one with the Cabin in the old spot and the other with the new spot?

[vivid bridge]

yes

in the fucked up evil mirror lake the train station is where the cabin is

so that actually checks out

you might have solved the case

[rancid slate]

[royal notch]

It depends on your idea of "plot hole"!

[azure bay]

something plot-relevant and impossible to explain by symbolisms

or obvious retcons

that contradict previously established facts

[royal notch]

Eilanders, most definitely.

And a welcome one, Dale's beard!

[azure bay]

in Paradox?

[rancid slate]

Dale's beard wasnt retconned

Yet

[azure bay]

at least not apparently

[royal notch]

I'm kinda sure it's going to be.

[azure bay]

I'm not

after all, they did make Dale's mannequin head beardless on Crow's therapy test machine

[vivid bridge]

I think thats just a generic head

nowhere you have to let go

[royal notch]

[azure bay]

no, it's definitely Dale, just look at them both

the same mouth, the same nose, the same ears, the same wrinkles

and it makes sense

it is about Dale

and it does store his brain

[rancid slate]

It uses Dale's face details but not shape

Head shape

[azure bay]

I'd say, it's enface while usual Dale's sprites are 1/3

[royal notch]

Fine, but the fact that it's meant to be a mannequin (without facial hairs) doesn't mean it "cancels" its beard in reality.

[azure bay]

only Paradox isn't reality

[royal notch]

I didn't say that.

[azure bay]

ok, then I spoke of that head for design reasons

[royal notch]

In the reality he could have a beard (retconned).

[azure bay]

it's on the devs' minds, they acknowledge its lack

[royal notch]

What i tried to say is that it's bald too. Those kind of models are made to focus on the anatomy, as you noticed. That could mean that also an ipothetic beard isn't represented.

[azure bay]

if they wanted, they could've modified Dale's bearded sprite and that would work just as nicely

they took some time to design it from scratch

redesigned beardless Dale isn't something mythical

and they may do the same for their most important game

I'd even say it's likely

[rancid slate]

He could also simply regrow his beard with some timeskip if its like Paradise and plagues taking some time between each level

[royal notch]

I'm not trying to support this theory, i'm just taking it as a possibility.

[azure bay]

there's no space for time skips. He was beardless in the prophecy

[rancid slate]

The prophecy was before he arrived

[azure bay]

there's a difference between possibility and likelihood

[rancid slate]

Im talking about after his arrival

[azure bay]

why?

[azure bay]

a meteorite destroying the mankind is possible too

[rancid slate]

So it wouldnt retcon the Hotel cutscene

[azure bay]

without narrative reasons it's lame

[rancid slate]

It grows with the elixir

[royal notch]

Oh, come on, are you really going to compare that possibility with a supposition supported by recent artistic overhauls and clear fanbase feedback? Now that's just kind of offensive.

[rancid slate]

Clear fanbase feedback

[royal notch]

#🩸｜general-chat message

An example.

[azure bay]

no, just an example. It's still more plausible than you think tho.

But that aside, Dale's beard likely had a single Paradox-limited purpose, to fit David Bowles. The cameos could permit Dale's beard too.

And since I don't see a mob demanding Dale to keep his beard, the only possible reasons for the Devs to keep it is mere laziness and negligence.

They are possible, considering some recent choices but considering the therapy machine and the importance of Dale's finale, I'm willing to give them benefit of the doubt and not to consider the possibility of retcon too seriously until 1st teasers

[azure bay]

doesn't seem any serious

35 voters

and even I prefer Dale with beard

but that doesn't mean I'd value it over consistency

[royal notch]

I honestly wouldn't mind because such retcon wouldn't be lore-breaking anyway.

[azure bay]

still nasty

they themselves were relying on the beard back in 2016

"the time I still had my beard" in Theatre's teaser

that's basic attention to details

screw that up and nobody will take you seriously

[rancid slate]

Beardless Dale calls attention, no way they would forget and retcon it, right guys?

