Medic - Feedback

[vocal dagger]

true, yeah

[woven ocean]

Healing should not be possible while moving. Medic should heal t hemselves slower than other players. Light armour and smg movement speed buffs should not stack. One or the other. Medic needs to completely lose out on all explosive gear and even grenades. Give medics a deployable healing station , flashbangs and gas grenades, a defibralator and the pick/hammer. Give ALL SMG's more horizontal recoil so they aren't a better pick than most AR at 50-100m because they're laser beams. Guns like the AK-15 have so much horizxzontal recoil and inaccuracy (bullet deviation) that even though they have high dmg, the SMGS outclass them. It doesn't help that medium scopes have so much recoil that the smg and AR are mostly just rocking red dots.

tbh medic benefits most from this because even if they bleed they can be at full hp in 3 seconds. This means you can QEQEQ spam angles to bait a shot before leaving into the open

[vocal dagger]

That and the aforementioned speed stats and weapon choices favoring the speed rush and flank gameplay that pairs very well with being able to make yourself exponentially hard to hit

[woven ocean]

Yeah if you try to play the game tactically at all your position is instantly given away by the bullet tracers ans then you just get grenade spammed or killed by one of the 30 snipers( sniping is too easy, there are too many sight lines and ADS makes AR's so slow)

[pliant bronze]

remove smg on medic(i know irl combat medics brings lighter weapons but this isnt irl) and put smg on assault class. so we dont see people running around gunning and self healing and not playing medic at all. im fine with self regen on all class but make it needs to be out of combat(not getting damged for x amount of time) and only regenerates up to what 60-80% and make medic heals you back up to 100%

[raven pumice]

A good start would be reducing self heal by like 25% so it takes longer for them to get back in the fight and reducing there max C4 so they have less effectiveness or choice on what they use there C4 on than other classes and give all classes a regen out of combat to 50-60 health max so medic is still needed to full heal or to heal while in combat

[ancient pebble]

Make throwing medkits a lot more apparent, people dont throw it because they dont know you can throw it using mouse3, also medics shouldnt have smgs

[buoyant root]

Medic shouldn't have 6 c4, it makes the class good against inf and good against vehicles

So scrap c4 or limit to only 3

[remote rose]

Lower mag count for SMGs, remove all grenades/explosives except smokes

[pliant bronze]

wish the hammer and pickaxe are primary gadgets instead of 2ndary so i can atleast breakwalls and drag my allies to cover

IF c4 gets removed on medic which i think it should

medics shouldnt be able blow off wall and be like swat or destroy tanks

[remote rose]

You don't need to break walls, you can res and heal right through them

[pliant bronze]

i mean what if both of you are sameside of the wall

lmao

[bitter pumice]

yeah I agree but as I said this is not the topic of discussion

[woven ocean]

as long as they have a self heal that is fast and mobile they will be the meta pick. They already have the best weapon class to actually play near the OBJ.. SMg.

[bitter pumice]

SMGs as a class also deserve a nerf

I'd argue as long as they have the only way of replenishing health they'll be the meta pick

[craggy bay]

Check #1065397987502719038

[bitter pumice]

yeah I know dw I was responding to @woven ocean

[craggy bay]

Ah ok

Although people in that thread still defend them

[craggy bay]

Other classes are at inherent disadvantages against the medic during playing the objective

If you don't kill them they'll run away and heal,if you kill them you'll die to the next enemy that comes around

[bitter pumice]

Exactly this, being the only class that heals pushes them over all of the other classes. Even if you win against someone if you are not a medic or don't have a medic near you most likely won't win your next gunfight.

People might say "that's what teamwork's for" but forcing people into this situation gives medic all the power. If they don't want to heal you, well you are now at a disadvantage. So people gravitate towards medics since that guarantees they'll get heals.

[woven ocean]

it does the opposite tbh because I almost never see anyone reviving or healing anymore. People pick medic with smg to just play quake 3 or go for solo flanks over and over

medic probably should need another medic to heal them

[bitter pumice]

this is what I'm saying, not the opposite. Since medic is the only source of healing people pick it for themselves and don't care about their team.

[wicked sail]

It is very unreasonable for the medic to heal while moving, although this will make the game flow more smoothly, but it has caused most people to only play the medic instead of other arms

Medics should be used as a logistical support rather than a main combat force. When you can move while healing and can choose many types of weapons, other professions (except engineers) become less necessary

[crude jay]

Many Medics I encounter are selfish Assaults. 20 Bandages with fast bandaging and a Healing Box they could at least drop, yet I am lying on the ground with my 4 Bandages, reviving at a snail's pace teammates three Medics ran past.
I concede that it's not always sensible to bandage teammates, but the least you can do as a Medic is make a safe revive.

At the very least give other classes the Medic's bandaging speed.

I'm sick and tired of seeing Supports and Engineers do a Medic's job.

The morally and mechanically right way to address this is to add a "Duty to Rescue" where Medics have to take care of their teammates.

[cedar rune]

[rare crow]

I agree with your main point about the role Medics should have, and I would argue that this is largely a consequence of the unrealistically powerful damage SMGs can deal against even armored infantry.

If SMGs were given their proper place as a speed-for-damage tradeoff, then this would shift Medics who actually want to be on the frontlines to the ARs, and then as a side effect, the improved handling Assault classes gets would actually become relevant.

[cedar rune]

You cant force people to do certain actions

[pliant bronze]

i mean they can turn on armor stat

to nerf smgs

theres an armor damage is set to 0 right now

this migh or might not help

idk

[rare crow]

I think this refers to vehicle armor. But I agree that a mechanic like Counter Strike's armor penetration stat could be a useful differentiator across weapon roles.

[pliant bronze]

no theres 3 types of armor

[bitter pumice]

Why does this thread always end up with forcing people into doing things? This is a game, being forced to do something is not going to be received well. The best thing you can do is make it feel like players are doing things with their own free will by incentivizing said thing.

[rare crow]

I believe currently body armor just acts as a flat increase in HP.

[pliant bronze]

armor(body armors and maybe helmet?), l armor (light vehcile) and h armor (heavy vechile)

im pepega spelled vehicle wrong

twice

but yeah armors like pubg and csgo might help like armos gives dmg reduction and some tempo hp on top(?)

[unborn smelt]

Remove SMGs, PDWs from Medic and give em to Assault. Or restrict Medic to DMR only or sth and medic player count will jump off its cliff.

[crude jay]

Just how much incentive do you believe will be needed to make Medics always go for revives over being a selfish prick?

[bitter pumice]

By removing medic's complete control over heals you could make those selfish pricks swith off of medic and let people who actually want to play medics do their job?

You cannot force playstyles on your players

[unborn smelt]

I remember I actually had to buy the Russian DLC for BF1 to actually get a automatic primary for Medic in BF1. Cause everything else for Medics was semi-auto

[bitter pumice]

That'll just lead to people quitting and your game dying

[pliant bronze]

yeah just removing it to medic and give it to assault would be much better

[crude jay]

You absolutely can, but you shouldn't.

[pliant bronze]

tho irl combat medics do bring light weapons but yeah

[bitter pumice]

Smh hence why I said this #1133102331274203187 message

[bitter pumice]

I don't like irl comparisons, this is a game and it's supposed to be fun.

irl combat is... let's not get into that.

[pliant bronze]

i know but i said first i agree on removing smg and/or pdw on medic

im just pointing it out irl they do thats why this game stil have that milsim stuff

[craggy bay]

https://tenor.com/view/pepe-smiling-green-frog-clap-clapping-gif-15400349

[atomic sparrow]

At this point this is not a discussion anymore, or criticism and suggestions of how to do something about the topic, it's just chitchatting

[pliant bronze]

are we? i mean we are talking about how to nerf medic or atleast balance it with other class

[atomic sparrow]

It's a lot of back and forth, people trying to convince each other.
It's simple: make an organized and well explained list with your thoughts about the topic once and if someone has doubts, you anwer.
And you can do the same with others.
After all, each one of us is trying to convince the devs, not ourselves, if that makes sense

[trail linden]

Medics are the most suited to assaulting because you need health to attack a point

just remove assault there is no way to give it an identity that doesnt overlap with one of the 4 main classes

nobody is going to play a class for slightly improved gunplay over Selfhealing/RPGS/Snipers/Ammo + LMG

[atomic sparrow]

Let me get this straight.. your suggestion to "fix" medic is to remove the assault class from the game?

Not sure if I'm misunderstanding here

[trail linden]

yeah

medic is fine as is\

look at battlefield, most people play assault because of the healing

or engineer because of Big Boom

[pliant bronze]

thats battlefield

[trail linden]

yeah and this game is roblox battlefield

it plays the same as battlefield

[atomic sparrow]

"roblox battlefield" - 4NT, merch

[pliant bronze]

lmao

[trail linden]

is it not?

thats not a bad thing, this game does battlefield better than EA devs so

[meager swallow]

Every class in battlefield is diffrent. In bbr Every class is fucking same

[atomic sparrow]

why people must associate everything? xD
Not all things are connected, people. I know you feel compelled to follow what you favorite sensationalist youtube writes on their titles, but chill

"Minecraft + roblox + battlefield = battlebit 😱 "

[pliant bronze]

boxy characters = roblox

[trail linden]

because ive put like 300 hours into the game

[atomic sparrow]

oh yeah? Show me then. Screenshot of playtime

[trail linden]

mb 228

[atomic sparrow]

And after all that time you came to the conclusion "roblox battlefield"?

[trail linden]

roblox textures with a mix of battlefield and squad

more squad mechanics but the gameplay plays out like battlefield

[bitter pumice]

Why do people associate a game that has been advertised to them (by streamers, content creators but still) as roblox battlefield with battlefield?

[trail linden]

people love this game because its more of a battlefield game than 2042

[atomic sparrow]

You're asking me or making a statament?

[bitter pumice]

I'm jokingly giving you an answer

[trail linden]

anyways back to the point about classes

[bitter pumice]

about medic specifically

[trail linden]

if people think medic is being overplayed

the only way to fix that is giving slow self heal to everyone in a way

as long as medic has self heal it will be the most played

[atomic sparrow]

"I got a vector and I'm a medic irl as well. I know for a fact that if I shot you 3 times you unlive; and I can also bandage and heal you in 20 secs. Yeah.. I know that 'cuz I'm a medic that has a vector irl"

What you gonna say next? That u got a glock in your rari?!

[trail linden]

huh?

[bitter pumice]

Giving a class complete control over the most essential resource is just guaranteeing that class being the most played

[trail linden]

also how tf do you know about my irl vector

[bitter pumice]

what?

[toxic steppe]

Why rely on others to heal you when you can do it yourself is one the reason why everyone plays medic

Doesn’t help that other classes don’t really offer much else

[craggy bay]

Lol no

Difference is assault has assault rifles,and no one else does

Healing is slow

Plus grenade launcher and defibrillator making it the only class that can revive(bf4)

It's a completely different thing

[bitter pumice]

Also bf3/4 although slow had self healing and medics healing was fire and forget so healing was not the main factor

[atomic sparrow]

you know what? just decrease the medic self healing speed and it's good. Your remove it completely and let medics heal themselves

"You can heal yourself, but you can heal everyone and get healed by others"

problem solved

[trail linden]

that wont change a thing, the majority of medics are only playing for the self healing

[atomic sparrow]

everybody is playing medic 'cuz of the self healing

[trail linden]

and slowing it down just nerfs the self healing without actually changing anything

[atomic sparrow]

you know what? that is probably what Oki will do
It'll be easier for them, will make most people happy, and will take only 5 minutes to find the code and lower the self healing value

[trail linden]

but how?

it changes nothing

[atomic sparrow]

if you self heal at a speed of 10hp/second, lower it to 5hp/second and thats it

[trail linden]

still people will just hide in a corner an wait that

[vocal dagger]

yep

[atomic sparrow]

at least they'll have to hide and wait there for longer

[bitter pumice]

what will this change except making the game slower?

[trail linden]

i dont think you understand how valuable being able to have every gunfight start with you at full hp is

[bitter pumice]

won't solve medic still being the most picked class

[atomic sparrow]

nothing, it'll just make the game slower

[trail linden]

why?

[bitter pumice]

[trail linden]

make it like that for hardcore or whatever but i like the casual movement shooter it is right now

[atomic sparrow]

You guys wanna make a bet? I honestly doubt we'll be getting something different from what I said above

[vocal dagger]

making it a thing you can only do on other people would actually push people to use it on friendlies more
this game doesn't need to be a run and gun speedfest (see every version of it since 2016)

[atomic sparrow]

a whole fancy new system with 30 injections of morphine, adrenaline, etc..

