🤔｜theories

[azure bay]

Still in the elevator, still flickering Dale goes up the lake towards Rusty Lake Hotel. Along the way he enters his memory cubes floating around him and faces new challenges and lessons.

With Owl's help he relives and corrects the worst day of his life by preventing a massacre on his birthday.

In the Theatre memory he sees a different set of plays ought to teach him about the universe, the samsara cycle and his future.

In a future game, Dale will finally reach the hotel, Laura will join him. They'll "celebrate" The Day of The Lake. They'll likely make an elixir using the golden cube and consume it. One of them will die (likely Laura), the other will be enlightened like nobody before and replace Mr. Owl as the new ruler of The Lake.

[wet willow]

so @azure bay isnt he going to the past? and use an elevator in the mill that apear in the final sence on rusty lake hotel?

[azure bay]

it was actually the future that Owl and Harvey saw in Hotel and it's happening "now"

[wet willow]

what

rusty lake hotel isnt it in the past

like

1800

[azure bay]

no

[wet willow]

crazy

[azure bay]

I mean

it is

but Dale isn't born

[wet willow]

yeh

[azure bay]

instead they had a prophecy

about 1972

[wet willow]

hm

what about the blue cube

[azure bay]

they control time

[wet willow]

yes

so it bring dale to the future

like 2000??

[azure bay]

I think it could

but there's no reason for that as of now

[wet willow]

confusing

[azure bay]

why?

[wet willow]

ill get pop corn and whats some theories on yb

[wet willow]

cuz i got into this univers recently so

might seem a little confusing when a lot of information hit me in the face

but i liked it tho

[azure bay]

there's not much on youtube so far

[wet willow]

ik

[azure bay]

but I'm trying my best

[wet willow]

specially ive been lazy and just watching theories on my native lenguage

[wet willow]

thank you btw

ill brb with some quentios i hope

[azure bay]

[wet willow]

[rancid slate]

Dont ask who is the robber guy

[wheat ore]

who's he ?

[azure bay]

someone who doesn't make sense

[wheat ore]

ikr?? seriously, it's so rude to steal like that 😿

[azure bay]

especially considering that he robbed a parrot, anthro or not

[wheat ore]

so rude

[rancid slate]

Dont be a Thief denier

Thief deniers be like:
"Must have been the wind!"

[wheat ore]

"oops ! slipped and got your wallet my bad"

[wet willow]

@azure bay

I'm back

With another question

Look

In cube escape paradox

We see as dale that Laura was liked by a corrupted soul (idk if you say like that in English I'm just translating the name)

But time later we play as dale becaming the soul that killed Laura and see dale without being corrupted

So I dale do not travel to the past how is it possible

[mellow sentinel]

Hola

[wet willow]

Hola

Como estás

[rancid slate]

Cube Escape Paradox takes place in Dale's Mind

He is stuck in a mental paradox

As a test from Mr. Owl

But in the real world, it happens in the very end of Cube Escape: The Cave

There is no direct time travel in Rusty Lake, as far as I know

[rancid slate]

There are more different endings too, one where Dale saves Laura

Just as Nowhere said too

[azure bay]

I tend to think there is. For instance, Mr. Rabbit's soul in the window before he even died. Or Harvey going back to 1935 in UB to start working for Owl.

[azure bay]

What I meant in that discussion, it wasn't Dale who went to 1893 in Hotel ending, it was Owl who saw him in future 1972.

But, to be fair, the only time we could somehow consider Dale time travel for real is him using the blue cube in Birthday.

Everything else so far is either cube travel which is different or, as Sp said about Paradox, a dream.

[covert wyvern]

@wet willow Please take a moment to update your "pronouns" if you want to stay in the server, they're currently just not acceptable.

[azure bay]

I'l just a dude from the internet but thx

[summer dragon]

There's also the blue cubes that let you go back in time (kinda).

[azure bay]

Considering Seasons, I'd say they let you go back and forth

Before you find one, you are bound to experience memories in a strict order. But after you are free to choose whatever

[hallow cape]

Lol cute

[wet willow]

Ohhhhhh I got it

[wet willow]

Ok ok

I'm sorry

I think is no offensive anymore

If it was say it I'll change again

[covert wyvern]

I'd just go for something completely different, if i were you.

[wet willow]

Ok

Done

[covert wyvern]

Thanks.

[royal notch]

After TPW, even time travel is canon thanks to Birthday.

[azure bay]

TPW being time travel doesn't really make sense. The Past and The Future can't belong to the same timeline because Rose's escape from The Past would contradict everything. Laura wouldn't be simply born

[royal notch]

I didn't even say that...

Since TPW states a similarity between memories and realities, what happened in Birthday must have really happened too, time travel included.

[azure bay]

ok

that's fair

[lyric perch]

Gotta say, who the hell locked grandma and lost the key in the mill

[azure bay]

I tend to take it just as a gameplay moment for weirdness sake

"be surprised but don't think too much about it"

[wheat ore]

"who's that"
"do not question why we have a knitting grandma locked up in the basement"

[azure bay]

@floral eagle even ehough the series is random, it has its laws, logic and a consistent cast.

Almost all 17 games are connected and different dreamers wouldn't be able to convey these connections

[floral eagle]

I based this theory on my dreams, they have these kinda of theme, that i need to solve something to progress further on the dream, there are some codes when i dream, for example, to wake up from a nightmare, i must shake my head, then i wake up, to peform a action, sometimes I have to say it...

The only thing though that isn't accurate are the dates, in my dreams dates are censored...

And I can think on my dreams

[azure bay]

well, in Rusty Lake there are several plot lines but most of them either branch from or serve the main one

[floral eagle]

Yeah, it's a mystery, I think k that their games are dreams so that the horror, graphic doesn't scare me lol

[rancid slate]

I assure you, they are very real

[vagrant roost]

I feel like when characters go into memories, they're just changing the memories, not the actual timeline.

For example, in CE: Birthday, Dale goes into his memory of his 9th birthday and prevents Mr. Rabbit from killing his parents. If the action of altering memories makes what happened in the new memory true, Dale wouldn't have been the Dale we see in the games. For all we know, the birthday incident might be the whole reason he became a homicide Detective. Also, considering we see Laura and Dale in those memory extraction chair things in CE: The Cave, I would assume that Mr. Crow and Mr. Owl are purposely changing the two's memories.

Why would they branch off timelines by altering the memories of the two people who they want to become the next ruler of the lake? If they change timelines, they're actively fighting against realities where both characters are available for the position of Ruler. I know that those two are also having their memories extracted to make a golden cube, but I've seen theories that the machine is also allowing them to alter the person's memories. In this case, Dale's elevator journey is literally all in his head.

I can only assume that going into memories and altering them only changes the person's memory of the event. I believe either Mr. Crow or Mr. Owl said something about Dale having to have a 'clear mind' or something in one of the games, but I could be totally misremembering it. If you want a new ruler of the lake, you'd want them to not be plagued by their traumas, right? What better way to do that then make them forget or alter their painful memories?

TLDR: I feel like the branching off timelines theory makes more questions than answers, and I wanted a chance to ramble about my theory lol

[azure bay]

This picture fails to describe The Past Within

Yes, initially we alter memories there too

but this time we have an additional perspective and other evidence meaning that it's not just memory

but a small reality

and then it throws an uno reverse card and starts altering the outer reality back

besides

TLDR: I feel like the branching off timelines theory makes more questions than answers, and I wanted a chance to ramble about my theory lol
what you described isn't a timeline branching theory

it's a single plastic timeline time travel theory

"you go back, you change your past and thus change your future"

branching timelines implies a new timeline that doesn't affect your original timeline and your original future

[vagrant roost]

That's the one hole in my theory, but I do think I have an explanation, as flimsy as it may be.

It seems to me that Albert's invention of the memory box thing was not known by the greater beings of the Lake, (ie: Mr. Owl, Mr. Crow, Harvey, etc) therefore making them have no idea that altering memories to change the future existed. I do think that it's possible that the memory box that Albert invented did in fact change the timeline (It's honestly the only way that TPW makes sense) but I find it strange that if Albert and Rose made such a powerful machine that could change the timeline, their research seems to be separate from The White Door and the other Mr. Owl facilities. Just from a scientific field standpoint, you'd want to give resources to inventors making world changing inventions, but we never see the Geater Beings actively help their research. If anything, they seem oblivious to Albert and Rose's research.

Harvey does see Rose at work in the secret lab level of Underground Blossom, but at that point Rose is already greying and the future's memory box is practically finished. I think by that point Dale and Laura are either already ascended to Greater Being territory or are at the cusp of ascending.

What I'm trying to say is that the timeline changing may be a thing in Rusty Lake, but not at the time of Dale and Laura's ascension. Remember, this is during the 70s, technology in general was just starting to pick up. Laura and Dale probably had to go through some other sort of memory changing that 'cleared' their mind, and changing only their perception of the memories was the only thing that cut it.

Also, we never see anyone enter a memory in TPW if I remember correctly. You can change the memory and give information to the person already in the memory, but neither Rose or Albert switch what memory they're in.

I may be completely missing something though idk

[vagrant roost]

I didn't know what else to call it lol, but yes, I meant a single plastic timeline theory 🙂

[azure bay]

Actually

I do agree on certain takes of yours

A single plastic timeline doesn't work with Birthday and, so you know, not even with The Past Within

But what I do disagree on is that it's all "just memories"

It's much more in TPW and has to be so in other games

The Lab in UB actually belongs to Owl

[vagrant roost]

Oh really?

[azure bay]

I do think he's not aware of every tech and trick

And I do think Albert knows more

But cubical device doesn't do much to cubes themselves

The game starts before it's booted and goes on even when both of them are off

Meaning cubes do contain realities

But, as I said, these realities are unable to passively alter other realities

Dale didn't save his own parents

And didn't change his career

But, based on what we see in TPW, he probably saved parents of his other-self

Who lives "inside a cube" and who he synchronized with when entering it

But what's more, TPW has shown us that even the world outside a cube can be just another cube

And the place outside all cubes is The Lake

So I'd say, this could be described by actual branching timelines

When you extract a memory, you create a new timeline (or at least gain access to it)

And initially it's a copy of your home timeline

But since you have a cube, you have a certain amount of control over ut

@vagrant roost I hope we it will help us find a common ground

[azure bay]

And yes, it's Best Kept Memory. And BKM advertises The White Door.

Also there's a tabletop game about this lab coming out tomorrow and one of the teasers depicted Rusty Lake mental health poster

[vagrant roost]

Yeah, you've made some good points!

[rancid slate]

Would Dale really accept his fate?

