Vehicle - Feedback

[desert cove]

Even tho he is BF4/Squad player

[rancid hound]

except they're a flea in your gameplay not a death trap

[rancid hound]

dude's probably only play Locker in BF4 and medic in Squad

[wide relic]

Yep

[desert cove]

Yet harder to destroy than fucking IFV

[rancid hound]

actually if being repaired constantly helis have more HP than a tank

[clever vessel]

Pov: the guy who only played op locker and op metro got their hands on vehickes

[rancid hound]

dude probably think he's a master in balancing after a match in Shanghai

[clever vessel]

Can confirm especially since people can and will repairbot helis (source: repairbots helis)

[rancid hound]

I'm 90% sure that even in Squad, Oki only plays medic

[desert cove]

He is a mortar guy in Squad

He said it himsefl on some earlier stream

A MORTAR MAIN

[rancid hound]

a mortar main in medic class

[clever vessel]

Sorry that’s a real thing?

A mortar main is a real thing???

[rancid hound]

would love to be proven false tho

[wide relic]

Was in a match last night an dude was flying a little bird wit speed hacks it was disgusting

[desert cove]

Yeah, in Squad, you can set up mortars and be effective on 70% of maps

It's fun gameplay loop from time to time

[clever vessel]

Found a heli hacker but get this: he was hacking with the transport heli gun

Got banned and all he had to show for it was 12 kills 2 deaths lmfao

[wide relic]

Doesn’t surprise me wit how many hackers there are banning all the time

[rancid hound]

I think dude probably watched WET and thought "BrUh TaNk'S tOo Op!!!!!"

Would be surprise if he never plays Talil

[eternal turret]

Helis used to be 2 shot by tank AP but Oki died to a tank once while on a heli so he stealth nerfed it to 3 shot.

[desert cove]

Iirc it was because people where whining that helis are to fragile, even tho they can't fly, and were dying in very easy to avoid situations

I doubt Oki have time to play game, and if yes, definitely not in ANY vehicle

[rancid hound]

"helis are too fragile"
||Like no shit, it's not a tank or a fucking gunship||

The people who whined probably thinks everything has to be a fucking tank except tank

[wide relic]

Yep especially little bird shit was designed for mobile not an Apache

[eternal turret]

And now we have an insane problem with heli backcappers just rushing towards the backline and never getting destroyed.

[rancid hound]

don't worry adding more streamer skins will fix

[eternal turret]

Yeah I think I'll just check out Enlisted again and see how it's doing.

At least I can move on that game without getting stuck in terrain every 5 seconds.

[graceful void]

god enlisted

i had maxed out everything before quitting a while back

such a shit game

was fun while it lasted though

[eternal turret]

can't be shittier than Battlebit

[wide relic]

I actually like the terrain on battle bit

[graceful void]

ex-gaijin devs

the grind itself was already so much worse

[desert cove]

That's a VERY HOT take

[rancid hound]

terrain is fine maps aren't

[desert cove]

I mean, a lot of rocks in stupid places to stop into, a lot of pleces that will stop you, a lot of extremly steep climbs that make any vehicle slow down to a turtle pace

FUCKING BRIDGES

[wide relic]

Bridges should be able to be destroyed

[desert cove]

Yeah, right

With current maps

Blocking acces to some points

Take on the level of Negdi's inertia

[thin mortar]

Cross posting this from the game-bugs channel since its a bug/heli problem. I have an issue with Helicopter controller support, specifically the little bird. When using a controller and trying to Shoot, pressing the shoot action will lockup the pitch and roll actions of the helicopter. Yaw is not affected. This lockup occurs if using the button on the controller or trying to circumvent the bug by assigning the shoot action to the keyboard and awkwardly hitting the spacebar (or other key). Here is a screen recording with a controller overlay to demonstrate what is happening. https://youtu.be/WlVpSIvvI6E

[vague flint]

The stream yesterday(?) he claimed he was medic main on the lockers servers & wants something like lockers for bbr

On god man I've accepted tanks/ifv is intentionally shit and are staying that way.

[frigid cloak]

The 50. cal humvees should have a 100 rounds with 3 or 4 ammo boxes to reload it

[clever vessel]

Well that explains why i feel like i’m playing op metro 80% of the time

[rancid hound]

talil in battlebit would be funny

[rancid hound]

it's called Oil Dunes actually

they removed it for some worse shit

[desert cove]

That isn't even in map pool

[rancid hound]

cuz they removed it

[desert cove]

Which is wierd because its quitr decent map

Not good, decent

[golden estuary]

It was alright, cash run there was wild.

Can't imagine driving any vehicles there tho.

Gonna be bouncing all over the place.

[rare sorrel]

still waiting for non ape brained balance

how can you trust a 1kd lockers only battlefield player to balance vehicles

[coral citrus]

Can we remove insta death in vehicles and just make it so destroying them kicks the crew out bleeding and black screened helicopter-crash style?

[rancid hound]

not really

you don't just survive a blast

[coral citrus]

I can provide you with a long list of videos showcasing crews bailing from disabled APCs/tanks after driving over mines/getting RPG'd...

[elder heath]

you dont survive a helicopter crash either but you can get revived from it

[coral citrus]

And more to the point, it's one more of those things that just makes me want to stay away from interesting battles as a driver. Why risk giving points to the enemy when I can be safe and stay back?

[wind cosmos]

for the littlebird just replace the "warming up" with a zoom so I can frickin see

the right click I mean

[rancid hound]

vehicles need more health

well not all

[rancid hound]

destroyed and disabled are different thing

[elder heath]

vehicles need less damage from c4 if we are sticking with the
"all classes should have c4" balance

[coral citrus]

Yeah, because there's no disabled in this game. Which there should be. But in the meantime that's what you can easily implement.

[torpid elk]

maybe if apcs had this as a benefit people would be more likely to use them for transport instead of humvees? idk though

its just, im not seeing the point of the vehicles. if the idea is they transport troops to a point and then provide fire support for the infantry they just deployed... im not really seeing that done. instead vehicles are better used just sitting back and performing the role of artillery. in fact, the lack of friendly fire makes them exceptional at this role as you dont really need to be careful or precise with where you shoot

[clever vessel]

vehicles in battlebit are a lot more akin to vehicles in call of duty with marginally better mechanics: they're ornamental to the point where the primary response they evoke is annoyance from infantry players

it's not as if they're impactless, because you can have 'an impact', but it's like what a wreath is to a door. It's not really a critical part of anything, and it's not even a part of anything at all

[coral citrus]

The transport vehicles are made largely pointless by current squad spawn system. The combat vehicles are made to stay back as artillery due to their current inability to be repaired back to full health after taking damage and the lack of an intermediate disabled stage that makes it exceptionally risky to get anywhere close to enemies.

[torpid elk]

like, im not advocating their outright removal but their role in game is completely different than their roles irl with mostly only passing similarities (tanks dominating flat open ground is the biggest). perhaps new vehicles should be added that actually support the roles vehicles have in battlebit rather than adding them in as a token "transport vehicle" that nobody ever uses

honestly, the only maps that i really see the appeal of btr/lav is on maps with open stretches of water than infantry might want to cross. its amphibious nature makes it a lot more flexible and nobody wants to try swimming across water and the boats are rather fragile and leave you exposed

[clever vessel]

the problem is that lots of battlebit, on a fundamental level, appears to be operation metro with some milsim mechanics. I don't know what it looked like before, and I don't presume to know the intention behind all of it, but this means that the current design of the game is fundamentally weighted towards extremely autonomous infantry with no value in squadplay or non-aggressive play

if you took away every vehicle in the game right now the only thing that might currently change is that on conquest the current experience of 'playing operation metro' is not temporarily disturbed by someone using a vehicle

like, if the goal is to keep this extreme autonomy, tanks and apcs need buffs to everything. they need customizability and comprehensive kit that will make them totally competitive, and still remain viable targets of other players. which will turn this into battlefield. that's not a bad thing in and of itself, but like, then... this will just be battlefield with a better matchmaking system

Otherwise, if the status quo is to be maintained? cut all assault vehicles, keep the ornamental transport vehicles, hell, cut the current number, and don't waste any more dev time with new vehicles

there isn't a real point to adding what are effectively skins to the same, weak, built-to-effectively-be-passive vehicles

[torpid elk]

its funny, life is cheaper in battlebit than in planetside. i have seen a lot more teamwork and squadplay in planetside than battlebit on account of the travel time required after spawning. medics were big fucking deals and because everyone was revived frequently and healed by medics ammo was also a thing people ran out of which made that a big deal too!

[coral citrus]

That feels a bit dramatic. Vehicles can already be pretty devastating with optimal positioning. Problem is most of the time optimal positioning for threatening infantry is also optimal positioning for them to near instantly blow you up.

[torpid elk]

like, because lives are so cheap in battlebit all people do is just kill themselves and then respawn with literally a full kit again at no cost.

if lives were more expansive the autonomy of infantry would massively drop

[clever vessel]

well, maybe the phrasing seems so, but:

i have, for my life, never seen an apc or a tank change the trajectory of a game. in a squad, with friends, or not, it doesn't matter. it's so cheap and so profitable to be an infantryman that any impact the average vehicle has is drowned out

[clever vessel]

on a less doomery sidenote: i'm wondering how the game would change if you could still spawn on objs while they were being captured?