[trail linden]

well this speedfest is what makes the game supper popular

[atomic sparrow]

The fastest route is to simply make the game slower for medic

you can patch that in 1 day

[trail linden]

its a battlefield with none of the bullshit of new Battlefield games and 127 players

if people want to play a mil sim just play squad...

[bitter pumice]

mate it being the lazy solution doesn't make it the right solution

it will literally solve nothing

doing shit like this is how games slowly die

[atomic sparrow]

It's not lazy, it's just faster. The guy can't fix bugs, improve quality of life overall and work on community servers while creating a whole fancy rework for medic

Don't get me wrong, I would LOVE if that was the case, but I'm being realistic

[trail linden]

then just dont touch medic'

[vocal dagger]

This speedfest feels pretty counteractive to the fact that this game has a lot of very tactical aspects to it and was said to, at least until the split between the modes, be a middle ground between a casual shooter(ie battlefield) and a more tactical one(ie insurgency/squad)

[trail linden]

which is why the modes should be seperate

[bitter pumice]

it beign realistic does not change the fact that the change would be the easiest/laziest change there is though

[atomic sparrow]

it's like nerfing vector. Players craving to rank up to get their hands on a vector and killing spree everyone is the only fun factor that makes people want to continue grinding

[trail linden]

are there any issues with medic that arnt too many people use it?

[atomic sparrow]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I doubt we'll get a fancy new medic rework

[vocal dagger]

They should, but until then, it shouldn't go completely one way or the other, which is why keeping the current gameplay speed at all cost might not be as great an idea as it may sound to some

[atomic sparrow]

if there was more than 1 person programming, I'd shut up

[trail linden]

still

are there any actuall issue with medic

[bitter pumice]

I think what is possible for oki should be oki's concern not ours

he is able to come up with solutions he can implement on his own

[vocal dagger]

yeah, it has:

• the best ability in the game(self heal and heal to others)
• incredible mobility
• some very good firepower
• no insentive for teamplay

[bitter pumice]

shutting down discussions like that hardly helps people express their opinions

[pliant bronze]

i mean they can remove smg and pdw on medic and transfer it to assault thats kinda solves the run and gun and self heal solution

[trail linden]

yes but does that negatively affect the other classes?

[odd cipher]

There’s plenty of incentive for team play. I get great points healing and reviving people who don’t run out in the middle of a kill-zone and die

[trail linden]

Snipers will always sniper, Engineers love thier RPG, support is the only one that loses out but i doubt anyone would go play support from medic due to opposite playstyles

[vocal dagger]

When it makes most other classes pretty much obsolete, can do pretty much everything on its own and has the strongest speed rush plays in the game? Yes

[trail linden]

Then just remove C4 from medic

Boom the other 3 class are no longer obsolete

[vocal dagger]

That would not change the fact you get a very mobile class with very good weapons and the ability to top themselves off on hp between encounters
Even without c4 a third of the lobbies would still be medics

[trail linden]

yeah but it doesnt make the other classes obosolete

snipers sniper

engineers blow shit up

[pliant bronze]

the c4 doesnt change the gamestyle tho

lol

[trail linden]

support players defend

[pliant bronze]

its the ability to run and gun and heal back

[vocal dagger]

The other classes are good at one thing
Medic may not be as good on any specific but it can overpower everyone else on sheer rush capability and versatility

[trail linden]

because thats what its best suited to do

[vocal dagger]

Because it's literally overpowered

[blissful harbor]

C4 is incredibly important to playstyle, you need it to destroy walls. This is especially important in maps where there are a lot of buildings, such as Lonovo. You need C4 to create yourself paths through those buildings, for both aggressive plays and escapes.

Besides, this games destruction is fantastic. Every class should be able to interact with it

[pliant bronze]

you mean the rush down an opponent? isnt that an assaults job

[vocal dagger]

Yep

[trail linden]

assault, whats that?

[pliant bronze]

i know thats why i said remove c4 and put hammers as primary gadget

so atleast medic can still move around

[trail linden]

assault will always be played less then medic aslong as it doesnt have self heal

[bitter pumice]

still, maybe medics can interact with sledges instead of c4

[pliant bronze]

make some safespot to pickup people

[bitter pumice]

since c4 is highly effective against armor as well

[pliant bronze]

medic shouldnt be able to destroy tanks

thats shouldve been engineers job

or assault

[bitter pumice]

or my goddamn drone strike

[pliant bronze]

or dat

lmao

[vocal dagger]

Transfer medic's offensive capability to assault and make medics more focused on healing their team instead of gigaflanking while self healing like they're playing BO2

That would pretty much fix it

[bitter pumice]

defanging medic will make the game more boring for everyone involved imo

they still need to have some offense

otherwise why would anyone play that in a FPS game

[vocal dagger]

It would definitely not make the game more boring to anyone that isn't a medic rusher
And they don't need to be helpless, they can keep assault rifles

[bitter pumice]

offensive capability involves ARs too FYI

[vocal dagger]

Yeah, but that is definitely not what I meant

[pliant bronze]

i mean they can slap dmr on medic in exchange for removing those other weapons

might or may not slowdown

medics

[bitter pumice]

Wouldn't that make medics a backline class though?

[vocal dagger]

That seems pretty good actually

[bitter pumice]

where they are not needed as much since people are dying a lot less

[vocal dagger]

They can go along if they wanna risk themselves a bit, or drag people to them

Like everyone else

🫡

[pliant bronze]

i mean dmrs wont be as good as snipers

dmr probbaly the weakest gun

right now

[blissful harbor]

Yea hammer would be fine, though I think it needs to knock a slightly bigger hole then, I don't wanna have to duck/jump through my holes which sometimes happens with the sledge.

Regardless, at this point, medic should not be nerfed. It's the most fun class, and you want to look at why that is, then make sure the other classes also have the same things, then balance from there.

In the case of medic, it's because it's the only class that can reset itself after a fight. That means you can take each engagement on a "fair" level(excluding armor). The reason other classes aren't fun to play is because you only get a single fair engagement, and not always that(ie, get spawned and take a chest shot from a sniper, now you don't even get a single fair fight this life).

So until other classes have some means of resetting themselves, we can't nerf medic, especially with some of the more extreme suggestions I've seen. That just makes the overall game less fun, which leads to people leaving/quitting. Balance is ok, but you need to insure that you do not make the game LESS FUN while doing so.

Instead, the other classes need some way to also reset themselves, although in a limited/worse way than medic. For example, a self healing gadget that is slightly slower than medic, and requires them to be stationary to be used would be ideal, as that solves the problem but still keeps medics speciality, especially w/ regards to rezzing.

Once that happens, then the numbers can be looked at again and medic can maybe be nerfed, such as losing it's C4 and getting a hammer instead, or limiting it to DMRs/SMGs instead of ARs. But any further discussion really shouldn't happen until the other classes are buffed properly.

[vocal dagger]

Yep, there's been loads of suggestion posts

[bitter pumice]

but it still would be conflicting design

we gave you a long to mid range weapon

now go into the frontlines to save people

[vocal dagger]

It wouldn't, your reason to go in the heat of the fight isn't to rack kills, is to heal people

It's not conflicting at all

[pliant bronze]

agree

tbh the only nerf medic just needs is removing that smg and pdw for me and medic should be fine

[vocal dagger]

Making it so light/no armor and light weapon speed buffs don't stack would be good too
No one needs to run at mach 3 to flank properly

[bitter pumice]

idk about you but if I was given a weapon that is effective at range then was told that my most effective teamplay zone was up close I'd think that's plenty dumb

[rare crow]

This is a good point. Bandages could just be given a slow healing effect by default, people still get a limited amount of them so it would not make the medic's infinite healing irrelevant.

[bitter pumice]

you can stop medics from racking up kills some other way

like the smg nerf that's being discussed

them being able to defend themselves up close should be a given since they are required to go there

just make them ineffective at range as a result

[vocal dagger]

The issue is as much their mobility as their firepower

They have both great close range guns and the ability to close distance fast

[bitter pumice]

can't engineer reach the same mobility as medics though?

[vocal dagger]

Without the self heal that guarantees they're always topped off

[bitter pumice]

I'd say increase the amount of bandages from 3 to 5/6 in this case though

we could have something like

[vocal dagger]

I could see the bandage thing but Idk about an increase
People are already extremely survivable as is

[bitter pumice]

medics and assaults up close, engies and support mid range and snipers at long range

[pliant bronze]

i mean dmrs still effect at close range tho their dmg aint a joke

[bitter pumice]

huh? idk about you but if you are not a medic or not healed by one after one fight you are as durable as wet paper

[pliant bronze]

especially that mk14 that can have full auto

[vocal dagger]

I like this

[bitter pumice]

we are not talking about dmrs specifically though

I'm more arguing about design philosophy

dmrs have their own set of problems

[vocal dagger]

If your plan is to rush people head on, sure
But I'd rather people still be extremely reliant on medics, just not having medics be able to use their healing on themselves

Yada yada team play something

[bitter pumice]

I've said this before

forcing teamplay on people will just make them search for ways to eliminate it

and you don't need to rush people

[vocal dagger]

"Forced teamplay" is the weirdest take I've ever heard

[bitter pumice]

snipers exist

then you have not read a lot of threads here

and how is it not forced?

[rare crow]

You realize that making medics incapable of healing themselves makes it so you need more medics to have a sustainable team?

[pliant bronze]

dont need to rush people? people literally rushing head on self healing after a fight go back and self heal back

[bitter pumice]

you are literally dependent on another guy cooperating with you

[vocal dagger]

That is literally what teamplay is

Fjdodjdjfisofjsjfosf

You depend on other people, they depend on you

[bitter pumice]

smh

man how is this hard to understand

[vocal dagger]

Apes together strong

[bitter pumice]

it comes down to consent

people wanting to cooperate to increase their effectiveness is different then trying to explain to your vector goblin medic you need healing so you don't get killed by a breeze

[vocal dagger]

Teamplay is not a thing when it is optional
If you can ignore it entirely and thrive anyway it's not teamplay

[bitter pumice]

you can ignore it and be less effective

[vocal dagger]

There IS no increase in effectiveness for medics though

[bitter pumice]

making it something you must do will just make people mad at each other

you can change it to make it that way

[vocal dagger]

I... yes I am in this thread

🥹

[bitter pumice]

give everyone self healing but make it slow so people will want a medic to heal them

ammo imo is already fine since people can call in ammo drops

limit anti vehicle options on some classes to make it other classes specialty to take care of them

but I'm saying limit

not remove

two are very different things

[pliant bronze]

the only thing balance in this game are pistols

[bitter pumice]

desert eagle with 90 damage body shots: 🥷

[pliant bronze]

idk why smgs have high damage

[bitter pumice]

also it probably feels that way only cause it takes a year to pull your pistol out

[pliant bronze]

like glock has 18dmg with high rate of fire meanwhile usp, 443 and m9 has ok rate of fire and good damage like 30 or 25 idk

tbh they dont need to balance the gun just remove it from medic and thats it

they can probably add dmr or just another weapon type like carbines

to medics

so they can still zoom here and there

and just doesnt kill you instantly and heal back after a fight turning them to a better assault class

[steel sluice]

as much as I love my SMGs on medic, I agree with you.

[tall cove]

Remove ranger armor from medic and give it to another class

[blissful harbor]

Imo, replace bandages. Players have a CMS kit for rezzing others. Everyone gets 1-3, medic gets 20(same as now). Replace bandage with a general healing kit(maybe IFAK), each player gets 3. Each IFAK has 100 HP on it. It can bandage(removes 40 HP, and can be done while mobile), then self heal while stationary, each HP you heal removes 1 HP from it, although it's slightly slower than medic heal. Medic has a better pack(maybe grizzly?), with infinite charge, and that can heal themselves or others (effectively the same they have now) while moving.

It's a small rework, but imo that handles everything with self regen. Each player has up to 300 HP of self regen per life, although they can replace their IFAKs via ammo kits/resupply drops. Each player can rez 1-3 others, independently of their own heal supplies.

Medics can rez 20, and heal/bandage others infinitely.

Imo, this solves 2 problems. The first is self sustain, the 2nd is people not rezzing because they are afraid they'll need the bandage for themselves. It also does so without hurting the medics role, or having other classes infringe on the medics role.

