Thieving Update

[keen yew]

yeah that could make sense

[graceful wasp]

stick some eggs in and get a few raw fish a day or 2 later

[coarse linden]

i think we had it by fish type so sharks needed other fish as a secondary to bait

[keen yew]

huh?

like you chop up the fish and bait the bigger fish?

[flint thistle]

Oh oh! Just had an idea for external thieving rewards

[graceful wasp]

sounds like what they're doing with the sailing fishing thing

or the classic barbarian fishing

[coarse linden]

it was like a cooking recipe; combine X of a specific herb/seed with a secondary (in this case tuna or sumin) to make X fishing bait

[graceful wasp]

speaking of fish

[keen yew]

ahh interesting

[graceful wasp]

clams and oysters for an underwater thieving area

get pearls and other aquatic items

[keen yew]

sounds like a cool way to implement it

[graceful wasp]

uses safecracking mechanic

could be added to the mogre area, sunken tutorial island and underwater at dragontooth island

[lone dew]

Safecracking is really bland

[graceful wasp]

what about safecracking with guards that patrol and can spot you?

[lone dew]

It aspires to be an active method (blinking) but that's never interesting when compared to a proper activity like pyramid plunder

[keen yew]

I mean, it's not a "proper activity". I feel like it fits where it is nicely

[graceful wasp]

mogre sees ya harassing their oyster, they bonk ya

[flint thistle]

@coarse linden

https://runescape.wiki/w/Travelling_Artisan_(August_2020)

So scroll down to rewards this temporary event had really cool consumable ones, the enhancers. The ability to get enhancers have been gone since the event ended.

I’d love it if thieving could become the new permanent source for these enhancers.

[lone dew]

If I'm already lean-forward, I don't wanna stare and wait for the thing to blink so I can reclick
I'd rather move around and do stuff

[graceful wasp]

might wanna remove that embed

[keen yew]

I quite like paying attention for the click

[coarse linden]

are there any you really like? (i'm more inclined to make permanent ones as physical items than consumeable ones)

[tawny anvil]

The artisan safecracking with the new update is kinda a worse version. It needs to be faster like how safecracking can happen back to back and you have a short time window to activate it to have a proper fail condition. Ideally with an additional layer of complexity like knowing your safes route

[lone dew]

Note that travelling artisan wasn't run again because some of these were busted OP

[coarse linden]

thats fine numbers can be adjusted

[graceful wasp]

maybe invention blueprints for those dwarven tools would be nice

[coarse linden]

most seem pretty meh

[graceful wasp]

have em tradeable like the arch ones

[hazy bobcat]

Eh, I feel travelling artisan don't really fit as a perma reward from thieving

I do think cosmetics should be added as rewards from the new upgraded crafting guild though 🙂

[flint thistle]

Critical enhancer, fishining flingers, luminite enhancer, and resource savers.

[coarse linden]

when i say perma i mean something like: steal this effect, chuck it into an equippable item you steal from dwarves

[graceful wasp]

actually, perhaps another thieving target that can give charms might be decent

currently it's only amlodd workers that can give em i think

[graceful wasp]

bag of dwarven snuff, sniff it to sniff out gems more easily

[real orbit]

Equip in the pocket slot?

[graceful wasp]

or as a necklace like expensive spices

[real orbit]

Mining already has most slots covered

Necklace is GotE

[tawny anvil]

also the reason it needs to happen frequently is so that it immerses you in the game

[graceful wasp]

snuffbox for the pocket seems fine

[lone dew]

Quiver slot awaits to be used by skilling effects but that's maybe not the time & place

Would need an entire new class of reward

[valid spade]

what about a prayer alternative to the edimmu lifesteal necklace?

kinda like how the vampires in osrs has the blood shard

so you can steal a "holy shard" ?

it should last for X charges so it retains value

[graceful wasp]

how about a set of gloves that give a boost to throwing knifes, darts, claws and daggers.

full on rogue flavour armour

[lone dew]

You'd need to throw a huge bone for niche weapon types to become viable

[valid spade]

this seems not very good

[flint thistle]

Make this update instantly beloved by letting us steal the pieces to assemble an overload golem. Not one that gives a free overload buff but one you can basically store your overloads in and have it fueling you saving inventory space and decreasing potion management.

So you’d steal pieces, assemble it at War’s, and then charge it with your overloads.

[valid spade]

unless you make it insanely broken

[lone dew]

EoC doesn't lend itself to this type of reward

[graceful wasp]

it does

they just didn't do much if any of it yet

[lone dew]

Not until a monster/boss is specifically weak to thrown or stab

[graceful wasp]

e.g. the berserker necklace boosting obsidian melee weaponry

if it's a case of there not being a niche to use it for, that's just showing an open content slot

ready to be used

[lone dew]

I do agree though that there's a thematic link between thieving, rogue, dual daggers, monkey knife fighters type of stuff

[valid spade]

its true that niches like that can be filled, but the gear in rs3 is made too linear to allow for it

[graceful wasp]

they're doing sidegrade gear exactly because of that

[valid spade]

if you want that kinda stuff to be a thing the bonus will have to be big enough to make the things in it "viable" and then its only viable with this specific piece and nothing else

[real orbit]

1 full overload salve gives the golem 1 charge which you can use by clicking on it to gain the benefits for an hour

[graceful wasp]

it doesn't need to be viable at all stages of the game

[valid spade]

but the sidegrades are still made within the linearity of the rs3 progression path

[lone dew]

Ovl golems are not happening, pretty sure some Jmods hate the idea (I don't remember why)

[graceful wasp]

potion bag, to hold all your strongest potions

[keen yew]

this sounds more like something for a 120 smithing or crafting update

[valid spade]

i still think a holy necklace would be good

[real orbit]

I'd have thought that it's because whenever it's been done as an event it's been fully free

[tawny dune]

I'd be more anxious about wasting time if I could be throwing away 10 ovl doses tbh

[valid spade]

a prayer alternative to the blood necklace

[coarse linden]

neat

[real orbit]

Or a "blessed flask" for overloads?

