👮ron-discussion

[near schooner]

yes

or national police, depends on what weapon

[smoky cedar]

the riot police is a subdivision for police departments so o agree

[near schooner]

real

[shadow ether]

Why not for each of them?

[near schooner]

lmao. bomba.

[smoky cedar]

Carriers of the vine? It depends because they’re responding to someone who just killed an officer. Other LSPD officers respond too. You can see Sergeant Perez’s crashed cruiser at the start

[frail quartz]

I feel like Carriers of the Vine would justifiably be one of those situations where they could wait for SWAT to be called in since they knew the suspects were armed and hostile and had no reason to believe anyone else was in danger in the building

[shadow ether]

Ides of march they are pretty much first responders who do their job a little too well
Sinuous trail they're there on a warrant
Rust belt is... agreed, should be entirely a FISA raid
Relapse — they are first responders who are too good at it
Hide and seek — FISA outright asked them to get involved

[tough spire]

Ides of March SWAT would never facecheck a heavily fortified position of military veterans. They would use different tactics. Sinuous Trail they have so many better options than going in guns blazing and "surprise we're the cops!"
Rust Belt wouldn't be SWAT as has been discussed already. Carriers of the Vine similar to Ides already has intel that it's a heavily fortified and armed compound. Relapse similar. Hide and Seek I don't care what FISA says.

[near schooner]

honestly dealing with an M249 and heavly trained vets is a really serious and dangerous thing, this would most likely actually get the goverments attention

[smoky cedar]

They don’t use M249’s as far as I can recall

And again at the start they said the whole LSPD is enroute not just swat

[near schooner]

or they would atleast bring a juggernaut just for that 1 guy or just go german mode and gas the whole building

[near schooner]

special suspects, doesnt always spawn

there can be two of em

[smoky cedar]

Waco Siege

[near schooner]

speak english

[smoky cedar]

It is English

[near schooner]

speak normalised english

[tough spire]

https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=Waco+Siege

[near schooner]

oh, thanks george

[smoky cedar]

The Waco factory was sieged/raided and gassed by the ATF, FBI and SWAT back in the late 1990s as I can recall

[near schooner]

oh

thanks pookie

[smoky cedar]

It was hours long standoff and im pretty sure the military was involved

As far as I can recall they also used tanks

[shadow ether]

How would they do it for barricaded military vets who took hostages?

Sinuous trail I think they didn't have time to wait for them, since they were actively destroying evidence

Carriers of the vine is an officer down response

Relapse is a 911 response, they got there first and did it well

Hide and seek maybe that's why it's the last mission, D platoon gets fukken fired

[near schooner]

why was spider a SWAT responce

[frail quartz]

It was a search/arrest warrant

[near schooner]

thats an easy national police responce. theres no need for swat

[shadow ether]

It was a warrant

[near schooner]

they dont need SWAT for that, national police exist for a reason

[shadow ether]

They had reasons to believe it had well-armed resistance and there was

[near schooner]

okay fair

[shadow ether]

Wdym national police?

[near schooner]

just bomb the whole entire place and say it was the yemen forces

[near schooner]

thats a thing of my country sorry

kinda forgot about diff police forces

[shy tulip]

I think the National Guard would be the closest to national police, or the FBI probably.

[near schooner]

FBI is like a goverment agency here

national guard is the closest to national police

[dark gyro]

It's a bureau yes

[smoky cedar]

The FBI enforces federal law

[frail quartz]

"there were tunnels used by The Hand underneath it. We highly suspect that the possible children on-site were soldiers for The Hand as well."

[shadow ether]

The Spider is a state police matter at most
The local PD's detectives go "hey, we need a SWAT team here, we need to arrest this guy and he probably has guys with guns who would gun down the patrol officers, so you go there first, check it out"

[shy tulip]

The spider would still be a local swat team going in, just with federal analysts coming in after to secure evidence, but mainly to assist local police

[near schooner]

it was a joke

[tough spire]

Ides - Not by facechecking it that's for damn sure.
Sinuous - Emergency power shutoff, for one. They would also not be inside going "oh we didn't know you were the real cops!" at that point.
Carriers - It's in the mission intel that this is dangerous, also, again, not a SWAT thing. It'd be more like Waco.
Relapse - It's plausible that the time demand of the bomb threat would force SWAT I'll give you that.

[frail quartz]

I know just a lil' silly

[near schooner]

real

[near schooner]

nerdy but extreamly agreeable

[frail quartz]

I don't know whether I should feel bad about using dark humor or not considering this is a real excuse being used to kill people on the other side of the world right now

[near schooner]

honestly i should never be trusted as a police officer

[shy tulip]

I think RoN will 100% show up on cop background checks now

[tough spire]

I went from wanting to be SWAT growing up to living in Portland, Oregon and being firsthand victim of police corruption/brutality/violence. I know too much to play this game without a very critical filter 🙃

[near schooner]

if i found a bomb vest, im strapping it to my chest and running at a suspect while screaming : DONALD TRUMP WAS PLAYING FORTNITE LAST NIGHT

[proven herald]

did they break multiplayer or something? I've got randoms joining a friends only lobby :/

[near schooner]

RoN is gonna alert the military at some point

[shadow ether]

Not just the bomb threat, there's a number of people gunning down civilians and someone, anyone needs to be on site to at least distract them by guns of their own
D platoon just does it too well, FISA doesn't get there in time

Probably why they want D platoon to go raid the port with them, that is an order

[smoky cedar]

If i find one ima see if life is like a video game, shoot the vest

[near schooner]

i feel like mfs just shoot the civilians instead of using them as full hostages and possibly negotiating or using them as live bombers

or atleast body shields

[smoky cedar]

Yeah some enemies are coded to take civilians hostage. This is mostly seen in port Holman though

Fuck autocorrect. Port hokan

[tough spire]

Having the civilians in bomb vests in Neon Tomb was such a weird choice given that there's seemingly zero chance they will go off.

[near schooner]

fire in the holman!!

[smoky cedar]

Yeah but the thing is those NPCs are hardcoded that if you shoot one then they will instantly explode

[near schooner]

im bout to blow

[smoky cedar]

Fucking annoying when they charged at me

[tough spire]

LOL wait if you shoot the civilian they detonate?

[near schooner]

💀

[smoky cedar]

Yes 😭😭

[near schooner]

yeah

[tough spire]

THAT'S EVEN DUMBER

[near schooner]

doesnt shooting a bomb make it blow?

[frail quartz]

They know the LSPD too well so they put a deadman's switch on them

[near schooner]

or does it just disable it

[smoky cedar]

It blows up

[tough spire]

Assuming it's like C4 or something, no, it wouldn't do either

[near schooner]

they dont even have a fucking detonator, its just a rig with cocktails and F1 grenades strapped on it

and some other homemade explosives

[tough spire]

Believe me the first time I saw a civilian in a vest I looked for a deadman switch.

[smoky cedar]

It ignites the gunpowder and fuse on the bomb since a bullet is hot. Bomb vests mostly work on fuses and stuff

[smoky cedar]

Yet there’s none but they blow up anyway if they get shot

[shadow ether]

What is facechecking? Not some sort of Face ID I assume
Sinuous — sure, they could cut the power, but then it would probably become an LSFD response very soon, and the guards would totally think it's fake swat who just cut the power, they can do that
Carriers — yeah let's wait for when FISA and the national guard finish their lunches, get into their trucks and slowly get there while there's an officer bleeding out

[shadow ether]

That depends on the material I think

[tough spire]

Unless they're really reckless and did bombs that intentionally were designed to ignite like that, it would most likely be an electrical current that sets them off. But not implausible

[dark gyro]

gunpowder would certainly ignite at the friction of a bullet

[near schooner]

that vest is home made, im pretty sure even hitting it would make it blow

im bout to blow

[dark gyro]

My mango, is to blow up

[near schooner]

creamer

[sturdy pawn]

Bruh i door wedged every door in the Brixley Talent Time and somehow the Brixley man is OUTSIDE THE BUILDING

[tough spire]

Facechecking - Checking something by face. Peeking in firsthand.

[sturdy pawn]

the mf somehow found some mysterious shitty path to be teleported outside

[smoky cedar]

Most if not all makeshift bombs will blow up since when gunpowder rubs together with the fuse it gets hella hot and blows up, not to mention the bomb itself

[tough spire]

Musta missed a spot or he snuck out while you were wedging

[sturdy pawn]

no, i did it in a way that means i'll come across him if he went outside whilst i was wedging

[dark gyro]

https://tenor.com/view/really-oh-now-stare-glare-side-eye-gif-17069038

[sturdy pawn]

i wedged every door before i entered the building, so i spent an hour looking for him

[shadow ether]

I need to take a look at the briefing, I think some scouting was involved and that's how they know they got hostages

[dark gyro]

Ah shi

[shadow ether]

Did you wedge the roof?

[tough spire]

If it's C4 it wouldn't

[sturdy pawn]

yep

[eager beacon]

im sorry

i just look at this chat and i see people talking about how to make bombs??

[tough spire]

Not how to make.

