Star Wars

[toxic rune]

they should at least try to trick you

you still know it's just for the money but it's about the principle of it

making it too obvious is disrespectful

I like episode 2

it's a great buddy cop movie for about 2/3rds of it

just condense the geonosis part a bit more and you got a solid good movie, maybe even great

oh man this one both hurts and explains a bit

Star Wars all ||the red squadron thing can have a lot of reasons in canon; the Luke thing is easy: because the trauma caused by the massive war he took a part in is a big reason of why the dream almost made him kill his nephew. Young Luke didn't have that trauma yet; I mean, realistically Vader's sacrifice meant jack like 99% of the other sacrifices in the whole war, but in the context of the story Vader's sacrifice allowed the new republic to be built, just because Palpatine came back doesn't invalidate the time between then and the OT where people got to prosper and not live under the shadow of the Emperor||

I maintain that the ideal solution for Star Wars is to give it to me

I'll take it places

[wispy vortex]

||Luke’s core character revolves around his ability to see the light in people. In no way could that character have done that. Also, there wasn’t time to prosper. It was just reset back to empire and rebels.||

[toxic rune]

Star Wars all ||that's young luke /shrug 30 years is a full generation worth of time||

[wispy vortex]

||Cool, tell us what happened in that 30 years.||

[toxic rune]

||I have no idea tbh||

Star Wars all ||I vaguely remember some people talking about reconstruction in one of the shows or movies||

||and the first order eventually rose up but hell if I remember when lmao||

[wispy lichen]

Star Wars all ||Luke being the hero is a central archetype to his character. It’s like Superman. I go to him for hope. ||

||Ending up a depressed cynic is just not Luke||

||Star Wars is about love conquering darkness. Why allow the darkness to win for the greatest beacon of light in the SW universe? It is thematically against the core of the franchise ||

[toxic rune]

Star Wars all ||if that's the core of the franchise and if that's what Star Wars is about, both of which may not necessarily be true||

[weary pine]

Star Wars all ||I'm actually fine with disillusioned and jaded Luke as a concept. But I'm absolutely not okay with him genuinely considering murdering Ben. I can see Luke going full Kreia and hating the Force for what it did to people, the galaxy, and his family. I can see Luke abandoning the Jedi Order. I can't see the man who spared Darth Vader thinking about killing his nephew. ||

[dry herald]

||I dont really see it as a serious consideration tbh. It was a moment of fear he felt, not wanting everything he worked for to go to waste. A knee jerk reaction that was for a moment before he actually thought about it and realized that it wouldnt help and would go against his views.

I can understand why people didnt like tlj luke. I personally thought it worked well though, at least with the setup that was given. I do think they shouldn't habe gone back to the "rebels vs empire" setup for sure, but within that context I could see why luke was the way he was||

[wispy lichen]

Star Wars ||I don’t think it’s a matter of if it could reasonably happen. Sure it could.
But it makes our heroes out to be jaded and dark, when they are built to inspire hope. It would be equivalent to Superman contemplating killing a kid because he learns they might one day become a supervillain and so the kid becomes a supervillain. It simply is not a thing Superman should do. Not because it isn’t reasonable, but because Superman is an archetypal hero who is used to create hope, not destroy it. ||

[autumn hemlock]

Star Wars, Superman ||Not just "because the just might one day become a supervillain", but because he has seemingly prophetic visions that the kid will destroy bottle-Krypton (I forget what it's actually called)||

Star Wars ||Also of note, Luke isn't a perfect Paragon of good, he almost falls to Sheev's goading in the throne room.||

[wispy lichen]

||which then results in the destruction of the Justice League and the death of all heroes btw||

[autumn hemlock]

Sorry, I know precisely enough about the DC setting to know the thing I mentioned is a thing, but not enough to know if you're extending the metaphor or if those are in-universe ramifications

[wispy lichen]

I’m extending the metaphor

[autumn hemlock]

Okay, thanks

[wispy lichen]

Star Wars ||this is what works very well about Luke tbh. He has seen the dark and rejected it, embracing the light and love despite all else. “I am a Jedi like my father before me.” is a rejection of the dark and embracing the memory of what his father once was and could once again be. One of the best SW moments, precisely because he was tempted but chooses the light. He embraces loving Vader over hating him. ||

And that’s my favorite scene in the movies XD

This convo reminds me of this one part from Luke Skywalker and the Shadows of Mindor ||

I have known Jedi. Many, many years ago. That knowing was not a gladness for me. I believed I would never know another, and I rejoiced in that belief.
But it is a gladness for me to be proven wrong.
I am happy to have known you, Jedi Luke Skywalker. You are more than they were.
"That's--" Luke shook his head blankly, blinking against the darkness. "I mean, thanks, but I barely know anything."
*So you believe. But I say to you: you are greater than the Jedi of former days.
Luke could only frown, and shake his head again. "What makes you say that?"
Because unlike the Knights of old, Jedi Luke Skywalker...
You are not afraid of the dark.||

I love Star Wars it’s so good

[warm thicket]

All the talk around whether or not the Holdo maneuver could work and why nobody did it before reminds me of the scene in Dune ||where the Harkonens switched from modern weaponry to standard artillery and got a massive advantage from it.||
Why did it work? Because nobody was prepared for it.
Why didn't anyone do it before? 🤷‍♀️ Sometimes warfare just be like that.
I truly don't understand why this is such a point of contention in the fandom. The number of things in Star Wars that exactly one person did exactly one time on screen that would have been really helpful throughout the series is astronomical

[wispy lichen]

Tbh that is something I personally care less about because Star Wars has never been consistent on tech lolol

[warm thicket]

Exactly
It's like when I see people explaining how lightsabers work.
There isn't any consistency in the mechanisms or fighting styles that indicates lightsabers work in any way other than, "this is pretty cool"
And that's ok. Sometimes it's ok for things to just be cool.

If you're really bothered by Holdo ramming other ships at light speed, just pretend for a second she was going at regular sub-light speed and ask yourself the same questions. Why doesn't anyone ram their ships into each other? Why doesn't anyone strap an engine and a droid to a big rock and throw that at enemy ships? Because they don't. Maybe nobody thought of it before, maybe people thought of it and never got around to trying it, maybe people tried it and it's just not normally as effective as standard tactics, maybe that's just not the story the writers are trying to tell. Who knows?

[broken smelt]

Just to add my 2 cents as a huge Luke fan ||I would say this is exactly the point: darkness DIDN'T win. Looking at Luke in thr OT, especially 6, he absolutely has an inner dark side. But every time we see him get close to the line (Force choking Gammoreans, nearly killing Vader) it's because his love for his friends is being manipulated. He will do anything to protect his friends, and his arc in the OT is all about learning that no - there actually is a line.

Him rejecting his inner dark doesn't mean that goes away. The whole thematic message is about being good is a choice we can all make, and in Ep 8 that remains true. But with the added caveat: it's a choice we all have to keep making.

Luke had a reflexive moment, where he raised his saber against Ben after seeing a vision of everyone he loves die, of everything he fought for undone. Then he immediately stops himself and regrets that reflex. That is 100% Luke: we see that constantly in the OT (leaving Dagobah against advice, confronting Vader/Palps, etc). And then ep 8 ends, not with Luke burning books and turning his back on his friends, but with him enbracing the CORE CONCEPT of what it means to be a Jedi! Using the Force for knowledge and defense, never attack. He does the most Jedi thing we've ever seen on screen and saves his friends, saves the Resistance, inspires the galaxy! (The entire point of the final scene of the movie is to make it clear that his story and myth are being told, and inspiring a new generation)||

Sorry for the long rant 😅 No way directed at you, and I'm not even trying to say anyone "should" like the movie or the choices made. Just trying to highlight why I really like it, and think it very much isn't a character assassination

[wintry lark]

||Except that every time Luke's had a moment of weakness in the past, it was because of rage, not fear||

[wispy lichen]

||and there was always coming back from his choice, not a destruction of everything the character had worked for and represented||

[broken smelt]

I don't think that's quite true ||he fears for his friends in ep 5, that's why he goes to Cloud city||

[wispy lichen]

Star Wars ||like losing his entire Jedi Order and failing restart the Jedi is a big smear on Luke’s legacy||

||now he’s no longer the “New Hope” but the same as all before him who had failed to prop up Rey instead ||

[broken smelt]

But he ||trains Rey, so in the end he helped the legacy continue on||

[vale dirge]

Are castings considered spoilers?

[wispy lichen]

||but it’s not his legacy anymore: it will be Rey who “fixes” the Jedi||

[broken smelt]

||But he is still a beacon of hope, by the end of the movie. That's the point of that Temeri Blag scene at the end|| again, just why it works for me. It doesn't have to land for everyone

[wispy lichen]

||which makes him just the same as Yoda or Obi Wan, a past failure ||

[vale dirge]

Eh, I’ll just mark it as one. This image feels like something Clickhole or The Onion would produce. Mando/Grogu movie casting

[broken smelt]

For me, that's too reductive thinking. A person can be so much more than either a failure or a success

[wispy lichen]

A New Hope through RotJ ||is about Luke being just that, the hope of the future. A new sort of Jedi who can create a new sort of Order. He rejects the thinking of Yoda and Obi Wan by refusing to kill Vader and decides on love. Yoda and Obi Wan were of an Order that failed, sure it was Sidious’s fault but there were flaws existing in the Order. They are tied to the old. And now Luke is too. Luke is not the “New Hope”, it becomes Rey instead.|| And that’s kinda what the issue is for me

[broken smelt]

That's fair enough, I disagree with that interpretation personally. But perhaps where we were in life when we first saw the movies impacted how the message was received and interpreted. Speaking only for me, the ||failure of Luke, then his learning from Rey (as much as he was teaching her too), and rising from that failure, embracing again the path of the Jedi, all that. It really landed for me, and resonated a lot more than it might have at other times in my life||

[wispy lichen]

||I’d argue that makes Luke a rehash of Obi Wan and Yoda because that is exactly the role they occupied in the OT. ||

[broken smelt]

||Not for me, since he takes that extra step of stepping up again in a way they didn't really. He did more than just train Rey. But at the same time there is definitely that Star Wars idea of "rhyming" which is undoubtedly present. And mileage may vary for how much that bothers people||

[vale dirge]

I’m just kinda jumping in here, but overall my biggest issue with the sequels is that essentially the whole conflict boils down to ||remember what happened in the original trilogy? Well none of that matters and we’re basically back to where we started post-Revenge of the Sith|| so the whole series just kinda feels stagnant

Star Wars all ||at least the prequels had things actually change. The sequels drop us in a world that is essentially the same as the one we saw in Return of the Jedi. There’s one Jedi, an evil empire, and a weak resistance.||

[broken smelt]

That's fair. Ultimately it worked well enough for me in the end, but it definitely could have taken bigger swings in 7 to create a fresher setting. Fingers crossed that whatever comes next does that

[wispy lichen]

Star wars all ||it just feels so reductive of what the old gen accomplished because it didn’t last, they failed to actually succeed. You could jump from the Prequels to the Sequels and nothing change all that much because it didn’t matter. ||

||and that’s incredibly disrespectful to Luke and Leia and Han IMO||

[broken smelt]

Not to get too real world, but I think that's kind of the point: fascism comes back even when you think it's gone

[vale dirge]

Yeah. So really I don’t dislike the sequels, I just feel nothing about them besides some bewilderment at some of the choices

[vale dirge]

I don’t think they did a very good job of that because it feels like the world never got to the point where the facism was gone

[broken smelt]

That's fair ( though also true of reality)

I'm certainly not saying they executed on the idea flawlessly. But I approve of the concept enough to still enjoy what we got

[wispy lichen]

Maybe our fantasy about hope and light and love could be more optimistic than reality is

[vale dirge]

I think there’s plenty of things Legends did poorly, but at least the Heir to the Empire series has an interesting villain that doesn’t just feel like the same old

[wispy lichen]

Maybe we go to fantasy not to see real life but to see something better than real life

[wintry lark]

ST ||It would have made far more sense if the ST rhymed with the OT instead of copying it. This time the sith faction are the scrappy rebels and they blow up a Republic space station||

[vale dirge]

And it does a better job of the whole “hey, it’s hard to root out an evil galaxy spanning empire that had full control over everything” than the sequels did

[broken smelt]

Which I think we still get! My point was only that George was also always very much in dialogue with the politics of his time in 1-6

[broken smelt]

No arguments here, that could have been interesting for sure. An evil working from the shadows, but in a different way from the PT too. It could have rhymed with both trilogies!