[coarse linden]

not sure how useful it is ultimately

but sounds neat

[keen yew]

isn't that just soul split but different

[real orbit]

With soul split? Potential to be OP

[valid spade]

its cool reward space and shouldnt devalue other rewards

[coarse linden]

I really REALLY want an overload golem, that is a golem thats just a big vial

[flint thistle]

I’m not sure I’d want it to be a time increase, feels like it should only be equal to the amount of time you can contribute. So if you wanted an hour it need to be you contribute an hour with of doses.

[valid spade]

you can even make it work with only fury necklace to give it less stats than its higher tier peers

[graceful wasp]

what about an enhanced grappling hook that increases the speed you get when using those shortcuts?

with some new thieving areas that can only be reached through em, like 2nd floor safes

[flint thistle]

You could have that, a big a vial you create through invention using a blue print you assemble through pieces gathered by thieving.

[real orbit]

An "overload blessed flask" probably makes more sense than a golem anyway since it doesn't tie it to a location or reduce number of invent slots needed (if you're only taking 1 overload atm)

[lone dew]

Elder overload salve jug (12)

[graceful wasp]

combat potions should only tick down duration while in combat, but that's for another thread

[real orbit]

80 does or nothing

[lone dew]

Obligatory reminder we need elder holy ovl, that is elder salve without the extra bits

[valid spade]

i think you could have thievable "potion extenders" like crystal shards you could add to pots to make them last X longer (like 50% longer?)

[lone dew]

Just combat and prayer, not making antifires every time

[valid spade]

so you would have a resource you could actually utilize

which would essentially act as a "higher amount of doses"

[lone dew]

(But that's best done by adding a recipe to the elf potion shop)

[flint thistle]

How would we feel about bringing back this back as a potential permanent reward?

https://runescape.wiki/w/Dragonkin_protection_charm

Could be worn in the pocket slot or neck slot and act as the poison totem/venom blood equivalent for dragonfire. Only acting as maybe a basic anti-fire is super is too broken. But that way you could be more chill fighting dragons without needing to either constantly chug potions or needing to hold a shield tanking your dps which really sucks if you want to use range in particular.

I’ve always found it weird how many more ways poison has to manage or manipulate it compared to dragonfire.

[valid spade]

this seems very niche

i wouldnt be in favour of it as a reward

[graceful wasp]

perhaps artisans to the guild you can pickpocket for gemdusts and crafting supplies.
the dust would need to be transmuted to be useable

[lone dew]

Abomination got powercrept to the point this isn't needed

[valid spade]

im assuming this was more related to a general dragonfire protection

not abom in itself

[flint thistle]

Correct

[valid spade]

like im really not trying to be negative, it just doesnt have a lot of use cases

[flint thistle]

The proposal was thinking of stuff like dragon slayer or farming dragons mobs.

[valid spade]

making antifires is about the easiest thing you can do

this would be useful for irons pre-antifire pot

and thats about it

[graceful wasp]

stealing eggs from a roosting chicken.
rare chance at cockatrice egg / god bird eggs

or sometimes the bird nest it's sitting on

[flint thistle]

Anti fires are still something you have to manage putting a cap on your task, and eat inventory slots. I notice it every time I have to do long dragon slaying tasks or when I was doing that very extensive KBD grind. Anti fires were continuously the bottle neck on my time in these, nothing else.

[graceful wasp]

dragonbane shield with venomblood is your friend

[flint thistle]

A shield kills your DPS which was my point

[valid spade]

how long do these tasks take you?

idk im an iron ive done plenty of dragon tasks and ive never gotten any of these issues

sorry if i come across rude, but im trying to understand where the need of this actually comes from

[real orbit]

It's really interesting to me you think there'd be no desire for it and here's me thinking it's not likely to get added because it'd be OP

[valid spade]

thats a really interesting perspective, could you elaborate?

[hazy bobcat]

Tbh this is an issue that should be solved by making shields not suck

[flint thistle]

I’ve never really measured but it’s been annoyance for me in most higher end metal dragons and gem dragons.

[real orbit]

I'd never have to make or carry dragonfire protection potions again, idk how much more there is that can be elaborated on there

[flint thistle]

That’s why I was thinking maybe it should be basic antifire not super

[valid spade]

that also invalidates dragonfire potions as a whole tho? is this really something thats good to do?

[hazy bobcat]

I've never really had antifires as an issue because you spend a bit of time making a lot of it and then its a loooong time until next time you have to do it

[valid spade]

yeah antis last a long ass time

[flint thistle]

Eh shields need such a severely fundamental rework I don’t think that’s the solution.

[hazy bobcat]

That aside, I just headcanon we kept the dragonkin charm and thats why we don't become smears on the floor when fighting Kerapac, Taraket and Kranon (they really should be winning otherwise)

[real orbit]

That's why I think it could be OP. It can't be useless and invalidate something else

[valid spade]

yeah rune dragons definitely takes me a while to do, but even then i dont find the antifires to be tedious

[flint thistle]

Make it a non-tradable reward

That you have to earn and it’s on the rarer side

Not like hero item rare

More like hypno wand rare

[hazy bobcat]

Ultimately its one of those things thats not really useful enough for rarity to make sense

[valid spade]

invalidating something doesnt necessarily make it overpowered

[flint thistle]

Require some quests to add it to the pool even

[valid spade]

^^^^

[real orbit]

Rare but like I want to chase this rare and not pure luck I made my bank 10x over from selling it rare

[valid spade]

antifires already are fairly "niche" potions overall

[hazy bobcat]

Like, you say constantly chug potions

super antifire last 6 minutes

[real orbit]

An antifire charm even that can be worn in the pocket slot is something I'd try to get

[hazy bobcat]

extended super antifire last 12 minutes

[flint thistle]

12 minutes isn’t very long

[valid spade]

what

12 minutes x4

is 48 minutes

[hazy bobcat]

lantadyme sticks is up to +2 minutes per dose

And you can always use a potion reservoir to auto chug for you

essentially, if you potion reservoir an extended super anti fire flask

thats 72 minutes for one click

and increase to 84 minutes if you had lanta sticks

not that I think 1 click every 6 minutes is very intensive and by no means could be called "potion chugging"

[flint thistle]

Tbh I don’t think potion reservoirs are a good solution either but that’s neither here nor there. It’s also 112 invention not exactly the most accessible item.

