#Oki, you Silly Goose. The Camo Kill Requirements are way too high.

1 messages Ā· Page 2 of 1

fresh stump
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Skins currently are wasteful anyway

willow storm
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for core gameplay, yea

fresh stump
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See, this would just be funny

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I'm down for funny

near onyx
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Perhaps we will. But that's why continued feedback is always necessary šŸ˜ƒ

ashen rain
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Iā€™m telling you, 20k kills for a grass skin

rotund snow
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there are some players with 10k kills on guns so I disagree. It would only qualify for that if it were higher than anyone will actually ever likely achieve

willow storm
minor lintel
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Yeah some people really like their gun and just wanna shoot for high numbers

rotund snow
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playing 5 invasion games and getting a "mastery" skin from it would be ridiculous

willow storm
rotund snow
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oh, sorry

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I would say that's a bit too low still but I think it needs to be brought down significantly for sidearms

fresh stump
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I don't think it's really "options" it's bloat because it's the same skin 5 times but in a different color

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It's unlocks for the sake of unlocks imo

willow storm
near onyx
fresh stump
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Where as you could have way more customizability by adding in materials, and having patterns unlock once. You could have different rotations unlock separately and all that, but the basic pattern to use with whatever colors and materials you've unlocked would be great.

rotund snow
willow storm
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rn mastery means nothing so whole convo is a bit wack, but I get why you're saying it

rotund snow
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can't be having everyone going around as masters

near onyx
minor lintel
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Guns don't have distinct enough advantages and downsides rn to really give the mastery camos anything status related

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Like I use the same build for pretty much all my guns with no issue

rotund snow
ashen rain
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Alright bud

minor lintel
rotund snow
minor lintel
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I used the ump for the weekly after the patch and was like "Did they buff this or something because this shit fries still"

ashen rain
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Those guns fucking SLAP

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theyā€™re exceptionally distinct

minor lintel
near onyx
ashen rain
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Groza just fucking uninstalls the game on peopleyou kill with how hard youā€™re murdering them, and the UMP feels like the Sniper Rifle of SMGs

rotund snow
minor lintel
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like distinct recoil patterns or something to that effect

ashen rain
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The only outlier there is the EVO and Honeybadger

minor lintel
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the badger is just bad kittenCry

ashen rain
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I Knowā€¦

near onyx
ashen rain
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But I love it ok itā€™s my baby AND THEY TOOK IT FROM ME

rotund snow
minor lintel
near onyx
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I wonder if Oki did a vote how this suggestion would end up PeepoThink

sage lagoon
near onyx
fresh stump
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I would fucking cry if he did a vote on this

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and not my masterclass of a post about unlock tickets

sage lagoon
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Oh btw I did like some compromises people suggested here without reducing the requirements fully

near onyx
near onyx
ashen rain
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Most of the stuff oki polls is extremely polarising

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Like the fucking glint changes

sage lagoon
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yeah some other folks suggested that other patterns requirements could be tweaked

minor lintel
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Yeah at the end of the day we can't satisfy everyone, I don't mind if they shuffle gold and silver to the front and give us something insane for 10k

sage lagoon
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Diamond crystals

minor lintel
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so you can still get gold and silver

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Honestly

sage lagoon
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see ^

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good one

minor lintel
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Make the 10k skin the MP7 skin they gave out for people who prestieged early but for all weapons

ashen rain
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Yup, exactly my suggested

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Add more mastery specific skins, adjust individual numbers without changing the top

sage lagoon
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but tbf we have to keep in mind Larry has content upto prestige 20 I believe

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so asking for anything tedious might not be welcomed

minor lintel
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10 or 20, cant remember

sage lagoon
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20 I think ?

minor lintel
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yeah but it lets people shoot for something if they wan't some crazy cool shit for getting 10k kills on a weapon

near onyx
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Nah I got won overby @fresh stump's post before. 5k is Good. Any further skins should be tied to weapon class mastery or sum (cod idea again lol) and mayyybee a lot later down the line we could look at going further beyond, game is still new. Gotta give the players a reason to get on and grind

minor lintel
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and it evades the issue with class mastery which makes people use guns they don't prefer.

near onyx
sage lagoon
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Stattrak ?

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I think thats trademarked ?

minor lintel
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Yeah, so if they shift gold to the first one or two slots and then make the 3rd one the early prestiege design for 10k I feel like people would be ok with that

near onyx
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The tag/kill counter would be unlocked at mastery (lets say in theory 5k), and show current kill progress continuing on, or something like that. So people that love a weapons are still noticed

minor lintel
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since both of the first two honestly look the same

dense junco
minor lintel
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you can literally just remove the first skin and move gold there instead

sage lagoon
dense junco
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just can't call it stattrak

sage lagoon
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oh ok

near onyx
near onyx
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anyways lol sorry my friends I must step away my the mancave for a bit so maybe well pick this up at a later time? šŸ˜Ž

ashen rain
rotund snow
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If oki yields to feedback and lowers the kill requirements, I will just say I think they should add a new tier at 10k anyway. Because itā€™s a big milestone, it just makes sense to have something there imo

ashen rain
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Guys guys guys, this is a battlebit feedback post and Iā€™m not seeing any insults being thrown around

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The fuck is this?

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Absolute cretins

rotund snow
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Itā€™s an entirely subjective topic so anyone who creates insults based on it is a bit silly

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More ticks than crosses on the topic of lowering it. I canā€™t imagine heā€™d look at this and consider higher numbers :p

ashen rain
rotund snow
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As someone who only has copper ones I think it looks nice

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But I did see a streamer with a gold one and it couldā€™ve looked a bit cooler

minor lintel
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Yeah gold also doesn't look good imo

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silver looks better

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I proposed them just giving the early prestige MP7 skin but for all weapons for 10k

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eh it just looks muted compared to silver to me

rotund snow
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It looks a bit plastic to me

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Could be moreā€¦ metallic

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But also it will vary per map

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Each map has its own lighting that can make them look a lot better or worse

minor lintel
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Yeah it looks like polished plastic

rotund snow
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I havenā€™t seen gold skin on many maps

minor lintel
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nah, 10k is fine for a cap atm

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maybe 20k for something crazy

rotund snow
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May as well put one higher

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No downside, just diminishing returns

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The picture on the left looks alright

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What mapā€™s that on

minor lintel
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it's just the shading on the gold is too dark

rotund snow
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Tensa does have super flat lighting

minor lintel
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needs to be a lighter gold for shit to pop more

wide topaz
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everyone here thinking they are gonna be playing battlebit in 3+ years still only using the same gun to get a single camo

rotund snow
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I would say itā€™s unlikely Iā€™ll ever play a gun long enough to get any as I will probably drop the game after a while

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But itā€™s possible

wide topaz
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not really.

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simply to much time using a single weapon, to get a single skin

minor lintel
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Some people really like some weapons

rotund snow
minor lintel
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@river echo is at like 17k kills on the P90 KEKW

rotund snow
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And how many people you think deserve it

minor lintel
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If you like the gun enough you'll use it, I wouldn't be at 5k kills if I gave up on using the fucking AK74 pre buff

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I did I because I like the gun despite it's issues

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I would shoot for 10k but it looks awful imo

rotund snow
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It definitely wasnā€™t bad as a gun

minor lintel
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nah but it was hurting in the damage output department

rotund snow
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Itā€™s only changed a little on that front

minor lintel
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enough to not be painful whenever I hit armor anymore unaware

rotund snow
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I think with a long barrel it actually killed slightly faster than it does rn

fresh stump
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5k good nuff šŸ£ . I set my post office there. I refuse to budge from 5k

minor lintel
wide topaz
rotund snow
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Not sure where a year came from

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It is not like everyone must play the game for one year

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Butā€¦ hmm. Iā€™m gonna say I average 3 hours a day gaming. So up to 3 if I distributed my time really well

minor lintel
river echo
fresh stump
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Kill bloat would be even more of an issue then

rotund snow
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I spent like 800 hours on FtD in one year. Same goes for TABG

fresh stump
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If he keeps adding skins, would you want a new player (which keeps the game alive) to have to unlock a 20k kill skin?

