mess-hall

[arctic rampart]

T17 when HLL players ask for an update: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdBTEMOM0y4

[silk igloo]

They should make MG players even more mad by limiting MG34 and MG42 ammo to their real drum values and having every MG except the 1919 be shoulder fired, together with free MG emplacements filling their old role of locking down areas.

Also let people choose between hipfire bracing and shoulder firing.

[full sky]

The Big question is when im aloowed to Mount on a truck 😄

Didnt try this in Pte 😄

[worthy charm]

I can already hear the angry crowd forming.

[analog apex]

I did - it was not possible. It was one of the things I reported too in the feedback - if not mounting on the alive trucks, then they should make it work at least on the destroyed wreckages of vehicles that were usable before and not part of the map assets.

the same goes for the unloaded truck big supply box - didn't allow bipodding either sadly

[silk igloo]

Perhaps they could make it possible at the flip of a switch, but on a moving vehicle it'd desync terribly or something. On top of looking very goofy to have 6 MGs on top of the canvas of a supply truck

[analog apex]

one thing I noticed on Omaha beach though - as US MG when I bipodded somewhere (in EXPLORE mode), the MG was shaking/flickering a bit for a while each time after bipodding. I wanted to check if it is weapon related, but the EXPLORE mode doesn't allow playing as Axis yet.

[full sky]

But it would be funny to Mount on a driving Truck between the enemys and shooting 😄

[silk igloo]

Ah, that's because the practice mode and explore is something different from the running game. If you look at yourself moving on the map, you'll notice how "griddy" it is

[analog apex]

that would be honestly feature for all the money! would take it

[analog apex]

maybe but it was OK when I was with Soviet MG for instance

I believe it was good with Lewis gun too

anyway, thx to the EXPLORE mode, we can check and see any time now even when PTE servers are down

[analog apex]

Imagine the Soviet truck, which is the only one where we can stand inside it at the back (and not in the air)... if players in there would deploy like 5 MGs in every direction 😄

[full sky]

Did anyone was online to a Time when the Pte server were seedet? Any time i looked in on Pte no one was online

[analog apex]

there were 3 servers online at all times during the PTE window, but only one of them was (barely) populated - was just about 15 people there every time

[full sky]

Didnt seee them on my testing Times 😄

[analog apex]

they were online from Friday till Monday pretty much

but no matter when I looked, they were empty or almsot empty

the map rotation wasn't plausible (just Kharkov and Mortain) and the presence of the EXPLORE mode impacted it likely too

[full sky]

Sooo maybe alot of people just using explore mode but the numbers of People who are Playing Pte would be Interesting

[worthy charm]

It was empty when I looked as well. Hopefully more will play when they host the new gamemode.

[analog apex]

if it's going to be Brecourt, I will definitelly hop in online

[wise dirge]

Hello chat what's going on

[full sky]

Hopefully testing a new Gamemode without Players would be bad

[analog apex]

I just pray the gamemode won't be as it was showed in that inglorious U15 trailer. Keep moving, we have taken the German OP! xD

[silk igloo]

i hope the area is as small as it looks like.

[analog apex]

honestly, imo such small area should have been set for the SKIRMISH, but OBJECTIVE I expected to be larger than it seemed on the trailer

[silk igloo]

It's probably the same size as skirmish. It might not have any tanks, so a small map would become a problem

https://tenor.com/view/we-dont-know-dont-know-bird-clueless-gif-12587825

[finite berry]

To be fair, machine guns would rarely overheat with how they're played in HLL

[full sky]

Personaly i dont like this small Maps when i want to rush on small Maps i can Play other shooters. The Big Maps and the Taktik thing is what makes Hell great for me.

But yes i see for smaller communitys it could be a good thing 🙂

[silk igloo]

Cant have much for tactics if the easiest and most efficient way is to run or sneak past the enemy and spawn behind them. You ever played wargame or steel division series? That's how it should be in HLL too.

[analog apex]

I see we have some preferences in common after all. 🙂

[analog apex]

How was it in those games?

[worthy charm]

"Realisticly" yes, but it would be a way to apeace the people who cry are unhappy about the mg42 on open maps.

[analog apex]

MG42 is probably the only MG that rly needs the overheating... could be possible with other MGs too but would be hard to achieve it with them I believe

[finite berry]

Add actual sway, make MGs more inaccurate when not bipoded and make a 50 rounds drum not magically hold 250 rounds

[worthy charm]

I dont like the 50 shot drums, not with one of the fastest shooting weopons in the game.

[finite berry]

Sounds like a skill issue :D

[analog apex]

they shouldn't be made inaccurate on purpose just because

[finite berry]

Get used to the fact that you can't just spam and must conserve your ammo

[full sky]

Dont get me Wrong but with a good defence something like this cant Happen taktiks in Hell are more Complex like just spawn behind the enemy lines 😄

[finite berry]

I meant in regards to weapon handling when not bipoded

[silk igloo]

I haven't played them too much, but you dont simply skip the enemy. If they leave a good position for you to abuse, then you take it and use it to punish the enemy. On open maps HLL approaches this, when you can lay out a lot of damage with MGs and AT guns if the enemy doesn't take that sweet spot first

[analog apex]

aah right, agreed then. But the bracing while standing already has a pretty big spread.

[finite berry]

Sorry, worded it weirdly 😄

[analog apex]

there is no ADS mode when standing / non bipodded

[finite berry]

Yeah, but the MG still is too accurate then

That's what I meant

[analog apex]

meanwhile in HLL... "I am sending the airhead behind the enemy point"

[wintry thistle]

Making the other side rage quit?

[finite berry]

In Squad 44, you can also fire without bipoding, but the MG becomes (nearly) uncontrollable then and it forces you to fire short, controlled bursts. That's how an MG should handle at best imo

[analog apex]

Problems of HLL's gunplay however is that the weapons (MGs and nonMGs alike) have no any kind of uncontrollable sway. And that there is no sway or effect when being suppressed. That makes the MG just spray and pray while it being still super accurate the same as the people it suppresses in turn.

[finite berry]

And that must change imo if you truly wanna "fix" MGs

[full sky]

But how hard do you want to get the Mg out of Meta ? When you cant shoot at nerby enemyes or Mount on the good positions. Mg isnt a good thing to play.

Pscht Sam 😄 i know 😄

[analog apex]

I mentioned it couple of times already - I would start adding FOV change as additional effect to the suppression. The more suppressed we are, the higher FOV our 1st person camera would slowly have (up to a pretty wide view) - also including when inside the ADS mode. Imagine you would be heavilly suppressed and when ADSing, there would be no zoom (it could be actually even zoomed-OUT) until the effect slowly wears off. It's the strong ADS zoom that makes everybody a sniper in HLL.

[finite berry]

You still can, you are just not laser-accurate. Naturally, that would also require a suppression overhaul so that not just your camera, but your actual aim is affected.

[silk igloo]

I think I played multiplayer once or twice in all three games I have and lost every time

[real parrot]

Suppression should also affect the precision on the weapon, no WW2 soldier would be able to hit accurate shoots at 150 meters while taking 50g of lead and bleeding.

Precision in this game is unreasonably high, like every soldier is a perfect shoot.

[finite berry]

Exactly

[full sky]

Maybe my Hip fire Mgs skills are pretty Bad but the Mgs on Hip fire are not laser accurate in my vision yes Mg 42 is better than Browning in Hipfire but on more than 10 meters it wouldnt be accurate and i thing when im firing a real Hipfire Mg in Person on 10 meters i would hit a target 😄

Another point is that aming with the Hipfire Mg takes time so every shooter is way faster in Aming and Killing than you are with the Mg.

Not talking about those People without aim when its Possible to lay down on the ground Mount the Mg and kill them 😄

[analog apex]

that would be ensured if the ADS had no zoom when heavilly suppressed - it's more difficult to shoot accuratly on large distances without the zoom

despite the gun still shoots where we aim - it's the aiming that gets harder with it

[real parrot]

I play with max FOV already, if the FOV gets higher I'll be able to see behind me lol

[finite berry]

Not laser-accurate, but MGs are too accurate when fired without bipods.

[analog apex]

only the very first shots are... but there is nothing that could prevent that and keep it realistic

even if you would make the bracing MG fire even more inaccurate, the 1st few shots will always be accurate - they have to

[full sky]

Playing everything with 60Pov even as an shooter 😄

[real parrot]

I always put the max FOV I can get in every game

[analog apex]

sniper zoom right there, but depending on the wide-ness of the monitor ofc

[nova pivot]

Try the DP

That thing IS a hipfire monsters

[real parrot]

But what about hip firing a 75mm cannon, that's a real no-scope

[nova pivot]

I want to hipfire AT rifles 🥺

[full sky]

Im not a big fan of the Russian Mg but yeah this one is Crazy 😄

But when you Bring it up the Britan Mg is trash in my View the Big Metal thing blocks every view and you have to Aim slidely Left to hit a target

[nova pivot]

The evidence has been erased, nothing has happened here.

[real parrot]

Hear me out, hip fire bombing runs

[past vortex]

*360 no-scope

[analog apex]

I don't know why but I dislike it too (plate magazine or too few rounds? idk). But when taking it and actually using it, I still find it great and effective. Just the initial prejudice against it lol...

[past vortex]

it has no hipfire dispersion, clearly a bug

[nova pivot]

That's why I love it

It's the closest thing to the STG that the Russians have.