Bro was literally just trying to solve a death or suicide case

And now he is the future of a bird hotel 😭

[deft haven]

he has no choice

[rancid slate]

What if

For the first time

We actually get to choose

[deft haven]

that would be fun

[carmine field]

Part of the journey is him understanding his fate

I think this is part of the purpose of Theatre

[rancid slate]

🥺🥺

[cold moss]

It’s like the wicker man but instead of being burnt you become cube jesus

[azure bay]

Why choosing? In RL you can both be burnt AND become cube jesus

[cold moss]

W watched the Wicker Man (the origenal) recently and it feels like Rusty Lake took alot of influence

[floral eagle]

I believe that Dale vandemeer is the reincarnation of Albert... reason is that in paradox he kills Laura, because he went in corruption, but after waking up from his paradoxal state, he knows what he has to do, using a golden cube...

The reason why I Believe Dale killed Laura, is the Samsara theory, he might be the reincarnation of Albert, but did choose to not be a killer, instead he choice to be a detective, that's why Mr. Crow tried to convince him to be corrupt soul, to make samsara work, the only problem is that Dale failed to follow the samsara path, that's why Rose was doing lab research to ressurect Albert, so the samsara keeps going...

What samsara is to the mr.crow and others like Harvey is unknown, but might be related to elixir...

So Dale in Corrupt state killed Laura, or Albert killed her, by using the blue cube..

Which means that there's an error in timeline...

To fix this error that's were the lab may have happened, Dale knew what he needed to do, but he might refused

Also the deer theory sustains it

[leaden rain]

I cannot argue if it is logical or not since I don’t know the lore by heart, but I can say it is a very interesting theory!

[rancid slate]

Most sane Rusty Lake theory:

[rancid slate]

I sadly have to

1. There's nothing that suggests Dale being Albert in the series. And the deer head thing, well, if all the deer characters were the same, then Dale would also be Mr. Deer which is also (RL Paradise spoiler if u havent played yet) ||Nicolas Eilander||, which just doesn't make sense either

2. In simple terms, the Paradox game is kinda like a dream in Dale's mind, which means things that happen there arent 100% real. Therefore, Dale did not kill Laura as corrupted soul.. He is literally the one trying to find the murderer.. (Spoilers I guess --> ||Laura killed herself|| )

3. Also, Dale does not wake up when he gets the Golden Cube. He remains with his eyed closed u _ u <-- Hello, I am Dale Vandermeer and you are watching Cube Escape Channel

[floral eagle]

Ok, even though i don't believe she killed herself, here is also a thing that i realized: Harvey is a parrot, right? Parrot tend to repeat words that people say to them, the reason why we don't usually know to much about harvey, is because he can't speak, since he is not a human... it was discovered that he is a female, reason why they didn't know? Harvey didn't put an egg during some time, she only put an egg during Laura time

Also i believe Harvey is imortal, and he probably drank the elixir...

[floral mauve]

UB says otherwise, with new evidence Laura indeed killed herself

[vagrant roost]

Trans Harvey is basically Canon at this point, I love it so much. Also yeah, Harvey seems to be immortal and I lowkey think he's at a higher level than Mr. Owl and Mr. Crow in some way. He doesn't seem to need the Elixir but rather make the Elixir with his eggs. Ie: You needing a black egg that seems to look and be one of Harvey's eggs to make the Elixir in the secret level of Roots

[floral mauve]

Secret level doesn’t really count much lore wise, only for the fun puzzle parts cuz you can make anything

Plus I don’t know if I recall it properly wasn’t it a crow egg or simply black egg

I don’t remember much

[vagrant roost]

Also the "It all started with Harvey's egg" quote that Laura says in Paradox. Could just be a reference to the first cube in the series coming from Harvey's egg in CE: Seasons, but it could also be a little hint to Harvey being the first/eldest character in the games. Remember, he was around during Paradise!

[vagrant roost]

Oh wait that might be it nvm

Okay it's just refered to as a black egg, but crow eggs and Harvey's eggs look the same in the games so it's really a 50/50

[rancid slate]

You just remembered me that when we click on Harvey durinh Summer in Seasons, we hear Laura's scream

I like to think that William was the one in control when Laura killed herself, but UB disapproves that

[floral eagle]

That's what is odd about the Laura's Death, if I am correct, After she died, Case 23 opened, with the evidences pointing on Rusty Lake, which implies that this lake might be responsible for her death...

I feel like it was intentionally, so Dale could investigate and enter the lake...

Maybe mr. Crow is a villain, because he used Laura death, Dale's sad memories and the theater of samsara to point him to do something for him, like a puppet...

[rancid slate]

Well, theres the RL Hotel ending and Paradox for that

Thats Dale's fate

[floral eagle]

Which implies that Mr. Rabbit was forced to kill Dale's parents, but in an ambiguous way: He could have done it to start the Dale's Journey or he tried to stop Mr.Crow's plans

[rancid slate]

We do know that Mr. Rabbit killed his parents to balance his past lives

But we dont know why he chose Dale's parents

Also, Dale literally sees Laura's body floating in Case 23

So ofc he would suspect of Rusty Lake

+He calls to the Hotel and gets a confirmation that Laura was there

[floral eagle]

I really want to understand where the devs inspired this story from lol

[rancid slate]

I think they say their inspirations on the website

But one of them is Twin Peaks

[floral eagle]

Maybe there is a lake that inspired this series

[rancid slate]

"Inspired by David Lynch's TV series Twin Peaks we decided to create our own imaginative universe called Rusty Lake"

[floral eagle]

Anyway, I am designer and I want to become game dev, that's why I am trying to understand this game lore

[rancid slate]

[rancid slate]

Does anyone has an idea of when the RL Untold Lab campaign takes place?

Like, before or after the Lab from UB?

I would say, as we see ||Albert's hand, while in UB we see just a blob, it could be after UB..? Cuz the flesh starts to get more completed||

And then in TPW we get the full thing

But in UB, ||Albert's Soul is on a cage, while on RLU he seems to be very free||

Oh yeah, and also there is no ||Cube Device in RLU||

In the promo for RLU, we also got to see Albert's soul on the Test Room 04

I presume this promo takes place in a time closed to the campaign, so now it is most likely that ||Albert was not showin agressive behaviour in that time. So they (Rose and the others) didnt minded make the Test Room 04 safe against him||

We also see no ||tank with Albert's inside, just like in TPW and the BKM station teaser||

With all that said, I think the timeline is..

RLU -> UB Lab-> BKM Teaser-> TPW

As for my ||"Hand being more advanced than the blob"|| point, it could also not be :b

Oh wait

Thats not ||Albert's hand||.. THATS ||ROSE'S HAND CUZ ITS USED TO OPEN THE DOOR||

So ||Rose was using her own flesh, huh.. If not Rose, it still is someone that works there..||

Oh wait

One more thing

The ||Memory Extraction Room name is "Test Room", which means.. UB in fact is after RLU, since Rose extracts her memory like she knew the machine was done and safe to use||

Yay :D

[azure bay]

1. I wouldn't call it trans.

Unless we call William reincarnating as Laura trans too.

2. Elixir made with eggs makes no sense on many levels. The most important one is that Williams memories contain numerous elixir ingredients.

And the egg in the alchemy minigame produces a crow.

3. No, thungs starting with Harvey's eggs has to be a Seasons reference. Laura wouldn't know much about Harvey.

[azure bay]

It's Mr. Owl who in control. And so far it seems he wishes him good

[azure bay]

He came for the pistol in their possession

[azure bay]

I don't think we have many reliable references to pinpoint the timeline.

1. Albert's soul could have escaped 1 more time any time around UB The Lab

2. RLU protagonists not finding the cubical device doesn't mean it's not there. The room that would hold it is absent. Whether the device is there or not, the room itself has to exist somewhere.

3. No, I don't think the hand belongs to Albert at all. As for Rose, not sure. She seems ok in every relevant game. Yeah, could be some other employee.

4. The canonicity of the promo videos is very debatable since it broke the 4th wall.

5. The tank isn't a good reference either. Just like device it could be elsewhere or even haven't been built yet especially if RLU takes place right after UB

6. Extraction room was never called test room. It serms you are confusing it with something else.

7. So I think the flesh is the only somewhat reliable thing because I do see the possible progression too.

[hallow sentinel]

all I can think of is whose flesh is it

I think I can agree it isn't Rose's hand nor Albert's

[floral mauve]

it can open the office though, some may say that it relates to the researchers at least, though you could say its puzzle purpose but it does seem to be important with its chemical intuition behind

for the tpw body recreation technology

[rancid slate]

Its called Test Room on the file name

[azure bay]

I see. But still, I don't think it's necessarily relevant

Could be just shorther than Memory Extraction Room.png

Or even just Extraction Room png

[rancid slate]

The paper files are named Bedroom Note and Bedroom Cypher

So I dont think it is just a shorter name

[azure bay]

I see a different possible notion then

Something to make it easier to navigate through cards

Like "that's the note you find in the bedroom, that's the cypher you find there and let's call that a test room so it's too not too confusing for newcomers"

[rancid slate]

The best name would be "hidden room" since thats how it is called in the guide

[azure bay]

That doesn't make my assumption less possible and thus doesn't make the filename more strong as a piece of evidence

I'd agree if it was called that in the game

[still pine]

I think I finally arrived at a plot for the entire of rusty lake games and I want to talk about it with someone

[hallow cape]

Go ahead

[still pine]

I mean its really long but if I brief it or write it in parts, I wrote a theory for the start which is Harvey lives on Harveys Island (ref in paradox) and essentialy I wrote it that there is this magical electromagnetic power that is underneath the island beneath the lake and that one day a major event leads harvey becoming an enlightened hybrid and the water of the lake becoming infused with this magical electromagnetic power. One day Margaret Eilanders parents or Grandparents come to Harveys Island and they have a family history of magic and rituals and maybe her grandparents learn the ways of the island and gain all this magic knowledge, the island also becomes paradise island. When Margaret is born or a little older Aldous Vanderboom comes fishing to the lake once and meets Margaret and they fall in love. Margaret moves from paradise island and Aldous builds the lake suite (ref in roots and birthday//I located this to be in the woodland hidden by trees).. as they get older Margaret tells Aldous all about the magic she learnt and from the lake and Harveys/Paradise Island and they also have children. After time passes Aldous decides to tell his brother, William about this and taking James they build the Rusty Lake House and soon after become alchemists and try to recreate the magic they have heart about from the glass bottle (holding the lake water) and one of Harveys eggs. Meanwhile, the Eilanders are back living on paradise island. ... this all goes on and I have some interested ideas about Dale and different timelines

Originally I thought it might of been potential that Dales father was birthed by Margaret and maybe that still is the case but then maybe not

I do happen to think though that Aldous/Mr Crow is Dales grandfather

When the eilanders and vanderbooms grow up they create their families and roots and hotel taking place at the same time

skipping some stuff, when Laura is rebirthed rose looks after her and albert calls for rose when Laura is a child and rose returns to the house where Alberts coffin lies and finds notes he written from just before Frank killed him. Rose uses the cubical device to connect with herself in the future to work together to resurrect Albert. Laura grows up and meets Robert and after her mental illness she leaves robert and decides to go to rusty lake mental health and fishing. Meanwhile, Rose she is working in the lab to build or help build the memory extraction machine and program. Robert kills himself in the theatre after hearing Laura is leaving him?? (to be its a little vague because of what you hear in the white door). However, Laura then fishes in the cabin in the lake...

