New Back end stuff, and how its bad.

[spare stump]

Idk worked fine for me

[distant ferry]

So, good players are turning you away from the game?

I know that there's an annoying meta and basically everyone aggrees that the game needs a huge balance patch, but EVEN THEN there will be some kind of meta, every game has it, you just gotta deal with it or wait for the devs to rebalance the game again.

The thing about "cracked player" is just skill issue honestly, this is a pvp shooter, a really good pvp shooter that gives a lot of control to the player instead of taking from them (cof COD cof).

[alpine wolf]

Naro is just based

[distant ferry]

You also complain that "people with money/good equipment perform better", OF COURSE THEY DO, that's true for every single competitive game/sport that requires ANY sort of equipment.
It makes such a huge difference that I refuse to play shooters where I can't get at least 120fps, and even at 144 I can feel myself being held back and unable to properly translate my skill to the game.
What's your solution to that? cap the fps to 60 and cut the playerbase in half?

Also, your numbers are all over the place.
3/4 shots with the svd doesn't kill, and the enemy with the asval needed 8 to kill you despite that weapon needing only 3 and ignoring most armors in the game?

Your feedback feels so baseless.

[dusk mortar]

Why is the title about back-end, but the content about client side performance?

The game always had a very low TTK. Nothing really changed.

This whole post makes no sense.

It's like you tried to cram 4 topics into one.

[limpid owl]

"I see less and less People using every gun and tool on hand and more and more SMG, M4 suppressed, AS VAL, And trolls, Lots and lots of trolls. " cause people learnt how to play the game and also learnt to play the meta

idk about the trolls

need more probably

a lot less people use proxy than when i first played

[remote zodiac]

Let me say this and try to make its as serious as i can because Text does not display my intention clearly enough. "META's" Cause Cancer in a game. Its been that way for a few years now.

[limpid owl]

i mean yes

meta's are annoying

i'd rather play something I like

[spare stump]

theres always going to be a meta in every game

[limpid owl]

luckily for me what I want to play is meta rn

[spare stump]

true atleast the meta is fun

[limpid owl]

every game has a meta

if the meta was proning in a bush with bipod m249 support I think the game would be much less enjoyable

so be thankful it's not that

[remote zodiac]

I'd rather Have the "meta" be Every gun other than SMG/ high DPS low damage guns. If it was a mix of assault rifles that dominated, and Not just the M4. The Meta is not the guns its the playstyle with those guns. Its Fire all your bullets faster then the other guy, its Zero Armor high speed barrel stuff in your face with and SMG so Armor RNG cant save anyone. That's just as Annoying as Bipod M249.

Worse is the "Meta" players using proxy to just shout "gamer words" at who ever they kill.

In case its not clear. This is whats personally happened to me, what those feedbacks based on. Im not getting a group consensise or some discord chat to foreword my thoughts threw.

[spare stump]

the meta aint even m4, plus ak15 and hk are both meta

[remote zodiac]

K then why did everyone i see and there damn dog have an M4 this time? Just that many new players in the Damn game both playtests?

[dusk mortar]

As val*

[remote zodiac]

This short test and the previousone, M4 has been the dominate gun ive seen pulling bullshit.

[spare stump]

because its the first gun you unlock and many players just use it because they dont know how to change it

[spare stump]

as val, vector, hk and ak 15 are the meta weapons atm

[dusk mortar]

If As Val isn't the #1 gun for you, then idk if we're playing the same game.

It's all I get killed by, and the thing that just hands kills to me non-stop.

[dusk mortar]

Vector for Cash Run tbh.

[spare stump]

its quite good but can be limited for range

so on more open maps its not as good as hk

[dusk mortar]

Living the CQC life.
Fuck Wakistan either way. Shit map.

[spare stump]

hate the oil rig one, cant see nout and i get sniped by a guy 300 meters away

[dusk mortar]

New Oil Dunes is fine tho.

[spare stump]

didnt play new oil dunes

[dusk mortar]

It's MUCH better.

Not even the same map anymore. tbh

[remote zodiac]

M4 pulls stupid shit off that people complain about to much, an AR that snipes on full auto, everyone else using AS Val to being sneaky dicks inside my own dam spawn.

[dusk mortar]

I never even see the M4. Not on Europe.