[analog apex]

maybe because it fires so slow

[past vortex]

yea it should have less
but it has NONE :}

if you practice a bit you can hipfire snipe :D

[full sky]

Its good makes a lot of Damage in my Vision it needs some more Rounds in a magazin but its ok

[nova pivot]

It is a weapon to move, it is not as static as the Browning

[analog apex]

well, the devs already showed us extended clip for M1 Garand in U15 trailer, maybe we can get a double magazine for DP too 😄 (was a bug there)

[past vortex]

t24 when

[full sky]

That would maybe balance the Dp to the Mg 42 😄

[analog apex]

but no buffs or nerfs would make the German MGs bad... they were the best and are the best

nice sights too

unlike Lewis gun xD

or god forbid Bren gun

[past vortex]

they could offset the mg42 sights a bit, just so

[finite berry]

It's sad that the Bren's biggest advantage simply doesn't exist in a video game

[full sky]

The Lewis Gun sight needs to be cut in Half 😄 no one needs this long Metal bar in his face 😄

[nova pivot]

I like long bars in my face, not metal ones though

[full sky]

Oookay 😄

But the actual Point is : Wehre is the Dev Brief and hopefully Ben will write something about the Mg discussion best he mention Sam and Me 😄

[wintry thistle]

In my experience infantry fights are determined by who has the better long/short range arsenal. Or just dies to tanks and arty

[analog apex]

he could use even just one word, to describe both of us at a time pretty accurately xD

[full sky]

Which word do you mean? 😄

[analog apex]

idk... rioters, troublemakers... something like that

I was hoping it would get out 12:00 like the last time, hopefully it's its size that makes it slower

[full sky]

I like Rioters maybe something i like: "We saw the Riots on our Discords please dont Fight over a topic but please discuss it nicely" 😄

[analog apex]

oh man we were so stupid 😄

in any case even one or two sentences about the initial MG feedback in the briefing would be great to see

[full sky]

I dont know if stupid is the right word we are just believe in what we thing about this Update and maybe a litte In Germany we call it " Dickköpfig" i think the best English translation is " We are breaking through Walls with our Heads" 😄

Yes i hope something over the Mg Feedback is a Part of the Dev Brief because there are hopefully more Feedbacks than us 😄

[analog apex]

we have such a word for it in Slowakei too, pretty much of the same literal translation as the German word is

"tvrdohlavý" (hardheaded/solidheaded)

[full sky]

Haha Nice 😄

[analog apex]

yep, indeed we are heh

[silk igloo]

That's how it should be in HLL, right? Instead of spawn cheese.

[wind shore]

Does the guy in the new HLL loading screen w/ Torbruk kinda look like Jack Black? Or is that just me 😭

[analog apex]

here we go!

[deft slate]

Can we join the events if we have hll from epic?

Or steam only?

[fluid pawn]

https://tenor.com/view/beef-dinner-chicken-gif-14217540

[fluid pawn]

PTEs (Public Testing Environment) are currently only available on Steam. This is because on Steam we are able to have a separate application where we can host in-development playtests for the community to give us feedback.

Unfortunately it's not so easy on console or Epic, however we do hope to come up with a solution in the future so that more players can join them 🙂

[deft slate]

Oh ok bro thanks!!

[solar slate]

we bringing counter strike to hell let loose 🗣️

[fluid pawn]

Looking forward to getting your feedback on this one 🙂

[analog apex]

No worries we will try make something special with Kröte 😄 .

[arctic rampart]

What's the point of the el alamein image with the big orange rectangle?

It shows up twice

[analog apex]

I was about to ask that too...

[arctic rampart]

I would love to post which one, but oh yeah, I can't post any images in here

[analog apex]

you can post it in some channel, paste link here and the image will render here

[fluid pawn]

Which image you refering to?

[solar slate]

i love actual gameplay/gamemode experiments btw instead of the offensive-lite we got before

[arctic rampart]

Check off-topic

[analog apex]

https://i.imgur.com/G6kXvYM.png

[solar slate]

only being able to destroy planes with TNT is conceptually pretty silly in a game with so many powerful explosives but I can suspend my disbelief

[arctic rampart]

First thing in my mind is how insanely easy it would be to defend from afar

[fluid pawn]

THat's been updated. Thanks for the heads up!

[solar slate]

yea i think you'd have to have tanks literally roll up on it or complete superiority coz the planes are so out in the open

[hardy oasis]

But it only takes one guy with a bomb to slip through

[solar slate]

but that seems fun to me tbh

the props could be something other than planes, a hardened structure or something

[arctic rampart]

I'm reading it on the steam post, didn't notice any changes

[analog apex]

yep, just checked it as well

[hardy widget]

New game mode is gonna end up like Skirmish.

[solar slate]

• The grid setup is a test of how we can free up our reliance on it as a system

this gives me hope for warfare and offensive as well

[fluid pawn]

-# WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS TO ME STEAM.... 😭

[analog apex]

so, before the Steam gets it updated - what is that orange rectangle?

just in short

[fluid pawn]

It should be this image for Brécourt

[arctic rampart]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1036120241366896691/1379781117598633995/image.png?ex=68417ccd&is=68402b4d&hm=7a3e18676d5affecb05f4886f8cfae824a4c832b4ac4b7e19321088bd6faaa3f&

[arctic rampart]

I mean sure, but wtf does it even mean? What's the point of the orange rectangle'd area?

[small fractal]

Probably warm-up volume position.

[analog apex]

aaaah, right
but what was that rectangle supposed to mark anyway? 😄

[arctic rampart]

Is that supposed to be the "Turn-back volume"?

[full sky]

Sooo nothing over the last Pte Feedback or did i overread something @analog apex 😄

[fluid pawn]

If I'm being honest, I am not sure... ahah
I've asked the devs now as they surely put it in for a reason

[analog apex]

yep, no updates about the new MG bippoding feedback sadly

hopefully next time...

[fluid pawn]

The last PTE feedback and this one will be answer an upcoming Q&A 🙂

[analog apex]

Another Q&A? You have been doing a great job man!

[arctic rampart]

2x tanks and it's a 30 min sleeper match. 😴

[fluid pawn]

We're still processing all the feedback from this weekend just gone so didn't have time to give any updates for this dev brief

[full sky]

Okay Great hopefully i can be there than 😄

You never answered when i askt you if you got my message 😄 but when i ask Sam something you answer me 😄

[fluid pawn]

I appreciate that! Trying our hardest to get more community engagmeent and comms going ❤️

[cyan saddle]

Warmup blocking volume

Area you cannot enter during warmup

[arctic rampart]

Also, why are the "devs" trying to reduce the reliance on the grid system?

[full sky]

I think Sam and me are very engagt 😄

[neat urchin]

@fluid pawn instead of modes we didn’t ask for really can we get an update to render distance or hit registration? Like actually fix the game first?

[small fractal]

Different skill sets.

[past vortex]

and the horrible UI that nags on the enjoyment every game .....

[arctic rampart]

Another thing that ties into this is that, assuming PTE goes well, peeps like it, devs make it and now we have another gamemode and a less grid-reliant map scheme.
Wouldn't this make it really hard to attract newer players?
I mean it's already a bit of a headache trying to explain how Warfare compares to Offensive since plenty of meaningful details get swapped around, then there's Skirmish which throws completely everything up in the air.
And now another gamemode and a off-grid map type? Like jeeeesus how tf are we gonna remember all of this?

[cyan saddle]

Last week's dev brief did have a whole section talking about LODs

[sick bramble]

100 supplies to each plane is a joke

[arctic rampart]

It is, but a minor one

[analog apex]

UI - I forgot to make a sentence or two about that either - indeed I couldn't have gotten myself to like it in the PTE. Might be the font used too.

[sick bramble]

u can build 1 barricade with it

[neat urchin]

Lod is different than render distance. Doesn’t matter the LOD if it doesn’t show up until I’m 50m from it. Half the time I can’t see in windows on console who’s in a building window 150m away

[night lark]

looking forward to a new game mode. I enjoyed skirmish a lot because it was an easy blatt fest for grinding XP

[arctic rampart]

Plenty to not get sniped by a Panther that can now destroy buildables xD

[hardy widget]

But no one plays Skirmish…

[night lark]

I do sometimes

[fluid pawn]

As mentioned previously, objective just a prototyped mode and we are looking to use this PTE to get feedback on what players think about it. The development of this mode has been led by a single member of the team, and has not taken away from any work on the rest of the game.

I know the team are working hard on those things that you have mentioned, as can be seen with the upcoming improvements to LODs in Patch 17.1

[cyan saddle]

They go hand in hand.

[arctic rampart]

Me and the boys don't play Skirmish because it's a 30 minute sleeper match.

[sick bramble]

This game mode is not terrible to be honest

[full sky]

Guys first Play the new Gamemode and than you can say its Bad or not

[hardy widget]

It’s not that Skirmish is bad…it’s just that no one plays it. Hardly any servers host it and if they do there’s no one playing.

[night lark]

I play if im solo and dont want to be reliant on non talking SLs ignoring the game mechanica

[cyan saddle]

because it's bad 🤫

[past vortex]

problem with game modes is ofc player fragmentation
most players will stick to "the best" mode to enjoy high player counts for better quality games and less waiting

[fluid pawn]

UPDATE: The orange box are the warm-up bounds for both sides.

[arctic rampart]

Da fuq

[gloomy quartz]

I'd love to see 50v50 on that small danzig map or the brecourt map

[analog apex]

only one side probably, but yep it makes sense

[arctic rampart]

You can almost see the british objectives from the german warmup area then

[night lark]

My only change for gamemodes is i wish artillery was removed entirely from Offensive

[arctic rampart]

I think the new gamemode as a whole is interesting to try out, but it'll be easily cheesed with HLL existing mechanics (like I showcased how you can cover the british plane obj's with a single or two semi-decently placed tanks.)
As well as the fact it'll be one step away from logic again, since a Panther with a HE shell can't take down the paper airplane

[analog apex]

*from the game xD

[cyan saddle]

It's just a volume. Basically everything inside of the box is a no-go zone for both sides.

[analog apex]

ahaaaaaa, now it makes complete sense - 1 zone but applied to both teams

[night lark]

Nah artillery has a place in HLL as it should since artillery and IDF in general was the most casualty inflicting weapon system im ww2

[cyan saddle]

Looks like defenders are given some time to build up defenses before the volume is dropped

[arctic rampart]

Pretty sure you can snipe this with a tank
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1036120241366896691/1379784396231540747/image.png?ex=68417fdb&is=68402e5b&hm=34448360f91392b22734aed934c3787c9a58381af80bee835965881ac845fbf2&

[past vortex]

seems like it will be tank heavy

[analog apex]

there will be no tanks will there? Just trucks.

[neat urchin]

No they don’t, that’s two completely different things . Might be in the same category of visuals but still two different things. The render distance on console has gotten worse ever since t17 has taken over. I used to see things far away with poor detail but now I can’t even see things far away in general. Two completely different things

[past vortex]

as in "if you dont have 3 good tank crews you are screwed"

oh no tanks, makes sense

apcs then :}

[analog apex]

aah, wrong... that text was for the Brecourt only

[arctic rampart]

El alamein will have 'em yeah

That's why I'm saying, you can probably snipe from German side to British side within warmup AND brits with using more than 2 braincells can easily make the planes completely inaccessible, mind you from very, very safe areas.

