custom-outfits-discussion

[hollow vale]

Harmony is now also submitted

Note for whoever implements them: Please make sure they have the same names, but anything for Paxton is Z "i.e. Royale Outfit Z" and anything for Harmony is A.

I may have submitted them under slightly different item names

[crude zealot]

https://discord.com/channels/302153478556352513/1484553601270419517

Need some help with the colors :/

[hollow vale]

Hues and saturation (I think) can be changed in the game with a dye kit.

Also, are you the one who made the hijab originally? If not, you'll need the permission of whoever made it to modify it

[crude zealot]

Ohhh I didn't realize that, thank you!

[latent hazel]

i still think the hijab should be a hair option rather than a hat option

[hollow vale]

I can see the argument for both really

[crude zealot]

If we've already got colors, does anyone have any pattern/theme requests for me to try?

[hollow vale]

Patterns may be tricky to implement on a tiny sprite.

[crude zealot]

Yeah...

[hollow vale]

Please also make sure you have approval from @high owl

They're the one who made the originals.

Please don't interpret me as discouraging you! You could probably go for dots or stripes or something ❤️

[crude zealot]

Thank you! I was really worried about trying to find them

And yeah! That was my plan :]

[hollow vale]

Just keep in mind we do already have a lot of solid colored ones ingame already, so you'd have to make variants like this for each pattern if you want to maximize color output (for patterns, try bright dark bw and light unless you want a specific pattern color combo)

[crude zealot]

And maybe like type themed ones lol

[hollow vale]

Also keep in mind you will need to do the corresponding overworld sprites, not just the trainer

I'm not sure if we have a limit to variations of the same hat, that may be a @sour juniper question.

[crude zealot]

Yeah, I'm already anticipating hand pain 🥲

[hollow vale]

It happens! Take breaks and do hand stretches.

With cc, I find that less is more in terms of detail

[sour juniper]

Hue can be changed, but not saturation. So a few variations like "Light", "Dark", etc. is acceptable but if it's just the hue that changes, then no. And even then I prefer not having too many because it can quickly become cluttered for players

[hollow vale]

They're wanting to implement patterns. Would you say you have a hard limit in mind for them to follow, or is it just kinda based on vibes

[crude zealot]

Okay, so let's say I made a stripe and spot pattern, then made light, dark, bright, ect versions of those, is that okay?

[sour juniper]

Right now there isn't a hard limit (it might be a good idea to set one though hahah) but I'd say at most 3-4 variations

[hollow vale]

3 or 4 seems like a good number for now!

We do have outfits with different variants, like my activewear ones, and there's usually about 2-3 variants each

So let's see... you could do solid, striped, dotted, and then you'd have room for 2 more variants max

Maybe a poke ball themed variant or something

[crude zealot]

And maybe one where the under layer is a dif color?

[hollow vale]

Hmmm, that's pretty hard to notice on the OWs

[crude zealot]

Yeah, prolly

Maybe a half tone one?

[hollow vale]

My advice: if it's something that'd show up only on the trainer, or is only a few pixels on the OW, don't add it

You could do a gradient or split one

[crude zealot]

Yeah!

Maybe one of these

[hollow vale]

Why not both, that'd settle your remaining variants

[crude zealot]

That's a good idea actually!

Thank you!! :]

[hollow vale]

You're welcome! If you post these to spritework, be sure that you credit the original author once you're able to get their permission Furthermore, when you submit them, make sure you note somewhere that they're the one who created the original for crediting purposes.

Speaking of which, @sour juniper sorry for another ping but I did have a suggestion for the forms for hat/clothes.
Some items that have been submitted in the past may have been intended to be obtained a certain way, like via a gym leader reward. Maybe an extra comments section on those forms would be handy to have for those notes or any additional credits. Even if that obtainment method gets denied, it's still good to have.

[sour juniper]

Good idea!

[hollow vale]

[next cosmos]

I'd also love a section on the forms for collab credits. I can make it myself, just need a reminder when I look at this chat again

[hollow vale]

I would love to see collabs on cc in general, since it can take a while

cooking...

[lone yoke]

something something naked joke

I love the design though!