[torpid elk]

i have seen them change a handful of fights every now and then by rolling up and then flattening a building and then driving away. they can break stalemates. they can also do this from like 50 miles away safe at the back of the map

[clever vessel]

like, bf4/bfv-esque where you're spawned a ways outside the point

[torpid elk]

on one hand, we might see actual defenders in fights instead of the token squad or two. on the other hand, im not sure a zerg popping out of nowhere to defend a point is much better.

i want good fights and that means numbers need to be about equal. the current problem is zergs just wash over a point. letting defends spawn in will help against zergs but it would also mean smaller scale fights could just have an entire army show up and ruin it similar to how some groups would do in planetside and run around and redeploy like 50+ people into a facility with barely 10 players on each side

[clever vessel]

hmm

in the end, it's still just too convenient to not make it powerful huh

[torpid elk]

it is still better and would help with the current problem of backcapping

[clever vessel]

new suggestion tbh: towed anti-tank and anti-air guns you can get from spawn or from via a hypothetical squad point system

defensive, flexible, most importantly possessing limited mobility, a concept which this game needs to embrace imo

[torpid elk]

if tanks were not made of paper and they didnt have to worry about everyone in the map having a match or flamethrower then i would love it

as it is everyone has a way to blow up a tank in a blink of an eye with either c4 or rpgs

[clever vessel]

oh yeah this would definitely only be a thing that has real impact if most classes lost their easy access to c4/rpgs

[torpid elk]

AA guns would be a pretty big deal though

[clever vessel]

honestly, this isn't specifically pertaining to vehicles anymore, but i'm honestly all for making trophy systems projectile-limited (shoots down only a certain amount) - and reducing the amount. Grenades shouldn't be outperformed in their niche by c4

[torpid elk]

it would really help limit the necessity of everyone having those tools though. right now, i think the balance idea is that everyone should be able to have a tool for any problem but that other classes should have better or more specialized tools.

so we have everyone getting c4, but engineer can get antivehicle grenades and an rpg while at it.

the problem is that everyone is picking the same tool and now the map is flooded with the only tool that really matters: c4

if we introduced stuff like anti-tank guns that support or engineer could build or something it would still give other classes a means to fight vehicles without absolutely flooding the battlefield with those tools

[clever vessel]

yeah currently the core balance idea works, but it works by rapidly marginalizing every option that isn't c4s, especially with the recent updates

[torpid elk]

now, instead of tanks being afraid of every bush and tree hiding some random recon bushwarrior waiting to toss a bunch of c4 onto them and blow them up in the blink of an eye they would only have to worry about sightlines of mostly static emplacements. it becomes similar to how players play when they know a sniper is in a certain direction. they stop sticking their head out in that direction willy nilly and use cover to minimize their exposure to the threat

[clever vessel]

also, c4 should really get a time delay between throwing and a throwing nerf imo

but that's more niche and i can see other, possibly more effective ways of going about it

[torpid elk]

a funky idea would be to make tanks and vehicles massively more durable but able to be disabled in various ways. that way, c4 would be unlikely to outright destroy the tank but you might damage the tracks and force an engineer to repair it before it can drive again

[clever vessel]

the playspace could just really do with things like this and incentives to fold fortifications into more permanent, defensible locales - like full-height walls as in bfv, imo

the current fortifications use is okay but scattershot and very temporary - they're only ever massed on chokes, where they're honestly quite decent at their job

[patent edge]

i dont snipe but surely pointing and clicking is skill as they have 100% accuracy guns

[clever vessel]

god i'm honestly weirdly salivating over the possibility of generalized engineering vehicles who provide infantry with sandbags/set up tougher fortifications

[torpid elk]

one of the issues is that buildings are... its awkward. buildings simultaneously feel too fragile and freakishly durable. after playing 2 matches of tensatown where my team founded the burger empire by fortifying the burger king, the first match the building stood for a freakishly long time, like 5+ minutes of dozens of players inside shooting at and being shot by dozens of enemies outside.

then the next match the building collapsed in the opening few minutes because a few antivehicle mines went off inside of it.

so, part of the problem with fortifying places and things is that if they are too fragile vehicles can just casually delete it (particularly btr/lavs). but they never feel consistent, other time they last forever even with a vehicle just really unloading on you

[coral citrus]

Requiring one person be the supplies Uber is kinda boring. But if transport humvees and APCs were able to carry supply boxes in their free seats then it might give these a bit more variety in the tasks they can perform, so that they do not need to shine at combat.

[clever vessel]

i'm down with that! absolutely great addition that'll encourage more diversification and commitment to their vehicles

[clever vessel]

and it's like, just not clear what constitutes the conditions for building collapse at all, and if they are there's extremely little visual indication in the game atm - i've seen everything from buildings with like six columns standing tall to buildings turning into the shanghai tower after a mild blast

[rare sorrel]

the lead dev is a lockers only player and not a good one at that

[rancid hound]

I think Oki has never even play conquest in BF

I remember back when he streamed playing BF4 and it's like he's in a metro only server

[torpid elk]

yea, like vehicles being good at collapsing buildings is fine but the issue for both sides, the vehicle players and the ones in the building, is that we have no good way to gauge how close a building is to collapsing. it isnt like it is a gradual process that happens in stages. its just sometimes out of nowhere the whole thing decides to suddenly destroy everything inside with no warning

[clever vessel]

And aside from the rooves and some types of buildings with marked destructible walls (bricks) it’s not exactly clear what can be destroyed and what will be - case in point again, the tensa homes, whom seem very inconsistently inclined towards partial, no, and all destruction

It gives destruction and fortifications so much more meaning when we can recognize what’s salvageable and what’s about to go kaboom, and also opens the doorway to things like reinforcing walls or reusing decimated house structures as more versatile mg nests

[rancid hound]

Wakistan moment

c4 death in case you ask

[vivid fog]

Sir, bb-scoreboard-screenshots is across the street

judging from the scoreboard and the names, is this JP?

[rancid hound]

yup

[vivid fog]

JP is always fkn sweaty

all my friends share the same sentiment

i moved to play at AUS

honestly not that much difference but at least people talk more

[fickle meadow]

this is off topic but how do you sort by squad?? it just lists everyone with no organization for me

[rancid hound]

i think its in settings under gameplay

[desert cove]

People don't use APC's as a transport becouse there is no need for it.

They are helis capable of taking 1/5 of whole team, spawn system, and fuck tone of jeeps and boats for personal use

APC's trensport capability is just a gimmick, and we really need to start thinking about them as IFVs

[elder heath]

nobody uses it because everyone is so fast compared to vehicles and the vehicles are so paper thin
except for exo support
theres no real reason to 'risk' hopping in a vehicle where your forced to stare out of a window, not knowing where your actually being driven to, especially when everyone has c4 available and can frag everyone inside the transport with 3 clicks and a zergrush

[desert cove]

yeah, that's second part of the problem

[torpid elk]

Gimmick i acknowledge, i was just brainstorming ways to make it a useful gimmick.

we currently just have IFVs without the I

[desert cove]

Vehicles do "well" on maybe 2 maps, Waki and azagor, Waki becouse you just spam HE on the brgdge full of lemmings to stupid to even go on the opposite side, so they get farmed while any counter with RPG's is blocked by a 20 snipers waiting for anyone to peak out.
Azagor is just small map with players going 3 possible routes, meeting enemy and clusterfucking eachother, you just spam he on enemies in groups for free kills

[desert cove]

And F too, given they die faster than they respawn

[torpid elk]

We have ifvs that dont transport infantry, cant fight, and because of how long respawn timers are for vehicles we dont have much vehicle either

[desert cove]

We have Little Bird, which is perfectly balanced and requires only few qol to be perfect

And a boat which is worse APC

[rancid hound]

lol the boat is a jokr

i cant see a reason to use it

[desert cove]

Becouse there is none

Not only it is extremly poorly designed, maps also doesn't need it at all

[rancid hound]

The apc can already go in water so the boat sucks even more than it already would

[desert cove]

APC can solo the boat in water. Deals more dmg, and is harder to hit, even with boat good accuracy

[rancid hound]

Apc has major downfalls but if you can handle them its a pretty solid vehicle in all aspects

[desert cove]

nah, it has limitations that make is objectively bad

[torpid elk]

My issues with helis is a combination of the annoyances they cause because of squad spawning and how it seems the only things that can threaten helis with good pilots are other helis.

I agree though that they are the best balanced vehicles

[rancid hound]

For me the biggest issue is the stupid ammo reloading

as far as tandems and c4 go thats just luck based

the rest of the flaws are annoying but not enough to make me not use the apc

[elder heath]

ammo reloading is kinda stupid
but it also solves the
"there is a tank camping that one hill the entire game will someone please do something about that"
problem a bit by forcing them to retreat to restock

[desert cove]

Not luck based, game design working against you

[elder heath]

like
do you REALLY want that wakistani water demon to have infinite ammo?

[desert cove]

Overall, after easily 8k kills on APC, it's worse at anything than a tank, requires much more skill, is much less rewarding and forgiving
It lacks identity,it lacks role, it isn't good at anything, at best decent,
While being harder to use than a tank

[torpid elk]

The tank is camping that hill because it is at the back of the map where it is safe and close to where they restock

[wide relic]

Perfectly balanced my ass u mean the god vehicle in batlle bit

[desert cove]

They are balanced very well?
They require extraordinary amount of skill to use properly, and they reward that. 99.9% players cannot get a few kills, because they aren't good enough

As Oki intended, literally

[wide relic]

U mean wit no real counter

People can be in that thing the whole match it’s stupid

[torpid elk]

Imo the problem is they become untouchable once a player does get good enough.

blackhawks are slow enough to theoretically be threatened (ignore their freakish durability)

little birds however, its like im trying to catch a mosquito with a pair of chopsticks

No amount of "just shoot the pilot out of the cockpit" is going to solve the problem that with the way they fly you will have better chances winning the lottery

[rancid hound]

LB is the only balanced vehicles, the rest is lackluster

[desert cove]

That's not true, a squad of players shooting at it will either kill pilot/destroy the choppa/or make him go away.
APC also can deal with them easily, ut it's easier to find good birb player than good APC player imo

[torpid elk]

Historically, there is a reason AA guns were fucking SHIT until proximity fuses were invented

[rancid hound]

well at least the fighting vehicles

the problem is somehow every motherfucking guns do the same damage to light vehicles

[desert cove]

Yeah, jeeps are nice, rhibs too

[desert cove]

Nah, it waries from 2 to 12, dmrs can go to 20

[rancid hound]

every automatic except Browning does 1

even sniper

unless you're shooting a quad I haven't tested it yet

[wide relic]

Sniper does 2

[rancid hound]

they feel more defensive than their actual offensive status

[torpid elk]

Well clearly what you havent seen the good pilots dude. You dont just "shoot at a littlebird". The dude is circling a point at over 150km/h laying pinpoint accurate fire.

i have literally seen a littlebird pilot strafe a perfect circle around the dude he was shooting at as if he was a fucking yoyo swinging in a circle from the the the string of bullets

[rancid hound]

except the RWS which is abused since you don't peak your head out

[rancid hound]

1 to heli, universal

Personally speaking LB is way too light and maneuvreable for its potential, beside that there's nothing more impressive

[torpid elk]

Like im serious, i saw a littlebird pilit draw a perfect circle in the sky around a dude with pinpoint accurate fire. He fucking wiped an entire squad on his own with a single circle, he was that accurate. You cant even shoot him either because of how fast he is

[magic ingot]

make them have quadbike health, problem solved

[torpid elk]

Besides, shooting just means accepting death anyways. The smart option is to try and get into cover. You only shoot if you are caught out in the middle of nowhere

[rancid hound]

I'm not sure why every gun does 1 damage to a heli

literally zero balancing effort in it

[magic ingot]

Jokes aside, has anyone destroyed LB tail rotor? Is it destructible?