[real orbit]

If you don't see the use that's fine, but it's wild to tell people that would want to use it that it's useless. Clearly if those people are interested in it as an idea then it's not useless all around??

[valid spade]

sure, saying its useless might be hyperbole, but as a reward it fundamentally removes the purpose of both niche potions and niche shields, these things are already not used too frequently

that seems like nothing but negative to the games health

[real orbit]

It can't be both usless and remove the purpose of other things, which is it?

[valid spade]

i just said useless was hyperbole?

[hazy bobcat]

Either its so niche its useless (why bother with it instead of antifires)

or its actually worthwhile and bad (antifire sinks items, we don't want that gone)

I don't really see a scenario where its filling a niche thats good

[valid spade]

yeah this doesnt fill a "sorely needed niche" or anything of the like

[real orbit]

Hyperbole means exaggerated which if you think it'd devaule existing stuff "useless" even exaggerated is the opposite direction? They're totally opposing opinions

[hazy bobcat]

Any premise that has I need to click 10 times an hour depicted as "chugging" is dishonest

[valid spade]

are we really gonna start doing semantics

is that whats happening here

[civic shell]

A little bit of quick work but a first pass at breaking up the thieving outfits (yes there are multiple that need breaking)

[hazy bobcat]

I think by default its not particularily worthwhile a reward, but in the situation where I'm wrong and it is worthwhile I think thats even worse

it being useless is the charitable interpretation

[flint thistle]

Maybe dishonest to you, but it’s how it feels to me.

[real orbit]

Would a permanent antifire item/buff devalue potions? Maybe, it could do. That's something that'd have to be considered and weighed for if it should be added to the game.

Would a permanent antifire item/buff be useless? No and saying it is isn't hyperbole it's just wrong.

[valid spade]

are you also chugging overloads then?

[graceful wasp]

did they make it so you no longer needed to own a pair of gloves of silence, or was that never a thing?

[hazy bobcat]

wasn't the premise that it was normal antifire and not super antifire

[civic shell]

is it a thing? i was just copying over the current exoskeleton text

[hazy bobcat]

Chugging means there is barely any time between each time

You chug saradomin brews if you keep tanking hits because the damage means you can't stop

[graceful wasp]

i thought u had to own a pair of em for the trahearn set to work as em initially

[hazy bobcat]

antifire is long enough between each dose that there is no chugging

[valid spade]

yeah using 1 dose every 6 minutes is not egregious at all

[hazy bobcat]

you sip it every now and then

[real orbit]

I don't think it particularly matters as both would be "useful" just to different amounts

[civic shell]

o maybe

[graceful wasp]

think they removed that part though

at some point

[civic shell]

well this is them being a strict upgrade now

if they arent already

[graceful wasp]

Jerrod cape also has a bunch of passive bonuses' that aren't really clear

don't have to wear it either, but still

[real orbit]

Like most of ED2 trash I don't bother with antifires because I can kill most the stuff quickly enough, but occasionally I get hit by one and the very small niche use of that being reduced is still "useful"

[civic shell]

tried to line up the two outfits so theres a clear combination for pyramid plunder (was also surprised how much both lean into pyramid plunder)

[flint thistle]

Yes when I use them. Guess what I don’t use most of the time? I find the tedium of managing potions and feeling like there is a time limit on my fun often not worth the extra damage. I know it’s a considerable amount but I’d rather just be able to do content without the pressure of time limits. I understand why they are there, it’s necessary for balance purposes, it does not mean I enjoy them.

[hazy bobcat]

Either way, you asked about thoughts on it as a reward
The answer to that question to that is no, I don't think its good reward space

[graceful wasp]

pyramid plunder was basically the main training methods for the better part of rs' history, up until they added priff elves

[hazy bobcat]

Meanwhile I don't remember last time I did combat without overloads

[civic shell]

clearly we have space for new gear peices that work on safecracking

[hazy bobcat]

I got so many I'm never running out

[civic shell]

or stalls

[hazy bobcat]

its salves too

[valid spade]

yeah once you make overloads you make so many its not really a thing to think about

idk

im even an iron and its just not an issue

[graceful wasp]

think imma write up a fort stall concept for game-suggestions later today

[civic shell]

coolio

[valid spade]

i do think we have gotten ever so slightly offtopic though

[hazy bobcat]

Stealing from stalls is solid, but stealing from your own fort seem a bit silly

[graceful wasp]

full set of dark kebbit fur gear would be nice though

https://discord.com/channels/303835144073248770/1372630378497708144

like that kinda stuff

[valid spade]

when will they add tax evasion to thieving, roald will not get my hard earned cash

[flint thistle]

It’s the perfect crime they never suspect you steal from your own people unless you are a billionaire.

[civic shell]

also in case it wasnt obvious the reason ive been doing Set Effect (3) for +4% xp is that you can still get back up to +6% if you pick 2 pieces to not use the elite outfit and use the xp outfit instead

[hazy bobcat]

I will pay taxes when he build roads to my fort

[graceful wasp]

if my employees can't guard their own salary, why should i trust em with my stuff

[valid spade]

build the roads roald you coward

[graceful wasp]

it's on site training

[valid spade]

imagine GE tax scaled with thieving level XD

[graceful wasp]

murder on the border showed us, they need more training

we've got the skills to teach em

someone sneaking into the fort is a big nono

be it with grappling hook, disguises or illegal merch

like harmonic dust

can't have high guards

[graceful wasp]

shop sellers should be pickpocketable for their stock

but you can't access the store for 24 hours when spotted

unless you bribe em

[valid spade]

you should be able to use your thieving to ali morrisane style sell your stuff for a higher price every now and then

XD

[graceful wasp]

i actually suggested stealing money through chat scamming npcs in here earlier i think

using the right dialogue option to make em buy air

that kinda stuff

[valid spade]

hahaha thats funny

[graceful wasp]

can't afk that stuff

[thick kayak]

Fair enough. All I know for sure is that thieving is listed as a support skill. And considering the mechanic is basically gathering, I think it should "gather" things that "support" other non combat skills whether than be stone spirits or even something for artisan skills that can save resources or boost speed for a duration. And as stated with the double cannonball mould, chase items that benefit skilling but maybe not to the extreme of memory dowser or sanas fyretorch.

