This item could use some buffs to be on the same level as other options, especially for its price

[stone flume]

Here's an item comparison, one is from the endgame of R2 (Hekawt, requiring only 1 win), and the other is a 3 star R3 item that has a total value of around 24 HAR + needing to beat the secret in the current endgame endless mode.

You trade curse of corruption (on the "worse" item) for Anemia 1 and 10% max health. The are currently no curse of corruption items in R3 so that difference doesn't matter at the moment. Why is this difference so small? I've been looking at Argentum for a while now, but wondering why on earth I would use it over my current offhands Wolfswood Reach or Soulcopper Defender (linked in the first comment).

In both of those matchups I would be trading a heavy amount of melee/projectile or just melee protections - and an impactful amount of speed on the latter AND then also losing out on healing and attack speed, for 25% more damage, which isn't even that needed when most of my R2 melee damage sets have ~100%, that increase is not justified for the huge downsides of this item.

Now the problem comes back again when the R2 debuff is removed, Evening Star is almost objectively better, because I'm assuming that'll be removed before more masterwork stars come out, but even then with the small amount of increase each individual level gives, I'd doubt MW4 Argentum would compete still. (And for what it's worth Evening Star is completely fine balanced in R2 since there's a higher amount of corruption items keeping builds in check)

Either the niche of the item needs to be buffed further and increase the damage upwards of 75-80%, or the nerf to attack speed needs to be removed such that it doesn't inhibit dps capabilities. The other option is to increase the item's defensive stats by removing the anemia, or giving it some other special protections/scaling enchant, but for how high the cost to get this item is, it's sorely disappointing for builds I'd want to use compared to other options in the Ring and before.

[eager raven]

the absolute state of attack damage items especially daggers

I'd use Evening Star to dodge anemia instantly

[uncut basin]

you can say the exact same about crest of the tundra and salazars greed

imo r2 items are too close to low mw r3 rares for the debuff to be removed

id just keep the debuff forever if it was up to me

[eager raven]

the promise for r3 items to be better than r2 items out the gate was handled really well but there's items like these that slip through

[uncut basin]

in the current state, with no debuff youd play the entirety of early r3 in r2 gear

and it isnt supposed to be like that

it stops you from using r3 items since they have to be masterworked to compete with r2 gear

[real pumice]

Gear lock is staying in place for a good while longer, we have no plans to remove it at a “set release point”

I think it’s really healthy for the r3 meta

[scenic rapids]

I personally would take argentums stats over reach, on rogue I would consider that proj prot wasted

[eager raven]

Argentum vs Wolfsblood Tome

[scenic rapids]

Soul copper argues very well against argentum though

[eager raven]

with a 75% SP wand, Wolfsblood is 61.25% magic

[scenic rapids]

As far as the attack damage on your set, you could just swap out the damage on another item to accommodate argentum's damage (say melded for Pelias', which solves the anemia issue)

[wicked finch]

is wolfsblood tome even as egregious as people make it out to be

offhands are weighted the same as any other armor piece yeah

it’s really no different from treads of the hungerer or any generic damage piece

[scenic rapids]

That's the thing, why is it not any different than treads

I personally feel attack damage should be higher than it currently is relative to magic

[inland trellis]

put symbiosis and wolfsblood tome next to each other and they look pretty similar budget wise

until you compare the damage stats

[stone flume]

This item could use some buffs to be on the same level as other options, especially for its price

[inland trellis]

either that or change its niche

they are literally the same item -anemia and like a drop in the bucket of max hp

[eager raven]

as stated above, Wolfsblood used on Mage is stronger then Argentum and is arguably better defensively than Treads

throw attack damage a little extra bone

5-10% buff across the board

Wolfsblood is always mentioned but lord have mercy on whoever compares their melee items to Hycenea's Vinelash

Gallery isn't safe either, consider that Attack/Proj/Magic in r2 is average 2:1:1 ratio

now it's 5:4:4, and if you're Mage it's 5:4:8 with a Gallery wand

[stone flume]

I'm fine with attack damage throughout R3 currently, you can build very defensive sets that still have a large amount of damage, sufficient for regular content. I just think this item's stats are pretty bad

especially considering the price + obtain method

[uncut basin]

please do not increase argentum attack damage

it is already bis by a mile

[compact trail]

I think it’s a fine niche that should be pushed but I also think that r2 lock should be removed/ not put in place at the beginning

[uncut basin]

i really think it should stay

otherwise the meta becomes a hybrid of r2 and r3 items

and then you have to balace 2 regions stats for builds used in 1 region

[stone flume]

I guess I'm fine with the lock staying, but compared to R2 and R3 alternatives, I would never ever use this item, it's stats are way too low for it to be considered, even if the damage is the highest in the region, it isn't necessary for a good build, the other two R3 options I showed have sufficient damage AND a ton of defensive items

[real pumice]

Opening r2 items in r3 would be hell for a very light balance team rn

But yeah the feedback on specific items is good 👍

[scenic rapids]

I would strongly consider argentum especially with aether treads

[stone flume]

I just used the Evening Star comparison to show the difference and use it to springboard into giving feedback about the item

[uncut basin]

its amenia 1

is it that bad

[scenic rapids]

It's not good when compounded with max hp as it's defense

[stone flume]

No, it's anemia 1, -15% attack speed and -3 Melee Protection for... +10% max health and +25-30% damage

[scenic rapids]

And 30% more attack than many other offhand swords

That's a huge deal for me

[stone flume]

That is a terrible trade off imo

[uncut basin]

galeblade moment

[compact trail]

I think galeblade is more wind aspect is bad

[scenic rapids]

I'd use argentum and slot in grace and be alright with it

[stone flume]

Maybe if the rest of your set is like +30% damage, the +30% vs +60% comparison would be much more appealing for those huge debuffs, but when most of my sets consist of +100%, going from +130% to +160% isn't that big and doesn't make a difference for the majority of breakpoints

[scenic rapids]

But you can slot argentum in to drop damage elsewhere? If I happened to use fungal fury on a set and this came out, id gladly drop it. Fury's first strike doesn't boost rogue skills (even though it does make for better one shots, which rogue wants to keep in order to keep up speed), and projectile prot which I do not want on rogue as my stat budget

I do think the price is pretty sharp, but if the tier budget per MW is supposed to be the same then idk what to do about it

[stone flume]

The downfalls of Argentum don't make up for it though, and I don't think you even need that much defence, but that's a whole other can of worms

That -15% attack speed is also an incredibly huge debuff for melee. For a regular 1.6 attack speed sword, that goes down to below 1.4. That is massive for dps

[earnest plover]

Get Aether Threads and you can fix that attack speed issue

[ruby kite]

Aether Threads moment

[earnest plover]

and Arbitrium is not an item you should building around just cuz it has low stats overall