Vehicle - Feedback

[desert cove]

Vehicles needs buffs, don't give devs stupid ideas for nerfs

You will get better dmg profiles while attacking tank from top than from the front

[rancid hound]

Long-standing buff idea I've had for APCs has been to give them two fly-by-wire ATGMs per life/resupply

Means they have to stand still to hit the tank, but it's a punishment for oblivious tank crews

[desert cove]

Tank also should have thermals, and more ammo, and not be 4000xp piniata, but a threat.
And APC should have night vision at least

[rancid hound]

Limited range obviously

[desert cove]

Oki said no missles many times

[golden estuary]

NVG/FLIR is scuffed cuz it's just a shitty overlay

[rancid hound]

Tanks and APCs need NV capabilities

[desert cove]

Tanks do have it

[rancid hound]

Okay but Oki is wrong and MY interpretation of intended features is what people should care about

Simple as

[golden estuary]

tank commanders and APC drivers at night 🗿

[desert cove]

Yeah, Oki is wrong, you too tbh

[golden estuary]

legally blind 😂

[rancid hound]

I just don't play night maps

ESPECIALLY because the playerbase seems to love the retinal torture of rain at night

Rain that looks like glowsticks

[rancid hound]

I understand why he doesn't want them in tbh

[golden estuary]

Yeah there's a few scuffed pieces of the environment, the grass, bushes, and rain/sleet/snow

[rancid hound]

It's perfectly valid

[golden estuary]

but i guess the only ones that affect vehicles are the latter 2

[rancid hound]

I don't even disagree, but I just like combined arms warfare and armored vehicle combat so I shill for stuff out of contrarianism

[golden estuary]

yeah what BBR has isn't combined arms 😂

it's armour shooting infantry from spawn

[rancid hound]

Eh it is somewhat, combined arcade combat

[golden estuary]

a whole different game lmao

[desert cove]

Not from spanw

You can't do that

[rancid hound]

Can't relate

[desert cove]

Same as from spawn protection zone

[golden estuary]

no care about obj, just point and click arcade 😂

[rancid hound]

Still, more armor spawns would encourage bolder play

[desert cove]

But you can camp on hills close to it

[golden estuary]

yeah, but you get what i mean, shooting from friendly territory

[rancid hound]

People are chickens with armor because 1) they hate the idea of having fun and 2) armor spawns take forever

4/5 people who actually use armor are feeders who will waste it despite such a long respawn time

[golden estuary]

and god has given them a main gun with lots of zoom, so they're gonna use all of the zoom damn it

[desert cove]

And go against idea of inf focused game
Better to have less, but good vehicle that offer a nice experience and proper gameplay loop, than to have dozens of shitters on wheels or tracks

[rancid hound]

Lemme correct myself, faster spawns

[desert cove]

Same thing

[rancid hound]

Eh

[desert cove]

Just make vehicles worth thier spawn time

[rancid hound]

I think players should have to stay on their toes and not having a tank around for 20 minutes is boring

[rancid hound]

Would require most classes losing their anti-tank capabilities or armor becoming far more powerful (people will whine much more about these solutions)

[golden estuary]

BBR tanks should unironically be more like MOBA tanks

[rancid hound]

BBR tanks should actually be good and people should get a chance to try them out

[golden estuary]

also, pls, give option to invert tank reverse lmao.

[torpid elk]

relatively slower with decent damage but not outright instantly lethal

bbr tanks are more like glass cannons

[golden estuary]

Yep, fully agree

[rancid hound]

BBR tanks need a huge buff in some way

[golden estuary]

They're meant to make the enemy take a different path

a big ole block of resistance

[rancid hound]

But making them missive damage sponges doesn't seem like a good solution to me

You can drastically increase survivability by playing smart and supporting your infantry blob (best use case), but the problems of everyone having magnetic C4 that they can throw 30 feet isn't gonna go away

[golden estuary]

I'm ok with sponge if the tanks aren't speedy and if the sponginess is directional (like it already is)

yeah

it's a lot of intertwined issues

[torpid elk]

what about if explosives could damage tracks and force an engineer to repair them for the tank to move again?

[golden estuary]

the bone-headed decision to have c4 on every class is defs a spanner

[rancid hound]

It's why I propose faster tank spawns and a few DPS + health buffs

[golden estuary]

i wish there was component damage 😂

[rancid hound]

Classes losing C4 would start a MASSIVE shitstorm

[golden estuary]

arma 3 tanks are just 🙏

[torpid elk]

i dont care, classes do need to lose c4

[rancid hound]

I mean BF4 had pretty good tank damage models for an arcade shooter

[torpid elk]

not just because of vehicles

[rancid hound]

I agree

It's just gonna be insanely controversial

[golden estuary]

3 was better with the reactive armour, 4's APS do be whack af

[torpid elk]

c4 is currently the only real choice of gadget. it literally does everything

[rancid hound]

APS sucked so badly

Why did they add it

[golden estuary]

To ruin fun that's what

"NEW COOL IRL TECH NICE SHINY ADD"

[rancid hound]

Free invincibility for 15 seconds is SO COMPELLING and makes for GREAT DYNAMIC GAMEPLAY

[rancid hound]

Ya'll cowards don't even smoke [repair tool]

[golden estuary]

at least reactive armour from bf3 was like, yeah takes skill for shooter to aim, and skill for defender to angle

repair tool do be very doo doo

no semblance of teamwork unlike bf

[rancid hound]

I use it when there's vehicles because I'm not a loser and a coward

I love my teammates

[golden estuary]

i never had issues repairing randos in battlefield

[rancid hound]

EVEN IF they don't revive me

[golden estuary]

but in BBR, they either so far away from action, or they just drive all the way back without stopping once they get hurt

[rancid hound]

It's why I always tell people I play with to have one on them

[golden estuary]

also, i don't think repair tool kills enemy infantry, heck it even repairs enemy vehicles

[rancid hound]

Repair tools can make or break an armored push

[golden estuary]

yeah but that requires armour to push in the first place

[rancid hound]

That's how I play

Hate the sitting in the back meta

[desert cove]

127 enemies, and fucktone of snipers, and you are proposing this shit

[golden estuary]

those mfers are content spamming HE from the backlines, or charging straight into and through the enemy without infantry

[desert cove]

For fuck sake, can't imagine more annoying mechanic

On such small maps

[rancid hound]

Ehhh, getting sniped as an engi while repairing is less of a problem than an RPG hitting you

But it's the same problem imo

You're already vulnerable enough

[desert cove]

Juts asking for C4 when stoped, and geting just shoot down by any random near

On maps that are effectively 1x1km at best

[rancid hound]

If you get out of your tank when you know there's enemies nearby with the intent to repair, you're kinda asking to be shot

[golden estuary]

That's a problem with giving every class c4 and mobility/map issue 😂

[desert cove]

Because vilaskis can't stop waisting space

[rancid hound]

If you're forced to get out due to a mechanic stopping you, you're screwed without any recourse

[torpid elk]

this is of course with buffing the tanks so they could eat like 5+ tandems or something like that

[desert cove]

What about when you need to repair track? Like it was suggested

Either bail out, or be sitting duck

[rancid hound]

It's why I'm against it

[desert cove]

Death in both cases

[rancid hound]

There's a difference between being a dummy and being forced to be a dummy

[desert cove]

Would not work. This is not Squad, with 50 guys on 6x6km maps

[rancid hound]

The tanks are already brittle enough

[torpid elk]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rancid hound]

If tanks were like 300% more durable, maybe

[desert cove]

Will not work in Hardcore alsk

Armour in Hardcore will be a fucking joke, mark my words

[rancid hound]

But I don't want tanks to take 8 hits from an RPG

[desert cove]

500%

While limiting AT options

[rancid hound]

Mobility kill with how BBR works is too much

[golden estuary]

arma tanks dealing with man carried AT with thermals, lock-on and guided

[torpid elk]

fair, maybe in a different game it would be better yea

[golden estuary]

might as well move close to the map border in friendly territory and RP as arty with HE lmao

[torpid elk]

i still think tanks being made more durable should be accompanied with some way to remove much of their threat without outright destroying them.

maybe if c4 could only damage tanks like that and not kill them? its really feeling like a bandaid solution though

like, infantry should have an answer to vehicles in a way that requires teamwork instead of just like a single guy with a few blocks of c4 popping out of a bush and blowing it up with no warning

[golden estuary]

c4 doing less damage to armoured vehicles?

[hazy shoal]

Give everyone sledgehammers, removing C4 from everyone but assault/engineers/support and only let assault/support have 2-3 and engineers 4.

Remove Tandem. Make frag have a larger radius and actually kill players. Buff Anti-Vehicle mines and make anti-vehicle grenades stick to vehicles.

Remove the LB and pretend it never existed. Remove BH deathstar tier weakness. Make it so that on fatal damage the BH always spins out and explodes.