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Not a 20 kill skin lmao, 20k

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I'm just talking from an unlock perspective man

minor lintel
rotund snow
minor lintel
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If you want to, it's different

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but you don't have to grind for 20k kills for one weapon

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quite literally no one forcing you to do so

rotund snow
fresh stump
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Bro, 20k kills is just stupid. I'm sorry. That's a time sync a new player will look at and just go "eh fuck that"

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The game needs to expand beyond kill requirements for unlocks plainly

rotund snow
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Tons of games have stretch goals

fresh stump
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Look, if you want to spend 80 hours per gun unlocking all the skins, be my guest man

minor lintel
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I will if I like the gun enough

fresh stump
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The option can both be nice, and unreasonable at the same time yo

rotund snow
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If itā€™s an option it doesnā€™t matter how reasonable it is for you

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Since you can ignore it

wide topaz
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the option to put 70+ hours on average for one gun?

fresh stump
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Like, I think it'd be cool to have a 4000 hour skin for like a player name plate or something

wide topaz
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yeah that's still fucking stupid

rotund snow
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You can get 20k kills on a gun with or without getting a reward for it

fresh stump
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Like that's cool, that rewards just playing the game

wide topaz
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especailly since its only that skin

rotund snow
minor lintel
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For the one gun you like using, nah it isnt lol

fresh stump
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having to get 20k kills for one gun, only that gun, and you couldn't even use it on other shit. Fuck that man

minor lintel
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I was enjoying the grind on my AK until the attachment rework

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and enjoyed it after it got buffed

rotund snow
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Itā€™s a milestone either way

fresh stump
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People are different, people tolerate differnt things, and "lol I like it so it's fine" doesn't make the kill count requirement any less ridiculous for anyone, even if you do like it and don't mind it

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Because you probs wouldn't care if it was 40k kills at the end of the day

minor lintel
rotund snow
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I wouldnā€™t care if it was any number, unless it went on for so absurdly long it was wasting dev time making the skins lol

minor lintel
fresh stump
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Is it a waste of dev time if 6 years later there are 60k kills worth of skins to unlock?

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At what point does it become a bit silly

rotund snow
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Not at 3 shiny skins, Iā€™ll tell you that.

minor lintel
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this is block shooter game

ashen rain
fresh stump
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tbh it'd be kind of based to add 10k worth of skins per year

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a good joke

minor lintel
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this game is goofy as all hell already

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you literally have "fuck you" sights

fresh stump
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Idk man, at some point I'd just see "get 60k kills for this skin" and figure "oh, the game totally doesn't intend for me to ever unlock that" as a new player coming in. It's just unreasonable and only serves to keep old players happy at that point tbh.

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If you wouldn't care, why do you care if it's lower

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if you don't care how high it goes, you shouldn't care how low it goes

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Because by your logic, 50k kills is a show of skill and dedication

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so shouldn't it be as high as possible?

ashen rain
minor lintel
ashen rain
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Itā€™s less of an achievement then

minor lintel
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Right like if I put the time onto the G36C for instance, and got 10k kills and put it down only for a cool ass 20k skin to come out after EA id be locked the fuck back in.

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because it's a goal I set for myself to hit

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and the devs are giving me another goalpost to hit that represents that milestone

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that actually takes time and dedication.

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and >>> IS ENTIRELY OPTIONAL <<<

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Just sounds cool, but it's really just a commitment skin

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"Oh you've used this gun extensively, here's a cool skin or some shit"

rotund snow
fresh stump
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Why should a game ask for 40-80 hours of gameplay to earn cool stuff for one weapon? Why should all the cool stuff be put at the end of a track? Would all the cool stuff past 10k need to be even cooler?

I think kill rewards are limiting. 5k kill mastery reward with other rewards sprinkled in with challenges would be perfect. General challenges could be extended later, more things added for more prestige levels. So you're not asking players to grind another 40-80 hours every time a new skin drops, and not bombarding new players with brand new content they will most likely NEVER get.

rotund snow
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Because itā€™s a stretch goal

fresh stump
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Anything past 5k is excessive and is diminishing rewards imo

rotund snow
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It isnā€™t asking, itā€™s giving you something for your efforts

fresh stump
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It is asking, you have to kill peeps with one weapon to get the skin. If you want the skin the game is asking you to do it.

minor lintel
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Yeah this is a WANT situation, not a need.

fresh stump
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This is under the assumption you want the skin

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this entire discussion is about wanting skins

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this is not about attachments

ashen rain
rotund snow
minor lintel
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then you need to get out there and go stop out some players if you really want the skin

rotund snow
fresh stump
minor lintel
fresh stump
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Yee, it'd be more naturally to throw in more skins to prestiege I think so you naturally earn this stuff rather than you having to only use one gun, which may potentially be on one class

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like snipers

minor lintel
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so if I already have 5k kills but the other skins require prestige 8 and i'm at 3

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what do?

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because now I have to power level

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which isn't at all fun lol

fresh stump
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Swap guns, keep leveling

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If you only want to use 1 gun ever for all 8 prestiges I guess that's fine, but that seems unrealistic

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You're going to be swapping to vehicles, sniper, support, etc at some point I think

minor lintel
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but now you've added a higher stipuation to use that skin

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which is worse

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because I've already done the kills

fresh stump
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Leveling up isn't nearly the same as leveling up just ONE gun with ONLY kills

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there are way more methods to speed it up

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and ideally, the gap wouldn't be from 3 to 8

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it's be 3 to 4, then to 5

minor lintel
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why am I being blocked off behind 1,000 levels

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but you get my point

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if I hit it early

fresh stump
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you're blocked off by 200 šŸ¤“

minor lintel
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I now have to wait for next prestiege to use my new skin I grinded for

fresh stump
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Most people prestige long before reaching the mastery on a gun currently.

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No, you level for everything

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You literally level by just playing

rotund snow
fresh stump
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I'm saying if you wanted to

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you can't speed up kills with one gun bruh

minor lintel
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Yes you can lol

fresh stump
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???

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How? Playing better?

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farming?

rotund snow
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I donā€™t know what they mean here either

fresh stump
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Ah, so you want to farm kills on game modes

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so you're forced to do that

rotund snow
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Changing how you play the game to get a skin is weird imo.

fresh stump
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And that's what peeps would do if the kill requirements were at 80k

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they would jump into invasion, sit back, and farm kills

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and probably have their eyes glazing over

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Leveling up player level is much more free form

minor lintel
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and they're not gated behind levels to unlock that

fresh stump
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They're gated behind kills which are slower guys

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like plz

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You could level up to prestige in a week if you really tried

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some peeps are like prestige 8 and don't have a mastery skin

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I can't spell prestige to save my life bro

minor lintel
fresh stump
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All both of you are saying is "you can do that" "you're allowed to do that" "it's ok if you do that"

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Like yes, I can grind for 90k kills and I'm allowed to do that

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Yes I can crush my balls

minor lintel
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see how those both have the same qualification of doing a thing better but one has less of a barrier like actually gaining enough XP to level within a decent timeframe?

fresh stump
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Yes I can power level myself for a prestige rank

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No one is arguing there shouldn't be a reward. I'm arguing the reward should be reasonable to get

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No rewards are being taken here

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Asking for kill counts to be lowered currently to 5k is not taking away anything

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Asking for there not to be a 100k kill requirement for skins 8 years from now is not unreasonable

rotund snow
minor lintel
fresh stump
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It's not actually hard bro, it's a time investment.