[shadow ether]

No, how to shoot bombs

[dark gyro]

what would make them go off

[eager beacon]

alr

[shadow ether]

Will they explode if you shoot them or not

[tough spire]

The plausibility of a bomb go to off if shot, see: Neon Tomb

[near schooner]

what did bro just say

[eager beacon]

well that depends on the type of bomb and who made it

[near schooner]

terrorists

[eager beacon]

was it made by someone that KNOWS how to make bombs? or just someone that saw it on the dark web

[dark gyro]

a poor craftsman blames his tools

[smoky cedar]

Terrorists

[dark gyro]

gunpowder go boom

[eager beacon]

also depends on the terrorists

[smoky cedar]

The Hand

[shadow ether]

I would say someone who clearly knows, just has no good tools for a factory made bomb vest

[tough spire]

If you want to talk about how to build a bomb I have a nice link for you: https://gprivate.com/69o47

[eager beacon]

well if its for something like neon tomb the bomb would probably explode if shot at

[dark gyro]

does not "depend on the terrorists", the girls say I'm "the bomb"

[smoky cedar]

I love how civilians with bomber vests are like “GET THIS THING OFF ME” or like “Is there a wire or something” but it’s ironic because not only can it not be taken off because it’d take a bomb squad and also all wires on the vest are rigged to something that will explode

[eager beacon]

the civillians are panicking

[smoky cedar]

Yeah but it’s common sense that a bomb vest is made to blow up not to be taken off :/

[dark gyro]

the civilians don't know any better

they are civilians

[shadow ether]

Any of y'all use suspect AI mods? Is there a good mod that makes suspect AI act differently based on who they are? Because I'm really tired to see junkies, private security and hardened terrorists act the exact same with the only difference being their guns

[eager beacon]

you would scream "GET THIS THING OFF ME" if there was a bomb attached to you

[smoky cedar]

Yeah they’re still brain dead civilians since they like to run around

[smoky cedar]

Suspect and AI Overhaul

[tough spire]

Trying really hard to find a good image of those vests but google image search failing me

[dark gyro]

I would probably wait it out with a smile

[dark gyro]

you're putting yourself on a list lmao

[tough spire]

I'm on so many already.

[dark gyro]

Elaborate

[smoky cedar]

I would just wait it out or just blow up honestly

Because im pretty fucked in that situation no matter what I do

Question is how the fuck did we even get in that type of situation

I would’ve already died or i would’ve just booked it and went home

[tough spire]

The moral of the story is: Adult clubs - not even once

[dark gyro]

You wouldn't really have any other options if you're just dwaddling in a building with that thing on

[shadow ether]

That's pretty much what happens, the bomb vest civvies just wanna go home but you got there first

[tough spire]

#🎨ron-screenshots-and-art message
Found an image finally. Those are like 2liter bottles. Those are definitely going off if shot.

[shadow ether]

Is it an explicitly adult club tho? I didn't see any stripper poles

[tough spire]

[sturdy pawn]

its called panic-

[smoky cedar]

I would just tear open the vest and just die because it’s not like it’s the only way I can deal with it because those type of bombs are also meant to blow up if taken off

[sturdy pawn]

i'd shit myself too and ask police to quickly take off an explosive vest that can level a building off my chest

[smoky cedar]

Yeah fair point didn’t really think about that but yeah

[sturdy pawn]

• they probs just saw like

all their friends get gunned down by jihadist boys

[shadow ether]

Not like a night club staff would know how bomb vests work, but a swat team MIGHT know how a bomb vest works enough to take it off and if there's a way for me to survive a bomb vest I'd rather take it, I'd hate to die without seeing how my favourite anime of the year ended

[astral warren]

Good thing it was a gun free zone. If only they had thought to make it a bomb free zone, too.

The fools. 😔

[tough spire]

This is America. If you ban bombs then only outlaws and terrorists will have bombs. 🙄

[astral warren]

Yes.

[dark gyro]

If you don't ban bombs everyone will have bombs

[astral warren]

That is how it would work, if owning those were illegal in and of itself. You would be defined as a criminal once you own it.

[shadow ether]

Not sure if making it a guns allowed zone would do much to like 20 guys armed with select fire rifles and in armor

[sturdy pawn]

there's a vague truth in all those "If you take away guns from people, criminals will still have it."

[astral warren]

But why wasn't it also a bomb free zone?

[sturdy pawn]

kinda...ish truth.

[tough spire]

Friendly reminder the "good guy with a gun saving the day" thing is NRA propaganda and largely a myth.

[sturdy pawn]

The thing is that most criminals use illegally attained firearms.

[shadow ether]

Isn't the entire US a bomb free zone?

[astral warren]

Not certain fields in Nevada.

[sturdy pawn]

It's kind of a bit too "late" so to speak to put in measures to remove guns entirely

[tough spire]

https://tenor.com/view/oppenheimer-oppenheimer-movie-oppenheimer-meme-oppenheimer-stare-opps-gif-15308305416107220221

[sturdy pawn]

because, well, if you do. A lotta guns gonna go "missing"

[shadow ether]

Is there a state where you're allowed a legal bomb vest?

[smoky cedar]

no

[shadow ether]

Certainly not in California where the game takes place

[tough spire]

A lot of places even ban fireworks.

[astral warren]

It was the saddest thing, I was out on a fishing trip, showing it to all of my friends, when a big mouth bass slammed into the side of our boat, and it flew from my hands and into the water! I've never seen it since... I miss that gun.

Br*tish places. Fucking loyalist ordinances.

[smoky cedar]

Definitely not since it’s an act of terrorism or conspiracy in owning one and will land you like 25 years in jail AT BEST. At worst you can get life without parole

Plus those are illegally manufactured

[astral warren]

We really need the government to step in and regulate our bomb vests. The quality is simply too inconsistent, and the pricing is ALL over the place!

[shadow ether]

That's what I'm saying, why make a night club a bomb free zone if the entire state is a bomb free zone by default 🤔

[astral warren]

Every little bit helps.

Maybe the sticker will change their mind.

[tough spire]

We need to bring back simple labelling like Mr. Yuck

[astral warren]

Like, "Man, okay, they REALLY don't want bombs here, specifically, I guess we'll take over the combination starbuck/panera next door instead."

[drifting burrow]

i wish i was allowed to kill the fisa agent in the mail level

[astral warren]

Apparently I can't share how I feel about the FISA agent. Isn't the point of your narrative to MAKE ME FEEL THINGS, VOID?

[smoky cedar]

I did on accident and had to restart because my team executed me

Bastards

[tough spire]

Their narrative is to edgelord and gain notoriety because that brings in new players.

[drifting burrow]

really? did you do it when he was already tied up

[shadow ether]

My MP7 with AP rounds has a tendency to just injure them so I definitely try injuring the HVTs in some missions even if I can nonlethal them

[smoky cedar]

No he just walked around i think

[astral warren]

They don't even have a narrative, it's an unorganized story board that is vaguely shaped in a way that is somewhat chronological.

[drifting burrow]

thats weird man

[tough spire]

You're right. I was giving them too much credit.

[astral warren]

Some of the levels are completely out of order in the timeline, and some of the missions literally wouldn't happen until you unlock a later one and gather evidence from it which then give you a lead to an earlier mission you've already completed???

[frail quartz]

Is there supposed to be a narritive besides "America is a dumpsterfire"?

[astral warren]

I stopped trying to follow it after the 3rd mission, honestly, I figured there wouldn't be much substance anyways.

[native rune]

People really took the swiper no swiping thing and made it into a law

[shadow ether]

Are they out of order?

[shadow ether]

There's a few storylines, you even get cheevos for them

[astral warren]

Mindjot, Brixley, and 23 MB/s are a mixed up mess chronologically

[shadow ether]

How so?

[tough spire]

We need to make a total conversation mod for this game that just deconstructs all the edgelord and copaganda and turn it into the gritty realistic hell scape that it thinks it's trying to be.

[native rune]

But we had to axe game modes for the sake of the story making sense

[frail quartz]

I mean, is it not the latter half already?

[astral warren]

You collect evidence for a lead in one of them on a mission you've already done.

[tough spire]

It is a bit.

[dark gyro]

Is the ballistic customization unlock mod game progression friendly or should I just go into the game vanilla

[frail quartz]

Some of the missions are kinda exaggerated for the sake of it, but there isn't really anything that made me say "this couldn't happen in real life"

[drifting burrow]

what are you even talking about

[native rune]

Them only sending five dudes to deal with it is an automatic “this couldn’t happen in real life”

[astral warren]

^ this one a thousand times

[shadow ether]

I had that happen twice, on 23mbps and on rust belt

[shadow ether]

Maybe they only have 5 dudes

[frail quartz]

That and I feel like the game does a good enough job of showcasing how a lot of the violence/crime depicted ingame are either caused or facilitated by deep rooted flaws in society and government

[sturdy pawn]

i don't really think calling this game Copaganda's right though

Considering the police force is absolutely shit at their jobs

[frail quartz]

Yeah I have to admit that streamer is definiently one of my least favorite maps in terms of believability/sensibility

[sturdy pawn]

The only reason D Platoon seems to be godly is because Judge is implied to be some FISA sleeper agent

[shadow ether]

You can be quite a shit cop and walk away with a B rank and a passed mission

[astral warren]

dying for crypto that crashed 5 minutes earlier anyways

[crude prism]

Judge is a cyborge confirmed

[drifting burrow]

i think the game needs more small maps with a few enemies. a lot of the maps are overly convoluted

[crude prism]

define small

[shadow ether]

Like, the game docks 50 points from you for each count of unauthorised injuring someone, but you make it back by picking up 2 guns

[drifting burrow]

like the food wall in swat 4

[crude prism]

that's not how the scoring works

you cannot "make up" losses

[astral warren]

Not a multi story building with a capacity of 500 people. So, like, no hospitals, or schools, or postage facilities.

[shadow ether]

That's definitely how it worked when I was trying to beat greased palms with at least a C rank

[astral warren]

huh

[crude prism]

Voll health house, big or small?

Spider with 10 dudes, big or small?

Mindjot, big or small?