[broken smelt]

Also agreed. Zahn is a great writer, and put more thought into fleshing that out

[wispy lichen]

I also see this nice track of thought up to Hand of Thrawn of the slow destruction of the Empire

And I think some EU stuff is straight bad, but some of it is a masterpiece of fiction. It helps that they don’t have aging actors. It helps that ||they don’t create such a big world-building req that the Empire is back, the Jedi are gone, Luke ran off, and Han and Leia split up. These are things you cannot work around anymore. You can’t have the next author back track and undo the damage because the damage is done. Those things are set in stone. ||

ST ||at this point I just hope Rey restarts the Jedi because if she fails too then lmao||

[broken smelt]

Well that is currently the plan. And I agree, if they drop the ball there... gonna be hard to recover

[vale dirge]

I just don’t think I’ll really interact with new Star Wars media unless it’s like Andor level good

I don’t have enough time to do more than that when there’s so much high quality stuff out there

[wispy lichen]

So tragic we’ll never see my king on screen tho

(Jacen Solo)

[autumn hemlock]

Speaking of things we'll never get... (Original Thrawn Trilogy, PT) ||Zahn's imagining of the Clone Wars sounds so much cooler, a series of conflicts between the Republic and some number of rogue systems propped up by rapidly mass produced legions of clones||

||Instead we just got Galactic Civil War 0: This Time It's American Civil War Coded||

[wispy lichen]

I’ll watch almost anything SW lol

[wintry lark]

that checks out

[toxic rune]

even more than that, a big point of episode 8 is that ||the jedi weren't needed anymore, that you could be good and worth something even if you weren't a jedi||

[toxic rune]

I like that, because well

winning a war doesn't really fix the situation

there's still decades of work to be done

[vale dirge]

Yeah, but it doesn’t even feel like anything was won ever

It’s like nothing has changed since RotJ

[toxic rune]

I don't like the first order being the new empire and turning the republic into a second resistance, I'd prefer if it was just imperial remnants

[vale dirge]

Yeah, I agree

And I’d like if the Republic actually had some teeth

They just completely recreate the dynamics of the OT without thinking if those dynamics even make sense

[toxic rune]

yeah

but that's on 7 to blame and I'm fine blaming 7 🙏

[vale dirge]

I’m fine blaming 7, too lol

[toxic rune]

while 8 has its problems the biggest problem with it is the cowardice of 9

[vale dirge]

I wish RJ had control from the start. I don’t think he did the greatest job with TLJ, but with what he had to work with he at least tried to make it interesting

[toxic rune]

Disney needs to fire the jedi PR team

let star wars have no jedi 🙏

[autumn hemlock]

I wish the directors/scriptwriters/producers had a group chat

[toxic rune]

you can see the writers every so often try to expand the worldbuilding into something interesting

but then nope back to this jedi sith bull again

[vale dirge]

I’m fine with Jedi/Sith stuff still existing, but it doesn’t have to be the focus

Like there’s trillions and trillions of people in the galaxy and only 10,000 Jedi at their peak in the PT. They might as well be myths to most people.

[toxic rune]

I don't like what they represent

it's so much more interesting to have a nuanced take on the force than it be reduced to the Goody Good Paladins vs the Evil Death Knights

[vale dirge]

I’m not going to start this conversation again lol

[autumn hemlock]

Jedi/Sith continuing to exist is fine as long as we get other ideologies that are presented as valid

[toxic rune]

and the focus on those two forces the worldbuilding to go through some hoops to justify it

especially in the scope that star wars has

I'd much prefer to have the jedi as a sort of state religion of the republic more than actually being confirmed by god as his one and true warriors to enforce his will of peace and prosperity on the galaxy

[autumn hemlock]

They should just make the Whills be a phenomenon that's cropped up because of millennia of subconscious Force use by the Jedi Order instead of true driving forces of nature

[toxic rune]

I'm also fine with them just deleting the Whills from canon tbh

not like anyone is doing anything with it

[wispy lichen]

Lol

I’m not gonna argue this either

[autumn hemlock]

Oh, also (assuming we're taking anything in the movies to be hard canon) I'd love if they changed Midichlorians from causing The Force to being a symptom of The Force

[wispy lichen]

Especially when I have very strong thoughts on it and have no interest in a Star Wars without Jedi, so it’s not worth arguing about for me

[toxic rune]

please for the love of heaven delete the midichlorians from canon 🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏

[unkempt sail]

Right, like the witches in The Acolyte were interesting

[wintry lark]

my understanding is that they just link the force to the material world

without midi-chlorians the force would exist, it just wouldn't be able to do things

and life wouldn't exist etc

[wispy lichen]

(I interpet it as the midichlorians are a physical manifestation of the force ala ki)

(You can become more attuned over time)

[vale dirge]

I prefer the Auralnauts’ view of midichlorians just being hardcore drugs

[autumn hemlock]

Nah, having some way to be able to go "this guy's probably a Jedi" is fine. PT ||Also once there was a risk of a secret Sith in the Senate, the Jedi should've used all their political clout to perform blood tests on all government employees||

[wispy lichen]

I prefer the Vergere view on the force but like 2-3 people here know what that means so lol

[vale dirge]

https://youtu.be/zwLccJOMTX0

[toxic rune]

I'm not a big fan of inborn magic 😔

especially in something like the force which just makes you better than normal people

and especially in an IP like Star Wars that is so uncritical of what it is saying

[wintry lark]

Unfortunately that's been a part of Star Wars since the OT

hell, ANH implies that being a good pilot is genetic

[toxic rune]

I mean, the OT is much more handwavy about it

like in the OT the jedi could just be a fringe, old forgotten religion that Vader has been a believer in and got super powers from

[formal rose]

...I wonder how much of a justification it is to say that later works implied that it was more that being powerfully force-sensitive makes you a good pilot

[vale dirge]

Rogue One kinda makes it seem like anyone can learn to use it

[toxic rune]

it doesn't need to be that Vader is the specialest boy in the world with the highest midichlorian count

[wispy lichen]

Anyone can

This is true

[toxic rune]

Star Wars as a whole flipflops on it

one moment it says anyone can use the force and it's not genetic

[formal rose]

Frankly, it might have worked better if the Empire had lasted longer than it actually did

[toxic rune]

the next you have the people who have too low midichlorian counts not even making it to full jedi, they get thrown to the auxiliary corps

[wispy lichen]

Most sources at the moment seem to agree it’s like a door you can work to open to allow a flow through, but some are born with a more open door

But anyone can train to open their door

[wintry lark]

PT ||I do think that the whole chosen one thing was completely unnecessary. Anakin can just be a powerful Jedi and war hero||

[toxic rune]

yeah lmao

or if the PT didn't make the jedi a state religion

it's like

the robes of a jedi aren't the robes of a jedi

they are the robes of a desert hermit because obi-wan and yoda were hiding

you ain't gonna get many high class tailor shops in Dagobah

[wintry lark]

old republic jedi armor is great though

[vale dirge]

Literally just watched a video making fun of this

[toxic rune]

but because Star Wars can't help but be self referential, the hermit robes become the order's attire

[wispy lichen]

High Republic armor is cool

Have you seen the HR armor

[toxic rune]

me nope

[wintry lark]

I'm looking it up and not really seeing anything

[vale dirge]

https://youtu.be/njb0uHRWrUk?t=368s

[wintry lark]

So basically a better reference point is probably Luke in RotJ. Which honestly isn't that far off from PT designs

[toxic rune]

pretty much yeah

the <expletive removed> black outfit is pretty snazzy

[formal rose]

Also, imo Luke's robes are so much better as Jedi robes
Just kinda silly for the hermit robes to actually just be the official outfit

[wispy lichen]

Armor isn’t the right word, but it has this much more gilded, glowimg, bright vibe. I love the aesthetic.

[toxic rune]

though the PT also weakens it by being self referential and having Anakin wear very similar clothing throughout

[wintry lark]

I love the idea that the Republic went into decline so the jedi decided they needed to change their color scheme from white and gold to black and brown to fit the tone

Instead of clinging onto tradition

[toxic rune]

iirc the official reason is that yoda wanted the order to be more humble or smth

he was like a traditionalist or smth

[wispy lichen]

I love Avar’s look

[wispy lichen]

It’s also this sign of ||excess and arrogance. Their power was so great and they thought themselves infallible. They were noble and bright, but also arrogant. ||

Avar is such a cool character

She ||senses the force via music, so she hears a different song in the force for all life||

[toxic rune]

star wars would be way more interesting if the jedi were just like a sect of a random planet

hell make it Tatooine if you want since the franchise is obsessed with that place

and the force was more 'contested' between different groups like the sith, the witches, the jedi and plenty of others with different views, philosophies and approaches

[wintry lark]

also, side note, but I wish the Old Republic had much more primitive technology. Like, maybe they're medieval aesthetically, even if they have hyperdrives. Maybe fundamental things like blasters and droids don't exist yet except as hidden Rakata relics. As it is, it feels like the galaxy's just been in stasis for millennia

[toxic rune]

hell have multiple different sects of jedi, could even turn the whole guardian sentinel consular thing into different jedi orders not just your class within the order

[wispy lichen]

I love Star Wars (the force and the Jedi especially) too much to engage in any argument about their merit fairly, so I’ll step away if that’s where the convo is headed lol

[toxic rune]

the stormtrooper armour in old republic also doesn't help

[formal rose]

I love that
"We are but humble monks and servants of the Republic"
"...is that why you're decked out in gilded gold and yellow robes?"
"Shut up..."

[autumn hemlock]

"It isn't our fault the peasantry value our services so highly we can afford to shine"

[toxic rune]

old republic stuff especially could use being less referential to current star wars

take some liberties and do something different 🙏

we don't need mandos and stormtroopers and bounty hunters and jedi and sith in the old republic, take the opportunity to do something novel

[wintry lark]

I don't know about getting rid of Jedi and Sith. Jedi are supposed to be this ancient religion, and the Old Republic is really the only place we've seen pre-Rule of Two Sith

[dry herald]

Yeah, I do agree there. like, episode 3 is definitely above the sequels for me. Only reason 2 is still below them is because I feel like it just doesn't work as well for me (and to be clear, I do enjoy pretty much all star wars except for acolyte)

[echo echo]

I also do really like the cold war vibe of the SWTOR era Empire and Republic attempting some sort of quasi-coexistence after one war ends and another war sits on the horizon. I wish they'd done more with it

[wispy lichen]

I think I like the Old Republic a lot lol

[wispy vortex]

Just a bit lmao

[wispy lichen]

It’s very interesting to see two giant factions in that era

It’s like nothing else in Star Wars despite the OT visual queues it borrows

Also the leadup to the Treat of Coruscant is so fun to see in the comics and books

[restive bluff]

Haven’t played in a while but I’m pretty sure I have over 1000 hours (a bit annoying to check though since part of it was before it was on Steam and my brothers play on the same account)

[wispy lichen]

It’s a fun game

[wispy lichen]

I think it is novel in the way it’s done

SWTOR || we have a giant faction of Jedi and a giant faction of Sith. This galactic war has so much powerful people on both sides. No operating from the shadows. No Empire vs. Rebels. Two giant government bodies fighting in a galactic scale war. ||

Nowhere else is there the sandbox to live your SW fantasy, whatever it is

[echo echo]

The Old Republic is absolutely ailing but not in ways that make it militarily inferior to the Empire and only held together by scrappy misfits

[wispy lichen]

It’s a paint of coat to make it feel on a surface level like the OT, but in a deeper sense it is very much its own thing

[echo echo]

The game is also structured such that light and dark become moderately divorced from Jedi/Sith or Republic/Empire as well

[wispy lichen]

Yeah. That part of it is super cool.

I think the most interesting way that is done is via the Sith Inquisitor where ||as a light sider, you devote yourself to rising to power so you can change the Sith Empire from the inside ||

[wispy vortex]

Legends ||Didnt work out too well for Luke when he tried it||

[echo echo]

SWTOR ||I wouldn't say it particularly does for light side Inquisitor either but the later expansions take the Republic/Empire conflict in some weird directions so hard to say||

[wispy lichen]

SWTOR ||I’d also point out the Inquisitor doesn’t have much choice. They are born a slave and rise through deceit. There is no alternative in their mind. ||

[wispy vortex]

legends ||Should have gone full Bane smh||

[echo echo]

SWTOR/Legends ||The Sith stories do seem constructed as being something of a justification for Bane's philosophy for sure||

[wispy vortex]

||Thats cause Bane is peak||

[echo echo]

SWTOR ||All of the Imperial story arcs (except Bounty Hunter) are pretty heavily focused on the ripe combination of Imperial infighting, backstabbing, and politicking (present also in the OT-era Empire) but also sweetening it with a layer of "Sith are everywhere and they're all half-mad loose cannons"||

||Arguably all three of them unavoidably spend more time fighting other Imperials than the do the Republic||

||And every other Sith thinks he's Him and has some half baked secret plot to become the most powerful Force user the galaxy has ever known||

[toxic rune]

not my star wars fantasy 😔

that is actually part of the problem with the old republic in general as a concept

and games set in the old republic in specific

you can't actually do new things in it because people don't come to star wars for new things they want their lightsabers and blasters and mando armour

so the galaxy has to be stagnated for thousands of years so that people can have the aesthetics they want

and the current canon is too busy, there's not a lot of space to place the story so it has to go to old republic

this is kinda why they started doing the high republic thing

it's kinda a compromise

[wispy lichen]

And people go to Warhammer 40k for Space Marines.