[spare stump]

literally nobody uses the m4 apart from bad players in EU

cause its not good

EU servers are more tuned into the meta then NA

[dusk mortar]

This must be a murica thing if you see M4.

It might as well not exist on EU.

[remote zodiac]

Guys. come on then why would I be brining it up if its not one of the guns pulling off stupid shit!?

[dusk mortar]

As Val, AK and HK are about all there is.

[spare stump]

true and even when you go up against it is a easier kill

[dusk mortar]

Yeah so I wouldn't even know if they used it. lmao

[spare stump]

idk it sounds like a skill issue to me, cause m4 is just not a good gun atm

[dusk mortar]

If you're constantly dying to one of the worst weapons...I mean.

Ok, maybe not the worst, but it certainly ain't up there to be common.

Maybe you're just hanging out in the wrong corners.

Or NA really has a boner for M4.

[spare stump]

if you got as val play as val no armour engineer cause that wins 9/10 times as long as you full health

[remote zodiac]

Wrong corner? playing the objective and stopping back caps is the "wrong corner?"

[dusk mortar]

According to most of my teams, yeah.

[spare stump]

are you laying in the open on objectives?

[remote zodiac]

That's not acceptable.

[remote zodiac]

No im hidding like a bitch behind every bit of cover from every sound of gun fire because most of them sound like AS VAL's right next to me.

[dusk mortar]

Yes but we'll lose for it regardless. Can't very well report my entire team.

[spare stump]

what level in game are you?

[remote zodiac]

Fuck if i remember. Like high 60 or something. I know i don't have many guns left to unlocks. That's not the point . I like using the guns I use and I know what they should do to people if I get the first shot off. Yet this test just shattered everything i'd preestablished from every playtest ive played in the past.

[dusk mortar]

I felt no difference.

[limpid owl]

that explains why you die easily to no armour engi

they don't have to aim if you sit in a corner

[spare stump]

maybe you just played against better players cause this playtest was not scheldued so any people who like battlebit enough to be in the server or follow on twitter played

[limpid owl]

also I almost always try to use off meta weapons

and it barely makes a difference

the game other than a few guns is very balanced in terms of gun balance

[remote zodiac]

I dont disagree with this.

[dusk mortar]

I played with massive FPS drops for the first hour because my pepega brain forgot that BBR HATES window capture, and I still top scored hard.

Like, it's just a matter of who you go against.

[limpid owl]

yeah

[limpid owl]

I am lucky enough to never notice being killed by a no armour engi

[dusk mortar]

I can't complain about As Val today either.

[limpid owl]

but I have been using the fastest possible loadout since like march

[spare stump]

i be saying people playing no armour engineer and they just charge head first into the enemy 💀

[limpid owl]

yeah

some people dumb

[remote zodiac]

I hate this for so many reason. and non of them involve the game itself.

[remote zodiac]

No Armor should be a 5 ticket lose for dying, its so stupid to play as Scout from TF2. But yet. I can shot one 4 times with a SVD and still loose the fight to someone with Zero Armor.

[dusk mortar]

Bruh

[remote zodiac]

Dont you start.

[dusk mortar]

No you don't start that shit.

[remote zodiac]

I know what i saw, I know what i did.

[spare stump]

no armour engineer people are dead weak, they are like 2-3 shot. they are very easy to kill if you can just aim decent enough. a majority of players though are like russians playing on crt monitors and are bad

[remote zodiac]

No U

[dusk mortar]

If you lose a head on fight with armor vs someone with none, that's honestly a massive skill issue.

Shoot that head.

If you miss, that's that.

[spare stump]

deadass. no armour engineer is only effective if you flank. you can literally die from like 1 sniper bullet if you are slightly damaged

[dusk mortar]

You're pretty much dead at any shot, because bleed is gonna finish you and you can't heal yourself.

No armor engi is just for cash run.

Everything else is griefing.

[limpid owl]

it's good for farming kills

that's it

[dusk mortar]

In Cash Run.

[spare stump]

yeah cash run and for playing objectives, run in their and get the whole squad to spawn

[dusk mortar]

In any mode with tickets...

[limpid owl]

I play not in cashrun

all the time

[dusk mortar]

You're much better of being able to heal yourself.

[limpid owl]

I just run to fights

If I was against evenly skilled opponents I wouldn't run it

honestly I'd probably run support

and hold angles or something

[dusk mortar]

Medic just wins out outside of cash run, because you can stay in the fight longer.