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It's not like a challenge skill wise or anything

minor lintel
rotund snow
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Itā€™s only an investment if you pay something into it

fresh stump
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Here's realistically what'll happen

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if there are 80k kill requirements

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8 years from now

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There will be a server that's open for kill farming as efficiently as possible

minor lintel
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they already exist

fresh stump
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so you can just bang out the kill requirements in like a week

minor lintel
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fast respawn servers are literally that

fresh stump
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Exactly, so why have it so high

rotund snow
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Kinda already is since thatā€™s how the most meta players like to play. They donā€™t do it for the skins per se, they just like lots of kills

fresh stump
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Ah yes, I'd love to earn a cool skin that I think would be neat to have by grinding kills for 40 hours in a server

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Like, do you not see how from a game design perspective that's just a bit silly

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and only rewards .1% of players

rotund snow
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Not really. I think itā€™s a strange concept that the existence of a goal means it must be strived for

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Most of the games I play I would never bother trying to get all the achievements for example if I didnā€™t think Iā€™d have fun doing it. And it doesnā€™t bother me at all that I wonā€™t get them

minor lintel
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yep

fresh stump
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Goals are meant to be reasonable, fun, and rewarding. Current kill counts are barely reasonable for single guns, arguably fun, and are at least rewarding. What this post is asking for is for the reasonability to be more in line with other games (which I agree should be the case). What I'm saying about the future is kill requirements shouldn't be so fucking high that reasonability is essentially out the window.

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I shouldn't have to potentially play a game for over 2 years worth of time for 1 gunskin

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only 1 gunskin

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for 1 gun

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just 1

rotund snow
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Stretch goals on the other hand

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Are just there in case people want to do them

fresh stump
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stretch goals are aok

rotund snow
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Even if thatā€™s only a very small amount

fresh stump
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kill goals are not stretch goals, they are kill goals

minor lintel
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that you get over time

rotund snow
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A stretch goal to me just means one the vast majority of players simply wonā€™t be able to conveniently achieve.

fresh stump
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not necessarily actuallly

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you do not get kills passively

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you have to actively use a gun

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if you use one gun, no problem it's passive

rotund snow
fresh stump
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if you play any other class that doesn't have that gun, it is no longer passive

rotund snow
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You donā€™t have to grind kills on one gun at once

minor lintel
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^

fresh stump
rotund snow
fresh stump
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it takes 4000 hours (estimate by someone, please someone correct me if this is made up af) for every gun in the game

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it takes 2x the time each time you swap guns

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I mean like for doing at once

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assume it takes 40 hours now (someone said it was like 77, no idea) for a single gun

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now you're doing 2

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it's now 80

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now you're doing 3

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add on another 40, it's 120

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do you see my point here

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and, and

rotund snow
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And each time you get proportionally more gold skins.

fresh stump
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if you max out a gun

rotund snow
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Same time/skin

fresh stump
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you're no longer getting shit

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meaning, none of your time is going to anything

rotund snow
minor lintel
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so you're saying you need a attainable reward to enjoy a game?

fresh stump
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so the solution is to just slap on MORE skins for every gun?

minor lintel
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like what?

rotund snow
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If you didnā€™t find that fun I canā€™t imagine youā€™d be trying to get those skins

fresh stump
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It's just a nice thing to go for and to try for

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people play games for differnet reasons at different times

minor lintel
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I play the game for hours and hours because it's fun to me, and the skins are a side thing I can do for that if wanted

fresh stump
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you WILL get bored of your gun

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you WILL get bored of the game at some point and not play for months

rotund snow
fresh stump
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Like, idk how to drill this in any further guys

rotund snow
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Many people already have them

fresh stump
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4000 hours is over a year of game time in game

rotund snow
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And those people mostly did it without even trying as of now

fresh stump
minor lintel
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and a good few of them have been playing the game less than I have hour wise lol

rotund snow
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Wasnā€™t unreasonable for them, it was effectively automatic

rotund snow
fresh stump
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Someone said some of the top peeps on the leaderboards only have like one gold gun max but have insane amounts of kills, so I've heard different but I'd need actual data at this point tbh

minor lintel
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yeah it was just them chilling and grinding out 120+ kill games or such

rotund snow
fresh stump
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That isn't an achievement man, gun mastery skins should be a combination of time and actual challenges. Not just kills, but kills can be a nice reward as well for 5k

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Well, it's an achievement in dedication I should say

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shouldn't say it's literally nothing

rotund snow
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I am just saying for some people it took zero extra effort at all for the skins, so I canā€™t really see it as unreasonable

fresh stump
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who are some people

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who

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Do you have a gold skin? How long have you been playing?

minor lintel
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@river echo lol, has literally had enough kills prior to the update

fresh stump
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how long did it take to get it lol

rotund snow
fresh stump
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Nice, that's ridiculous

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285 hours for one mastery skin is crazy

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Like insane

minor lintel
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I'd have the AK74 gold by now If I had waited for prestiege rework

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^

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Yeah i've also used other guns

fresh stump
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I don't think the point is coming through

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You should've had it by 285 hours if it's your main gun

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well, I will give this though. XP changes and all that

minor lintel
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You're speaking on it from a completionist standpoint when it's not set up that way at this current time

fresh stump
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I'm not arguing about this from a completionist perspective

minor lintel
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you ARE NOT MEANT to get all the guns to 10k

rotund snow
fresh stump
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I'm arguing about this from the perspective of I will NEVER get 10k kills because that's insane lmao

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unless I go grind for it

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in a server made for it

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5k, I could see myself getting that and putting in work specifically for that

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and not grinding for it in a server

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I only have 155ish hours for context

minor lintel
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I had like 2500 before I knew that the fast respawn servers were even a thing lol

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by just playing regular ass servers

fresh stump
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I like to swap weapons a lot, I play different classes a lot

minor lintel
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SAME

fresh stump
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Just one gun

minor lintel
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I swap weapons all the fucking time dude lol

fresh stump
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I could see myself grinding 5k, that sounds reasonable

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I don't have the highest K/D or anything, my favorite gun is the ak5c tbh so I barely get to use it šŸ˜­

minor lintel
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You do not have to laser focus to grind weapons out

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doing that fucks your mental

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it's long term

fresh stump
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It's too long term

minor lintel
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it's genuinely not that long term

neon orbit
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I mean I've went from 300 kills on the Val 2 days ago to 2100 rn

minor lintel
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I'll literally be going for AS Val gold once I finish the G36C (hopfully gold will look better by that time)

neon orbit
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It's not that hard

neon orbit
fresh stump
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I said 40 hours earlier, some peeps estimate it at like 70. Doing 70 hours (in game, not searching, etc) of kill work sounds like a nightmare per-gun if you wanted to get gold.

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It's not that it's hard bruh

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it's just a time sync

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5k is still a while

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8 k would also be better

neon orbit
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But it goes 2.5k to 5k to 10k

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That works

minor lintel
fresh stump
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Do you guys only play this game?

minor lintel
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and that was in like a few days of playing against cateat players mind you

fresh stump
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Actual question

minor lintel
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NOPE

neon orbit
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I study computer science

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So no

minor lintel
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I also work at a data center for majority of the week

fresh stump
neon orbit
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Yeah as a first year who has to be in every day

fresh stump
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that's a joke btw

minor lintel
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also play other games too

neon orbit
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I was gonna say

minor lintel
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so like nah, the "no life" excuse doesn't really apply here lol

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It's about how time is used, not how much of it

ashen rain
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I mean, I get 50+ kills per game on a good day, and I play 4 or 5 games

minor lintel
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I get like 80-90 average just chillin with soundcloud in the background or a long ass youtube video

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Gameplay is fun and I like to pass the time

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like that's kinda it KEKW

ashen rain
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Lofi beats to shoot humans and relax to

minor lintel
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and some days i'll only do like 5-6 matches, other days when I don't have shit to do and don't feel like playing anything else i'll boot up BBR for most of the day and do chores

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Ain't like I HAVE to, I want to.

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Will I reach 10k kills on the AK74? Yeah, but I'm not gonna burn myself out over it

neon orbit
#

Yeah trying to go for gold with the mindset you HAVE to get it and thats the only reason to play would just burn you out

#

I'm using the AS Val because it's fun and I'd like it to be my first gold, I'm in no hurry though

fresh stump
#

question

#

pistols

#

they're also at 10k

minor lintel
#

reduce them

fresh stump
#

Why

minor lintel
#

there's literally no way to increase reserve mag capacity

#

outside of engi i think

fresh stump
#

Huh?