This part is kind of confusing but ill try to write it different

so ive decided there is like 3 timelines

If you notice when you play the lake there are 2 different endings, one where a green gem is used and laura lives and another with the blue gem and laura dies. Also, I think Paradox occurs the same time as this and in the short film on youtube Laura being actually inside the lake is symbolism of the cabin??.. maybe? So in Timeline 1, Dale drinks the red vial and Laura is fishing and Dale watches Laura die (this to me is like torture fate because it is a fate worse than death, all you can do is observe you cannot change the future and she still dies nomatter what you do". In Timeline 2, Dale drinks the blue vial and Laura in the cabin fishes a man out the lake, is this dales dead body? she also uses the blue gem and in this ending she dies, Dale having killed her,, Dale also in paradox turns to corrupted soul and kills Laura. I believe there is a 3rd Timeline, upon watching the paradox short film you see in the cabinet is 3 vials and one is green, I think Dale drinks the green vial and becomes an enlightened hybrid and Laura using the green gem lives.

--you see that Laura must live aswell because she is old in a scene in Underground Blossom, i thought this to be due to the timelines

As for who Dale becomes this also gets confusing but I think he becomes Mr Rabbit for a few reasons, one reason is Mr Rabbit says in birthday that he needs the substance of ONE of his past lives. and this is the pistol. Anyways, skipping other viable reasons why Dale is Mr Rabbit, Mr Rabbits other life is David Eilander. I think that in the timelines it also affects Dales Birthday/family. You can see in paradox ch2 in the newspaper it says family massaccred and boy survives which to me strikes fate turning to be one way and this being a timeline where only dales family died, but in another timeline his family survived. And potentially in the other they blend together and when Mr rabbit hobbles to the tree it is Dale and David blending together (something also similar ref in Underground Blossom -- I think,, I hope im not wrong but which ever it is, maybe past within, rose and rose blend to become one at the tree)

Paradoxical Timeline x3

1 2 3
Neutral Death/Evil Life/Good
Red Vial Blue Vial Green Vial
Tortue/Observation Death/soul Enlightenment
Family Live Family Die Family Die and then Live?
Mr R dies Mr R lives Mr R lives and then dies?

? is dale with the golden cube part of timeline 3

I dont know if this helps or is even right

little things can also make sense like David Eilander becoming the magician because of his familys history of magic, etc

... I mean originally when I had it that Margaret birthed Dales Father, I had it that all 4 brothers (including Gerard) lived together and when 3 of them each had a child each it was more like Dale and Jakob were near the same age and got along with each other but David was jealous (one reason why David as Mr Rabbit might of killed Dales family, however Dale when he was really young had to have his memories removed of Rusty Lake and he and his mother and father left to live somewhere else taking some heirlooms eg. the record player and the record of the lake suite... why Dale has no memories of Rusty Lake. However, the scene in Roots has written in the attic window? that Dale was born 18/12/1930 and its written in the house so whether he is one of Franks or Roses child I dont know?? but I seemed to enjoy it more when he was playing with Jakob in his past because in Paradox Mr Owl uses the present mind and says he knew Dale from his past and in Mr Owls past mind he is portrayed as Jakob, which made me think Dale was there but had his memories extracted.

other questions ive arrived at after playing untold is ... can only people enter the memory extraction machine or can you also place in memory cubes to create other cubes such as the blue or golden ones? Also, there are 4 beds in the bedroom - one for each player, who do you play as, assuming one of them is Rose? Did Rose make the memory extraction machine or is this a time after Albert was resurrected, and if so, did he make it? My other question is, are the memory cubes you see floating on the lake, etc the ones made from the machine? Is it that the technology is passed through time so that memory cubes are able to be made in the past?

Although it seems ive written a few paragraphs of text, I have briefed it and skipped alot of the story because I felt it makes sense and can already be understood, but I plan to post the full thing maybe on reddit. Thanks for reading this far.

@rancid slate @wintry copper what do you think?

[rancid slate]

I dont think the Old Woman from The Mill is Margaret.. They have like 100 years age gap

[azure bay]

Harvey lives on Harveys Island (ref in paradox)
The globe in Paradox is definitely not to be taken literally. It doesn't reflect the real geography but rather a metaphorical path of a character.

Besides, the globe isn't even consistent across the 2 chapters because in ch1 it depicts Laura's life and in ch2 the one of Dale.

there is this magical electromagnetic power that is underneath the island
Where does this concept come from? What power? Why specifically electromagnetic? What evidence do you have?

One day Margaret Eilanders parents or Grandparents come to Harveys Island and they have a family history of magic and rituals [...] the island also becomes paradise island.
For 1, even if Harvey Island was real, it can't be Paradise because the Rusty Lake hotel was built on it later on and on the globe it's a completely different landmass.

For 2, the tradition of the Eilanders seems much older than just 1-2 more generations. And there were definitely many more cultists according to the paintings.

When Margaret is born or a little older Aldous Vanderboom comes fishing to the lake once and meets Margaret and they fall in love.
Aldous wasn't even born back then. In fact, he was born 3 years after the events of Rusty Lake Paradise. What's more, Roots and Paradise are separated by more than half a century.

After time passes Aldous decides to tell his brother, William about this and taking James they build the Rusty Lake House
Even though I can imagine William and Aldous building the house, James has no way to be a part of that. He seems like a distant relative that happened to inherit the property. He even had to learn alchemy from scratch.

Margaret moves from paradise island and Aldous builds the lake suite (ref in roots and birthday//I located this to be in the woodland hidden by trees)..
You seem to be confused about the "suite" word. It's polysemantic. It can mean a hotel room and a piece of music. So if you implied the Rusty Lake Hotel it was built by Mr. Owl after the Eilanders were reborn and abandoned Paradise. And Rusty Lake Suite in Roots and Birthday is just music related to the

I do happen to think though that Aldous/Mr Crow is Dales grandfather
That is very debatable. There are alternative versions:

1. It was just an asset reuse.
2. Mr. Crow only pretended to be Dale's grandpa inside his memory

skipping some stuff, when Laura is rebirthed rose looks after her and albert calls for rose when Laura is a child and rose returns to the house where Alberts coffin lies and finds notes he written from just before Frank killed him.
That's wrong too. Albert was killed in 1926. Laura was born in 1935. The Past is an altered memory taking place in 1926 and can't represent the original events

Rose uses the cubical device to connect with herself in the future to work together to resurrect Albert
And it was the other way around. Future Rose contacted her past-self 1st

Robert kills himself in the theatre after hearing Laura is leaving him??
Actually, Theatre takes 2 years after Laura left him. In fact, the same year she died. His suicide attempt for for the latter reason.

If you notice when you play the lake there are 2 different endings, one where a green gem is used and laura lives and another with the blue gem and laura dies. Also, I think Paradox occurs the same time as this and in the short film on youtube Laura being actually inside the lake is symbolism of the cabin??.. maybe?
Laura's trip took place in 1969. Paradox is Dale's dream taking place in 1972. They are not directly connected.

[rancid slate]

@azure bay if the Child Lane Station was real, would you say it takes place in the very end of 1939 or at the 40s?

[azure bay]

As for who Dale becomes this also gets confusing but I think he becomes Mr Rabbit
Dale Vandermeer and David Eilander are 2 completely different and unrelated characters. Because exactly, Rabbit came for the pistol. The same pistol his sister killed herself with in the hotel. That's the past life he was reffering to

[azure bay]

It could represent a whole time period. But If I were to pinpoint a single year, I'd go for 1940 because Dale's parents were killed in winter and Laura is dressed for summer

[rancid slate]

Interesting

[still pine]

• The globe in paradox, the mere fact that someone took time to write that in shows that they thought about it. It is a reference nonetheless and is potential.

-The electromagnetic power is fanfiction/idea based on my already knowledge of electromagnetic power and other references of magic-like folklore in the games.

-Harveys Island could be paradise island. Based on that it was Harveys Island first and then the eilanders made it paradise island and then after it became the hotel. yes it was a different landmass, but as you say the map on the globe is not to scale and im using my imagination here.

-In the mill there is a picture on the wall of what seems like aldous and margaret together and for me that linked how the eilanders and vanderbooms share the knowledge of enlightenment and change form

-James is williams nephew, so surely that makes aldous the father of James?

-no, I am fully aware of what a suite is, a suite does not have to be part of a hotel or house, you can have a suite by itself, besides it was my imagination that came that it is in the woods however, the lake suite in fact could be anywhere. The fact though it is in birthday and roots when dale is not supposed to know about rusty lake indicates that someone did.

-yes and ive thought about that but I am also trying to make it fit. and yea I suppose I like what you say also.

-no? ive already taken into account the letter written was 1926 which is also the year albert died in roots, the day albert written the letter for rose to read in the future. Rose though leaves laura and it does appear that the corrupted soul meeting her (taken in consideration there is no metro and it is a representation of Lauras life), rose then goes to resurrect albert.

• well maybe, I put question marks because I was not sure and only assumed that robert killed himself for this reason

[azure bay]

Timeline 1, Dale drinks the red vial and Laura is fishing and Dale watches Laura die (this to me is like torture fate because it is a fate worse than death, all you can do is observe you cannot change the future and she still dies nomatter what you do". In Timeline 2, Dale drinks the blue vial and Laura in the cabin fishes a man out the lake, is this dales dead body?
Timelines in Paradox aren't exactly timelines. It's a loop. Dale goes "back in time" in the end of every chapter. The only caveat is, 2 Dales from neighboring iterations meet each other in the end

[still pine]

There is also the fact that mr rabbit was dressed in dales detective clothing, Laura in paradox says one of us will die and the other enlightened. You see dale walking off with the golden cube to which I understood partially as that is what connects the past and the future like in past within, or maybe what the golden cube does is different. But it is that a black, white and blue cube are used to make the golden cube. Also I would think that dales grandfather is aldous

I dont know what you think I mean by timeline but a timeloop is also vague and I think it should be considered as one.