I fixed the game, you're welcome :^)

[torpid elk]

😏

[desert cove]

Arma is a mil sim, with tanks being much more competent, and game itself have a community focused on coop and trying to imitate irl.
Coop in BBR ends at medics not ressing you, even tho they can see you plain as day

[hazy shoal]

I think sledgehammers should be baseline and be able to do okay vehicle damage imo. I think you should be able to gang up on a tank with sledgehammers as a squad to take it out just because that'd be funny. Let it apply a stacking slow to mimic damaging its treads so it can't run away

[torpid elk]

i make sure to stare at medics as i bandage myself after they die from sticking their head into a door instead of healing me and then i grab and drag them out into the middle of the firefight so nobody else can revive them 😏

thats how you get medics to start embracing teamwork

[desert cove]

In amra you can expect, even demand, inf to work with you/cover you.
In BBR, expecting such thing is a fucking joke

[hazy shoal]

Just have 10 guys beating on it it like zerglings

The few moments I can work with a tank or APC feels really cool

but you ALWAYs get swarmed eventually due to the spawn system

I don't think I've ever been able to repel a singular push because there's always 1 guy who survives and hides in a cuckshed and becomes a mobile spawner

[torpid elk]

yea, i have complained a LOT about that in spawning mechanics

[desert cove]

You would need to make 1 c4 deal 10 dmg for it to work

Quite unrewarding, isn't it?

[torpid elk]

man, funny how planetside didnt have this problem with medics 🤔

oh wait, they cant really heal themselves

[golden estuary]

Yeah there's no macro semblance of teamwork

Even micro there's barely any 😂 I'm the mfer building forts n walls

From making spawn side objectives harder to cap, reducing spawn camping, and making firing positions for jeeps.

[graceful void]

they can, except they also heal everyone else around them while using their self-heal

[golden estuary]

Trying to coordinate vehicles and infantry can only be done at a private squad level

[torpid elk]

oh yea, i forgot that. i havent played in forever

[hazy shoal]

Sounds like a reason to buff anti-vehicle grenades so people need to make a meaningful choice of "Do I want to shit on vehicles or have a grenade that's better in every single way"

[golden estuary]

AT nades being super bouncy 😂 why do they even exist

[hazy shoal]

Anything that nerfs C4 I'm for

[torpid elk]

still, its designed to try and prevent selfish play and even turn selfish play into something that still benefits the rest of your team

[graceful void]

yeah understandable, as much as i liked the game, it has been a while since i touched it

i think people really hate the idea of AOE heal in this game though

[golden estuary]

BBR is selfish plays get score

[graceful void]

which is how PS2 got around the issue

also in PS2, everyone has instant medkits

[golden estuary]

Trying to teamplay in BBR is a waste of time

[graceful void]

so that's different as well

[torpid elk]

the simplest solution is to just make it so medics can only heal from ones they throw on the ground and that they heal at the same rate everyone else does when they do

[hazy shoal]

I mean Oki is on record telling someone he only plays BBR to kill people in response to them asking for bonus points for playing the objective/defense

So uh, yeah, by design it's very kill orientated/selfish

[torpid elk]

jesus fucking christ, this game was still born when i bought it then

[graceful void]

i'd prefer that approach honestly, but a lot of people hated it whenever it's brought up lol

[golden estuary]

battlefield didn't have such levels of selfishness, cuz there's no class that "does everything" like the medics in BBR

[torpid elk]

its ok, when he runs out of people to kill because zergs devolve into ouroboros trying to devour each other without ever catching each other he will be forced to implement mechanics that actually force people to fight

[golden estuary]

dusty dew round circle in a nutshell

[torpid elk]

generally, players dont know what is good for them

just look at mobas

[desert cove]

Most active thread in feedback section, by a fair margin

[desert cove]

Source?

[hazy shoal]

I'll see if I can find it, there's a picture floating somewhere

If I come across the picture I'll post it, otherwise I'd have to go through months of Oki's posts and I think I'll kms in the process because I don't remember the exact words he used

[torpid elk]

how long ago was it?

that could help narrow it down

[clever vessel]

honestly who cares what oki said x time ago we're not here to litigate what oki wants we're here to give feedback

he's not a founding father of the united states, he's a game dev with his own opinions and stuff and we're just here to say what we think

[elder heath]

killcams and parachutes

for real though, can we walk back the 'no paracutes'?
it gets kind of annoying being held hostage in a flying 'shoot me sign' because the pilot doesnt know how to drop a rope

[clever vessel]

what's even the rationale there

parachutes are like - their own form of liable, you're floating relatively slowly above enemies who see an easy target

[elder heath]

like i want the rope system
i love the rope system
i want to keep it, its unique and afaik no other game lets you pilot 126 other people on a dangling rope from a helicopter like a madman

but we really need a system for bailing on bad pilots mid flight
could even do something simple like
if rope is down -> no paracute
if no rope is down -> you get a chute

[clever vessel]

or you could just make parachutes very high risk, like, you have to deploy them at 30-40m above the ground and you glide for 10-12 seconds to ground level

[vague flint]

No parachutes is what prevents helis from circling the skybox limit raining down infinite troops at the enemy backline

[elder heath]

plinks your tail rotor once

[clever vessel]

wouldn't that be the fact you can't spawn on them outside objs and spawn which restricts it to a few squads only

[split reef]

First they need to fix all the bugs with the big boat (bouncing, too many sandbars). I think the driver or second seat should function similar to the tank commander with spotting giving the gunner elevation info.

I'd have the gun be a slow firing long range artillery that requires specific barrel elevation to be accurate. Maybe put the rhib minigun at the back so it has limited anti air.

[elder heath]

and besides the point
you can already do that now with the rope system

[vague flint]

The rope forces them into engagement range

[opaque lily]

Killed an enemy littlebird transport with my AUG side gunners. Then later on we sniped out the pilot in the littlebird military with AUGs.
Also killed 4 tanks, 5+ apcs, 3 attack boats, rib boats, cars, snipers. Yet despite the mass of vehicle assets killed we lost by 450 points.
Vehicles are useless

Fly. The. Damn. Heli

[cedar ember]

So... With good gunners the BH can take down another BH in about 30 seconds.

Also please use BH or Blackhawk to describe that heli. We have a literal transport heli that has the same HP as the LB.

Also, have you been around before the heli HP buff? They were almost useless and died about as fast as the LB. Except they were heavier and slower.

[rancid hound]

Most gunners aren't that good or they run off before going down. I'd dare to say there's more crashes than kills during a BH fight.

I was around, but I think it was an overcompensation. A middle ground is needed imo

It's silly that a helo can eat 4-5 RPGs just as a concept. I'm all for making helos a lot faster to compensate for a slight health nerf, but I think they're way too tanky in their current state.

[cedar ember]

I am an avid pilot. In order for the BH to be in lethal range of infantry, you have to be so close you are in danger of getting hit by RPGs. As it stands now, i can tank one hit before I need to run. Mostly because I don't know if it was a tandem.

If they are reduced in health, i guess it'll make you happy, but myself and many pilots i know will have to find another game, as the helis here won't be viable.

You can't balance the game around people who are too ADHD to focus a single target for 30 seconds.

[rancid hound]

I suggested several times to make the miniguns more accurate and lethal, because they suck

[cedar ember]

BH can also quite easily deal with LBs if the pilot knows their stuff

[rancid hound]

There's no reason the LB should get a minigun buff and not the BH

But that's where the game is right now

I just think Oki hasn't really balanced vehicles as a whole very well

[cedar ember]

I'm ok with a 15-20% HP nerf on the BH if:

• guns are more accurate
• slight speed buff
• LB alpha damage down
• tail rotor single hit KO removed and replaced with a damage modifier to the main health.
• on death, any heli will start the Blackhawk down mechanic. No more insta death.

[rancid hound]

I agree with all of this lol

[cedar ember]

Cool beans 😊 I would be quite happy with that change set

[rancid hound]

It's just kinda bizzare that the BH makes a better APC in its current state than the actual APC

[cedar ember]

Slight aside, only LMGs should be able to damage helis as far as guns go

[rancid hound]

There's a serious level of confusion with vehicles as a whole

[cedar ember]

Helis are a fantastic top tier troop transport irl and in squad

[rancid hound]

I think exceptions could be made to have a rotor shaft hitbox that intermediate calibers can hit

[cedar ember]

Sure, but that should be next to impossible... Irl you would never make that hit

[rancid hound]

Well yeah

It's supposed to be a hard hit

[cedar ember]

Snipers hit me way to often lol

[rancid hound]

Mostly to punish stupid pilots who hover too low or get ambushed from above

I think allowing DMRs and heavy ARs do damage as well would be fair

[cedar ember]

I'm always a little sus when I'm insta killed as pilot during a complex high speed turn from 1200m away

[rancid hound]

I'm right there with you

We were talking about how helos have buggy hitboxes earlier in here

[cedar ember]

Fair

They also seem to screw with aim of people inside too

[rancid hound]

I've been shot out of the pilot seat at absurd ranges with zero idea how it happened

[cedar ember]

Also fun fact, your tail rotor can be popped while in spawn in the "protected area" lol

[rancid hound]

Seems like there's some kind of desync where helo hitboxes don't register, so the bullets skip past it and hit people inside

[cedar ember]

Yeah, not ok

[rancid hound]

Which would explain some weird kills I've gotten while chasing BHs with the LB

[cedar ember]

Yep

Iv died so many times to an LB chasing me

Shot out

[rancid hound]

I shoot out pilots more often than I kill the helo with both BH and LBs

Which is very confusing when I'm on their tail

[cedar ember]

I'm not too sure if Oki will balance the vehicles though. He seems very anti vehicle

[rancid hound]

Unfortunate considering how much of a slog most of these maps are to walk across lol

[cedar ember]

It's an important part of the formula

Also we NEED vehicle customization

[clever vessel]

I'm so down with the last one

[rancid hound]

You can't have a BF-like game and just neglect the vehicle side of things

[clever vessel]

real

[rancid hound]

Idc what Oki thinks, you have to actually make it work

[clever vessel]

i'd be down with customization for it that involved playing with its stability and potentially even carrying capacity

e.g. cutting 6 seats for an autocannon on the sides

(not a serious proposal just an idea)

[rancid hound]

Vehicle customization would be amazing, but I seriously doubt Oki would do that

[cedar ember]

Let us swap out one or both of the BH turrets for a 5mm nade launcher. More of an anti vehicle/tank/building tool. Slower fire rate, lower ammo.