#

oh you mean like how many pistol mags you have, was confused lol

minor lintel
#

yeah sorry lol

#

yeah, you get like 3-4 at MOST

fresh stump
#

Well, I don't see why that would be a good reason for it

#

If someone wants 10k kills with the pistol, they can just get it with time and effort ofc

#

might take a little longer ofc

#

may not be fun

minor lintel
#

Plus I believe Oki has said they're not meant to really be primary weapons

minor lintel
fresh stump
#

Fair lol. But I mean

#

you can see how the argument extends to pistols as well

minor lintel
#

But that's a difference in methods to get ammo for them

fresh stump
#

Why should we lower pistol's 10k kill requirement, "it's annoying"

#

"I can't kill as easy"

minor lintel
#

I can just play assault and run smal boxes and ranger mags

fresh stump
#

"I have to farm"

minor lintel
#

and by the time I run out of both I probably have like 20 kills before I die

fresh stump
#

Nice, tbh I can't get many kills with the pistols

dense junco
#

if there was a secondary only OCS that would be cool

fresh stump
#

I'm a usp stan, I'll probs get the 10k with it before my ars lol

minor lintel
#

Pistols it's more like 10-15 if you're really accurate

#

MAYBE

fresh stump
#

Deagle would probs be the easiest one to get that many with. Then again, I haven't used it since the nerf since the usp became usable šŸ™

#

I want that suppressor šŸ˜­

#

But I digress, my point is everything you guys are saying applies directly to the pistol kill counts to tbh

minor lintel
#

Like if we get a ammo belt for pistols that gives like 4 extra mags i'm doing gold RSH in a heartbeat

minor lintel
#

not pistols

fresh stump
#

So?

#

It's a time investment, an achievement

#

why should it be shorter

minor lintel
#

Pistols aren't usually balanced around full HP engagements short for a few just for usability sake

fresh stump
#

I'm not trying to gatcha here, I'm legit just trying to stan your argument but for pistols

minor lintel
#

I understand

fresh stump
minor lintel
#

but i'm saying they're not the same because of what they're used for is all

stray goblet
#

Pistols arent made for primary use, so by definition you're going to use them waaay less

minor lintel
#

Yeah, If they gave belts more mags for pistols i'd be ok with 10k

#

rn you don't really get much

fresh stump
#

I don't think arguing that you use them less is a good argument because you can just choose to use them more, just like you can choose to use only one gun

#

and similarly, you can choose to only use one pistol

minor lintel
#

and unless you're support or assault, it's gonna not be a great time

#

even then you have to take time to fill them back up more than you'll likely be killing anyone with them at full HP

fresh stump
#

I don't think that matters, you can just call a supply drop for one, but besides that everything you guys are saying for the other guns - including snipers which tend to need to refill more as well - is stuff like "it's fun to go for for me, not everyone needs to get the skins, I should be rewarded for the time I put in".

#

Just because the gun is hard to use doesn't mean it should be lowered from 10k

#

some guns are just bad on the primary side too

#

well bad might be strong wording, but you get me

minor lintel
#

Snipers don't have to roam as hard in all honestly if you have a good spot

fresh stump
#

Yee, was just saying for the ammo bit

minor lintel
#

Hell Ive gone on 20 headshot kill streaks before needing to go refil, plus they have ranger vest too mind you

fresh stump
#

Technically lmgs don't get very many backup mags šŸ˜‚ . That doesn't count thouth

minor lintel
#

Pretty much

fresh stump
#

The sledgehammer skin requirement is also really stupid imo

#

For the same reasons as the pistol skin, but like way worse

#

But if we're arguing that people put in the time, then it really doesn't matter what the requirements are

#

if one guy out of the 8billion people on the earth will do it, it's fine right

minor lintel
#

I might just for the sake of the gold deagle or RSH

#

ah ok

fresh stump
#

I do admit it's a tiny bit cool, I certainly never would do it too lol

#

I think it's cool they did it don't get me wrong

#

I do not think y'all are stupid or lame for going for 10k kills

minor lintel
fresh stump
#

Except Meizu, he's a dumb dumb

minor lintel
#

and doesn't drop mags

#

or forget to pick them up

fresh stump
#

hot tip, if you drop a mag you can just pick it up while reloading. It's always faster than tacticool reload

minor lintel
#

Ye I know

#

I'm just saying in some situations you have to bail

fresh stump
#

I've made a stink about that being the case, it kind of removes the point if you can pick up a mag while reloading šŸ˜‚

minor lintel
#

but yeah nah i'd have more of a bitch fit if ranger armor didn't exist

fresh stump
#

Like, I still hold to reload because I'm lazy on the move, but that's the only time I hold to reload really.

minor lintel
#

just give us a pistol equivalant and we ball

fresh stump
#

I digress about the reloading and ammo capacity though. Point is you can't really argue for those (pistols, sledge) to be lowered if your only reason for not lowering the primary kill counts is "eh, it's a goal to go for so why not"

#

I'd argue the sledge is kind of fine because it's just a meme. It'd be way better if we had a melee slot (please go vote up that suggestion)

minor lintel
#

Which is why they should add a belt that gives extra reserves

fresh stump
#

I mean I'd grind it out without the reserves personally if I wanted it

#

the reserves don't bother me personally at all actually

minor lintel
#

idk if you're aware, but ranger gives you a SHIT ton of mags

fresh stump
#

155 hours my bruv, I know lol

minor lintel
#

Ok lol

fresh stump
#

I ran light medic outta choice

#

Going fast was my passion šŸ˜­

#

Now I can only go kind of fast

#

At least running engineer is faster šŸ˜Ž

minor lintel
fresh stump
#

I really want recon to get smgs so I can go EVEN faster.

The heavy secondaries in general are just a little wack atm

#

they went from one tap headshot machines (deagle) to what they are now

minor lintel
#

deagle still one taps no?

#

just not on exo

fresh stump
#

Which is reasonable, the deagle was insane before, but I wish they were a little more OMPH. Yea it does

#

But it doesn't do it as gooood

minor lintel
#

Eh I still think the draw speed can be buffed, but it's fine

fresh stump
#

Although, like I said, I've been a usp stan since the secondaries update. So I'm just speaking off barely any usage of the deagle

#

Someone should start a pistols server so I can upgrade it more

#

I do wanna grind out the last suppressor for it

#

to TLDR about my last point though, you guys are arguing that things shouldn't be lowered because "it's a goal for funzies" essentially. And I was saying you can make that argument for pistols and such too. Pistols and the sledge being less capable doesn't really matter if the goal is just for funzies. Why should it be lowered at all? Because it's tedius? Because it's boring? Because it's annoying?

That's personally how I find the kill counts right now for all weapon skins and why I think lowering them a bit more would be good. 10k is a lot, I think 5-7 k would be more reasonable per weapon. I think that'd cut down on the time massively. 5k seems perfect to me tbh. since it cuts the 3500 hour (which is almost half a year's worth of time bruh) time sync down to a mildly more reasonable 1,750 (still a lot, but it's a compromise) hours to earn the skins for all the guns. Keep in mind MORE guns are going to be added and MORE skins too (all twitch drops ofc), so that number will get even more bloated as time goes on.

I think BBR should shoot for quality over quantity with the skin and progression rewards. Not bloat it with a bunch of the same patterns over and over with different colors. It'd be more rewarding to unlock the mastery skin as well if every skin unlock felt like a new piece of player expression being unlocked.