[wide relic]

I hit once never been able to again

[rancid hound]

if you hit it likely it'd already be blown up

I haven't seen a crashed LB, only wrecks of them

[desert cove]

I have seen them, I have shoot down guys doing 30-0 in like 7m of the game,

[rancid hound]

it's not hard to down a pilot but it's annoying trying to get one mid fight on Wakistan

[desert cove]

yeah, but hard to do

[rancid hound]

man the balancing between vehicles themselves are hilarious

I feel bad for Abrams users their tank is like 20% larger but have the same stats as T90

It's easy to peak through static hesco blocks and shoot Abrams using the T90 without getting shot, not the other way around

[torpid elk]

Yea, sounds about right.

my complaint with helis is that they, when skill rises right enough, are too safe. We cant give engineers lock ons (god that would be fucking AWFUL) but i want something that can reliably... maybe not threaten unless they are cocky and overconfident but at least deter helis from just flying everywhere at the back of the map right outside their enemy's base

[rancid hound]

ATGMs when

need a way to bring helis down

[torpid elk]

I was thinking some sort of AA vehicle witb proximity fused projectiles. Balance it with firing arc maybe? Basically something to tell helis to get the fuck away and stop dropping people at the back of the map

Either that or we add a ciws phalanx technical

[rancid hound]

that'd definitely be used against infantry more....

[patent edge]

U realise atgm are anti tank not heli?

[torpid elk]

Already ahead of you. I mentioned firing arc 🧠

[magic ingot]

Abram irl has more crews and has safer ammo storage

[patent edge]

And ERA

[rancid hound]

you can... guide it?

[magic ingot]

weird thing btw, I scored way more kills on btr over lav for some reason

[patent edge]

Anti Tank Guided Missles

Atgm

[desert cove]

Just add proximity fuze to apc HE

[rancid hound]

BTRs have smaller turret

[rancid hound]

no just make it fire more accurately with more splash

[torpid elk]

I got an idea! Give tanks era but make it splatter nearby infantry!

[magic ingot]

uh… so? Sorry my brain is smooth

[rancid hound]

airburst is fucked up

[rancid hound]

less likely to get hit

[desert cove]

Splash is good, accuracy needs to be like in boat imo

APC is limited in AA by its velocity

[torpid elk]

And firing angle too!

[rancid hound]

splash is dogshit along side damage, not by a big margin tho (except for damage)

[magic ingot]

My PB is 4 tail rotor snipe in one match

[rancid hound]

you can guide it to whatever you want, I'm not sure if you're saying this unironically

[patent edge]

Except irl they are too slow to hit a heli

Thats why they are anti tank - because they literally cant hit helis

[magic ingot]

oh right tail rotor destroy xp is not boosted by engineer class, pls fix

[rancid hound]

they're faster than an RPG + they're guided, I'm not sure what's your point

[foggy whale]

in reality the absolute majority of time when a vehicle is "killed" it's not via a catastrophic explosion. The crew compartment is separate from ammo storage on most modern vehicles as well.

[rancid hound]

T90 💀

[magic ingot]

Not T90

[rancid hound]

considering your ass gets blown up usually by c4 you'd get squashed anyways

but c4 shouldn't deal a big blow to modern vehicle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6A7fKcotyM

Every motherfucker is an AT apparantly, thanks Oki

[torpid elk]

Im an advocate for the introduction of mission kills combined with massively raising the durability of vehicles. C4 will disable a tank in various ways and force an engineer, likely the driver being forced to get out, to repair it.

[rancid hound]

maybe in hardcore, nobody's gonna repair a tracked vehicles mid game

[magic ingot]

this is not a milsim

[torpid elk]

So a tank could lose tracks and be rendered unable to move but could still shoot, it could have the turret damaged, etc

[patent edge]

Rather i think c4 should be nerfed - way too many run it for good reason

[rancid hound]

you don't get out to repair and get your vehicle stolen by a stray dude, that's not fun tbh

[torpid elk]

Make it take like 5 seconds with a repair tool. Im betting vehicle players would prefer it to the entire vehicle being popped

[rancid hound]

idk just give everyone nukes

c4 definitely needs a nerf

[rancid hound]

I think HP buff is enough

[torpid elk]

This is a problem with the game not having a way for you to reserve a vehicle you recently left

[rancid hound]

^

[magic ingot]

HLL handles it by class, you can only get into tank if you’re tank commander/tank crew, who only has a pistol lol

[rancid hound]

crewman kit has been suggested (by me), every motherfuckers hate it

well idk

[magic ingot]

they now give spawn heals to “prevent stealing vehicles”

[rancid hound]

(ground) vehicles have so many downsides that solving one issue isn't enough to justify another drawback being added

[magic ingot]

can’t stop my ssd and fiber to get in match fast and snatch the tank before anyone else does tho lmfao

[torpid elk]

Basically, make it so vehicles cant just be yoinked and even enemies cant yoink it from you if you are within 5-10m of it and are alive. C4 would leave a tank a sitting duck and force crew to either leave and fight off the guy who bombed them before repairing it or abandon the tanj

[rancid hound]

squad lock vehicles pls ffs

[magic ingot]

now imagine giving SL the ability to call in vehicle with squad points

[rancid hound]

that sounds way too complicated for a game like this tbh

[magic ingot]

~~tonk spam imminent ~~

[rancid hound]

"SL airdrop me a BTR"

[magic ingot]

If they make mg only btr (no HE, so no building destruction and splash) it might be okayly balanced

[torpid elk]

Well what then? Buff the health? Too much and that just makes explosives useless

[rancid hound]

c4 restriction

if devs decide to keep current damage status

[magic ingot]

also: humvee have way too much hp? Apparently one heat can’t kill it

[torpid elk]

Its a step but i really doubt this alone will solve much

[rancid hound]

c4 currently are meant for wall breaching not blowing vehicles, maybe reserve them for engis and assault will work better than just universally equip them for all classes

[magic ingot]

And transport vehicles don’t have rear dbl dmg iirc

[rancid hound]

vehicles have zero upsides regarding the issue of protection, tanking em up to like 50% more HP wouldn't add any real downsides

[magic ingot]

Support cries in shambles

[rancid hound]

fucking c4 spam is way too annoying

[torpid elk]

In not concerned about protecting the vehicle players sitting at the back of the map sniping with a tank. Im concerend with getting then to actually use the vehicles and make an impact. They need to be able to survive the frontlines while still being threatened by infantry. You cant fucking do this with just a straight hp buff because all that changes is make sitting at the back even safer because now they are even harder to kill

[magic ingot]

Suggested in gadget thread

[patent edge]

Ngl if medics didnt have c4 vechiles would die a lot less just because a. Everyone plays medic and b. Medic needs nerf

[rancid hound]

medics don't need c4, the rest is ok

[magic ingot]

i die to engi rpg more

6 rpg in one life is kinda ridiculous

[torpid elk]

Players are playing optimally and i want to change optimal vehicle gameplay from "i sit at the back and shell people for free kills" to "i follow infantry to support their pushes and synergize with them protecting me and repairing me when i get disabled by damage"

[rancid hound]

I'm curious how will HP buff encourage more camping? Camping is done literally because vehicles are weaker than what they're supposed to be

[magic ingot]

oh did I forget to mention you can zero in rpg iron sight?

[patent edge]

Rpgs out of helicopters slaps

[rancid hound]

I agree with the issue of camping but vehicles are currently dominated by infantry on the field most of the times

[magic ingot]

AC130 above

[rancid hound]

it's not like we're tanking a beast, we're tanking a paper tiger at best

[magic ingot]

Heli physics is jank in first place, projectiles don’t inherit vehicle velocity making aiming way easier than should

[torpid elk]

Any direct hp buff doesnt just apply at the frontline but also at the rear where no, if any, enemies are. If you buff vehicles enough that getting bricks of c4 and rpgs thrown at you dont threaten you (you know, like what youbcould expect at the front) then you are just that much safer at the back too.

[desert cove]

Bandaid solution

[rancid hound]

for now

[desert cove]

No. It never should be done that way

It's just stupid

[rancid hound]

Oki doesn't seem to have the capacity to understand the magnitude of his questionable system

[torpid elk]

Look, i dont want to be mean but a direct hp buff just makes camping safely at the back of the map even more dominant. If you cant understand why then you need to start considering why do players play the way they do

[magic ingot]

engi got c4, rpg and p90, I don’t see why I wouldn’t play it to f up everyone’s day

[rancid hound]

well it's either HP buff or explosive nerf, depending on your interpretation at this point

[torpid elk]

I can agree with this from what i have heard about shotguns.

[rancid hound]

so since it's getting quite confusing I'm gonna wrap up my entire solutions right here:

1. Keeping current explosive system, buff HP to allow it to tank more hits

2. Nerf the explosive system, keep HP the same

[torpid elk]

Rpgd should be vehicle killers, c4 should be vehicle disablers. Thats the way i view it.

maybe leave some room in there for mines too. Im not sure whether i want them to at best disable or be capable of destroying...