[hardy widget]

I just don’t see the point in working on new game modes when the last creation wasn’t popular. People are more pumped for dynamic weather.

[snow pond]

25v25 booo

[arctic rampart]

Don't you love remembering every sector, garrison, vehicle and call in rule of each of the gamemodes? 😏

[night lark]

I guess balance it with period correct small calibre tanks like 50mm armed Pz IIIs or shorty PzIVs

[full sky]

When dynmaic weather means more fog or Rain im out .

[analog apex]

Brecourt objective 25vs25
El Alamein objective 50vs50

What happens when the server switches the map from larger map to the smaller one? @fluid pawn Will the 50 random players get kicked? 😮

[hardy widget]

It actually looks like the fog will be less foggy

[snow pond]

yes

[analog apex]

That doesn't sound good.

[snow pond]

or you cant queue them together in the same server. 25v25 only servers

[humble perch]

We got HLL russian roulette before GTA 6.

[full sky]

But yes i dont know if we need the new Gamemode. There is a lot to fix or to optimize i thing would be better

[snow pond]

both are crap

[cyan saddle]

I remember when they were working on Objective back in 2023 they said that it would gracefully transition somehow

Not sure they ever said exactly what it implied, but it certainly didn't sound like it would straight up kick people

The original original plan was to require separate servers for 25v25 modes, they might also be doing that for this PTE

[silk igloo]

So they can add items into player inventories based on mode and class... inflatable boats on remagen when

[novel geyser]

They shouldn't give up on making modes just because the last one was bad
I think the other two modes are also trash

[arctic rampart]

So like, if we're playing warfare, both sides have vehicles, pretty simple.
Then again if you're playing Offensive, both sides will have vehicles, but the defenders will only have them after like 3 minutes where as the attackers will only have the vehicles corresponding to their HQ spawn, but when they cap first point they will get the rest.
(Insert explanation for Skirmish vehicles, cause I got no clue there xD)

And now in Capture, if you're playing specifically this list of maps, both sides will have vehicles, but if you're playing these maps, the attackers won't have vehicles and defenders will have vehicles that won't respawn.

Explain that to a new guy and see their reaction. Then say, "that's just for the vehicles"

[snow pond]

so another system people dont play? Skirmish is a dead mode.

[analog apex]

...which would require a dedicated server just for that. Seeding chances very low while the owner needs to be paying for it. :/

[cyan saddle]

Have you read the dev brief? 😅

[snow pond]

YEs

[hardy widget]

The other game modes are literally the game…so you thing the game is trash?

[silk igloo]

One server swapping from one 100 player game to two 50p ones?

[cyan saddle]

This was all largely developed back in 2023 before Skirmish was a thing. There's no direct plans to release this or spend more development time on it.

[snow pond]

so friends playing together get split up?

[finite berry]

Make it a commander call-in. Easy.

[snow pond]

So its a test for planting explosives and nothing much more. Fine.

[arctic rampart]

Dude, if these gamemode additions and changes get added, my explaining time will increase by another 30 mins to the new guys

Like jesus, even I am losing track of what changes in each gamemode and each circumstance

[snow pond]

However. The Purposes of Objective Mode and this PTE:
A 25 v 25 environment

alarms me

[arctic rampart]

It does everyone

[solar slate]

@fluid pawn for what a single person's opinion is worth, i really like the idea of destructable objectives being the main goal - my foremost personal frustration in hell let loose is the inability to overcome a team that won't do the basics, with territory swapping not being the focus (thus eliminating a lot of the 'work' players are unwilling to engage in) and increased ability for a few good players to clutch by engaging in a fight instead of backline garry building is really exciting to me conceptually

[finite berry]

Not my problem. 😉 jokes aside tho, how? Players wouldn't have to control artillery anymore, it would just come down to being something the officer can call in from time to time

[novel geyser]

Yes

Both warfare and offensive need serious changes

[arctic rampart]

So like, if we're playing warfare, both sides have vehicles, pretty simple.
Then again if you're playing Offensive, both sides will have vehicles, but the defenders will only have them after like 3 minutes where as the attackers will only have the vehicles corresponding to their HQ spawn, but when they cap first point they will get the rest.
(Insert explanation for Skirmish vehicles, cause I got no clue there xD)

And now in Capture, if you're playing specifically this list of maps, both sides will have vehicles, but if you're playing these maps, the attackers won't have vehicles and defenders will have vehicles that won't respawn.

Explain that to a new guy and see their reaction. Then say, "that's just for the vehicles"

Cause of this. This is everything just regarding when and how can you get a vehicle in each gamemode.
This doesn't even scratch the surface of garries, how sectors work, locking distances, distances between garries (which also are different from warfare/offensive to Skirmish for example), supplies, nodes, yada yada

[night lark]

Theres 4 game modes now. So its basically the same as Squad and Squad44 in terms of number of game modes i think.

[hardy widget]

Can’t work on changing warfare and offensive when working on a game mode that will die in a month.

[novel geyser]

Can't say for sure if the new mode will be doa
Skirmish just wasn't anything new or interesting
It was just warfare without the extra steps

[solar slate]

skirmish was really bad

[silk igloo]

just tell them to read

[novel geyser]

Though this is just the pte they could recycle what they have for a better offensive mode

[night lark]

Unironically this.

[solar slate]

they had like one good concept in there with the multiple cap points in one grid band but went for the warfare and offensive -lite which is just really boring

[arctic rampart]

Also, will Capture then use "Garries" aka 50/100 supplies with 200m distances or the skirmish bs of forward positions?
Cause in Brecourt it's normal garries from what's visible, but in El Alamein it's just a few defaults

[silk igloo]

Im gonna say it for the tenth time. back in MY day when i started playing project reality in ~2006 all my questions were answered with either "read the manual" or "read the f***ing" manual, and I turned out fine. 🤪

[solar slate]

i would definitely like for t17 to experiment with warfare and offensive in PTE, i understand the hesitancy, but the gameplay loop has been really dull for a long time because the optimal things to do are anti fun for 99% of people

so it leads to a lot alot of 20 minute matches where one team gets stomped

[novel geyser]

Warfare is usually total filler and time wasting until the round timer ends unless it's a stomp and offensive just has terrible pacing

[snow pond]

T17 -> Just make more Warfare and Offensive maps. And perhaps change offensive so that some objectives are destruction based. Job done, back home for tea and medals.

[analog apex]

I noticed that too, but I wonder also if it is not just the **initial **garrisons.

And forward posts used for the rest as buildable spawnpoints.

[finite berry]

Squad 44 has at least nine, but only four or so get actively played (Frontline, Offensive, Seeding (most common) and Invasion). Then there's Armoured, RAAS, AAS, Contagion (Zombie Mode) and Supremacy.

[night lark]

I watched loads of youtube videos to explain how stuff worked and joined a clan day one of playing so i could learn

[hardy widget]

No one plays squad 44 though.

[finite berry]

https://tenor.com/view/terrminator-wrong-gif-10539477

[analog apex]

~200+- players

[snow pond]

looks like a rounding error to me

[analog apex]

it's facing the status of a notAlive game again

[finite berry]

Just temporarily

[hardy widget]

They are trying to get people back with the Pacific. If HLL brought in the pacific into play, Squad 44 would tank for a 2nd time.

[night lark]

Nowhere near the player count in HLL but they arent comparable games anyway imo. Squad 44 has some way better mechanics though like their vehicle system

[finite berry]

There is a connection issue bug that desperately needs fixing

And Guadalcanal is about to hit

I'm optimistic

[analog apex]

Just for people that like the Pacific.

[hardy widget]

That game died a long time ago. Let it rest in peace.

[night lark]

Nah, its still fun.

[hardy widget]

2 Pacific maps aren’t going to revive it.

[finite berry]

I know that feeling. I have trained and taught new Squad 44 players the game and spent up to three hours in VC explaining everything to them (that times 20 new players or so). It's long, it's tiring, but it's necessary, so imma do it. It's the same here. Teach 'em.

[night lark]

I bounce between Squad, HLL and S44 and i like all three

[hardy widget]

The mountain of maps, factions, game modes…200 concurrent players…

[finite berry]

It never did.

[night lark]

HLL is far easier imo. Its just not that complicated or deep

[finite berry]

Of course not. Advertising, optimisation, bug fixing and appealing more to new players will do.

[solar slate]

squad 44 just has bad 1st person feedback and graphics are too dated

thats all thats holding it back otherwise its likely the better game

[wintry thistle]

Squad 44 is built too much like a mod

[night lark]

Theres no point trying to convince a player base that cant consistently build garrisons that Squad 44 is good tbh.

[finite berry]

It literally started as one.

[hardy widget]

Tbh no point in really talking about Squad 44 here as it’s not a direct competitor game

[wintry thistle]

Exactly. That’s my point

[solar slate]

just goes to show if ur gameplay feels unsatisfying it doesnt matter the rest, ppl arent gonna stick around to learn unless they really have a hardon for the theme matter

[night lark]

There are some bit thats HLL could easily adopt like the vehicle system and number of vehicles that a period correct for the maps

[solar slate]

easily is a bit of a stretch

[finite berry]

😄 perhaps, but I can debunk the myth of Squad 44 having diEd a LoNg tiMe aGo

[solar slate]

multiplayer game dev is rarely easy

[hardy widget]

No point homie.

[finite berry]

Performance and optimisation are holding it back, not graphics.

[finite berry]

You have no point lol

[solar slate]

nah it ran well enough on my rtx 2060

just feels poopoo to play

[finite berry]

What feedback, exactly?

[analog apex]

I don't play it just because of the much lower environmental detail/graphics. As the places feel too generic, many nature asets as well.

[night lark]

Nah it would be easy to emulate the vehicle system. Its kinda meh how gun calibres in HLL just dont matter

[solar slate]

game feel

[finite berry]

It doesn't for many others. I live part-time in the Steam forums of Squad 44, believe me, performance is a major issue

[hardy widget]

Good one.

[finite berry]

What is the issue in your eyes? I like iz

[solar slate]

people stick around for games they like even if it runs poorly

[finite berry]

Please elaborate what your point seemingly is

[hardy widget]

That there is no point talking about Squad 44 in a HLL discord.