#

lowering the kill counts of the primarys to around 4-6k for all the base skins would be good. Supplement that with challenges and suddenly you have an even more rewarding system for mastery skin unlocks

#

You could have something for mastery skins like:

  • Bronze = all attachments and 1k kills
  • Silver = all challenges and 3k kills
  • Gold = everything unlocked for the gun (skins included) + all challenges beaten + 5k kills
#

Point is, there's room for expansion beyond kill counts and they shouldn't be the only factor. With 10k being the only mastery marker right now, challenges added later would increase the time to get shit who knows how much depending on how Oki's monkey's paw touches the skin system in the future

#

actual TLDR: I'm lazy and I don't wanna get 10k kills bruh plz

#

Oh, and pistols should be lower than 5k,. Don't know if I sad that, my TLDR didn't cover it. I agree on that for sure lol

#

I'd love to have materials and such as well

#

My ticket system post (which I will not link this time) is mainly where my elaboration on challenges and such comes from

#

I want some gears of war 3 style skins yo

#

moving parts, cool patterns

#

Look up gears of war 3 gun skins bruh, and gears 5 skins

#

they're šŸ”„ šŸ”„ šŸ”„

#

Gears 3 is actually a great example of progression for unlocks that can take a good long time, but isn't tedius and boring like a simple "get 10k kills"

#

you actually get badges for most everything you're doing. So if you DO get 10k kills you can display it proudly to everyone at ALL times

#

I think a similar system would be pretty sick in BBR

fresh stump
#

I'm going straight to the presidency at this rate

near onyx
fresh stump
#

My "add a kick button" post was unloved unfortunately

near onyx
stray goblet
near onyx
#

Not gonna lie I almost spit out my drink when I came back in only a few hours to see like 400 more comments šŸ’€

fresh stump
near onyx
fresh stump
#

like for kicking people

#

like painfully

near onyx
# fresh stump no like literally a kick

Oh wow I had to double take that! Like with your legs lol! If they add that I would kind of miss all the funny awkward moments that happen in this game because of no melee

fresh stump
#

It's mostly for booting people off things šŸ˜Ž

woeful acorn
#

Tbh 10k for max camo is whatever but 10k for current gold is hella meh

surreal minnow
#

and a rainbow rgb gamer skin at 100k

oblique oak
#

i can see all the rainbow mp7s already ahaha

#

I think 5k is better for gold and much more attainable for the avg player. Make 10k something else? for the real grinders

ashen dagger
#

It shouldnt be attainable for the average player. Thats what bronze and silver are there for.

wide topaz
#

you still an idiot if you think that lol

ashen dagger
#

Why are you calling me an idiot out of nowhere?

#

Theres no reason to attack me like this, I havent done anything to you

fresh stump
#

I think balancing things as "shouldn't be obtainable" is a bad mindset. I think "would be obtained" is a better framing

#

I'm just nitpicking tho

#

I think balancing things based on time investment isn't great for a game either necessarily. It's great if everything you do contributes towards that thing

#

But like, getting kills with one gun isn't the best time investment. I do agree they should be challenging though

#

I've said my points plenty though, so I should dip outta this convo and let others talk lol

ashen dagger
#

How do you propose we balance skins around skill?

wide topaz
ashen dagger
#

So why call me an idiot?

#

Just because i disagree with you

wide topaz
#

no, just because this opinion is simply idiotic

ashen dagger
#

Can you stop attacking me and instead engage with my argument?

wide topaz
#

your argument is "skins must be deserved"

#

mf pulling a "feel pride and accomplishment" argument

#

and expects people to like it

ashen dagger
#

I expect you to not attack and insult me out of nowhere because you dont like my argument.

wide topaz
#

my man, your just pulling that EA bullshit response, and say "it's my argument"

ashen dagger
# wide topaz mf pulling a "feel pride and accomplishment" argument

As for this message, YES. The problem with battlefrontā€™s ā€œPride and accomplishmentā€ thing was because they were SELLING unlocks that effected the game and gating them behind a huge grind. If they werent selling them and they didnt actually impact the game, nobody would have had as big of an issue with that statement.

wide topaz
#

they still did

#

even after it was long made free

#

because that grind never changed lol

ashen dagger
#

To say that unlocks are bad because ā€œits basically just the pride and accomplishment argumentā€ is very silly

wide topaz
#

people don't like seeing that they got to play over a year to get things they want, especially since its a massive time frame

ashen dagger
#

Good thing it wont take a good player over a year to unlock anything in bbr

wide topaz
#

for this? it would lol

#

unless you got total free time of 12+ hours a day its gonna take you a month to get one gun, dedicated to that one thing

#

more if you only got an hour or 2

#

and thats playing at top player levels or above

#

for a single gun

ashen dagger
#

Why does it have to be accessible to bad players? Why do they HAVE to have access to a skin that is meant to provide a grind for players that have already completed what the game has to offer and want to play more?

past prairie
#

Patrician taste

ashen dagger
#

Like everything in this discord, youre taking from a good playerā€™s experience to just give things to bad players, for what?

wide topaz
ashen dagger
#

I do.

wide topaz
#

he's gonna see that its not gonna take a couple weeks to get on his main gun, and not give a rats ass beyond that

ashen dagger
#

Pretty sure snoozn is trying to get the scorpion skin (not his main gun) and mocrox was thinking about going for all skins. Just two examples off the top of my head.

#

Also I want something to grind for. Making the gold skins easier to get just takes away from that.

wide topaz
#

yeah, trying to get and thinking about going for all of them

#

they ain't gonan give a fuck if its lowered and/or based on how many kills the guns get

#

there's a point between "everyone has it" and "only the people with nothing going on or getting paid can get it"

ashen dagger
#

Why are you trying to speak for them? How the hell do you know what they think?

wide topaz
#

all you got is a sentence

ashen dagger
#

Youre the type of guy to play osrs then complain about the grind lmao. Ask jagex to lower the max level

wide topaz
#

yes because I hate the grind, totally

#

there is a grind

#

and then there's "you got 12 hours free a day, you might get it done in a week"

ashen dagger
#

Not that hard to understand

wide topaz
#

everyone enjoys it when it starts bud

#

but when you are in hour 200 and you are on gun 3 of 47 and counting

#

not so much

ashen dagger
#

Its fine if you dont like to grind, but you should whine about it to get it taken away from other players.

wide topaz
#

my man I want a grind, but not 1k hour minimum guaranteed grind

ashen dagger
#

Then grind the silver or bronze skins

#

seems simple enough to me

wide topaz
#

and this is why your argument is idiotic

#

its either "why take away from what people deserve"

ashen dagger
#

Atleast you didnt call me an idiot this time

wide topaz
#

and then you flip and say "just don't grind for it"

ashen dagger
#

Theres no contradiction here.

wide topaz
#

the guns need to have mastery skin based on its average kills.

#

pistols being at 10k is a joke

#

snipers underperform the average by 50 kills, dmrs by about 20 give or take

#

by putting everything at 10k, it's just a massive bloat of frustration.

ashen dagger
#

I never said that shouldnt be the caseā€¦

wide topaz
#

you actively spoke out against that very thing in this thread

#

the OP even said the numbers were up to interpretation based on average kills per hour with the weapon/weapon class

#

I like a grind, but its the fact that its 10k for every single weapon that we have a problem with

ashen dagger
#

In fact im quite sure i explicitly said the opposite.

wide topaz
#

....

fresh stump
#

Honestly I haven't read anything and I believe it's probably your fault devil lol

wide topaz
#

you constantly told Sbeve that wanting to lower the grind at all was stupid and taking away from good players

#

actually no that wasn't you

#

you just said taking away from good players over and over

ashen dagger
#

I actually had a conversation a while ago in this thread where we were talking about how sniper kill requirements should be scaled based on good sniperā€™s kpm

fresh stump
#

That sounds horrible somehow, and I'm not sure why

#

For me, I basically want all the stuff in my ticket post to be a thing

#

It'd make everyone happy I think imo

rotund snow
#

I see no downside.

ashen rain
#

All for it!

wide topaz
#

some guns maybe, classes are small enough currently that it could be class based. Personally I think it would be better based on kill averages per weapon. More rewards sure, but for 10k+ they would have to be significant since a kill quota is not a measure of skill just time.

wide topaz
#

just gold is very meh, especially since its for 1 gun. but its just more that its 10k for every gun and gun type, just for one skin per gun. I wouldn't say no to other rewards for getting that many kills, but that not really the problem. most people put 500 hours into a game a year, some close to 1k, expecting that much time (at unreasonable kill rates for many of the weapon types) to get a couple guns that you deem your favorite is just crazy. some guns like the more meta/popular guns can likely stay at or close to 10k, but others need to be tweaked to their kill potential.

surreal minnow
#

Have you guys been arguing since last night?

wide topaz
#

what do you mean forced over?

surreal minnow
#

XD yā€™all have fun

wide topaz
#

thats a bit of a stretch

#

Like I said I prefer each gun is based on the average it gets

rotund snow
#

Shouldnā€™t be based on how itā€™s considered. Oki will have the actual data

wide topaz
#

if that is a problem, why have them at 10k in general?

rotund snow
#

And rightfully so

#

Because that means people are doing better with them

#

To be clear, I would say data on the guns should be stratified by player experience

#

To reduce bias for guns being more used by better players

wide topaz
#

as long as a true average is pulled I doubt people would be penalized nearly as much as you would think.