[toxic rune]

yeah I have a massive problem with that too

warhammer 40k is already not good but it's at its worst when it is focusing on the two worst factions, the guardsmen and the space marines

which just so happens to be 90% of warhammer 40k media 😔

[echo echo]

Every once in a while I do wonder why you want the things you want from Star Wars from Star Wars

[wispy lichen]

Maybe the problem isn’t a franchise filling a niche but wanting it to change it’s niche to what you want instead of finding a different fandom

[toxic rune]

because they are there

it's been done in this franchise already

these things I want already exist

[wispy lichen]

Yeah. Star Wars is Star Wars lol.

[echo echo]

Your criticisms of it often read to me like "I'd love Star Wars if it was something completely different"

[toxic rune]

sometimes in an incomplete form that could be expanded upon and done better if the writers had more freedom, but they are there

all the things I want in Star Wars already exist very explicitly in the franchise

even the droid revolution!

though that one is played for a joke

[wispy lichen]

Yeah. I think you’d like Star Wars without blasters, Jedi, Sith, Empire, etc. which is no longer Star Wars

[toxic rune]

and then there's like one or two easter eggs referencing the joke

I would be very happy with more 40k media not about space marines

can we please give some time to the eldar? 🙏

hell I'll take the tau if GW wants to make them the new protagonists whatever I don't care just no more space marines or guardsmen for a while 🙏

okay the "very" is a lie, it would be impressive for anything 40k to make me very happy but I'd be happier that's something

this is part of why I like Fantasy more tbh, it's got way less of a focus on the empire equivalent(s)

Star Wars Fantasy would go kinda hard tbh

[wispy lichen]

Why actively engage with franchises you mostly dislike then

Why not engage with franchises you do enjoy?

[toxic rune]

because there's parts I like lmao

Jedi Academy is still on my top 10 favourite games

old battlefront 2 is still a banger, x-wing and tie fighter still slap, republic commando is still a hella solid game

hell I'll go back to Star Wars Galaxies if I can find a good private server for it

that game is dope

[wispy lichen]

Okay but that is things you enjoy. You can wish for more like that. Why desire the deletion of things people like me love? There is room for both in the franchise.

Because there is a world of difference between “Star Wars would be better if there were no Jedi or Sith or force” and “I wish Star Wars had more of X”.

Those are two completely different mindsets, one of which indicates the majority of the franchise you dislike. Which isn’t a problem with the franchise (that many love) but with different enjoyment that you could perhaps find in a place that is not Star Wars if you so vehemently hate the core of what Star Wars has been since 1977.

I’m sorry my brain is not braining rn lol

[toxic rune]

because there's been enough sith and jedi to fill the whole canon for the next foreseeable future

there's been very little of pretty much anything else

star wars is 60% jedi 30% sith 9% mandos and 1% weird space creatures

also that's not really the core of what Star Wars has been since 1977

I am confident that you could tell the OG trilogy without jedis, siths or the force and not have to change very much about the plot, characters or themes

[autumn hemlock]

I could do with more weird space creatures.
Just maybe not Hyperspace Whales.
Though, if the Hyperspace Whales were intelligent and warring with colonies that were cropping up in their migratory ranges...

[toxic rune]

I know that for a fact because those movies were made in the wake of Star Wars' success

oh wait my count was wrong

star wars is 60% jedi 30% sith 7% mandos 2% tatooine 1% weird space creatures

there we go

[echo echo]

I'm all about space whales in any form, gimme more space whales

[wispy lichen]

But that is what the franchise was then? “You could do Star Wars again if it wasn’t Star Wars”. But it WAS Star Wars.

[wispy lichen]

Purrgils

[autumn hemlock]

I'm not going to take Naru's "no more Jedi/Sith stories" absolutist stance, but I'd be happy to see more stories that aren't about them.

Like give me The Space Hobbit, but Gandalf is a Jedi

[echo echo]

I mean that has been much of the last decade of Star Wars and, for as much as I've enjoyed a lot of it I can't say it has gone over well for the franchise as a whole

[wispy lichen]

Recent Star Wars has lacked Jedi/Sith, that’s true

And Jedi that do appear have been like individual, not organizational

[wispy lichen]

I’d love for diverse SW stories across the board

[toxic rune]

nah it'd still be star wars

[echo echo]

I do not need convincing that Andor for example is peak Star Wars. But it also went widely unwatched

[toxic rune]

can even keep the lightsabers

also I don't mind more force in star wars, just make it interesting

either steer it away from good vs evil or at least examine it

[wispy lichen]

What do you see as the climax of the OT then?

[toxic rune]

not sure I understand the question tbh

[echo echo]

There's actually a stat going around that Cassian Andor has more screen time than any other character in Star Wars (counting only live action). I haven't checked those numbers but I imagine it can only be true if they're counting Anakin and Darth Vader separately for some reason

I absolutely buy that he's up there though

And of course Din Djarin's gotta be up there now too, especially once the movie comes out

[wispy lichen]

Star Wars ||I see the ultimate climactic moment as the confrontation in the Emperor’s throne room between the light and darkness in Luke and ultimately, his choice to be a Jedi. ||

[wispy lichen]

Do you hate superhero movies?

[toxic rune]

I hate superheroes period

[vale dirge]

Do you like bad boys?

[toxic rune]

takes a lot of work to get me to like a super hero

[wispy lichen]

Hmmm

[toxic rune]

well or them being an x-man, those ones get a free pass

[toxic rune]

nope

I like the movie Bad Boys, that movie was cool back when I watchedi t

[wispy lichen]

Yeah I think Star Wars is a lot like superheroes. There is no removal of good vs. evil and ultimately, hope.

[toxic rune]

you can have hope without simple good vs evil

it's stronger, in fact

[wispy lichen]

So to ask for removal of good vs evil is to completely alter the franchise IMO

[toxic rune]

oh. episode 6 ||the whole final part with the battle and the ewoks and all that, the luke part is part of it but only a small part||

also Star Wars 100% does not need to be a superhero movie

there's a lot of stories that can be told in Star Wars and some writers even tried

the results were questionable but I do appreciate that there was an attempt

Coruscant is a very fun setting for neo-noir/cyberpunk noir stories

the whole Empire age works for those too

[wispy vortex]

Exactly

[wispy lichen]

Anyway I’ve made my stance clear and got into the argument despite saying I wouldn’t so Imma step away now 🥲

[glad mason]

My ideal Star Wars would be something that can capture the mythos of the Force as it was presented in the original series, while remaining relatively grounded and avoiding Skywalker family melodrama

I’m watching Andor again and that + more Force stuff would be perfect

[wispy lichen]

My ideal Star Wars is a nomadic Jedi interviewing different force sects for Jedi Archives

Ala Magnus Archives

[glad mason]

That could be fun

I’d like to get into more of the religious/ mystical aspects of Star Wars

[wispy lichen]

I like some of the mythical stuff. It’s funny how different authors say different things completely lol.

My favorite approaches to the force are in KOTOR 2 and then in New Jedi Order Traitor (though they come to very different conclusions about the philosophy)

But Mortis is my favorite Clone Wars arc

[wispy vortex]

I know exactly why you want this

[glad mason]

Crazy idea I have is the binding of Isaac/ sacrifice of Iphigenia but set in ancient times (ie maybe even before the proper Jedi order)

[wispy lichen]

Jacen

[toxic rune]

lmao the first thing I thought was the game not the bible

[wispy lichen]

Also every time I visit Voss in SWTOR I had SO MUCH FUN

Best planet

[glad mason]

I feel like the ideals of the dark side would quite easily lead to human sacrifice and it would be a neat founding story for the proto Jedi?

[wispy lichen]

Have you read the Dawn of the Jedi comics? Those are some interesting early myth-esque stories

[glad mason]

No but that sounds neat actually

[wispy vortex]

I read the book, I really enjoyed the setting

[wispy lichen]

The setting is great

[toxic rune]

okay but what if it was the jedi making human sacrifices out of a sense of righteousness 😌

[wispy lichen]

I did not like the book haha

[toxic rune]

especially since they already do that in a way

[glad mason]

Give me the sith empire as canaanites/ carthaginians

[wispy lichen]

Maybe you’d vibe with Tales of the Jedi or the Lost Tribe of the Sith

Tales is a bit… old… but you may like it

[toxic rune]

my ideal star wars realistically is FFG's Star Wars; a sandbox for you to tell whatever story you want on it

[glad mason]

I like Andor a lot

It does a lot to fill in the politics of the Star Wars world

[toxic rune]

there are many stories that I think would be neat to tell in Star Wars, a Dark Side Werewolf story could be very fun

[glad mason]

But the setting of Star Wars is fundamentally not a good one for political discourse

[toxic rune]

or a story about someone who follows the dark side out of necessity and by circumstance can't follow the light side

would be even cooler if they didn't end up either abandoning the dark side or becoming corrupted

[glad mason]

Naru, is your ideal story just shilling the dark side xD

[toxic rune]

this one has been attempted a couple of times but very shyly

I want it to be bolder

[wispy vortex]

Bane Trilogy

[toxic rune]

like both Anakin, Savage and Maul kinda fit the Dark Side Werewolf thing

[toxic rune]

not necessarily shilling, just making it more interesting than evil juice of evil

[wispy vortex]

Bane ||Circumstances force him to the dark side, and he stays there.||

[glad mason]

You should read those edgy Naruto fanfics where he meets with kyuubi while he’s a kid, becomes super OP, and then starts one-shotting the entire cast and takes control of the Leaf

[wispy lichen]

||think he’s too evil for Naru||

[toxic rune]

lmao classic

[wispy lichen]

star wars general ||which, I would point out, is the point. The dark side is inherently evil. ||

[toxic rune]

I have been tempted to check those out

the 'dark <protagonist of the series the author liked when they were a child/still like if they are writing as a teenager>' I think is a cute fun genre to think about

probably not for me but I find it interesting

like, I think that a story where someone in a bad situation like say slavery, who reaches for the only power that can help them break their chains and become free and this power happens to be evil is interesting

[wispy vortex]

Literally Bane

[wispy lichen]

That sounds like Bane lol

[toxic rune]

and I think that the question of "why is the only power willing to help this slave the inherently evil one" is worthy of being asked and examined

is it truly irredeemable, is the good power actually good when it turns a blind eye to the suffering of millions in favour of its favoured children, are you not allowed to rage against your terrible situations? I think those are all interesting questions to base a story around 🤷

[wispy lichen]

According to Vergere ||it is only power, it is the user who twists it with hate and anger to use it as a weapon and bend it to their will instead of let it naturally flow ||

||all is one and so to blame the dark side for your own darkness is to reach for external explanations that could possibly explain your wrongdoings instead of holding personal accountability ||

[toxic rune]

Star Wars all ||the natural flow is to die a slave and your only way to escape captivity is to use it as a weapon, what then?||

||is it wrong to use the dark side to free yourself when the right path that the universe reserved for you is to die as a slave?||

||like, what is it like to not be the Force's favourite child? Are you not allowed to fight against it if the Force has determined that the only thing in your future is toil and misery? Does rejecting that and trying to forge your own path by defying the will of the Force make you irredeemably evil?||

I think those would be fun questions for a star wars story to address

[wispy lichen]

Star Wars all ||I don’t think of the force as having a will||

||I think of the force as simply an energy pool||

||and people ascribe will to the force to justify their atrocities with an external reason to blame||

||or to blame their misfortune on something instead of life sucking and being unfair ||

This is from New Jedi Order btw

I’m not pulling this from nowhere

[dense lance]

The Force has a will in the sense that objects are solid

Many many micro interactions average out to a general macro effect

[toxic rune]

I mean, it (original trilogy) ||helped Luke more than the people of Alderaan||

[wispy lichen]

NJO

||“Ah, I see. You can do whatever you want, so long as you maintain your Jedi calm? So long as you can tell yourself you’re valuing life? You can kill and kill and kill and kill, so long as you don’t lose your temper? Isn’t that a little sick?”||

This is what Vergere says

NJO ||so Vergere argues the force has no will, it is simply used as an excuse.

Light and dark are no more than nomenclature: words that describe how little we understand. What you call the dark side is the raw, unrestrained Force itself: you call the dark side what you find when you give yourself over wholly to the Force. To be a Jedi is to control your passion…but Jedi control limits your power. Greatness—true greatness of any kind—requires the surrender of control. Passion that is guided, not walled away. Leave your limits behind…If your surrender leads to slaughter, that is not because the Force has darkness in it. It is because you do…The only dark side you need fear, Jacen Solo, is the one in your own heart||

NJO also this ||

Jacen: "I was out of control—"
Vergere: "You were not. Don't make excuses."
Jacen: "What?"
Vergere: "Out of control is just code for 'I don't want to admit I'm the kind of person who would do such things.' It's a lie."||

[toxic rune]

Star Wars all ||I do like the "you are just excusing your actions, the power is just power" but I don't think current canon agrees||

||like, current canon is that the dark side is inherently evil and always bad||

[glad mason]

I think Darth puppykicker is a great guy actually

[toxic rune]

lmao

[wispy lichen]

Star wars ||that fits into this viewpoint by there being no dark side. Simply the force. In all life. ||

[autumn hemlock]

You know what I'd like to see? A Star War with an Evil Lord of the Sith that comes to the conclusion that being at the top of a diverse and functional society is the greatest path to power, and basically becomes Vetinari.