[finite berry]

Yeah sorry, but you're mistaken there. Steam forums say otherwise

[hardy widget]

You wanna go talk Squad 44 go hit up their discord

[finite berry]

Ah, fair point then, actually. Although you kind of started it 😄

[finite berry]

Already there :D

[solar slate]

nah buddy, the industry is full of games that ran like garbage and still had millions of sales and concurrents in tens of thousands

[silk igloo]

I've begun to hate youtube guides though, a proper manual like the tank bible would be better. Trying to search specific things out of a youtube video is just eugh

[sick bramble]

squad44 lost fight against HLL years ago you know?

[solar slate]

S44 is simply not enticing to play the game feel is bad, someone tries it and they dont like how the game feels and looks, they dont stick around to complain about performance, they just dont play it

[analog apex]

it was never a fight... PS (SQ44 name back then) had never any marketing - it was more like a surrender

[finite berry]

Mhm, I disagree, but I still see your point. Have you seen Guadalcanal yet?

[wintry thistle]

Guides are for weaklings. The proper way to learn is trial and error/asking people questions

I’ve almost never watched a YouTube guide to learn a game ever

[silk igloo]

read the manual

[sick bramble]

i want to see something further than 50 meters in squad
and they cant fix even that

not fps, no visibility

[finite berry]

Yeah... It's on the previous devs, unfortunately. Not saying they were bad in general, but in comparison to the new management and devs, they were.

[wintry thistle]

Yeah, if there even is one

[analog apex]

I don't care about the Pacific...

but I have seen some videos

[sick bramble]

Yeah i love bolt action ww1 gameplay

This is pacific

[analog apex]

Western front maps are however which I care about + Soviet area

[finite berry]

That's how you feel, doesn't mean that everyone feels the same.

[tawdry crater]

RO2 did bolt action gameplay fine

[solar slate]

point me to the active players then

[finite berry]

Same here, I also like that better

[hardy widget]

This game is very much a successor to RO2 imo

[tawdry crater]

Eh

[wintry thistle]

No

[sick bramble]

squad44 is not clear in gameplay for me

[finite berry]

https://tenor.com/view/obi-wan-kenobi-of-course-i-know-him-hes-me-gif-12774102

[wintry thistle]

Not at all

This game is nothing like RO2

[finite berry]

Eeh.... not really.

[sick bramble]

additionaly I hate weapon sight sweep

[hardy widget]

I’m not saying it’s anything like it. I’m just saying it took that crowed over

[sick bramble]

weapons should not be accurate, not your sight

[hardy widget]

It filled that gap

I was huge into RO2

[wintry thistle]

Honestly not even. I’ve heard plenty of RO2 players say they don’t care for this game

Lots of HLL players have never touched anything besides main stream games

[hardy widget]

There is no game like RO2, but if anything HLL is the closest in terms of game play

[wintry thistle]

I’d still disagree

[sick bramble]

dont forget about not rendering textures

[wintry thistle]

RO2 feels little like HLL

[sick bramble]

(sry for ping)

[worthy charm]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-whatever-tired-obiwan-kenobi-gif-1390762166374797148

[finite berry]

(Squad 44 with the Pacific?)

[sick bramble]

HeroesAndGenerals..

[analog apex]

in HLL or SQ44 xD

[sick bramble]

sq44

[finite berry]

Out of curiosity, based on what? MA upgraded the graphics immensely in one of their first upgrades.

[wintry thistle]

RO2 is more realistic than HLL anyway

[sick bramble]

BRO IN HLL I SEE NOT RENDERING TEXTURES at about 500 meters
in squad44 at 20

[finite berry]

...man, the memories. How much I loved and hated that game xD

[analog apex]

I mean more like the environmental detail.

density of assets and their logical natural placements

and how they look

[finite berry]

Hm... Not sure whether I can follow there

[sick bramble]

2017-2019 versions were the best

[solar slate]

heroes and generals

[analog apex]

Ok, on msot SQ44's EU maps especially older ones, you can look any one direction and you will see the same tree copypaasted like 30 times 😄

empty or feelEmpty indoors

[hardy widget]

I went from RO2 to Post Scriptum to HLL and to me HLL filled thr RO2 void well so I’m sticking to it lol

[sick bramble]

I hated only and captured weapons in hg

[finite berry]

I have completely different experience with that 🤨

[solar slate]

that name just woke some forgotten memories

[sick bramble]

maybe because of vram

i have 4gb vram and thats why?

[finite berry]

Got improved immensely (although there are still empty floors left, especially on Arnhem, gotta admit that).

[wintry thistle]

I think they fixed the inside of most houses. Could be wrong

[analog apex]

and even indoors that have stuff in them in SQ44, they just don't feel as alive/natural as indoors in HLL are

[finite berry]

They did

[analog apex]

in HLL I believe somebody lives there, in SQ44 I don't

[finite berry]

I will agree there, but it doesn't bother me as much.

Probably because I'm used to it

[sick bramble]

gameplay is more important

[finite berry]

Just like I think that HLL explosions look atrocious and sometimes comically bad because I'm used to what Squad 44 has to offer to the table

[finite berry]

Naturally

[sick bramble]

and clarity of game learning

[analog apex]

not to me for instance, it's like visuals first and gameplay after (only up to a limit ofc - wouldn't play a terrible game no matter how it looks)

[sick bramble]

dont compare s44 and hll
hll is more arcade game than you might think

[arctic rampart]

Build of Shoot aka the old Ace of Spades >>>>>>>>>>>

[sick bramble]

okay tank mechanics are better

[arctic rampart]

If you know, you know

[sick bramble]

modules>> tanks with just hp

[analog apex]

gunplay as well
SQ44 gunplay >> no gunplay in HLL? 😄

[solar slate]

i didnt get to play tanks in s44 because they were always insta taken

but they do look a lot more interesting than hll ones

altho i still really like playing hll tanks, just wish not every 2nd infantry guy had a satchel

[finite berry]

We could go together if you want :D

[sick bramble]

please i dont want esport gunplay with dispersion etc..

[solar slate]

i dont have it i was playing during the free weekend

[finite berry]

Ah, okay

[night lark]

Being able to actually adjust sights and the sheer number of weapon variety in S44 makes me happy. I hate that with panzershreks you have to lob your rocket instead of using the adjustable sights

[finite berry]

Well, there might be another one some day

[night lark]

Also rifle grenades are so fun

[sick bramble]

I would love adjustable sights

[finite berry]

You can adjust sights on the Panzerschreck by now

[finite berry]

I hate them xD

Bloody explosive rambos

[night lark]

Not in HLL you cant because the gunplay is for Battlefield bros

[finite berry]

Ah, sorry, thought you meant Squad 44 😄

[finite berry]

(Also fire modes)

[night lark]

Yeah nah in S44 its great. I always sight in for 200m on rifles and aim at the best buckle. Will always get reliable hits

[sick bramble]

bipods

[night lark]

Having select fire on MG34s is great too

[finite berry]

(And barrel change)

Although that's kinda unnecessary 😄

[sick bramble]

barrel change is too much

but fire modes, bipods are fine

[sinful bluff]

Guys what would you think of a server with 150 players?

[night lark]

75 aside?

[sinful bluff]

Ye

[night lark]

Thatd be fun

[analog apex]

unrealistic with HLL level of detail

realistic for less dense level-designed games

[night lark]

id put level limits and enforce mic requirements for SLa though

[finite berry]

Does HLL have an in-game mic-check?

[hardy widget]

I want the campaign mode from RO2

[analog apex]

jsut for thhe functionality, not for the squad-joining

[finite berry]

Yeah, but that's already very good

For squad joining, the SL just should do a mic check

[night lark]

Nope. Purely a manual admin thing you have to check

[analog apex]

hardly, since he has to be on the deployment screen to do it

[night lark]

I like how Squad SLs will kick non responsive players tbh

And being able to name squads “ENG MIC” or similar too

[finite berry]

Get Easy Red 2 :D

[finite berry]

Why's that?

[analog apex]

because it's impossible to manage squad while alive

not possible to kick people for instnace

one has t obe on the deployment screen in HLL

[finite berry]

???? Sorry, but that's dumb, isn't it?

[analog apex]

yep

[karmic inlet]

can there be multiple TNT's placed on object at the same time?

[sterile pagoda]

Ngl I wouldn’t bother adding the Danzig post office map if we don’t have a Polish army faction

[cosmic pilot]

There's this thing called GPU instancing which I'm almost sure hll doesn't do to the extent it should.

Tbf, most games don't do it

[solar slate]

probably the case for most building assets

coz any towns they have be laggy af

[nova pivot]

I don't like the idea of small maps.

They already tried to turn this into a COD with skirmish, if we let them continue like this in 6 months we'll have a battle pass

[cosmic pilot]

Uh, no.

[silk igloo]

the map on el alamein objective mode is effectively bigger for attackers since all squads can spawn anywhere in the neutral, not just recon. i had the map upside down. it's bigger for defenders to roam around destroying enemy spawns and creating their own.

[sterile pagoda]

COD buzzword!!!

Ding ding ding

[cosmic pilot]

Cod mentioned

https://tenor.com/view/muerto-gif-16250174877271582365

[polar prism]

I don't get it,

So for the Danzig map, when it releases officially with the Polish faction

Will it be a Danzig Post Office faction?

well

At least they had uniforms

[oak current]

if you dont get it, the dev brief answers all questions
https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/686810/view/528722148165947156

[polar prism]

So will it actually be the Polish army? Because that's not accurate at all

[oak current]

its not gonna be anything

this is a left over map, that was set up for objective mode - this PTE is to test the mode

The Purposes of Objective Mode and this PTE

To dive further into the scope of what Hell Let Loose could be, by utilizing mechanics that aren’t centred around Capture Points and territory control
To gauge community interest in the mechanics and setups of the maps presented in these modes. We are particularly keen to hear your thoughts on:

[polar prism]

So the map won't officially make it to the actual game?

[oak current]

maybe, maybe not - this Pte is about the gamemode, not about how much you like an early-in-development phase of a map

[polar prism]

Okay, let's say it does make it to the game

Will they make a Polish Danzig Faction

[oak current]

maybe if everyone goes: oooh give us more of this sweet danzig taste - then they might? but as they have pointed out - PTE is for gamemode testing

[polar prism]

That was my question, so no that Dev Brief didn't answer my question

[oak current]

it did

this is a PTE about the gamemode, nothing else

[polar prism]

My question was when (if) it releases officially will it have a Polish faction - will it be regular forces or a Danzig Post offiice faction

It doesn't answer that

[oak current]

then the answer is: nobody knows or will be able to tell you "what could be if maybe this and this would go that way"

my guess: probably

[polar prism]

So yeah it doesn't answer my question lol

[oak current]

[polar prism]

Hence why I asked here

[oak current]

fair enough fair enough - then the answer is:

[winter rover]

They'll probably do army, doubt they will do a post office faction

Historically accuracy doesn't matter to the devs

[oak current]

if they make unique factions for a single map, they are swimming in money and extra time

imagine having a faction for each map, cause on SMDM this group fought and on SME this group fought and so on

[winter rover]

Could mean a Polish faction is coming in the future 😄

[oak current]

plonk on an outfit, faction loadout - carry on

polish faction for some early war maps

[cyan saddle]

I don't get it either. So will they be adding the pacific or not?

