#more visible mines

184 messages Β· Page 1 of 1 (latest)

idle orbit
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please i have myopia, it's like impossible to see

ashen scroll
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even bigger red spinny lights

shadow spade
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Any suggestions to make them more visible?

idle orbit
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some way to highlight the mines like a brighter aura or a literal highlight

shadow spade
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Sure a quick mod could fix that as a temp fix until Walt looms into more accessibility options

idle orbit
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i would do that but i have zero experience with technical stuff

shadow spade
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Shouldn't be that hard, if a brighter light works then that could easily be done, I could do that but no time ATM

dense stirrup
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if you have a sensor on your ship it can highlight mines

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how about that

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sounds balanced enough

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just highlight it with a green square around the mine and maybe a word above that saying MINE

daring gyro
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good enough

wispy charm
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Good idea let’s make it so you have to spend more on your ship if you have a visual impairment

daring gyro
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True

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Let's remove mines 😈

vocal kiln
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make the red sweeping light brighter and saturated

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right now the color of the light is just too faded that if you are bit zoomed out u cant see it well not to mention if you get the red space bg its even harder

subtle horizon
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faint red ring

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that lets you see the actual range

dense stirrup
shadow spade
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This isn't a balance issue, it's an accesability issue

idle orbit
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^this is an accessibility issue

dense stirrup
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idk how but i don't realise it until somebody tells me it makes no sense

somber crater
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So now you know, grab a mine ship against Kawa for added emotional daaamage, very effective!

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I am kidding sorry Kawa

somber crater
dense stirrup
somber crater
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Well I did and Saris got a good chuckle out of it ;~;

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#ships message

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Undaminah

tough walrus
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𝚚𝚊𝚠𝚊 πš’πš–πš–πšŠ πš˜πš—πš•πš’ 𝚞𝚜𝚎 πš–πš’πš—πšŽπšœ πšŠπšπšŠπš’πš—πšœπš 𝚞 πš—πš˜πš LUL

somber crater
keen lotus
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Mines should be more obvious, but in turn last longer, that way they are actually viable

ashen arrow
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Aren't the point of mines to be hidden, then explode when your opponent least expects it?

maiden merlin
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the problem is that they're only hidden to some people

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also when they're used like actual mines they r unfun to play against and to use

maiden merlin
keen lotus
somber crater
maiden merlin
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back in classic they were also awful to fight

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and to use

woeful willow
maiden merlin
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i liked the classic mod's red range circles around them

idle orbit
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thought i'd post this clip to show how hard it is to see mines

ashen arrow
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theyre hard to see when they just launch

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then they glow and are easier to see

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if you look closely you can see them when you first glow

idle orbit
ashen arrow
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thats when they just start glowing

idle orbit
gray tiger
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Make mines unseeable unless you have sensor for all

maiden merlin
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no

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how to make cancer in mp 101

idle orbit
languid arch
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As much as I love accesibility and all, mines are that weird spot where the solution is its own issue and its intended use as well

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If you make them more visible, they fail at their job.
If you make them invisible, they become annoying.
If you alienate their concept, they are no longer "mines".

pulsar wharf
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Make mines very visible but only when nearby?

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It would also probably make them better at zoning for most situations and make a better soft counter for monothrust ships that are bad at turning

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Since monothrust is kinda the meta rn and kinda boring

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As for the distance idk but a good bit shorter than normal fog of war

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Mines were always bad and one of the albeit less problematic counters is to just avoid a minefield so at least making it take more effort to do that could make it better at zoning

gray tiger
maiden merlin
maiden merlin
maiden merlin
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i don't think any of u have ever seen effective mine use

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lack of visibility only makes it cancerous

ashen scroll
languid arch
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The reasoning becomes "Why would you deal with them when you can outright avoid them"

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And that translates to annoying

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Why? because it either works, or it doesn't

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I personally believe mines don't have a place in Cosmoteer, from a 'weaponry' standpoint.

maiden merlin
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space creation and in conjunction w/ tb/rammers

languid arch
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(That took a while)

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You say space creation, but it deletes itself after a very small while, while at the same time its not visible enough for some people and that not only is unfair, but also their intended purpose

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Can we go back to the concept of a minefield?