[steel sluice]

I dont even use armor on my medic build. I go for fast as possible with quick ADS

[pliant bronze]

you know what nvm medics do have carbines forgot

lmao

[blissful harbor]

I don't think medic has a "no armor" option, only engineer does. Medics have light armor, ranger armor, medium armor, and heavy armor.

[steel sluice]

I think you are correct. thats just what ive been calling it

[pliant bronze]

oh kinda like that

instead of self regen

my idea was give everyone self regen but only upto 70%

and you need to be out of combat likedont get shot

so only medics can bring you up to 100% hp

[steel sluice]

you lost me here

[bitter pumice]

This is similar to what I had in mind as well. Thx for putting this out.

[pliant bronze]

you know like the game has out of combat thingy but even if your not getting shot you still cant teleport since your in the proximity of an enemy? something like that

[steel sluice]

i know what it means. im saying that its counter to what the medic is suposed to do

and the situations a good medic will findthemselves in

[blissful harbor]

I don't think regen fits in with battlebits playstyle. I would reject and expect oki to reject any form of self healing which lets the user keep their gun out and active, so imo it's a poor point to discuss.

Even medic can't do that, you are very vulnerabile while you are bandaging, healing, or rezzing someone. This is good and should be leaned into and accepted.

You shouldn't be able to passively regen your HP while having your gun out and ready as this completely disrupts the intended flow of battlebit.

That's why I think my previous suggestion is likely the best way to buff other classes with self sustain

[pliant bronze]

yeah i agree thats why yours is better than the self regen thingy

[steel sluice]

I liked someone elses idea that the medic takes a long time to heal itself which would make sense. it is a lot more difficult to do even simply medical procedures to youtself bc of pain and whatnot

[blissful harbor]

I see this is a terrible idea, the current pace of healing is fine. This is nerfing for the sake of nerfing, and it reduces the overall fun of the game dramatically.

[steel sluice]

I mean its a broken class bc I run it all the time. It should take longer to heal yourself

[crisp jacinth]

giving everyone a minor self heal sounds good but there'd have to be some incentive to not just sit there guns-up and camp until it regens. b/c that's ultimately what all gameplay will come down to when everyone can self sustain

[steel sluice]

yes. someone also mentioned earlier that making other classes more fun to play would also help greatly. I try to play engineer for the RPGs but its rather difficult to make the some points I make as a medic

[blissful harbor]

It's not a broken class, the other classes are just missing an important feature, one that only medic does. That doesn't make medic broken, it makes other classes lacking.

Again, simply nerfing for the sake of nerfing, reducing the overall fun of the game, is bad and pointless. First we need to adjust the other classes; we want them to be viable and fun like medic. If medic is still outshining them, THEN we can think of further nerfs. But regardless, I do not think medics current healing needs to be changed in anyway.

After other classes are buffed, we can maybe think about changing medics available guns, removing C4 and giving it a hammer or C2(breaching charge), instead, or removing impact grenades from it. But not before the other classes are brought in-line with medic, because until that is the case, any nerf to medic reduces the fun of the game dramatically and that makes people leave/quit which is what we want to avoid.

[steel sluice]

imo the best gadget for a support medic is the smoke launcher.

as long as that stays im fine

[crisp jacinth]

yeah medic feels way more balanced when you use m320 instead of c4

[mental stirrup]

Medic atm is so stacked that It needs something (namely removing SMGs) adjusted.

As it is, it's better assault in pretty much every way and buffing classes TO that level not only takes a lot of time but also more work.

I see WAY more medic players than I should and a lot of them not actually doing the medic thing and that's def not something that should just be a baseline for class strength

[odd cipher]

Just give assault hp regen on kill 🙂 make it the real aggro class

[blissful harbor]

#1133102331274203187 message

what are your thoughts on this? It would require a bit more work, however, it could be done entirely with adding new gadgets, not changing any systems or anything, so would be a reasonable amount of work for what is gained.

I will maintain my stance that nerfing for the sake of nerfing is stupid and won't help anything. Removing SMGs from medic literally just makes the game significantly less fun, with nothing to comepsnate for it. That is a great example of a TERRIBLE nerf in the current state of the game.

[odd cipher]

Tbh actually remove c4 from medic and let us sledge. 90% of the time I’m using c4 to either break walls or destroy claymores

[steel sluice]

you dont just shoot the claymores?

or you mean like around walls?

[bitter pumice]

c4 on claymores sound like a waste

[blissful harbor]

all that will do is make people who enjoy that playstyle stop playing, and that's not what we want. We want to keep the game fun and allow for more or other playstyles to be effective, not remove the most fun playstyle without any compensation. Literally, that is how you kill games. That exact mentality is what you want to avoid.

Until other classes have some self sustain, nerfing medic is the worst thing for battlebit.

I'm not against nerfing medic, but I am against nerfing it needlessly and before fixing the problem with the other classes. Medic should only be nerfed AFTER those changes are made and in the event that medic is still over shadowing everything else.

Most of these nerf suggestions are coming from SPITE against medic SMG users, not from actually wanting to improve the game.

[odd cipher]

Around walls. I clear buildings a lot and so it’s either my 2 grenades (that can roll cause I hate impacts) or my 6 c4

[steel sluice]

i typically run silencers on all my guns so I kinda just shoot them

[odd cipher]

Depends where they are, sometimes you just can’t

[steel sluice]

yea it does

[odd cipher]

I’d be down for that breach charge he mentioned too, idc if it hurts players I just wanna break walls with it

[woven ocean]

Every game that tries to force someone to be a healer experiences a huge disparity of team work where 90% of the players don't even try because " playing healbot isn't fun " . Then the organized players just steam roll the casual random MM players.

[woven ocean]

Not in my opinion. I played a lot of League of Legends when I was younger and NO ONE wants to play support. Maybe like 10% of the playerbase wants to if it's even that high.

[odd cipher]

Support only has loads of players when it’s broken (ardent enchanters meta a few years ago)

[woven ocean]

current medic completely breaks class identity and makes it pointless to pick any other class unless that class is sniper.

[woven ocean]

yeah when the support can farm kills but then the ADC ends up hurting for gold and you can still lose

[odd cipher]

The ardent meta was specifically the support item being so strong the support would finish it and it buffed adcs like Draven into 1v5 status with the extra damage they gave him

Nothing to do with the supports damage

[woven ocean]

I never played then but when they added new starting items it made it possible for some supports to get early kills and people even started using Mid lane champs as a support for early kills. Even I was guilty of playing support lee sin when forced to support. I would end up with like 8 kills before 10 mins lol but then ADC complain about lack of gold from " his " kills. Also not as good as an actual support.

[odd cipher]

Yeah that’s the newer meta, high damage supports since actually supporting is weak

Anyway, off topic

I think medics being everywhere is actually good for the game

Given that hp is such a limited resource

If medic is nerfed too heavily everyone will switch to a diff class and then you have no healers

[woven ocean]

Why lol they're mostly not even reviving or healing people. They play medic to heal THEMSELVES. That's the reason I play it. Fast AF with insta kill SMG and can go on 5 minute kill sprees because I heal myself. Start bleeding? Sprint away while bandaging in 2 seconds. Most of my deaths on assault are because I bleed and it takes me so long to stop it that an enemy medic air strafes around teh corner with a vector and instakills me.

[fast comet]

Worst take I've seen in about a week, and this Discord is packed full of horrible takes.

[blissful harbor]

because other classes are lacking self sustain, yes. I don't pick other classes because I can't reset myself.

But if supp/engineer could reset themselves without needing medic, even if it's in a more limited fashion? I'd play them. Assault needs more changes, but there's a specific thread for that so not gonna get to much into it.

The problem is NOT medic, the problem is with the other classes lacking a reset option. Assault is the only class that needs significant changes in addition to the ability to reset.

Again, you are literally just nerfing out of spite. You aren't thinking about the problems or implications.

If medic is nerfed, what do I play? Still fucking medic, because it's the only class that can self reset. Nerf it more? What do I play? Another fucking game.

[carmine marsh]

yes so give other classes self healing capabilities instead of removing the playstyle that a very huge portion of the playerbase enjoys most

[woven ocean]

The problem is that we might as well just remove medic and give everyone medics base abilities then.

[fast comet]

Medic is still the most popular class on all BF games, they will still be extremely popular even by giving other classes means to sustain themselves.

Half bandaging time and instant self heal alone are enough to still make it extremely appealing, let alone the weapon selection.

[atomic sparrow]

give self heal to everyone and only allow medic to revive

problem solved

[blissful harbor]

not at all. You can read up on the suggestion I posted up top. No need to remove medic, it would still keep it's role, but other classes would become viable. You are way too salty to be talking about this rn, you are just making knee jerk reactions and suggestions.

[woven ocean]

I'm saying that if other classes don't have the same ability as the current medic they still won't be nearly as good. Medic HAS THE BEST surivability and dps in the game right now because it gets SMGS, light armour, extremely fast banding and healing + c4 and grenades.

[fast comet]

Well yes, medics need a plethora of changes to their kit, SMGs need a complete revamp too

[woven ocean]

I'm not salty at all.. I literally only play medic and maybe 10% of the time sniper. The class is way too good.

[blissful harbor]

Yea, and why do you play medic? Type it out.

Exactly what part of the kit makes you pick medic over everything else?

[woven ocean]

I play medic because it has the most mobility, dps and sustain lmao

everyone needs medic...medic needs no one

[odd cipher]

So gut medic while the other classes are still bad and then what?

[blissful harbor]

And if the other classes all had sustain?

Then engineer would have the most mobility, match it for DPS. Support would be more tanky and match it for DPS, but have less mobility.

Just with that one change two other classes are suddenly viable, and now you aren't forced to play medic at all.

wow. Exactly what I've been saying.

[carmine marsh]

and that's what everyone is saying, let's give other classes capabilities that make them worth playing over medic instead of your idea to remove medic from the game for some stubborn reason

[woven ocean]

The reality is the game is supposed to be team based so all the classes are supposed to lean on each other, doesn't really work when one class is godmode

[woven ocean]

They're still not actually viable though because they get 2 of medic traits while medic has the 3. It will still be the hard meta.

[woven ocean]

I don't actually think Medic should be removed. I think it shouldn't be able to heal itself, bandage the same speed as other classes and lose it's explosives. SMG's need a big horizontal recoil nerf.

Give medics a deployable heal station to slowly heal.

[carmine marsh]

that's how milsim mode should be - the rational truth is that, the casual playerbase can not work well together with the idea of making the game more teamplay focused with each class having very specific designated roles and purposes

[woven ocean]

the first week people were working together...now people rarely even try to revive you and definitely not heal you because 99% of players have learned solo rambo smg medic meta or sit in a headglitch spot with sniper.

[carmine marsh]

it's not because it's meta, it's because it's what people find MOST FUN

[blissful harbor]

Of course they are. Engineer with self reset would actually be better than medic for most aggressive/solo minded players.

It would be faster or have same mobility, have RPGs for dealing with players behind cover, has access to PDWs and SMGs, so matches it everything people use medic for who are using that playstyle.

[woven ocean]

lol buddy it's META...come on.

[woven ocean]

Why? Armor makes you so slow and barely makes a difference to TTK. Mobility way more important in this game. My bad I mixed up support. But even still how would it be better when it can't heal itself and medic can?

[carmine marsh]

of course it is meta if you specifically strive for highest kill counts, but there is currently no reward for winning or getting #1 on the leaderboard

the fact is that everyone plays medic because it's fun

[odd cipher]

Nobody likes bleeding then having to heal after as it is. Imagine being any class other than medic and having to spend twice as long bandaging after a sniper tags you

[woven ocean]

to be honest even if you don't want that it means you can turn your brain off and frag out by yourself and heal yourself lol. Everyone plays medic because it's the best. I barely even get killed by AR's anymore.

[odd cipher]

Then you have to find someone else to heal you

Ofc the other roles are dead

[woven ocean]

I think bleed was a dumb mechanic

[odd cipher]

I’d accelerate all bandaging to medic levels tbh

[woven ocean]

I'd just remove it unless hit by a grenade because it's just tedious.

[carmine marsh]

i think bandaging takes way too long with other classes but not sure whether that's something that'll ever get changed

[blissful harbor]

Do you not know that engineer has the option to remove armor, something medic doesn't even have? It has access to SMGs, PDWs, and DMRs, as well.

But even still how would it be better when it can't heal itself and medic can?