And antivehicle grenades too now that i think about it

[magic ingot]

ngl I don’t really have much to say about ground vehicles since they do pretty okay if infantry can follow to cover it from c4 fire or just sit at spawn to anti spawn camping bozos

[rancid hound]

way too complicated for a playerbase with the mentality of a BF locker main. Nice point but sorry man I don't think it'll fit well

[magic ingot]

Easiest 70/0 ever

[rancid hound]

again the quickest way to fix current explosive problem is just restrict it to its designated class and purpose

[magic ingot]

why does class even exist

[rancid hound]

I wish I don't have to tell infantry to advance while I'm clearing enemies at C for them

Wakistan

[magic ingot]

Pubs do be like that

[torpid elk]

After playing voxel fortify (shit gamemode right now btw) im going to have to pick a nerf to explosives, particularly in radius too (or maybe just make damage have harsher falloff within the radius).

in a mode entirely around building they have 2 tank spawns like every 30 seconds capable of flattening a like 5m radius instantly. The map is totally flat too so just shoot at places people have built. Chances are a person is there and you get a free kill

But other sources of explosions have the same problem in that mode

[rancid hound]

https://tenor.com/view/gigachad-chad-gif-20773266

[magic ingot]

buildable trophy to disable rpg and tank shells pls

[rancid hound]

you shouldn't be able to intercept tank rounds, but rpg should be

[wide relic]

C4 should diffently be vehicle killers also watch a vid on there xplosions an you’ll see

Vehicles aren’t supposed to be invincible

[rancid hound]

❌

[torpid elk]

How much c4? Currently the problem witb c4 is it kinda does everything.

im not saying you shouldnt be able to kill a vehicle with it but as it stands a dude hiding at the back of a building can toss c4 like 10m out and through a window onto you silently and then blow you up with no warning.

if we want to keeo c4 as a general purpose tool it needs to be dialed back

[wide relic]

They need to nerf the throw distance is all . The size of it all depends plus if ur utilizing other things

[torpid elk]

You know what, keep the throw distance but nerf c4 damage and add a satchel charge which is also throwable but a much shorter range. Sticks like c4 but has a fuse instead of a remote detonator and have a much larger blast radius and damage and you only carry 1 or 2

Maybe something like that?

[wide relic]

Maybe. I just think they need to shorten the throw distance

I’d like to be able to take out tank treads to

[magic ingot]

Don’t be an emoji ass try to democracy bully someone, say why you disagree

[wide relic]

I think they would a good idea but implementing them would be bad since the only way to kill vehicles at this time is by explosives or via vehicle vs vehicle an would make campin more of a thing than it already is

Tho I will say rpg directly should be reduced damage for tanks at least

[desert cove]

They also aren't supposed to be unplayable

[thorny mason]

piggybacking off this; hot take here, I think the recent l-armor damage buff that the Littlebird got is their way of telling us "it's not for hunting infantry"

if you're an exceptionally good pilot it can be and it is, but I think the intention is for the littlebird to be air "support", not air superiority

two miniguns that don't need to reload with an exceptionally high fire rate, ammo count, and non-negligible l-armor damage

[desert cove]

Imo, LB not dealing dmg to tanks/APC give clear enough message

Buff to l dmg was just to big

[thorny mason]

i just don't see the bird designed for hunting infantry in general

in spite of those guns, they have the drawbacks of being non-gimbaled, pilot controlled guns with a relatively long spool up time

[desert cove]

But that's what they are the best at

[thorny mason]

i would hard disagree on that, that's what they're most used for

i would much prefer the average pilot to assist big transport birds and take out other helis than fly around and maybe get a single drop every now and then

[desert cove]

They are good at both tbh

[vast sinew]

https://tenor.com/view/hadeel928-cat-tea-coffee-morning-gif-25844646

(after going 52/0 on valley in LB)

[wide relic]

Once u destroy that silo around c I’m sure it’s easy pickings

[clever vessel]

Honestly I kinda want to see a more in depth tank disabling and repair system that includes this

[graceful void]

oh jeez, can't imagine how aids it's going to be once people can disable vision ports and treads

before finishing things with a tandem up the ass

[desert cove]

Yeah, it will end exactly like that.

[clever vessel]

Oh I mean any change kinda just requires a total rework or cut of the tandem imo

[desert cove]

Everytime someone brings this up I explain that in BBR, it will never work, too saft gameplay and movement, to much players, to narrow maps

[clever vessel]

We have to work in the theoretical world where the Devs did not unironically create a one shot weapon for no reason other than convenience

[desert cove]

Let's leave thoeritical things AFTER vehicles start workin gin this game

[wide relic]

And it’s tactial

[desert cove]

It's fucking stupid idea, that's what it is

Just drive into lonovo C and stay in place for 10 s lol

[frigid cloak]

Like the limpet mine from battlefield 1?

[graceful void]

camping 300m away with a tank is tactical

[wide relic]

It’s amazin idea even for vehicles ud have to be smart about it an it will cut down on the chicken shits that go back to base to heal after 2 hits

[graceful void]

and it's just the sort of change we need to really reinforce the VEHICLE META

[wide relic]

So what I’m suggesting

[graceful void]

yes, so we'll force tankers to engage in TACTICAL camping

👍

[desert cove]

It's total nerf and would make ANY gameplay style worse and even more not viable

And people would camp even more

If you want them nerfed just say it, no need to hide behind "tactical gameplay ideas"

[clever vessel]

Me, sitting out in the water on Basra: tactical

[magic ingot]

Me, sitting on the hill outside of spawn chopping down trees with apc so enemy stop hiding in bushes like viet cong: tactical

[wide relic]

Not if the armor gets reworked where if u hit wit a rpg it doesn’t do that much damage from the front

[wide relic]

I actually just want them totally reworked . Only vehicle I want nerfed is lb

[magic ingot]

Many shooter games have this problem of vehicles being extremely vulnerable without infantry support and you can’t expect pubs do that

While aerial units is its own can of worm

[wide relic]

I mean that’s a given both rely on each other u don’t see just armor just infantry there movin Cordinated

[magic ingot]

just play escort mode where infantry have to stay with the tank

(Not in BBR)

[clever vessel]

Oh yeah speaking of armor

[wide relic]

M4 gunners in the back for apc?

[clever vessel]

Wondering if it would make sense for tanks to get an armor 'bar' which protects it from most explosives sans ap

[magic ingot]

do historically accurate skirt armor which negates HEAT altogether

[wide relic]

I was thinkin of a radar thing that detects where ur shot from an distance also on tank wide

[desert cove]

That's fair

[desert cove]

Yeah, BF4 solved this problem tho

BFV has very nice middle gorund imo

BFV gameplay is something devs should strive to

[rare sorrel]

BFV vehicle gameplay is certainly something the devs shouldn't aspire too

Same issue in it, tanks became glorified snipers

[clever vessel]

It's most certainly a vast improvement still, considering in BFV I remember much higher tanker confidence to play both aggressively and ptfo

[rare sorrel]

Because the tanks actually soaked more damage, it's not some great mechanical difference

Also only one class had dynamite and its throwing range wasn't great

Minimap

[clever vessel]

Yeah but that was... Pretty good for the vehicle balance wrt infantry imo

[rare sorrel]

It wasn't because it was horribly balance and designed too

Again tanks were glorified snipers

[clever vessel]

Right I forgot about the Pacific maps

[wide relic]

Lol I’m tempted to reinstall it lol

[clever vessel]

Honestly the main thing this game could learn from BFV is map design ngl (not the Pacific maps)

Look I loved the Pacific maps but having the most obvious chokes between every point was a god damn nightmare

[graceful void]

didn't they also dumb it down later?

i remember liking it for a while

but i quit, and then they fucked up all the ttk

and made vehicles easier

[clever vessel]

They dumbed it down quite a bit yeah espec during the repeated ttk changes

[graceful void]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1047559576830095452.webp?size=48&name=sadge&quality=lossless

i enjoyed BFV vehicle gameplay back then

i didn't think it was that complicated but casual fps gamers do be like that

[clever vessel]

Vehicles were kinda fun at the start and then players complained attrition out of the game nearly entirely

Still find them fun when I go back but they've lost their niche

[desert cove]

me to

[clever vessel]

Any of y'all BFV PS4 players

[desert cove]

Console peasant

Only glorious PC

[clever vessel]

Damn right, but it was fun as hell

[desert cove]

(500h bf4 and 1000h skyrin on Xbox lmao)

[clever vessel]

Still remember my 11 V1 streak for 8 hours

[clever vessel]

God damn, nice

[desert cove]

wait

[wide relic]

Yep

[desert cove]

maybe not 500h, definetly a lot, but not that much, i don't remember tbh

Skyrim definetly was abused tho

[desert cove]

How exactly? I played only after 2022

[wide relic]

If i remember Correctly they shorten the map a bit I haven’t played in a few months tho

[clever vessel]

The game's attrition system started out stronger with less ammo per player, no health regen, no picking up ammo and health directly from medics and supports

It actually already received an effective death blow after the beta when devs responded to ppl complaining that the game was turning into an ammo hunt by increasing base ammo so much most classes could easily skirt asking for ammo boxes just by using the buildable resup points on the objs, though the direct ammo and health pickups is a 2021 feature iirc

Tanks instead got stuck with a much more intense attrition system, actually pretty similar to bbt now that I think about it - main difference being more base ammo, customisation, and the presence of some buildable vehicle repair points throughout most maps

While it was now viable to go aggressive, the base impulse was still for most tank players to sit back and take passive positions far back facing chokes like on rotterdam

As @rare sorrel said it was balanced pretty badly, and the main boost was merely that tanks had substantially higher health and therefore higher leeway

Except for light tanks

Pretty common to see light tanks basically serving as glorified armored cars on most maps, which, basically makes them this game's apcs lmfao

[magic ingot]

camping at spawn is total valid strategy to not get one shot by tandem

[clever vessel]

No I agree! It's valid and while frustrating I get why if exists

[magic ingot]

I got yelled at every time I do that

[clever vessel]

TL;DR: you can't have attrition for vehicles and not infantry

Or at least, vehicles can't actually suffer from harsher attrition than infantry, not unless they're much stronger individual units, but that just makes them extreme wild cards

[wide relic]

I just c4 the ally tank now if I see them campin in spawn 😀

[magic ingot]

can you even damage it

[clever vessel]

In BFV tanks could be anything between useless and going 80-0 holding a really important choke with honors

[magic ingot]

Iirc FF is disabled

report griefing regardless

[wide relic]

When the enemy hits the c4 it acts as there kill

[magic ingot]

oh

oh

[wide relic]

Ya had somebody do that to me how I learned it

[magic ingot]

Such a D move

Will 100% report griefing if I’m the tanker

[clever vessel]

Problem is devs' impulse to nerf things that are deliberately marginalising themselves as opposed to buffing them tbh

[wide relic]

I respect the creativity to it

[magic ingot]

Tensatown tank in town is as good as dead

[clever vessel]

They see shit not doing their job and are like alright let's make it harder for you to do your job :3

[wide relic]

Usually the threat of it in text chat tho is enough to get them movin

[rare sorrel]

You can go on about it but in the end

[magic ingot]

Wait

Theres text chat in game??