[frail quartz]

I might go a bit more indepth with that "Fake swatting" and "Shooting threat" mission I proposed earlier and make suggestions for it

[shadow ether]

You can if you're not going for S or A+

[drifting burrow]

all of these are more on the big side imo, except for the spider, if it was only the main building you go into and not the adjacent grocery one and entire outer area

[shadow ether]

If you don't aim to be the best cop, the game kinda lets you get away with surprising amounts of shit

[sturdy pawn]

that's for gameplay anyways

[crude prism]

The amount of points possible is set when you load into a mission.
Getting a penalty lowers the maximum score possible, you cannot "make up" penalties in any way

[shadow ether]

Shot 2 civilians
They survived
-100 to my points
Still cleared it with a B

[frail quartz]

America, amirite?

[tough spire]

You go around a heavily idealized propaganda machine of an HQ, save the day in situations you most definitely should not even be involved in, and all while playing the "underfunded" underdog.
There is no negative consequences for any of your actions beyond a score ding and maybe losing an officer to "stress."
It's pure copaganda.

[shadow ether]

How is HQ a heavily idealized propaganda machine?

[drifting burrow]

yeah obviously this is copaganda, and not a game made in inspiration from swat 3 and 4. this is the dumbest take ive seen all day

[frail quartz]

To be fair I'm not really sure how we could add "firing the player" mechanics to this game

[astral warren]

Spider and mindjot are small because of how much fewer doors and stories there are than voll health house. Voll has a huge outside area in total, as well as a very complex ground and upper floor, in addition to a basement.

[sturdy pawn]

i'm really starting to think people who use the word copaganda likes to stretch anything about playing as an officer as copaganda

[native rune]

I’d prefer to call it bad game design before copoganda

[sturdy pawn]

-> Does good thing as an officer in game

"OMG THIS IS COPAGANDA!!!!"

While I agree with the HQ part, saving the day's the point

I mean shit, what the fuck do you want the game inspired by Swat 4 to do?

Objective: Punch the elderly woman (?)

[crude prism]

imo the game needs more maps that are like Neon or 213 sized. (maybe excluding the tunnel/3rd house on 213)

Neon feels like a very good balance of size vs enemy capacity to me. There's not gonna be people in every room, but you still have to work it

Kawayu beach is a "fine" map, but it's also basically irrelevant as far as gameplay is concerned. Anything smaller and you're just sleeping through it

[shadow ether]

What is it about the HQ that I'm missing?

[drifting burrow]

literally ready or not exists because there wasn't a swat 5. theres no other games that have been made in the same sorta style for a while. its filling a hole in the genre

[sturdy pawn]

the HQ's actually a museum now haphazardly renovated into a station

It's in a state of disrepair in a lot of places

[tough spire]

You're falsely assuming that copaganda means it's inherently bad or wrong or something.

[prime wing]

Lies! You have SWAT stories the ron killer

[shadow ether]

And how does it make it a huge propaganda piece?

[shy tulip]

Even matches the graphics of SWAT 4

[frail quartz]

Like I said before, I think the game focusses on the deep rooted flaws of american society and government enough to make up for it. I don't think the game is trying to depict policing as the sole answer to fixing the broken system it tries to showcase

[sturdy pawn]

i don't think it fits for an underfunded police department

something like just a ye old average run down station instead

[smoky cedar]

Ends of The Earth is probably the easiest map to S rank on, except that I have 2 S ranks, neither of which at EoTe

[crude prism]

Spider still has like 10 people in it. So do people want physically small but packed maps? Or something like Kawayu or gas station with low suspect counts and small workable area?

[drifting burrow]

are u talking about the first swat games? i should play it eventually

[shadow ether]

Didn't they get the building basically for free

[sturdy pawn]

The word copaganda itself already has negative connotations. Copaganda's just straight up two words mixed into one, Cop and Propaganda

[frail quartz]

Stopping criminals can only help so much when two more fires appear somewhere else everytime you put one out

[sturdy pawn]

calling it "Copaganda" doesn't sound right at all, because this implies it's spreading some propaganda about police officers

[smoky cedar]

In the old station it was actually a subway station repurposed, but yes this is a museum repurposed in 1.0 as far as I know

[prime wing]

no, its a steam early acccess ron copy

[astral warren]

Either is fine, but I think simpler maps work better with more suspects and more complex ones work better with fewer, just need some AI tweaks so they don't bunch up all in one room like they can sometimes. I had 3 suspects standing in literally the same spot on 23MB/s.

[tough spire]

So is Top Gun bad because it's military propaganda?

Because it absolutely is, and is still a fun movie.

[drifting burrow]

nah i never got that, i never bought the supporter edition back then lol

[native rune]

I think as the suspect ai stands right now, small maps with few suspects are incredibly boring. You can clear ridgeline with an S in like less than a minute for example. I think the “smaller maps with less suspects” request is too idealistic without giving the ai a lot more behaviors and the player more tools to deal with situations.

[prime wing]

no no im sorry, its a bootleg ron copy

[sturdy pawn]

The word copaganda doesn't fit Ready or Not

[crude prism]

This is the point I'm building towards

[prime wing]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1619310/Tactical_Squad_SWAT_Stories/

Steam

Tactical Squad: SWAT Stories

Take on the commanding role for an advanced special weapons and tactics team. Tactical Squad: SWAT Stories places great focus on realism, drawing not only from the rich history of tactical games, but also real-life situations that saw need for such units to be deployed. Your squad members follow your lead, but also actively respond to various si...

Release Date

2024

▶ Play video

[shy tulip]

My hot take of the day is that small maps will probably never work the way people want them to. People want pre-scripted moments, maybe if we get scripted DLCs, but that's not what RoN is nor what the majority of people want.

[astral warren]

I'm imagining they actually finish making the video game.

[sturdy pawn]

it doesn't counter the criticism of the police force at all.

[drifting burrow]

oh ok i never even seen this before

[stone bay]

Prepared or not

[native rune]

I think the only way void can make a map “interesting” is to cram at least ten armed dudes in it and call it a day

[tough spire]

You are welcome to create your own definitions however you want my dude.

[sturdy pawn]

It just feels like you're looking too deep into Ready or Not when it quite simply is a game heavily inspired by Swat 4.

[stone bay]

i enjoy the environmental story telling

[sturdy pawn]

Copaganda is shows like the Rookie

that's copaganda, literally, it's funded by cops if i remember

LAPD funded that show and shit.

[shy tulip]

Not the rookie

[native rune]

I hate the cop show clips I keep getting on YouTube shorts. They are so fucking cringey like who watches this

[sturdy pawn]

Ready or Not's not funded by the police force of some god fuck knows bum what country.

[amber dock]

Small maps have a place but larger maps definitely make a greater impact

[sturdy pawn]

It's literally just a SWAT game, inspired by a classic SWAT game, that makes you play an extremely difficult game where split second choices are made to shoot or not to shoot.

[amber dock]

Hopefully the dlc brings smaller maps to serve as a bridge between larger maps

[shy tulip]

For me it's just overall funner. Ends of the Earth was a one and done map for me. I'll probably only ever replay it when I redo my campaign and when I go for S rank.

[frail quartz]

Same here

[astral warren]

You don't need "pre-scripted moments", that would delete replayability. Just have more suspect interaction with the environment. There's already closets they never hide it that you can search, and there's already behaviour for them to hide under beds which I think I have seen happen once since 1.0, and then never again. Just use the things that are implemented in the game already

[shadow ether]

I play ends of the earth nonlethal when I need to bring officers to therapy all at once

[amber dock]

That’s the primary advantage of small maps. Putting them between larger maps gives downtime and helps flow

[shadow ether]

It's a way easier map than gas station

[stone bay]

what's the shortest mission thus far

[sturdy pawn]

that shit only happens in Twisted Nerves

[sturdy pawn]

gas station, personally

[amber dock]

Beachfront or Gas station

[shy tulip]

Probably Lethal Obession since it seems they nerfed the amount of traps

[crude prism]

RoN works best when players are challenged, as it keeps them engaged.

Players actually have to give a shit about what they're doing.

With repeated suspect nerfs, and more behaviors to suspects needed. The game can be effectively steamrolled by a single player on all but maybe a handful of maps right now.

Until they figure out how to improve the suspects on the behavior side, the challenge really needs to be turned back up

[astral warren]

Yeah, the one time I saw it was on Twisted Nerve.

[sturdy pawn]

fucking up and accidentally shooting a civilian should be an instant F tbh.

[crude prism]

Small maps just do not work for RoN. In multiplayer especially. (currently)

[muted star]

I'd make ROE bit more stirct on top of that

[astral warren]

I would agree if ROE wasn't broken in multiplayer.

[sturdy pawn]

I'd remove the whole thing about collecting evidence tbh.

That just makes not a lot of sense.

[shy tulip]

I'm starting to agree that the best option is probably difficulty settings. An easy mode for people who want to walk in and shout down people realistic style. Harder settings for people who want to use tactics or get punished

[sturdy pawn]

Like...Why?

[crude prism]

I agree, 100%

[sturdy pawn]

SWAT doesn't have time to pick up a gun and place it in a folder.

[astral warren]

Difficulty settings are too much clutter. The game already needs a spreadsheet to be understood, I don't want to have to read through 2 more to fully understand it.

[shadow ether]

Shooting a civilian dead IS an instant F

[sturdy pawn]

don't remember that being the case tbh

[shy tulip]

Never once had to read a spreadsheet, if you're lookin for the tiny details like that, that's kinda on you

[sturdy pawn]

kinda forgot lol.

[bitter mason]

Just a legacy thing from SWAT 4 they they pulled over into the game.
Hell I swear I remember when Void said they wanted to change the evidence collect model from the baggie to something a bit more realistic.