[glad mason]

(Unironically me about darth maul)

(He didn’t mean all the murders and war crimes guys)

(Well he probably did but he was feeling a lil goofy)

[toxic rune]

that would be very fun

[autumn hemlock]

And the local Jedi struggle with how to deal with him because he's openly Sith and clearly pursuing power in a way they feel they should be opposed to, but he's the cog that makes society work

[toxic rune]

lmao I was about to say

I think you can say that of Savage but Maul is a bit harder

[glad mason]

Savage was pretty nice for a guy called Savage Oppres honestly

[wispy vortex]

Current canon doesn’t exist 😌

[glad mason]

Side note I’m kinda hyped against my will for Maul Shadowhunter

[wintry lark]

He didn't choose his name

[glad mason]

He was savagely oppressed

[dense lance]

If the Force is just an amplifier for the emotions that people feed it then there are so many more interesting stories to tell with it than Jedi vs Sith. You can literally do Green Lantern

Binaries are boring

[wispy vortex]

Droid hater

[dense lance]

All droids are binary non-binaries

[unkempt sail]

Finished DFR, and it also seemed to end abruptly- ||intrigued by the clone thing at the end, because I'm fascinated by the pre-PT image of throwaway lines like "the Clone Wars"||

I'm at the library and if the toddler lets me, I'll pick up Rogue Squadron upstairs. I've got Last Command on hand at home already because weirdly, husband had that and HTTE but not DFR

[warm thicket]

I'm kinda surprised, I felt the opposite for DFR. It felt to me like a more natural buildup to the climax of the story. HTTE felt like it kinda just stopped imo

[supple star]

Started Wedge’s Gamble

[wispy vortex]

One of my favorites of the series

[supple star]

WG 4/Aftermath: LD ||So that is why Salm suspects Tyhco. Yeah he should be worried||

[wispy vortex]

||Id be too, no matter how reliable Tycho seems||

[supple star]

https://tenor.com/view/seen-it-marty-back-to-the-future-ive-seen-this-one-gif-5960361

My reaction. Hope I’m wrong

[wispy vortex]

||Obviously Wedge is the real spy ||

[wispy lichen]

WG 4 ||Fey’lya always wins the “worst member of the New Republic” award||

[supple star]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1lpOORwkbdE

[night sundial]

I love Visions, hope they keep it going for a long time. Or even choose specific ones to be expanded into shows. Ik that half of Vol.3 will be sequel episodes to ones in Vol.1 and Vol.2 but still.

[unkempt sail]

Thinking about it more, it does feel like an organic collision of the separate plot threads. I just felt like the very end seemed abrupt, ||with C'Boath confronting Thrawn and the heroes realizing all the dead tie fighter pilots were clones||

[supple star]

I believe they announce that some episodes were being expanded into shows, can’t remember which ones.

[wispy lichen]

The 9th Jedi (PEEEEEAAAAK)

[wispy vortex]

Which one was that?

[wispy lichen]

Ninth Jedi ||a sabersmith’s daughter has to deliver lightsabers to a gathering of force users who are the last chances at resurrecting the long dead Jedi Order. Turns out, the prospective Jedi all turned to the dark side before the meeting||

there was a lot of room for wider world building in that era, disconnected wholly from main canon

[wispy vortex]

Ooo

[supple star]

WG 7 ||Wait Bryor Jace is dead. And he died off screen?||

||I wonder how well Thrawn and Isard get along.||

[steady pike]

actually, ||all but 1 got captured by the sith who showed up in their place. The series is presumably going to be about finding them.||

[supple star]

WG 12 ||That bio weapon is disgusting. So Derricote is one of those monsters.||

Seriously that is really nasty.

[golden flame]

@wispy lichen YO
https://www.amazon.com/Star-Wars-Revenge-Episode-Deluxe/dp/B0F1XFPRYG

[wispy lichen]

Yeah! I remember when that first released. It’s such a gorgeous edition.

[topaz cliff]

Oh yeah I finished reading revenge of the sith the other day. Pretty good book

I thought the differences between it and the movie were interesting

[bright blade]

The Revenge of the Sith book is incredible. In retrospect, I just have one major gripe with it in the midst of the awesomeness of everything else.

RotS book ||I think this book ruined Dooku. Fundamentally misunderstood him. Removed all nuance to his character in other works, Legends and canon, to make him a supreme racist human supremacist. The book makes him a total narcissist who's sole motivation at this point is human supremacy. It's at odds with every other depiction of him.||

Good thing it's a plot point that's resolved quickly 😉

[supple star]

Dang I forgot to take a picture but at Fan X today there were these really cool old promo cards. They featured Mara, Coran, and Karrde with Stackpole and Zahn playing Coran and Karrde respectively.

Found it online. Minor spoilers

[cedar osprey]

Crackpot theory I found

[wispy lichen]

<@&1396936875054203020> just checking in, today is the day we are supposed to move on to the next book, but I don’t know if others have finished either. We can delay the next book for a week if that works better for others?

[supple star]

I am still on Wedges gambit so I would like it if we delayed it a week

[autumn hemlock]

Last I checked, I was basically out of Legends material I can get from Libby, so I've probably fully fallen off

[wispy lichen]

If you wanted, you could always hop back on for Hand of Thrawn (Specter of the Past, Vision of the Future) and / or New Jedi Order if Libby has those

[wispy lichen]

Yeah. I am too lol.

[supple star]

WG 16 ||Gavin explaining why he isn’t a starry eyed rural bumpkin is so cute. “I’ve even been to Mos Eisley. Once”||

[supple star]

WG 18/TLC ||Oh Corran you don’t know the half of it about the ch’hala trees. Might not be a good idea to be near them. Though I doubt Thrawn shared the secret with Isard.||

||Unless she knows herself. She was the head of Imperial Security after all||

[supple star]

WG 24 ||Great, just great. Also please say it not be about Tycho.||

[wispy lichen]

WG 18 / TLC ||I like when he mentioned them being “sniffers” like he was so close to being right lol||

[supple star]

WG 25 ||What was it that Iella said about the chances of running into someone you know by accident on Coruscant?||

[wispy vortex]

Seems to happen all the time lmao

[supple star]

WG 26 ||No Aril! I was worried she was dead. This is much worse.||

I really hate Derricote. Like I need him to die in an incredibly painful way hate him.

[supple star]

WG 29 ||Wedge, don’t you know the rules. If you think someone is dead but don’t see the body, then they aren’t dead!||

WG 30 ||Hmm, Iella’s husband is named Diric and there is a Diric on Derricote’s staff.||

[supple star]

WG 33 ||Yes Loor! Punch Derricote Punch him! Granted you are punching him because he hasn’t made his virus deadly enough but still.||

[vapid fossil]

Light reading for @wispy lichen

[wispy lichen]

WG 25 ||Corran breaking his cover in every possible way lmao||

[wispy vortex]

||Who needs a cover when you have a blaster||

[wispy lichen]

WG 32 ||Maybe Gavin should have asked someone else for the sex talk 💀 ||

[wispy vortex]

||I thought the whole thing was really sweet||

[wispy lichen]

That chapter was a wild ride ngl

Bet I hit my page goal for the day

[wispy vortex]

nice!

[unkempt sail]

Last Command 8 ||I feel like Winter is obviously Delta Source, but not sure of the why. It also occurred to me earlier that contemporary readers would've known that Bail was Leia's adoptive dad but wouldn't have pictured Jimmy Smits, which is weird to think about. Maybe there were comics around about him? Maybe wookiepedia's Legends version would say so||

[supple star]

That chapter had me cackling.

Something I am really liking about the X-wing books so far is how “normal” the characters are. There is a lot of consideration for how people live in the galaxy.

Stuff like chapter 32 and ||when Wedge goes to the museum|| really helps sell the characters.

Also I find it interesting how canon turned down how xenophobic the Empire is. Or at least, made it less obvious.

Because it is a heavy theme here.

[supple star]

Finished Wedge’s Gamble. ||I am really not sure if Tycho is the spy or not. A lot of evidence points towards it being him, but almost too much. Trying to think who else in RS it could be.||

[topaz cliff]

I've started Rise and Fall of the Galactic Empire. The most unfortunate thing in my opinion is how entrenched in the sequels it is. Or at the very least, ||palpatine's return. You can maybe read a little into the author thinking it's absurd, but it definitely pained me each time it was mentioned in the introduction.|| I've heard it's a good book though, I'm excited to read it

[wispy lichen]

<@&1396936875054203020>
This week we move onto to the Krytos Trap by Michael Stackpole. This is book 3 of the X-Wing series.
In two weeks we will move onto the Bacta War.

(And after that is I, Jedi which anybody planning to hop in for New Jedi Order I highly recommend that one)

I, Jedi follows up on a specific plot of the first four X-Wing books and is a retelling of the Jedi Academy Trilogy. It is a standalone though. I won’t say more than that because spoilers, but it’s a great prep for New Jedi Order.

[wispy vortex]

Love I Jedi, it’s so good

[broken smelt]

Ahh, I wish I had time for a reread. I read I, Jedi many years ago, and remember not really caring for it. But I'm curious how I'd take it now (I hadn't read any of the X-Wings books at the time)

[steady pike]

i kinda want to live in a universe where Lucas renamed the original trilogy to episode 4/5/6, but never actually made 1/2/3

just to see all the crazy ideas people come up with after he dies

[vale dirge]

https://www.humblebundle.com/books/star-wars-novels-go-beyond-films-books

[supple star]

Dang, what a deal. I love the HumbleBundle.

[topaz cliff]

I saw a video today that was sort of a trailer I guess for the death troopers novel, about ||zombie stormtroopers I think?|| Anyone know if it's worth checking out? It seemed pretty cool

[wispy vortex]

It was a good book

Nice and scary

[topaz cliff]

Nice, I'll have to check it out

[unkempt sail]

TLC 18 ||I'm surprised Delta Source is tree microphones- I really thought it'd be Winter, and that she was double agenting when talking to Ghent||

[supple star]

I thought the same thing

[autumn hemlock]

The Last Command 18 ||Winter was absolutely screaming "I'm the traitor", but I wouldn't be surprised if she either had enough of a role in prior books or in books set later on that she wasn't allowed to be the traitor. That or we all fell for the red herring.||

[broken smelt]

TLC 18 ||Winter was introduced in this trilogy so it was 100% a striaght red herring. Pretty well done, I think||

[wispy vortex]

||Its crazy looking back through the series how many times Zahn mentioned the trees||

[golden flame]

For real

[dense lance]

hot take: "Aau's Song" should have been the foundation for the New Jedi Order

[vapid fossil]

https://x.com/sw_holocron/status/1977064940969062628

Star Wars Holocron (@sw_holocron)

💕The first official Star Wars romance novel has been announced at #NYCC.

STAR WARS: EYES LIKE STARS is a charming young adult romance set 1.5 years before The Force Awakens.

Read more about the book and every other #NYCC announcement here: https://t.co/7vRykglqnt

X · Oct 11, 2025, 5:33 PM

A Court of Star and War

[wintry lark]

Honestly kinda surprised there hasn't been a Star Wars romance novel

[echo echo]

Is that... Shallan and Adolin?

[wintry lark]

not what adolin looks like unfortunately

[golden flame]

as long as it's a good book then neat, variety is cool

Jar Jar book though...

[echo echo]

Its close enough to be hmmmmm

[supple star]

Isn't Lost Stars a romance?

Pretty sure it counts as one.

There is also the Princess and the Scoundrel

[bright blade]

Glad I wasn't the only one

[warm thicket]

When am I gonna get my gungan smut novel?

[wispy lichen]

There has!

Lost Stars, Princess and the Scoundrel in canon

And High Republic has a major romance tho I wouldn’t call it a romance series

Lost Stars 2 would be better than this on the romance front because Lost Stars was SO GOOOOOOD AGH

we haven’t seen those characters in so long

[wispy lichen]

Yeah, false advertising 😭

[autumn hemlock]

Maybe they mean structurally pure romance

[wispy lichen]

Lost Stars is!

And it’s good

[autumn hemlock]

Or first in the timeline, and in Star Wars Land these two leads literally invent being romantic

[wispy lichen]

They mean the first using the romantasy tropes and format

And forgot that romance has been a huge part of Star Wars since Empire Strikes Back released

[wispy lichen]

Lost Stars is prior to this in the timeline

[autumn hemlock]

Hmm, yeah, I do see TIE fighters on the cover, which puts it at what, like 10BBY at the earliest?

[wispy lichen]

Lost Stars?

It takes place around the timeline of the OT

ending with ||the Battle of Jakku||

[autumn hemlock]

No, Eyes Like Stars

[wispy lichen]

It says 1.5 years before Force Awakens in the tweet

[autumn hemlock]

Wait, I remembered to read the blurb

[supple star]

I looked a bit more into this and supposedly this is the first of an initiative of Star Wars ‘genre’ books. There might be a horror and a war book in this initiative later down the line.