[rare sorrel]

This game is made by, designed by and balanced by a 1kd lockers player

[clever vessel]

Top left by default

[clever vessel]

Honestly I'm glad it's a mid lockers player and not a good one

Good lockers player wouldn't even make a game with tanks

[rare sorrel]

Mid? 1kd is terrible for a lockers only

[magic ingot]

Idk man, might want to study what makes HLL tankers moving

[desert cove]

Unfortunatly true

[clever vessel]

Well I wouldn't know as someone who plays lockers very reluctantly

[rare sorrel]

In regards to vehicles the problem isn’t how good or bad oki is, but him being a lockers only player

[clever vessel]

Real

But it's fine tbh so long as he's up for listening to feedback from ppl who have played combined arms modes/games... If he is up for it that is

[rare sorrel]

Not even just an inf, it lockers only. Trash map for drooling players who have zero awareness and like shooting down narrow corridors and explosive spam

He’s not listening to feedback, he has openly stated he hates vehicles and this game is about inf. Vehicles are here because he straight ripped 80% of battlefield and made it Roblox

[clever vessel]

He has what

[rare sorrel]

What did you expect from a lockers only player

[clever vessel]

Ah fuck it I'm redownloading bfv

[desert cove]

Source would be nice

[clever vessel]

^

It's not really like an existential thing anyhow, just a disappointment for me, but bbt is still fun

[desert cove]

I mean, one out of 3-4? gameloops being complatly bad, broken and borderline unplayable is bad thing

[clever vessel]

Yeah

What to do~ at least there's BFV and 4

[desert cove]

Wakistan C?

[cedar ember]

Imo little bird is balanced. I have maybe faced a good little bird 3 times? The big birds with a half decent pilot can make quick work of a little bird

[rancid hound]

openly admits "players are the problem not vehicles"

jesus christ this argument

search up "vehicle" from Oki and go to page 3 of the search

[desert cove]

let him play then lol

[wooden viper]

I respect your opinion, but I whole heartly disagree. Infantry is useless against a good player. I have seen in Wakistan a good pilot clear the bridge from our forces in less than 5 minutes. IMO we need an anti-air solution, either as a tank or as a gadget for the Engineer.

[desert cove]

You want dedicated counter for maybe 300-500 players if not less form 40000k?

Even the best of the best players in LB aren't invinvible, you just need to try counter them. But if your team is too busy circle ressing in waki bridge, so they can farm unopposed, that's not thier fault

[wide relic]

That’s 80 % of waki games tho one team is always just focusin on bridge……

[desert cove]

Map issue tbh,not only one with waki

Same with tanks going 100-0+, 99% chance its waki (or azagor), not other map

[cedar ember]

Anti air wouldn't be a bad idea, but the current state of the big birds, anti air would make them mostly useless. They die SO easily from tail rotor hits as is. And since small arms fire hurts them, throwing in anti-air would be too much.

Anti air wouldn't be bad though, because it's another choice. Engis have to choose anti armor or anti air. As long as big bird gets some love, I'm all for it.

And maybe countermeasures... A good pilot should always be hard to knock down.

[wide relic]

Anti air would be the equalzier . If it’s a good pilot they won’t really notice it

[golden estuary]

With LB, it's OK in the hands of average pilots, but it's whack in the hands of good pilots who basically snipe from long range with it while being nigh unhittable.

I wonder what's the damage falloff for minigun. If there's any.

The glass damage resistance and bandage healing basically means those pilots will never die since any bullets that reach them would have some piss tier fell-off damage 😂 and the only "viable" strat against that is the Aug, but the distance still means you only drive them away for a brief moment to repair.

[rancid hound]

you know he won't right

[rancid hound]

exactly

[golden estuary]

The whole point of AA is to make good pilots less oppressive.. Not oppress average pilots.
If good pilots aren't affected by AA at all, why even bother adding them?

Same logic as flat fines for speeding VS percentage income fines, rich people with fancy cars don't care about hundred dollar fines.

[pine roost]

Fix the prancing pony thing going on with especially quad-bikes where they go on the back wheels and stays like that...

[wide relic]

What about fixed aa guns in location from squad build that way u have to use actual squad points

I have 0 skill flying in most games this one im sure aa would make things intresting at least . Or have them redo bullet damage for helicopter vehicles

[desert cove]

If good player won't notice/be affected by AA, then it's not an equalizer but another way to farm kills from inexp. pilots

[wide relic]

Ya an ? There’s been couple times I’ve been able to go after helis that landed wit c4

[wide relic]

I should reword that sweat pilots u know the ones I’m talkin about . I suck at flyin an still can secure kills I die by crash more often than not

[golden estuary]

AA should not make the experience of average pilots suck, but make the life of infantry VS ace pilots suck less.

Buildable emplacements sound nice but you know people are just gonna use them on infantry 😂

Even battlefield, which put AA emplacements in spawn, still had people use them to shoot at infantry outside of spawn

[desert cove]

There is kind of no sollution for really like 0.01% of playerbase being good pilots

Without harming all transport helis guys and raising skill floor even more

That's just thing players need to accept, learn to avoid, mitigate and counter

[golden estuary]

Damage fall off would be a possible bandaid. Since those ridiculous shooting distances is something only those 0.01% do.

[desert cove]

If they will be behaving like lemmings and just ignore helis, but still whine about thier existence, that's just thier problem

Players learned how to do AT, and can come with very creative ways to destroy vehicles

To the point where on 254 armour is unplayable, imo

[wide relic]

Not if they pull a battlefield an make it so hits on infantry aren’t as effective maybe

[wide relic]

Ya idk some of those mini gunners on black hawks got laser accuracy

[golden estuary]

Minigun when you have a pilot who's lagging is oof

[desert cove]

They suck, they need buffs

[golden estuary]

Idk. Some connection fuckery between pilot and gunner makes it suck even more.

[rare sorrel]

#battlebit-eng message

S... — 04/12/2017 12:19
well i been working on FPShooting systems about 5-6 years
but vehicles
0 years
XD

another one

[rancid hound]

xd

[placid panther]

I think there should be a like 5 minute timer on tanks, IFV's, and attack littlebirds, what ends up happening is someone will sit in a vehicle the entire game and no one else get to enjoy it, maybe after 5 minutes you get a 1 minute remaining timer giving you time to fly back to base in a Helicopter for example, then there would be 5-10 minutes or so where that person cannot enter the drivers seat of a vehicle or any seat in a tank, also if a person jumps out of a drivers seat and is back in within 30 seconds or so it will resume the timer, if they are out of the vehicle for over 2 minutes or get certain distance from empty vehicles, say 150 meters, the timer restarts and they can get 5 more minutes in the offensive vehicles, these numbers are just spitballs but i would love to see a system like this implicated in the next couple of updates.

[golden estuary]

Some sort of method to prevent vehicle hogging would be needed with the current tank/lb playstyles.

[rare sorrel]

my brain is going to explode from those takes

[torpid elk]

the solution isnt to massively restrict players who want to play a certain way.

the solution is to give more freedom. make spawning vehicles cost squad points. now losing them is less of a risk because you can more easily buy a new one to use instead of waiting like 2 minutes for them to respawn. it would make the risk of using the vehicles at the frontline much lower than it currently is

now anyone can use a vehicle if they want and have enough squad points

[golden estuary]

Gotta have more ways than just attacking to earn squad points too

And also people who jump squads to use points or respawn 😂

[coral citrus]

Like the concept in general but you'll also need some form of passive income for losing teams to avoid them getting spawncamped against superior firepower.

[torpid elk]

Absolutely, that is among other changes that will need to be made to squad points

[clever vessel]

there's a bit of comedy in the fact that a thread about vehicle feedback has become a general balancing thread lolol

comedy in the sad sense, but still, lured a laugh out of me

[coral citrus]

I mean, as a vehicle enjoyer I do feel a bit bad when I see someone spawning into the tank or APC just a millisecond after I managed to. Making it so I can have my fun without taking away others' opportunities is a reasonable consideration I think. :)

[torpid elk]

Its just the nature of systems. Everything is interconnected.

[clever vessel]

Absolutely, and I'm glad we're having these conversations tbh

[rancid hound]

yup, better be off topic but helpful rather than silent

[warm dome]

Blackhawk should take no more than 2 heat rpg shots to take down, they’re hard enough to hit already but would reward good aiming with the rpg

[rancid hound]

"BuT iT's ToO wEaK"

crybabies will cry about it being too weak and not a heli with gunship armor

agree tho

[clever vessel]

On a squad points related topic I have this idea of adding demolitions explosives that do building damage and high infantry damage with very little splash and range - e.g. a Bangalore

[rancid hound]

that sounds contradicting

[clever vessel]

Not intended for buildings but for fortifications

[warm dome]

Huh

Isn’t that just c4

[rancid hound]

satchel charge when

[clever vessel]

Hmmst honestly yeah sounded better in my head

[rancid hound]

well just make frag RPG better

[clever vessel]

Was just thinking of fortifications only explosives mainly

[warm dome]

Ong

[rancid hound]

that solves a lot of issues alone

[warm dome]

Rpg needs to be more viable across the board

[clever vessel]

What changes wld you suggest

[rancid hound]

more splash

more damage

it's still restricted by explosive kill cap

nerf HEAT damage on infantry please

tandem splash shouldn't exist

[clever vessel]

You know what? Makes sense, for that

[warm dome]

Nooo it’s literally a sniper 😭

If u are engineer u get a sniper and vector and crap tons of c4

Heat mad powerful

[clever vessel]

Actually fuck now I kinda want a bulldozer attachment for the tank

Makes it dreadfully slow but it just eviscerates fortifications, and can be ditched anytime

It'd be great utility, especially right now with the game's fortification-laden chokes

(well. If it doesn't get blown up by three engis, that is)

[warm dome]

True

That would be good

[rancid hound]

tanks are already slow tho

[clever vessel]

That is quite true

...and honestly the main balancer would probably be the sheer vulnerability of doing it in an active combat zone

[rancid hound]

if Oki insists on keeping his questionable system then the only choice left is to add APS

[clever vessel]

APS?

[rancid hound]

active protection system

[clever vessel]

If the current system is to be kept I doubt Oki would implement it anyways

[rancid hound]

sadly yeah

[wooden viper]

The problem is exactly as I said: LB have too much mobility. Most Pilots I encounter hog the vehicle for most of the match. They do fly-bys with upside down. Sorry, I refuse to believe it's only a "Infantry ignoring heli problem". If someone wakes up, and every match they play they decide to be a LB pilot. With enough matches he'll eventually run through most opposition.