[crude prism]

There is literally weapon stats the game holds on the backend as leftovers from the PvP build, void could literally pop up a little stat sheet that the game ALREADY HAS HIDDEN FROM YOU

[smoky cedar]

You lose 350 points but it’s not an instant F

[sturdy pawn]

also Void's gotta add more light to the fucking cutomization screen i swear to God

[shadow ether]

We got two wounded civvies and got out with a B
Got one killed and it was an F

[native rune]

^

[sturdy pawn]

Wounded should be an F too

[amber dock]

^

[sturdy pawn]

Like love of God PLEASE, i'm trying to see how dripped out I am

[smoky cedar]

No because those are accidental discharges. It just ruins the point of panicking

[crude prism]

game actively scams players though

"this ammo type JHP deals more damage to bare body parts"

except when it doesn't

[muted star]

And remove some from levels lol. Nvgs are useful like on 3 maps

[frail quartz]

I feel like there should still be a fine distinction in the scoring system between "The mission was overall successful but had a major accident" and "The mission went horribly wrong and as a complete failure"

[sturdy pawn]

Hospital, Neon, and Twisted Nerve mostly lol

[astral warren]

It is my fault for wanting to understand how the game I am playing works? I never thought someone would victim blame someone for a hypothetical problem they would have over a hypothetical solution that probably won't be implemented. Very impressive!

[frail quartz]

Obviously arresting all the suspects but killing one civilian shouldn't be considered as bad as killing all suspects and killing half the civilians

[crude prism]

the game not telling you everthing about suspects is fine (like hey suspects on this map have 10% more health!)

but the complete lack of information given to players surrounding ballistics/armor/helmets etc, is seriously annoying

[bitter mason]

Difficulty would definitely be a good option, but I think the base gameplay loop and suspect behaviours overall should still be more refined
Could be something like
Easy = on average more compliant suspects, less acurate slower reactions (depending on the map)
Normal = the true Swat 4 styled experience. Suspects vary heavily depending on the map, But provides a fair challenge that doesnt require shooting on sight
Hard = Far less compliant suspects, far more accurate, on average more skilled, and faster reaction times

[astral warren]

Especially considering kevlar is just a noob trap.

[smoky cedar]

Rust Belt
Port Hokan
Neon Tomb
Twisted Nerves
Relapse
Buy Once, Buy Twice

Bunch of dark maps that I all used NVG

[crude prism]

no bro Void implemented it specifically for roleplay!! totally!!!!

[kindred temple]

if police uses it then why not add it

[smoky cedar]

I didn’t even know that carrier of the vines enemies could use M249s until someone told me. I never encountered them

[crude prism]

they can (?)

[smoky cedar]

The only hint we get is “suspects are extremely volatile” “suspects are extremely hostile” “suspects have hostages”

[kindred temple]

how are they able to even carry that shit bro

[smoky cedar]

There’s a special variant of them that can, up to 2 can spawn

[summer copper]

24 hostiles in the last mission is crazy

[smoky cedar]

No idea how middle aged-old women are THAT fucking experienced with HEAVY machine guns

[bitter mason]

random tiny detail but I kinda wish they added more melee weapon models for suspects than just a kitchen knife.
like wheres the combat knives, switch blades, machetes stuff like that

[summer copper]

the officer mental health thing is annoying when i'm trying to beat a mission lethally

you became a swat officer and can't handle one mission without resigning, okay fuck off then

[crude prism]

I'm looking at the map data right now. In vanilla they absolutely cannot spawn with the M249

[kindred temple]

i stopped the active shooters on elephant without letting them kill a single civilian on the map

and my team is stressed

for some reason…

[bitter mason]

honestly. Play on practice mode. you dont have the squad management. You still unlock everything and progress the same and you can restart from the pause menu whenever
its legit just the better way of playing

[smoky cedar]

Eh someone told me they had M249s. Never seen them though

[astral warren]

Kevlar has no purpose but to make the gameplay experience worse for first time players. 7.62x39 also serves no purpose because it's just shitty 300blk with more recoil and less attachments. The fact that ceramic blocks 40% of damage after being broken also is not explained anywhere, and is a very important consideration to make if you are trying to choose between steel and ceramic. The only thing obvious about armour is that steel makes you fat and slow. I can't understand why only certain JHP rounds do extra limb damage, too. Overall the game just needs really serious cleanup with the weapons to make them make more sense, and preferably information somewhere in game so you can actually know the differences between the weapons and ammo you're using, and why you might pick one over the other for particular circumstances or situations.

[summer copper]

swat officers: become swat officers knowing they will have to kill or die
same fucking swat officers: oh my god we killed someone who pointed a gun at us, i need to quit now

[shadow ether]

Except the "extremely volatile suspects" act professionally in every map

[smoky cedar]

Get the No Mercy For Terrorists mod and the Stress For Less mod. Works really well

[frail quartz]

Seconded, why are professional security guards carrying kitchen knives

[summer copper]

i will get mods after i S rank everything

[prime wing]

maybe because thats not the purpose of commander mode?

[kindred temple]

good luck

[sturdy pawn]

also some suspects eat 5.56 for dinner

i had one take like, 5 shots before he goes down

[bitter mason]

Why are security guards carrying knives in the first place tbh.
Unless its some utility knife which should do poop all damage
which is another thing, somehow knives can just cut clean through armour lol

[shadow ether]

Maybe for seeing all the dead people already there?

[crude prism]

commander mode traits are still broken btw (and assuming they get fixed, the vague info about what they do is dogshit)

the reason that 7.62x39 is just shitty .300blk is because they literally SHARE the damage curves, because void didn't make a separate one for 7.62x39
(multiple calibers do this btw)

[frail quartz]

VOID MOMENT

[smoky cedar]

Stab vest is the only one designed for stabbed but for some reason yet it’s still useless

[crude prism]

light armor still lets you choose "full coverage" even though it doesn't do anything

[smoky cedar]

It’s basically just No Armor

Doesn’t do shit it’s basically cosmetic

[summer copper]

okay so was commander mode specifically designed for non lethal?

[frail quartz]

I can't wait until we finally leave early access

[smoky cedar]

this is 1.0 bucko you’re living under a rock

[kindred temple]

maybe but for some reason if you complete this mission non lethally their mental health will increase

[bitter mason]

stab vest is just completely pointless.
Im sure steel or ceramic would be enough to stop a knife no?

[smoky cedar]

Or is it 1.1? I dont remember

[smoky cedar]

Steel yes

[crude prism]

needs to be renamed to "chest rig" or something, stab vest implies that it HAS SOME EFFECT to anyone with a brain

[smoky cedar]

Unsure about ceramic

[astral warren]

Probably hit the limbs, then, because 5.56x45 should 3 shot to torso at worst.

[frail quartz]

Yeah, 1.0 is early access to an unfinished/unpolished product

[astral warren]

Stab your toilet for science.

[muted star]

wut

I've been lied to

[crude prism]

only heavy armor can get side plates, therefore selecting "full coverage" on light armor doesn't do anything

[kindred temple]

lmao

[astral warren]

Does light armour still get a rear plate?

[crude prism]

THIS LITERALLY WASN'T AN ISSUE PRE 1.0

[smoky cedar]

Yes

[frail quartz]

Does it still make you slower if you wear steel even though you don't get extra protection

[muted star]

I mean it's a UI bug probably then

[crude prism]

YOU LITERALLY COULDN'T SELECT FULL COVERAGE FOR LIGHT ARMOR DURING ADAM

[astral warren]

I think it does.

[crude prism]

Devs actually took a step back

[frail quartz]

VOID moment

[astral warren]

This game is just a big unfinished mess atm, internally speaking.

[crude prism]

You would get the penalty for wearing two plates, not the third

[smoky cedar]

run that back

[crude prism]

The loadout UI for light armor used to only show "front only" or "front and back" (1.0 added the "full coverage" option, which only heavy got)

[astral warren]

I hope at some point they update the guns so that all 4 rifle calibers don't perform almost identically in 95% of situations.

[amber dock]

Would be cool if they implemented full coverage for light armor

Side plates exist

[frail quartz]

I mean, in the CQB environments of the game, they basically do for most calibers

[shadow ether]

Because they know ALL OF THEM are getting life sentences and not an easy way out

[crude prism]

then heavy armor would need buffs of some kind lul, that's literally the only difference between them

-2 slots for side plates

[astral warren]

Sure, but then why have different guns at all if they're not meant to be different? Seems like a lot of work for no actual gameplay purpose.

[kindred temple]

makes sense

[prime wing]

SMGS have entered the chat

[astral warren]

SMGs are pointless.

[kindred temple]

but they shouldn’t gain THAT much stress

[shadow ether]

Lmao I main SMGs

[tough spire]

Devs really need to just hire @crude prism for QA at this point.

[astral warren]

You can, but they're pointless.

[crude prism]

.300blk JHP needs to be nerfed, it shouldn't penetrate the suspect medium armor type, only JHP 7.62x51 and JHP 7.62x39 should

.300blk is objectively the best bullet in the game

[kindred temple]

not really

[shadow ether]

How so? They are good if you shoot to wound

[kindred temple]

^

[astral warren]

Why would I EVER run an SMG when the ARN-180 is the same size and does far more consistent damage against armour and and at a distance?

[muted star]

You gotta try making a balance mod lol

[kindred temple]

also i like the mp5 slap

[astral warren]

If I have to shoot more times there's a higher chance I'll shoot an extra time on accident and kill the suspect. Clicking twice consistently is easier than clicking 4 or 5 times consistently.