[royal notch]

True, but with what they have made with the Eilanders i don't think this would cause bigger chaos.

[azure bay]

the Eilanders are better characters than the guests

[royal notch]

Absolutely.

[azure bay]

it redeems them a ton

[rancid slate]

All of that simply because they decided to have different interests when enlightened

[azure bay]

I tend to agree that the guests are rather nothing like the Eilanders

[royal notch]

I was talking about Hotel's files.

[azure bay]

in the beginning I seriously considered rebirth amnesia as an expanation

now I'm more cynical and thus unsure

[royal notch]

Let's hope Mr Rabbit will answer some.

[azure bay]

you mean the 10th anniversary?

[royal notch]

What? It's confirmed to be the game for that date?

I thought it was a generic teaser.

[azure bay]

it was rather blunt with its wording

"celebrating the decade of RL", "the show just begins"

too specific

[royal notch]

Well, another thing not to hope for!

[rancid slate]

Why not?

Releasing a teaser doesnt mean they just started working on it

[royal notch]

I onestly expect something greater for such an important date!

[azure bay]

SR was a good game

[rancid slate]

Thief game

[azure bay]

I wouldn't mind something similar

I don't expect anything particularly big. Only a fun free game with UB-like narrative only in the setting of Theatre

[rancid slate]

I expect Cube Escape The Lake

[azure bay]

meaning?

[rancid slate]

/j

[azure bay]

k

[royal notch]

It's just that 10 years really seems a very big achievment and i'd expect some really great celebration, like Dale's enlightenment!

Samsara was fine for half the journey.

[azure bay]

Used to think as much. But after the alchemists were teased Dale's finally is already officially off the table

[rancid slate]

Me

[azure bay]

I want to see the brothers too, I expect their game to be rather big and I don't mind the anniversary game not as big as long as it's a present like SR

[royal notch]

But there's time until april... i'm being nostalgic about the old quantity release.

[rancid slate]

If they made a game with SR gameplay length but with a good amount of info it would be so cool

Cuz its not a short short game

[azure bay]

I believe SR was comparable to Seasons and Case 23, no?

maybe even The Cave?

[royal notch]

In my opinion The Cave has the most balanced quantity of time required to play it.

And Samsara Room felt a bit shorter.

[rancid slate]

My last SR all achievements gameplay and having all solutions took 19 minutes

[azure bay]

what about The Cave?

[rancid slate]

Didnt replayed it yet

[azure bay]

I probably remember SR taking longer than The Cave because of the bird chapter

[rancid slate]

Ive seen 2 hours Blind playthroughs of SR

Most of the CE were short and they were good too

[vivid bridge]

They'll finally make a game about the bridge you guys trust me

[rancid slate]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/534154676669513730/1283518393269489685/114_Sem_Titulo_20240911155900.png?ex=678571a7&is=67842027&hm=74cf4c40159571fd1d96cb7dc66776be8598c26389ec7f5dbef8b7fe8197e3c1&

[pine oak]

I knew that Harvey is enlightened human

And I was saying that from the beginning

/j

But I really believe it’s true

[vivid bridge]

We joke but with us getting a young aldous game, you think we could get a young mill lady?

Probably not considering she has not been referenced in 10 years

But one can dream

[rancid slate]

Only if she drinks the elixir

Shes seems to be born between Franl-Leonard-Rose years

[vivid bridge]

True

Mrs. Sheep

Please

Maybe if we bully damy we can make it happen

[covert wyvern]

Do not.

Actually I'd love to see a mrs sheep nvm

[deft haven]

Love how you changed opinion in 1 minute

[covert wyvern]

I didn't actually read up and I think sheep are really cute! Haha

[vivid bridge]

So you're saying if we bully you it could happen?