Bro. Please. Read before you type. The entire point I'm making is to give other classes the ability to self sustain, instead of just nerfing medic. Scroll up and read the big suggestion I gave earlier.

Self sustain is the ONLY reason medic is played so much over those other classes. But that doesn't make medic "OP", it means the other classes are missing a VITAL FEATURE. Nerfing medic when the other classes are missing that vital feature makes no sense, because the problem is with the other classes, NOT medic. Give other classes self sustain, and suddenly you have 2 classes that are IMMEDIATELY relevant. Assault needs further buffs/reworks, sure, but it has it's own dedicated thread.

[woven ocean]

if you give other classes a VIABLE self sustain, what becomes the point of medic/

[carmine marsh]

you can still give classes more unique things for them, the game is in early access and nothing is finalized

[odd cipher]

Consistent self sustain, faster revives for the actual team players

Obviously

Just give the other roles something similar to the medkit but with a limit

Probably more than 3 bandages while we’re at it

[blissful harbor]

Go read the fucking suggestion, jesus christ.

Medic would still be the best for healing, vital for rezzing others, etc, for players who prefer to play like that. The other classes couldn't replace medic when considering it's role. Faster revives, mobile self sustain, healing others, would still have medic fulfil it's medic role, keeping it relevant and strong, but not mandatory.

[odd cipher]

Patience of a saint this one

[fast comet]

You mean besides immediate self-heal and half time on bandaging?

[woven ocean]

If you don't nerf the ability of medic to self heal it will continue to be the meta class. Medic is played because it has the trifecta of FPS top tier abilities. Mobility, DPS and Sustain. Like I can literally go on a solo 30 kill run with medic before dying. I can't do that on assault, support or engineer even with your limited heal suggestion.

[woven ocean]

Every other genre of game that has a strong heal class usually does so by nerfing it's damage.

[carmine marsh]

wonder if this could be pinned because it needs to be pinned, i'd really like to see anyone's criticism for this suggestion and why it should or shouldn't be implemented

[fast comet]

Like??

[woven ocean]

Literal every game with a healing class. Besides the battlefield games every other team based game nerfs the damage ability of the healing classes.

[odd cipher]

I have no criticism besides he should attach the suggestion for medics losing c4 for a breach charge option that doesn’t do anything but break walls

[woven ocean]

I bet a lot less people would play medic if it only had DMRs.

[fast comet]

Again, like?

[odd cipher]

Dmrs are in the toilet atm but even still I doubt it

[carmine marsh]

valorant

[odd cipher]

Not being reliant on randoms when you’re playing solo will ALWAYS be king for fun

[woven ocean]

people are playing medic so they can play Call of Duty. The DMR's would get in the way of that.

[odd cipher]

Bro give me a dmr that isn’t fire rate limited and test that theory

[woven ocean]

never played it but the support classes literally do not have the abilities of fraggers, duelists and entry classes

[woven ocean]

It has to be fire rate limited otherwise you're using an AR.

[carmine marsh]

why aren't people allowed to play call of duty style if a huge portion of the playerbase plays the game for that? milsim mode is coming where it won't be viable

[odd cipher]

It already should have higher recoil than an ar, uncap my fire rate you cowards

[fast comet]

I'm still waiting on names buddy

[woven ocean]

because half the game was made with another game in mind...and then there was medic. It's kinda cheesy air strafing around the map, dolphin diving around corners to insta fry people , drop shotting, lean spamming etc. I do all of that but it's really brainless stuff and just looks bad and feels bad to be on the receiving end.

[woven ocean]

Google.com

[fast comet]

Google and do it yourself you moron

[carmine marsh]

it doesn't feel bad on the receiving end for me, you'd be surprised how many people play the game for this, and again, for all the people who hate running and gunning, milsim mode is for them

[fast comet]

Like, what kinda reply is that, if EVERY game does that surely you'll be able to find 1 game to bring up???

[woven ocean]

lol the netcode is not great, you can die before someone even peeks you on your client so when someoen dropshots in 1 frame or phases through you as you run past a door it becomes quite janky. the lean wiggle just penalized people that actually aim for the head.

[carmine marsh]

my question is what would be the point of milsim mode if the base game itself gets all of the arcadey mechanics gimped and removed and the pace and flow of the game slowed down

[woven ocean]

It would still be arcadey without all the "movement tech".

[native compass]

Make medics have to deploy the medkit to heal themselves. This way they lose the medkit and can only effectively heal themselves 2 times per life unless they resupply. This would help reduce their healtime and render them unable to infinitely heal and be a one man army.

[carmine marsh]

it's not the netcode, it's the servers, game has become way more laggy with more bs moments since early access release

[woven ocean]

I think it's both because the game is heavily client side and I see people all the time with 2 bar ping top fragging as the glitch all over the place.

[carmine marsh]

so what is left of the arcadeness if you turn the movement into just walking around, slowly peeking corners and proning in grass

[woven ocean]

You're still using super low recoil weapons, in small maps with super fast healing, climbing, running, strafing etc. I personally don't enjoy playing spammy movement games. I don't feel like repeating the slide spam of warzone all over again. It's kinda dumb when you can completely make tactics and team work irrelevant through mechanic exploits. Drop shot/lean becomes popular and you get people aiming for legs ( no armor still a 3 shot on some rifles) and it just looks bad.

[carmine marsh]

and milsim mode is meant to fix all of this for the people who don't enjoy these arcade mechanics so...?

[woven ocean]

the milsim mode is not going to be great unless they completely have new stats for everything in it. If you die even faster in that with all the laser beam weapons it's going to just feel bad. Idk how anyone enjoys janky looks gameplay. lean spam looks bad, it's brainless and is just cheesy.

[carmine marsh]

i think it would make more sense for the base game and the milsim mode to differ enough from each other to actually warrant for the existence for such separate mode and for people to find a reason to play it over the base game

if the base game itself has its pace slowed down a lot and arcade mechanics gimped or removed then the milsim mode simply won't offer enough for players to actually give a shit about it and it'll be a 100% dead mode and a waste of development time

[woven ocean]

We're going from a battlefield style game int oa roblox game. That's how it feels.

[carmine marsh]

and i don't think that's what should happen

[tall cove]

Me reading the 1084930506830394750605749405685930th argument in feedback

[fast comet]

Jakey's argumentations hold no value, it's ok

[pliant bronze]

base game is actually milsim and not arcadey version tbf

[carmine marsh]

yeah and there's literally a milsim mode for this game in development

[pliant bronze]

i think its there tho cuz its literally what battlebit was supposed to be

[carmine marsh]

and all the people wanting the base game to become even more milsim-like don't realize how this'll affect the game's lifespan going forward

[pliant bronze]

game has stuff tthats from the milsim version of it

just probably needs improvement but i doubt its gonna come soon since people prefer the arcadey stuff

[woven ocean]

I think when casuals start getting crushed by " movement sweats" they'll start logging in less and less.

[bitter pumice]

Just want to point out that this is the Medic feedback thread.

[woven ocean]

Medic ruined teh game

hahah

[bitter pumice]

And you not reading previous arguments ruined the thread 💀

[carmine marsh]

the thread doesn't really matter either way until walk's suggestion gets pinned and actually gets some attention - it's the most important feedback/suggestion there is

[bitter pumice]

yea walk is goated for that

[woven ocean]

I've read them and still don't think they'll work because it seems like they all want to keep medic as a solo fragger class and try to alleviate the issues of other classes by giving them some poverty sustain so they can be maybe 2/3 as good as medic.

[bitter pumice]

and with that you just proved that you didn't read them fully

[woven ocean]

His suggestion was to give other classes the abilit to basically heal themselves 3 times while medic has the same as now.

[bitter pumice]

Then nerf medic if it still outshined every other class

Like removing C4 was mentioned

so medic would not be able to deal with vehicles

[carmine marsh]

300hp of healing is A LOT btw, it's enough for people to switch to other classes

[bitter pumice]

the main attraction of medic rn is that they are the ONLY class that can reset after a fight, giving other classes this on a more limited and time consuming way should shake up the balance

[bitter pumice]

exactly

most people don't even get healed 300 hp in a life by their medics

[woven ocean]

If I'm going to play a class with the purpose of killing as many players as possible before dying I'm still going to pick medic over assault . Unless you give Assault more damage or a regen shield I can't think of a reason why I would want to play it over medic. Need ropes? I can spawn in as assault place some ropes then respawn.

[bitter pumice]

my guy you do realize that assault is probably the weakest class out there rn right

[woven ocean]

My longest streak on medic without dying is like 40 kills. I could not accomplish that on any of the other classes bsides sniper. I probably healed myself like 3000hp

even the medic in Bf games had limited self heal

[bitter pumice]

in what battlefield?

[woven ocean]

bf43

bf3

[bitter pumice]

they healed themselves just as they did others

how is that limited

hell it was even more passive then BB since you threw down a medkit and laid on it

[carmine marsh]

assault has heavy armor, faster reload speed, and devs have already acknowledged that the class needs more unique things going for it - giving it 300hp of healing, and more weapon classes like carbines or dmrs, is already good for making people use it, and engi with self-heal will become just as popular for solo fragging as medic because of rpgs

[woven ocean]

that's way better than a guy sprinting around the corner while healing after you tag them so they can repeek you 3 seconds later with full hp

[woven ocean]

the problem is with the netcode + ttk the armor is basically useless unless it's exo vs non-m2000 sniper

[bitter pumice]

You could also make self healing stationary on top of that

but that would not change shit if the other classes depend on medic to get their health back

they can depend on medic to heal faster but to heal at all is giving medic too much importance

[woven ocean]

it would change medics being the Call of Duty class that can literally get out of danger by air strasfing while healing as they zoom into cover.

The problem right now is Medic is a fully functional class by itself. It does not need the other classes, at all.

[bitter pumice]

yes but people would still pick medic to not rely on others for heals

how did you get that out of what I said

you'd still pick medic to flank

[carmine marsh]

that problem is literally solved by giving other classes self heal options and more unique gadgets and abilities

[bitter pumice]

cause medic would be the only class that can take 2 fights back to back and hope to win

also making classes literally depend on one another rather than improving each other but being able to stand on their own only will lead to frustration

and the class that controls the more important resource being overpicked

[woven ocean]

if they had to sit still on a floor I bet less people would play it. Right now it's the mobility + sustain that makes it so strong. Both those come together to make it the MOST survivable class. If I shot a guy and he ran in a building I could nade it if he's sitting there on a healing kit. Instead he's sprinting while healing to come around a different angle 3 seconds later full hp.

[bitter pumice]

ain't no way people will give up sustain if they can't move. Sustain is more important than movement. This alone will just lead to people taking less fights overall

[woven ocean]

There is literally no point in having classes and team objectives if they aren't supposed to need eachother to work. Otherwsie we might as well just let you create a soldier and you can mix whatever stuff you want as long as it fits within your supply points etc

[bitter pumice]

Needing each other to work is very different than teamplay

[woven ocean]

Movement in this game means getting hit less which means survivng longer and killing more. There is a reason people are starting to opt for light armour or no armor. Heavy / EXO instantly breaks and the movement penalty makes you more likely to get hit.

[bitter pumice]

each class have their strengths and weaknesses so teamplay means they cover each other

[woven ocean]

If every class could take out vehicles there would be no point in engineer.

If every c lass could get ammo there would be no point in support.

[bitter pumice]

but needing each other to work means you are looking at your random medic who doesn't even speak the same language as you for heals while he's just shooting at the heli flying overhead

mate

[bitter pumice]

how did you understand me this badly

it's almost as if you are trying to not understand

when did I say everyone should be able to do everything as well as each other?

how did I even imply that?

[woven ocean]

The other classes are supposed to depend on the engineer to take out vehicles. This is how it is in every other BF style game. It's either that or you find yourself a vehicle.

[carmine marsh]

this isn't battlefield

[bitter pumice]

Except you had supports with c4 in bf4 and recons also had c4 in bf4

[woven ocean]

This game has 99% of it's inspiration from Squad and Battlefield.

[bitter pumice]

so?

[woven ocean]

BF4 is when the game went to shit

[bitter pumice]

I gave bf3 as an example as well...

bro is literally focusing on sentence fragments to argue

bf3 had passive hp regen was medic useless?