[winter rover]

No

[cyan saddle]

Dev brief was really vague on it

[winter rover]

They said not in the near future

[oak current]

bad abu

[thin scarab]

Can the Devs make a Tank only Game Mode ?

[covert elbow]

Probably not allowed because of the code /s

[winter rover]

With this cancerous tank system? God no

[thin scarab]

Its gonna get reworked so

[covert elbow]

Maybe

[winter rover]

With minimal effort

[past vortex]

does it

[covert elbow]

Considering the other “reworks” we’ve gotten they use the term pretty loosely

I haven’t seen an actual “rework” this year. It’s all be updates

[past vortex]

a color change is also a rework

[oak current]

and an update

[covert elbow]

Yep

[winter rover]

I've never disliked a dev team as much as I dislike the HLL dev team

[covert elbow]

Yep

[past veldt]

The last dev team

These guys are technically good at making this game work. Waaaaay better than BM was

Their game design isn't good though

So many bugs fixed that BM said were impossible to fix. Lots of neat new things coming on the back end which we'd never have gotten under BM

[silk igloo]

Yeah. Changing the grid system like Brecourt where the red area extends to the flanks is wild. Grid by grid warfare when

[arctic rampart]

If they're planning to go off the grid pattern for maps, I don't think I will support that

[oak current]

makes you wonder if they'll also reshapre the capture circle to becoming a capture zone instead, with flexible shape

[past vortex]

complex polygons

[analog apex]

a sector system made of square-shaped sectors can never ever work well

and of straight line

[cosmic pilot]

Yes it can

[analog apex]

there are problems right if the cover density is not balanced in the area (nto possible to do if the maps are to stay natural), another problem when the map includes a river etc etc.

there is no way to do it especially if the gamemode is locked to 15 sectors - no more no less (especially river maps)

[cosmic pilot]

Behold, calculus allows us to approach continuous functions by approximating with arbitrarily small squares

[analog apex]

if the map includes a river that takes at at least 6% of the map (which easily does) such a system gets broken imediately

add the strongpoint locations to it that are restricted to 1 per sector, and the problem gets even bigger like we can see on Remagen

[analog apex]

but HLL's squares are big

yep however... if made smaller enough, it could work better... not perfectly though

only non-square-shaped sectors could work best

[novel mantle]

my biggest complaint about them

[wind shore]

That part

[karmic inlet]

can there be multiple TNT's placed on object at the same time?

[ivory scaffold]

You mean satchels?

[analog apex]

he means TNTs

a new thing for the Objective mode

[ivory scaffold]

Oh! Sorry I have lot caught up with the new info yet. I’ll go back to my corner and read.

[lucid tusk]

Administrative results, one of the biggest guntubers on YouTube, just did a pretty hefty hell let loose video

[covert elbow]

Link?

[lucid tusk]

It's on his non gun account, Bureau Files

[covert elbow]

This guys got like 3 account

[silk igloo]

Are you saying this like a disaster happened and we're about to be flooded again, or something else

[covert elbow]

What kinda video is it?

Like a game analysis or just a gameplay dump

[lucid tusk]

More of a "i play the game and hate/love it and you should too"

[lucid tusk]

Probably flooded, he's got a pretty substantial online presence

[covert elbow]

Damn

Kinda cringe

[silk igloo]

i'm only 39 seconds in and he's already mentioned "mil sim", "getting shot from nowhere" and "having to run hundreds of meters"

gaaah

[wind shore]

Hey guys, is this game worth buying on ps5 pro? I haven't touched a single game except call of duty for the past 19 years, looking to sink my teeth into another fps game that has a large community and not a crazy amount of cheaters lol

[analog apex]

yeah man, for some it seems that's all it takes for being able to call a game a milsim 😄

[covert elbow]

Yea I am g holding out hope

[silk igloo]

well, the bit seemed kind of exaggerated and comedic

[lucid tusk]

He actually goes into why it's not a milsim

[finite berry]

Link?

[covert elbow]

Oh nice

[analog apex]

is he? well at least he told is just as a joke

...whoever HE is

[lucid tusk]

Start at 16 minutes if you're jaded still, it'll reinforce your beliefs

[silk igloo]

Right, he's clearly joking, it's just not immediately apparent

[finite berry]

Overall, yes. You just need to be aware that this game plays nothing like CoD.

[novel mantle]

oh man I can't wait to defend the danzig post office as british soldiers

[wind shore]

That's fine 🙂 I'm not looking for a clone of the game. I just wanted to make sure there was an active player base before buying the game

[finite berry]

Yes, don't worry about activity.

Oh, and never play on official servers as those are unmoderated which greatly increases the risk of encountering cheaters.

If you need some help with passing over from CoD to games like this, DM me and I'll try to help you.

[novel mantle]

I bet if we got a winter war, they'll just use german vs soviet teams

[wind shore]

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind! 🙂

[wind shore]

Will do, thanks 😊

[finite berry]

Then welcome aboard 🫡

[covert elbow]

Probably

[silk igloo]

Battle of Raate road, 2000x1200 meters of trees and one dingy road. great

winter war probably wouldnt be that... cinematic in hll

[rain lark]

How many hackers are on pc? i think at least 1 per game

[worthy charm]

On Official servers maybe, but community server usually got no cheaters at all.

[oak current]

except Willes

[covert shard]

Canned Tuna is the perfect food, per can it is 20 grams of protein for 90 calories. Canned Tuna's has a calorie to protein ratio of 4.5 ( for context is .5 off the theoretical limit of 4.0) canned tuna is canned protein

Message #💬︱off-topic

[worthy charm]

Nah, when I play infantry I rarely got a positive KD.😅

Except last week, I got lucky for once an had a 2.0 KD. That felt very very wrong

[oak current]

[empty steppe]

Guide to positive kd

-Get big gun that go “BRRRRRRT”

-Find window overlooking baddies

-Mount gun

-it don’t matter if you miss because there gonna be so suppressed they can’t shoot back

[worthy charm]

3 secons after mounting ding with a following deathscreen

My KD also could be bad because I always play flamethrower if I can😆

[empty steppe]

Well there’s the problem 🤣

Honestly… as much as I don’t want it to be, for me, best gun in the game is mp-40

[worthy charm]

Its better after the buff, in comparison with anything else its still not a good weapon

[empty steppe]

But I use the fg-42 because I spent too much time wasting my life trying to get it

[empty steppe]

I’m so glad they buffed it dude

[worthy charm]

My aim on long Ranges isnt the best so the ppsh gotta be it for me.

[empty steppe]

Stick or drum 🤨

Ima drum kinda guy, the stick magazine is also very good though and has its uses

[slow egret]

WHy do OFFICERS ALWAYS leaveeee !!!!!

[worthy charm]

Obviously the drum is better, but they are both fine.

[finite berry]

Please don't tell me there is a drum mag for the MP 40

[worthy charm]

https://tenor.com/view/aha-gif-2873577311782390556

[empty steppe]

COD fury insues

[empty steppe]

Yeah

[worthy charm]

Vanguard Garand drum mag moment.

[finite berry]

for real :(

[empty steppe]

Hear me out… forget the BAR, M1 garand with full auto and a drum mag is better

[worthy charm]

Its so funny it still had the ping sound from ejecting the clip, even with a mag.

[empty steppe]

What if inside the magazine it just held multiple clips, and you got like 3 pings as it fired through them 🤣🤣🤣

[finite berry]

I swear to God, seeing Vanguard's weapon designs gave me violent thoughts xD

[empty steppe]

Would have had John Moses browning crying

[worthy charm]

I didnt need this CoD specificly for this.😂

[finite berry]

CoD has been bs for a long time, but man, Vanguard put it on another level

Everything about that game was atrocious, really everything

[worthy charm]

Imagine the last few CoD wouldnt just been games, instead of DLCs.

[covert elbow]

Cheese cake that’s litterly what a BAR is

[empty steppe]

NUH UH

BAR don’t have no drum mag 🤓

[covert elbow]

Wha

[empty steppe]

You heard me

And also there’s is numerous mechanical differences but I’ll save you from that convo 😉🤣

[nova pivot]

I want it

[empty steppe]

Well to be short and sweet, their gas piston systems are extremely different, with the BAR having a more closed off system then the garand. Also there’s BAR’s older design is a lot heavier and more cumbersome (which can be good for some conditions)

[nova pivot]

Thank you

[vestal spear]

plus ones a infantry rifle ones a squad support lmg

[cedar arrow]

Who the hell is Gary and why does everyone think he’s hot ?!

[slate canopy]

Have you seen HotDog7 and Sugar 5-0? You'll learn 😎

[gentle lintel]

https://tenor.com/view/mujikcboro-seriymujik-gif-24361533

That’s Gary

[lethal perch]

hey i just read the dev brief, i dont think they should go for 25v25's i really think they should just try everything to be 50v50, dont even change the map sizes. keep things 50v50 always.
does anyone know why the team is trying a 50 player mode? doesnt the community only prefer 100p? is this a console thing?

[slate canopy]

My guess would be since it's more close quarter fighting, since you have to plant dynamite, you don't need 100v100

You don't have tanks, just vehicles for supplies and transport.

[empty steppe]

Okay I just thought of smth… why does tank commander for the US forces not have a grease gun???

Like the one place it should fit in… it’s not there lol

[covert elbow]

It’s Hell Let Loose

[real parrot]

Great, another game mode that no one is going to play

[empty steppe]

Very true but this one… idk man, I’m a wee bit angy

[covert elbow]

There’s a lot more issues then that historically wise ahah

[cosmic pilot]

people like you is why we can't have nice things

that's it, every map will now be smaller and 20v20

[covert elbow]

6v6. Take it or leave it

[cosmic pilot]

1v1 hill 400

[covert elbow]

Btw all members of the tank crew would have a SMG. Early war it was the Thompson but it was switched to the grease gun at some point

[storm stratus]

Whats “Objective Mode” mean? New game mode test?