Also maybe 100+ thieving there can be someone to steal from in the invention guild that's basically scavenger farming but for skillers. No physical item but you get invention components at similar rate to current meta scav farming.

[cedar kayak]

Things mentioned and things I can thing of as exciting rewards feel out of place coming from thieving.

Like permanent relic power for certain relics, interlocks with archeology.

I was also thinking about having a mobile effect that stacks with the mobile perk, similar to how shifting tombs currently works (extremely fun).

I know thieving is a supporting skill, but it's hard to visualize what that means currently without something meta shifting. Rare pickpockets like the osrs blood shard isn't particularly fun, nor is rushing the last sarcophagus in pyramid plunder in rs3.

[real orbit]

I think something to maybe consider for new pickpocket targets is a "successful" pickpocket maybe doesn't have to produce loot but just means not getting caught? That way you don't have to fill out their loot with random trash and could just have a 1/X chance of a chase item or happily stay at them for just XP.

[graceful wasp]

spend some time thinking out a loot table for fairies.

dusts

• ground tooth (protection spirit tree)
• extra fine sand (fairy sleep dust)
• bucket of sand (fairy sleep dust)
• ashes (necro inks / herblore)
• garlic powder (ward vampyres / cooking)
• chocolate dust (sweet tooth / cooking)
• dragon scale dust (herblore)
• goat horn dust (herblore)
• Gorak claw powder (herblore)
• ground charcoal (quest / trash drop) / potential herblore item
• ground sulpher (quest / trash drop) / potential herblore item
• ground mud runes
• ground astral runes (quest / trash drop) / potential herblore item
• ground miasma runes (probably not)

seeds

• mushrooms (bittercaps / morchella)
• apple (attracts fairies)
• rosemary (attracts fairies)
• snapdragon (attracts fairies)
• spirit seed
• willow
• elder seed (attracts fairies)

(potential additions)
flowers foxglove (literally known as fairy bells), lavender, pansy, bluebells
trees : rowan, hawthorn
bushes elderberry

ofcourse some of the existing flowers could just be added because, it's kinda their thing

[latent mortar]

Q: What parts of Thieving do you currently enjoy or find rewarding?
A: Currently just HAM members for easy clues. In the past, I did alot of knock out lures at Monkey Knife Fighters and Pyramid Plunder. Neither were enjoyable. Too repetitive. On my iron, I mainly did Elf Thieving to 111 Thieving. Never touched Safecracking yet on iron.

Q: Would you prefer more passive training, active mechanics, or something totally new?
A: More active but also something new.

Q: Is there a style/theme of Thieving content you'd love to see?
A: For one aspect, maybe expand on the Firebreathing activity from the Circus and Char's activity, we can pickpocket dust, use Herblore to make it into potions, and use our Firemaking level where we become "Fire Sculptors" where we form a shape. Like with God Statues. And it lures spirits to a. loot from or b. loot keys from and then the keys can be used to open chests?. Or perhaps could be considered in a thieving dungeon.

Edit: or we can use existing planks from Fort Forinthry to create shape then to light on fire using the special dust. Depending on shape it attacts certain monsters or creatures or spirits to then loot from by sneaking? Just throwing a random idea out there.

Q: What would you want to see as part of a skill level increase? (110/120)
A: Honestly not sure. Something more active/rewarding. There is plenty of AFK options already for Thieving.

Q: Any specific NPCs/areas you'd want to interact with more?
A: Perhaps to pickpocket from vyres to get congealated blood as one loot

[thick kayak]

your content suggestion seems a lot more firemaking focused, i dont really see the thieving aspect at all

[tender jasper]

I think the safes in Zemouregal's Fortress should give a rare chance to give Zemouregal-themed items.

[graceful wasp]

he'd totally have an Arrav action figure / voodoo doll

[tender jasper]

we should be able to steal tiny zemouregal skin unlock tokens

[graceful wasp]

new varrock tasks, dominion tower kills, vorkath kills

[tender jasper]

(and he should also be made available as a familiar override using the animations of the other bobblehead pets)

we should be able to steal https://runescape.wiki/w/Wine_of_Zemouregal

Rogues' Castle safes should give rare chances at the Chaos Elemental/Revenant corrupt and ancient warrior armour drops.

I dunno what Zanaris could get.

I guess chances at whatever fairies get if they get added as pickpocketable NPCs

I guess the lower-level safes could probably get some unique area-themed loot too

Oh right since i'm not actually explaining my thinknig probably - safecracking would get an XP nerf but gain additional loot in return.

[thick kayak]

I do like the idea of uncommon/rare items from safes, both level appropriate and ideally area themed. Probably not required for comp/trim or anything cuz that seems very disgusting to require you to obtain them from low level safes just for comp but maybe. Whether it be some nice QOL (think hairclip prior to King's Ransom) or something of that nature that is not necessarily required. But a nice reward to obtain if you get lucky or decide to spend the time farming for it.

[edgy jay]

I'd love to see just unique, rare-ish rewards in general. this done poorly would be something like the mystical sand seed, where you get like 2/hr from crux knights while fully afking. it's not hype, will never be valuable beyond hour 1. done well, this looks like dragon mattocks/uncheckeds/maul pieces from BGH or sceptre of the gods from pyramid plunder - 3/4 of those trigger a broadcast and they feel like hype moments. Mattocks are still reasonably valuable to this day, maul was valuable when it was relevant, same with uncheckeds before Iaia and experimental firemaking/fletching wrecked their value.

example ideas (i'd assume they're coming from new, active content rather than most of the existing AFK thieving content):

A unique tele item that brings you to every heist location and maybe bundles some other tele items, like communication device (item meant to be useful for thieves and also others, like cluers/slayers). harkens back to sceptre of the gods - could be tradeable, or not.

spirit drop cleaner - works on stone spirits, wood spirits, RC anima, and any future spirits. similar to the upgraded versions of other drop cleaners, can either destroy them or automagically put them in invent.