[hollow vale]

It's based on torchic!

I'll try and do ones for treecko and mudkip too but idk if my design juices will be intact

[hollow vale]

the drip

[hollow vale]

torchic tuft has been yeeted for submission

[hollow vale]

It looks like Frog included that with the suggestion I made!

[twin oyster]

Mmm the type symbol shirts count as 18 separeted item not 18 variation one 1 item :v

[hollow vale]

I think that one could be an exception

Now that it exists tho I don't think we need type variants of every item ever

[twin oyster]

Yeah i wasnt going to, theres not even enough space in hats to put the symbols

And color only variation are pointless

[hollow vale]

If anyone wants to design me a hairstyle based on Treecko, I'll sprite it
I have ideas for Mudkip already (probably a mohawk)

[twin oyster]

basically a bit on the top with faded sides and a ponytail shaped like the tail

[hollow vale]

hmm maybe

the ponytail could be a good tie-in to grovyle too

i'd need a picture of what exactly you're describing to get a better idea, though

oh wait

what if its just stylized spikey hair

kind of like this one by jinmugiwara, though i'd do everything here differently

minty-red did a cute bob hairstyle too

[hollow vale]

this is what i'm thinking for treecko - quick sketch so its shite

[hollow vale]

mudkip, meant to look like a wetsuit (it will have sandals or swim shoes)

[lilac anchor]

Are the team aqua/magma outfits still needing to be done? I know I had previously agreed to do one before and I apologize for the disappearance

[twin oyster]

i think the rse versions are done but the oras still need doing but i would need @next cosmos to confirm cause we havent been keeping the chart updated :V

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UB7niajc-RYRSKwejldXYcWlrGONxt8C26urQP999uE/edit?gid=507187383#gid=507187383 heres the chart but like i said is not updated

[lilac anchor]

Well im still listed for oras aqua male so ill take that as a yes

[hollow vale]

Yeh I think it's just the ORAS versions that need to be done

@next cosmos do we have a female rse aqua outfit?

[next cosmos]

We have all 4 RSE team outfits, whoever made the aquas just took the male and cut out the stomach. It works, that's basically what the design is

We need all 4 ORAS outfits still, hats are done

[hollow vale]

ty Paya!

I think we already have these, don't we?

[outer basin]

I adapted some glass specs from the gen 5 musicals for pif
It hasn't been added yet; waiting on an update

You could arguably make larger ones

[hollow vale]

Yeah you probably could... Hold on a sec

[outer basin]

But the requester could also be talking about 1970s glasses like these

[hollow vale]

Hey @icy tartan! We see your request here, was this what you were looking for?

If not, we're happy to make something more like the ones you have.

[outer basin]

There weren't a lot of glasses options in the 70s

[hollow vale]

Yup, it was that or nothing

[icy tartan]

Like these! The big round clear ones

[hollow vale]

So you want round, clear framed glasses. I think we can do that

[icy tartan]

Awesome :3c those are mine in real life lol, I just think they're neat

[hollow vale]

I made them purple so they'll be recolorable, but they are huuuge

[icy tartan]

OMG they're perfect

[hollow vale]

All done and submitted for approval!

They'll be known as "round purple glasses" in-game.

[icy tartan]

Fantastic!!

How does recoloring work - is that something you can do in game I didn't know about?

[hollow vale]

You can get a dye kit in-game.

[twin oyster]

Yup in safron if im not wrong

[outer basin]

It shifts the hue of the clothes - both fullsize and overworld minis

[crude zealot]

Which version do y'all prefer? The dark blue is gonna be recolorable
https://discord.com/channels/302153478556352513/1484553601270419517

[hollow vale]

Blue top would be cool

[twin oyster]

volkner hair done, also nice changes to the form

[twin oyster]

ok next hair on my list is mirian on petition from vivi now to get the pink and purple obviously the only way is making it the 5th option but on the others shoukd i make it like a 2 tne with the regular palette

[hollow vale]

I think solid is fine, then special for Miriam's specific coloring

[twin oyster]

hey i forgot in the game which layer goes on top hair or outfit?