[frail quartz]

Exactly

[crude prism]

I would prefer to get the game to a good state instead of rely on mods. (fuck mod.io and nexus)

[tough spire]

Running a P90 as a SAW is the the best response to "SMGs worthless"

[muted star]

Everybody would like that but it is what it is right now

[shadow ether]

Because you're not always up against armor? I only take rifles when I know armor is a factor

[prime wing]

Nexus is not that bad

you just have to copy paste files

no vortex

nothing

[crude prism]

I mean somebody else can reach out to me and I'll spill everything that needs to be fixed/rebalanced

I don't care to teach myself UE4 modding right now

[smoky cedar]

It’s just drag & drop

[prime wing]

as for downloading viruses, Modio is the suspect

anything goes in modio until someone gets fucked

[muted star]

If you have a list of changes with values you can send it to me or on modding cord

[crude prism]

yeah that's gonna take a brief bit lul, but sure

[prime wing]

Mod should be named Common sense overhaul

[muted star]

Noted

[crude prism]

let me make a page on the big bullshit spreadsheet

[astral warren]

300blk would objectively be the best bullet in CQB, but I definitely agree that no other bullet has any point. 5.56x45 is okay, I guess, but lots of pen if you miss, which can be spooky. 7.62x39 is shitty 300blk, and needs to have its recoil reduced considerably, and probably should have a small damage buff. 7.62x51 should also have a small damage buff, and the hollow points of all weapons should be made to do bonus limb damage. Also fix the headshot multiplier for the AP FAL/SA-58. 5.56x45 should have the advantage of being able to defeat armour 4 with recoil comparable to a submachine gun, at the expense of less overall damage. .300blk need the JHP nerfed, and the AP round for it should receive a small damage nerf, so it will take the same number of limb shots as 5.56x45 to incapacitate a suspect.

[sturdy pawn]

well, 300blk is the new trend

that and also the subsonic variant is apparently very silent?

[astral warren]

300blk doesn't have shit on 8.6 blackout.

But yes, 300blk if chambered for subsonic muzzle velocity is very quiet when suppressed.

Some higher end suppressors can end up making the action of the gun cycling louder than the report.

[frail quartz]

It's more about stopping power than armor penetration. Almost all of the rifles consistently two-shot suspects and almost all of the smgs only three-shot

[astral warren]

^ more consistent results with fewer rounds spent

[crude prism]

low power calibers also don't stagger suspects

[frail quartz]

Exactly

[crude prism]

(it's raw % chance built into the ammo, doesn't matter for the actual damage dealt)

[shadow ether]

Yeah, and they three-shot to wound, and that is REALLY GOOD when you need to take suspects alive

[astral warren]

Rifles do it in 2.

Same outcome.

[shadow ether]

Rifles kill in 2 for me

[astral warren]

Quit shooting them in the head or between the elbow and shoulder / knee and hip

[shadow ether]

That implies I get any headshots

[astral warren]

You could also be hitting them in the arm and then the torso.

Just click once and if they don't fall down then click again.

[shadow ether]

I shoot center mass most of the time

[frail quartz]

For me, I find smgs to be more easy to accidentally kill with because I need to shoot more bullets in the same amount of time which makes me prone to shoot more than I mean to

[crude prism]

since 1.0 you're losing like 50-100% of damage with arm -> torso hits

collateral hits don't do shit

[astral warren]

Human flesh is the strongest material on earth, I guess.

[crude prism]

flesh is the hardest material to penetrate besides steel and concrete lul

[frail quartz]

VOID moment

[astral warren]

Good to know if anyone's about to shoot me in the face with a 7.62x51 NATO FMJ I can just hold my hand up and stop the bullet.

[shadow ether]

I never had that problem tbh, though maybe because I rarely use full auto on SMGs and prefer semi auto or burst fire that won't let me overkill

[crude prism]

when you need all 160 damage to down someone, a hand hit deals 16, and then you lose like 30% power which makes it not 1 shot anymore, jej

[frail quartz]

That's what I mean, I need to shoot more quickly in semi auto with SMGs than with rifles because it takes more bullets to down someone

[astral warren]

10mm mp5 is funny if you want to use .45acp but have SLR47 recoil.

[shadow ether]

Try burst fire

[crude prism]

SMGs also suffer from the unbalanced recoil debuffs

[astral warren]

That didn't work in Vietnam.

[shadow ether]

We're in los suenos, chief

[astral warren]

Yeah idk why SMGs have an additional nerf to them when they're already completely useless. Fuck SMGs, I guess.

[astral warren]

If it didn't work over there why would it work here?

[frozen beacon]

P90s good

[astral warren]

eh

[vestal mauve]

ive never had a single issue with SMG recoil
y'all have a skill issue

[shadow ether]

Because we have different goals here

[astral warren]

No, we're talking about how SMGs get MORE increased recoil compared to rifles, handguns, or shotguns when your arms get shot.

[crude prism]

you can reduce up to 70% of recoil on rifles with the right attachments

no SMG can get more than a 20% recoil reduction

The injured arm debuffs add flat value increase, so it affects SMGs way more because they can't get nearly the same PERCENTAGE reduction

[astral warren]

^ that specifically

[shadow ether]

We're not marines, we're swat, a police force
We want our targets to stay alive, preferably all of them all the time

[astral warren]

Void is terrible at understanding how numbers work together, aren't they?

[tough spire]

Again: P90 as SAW.

[stone bay]

That is being polite but yes

[frail quartz]

Either way it just seems kind of pointless when you're using more ammo with more room for error

[astral warren]

I was making a joke about the XM16E1 having a 3 round burst mode that wasted thousands of dollars of ammunition because the cyclic rate was way too slow for the point of impact to be even a little bit close.

take your funny pills

[crude prism]

SMG debuffed recoil is ridiculous https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1c7Ndr9-pWcs6_BcBGWPptbv_-2FzNGgE?usp=sharing

^example vids

[shadow ether]

I had no clue about your obscure american experimental gun factoids from a war I know about from the funny shooty movies

[astral warren]

google factoid right now

[shadow ether]

Nyeh

[astral warren]

that word doesn't mean what you think it means

[vestal mauve]

ok redditor

[astral warren]

r/r/r/r/r/r/r/r

[shadow ether]

I keep hearing it in that meaning

[frail quartz]

While we're on the topic of guns, do you think we'll ever be able to add BAD levers to ARs?

I know the HK416a5 already has one built in

[astral warren]

Least German rifle.

G11 hyperburst noises

[prime wing]

google drive wont be admissible in court buddy

"Your honor, my client had a skill issue"

[summer copper]

real

[umbral oar]

watchmen doesnt know his mic is muted 💀

[prime wing]

this is a true moment in the saga

nature is healing

[bitter mason]

got damn the auto securing is even more of a problem now, there seems to be a pathing bug where the swat ai are dead set on running to the floor above to collect something

nearly caused a disaster on neon tomb since they just b-lined straight out of the bar to the dancefloor

[hardy plinth]

Is this game trying to be realistic to its own detriment?

For example: since not many weapons exist that are non-lethal, all we have in the game is only 2/3 truly non-lethal guns

[kindred temple]

taser is a non lethal weapon

which is very effective btw

idk if pepper spray is considered as a weapon

[hardy plinth]

Another example is that some guns are better than others in every conceivable way, like semi-auto shotguns over pump-actions since they want to keep the damage the same since they're all 12-gage

[kindred temple]

but its fucking useless anyway

[hardy plinth]

If it works

And if you're playing multiplayer that's a very big if

Maybe the problem is more that the realism creates problems from a game-ballance perspective, but Void doesn't account much for it

[shadow ether]

Not all less lethal weapons are guns
In fact most of them are not

[hardy plinth]

But they're the only ones that work consistently

[shadow ether]

Grenades work

[hardy plinth]

and I guess I'm answering my own question then

[shadow ether]

Stingers are pretty damn good

[hardy plinth]

Flashbangs feel broken most of the time

Maybe it's just in multiplayer

[shadow ether]

Try stingers

[hardy plinth]

Yeah I've been using those more

and they work 90% of the time with the m320

but I've had moments where one exploded 0.5 meters behind a guy and it didn't do anything

[shadow ether]

I suppose I'm lucky, never had that happen

[kindred temple]

flashes are so useless

[bitter mason]

this game being "realistic" is honestly just a marketing buzzword lol
Less lethals should only be there to ensure you get an arrest, not the only viable way of consistantly getting arrests

[hardy plinth]

I think the stress mechanic should be reworked

[shadow ether]

More to do with every suspect acting the same way, as in "a lone target with good weapon control and a death wish"

[bitter mason]

yup

[hardy plinth]

Enemies never surrender until you hit them with a grenade, gas or any form of stun

I feel like this in itself is not realistic if you're actually calling it a stress mechanic

[bitter mason]

I figured it should just be removed but when I thought about it it could be good if done differently
basically only being affected by kills rather than literally anything

[tough spire]

??? That's not true

[stone bay]

It's rare. for sure

[hardy plinth]

Really? I've never had an enemy surrender from stress without a stun first

[shadow ether]

You would think a junkie would piss their pants and give up seeing five swat officers enter the room and aim at them, but nope, they all think they should fight to the death

[tough spire]

It's not even that rare at the start of an encounter.

[hardy plinth]

I think the game would be more interesting if you could bash down a door with a battering ram and you still need to look whether an enemy is trying to shoot you or whether they surrender immediately

Instead of just shooting anyone on sight

[vocal night]

people are just trigger happy because they would dome you in 100 ms before

[stone bay]

Heck, even some of the civvies are like that...start snapping pics...

[tough spire]

If you get the drop on an unsuspecting person and shout at 'em they'll drop their gun so quickly a lot of the time.

[hardy plinth]

I've never had that happen

[tough spire]

I've had someone surrender to me on the top floor of Voll down in the garden

[bitter mason]

honestly, unmodded. never happened. They'd hesitate but then almost always try and shoot

[tough spire]

And by "I've had someone" I mean today, in the past hour

[stone bay]

Me too...hardened crims lol

[tough spire]

I play 100% vanilla.