[restive bluff]

I need to get to Lost Stars eventually

[wispy lichen]

It’s a banger

Love it

[supple star]

Agreed

[wispy vortex]

I need to read it too

[unkempt sail]

Last Command 26 ||Luuke shows up way too late from what I was expecting after my husband joked about him anytime the Expanded Universe comes up the entire time we've been together.|| I have like... twenty pages left; idk if we have time to resolve ||the Tantiss cloning program...||

[unkempt sail]

Aaand done. Overall, I do think it was a good immediate sequel trilogy to the original movies and I'm curious how other authors riff in this because I'm aware that there's more stories about [EU general] ||the Solo twins and Mara Jade, and maybe a Luuuke?||

[unkempt sail]

There was an excerpt of The Truce at Bakura in the back of my copy, and it reminded me how odd it feels for all droid and ship numbers to be written out, like Too One-Bee in the sample. Maybe it's for consistency with Threepio and Artoo, I guess

[wispy lichen]

Yeah. It’s a fun immediate sequel that carries the main characters forward into their next step in life.

That’s about how I feel about it too

Very 90s feeling haha

[wispy lichen]

EU general ||yeah there is a lot more Mara Jade and a lot more Solo kids. Luuuke is a joke in the fandom. ||

[wintry lark]

immediate
five years later

[unkempt sail]

Started Rogue Squadron and had to pause to consider the timeline (helpfully in the back of the book), clearer than the one in the back of my copy of The Last Command.

RS 6 ||nice mention of the legendary Katana fleet being out in the middle of nowhere as the new team considers what the New Republic needs||

[wispy vortex]

||Im pretty sure he showed up in an official parody story||

[wispy lichen]

RS 6 ||yeah RS is nice because it clearly is paying a lot of reference to HTTE, despite taking place earlier in the timeline ||

[wispy vortex]

||That sort of stuff is what made me fall in love with Legends. It usually felt like the authors actually read other books and dropped in little references and cameos from other books and series.||

NJO is full of them

[wispy lichen]

Also: timelines for easy reference if that interest anyone (one has all the mainline novels, the other has everything)

[wispy lichen]

Yeah (EU general) ||there is this love for the Star Wars universe at play in so many of the novels. || canon doesn’t quite give me that feeling as much

[wispy vortex]

Especially the sequels

I could believe Rian had never interacted with Star Wars before he got the job, and then only watched TFA

[wispy lichen]

Even the novels I’ve read in canon feel more like stories set in the setting of SW than stories that love SW

[wispy lichen]

Totally

Something like KOTOR 2 even feels very in tune with knowledge of the inner workings of the SW universe even when criticizing it

[wispy vortex]

Exactly

KOTOR filled in so much history that felt like Star Wars

[wispy lichen]

KOTOR 1 and 2 are both super Star Warsy and pull from existing lore and themes excellently

[echo echo]

That, I disagree with. I can get on board with the idea that he didn't love Luke Skywalker, I don't either, but a lot of what I do like about Star Wars is very present in TLJ

I think he was the wrong man for this particular job but not the wrong man for any given Star Wars job

[wintry lark]

I feel like the animated stuff definitely does

[dense lance]

Rian's major flaw was not seeing any sort of narrative conflict between Poe and Finn

[dry herald]

I still hold fhat tlj is the best sequel. They all have many flaws ofc, but i enjoyed tlj the most

Rise of Skywalker ||and really wish Abrams didnt just backtrack on everything in it||

[dense lance]

Abrams simultaneously set absurd initial conditions and then refused to follow up on Rian's progression of those conditions

Having Rebellion 2.0, Luke in exile, and SK Base get blown up were terrible for setting interesting storylines and Rian did his best

[dry herald]

Agreed

[warm thicket]

If only Damon Lindelof had done Force Awakens. He would have known what the answers to his mystery box questions were

[echo echo]

The kind of fundamental premise that three different directors were going to independently write three different parts of a trilogy inna vacuum from each other was also absurd

[sturdy scroll]

My complaints about TLJ boil down to he handled Luke incorrectly and the whole find a codebreaker plot felt unnecessary to me. Rian's whole shtick is playing with expectations and he does that wonderfully in other venues (see Knives Out et al) but I kinda think he alienated a huge number of people by taking Luke, you know ready fire aim, rush into trouble without thinking about it Luke into a hermit who sits alone and won't do anything.

A lot of people yelled about the hyperspace scene at the end, and I kinda get what they were after but at the same time it was one of the most stunningly beautiful scenes in the movie.

My complaints about the sequel trilogy boil down to them not having unified vision on where they were going from the start. Losing Carrie Fisher prior to the last movie probably didn't help.

[warm thicket]

One day I'm gonna show my kids the sequel trilogy and stop at TLJ and tell them, "Yeah it's really weird, but the sequel trilogy is only two movies. Nobody knows why."

[echo echo]

It sounds sexy, at least the way they pitched it ("maximal directorial freedom") but it was absurd enough that RJ and Trevorrow kind of ignored the premise and collaborated somewhat extensively prior to Trevorrow getting canned (I've always wondered how TLJ would have been received in a world where Trevorrow was allowed to work with RJ's ideas instead of against them)

[warm thicket]

Cue Jenny Nicholson reading two other treatments for Episode IX, not liking either of them, and ending by saying, "I guess I can take comfort in knowing that this movie was going to be bad in every timeline."

[echo echo]

I don't really feel obligated to look at in progress scripts as being representative of a final product

Especially since its coming from writer/directors who are going to be able to make (some) adjustments (limited of course by CGI etc)

[dense lance]

Abrams also wrote his bit independently of the story group so everything at the beginning was chaos

[wispy vortex]

Complete incompetence on all sides

NJO had 12 authors over 19 books and still managed to have a perfectly coherent story

[echo echo]

The difference between authoring an entire book, even in a series, and a two hour movie in a six hour trilogy without collaboration from one of the directors (who ended up becoming two of the directors) does seem notably different to me

NJO also isn't necessarily known for consistency in quality anyway

[wispy vortex]

But story was consistent

[echo echo]

I don't know how much narrative control each author had over the direction of the story, either. Disney's dream here was that each director was going to have full creative control in their little sphere of operation in a way that just doesn't make sense

Very specifically an abdication of central planning on what the story was going to be

[wispy vortex]

Which was a terrible idea

[echo echo]

That do be what I initially said

[wispy vortex]

Ya

[dense lance]

ish. It took a while to solidify just how the Yuuzhan Vong interacted with the Force

[wispy vortex]

Sure, but there were no complete U-turns

[wispy lichen]

NJO is interesting because you find out lore as the characters find it out, so the authors can make stuff part of the official story in small chunks and integrate all those previous chunks

[wispy lichen]

The biggest shock of NJO was just how unified the story was for how many authors it had

[wispy vortex]

Its because they sat down together at the very beginning and planned it all out

And continued meeting as the books were written

[wintry lark]

It's almost like they should have done that with the ST or something

[unkempt sail]

My husband says Yuuzhan Vong is when he gave up on EU. he's explained it to me before, asked him again just now- [eu general?] ||"they're little special sadomachist dark elves! R.A. Salvatore just imported drizzt; they suck"||

[wispy vortex]

Not really?

[unkempt sail]

he does also say his star wars EU opinions are from when he read them as a teenager

says courtship of princess leia is his favorite EU though that's many books from now in the reading order

[wispy vortex]

What the hell

Tell him I think he is insane and that Courtship is imo one of the lowest points of the entire EU

[warm thicket]

[Last Command Chapter 17] ||Between the ch'hala trees and the ysalamiri, I think Zahn did some of the coolest biological sci-fi seen in Star Wars.||

I really missed that from any of the other movies and shows. If they aren't making some kind of monster, I feel like the writers aren't all that interested in making the other organisms of the Star Wars universe all that interesting

[wispy lichen]

EU general ||so I think this makes sense from reading the first book or two, where the beginning of the series does depict them that way, but it’s in service of setting up the much more compelling mid-to-late series messaging ||

[wispy lichen]

I think you would like New Jedi Order then

[wispy lichen]

That’s interesting! I haven’t read it yet but I am familiar with elements it introduced from later content

[warm thicket]

When's that in the reading again?

[wispy lichen]

It’s the last thing but it’s 19 books

[unkempt sail]

I'm curious about Courtship because I see it's by Dave Wolverton, who I haven't read yet but I know he was Sanderson's writing teacher at BYU if I recall (the class Brandon currently teaches)

[supple star]

It looks like we’re are doing it after Wraith Squadron.

[wispy vortex]

Yeah

Courtship ||Its about how Han gets insecure about a rich prince, wins a planet in a sabacc game, then kidnaps Leia with a mind control gun to take her behind enemy lines to the planet to impress her and win her love. It works.||

[broken smelt]

Courtship is also one of my least favorites 😅

But just proves the addage that everything in Star Wars is someone's favorite thing

[supple star]

You know what I was thinking this book needed? The Krytos Trap 30 ||Fey’lya being the absolute worst||

Like seriously this entire page is just him being the worst.

Just gag 🤢

TKT 31 ||Hey at least Derricote is dead||

[warm thicket]

Lol ||"Gavin Darklighter" is the most Star Wars name I've ever heard.||

||It's the kinda name that I'd role up to play SW5E with.||

[unkempt sail]

I saw that and wondered if it was an attempt to make ||Skywalker seem like a normal Tatooine human name||

[vale dirge]

I like how the first name is often just like a normal English first name

[wispy lichen]

||Biggs Darklighter was Luke’s friend on Tatooine ||

[vale dirge]

Luke, Owen, Ben, Gavin

[wispy lichen]

Appears in A New Hope

[unkempt sail]

Ah, I think I just didn't know his last name

[wispy vortex]

There were a ton of scenes of him and Luke that were cut

[unkempt sail]

RS 14 ||trying to decide if Emtrey is hacked or is just... showing some chaotic good personality in looking for the part Corran needs for X-wing repair||

[wispy vortex]

||Hes just good at his job||

[wispy lichen]

https://tenor.com/view/doom-glowing-eyes-video-game-gif-17663260

[vale dirge]

Which Toa is that?

[dry herald]

[Statement] only a meatbag would call the great assassin hk-47 a toa

[wispy lichen]

[Observation] Meatbags underestimate the greatness that is HK-47.

[unkempt sail]

RS 30 ||wait Wedge is only 27? I mean, I guess this isn't that long after the OT and he did originally comment that the "kids" were all about his age except Gavin. Also! Emptry just casually smuggling corellian liquor on the side lol||

[unkempt sail]

finished and will be moving on to Wedge's Gambit. the x-wing series is fun! I think I like when Star Wars spends time on the less mystical side of things (which is funny because I was more interested in the Dathomir witches in clone wars than husband was. Feels a bit grounded, I guess?

[supple star]

TKT 33 ||There have been a few examples of Corran probably being Force sensitive so far plus the medallion, but I think him inadvertently Jedi mind tricking the Stormtroopers right here is the most obvious||

[echo echo]

I tend to think that having a well fleshed out grounded side makes the mystical hit harder when its reintroduced

I can think of several examples of writers using this intentionally and for effect (Rogue One, season two of Mando), but I even think in a real general sense Andor makes the OT stronger by standing as a comparison point

[wispy lichen]

Yeah! I think it’s a fun story. It knows it’s trying to be fun so it succeeds at that.

[wispy vortex]

It’s exactly the right scope and focus

[wispy lichen]

(I also like that it’s clear Stackpole read prior Legends stuff even though it takes place earlier in the timeline)

[dense lance]

So, is the ROTS Deluxe Edition worth it for the commentary?

or is it Stover just being paid to ramble

[wispy lichen]

Probably the latter

I don’t know for sure

But also it is pretty

[vale dirge]

A clanker with delusions of grandeur? Color me surprised!

[dry herald]

[query] Master, do I have permission to destroy this meatbag? I do so miss performing violent crimes

[unkempt sail]

Wedge's Gambit 12 ||biological war crimes!||

Chapters are short so it's very easy to "and just one more chapter..."

[unkempt sail]

WG 15 ||oh hey there, Winter||

[wispy lichen]

||Queen 👑 ||

[unkempt sail]

WG 18 ||lolol the trees! all over, doing their color shifting!||

[wispy lichen]

WG 18 (+ Last Command)||I like how Corran gets close to the truth by accident about the trees||

[unkempt sail]

WG 32 ||omg Gavin you can't just ask people if they've had interspecies relations!!||

[unkempt sail]

WG 35 ||Oh hey, is this passing reference the first appearance of meiloorun fruit? Per wookiepedia it is which reminds me I need to resume Rebels at some point...||

[cedar osprey]

10 years ago?? What is time anymore https://fxtwitter.com/discussingfilm/status/1979941259553673251?s=46

DiscussingFilm (@DiscussingFilm)

10 years ago today, the trailer for ‘THE FORCE AWAKENS’ was released.