[slate canopy]

Yup, it's in the PTE coming up.

https://discord.com/channels/316459644476456962/322320603350827010

Look in there for the information

[storm stratus]

Yeh thats where i got it but was confused. Any idea how its going to play?

[covert elbow]

It’s stated in the dev brief word for word

[slate canopy]

Objective Mode is like you have to put TNT on 5 planes, and to win as the attackers you blow up the 5 planes in the time, while defenders win with 1 plane still up (similar to offensive/defensive, but it's an object, not a point)

[arctic rampart]

Itll be fun for 20 mins, then a few people will realize how easy it is for the defense

[storm stratus]

Like Rush cross Offensive.

[analog apex]

As long as there are no any kind of tickets in the game (not global ones that would end the match, just local ones that would give some negative effects when depleted!), it will always work just the same as the OFFENSIVE or even WARFARE = even if the defenders would be dying whatever many millions of times, but as long as they have spawnpoints there especially OPs that can't even get destroyed by arty/bombings, the defenders can just keep respawning there endlessly even if surrounded and keeping going back to their camping spots around the circle/objective. With OBJECTIVE it will be the same.

Also, the** initial (pre-built) garrisons** are a big part of this problem as they are not temporary, but they stand until they are only manually dismantled (can't be destroyed from afar as these are protected against it). The initial OFFENSIVE garries (and in OBJECTIVE too), should exist just for like 3-5 minutes and then they should self destruct imo. With the spawn wave timer on them of just 10 seconds, they are overpowered so much and can be even combined with building a normal garrison right next to them. And especially if they are located close to the objective.

[storm stratus]

Sorry didn’t click the blue writting on the steam link.

I see is that a new map Danzig. Sad its not full size

[wind shore]

Yo this is so cool thing that Danzig is coming

[analog apex]

And also about the OBJECTIVE - adding actual physical objectives to perform like planting the TNTs is good. But I always hoped such stuff to be added/combined to the OFFENSIVE gamemode and not making it its own (and small(er)!) gamemode.

I would also expect some more diverse objectives types like...

• destroy a bridge/guns/ammoDump/fuelDump etc.
• defuse pre-planted explosives before they explode (like when the Germans planted them on Remagen's bridge for example in attempt to blow it up before the Allies came)
• remove obstacles on the beach (or elsewhere) by engineers
• capture officer (just a dummy character that could be also killed and this sideObj would fail then)
• find enemy intelligence (map, document) and deliver it to your commander
• cut/repair the communication cables (could disable/enable the command VOIP channel)
• clear a minefield as engineer
• destroy AA guns (air support a few hundreds of meters around it would be unavailable until done so)

...or any other interesting stuff. There could be several of them all around the OFFENSIVE map and if the tickets would be a thing, succeeding in each could also give/take tickets into/from the spawnpoints located in such an objective's area.

Actually, I guess I will make this a thread later.

[wind shore]

I hope would be unique skins of Postman and some DLC certain locked only on Danzig map, just 1-2 uniforms

Some standard one, and polish faction

Postman - I meant and it’s own

[oak current]

The Purposes of Objective Mode and this PTE
To dive further into the scope of what Hell Let Loose could be, by utilizing mechanics that aren’t centred around Capture Points and territory control
To gauge community interest in the mechanics and setups of the maps presented in these modes. We are particularly keen to hear your thoughts on:

A 25 v 25 environment
The map sizes
The TNT mechanic
The destruction gameplay loop
The PTE is to also test the concept of destruction/objective-focused goals. Those up there are the 4 main testing concerns.

[analog apex]

That may be, but OFFENSIVE could use this on a large map and to differentiate itself more enough from WARFARE.

[oak current]

Mans not reading what I'm writing. They are testing how people enjoy the concept of an objective-focused goal. that it was made originally for its own thing is just secondary.

[analog apex]

I do, but I don't intend to post this into the PTE feedback section.

This feedback here is OBJECTIVE related, but not necessarily PTE related.

About OBJ-PTE related feedback I will probably post something that it's not bad, but unnecesary. The effort for making a new gamemode like this could have been put somewhere else... no matter if made (allegedly) just by 1 dev.

And about one of the topics - HLL doesn't need 25vs25 to begin with as it's against the game's spirit and also it creates problems for players when server will be changing from large maps to small ones. Or to pay for another server just for that. Either way, it doesn't make much sense.

What I fear... if the "experiment" with the small maps would be successful (whatever that means because I do not know what's the measurment here), the devs might decide to start working on more smaller maps like this, while ignoring the main big ones HLL is about primarily. And that would be bad.

[arctic rampart]

Yup, I agree on those points quite a bit.
Also, I think it'll be a headache to remember each of the details about the different rulesets to mechanics to each of the gamemodes

[analog apex]

That too. But I am trying to see what the goal of the devs is. Overall, HLL was always supposed to be about large battlegrounds. SKIRMISH already went against it, it isn't being played much at all. The Soviets don't have a single SKIRMISH map yet and we are already testing another one with even smaller areas and lower playerNumbers that includes destruction mechanics... mechanics that should have been in OFFENSIVE instead and easily tested there too.
It's rly hard to see what the long-term plans are regarding all this stuff.

[craggy steppe]

Doom to fail. Hope they focus on improving offensive after this...

[analog apex]

that would be nice

[vestal spear]

that 1 spawn on the beach map is quite brutal

[hollow pelican]

@shell spire StandardD on kehari

[analog apex]

honestly, on the beach OFFENSIVEs the defenders should have limited amount of respawns because especially Utah beach is even more brutal than Omaha. If the attackers aka US would killed many enough of Germans, they should stop endlessly coming. Which brings us again to... local tickets.

When the Germans get setup to cover the beach, for the US it's just 30m of suffering without being able to do anything at all.

[wind shore]

It’s not about the win

Always about the win the game, about this point

It is yes, but it is historically accurate how you landing on the Normandy beach

[analog apex]

far from accurate when it comes to Utah beach

[wind shore]

Why

[analog apex]

as I said - it's even more brutal than Omaha... in HLL

[wind shore]

Why it is far from accurate

Utah?

[analog apex]

because in HLL it is a bigger meatgrind than on Omaha

because of the distances and beach width

[wind shore]

I would say the only thing it is innacurate , that it should have more players on that map like Omaha’s, about 300+

Or 400+ players for map like Omaha would be nice

[analog apex]

yep, but not unlimited like it is

hence, limited amount of respawns

[wind shore]

The distance is accurate

[wind shore]

400+ players storming Omaha beach, 200 on defend, 200+ on 3 sectors on the same moment

[analog apex]

I didn't mean that the place is inacurately portraited in HLL. Just that it's aspects make it a bigger meatgrind than on Omaha, because Omaha is bigger than Utah and provides some distance between US and GER.

On Utah, the GER are much closer to the US and can get them from the easy to get camped positions.

[wind shore]

Yes it is, but I see no problem with Utah

It is okay

[analog apex]

You maybe didn't try it as US.

because it's rly easy to lock it down and give the US no chance

[wind shore]

I tried it, but I’m not complaining if I lose the game

I just play the game and enjoy

Sounds like skill issue

[wind shore]

And anyways it is fun, you can lead you squad like it was real in Utah, make normal defensive position and after take the point

I like landings from the US side it is funny and only thing I miss, that it is the limit of players on Omaha and Utah, it were more bigger

And when I see the other sectors is empty it is more problem for me

Feeling not enough immersive for Omaha

[analog apex]

hardly if we won't get out of the boats alive... I would expect that more on Omaha but not Utah

[wind shore]

Do you know that it was in real like this?

Yes it was just the bloodiest amphibious operation

[analog apex]

do you know what the casualty rates were on Utah compared to Omaha?

[wind shore]

Utah probably less

fr

[analog apex]

then why the GER have so much more kills on the beach part each time I play it, comparing to Omaha

[wind shore]

But US landed on the boats

It is not way just to teleport them, or if, it wouldn’t be Utah

I enjoy from that moment when boats coming and I die

It is real battle, how it was, you getting bullets of course

[analog apex]

ofc in the boats, why would anybody want them to teleport? I know I never said it nor meant it that way.

But when the US manage to keep killing the Germans but are locked down despite that (very easy to do even by 1 MG), and that's why they should be rewarded - the GER should have limited amount of respawns... that's what I am trying to tell.

Simply put - the US being able to cap the beach by killing off x amount of the defenders. Otherwise the GER will always keep coming back and keeping locking the beach down no matter how many GER die.

[wind shore]

I think better way to play Utah or Omaha, would be increase the number of players above 400+ , that would be epic. Each sectors would be filled by players and of course more chance to survive in this situation

[analog apex]

which is ofc not possible due tech limitations, hence we need to get it simulated via respawn numbers

[wind shore]

I passed this point already

On Utah , it was not easy yes but it was funny

[analog apex]

The goal of GER having limited beach point respawns would be to keep the brutal feeling for the US at the beginning for few maybe 10 minutes, but when the GER start to be killed off, allow the US to advance and play the rest of the objectives normally.

[wind shore]

But I like Utah not for it, I don’t like Utah at all, cause it is about hedgerows

[analog apex]

Normandy IS about the hedgerows

[wind shore]

Those fields it is always long distances , on those maps were nothing except those fields

[wind shore]

Yes, I know, it was always like that

They fought in hedgerows

[analog apex]

my simple point - to give the US at the OFFENSIVE beach have some prospect other than playing all 30 minutes on the beach no matter if they are killing the Germans or not

If they do, give them a chance. If they don't... they deserve those 30 minutes of suffering 😄

It's the HLL's ultimate problem... unlimited respawning, unlimited ammo and unlimited spawnpoints.

here we woud laddress it at least a bit so the gamemode gets more balanced **without **taking the key thing from it... the suffering at the beach

[wind shore]

I don’t like beach maps, but I play them

I meant , I’m not saying that those maps should be changed until it wouldn’t be look like Normandy

Or complaining about the map, I think it is cool

[analog apex]

landscape has nothing to do with the beach problem

[wind shore]

Yes, somebody before said about PHL that it is bad

[analog apex]

there is no beach at PHL

nor beach offensive

are you changing the subject?