[bitter mason]

thats what my vanilla experience has been. If you dont stun them in some way they will always choose to fight, maybe they hesitate at first but will always try and shoot at you

[shadow ether]

Never happened to us. Suspects sometimes run away, and then they come back and start shooting

[hardy plinth]

In my past 50 hours whenever I'd yell for compliance even when me and my friend are both aiming our guns at the back of an unsuspecting enemy I get a "fuck you!"

[stone bay]

Well, someone's wrong. Seems the consensus is they are psychos, so...yeah.

[shadow ether]

Also, has anyone seen enemy AI use team tactics of any kind?

[bitter mason]

distance seems to really mess with compliance too. If you yell at a civ who is a short distance they will hardly comply until you get close

[hardy plinth]

ROE is also confusing, I feel like the only moment you'll get punished for shooting is when someone is complying

[tough spire]

Cool well I just saw it like 5 times in the past hour so go off.

[hardy plinth]

otherwise you can just be a spec op and kill any suspect

[bitter mason]

nope lol, they might aswell all be one man armies

unless you count one at a time busting down doors to charge the entry team from a perfectly defendable position just to get shot as "teamwork"

[shadow ether]

You would think a strike squad made of veterans of war would try acting like a team, but they don't seem to interact even in the same room

[bitter mason]

basically what it is lol
ROE was always terrible cause the suspect AI and animation readability was terrible. You will get punished for killing someone if they hesitate I believe tho

but its very loose

[stone bay]

Hardest map guys?

For me. Neon Tomb

F that place

[tough spire]

Weapon raised = fair game. Weapon down = hold off.

[hardy plinth]

Even then

[shadow ether]

Like... There is a team AI in the game, our squad has it. Why no similar AI for the professional teams of suspects?

[hardy plinth]

You can just snipe an unsuspecting enemy like you're playing Splintercell and it's fine

[bitter mason]

Relapse is my least favourite map just because its so long
very tiring to clear

[shadow ether]

Greased palms

[vocal night]

greased palms is just bs most of the time

[shadow ether]

fuck that map

[tough spire]

Greased Palms is so easy now tho

[stone bay]

Yep, long, but do-able. The Tomb is just punishing...keep losing my team to the bomb vest, can't drop him fast enough

[summer copper]

hide and seek is giving me a hard time rn

[hardy plinth]

Greased Palms is ass because enemies can see you through the smallest gaps between boxes

[shadow ether]

We were trying to beat greased palms yesterday and it's so ass
"This game is CQB" my ass

[kindred temple]

greased palms

[frail quartz]

VOID MOMENT

[bitter mason]

I've not had too many issues with bomb vests, you just gotta try and make the map as linear as possible using door wedges

[summer copper]

you guys find the postal one the hardest?

[vocal night]

yeah

[kindred temple]

yes

[vocal night]

especially for s rank its so annoying

[shadow ether]

Yes

[kindred temple]

there can be up to 20 suspects

[stone bay]

It's tough, for real, but again, the Tomb for me...ugh.

[kindred temple]

with AKM’s

[tough spire]

I think Tomb is way harder than Greased.

[summer copper]

i didn't find greased palms to be all that gnarly

[vocal night]

i had no problem in tomb before

[tough spire]

It's such an assault to your senses. Thank goodness you can turn off the lights and music.

[hardy plinth]

night vision helped me on Neon Tomb, otherwise enemies are so hard to spot in the neon areas

[stone bay]

Thank you....agreed. 🙂

[bitter mason]

Greased palms is certainly really bad if you're not just shooting everyone. They see through the smallest gaps and the map itself is just very open and large. Good for a shootout, not for arresting ppl

[shadow ether]

We had much less trouble with the night club through good door/hallway control

[vocal night]

ye its a lot more linear

greased palms is just a huge map

[tough spire]

The thing about all the keyholes on Greased is... you can be using them too

[vocal night]

not really no

[tough spire]

Yes really yes.

[vocal night]

your visibility through 3 pixels is shit

theirs is perfect sure you can hit them too

[shadow ether]

If you have superhuman eyesight and reaction times then certainly

[kindred temple]

its difficult to identify who is shooting at you thru these gaps

[summer copper]

like the bots lol if only

[vocal night]

they also seem to have the same accuracy when they are strafing side to side

[tough spire]

Good lord skill issues.

[tropic mantle]

Gotta love Ready or Not, updated my game and I can't even change what weapon I wanna use 💀

[stone bay]

Okay....funnest map then? For me, Voll House...love clearing that place.

[tough spire]

If you're gonna complain about it being a fair fight between keyholes you've already failed the point of a keyhole.

[summer copper]

me having a skill issue because the bots have a reaction time of 0.1s

[hardy plinth]

I actually found the bomb guy on Neon Tomb to be pretty funny

[kindred temple]

i like 23 megabytes per second

[stone bay]

A good romp!

[vocal night]

enlighten us

[kindred temple]

what if im doing a non lethal run

[vocal night]

because it doesnt matter if you are closer to the hole or further away either way they have much higher perception than a human can

[kindred temple]

will the keyholes help?

[summer copper]

it's fun until i get shot through the holes on the balcony

[tough spire]

THAT is much harder. But not impossible. You can tase and beanbag through it pretty well

[stone bay]

Gotta go up the side

[tough spire]

You can literally solo stealth run Greased with a taser in current AI build.

[vocal night]

you can do that in all maps

[tough spire]

But it sucks and I don't recommend it. Beanbag for those long shots.

[summer copper]

do it then

[tough spire]

Already have. I've solo stealth tasered the entire game. 😐

[summer copper]

did you record it?

[shadow ether]

Twisted nerve or rust belt for me

[tough spire]

I wish. But apparently replays are turned off by default now.

[stone bay]

Aw, dude...good for you, but I hate both of those! lol

[shadow ether]

not clearing it from the top floor down is a mistake

[tropic mantle]

Any reason why one is not able to change what weapon I wanna use in this update?

[summer copper]

i've already S ranked 23 MB/s

i don't need to play it again

[bitter mason]

outdated mods?

[stone bay]

It's a known bug. I think there are solutions on the Steam forums, but I can't recall them now. Likely a re-install. If you've mods, then there's a list of things to do

[shadow ether]

Also club neon is hella fun but it's challenging

[prime wing]

mod issue

afaik

[stone bay]

Yep, he's the bane of my existence! A lot of R&G with that guy hehe

[prime wing]

thats why it is important to remove mods after any update, hard to track what could be breaking the game

[stone bay]

I had to remove the mods.sav file once too

I think that's what the file is called

[summer copper]

i hate to be the 🤓🤓🤓 but it's RNG instead of R&G, stands for random number generation

[stone bay]

Well, okay...lol...I like making people upset 😉

[shadow ether]

I don't think we had much RNG trouble but it's more of a skill issue for us, we can't really react in time if the explosive hugs dude is in the couch rooms

[summer copper]

i'm not really upset but just wanted to let you know

[stone bay]

🙂

[tough spire]

Rhythm & Gas

AKA my Voll House runs.

[stone bay]

Rock & Girls?

[shadow ether]

Relax & Guns

[summer copper]

my voll house runs typically include an SA-58 with a special magdump set aside for Voll

[stone bay]

Voll House is shotgun terra for me...CQB

love it

[remote flame]

Trying Ironman mode after getting S score on all missions... It's a freaking breeze! Just made it past the stupid Post Office map and took no losses. Hopefully will make it all the way through first try

[shadow ether]

Imma try C ranking voll house while arresting everyone and straight up executing Voll

[stone bay]

hehe....he is annoying

[tough spire]

You absolutely will

[remote flame]

the club mission will make or break it

alllaaaahukbar

[summer copper]

Magdump the five seven

[stone bay]

It's the hardest for me, but I really like the mission

[shadow ether]

Y'all talking about post office keyholes being a problem when for us it's always been stupid large ranges and stupid wide view cones from stupid positions far away

[shadow ether]

Bold of you to think I won't take a magnum for it

[vocal night]

at least you can see them back most of the time

[summer copper]

excellent choice sir

[hardy plinth]

I learned their view cones when on alert is 320°.
Pigeon FOV

[shadow ether]

Yeah when they are already shooting

[vocal night]

true

[shadow ether]

Absolute fucking disaster of a map, I haven't hated a map this much since swat 4

Actually, no, I didn't hate any of swat 4 maps this much

[drifting burrow]

my least favorite swat 4 map was probably the diamond heist one, mostly because of the top floor near the start of the map. clearing it from the side doors makes the swat officers screw up sometimes

and maybe the area around the vault

[sturdy pawn]

i feel like half the time my swat guys get injured is because they arent programmed to check a corner

[shadow ether]

My least favourite swat 4 map was the fookin hotel with bombs, and hospital raid as a close second

[drifting burrow]

oh yeah those ones, i kinda liked the bomb one tbh. hospital raid is ok

[shadow ether]

Do y'all turn the music off on club neon map?

[kindred temple]

yes

[tough spire]

Always

[kindred temple]

its annoying

[drifting burrow]

i dont

[shadow ether]

I don't lol

[drifting burrow]

i mean yeah its annoying but i just tune it out in my brain

[bitter mason]

hotel on swat 4 is a paaaaain, hospital isnt too bad if you choose the second entry point but them suspects are deadly. I honestly think level is scarier than fairfax in a few ways

[shadow ether]

Is it annoying? I love the music

[drifting burrow]

i think the music is still cool, its just that ive played that level so many times that its kinda annoying now lol

[bitter mason]

I only turn it off to stop the strobe lights

[vocal night]

music is fine but all those lights get annoying

[tough spire]

The music masks your situational awareness that I don't think the AI are affected by, only you. The light strobe is also obnoxious

[drifting burrow]

one of the most annoying things in ready or not for me is the inability to see in the house from outside if you're far away from an open door on the farm/carriers in the vine level

[vocal night]

draw distance in general is an issue in the game

[tough spire]

??? Where are y'all having draw distance issues?