[hollow vale]

hat -> hair -> outfit

[twin oyster]

ok this one gonna look weird with some outfits

[hollow vale]

eh it happens with some longer hairstyles already

just make sure there aren't any gaps when other animations are playing

curiously, i noticed that BW2 actually "culls" hair of some characters when they're too long and close to the body. cynthia's front facing sprite for example just shows the front of her hair

[twin oyster]

@atomic crag @frozen plank where should we put the miriam hair?

[hollow vale]

Miriam is a school nurse, so maybe it could be unlocked in the trainer school or something

[atomic crag]

Mhm yup yup

I concur

[twin oyster]

ok so whos hair should i do next

preferable something that isnt long and asimetrical

[hollow vale]

if hilbert's hair isnt in the game that might be fun

[twin oyster]

theres like no pics of hilbert without hat... im doing saturn

[outer basin]

@pine loom Clefairy erm, I mean Saturn hair

[next cosmos]

What I did for the others was look at their pokemon masters costumes, sometimes they have ones without a hat. I know I started it at one point, but its been forever. I'm sorry for not having the time to finish!

Also for real, Hilbert was just born with hit hat on probably why I never finished him. It's a shame cause it's an interesting short hairstyle. My hoenn load is clearing up, so maybe I'll see what I can do, I'll have to take some creative liberties here. If no one else wants the task ofc

I also need to finish Gold too

Sometimes spriter resources could give a hint too, since they'll have the hidden parts of sprites ripped. Hilbert? Nope, the hat grows on his head

[bright crown]

no wonder he always has the hat on, hes bald

anyways there is a bit more of his hair seen in the manga apparently

[outer basin]

Behold
Hatless

[next cosmos]

I didnt think of using the manga, sweet!

[hollow vale]

yeah manga is a good reference for that

[hollow vale]

Hmm, I'm thinking of proposing more in-depth/updated guidelines for CC similar to the regular spriting ones

We still get people trying to submit references and I'm sure there are rejected items that I'm not seeing atm, might be handy to have them

[next cosmos]

That would be great!

[hollow vale]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-write-scribble-sketch-draw-gif-17181052902092737226

i will work on them in the coming days

[pine loom]

Haha.

[frozen plank]

no idea

[next cosmos]

Also just putting it here so I dont forget, I already updated a new hair style I made and while I could have just updated the accepted folder in the drive, I wanted to take the chance to fill out the form with the fix. I think it could be a lot better of an experience, since there are required questions that shouldn't be required, and I think users should be able to skip everything. But yeah, already sent a message to frog 👍

[hollow vale]

I definitely think transitioning to the forms is a good idea. Lots of information can be provided through them that you can't otherwise

[latent hazel]

concepts

[latent hazel]

two more concepts for the evo line

[hollow vale]

A Togepi-inspired Decora hat would be kind of cool. The triangles already look like hair clips.

[latent hazel]

the hairclips were meant to give that vibe but i can add ribbons and eggshell pieces maybe

if i do sprite these, i do want to finish the togekiss hairpiece first

[hollow vale]

Preliminary version of the updated guidelines. I feel like I'm forgetting something. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dxPushHLDm4aF1nr68Jmkikmp7FVpv-_eD5OGph5h2w/edit?usp=sharing

[outer basin]

"hat" idea: clown makeup

[hollow vale]

i was thinking about that while writing this, funnily enough

[outer basin]

The second one here looked like clown makeup the first time I saw it out of the corner of my eye
Maybe you experienced the same thing

[hollow vale]

But I think because of how hat layering works, it may be tricky to do proper face paint

hat -> hair -> clothes iirc

so the white paint may clip through hair

[outer basin]

Worst-case scenario it looks like a face mask

https://tenor.com/view/clown-clown-mask-mask-mask-up-gif-26275825

[hollow vale]

Imagine unlocking it after losing X amount of battles LMAO

[outer basin]

Or imagine a side quest where you have to entertain at a kid's birthday party

[bright crown]

And it will say nothing about it, along with getting a clown nose

See how long it takes some people to notice

[outer basin]