[rancid slate]

Just as the name of the streets in White Door, the names of the islands in the Globe are merely just references to the Rusty Lake series

Margaret has a very different design to the Old Woman in the Mill. They are clearly not the same
+Margaret is Mrs. Pigeon, which clearly has no affection or any relation to Mr. Crow

[still pine]

Yes they have different designs, in terms of her head scarf but I thought they looked similar enough for that to be margaret. Usually for me, pictures in rusty lake mean something. and I also like to believe it is all linked or can be linked

[rancid slate]

Theres a picture of her there so we know why she is there

[still pine]

no Mrs Pigeon and Mr crow have no connection anywhere ive noticed but do they need to? I assumed they just parted ways after some point

[azure bay]

The globe in paradox, the mere fact that someone took time to write that in shows that they thought about it. It is a reference nonetheless and is potential.
The globe can't be real period. In different chapters it even depicts the same landmarks in different locations. I'm telling you, it's about the character's stories. Just look at them closely with the wiki timeline at hand.

The electromagnetic power is fanfiction/idea based on my already knowledge of electromagnetic power and other references of magic-like folklore in the games.
Ok but why are you so sure that this trope is used in Rusty Lake? It could be any other power source or none whatsoever.

Harveys Island could be paradise island. Based on that it was Harveys Island first and then the eilanders made it paradise island and then after it became the hotel. yes it was a different landmass, but as you say the map on the globe is not to scale and im using my imagination here.
No, you need to choose. Either the globe is real and Harvey's island is not Paradise, or the globe isn't real and so isn't Harvey's island.

In the mill there is a picture on the wall of what seems like aldous and margaret together and for me that linked how the eilanders and vanderbooms share the knowledge of enlightenment and change form
The old lady in The Mill has no way to be Margaret. Margaret became Mrs. Pigeon then she died and became a corrupted soul haunting the lake. Including the time period of The Mill.

James is williams nephew, so surely that makes aldous the father of James?
No, there could be a third brother. And if not, Aldous would be a distant father. Just think about it. Aldous disappeared simultaneously with William's death. James was the only heir. Wouldn't he wonder what happened to his father?

[rancid slate]

Mrs. Pigeon is already corrupted since 1893

She couldnt just appear as a human like nothing happened and even date with Mr. Crow

And die 1 second later

[rancid slate]

For the 1926 thing:
•Rose is wearing her black clothes which she doesnt after 1935
•Laura is nowhere to be seen or even be mentioned, so she doesnt exist in TPW Past. Therefore it clearly is in 1926 and not later

Also, they live in the same house, it wouldnt take more than one day for Rose receive the letter

[azure bay]

no, I am fully aware of what a suite is, a suite does not have to be part of a hotel or house, you can have a suite by itself, besides it was my imagination that came that it is in the woods however, the lake suite in fact could be anywhere.
The lake suite in Roots and Birthday is just a song, it's not about any kind of building near the lake.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suite_(music)

no? ive already taken into account the letter written was 1926 which is also the year albert died in roots, the day albert written the letter for rose to read in the future. Rose though leaves laura and it does appear that the corrupted soul meeting her (taken in consideration there is no metro and it is a representation of Lauras life), rose then goes to resurrect albert.
We're entering the year of the memory in The Future cubical device, it's 1926

[rancid slate]

And for Robert "suicide", he simple did not killed himself

He shot himself

And survived

[still pine]

• I didnt use the wiki timeline. Ive dedicated hours of intensely watching and writing down the events in each game. For me Harveys Island could potentially be real, infact the fact its written for me shows someone has thought about it.

• yes it could I suppose but as again I said it is fanfiction.

• Harvey would exist way before the eilanders, so I dont get what is hard for you to understand?

look im getting annoyed, all im recieving is negative comments..

• sure there could be a third brother, I found it perfectly fine to also assume aldous could be the father since there is not a third brother. Distant father does not even make sense??? what on earth is a distant father? Clearly james left his father and went off (time before he comes to the house he inherits)

[rancid slate]

But as we dont see the hole in his head again, it also is just figurative

Not actually happened

Just a metaphor, if you may

[still pine]

I believe these enlightened hybrids can change form between human, animal and hybrid

[rancid slate]

But Mrs. Pigeon was corrupted

She was not even alive

She died

We only see the corrupted ones changin from souls to animals, but not souls to humans

And Margaret being Mrs. Pigeon is only suggested, not confirmed

[still pine]

I dont understand your counter-argument here

[rancid slate]

Everything leads to a year that Laura wasnt born

[still pine]

but if I one day just said to you come to my lake suite you would think it was a suite by the lake? again it is fanfiction

[azure bay]

here is also the fact that mr rabbit was dressed in dales detective clothing
That's not true. They kinda look similarly but the colors and the body build differ.

Laura in paradox says one of us will die and the other enlightened
Yes, because in the future they will participate in the elixir ritual. Like Caroline and Jakob, like Aldous and William, like James and his dog.

But it is that a black, white and blue cube are used to make the golden cube.
Not exactly. Not every black and white cube would do. The mural and the book, if you look closely, make it clear that only Laura's memories about William's elixir ingredients were able to create the golden cube.

[still pine]

We're entering the year of the memory in The Future cubical device, it's 1926

I know??

[still pine]

and how?

[rancid slate]

Many people shoot themselves in real life and survive too

It is not impossible..

[azure bay]

we have 2 options for Bob's survival specific to RL universe

it either wasn't real

[rancid slate]

1. He is a pro

[azure bay]

1. no, another Owl's illusion

[rancid slate]

2. He used cheats to inf health

[still pine]

idkk I think its clearly the same.

so explain why there is a green vial in the paradox short film then

[rancid slate]

[azure bay]

either no, 2) Owl's magic helped him survive

[still pine]

But it is that a black, white and blue cube are used to make the golden cube.
Not exactly. Not every black and white cube would do. The mural and the book, if you look closely, make it clear that only Laura's memories about William's elixir ingredients were able to create the golden cube.

I believe it is a secret but there is a scene where there is a machine and it takes a black, white and blue cube and it makes a golden cube and dale walks off with it

[still pine]

alright, if you say so but it is in the brain

[azure bay]

that's on the surface level. But the book explains it in details

[rancid slate]

He has a very strong head

So much pain stuck there

Not even a bullet would affect him anymore

[azure bay]

The machine extracts William's elixir memories from Laura's cubes and uses them to create an elixir golden cube

[still pine]

why would mr owl want robert to survive?

[azure bay]

because he needs him at The White Door

it's canon

[still pine]

ive looked at the book in the cave also, theres not much detail there

[azure bay]

we see elixir elements in Laura's cubes on the mural

Then we see Laura's cubes marked with elixir insignia in the book. Just like the resulting golden cube

[still pine]

no but in general why would jakob need memories of laura?

he is already enlightened

[azure bay]

"My time is limited, Dale. I need a successor, the ruler of the lake"

[still pine]

what mural?

[rancid slate]

In Cave, Mr. Owl says "We need the full elixir" or something

[still pine]

is that not implied for dale?

[azure bay]

the thing is, Owl has no sustainable elixir source

Laura's memories are such

So they need them to enlighten Dale

[rancid slate]

Erm, achshually

[still pine]

I suppose but these memories arent traditional chemistry, suppose its more scientific

[azure bay]

dog's shitty extract is not a sustainable source

[rancid slate]

😭

Let the dog be important bro

[azure bay]

Caroline makes her elixir in Paradise exactly like that. She takes her cubes, extracts the icons of the ingredients, makes them react and suddenly Jakob is Owl

[azure bay]

it is important. But it can't save the lake

[still pine]

since she is burned at the stake which in our actual history is what they do for witches, I only assumed its more of a magic ritual

[azure bay]

more or less

there's no division anymore

[still pine]

and what I asked earlier about the 3rd vial in paradox short film?

[azure bay]

the same things are performed with magic, alchemy or science

[azure bay]

Here's the short timeline of Paradox. I'll explain later in details:
ch1 -> ch2 -> the film

[still pine]

I thought those memories were more like flashbacks

[azure bay]

what memories?

[still pine]

the black cubes

[azure bay]

it's complicated

[still pine]

I thought this is what you were referring to?

[azure bay]

these cubes are more real and objective than just "memories"

[still pine]

these cubes hold memories, do they not?!?

[rancid slate]

With "stop them", Mr. Owl meant that by getting the Golden Cube or Dale being enlightened, Dale would be able to defeat the Eilander souls?

[azure bay]

nominally, yes. But in TPW one such memory threw an uno reverse card and started controlling the "reality"

which means, it's a reality too

a different one

but still real

and they are still taken from people's heads

now to Paradox

it's a peculiar structure

It's a dream Dale is seeing while connected to the golden cube machine

a carefully constructed dream

by Owl and Crow

[rancid slate]

It is like a test

Your final challenge

[azure bay]

depends

bacause it's followed by Birthday and Theatre

do we consider them tests?

or rather a reward?

[still pine]

so I believe the corrupted souls are the eilanders and then finding the two cubes was dale

[rancid slate]

I consider them torture

[still pine]

the black and white cubes dale puts into the thing

[rancid slate]

/j

[azure bay]

That's has no way to beat the corrupted souls. Dale needs to do something bigger in the future to achieve that.

[rancid slate]

Yeah

In Cave, they are still wandering and even attack the submarine

[azure bay]

they even attack Dale himself

[still pine]

I am under the idea that it is a memory that mr owl extracted thats why when he is in there again he remembers it but only vaguely. I believed mr owl drugged dale and hit him and put him in there

[azure bay]

It can't be a real memory. Rather a memory of a dream

[still pine]

I was rather just explaining that these were the cubes he put in the machine not a golden cube

[rancid slate]

Case 23 contradicts you

[azure bay]

no, they were a test for Dale. If he's smart enough to be taken to the lake

[still pine]

why?

[rancid slate]

End of Chapter 2

[still pine]

this is what I was replying to

[rancid slate]

Dale turns on the fan and goes eepy mode

[still pine]

I think I misread

[still pine]

I cant even remember youll have to tell me

I have been thorough about this when I wrote it originally

[azure bay]

@still pine Dale doesn't defeat the souls with 2 cubes simply because they are not defeated. Besides, Dale is going to become the most powerful being ever, even stronger than Owl himself

[still pine]

I was not suggesting dale defeats the souls with 2 cubes?

[azure bay]

ok

then may I go on with dicecting Paradox?

[still pine]

sure

[rancid slate]

How does Laura know Harvey's name..

[still pine]

maybe harvey told her?

how does anyone know harveys name

[rancid slate]

People believe he cant speak, only repeat

[still pine]

was that not mr crow in the boat?

[rancid slate]

Yeah thats him

The thing is..

Mini Mr. Crow was inside Harvey's box

How does that affect the lore

Does he has a power of shrimking?

[still pine]

and here certain facial features are the same

[rancid slate]

Hair and body are different

So no

[still pine]

forget about the hair

the body?

[azure bay]

they are drawn by the same artist. Otherwise this makes no sense on any level whatsoever. Drop it please.