[halcyon rover]

This was about making the CTF objective a vehicle

[rancid hound]

what

really

[halcyon rover]

Yea

[rancid hound]

that's a goofy idea

[halcyon rover]

It was my idea

Lmao

[rancid hound]

so essentially making objective mobile?

[halcyon rover]

We were talking about how to make CTF flag less 100 grenades per minute

[rancid hound]

lol

[halcyon rover]

To do some overwatch escort style stuff

But Oki replied w/ that

If driver gets objective stuck in ditch, game over

[rancid hound]

he should fix maps first before introducing new goofy modes tbh

[coral citrus]

Let trophy stick on vehicles

[rancid hound]

lmao imagine a quadbike with a bunch of trophies stuck on it running around

[torpid elk]

just make it so the objective can get reset? or maybe add ways to help get vehicles unstuck too, like maybe a ramp that we can build?

[rancid hound]

ramps would be really nice

[torpid elk]

support quadbike 🤔

[halcyon rover]

Ngl the concept was not that serious and CTF turned out fine anyways

[rancid hound]

i still have yet to get a chance to play ctf

havent seen any servers playing it

:(

[torpid elk]

i played ctf a few times, i think having 2 flags per team might be better personally. would help divide up the fights and reduce how clusterfucky grenade spammy things can get. havent played lately though so maybe it is different now

[desert cove]

That's just a mechanic to punisch competent players for doing good and not dying.

[wide relic]

I like it

[desert cove]

It is "infantry ignoring helis problem". You literally can deal damage to little bird with a fucking side arms. You can shoot out pilot from his seat. Just shoot at LB for gods sake, 90% of weapons do damage to it, some like SCAR/AK15/AUG do a lot of it.
Not to mention RPG'S or Vehicles, especially APC and 7m CROW and HMG

JUST SHOOT AT MOTHER FUCKER

The amount of pilots able to avoid squad worth of playerrs focusing them is extremely low, if they even exist. Even 100-0 guys will fold when 10 players will start shooting at them.

[rancid hound]

no

[wide relic]

I think should put ctf on district

[torpid elk]

look man, im going to be honest. i am NOT going to blow through hundreds of rounds only for like maybe 10% to hit for a chance to hit and maybe kill the pilot. that fucking lightshow i shoot into the sky will be a fucking beacon for any and every enemy recon player too. i have quite literally traced gunfire through trees to headshot people i literally cannot see.

[desert cove]

Then too bad for you. YOU CAN easily counter them, if you refuse then too bad

[warm dome]

Which is why Blackhawk should take 2 heat rpg and little birds 1

[wide relic]

Little birds def should take one

[rancid hound]

2 heats for a blackhawk is harsh

[magic ingot]

They already die to one?

[rancid hound]

Considering that its already easy enough to take out the tail and bring it down instantly

[wide relic]

It’s not that easy to do

[rancid hound]

if you’re in an apc or tank its very easy

[wide relic]

Infantry not so much

[rancid hound]

not sure how many shots it takes with a rifle or one of the humvees with guns

[torpid elk]

Infinite, because there will be an engineer inside repairing it

[magic ingot]

I’m not even sure what’s black hawk supposed to do

[torpid elk]

Be shit gunship or a worse version of the transport littlebird

[rancid hound]

if there’s a good crew yes but most of the time thats not the case

[wide relic]

It takes a lot of bullet damage for it go down . I’ve used all the ammo on humvee one time an never could bring it down

[magic ingot]

You kinda owe to get F trying to backcap and instantly tail sniped

[torpid elk]

God, i hate backcapping 😩

[wide relic]

I have no pity for helis

[magic ingot]

I steal an apc and camp at spawn for those foolish back cappers

[rancid hound]

they can hunt other birds

[torpid elk]

Ooops, the bushes speak c4 and tandem

[rancid hound]

although it depends on how good your pilot is at positioning

[magic ingot]

biased opinion, they suck at using gun so they backcap to get pts

[magic ingot]

Most backcappers don’t intrude blue area to c4

The real threat is randomly synced tandem only

I’ve been throwing reports on new district regarding south faction having huge advantage holding off vehicle in spawn area overseeing F while the north faction got LoS blocked by buildings

[wide relic]

I love hidin in the reeds wit a 249 an medium scope on that map

[cedar ember]

Catching up... as far as AA. I would argue that AA should make life pretty sucky for bad pilots. But you also can't balance it around the 1%.

Assuming we are talking about ground to air missiles that are used by infantry, there has to be a few balancing factors.

1. AA has to occupy the same slot that AT rockets use.
2. All heli's need a limited supply of flairs. Random number, but lets say 15. Flairs are not a "fire and suck it engi" item though.

Flairs in conjuction with good piloting will allow a pilot to survive. Though once flairs are depleted, a pilot would be forced to use buildings (or somehow have a gunner shoot the missile) to avoid being hit.

Air vehicles need a warning when they are being locked on to. Evasive manuvors can be employed to break a lock. Keep in mind that with how many people are in a single game, you have to make it somewhat possible to stop a lock - else you will just be shot down by 35 missiles the second you take off.
3) Small arms fire on the big birds need to go away, or be cut down greatly. Once you have proper AA, that needs to be the avenue used to counter them. Little Birds should take small arms fire, because they are fast and lighter. They have no excuse

[rancid hound]

maybe the copilot could be the one to activate the flares so it actually has a purpose

[cedar ember]

I think both should be able to, but even if the pilot can activate flairs, it would be MUCH less effective than if you had a dedicated player doing it for you.

And that isn't even a balance thing. Try flying a heli, dodging missiles, dropping off players and firing flairs

A little hard lol

[rancid hound]

yeah

and then add in the vehicles trying to shoot your rotor from the ground

[cedar ember]

I really think the rotor mechanic needs to go away

[rancid hound]

i like it personally

even if you’re in the bird as it goes down you get to live

[cedar ember]

I just don't think the big birds should be able to be one tapped.

[rancid hound]

and now that bandages heal its not even so bad

most of the time

all it really does is take out your armor and make you vulnerable depending on where you land

[cedar ember]

I have been randomly shot out of the sky with a lucky af rotor hit from across the map. It really sucks when that happens. Its not good gameplay, and I really can't counterplay that.

IMO - destroying your rear rotor should just force you to counter rotate to maintain control, just like real life. That would be a massive pain in the neck, and a large number of pilots, even good ones, would most likely crash. But the good pilots can always try to limp back to base to be repaired.

I think the "blackhawk" down mechanic should be moved to when the big bird takes lethal. It will start that spin, main rotor destroyed. It basically gets a new - smaller - health pool that if depleted, will cause the heli to actually blow up before it hits the ground. If still alive when it hits the ground, exact same mechanic occurs as we have now when your rotor is hit.

[rancid hound]

this would be a cool change actually

having the birds just explode in midair after their health depletes no matter what doesnt make a whole lot of sense especially if the thing finishing it off is like a rifle

[cedar ember]

Also the rear tail rotor hitbox needs to be smaller haha. With that change, I would be ok if a single apc shot would do it in. As now we have actual counterplay.

[torpid elk]

My first 200 rounds did nothing but clearly my last round hit something really important

[cedar ember]

100%. I think that should apply to all vehicles though. All vehicles should be disabled before destruction so they are just mobile coffins =P. Look at the APC and jeeps mostly here.

[rancid hound]

yeah the guy with the lmg dumping their belt into it did nothing but my singular m4 mag was DEVASTATING

[cedar ember]

Granted, you take a tank shot in a jeep, anybody inside would most likely be very hurt, but still able to try and live =P. Even if that is still pretty unlikely

[rancid hound]

mustve had explosive bullets

[torpid elk]

I mentioned mission kills.

make vehicles much more durable but also make them able to be mission killed in a variety of ways that would require and engineer to patch up for the vehicle to continue to be used

[cedar ember]

We are talking about one narrow aspect of the game though. In rality there are a BUNCH of changes I would love to see that all go into making balance, but also increasing the innerplay between vehicles and ground.

[cedar ember]

10000%. Like if you take an AT mine in a tank or APC, that should fuck up your treads or tires

you can still use the turret, but moving will now be a little hard

So while I am technically wanting to buff vehicles here. I am also advocating for stuff like this which still creates balance and the ability to answer vehicles

and also gives certain gadgets more reason to be used

[cedar ember]

fwiw, the new "health pool" that the heli gets on being disabled can also reflect on how it was disabled. IE, if you just took your 4th AP tank shell, you may only have 10-20% of that "disabled state" health pool. That way heavy arms doesn't feel pointless.

[desert cove]

Any idea that requires engi to come out of disable vehicle in the middle of the fight is gameplay breaking stupidity. Its to easy to die to RPG splash, snipers, inf that way

[placid panther]

why

[desert cove]

At best, after vehicles are good enough we could have system like form BFV with tracking and repair from INSIDE

[placid panther]

One person will sit in a vehicle the entire game, I believe in BF4 they are referred to as vehicle whores

[cedar ember]

mmmm, I would rather the engie and their team have counterplay than just sploding... How would it be any different if an engi had to get out and repair a vehicle vs just blowing up in the first place?

To start, stick with your team so you can be defended.
And... if you don't, an enemy could actually try to commandeer your vehicle.

Both sounds like great gameplay to me. It creates counterplay and a reason to work with your team for both sides.

[desert cove]

People just can't accept others enjoying the game the way they like. Especially when they can't out skill them. Sweats will whine about vehicle players becouse their hundreds hours in aimlabs are not effective

[cedar ember]

And who said you had to leave your vehicle, a random teammate could always try to patch you up. Traveling with a supporting fire team IRL is always done for a reason - to help prevent exactly the things you are concerned about.

[rancid hound]

they should add firing ports to the apcs so there’s at least some form of defense against people who run at you from behind with c4

[cedar ember]

We just need less players with c4 haha. c4 should be engi - and maybe support - only.

[placid panther]

I love vehicles, and the people that play them, it just sucks one person will take a tank or IFV and sit in it the whole game, then no one else gets to enjoy them

[placid panther]

I agree

[rancid hound]

true

[torpid elk]

Just make vehicles reserve themselves for like 1 minute, until the previous driver dies, or until they travel further than 20m away from the vehicle. During that time they vehicle cant be stolen be friendlies or enemies. Enemies can still try and kill the driver repairing the vehicle to steal it though

[cedar ember]

Vehicles should be squad lockable with any player able to unlock the vehicle if nobody from said squad is near it for a minute or so.

of course, enemy can just hop in whenever

this is for friendlys only

[cedar ember]

That sucks, but I don't think we can address that. Honestly, I have hopped into a tank multiple times as the gunner, and just asked the driver if they were ok with switching off each time we go to rearm. You would be surprised how often they agree.