I think the clown nose is already given out by the clowns in poke centers

But I had suggested that the ditto mask be added to your face with no warning and that didn't happen, so I don't think it'll happen for the 'clown mask'

[next cosmos]

hmmmm..... you know how we have pokemon come up to you while you're idle? What if a ditto dripped down on top of the player

actually it wouldnt work with how maps are set up

[hollow vale]

If only.. Ditto splat hat would be so cool

You do just randomly get the glitch one though

[outer basin]

The glitch one is so ironic

You're supposed to get it if you encounter a fusion with no sprite, like when gitlab went down... But the obtainment method itself is glitched

[hollow vale]

I thought it was funny when someone came in here and was confused about why it was there

LMAO

waiittt looking at the drive and @cursive sapphire cooked
The Eri outfit puts the makeup on the clothing so the hair layers over it

that's so smart. clown makeup becomes clown outfit.

[next cosmos]

I was talking to frog about expressions, it may be a thing we do in the future. We need some time to rest after the demo drops, but if he decides to go through with it, maybe we can possibly add another layer type. It's a long shot

We're both kinda burnt out and need to rest before thinking of adding other features

[hollow vale]

That would be interesting! But you two definitely deserve a break before all that

[hollow vale]

While you're hanging around in here, how is this looking Paya? I may send it over to Frogman later

[next cosmos]

I can skim through it real quick c:

[hollow vale]

If you have the time I wanna make sure the information is correct, especially on the references and nono content

[next cosmos]

So far its looking great

I think when going over file names, providing an example may be beneficial. But also the form passes through a script that automatically changes the file name, so its not necessary anymore to be super strict for the format

[hollow vale]

There is one!

[next cosmos]

its this question that auto fills the id on the form

[next cosmos]

ahh I see! I didnt see an example on the hair section

lol I'm reading where you're typing

[hollow vale]

I figured I might as well add them

[next cosmos]

haha you have my template as the example. I altered the one from oh_ok because my eyes yern for dark mode on everything (look forward to it in hoenn)

it looks great! Love the plug in for the preview tool as well. Only thing it needs are the exact resolution for all items, and I think direct links to each form type would be beneficial as opposed to the link to the discord message with them.
Hats: sprite in 40x160, export 80x320
Hair and outfits: sprite in 160x160, export 320x320
Trainer: sprite in 80x80, export 160x160

oooh that torchic hairstyle is so cute and accurate! love it

[hollow vale]

I love using it, so much easier to just have everything all there.

[next cosmos]

Also, it might be a good idea to mention that EVERYTHING (hats, hair, and outfits) all need an accompanying trainer sprite. For us we know it and it's implied, but newcomers are confused by that it seems

[hollow vale]

Yeah that's also fair, I thought I made it clear but I can absolutely make it clearer

[next cosmos]

Other than this and the other points, you did a great job and it will definitely be helpful

of course there's one more thing 😩 It could provide a good incentive if we put that we do have a vanity role associated with submitting 5 outfits (outfits only that aren't just recolors, no hair or hats)

[hollow vale]

oh you're so right i forgot about that one

[next cosmos]

it's all good! it's a new thing

[hollow vale]

I thiiink I've applied everything that you've brought up

[next cosmos]

oop, found something. I'm not sure what _s files are, but these would be hair color 5

[hollow vale]

yeah i wasn't sure if it was _s or _5, lemme fix that

[next cosmos]

awesome!

[hollow vale]

love how round the ows for silcoon and cascoon are in bw2

[next cosmos]

cuties! we use these for the OW sprites too

[hollow vale]

they're pretty useful for hats and such, i used them for the chingling ribbon i submitted earlier

[next cosmos]

That reminds me, I guess something else to add to the guide is that all clothing is subject to be edited if need be, and that due to the nature of the contribution, these items are not to be taken out of the game in the event the maker becomes a withdrawn artist. Sad I have to say that, but we've run into something in the past, and need to make it known should probably be an added question on the submit forms as well, like an acknowledgement

I can take care of the forms real quick, I should have access I do not, I'll ask Frog for it tomorrow

And that should be it, not nearly as fun, but necessary. I'm sorry I keep thinking of things after you've edited it, but hopefully that'll be it. Or at least one of the last things

[hollow vale]

Don't be sorry! That's actually really important to disclose.