**💬 406 🔁 1.3K ❤️ 12.9K 👁️ 452.9K **

▶ Play video

FxTwitter · Oct 19, 2025, 4:02 PM

[golden flame]

No

I refuse

I cannot accept it

[wispy vortex]

Jazz guess what

Its been 20 years now

[golden flame]

NO PLEASE

[wispy lichen]

TKT 11 ||Fey’lya go die in a ditch pls||

[wispy vortex]

Legends ||Gotta save him to screw up the Vong war!||

[wispy lichen]

Legends ||Truly the most rage-inducing villain of the NJO||

[wispy vortex]

||And he ends up seen as a hero||

[dry herald]

Man, I remember the hype I felt for that movie

if only the sequels were better 😔

[wispy lichen]

NJO ||People fr say “he suicide bombed in the end so he earned being seen as a good guy!” Kriff no. He’s why the Vong hit Coruscant. I solely blame him for the lives lost. ||

[dry herald]

(I'm not a sequel hater to be clear; but even I recognize they're pretty flawed)

[wispy vortex]

||I wish they had gotten Bothuwai||

Would have served him right

[topaz cliff]

man, force awakens era was something else. First star wars movie I saw in theaters (saw it 3 times, actually). I remember getting a bunch of the lego sets for christmas, and the visual dictionary which I read so many times. Also lots of nostalgia for the lego game, one of the most slept on lego games imo

Was so excited about all the new characters

[golden flame]

My birthday was that weekend. So of course I invited half my 7th grade class to go watch it

[wispy lichen]

https://youtu.be/tyg_qpnl0hk?si=847c-Tedi5bcdAaI

@wispy vortex

Spoilers for all of Vector Prime

(First New Jedi Order book BUT there is a big end of book spoiler in there)

[wispy vortex]

What could have been 😭

[wispy lichen]

<@&1396936875054203020> today we move onto the next book “The Bacta War” by Michael Stackpole and final book of our first chunk of X-Wing. After this we will be reading I, Jedi.
(Those who have interest in hopping in for New Jedi Order later, I, Jedi is a good one to read!)

[wispy vortex]

I Jedi is one of my favorites

[wispy lichen]

I’m excited to read it. Ofc I know the jist of it, but it seems like it’ll be fun.

[wispy vortex]

It’s a very good retcon

[unkempt sail]

Neat, was able to grab Krytos and Bacta as well as I, Jedi at the library

That is...maybe not how I would picture Corran if that's him but who knows

[wispy lichen]

That is ||Corran|| lol

This is I think the best art of said character

Or this

[autumn hemlock]

I choose to misinterpret that Corran is the Ithorian, and the other pictures were misuploads

[wispy lichen]

TKT 46 ||ITS MY GOAT||

[wispy lichen]

All done ☺️

[cedar osprey]

The news of that cancelled Ben Solo movie made me so mad

WE DESERVED THAT MOVIE

Even Lucasfilm was fully on board with it

[vale dirge]

Nah

https://tenor.com/view/past-die-kill-gif-24945231

[dry herald]

Ah, another movie to contradict all already established aspects of the sequels

[echo echo]

"Lucasfilm was fully on board with it" is not inherently a sales point to me right now

[bright blade]

-# Lucasfilm was fully on board with Andor, though

[frigid nexus]

https://tenor.com/view/inconceivable-princess-bride-you-keep-using-that-word-i-do-not-think-it-means-what-you-think-gif-17924604

[warm thicket]

I just finished Last Command, which handled female representation so spectacularly that I didn't even notice all those years ago when I first read the trilogy. ||The entire last battle came down to the actions of Mara and Leia. Mara doing the actual fighting, Leia's work to get the Noghri people on the side of the New Republic paid off, and then at the end Mara got blinded by C'baoth and was guided by Leia through the collapsing chamber to finally take him out. Heck, the whole dang book is named after Mara.||

[cedar osprey]

I’m feeling a NEED guys

The need to rewatch Andor

[unkempt sail]

A stray thought just occurred to me- Thrawn is basically a Bond villain in the Star Wars universe, like maybe a Blofield type (I haven't thought about this further so no extensive elaboration other than looking at art and petting a ysalamiri)

[bright blade]

Interesting. I thought of Thrawn as an evil Sherlock Holmes. Or perhaps a Holmes villain.

Never mind the fact that Lars Mikkelsen has played both Thrawn and a Sherlock Holmes villain. 😛

[unkempt sail]

I was going to say bond too, but I'm thinking Mads

[bright blade]

Did no one in the Empire ever remark on the striking resemblance Galen Erso bore to Grand Admiral Thrawn? 😜

[echo echo]

Hm I don't think you're wrong and I wonder if that's part of why I haven't ever really connected well with Thrawn

[dull dust]

the chis? hes blue.

Thrawn strikes me as almost like a Rommel type figure. at least heavily influenced by public perception. He's the face of military competance under the larger mad administration. he represents that power of that sort of authoritarian state wielded by fiercly competant individuals and not hindered by its own inadequncies

Now debates about how competant rommel actually was is another discussion.

[golden flame]

I think it's in Thrawn: Alliances where ||One of Vader's stormtrooper commanders is on the Chimera and goes "ok yeah if the entire Empire was run like how Thrawn runs his ship, it would stand forever". While that's a bit of Zahn patting himself on the back, it shows the kind of effectiveness and charisma Thrawn had||

[autumn hemlock]

||OTOH, any stance other than "The Empire will stand forever" or "The Empire will rise again" is almost so un-imperial as to be treason||

[warm thicket]

While I haven't seen any of the canon stuff, I can verify after reading the Thrawn trilogy that ||the entire empire being run the way Thrawn runs things would not, in fact, lead to the empire standing forever. It barely stood for the length of a pregnancy.||

[wispy lichen]

Zahn decided in canon ||to gradually reduce the “villainy” of Thrawn over time so a lot of people say the Empire would be “good” under Thrawn or that Thrawn isn’t evil. In canon he’s become more of an anti-hero (I note: Zahn says he writes his novels to all exist in the same “canon” so he sees Legends Thrawn and canon Thrawn as the same. My interpretation is that he lost what remained of his good nature in service of an evil and terrible empire.)||

||and yes, Thrawn is a villain and the empire would be evil even under a military dictatorship||

[autumn hemlock]

OG Thrawn Trilogy ||Eh, from what I've seen there's no way Thrawn doesn't count as evil. Maybe less evil than the Empire as a whole, but it isn't Good to execute a gunner because his officers didn't drill him enough, or literally anything to do with the Noghri.||

[supple star]

This reel sent me😂 https://www.instagram.com/reel/DQIWapEDJ8J/?igsh=d2ZnMHhteDI4MWg0

ginnyanthony101

Yeah not my usual Art content. I just thought it be funny. Everyone just needs a good laugh I still laugh at these. And credit to my friend @sleepy.annie64 we’re due for a part 2 😅

Likes

1444

Instagram

A person who knows nothing about Star Wars names the clones.

[supple star]

TBW 19 ||Erisi suck, like she has zero remorse right here||

[supple star]

TBW 22 ||Karrde!! We got Talon Karrde here!||

[dry herald]

Og thrawn trilogy ||I would say that thrawn is an anti villain though. Hes motivated by genuine beliefs. He just also doesnt have any morals besides law and order||

[cedar osprey]

You know what I want most

I want an Admiral Raddus prequel

[wispy lichen]

Ok but Admiral Ackbar is right there

https://tenor.com/view/its-a-trap-gif-19925444

[wispy vortex]

Ooo political drama with Akbar and Tarkin

[dull dust]

Political romance drama between akbar and tarkin

[wispy lichen]

I don’t know if you know but Tarkin was xenophobic

And Ackbar has personal beef with him

Namely ||Ackbar was a slave to Tarkin||

[dull dust]

I’m well aware it makes it spicier

[wispy lichen]

https://tenor.com/view/okay-sounds-good-jim-halpert-the-office-good-point-gif-11119519098820520575

[unkempt sail]

Krytos Trap 8 ||oh no, amnesiac Corran!||

[echo echo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndTtiggfVsA&t=3s

[unkempt sail]

Krytos 38, Andor all ||I recently read a mystery novel with fourth wall breaking that noted the culprit shouldn't be someone introduced too recently, and I was still wondering who the mole was (watch it be trees again) so I was very surprised to see Diric. I've also been thinking Kirtan kind of reminds me of Cyril in thinking he's so smart but then wondered if I was just going off of dogged young Imperial trying to advance himself. Dying does also feel a bit similar lol||

Krytos 40 || so Corran's been on Coruscant the whole time???||

[supple star]

Yeah Rogue Squadron has in many ways reminded me of Andor. I don’t think the writing is quite on the same level, but in terms of themes and story they are very similar.

[wispy lichen]

I think they are very different focuses tbh

Like Rogue Squadron still has that fun pulp factor to it while Andor tries to be more serious in tone

But they have a lot of similar themes and story under that different lens of focus

So I’d be reluctant to say X-wing is on a different level when it simply isn’t trying to be that type of story

Like diff metrics in my mind

[supple star]

True. That is what I meant, similar ideas different execution.

[unkempt sail]

Krytos all, Andor ||Corran's plot in the high security prison reminded me of the S1 Andor plot a little bit, but mostly for the setting because Corran wasn't trying to get his fellow prisoners to break out en masse and he had the Derricote thing to throw guards off as he escaped||

thematically different, but there's some setting resonance if that makes sense?

with a dash of Ace Attorney for courtroom shenanigans, maybe

was this the book that introduced ||super star destroyers?||

[wispy vortex]

||No, one showed up in RotJ, the Executor, Vader’s flagship||

[unkempt sail]

oh oh oh also one more final krytos thought ||It's interesting to me that Corran's got a Jedi grandfather- I guess we didn't fully have the "Jedi can't marry" thing established at this point? Luke didn't remark upon that as unusual so idk. I was also enjoying having some non-Force focused Star Wars for a bit, but inevitably there has to be a lil something something I suppose||

[wispy vortex]

||Yeah, in Legends Jedi married all the time||

[copper kite]

https://www.tumblr.com/jethroq/725872169492611072

Helvetin ☭ Kommari

Tumblr · Aug 17, 2023, 4:14 AM

[dry herald]

Man. Just finished andor 2x8

||that was a heavy episode 😭||

||I knew it was coming from when the Ghormans started resisting, but still, my feels from seeing them all die 😭||

||also, dang, syril going to his hatred of cassian after seeing the atrocities of the empire. Makes sense i guess, as thats all he had left. Was hoping hed get redemption though. But his death makes sense too. ||

[wispy vortex]

😔

[dense lance]

Luke Skywalker and the Shadows of Mindor appreciation moment

[wispy lichen]

Stover

[dense lance]

||“My best trick is to do one thing–to make one small move, even a simple choice– and kill thousands of people. Thousands.”||
from Mindor

[wispy lichen]

A reminder that NJO Traitor is the best Star Wars ever

[dense lance]

TLJ riffs on Mindor without even trying

-# which is why Luke should have been on SK Base

[unkempt sail]

Bacta War 13 ||so much for subtly entering Thyferra but hey, may as well try nascent Jedi abilities...||

[wispy vortex]

||doesn’t always go well ||

[unkempt sail]

BW 15 || Bror Jace?? I figured when Corran thought he saw him earlier it was a case of him mistaking a relative for him||

[wispy lichen]

You’re ahead of me in TBW LOL

One of these weeks I’ll finish on schedule

Probably this next one because my schedule will clear up

[unkempt sail]

BW 19 ||lol Gavin's astromech is named Jawaswag? Sounds about right for a tattooine teenager. Glad he's not dead, though maybe it's a rite of passage for rogue squadron to make the rest of the group assume they're dead...||

[unkempt sail]

Haha, I figured I was catching up to where we were supposed to be!

[wispy lichen]

You’re caught up just about! Haha. We technically move on tomorrow but I’m early in TBW. I’ll probably finish Tuesday.

[unkempt sail]

I think kelsierisgood probably finished since he was posting last week?

Anyway BW 22 ||Talon Karrde! ||

[supple star]

||This series does have a lot of fake outs. One chapter it’s oh no this character is dead and next it’s oh they are ok.||

[supple star]

Yeah I finished. Forgot that I was going to post my overall review for these books.
I really am enjoying the Xwing series. Wedge and Corran are great. ||I really like the way he thinks things through.||
Also I really liked the villains. ||They are all very competent in certain ways, and because of that they assume they are in others. I find it funny that Isard falls to the same flaw she pointed out in Loor.||

[wispy vortex]

||Isard is iconic. Competent and blind, all at the same time||

[unkempt sail]

Xwing to the point I'm at ||it really feels like she's going through her Cersei Lannister era on Thyferra||

[wispy vortex]

||lmao exactly||

Xwing all ||The Krytos Trap is such an insanely brilliant idea. It played out almost exactly as she planned. I loved how she targeted the New Republic primarily politically rather than militarily like Thrawn||

[supple star]

||And when she tries to fight them militarily, she fails||

X wing all ||I love how she is initially presented as this competent, “It is all according to my plan” kind of villain. But as the series goes on we see her flaws. She very much thinks that she can’t fail, it is either someone else’s fault or it was a part of her design, even when it clearly wasn’t. Even better is watching all the other Imps realizing who exactly they threw their lots in with.||

[wispy vortex]

||Imagine if she had deigned to join Thrawn||

[supple star]

||Thrawn would have probably quickly discovered exactly how unstable she was under her cold demeanor and keep her at arms length.||

||Or galaxy length considering how they did know about each and he never offered any help||

[wispy vortex]

||He called for her to join him but she refused.||
Legends ||Isard captured Soontir Fel and sent him to Thrawn||

[wispy lichen]

Legends ||if I had a nickel for every bozo that slept with Palpatine to get high in rank and take over the galaxy which isn’t a lot but it’s weird that it happened twice ||

I’m still early in this book but I have an ear problem so I’ll keep reading tomorrow

[wispy vortex]

||I mean, this one worked out better. Kinda||

[unkempt sail]

MonkeyGirl is this a reread for you?