Most tank drivers would rather do that, and maintain an active gunner - probably why

[rancid hound]

to combat this maybe they could adjust vehicle respawn times so they arent limited to only respawning after said vehicle is already destroyed

[torpid elk]

The wheels on the battlebus go round and round!

[cedar ember]

Ehh, that could be harry fast. "Oh look, we have 15 tanks because we managed to not die, good luck!"

[magic ingot]

tanks excel at open ground combat not city

[winged adder]

I had an absurd vehicle theft moment the other day. Parked a humve on the edge of spawn, behind cover, next to A, with the turret covering the objective.

Turned the engine off, and started engaging with the turret.

The first person to spawn in, turned the engine on and rammed the humve directly into the building at the point before getting out and dying

[rancid hound]

the more the merrier

[cedar ember]

This happens all the time. We 100% need squadlocking

Had somebody do the same, except they drove me into the ocean.

just yesterday

[torpid elk]

My idea still stands, tie vehicle spawns to squad points. Then we can limit how many there are with the squad point system

[cedar ember]

Honestly, I wouldn't be against that. But there should be a maximum timer where a tank will spawn if no squad spanws one

We also need a maximum number of tanks

[rancid hound]

max tanks per team should be 6

[winged adder]

Oh don't get me started on the new boats on one of the new maps, there'd a sandbar stopping them from entering the center bay.

I got one off the sandbar, backed up, started shooting a rhib, and someone spawned in and beached it on the same sandbar

[cedar ember]

lol... have the tanks get airdropped in. Imagine the enemy seeing that and doing a mad push to try and capture the drop. That would quite honestly be fantastic gameplay.

[winged adder]

Only if I can call on in onto a windmill to crush it

[cedar ember]

I mean, fair is fair right?

reminds me of the old COD strategy where you would use care packages to squish enemy players lol

[magic ingot]

I don’t get why tons of random ahole like to drive away spawning vehicles

[cedar ember]

People like to grief and watch the world burn.

[rancid hound]

free uber moment

[heady jewel]

Me reading the 1019839540202847302028475940382730 message in here

[patent edge]

Imma unfollow this cuz its clear tandem and c4 need a nerf and nothing else useful is being discussed

If the vechiles are buffed instead more people will use tandem which will make more drivers salty in this thread

[hollow tapir]

This thread could be named - vehicles’ rant since they won’t acknowledge anything said here, even if it’s good ideas

[rancid hound]

copium inhalement channel

[cedar ember]

Honestly this is a pretty narrow sighted view of the discussions in here... there have been plenty of great suggestions from many people regarding vehicle gameplay that exist outside of c4 and tandem abuse.

[cedar ember]

Sad, but true lol. I can only hope that maybe, just maybe, they would.

[desert cove]

I had this multiple times with the new boat (because for some fucking reason driver and gunner are split). sitting in water and shooting helis/people droping on basra C

Every 2 m some random decided to spawn on the boat and drive it straight to the beach

FFS

[rancid hound]

squad lock when

[desert cove]

Not squad lock. Vehicle lock, for driver only, LBA, tank and APC, 30 s

[rancid hound]

You can 1 man squad, same results. Vehicle lock encourages more 1 manning which is stupid (except APCs which doesn't even have second fighting seat lmfao)

[cedar ember]

What I was thinking

[sick berry]

shit like that drives me up the fucking wall. i really hope they add something akin to taking the keys out of vehicles, so no one can start the engine except you. maybe have the key automatically teleported back once you die

[desert cove]

this needs to be changed

[rancid hound]

currently yes

[magic ingot]

why apc is objectively best light vehicle

[rancid hound]

the worst*

[magic ingot]

You have both control of gun AND wheel

No random dHead messing with it

[cedar ember]

At the cost of being as squish as a humvee lol

[rancid hound]

APCs have zero redeeming features for its supposedly infantry fighting role

comparing it to lighter vehicles is pointless

[cedar ember]

Yep, the light vehicles are actually stronger

You don't die as fast

[magic ingot]

can’t even one shot dudes

[vague flint]

ong i think i took my last ever apc today

[rancid hound]

rip
||rest in pieces||

[magic ingot]

Apc is good at camping own spawn nothing more

[cedar ember]

Even then you can get one tapped lol.

[magic ingot]

oh and random tail rotor snipes

[vague flint]

had some medic tank 9 rounds, 2 being direct to the chest, just bandaged once and kept healing with his box 😔

[rancid hound]

actually no

[vague flint]

took the apc back to base and bailed on it lol

[rancid hound]

you're not hitting anything at spawn with APCs, that thing has artillery accuracy without artillery capabilities

[magic ingot]

The most annoying part is people jump like circus clowns to avoid the he splash damage

[rancid hound]

lmfao ikr

[magic ingot]

Which is shockingly effective

[vague flint]

see they still hit, jsut did almost nothing

[rancid hound]

given how inaccurate and weak that shit is, it's effective (at pissing me)

[magic ingot]

did I forget to mention btr has the smoke launcher on the vehicle model but not usable

[cedar ember]

Just like how inaccurate the heli mini guns are lol...

[rancid hound]

just add 240s and PKPs at this point they'll fare better on those helis' peek holes than pea sprayers

[magic ingot]

Bro, at least they do something now with the explosive change, you may detonate enemy ap mine or claymore to kill enemy

[vague flint]

honestly just weld a makarov to the front of the apc and you'll double its inf fighting capacity

[magic ingot]

chopper can’t even do the accidental detonation

[eager needle]

@magic ingot has earned the Tier I Member role!

[cedar ember]

I am just glad they made it so c4 despawns when you die... I have died soo many times to killing a guy after the threw c4 on me, only to also die a second later when he spawns.

[rancid hound]

no way!!!!

[magic ingot]

While some people grief spawn camping vehicles by throwing c4 on them for enemy to detonate

c4 bad

[cedar ember]

I think friendly c4 should hurt friendly infantry

vehicles.. that is a tough issue

more likely I would rather bans be issued for griefing than any gameplay changes

[vague flint]

you right weld it to the back and it'll probably still be more effective than the 20mm hedp main gun

[magic ingot]

make c4 clip through friendly vehicle

[cedar ember]

I think it is a valid strat though to c4 up a quad bike and drive it into a tank

Don't want to ruin that gameplay

[magic ingot]

Throw c4 before riding it?

[vague flint]

so allow c4 to be placed on empty and enemy vehicles, but not friendly

[rancid hound]

Bradley war recreation in this game 💀

Oki needs a fucking Oscar for his hilarious acting in this whole process

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtihfrl4miM&t=42s
Also you can see the fucking 30mm isn't that inaccurate even at miles away lmao (Yes I know this is an Apache's 30mm not BTR's 30mm but same shit)

Holy fuck man "balancing" drains my braincells

[vague flint]

isnt the bbr btr a 20mm?

i mean, not relevant but still

[desert cove]

no, 30mm

[rancid hound]

30mm, just different shells' length

but they're both explosive so it doesn't matter

[cedar ember]

I would say allow c4 to be placed on empty, or squad controlled vehicles

[rancid hound]

the point is balancing is so awful

[vague flint]

🧐 you right lol

dunno why i always assumed 20

hud says 30

[rancid hound]

if devs want to keep current APCs' damage and accuracy, one solution left: remove mag and increase fire rate

[magic ingot]

how many c4 can I deploy at a time?

[rancid hound]

20 rounds ready, there's a 30mm sign

[cedar ember]

when a 30mm explosive round knocks off a player's helmet, but does no damage lol...

[cedar ember]

as many as you can carry

basically unlimited if you have a resupply

[rancid hound]

fact: c4 has faster ttk than AP shells on a tank

[magic ingot]

I have an awful suggestion, make c4 singleton deploy so you can’t just spam 4 on a tank and one shot it

[rancid hound]

no that's a decent idea

[magic ingot]

and s.c4 no longer a meme

The only gadget to burst 4 c4 worth of damage

[cedar ember]

That... or make it so c4 has a det range.

[rancid hound]

make c4 takes time to stick and deploy

[vague flint]

is there an arming distance for the rpgs?

[rancid hound]

no

[magic ingot]

No

[vague flint]

didnt think so

[magic ingot]

You can practically shoot your own foot

[rancid hound]

yup

[magic ingot]

no rocket jump sorry

[cedar ember]

Honestly, if they added a sound and animation to arming c4... that would mostly fix it. I sitll think only engi + support should have it though.

[rancid hound]

engi + assault

[cedar ember]

I could agree with that

[rancid hound]

support needs different love not this one

[magic ingot]

HLL has this … satchel thing that can only be time fuzed at least 30 sec but one shot heaviest tank

[cedar ember]

support needs the ability to deploy mg nests. THAT would be fantastic. Engi needs to be able to make temporary rearm and repair stations for vehicles. Assault needs flame throwers 😛

[tulip ibex]

Guys can we vote. GUNNERS GET TRANSPORT EXP in black hawks? /

[rancid hound]

assault is supposed to be the main spearhead so giving them explosive is reasonable, same with engis being specialist class that focus on anti vehicle. Not the rest, they're not supposed to be frontline units

replacing them with anti wall charges or hammers are enough

[cedar ember]

I guess big difference is that assault should max be able to have like... 2-3 c4

[cedar ember]

100% agreed. Shaped breach charges for all other classes.

[desert cove]

Does anyone have pic of APC?

[rancid hound]

well if we limit c4 for classes then default should be 6 to not making vehicles that OP

[cedar ember]

6 for engi, 2-3 for assault. Given they are faster and supposed to have less gear.

[sick berry]

support really likes having C4. being able to refill them means you can be very effective at tearing down walls and buildings, which i think is neat. medic and recon having C4 is questionable though

[vague flint]

assault getting like 3 c4, engi getting 5, everyone else gets wall charges

[rancid hound]

support needs better gun not explosive

they're not oppenheimer

[sick berry]

it's already near impossible to close the gap with a vehicle as a support
i don't think you need to remove C4 from their kit entirely

[vague flint]

like assault can be lat, engi is hat

[rancid hound]

support should stick more to "support" role imo, not charging

[rancid hound]

ingame or

[cedar ember]

give support a nade launcher that has ammo for smoke, impact and frag nades. Maybe 2-3 of each. THAT would be a cool weapon. It would probably be a gadget, not a primary.