[next cosmos]

That's a relief!

[hollow vale]

Added that in

[next cosmos]

Thank you!

[hollow vale]

One more thing though. How frequently are CC items released? I would assume it's with actual game updates rather than sprite packs like the old guide says.

[next cosmos]

Yep, game updates only

[hollow vale]

Figured I'd plunk that on the end of the guide or in a general CC FAQ

probably both, since a FAQ can be pinned in here and updated as needed

[next cosmos]

I would love to include them with sprite packs, but they are integrated with the game's code

Great idea c:

[hollow vale]

That FAQ will need to be written tomorrow though, I'm sleepy

[next cosmos]

hahaha I feel that, I should be going to bed soon myself apparently it magically became 3am

[hollow vale]

that's so real, i blinked and it's 2

luckily i can just write stuff out at work and type it up when i'm home

[hollow vale]

Is there anything specific yall wanna see on the faq

[next cosmos]

Not that I can think of, but I'm sure over time we'll get questions to fill it in. Also got those acknoowledgement questions in all the forms

and this is hilbert progress. proving to be more of a pain in the ass, but I'll get through it

Started with what little the gen 5 sprite gave, and used two other hairstyles to fill in allllll of the gaps. Then kinda try merging them together manually

[hollow vale]

it's looking cute though!

[next cosmos]

Thank you

[hollow vale]

It's been a sec since I've played the game, where can the player find the dye kit for clothing again?

Also, do people who make clothing have to be a spriter first? If not, they probably should...

[bright crown]

Saffron Boutique

[hollow vale]

Thanks!

[hollow vale]

Updated this again with the FAQ in tab 2, I think I got the most commonly asked questions

[steel lagoon]

I have yet to play the game but I 100% plan on playing as my totally epik and kewl oc “MyButt”.

Slight issue

I want to have a custom sprite of him, and I do have one but it’s designed for Pokemon Crystal Clear

Therefore it looks kinda buns.

[hollow vale]

We don't really take custom sprite requests unless they're something that can benefit everyone, like a general outfit, hairstyle, etc.

But you're welcome to make your own and use it exclusively in your game.

[next cosmos]

this is where I'm at right now

and looks good with the hat

[hollow vale]

wahoo

[next cosmos]

was debating on that back spike, but I think it looks better with it

[hollow vale]

Yeah I agree

[next cosmos]

I cannot for the life of me find an image or pokemon masters model of the back of his head, so I'm kinda just guessing There is a 3d model of hilda available for spinning, but not hilbert. I may have blender on my pc, but I don't know about file importing in this area. Oh well!

[hollow vale]

I got you, hang on a second

It looks like there's a lot of spikes, not just that one, but it can look like it on a smol sprite like that

(If you have MMD-tools for Blender, you can load PMX files like this one https://www.deviantart.com/mikumikuknight/art/Hilbert-dl-845504497 )

[next cosmos]

Sweet, thank you so much! I think I would probably consider the OW probably done than, since if I add a lot more than it may be cluttered and overdesigned

but... I tried anyway and it kinda looks like a disappointed face

[hollow vale]

Oooh it looks so fluffy

I love that

[next cosmos]

looks a little strange with the hat, but you like it more? I can also play around with it tomorrow

[hollow vale]

Yeah I see what you mean I think you can get away with it looking a bit odd though

I mean, the Urbain hair I made for Paxton (they have the same haircut) clips through the hat a bit

[next cosmos]

haha branden's hair clips through the magma and maybe aqua hats. Drives me nuts, but that hair style took me weeks to try getting right what a pain in the ass. At least it looks good with his default hats, which was the priority

[hollow vale]

I wish there was a way we could fix stuff like that! But the way CC is made, it just is what it is. Can't have it cull parts of the hair because then it'd mess up some but not all hairstyles, or not work for all hats

[next cosmos]

We talked very early on in CC development (late 2023? or was it late 2024) about invisible masking of some sort, like people being able to draw special pixels areas around the hat that would make the hair layer invisible in those sections. It didn't work

[hollow vale]

Yeah, that sounds about right - one size does not fit all

[lone yoke]

I mean my immediate thought is to do what OSRS does

which is to have some haircuts automatically swap to a sort of "pressed down" version of that hair whenever headgear is worn.