Or let us sacrifice the internal seats to carry around a mobile rearm station for APC/Tanks/Troops.

Dunno, stuff like that.

[clever vessel]

OH HELL YEAH A NADE LAUNCHER

[rancid hound]

Their current armaments aren't actually bad in concept, just underpowered on the numbers end of things

[clever vessel]

nade launchers are like such a decent intermediary it's a shame that they're apparently a blacklisted development thing

[rancid hound]

Rocket pods tho

[cedar ember]

Or swap out both turrets for 4 missiles

4-8

[rancid hound]

Isn't there a civilian LB with rocket pods?

[cedar ember]

Though honestly i would prefer if we could have both turrets and missiles/other utility

[clever vessel]

i don't think civilian and rocket pods go together

[rancid hound]

It's the blue and white one

I remember this very specifically from the playtests

[clever vessel]

oh the news copter?

[rancid hound]

Not sure if they spawn anymore

[clever vessel]

it doesn't have any offensive capabilities no more from what i've seen

[clever vessel]

yeah there's one on eduardovo

[cedar ember]

I wouldn't mind a container heli that could transport vehicles or repair rearm stations. Make the station unlikable, but if the enemy captures the territory then you lose it until you recapture

[rancid hound]

Over-all, I think vehicles need a near total rebalance

[cedar ember]

Agreed

[clever vessel]

agreed

[cedar ember]

Helis are by far the closest to balanced

[clever vessel]

i think that's the one thing we're all in agreement on lmfao

[rancid hound]

Helos need more speed and DPS, but a little less health to not be more of an APC than APCs

[cedar ember]

They should still be afraid of APCs though

[rancid hound]

Yes

[cedar ember]

That's their natural enemy

[clever vessel]

ofc ofc

[rancid hound]

APCs could use a bit more accuracy, it's insane how often the bullet spread just misses a guy up close

[cedar ember]

But... A skilled pilot should be able to navigate an APC without being shot down in half a second

[rancid hound]

Also needs at least one more hit worth of HP

Plus, a 30mm round should just vaporize a guy on direct hit

No reason someone should survive direct hits from an APC

[opaque lily]

You can tell it's a Tandem by how slow it is, the distinct sound of it, and the hefty firing arch. The rpg man will also take his time to aim it at you. Even then if your circling at 150+ km/s no rpg will hit you.

[cedar ember]

As of now, you have to get a headshot to kill in one hit, if they don't have armor

[clever vessel]

honestly that could be a really good perk

[rancid hound]

I don't mind if the splash damage remains the same, but direct hits should one shot everything except exo armor

[cedar ember]

Kind of hard to see the speed of the RPG from the pilot seat. And 150 m/s is too fast for the miniguns

[opaque lily]

Also, if they are harassing your home objective they will 100% be using tandems. Often best to avoid it wholeheartedly.

[clever vessel]

especially with a buffed APC making offensive play more common and therefore more 'getting in your face' situations

[rancid hound]

Would give exo armo a reason to exist and an upper limit to APC damage vs infantry

[opaque lily]

True. I mostly fly that fast when circling B on Sandysunset so we can wittle them down and start killing them.

[rancid hound]

The real vehicle rebalance would be limiting C4 to engineers and supports

[cedar ember]

Camping spawns is a little too easy right now. Some maps are set up in a way that let's you punish spawn campers, not many though.

[cedar ember]

This is very very much needed

[clever vessel]

medics when they realize they can't just do everything outside of long-range fires:

[rancid hound]

Battlefield worked just fine with only two classes being able to reliably kill vehicles

[clever vessel]

okay unnecessary shade aside it's not merely a good change it's a necessary change

[cedar ember]

They don't have access to the DMRs?

[clever vessel]

DMRs are okay but they're gimped in the current balance set-up so I don't usually consider them as being good for long-range fires

hitting that followup shot is a nightmare at the best of times

[cedar ember]

Fair. They are still a thing though and do work kind of

But the recoil is insane

[rancid hound]

Bullying vehicles by turning every class into an apex predator capable of tossing magnetic C4 30 feet at you from behind cover is insanely bad

[opaque lily]

6-10+ accurate bullets is still not going to kill squat. The damage needs to be buffed, not it's already adiquate accuracy

[cedar ember]

So true

[opaque lily]

Hopefully it can be equal to the littlebirds damage, as it should be

[rancid hound]

It should be equal to the LB damage, it's supposed to be the same gun

[clever vessel]

honestly you could also just do that suggestion we had yesterday of making it accurate for the first 5-6 seconds and then it just gets wildly inaccurate

[rancid hound]

A BH should be scary and able to clear hostiles off a rooftop in order to secure a drop for the passengers

[clever vessel]

you can't just sustained fire infantry targets anymore so it's okay for suppression but not at all appropriate for killing in itself

[rancid hound]

Idk how many times I've just stared a BH down with an RPG or LMG and killed several passengers or the pilot because the miniguns have such bad DPS

[opaque lily]

It's already like that though only for about 3 second bursts

[clever vessel]

yeah but only for like, extremely short bursts

extending the time on its own would be a pretty decent buff imo

[cedar ember]

If bursted properly, good gun. But that gun shouldn't take somebody who is skilled at it to work. Any player should be able to pick it up and be good.

Also a good BH crew is 5 people, if not 6. That's a lot of people doing one task, it's ok to be powerful

[desert cove]

Yeah, mostly. They can't PTFO in any meaningful matter, exept BH and constant backcaping.

Which is extremely effective because your teammates have colective IQ of an ant, so good luck with taking this point back, before match ends

[clever vessel]

honestly sometimes it's not even that your teammates are stupid it's that the game encourages you to be a stupid ass mofo atm

if the central game loop is 'let's just keep going after kills and moving forwards towards the red objs' then there's no difference between an intelligent player and the dumbest idiot you've ever seen outside kill count

[desert cove]

True

Objective play must have bigger priority in this game, because zerging in a loop will not end well

[shut crescent]

i love all of this

if only oki didnt have a hate boner for vechs it might happen

why the fuck did he even add them if he hates them so much and makes them near worthless?

[desert cove]

Marketing, for trilers and BF feeling, propably

[shut crescent]

"BF feeling"

something tells me that the bf feeling is kinda ruined when everything bigger than a jeep has no use besides "looks cool"

[desert cove]

Exactly

Look at the new boat

Basically BF4 boat copy

Worse than APC, which is an achivement in itself

[rich spruce]

Yeah the boat is terrible

The tiny splash radius + low velocity makes it impossible to kill infantry with any common sense and it stands no chance against an APC

[desert cove]

At least its accuracy is good

I whine about A]C accuracy for like 6 months, but I will gladly take boat accuracy on APC, assuming no splash/dmg nerfs

[desert cove]

It also have HP like RHIB and its resistance to dmg is 50% of APC one

So tandem one shots

[rancid hound]

calling it a BF4 copy is an insult to BF4 man

[earnest ocean]

But you have 2x zoom max

[desert cove]

True

[earnest ocean]

Defeats the accuracy

[desert cove]

Yeah, with most of your engagements being 200m+ because you can only sit in water

[desert cove]

Because of bad design

[earnest ocean]

I wonder who designed it

[desert cove]

But the accuracy alone is nice

[desert cove]

I wonder who, fr

[earnest ocean]

Ngl it could have a coax or another mg for its hp

[desert cove]

Definitely not someone who played BF4 a lot

[earnest ocean]

Its modeleled

[desert cove]

Ffs a lot of features are modeled but not working

Smoke grenades on APC, ERA on T90, coax on boat

[earnest ocean]

I thought the one who played squad a lot and played logi a lot

[desert cove]

Yes, played Squad a lot. Mortars in hardcore should be good tho

[earnest ocean]

Xd

Only if it can team kill

But you can't see blue markets above your TMs

So you have to identify friendlies by eyesight

[desert cove]

Someone propbaly wrote "sorry tk" in chat a lot

[desert cove]

Mortars in squad doesn't work like that, you get a marker, and you are shooting a marker

Simple ass

Because indirect fire

If TK, then really not your fault, because SL is responsible for giving you firing missions

[earnest ocean]

That's nice

[desert cove]

You just set up range and right click

When you are told to

That's my experience with mortars

[earnest ocean]

That's nice and kind

Can't imagine what airstrikes in hardcore 254 players would do

Massive tk if someone from both sides fuck up

[rancid hound]

hell nah bruh the commander's gonna have a 100-0 in Wakistan

or whoever's in charge of calling the strikes

[rancid hound]

well fuck I changed my mind @desert cove

helis tail are too easy to destroy

[desert cove]

I told you so

[rancid hound]

just downed 4 helis while they ran back

[desert cove]

It really needs a buff

[rancid hound]

im still advocating for a BH HP nerf tho

or at least more damage that vehicles deal to BH

[earnest ocean]

When I tried out the RCB90 and realising on multu islands, I downed 3-5 Helis with no effort, too.