[covert wyvern]

Hahaha let's leave the bullying at the door

[vivid bridge]

[deft haven]

We also need a mr tiger

Why

Because i want to

Muahahaha

[floral veldt]

We did get 4 mammals in game, Deer, Rabbit, Boar and Mammoth

So it is possible @deft haven

[deft haven]

I mean, mammoth is yet to come

But yes

It is

[main badge]

excuse me, mammoth?

who’s gonna be a mammoth?

[azure bay]

Nobody, it's just an animal from sneaky teasers across 5 years

[main badge]

so nobody yet

[main badge]

where do i find this teaser? did i miss something?

or is that a name to a different game outside rl?

i just checked your links AND IVE BEEN WATCHING YOU ON YT FOR AWHILE THAYS SO COOL

[azure bay]

Old Paradox Christmas puzzle, old roadmap (2019), The 7-year anniversary where's Waldo style roadmap, and finally it's hidden among prompts of Dale-E

[azure bay]

🫶

[main badge]

ohhh okay, yes i remember the where’s waldo thing but i was so focused on finding the characters i did know i didn’t even think about the others lol

thank you!!

[azure bay]

You also say it as if it's Mr. Mammoth and somebody will be enlightened to become it.

It's just an animal, really

[vivid bridge]

While we don't know what the mammoth game actually was, the decision to go prehistoric is hilarious

[azure bay]

In a good or a bad way?

[vivid bridge]

Good

I wish they stuck to it instead of ultra committing to TPW, which essentially overtook the entire next five years

[main badge]

i lovedddd the past within

but im just a big rose fan

[vivid bridge]

I just wish it didn't take that long to make

It really derailed the story

[azure bay]

They needed to make it, they faced problems, they couldn't back off

it's unfortunate

[vivid bridge]

yeah but still

there's a parallel universe out there where they instead focused on Mammoth and the series went a completely different path

in that universe i'd be like "man, we've spent the last 5 years in this stupid prehistoric age, can we go back to the present day? I wanna see Rose and Albert"

[azure bay]

I believe 20k BC would be more akin to Roots/Paradise and go just as smoothly

[vivid bridge]

well yeah

I was mostly making a joke

[azure bay]

k

[vivid bridge]

I wonder if The White Door would still have happened

that game is so strange since its not on the mammoth roadmap

[azure bay]

I think it would

SM was seemingly teased in Paradox

a maze in Dale's test

[vivid bridge]

but then why was it not on the roadmap

do you remember when TWD was announced

May 2019...

[azure bay]

the idea probably was rather spontaneous but I believe it was inevitable

it's like suddenly realizing the thing you have to do

[vivid bridge]

they must have decided to scrap the mammoth the moment after they posted that roadmap lol

[azure bay]

more or less?

[vivid bridge]

the white door would have been much better if there was a mammoth involved...

[royal notch]

Dudes, i just realized that if we assume that Dale stayed for half a year at the Lake's bottom then Mr Owl has been stuck in the cave for the same amount of time!

[azure bay]

note necessarily

[royal notch]

Unless he stayed at the bottom as well?

[azure bay]

time does not exist in the lake

[royal notch]

In the Lake, fine. But outside? If Mr Owl got out immediatly after his job then...

[azure bay]

but when?

[royal notch]

We know that helped Dale distracting the corrupted souls.

[azure bay]

no matter how little he spent down there it doesn't have to be consistent with the surface

[royal notch]

It should, instead, because then it would be an insensate time machine. Just go for a swim and you get the possibility to go anywhere in the continuum?

[azure bay]

maybe, or maybe it's just about how time flows forward

[royal notch]

That would be too randomic.

[azure bay]

subjective

objectively it may be anything and nothing

not even sure the devs themselves thought all that through

or even some of it

what we know for sure, the lake is like a crossroad of time

but what happens when you go back?

how would it determine your time or even timeline?

clearly somehow

but still an interesting question

and to what extent?