Almost undetectable explosions. If you have time to avoid them, they don't work and are a waste of time. If you can simply tank them, they don't work and are a waste of time. If they DO work, the only purpose for them is to be spammed to no end, and that would be dumb and unfun.

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There is realistically no way to balance mines because their concept is flawed.

idle orbit
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well i mean it could serve as great area denial

maiden merlin
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that encourages unfun tactics

maiden merlin
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nukes probably do that better now though

daring gyro
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I believe that we should remove mines and replace them with something that isn't a hit or miss, or a better hit or miss

maiden merlin
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nukes:

ashen scroll
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nukes aren't even remotely similar to mines

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if its unfun for mines to just be an unmoving area of denial, what if it were a shifting area of denial?

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they could slowly move in some way, possibly

pulsar wharf
pulsar wharf
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I think that if mines were say, invisible until nearby, they could serve as a much more effective area denial tool. Mines are already quite devastating when they actually hit so you never want to outright tank them anyways

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They could use a duration buff to fit a long term area denial role

maiden merlin
maiden merlin
idle orbit
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as in it punishes enemy movement

idle orbit
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(my opponent had zero clue what killed until i said it was mines..)

ashen arrow
idle orbit
maiden merlin
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that's the intended purpose imo but it would be better if u could actually see what was happening

idle orbit
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(it also somehow got thorugh the shields lol)

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but the point was that they're basically invisible

ashen arrow
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i play with fancy lighting on so it might be easier for me idk

maiden merlin
spark plover
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if the issue with this is accessibility just add an option in the settings to change mines visual for disability.

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otherwise just make the mines blend in less with back ground

daring gyro
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the problem is that mines suck because you can't use them reliably and because the enemy could die and not know why

safe charm
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They could be marked on the radar, or they could have tiny bright blinking lights on them that would show up as the same tiny blinking lights even when zoomed out. So you can see the minefield as clearly as christmas lights.

unkempt vale
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sensors giving mines a small glow could be nice, I think mines can be more visible and given a buff so that they allow for some interesting offensive plays

ashen arrow
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lol i see how theyre hard to see now

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someone didnt see how they blew up just like your clip

maiden merlin
unkempt vale
idle orbit
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as from a balance standpoint, i think that increasing the number of shrapnel instead of increasing the damage stat would be preferable

maiden merlin
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why though

idle orbit
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it punishes bad movement far more than careful movement

maiden merlin
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how?

idle orbit
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more shrapnel = more damage dealt at centre, spread out damage away from cenetre

maiden merlin
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not really? it would do the same as just upping the damage

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would just be more consistent

idle orbit
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just returned from eating and thought about it, yeah idk what i was thinking

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it is more consistent tho so that'd still be preferable

wispy charm
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halving damage per projectile and upping projectile count would do what youre talking about, but i fear for lag

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in my opinion, mines should be used as an area denial weapon. unless dealt with by flak or pd (and spending valuable time not staring down your enemy) they should be there for good.

the visual aspect of mines right now is interesting. bad players seem to complain that you can just run through a field of mines without ever seeing them (and thats understandable, especially with people with visual impairments) but it splits opinion on them making people thing they were designed for stealth.