[rancid slate]

Yeah

[still pine]

look i just feel everything I say just gets a negative comment from both of you

so actually I want to leave

thanks

[rancid slate]

My theory is that the pigeon from Sorrow Cross is Mrs. Pigeon

[azure bay]

that's nothing personal. It's just that you miss a lot of details which prevents you from learning the truth

I'm trying to help

[still pine]

ive spent nearly a week of intensely watching and rewatching the games specifically to find details, and I started playing these games years ago

[rancid slate]

The truth is that the history didnt even ended and it is still going, so Harvey Island and Margaret being the woman from Mill could actually turn true in future games

Also, Nowhere is a Thief denier

[azure bay]

You can't even imagine how humbled I was after finally coming out with my theories for the 1st time

that's the purpose of discussions

to keep each other's mistakes in check

[rancid slate]

Guys, William in fact is Laura

Mr. Owl just told me

[still pine]

in discussions you agree and disagree. personally ive felt like nothing Ive said has been agreed. correction is fair enough but somethings im fairly adamant on. besides as it was said alot of what ive written is fanfiction, so theyve not happened in the games but ive filled missing links

eg. harveys island

[azure bay]

As I said, Paradox is rather a memory of a dream he just saw.

It's looped in such way. In the end of the dream he finds a memory cube about that very dream and thus goes to the beginning. But inside the dream he may act a bit differently and he has a choice.

On the surface level this choice is represented by 3 vials:
The blue vial turns you corrupt and you kill Laura.
The green vial is a poison that kills you.
The red vial just lets you leave the room.

But on a deeper level it's about who lives or dies.
The blue vial is about Laura dying.
The green vial is about you killing yourself.
The red vial is an attempt to evade the choice. But, as Crow said, "you can't escape the consequences of your actions". Because in one of the future loop iterations you will inevitably pick the blue vial and kill Laura either way. That's why the green vial saves Laura. You just kill the would be killer, e.g. you.

The ultimate expression of the Paradox coise are the 2 secret endings. Dale either accepts the consequences of Laura's death and finds the real exit from the loop. Or dies trying to save it ending all of that for good

[rancid slate]

Actually, the purpose of this channel is to let people theorize and not ruin theories just because X game says otherwise and the person didnt knew that 😭

[azure bay]

That's another problem, fanfiction and theory crafting are different things. You may fill in the gaps however you want but the more suitable place for that would be #🎨｜fan-creations

here we mostly try to understand the original work

[still pine]

If I was to decide what the green vial was I would make it one that changes your form. since no one knows this

it is theories also

is not fan creations for artwork?

[azure bay]

depends

here we discuss the existing lore

it is kinda a form of art

but if I were to post it in fan creations I'd be beaten by the mods /j

[still pine]

theories are usually something that has not been explored yet

[azure bay]

not necessarily

we've got evidence, we gather them together and build upon them

[still pine]

lol you sound like dale

[azure bay]

I'd say, like a theorist

right now I can say how Dale's story will end with high precision and confidence based on many little clues spread througout the series

it's built up for a long time

since late 2015

[still pine]

does it include him becoming the successor of the lake? just to mention what you will go on to say is then fanfiction fan creation

[covert wyvern]

I don't think trying to decide what is "fanction" and what is "sound theory" is worth debating.

[still pine]

alright

[azure bay]

@still pine do you have questions about Paradox and timelines?

[carmine field]

Apparently yes

[floral mauve]

tbh this is one of the few things that Owl confesses that he cant do shi about it (though he can just cant solve it completely)

[vagrant roost]

I'm going down the rabbit hole of why Albert threw Frank in the well and I need to ramble about my thoughts because omg I need to get all of this out.

This all kind of started with me seeing that a lot of different media contains a child falling or being thrown into a well. I was curious why this was so common so I looked into it a bit further. Turns out that back in the day, disabled or children deemed not good enough were sometimes; very rarely though; thrown into wells. Being locked in the attic was more common, but being left for dead in a well was apparently more common than it should've been. Which got me thinking, was that why Albert threw Frank in the well?

Albert very clearly has a facial scar or deformity even before the beehive incident, which might mean that he was disabled in other ways than just facially. Albert is literally the runt of the litter, being the last triplet to be born. We also see how sadistic Albert is, probably a mix of the abuse he endured as a probably disabled child and his innate mental illness.

So let's get to why I think Albert threw Frank in the well specifically. Of course this could be just because he was the first nephew and was given the love that Albert was deprived of, but I think it goes deeper than that.

I've seen lots of people in the fandom headcannon Frank as nonverbal or having some sort of speech impediment; which I TOTALLY agree with; and that got me thinking... This popularly headcannoned nonverbal kid with big dorky glasses was thrown into a well; a way of getting rid of a disabled kid back in the day; by his probably disabled uncle...

Albert threw Frank in that well because he saw that he was treated with the love that he hadn't been given. He saw similar traits in Frank that he himself had and was jealous that he could be loved despite his disability.

(I already posted this on Tumblr so if you've seen it before, that's why. Also, remember this is just my personal theory and I'm not saying that Albert or Frank are canonically disabled, whether that be physically or mentally. I just read some of Albert and Frank's character traits as autistic or neurodivergent and, coming from an autistic person, I really got into as you can tell lol)

[azure bay]

I think people headcanon Frank as silent because there's next to no other way why he wasn't found

I agree that Albert could be jealous of the love he got

I also think that the bigger motive was to hurt Emma

[floral mauve]

we could develop many stories since we got no evidence at all such as Frank got traumatized and cant talk, or Albert constantly threat him with the life of his mother or something

[vagrant roost]

Yeah, which I think is the funnest parts of theories personally. When you don't have a Canon reason for something happening, you can theorize 🙂

[vagrant roost]

I think that was definitely a factor too

[azure bay]

It seems like a big brain moment

He's not only jealous of this love, he found a way to weaponize it against her

[vagrant roost]

EXACTLY, YOU GET IT

[celest plank]

Any theories on who the corrupted one is

[azure bay]

Dale

[celest plank]

thats What I think to

[azure bay]

He's the only corrupted soul in the game

[celest plank]

we got Bob and the Eilanders and possibly laura

[azure bay]

But not in Paradox

[celest plank]

I mean its Just a painting not a part of paradox

[azure bay]

But it is. It's about the room literally in Dale's mind

[celest plank]

all the events occurred before paradox

[celest plank]

yeah that makes sense

[azure bay]

And created for Dale

[celest plank]

What are your Thoughts on laura suïcide Murder?

bro killed 6 people Just to suïcide 😭

[azure bay]

The Cave has unambiguously shown who killed Laura and Underground Blossom unambiguously revealed why

Have you played these games? Rather asking if it's ok to spoil them

@celest plank

[celest plank]

I Just finished the Cave recently

I didnt see who killed her

a corrupted soul killed her is all I know

Which one the Ones we know the one we dont knoe

no idea

[azure bay]

In The Cave there's Laura's memory of her killing herself.

It's the most trustworthy depictuon of what happened

Corrupted souls doing it is rather symbolic

[tribal hedge]

Grandma threw Mr. Crow's key in the web and locked herself with her key.

[celest plank]

killing your self over ptsd 😭 when 6 people died to birth you

[azure bay]

She has no idea

[celest plank]

ik but still its kinda irritating ig She Will Be reborn

[celest plank]

so Laura wasnt supposed to die but died Because the time piece Which would Protect her wss lost

I think

[rancid slate]

I agree with you

Most of the bad things happen after she loses the timepiece

And Rose said that the timpiece was going to protect her

[azure bay]

I'm not sure what the timepiece was supposed to do and did in the end, by losing mother is a big enough trauma

[lost thorn]

I always wondered why Laura screamed if she killed herself?

[floral mauve]

Did she really scream

[celest plank]

I dont think She screamed it was just an illusion that I guess

[celest plank]

if She really did I Mean it hurts to slit your throat

[celest plank]

my theory is that the theif was One of the eilanders who came to get the Protection off Laura Because somehow He/She saw Future and they want to stop laura Because She is important in Connection to dale

A corrupt soul tried to kill laura and also One tried to kill Dave Because laura and Dave are Connected we Know that

Maybe they dont want Creation of golden Cube Which Dave haves

Mr Owl told that Dave would end the corrupt Souls

is it with the help of laura in form of the golden Cube?

just a theory

[celest plank]

maybe we Will get a blue Cube to see What was supposed to happen
and i am like 60℅ sure about this

Because otherwise its just wasted plot

or a plothole

I am not even sure if the blue Cube Changes the past or just the memories of the past

[rancid slate]

Yeah, the Thief shows up 3 times and even has voice lines

[celest plank]

ikr

[rancid slate]

He has potential

[celest plank]

or just a theif

you never Know

its Rusty lake

Why TF this game so underrated

[rancid slate]

You meant like his gender? We see him shirtless

[celest plank]

Where did the Gender Come form 😭

[celest plank]

when did we see him shirtless

[rancid slate]

Soul Street

[rancid slate]

I hope we get an answer soon

[rancid slate]

In the Cave, we use Laura's memories to create the Golden Cube. So it would be opposite, wouldn't?

[celest plank]

yeah right

[celest plank]

the Main point is we Need laura for the golden Cube and dale to use the Cube to Change the Future to end the eilanders

eilanders dont want that

so they Try to kill laura now and then

we even saw mr Rabbit coming for the gun but that isnt really Clear Why

[rancid slate]

Bro really likes guns

[celest plank]

but if mr Rabbit Can Come in a Physical form so Can Another eilander maybe the theif is like mr Rabbit Physical form

not a very Clear theory but with this One the prices of the story start to Make a little sence

[rancid slate]

I just really hope Thief gets another appearence

[celest plank]

ik he is Only in One game

[celest plank]

we got all Horrible people Murders animal thingies suicidals and then we have

Dale

he just exists bro is doing his job 😭

[celest plank]

I Mean who doesnt love to Play with nipples

[floral mauve]

I dont get where this comes from, why does it link to the Eilander, they have no interest in Dale and Laura. CS is living in pain and suffering, it would be a relief for them to end, to countinue the cycle of samsara

[celest plank]

I Mean at this point nothing Links to Anything but in the Mill mr Owl Wrote to mr Grow that dale Will end the corrupt Souls Which May Mean The eilanders possibly

[floral mauve]

ye except they arent Eilanders

[celest plank]

Which is Why they attacked dale while he was in the basement and they even attacked laura but She was Saved by the goat Harvey

[floral mauve]

Eilanders were their past lives

[celest plank]

I just call them eilanders

[floral mauve]

maybe guests cs sounds less confusing?

[celest plank]

CS?

[floral mauve]

corrupted soul

[celest plank]

oh

yeah

mb

I Will use guest CS form now on

[floral mauve]

its not really why they attacked them, they are simply aggressive towards anyone it seems roaming around the lake

otherwise it wont be an issue for Owl

[celest plank]

that makes sence

Where does vincent van goug Come from in the story

😭

[azure bay]

As I said once and will say in the future, black clothes, a moustache and antagonism are not enough to draw an equal sign. You need it to make sense and Nicholas is currently a deer ghost haunting the lake. He simply can't be this man

[azure bay]

You feel pain, you scream

And Laura died painfully

[azure bay]

I'm not sure how a blue cube is connected to wastingg plot

[azure bay]

Blue cubes change nothing. They just control time. It's people who make changes. They need blue cubes only when it's too late and they need to rewind things

[azure bay]

The Eilanders have no agency. They are just mindless hostile souls.