Magnum Opus Gem Setting - can combine with 1000 (or w/e) amount of jewelry with charges to make an infinite-charges version, or perhaps use the enchant system if you wanted to revive that to make those items no longer drain charge. This would be coveted mostly by rich skillers but also some combat enjoyers, like with the new ring of retribution. Probably exclude EoF in this, and this item would have to be truly very rare.

tl;dr more rare skilling drops that feel like hype moments.

[errant birch]

What if instead of their being just Luck Boost for the RDT we have some other tangible reward tables or specific items to increase. Personally I think it would be really neat if we could have Clue Boost or Scroll Boost. Something with a whole different table that you want to unlock, it could be something just tied to purely thieving where you have 3 to 4 tiers of it you could unlock.

[graceful wasp]

wanted to share the concept for a small fort addition for stalls / pickpocket targets.
https://discord.com/channels/303835144073248770/1385064396040179854

[civic shell]

Wait what if we did stacking luck

We introduce some new item that adds luck here, could still add in the relic/ring if desired. That way we arent breaking the relic system

[graceful wasp]

Making relics deprecated once you get an upgrade isn't breaking it.
It's basically build into the system with the 4 tiers of luck having their own relic to begin with.
They have planned obsolescence

[errant birch]

@civic shell we had that called insignias but it got too complicated lol

I loved that collectors insignia from BA

[civic shell]

The more im thinking about it the more im just not liking our luck system

Its almost like each tier needs a way to scale the % up

Because tier 4 luck will never be better than what it currently is

Just more and more convenient ways to have it turned on

Until we get to whats being pitched now: its always turned on

I think having it be better and better tier 4 luck (luck that is applied to the current highest end activities/monsters) is more interesting

Being able to give up more gear slots or relic spots or inventory slots to potions to stack it

Hell, maybe its time to introduce tier 5 luck for lv100+ stuff and bosses on the scale of amascut

The question of “what does thieving reward” could be luck if the luck system had more depth. More tiers to plug in to and more things to do within those tiers

You could have different rates of overall tier 4 luck, tier 4 luck that is more effective on undead or dragons or demons or vyres, tier 4 luck that greatly increases odds of getting uniques but when you get the drop its only 33% of the shards needed to actually get the unique

[errant birch]

I would like different types of luck tbh. Themes of them tbh, even when they initially did the luck rework it sort of made it bland until we found out that they secretly released the hsr from it. I would definitely like unique luck variations that could have effects on the type of loot you can get as you mentioned Avernic.

[thick rapids]

There could be a Hero item related to thieving? Like <hero's name> pickpocketing bag

[lone dew]

May be too specific if it's just for pickpocketing

[graceful wasp]

Joker mask
examine: they never see it coming

[hazy bobcat]

Pirate Pete's magical blackjack of teleportation

[thick kayak]

I believe Sponge already expressed disinterest in the idea of another Hero item

[graceful wasp]

silver stalls giving silver stone spirits without having them in their stock is silly

silver stalls not having sickles, or unenchanted silver jewellery in their stock (at 0) also probably shouldn't be the case

the silver stall in keldagrim could probably also have silver bolts, given dwarven propensity for crossbows

honestly the item list for all stalls is questionable at best

except for the wine stall

[remote notch]

a nice reward for thieving could it be a magical quill and a couple materials to make a godless tincture, to transcribe inside a masterwork god book (made with materials from wc, mining, divination and farming), a new item made to consume diferent scriptures and god books(you can transcribe all of them but not at the same time) on it but you need one magical quill and 1 godless tincture and other specific resources for every each one, where you need to use pages and manuscripts on it at the cost of one quill and one tincture to recharge it with the possibility to use 2-3 effects of the books at the same time or so.

You can get the magical quill and the 6-8 diferent materials to manufacture the tincture only by pickpocketing high level npcs

in some way, getting the materials only by pickpocketing have sense cuz you are not supposed to have access to fabricate this wonderful book and at the same time fills with more rewards 110 crafting skill

[thick kayak]

that sounds extremely overpowered. Players would definitely start doing "book switches" mid fight, no thanks

[stiff current]

bit late to the party but here's a few ideas for reward space

• ring of suffering-esque necklace that can hold thousands of non-teleport necklace (featherfinger, gluttony, binding, insatiable (only featherfinger is fine too and probably more thematic)) charges, perhaps with effect increases and a large (~15) prayer bonus attached
• tradeable codex for a style-agnostic ability that moves you to the opposite side of the enemy you're fighting and sneak attacks them, see https://i.imgur.com/pnPsjyA.png for examples
• "Darren's Pickpocketing Bag", you decide what it does?!?!?
• referencing this post #1380456530511532174 message my preferred way of handling the luck relics has been and still is a luck/xp only relic slot, since those 2% xp relics feel like a fair tradeoff to having luck, so perhaps we'd steal an item that unlocks this slot? (and while you're at it, get rid of monolith energy, its stupid and pointless)

i REALLY want to suggest gorajo pickpocketing but the options for that seem too vast to really do it justice if its not the main focus of the update

[remote notch]

Let's assume that it is today and that it sounds somewhat like that, but probably not in the future due new content with higher difficulty, cap level and new harder bosses, and it isn't switching, kinda the opposite, its for three pocket slot item on at the same time if u want(you have to chose right witch one are you going to imbue cuz they get consumed as a permanent slot or to recharge it), for example scripture of elidinis and bik book and something new (giving more space for new rewards for skilling on pocket slot), and i think it could work to combine books, scrimshaw and blood essence too, with an update as a reward from maybe one or two quest from havenhythe with the addition of two new combat blood essence (necromancy and summoning benefits) and six or more skilling blood essence (for all the new skilling content coming up) all of this with the posibility to add future pocket slot items on it

[copper trail]

In terms of rewards from a thieving update:

I feel like a higher tier augmentable mainhand is a given, maybe also a thieving off-hand?