#

and some guns being as high as they are now, even if I hope they drop, wont be terrible. not great, but not terrible.

#

oki should also do some math with the average player kills in an hour

#

see how that effects things

#

If oki had data for the average player kills per hour, that would change alot of arguments

#

Like I said my 60 hours per gun minimum was done with 300 kills an hour with that weapon

#

so finding how many kills players get on average in an hour, in general, would be a starting point

#

then refine it by weapon from that

#

technically it should be player, class, weapon for a proper stat, but I don't know how involved his data is, especially with the recent class changes

stray goblet
#

change everything to 1 kill

fresh stump
#

Honestly that's better even if it's functionally the same

#

I still think it's too high, but for some reason that feels more acceptable if there's 4 mastery levels

real frost
#

The kills im fine with its the prestiging cause prestige is awful and causes alot of suffering

minor lintel
#

yeah I think gold being at 10k is kinda not it still

#

First reason being it doesn't look great, second reason being that usually gold is your FIRST skin you unlock for progression nowadays

stray goblet
#

but what about the sense of pride and accomplishment PepeHands

minor lintel
#

get rid of whatever the 2.5k skin is supposed to be because it's ass

#

put gold there instead

#

give the early prestiege skin to all the weapons and make that the 10k skin

#

ez pz

#

well it isn't ass, but whatever that skin is supposed to be is basically identical to the silver at 5k

#

Like you'd be hard pressed to tell a difference in most lighting

fresh stump
#

Don't get me wrong, I still personally think it's too long for it imo. But having 4 mastery tiers at least makes it chunked up more. It doesn't solve the actual problem, but it makes the pill easier to swallow

minor lintel
#

ye, gold and diamond skins are usually the most saught after and more "grounded" in regards to games like this

fresh stump
#

šŸ’€

minor lintel
#

hence why they're usually early in CoD games and later unlocks like orion are insane looking and not as appealing for a lot of people

#

so if they put those at like 5k or even add 7.5k respectively and then whatever else above that people probably wouldn't care a lot

stray goblet
#

name it Pride and Accomplishment

worldly swan
minor lintel
stray goblet
minor lintel
#

so if you wanted just the basic ones, you still need to go for P5

stray goblet
#

I'm on p2

real frost
stray goblet
#

the ONLY annoyance I have is having to recustomize armor and weapons

minor lintel
#

Yeah I would like that to not happen

worldly swan
#

skins mean nothing. You will die more with colorful puke.

stray goblet
worldly swan
#

I forgo toliet

minor lintel
worldly swan
minor lintel
#

AY

stray goblet
worldly swan
#

me when I dodge your bullets
šŸŸ

stray goblet
#

šŸ”

worldly swan
#

add fishing minigame bc I be catchin kills

#

šŸ 

stray goblet
#

Call me 2k

minor lintel
stray goblet
#

cuz I 2k my balls

worldly swan
stray goblet
#

cant move your mouse if you kill me

worldly swan
#

šŸ¦ˆ

worldly swan
minor lintel
worldly swan
minor lintel
stray goblet
#

take that back Gorbino

worldly swan
stray goblet
minor lintel
#

But back on topic, nah them being behind prestiege is kinda lame i'm gonna be fair

#

I'd feel like garbage as a new player if I wanted a patten that's like prestiege 5

stray goblet
#

I will use the riot shield when we get skins for it that you acquire by killing people with it

minor lintel
#

just cap them out at like 200

echo barn
#

Riot shield could use a simple shield bash

#

Doesnt even need to onetap

#

What this man is saying. Prestige tokens would make more people want to do it. It would give it a more tangible reward rather than "here's more grind you just unlocked"

main mountain
#

Diagree with thread, its called mastery for a reason

fresh stump
#

I once again want to bring up this argument

#

Pistols

#

Is it ok for pistols to have 10k kills as well because it's "mastery"

#

even if it's annoying, even if you don't use pistols as much, and even if they aren't as strong?

#

If you answered "yes", I hate you, but you're consistent for sure

surreal minnow
#

Yes

fresh stump
#

I hate you, but respect

#

This also applies to the sledge

#

But, point is if you're not ok with the pistols/sledge being that high then you should understand where people may be coming from with the primaries as well

#

But if you don't care and just want it to be 10k then you fine, you won't change no matter the argument tbh lol.

#

I ain't repeating all the arguing in this thread for specifically you meizu, I know better šŸ˜‚

surreal minnow
#

XD 10k is fine

#

Iā€™m prestige 1 at 6k on mp7

fresh stump
#

It's just a question of what you think is reasonable and what you believe is "casual"

#

I personally think 70 hours for a master skin is a bit much

#

especially with like 40 guns in the game

worldly swan
#

grinding for pistol kills is easy just need to spam them

fresh stump
#

These numbers are pulled from OP btw, not pulling them completely out of my ass

stray goblet
#

I have a ancillary question

fresh stump
#

Yea, so no matter what I say it wouldn't convince you

stray goblet
#

Are the current 10k skins worth what you invest to get them?

fresh stump
#

We're just expressing how we don't think it's reasonable for the most part, and you're expressing you think it is

stray goblet
#

I dont think they are worth the amount of kills, and more importantly, the amount of time required

echo barn
#

Let me get an iced out weapon at 10k EZ

fresh stump
#

I'm viewing it as both

#

I think 70 hours on one skin is atrocious on one gun still

echo barn
#

Meizu has a point. It's to flex your main gun you like. But also the argument that even for one gun it's too long is also a good point.

fresh stump
#

You might be the kind of player that doesn't cycle through a lot of guns, that's fine. But by hour 15 I can guarantee I've probably mastered the gun lol. It's not that hard

stray goblet
#

100 hours is something like a month of playtime for the average person, and 2-3 weeks for a hardcore player

#

that is insane

fresh stump
#

I've mentioned possible fixes that I think would be fine

stray goblet
#

there are MMOs that require less hours to get to max level

fresh stump
stray goblet
#

you can learn entire skills in real life for that time

fresh stump
#

10k kills on top of possible gun challenges and stuff in the future as well would be horrid

#

depending on how they're done of course

heady yarrow
#

I learned how to play an electric guitar in like 60 hours E_ šŸ‘

fresh stump
#

I have about 30-40 hours in guitar, and I'm still shit at it I'll admit šŸ˜‚

echo barn
#

So guys. How about this then: make basic colors more accessible while having big-dick unlockables like silver/gold/exotic colors or skins

fresh stump
#

I don't practice well

heady yarrow
#

It takes time, I just play

fresh stump
heady yarrow
#

The only thing thatā€™s stopping me is the noise complain

#

And my momā€™s violence E_ šŸ‘

fresh stump
#

Actually nvm I can't search the thread.