[drifting burrow]

outside area on mail map

some enemies disappear if you're far enough

or just npcs in general

[bitter mason]

yeah this does happen

[tough spire]

Only place I've ever seen that is outside on Greased by the trucks

[bitter mason]

or did idk if theyve fixed it

generally draw distance has been fine outside of that one area on greased palms

[drifting burrow]

well yeah that map, thats usually where it happens

[shadow ether]

I also had that happen on carriers of the vine

[tough spire]

I just beat both bombs and all shooters on Elephant inside 60 seconds. Now to spend 5 minutes hunting down all the people...

(Or more like 15 because I can never remember where all the rooms are)

[dusky fjord]

Facts

It’s always a ass pain to find the fuckin goofs on that map

[tough spire]

Hide and Seek with objectives that shouldn't be my job as SWAT are the best part of this SWAT game!

[sharp fox]

hide and seek has funny big map so its ok

[smoky cedar]

17 civilians

[smoky cedar]

I was so fucking traumatized when i cleared that ONE container in the warehouse

Immediately BLEACHED the FUCK outta my eyes

First i see a naked woman, very next room has

A RECORDING STUDIO

Instantly im like “Oh fuck no,” “Entry team to TOC, just end it.”

[tough spire]

I meant Hide and Seek as in the child's game not the map but I hear you.

[shadow ether]

"FISA to entry team, you will end nothing"

[smoky cedar]

“Entry team to TOC, do me a favor, will ya?”

“Entry team to TOC, bring me the holy water.”

[shadow ether]

I swear Hide and Seek is the last mission only because Judge gets fired

[smoky cedar]

You’re in RoN discussion smh not general discussion. Of course im gonna think you meant the map

[smoky cedar]

He does??

[shadow ether]

Not sure but after THAT talk with FISA most likely

[tough spire]

I'm discussing playing hide and seek with the kids on the elephant map. 😐

[smoky cedar]

What talk

[shadow ether]

This one
#🎨ron-screenshots-and-art message

[smoky cedar]

I meant the other container, where there’s a single naked woman and then in the next room there’s a p0rn studio

[shadow ether]

Doesn't change that Judge gets fired lol

[smoky cedar]

That’s really extreme for him to be fired

He’d likely just be reprimanded and given disciplinary action for talking back to a federal agent

[shadow ether]

Talking back to FISA is the least of his concerns at that moment

He stumbled upon FISA's shady dealings and had to be pulled out directly
And that's if you listen to the FISA agent and lock the doors without investigating

[smoky cedar]

Kinda ironic how the FISA Commander is like the only person ingame whose subtitles are red. Really implies that FISA is the real enemy in the game

[smoky cedar]

What happens if I don’t

I imagine my AI will execute me honestly

[shadow ether]

Nothing gameplay wise but logic says Judge gets super fired and charged with messing with a FISA investigation

[smoky cedar]

So what are the voice lines

[shadow ether]

No voice lines

[smoky cedar]

And yes it does make sense he’s get a federal charge for interfering with an active FISA investigation

[smoky cedar]

So it’s just that convo and you can leave it open or close it and nothing happens?

[shadow ether]

I kinda wish there were more lines for reporting soft objectives and evidence

[smoky cedar]

Fr

[shadow ether]

Yes

[smoky cedar]

Judge is just like “Bagging evidence.”

Is bro gonna bag up a whole fucking room? This is confusing especially on Carrier of the Vine and 23 mbp/s because you’re not gonna bag up a whole painting, a big ass bitcoin farm mind you

[shadow ether]

Especially hilarious if it's a whole ass server rack or a huge printing machine mounted on a desk

[smoky cedar]

Also makes no sense to bag up child ykyk

Just like keep it as evidence, don’t gotta put 2 pictures in a whole folder

[smoky cedar]

“Bagging up the heavy ass shit USIA stolen files.” 🗿🗿

[wispy mural]

Judge don't play it's a warzone out here

[smoky cedar]

There’s tons of shit on that table, man puts it all in one ziplock

[foggy trench]

finally got way out west

[smoky cedar]

Doesn’t even bag it even

[foggy trench]

never doing rust belt again fuck that map

[smoky cedar]

What map is the coyote one

Oh shit nvm

[foggy trench]

old name for rust belt

[smoky cedar]

Oh so they never changed the achievement

[foggy trench]

but they changed the requirements for some reason

none of the old guides were true

[smoky cedar]

so beat it with 357 magnum? And that’s it?

[shadow ether]

Imagine being TOC

"Entry team to TOC, evidence secured" talking about either a dude's cp stash or a plan of attack by a damn cult

[foggy trench]

i tried like ten times i got like this:

[smoky cedar]

Except our AI have more voice lines
“Bagging it up.”
“I got it.”
“I’ll get it.”
“Packing evidence.”
“Collecting evidence.”
“Bagging.”
“Packing it up.”
“Grabbing evidence.”
“Collecting.”
Etc

[foggy trench]

magnum for you and AI squad, zero primary ammo for you and them
no shield for you nor your teammates
no grenades, rams, gas or any tool/grenade for you or them
all civs cuffed and alive
squad can clear rooms for you but you need to kill/put down at least one enemy with the revolver

[shadow ether]

Swat 4 at least had the officers report on what exactly is the "evidence" and comment on what's happening

[foggy trench]

im not sure if i got it last time because i changed their primaries into only the magnum or because i took out the shield of one of AI mates

they probably can use primaries if they don't have shield but i can't confirm

[smoky cedar]

So basically a
No shield
No tools at all
Revolver only
All civilians alive
MINIMUM One enemy incapacitated

[foggy trench]

yeah

no grenades, nothing
use them for moving and clearing without anything ONLY

[smoky cedar]

What do i put for breaching tool then, just force them NOT to use it?

[foggy trench]

i used them only opening/kicking doors

some guides say they can use the ram/breach shotgun others say they can't, i didn't risked it

[smoky cedar]

So only
Kick Leader Clear
Leader Clear
Move Clear
Open Clear
Open Leader Clear
Move Kick Clear
Kick Clear

When opening doors

[foggy trench]

yeah

[smoky cedar]

Can they do scans like PEEK & PIE

[foggy trench]

i think so but i didn't put the mirrorgun on any of them

so idk if it counts as a gadget for the achievement

[smoky cedar]

Also is it insanely difficult? Because if it’s simple enough then i need to get that other achievement anyway for getting a C+

[smoky cedar]

Nono i meant like on open doors. Mirror guns count as gadgets

[foggy trench]

it was infinitely harder to find out exactly how to get it than doing it

[smoky cedar]

so it was easier done than said

[foggy trench]

the revolver is rly good on this map bc the enemies are close

it's one shot two max on any enemy

[smoky cedar]

ima slap a laser on that thing, call it a day

i always use NVGs on that map

[foggy trench]

as long as they don't use any tool it's good

oh, no NVGs
all the guides say they block the achievement

even if the AI squad is using only the revolver they still carry the primaries so they can light the way for you

[dark gyro]

Man I just got mugged with a needle clearing the meth lab in Twisted Nerve

[shadow ether]

Wat

[smoky cedar]

So basically all of us have to be Helmet Only

Does gunfighter mod (placing helmet wear in deployables) bypass this?

[shadow ether]

Mods don't let you get cheevos

[foggy trench]

anything that isn't the NVGs
gas mask is useless so i'd use the ballistic mask

and idk because im modless

[smoky cedar]

So if i play in safe mode does it turn off all nexus mods, mod.io mods, or both

[shadow ether]

I dunno, try it

[smoky cedar]

I’m on mobile rn

[foggy trench]

the mission itself is not hard

[smoky cedar]

Me who got an F on it

[foggy trench]

after you memorize the areas that spawn enemies they aren't hard to take down

they won't hit you if you use corners and the tunnels are full of stuff to use as cover

[smoky cedar]

Idk every room they spawn in but I know. some specific areas they’re guaranteed

Also if mods don’t let me get achievements how come S ranks still count towards medal of valor, how come they count to mission completion achievements, the secret Kill Me command?

[foggy trench]

every big area will have more than one, every other will have one at max
you can know bc the three big areas have multiple doors leading to them, so after clearing the smaller passages you know that two or three doors lead to the next area

[smoky cedar]

so almost every room in there has one suspect

[foggy trench]

50/50 for smaller rooms but you don't need to be TOO careful

[smoky cedar]

ima just run & gun because i have No Mercy For Terrorists mod which ceases penalties from killing suspects and also a Stress for Less that decreases AI stress gain

[foggy trench]

out of (example) 15 enemies 10 will have shotguns that won't hurt you much if you run full steel

[smoky cedar]

revolver is OP anyway

[smoky cedar]

what about ceramic

so basically ceramic for rifles Kevlar for pistols steel for shotguns?

[foggy trench]

didn't tried it
just don't run kevlar and you should be good

[smoky cedar]

So should i run ceramic or steel

[dark gyro]

I run steel

[foggy trench]

steel and ceramic are both for higher calibers but steel penalizes your mobility more in exchange of taking more to the armor than yourself

[smoky cedar]

what about ceramic

[smoky cedar]

So Kevlar gives minimal armor but speed?

[foggy trench]

ceramic makes you faster but you get hurt more with each shot

[smoky cedar]

Eh screw it i have a mod that allows me to sprint so i don’t care about the walking speed much

[foggy trench]

kevlar is minimal armor, i wouldn't risk it at all bc you will 100% get at least one limb red

[vocal night]

armor penalizes your acceleration not your top speed

[foggy trench]

actually it's the other way around, ceramic makes each round hurt less but protects less from the rounds themselves

[smoky cedar]

i know but i can still sprint

[foggy trench]

overall protection is worse but round breakdown is better

[smoky cedar]

so it basically stops the bullet but it hurts and damages you

[foggy trench]

steel does that

[shadow ether]

Isn't the point of a bullet to hurt and damage you anyway?