Things like the Phaoroh's sceptre and sceptre of the gods were cool, something like that

Maybe new relics, perhaps one that increases the chance of clue scrolls while thieving or one that increases the speed in which you traverse shortcuts.

Secondaries for new thieving summoning familiar

I like the cannonball mould idea, seems useful.

New gemstone only found rarely by thieving a high level gem stall.

[abstract delta]

Tier 5 luck item, but only applies to skilling drops.

[thick kayak]

why?

Luck already does very little

[graceful wasp]

Luck should improve ushabti capture chances

[thick kayak]

Agreed, it really should affect anything that has RNG to it

[keen yew]

I'd rather not

you start opening the door for luck to affect things like fishing chance etc

what luck does now is pretty consistent. it affects the chance of rare loot

well almost

there's a couple of exceptions like bgh multi spawn

[thick kayak]

okay with some exceptions of course

[keen yew]

even that kinda makes sense. it provides the "rare case" in contrast to the "common case"

ushabti doesn't have a "common loot". it's success or fail

[thick kayak]

I dont quite understand the difference of ushabti success or vs not rolling rare loot. They are both probabilities, ushabti happens to be much more complex with slayer level and slayer task affecting success rate

[keen yew]

to put it differently, ushabti success isn't always rare

it's only sometimes rare

it's more similar to other "success rate" mechanisms like fishing catch rate than it is to loot mechanisms

[thick kayak]

Im still not seeing the differentiation from ushabti to a rare boss drop. rare boss drop isnt always rare due to rng. They are both RNG, both have a probability. Obviously at the end of the day, if they decide luck shouldnt affect ushabti, it shouldnt. Same with your argument of fishing, its just a probability roll every X ticks, the probability just happens to be pretty high that you catch a fish every few ticks. And again they can pick and chose what probabilities luck actually affects.

[vagrant palm]

master thief's silk gloves, makes it easier to pickpocket undetected 🤔 I'd find it cool/on theme if a skilling outfit had at least some parts that you would need to thieve from various targets, a la imcando (perhaps the ability to make a base skilling outfit and thieve the ornaments for leveling?)

[thick kayak]

kinda on that note, "stealing" thieving perks. But they are more like permanent buffs that you "learn" throughout thieving because thematically, your character realizes that doing X instead of Y when stealing from someone's pocket has a better success rate

[vagrant palm]

oo yeah I like that, reminds me of the cremate bones ability - codices would be neat to add for thieving

[thick kayak]

And on your suggestion of items. Im more thinking tools. If you think about what exactly our character is doing, its "gathering". So Thieving should have more access to gathering themed perks imo. Even though we aren't gathering artisan resources, we are still technically gathering, we just happen to be gathering support items for gathering skills, like seeds, stone spirits, etc

[fallow wasp]

Probably would make Powerfull first age Curios - that could shake up meta!

🔹 First age pendant - for cluers somthing (maybe declutter some teleport items from cluer inventories somthing similar like Passage of the abyss)
🔹 First age symbol - for skillers somthing ( maybe you sacrifice items to First age symbol for buffs kinda item sink angle https://runescape.wiki/w/Travelling_Artisan_(August_2020) )
🔹 First age earring - for pvmers no power creep but some kind of utility etc

🔸 With Archaeology you can dig (damaged) first age curios from first age dig site in Havenhythe. Restore and upgrade from base to plus +12!
🔸Have to pickpocket 12 different npcs for each tier of blueprint recipe fragments. After reading recipe you know what materials are needed for upgrading each tier. ( It would be somth similar like Dragonkin potion recipes https://runescape.wiki/w/Dragonkin_potion_recipes )

First age pendant recipe fragment +1 / First age symbol recipe fragment +1 / First age earring recipe fragment +1 - ( pickpocket Vyres )
First age pendant recipe fragment +2 / First age symbol recipe fragment +2 / First age earring recipe fragment +2 - ( pickpocket Tzhaar )
... +3 ( pickpocket Goebies )
... +4 ( pickpocket Fairies )
... +5 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +6 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +7 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +8 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +9 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +10 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +11 ( pickpocket X npc)
... +12 ( pickpocket X npc)

🔸Tiers +1 till +12 can be upgraded at crafting guild with a lengthy crafting process + each tier cost different materials. Can be tie in with 110 crafting unlocks lets say - 98 crafting +1 curio, 99 crafting +2 curio, ..... 110 crafting +12 curio!
🔸Materials for upgrading curios can only be got by Thieving skill - stealing catacombs, safes, rob banks, npc, dungeon chests etc etc stuff
🔸Each tier adds some kind of benefit or enhance the benefit

[tired spire]

An update to camouflage fragment rates would be nice.

[thick kayak]

Shifting tombs gives more frags an hour than reg thieving

[keen yew]

yeah do shifting tombs. you get the desert pantheon aura for your work too

[errant birch]

How about area buff unlocks for thieving? Similar to how Jas works? Maybe some new modifiers you can unlock and place at different cities or regions and they give you small perks. For example, while thieving guards in varrock with this new unlock you get a small chance of hitting a new thieving drop table or maybe just 2 to 3 new times only. You dont even need new tables, you could just add clues, unique items or maybe even something associated to the thieving guild that you need to hand in to get some new unlock.