If the main body doesn't hides the tail, you can shoot it down, you can see it from a lot of degree

[desert cove]

Propably only real use for it lol

[desert cove]

Yeah, it's easy as fuck

[cedar ember]

See... My thought is that he should add them properly... And people who don't like vehicles can just play the gamemodes without them.

Given that a large majority of 127 servers always choose conquest means something.

[cedar ember]

I have had passengers try to RPG the boat, but the rockets get messed up by a moving heli... They get wonky.

[hazy shoal]

When someone says "just use the AUG against LB, works for me every time" this is the scenario I always imagine - one where the LB is already on fire, being attacked by another LB, and essentially a sitting duck

[tulip ibex]

where do I find respawn timers for vehicles?

[earnest ocean]

nowhere

vil never made a sheet

grote might have on his server

[thorny mason]

ngl i very much would not mind if the transport/police littlebird/hermits turned into less of a ufo but didn't get one-shot the millisecond they started hovering

a heat should bring you super low but imo should not instakill a LB unless it tail-rotors

it really discourages playing an active transport role since people take a second to drop even with a warning

[clever vessel]

to be fair, the littlebird isn't ideal for the transport role no?

[thorny mason]

specified a bit more

in the edit

[clever vessel]

ah

it's a very weird position tbh

[limpid flame]

It's

So

Easy

To kill littlebirds

[clever vessel]

oh one thing: the blackhawk could benefit from a vehicle commander v channel

[thorny mason]

i think all vehicles could use a separate voice channel to talk to other drivers/pilots

[clever vessel]

o true

[thorny mason]

could give it to copilots, commanders, shotgunners

flesh the roles out a bit more

[clever vessel]

actually does anyone know how many news copters there are?

[limpid flame]

Game physics allow it to fly the way it is rn, oki made it that way And to what I know its not gonna change, typical pilot who Just picked up how to fly will not be Rolling around, doing upside strafes without crashing, high tier pilots know how to fly thru rolling, the exact same reason why grinders on infantry can crank 100+kills And not everyone else

[clever vessel]

i only recognize it on eduardovo

[thorny mason]

there's police birds on tensatown

and my personal favorite the hidden heli on sandy sunset

[clever vessel]

oh shit right, that helipad up north

[thorny mason]

though that one has less seats

[clever vessel]

honestly i feel like they should also be something you get in base

[thorny mason]

the one in tensatown is in base, the one in sandy sunset is neutral territory far from action

that being said imo there just needs to be more of these things across the maps

[clever vessel]

the one on eduardovo is weirdly situated off C

[thorny mason]

i can't imagine a world in which that breaks balance in a 250 player game

[clever vessel]

turn it into the air humvee lolol

[desert cove]

Right? Not as easy as tanks or APC's, but still easy enough for them to not be a problem if players want so

They learned to shut down armour effectively, and now its extremely rare to see good scores on 254 games, even in tanks, probably impossible in APC's

[hazy shoal]

I'm pretty sure I've seen a LB with like 5 guys on its rope going sanic speed so I don't see why it'd be worse

[limpid flame]

I literally hopped on to an APC to kill clanmate for fun And I tailrotored him in first shot

It is not hard i dont get those casuals

[hazy shoal]

I wish they removed all the non-remote turret humvees. They're so bad to use.

[desert cove]

Yeah, right?

Extremely fucked up how easily you can be shoot out from there

I learned while playing BFV, that open top turrets are a fucking joke

And thier addition says as much as "you have a vehicle with a turret, but you can't use it LMAO, fuck you peasant"

[clever vessel]

ok at least the browning is better because it has like - actual armor around the player so it's not as easy to get hit as in bfv

god why didn't any of the tanks have armor for the turret player in bfv ffs

[desert cove]

It's realistic

[desert cove]

Doesn't change the fact that it's still very easy to hs you or kill in legs, when in HMG turret

It should be RWS like 7m

[opaque lily]

You can hover above and kill boats since their gun only has 30 degrees of elevation and the miniguns damage it. For APCs in the water your guy needs to shoot out of F11 (left) or F12 (right) while hovering above and a bit to the side.

[cedar ember]

Sure, but getting above them without a tail hit is hard

[desert cove]

Boat should have 20°, like a tank, which is even worse.

[hazy shoal]

I just drone bomb boats

I feel like drone bomb was stealth nerfed recently though

like you gotta be so much closer now

[desert cove]

God boat is bad, HP like RHIB, small arms do dmg, hitbox bigger than BH, gun weaker than that of APC, worse elevation, and griver gunner is split

Ffs, they intentionally must have made it that shit

[clever vessel]

incompetence does the job of nefarious people far better

[opaque lily]

The HP is not even close to the rib boat.

[desert cove]

Data mining says its identical

[desert cove]

APC is an example of incopetence

Boat must be intentional

[opaque lily]

You trust numbers while I trust my gunner anialating rib boats but having to stick on patrol boats for far longer.

[desert cove]

I struggle with other explanation

[desert cove]

There are also dmg resistances

HP is the same, but big boat have definitely more resistance

[opaque lily]

Thus, you cannot compare them to a rib boat

[desert cove]

In hp alone I can, because number is the same

Tandem one shots it, soo

Just like rhib

[limpid flame]

Your gunners have to be the biggest cap i have heard

[opaque lily]

It's mostly closing the distance which is dangerous. I find banking to one side while flying in towards them while maintaining max altitude will let you get in range and above them. They will fire a string of 10 or so shots which is when you start banking even harder since their next 10 will be readjusting and will likely hit you (at the cost of loseing altitude which you can gain back when he reloads)

Engaged an attack boat and an APC in the water on Wineparadise at the same time and killed both. APC with my rpg man and the attackboat with the gunners. Then my chopper filled up with people and some moron put c4 in the back which caused the camping tank hit to detonate killing everyone. RIP.

[hazy shoal]

meanwhile, on remote turret jeep:
Not pictured: getting tandem'd 200 meters away

[desert cove]

What else if not a tandem

[hazy shoal]

sneaky bois c4'ing me from behind but my team cleared out the trees

[golden estuary]

build hescos around the jeep to stop tandems lol

[hazy shoal]

There was a LB with a squad of engineers RPGing us throughout the game sadly, wouldn't have done much

I got revenge though

[torpid elk]

But at least the jeeps dont take forever and then some to respawn

[wide relic]

Ya thought I was just doin it wrong

[desert cove]

Meh

Stryker M-SHORAD is sexier

And more than half of it's model alredy exists

[sour swallow]

Serious ideas please

[desert cove]

Yeah, it's serious

just make missles not present

[earnest ocean]

They are serious ideas, hence they are very hot

I don't want to mention any current even much but one side from the current war, strapped 6-8 aks together to use it as AA drone killer

Imagine that but with ultimaxes and it could be placed down by a support through a buildable

[rancid hound]

Oki just add light tanks if you refuse to do anything about vehicles man

[desert cove]

No MGS man

No

It's wheeled

Wouldn't fit

M10 brook would be better

[rancid hound]

you don't just add every random vehicles man

USMC doesn't operate those

there's a limit to how diverse your faction should get

[desert cove]

man, it's roblox game

gameplay>realism

MSG is too simmilar to lav for average battlebitter, it needs tracks

so M10

[rancid hound]

hence there's a limit but not fully realism

but the best option is to fix vehicles rather than adding new shit

ngl if Oki adds APS for vehicles death tolls will go down by like 50%

or more

[rancid hound]

not even BF has random vehicles bro

they didn't add tracked ifvs for a reason

[desert cove]

becouse wheeled ones are sexier

simple as

[rancid hound]

true that

[desert cove]

Shame devs didn't added BTR 90 but 82

90 doesn't looks so cheap, and could mount ATGM's without looking like a clown

[thorny mason]

at this point i give up on vehicle balance

devs give copilots and codrivers loudspeakers

anyone in the front/cockpit really

feel like I could send a far more concise message to the occupants of the precious heli seats to get on the damn rope if it's blasted in their ears

[crude anvil]

Give tanks glint

[unique jackal]

Funniest thing I’ve heard on here

Id go into a diatribe about vehicles being underpowered, but it’s a moot point

And I’ve already done so 2 or 3 times

[torpid elk]

make the glint be large enough to not only cover the tank but like 10+ meters around it

[graceful void]

sounds like the buff that tanks needed

[past widget]

in some game, WW3 I think it was, tanks had glint, and you could shoot out the little cameras to blind the tank

[opaque lily]

Ever since the game release the gameplay has been changing and morphing every week. It has now finnaly settled on tanks camping in their safe zone sniping away all game being absolutely useless to their team and a blight for any helicopter pilot and unfortunate infantry that fall victim. I have been able figure out a counter to every single vehicle in the game thus far but I cannot do shit against these safezone camping tanks. On Wineparadise for example, we had 2 US Abraham tanks camping their hill in their safezone. I got a littlebird transport going and had guys fire rockets roughly 300m+ at the first tank and eventually got them on fire. However the second one was 500m+ and simply too far for ANYONE in the game to counter, not even us.