[wispy lichen]

||Daala is such a girlfailure||

[wispy lichen]

No 😭

But I’ve read later stuff so I have some broad knowledge

Avoiding spoiler tags for this one tho

Legends general I will click on haha

[wispy vortex]

Legends ||Daala didnt sleep with the Emperor, she was with Tarkin|| I was thinking about ||Roganda Ismaren||

[wispy lichen]

Wait your right

I’m wrong that’s right

[wispy vortex]

This is true though

[wispy lichen]

Yeah

[wispy vortex]

Legends ||Shes like Feyla, she just wont stay gone, always arrives to make things worse||

[wispy lichen]

||Just like that one lady Viqi Sesh or smth like that from Kuat||

||it’s Shesh||

[wispy vortex]

||And Nom Anor||

[wispy lichen]

||oml Nom Anor||

[wispy vortex]

||Coming back from failure after failure to just fail again (but in a way that horribly messes up the New Republic)||

[wispy lichen]

Legends ||nom anor is kinda like Maul if Maul accomplished a lot more. A memey villain who is funny. But Nom Anor is actually despicable and accomplished a lot. ||

[wispy vortex]

||Maul deserved better||

[wispy lichen]

<@&1396936875054203020> today is our day to move on to I, Jedi by Michael Stackpole. (Though I think only 3 of us are actively reading and 2 are on TBW lol).
We will be on I, Jedi for two weeks before moving onto part two of the X-Wing series. This begins with Wraith Squadron by Aaron Allston.

I should finish TBW tomorrow hopefully lol

I, Jedi I am excited for

[wispy vortex]

Yay

[wispy lichen]

As a note: I, Jedi is a retcon in ways of the Jedi Academy Trilogy, taking place parallel to the plot of that trilogy, so just have the knowledge that is why it is the way it is

[wispy vortex]

(Because Jedi Academy is terrible and Kevin J Anderson should be ashamed of himself)

[unkempt sail]

I was gonna say, I don't see those in our reading pin

[unkempt sail]

I read this aloud to husband and he said yeah, pretty much. "The Dune prequels aren't just bad because of Brian Herbert; they're also bad because of KJA" though that's more of a #1404497733108236318 thought

[wispy vortex]

Jedi Academy ||Kevin J Anderson basically went “oh here’s my edgy oc teenager that’s more powerful than Luke oh and his ship is invincible and can blow up stars!||

[wispy lichen]

They are not lol

I, Jedi is commonly thought of as a way to not read that trilogy (which had important plotlines but sucks)

The funniest Jedi Academy plotline is ||Lando trying to sleep with Mara and so he and Han have bets back and forth gambling the Millenium Falcon because Lando wants to impress Mara but gives it back to Han in the end. The next book, Mara and Lando are sleeping together. ||

[wispy vortex]

||Shhhh no they aren’t||

[wispy lichen]

It’s so bad

Anyway Bean and I decided to not do JAT and just do I, Jedi for the readalong

Oh I should also note I, Jedi is good prep for NJO for any who were interested in reading that, but maybe not X-Wing

[warm thicket]

I'll be re-joining once we get to Hand of Thrawn, there are too many books in the world and I only have my two eyes

[wispy vortex]

Just got to open your third

[warm thicket]

I tried that and I saw my future

[wispy vortex]

Were you reading I Jedi?

[warm thicket]

Nah, a friend of a friend published a book that I've been working through atm

[wispy lichen]

Valid

[unkempt sail]

BW 30 ||wow Ysanne jumped real quick to "let's genocide the natives and slaughter defector families"||

[wispy vortex]

Looks at Coruscant

[unkempt sail]

I mean, yes, but also ||"round them up and when we hit a quota, kill them all" is a little faster than bioweapons||

[wispy vortex]

||More humane I guess||

[unkempt sail]

||which to be fair! she was mad it didn't transmit and kill fast enough which is why derricote got sent to prison iirc||

[unkempt sail]

BW 38, light Expanse || "You could never shoot me." "True, but she can" reminds me of the "You're not that guy/I am that guy" from Amos||

[unkempt sail]

finished Bacta War last night, very satisfying. Started I, Jedi and was startled by the first person point of view

[wispy vortex]

Hey, it’s in the title!

[unkempt sail]

BW all, general title speculation ||I am curious about there being a later novel titled Isard's Revenge if she allegedly blew up in a shuttle but this is either the 1) no body, wasn't actually dead situation or 2) clone shenanigans||

||or maybe 3) a long simmering plot that I don't think late-state Isard is capable of||

[supple star]

Ok time to start I, Jedi

[supple star]

IJ 1 ||“Grand Admiral Thrawn and his antics ruined our first anniversary, and rescuing Jan Dodonna and the others who had once been imprisoned with me on the Lusankya had called me away during the second. And then the reborn Emperor's assault on Coruscant dropped a Star Destroyer on what had been our home.” Okay I am only one for three on this. Nice to know Jan gets rescued though||

||Corran trying to explain why he doesn’t want kids is hilarious||

||I love Corran almost proudly listing out the multiple logical and emotional methods of attack Mirax used to convince him.||

[wispy vortex]

||Jan Dodonna and Co you’ll learn about in a future book once we return to the X wing series. The reborn emperor is from a comic we won’t be covering||

[supple star]

||I thought so on the first. The Emperor stuff is Dark Empire right. There was someone here talking about that a while back||

[wispy vortex]

Yep

Monkey was reading through it

[unkempt sail]

IJ 1 ||"The New Republic media avoided showing the twins drooling and dripping the way children do, and they really maximized the appealing things about the toddlers." Look, I love my almost three year old but she is also a menace. Delightful, but Corran is right to be wary lol||

IJ 2 || Mistborn children ehhh Ooryl? ||

[supple star]

IJ 3 ||Ok this is terrifying. I wonder what is causing this immediate memory loss of Mirax||

[wispy lichen]

Yeah. I finished it.

Crimson empire makes it worth it lol

[unkempt sail]

IJ 6 ||Nice to finally hear Corran's dad's holo message; that felt like a dangling thing from Bacta War||

[dry herald]

Andor 2x9 + rogue one ||dang, that was a good episode too. Felt nice to have a more standard action sequence after the devastation of episode 8. While still having important growth for both andor and mon mothma . Her speech went so hard too.

Im also glad bix didn't die. I was worried she would at some point, from oding or in battle. Mainly because of jyn and andor being a thing in rogue one. But her leaving andor to motivate him to fight is much better tbh.

Also, k2so being very k2so in his first lines . Still best boi.||

[topaz cliff]

Same tags ||idk if you've seen or are curious but when Draven says gold squadron is escorting her and she's going to make a speech, he's referencing rebels 3x18 "secret cargo." It's a really mid episode but you can youtube the speech she gives if you care or haven't already seen it||

[dry herald]

||hmm, interesting. I only watched uo through like, the first few s3 episodes in rebels, and I remember almost nothing as I was like, 14 at the time. Might have to check that out though for the connection||

[dull dust]

Which sentient star wars species do you think tastes the best

[wispy lichen]

Mon Calamari

[wispy vortex]

Especially fried

[autumn hemlock]

Which Mon Calamari, the Mon Calamari or the Quarren?

[bright blade]

The ones that taste like calamari, duh

[patent schooner]

Apparently people kill Wookies for meat sooooooo.....

[patent schooner]

~~and you get a fur coat as a bonus 👍 ~~
-# No I am not Trandoshan why are you asking? 🦎

[unkempt sail]

IJ 14 ||and now it's a murder mystery! Cue the Ace Attorney investigation music as Corran puts his CorSec hat on (not that he ever takes it off)||

IJ 16 ||... Kyp Durron is the prodigy main character of Jedi Academy, isn't he. Exudes some main character energy, I feel like||

[wispy lichen]

Yes

[wispy vortex]

Yep

[unkempt sail]

granted, I might be colored by your/my spouse's general disdain but ||...he's so edgy and annoying||

[wispy vortex]

He is correct

It’s worse in the actual trilogy

[plush vale]

Hello! I have a question
A while ago I was looking for something to watch, and I tried Andor, but the first episode didnt hook me much
||Mostly because a lot of it was cassian imposing for ever more favours from various people while nothing much happening for much of the episodes||
Could any andor-liker tell me (with a ping response if possible!) how many episodes I should watch minimum before I can have a good impression on wether I would like the whole show?

[autumn hemlock]

Andor General ||I think a reasonable sniff test is the first 3 episodes; they form a single cohesive arc. If you're still on the fence after that, you could try just watching through to 9, but that's a lot of show to commit to if you aren't sure if you like it.||

Oh, oops, @plush vale

[bitter trail]

@plush vale andor general ||i've seen up to episode 6 recommended... the first three do have an arc but there is a lot of show still missing from this introduction, namely a whole other angle on the situation with a character in a totally different side of the rebellion ie. the inner core politics of what's going on, the shiny beautiful core world where it doesn't look like Cassian's "on the ground" view. Cassian also has a character arc that is paced for the whole series, so he isn't going to change right away||

[plush vale]

Ok, thank you for the responses <3

[autumn hemlock]

-# I'll also invoke the Survivorship Bias words and say that it generally gets better as the show goes on

[bitter trail]

i do agree with that

[patent schooner]

||yeah each three episodes basically are one arc. Watching only episode 1 is like only watching the first third of a movie. There is always alot of buildup and when it goes down it is totally worth it||

[bitter trail]

andor general ||yeah that's why we're indicating in sets of 3. 3 or 6 or 9...||

[plush vale]

Andor ep1 ||When I was watching the first episode, I was generally enjoying the feeling of the world feeling expansive and alive, if gloomy (in some ways). Also the opening sequence was cool. but then it felt like the same scene played out 3 times with cassian asking for a favour of someone thats dead tired of him asking favours of them and then they begrudgingly go along with it||

||That felt kind of like nothing was actually happening and that was kind of what my vibe at the end of the episode was, which is a little bit of a shame||

[bitter trail]

andor ep1 ||that is what he's doing in the first episode, yep!||

[patent schooner]

||Think of it as Indroducing important characters in Cassians life and his relationship with them||

[plush vale]

Ep 1 reaction ||its was a bit boring unfortunately which is why im asking here :d||

[bitter trail]

i'd say carry on

that is not the show

some spoilers for series around this question ||the situation on ferrix changes significantly and this arc for cassian takes him OFF ferrix near permanently after episode 3||

[autumn hemlock]

ANH, Andor 1 ||to make a weird, rough comparison, if we take the first 3 episodes as a single story, by this point in A New Hope Luke still has an aunt and uncle.||

[echo echo]

Andor is weirdly only kind of about Cassian Andor anyway

I haven't mathed it out and I am somewhat skeptical of the claim but for a character who is absolutely in contention for the most live action screen time of any Star Wars character he is often secondary or even tertiary in many or most arcs of the show that bears his name

[bitter trail]

i want to make a comparison to Mad Max

[echo echo]

Yes!

[bitter trail]

i was going to do it above but felt maybe it was going overboard on Remilia's question ha

[echo echo]

Maybe. I think if she was going in expecting Cassian Andor, Rebel Super Spy The Show, it kind of isn't that

Nor is it trying to be exactly

He absolutely becomes the version of himself we see in Rogue One, but that's almost incidental

[topaz cliff]

I was watching the clone wars episode where ||the smugglers poison tea shipments on mandalore|| and man. People seriously claim this isn't a kids show lol.
Like it's such a basic portrayal of corruption with plain dialogue to make it accessible to kids who have no concept of this sort of stuff

And that isn't bad! It's okay to like stuff for made for kids as an adult. But don't pretend it's more than it really is

[bright blade]

I remember that episode. It was a good one.

[topaz cliff]

I've been putting together a watch order of everything for my friend who has seen basically no star wars. I want her to watch siege of mandalore because of how much it enhances ROTS, and so worked backwards to try and get the most important clone wars episodes for that

If anyone has suggestions to change this I'm open to them

[echo echo]

I think I'd start with the OT and work out from there

Its greatest sins are mostly tied to how dated it is, and it mostly stands up despite that

I think getting beyond that too that it is very difficult to find Star Wars whose existence is not in some way in dialogue with the OT specifically

[autumn hemlock]

A New Hope's greatest sin is that it's as old as modern special effects. Exactly as old as modern special effects...

https://tenor.com/view/obi-wan-kenobi-of-course-i-know-him-hes-me-gif-12774102

[wispy lichen]

Corruption!