[graceful wasp]

have a local rogue fencer that has a checklist of fancy loot that you gotta get from specific chests, npcs or safes.
all logged in a thieves guild logbook ofcourse

so they know who to ask for, when they have a particular piece of loot they want

there's one in varrock fencing basic gold stuff already

those fencers could then also serve as thieving's slayer masters for specific acquisition tasks

or city quest style item collecting tasks, that are suspiciously common on certain thieving loot tables, but can be gotten through other means

[thick kayak]

I do like this idea

a thieving collection log basically

or more akin to archaeology collections but for thieving

1st time completion reward, and repetition rewards

I like it a lot actually

thinking about it more just makes me like it more and more, archaeology collection for thieving

[errant birch]

I think all skills should have proper collection logs for their own design purposes

[thick kayak]

potentially, but I'd hate to see any of the skills have half baked things, or collection logs simply for the sake of collection logs

At least with thieving, it seems reasonable that some snobby rich guy would want to add X to his collection, and so hires a thief to make it happen

[errant birch]

I think thieving has a lot more range than most skills of just how expressive and unique it can be in the ways you can train/interact with it. It has the potential for a clog system but i think skills like Hunter need it way more.

[graceful wasp]

basically, most skills can have a poh room that's an exhibit

for hunter, that'd be like your classic huntsman lodge room

perfect pelt as a carpet / wall decoration and all that

thieving could basically just have a bunch of display cases and a giant safe

that's bigger on the inside, with stuff like a pyramid you stole

like a perfectly shiny miniature pyramid, from the agility pyramid

or a moon

https://tenor.com/view/the-plan-is-simple-gru-minions-the-minions-plan-gif-15580541

[opal glen]

While I'd hate the grind, it does give extra motivation

[olive quest]

Thieving is one of my favorite skills, if not my number 1 favorite skill. That being said, I spend 95% of my thieving time on safecracking and prif workers. I know it's not super engaging, but that is simply what I enjoy the most.

I would suggest some combat equipment/methods that are tied into the thieving skill.

example:
Smoke Bombs - Created with herblore and requires thieving to use. Makes nearby aggressive NPCs not target you for a certain amount of time based on the tier of the bomb.

Highwayman's Mask - tier 25, hybrid/all armor, killing any NPC that has a pickpocket option will also generate additional drops equal to 5 successful pickpockets and provide the same amount of thieving XP.

Rogue's Mask - tier 50, upgraded from highwayman's mask, generates drops/xp equal to 10 successful pickpockets.

Bandit's Mask - tier 75, upgraded from rogue's mask, generates drops/xp equal to 15 successful pickpockets.

[vagrant palm]

ooo 👀

[tired spire]

just went pickpocketing gnomes for reed seeds and that was utterly painful of an experience. way too high of a failure rate.

[whole belfry]

Afk master farmers for a few hours.

[tired spire]

I have been. But I needed Reed seeds.

[keen yew]

do zuk

it's like the source of reed seeds

don't need to complete it the mobs can drop it

[clear halo]

Has anyone suggested the ultimate target for theft - the bank? I think there's a number of opportunities there - sneakily stealing from the counters, distracting tellers, safes, safety deposit boxes, even breaking into vaults. For more active skilling, sneak through different banks and steal keys from a number of NPCs to unlock a special special safe (maybe with some kind of active puzzle aspect required to open it).

As for things that can be found in the bank - a few random ideas:

• Something that decreases the penalty from gold accumulator
• A scale that give a small bonus to thieving gold drops
• Magic Bank teller drawer that stores some kind of items (An opportunity to add something similar to stone spirits to drop tables that give thieving benefits?)
• Bank stamp/seal of some kind - pocket item that occasionally attracts a bank employee to give you itms (like Seren Spirits)
• Rare coins that can be consumed(?) to give some kind of luck bonus
• Some kind of jeweler's loupe that gives a bonus to crafting - gem cutting XP, or maybe some kind of improvement to some of the crafted necklaces (making teleports permanent instead of requiring charges? Though that might be too powerful)
• Some kind of land deeds that can be traded to the POH Estate Agents for some kind of bonus (construction XP? Maybe a discount card for POH material?)
• Area specific rewards (Elf banks give a different reward than gnomes, etc)
• Heirlooms from famous NPCs that can be returned to them to give reputation gain bonus for some areas
• Loan documents for random NPCs who will reward you for saving them from debt

It seems like an obvious target for a "master" thief

[thick kayak]

thats more or less what everyone is referring to with heists. It doesnt have to be only a bank or only some rich dudes house. it can be both and more

[olive quest]

so like, break into the museum at night by using a gnome glider to land on the roof, then disable the security and steal antique lamps?

[errant birch]

Bank Vault or a Dragon. Both of them would be fun.

[thick kayak]

why either or? Maybe on initial release they give like 4-5 heist types (banks, dragon lair etc), and then they easily have room to just create new layouts, methods with new thematics like Castles etc

[stark harness]

What parts of Thieving do you currently enjoy or find rewarding? Unique items or chase items - SOTG, Ibis outfit, Big items with QoL.
What do you think isn't working with the skill as it is? Whenever someone thinks of thieving it's an AFK skill. AFK Martin in Draynor for seeds, AFK Crux Knights for xp, AFK Safes in the wilderness for pilfer points.
Would you prefer more passive training, active mechanics, or something totally new? this one is tricky. I would love to see a minigame around thieving that would award good xp while still having an engaging mechanic. Minigame rewards + Thaler would also be nice to get from it. Pyramid Plunder with all it's flaws is fun, I would just make it more group focused. Example is doors reset in PP when someone enters making it more rewarding to do in a small group or solo, removing this would promote group thieving.
Is there a style/theme of Thieving content you'd love to see? Group thieving/Minigame content
How do you feel about the current loot and XP balance? XP balance is ok, I feel the loot is lacking. Having some chase items like a 'blueprint' for ancient gear would be an idea to build.
What would you want to see as part of a skill level increase? (110/120) **A quest regarding a master thief's hoard that has been lost to the times. This trove could contain secret codes such as Fairy Ring combinations that when entered, teleports you to a brand new area. Potentially a museum of holy relics on display. Lorehounds would love that lol **
What new stalls, chests, and pickpocket targets would you like to see? I'd love to see the land of the goblins visited again. I feel like Dorgesh-kaan is abandoned.
Any specific NPCs/areas you'd want to interact with more? Dorgesh-kaan, Hidden desert temples

[errant birch]

@thick kayak I just think it gets out of scope when we make 110 updates to make it that elaborative. We can try to share the ideas but theyre also gonna patch in numerous other thieving related issues/content at the same time too most likely.