After maybe the last 10+ days this is what the game is devolving into in Oceania. I've talked to other pilots and they agree that it has changed, and also changed for Asian servers too for one guy I spoke to.

[desert cove]

I mean, we have 3d spot which is much more OP than glint but ok? Imo ok, but add x6 thremal camera for gunner and mg gunner to compensate for that

[desert cove]

There is no camping in safe zone for fuck sake

People are to stupid to differentciate safe zone, from spawn protection zone, and can't even see that no map allows on camping from spanw prot. (Exept salhan, but tank were removed)

First point doesn't count, because there is not even 100 meters form spawn protection to point A /E

Hardly camping on AR distance

[desert cove]

You really need to be blind to not see that both E and A points on Wine are far from spawn ptotection.

[clever vessel]

Yes that should be the case; there should generally be no counter to the situation where the vehicles are worthless and taking random pot-shots for 20 kills over 30 mins, them doing that is the counter

We’ve finally reached the point in the game where the median player has figured out the most effective counters to tanks in general and therefore every remaining tank player goes into the game expecting and preparing to do exactly this

[clever vessel]

(Sorry i’m being glib i get that you’re not saying this)

(I hope)

[opaque lily]

You are the most bizzare cunt on this whole discord mate.

[desert cove]

Why tho? Because I correct you for saying things that doesn't really exist?

People are puting camping and staying in spawn protect in one bag which is stupid and unfair

[clever vessel]

Like i complained nearly a month ago now: tank players were encouraged by the ease of destroying and immobilizing them

Well we’ve reached near the bottom, where tank players are now mandated to do this

There are more exceptions than before if only because the more solidified blob gameplay means there are large periods of time where the tank is free to just move wherever it wants on the map before it runs into infantry and dies

[opaque lily]

You could go into the game right now, into a wine paradise 254 player conqest match and see the safezone for the US team. It encapsulates the whole hilll where tanks are completely immune to anything as stated in my littlebird example.

[desert cove]

You mean US side hill with A point?

[clever vessel]

And this will disappear instantly if inf gameplay is reworked significantly and we’ll be back to square 0

[desert cove]

I am not aware of other places to camp with tanks on that map except A and E points

Which by the fact that they are points, can't be in safe zone

[clever vessel]

Also yeah wine a and e are just dumb tbh, fighting on them is infuriating

[desert cove]

Idk how can map designer design a map with places that incentivise camping

Looks like consultation prize for not being able to do anythig else

[clever vessel]

Honestly i think it’d be better with stronger vechs because the positions aren’t especially good for sniping as it stands, since the urban area is so thick you can barely see much outside of that garden

In general it’d probably be a far less terrible offender with a game that isn’t balanced like this right now

[clever vessel]

also very serious tank suggestion: i think tanks should be actively tracked on a minimap

it will tell you exactly where you need to shoot your tandem to hit one at any time

[desert cove]

Yeah, make it so you also get bigger splash radious, because with 6 meters you can still miss

Make it 20 for good measure

[clever vessel]

hell, while we're at it, i think firing the tandem alone should cause the tank to explode

the moment you left click the tank blows up

[cedar ember]

Camping tanks is because tanks can't do anything else

Pushing with infantry will get you killed, and trying to take position on a hill closer to the action will get you c4 cheesed within minutes.

And it's not like you will last a while pushing with infantry, minus one map, the average time i see a tank live while pushing is about 35 seconds (after they reach the fight)

Dealing wth armor is beyond trivial

[clever vessel]

also like while people say pushing with infantry confers a bonus

right now it absolutely don't

infantry have no reason to fire at the people firing at the tank, and even when they do they have like near zero way to locate in time to terminate

[rancid hound]

haha bro "combined arms warfare"

no thanks bro we ain't playing Squad

nobody would protect your tank from infantry

[clever vessel]

yeah

like i think the important thing is it's not even that people don't want to, it's that there's zero way to

[rancid hound]

AP has the same damage as HEAT RPG 😐

[rancid hound]

yuh nobody will care about an engi shooting rocket at your tanks or APCs

[clever vessel]

not merely is the game pace god damn fast, which makes it difficult enough as is, there's no reason for infantry to expose themselves for a tank as opposed to just joining the blob

[rancid hound]

still devs think we're playing this game with Steel Beast mindset or something

LET'S FUCKING GO OLD OIL DUNES

VIL BEING BASED FOR ONCE

https://tenor.com/view/gigachad-chad-gif-20773266

[desert cove]

Instead of protect, babysitting would be more accurate word. Because tanks really need to be babysit to be effective

[desert cove]

Yeah, now I have a chance to play multu once more

[rancid hound]

infantry fighting vehicles more like vehicles fighting infantry man

[desert cove]

Running from infantry vehicle

[rancid hound]

real conquest

[earnest ocean]

Hell yeah

I hope that there will be servers that will only have old maps

[limpid flame]

Conquest is meant to have meaningful amount of vehicles that will be a threat

[last axle]

attack heli on old oildunes

[earnest ocean]

How to get +20 vehicle kilos

[opaque lily]

Yes, but they need to be countered in at least some way. I'm going to assume there's a range/distant limit to the c4 drone so you can never truely get the camping tanks on wineparadise (have only used it once where I killed a tank in safe zone on Sandysunset so idk) since rpgs cannot reach them.

[limpid flame]

there is so many ways to counter every single vehicle in this game already

the lack of doing so is a literal skill diff

smarter players bully vehicle users

[opaque lily]

You can't kill camping tanks on Wineparadise. It's simply too far for anything.

[rancid hound]

oil dunes is the only map where you have to worry about other tanks rather than RPGs and C4s as a tank

really based

you can't really snipe infantry like other maps

https://tenor.com/view/gigachad-chad-gif-20773266

hurts to see it took Vil this long to bring back this masterpiece

[desert cove]

Now they are countered while not being a meaningful in any way

[desert cove]

You can move your ass and get it from behind easily

Flanking is an option

[opaque lily]

My god. Do you not know what a safe zone is? You have 10 second out of bound countdown to do anything, not possible.

[desert cove]

I want screenshots of tanks camping in safe zone

Because right now, I call bullshit

[magic ingot]

I guess he meant blue zone (enemy no entry)

[desert cove]

I will apologize if I am wrong, but I think you are saying bullshit

[magic ingot]

Practically can’t flank

[desert cove]

I know, I don't think there is place like that

Vil does bad maps, but he made them so you can't camp from blue zone

[magic ingot]

There is? There are two points close to each side, the one near center both have good hills in blue

You need to do a bit of deforest to make them viable

[opaque lily]

Can't flank, can't c4, can't rpg - well can but getting 6 hits with 5 reloads is beyond unlikely.

[magic ingot]

Trees are biggest enemy

[desert cove]

Screenshots pls

[opaque lily]

Play the game > open map with the keybind > look at blue/red zone.

[magic ingot]

Just sanity check, 127 conq right

Idk layout of 64 conq

[opaque lily]

Yes. Wineparadise is the worst, but such things happen on Sandysunset too

[magic ingot]

Eh sandy is north side advantage apc hill camp first point

South housing layout is bs

[limpid flame]

I cant even listen to slazenger without laughing

[opaque lily]

Cringe

[limpid flame]

You either have the most bot like experiences or you Just dont know how to deal with safezone campers at all

[desert cove]

So send it, if it's so easy to make, I am in theatre atm so well.
Even if I could see it, I don't know what place you are even talking about

[opaque lily]

You can't kill a safezone camper that is hundreds of meters deep within their protected zone. Be scilent when in my presence

[limpid flame]

Safezone disables shooting unless you leave it

[opaque lily]

go to VC and stream

[limpid flame]

He has to leave at some point to be able to shoot

[opaque lily]

on wineparadse, I'll show you

[limpid flame]

Which is the exact time you deal with them

[desert cove]

On sandy, you can shoot only at first point, which is barely camping, if enemies are 80m away

[magic ingot]

He just means blue zone not really safe zone, safe zone isn’t even drawn on map for some reason

[limpid flame]

Slazenger is the one advocating for blackhawk to be turned into literal gunships, after that claim i Just cant listen to him

[magic ingot]

They already are?