The number of times Satine says that word lol

[supple star]

IJ 15/Stormlight ||The Halycon line of Jedi sound like a bunch of Stonewards. Corran himself feels like he could be either a Stoneward or a Skybreaker. Though the younger Corsec Corran fits the Skybreakers better than current Corran.||

IJ 15 ||Brakiss is sure acting odd, considering what I know about the origins of the Massassi temples in canon and legends, which is only a little, I have a bad feeling about the Jedi academy being located there.||

||Yeah Brakiss’s attitude about the temples, it is giving very much “aliens built the pyramids vibe” in the no way “primitives” could build this way||

||Yep he’s got some dark side tempting going on||

[warm thicket]

Oh, humans for sure

[wispy vortex]

Mmmm

[supple star]

IJ 16 ||I think I have heard of the Sun Crusher before. It gives me that bad kind of overpowered vibes||

[wispy vortex]

||It’s a big reason why people say Kevin J Anderson ruined Legends. Too many overpowered super weapons||

[supple star]

IJ 16 ||Same with Kup, like he’s the bestest apprentice in the academy and Luke is now putting most of his focus on just training him. Like what.||

[wispy vortex]

See this rant (no spoilers beyond where you’re at)

[supple star]

Yeah don’t care for that type of story. It’s fun when you’re a kid playing legos or action figures with your brothers. But not as a story.

Fortunately it seems like this book isn’t going to dwell on that stuff.

[wispy vortex]

It does it’s best to gloss over it and focus on Corran’s journey

[supple star]

That reminds me IJ 16 ||I am really liking Coran’s progress with becoming a Jedi and the focus different force talents||

[wispy vortex]

||Its a big part of why he’s my favorite character. He has to work around his gaps in ability in interesting ways. You’ll see a few really good examples of that when we get to NJO||

[supple star]

IJ 17 ||Looks like Kyp is catching that Sith bug aswell. But never mind that because Mara Jade just showed up||

18 ||Well now I really don’t like Kyp||

[supple star]

IJ 23 ||Corran is just rage baiting Exar Kun ||

[wispy vortex]

The true master

[unkempt sail]

IJ 22 ||...idk that I want to know Kyp's history with Han; I'm thinking of him as an OC fanfic character who all the mains care about deeply for some reason||

[wispy vortex]

If you want to know… Jedi Academy ||Basically when Han went off to Kessel earlier in the book, he and Chewie got shot down and sent to work in the mines, where they met Kyp and befriended him. They escape into the Maw, and end up captured by an Imperial installation there, one devoted to developing super weapons. It’s where the Death Star was designed. They steal the Sun Crusher together, then Han takes him on vacation and bonding time before taking him to Yavin. ||

[wispy lichen]

JAT ||he’s like a surrogate son of Han’s ||

||and everyone else looks at him and groans ||

|| “this emo dummy again”||

[supple star]

IJ 25 ||“I've filed a claim for this place, and now it's mine. I'd love to have you stick around, but your statue is right where the wife will want the entertainment center. You understand, don't you?" 😂 Corran out here evicting a Sith Lord.||

||Oh Corran, never do the “and there is nothing you can do about it” There is always something they can do about it, like force throw all of your explosives into the lake||

IJ 25 ||And just when all seemed lost, Mara shows up to join in the rage baiting||

IJ 25 ||Oof, Poor Luke, this Jedi Academy thing is not going the way he wanted, but I am with Corran on this one. Redemption as Luke sees it, is possible, and while it does seem that Kyp has repented, how Luke is going about that is definitely wrong.||

[wispy vortex]

||I love how Stackpole uses Corran as a lens to criticize the issues everybody had with the Jedi Academy trilogy. It still bugs me that Kyp gets off scot free||

[supple star]

||It is kind of interesting comparing Luke’s failure with the Jedi Academy here compared to his failure with Ben and the academy in canon||

[wispy vortex]

||Yeah, here he still failed due to internal flaws, but flaws that fit the character and were backed up by his history.||

IJ, Sequels ||Corran actually leaves for the exact opposite reason the Academy failed in canon||

[supple star]

This kind of just changed my opinion of Luke in TLJ. I didn’t mind it before but this is a lot better.

Like imagine if ||his failure with Ben was like his failure with Kyp. Ben is obviously falling to the dark side, but Luke keeps saying that he can save him. Which causes the academy to be destroyed and Luke to be broken and go and become a hermit.||

[wispy vortex]

That would be so much more compelling and fitting with his character

Late Legends very big spoilers, do not touch unless you don’t care about spoilers ||This is the flaw in Luke that happens with Jacen, and it’s what results in Mara’s death||

IJ ||Ultimately, Luke does have some culpability for Carida, he let Kyp go way too far, just assuming he’d find his way back to the light on his own||

[supple star]

||Yeah that’s the thing, I would be more willing to let Kyp off the hook if you know, he didn’t destroy an entire solar system||

I am just going to blame that on the fact that the Sun Crusher exists at all though.

||Like why does a starfighter with the power of Starkiller base that can be easily used by an angsty teenager exist in the first place.||

[wispy vortex]

||Dont forget it’s completely invincible to the point it can just fly through Star Destroyers||

[supple star]

||Oh so it’s the Arrowhead as well. Freemakers did that and a small ridiculously easy to use weapon that can destroy entire planets so much better. And it was less ridiculous, despite being a funny Lego show||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 25 ||ok, so if the Solo twins are not quite three they are about the same age as my kid, got it. Toddlers with lightsabers would be terrors

Anyway, Mara Jade here to save the dayyyy||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 29 ||heck yeah, DNA as info repository I love it||

[supple star]

||Yeah Corran’s grandfather is cool||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 31 ||Keevy Spart is written like such a stereotypical nerd I'm half expecting a pocket protector in his outfit||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 38 ||Corran's very funny when he plays dumb, and he has the experience to know how an interrogation is supposed to go lol||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 42 || Corran's mcgyvering a lightsaber together and it's interesting he's going to use jewels from Tavira's gifts and it doesn't specifically have to be kyber crystal; I assume this is a Legends quirk||

||oh like a page later it says Durindfire is why his grandfather's blade has a distinctive silver color, I see||

[wispy vortex]

||Yep, kyber crystals hadn’t been introduced yet. ||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 43 ||omg we're Christmas Caroling Captain Nive (and by that I mean haunting him with his dead). I think Corran's illusion projection could be annoying if written wrong, but I do buy that it's Halcyon heritage + his detective-y background working together||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 44 ||oooh so he can change out the gem focus of this lightsaber, interesting||

[unkempt sail]

IJ 48, general Mistborn ||"She closed a handful of [coins] and I realized a second too late what she was really doing. With a telekinetic push she accelerated them at me. I got my lightsaber up and deflected most of them, but two thudded against my chest and one skipped off my forehead, opening a cut above my right eye." I see theSaarai-kaar using that old Scadrial trick||

[unkempt sail]

And done - will need to sit with my thoughts before writing a GR/SG review, but otherwise ||I'm very relieved to have Corran as a viewpoint character for these events, and it really felt well setup for integration of his pilot, Jedi, and detective selves. I kinda hate that Mirax is mostly AWOL but at least she makes an impact at the end when she does appear.||

[wispy lichen]

<@&1396936875054203020> Today we move onto our next book, Wraith Squadron by Aaron Allston. We will be on the Wraith Squadron part of the series for the next few books. The next book will be Iron Fist!
We will be on Wraith Squadron for two weeks.

[wispy lichen]

Also Happy Life Day!!!

[supple star]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-happy-life-day-wookie-life-day-star-wars-holiday-special-gif-19237522

[wispy vortex]

Happy life day!

[unkempt sail]

apparently you can meet 'n greet chewbacca in a Life Day outfit at the parks starting today lol https://www.instagram.com/p/DQw0dvqgfPG/

starwars

Chewbacca is ready for Life Day. Celebrate the Wookiee tradition for a limited time in Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge® at Disneyland Resort and Walt Disney World.

Likes

36715

Instagram

[wispy lichen]

(He is not in fact wearing the robe. I’m at Disneyland today lolol)

I thought he was supposed to be!

[wispy vortex]

Oooo have fun!

[wispy lichen]

Update: I searched out Chewie early in the day and he was not wearing a robe at that point, but at the big fan gathering at the end of the day, he came out for the first time in his red robe

[wispy vortex]

How was it in the rain? It was pouring over here

[wispy lichen]

💀

Bad

It was bad

[wispy vortex]

ugh

The park is nice in a light drizzle since it keeps away the crowds, but anything more is miserable

[supple star]

IJ 42 ||Huh, I guess kyber crystals didn’t exist yet when this book was written. I also wonder how Legends reconciled with the Jedi not having families in the prequels.||

[wispy vortex]

||Depends on the media, but generally they ignored it||

[supple star]

||Yeah because if there are all of these Jedi having families, it does make Anakin’s whole thing not make any sense. But I can’t think of a way to reconcile these things so ignoring it is probably for the best.||

[wispy vortex]

||A ton of Jedi had families in Legends. A good chunk of the Inquisitors are the children of Jedi||

[unkempt sail]

||I've also been wondering if we can hand waive that as "oh, you know those Corellian Jedi have their weird traditions"||

[wispy vortex]

||Nah, one of the first Jedi students Luke introduces is also the kid of a Jedi||

[supple star]

General legends I assume ||Also did this book say that Obi Wan is from Tatooine? I don’t remember where he’s from in canon but I know it’s not there.||

[unkempt sail]

||they called it his home world, yeah, so I spent a good 30 minutes reading his Legends wookiepedia entry||

||apparently it is Stewjon after Lucas did an interview on The Daily Show, after prequels but before Disney bought them or something because it's on the Legends entry||

IJ 26

||Speculation about Obi-Wan Kenobi's homeworld first appeared in chapter 26 of the 1998 novel I, Jedi, when Corran Horn asks Luke Skywalker, "Wasn't [Tatooine] Obi-Wan Kenobi's homeworld?" Luke doesn't address the question.||

[wispy vortex]

Star Wars general Kenobi, nothing big || Birth place

The novelization of Revenge of the Sith indicates that he speaks with a Coruscanti accent, although, as he was trained at the Jedi Temple on that planet, this could not be considered a clue to his homeworld. Star Wars: Attack of the Clones: The Visual Dictionary identifies Kenobi as Coruscanti in the Dexter Jettster section, but again, since he was raised in the Jedi Temple on Coruscant, this doesn't necessarily indicate the planet of his birth. Star Wars: The Clone Wars Character Encyclopedia and Star Wars Character Encyclopedia also stated that Coruscant is Kenobi's homeworld. Early printings of the The Rebel Alliance Sourcebook and Star Wars Screen Entertainment both stated that Kenobi was born on Tatooine, and while his homeworld had yet to be revealed, this was highly unlikely, considering the planet's distance from the Core and the fact that Anakin Skywalker resided there and wasn't discovered until he was nine years of age. Furthermore, these two sources were written during a time when it was widely (but ultimately erroneously) accepted that Kenobi was the estranged brother of Owen Lars, who, at the time, was also believed to have been born on Tatooine before it was revealed he was born on Ator.

On August 14, 2010, Obi-Wan's homeworld was finally named in an interview between George Lucas and Jon Stewart of The Daily Show at Celebration V. A fan-submitted question came up regarding the name of the homeworld, and Lucas already had a name for this planet, Stewjon.[1]

||

[supple star]

Ah I see.
This might be an understatement but I am getting the vibe that OT and after Legends and the Prequel trilogy really do not mesh very well together.

[wispy vortex]

The OT and Legends work well together, but Lucas changed a ton for the prequels and it started to fall apart

[unkempt sail]

I mentioned this conversation to husband and he said that EU writers weren't allowed to touch certain era topics like (general) ||why Anakin turned|| though I don't have a source for that other than assuming it's because Lucas wanted to write that himself eventually

[wispy vortex]

It’s briefly touched on in IJ, but without any detail

[unkempt sail]

Which is why I find the Legends references to the Clone Wars interesting

[wispy vortex]

It’s definitely a big hole, so I assume something like that is true

IJ ||Did you also notice that Nejaa died after the Clone Wars, during peace time?||

[unkempt sail]

Like they knew it was a Thing that happened, but no context beyond one or two lines

[wispy vortex]

||Order 66 didn’t exist yet||

[unkempt sail]

IJ ||yeah! Like there's no Order 66 to snuff out the Jedi, just a long hunt by the empire||

[supple star]

||Not to mention the clone wars itself is always talked about in very vague terms||

||I also note the apparent absence of the rule of two, and that the emperor and Vader are often referred to as “Dark Jedi” instead of Sith in the Thrawn trilogy||

[unkempt sail]

Okay also looking at this levels of canon description I also see why Disney was like nope, starting relatively fresh.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Wars_Legends#Official_levels_of_canon

[wintry lark]

The hierarchy is still kinda there imo

A lot of Legends is assumed to be true unless contradicted, making Canon essentially equivalent to G- or T-canon

[wispy vortex]

Even G level in Legends had contradictions

The RoTS novelization had tons of contradictions with the movies. Not to mention ||Shaak Ti dying 3 times||