[desert cove]

Yeah, in game

[sick berry]

tearing down walls and buildings isn't charging

[vague flint]

assault needs guns not gadgets

[rancid hound]

hence giving them anti wall measures instead of c4

[sick berry]

in the same way a support player can manipulate the terrain with buildables, he can manipulate it with C4. which i think is a really cool dynamic

[cedar ember]

They need both... @vague flint

[vague flint]

need one a lot more than the other

[cedar ember]

True, but them not having c4 means you actually have to... work as a squad to cover multiple roles... gasp 😛

[vague flint]

i'd like sup to get a smoke m32

[magic ingot]

imagine teamwork

[vague flint]

but not more explosive spam

[magic ingot]

I use engi for building removal btw …

4 at mine can remove the temple at E of salhan

[cedar ember]

I would love for support's smoke to have the ability to change the color to use it for marking points as targets, or pickup etc

Having the ability to see a colored smoke marker as a heli pilot when picking up teammates... that would be SUPER NICE. As it also tells me where I should be able to land.

[magic ingot]

My next challenge is remove the center apartment complex at river

gotta be fun

[vague flint]

rather than gadgets though i like if they got a mg3, HBAR aug, bullpup pkp

[vague flint]

that would be cool, maybe even ir blocking smokes too

[magic ingot]

Ngl that sounds like the role of squad lead

[desert cove]

Those are nice, I can work with that

Thank you

[rancid hound]

np 👍

if you need more vehicle images they’re on the wiki

[cedar ember]

I think we need more than just the squad lead to be able to do that though
I think a squad lead should get those smokes though, as a free gadget.

[rancid hound]

perfect modelling, godawful performance

[rancid hound]

especially if the squad lead in question either a) doesnt know they’re the leader or b) doesn’t care and doesn’t want to help the squad

oh wow, they said it used APFSDS themselves

which can't do shit

[cedar ember]

as in, IRL they can't, or in game they can't?

[rancid hound]

in game

worse than tandem

same as heat

[cedar ember]

they should match a tandem imo.

[rancid hound]

tandem should have no where near capabilites as APFSDS, ie buff AP

[cedar ember]

And... tandems should be removed from the game and instead placed as an optional turret on humvees. For that matter, we need vehicle loadouts lol.

[rancid hound]

10 to kill a tank from the front with AP is funny as hell

thats goofy as hell

and you have 14

[desert cove]

I did a low effort thing

[rancid hound]

perfect

[cedar ember]

And they wonder why tanks camp lol.
Honestly, I hardly bother shooting at enemy tanks for that reason who are also sniping. And I bet they do the same.

[sick berry]

360x200 pixels lol, lmao

[rancid hound]

at least it has a loud cannon

at least it can swim

[rancid hound]

tank v tank results in engis win (this is true)

[cedar ember]

apc in the water is probably one of its best places right now. Stay far enough away to make it hard to be hit with RPGs, no more c4 spam.

[desert cove]

Literally the only good thing

[rancid hound]

not anymore

[cedar ember]

100%... and I never have an engi lol

[rancid hound]

now you can't swim well anymore cuz if you turn your back it's insta death

[cedar ember]

yep...

[rancid hound]

shot an LAV in Wakistan water, dude turned around to his death 😭

thanks Oki

[vague flint]

me when I shoot a littlebird with a 5kg dart moving at ~1600m/s 🧐

[cedar ember]

That little bird pilot was bad...

but also good shot

Not to downplay that shot, he should have never been going that slow for that long though

[rancid hound]

wow....

[vague flint]

oh no that is a shot most anyone could make i think

[rancid hound]

if you go to the water area in a lav you’re basically asking for people to shoot tandems at you

[cedar ember]

still don't die as fast as if you were on land 😛

[vague flint]

just that its such a clean hit

[rancid hound]

True

running in water is only good against RPG and c4

against tank you're fucked

Surviving on land is luck based in an apc

still better than on land tho

[cedar ember]

oh yeah...

[rancid hound]

sometimes you live for a while most of the time you dont

[cedar ember]

I find it fun to go to the islands and hunt snipers in an APC 😛

[rancid hound]

c4 is the biggest issue because sometimes people dont know where to aim the tandem to oneshot the apc

real

[cedar ember]

I know where to aim, but I don't. And I still one shot them lol

[magic ingot]

apc long range accuracy is so bad

[rancid hound]

30mm howitzer

artillery accuracy

[rancid hound]

I survived a tandem with like barely any health left once

my shit was smoking and beeping all the way back to base

i was lucky no enemies were on the way

[cedar ember]

whenever that happens to me, there is always some jerk on the enemy team camping the spawn line that gets me lol.

[rancid hound]

[rancid hound]

https://tenor.com/view/meme-lang-meme-lang-gif-25328011

as a rule of thumb, never engage vehicles unless you have to as a vehicle

yeah

[cedar ember]

imo, if you are hugging the enemy spawn line and stay in one area too long, the enemy team should get a global enemy ping on your face.

[rancid hound]

its usually not worth the time

I fight tanks because I don't want to let people die to it lmao

Although i do almost always shoot at birds if they’re close

4 shots landed friendly engi pops in, "vehicle assist"

[magic ingot]

I like to bomb the first point out of existence and camp happily at spawn with my apc

[rancid hound]

yup hate those thing

annoying sound

quadbikes are easy targets too but those arent real vehicles

so i dont count them

[cedar ember]

there is actually an insane counter to little birds in the game already

[magic ingot]

my answer is ultimax

[cedar ember]

its... and I know this will shock you... buildings and smoke.

[magic ingot]

5 l-vehicle damage

[rancid hound]

survival onion:
layer 1: don't be seen

man the day Oki fixes vehicles I'll buy support pack

[magic ingot]

Smoke can be trophied right?

[cedar ember]

sniper on rooftop motionless gets nabbed by a littlebird
Sniper: "WTF that is so op!"

I do think supports need another buildable, a proper full height wall so they can try to repair and reinforce buildings with blown out walls.

Or.. just let them build up any area that has a destroyed wall

[magic ingot]

Support feedback thread it goes

[cedar ember]

yeah lol

[desert cove]

3d spot💀

[wide relic]

Tandems need a buff

[eager needle]

@wide relic has earned the Tier I Member role!

[rancid hound]

[heady jewel]

[wide relic]

Uh what does that mean

[heady jewel]

Tandems 2 shot tanks iirc

[wide relic]

I want my heli killer lol

[heady jewel]

They don’t need a buff 😔

[desert cove]

Tandem two shots tank, one shots APC
This mf: let's buff it

[heady jewel]

One shots everything else

[wide relic]

More on the side of heli damage don’t worry ur tanks safe lol

[heady jewel]

They one shot transports

And little birds

I’ve died to tandem rockets so many times in a transport

Max health

[rancid hound]

i’ve never been hit by a tandem in a transport

[heady jewel]

Then you don’t play transport right

You need to drop the guys in the danger zone

[wide relic]

I’ve hit little birds it takes two

[heady jewel]

I really don’t think it takes two for a little bird

[rancid hound]

i do but i dont stick around long enough to get shot down

im in and out

[torpid elk]

I thought layer 1 was "dont be there"

[wide relic]

Full health it does unles u get the rotor maybe

[desert cove]

You can't not be there when you are there🤔

[cedar ember]

How would you be able to justify killing big birds easier?? They are already pretty damn easy to shoot down... And pose very little risk to ground troops. A bird flying low enough to be a risk is already in danger of being killed.

[magic ingot]

random idea, buildable SAM (200~500points cost?) which can two shot LB with 150m range for area air denial and 10 seconds reload to give LB a chance to GTFO

Can never destroy tail rotor (important)

[thorny mason]

it'd be sick if transport little birds were able to fire flares or somethin

eyes in the sky type deal

i'd be happy with a working ping as well

[magic ingot]

Oh yeah for some reason you have like 60% chance pinging the passenger instead of the vehicle

[torpid elk]

Trying to ping vehicles from across the map with binos is hell.

oops, little too low and ny ping is off by 100m. Oops too high and off again by 200m. Ooops, i linged the vehicle but it did the little red "enemy here" ping and not the "tank here" ping. Oops, out of pings and now the tank drove off behind a hill

[limpid flame]

APC randomly tail rotoring too

[magic ingot]

calculated

[limpid flame]

Random ass light weapon will be enough to make the pilot run away

Snipers literally sniping you out

This only happens because people dont even try to shoot at the LB

While in reality you can make the best of LB pilots literally rage quit Just by focusing fire

[thorny mason]

yeah i gotta be completely honest, i don't like being fun police but you shouldn't be able to get one-shot through windshield no matter what bullet hits you

[magic ingot]

you guy’s favorite p90 do decent l vehicle damage now start looking up

[limpid flame]

People will also complain about the 1% of LB pilots but they are more than happy when 99% of them suck af And are more than likely a free kill for them

[thorny mason]

taking sniper fire from every direction as a heli is kinda annoying and there's not much you can do about it besides just start yawing like you've been sucked into a whirlpool

[magic ingot]

LB has too much speed for SR to reliably track but BB is just flying target practice

[limpid flame]

It's cause that 50% damage reduction for a shot into the Glass Got bugged And never went thru

[thorny mason]

i knew it

[limpid flame]

Tf u mean, you Just hit it

[thorny mason]

i called that shit

[limpid flame]

Both are extremaly easy to shoot at

[thorny mason]

i really wish more maps used transport hermits/littlebirds; they seem lackluster but offer such a more active playstyle than the armed ones or big birds

[limpid flame]

You have a direct LB pilot speaking on experience, i've had tons of deaths Just because i get randomly sniped out or Just beamed by: 7M humvees, APCs, AUG/M249/Ultimax, RPGs, even fucking tanks start to target LBs

[magic ingot]

I shot down a LB with P90 yesterday

[limpid flame]

Good for you

[thorny mason]

pdw's have unreasonable amounts of l-armor damage

littlebirds have a pretty small health pool

[limpid flame]

This game never should have a way to shoot down flying vehicles with light weapons, there should be dedicated gadgets or vehicles for AA

It ruins the vehicular feel

[magic ingot]

I’m more surprised one apc shell isn’t instant death for LB

It’s assist 17

[limpid flame]

Same for c4 being available for every1 And tandems everywhere, exactly why tanks And apc players are FORCED to spawncamp