Can’t you see 8 engi raining rpg from above

[opaque lily]

Absolutely. Guns need to kill in less than 10 shots

[limpid flame]

There is no safezone camping tanks/apcs that cant be dealt with

It is just not a thing

And even if it is, it's highly ineffective

[magic ingot]

Apcs are too ez, two synced tandem ez clap

Tank much less so

[desert cove]

While sitting in then is pointless, unles its Salhan, from where tanks where removed becouse of that

[opaque lily]

You spastics have left me no choice, going into a game and taking a screenshot of the wineparadise map right now

[magic ingot]

Seems like someone can’t even read patch note

[limpid flame]

There are maps that have issues but vilaskis thinks he designs best map ever so you cant even do shit about it unless he realizes

[opaque lily]

I got the closer yellow spot representing Abrahams tank on fire with the littlebird rpgs but the other one was simply too far anyone to hit, possibly even for a c4 drone. This was flying me flying on the borderline safezone just so they could get a shot at 200 altitude.

[magic ingot]

Bruh definitely not there, tank can’t climb that cliff

[opaque lily]

Furthermore, I just played a 40 minute game where a friendly tank was on that hill the whole game. He got 24 kills in 40 minutes.

[magic ingot]

I usually sit right below the cliff and need to deforest to get a good view but that should average ~ 40 kills

[opaque lily]

And that's tottally fine since enemy player can contest you, but not these safezone camper that are all too common these days.

[magic ingot]

I think that’s worth reporting if they sit on top of the hill, feels like the same exploit as salhan

[opaque lily]

Is that so. I assumed there was a natural path up there since the tanks are there every game. Simmilarly on the other side too.

[magic ingot]

That cliff is yelling “no tank on top” for me

I mean, you can tell from map, it’s a cliff all around

[opaque lily]

As for Sandysunset, there is an unforgiving safezone near objective A and F which tanks and APCs will camp the whole game. I can only just barely contest them.

[magic ingot]

I don’t see a clear way up

I mean, uh, they do they, me sweat infantry can ez 40k when they maybe barely get 20?

[opaque lily]

Littlebird pilot suddenly got quiet. Would of thought he would of had a mutually interest in seeing these impposible to kill campers seeing as they are shooting at us all game.

[magic ingot]

I’m convinced vehicles doing blue zone camp is intentional and by design judging from new maps’ layout

Deters back cappers a bit (still not effective lol)

[limpid flame]

Effective af XD

24 kills in 10 minutes is such a shit KPM lmao

Not even a threat

HAHAHA

[magic ingot]

Resupply takes forever for tank on larger maps

They just don’t have much ammunition to work with in first place and are super slow

[limpid flame]

you literally cant take slazengers opinion at all

[rancid hound]

bullshit take tbh

if you want to stop camping stop making vehicles shit

[rancid hound]

24x1 = 24 tickets loss for the enemies
0-1 and more = 15 or more tickets loss for your team
Which one will you take

[magic ingot]

Assuming they all stay dead and not resurrected (which should be the case for camping vehicles)

Not so much for run nd gun playstyles unless you’re just pushing with blob

[limpid flame]

Why do I even bother arguing with a guy that thinks 24 kills in 10 minutes is a threat to the balance

It's literally like that tank is not even alive

Bro doesn't make a SLIGHT dent in the tickets

Barely a threat to the general gameplay

Is literally fucking useless

And you acting like he has an unstoppable gameplay tactic that HAS TO BE DELETED RN

Dayum this community is shit

Jesus

This is the exact type of people calling out nerfs for everything that is not fun according to them

Furthermore, another interaction in this feedback channel is literally useless, have a great day or evening or whatever guys

[desert cove]

Would be hard to get there imo, if even possible

[desert cove]

I suck at inf gameplay, but I can do more than duble of that killnwise in this time lol

Definitely not a threat

[limpid flame]

Exactly what I mean

The lowest skill bbr player reaches at least 30 kills by the end of the game

24 kills in a tank is nothing

10 minutes

That Guy was sitting waiting for targets more than actually playing

[rancid hound]

bet he's crying when tanks go out and farm children on Wakistan

man you can never satisfy people

[rancid hound]

because bro thinks his gunship should be top of the scoreboard and not being challenged by a guy sitting on the hill

[limpid flame]

The whole argument is "nerf this it's op" infantry players can crank 80-120-150 kill games, respqwn at will, die as many times

Vehicles have borderline 5 minutes respawn timers, why would I not be able to crank high kill games

Considering the threat amount

A good vehicle player is gifted high kill games purely by his skill And game sense

Vehicles should be powerful

Should be a threat

[rancid hound]

what are you advocating for

[limpid flame]

And should be somewhat hard to deal with, unless countered by effective strategy

[rancid hound]

I'm not disagreeing with you

[limpid flame]

I want to see vehicles powerful, I want to see vehicular combat balance way better than it is, even if I am LB player, I want other vehicles to thrive

But people like this make it so much worse

[rancid hound]

the problem is like I said there'll always be crybabies

you get so many of them that you don't know what you're dealing with at times

[limpid flame]

You cant dodge it, I know that from BF3, BF4, Bad Company 2, any game you name

Every infantry scrub thinks it's uncool to die to a vehicle

[rancid hound]

the only thing I hate on BF4 are attack heli sweats

the rest is fine as it is

[rancid hound]

yes bruh especially 128 crybabies packed in a 2x2 km box

[limpid flame]

It was an unbalance vehicle, that is true

[rancid hound]

they cry about why vehicles don't go to them so they can kill it easier when you have a billion angles

that's funny bro as if people hate dying

/s

[limpid flame]

It's annoying cause you cant reason to them, conquest is a gamemode designed AROUND VEHICLES, It's whole idea And identity IS THE VEHICLES

And they will still complain about them

And every vehicle plsyer will tell that the vehicle balance in BBR is fucked up

[rancid hound]

of course the only fun is blowing up morons in tanks with c4

you can't blow back the c4 throwers that's not fun

well saying morons sounds harsh cuz they can do no shit

[limpid flame]

Harsh but true

[rancid hound]

to them it's just run and gun

idk man just remove vehicles sounds better cuz we're better off having no trash than full of trash

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[limpid flame]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

Thats what gets me annoying, freedom of speech is annoying but shitters should not be allowed to speak about balance, monkey movement follow singular opinions, even if they are wrong, thats why so many people want LB nerfs, thats why so many people think APCs are broken(lmao), exactly why people think tanks need to be nerfed(wtf)

Feedback channels should be Reserved for actual devoted players, the ones that grind the game, the ones that have knowledge

Cause many games listened to blue collar players, weekend andy's And random shitter which killed the balance entirely

[wide relic]

💀🤣🤣

I actually like usin the apc I can get the annoying ass lb if I try an always better when your not a moron an actually move wit infantry believe me more often than not they help u out if ur on obj just don’t push farther than them an you’ll be fine

[carmine flume]

they should add vehicle resupply stations to capped points otherwise i think ground vehicle balance is actually pretty good

BH is actually useless though unarmed LB is a much better transport vehicle and armed LB just shreds any other heli especially BH

[crude anvil]

Feedback threads should be for me and me only, everyone else is dumb.

[desert cove]

By Attack heli you mean Cobra/MI-28?

[desert cove]

Oh yeah, another one using "play with infantry argument" . The same infantry that doesn't reas you because it hurts thier KPM. Yeah, right. That doesn't happen. Like, it's more than very rare to be able to use infantry to your advantage, not to mention cooperatiing with it. Maybe by following zergs on Waki, then yes.
Argument like this can rally be made only by players that never really played FPS game with randome, especially on that scale, or are trolling or purpose

I have pulled it off only on PS2 while playing with outfit, in organised manner

[wide relic]

I mean when I play wit my clan . Maybe quit crying about vehicles your kd can take a hit it will be fine 🤣

[limpid flame]

It's a vehicle balance thread, his only place to talk about the vehicles In a somewhat chill place where there is a slight chance of being listened to, who are you to tell him this

[desert cove]

Yeah, with a clan you say. Lets gatekeep gameplay loop behind clan cooperation lol

[limpid flame]

What is your input to this whole thread then, go somewhere else

[wide relic]

Lol I mean I also find squads in matches that do that to ?