TLDR: Consolidate the skins we currently have, they're bloated. Separate pattern, color, and material unlocks. Let us mix and match as we please with these unlocks. Colors, patterns, or materials could be animated, etc.

stray goblet
#

incredibly excellent suggestion

fresh stump
#

Example: I unlock blue, I can now use blue with every pattern. I unlock a pattern, I can now use it with every blue. I unlock a material, I can now use that with every blue and pattern

stray goblet
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wow 10k kills is totally reasonable

image.png
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its not like the average player will have even less kills than I do

fresh stump
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OH

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and reminder

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it's 70 hours of playing WITH THAT GUN

stray goblet
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yes

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ONLY

fresh stump
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not like with the game open, or playing it in general

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or loading screens

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etc

stray goblet
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no C4, no nade kills, no swapping to pistol to finish someone off

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just that gun

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that isnt just insane, thats preposterous

fresh stump
#

I think even for the more hardcore peeps like MarsanX lowering it to 8k would be more respectable

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I think 5k is perfect, but 8k would at least keep it more "hard"

stray goblet
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I'm fine with people keeping it even at 10k, but give me something worth 1k kills on a weapon FFS

surreal minnow
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10k sounds nice

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So keep it 10k

fresh stump
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10k does sound nice true, can't dispute that

stray goblet
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Keep it only for Dezda at 10k

fresh stump
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Lmao, I'm ass at the game

image.png
surreal minnow
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10k isnā€™t impossible and itā€™s a MASTERY skin for masters of that gun

stray goblet
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me when I capslock a nebulous word to emphasize a point that has no standing in the real world

surreal minnow
stray goblet
fresh stump
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It's a 1.35 KD, it's not the worst thing lol

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My w/l is 1.0

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I'm perfectly balanced yo

surreal minnow
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Bare minimum

stray goblet
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sure go ahead I dont give a shit and neither will the dev

fresh stump
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I've only got 530 on the pp2k, I like that one

image.png
heady yarrow
surreal minnow
stray goblet
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I think its stupid as it wastes time to make something no one gives a single fuck about

fresh stump
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But point is, I'm a casual player but I'm pretty loyal to the game. I come back pretty regularly.

@heady yarrow I play support sometimes, so it tanks my KD for sure lol

stray goblet
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but yeah go for it

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I dont care about that, i care about regular skins taking 2k kills to unlock

heady yarrow
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PP2k is also my most killed weapon though I switched to groza since PP doesnā€™t really do range well at all

stray goblet
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the subtext of the argument is that you view these skins as worth the arbitrary numbers assigned to them most likely out of haste and without much thought, which I wholeheartedly disagree with

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the skins are emphatically not worth spending hundreds of hours in a game with a single firearm

fresh stump
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I liked squad leader šŸ˜” . I am a medic gaming stan I'll admit.

image.png
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I'm garbo at recon tho

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and support tbh

stray goblet
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if they were an entirely different model, something actually worth 10000 kills to get, sure, whatever

fresh stump
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To be clear, there's nothing wrong with a reward being at 10k. There's nothing "wrong" with a reward being at 100k. I just think it's kind of like padding in a single player game in a sense. It's just there to be there.

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Even if you added a diamond skin or something I still think it'd be a bit of an issue

stray goblet
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I dont because almost zero people will get it, not out of lack of skill or laziness, but due to the sheer time investment

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you're asking people to devote time to a singular objective that most people will not reach due to simply not being able to stay home and spend 16 hours a day on a game

fresh stump
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TBH that's the reason I don't go for kill rewards, or look at my skin list, or anything like that. I know it takes forever so I just don't bother going for them actively. If I really wanted them I'd just join a kill grind server - which at that point why even have the skins be gated off if I can just earn them by grinding in a server made for them. It's just padding at that point.

stray goblet
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"But I want the skin and my skill with the weapon is statistically better than anyone else" "Oh well you dont have to go after that skin"

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??????????????

fresh stump
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This is kind of like the microtransactions argument for skins being optional

stray goblet
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People keep bringing up the idea of "mastery" as if it somehow excuses banal and arbitrary conditions

stray goblet
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"Oh you dont have to buy anything in the store, it's there for people that want to get it"

surreal minnow
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As I said 10k I achievable

fresh stump
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I mean the diff with microtransactions is they employ a bunch of tricks to make you want to buy it obviously, but you guys get the point

stray goblet
surreal minnow
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I want a rainbow skin

stray goblet
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stop strawmanning, no one is saying there should be no investment or goal to go for, the issue is the distance asked for the reward recieved

fresh stump
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Things should still feel like a reward, it's fun. It's just 10k currently feels more like padding than a reward - to me at least. It's like HAVING to grind in an mmo or rpg. MMO's make the grind a part of the fun, and so do RPGs, but if done poorly it fucking sucks. 10k for the gold skin is it done poorly

stray goblet
fresh stump
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TBH, if the goal is unlocking stuff by calling it a "mastery skin" - implying you've 100% a gun essentially - then 10k will never be ok

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If it's just a plain ol' skin. No requirements, just something you get, I think it's more ok

stray goblet
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Make the Scar H have aftermarket rails, Lancer magazines (the ones that are seethrough) instead of regular ones, different models for scopes or allowing other skins on top of it, different barrel attachment skins, etc etc

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I would say 5k

fresh stump
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I still think it's bloated (as I've said 1000 years ago), which is still a problem, but the framing of it is defo a problem

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5k would be my preffered limit. I think games should end at some point personally. It's satisfying to complete stuff

stray goblet
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Thats approximately 70-100 hours for a dedicated player in my estimation, and far less of a slog than 10k

fresh stump
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Getting the gold skin is literally the length of an AC game, and is technically more repetitive

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You actually do the same thing over and over lol

stray goblet
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the fatigue between 5 and 10 is not linear, the closer to 10k you get the worse it is

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Trust me I've grinded out things for far longer in far worse games

fresh stump
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I know killing people is in different situations, but it's basically the same as a ubisoft AC game if we're comparing apples to oranges here

stray goblet
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WoW, Warframe, GW2, this whole "put a goal at the far end of a field" thing doesnt work

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And the problem with this is?

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You earlier said they'd add more skins

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so that isnt an issue

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stat tracker attachment

fresh stump
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Once again, I'll bring up the pistol argument as well. If you think 10k is fine for primaries because it's "work", "challenging", "rewarding", etc, then the logic should apply to the pistols and sledge as well. If you agree with that - that's fine but you'll literally never agree with us on this (which is ok).

stray goblet
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enjoy the funny number

stray goblet
fresh stump
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I've heard worse šŸ˜”

stray goblet
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I'm going to hurl racial slurs now because someone didnt disagree with me

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šŸ˜ 

fresh stump
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Inertia thread moment

stray goblet
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(for the record this is in fact satirical)

fresh stump
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To be clear, there isn't a 100% problem with 10k skins because it's subjective if it's a problem or not to people

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But, with the votes on this thread, it's clear people are in the minority for keeping it the same

stray goblet
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We are not talking about a skin you acquire by playing the game normally

fresh stump
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So if it'd make the game more fun for more people, why not change it

fresh stump
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But do post it up, it's important to get your thoughts out

stray goblet
fresh stump
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So don't expect to win if that's your goal lol

stray goblet
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I like the AS Val right? I've used it in every game that's had it. I enjoy the idea of a fast firing, high damage per bullet gun with a small mag. In Phantom Forces I got something like 16k kills on it. On Bf4 I got 30k+. If you are using a gun for a reward as the primary incentive, in my mind adding a skin at a far-off goal isnt going to help you. If anything it's going to make you burn out

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Going for a particular goal in mind for such a long time frame is not beneficial in my experience, nor has it been for anyone I know who's grinded for said long-distance goals

fresh stump
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I think "nobody is forcing you to grind it" is a bad argument because no one is forcing you to play the game technically either.

stray goblet
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I was under the impression that you like the gun so you use it because you like it

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You want to be rewarded because you prefer a firearm?

fresh stump
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No one forces you to go to work in the morning technically

stray goblet
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What are YOU on about

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Why in your approximation does someone go for 10k kills on a weapon?

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what are the reasons?