[tribal bramble]

i wish we could do heists like a mini game for rewards and bonuses

[graceful wasp]

https://tenor.com/view/payday2-gif-23955341

[olive quest]

heists could be rooftop agility courses with thieving skill checks involved, resulting in lap completion granting a large amount of agility xp, thieving xp, and whatever treasure the goal of the heist was

for example:
Museum Heist:
-grapple onto the varrock north-east wall from outside (agility xp)
-make your way past guards using knock-out methods (thieving xp)
-grapple from the wall to the rooftop of the varrock museum (agility xp)
-lockpick the skylight access and descend into the museum. you do not physically enter the museum and success chance is 100% with master thief's lockpick on toolbelt, but failing will have a chance to alert the guards and result in being sent to the varrock pillory cages (thieving xp)
-background sound effects and text of the heist play during an automatic thieving check, during which time your character is carving a circle in the glass display to steal an artifact. failure will result in capture and being sent to the varrock pillory cages, while having the sharpened knife forinthry kitchen bonus will make your success chance 100% (thieving xp)
-if successful on the previous step, you emerge back onto the rooftop and can improvise a glider/parachute out of torn museum curtains to escape back to the initial starting point, but there is a chance of dropping your stolen loot and only receiving a portion of the lap completion agility and thieving xp. success chance is 100% and animation is changed if you have any version of wingsuit attached to your toolbelt. (agility & thieving xp)

[steady delta]

The skill isn’t rewarding enough… grind to 200M exp and hope to never have to do it again. Why afk thieving when you can afk anything else combat related and make way more money. Don’t even have to worry about death fighting most things these days. More likely to die from pickpocketing then afking some slayer mob with soul split / ghost from Necro.

[narrow veldt]

https://discord.com/channels/303835144073248770/1398886505312813126

Had an idea about a city in the wilderness that could perhaps be ruled by thieves, rouges, bandits, and followers of zamorak.

Could have some interesting theiving related activities!

[high peak]

interesting

[high peak]

😮

[gray sparrow]

What's the news in here, fellas?

[civic shell]

🦗

[thick kayak]

Not much, theiving update isnt even scheduled until after havenhythe i believe

[flint thistle]

Thieving is the last major update of the year on the roadmap, havenythe starts next year.

[lavish rover]

https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/rs-ahead-at-runefest---havenhythe-leagues-and-more-revealed Theiving is described as late this year, havenhythe is early 2026. The vertical order doesn't mean anything in the roadmap graphic afaik, the top one is just usually the big updates for that part of the year.

[keen garden]

Btw does anyone know what the combat update is?

Also are we getting any word on 110s for combat?

[thick kayak]

The vertical has been accurate tho. But yeah I understand if they moved stuff around, I just wasn't aware

[thick kayak]

I believe it's just balance and trying to smooth things out across the board

[jaunty grail]

Safes should roll a chance for hero items and not just by luck of the dwarves

[thick kayak]

No

[jaunty grail]

why not? we have a literal master thief that probably has a better loot bag

[thick kayak]

Because 1 the only hero item lotd can obtain is hsr. And 2 safes are extremely accessible, much easier to spam than killing anything that accesses the rdt or clicking seren spirits, and would most likely end up rolling the table wayyyy more often than any of the previous mentioned methods

[abstract delta]

Except RDT is afkable where spirits and safes are very very not

[hexed vortex]

Spirits are extremely AFKable with potions and a reservoir

[short plinth]

prob way too late for any of this but, I don’t hate the click and afk per say, but i feel if that is added, there should be something else to spice it up. Safes were nice but pretty op, technically though pyramid plunder gets you 99 in 1-2 days all the same though as safes. Unique rare rewards like pp offered would be nice. Something interactive like a puzzle to open a chest or disarm traps as you go through some obstacle or building would be neat. Like a true heist.
Or go a completely different direction and add thieving to combat, maybe steal a resource, maybe even a rare unique one that wont be dropped otherwise, with a chance ofc, or even some of the enemies armor to make them less tanky or maybe in a more magical sense, you steal an attack or effect to some degree.
Can Integrate it with agility and have stealthy thieving with obstacles and dodging, kinda like the vamp minigame thing in osrs that gives the one stamina related ring. Can even integrate it with archaeology and steal fragments of priceless relics that you repair and sometimes one will work when repaired.
Either way, give a reason to do said method, not just “ok i got 110, im out”

Can rework the heist minigame to be a group activity where you need people to distract guards etc as you navigate and steal from some mansion or something. A skilling boss of sorts but in minigame form with new drops and a coll log like a boss

[floral steeple]

As many already suggested; please make it possible to thiev into locked buildings by tasks given from Thieving Guild 🙂 Would be cool to see ppl trying to search valuables from locked buildings where you cannot normally enter.

There could be monsters, traps also included in these buildings

[supple vault]

There is a thing in osrs where you steal house keys and rob citizens homes. 😂 could be like that

[regal spire]

I'd say robbing a bank is not yet an option but would be cool to add. You go in with a blackjack knock out the bank employees and safcrack the vault for gp and artefacts. You could do it in like team form training to rob bigger banks. Let's be honest not being able to bankrob in 2025 is weird eh?

[autumn gazelle]

I would love benefits to be added for the Master Lockpick and Safecracker. They're a bit of an oddity currently.

[narrow veldt]

King of Thieves would be cool

[thick plover]

Generally, remove some of the items that are useless in game. We have an over abundance we don't really use after the achievement or you hit certain level, because there are hundreds of choices. Use some RNG mechanics in thieving, where you actually need to continue using the skill for a critical item in a skill like herb, div, combat, or maybe rc. Something you can't buy in game, but it has some really good bonus that you absolutely want it for training another skill. It'd put some life back into skills you don't use after you max. But have them at a 1/2500 chance of obtaining.

[opal glen]

Be nice if a prize for the thieving update was ability to gain like 30-50 bank spaces. Just one time as a new thieving reward or something

[half rain]

No

Getting bankspace would be nice but i don't see why it would be a thieving thing