It would have to be opt-in by the hair spriter, of course, and it still wouldn't work with all hats, so it's probably not worth the effort lmao

[next cosmos]

yeah definitely not, but I would love that

although if that were to be a thing, I would have an automatic rule in place that any kind of updo will not be shoved into the hat I hate it when you have a pretty ponytail in game and the minute you put on a hat, ALL of the hair is inside of it. Make it a low ponytail dammit such a pet peeve of mine

[hollow vale]

FFXIV also does this. Modded hairstyles do not always do this

[next cosmos]

omgggggg tell me about it, the clipping is so bad in that game, but sometimes you find a really good modder, and you get spoiled

[hollow vale]

real...

looks at my character whose hair clips through her cowboy hat....

[next cosmos]

As a lala player, I'm grateful when modders even think of us, but man sometimes the hair is still way too long and there are no proper weights, so it sometimes goes through the whole body

[hollow vale]

I play a viera so I know the pain but with hats in general

[lone yoke]

would it be possible / reasonable for some hat items (like hoods, the cardboard box, the TVs, etc) to just unrender hair

[next cosmos]

big oof, at least there's a mod that adds hats back for you guys!

[next cosmos]

no

not with the way its coded

[lone yoke]

blow up the code

[hollow vale]

thankfully they've also added hats back in a lot of cases as of the 7.x patches

[hollow vale]

put the baby hair on

wait paya do you know about the baby hair origin

[next cosmos]

no 😮

[hollow vale]

i made it in reference to this

[next cosmos]

OH MY GOD. I knew it looked familiar 😂 I forgot about this

[hollow vale]

i see this image pop up outside of ffxiv all the time and i always lose it

[lone yoke]

actually that reminds me

[hollow vale]

genuinely curious how it's going to be obtainable in game when it gets added btw

-# it'd be funny if the unlock is a quest where you just fuck up the person's hair

[next cosmos]

please bring the hair cutting npc back in a weird quest

[hollow vale]

PLEASE lmao

i meant for PIF since Frogman/you approved the baby hair, but I'll also take Jandelaine content in FFXIV

[lone yoke]

OSRS actually released a lot of NPCs with new unique hairstyles a few months back

I mostly know this because a lot of players (myself included) are annoyed that these hairstyles just... aren't accessible by players

but maybe I could look into spriting them here

[next cosmos]

OSRS? 😮

[lone yoke]

ok so real quick, on the off chance that I actually do that thing, is there any precedent for visible hair ties / accessories? Like with the coloring system

[next cosmos]

Make them white/gray so that they don't change with the hue shift

[hollow vale]

I think they mean old school runescape

i touched on accessories in hair in the new guidelines too

i need to send those to frog at some point

[next cosmos]

I saw!! I didnt realize it wasn't just me who did this, I was so happy you realized why I as doing it

[hollow vale]

Yeah, it's really cool

I do be out here seein everyone's hard work

[lone yoke]

yeah, old school runescape

I ask because one of the new NPCs, a boat racing elf named Gwyna, has this rad sidebang / swinger ponytail combo

[next cosmos]

For example sheep, hairs 1-4 will always be white and gray, but when there's a special hair 5 that has the character's original color, I'll give the original accessory color back

[next cosmos]

cute! we could always use more styles

actually finished a wavy ponytail with a side bang, but it doesnt have a long bang like that

[lone yoke]

It's a bit clearer in the chathead but for some reason all the elves in osrs suffer from horrible uncanny valley disorder

[next cosmos]

and yes, I finished a few more characters! We now have dawn, gloria, cheryl, the little boy from pokemon snap 2, the gym leaders that will be in the hoenn demo, bw moms from 1 and 2, and soon hilbert when I get to his trainer sprite. it's a mess