[fast comet]

Don't argue with him, he'll make a claim and then tell you to google it instead of supporting it

[carmine marsh]

what does that matter? it's clearly very different from those games and is made to be different on purpose

[woven ocean]

No it wasn';t because medic bags kept you in the fight FASTER at full hp instead of waiting forever to regen

[bitter pumice]

Bro is literally incapable of having an argument

cause he refuses to read your arguments

[fast comet]

Smartest FPS player

[bitter pumice]

THIS IS THE EXACT SAME THING WALK SUGGESTED

[woven ocean]

The same shit applied to the medic too in that game, it couldn't just insta fking heal itself

[bitter pumice]

smh

[woven ocean]

literally most of you in here are against passive regen

[bitter pumice]

they had medpack for themselves on demand

[woven ocean]

they had to sit on the medpack.....

[bitter pumice]

because it doesn't fit the games pace

for how long mr jakey

max 5 seconds

[woven ocean]

the games pace is only crazy fast because medics lmao

[bitter pumice]

as long as it takes people to bandage themselves basically

y'know what I'm done arguing actually

only you can argue yourself in a circle, end up disproving your point yet still insist you have a working argument

[woven ocean]

bro you are arguing in such bad faith. As if sitting still on a medkit is the same as full sprint 3 second heal. That's why medic is so strong because it is THE BEST run and gun class.

[bitter pumice]

nobody is saying keep the sprint heal, you are pulling the argument about people not having a heal themselves to medic being able to heal on the run

read people's arguments or just don't argue at all

[woven ocean]

No one has suggsted changing how the medic heals themself at all.

[bitter pumice]

I myself said that sprint heal is a problem yet you argue as if I want to keep it

[raven pumice]

I would say if other classes get healing how would it be limited compared to the medic? Can not heal to full (50-75 max heal), have limited uses/resources to heal, needs longer time to heal, takes up a secondary slot or some other thing?

[craggy bay]

Wtf no

[scarlet skiff]

Except for the suggestions walking about changing how medic heals or needing to drop med box or literally the rest of this thread

[tawny igloo]

lol

[hard crest]

Swap C4 for breaching charge. Same destruction, damage to players close behide walls. Can't be used as additional granades, no damage to vehicles, small dmg to soft skin vehicles

[bitter pumice]

not even the clowniest take I've seen

[woven ocean]

"Imo, replace bandages. Players have a CMS kit for rezzing others. Everyone gets 1-3, medic gets 20(same as now). Replace bandage with a general healing kit(maybe IFAK), each player gets 3. Each IFAK has 100 HP on it. It can bandage(removes 40 HP, and can be done while mobile), then self heal while stationary, each HP you heal removes 1 HP from it, although it's slightly slower than medic heal. Medic has a better pack(maybe grizzly?), with infinite charge, and that can heal themselves or others (effectively the same they have now) while moving.

It's a small rework, but imo that handles everything with self regen. Each player has up to 300 HP of self regen per life, although they can replace their IFAKs via ammo kits/resupply drops. Each player can rez 1-3 others, independently of their own heal supplies.

Medics can rez 20, and heal/bandage others infinitely.

Imo, this solves 2 problems. The first is self sustain, the 2nd is people not rezzing because they are afraid they'll need the bandage for themselves. It also does so without hurting the medics role, or having other classes infringe on the medics role."

[bitter pumice]

not full healing would make self heal pointless, it should be slower and more limited

[woven ocean]

Literally says that medics will still be able to heal the same as now in his suggestion.

Literally says " still heal while moving".

[bitter pumice]

not sure if you noticed but my name isn't Walk

only one person has that name

you were arguing with us

[woven ocean]

I was replying to the othe guy. I didn't tag you.

[scarlet skiff]

I went to scroll up to find stuff but you guys have been arguing for hours no wonder you don't see anything but walks post

[tawny igloo]

#1133102331274203187 message

[tall cove]

You guys are at 1500 messages

[scarlet skiff]

Thanks racko doing the lord's work

[tawny igloo]

Yes sir I feel like this needs to be pasted once in a while

[bitter pumice]

That's not the post in question though 💀

Still is a huge help

[tawny igloo]

I feel like that post is a good, clear base to start off on what improvements could be done to medic

also just started following again so I havent seen any new messages

lol

[scarlet skiff]

And if you scroll up from there it's not a screaming match

[bitter pumice]

Found the other one #1133102331274203187 message

[atomic sparrow]

Lt. Col. Soundboard already gave the solution to the problem

[carmine marsh]

both are valid suggestions and people will be preferring one or the other

[atomic sparrow]

🤪

[carmine marsh]

i still haven't seen a single criticism over walk's suggestion

[tawny igloo]

That's true, The main issue is the exclusivity medic has with healing, there need to be more variety in how other classes heal (Or incentivizing medics to heal others more than killing)

[bitter pumice]

Honestly with the addition of not being able to move while healing to walk's suggestion, it sounds really good

[tawny igloo]

Damn that was immediate lol

[bitter pumice]

It's a FPS you can't really incentivize anything over killing

[bitter pumice]

Wish I actually saw a counter argument though

[woven ocean]

That was his suggestion for the other classes with their 300hp of healing. His suggestion says medic self heal ekll be the same.

[tawny igloo]

Yeah thats why its more viable to work with the first option

[bitter pumice]

Bro for fuck sake

READ before writing

look at what I said

[tawny igloo]

Tbf walks suggestion is slightly hard to understand only reading it once with my smooth brain

[rare crow]

#1133102331274203187 message

[bitter pumice]

eh as long as all class healing is implemented the movement nerf can be playtested

[woven ocean]

You are the one not usinf grammar so it becomes hard to dinstinguish if the addition is part of Walk'a suggestion or you saying that adding that too his suggestion.

[bitter pumice]

oh the irony

[bitter pumice]

I said "with the addition of*

[woven ocean]

I am on mobile now an sloppily type it on my phone with half keypad workjnf

[bitter pumice]

there

fixed it for you mr perfect grammar

[woven ocean]

I am jot the one being aggressive over every comment

[tawny igloo]

Yall gotta chill lmao

[bitter pumice]

True that

[tawny igloo]

Sorry to ruin all the fun, I love a bit of banter but we need to stay focus my fellow battlebitters 😎

[hidden panther]

remove c4 from medic or at least only carry 3max, a medic is a good anti everything, even tank can get 1 shot by a medic

[clever ore]

Add regen health for everyone except recon. Or assault gets health stims. Either one works

Also

[bitter pumice]

Recon discrimination 🤨

[clever ore]

It do be like that

I just think sniper battles would become boring if recon had regen health

[bitter pumice]

I'd require more skill imo

[clever ore]

Yea prolly lol

[bitter pumice]

because you can't get away with bodyshots anymore

[clever ore]

Just don’t like snipers hehe

[bitter pumice]

I can tell lol

but recon not having regen would not effect you only other recon

and it'd make the game less fun for them

[clever ore]

My reasoning it would force recons to move more to seek heals instead of sitting back at the back of map with supply crate

Give them incentive to move up

But having to do headshot for sniper duels would make it more skillful

[bitter pumice]

I mean if a recon is so far back that it annoys you they probably won't/can't move up anyway

[raven pumice]

and at some point there damage at far range ramps up to one shot to body

[bitter pumice]

Anyway this is getting a little off topic

[bitter pumice]

at 1000 meters so that's fine

[clever ore]

Not really annoying just pushing people into the fight more. If ur running around as a infantry you rarely die to longer range snipers

[bitter pumice]

even though I don't like it

[clever ore]

Atleast there isn’t a sweet spot one shot body at like 150m in bf1

[blissful harbor]

snipers/dmrs should just be straight up disabled in blue zones, force them to go somewhere they can be ran up on. Same deal with tanks. Can't shoot main gun in blue zone!

[clever ore]

Lol I’d be cool with that but some maps would just break if you couldnt fire in blue zone haha

Construction

Alright back to the topic

Give medic 50 cal

Real

[blissful harbor]

Only the primary guns, to prevent players from intentionally blue zone camping. Pistols would still be ok to shoot, and it wouldn't apply to shorter range weapons like ARs, SMGs, etc, only the DMR/Snipers.

Construction and similar maps are a different topic, though.

medic already has 2 .50 cals, deagle and RSH12 😉

Anyway, back to medic, I see a lot of people are liking the suggestion I made, hopefully that is something for devs to consider seriously.

[fast comet]

Even if assault got health stims absolutely nobody would play it anyway

[bitter pumice]

I think stim in this case would do something other than healing

[heady viper]

remove C4 from the class, re make into breaching charge to compensate (though tbbh i dont think medic should have explosive ordinance other than nades, its just not the class for it.

Med kit should only be usable by the medic on him self it, he first places it on the ground (too eazy to drop a body, cover and heal given you have a couple seconds, and re initiate in less than 15 seconds at full hp from the last engagement. a bit op in gunplay)

[austere orbit]

Medics outshine every other class available in the current iteration of the game. Their self healing capabilities alone make it hard to choose any other class when in game, health doesn't regenerate automatically. Why would I choose to play Assault or Engineer over Medic when after 1 or 2 gunfights later I'll be sitting at ~5 - 20% health and HAVE to seek out a Medic. It doesn't help that Medics additionally have C4 in their kit allowing them to deal with enemy vehicles.

If I was to attempt to level the playing field for all classes, adding health regeneration would be one solution. It would allow all classes to not have to be so reliant on medics like they are currently.

[blissful harbor]

C2(breaching charge) or hammer on medic is fine in place of C4, as long as they have a solid way of interacting with the destruction.

Second half of comment., nope.

[heady viper]

pretty sure these are feedback threads not argue against everybody elses feed back that dosnt align letter for letter with mine! lay off dude plz, you have literally replied to all but one of my feedback comments with nothing but NOPE this why your dumb and im smart lol

[hard crest]

it's needed. Medic outperforms Engi at AT on some maps. And is close behind on rest of them

[austere orbit]

Honestly just remove the C4 and give em a sledgehammer

[hard crest]

Nah, Sledge isn't as good at demo as C4/breaching charge would be

Especially when you play battlebitlike movement shooter

[austere orbit]

I will admit C4 is nice as demolition but medics don't need em, they can live with a sledge. Medic should NOT have AT capabilities

[hard crest]

It definetly should not have AT. Any AT. He have smoke to make armour life worse

[undone haven]

medics shouldn t carry ARs . but this should be done after SMGs are nerfed. SMGs shouldn t be as good as ARs or better

[odd cipher]

smg's are always going to be better within their engagement range (like inside a building) which is coincidentally where i hear 90% of the vector crying

[rare crow]

Shooting at someone with actual military body armor with an SMG is just going to give them some bruises and make them angry at you.

SMGs already have an advantage in providing movement speed and quick switching precisely so utility classes like engi/medic can more readily defend themselves. But they should not be superior to ARs in any face-to-face encounter and they certainly are not IRL.

[odd cipher]

just delete them from game then. they'd have 0 reason to exist in game

and then we can move to everyone using ak15/fal since that's a much better meta

now the sweats can actually kill you whiny babys at 100m

[carmine marsh]

make armor immune to smg bullets - congrats now you've created leg meta

inb4 make legs magically immune to smg bullets too

[rare crow]

Being able to move around quickly is extremely valuable in any FPS. People who like to run and gun would just need to use that mobility for actual flanking and gaining the upper hand through skill and not just holding LMB in your face.

[rare crow]

Obviously that would not be a desirable level of realism, but a more pronounced protection would be adequate. And they would remain just as deadly against unarmored targets.

[odd cipher]

the movement speed diff isn't high enough to justify making an entire weapon class useless but go off man

besides i'm absolutely here for all the people who cry about how op the vector is after they get flanked by it, like they weren't dead at that point no matter what gun i had

[vocal dagger]

the vector being a laser isn't the only issue
the vector is a laser that(like mosts smgs) buffs your movement speed, can kill extremely fast, and is simply better at close and close-ish range
pair that on medics, which can get rid of all their armor for insane speed and keep healing themselves indefinitely and you basically stripped away every cool mechanic of the game in favor of 'rush towards enemy, adadada spam, qeqeqe spam, and delete enemies'
ARs currently cannot fare against that, expecially with current recoil levels and just how snappy movement is

there is no place for defensive play of any kind when this exists

[mental stirrup]

why are we mad about a overturned gun in a class discussion?

[vestal rock]

Give all classes a slow out of combat regen, make medics slightly faster. Remove medic self heal from medkit(removed in-combat healing), medkit can be used on allies to heal them fast like it does now and works in combat since used on others. Medkits dropped give exp when used.