[wide relic]

O does my opinon hurt ur feelers

[limpid flame]

No i dont really i dont care for you

[desert cove]

Right, as if my KD was so important. I would gladly have -10.0 kd if it ment that this gameplay loop is made properly

[limpid flame]

I care for the entire vehicular balance

And I care for other people wanting meaningful changes in this part of gameplay

[desert cove]

Then good for you. Most of the player base doesn't have that luxury. You must be a lucky guy then

[wide relic]

There’s vehicle balance then makin vehicles to op . FYI I do think the game needs a vehicle rehaul balance an incresased spawns

[wide relic]

All I’ve seen from u when someone disagrees wit u is u say there morons or skill issue . Old multi is the only one of three people that wil discus it

[wide relic]

Same we all want pretty the same thing balance

[desert cove]

Increased spanws are bad idea

It only makes vehicles more present , which kind of defeats Oki's vision for the game

Imo, having less, but better vehicles would be much better for the game

Just make them worth those 6 minutes, right now, they are barely worth 1

[limpid flame]

Cause compared to drzewny i've lost My sanity explaining to people like you over And over the same shit

[unique jackal]

Agree, and rn if they increased spawns it would only make more engineers carry tandems because more mobile point stashes are now roaming around the maps

[wide relic]

Oki vision of the game is a cluster fuck they need to iron it out more .

[wide relic]

Lol so u troll everyone then who has a different opinion got it

[wide relic]

I pretty much get one go in vehicle then can’t get in apc or tank rest of match

[desert cove]

That's fair, in theory

You fucked up, no vehicle for you

Shame that right now it's easier to destroy them than finding non conq server

If they will be worth thier respawn, it would work well

Rewarding skilled players and incentivising getting better, whilr discouraging people that treat vehicle like some kind of powerup mario cart style

[wide relic]

Honestly never have a problem wit that myeskf server browser always find dom for me if I don’t want to deal wit vehicles

Just it staying a dom server is the tricky part

[desert cove]

That's ture. I didn't mean it's hard

[wide relic]

Gotcha . Frontlines on the other hand different story

[carmine flume]

simply having infantry nearby significantly reduces the chances that someone will just run up and c4 your tank + it’s harder to peek with a rpg. you dont need to do complex coordination, just push the obj that the infantry are pushing

[desert cove]

Man, I was blown up inside half team blob too many times

It doesn't matter how many teammater are around you, when they doesn't care about you

And how surprising this may be, they don't

[carmine flume]

idk man from what ive played i even got repaired

[desert cove]

Yeah, I happens

Sometimes, extremely rarely

Too rare of a occurent to have any impact and be treated as an argument tho

[carmine flume]

true but like if vehicles arent helping pushes there is no reason to use repair tool

its like a self feeding loop

[limpid flame]

Define troll, cause so i've given plenty of constructive criticism And feedback

The only people who are trolling are the infantry scrubs that Just want vehicles to be nerfed or plain out deleted

[magic ingot]

play dom if can’t handle vehicles

but let’s be real for a moment, what’s the intended counter for LB

[torpid elk]

Part of the issue imo is the game requires people make a deliberate choice to do teamwork that is inherently slower and less rewarding than just running around like a headless chicken.

To use medics as an example, you need to stop what you are doing to heal people. You cant do it passively. And when healing people you are not running around racking up kills

We need to just admit it, the game isnt currently designed for teamwork

[magic ingot]

A headshot score more kill than a rev

[limpid flame]

From Oki's standpoint, it's RPGs, IFVs And ground firearms, or other helicopters

[magic ingot]

Self counter is not a counter, not sure what IFV is referring to and never seen someone even try to rpg an LB

[limpid flame]

IFV is LAV And BTR.

[magic ingot]

That muzzle and spread seriously?

[limpid flame]

Very easy.

[magic ingot]

Sure LB can’t damage an APC but one hit from APC deal only 17% hp damage to LB

[limpid flame]

RPGs are a Daily occurence even for the top 1% of pilots

[limpid flame]

It's not about the consecutive hits, it's about how easy it is to tail rotor

[torpid elk]

Technically it is, but unless also countered by other thing is creates very insular gameplay. When only lb counters lb we just end up with lbs untouchable in the sky

[magic ingot]

Do they hit? I’ve seen people mass salvoing BH with moderate success but LB is like bs

[limpid flame]

Cause you've seen the shittiest people of this community

Lack of skill makes LB look like OP vehicles

[magic ingot]

I thought this is supposed to be a casual game

[torpid elk]

Lbs are too fast to feasibly threaten with anything other than other helis or a surprise tank round to the face

[limpid flame]

Actual good Players, good And not tryhards, can easily deal that

[magic ingot]

Ngl I do that all the time

[limpid flame]

@desert cove pls explain this again

[magic ingot]

Oh you slow down? Oh? Take this ap

[limpid flame]

IM tired of this topic

[magic ingot]

Id like to see your half an hour rpg shooting down perfectly strafing LB that is actively maneuvering clip

[torpid elk]

Anyways, most vehicles are too weak but lb are the complete opposite. Where tanks are threatened by like everyone on the map having c4, mines, and rpgs and are slow enough to be very vulnerable if they overextend or get snuck up on a little bird instead dodges 9 out of every 10 shots fired at then and can fuck off to the other side of the map in the blink of an eye if they do get damaged

[magic ingot]

even just rpging a bh can get to kamikaze’s weekly choice of top moments, you’re making it sound like a walk in the park

[limpid flame]

https://youtu.be/r9CxGTrjTEg

[torpid elk]

Lb are playing ace combat while everyone else is playing a survival horror game against them

[limpid flame]

My clanmatw

Top 0.5% pilot

[magic ingot]

Bro where’s rpg

It’s also just sad Lb having so much hp it’s more likely you random headshot the pilot than taking it down

[torpid elk]

No, there were 2 rpgs in one clip that completely missed only for him to get headshot or something

These are all probably recorded before the change to glass

[magic ingot]

ngl I’m only seeing an exploiter vigorously defending to get it not nerfed

Just like Vector pre nerf

[torpid elk]

Dudes a good pilot, but doesnt bug out when he should and is overconfident. Half of these deaths are gun deaths because people finsally start turning around to shoot at the littlebird circling then

[magic ingot]

by repeating top1% or top 0.5% I bet he’s very proud and can’t wait to show off his quote on quote skills

[desert cove]

What you want me to explain again?

[crude anvil]

Leave the game

[desert cove]

Probably nothing because this vehicle is vulnerable to all the same things inf is

Which means everything

With exeption of hand grenades

Idk if something needs a counter if everything counters it

[limpid flame]

Fresh.

[desert cove]

You mean those changes that doesn't really work?

[torpid elk]

They work inconsistently

Which is a major issue

[limpid flame]

No, we confirmed it with oki, it doesnt work at all.

[limpid flame]

Matter of fact i had a clip of dying to an anti vehicle nade lmao

[desert cove]

I meant Frag

BUT WTF HOW?

In a fucking heli

HOW

[limpid flame]

Skill issue from my part xd

But it CAN happen

Bro must've yeeted his best nade in his life

[heady jewel]

Guns

[magic ingot]

Not all guns get L vehicle damage in first place

[heady jewel]

Rockets

Blackhawk

[desert cove]

Only all AR's, Snipers, DMR's, LMG's and PDW's. With most dealing more than 5 dmg

Also HMG, 7m, Coax(which is 7m tbh), and miniguns

Kriss Vector too, for some reason

[magic ingot]

Conversation literally going in circles

[heady jewel]

@magic ingot mf a well placed rocket is more than enough

[desert cove]

Because some people are to dumb to understand some things

[heady jewel]

I don’t think it’s a one shot but it’ll scare it off

[desert cove]

And it's not open to interpretation who

[magic ingot]

Sounds like you never hit one lol

Im not allowed to make a certain statement due to thread rule

[desert cove]

I have more LB kills than kills in all helis overall

Tho i don't engage them that often, because a they are is pain in the ass, and I have more pressing matters to deal with

Tandems, for example

[thorny mason]

i really hope they revert or at least compromise on the littlebird l-armor damage man

makes flying transport so unfun

i can try and dodge as much as I can and live longer, but all it takes is 2, maybe 3 seconds, of taking damage total and you're down in a police heli

[magic ingot]

police heli? Tensa?

[thorny mason]

the large transports have no hope to outmaneuver the fire and have to rely on a perfect gunner to match that dps

[thorny mason]

the one on tensa, the one in sandy, pretty sure there's a few other unarmed littlebirds

[magic ingot]

Those are practically target practice

[desert cove]

L armour dmg is very propably a additive statistic

So every weapon deals dmg to soft vehicles+l armour

[thorny mason]

unfortunately, they fly well enough to deal with most rpgs outside of hotdrops, but they simply can't handle sharing the airspace

[desert cove]

Then multiplicated by it resistance

[magic ingot]

Armed lb doesn’t even do hotdrop?

Drop who, copilot?

[thorny mason]

well armed only has one other seat, they're not dropping much at all

talking about the unarmed ones

[magic ingot]

Ah

[limpid flame]

Imagine being a tank, an attack vehile, having to hotdrop

[thorny mason]

the intention behind making littlebirds vic shredders isn't bad imo but helis just aren't in a state of balance where that's necessary atm

[limpid flame]

Armed LB is exactly the same type of vehicle

The conversation is going in circle cause people are still too dumb to understand

Solid arguments

[magic ingot]

• overbuff bh hp
• buff lb to counter it

Why am I seeing a pattern here (peeks at claymore nerf

[desert cove]

Most people on this server don't want to understand

I have seen it many time

What we see in this thread is nothing

I had displeasure of arguing with so called "wave"

Thanks Oki, our god and saviour, that he was banned

[magic ingot]

armed lb should have a longer respawn timer than tank based on its combat efficiency

[thorny mason]

imo armed lb's shouldn't be in spawn

replace em with transports

make more points with helipads

[desert cove]

No, tank just needs a lot of buffs

And it's only 1 min of difference

[magic ingot]

You mean make it like waki tank that only spawns on cap?