[cyan saddle]

Sam trying his very best not to kick something I can tell

[wind shore]

I think that Utah it is not about the kills

And it is about offensive mode

[analog apex]

you are missing my point completely, I never said it was

[wind shore]

So why make sense limit spawns to Germans and it would be an advantage trick in gameplay for US for that map

Cause nobody getting limited spawns

[analog apex]

not for that map! just for the beach part!

and play the rest of the objectives normally

[wind shore]

Yes, and they would pass this point more easily

It is an advantage

So to get win it is trick

[analog apex]

but only if they would kill enough of the GER. If not... it stays hard for the US as it is.

[wind shore]

Yes it is hard

It is cool that it is hard, cause it is real Utah landing

Or do you think it was so easy to land in Utah in 1944, I think not

[analog apex]

and here we are again at the start

[wind shore]

And in game you can feel in this boat

[analog apex]

utah is not suppsoed to be as bloody as Omaha, yet it is more bloody than Omaha in HLL

[wind shore]

I just on Utah take machine gunners

[analog apex]

I honestly give up, I tried my best to deliver the point, yet it keeps escaping you.

[wind shore]

Pass throw the beach on the other side, build garrison and that’s all

[wind shore]

I understand your point

But u cares about the kills and win, but it is not about this

[analog apex]

then why you always start talkign about something else? First hedgerows, then boats, then teleporting...

nothing to do with any of what I was tryign to say

[analog apex]

HLL is a game. You can play it for fun, but a game as such needs to have some balanced chances when it comes to achieving the goals.

[wind shore]

But I feel ok about Utah

And all maps

Also El Alamein , and Remagen

[analog apex]

whatever you say... man, I rly give up

[wind shore]

I never complained about them

For me it’s just ok and funny to play Remagen also , just 1 thing it is lags

[wind shore]

Yes and limit the spawns will not be funny when commander will shout just not to die

[analog apex]

you subjectivelly dont' see any problem, but objectivelly there IS a problem, on Remagen it is the meatgrind
but whatever, I am outta here

[wind shore]

So play Kharkov

It is just more open, and has no tiny place like bridges

[analog apex]

you are not getting it

the endless meatgrind is not supposed to be a thing

why should I play Kharkov if the Remagen could be just as good if gamemode rules fixed?

[wind shore]

Cause it was more in real historically balanced

[analog apex]

you are either not getting it, or are intentionally doing it on purpose... I don't know. See ya.

[wind shore]

I’m getting it, but if it was in Remagen that bridge, so why it is in game if it could be Caen for example, not to add at all Remagen. It is like this

I’m not complaining about those maps , again, but other players saying that it should be - Remagen, and in the same moment ask to remove this map

It is big contradiction for me

[analog apex]

there is no problem with the maps, just with how the gamemode is being setup which creates problems

[wind shore]

Spawn camping is also problem

When you spawn at outpost or garrison and you die instantly

It should be protected dugouts

[analog apex]

that's up to the player to calculate the risk... knowign where his OP is and if the enemies are nearby

[wind shore]

Yes and some people place an MG and waiting for the spawn

Or waiting until players will spawn

It is playing with game mechanics

It could be also protected by 3-5 seconds

So you can take cover or run from the outpost or garrison

[finite berry]

Had the same feeling, hahaha

[pine ember]

Man real Kindergarten happening in here

[analog apex]

https://tenor.com/view/willem-defoe-creepy-smile-gif-18146639864090414304

[analog apex]

or take aim at the enemy without minding his incoming fire thx to the spawnProtection and headshot tapping him, right
no!

and with knowing this, next time to build an OP in middle of an open field, knowing one is safe to spawn and safe to kill anybody we spot afterwards even if he's not spawncamping... right? 😏

Anyway, if one spawns on a spawncamped OP or garri and dies, can't be helped. If the one however tries again and gets killed again and again and again... that's just his own personal stupidity that is to blame. Such players should not be catered. Always depends on the specific implementation of stuff in a game, but such spawn protection should have no place in HLL. Not even at the HQ since there are 3 of them.

And if everything is spawncamped and nobody has nowhere to spawn (an extreme case only), then the team is doing something seriously wrong (not many enough spawnpoints or built in bad/open spots) and deserves nothing else than a quick defeat.

[worthy charm]

I dont buy this.😂

Sam gonna smash his table.

[analog apex]

No worries I will have it on sale next weekend 😄

But honestly, I wasn't angry or anything... just so superExhausted after that discussion.

[worthy charm]

I could maybe an Ebay reference, but only germans would get it so I rather just dont do it.

[worthy charm]

insert super earth gif

[cosmic pilot]

There being problems in the game mode is what makes it interesting to play.
Right, the fundamental problem of warfare is you cannot attack and defend equally at the same time, but it's precisely this conundrum that makes warfare the more popular mode.

What is a problem, is not having the proper tools to solve those problems.

Give us more tools/toys to solve the tactical problem.

This is why I do not fundamentally have a problem with the grid system

[low sundial]

[analog apex]

if we had non-square shaped sectors, we would have the tool right there. Certain strongpoints are not possible to flank not because of natural tactical opportunities, but just because of a straight line the devs drawn on the map. A line that decides if a spawnpoint can be built there or not. I consider that a pretty visible problem.

Sector straight lines, strongpoint locations in relation to the given sector vs spawnpopint placement & garri restrictions - those are true problems when it comes to the gamemode vs map.

[cosmic pilot]

Unequal strong point locations because of a straight line is "necessary" so that you can have variety and not every strong point is the same.

Part of the problem with the newer maps is to SPs are too uniformly centrally located which makes them feel the same.

[analog apex]

No, because it should be the map assets that make it different (presence of cover, houses, trees, bushes...), not a straight line drawn by the devs.

Some strongpoints have it bad placement for one team, greatly favouring the other... and if that SP is located also on the far side, then that's not a variety, that's a bad design.

[arctic rampart]

You're both kind of right

[analog apex]

This bad design amplifies in the OFFENSIVE gamemode - if the strongpoint is located on the far side, favouring the defenders, the attackers have to get all the way over there just to start capping. While other points are right on the line.

Another big one for OFFENSIVE are the 1st objectives - some are impossible for the defenders to reach in time, some are the exact opposite for the attackers. Again, that's not a variety, that's a bad design.

Imagine you are playing cards game of poker... in one game the dealer gives you only up to 4 cards and in another up to 5 while your opponents will always have 5. Fair?

Hardly, because with 4 cards only, you can't get combinations like straight flush, royal flush etc.

Different game, but the core logic stays the same - the gamemode rules differ so much in HLL, that it's not even fair either.

[heady hornet]

wasnt the non reachable first cap point a later design choices by the devs, by moving the default garries further back?

[analog apex]

not rly

They were not moved back - for some objectives they have been just too close and for others too far. It has always been that way, sadly.

And to be honest, they feel completely random without any system in their placement.

[cosmic pilot]

It's not straight bad design.
With 15 strong points per map who said each one should be perfectly fair for both sides?

Your argument essentially boils down to, even if you don't realize it, "sectors are bad because I can't redzone Garrison teleport the entire team from whatever direction I want".

You need to have tactical problems in your game created by consistent rules governing what the player can do.

"This is a problem therefore it's bad" is an incorrect way to look at things

Is the entire mid row of remagen a problem? Yes.
Does that mean it's badly designed? No.

[analog apex]

Your argument essentially boils down to, even if you don't realize it, "sectors are bad because I can't redzone Garrison teleport the entire team from whatever direction I want".
Not rly. The point is that some SPs are so far that the team that holds such a point with an SP on the far side, it prevents the attackers from building usable garrisons at all since all of them are forced to be placed in the red territory (and disabled by any 1 enemy hidden anywhere). This problem wouldn't be there if the sectors would have fluid shape that would follow the cover or other natural aspects of the map (a compound border, trench, hedgerow...).

*With 15 strong points per map who said each one should be perfectly fair for both sides? *
It's one thing to have an SP that favours one side more than the other. But it's another thing when the difference is mindblowing big.

"This is a problem therefore it's bad" is an incorrect way to look at things
If the difference is too big, it is a problem and if it is a problem, then it's bad by the definition.

Is the entire mid row of remagen a problem? Yes. Does that mean it's badly designed? No.
This is another topic - the endless meatgrinder. Especially with such a narrow passageway like the bridge, it is the absence of any kind of limited respawns that makes it stalemate with a lots of dead corpses on both sides. Therefore badly designed, but in this case, it is about the respawns as they are unlimited and dying doesn't matter. Endless throwing bodies at the objective... can't be called a good gamemode design even in general (at least not in a large-scale tacShooters).

[covert elbow]

The bridge middle point on remagen is absolutely a problem lmao. It’s quite litteraly luck based if you win on that map because of the mid point

[worthy charm]

I could imagine Remagen as a very cool objective gamemode map. You could cut it in 3 parts, first one being 2 points to capture. The second one could be to hold the bridge for a certain amount of time (if the germans can do that the bridge is destroyed with a cool animation maybe 🥺 ) and the last one like 4 AA guns on the cliff.

Sure would make for some good gameplay

[nova pivot]

Yes

Very Isonzo like

[covert elbow]

Ah that would be so amazing. Lovely idea Willy

Said it before, this game has a ton of potential. It’s a shame it’s almost all squandered

[analog apex]

And in case of destroyed bridge maybe a near-impossible objective for the US... a pontoon bridge?

but that's just a random thought

[worthy charm]

There are a lot of possibilitys

[analog apex]

and that's why the devs will keep it as it is 😄

[covert elbow]

Cheese and Willy in the VC? What’s going on in there

[finite berry]

Something cheesy if you will.

sorry

[worthy charm]

We killed some bots

[covert elbow]

Nice

[worthy charm]

#off-topic-mess-hall message

Im not bored anymore so that was successful

[empty steppe]

We were spreading democracy

[empty steppe]

:0

[worthy charm]

@empty steppe btw the cake is a mandarin sour cream cake with crumbles on top

so really no cheesecake 😅

[empty steppe]

That sounds pretty fire 🔥

[empty steppe]

Good 🤨

I may have committed cannibalism yesterday 😔

[worthy charm]

Scandalous

[empty steppe]

🫣

[empty steppe]

MY BAD

[nova pivot]

It's all a lie 🥺

[river rover]

ℹ️ **AMD Adrenalin Edition 25.6.1 GPU Driver released.**ℹ️

[wind shore]

Free weekend?

[river rover]

Just happened to see it on one of my sites I frequent. 😉

[wind shore]

Okay !