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Personally I see 3: it is a meta firearm, the person enjoys using it, or they are trying to 100% it

fresh stump
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I think how we're thinking of these rewards is fundamentally different as well. You guys are thinking of the rewards as something cool to get. Like challenge for "mastering" the gun. While I personally view it as just some rewards for using a gun. For "just some rewards" I feel that 70 hours is a bit much. 30 hours is perfectly reasonable for mastering a gun, and is 100% still a challenge, still shows your skill, etc.

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Like, 30 hours is a lot still. It's not like you're taking anything away by shortening the time span to get something.

Think about it this way, prestiging.

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Prestiging used to reset literally everything

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We can all agree that's bad, but it made prestiging multiple times a challenge

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Some people did complain when it was changed to not reset guns too, but the game was better for it imo

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Now prestige better respects the players time as a whole, and I think earning mastery skins could be improved that way as well currently. In the future it'd be better to flesh the stuff out with challenges and the like though

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oh, and earning XP used to be ass

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And apparently it used to be EVEN more ass before that

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Speeding things up isn't necessarily a bad thing, or makes the reward worse.

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If you just want to get something to get something, that's fine. But I feel like maybe there are other ways they could reward long time players other than gun skins, which are often seen as collectibles for players.

stray goblet
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I remember that borpanodders, I'm not saying that long term goals are bad, I have a problem with them being the singular logic for time-gating things offs. Because it is a timegate. What if a skin comes out at 10k and I really want it because I simply like the look of the gun with the skin on? I'm supposed to spend the next couple weeks and 100+ matches/hours of game time with that single firearm instead of half that (5 instead of 10k)

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Also respectfully so what if you have 8k on the gun, you were using it because you enjoyed it to begin with, why does the skin existing at 5k for instance, before you got to the number on your gun now, matter

fresh stump
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Oh, other issue

real frost
fresh stump
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Say duke wants the skin, he has to grind out 70 hours to get it right

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A lot of players are like that and will grind the fun out of a game

stray goblet
fresh stump
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It's just kind of a reality tbh

worldly swan
stray goblet
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I personally saw 3 reasons you'd ever get that high up with a given gun

fresh stump
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Players tend to find the best way to ruin the fun of a game for themselves via optimization.

stray goblet
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yeah that's one of the reasons

fresh stump
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I showed my hours earlier, I think I can probably represent the casual BBR player who likes the game a bunch, but doesn't hop on every day.

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Thing is, devs DO control for that. It's basic game design

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You adjust things to get the players to play in a way that is fun, or intended

stray goblet
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You dont give a rope long enough for people to hang themselves with

real frost
# worldly swan you're gonna die alright

I already die alot but thats cause im a fast pace aggressive player i would still like my guns to look nice they way i want without going through the pain of prestige i wish they added perma tokens like CoD does for prestiging

fresh stump
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They can't, but they can control the circumstances the behavior is in

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I can probs find a video about this

stray goblet
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You can laugh all you want, but I dont find the argument provided by Meizu and others compelling for the simple reason that I've seen this before in the MMO scene

worldly swan
fresh stump
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We don't consider Meizu a real human, so that's reasonable

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So a good example is efficiency in MMOs right, given the chance players will do the most efficient thing possible to get to where to go. This could be looking everything up instead of experiencing the game for themselves (we all know someone like this), grinding in the same place for hours instead of doing quests that are laid out for them, or cheesing enemies because the game lets them do it

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it's why balance patches exist

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why games change seemingly arbitrary things

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I'd argue, having it at 10k will make players grind the fun out of BBR and leave due to burnout more often simply because they want a skin for the favorite gun.

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And only for one gun, not for every gun

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once a player burns out from a game, it's hard to get them back I would think

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XP progression used to be so slow it burned people out as well

stray goblet
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I didnt think you were actually, just leaning into it pepeLaugh

stray goblet
fresh stump
stray goblet
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meizu my beloved

fresh stump
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I'd fucking cry if you were lol

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tbh yea I think it's reasonable to never have anything at 10k

stray goblet
fresh stump
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Games run into this issue a good bit though to be fair

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How do we reward long time players who have everything? Issue is, they'll focus on that and not the new players just coming in. Seeing a COLOSSAL wall of skins you unlock over time can be overbearing for some people

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No one is forcing them to do it is a bad argument here, because we all want to do this

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I want to unlock the gold skin

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but I don't want to put in 70 hours because that's stupid

stray goblet
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I want to have sex with women and men

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wait wrong thread

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that goes in inertia my b

fresh stump
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Now, the game can change later on, way later on. Let's say everyone's been playing for 8 years, then maybe the skins can expand out another 5k. But for the moment, in current day, 2023, I think 5k is much more resonable

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game's just startin' out

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Well in my eyes it is, I know it's been around in the background for a bit

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If it started at 10k as well, the expectation would be ANOTHER 10k later

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so it'd actually be better for the devs too imo

stray goblet
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Ok actually I can start seeing maybe not exactly Marsan's point, but something close to it or a variation (dont wanna put words in their mouth if at all possible)

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10k skins currently allows for future proofing

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so that is a genuine argument in favor of them

fresh stump
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I mean I understand marsan's point perfectly, I just don't agree personally.

stray goblet
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if you're just going to add stuff later on, why not keep it as it is currently with regard to the "MASTERY" skins

fresh stump
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yea, padding

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it's padding

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not fun padding, just padding to say there's content

stray goblet
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my apologies for not seeing its value until now, it do be making sense

fresh stump
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My point is, 10k is too much at most any point imo

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even if the game was 8 years older from now, I'd probably have issues with the guns taking 300 hours to 100%

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even if there was triple the content

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If i have to unlock that shit in a linear track, that's a problem lol

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I like unlocking customization, I'm a drip fiend, I just like having it. So seeing shit I know I'll never get simply due to time investment alone is demoralizing and makes me not want to play by proxy. That may seem silly, but it's similar to how every game has a battlepass now. I'll see one and just go "eh, I don't wanna play that game"

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And I know other people are like that with battlepasses, and level up systems are essentially just old battlepasses

stray goblet
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I would say this then:

As of current, the skins offered are far too not worth it for the kills they require, and are far too few in number to justify the 10k for the pinnacle ones.

The 10k are good for future proofing the game, but to avoid burnout along the way, there needs to be far more skins added between 100 and 10k to justify the skin system as a whole.
Streamline the currently available skins, make so we have more customization (iE let us unlock colors and patterns separately, and then mix and match as Lostmixup suggested) and make skins at 10k worth the time and effort their existence asks of the player

fresh stump
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But this isn't even leveling up, it's getting kills, which is EVEN slower

fresh stump
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And I represent a good number of people that are like that I'm sure

stray goblet
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maybe xp earned on the gun might be a better system for most skins other than mastery ones?

fresh stump
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agree to disagree on this though of course, I think it's important everyone's opinion is out there regardless

fresh stump
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Earn XP for having a gun equipped

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XP goes up faster with kills

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But everything you do with the gun equipped would passively level it up as well

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Great compromise actually

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I still think taking 70 hours would be overkill. But cut that time down to like 40 hours (still too much, but I'm compromising personally) with a passive XP system so I'm always earning progress towards a gun's skins if I want to be? That sounds much more appealing to me

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It's not really a "used to have" thing for me personally. I'm the type of gamerā„¢ļø that tends to play a few games at a time. I do tend to have a few I always come back to - especially smaller community indie games like this one. So I imagine I'll be playing the game long enough to eventually get a golden skin. But I'll probably get my first one at like 700 hours on accident

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Nah I gotcha no worries

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I'm just trying to explain my perspective. My pov has exactly the same justification as yours does in terms of validity I think.

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You're like "why shouldn't I get something for 10k", I'm like "why should I take 70 hours to get that thing".

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It's just different sides of the coin at the end of the day

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šŸŒˆ

stray goblet
fresh stump
stray goblet
#

I dont think we should

south flare
#

camo kill requirements are too high???

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what

fresh stump
#

Oh no

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moukwa found the suggestions button

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I'm not fighting with Mez AND moukwa

stray goblet
#

its joever