And when they are not (Mr. Rabbit), they aren't trying to undermine Mr. Owl. They are just doing whatever they need to be reborn.

And I don't see why Owl or Dale would want to stop them in such cases. Corrupted souls are more dangerous than reincarnations with no recollection of their past lives.

Chances are, that could even be the end goal regarding them. To appease them and make go on with their new lives using the golden cube or whatever

[azure bay]

I think it's about self consciousness. Laura's soul was just as feral when she 1st manifested but later on she's got a goal and a plan and was able to perform complex tasks

[azure bay]

The problem is, the thief doesn't make sense as of yet.

Humans don't rob parrots, anthro or not.

[azure bay]

Besides being an hommage to RL favorite compatriot artist, I think van Gogh is a IRL reference for Rusty Lake mythology

We know what happened to him and we can use that knowledge and project it onto RL lore

There's also a theory that his mental issues were treated in RL Hotel

Instead of St. Paul

[vagrant roost]

Sometimes times are tough and you have to rob an anthropomorphic parrot man, I get it 🤷‍♀️

If you're going to rob someone, rob someone who has a shiny timepiece in their pocket

[azure bay]

The problems arise when you are unable to see them and have no idea they exist in the 1st place

[vagrant roost]

Wait how would he not be able to see him? That girl in the School St. Level was able to see Harvey and even commented that 'he looked funny'. Same with many other characters in UB. IE: Bob, the ticket lady, the food stand clerk, etc

Tbh I wouldn't be surprised if the robber saw Harvey and was like "Oh, he's either a furry or he's into some weird stuff, I can easily rob this guy"

[floral mauve]

how many of those are real or could simply be metaphor as the entire station

how much is Harvey involved in Laura's life

if its that much then he shouldnt be in a cage or box unless he likes it idk

[vagrant roost]

I can see it being a metaphor because all of the stations are metaphors in a way, but if the question of 'But they can't see Harvey?' Comes up, we have to use the logic of UB

[floral mauve]

which I highly doubt as you can see in Paradise and Mill

[vagrant roost]

In UB, other people can see Harvey, metaphor or not

[floral mauve]

not necessarily about that, its about how much we see is true, we only know some general results, like Laura indeed got bullied, depressed, fall in love and killed herself

we dont know how much is Harvey involved

at all

[vagrant roost]

I'd assume he was Laura's main caretaker after Rose left. Harvey's whole existence seems to be bound by the lake and if some event stops a (possible) future ruler of the lake to meet their destiny, he's going to be the person who has to fix that

But yeah, it's all theory, which this channel is all about lol

[floral mauve]

we dont know Harvey's purpose at all

that sounds more like Owl

even thats uncertain

[vagrant roost]

That's why I said I assume so. We can't be fully sure, but we can make hypotheses

[floral mauve]

I dont think he would care that much about Rose in a human way

more in a funny way

[azure bay]

Considering evidence we've been getting all these years, anthro Harvey in UB is out of nowhere. It's either a part of a metaphor a horribly poor retcon

[floral mauve]

thats an assumption

[vagrant roost]

Assumption and hypothesis go hand in hand, but I don't want to argue about correct words

But back to what I was talking about, sometimes you got to rob a funny looking parrot man!

[azure bay]

Back to what I was saying in response, people are unaware of asuras existence and are unable to see them. Rusty Lake is basically a copy of the real world except it has a secret side of anthro animals, weird cubes with images and dark spooky non-catgirl shadows

[floral mauve]

:((

[vagrant roost]

I'm just confused on where you're getting the fact that people can't see Asuras. I understand everything else about your statement, I'm just confused on that specific part

[azure bay]

Mr. Crow was literally standing behind Albert and other kids. They never acknowledged him

therefore if an asura doesn't want to be seen, they aren't

[vagrant roost]

Harvey may have wanted to be seen though. To help Laura in her journey, he had to be visible to people who could help progress the story

[azure bay]

People would freak out

and, again, Harvey isn't supposed to be an anthro

so much evidence indicating he's a bird

[vagrant roost]

He may have taken a more humanoid form. We aren't certain of what Harvey can do fully

[azure bay]

I think here, a conservative approach is more suitable. So far we've seen only 2 asuras being able to pretend to be humans. And we've seen 10 of them

[vagrant roost]

That girl in the School St. Level even comments that Harvey looks funny, so even if he wasn't in full human form (whether that be because he's not able to or because he just wasn't for some reason) he was atleast human enough for people to see him and be like, 'He's weird looking, but not a freak of nature'

[azure bay]

Underground Blossom isn't to be taken at face value

It does lie

That's not how everything happened

There was no subway

Laura didn't break up with Bob there

She didn't die right away

She actually had time to have a long trip to Rusty Lake

[floral mauve]

Which oddly got forgotten

[vagrant roost]

Oh wait I think I know what your original point was. I thought you were saying that the robbery happened but UB didn't

Nvm

[vagrant roost]

NO BECAUSE WHY DOES EVERYONE FORGET THAT LAURA WENT TO RUSTY LAKE FOR A MENTAL HEALTH BREAK

[azure bay]

I guess it wasn't so crucial for her personal story

[floral mauve]

I was looking forward to see what really happened during the trip

like the true ending and what's Harvey's role

unlike we have to speculate in your video

4 damn combinations

it is absurd

[azure bay]

So was I and I am kinda disappointed. Hope RL redeem themselves eventually

this trip seemed like a big deal

[floral mauve]

it should be

like the final breaking point

for her mental health

UB legit just told us that Laura killed herself cuz mama gone

[azure bay]

to be fair, I may have not be the case. It took another 2 years for her to kick a bucket

[floral mauve]

seasons hints otherwise

a significant turning point

[celest plank]

I think Harvey Has a Human form Which He Stays in (possibly) like mr Crow and mr owl

[azure bay]

The problem is, we have no idea

Do they get it automatically?

[celest plank]

Harvey is a Mystery itself

[azure bay]

Or does it solely depend on their past life look?

[celest plank]

I think its the running out of elixer power that Turns you into human (the Cave)

[azure bay]

Because they used to be humans in their past lives

was Harvey tho?

it's like

[celest plank]

possibly we never know Can mr crow turn into a crow if He does we have a answer

[azure bay]

We've never seen an asura turning into an animal on a whim

[celest plank]

and elixer is supposed to Make you Immortal Why is if running out and Why not running out on the Dog Why is He still Normal 😭😭😭😭

elixer is Too complex

[azure bay]

I think after all these years I've cracked it

[celest plank]

What is if?

*it

[azure bay]

The default power the elixir grants is immortality. I suppose true imoortality but there's a catch

You are immortal AS LONG as the elixir is INSIDE your body

[celest plank]

So the dog shat 💀

Which gave the other Two elixer

that He owned

but What about elixer of mr owl and mr crow ? down the drain? did they not shit for years?

do they even shit?

[azure bay]

Boar does. So I think it's fair for them too

[celest plank]

boar shat right

but He Ate his shit

making him Immortal again

[azure bay]

and apparently that doesn't save from flying axes

[azure bay]

So the only real difference between their immortality and the one of the dog, they've got theirs earlier and have it already worn off

[celest plank]

I Mean technically He still lived curropted

I mean so did people without elixer

[azure bay]

then nobody dies ever

[celest plank]

Too complex

So the dog is possibly dead?

[azure bay]

but seriously, the elixir keeps you on your curent life

[azure bay]

eventually

[celest plank]

RIP THE ONLY GUY WE KNOW FULLY ABOUT

[azure bay]

now to why the dog is still a dog

we observe 3 different effects of the same elixir

the dog is just immortal

Mr. Crow isn't only immortal but also got a cool crow look

he's an asura

a demon or demigod depending on translation

and Dale will become a deva, a god

[celest plank]

SO the dog is let me guess manush?

[azure bay]

so what's the difference between them 3?

[celest plank]

Good evil and neutral

[azure bay]

I think I found a consistent one and I don't think it's karma. As if karma ever mattered in RL, tbh

[celest plank]

I mean karma worked on ielanders

[azure bay]

did it?

[celest plank]

In the gain of immortality they lost life

They killed 2 innocent souls

who killed themselves to save the lake becoming true immortals

[azure bay]

and yet that was the exact thing that made them reborn in a higher form of existence

"please take this sacrifice and enlighten us"

[celest plank]

Karma is i would say not applicable here

Here as in the game

[azure bay]

So it's not karma that defines the elixir effect

I think it's a state of consciousness

The dog is an animal, it's unconscious so it gets the basic package

Aldous is a sentient human, he get's something more

even such pig as Gerard is good enough for such transformation

and Dale has got a unique elevator trip

fixing his traumas and learning valuable lessons

[celest plank]

Why do you think jakob killed the guests ? Revenge ?

[azure bay]

reaching "a higher state of consciousness", as Owl said

so he outdoes everyone

[azure bay]

maybe but the main goal was the white future cube

that's how Owl discovered Dale for the 1st time

[celest plank]

Any idea when the story is ending?

[azure bay]

wdym?

[celest plank]

IT is giving me a headache

Like when do the games end

The complete story

[azure bay]

it's not that simple

we've got several storylines

[celest plank]

Ik its not

[azure bay]

some of them are already over

some are closing to their conclusion

[celest plank]

But we have been getting games consistently for a while with very less story it will take forever

[azure bay]

and some seem to only begin

[celest plank]

All of them will end at one point

Completing the story

[azure bay]

Dale's current story seems to end soon

we're already getting teasers

but I think a new story already began

[celest plank]

Harvey laura albert mr owl and crow

[azure bay]

Owl and Crow seem to end with Dale's ascention

[celest plank]

These mofos wont live wont let live

Even bob

[azure bay]

Laura's story was rather finished back in Seasons

it was only getting more details and context

[celest plank]

Her rebirth?

[azure bay]

I think so

I think we'll get some new pieces about her but it won't be a lot

but Albert

[celest plank]

Harvey is still unknown and mr bat his story will end as a side quest

[azure bay]

he's only warming up

[celest plank]

Bro that mofo is my favourite

[azure bay]

not sure Bat has enough potential. Unless they do a Bob-like side story

[celest plank]

Thats why i said side quest if he gets it good if he doesn't who cares

Albert and harvey are still unknown to this point

Although we saw alberts whole life we know nothing

[azure bay]

Harvey doesn't seem like an interesting center of a story

[celest plank]

Dale does

[azure bay]

He's not a big actor

[azure bay]

and he's about to change his role from a hero to a mentor

[celest plank]

Still a main character he was probably the first immortal

HE existed in the time of jakob

[azure bay]

not sure

could be just a parrot back then with no powers

could be a time travelling parrot

[celest plank]

What kind of game this is imma kill my self fr 😭😭😭😭

Never had this level of complex story like

[azure bay]

I think it's not exactly complex

[celest plank]

Its just very incomplete

[azure bay]

just ambiguous

and we have different precedents and points of reference

[celest plank]

any games like this in your suggetion

[azure bay]

?