[thorny mason]

there's a few littlebirds that spawn on points already

pretty sure waki has em

but yes

it would help prevent people forcing armed lb's every match and getting to the point where they just dominate the game

and having more unarmed transports would ease downtime moments in conq

[magic ingot]

play infantry conq

[thorny mason]

on top of just keeping the airspace interesting

[heady jewel]

When was the last time you saw a server playing it

[magic ingot]

Never

[clever vessel]

Did the LB make its way through this thread again

[desert cove]

Once per day

Seems right

Remember to be back for tommorow LB shit storm

[opaque lily]

How subhuman do you have to be to protect a tank camping on a hill in the safezone for 40 whole minutes lmao. conveniantly choose to ignore that it was a friendly tank too thus a detriment for our team.

Buff the damage of transport chopper's miniguns, fix the window so you don't get window sniped. Add functionality to the cooppilot seat that currently serves as a meatsheild for the gunners, add HP to the tailrotor so splash damage won't destroy it only a direct hit.

Then we'll be golden 👍

Also reduce the chopper's base health

[last axle]

Those fucks are annoying, the only way to counter them is attack helicopta with like 2/3 RPGs, but not all maps have the transport lb

[desert cove]

Lmao

BH doesn't need so much love

[desert cove]

Again. It's not a safe zone

[opaque lily]

Too right. I was able to get a tank on fire with two RPGs on the littlebird but just simply couldn't get the second one who was 400-500m out from the safezone's borders.

[desert cove]

Learn proper names

Because you can't do shit in safe zone

You are only misleading others

I may sound like an ass, but semantics are fucking important

[clever vessel]

Did you miss like the three weeks of convos that that guy and the rest of us had about how the tanks are so gimped that people are incentivised to camp

(oh but I'm for all the transport choppers though)

Like come on this is still the same issue of people circling around and eventually landing on 'let's punish the tanks for camping which we can barely substantiate but is so bad it requires major game changes'

It's so painful to stress again that when people are refusing to go out of the safezone for fear of getting hit, scoring a grand total of 20 kills over 40 minutes, the problem isn't that the drivers are psychotically obsessed with not getting hit

[wide relic]

Just play obj get over the fact of dyin an that it just a game simple …

[clever vessel]

I mean yeah

But like

People are playing this game to have fun

The only properly structured way in this game, structured as it is, is to have lots of kills

So people are just gonna play to get the most kills

[clever vessel]

It's just this again where there is no dimension to the game beyond the overly fast and simplistic inf gameplay

So most people play to have the most fun via doing stuff like that

For tank players who own 1) an extremely expensive and rare system per match, 2) a relatively fragile system with lots of theoretical power, why would they play the obj

You can't just expect some players to give up the fun they want

[limpid flame]

Play infantry And get over the fact of dying

It's that simple

What kind of an argument even is this

[clever vessel]

When players are having to work against the design incentives set out by the developers of a game to be effective... That's bad

[wide relic]

I do mofo I like my sucide c4 shenanigans

[clever vessel]

Like you see this in the LB convo too but to a different extent since unlike the tanks the LBs are observably viable and can pull off good performances

[clever vessel]

We stan suicide C4 tbh

[wide relic]

Honestly avoid waki now

[clever vessel]

Fr? Wouldn't that be good for suicide c4

Just sit on c and wait for the blob to pour in?

[wide relic]

I find it fun to be able to die an respawn

[limpid flame]

Good for you, some people dont enjoy dying 24/7 And rather feel more useful for the team by getting higher amount of kills in the game. Where vehicle death is a 5 minute respawn so death in it is more of a loss than 5 minutes of losing infantry players

[wide relic]

A lot of people just mob up I think they expect it on waki more sandy bas ra on the ship are good to

[wide relic]

That’s just bein self important don’t get me wrong I like using vehicles actually just keybinded the rolls for lb

[limpid flame]

Self important is good for the team

In a game where you cant expect teamwork, expect only yourself doing good

Dont get me wrong, cooperation exists, but it's not even worth trying most of the time

I rather have Faith in myself And do myself good

[wide relic]

Understandable I’ve just always played for team I’m a utility player

[opaque lily]

I'm fully aware of how fast they die when they even try to help support an objective against infantry. Does not change the fact that safezone camping has zero counters.

[clever vessel]

Yeah, but safezone camping is literally useless. The guy up there just spent so much time telling you that they literally cannot be getting those shots on you, not unless you're directly strafing the spawn area on most maps

The exception is wineparadise with the slopes at the map edges next to spawn and the tree cover and that's not even a safezone camp that's just a general camp

Introducing safezone camping counters is a meaningless exercise in nerfing tanks more while achieving effectively nothing

You can make them visible on the map for being stationary - which they can just counter by moving. You can forbid ever firing in the blue zone, which will at best solve some edge cases like on sandy. You can even make it an exploiter/griefing report worthy thing, which will just open the door to generally reporting any vehicle in the rear as an exploiter. There's no winning this by somehow introducing a counter to something countering itself

The counter to tanks sitting behind aiming at copters is convincing tanks to be out there, firing at things on the ground and being too occupied to reliably look up

[rancid hound]

jesus can yall stop arguing about "safe" zone

[desert cove]

One person can't it seems

Probably wants to spawn camp,I can't imagine other reason to create non existant problem

To push for changes to safe and spawn protection zones

[clever vessel]

Real

[opaque lily]

Good greif.

[wide relic]

Lol 😆

[clever vessel]

day 10000 of asking for ifvs to get their coax guns

[desert cove]

I think it's in the works

SoonTM

You know

[clever vessel]

honestly there's really not much to talk about anymore since there's not really been any real vehicle changes since day 1 and within the little time this game has been public it's rapidly settled into its probable long-term balance

[desert cove]

After the heat death of universe

Because its vehicles

[wide relic]

Doesn’t oki hate vehicles to?

[desert cove]

Hate maybe too much

He definitely doesn't like them, and it seems he is kind of scared of them

[wide relic]

Ya it’s definitely noticable must be a medic main

[desert cove]

I think he wants to avaoid BF4 air-like unbalance

[clever vessel]

would be nice to get modding so we can test out stuff tbh

[desert cove]

Which is stupid notion, because most vehicles sucks very much

[clever vessel]

honestly could you walk me through what bf4 vehicle problem was

only have abt 40 hrs on it

[desert cove]

Ground vehicles were OK in overall thing, air was very OP

Not a lot of inf counter, very effective

Attack helicopters cound easily kill whole enemy team 3-5 times

[rancid hound]

jet is fine

attack helis are where the shit starts

[desert cove]

Helis overall

Scout were also busted

[rancid hound]

LB is normal in BF4

Not really

not as busted as attack helis

i dont feel its danger

[desert cove]

Your right

[rancid hound]

day 10000 of asking Oki to fix the fucking sight of tank

[desert cove]

Scouts were as effective as IFV/tanks

Attack helis were murder machines

[rancid hound]

beside helis most BF vehicles can only be as good as the crew

[desert cove]

With like 3 counters in match

AA, stealth jet, other helis

[rancid hound]

that's what happens when you have limited stingers but unlimited flares

[desert cove]

Inf was struggling very much

[rancid hound]

yeah BF4 isn't a good place to look for

Squad vehicles mechanic can be observed and learned from

they're not milsim AT ALL

[desert cove]

It is imo, BF4 did A LOT of things extremely well

Even ground vehicle balance

Air is fucked up, i am happy that its not planned for BBR

[desert cove]

They are very much mil sim

Not AS milsim as GHPC, but still

[rancid hound]

the only milsim part of Squad's vehicles is the ammo position

the rest is the same as BF4, you can't repair from the inside but who cares? Maps are big af anyways

[desert cove]

In terms of features, yes. Balance? NO.

[rancid hound]

More balanced then BBR lmao

[desert cove]

Taking inspirations from Squad gave us current shit show

[rancid hound]

you have T62 tanking M829A4

[desert cove]

Yes, but not a good example

[rancid hound]

we don't learn all of it

just the damage model

and the sighting system

vehicle thermal when

[desert cove]

If you want THAT level of realism, don't play games

It's contrary to good gameplay

[rancid hound]

that's not realism, that's balancing

I'm not asking for GHPC

can we add this so bush hiders can't just pop and fire without us noticing

[desert cove]

No. Its realism, not balancing.

[rancid hound]

T62 can't tank M829A4, I'm not sure what are you talking about

[desert cove]

Yeah, but we don't want that in a GAME

[rancid hound]

I didn't say we need to