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mines should be (in my opinion, obviously everyone elses will differ) a weapon that is seen and known to exist, and the goal to fight against it is to pilot around it. they shouldnt be a wile-e-coyote painted wall that players run into thinking that they are stars in the background.

daring gyro
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But is we make them visible then it wont be a warcrime πŸ₯Ί /j

spark plover
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what if mines once launched are less visible as they are now for a period of time. Then they flag up on the enemies screen. Or maybe they are less visible while they get armed

idle orbit
maiden merlin
spark plover
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oh i dont know how mines work

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i thought they instantly armed like a missile

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i just know they are hard to look

maiden merlin
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pro tip understand how the thing works before giving feedback

spark plover
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dont be a jerk

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im giving a sugestionm

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I also mean they appear as a blip sort of like enemies on the radar

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so they actually are more visible

maiden merlin
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that won't help bc most ppl won't be zoomed all the way out

spark plover
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they dont have to be

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its just a small red dot in place of a mine

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when you zoom in really close you can see the actual mine

unkempt vale
maiden merlin
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mines do more damage than lc

unkempt vale
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oh oops

maiden merlin
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w/ large damage explosions (which would need to be like nukes) it would ahve the problem of being even more disproportionate against speed (since fast ships will allow the splod to phase through it) and will also be laggier than just projectiles

unkempt vale
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it will be more laggier? sheesh, there’s no winning against this lag thing

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I’m sure someone somewhere figured out a better way to sync shrapnel in simulation games, I’ve got no examples on my hand though. But yeah I’m back on buffing shrapnel count or shrapnel damage

maiden merlin
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current problem is a) they're hard to see when deployed and b) very inconsistent damage (can 1shot most fast things, 0 damage to slow stuff)

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a can be fixed by giving it a glow/highlight/whatever, b can be fixed by making it home or increasing shrapnel speed

unkempt vale
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faster shrapnel still causes issues, but yeah I think it’s a good approach; fewer projectiles with more damage makes mines even more RNG, but can actually damage some slow ships instead of causing low damage

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farther trigger radius?

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along with faster shrapnel and higher shrapnel density, maybe a slight damage nerf

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fast things still go kaput, but maybe it’s a feature not a bug

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β€œdon’t ram the minelayer” can be a good philosophy for life

maiden merlin
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don't think a damage nerf would be necessary

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look at mines in action

ashen scroll
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yeah mine shrapnel should have a speed increase

subtle horizon
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  • mine shrapnel now is firen in burts of 300
  • mine shrapnel now homes in at 999d
  • mine shrapnel flies at ftl
next shale
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I think more reasonable/accessible solutions to this are make mines very visible for everyone (neon highlight and lights) and have them be an area/ramming denial tool, or make them completely invisible for everyone so everyone is on equal footing (disclaimer, I prefer the very visible solution)

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(Perhaps they're neon highlighted while arming and then go completely invisible)

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I agree the current implementation is definitely not accessibility friendly

pulsar wharf
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The issue then is that mines have a relatively low lifetime and are hard to consistently spread into an area right?

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Fixable at that point ig

maiden merlin
maiden merlin
wintry nacelle
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I'd rather mines be visible and deal more damage than invisible and nearly useless like they are now

next shale
# maiden merlin then it just turns into qol- since u have to memorize

Yeah so I personally prefer the they're very visible, and have longer lifetimes/more damage. I proposed the completely invisible idea in case Walt absolutely wants them to be a stealthy thing and doesn't want them to be more visible. If they're completely invisible then people with fighter jet vision are at the same disadvantage as everyone

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(Or make them completely invisible but putting a sensor array on your ship highlights them in bright neon colors, so there's actually a counter)

maiden merlin
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sensor is still never going to be used unless it would have a sensor anyways

supple onyx
somber crater
maiden merlin
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sensor is just going to be pd:missiles except basically useless

somber crater
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Mhm

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At least PD can do other stuff like deal negligible amounts of damage and help vs stuff like DC and all types of missiles.

subtle horizon
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what if sensors made pd and flak better but not in like dps

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like turret speed and targetsearchespersecond

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and for pd would be reduced spread and more accurately

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short range but still

maiden merlin
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new lag bomb is just a friendly fire cannon w/ 999999999999999 pd attached and a sensor

idle orbit