[hard crest]

You want to make medic faster? Even if sightly? LMAO
MF can alredy outrun reversing vehicles, accelerating APC, and propably all vehicles except quad up steep hill. Medic speed should be nerfed. Or his C4 taken away. Both would work

[hushed yoke]

reduce c4 to 2 or 3, I'm fine with even removing it from the class.

I think I have the opposite opinion to most others about healing.

• Make all self bandage speeds the same. Medic should still revive faster than other classes.
• Increase medic self heal speed with medbag.
• Give other classes some form of self heal like AI-2 for RU and ??? for US, having this heal to full at current speed of medic self heal.

[hard crest]

3 C4 is still enough to destroy a tank or APC. In 90% of cases with impunity

Which shouldn't be a case. Not everyone should have AT option. Especially when there is 254 player on the map

[woven ocean]

Cumulative effect. SMG on classes with Light armour of no armour with always be better than normal,heavy or exo because of the insane mspeed stacking.

[atomic sparrow]

#1133102331274203187 message

[woven ocean]

That was about Medic. The class get's both Light Armour and SMG. If Medics didn't have SMG half of their annoying playstyle wouldn't be viable.

[woven ocean]

Its already here with all the lean spam and dropshotting.

[tawny igloo]

Keeping the dream alive sir 🫡

[atomic sparrow]

🫡

[warped atlas]

wanna know how i would "nerf" medic?
a radical rebalance of SMGs/PDWs (this is kind of 3/4ths the current problem)
move ranger vest to assault
limit medic weapon choice to SMGs/PDWs, letting assault use everything but snipers / heavy weapons
trim gear slot 1 to be the choice of defibrillator, smoke launcher, (maybe) meme c4 vest. imo medic should not have lethal equipment at all (excluding grenades since frag spam is less cancer than smoke/flare/flash spam) but the defibs should be able to zap zap people
medic gets 10 'personal' bandages for self use
medic gets 10 'team' bandages, patching up bleeding teammates, and reviving as a medic consumes 'team' bandages first before 'personal' ones
if the medic is carrying a defibrillator, reviving teammates instead does a little animation of charging defibrillators, reviving at a higher health compared to a 'normal' revive (this gives healing xp points), the medic can hold out and 'fully charge' defibs up to revive at full health like in BF
self healing as a medic is 0.25x (number not final) speed, you can still do it though

does this fix all the problems of deathmatch and selfish medics?
no
but it kneecaps their explosive lethality, especially passive 'place and forget' lethality (clays/AP)
it takes them out of deathmatch longer to self heal
and the rebalance of bandages reinforces the teamwork role they are supposed to play, cutting their ability to be 'selfish' in half (20->10), without actually nerfing medics who pick people up, and even rewards being team players with 'less' healing work carrying defibs

yes, i get that (almost) the entire game is destructible and alot of people straight up do not want "just remove c4 from medic"
but i just dont get why MEDIC of all the classes HAS to have access to explosive breeching charges and anti personnel traps
explosive destruction and traps is kind of the entire identity of engineer since the repair tool is literally throwing with how paper thin these vehicles are

ahhh that was a long wall of text to fit into 2k characters
i didnt even know discord had a character limit until like 4K letters in

[woven ocean]

Good suggestiob

[pliant bronze]

pretty sure peopple would rather want medic to have assault rifles than smgs

smg and pdw are very lethal than assault rifles in this current version of battlebit

your suggestion works mostly on a milsim than a arcadey game

[pliant bronze]

the run and gun and self heal what makes the medic a strong class. medic still having smg/pdw makes them a better assault class

[crisp jacinth]

smgs just need a nerf

[fast comet]

Because the medic's weapon choices are part of the medic issue

[tawny pasture]

I have to agree to an extent, medic besides having self healing also has the 2nd largest gun collection in the game

ARs which are generally good, SMGs which are really good and PDWs which are also very strong

[manic fern]

medic really needs to be in close combat alot, so that wont really work

medic needs to be fast and be able to do his job in "hot spots" on the map, where close combat is literally the main focus

[pliant bronze]

are you saying assault rifles cant fight close combat?

[manic fern]

no. what i am saying is that stuff like mp7 (aka most smgs) are literally made to be used in cqb, so its obvious that they will be more effective at that range than more mid range weapons like assault rifles

[pliant bronze]

yes but the problem witht he current version of the medic

is literally the run and gun and self heal

that they are literally an assault class

than medic

[manic fern]

and that is what i am saying: their arsenal has to be probably limited

[pliant bronze]

if this was a milsim game i would agree for smgs

only

but it isnt right now

[manic fern]

or, instead, a class debuff for longer range engagements, i.e. less recoil recovery or higher spread

[pliant bronze]

why would you debuff

them

[manic fern]

because they belong in cqb mostly?

[pliant bronze]

when its more simple to put the smg/pdw to assault

[manic fern]

and to encourage players to use assault and etc

[pliant bronze]

bruh more people play

medic

cuz of the smg

and self healing

they arent playing medic cuz of the rifles

[manic fern]

you do not understand

they use smgs because they are also fine at mid range

and they dont care to go use an assualt because it literally does not give them anything

but more longer range weaponry and higher in general accuracy could help the case

[pliant bronze]

you do understand smg are the strongest gun ingame right now?

[manic fern]

RIGHT NOW

[fast comet]

We are all discussing assuming the obvious, aka that SMGs need to be nerfed the fuck out

No aimpunch, more damage dropoff

[pliant bronze]

i know ive seen the discussion

[fast comet]

It's a glaring issue not limited to the medic and pretending it'll be like this forever is silly.

[pliant bronze]

i know its not limited to medic

[manic fern]

im saying that when smgs get fixed, those are necesasary steps to actually balance the medic too

[pliant bronze]

but medic having the best gun class and better sustain is the problem

and balancing guns are harder than balancing the class

literally just move smg on assault

or

[fast comet]

Of course it does, but they're issues that go hand in hand. It's not healthy to overcompensate the medic for the blames of the SMGs

[manic fern]

literally just get them a debuff in accuracy/recoil and thats basically it

[fast comet]

Besides, SMGs and PDWs are the archetypal medic weapon

[pliant bronze]

they are for irl things right? but this isnt irl

like i said that thing would make sense if this game is actually a milsim game

[manic fern]

true, its just that after smgs get fixed, medic will still be quite a bit better than i.e. assault

[fast comet]

No, not really, IRL squad medics, combat medic and CLSs use rifles.

[pliant bronze]

but its an arcade game

[fast comet]

But in a game where you're usually required to rush in hot zones to pick someone up, SMGs are the ideal weapon

[pliant bronze]

anyway beside irl stuff this is a medic thread

and medic having smgs are problem

too

smg having sustain and best gun idk man

[fast comet]

Yes, again, because SMGs are busted.
Medic is also busted.

SMGs need be toned down, so does the medic.

Taking the weapons away from them because they're busted right now is kinda silly.

[pliant bronze]

like i said balancing guns are harder than balancing the class

[fast comet]

That's just your assumption.

[pliant bronze]

you can literally give everyone heals

bruh game literally has a gun problem right now

where most guns have bad stats

[fast comet]

Yes, that's because the devs are woefully incompetent when it comes to gun balance

Not because it's hard.

Just look at their past nerfs.

Them not knowing what on earth they're doing doesn't mean it's hard.

If anything

Considering they really don't want to give other classes sustain

Balancing the classes is going to be so much harder

Ok, you take away the Vector and the P90, now everyone is using an M4, an AK15 or an SG.

Probably just an M4.

[pliant bronze]

smg are literally better than any rifle right now tho

[fast comet]

Ok and?

[pliant bronze]

and making other class ahve sustain make them playable

as medic

[fast comet]

I just said

The devs don't want other classes to have sustain

[pliant bronze]

i mean more playable then the current version we have

[fast comet]

An incredibly braindead take, but it's their game

[pliant bronze]

i like how it turns into an insult when one doesnt agree

[fast comet]

I can assure you nearly nothing would change, lobbies would still be 60% medics, 20% engineers and 20% snipers

[pliant bronze]

🤷‍♂️

[blissful harbor]

#1133102331274203187 message

all that's needed. Medic is currently the most fun class in the game, so we need to expand on the other classes before nerfing medic by giving them all some self reliance/healing. There is no point in nerfing medic(which just removes the fun out of the game) until the other classes are given the thing that makes medic so much fun, which is self sustain. The "issue" with medic isn't an issue, it's that other classes are lacking a core feature to FPS games, a way to reset after a fight.

Once that's done, can see how medic feels and see if further nerfs are warranted, such as removing avail weapons, swapping C4 for C2, etc.

Assault specifically needs a rework, though that has it's own dedicated thread.

[fast comet]

Devs said "if you don't like it go play battlefield".

Considering the rightful mediatic storm BF devs underwent for saying the same thing I have all the right to express what I think.

[pliant bronze]

what does it have to be go play battlefield kek

i dont even play battlefield

[fast comet]

That's what the devs said, don't ask me

I don't play BF either

[pliant bronze]

doesnt need to be battlefield tho

check that link by walk

heck check this #1133102331274203187 message

too

[fast comet]

Doesn't mean that everything BF does is bad either

And why are you linking me to something I agree with?

As I said, medic doesn't need to lose SMGs

They need to be toned down

And a lot of guns need to be toned up

[blissful harbor]

I don't agree with nerfing medic by having them place the boxes on the ground. Medic as is should be the baseline that is built around. The timing for resetting(bandaging bleed+heal) is literally perfect. It's not too fast, not too slow. So we should be using medic as a template for the pace of the game, not nerfing it into a state where NOTHING is fun to play.

[fast comet]

Yep, just finished reading the second link. It's not good.

Making everyone miserable isn't the solution

[pliant bronze]

actually wrong link kek

[blissful harbor]

Yes, it's important to realize that the core fundamental gameplay and pacing of battlebit is what makes it popular. Do. Not. Fuck. With. That.

[pliant bronze]

this one #1133102331274203187 message

like too exclusive for medic

like if everyone has atleast a form of self sustain

[fast comet]

I'll dare say that it's the pacing that the medic provides, not the pacing itself.
If the medic class would suddenly be unavailable it'd be a VERY different game.

[blissful harbor]

Yes, it would be a dead game.

[fast comet]

Pretty much.

Most lobbies would be sniper slogs

And engineers

[pliant bronze]

i mean might as well make medic unavailable make everyone have self sustain and put the stuff from medic to assaullt class except the heal allies part

[blissful harbor]

So instead of killing the game, take the success, whether intended or not, of what medic is, and lean into that and improve on it.

Other classes having the ability to reset suddenly makes them all very good choices, except for assault (which needs a rework, for example, having ALL guns except bolts/heavy LMGs avail) would be an interesting place to start.

[fast comet]

I'd also restrict bolt action rifles, but that's for another thread

From assault, I mean

[pliant bronze]

he did say bolts and lmg

[fast comet]

Oh

Yep

Sorry, I'm on my phone

[pliant bronze]

heck they can make support more unique instead of healing make them replenish armor for themselves and allies but this isnt for here so wont go discuss further

[fast comet]

I can't even see a feedback thread for support anyway...

[warped atlas]

everyone can blow up tanks and level buildings
does that make engie useless?

[pliant bronze]

the feedback is limited wish it was like everyone

[fast comet]

It's evident that the devs couldn't care less about the Support class tbh

[pliant bronze]

its not even a dev

that started it tho

[fast comet]

I know

I meant more in general

The new game mode completely removes the 1 thing Support is kinda good at lmao

Least amount of guns, with half of them being literal downgrades of the first two

[pliant bronze]

no but like if they wanna make more engineer unique they should be the only class that do it or atleast engineer + assault thats have explosive

[fast comet]

So I doubt they're strapping to see a Support feedback thread lmao

[pliant bronze]

pretty sure they would check this tho eventually

[fast comet]

Yeah, and there's no thread

[pliant bronze]

since pretty sure balancing isnt their priority right now

[fast comet]

There's no thread for the MG34 and the Ultimax either which are literally useless

[fast comet]

I very much hope it's their top priority right now, because people will get tired of medic lobbies, SMGs and pointless grindy unlocks soon enough.

[crisp jacinth]

arguing we should take smgs away from medic because "they are op right now" and "weapons are too hard to balance" and "this is not a milsim game" can also be used to argue that we should take self-heal from medic and give it to support just as an example.

Doesn't that sound silly? These are frankly weak and nonsensical armchair arguments and it's mind-boggling to see them parroted over and over as if they make sense.