[visual niche]

I don't remember you approving an Xbox free weekend @river rover 🤔

[nocturne hinge]

Low levels inbound

Anyways, back to

[covert elbow]

F**k

[gentle lintel]

LANGUAGE FILTER EVASION 🚨

[real parrot]

https://tenor.com/view/my-beloved-beloved-tax-fraud-gif-25476792

Tax evasion my beloved

[wind shore]

[covert elbow]

https://tenor.com/view/what-you-gonna-do-mad-southpark-fight-gif-4931278

[slate canopy]

(╯°Д°)╯︵/(.□ . )

[oak current]

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

[empty steppe]

“Pulls mg-42 out, we’re so back”

[robust wyvern]

Anybody know if Garrisons and Whiskey has a discord? There is a player I want to let them know about. You know the type, constantly saying the n-word, saying he hates the Jews, etc.

[slate canopy]

I don't know if they have a set server? I know The Outposts does seeding with them. Lemme see if I can find some information.

[slate canopy]

Are you still in the server?

[robust wyvern]

No

[slate canopy]

Ahh, i was gonna recommend seeing if they had a !admin command.

[slate canopy]

I think I found it. Lemme DM you

[covert elbow]

Those people disturb me…

[empty steppe]

That’s real 😅

[analog apex]

I believe they were just playing Helldivers together... probably. Both of their profile statuses showed that active game at the time.

[wind shore]

Give Germans Volkswagen schwimmwagen

And it would solve the problem

[covert elbow]

NIH uh

[wind shore]

Was no pontoon bridge

In Remagen

[empty steppe]

Why has this been made such a big event 🤣

[analog apex]

In that case would be better if the bridge jsut remained destroyed the way that infantry would be able to get through its ruins to the other side... but no vehicles anymore.

Or to straight end the match otherwise.

[wind shore]

This is iconic battle

So pantoon bridge would destroy the aesthetics of this map

Would be no fighting for that bridge anymore

And this iconic battle will turns just everybody would run in pontoon bridge

Maximum - give Germans schwimmwagen

So they could easily swim

[analog apex]

In any case, this is a game where the possibilities of turns of events may be different - therefore destroying the bridge would be OK the same as pontoons as there were engineers that could have done it if it happened (if they decided to ofc).

It's the same like with objective on any other map... for instance the US is free to fail to capture the Brecourt in HLL despite it didn't happen that way historically. Does that mean we should make that objective non-capturable too for the GER? Ofc not. The same with the destruction of the Remagen bridge - didn't happen, but could have happened.

[noble stone]

People just want an easy way out of maps they don’t like or mechanics they don’t like until they get that easy way out and the games are ending fast as hell

[analog apex]

you don't seem to be knowing what the topic is about - it continues to the yesterday's discussion about the OFFENSIVE and physical objectives in it

[wind shore]

So better to play eastern front maps and Africa

It is so balanced

[analog apex]

it's not about making the game easier, but the gamemode to become more distinct and interesting when comparing to WARFARE

[wind shore]

No tiny places no bridges

[noble stone]

Don’t need to

[analog apex]

that's just an opinion too

[noble stone]

https://tenor.com/view/dumb-and-dumber-jim-carrey-duh-uh-yeah-lloyd-christmas-gif-7940001541646448846

[wind shore]

Yes it is just wants to make game easier to the level when we will turn into ameba and will know just press click right bottom and it would win the game

So easier on the level when we will just join the game, click - win option, and we will be happy

[analog apex]

OFFENSIVE is way too similar to WARFARE, the only visible difference is 1-way capping and no softcap, but all the principles are way too much the same

[wind shore]

It is more intense combat

In offensive

In warfare both teams just walking on the map

[analog apex]

if OFFENSIVE got physical objectives in addition to cap circles, woudl become much better

[wind shore]

Which physical objectives

[analog apex]

and if fulfiling those physical objectives would give some rewards to one or the other team, woudl be even better

[analog apex]

non circleCap stuff (destroying something, clearing up obstacles for the tanks, defusing minefields, defusing some preplaced explosives for example n the Remagen bridge)...

destroying AA gun would allow sending the other team air support in that area only afterwards

many ways to make OFFENSIVE to get more interesting stuff it deserves as a separate gamemode

currently the gamemode is way too simplistic & binary

[desert owl]

It’s a solid core

[analog apex]

yep, a solid core that could use to get something built upon it

[noble stone]

The game plays hard enough as it is with ignorant blueberries you wanna put more on their shoulders on top of that in offensive where half of them think they can still cap the next point if they’re defending it’s never gonna work

[analog apex]

People just want an easy way out of maps they don’t like or mechanics they don’t like until they get that easy way out and the games are ending fast as hell
I agree with the replied statement of yours, but against your newest comment right above 😄

now it suddenly got hard for you 😄

[noble stone]

How did that get hard for me lol

[analog apex]

first you said it was an easy way out of maps, but when the same thing we talked about up there, talking about down here, your statement changed

[noble stone]

My first statement was saying if people don’t like maps they always complain to the devs to change this or do that that’s what I was saying my other statement is something else

[analog apex]

then that statement was completely misplaced as that wasn't the topic at all to begin with... so I just don't get it

[noble stone]

Two statements about two different things

[wind shore]

Yes about AA guns

Not be able to use the air ability for commander

[analog apex]

Anyway, I wouldn't see it becoming any harder for the "blueberries" - those physical objectives could be just optional extras, in additional to the mandatory cap zones.

To spice things up.

Could help if completed, but wouldn't necesarily prevent from winning.

[desert owl]

Going to feel more like a campaign if you want it to

[noble stone]

Talking about the addition of pontoons on Remagen is an easy way out but my bad I guess that’s a whole other topic even though it still applies and then you’d have those blueberries that would just be attacking those objectives

[analog apex]

you didn't read the whole stuff again

I was talking about the pontoon only if the bridge would have gotten destroyed

[noble stone]

Which it didn’t

[analog apex]

again you didn't read another stuff I wrote before

[noble stone]

I get what you said

You want a game where history can change

Things could’ve should’ve would’ve happen

What if this happened

What if that happened

But it didn’t and that’s what we got so it’s the map and things we got

[analog apex]

didn't, but could have

Germans also didn't hold the guns at Brecourt but it happens easily in HLL. Because it is a game and some kind of alternate possibilities for the historical combat scenarios are normal and just fine.

It is the very same thing, just with the bridge.

It is the thing with everythign we are fighting for in HLL, so no idea why you are so hard against the bridge when it is that way everywhere else already...

doesn't make sense

anyway, I gtg shopping so see ya

[noble stone]

Destroying a whole bridge compared to holding brecourt is like a whole different animal I get what you’re saying but come on

Would prolly make a lotta peoples games crash 💀

[silk igloo]

The bridge did collapse though.

[analog apex]

Even a little code change can cause a crash. If any devs would ever follow this logic of yours and wouldn't do any stuff because of the constant fear of what a new content or a change could do, we wouldn't have a game to play at all.

Size of the objective doesn't matter - it could be done well, and it could be done bad. The same as anything else in the game.

[noble stone]

Im not saying dont add new stuff Jesus Christ get a load of this guy

[analog apex]

I didn't either - I was connecting it to what you said about if the bridge gets destroyed that it would cause a crash.

[noble stone]

It’s just opinions vs opinions man

And I mean yeah every new map has problems or things that make it crash that take time to fix you’re right just feel like the bridge collapsing especially on console would be a whole different story but I get that you’re pc so that’s not your problem

I love the game and regardless of what they do to it I’m still gonna play it so hey if they do everything you’ve said I’ll still play lol

[analog apex]

Maybe, but you seem to be the 1st guy that wouldn't want actual objectives in the game. Or at least, one of the very few. Because over the course of HLL's history, multiple people were coming with the ideas of having something more than capping some circles. And never advocating for the circles pretty much.

So when it comes to the 2 of us, let's just agree to disagree and move on.

[noble stone]

I just think each individual game mode should stay the same and then the objective game mode should come in like it’s gonna it’s not that I don’t want objectives I feel like I got that whole part mixed up my bad

[analog apex]

All good you didn't mix up in this one. The thing is that the ideas of having the actual physical objectives that came from the people, usually didn't want a separate gamemode for it and mostly assumed it could get into OFFENSIVE.

Now, the OBJECTIVE mode no matter how it will be, as a smaller gamemode may likely end up just as badly as the SKIRMISH did. We shall see...

[noble stone]

Hope not the Brecourt one looks good but I mean you never know

[wind shore]

It would be like Band of Brothers

New objective mode on Brecourt Manor

Would be nice , it is very cool

[analog apex]

I expected though that for instance if the mode would be that small, it would heve a separate map for it, meaning: it wouldn't be just the same place from the big map, but a separate one made of additional assets and maybe quality that is not possible to have on the large map because it's... large. For instance, grass with large rendering distance, maybe denser hedgerows to be liek in reality and stuff liek that.

But it seems it's rly going to be just a cutout from the large map without any changes in the playable area.

I ofc noticed they added some little compound / 3 houses to the far west of Brecourt (area which on large map is actually out of bounds), but the rest seems to be the same. We'll see when we get to test it today...

[analog apex]

Another thing I kind of hoped they would do - open the Brecourt manor building again after long time at this occasion. But I guess they didn't.

[wind shore]

I hope it would give this vibe of this film

[wind shore]

It was building?

[analog apex]

Yep, it used to be open and fully accessible, all its rooms on all its floors, including the bard that is connected to the manor itself. All was open.

[wind shore]

It is already in game, near Brecourt Manor - those little farm

[wind shore]

Oh really? It was with interior?

[analog apex]

full interiors yes

[wind shore]

Do you have screen shots?

Can you share it in channel please

[analog apex]

I might have it on my SMdM v1 video, lemme check I will post it here with the time link so you don't have to search for too long (it's a long video)

[wind shore]

Ok

[analog apex]

https://youtu.be/p6nBO7aziuY?t=3089

[wind shore]

AND THIS IS THE SAME BUILDING which is on SMD NOW?

Why it is locked 😦

It looks more interesting with open interior

P.S. it was locked hood

Now it was opened again

Yard

[analog apex]

yep - same building, just today has no interiors and is inaccessible altogether

sry for a late response, our whole block lost electricity

yep the yard was much more open back then as it look very different

[wind shore]

Oh I thought it would be today PTE

it is on Saturday

[silk igloo]

PTE is in 7 hours, tomorrow is some event