[lone yoke]

not me burning out halfway through one outfit and giving up for a year

[next cosmos]

And to be clear, I don't draw all of these by hand. Free to use sources, game freak, artist permission, and my own editing. properly credited on the sheet ofc

[next cosmos]

starting out with an outfit can be rough

[lone yoke]

I'm stuck at an impasse of "I really like drawing outfits" and "I really don't like spriting them"

I don't think I'll ever go back to outfits as anything more than concepting

[next cosmos]

with outfits I often get in a groove after a while, and I make up rules that I need to follow. By the end of it the rules change and I have to go back to the beginning and catch the walking cycle up

Its not easy, I still need to make more protag outfits I did like... one. Maybe two? I dont remember tbh

[lone yoke]

97 sprites moment

I mean even with all the copying and mirroring you can do it's a LOT

[next cosmos]

if your outfit is 100% symmetrical, than you can get away with 44 frames

[lone yoke]

slightly less than half

🎉

[hollow vale]

I saw those. Great work!

But yeah, I also don't always draw completely by hand. The Buneary ears I submitted last night are literally just edited PMD sprites.

My biggest tip for outfits is to do them in the "everything" layout. That way you can copy and paste certain pieces Dive and Surf's front facing sprites are incredibly similar, for example

Also, less is more.

[next cosmos]

There are some animations that are easy. Surf doesn't have an animation, so you're looking at 3 frames if symmertrical, 4 if not. And then fishing, every single frame is unique, so you can only reuse the left and right direction if symmetrical. Otherwise you need to do all 16. You kinda learn where you can strategically cut corners the more you do it

[hollow vale]

Make sure you're compressing your designs into tiny pixels. Imo, if the design isn't going to be more than a pixel width on the trainer sprite, you can honestly get away with not having it on the OWs.

[next cosmos]

yep! Surf is exactly the same as dive, but the chest goes down one more row of pixels. So basically make surf front facing first, and then copy and paste to dive, but erase a row. boom done

[hollow vale]

For example, look at how I compressed Paxton

[next cosmos]

it came out so good!

[hollow vale]

He's got quite a bit of detail in his outfit!

Especially the back, with the MZ logo. It's been adjusted to a white square on the OW.

[next cosmos]

and of course the trainer sprites dont have backs

[hollow vale]

yup But I simplified it so you can at least tell what it is on the OW sprites.

You can also see that I didn't include some details like the stripes on the pants or the badge detail

or even the pouch!

Less is absolutely more, so long as you can tell what it is

[next cosmos]

tbh players are more likely to auto run the entire game and rarely do they walk, so they dont even see the details if there are any

[hollow vale]

(also making harmony's was so easy because of the compression in the design)

[steel lagoon]

Drats. And here I was hoping you could get a request from here too.

Oh well that’s all good!

[lone yoke]

Putting this here so you have to imagine it too. You know how the hat slots can also be used for other accessories?

"hat" concept: avril lavigne tie

[hollow vale]

You can request things, but we typically try to keep them less "hey guys make my oc's outfit for me and me only" and more "hey i think this outfit would be cool for everyone to use"

[outer basin]

I have no idea what avril lavigne's tie looks like, but I did submit a few ties with the musical props I submitted

There's like a striped tie, a spotted tie?, a black tied, a blue bow tie, and a white bow tie,

[latent hazel]

i abandoned an outfit for months because I was sick of spriting it lol (I finished it recently)

this one, just could not deal with the detail I gave this one

some people wanted a more "neutral" outfit alt for the water type

[twin oyster]

kinda funny when so many types have only 1 gendered option

[hollow vale]

I try to keep mine neutral unless it's clearly meant to be feminine

Or masculine

[latent hazel]

i just do whatever the fuck but people wanted a non-dress outfit for the water type ace trainer

[snow escarp]

Dresses are usually more fun to design
I say this as someone who wear almost exclusively pants

[latent hazel]

i wear the same style of clothes all the time because I prefer comfort but man

clothes are fun to draw!

[rustic geode]

Can anyone tell me what the overworld sprite for the Little Ghost Girl in Pokemon Tower is??? With her only facing sideways, I'm having a hard time identifying it...