[spare stump]

thank god for russians

[dusk mortar]

The respawn time easily fucks you over.

[limpid owl]

yeah

medic is op

[dusk mortar]

Because 99% of the medics are brainlets.

So you gotta take care of yourself.

[limpid owl]

anything with self healing will always be good

luckily I have a squad full of mostly medic mains I play with

[dusk mortar]

You're down?
Just hold Space.
None of those 5 medics 0m away from you will revive you.

[spare stump]

medic will always be a solid pick

[dusk mortar]

Every. Time.

I almost never even see anyone attempt to heal me.

[limpid owl]

but that's why I never play medic

[dusk mortar]

I play solo.

So I have no medic other than myself.

[limpid owl]

yeah you have to play medic

[spare stump]

i only play medic during 10x exp when theres no vehicles, cause if you blow up a full tank in 10x exp thats like 60k exp

[limpid owl]

medic is great for when i jump from too high up

[dusk mortar]

I honestly have better odds at reviving myself than hoping for a random medic to do it.

[limpid owl]

on engi i just gotta deal with playing at 20% hp

[spare stump]

i play solo as no armour engineer and i just scream that i need healing to a medic

[limpid owl]

you are in med

you should be fine for medics

[dusk mortar]

How often does that work? 1/50 times?

[spare stump]

doesnt mean i play medic innit

[remote zodiac]

bruh. What skill tier is this game running because I get farmed by near by medics to revive me and everyone else every game...

[limpid owl]

half your team is med

[dusk mortar]

You're def not an EU gamer.

EU medics do not exist.

[remote zodiac]

two thirds of mine was medic.

[spare stump]

yeah but i dont play with med clan, i play solo or with some irl friends

[limpid owl]

ok

[dusk mortar]

I often revive like half a dozen people back to back.

Then go down and not a single one even pretends to try and revive me.

[limpid owl]

ye

[dusk mortar]

If I revive someone instead of gunning down the enemy, I am the one who is certain to die.

[remote zodiac]

time to move to Another country with useful medics

[dusk mortar]

Yeah but then they might all start using M4.

[remote zodiac]

Would you rather that then AS VAL spam?

[spare stump]

that cause m4 is a bad gun so its easy to go up against

[dusk mortar]

Easier kills for me, no doubt.

[distant ferry]

Ak15 ain't meta at all wym

[spare stump]

nah trust ong

[distant ferry]

It's not

Val shits on it day and night

[spare stump]

that can be said about every gun though

[distant ferry]

No

Ak15 has pretty high ttk

[spare stump]

what guns?

[distant ferry]

Wym?

[remote zodiac]

I see over a dinner, This chat has yet to come around to my point of view. well then. Ill say it. Naro is right. AK15 Is not Meta. Its not an SMG so its not for cool kids.

[distant ferry]

I don't se the point of this thread.
It starts with saying that the new backend is bad (?).
Then it becomes about the meta.
Then it becomes about "other players being good" or something.

Idk anymore.

[remote zodiac]

Here is what it started as. New back end stuff. makes the game from my personal view of it. act and preform great. It felt like A major improvement and i saw noticeable issues with my Old and lower end rig now gone. I was on the same playing field as everyone else. I was doing good. But Then I saw the "META" shit really hitting hard because everyone was using the same stupid overused Idea to play the game when the Dev's need A mixture of Data to work on. hello! if everyone uses the same damn guns and game play to be the COD comp nerds then the game becomes a COD Comp game. See what im saying? I play Non Meta to have the Extra Data the game needs. But apparently i'm not alone in feeling the curb stomping from trying to play how I want to play.

[distant ferry]

The meta has nothing to do with backend

You're basically saying:
"The apples are sweet, which makes the oranges sour"
Like ????

Two independent variables

And idk why you're mentioning "competitive CoD", that game is scripted and shit.

Every shooter has a meta and we know it.

I keep complaining about it lmao

[spare stump]

i too am confused

[distant ferry]

But trying to corelate "good backend" with "good players playing the meta" is just nonsensical

[spare stump]

i dont like saying this but this unironically sounds like a skill issue

[distant ferry]

The meta is a real concern though, it IS getting annoying.
But everything else that he's saying just makes 0 sense.

[dusk mortar]

Which brings us back to my previous response.

This thread doesn't even know its own topic.