[celest plank]

Like any game like rusty lake series you can suggest

[covert wyvern]

That's more of a #🩸｜general-chat / #🛖｜the-cabin question, nothing much to theorise about RL in other games

[celest plank]

[royal notch]

What are your thoughts on the grandfather clock? If we revisit all the moments where it appears, we have some where it seems more than just a classic clock, especially in Paradise. Could it be something more arcane, deriving by the Lake's influence?

[azure bay]

It can't be the same clock all the time

For 1, the clock from Seasons can't be the clock from The Mill

going back and forth between the mill and Laura's house is unlikely

for 2, we've seen the mechanism of the clock in Paradise and the one in Roots

even if the one in Roots isn't exactly as it was depicted Sam would probably notice its organic part

[royal notch]

So it exists a clock-building company in Rusty Lake since at least 1796. Uhm...

[lost thorn]

Didn't Laura teleport in it to the lake? What if the clock is some sort of transportation device as well?

[azure bay]

The clock was there before Laura was teleported

[lost thorn]

I didn't say she transported with the clock

[azure bay]

I see

in that case

[lost thorn]

What if those clocks help mr owl and mr crow transport regular people

But maybe they don't need it if they were able to teleport dale

[azure bay]

Yeah, I wouldn't be sure the clock itself was a teleporter. We've seen her disappear under the ceiling too.

[lost thorn]

I don't know it feels interconnected somehow
The typewriter mentioning what's going on in real time in the mill

[azure bay]

I don't think it was in real time

[lost thorn]

It was

[azure bay]

the old man never left the mill

[lost thorn]

The numbers appeared from the sky
That's what the typewriter said

[azure bay]

they appeared after Dale was teleported

[lost thorn]

It mentioned a man walking
It could very well me mr owl or a random rusty lake resident

They do exist and they do go out near the lake
Just like the man who goes fishing

[azure bay]

that has to be Crow. The iconic hat of the boat man who is Mr. Crow under the context of Case 23

[lost thorn]

Yes but time in the lake is different
The events of the mill span at least 2 years

Even if the timeline was a strict linear progression and not all muzzled and circular, that would indicate the typewriter was foreshadowing something which is a time related affair

[azure bay]

I'd rather say, "the time stopped". But it's not twisted like a pretzel as you claim

there's still a strict order of events

[lost thorn]

Maybe not
But time is irrational there
Especially underneath the lake

[azure bay]

underneath the lake is a diffeerent story

it's an entirely different dimension

please, don't mix it up with the surface

the story on Dale's board is likely someone's testimony

of a person who's been at the lake some time in the past

maybe Dale found it in a library or smth

it doesn't have to be the same numbers

[lost thorn]

I did not
I mentioned that time there is especially worse
That doesn't mean time on the surface is excluded

[azure bay]

I think it likely does because the surface is like a portal to a different world

you'd expect a land mass under Paradise. But in reality it's like floating over the trees

[lost thorn]

Whatever the reason maybe

It's factual that time in the mill is at least different

Maybe not as bad as the lake itself
But it's affected

[azure bay]

I'm not sure it's the lake

normal people would notice that

it's not exactly deserted

I'd rather bet on Mr. Owl being desperate with his limited time

you see

let's stick to Occam's razor

the most simple explanation is the most likely

for one, the time being slown down but still being linear is more simple than the events happenning out of order

[royal notch]

Perhaps only the mill suffers this slowness because of the constant water passage.

[azure bay]

for two, that paper being just a story is waaaaaaaaaay more simple than a depiction of The Mill in real time

[lost thorn]

Sorry I'll have to continue my rusty lake untold session 🙏

[azure bay]

have a good time

[lost thorn]

Thanks for understanding

[rancid slate]

Guys

Clearly

The Thief is a mercenary

And loves stealing clocks

She stole Laura's clock and gave it to Mr. Crow

Like

Clearly

Thats the online possible solution

Everything leads to that

[azure bay]

where does Mr. Crow come from and where he goes next before we finally retreat the timepiece?

[rancid slate]

Uuuuhhhh

[lost thorn]

I have a small theory about rusty lake Untold

What if ||we the players are part of the rusty lake universe and the entire game is just our own version of Dale's Paradox? The game always ends on a loop, just like cube escape paradox, what if that means we're strapped in a machine too||

||I think it's fair to have thought that the player is Rose herself, but I doubt that as in the ending sequence we learn that in real time there's three other people besides us (the other players) experiencing the same loop with us||

[azure bay]

It looks like ||Paradox|| but it's unlikely to be ||Paradox||

||Paradox|| is an artificial construct, the lab is a real location

||Paradox|| clearly has a purpose and guidance

on Owl's and Crow's behalf

RLU: The Lab lacks at least one of these things

[lost thorn]

Yes but ||Paradox also incorporated real locations other than the green room, the forest for example is a real location, back to rusty lake untold, what if Rose Vanderboom managed to successfully build a machine that recreates the same effect, it wouldn't be the first time the Vanderbooms come up with something that Owl and Crow are capable of||

||I don't know whether it's on purpose or not, but I've noticed a pattern and that's a theme of simplicity, the first issue is always more difficult but then it becomes easier the next time it happens||
||Jacob had to solve plagues and gather memories and be burned alive to be enlightened, but Aldous only needs to drink an elixir. Ten people had to have something sacrificed in order for William's soul to come back, Albert only needed hias tooth, his flesh and his blood. Mr owl needed to prepare a detective and Laura for years in order to extract the memories and create the gold cube, Albert does that in a far easier manner||

[azure bay]

||Yes, Paradox supposedly incorporates some real locations but the focus is the unreal one + the cube that comes out of nowhere in the end.

In RLU there's only a real location and The Lab cube's origin is clear and simple. We see how it's excracted.

Back to Occam's razor, The Lab works just fine without making it an artificial machine-induced dream. It's simply unnecessary.

And speaking of Rose, if she'd built such a machine we'd probably get a hint avout it in her digital journal. Instead we see her still thinking of Laura and producing cubes. A Paradox dream machine siply sevres her no good for her goals.

On another note, I'm afraid, you are mistaken about "the simplicity" theme. Because you seemingly misunderstand what's really happenning in each case you've evoked.

What the Eilanders did wasn't about Jakob's ascension. It was a different ritual with different purposes and Jokob was supposed to stay dead. It was Coraline who invented the elixir and outsmarted everyone by saving Jakob's soul at the last moment. Her way was still a bit exotic but it's not because she couldn't do like Aldous. The brothers were likely using her lost knowledge after all. It was just her plan that required such a complexity.

William and Albert also had different goals: one wanted to simply live, the other wanted to preserve his body and personality. And I wouldn't say Albert's got it easier. Creating cubical devices and convincing one's past-selves to cooperate isn't exactly simple.

And finally Owl could create the golden cube right from Laura's birth. All he needed were William's elixir memories inside Laura's cubes. No preparations, no nothing. The thing is, the golden cube isn't his endgoal, it's a mean to create his successor. That's why he was preparing Dale and Laura.

And again, saying that Albert has got his cube easier is underappreciating the effort he and Rose put into their very complex plan.||

[lost thorn]

||I.. See your point, but doesn't Laura's death trigger the release of the cube in paradox? How would you explain the loop that happens at the end of rusty lake untold?
Here's my interpretation to why the loop happens if RLU:lab incident is real and I don't know if you'll agree or not, what if unlike paradox, the player isn't being pulled back to the start of the events, but rather the player made a link to the cube that had his recently extracted memory of being trapped inside the room, and he wasn't being sucked in literally, more like he is making a connection with the cube, just like how Nicholas was making that connection before David injured him, maybe the player is doing the same and the moment he's interrupted outside the cube the loop ends||

[lost thorn]

||I see what you mean in all the examples
But I still think that Mr owl went to more hoops to get the golden cube, and planned way longer than Albert ever did, he had to gamble on Laura getting depressed and had mr crow call her occasionally, he had her face a traumatic incident in the cabin in the lake, he had to have her take her own life and then count on dale to indirectly help by teleporting her
Where she gets her memories extracted by mr crow, then they undergo a long chase where mr owl captures her and almost loses his life if mr crow wasn't there to stabilize the pressure into his helmet, and then they have to capture those three cubes inside the lake and put it in a complex machine to do it
That plan and the preparations took about two lifetines
Meanwhile Rose and Albert's plan took one generation only and only focused on creating two devices||

[lost thorn]

||also I think I got the answer to my first question
The black cube that appears out of nowhere after killing Laura shouldn't belong to dale but rather to Laura, and yet it hosts Dale's memories which means the loop is artificial because that black cube is illogical, it shouldn't already have Dale's recent memories especially not when we don't see his memories getting extracted, the cube isn't as real as the one the player gets from inside the machine therfore its properties are different||
Would you agree with that?

[azure bay]

I really doubt Owl wanted Laura's death. One of his doctors seemed to sincerely want to help her. I'd say, Laura's death was rather a setback Owl had to plan around.

Speaking of the loop in RLU, It doesn't seem we have enough evidence to say anything for sure. I wouldn't even be sure the authors themselves thought through what happened.

What I can assume, there was some kind of an accident, considering the lack of electricity and Albert on loose. Also I think the protagonists had their older memories removed vefore the loop has started.

Maybe there was some kind of experiment leaving them with no memories. Then there was the accident, then they woke up and had the 1st iteraion of the loop ending up in the chamber abd extracting the only memory they had - the newly formed one.

I agree that physically the protagonists are stuck inside the extraction chamber with the cube but their minds are inside it. Since The Past Within I consider cubes the timelines just as real as the world outside which has to be a cube too. So I think every loop iteration is real leaving behind comatose bodies of the protagonists while their minds merge with yet another version of them.

[azure bay]

1. Albert and Rose could have planned for even longer. She's been crafting her cubical device for up to 60 years

2. As I said, Owl was rather interested in Laura living. The source of her depression was out of his control and his people were doing everything to help her for no result.

3. Mr. Crow didn't call Laura if you mean Seasons. It was her future-self. Yes, she repeated some of Crow's phrases but when the voice says to "find [them] in the past" we find Laura.

4. We don't know much what was really about Laura's trip to The Lake (and I'm bitter about it) and objectively it could be just another desperate attempt to relieve her trauma.