[royal notch]

Rusty Lake is not its own bubble, anyone can visit the place and go for a swim, like the fisherman in the Cave. If he had accidentaly fallen in the waters, i assume he would just got on board of his boat again. With the risk of the Lake being an open multiverse, imagine all the possible missing person cases leading there.

[azure bay]

the deeper you go the less the lake is there and more the forest

you can't breathe on upper to mid levels

but totally can at the bottom

[royal notch]

I think though that the time outside should flow constantly matching the time of the stay, independently by how such amount of time has been felt. Because then Mr Owl and Dale's reapparition in 1972 would become just an odds matter.

And Mr Crow's, too.

[azure bay]

that would feel normal but it obliges nobody

again, we don't know how it works

and any guess that describes what we see is just as good as the next

if the devs want to make it random, they will.

if they want to make it normal, they will

if they don't bother, nothing is true

[royal notch]

What i was thinking about is that Aldous supposedly went to help his colleague at the time he needed it. Meaning that Mr Owl may have waited without any primal needs at the bottom. Do you think it happened something relatable to what is seen in UB?

[azure bay]

maybe

if Harvey's cubes are at least somewhat canon

btw

I reflected a bit on what we know

and I'm almost sure that Dale didn't feel like he spent half a year in the lake

he didn't change visually for sure

[royal notch]

I've always assumed that he lost consciousness when he entered the Lake's waters to be then controlled in his movements, until he would wake up while rising.

[azure bay]

I mean even if he didn't, if it was somebody else, that wouldn't feel like that

[royal notch]

I agree, otherwise they would starve.

[carmine field]

what do you think about the mill? Considering that its game takes place in both October 1971 and the summer of 1972

The typewriter puzzle gives the idea that time stops around the mill.... 🤔

[vivid bridge]

huh

I never thought about taking that puzzle literal

[rancid slate]

🐈

[visual coral]

It's either that or some weird time skip
I'm leaning towards the time stop given that Crows wife(if that who she is of course) must be over a 100 years in 1971

[honest brook]

I assume it's a time skip

[rancid slate]

Most likely

Like 1891 Search

[royal notch]

I always took that tale literally because of all the other informations being true. There is an old man owning the mill (it turns out he's Aldous), his movements are depicted in the map and investigated by Dale (why would an old man take routine walks to the local dangerous cave?), and later on actual numbers appear above the Lake. So i assume that even the conclusion of time somehow stopping has some truth to it.

[azure bay]

Time skip has its problems. The biggest one, why did they wait for 10 months before they extracted Laura's memories?

A bit less important but still interesting why didn't the corpse rot?

[rancid slate]

For the plot

[honest brook]

Most likely because the extraction machine needed the storm for it to work.

[azure bay]

you can't be serious. Owl could summon storm anytime. He didn't need Dale for that

[rancid slate]

Maybe they (the devs) wanted to justify the 2 Cubes in Investigation

By Mr. Owl using that as "sign" to Mr. Crow

Like

Dont extract Laura's memories until we are sure Dale's coming too

[honest brook]

Except Mr. Owl explicitly states in the letter that he is waiting for Dale to find the two cubes before he summons the storm. "If he can find the two cubes, I will give you storm."

[azure bay]

I can't believe that's how it's supposed to work.

Finding cubes was rather a test than some power ritual.

Besides, don't tell me there was no storm even once in between the events

[vivid bridge]

I think it might just be gameplay. There is no reason why Crow's machine would even need a new rope to work. Did the old one break and he never went to the hardware store? It's all just convenience for gameplay's sake

[honest brook]

What do you think Mr. Owl meant by that, then?

[vivid bridge]

crackpot theory with no evidence: There is no natural weather in rusty lake, only magic masks and Owl t-posing can cause storms. So when Owl sends Crow a body, he's like "I'm gonna give you storm in like an hour so be ready" because they haven't figured out how to connect the machine to, like, the water wheel