[smoky cedar]

hurts less but protects less?

[foggy trench]

if ceramic stops the bullet it won't hurt you as much as steel but it got less chance of stopping the bullet than steel

[foggy trench]

yes

[smoky cedar]

so basically a painkiller kinda but it’s armor

breaks bullet but hurts?

[foggy trench]

if the bullet penetrates you the chances of dying are higher than if it just hurts you

[smoky cedar]

???

[foggy trench]

the ceramic breaks the bullet IF IT STOPS the bullet, so it doesn't hurt as much
steel doesn't break so it hurts more but it got more chance of STOPPING the bullet

[smoky cedar]

So which is stronger

[foggy trench]

depends on how you play

[smoky cedar]

in general which one kills you faster

[foggy trench]

steel is more certain, ceramic is more gambling

[smoky cedar]

Also heavy armor steel full coverage?

[foggy trench]

yeah

[smoky cedar]

ok

plus a ballistic mask?

[foggy trench]

for full protection yeah

[summer copper]

the bullet typically shatters the ceramic hexagon anyway

ceramic is more moveable as well because it's essentially a beehive pattern of ceramic hexagonal plates

[foggy trench]

i run steel aways because im more used to engage while getting shot

[smoky cedar]

i always ran ceramic and had bad luck most of the time, no wonder it felt like running Kevlar

thought it was the strongest ngl

[foggy trench]

ceramic or steel is more about gear points

if you want more points to spend somewhere else you get ceramic because steel is more expensive

[smoky cedar]

how much does steel cost

[foggy trench]

but it's not worth it imo because no gear is more important than the one that decides if you die or not

[smoky cedar]

how much does ceramic and Kevlar cost

[shadow ether]

Wait, does it? I'm pretty sure my light armor gives me 13 slots no matter if it's steel, ceramic or kevlar

[smoky cedar]

yeah

[foggy trench]

heavy armor: less points more protection overall
light armor: more points less protection overall

same for kevlar, ceramic and steel

[shadow ether]

Yeah but I'm using light armor and the slots don't seem to change with the material

[tough spire]

Pretty sure steel/kev/cer all give same equipment points

[foggy trench]

yeah i confused it with the weight

weight gives the points, material gives the velocity

[smoky cedar]

It’s 2 less points and it’s not like it matters. We can’t use ANY gear

[foggy trench]

if you want to save points you get the lighter armor, if you want to save speed you get the less protective material

[shadow ether]

Which is why there's no reason to use kevlar at any point in the game

[foggy trench]

kevlar and the stab vest only exists to give options because running any of them is aways a loss

[smoky cedar]

Heavy armor steel full coverage is the best option since it’s not like we can use any gear besides max out our 357 magnum

[shadow ether]

Doesn't stab vest give like 15 points of equipment?

[smoky cedar]

Yes but it’s fucking useless. It’s literally just No Vest but with gear

[foggy trench]

no gear is worth going down after getting hit twice

[shadow ether]

It's good when you absolutely don't intend to be shot at because you are 4 dudes with 13 gas grenades each

[foggy trench]

you would be surprised how fucky the gas effect area can be

[summer copper]

which ends up not mattering much when you get clarted from cross map

[foggy trench]

once i gassed that one garage in the beginning of twisted nerve TWICE and the dude still shot me because he slightly stepped outside the doors

[shadow ether]

I would, the radius for it is kinda shit

Which is why we take stingers instead now!

[smoky cedar]

gas grenade has a splash effect. Explodes through walls and people get stunned through entire rooms sometimes

M320 flash and gas launchers are good and effective

[foggy trench]

nah gas is still the most op option
you just gotta calculate the grenade movement

[smoky cedar]

Yeah

[shadow ether]

It is op for area denial

If you can't wedge a tunnel, gas it instead, no one will be coming through

Also some object hitboxes are total cancer
The statues on voll mansion are the worst

[smoky cedar]

Love how grenades have both a negative and positive impact on suspect morale

Either they

• Shit their pants and surrender
  OR
• Get really fucking angry and retaliate even harder

[summer copper]

i've never had someone get pissed off while choking on CS gas

[shadow ether]

Like, ten times my grenades ricochet off the hard particles of thin air or something

[smoky cedar]

CS gas usually causes an insta surrender but it’s more common with stingers and flash bangs for them to get pissed off

I’ve had some charge at me after flashing a room

Or stingers

[tough spire]

omfg the random "Crisis" quitting is killing me on this final achievement. FUCK IT - I am doing Hermit as an S run

[smoky cedar]

Is Ironman the same difficulty as a normal game but with die once die forever?

If yes that’ll be HORRIBLE.

[foggy trench]

if they start coughing they won't retaliate

if they don't then the gas didn't affected them

[smoky cedar]

I mean after the effect is over. Gas is basically guaranteed

To make them surrender

[summer copper]

i've had officers to from content to resigning in one mission

[foggy trench]

what would you even be doing to have almost a whole minute that it takes for the gas to dissipate before surrendering them lol

[smoky cedar]

Rest in peace to the 22 year old Issac, Nyguen who was KILLED, not incapacitated, but KILLED on his first mission.

[smoky cedar]

it’s like 22 seconds

[tough spire]

I just lost on coyote or whatever because of that exact thing.

[smoky cedar]

but people tested it. im not dumb enough to take that long to yell at one person

[foggy trench]

it's almost 40 from the second the gas start comign out plus a few seconds it takes for them to stop being affected by it

[summer copper]

if i was gonna go for the hermit id try and S rank as many missions as i can

practicing in commander mode

[smoky cedar]

do practice mode so that your teammates don’t cry their heart out after tasing a suspect that charged at you with a knife

[summer copper]

my teammate after killing someone who shot them 5 times with an assault rifle: 😢😢😢 i quit

[dark gyro]

I've completed all objectives on twisted nerves but "bring order to chaos" isn't done yet. I can't find whatever hostile's left. Everyone is zipped

[shadow ether]

Check under the beds and in wardrobes

[smoky cedar]

Did you clear the cave and the third mini building

[summer copper]

walk around yelling and they'll eventually reply

[smoky cedar]

Also yes check under the bed

[dark gyro]

Yes all areas are cleared

under the bed ah, aight

[smoky cedar]

Just shoot at random intervals and they’ll yell back or go towards you

[summer copper]

exactly

[smoky cedar]

Crouch and then use free lean. Hold S while in free lean and you’ll be in a prone position. Best way of clearing beds for me. Or just ask your AI to clear the beds, they should automatically do it when moving and clearing a room

Check out closets too

[smoky cedar]

Have you cleared the attic? That’s where my last pack of enemies were when i first played

[dark gyro]

attic is empty

LMAO A guy carrying an AK just rushed out of the blue painted house after I just cleared

[smoky cedar]

tell your teammates to search and secure every room. make sure to drop chemlights

[smoky cedar]

Have you cleared that cold area with metal shelves with bags of cocaine

[summer copper]

elusive methhead

[smoky cedar]

Was that the last one

[dark gyro]

No

It's getting frustrating

I can't clear it even after 3 dudes seemingly rushed out of nowhere

[smoky cedar]

Chemlights checmlights

[dark gyro]

why

[smoky cedar]

They exist to mark locations or rooms already cleared

[dark gyro]

yes

I drop them

[native rune]

Sounds like it wasn’t cleared then

[dark gyro]

it looks buggy af man

[summer copper]

i'm sure that accidentally missing a room or maybe the entire second house or tunnel system isn't a bug

[dark gyro]

It's been 40 minutes

I've seen everything that it allowed me to see

I've got about 20 dudes tied up moaning on the ground

All objectives completed

All civilians alive

I cleared the main house, the painted house, and the little delapidated building

[summer copper]

did you go into the tunnels

[dark gyro]

Yes

[summer copper]

interesting

[dark gyro]

Spammed F in every room, asked my dudes to scan, and ran out of chemlights

[true panther]

any civilians sent back to the spawn?

[dark gyro]

No they're just cuffed

Was dragging them out part of the mission cuz it was never mentioned

[native rune]

Soft objectives? Also if you failed an objective like secure X amount of suspects the level won’t automatically end

[dark gyro]

All objectives are complete

literally

"Bring order to chaos" is the only missing point and I don't see any remaining weapons or headbag terrorists

[twin stump]

Be me, new to the game
Get lost in the map, didnt bring NVG, have flashlight gun attachment but can't find the keybind

Get lost again

[dark gyro]

top mouse button W

[native rune]

I mean I dunno what to tell you then. If bring order to chaos isn’t completed you haven’t eliminated all the suspects

[true panther]

Either means they are hiding somewhere or you've been doing ring around the rosie with a suspect without knowing it

[summer copper]

real

[native rune]

Literally happened to me today. Looked all over Sins of the Father for the last suspect, passed one of the balconies which had the door open maybe several times. Thought, “no way he’s out there” and got the shit scared out of me as he was just chilling out there behind the open door

[dark gyro]

They aren't replying or hiding or shooting, I searched the entire map more than 4 times

[true panther]

Bring order to chaos is done when all suspects are downed/secured, you're missing someone somewhere

[native rune]

The tunnels have small hideaways very close to the ground, the sections that have dead-ends

[dark gyro]

I know about them I tried glitching through

[summer copper]

you can just go back to the truck and extract and finish the mission

if you really cannot find them and you've tried everything and looked everywhere, and you think they might be glitched out somewhere

[acoustic eagle]

u want hard mode? use the "head to exit" command to every civilain u find on the college map