5. But all aside, Owl and Crow could have planned all of that of even in a shorter time than Albert and Rose did. They seem to have started the preparations for a new day of the lake back in 1935 and seem to have started acting in 1966 (when he gave young Dale a watch for the blue cube machine).

And another thing is, the golden cube, just as I said, wasn't the endgoal. The endgoal is on a muuuuch bigger scale. And still it took less time to perform. Than Albert's plan.

[rancid slate]

Theory: The Thief robbed a watch and gave it to Mr. Owl

It all makes sense now

[azure bay]

tell me more

[shrewd kernel]

Uh, what exactly is falling into place. Are you saying that the watch you received at your birthday from an Owl is a chronometer?

[rancid slate]

No..?

It looks like a regular watch to me

[shrewd kernel]

Then I don't quite understand. tell me more

[shrewd kernel]

I just met someone who assumed something similar, so I asked in advance

[rancid slate]

Its kinda a joke theory

The Thief says that he likes the timepiece. You could imagine that he doesnt like just the timepiece, but clocks in general (He probably just stole the timepiece cuz it looks golden and therefore could give him a lot of money)
But.. since he doesn't sell the timepiece after years, he seems to have some type of attachment to it

First, I thought about the Thief stealing the clock from the Vanderboom/Laura's house

To justify its appearence in the Mill

But now, I thought about the Thief stealing someone's watch

Just because the year is 1966

We dont know exactly which year Laura and Bob started dating

Since theres no evidence of Bob in 1964, I think its safe to say most people agree that they started dating in a year between 1964-1969

Which 1966 fits

But ofc, theres nothing connected to 1966, neither to the poor Thief

Besides the fact that its a watch

[azure bay]

What evidence of Bob in 1964?

[rancid slate]

Oh

*no evidence

[lost thorn]

Oh you do agree!
I think the link can be broken however if the connection was somehow severed but that's just me

[azure bay]

I'm not sure. The only case of a mind losing connection to its body outside a cube was The Past Within. It did involve recursive cubes but it was much more than that.

The trick was 2 minds entering the opposite cube and thus body simultaniously.

Both Roses focused on their respective cubes and effectively switched bodies that were still concentrating on these cubes. The minds were funnelling back and forth faster and faster until they merged together. I think that was the moment the link was broken.

Speaking of Paradox or something similar I wouldn't be so sure. I suppose that if there was something to change inside or outside all cubes they'd be able to send all the minds back by domino effect. Like they detach from the minds of the rightful body owners and go 1 cube out. Then they detach again leaving another set of bodies conscious. And so on and so forth until they returb to their original bodies.

[lost thorn]

What about Nicholas?

[azure bay]

What about Nicolas?

[lost thorn]

His link to the cube was severed when he got attacked

He was so focused he didn't address Jacob

[azure bay]

He somewhat did

[lost thorn]

He was talking to himself

"must find her memories"

[azure bay]

Not entirely sure

Could be a way to say "don't bother me"

[lost thorn]

Either way

His face looked weird

He surely wasn't fully there

[azure bay]

Yes, however I'm not sure how deep he went

Not sure he could

We don't really know if you can really sync with your other-self in someone else's cube

It didn't look so for Jakob in Paradise

But that could be just an artistic choice

[lost thorn]

He didn't notice David coming

[lost thorn]

Okay but the cube isn't Dale's in paradox
Or do we chalk it up to artificial machine?

[azure bay]

It has to be Dale's

1. He's the only person there

2. We've never seen it extracted from Laura for sure

[lost thorn]

But it doesn't come from dale

[azure bay]

And still, he's the only acting person there

I think a memory about his dream was intentionnaly hidden in the end of that dream

Hmmm

Now I notice an inconsistency

In Best Kept Memory people were paying to dispose of their painful memories. To forget them. And BKM did it by extraction

But in RLU the cube extraction doesn't make the crew forget what they've been through

[rancid slate]

Doesnt the beggining says u dont rememeber or recognize where you are?

[azure bay]

Memory sync amnesia isn't the same thing as memory extraction amnesia

I mean that memories extracted from your head are meant to be lost

and when you enter those memory cubes you forget what you were doing outside

[minor remnant]

@hushed bronze thank you for the timeline videos. been a fan of the games forever but recently have been trying to connect the timeline together and your videos are very well made and made understanding it simple and streamlined. thank you again 😄

[hushed bronze]

Oh thank you! 😊

[wary wedge]

Question: in rusty lake:paradise, did they just invite jakob eilander (islander) to just be like a lineage to sacrifice the memories? (I think this is a theory 🙏🙏)

[honest brook]

Sometimes I also interpret that maybe they just got Jakob to come to the island just to sacrifice him

[azure bay]

@honest brook @wary wedge yep, that's their goal. Live through plagues, sacrifice their firstborn on a special day so they become enlightened

[leaden rain]

Did they actually become englightened after the sacrifice or is it your assumption?

[honest brook]

i think they did, my guess is they became the guests we see in Hotel

[leaden rain]

Oh yeah according to that they became enlightened

Thx

[azure bay]

It's a veeeeeeery safe guess

[inner nova]

Did Rose come from a bean?

[azure bay]

it was a human egg cell

[inner nova]

Aaaaaah, ok that makes sense.
I assume Ida’s?

[azure bay]

yep

[carmine field]

rose vanderbean

Kinda bizarre to think that Albert extracted the egg from Ida's corpse

[rancid slate]

Do you think he put his hand there or he openned her..

[carmine field]

💀

I wonder what Rose's view is on her father's deeds

[rancid slate]

She is as crazy as her parents

[carmine field]

At least she helped Frank get back on his feet

[azure bay]

The devs said she didn't know who her mother was

[carmine field]

But The Past Within

......

[azure bay]

Still

A woman that broke his heart

And the greatest creation with no details

[carmine field]

Now that you say it that way, maybe

[rancid slate]

One thing I noticed is that Frank used to have glasses and now je just doesnt lol

[carmine field]

Adult Frank with glasses would look cool tbh

[sudden dust]

since theres a photograph of ida with her name in tpw and rose digs up graves with names in roots she might’ve made a connection at some point

[lunar axle]

Who abandons their 10 years old child just to fulfill the wish of their father from beyond the grave.

[azure bay]

Nah. There's no guarantee.

Besides, digging graves makes no sense. Or combining a skeleton makes no sense.

Something of that didn't happen

[rancid slate]

Im pretty sure it did happen

Rose told me

[azure bay]

Just think about it. Digging out bones of different individuals to build a skeleton jigsaw puzzle only so it opens its mouth to reveal a timepiece

[rancid slate]

👽

Seems legit

[azure bay]

¯⁠\⁠\_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

[rancid harness]

Will the Vanderboom family line stop with laura?

[azure bay]

I think that depends on a timeline

Laura was resurrected in Seasons but she can't cancel out Dale's story arc

[rancid harness]

Ahh noted

[lunar axle]

Laura is a Schrodinger's cat. Both dead and alive.

[wheat ore]

Schrödinger's harvey ( definetely commited vehicular manslaughter )

[tribal hedge]

Rusty Lake is a cool surreal franchise, you should try it.

[azure bay]

Yep, it's surreal and highly symbolic. You often cannot take it literally and use the information it gives raw to extrapolate speculations

[tribal hedge]

Any evidence it is the case here?

[azure bay]

Why the heck would a buried skeleton open its mouth only when it's assembled? What's more, assembled using bones dug out all around the graveyard?

[tribal hedge]

Because if anything is fantastical in Rusty Lake, it's the timepiece?

[azure bay]

That's just a "magic of gaps" argument

[tribal hedge]

surreal

[azure bay]

to me it rather looks like a piece of gameplay

a funny puzzle that adds nothing to the lore

surreal

but not to be taken at face value

I can imagine a timepiece being hidden inside a skeleton

I can imagine Rose digging it out

but for real

where are the missing bones?

why aren't they there?

how does Rose know what to do?

I think it's just easier to assume that the timepiece skeleton was more or less complete when Rose found it

and she had no problem to retrieve the treasure

and thus she didn't need to desecrate the rest of the graveyard

especially the people she buried herself and knew for sure they could not have the treasure

[rancid slate]

If Rusty Lake is just a normal world Im leaving this community

[azure bay]

it's not but it can't work on a game logic

Paradox is a good reference

the same story is told differently under different formats

[tribal hedge]

Rusty Lake is under no obligation to make everything make sense to you. Assuming something because you want it simple is illogical.

[azure bay]

As I said, Paradox is a good example of gameplay not being the lore

In the movie it's simple

in the game there are many things to keep the player busy

and even to show them the right ending at the right time

[tribal hedge]

Paradox is a simulation.

[azure bay]

and so?

[tribal hedge]

What's bizarre is easiest explained of all games: it's a simulation.

[azure bay]

it's not so much about the bizarre but about the themes and conventions of different forms of media

Paradox has confessed that a game may lie to us

one of the themes of Paradox is a choice

on a basic level it's the choice of the vial

but in the game we don't see that choice

it's been made by the devs for us

[tribal hedge]

When?

[azure bay]

I'm explaining it right now

in the game the devs always give us a certain vial they want us to see the effect of

but in the movie all 3 vials are always available

even in the secret clip we get after unlocking the green vial ending

and only then the notion of choice becomes obvious

I suppose the movie has its lies too

it's just another form of media with its limitations

(especially considering how it's all depicted in the comic book)

but I'm certain that it tells the truth about the vials and the game lies

another example

We have 3 games depicting the same location with the same rooms

The Lab in The Past Within, Underground Blossom and RL Untold

and every time we see it with a different layout

at least 2 of them aren't telling the truth

and I think it's neither

There's just a lab with some undefined layout and each game simply depicts this location according to its needs

The gameplay locally defines the observed reality

And I think that's the case almost everywhere

Gameplay, symbols, narrative tricks

sometimes the surreal parts are real

[tribal hedge]

They may have described different parts of the lab lol.

[azure bay]

dude, they've shown the same chemical lab and the same memory extraction room differently each time

[tribal hedge]

The same?

[azure bay]

the same

[tribal hedge]

I expected an answer proof lol.

[azure bay]

it looks the same, it features the same items, it does the same things. Saying that they are somehow different are excuses and an unnecessary mental gymnastics

Okkam's razor

[tribal hedge]

You said they look different lol.

[azure bay]

They are depicted differently

[tribal hedge]

How do you know?

[azure bay]

in TPW the chemical lab is cramped together with a ton of other stuff. In fact that room combines several of them from Underground Blossom

[tribal hedge]

Yes, items moved between rooms.

[azure bay]

no, because there's no way you can cary other heavy machinery around that easily

and no need

[tribal hedge]

You absolutely can lol. Harder equipment is carried daily.

How do you think it got there beginning?

[azure bay]

it was built there where it's needed. There's no need to move it elsewhere

as long as it's accessible

[tribal hedge]

An office can't forge steel lol.

Assemble on large scale.