🗿

[spare stump]

all he oki needs to do is slightly nerf engineer speed and slightly buff support speed innit

[spare stump]

yeah cause OP crammed like 4 topics into one thing

[remote zodiac]

Im trying to make this as simple as possible, and i keep having to rethink how to write it.

[distant ferry]

I have a thread that talks about doing this in a very simple way.

[spare stump]

indeed i have read it

[distant ferry]

But weapons also need rebalancing.
Not just a nerf here and a buff there.
I'm talking about a complete overhaul.

[spare stump]

im just happy the meta is fun, could have been playing support and standing next to 8 bipods with a l86 whilst camping a window

[remote zodiac]

Why did i even bother trying to put in feedback, When i could have went digging for Someone's post that matched my feelings and posted in a likely dead or quiet chat.

[spare stump]

none of understand your point, either you are complaining about the meta, or complaining about the backend that works fine. but the meta and backend aren't directly correlated

[remote zodiac]

The feedback is. "Good backend changes made the currently unbalanced game VERY unbalanced." As Naro said it. game needs an overhaul and For the first time im seeing that after Oki's recent changes.

[dusk mortar]

Did he say that tho?

[distant ferry]

1st: the backend has nothing to do with it.
2nd: the meta has been stabilished for quite a while.

[spare stump]

but the backend is not related to the meta? i just think you went up against good players for the first time as the test was less known about

so less casuals joined

[dusk mortar]

We both know you're trolling.

[distant ferry]

That is true.
The mini voxel tests were hell

[spare stump]

also people had 4 weeks to prepare and see what loadouts they liked

[dusk mortar]

Some tweaking would be alright, but you just can't have perfect balance.

[spare stump]

innit, csgo which is arguably the most balanced game atm still needs balancing changes and like 90% of guns minus eco rounds are ak, m4, or awp, metas will always be prevalent

[remote zodiac]

But I toke part in a mini test with lower population numbers before and came out fine not feeling This mess this time.

[dusk mortar]

That's a game in which pretty much anything is one shot kill to the head.
That's the balance.

[distant ferry]

Not perfect, it's because there's no reference model for balancing.
Some weapons are just much better than others with basically no drawbacks, others are the opposite, others make no sense when you loom at the real life counterparts

[spare stump]

was it one during the middle of the night for eu?

and if so thats why

[dusk mortar]

Some small tweaking would fix that.

No whole rebalance needed.

[remote zodiac]

No. last one was morning time On EST.

[spare stump]

how long ago was it?

[distant ferry]

If you do some small tweaking here, other weapons may get shafted or have their spot taken, and then you will have to balance those to make them "fit", and the cycle continues.
It's better to just make a reference model and balance all the weapons at once, comparing them to one-another and based on the reference model.

[dusk mortar]

My arbitrary balancing can fix this.

[remote zodiac]

Hmm. Lets see. might have been 3 months ago. I missed two play tests from moving and spending all my savings on someone hospital stay.

[spare stump]

thats why then, 3 months ago barely anybody was playing the meta

[distant ferry]

New fast engi+val meta came with the armor update

Back then it was the ak74

But ppl were already learning how to run'n gun with smgs and the val

[remote zodiac]

I know i played the update when Armor was adjusted. just have been two months then. because I remember being really pissed off about getting run down by engies with SMG's running and mock 5.

I felt like the performance improvement's from then to now seemed pretty significant from last time, Considering my PC is likely a 8 of the power of the next losest makes PC here. It was an good improvement but damn if i didn't feel the Meta gun's hurt more this time.

[distant ferry]

Well, Oki did optimize the game further since then, but that didn't affect already good players and it still has nothing to do with the backend

[remote zodiac]

T^T Fine.

ill shut up now.

[outer heron]

M4 was never meta

Always been ak74 long barrel meta

And if you feel like being a cunt then aug heavy barrel is dumb

And if we're being funni the fucking val outranges the ak74 because oki

[nocturne hare]

This game can run on a potato, are people with bad PC's seriously an issue in Battlebit? I've seen this argument made in every single battlefield game fyi

[dusk mortar]

The thread makes no sense in the first place, don't question it.

[spare stump]

true this fella crammed 3 topics into one and was wrong about all 3

[dusk mortar]

"Back end bad"
Proceeds to talk about weapon balancing, skill gaps and hardware differences