This is the medic feedback thread yes but that doesn't mean adjustments to weapon stats isn't also being considered.

The people making these feedback threads are server mods and it's being done as a "trial run" that's why there isn't one for every single aspect of the game, just some of the most controversial.

It doesn't mean that devs only care about these current feedback threads, what it does mean is seeing if we as a community can be trusted to be more constructive or not

[zenith panther]

Medics having the best weapons in the game isn't a medic class issue its an SMG balance issue

Also Medics shouldn't have C4 but thats just like my opinion as a vehicle player getting vaporized by people materializing from flanks that are impossible to cover

[crisp jacinth]

Yeah medics having c4 makes them a little too good at everything frankly. Especially with how fast they can move compared to the other classes. It's another thing that makes them into "just a better assault" atm

Instead they could maybe get a hammer. Something that can be used for destroying structures but not vehicles. Leave that to assault and engineer

[uncut pewter]

Medic is super OP. I didn't even know you could sprint and use the Medkit at the same time until very recently. Seems like that using the Medkit to heal yourself should at least restrict you from sprinting.

[noble walrus]

Too OP as they are right now. Shouldn't have SMG's. Probably should have C4. Limited, stationary, slower self heals

I get the wanting to promote team play, but how they are right now medic's just the solo class. Reduce offensive abilities and chill down the self healing

[fast comet]

Medics should have SMGs because they're synergic with their intended gameplay.
The problem is that SMGs are busted.

[noble walrus]

how are they synergic over assault? And why couldnt PDW's and Carbines fill that role for medic as I've been of the thought for a while the speed boost is too much of a force multiplier for the medic's abilities. This is why self heal should be stationary and slower as well

Send me a link to some details on the medics intended gameplay and synergic weapon matches

[fast comet]

Medic's intended gameplay: picking up the dead, which means getting head-first in hot zones

Short ranged weapons are the ideal Medic weapon

As well as PDWs

[uncut pewter]

I'm assuming medics should be fast since they're supposed to be able to quickly get to one wounded soldier to the next without a ton of speed penalties, however, the one thing that should be nerfed is their ability to sprint while self-healing

[fast comet]

Which is a ridiculous distinction because there's several PDWs in the SMG tree

[noble walrus]

I can agree with that

However imo sprint self healing should not be a thing at all

[fast comet]

That is a perfectly valid correct take

[crisp jacinth]

no explosives for medics. thats it.

[novel forum]

medic is both the fastest class (with smg access and lightweight kit) and has the highest sustain, and currently the best weapon (kriss)
Its tough because you want them to be fast so they can get to those friendlies and help them.

My suggestions would be
-tone down their self sustain by reducing primary mag storage on some of these extended mag guns so they can't just run roughshod through an entire flank without support, and what, like 400 rounds of ammo with max primary mags and an extended/drum mag?

-perhaps limit the amount of self healing you can do (ex, you can only self heal up to 75% hp or something)? something to help out the self sustain issues further

[rare crow]

I like your suggestion about nerfing self sustain ammo-wise. They shouldn't even have access to drum mags IMO.

[novel forum]

thats a lot of the problem IMHO
they have the highest self sustain, and highest speed, all they need to do is engage on a flank one at a time, they go into every fight at full hp, if they can win one 1v1 they can win every single one until someone gets keen or they over extend

you want them to play like a medic limit their offensive power by making them pay for those 20 bandages with mag pouches

[soft creek]

It's all fun n games till someone suggests buffing medics outgoing healing instead of nerfing self sustain

[woven ocean]

Its like 3 seconds lmao

[odd cipher]

bandage->heal to full->reload

not even accounting for repositioning movement time you probably need to get into a mostly safe spot to bandage

[fast comet]

10 seconds is about right

More if you're using smoke too

[woven ocean]

Lol it's 1 second for medic to stop bleed and 3 seconds at max for full heal. Why are you suddenly adding reload and repositioning? I literally just sprint and air strafe into cover while doing both.

[fast comet]

Also, Jackey, I'm still waiting on all those games you mentioned

[woven ocean]

Google.ca

[fast comet]

Google gives me nothing, I'm too stupid, you need to help me out man

[odd cipher]

suddenly? i feel like it was implied by the "every gunfight that wasn't a flank kill" but i guess if you're on the slower side you might miss that

[fast comet]

(Don't argue with this guy, he has no clue about anything he's talking about)

[novel forum]

what you got frustrated that I wasn't engaging with you so you went to be a cunt in another thread, raz?

[woven ocean]

Bro why do you always go right to insults? Super low tolerance. I often get shot without even firing a bullet and then immediately air strafe into cover and swing peek the guy rushing me 3 seconds later at full hp.

[novel forum]

because autistic screeching gets him attention, just block him and move on

[odd cipher]

because at this point, after days of discussion, you've proven repeatedly to not be interested in actually reading anything posted and just polluting the threads with garbage

[woven ocean]

You literally just insult anyone that doesn't agree with you. You grouping other elements into heal speed to try and strengthen your opinion. Why not just play Krunker.IO or roblox if that's what you want the game to be?

[fast comet]

Nah.

Buddy here called me an idiot and said that every game has healer classes do less damage.

I said that it's not the case in BF and said every other game.

I asked what games and I was told to Google it. Still don't know what games he's talking about.

[odd cipher]

i like the game as it is and would rather they buff the other classes into relevance than nerf the only fun part of the game, there are several posted suggestions that i agree with that make more sense than anything you've "contributed"

[fast comet]

Also, I apologised to you in DMs and I also explained to you what's the problem here, if anyone's being a babyman here it's you.

What an absolute loser lmao

[woven ocean]

Where did I call you an idiot? Was it after you insulted me in every single reply?

[fast comet]

You can Google it.

Also, you can reply to where I've insulted you before you told me to Google stuff to support your argument.

[woven ocean]

I've played enough games to know most of them won't work unless you take a hit at the medics survivability or damage. If you give other classes a slow or limited way to regain HP the medic will still be the better class lol. In modes like 32 v 32 there aren't even vehicles to be concerned with.

The games netcode + amount of angles favours aggressive peeks. Flanks work so well because positional audio and sound mix is so bad + maps are extremely porous.

[fast comet]

All those games played and you still can't mention a single one

Truly a gamer

[primal horizon]

i think one big issue with medic is that the class has the comfort of engaging each enemy with full health. i think it would be nice if other classes had this benefit and that the whole bandage and bleeding system should change; bleeding should be removed and using a bandage should start a slow natural heal while the player is out of combat.

[bitter pumice]

This is what a lot of people have said actually

the messages must have gotten buried again

medic should not be the only class that can sustain itself

here found one #1133102331274203187 message

[fast comet]

That is the only way to prevent the game from becoming medics vs snipers tbh

I mean, it already is for the most part

[odd cipher]

also they reduce the amount that armor blocks and make it replenish able from supports

would make support pretty popular

[bitter pumice]

yep

[odd cipher]

esp if they gave them some more weapon options and some help with move speed+ads

[chilly star]

Medic is just good assault, to the point picking assault almost feels like a hilariously bad idea. There is no point to pick assault as long as Medic can self heal, and go mach 10 with an SMG with the effective range only tied with the M4 around 90-100m. Every stat buff assault has is trumped by just using an SMG outside of using ADS/Reload of the AUG/SG550.

[outer garnet]

Limit weapons to smgs/PDWs only

[woven ocean]

They're the best weapons in the game lol

[humble pawn]

Sprint healing should just not be a thing at all, just make it so you move as slow as if you're dragging a body since that is already in the game and should be easy to implement.

Aim punch needs to be removed or be based off of damage otherwise you lose if someone using an SMG shoots first.

C4 should still be removed from medic. I know Oki said on stream that he wants them to be able to interact with the building destruction like everyone else, but like others have said its very strange that he completely forgot that the sledgehammer exists (also strange that he said they didn't want to give assault a stim for healing since that reaches into medic territory, when medics territory is reviving/healing faster). They could also just copy + paste the mechanics of C4 into a new explosive that does less vehicle/player damage and just change the model.

These are the main issues I have with medic in this game, when ~60% of the lobby is consistently choosing one class something is wrong with the balance of the game. You cannot realistically buff every class to be medic level when medic can literally do everything (excluding recon range) any other class can do without putting into question why classes exist in the first place. Most of my friends have already stopped playing simply due these balance issues, it gets boring fighting the same class every game.

[outer garnet]

Yes, right now they are

[chilly star]

Give em C2, does less damage to vehicles but operate with the same destruction

[odd cipher]

i'd straight up be fine with C2 not even dealing damage to vehicles/players if it'll destroy walls and other explosives like claymores

[humble pawn]

Literally all they would have to do. Just copy C4, change the name + model, lower damage value. Now medics can interact with environment still, but aren't vehicle destroying menaces. I'm more killed by medics than engineers and I don't see how that's not a balancing issue.

[novel forum]

I think the solution like I said before, is actually to leave all that stuff alone and just take away their ammo capacity.
There's no reason a dude should be able to run 50mph with an smg and a ton of mags, and infinite health and 20 bandages, give them like 3 mags and don't let them take extended/drum mags.
suddenly medics can't operate outside their groups like the cruise missiles they are now, if they get into big engagements they are either playing their role or have some support buddies supplying ammo

[chilly star]

Most cruise missile medics really dont need ranger armor, unless the enemy team is REALLY bad with 0 awareness

especially with the p90

or vector

[novel forum]

I think you give them 3 vector mags, most of them are getting 3 kills, tops

[odd cipher]

you wild lol

the sweats are all running quick mag vector

the bads are running drums and dying to ar because the ads speed is too slow

[chilly star]

Nah drum is for maps where you dont need to ADS

[odd cipher]

drum was good on namak, everywhere else the quick mag is better

[novel forum]

I really don't see many medics adsing they just run right into you

[chilly star]

Laser+Drum on something like that map where it's mostly indoors

[novel forum]

fire while adsing, you seem to get the accuracy immediately not once the weapon is up

[chilly star]

Ranger is just honestly too good of an armor type, most the time medium armor doesn't add survivability

especially vs smg's

[novel forum]

I play with the 249 quite a lot so this whole "slow ads with a drum" thing does not compute XD
I Mean yeah its not instant but you just dont faceplant directly into dudes

[odd cipher]

it's just way slower than not using it, you should be on the move with the vector anyway so you could get caught sprinting and the slowdown on the drum just isn't worth it for 20 more bullets, it feels significantly worse than quick mag

[novel forum]

Ive gotten caught reloading after vaporizing 2-3 guys a lot more than ive been caught not ads't in walking into a dude that i couldn't just hipfire 1400rpm at

[odd cipher]

it happened to me way more with drum than it has with quick, faster to just drop the mag and get 40 more rounds

anyway, on topic, buff other classes first, remove/rework bleeding+bandages, then adjust medic

C2 instead of C4, C2 does no damage to players/vehicles but still breaks walls/can destroy claymores

big brain

[novel forum]

sure

[chilly star]

I dont like drum mostly it ass quite a bit of horizontal recoil, quick still easy to burst someone 50-90m out~

[novel forum]

in my experience, as long as youre willing to run a red dot because the higher zoom sights just feel bad, you can rip almost the entire mag through a doorway at almost double that, most of the time

[chilly star]

I use slip/dot bot that's just me

[novel forum]

if you have the confidence to just rip ammo at people you can typically kill anyone at most ranges in one mag but there's a bit of a mental block to it

consequently its basically the reverse for the 249, if you rip ammo at people you'll never kill them but if you fire extended bursts you will XD

[delicate rune]

To balance Medic, Assault and SMGs as a whole need to be changed first. Below is how I would change Medic assuming Assault is used how Medics are now; a generic but very versatile class that has tangible effects in combat. I have a realistic approach and a not so realistic one.

Realistically the way I would change this class is to limit them to ARs & Carbines and remove C4. ARs are versatile enough so medics can use them in most situations to fight alongside teammates. Carbines are ideal for when your teammates are in a CQC environment; enough to protect themselves while not being at much of a disadvantage. No C4 means they need to rely on their team to bust open nests, create paths, and destroy vehicles.

Unrealistically, I would overhaul healing in general and the apply the above changes. Firstly, make bandages very slowly regen hp to about 60%. It's enough to die from 1-2 less bullets in a fight which is noticeable. The desire to seek out a medic is still there but makes players feel a bit better than being one bullet away from death. Secondly, I would give medics a resource (blood or w/e) to heal with. They spawn with a set amount. More is consumed if they heal themselves rather than teammates. They replenish "blood" by reviving non-medics and regenerates when nearby teammates. This will make them stick to their team and not form squads entirely of medics.

Honestly there's plenty of ways to balance this class because of how versatile it is. None of the guns, movespeed, gadgets, or healing are too strong by themselves, its all of these things in combination that make the class strong, which means adjusting one or two things should bring it down to the level of other classes (except engineer which imo is a close 2nd best).

[crisp jacinth]

"nerf medic pls" 🤓

[soft creek]

Me when just make medic a better medic and we done

[deft field]

Remove smg’s from medic and give them to assault to balance the current OP self heal smg meta.

[cedar rune]

removing smgs wont solve the issue of self healing

which isnt really an issue either, other classes not having passive healing is the actual problem

as is how much "effort" you have to spend manually healing people instead of just throwing a med bag onto the ground

[soft creek]

As is staring at said box on the ground instead of the angle someones about to swing you from

[mint linden]

I agree with everything he said except the slow regen from bandages and self-healing from blood mechanic. Just limit the amount that medics can self-heal to 60% so they cant keep running in and out of combat without support from others. I totally agree with you on the removal of C4 from medics. It is insane that the medic has access to explosives capable of destroying a tank. The devs have stated in a streamer town-hall that they don't want to remove C4 from the medics because 1) they want to give every class the ability to manipulate and destroy the world, and 2) to limit the vehicle meta. For the first reason, I dont understand why they just dont give medics a breaching charge that does very minor damage to vehicles but similar destructive capability to buildings. For the second reason, vehicles are already consistently bombarded with tandem RPGs by engeneers, keeping them at bay. So having hordes of medics running up on our armor with C4 just makes it impossible to provide any meaningful support.

[delicate rune]

| limit the amount that medics can self-heal to 60%

^ much better idea

| they want to give every class the ability to manipulate and destroy the world

limit capacity to 2 or give them a hammer, i agree theres no reason they should have tank killing in their portfolio

[rare crow]

I suggest people suggesting that a medic can't heal themselves to full think through the implications of making them dependent on other medics for class variety in a team.

[cedar rune]

all these ideas coming out but did anyone of yous ever stop to think and ask yourselves if any of these "solutions" would make the game more fun to play

😂

[pliant bronze]

fun is subjective and you cant please everyone tho

but i mean if you want to please almost everyone especially other people who uses <X> class this suggestion works #1133102331274203187 message

[delicate rune]

You're right. If medics cant heal themselves to full then that means 2 medics are needed to heal a squad to full. The current reality though is most players are medics already because the class is too versatile. Remove the versatility and less people will play medic. People will need tools from other classes. Even if no changes were made other than the lack of full heal, most people would still play medic because they can still heal themselves more than others, weapon variety, C4, points/min, and speed.

[soft creek]

Lowkey just modern day bf5 healing

If only anything that happened here got applied

[rare crow]

Yes, the class is too versatile relative to others, but I think we must recognize that it currently feels good to play. It can be argued that a reasonable first step would be to allow everyone to heal themselves to full, just not as effectively, and only then tweaking things further.

[rare crow]

Having dwelled further on this proposal, I think that a simpler way implementation-wise, would be to just keep bandages (adding the slow heal effect) but making it so that reviving another player consumes THEIR bandages first. Then there won't be this conflict between self-healing and reviving others.

The fire mode button could also be used to switch between using your bandages first instead, and let medics default to that since they have a larger supply.

Furthermore! This could go along with turning the First Aid Kit into just a resupply box for bandages. This allows multiple people to grab and heal themselves simultaneously, further reducing the added benefit of having multiple medics around.

[hallow bison]

For now, medic is more capable to do assault thing, so buff assault should solve the problem, medic is actually ok

[loud burrow]

Medic is one of the three playable classes in the game. One of the reasons why medics are strong is because of snipers. You constantly catch a shot in the body from them, as a consequence you get bleeding and low hp. Medic can quickly drain the bleeding and heal himself. Other classes will take longer to bleed and will be left with one shot for the rest of the game (or there is a small chance that someone will heal). And because of the number of snipers in the match (for example, on Basra against myself counted 43 snipers in 127 vs 127 mode), you get bleeding consistently once a minute (if not more often). A medic will just heal and move on, while another class will not survive a second shot to the body. ( sorry for my English )

[blissful harbor]

Remove medics ability to self heal, and people go play other games, lol

What is with people wanting to literally gut the game?

Why not just give the other classes a slightly more limited way to heal themselves?

[novel forum]

remove medics ability to self heal unless they drop the medpack and use it like everyone else

the running self heal removal is only going to affect solo medics, if thats going to chase you to 2042, you're the problem lol

giving everyone else the ability to heal is just eliminating teamwork, in a team game, so you can keep running off with your kriss by yourself

[fast comet]

People suggesting altering the current medic self heal have no idea what they're talking about for the most part

Barring sprint heal

[thorny sonnet]

so, like battlefield then

[carmine marsh]

milsim mode is in development, all the players who prefer a slower tactical teamwork focused experience will be able to enjoy it to its fullest there, the casual playerbase is not capable and most importantly not interested in this level of teamwork involved in what's basically roblox battlefield/cod at its current state (which is why the game reached such a healthy player count to begin with)

you wanting all the cod zoomies to leave the game so it can die is not a healthy mindset in any way and does not help solve any issues

[novel forum]

I beg to differ

[carmine marsh]

if you'd rather the game die than have a base game that's enjoyable for various styles of play and a wide variety of players seeking different experiences with the game, and then a milsim mode focused on teamwork and tactics for all the people who bought the game for the squad-like experience that runs on weaker pcs, i don't know what to tell you

[crisp jacinth]

i think this is a good idea. it solves the heal-while-sprint problem, and the problem of teammates not knowing healboxes exist

[thorny sonnet]

the only thing that the medic may need in terms of rebalancing is to put a movement penalty on self healing with the medkit (reduce it to walking speed/unable to sprint)

[novel forum]

I see your point
one class having infinite health and the best weapon and the highest speed isn't killing the game
removing any one of those will though?

[carmine marsh]

because it is what a large majority of the playerbase ENJOYS the most

[novel forum]

a large majority of the playerbase plays medic?

[carmine marsh]

because it is the most enjoyable way to play for the average player

🤯

[novel forum]

yeah, being overpowered is probably an enjoyable way to play

yet here we are

[carmine marsh]

and giving other classes ability to self heal as well will make the average player enjoy playing other classes too!

isn't that crazy

[blissful harbor]

I'm not a problem, I'm one of the people playing this game, and I very much love it and want to see it become the best it can be. How can you say with a straight face I'm a problem?

Taking away medics ability to self reset literally completely ruins the game. Now everyone will be running around with 30-60 HP at all times after every fight, fighting fresh spawns with 100-165 HP. Does that sound like a fun game to you?

It doesn't sound like fun to me. It would be terrible.

[crisp jacinth]

i wouldnt necessarily say that i enjoy being stuck playing medic because of his benefits. I play assault too, sometimes engineer and recon, but medic is always there in the back of my mind NOT because of the more supportive playstyle it should be fostering but instead the selfish solo play style

[thorny sonnet]

im somewhat mixed on this idea though. the idea of having medic doing the healing manually means that ur teammates need to cover for you (basically only one man is capable of doing combat, and the other one has his hands full with healing), which incentivizes teamwork in a way.

having it be the battlefield style of healing however means that everyone could just perpetually peek a corner while being passively healed without anyone needing to do anything.

this might be more of a preference on my end though

[novel forum]

read the rest of what I said

[novel forum]

oh you're thinking the box healing aura like battlefield
You can actually drop the medic box RIGHT NOW, and people can run up and press F on it to heal

[crisp jacinth]

yeah this is a good point. the second thing you said about reducing move speed with self-heal to walking speed a la packing mags would work here too. I think the devs are on your side of wanting medic healing to be more interactive than BF

[blissful harbor]

I did. Your arguments are nonsense. You don't consider the reason people like medic or play that way at all. All you see is people play it and it makes you mad. You didn't consider anything other than your own feelings in your position.

[novel forum]

perhaps the people playing medic like a solo assaulter should be playing assault

[carmine marsh]

that will happen when other classes are given self heal ability

simple as

[blissful harbor]

perhaps you should consider the fact that in it's current state, no class besides medic has the ability to reset, so no other class has any ability to play aggressive.

[novel forum]

everyone should get everything, remove classes like 2042

[thorny sonnet]

id argue that this might cause more confusion since no one will know whether or not if the medic has dropped his medkit. this may be remedied with just simple communication or a logo on the screen, but that just adds more steps to what is already a perfectly fine way to heal teammates

[blissful harbor]

In other words, nothing is wrong with medic, the other classes are missing a vital feature, the ability to self reset. That makes them UNVIABLE. That doesn't mean medic is OP, it means the other classes are UNVIABLE to play at all. The solution is not to ALSO make medic unviable, it's to give the other classes the ability to self reset in a more limited fashion so they become viable.

[carmine marsh]

limiting options should be done for milsim mode, making the base game more miserable to play for average players is pointless

[novel forum]

my suggestion was you can heal team mates the same way
you just can't heal yourself on the run, you have to drop the box and use it

[blissful harbor]

An FPS gamewhere you spawn in with 120-160 HP, but are reduced to 60 HP max after every fight is literally unplayable. That would be awful.

Even you wouldn't play it

[novel forum]

I agree
I can't wait for self healing snipers

also tanks should repair and rearm automatically, we dont want to rely on engineers or teamwork

[crisp jacinth]

as a repair tool engineer i take this personally

[blissful harbor]

nice false equivalency, bring out more logical fallacies.

[novel forum]

you should also be able to bandage yourself while downed

[carmine marsh]

what's the problem with that? a sniper can just request their medic to heal them between respawns or drop a medbox on their feet at the start of a game, it'll barely change anything for the worse

[thorny sonnet]

well the solution is literally what you just said

"you just can't heal yourself on the run", just make it so that they dont run (add movement penalty)

[novel forum]

yeah that could be a thing too

[thorny sonnet]

that is literally the only realistic nerf that the medic should ever recieve

that or reduce the weaponry (remove smgs or smth)

every other class however, needs a buff

[novel forum]

my other solution was to just severely limit medics mag capacity so they cant just roll a flank solo engaging at full hp over and over, they're sort of stuck working with the team because they have hp sustain but not pew pew sustain

[novel forum]

nothings wrong with it, we should limit teamwork whenever possible, everyone should be completely self suffecient

amirite?

[carmine marsh]

how does it limit teamwork? you're still free to play a supporting role if that's what you prefer

[novel forum]

you're playing a solo game together, not a team game

[thorny sonnet]

ehhhh... im not so sure with that suggestion

mag capacity isnt really the core issue with the medic. and i feel like having only 4-5 mags seems pretty balanced for what it is

[carmine marsh]

well yes, that's what people enjoy the most, that's why the game got so popular in the first place

[thorny sonnet]

self healing while being able to do donuts at mach 3 however is a real issue

[novel forum]

the game got popular because it was fun, because of the aggressive moderation

[thorny sonnet]

you can play a support role for your team if you wish

but it should not be enforced

but incentivized

[blissful harbor]

yea and your suggestions literaly remove the fun.

[carmine marsh]

yes and why is the game fun?

[crisp jacinth]

i thought the game was more fun when there was actual variety to peoples weapons and playstyles and spawncamping wasn't down to a calculated excel spreadsheet and there wasn't so much trashtalking but here we are. if something doesn't change soon I do think we will lose lots of players

[carmine marsh]

variety in weapons wouldn't change even if vector got nerfed, hk419 is literally an ak74 with 10 less rof and slightly lower velocity, acr is a m4 with 5 less damage, g36c is a m4 with slightly lower velocity and 50 higher firerate, ak5c is a m4 with 5 second reload speed and 1.5 first shot kick etc..

[novel forum]

its fun as long as the above two chuckleheads can walk through a flank on their own XD

once they have to play the game its off to COD

[carmine marsh]

i've never seen any trashtalking in this game either, but maybe that's a problem with your region

[thorny sonnet]

ive only met one in my whole 60hr playthrough in AUS

[crisp jacinth]

it's gotten progressively worse over time to the point where a clan bullied me despite saying nothing the whole game and then mass reported me at the end

[thorny sonnet]

everything else was either mild or playful trashtalk