[hollow vale]

I believe it's just a blue recolor of the normal little girl sprites in BW2

[rustic geode]

Which one, though? It's not the preschooler...

The Lass?

[hollow vale]

No, it's like an NPC, non-trainer sprite

It's the same one that the little girl on the sevii islands uses

https://www.spriters-resource.com/ds_dsi/pokemonblack2white2/asset/48049/

[rustic geode]

Omg it's one of the twins!!

[hollow vale]

Yep

[rustic geode]

YEESSSSS I can finally work on the sprite! Thank youuuuuu!

[latent hazel]

what size do i export hats again

ok 2x

[hollow vale]

all items are exported at 2x scale

[twin oyster]

ok i got time to make more hair again any request

[outer basin]

Make Corbeau's hair so people can have the matching hair for the suit I did

"two-block cut"

Back view

[twin oyster]

ok its better that what spgen is asking for (ryuki and piers )

[hollow vale]

corbeau set would be cool

if you want you can also make taunie's since i've already made urbain

[twin oyster]

ok ill think kinda like this for macas head

in dark colors

[twin oyster]

ok done kinda i hate the side where the hair falls

regional set kalos? yes

[hollow vale]

yeah i'd count it as kalos

[twin oyster]

hey @next cosmos i was thinking bout doing murdock hari the fork and knive but is mostly a 2 color thing i know i can use the extra color like in the seviper lady hair but do you think is fine if i use just 2 shades for the faded part and then the fork and knive in grey

[hollow vale]

I don't see why you couldn't do that

[twin oyster]

mostly cause is almost more of the extra color then the regular color

[next cosmos]

It would be hard to achieve with the 4 color palette we use now, I suppose it would be okay in a special case to add more shades in between, but we would need to make sure that it dyes right. Otherwise you would need to plan your highlight and deepest shades carefully

[twin oyster]

it wouldnt be a new shade as much as a new color kinda like the red on lucy hair which was acepted already just this one has lots more of the extra color

[next cosmos]

Oh I see, what color did you have in mind?

[twin oyster]

well i was thinking keep the grey and do the fade below in the hair colors

[next cosmos]

Oh ok, I don't see a problem with that

Accessories like headbands, hair ties, and hair clips I keep white/gray so that they don't change hues when dyeing. Gray is perfectly ok!

[twin oyster]

alrigth

huh i kept naveen hair bands orange... im sure they die fine

[next cosmos]

I would personally change it to white/gray

[twin oyster]

ill do it later

[hollow vale]

Torchic outfit is doneee

[hollow widget]

Is there a Male Themed Gengar/Ghost type outfit to go with my floating pokeballs and and warturtle gang sunglasses.

[twin oyster]

not yet, the ghost type trainer is ready but it hasnt been put in game yet

[hollow vale]

Also there's no gengar specific outfit

You can have a look at this though I'm not sure how up to date it is https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19uYNGk5SbBqcsHV155IBcABcIbRatEhkLTwTK2R3LU8/edit?gid=891834841#gid=891834841

[hollow widget]

Hell Yeah, im about to face off against gio, my character looks dope. just could use some improvements lol, is that gonna be included at the start of the month?

[twin oyster]

not likely the development team is very small and focused on the hoen game rigth now

[hollow vale]

Yup, I believe rn Frog and Paya are working on PIF Hoenn. The original game should be updated eventually ™ since I don't doubt there are bugs and such that need to be fixed too.

Outfits have to be manually coded in, so they will be added every time the game updates, not through sprite packs.

[hollow widget]

very true. thanks anyway. I am looking forward to Hoenn, that cannot come fast enough, such a great region.

[hollow vale]

I just asked Frogman and he confirmed for me that it'll be in the next PIF1 update!

[hollow vale]

Doesss anyone know whos email address this is

[snow escarp]

not mine but
that censoring isn't very effective

[next cosmos]

Worst case scenario, I can email it with my pif email to see about a discord username. Could actually do this for the others too

[hollow vale]

I had no choice

[hollow vale]

Okay, I think I have all the credits situated except for these:

Outfits
Team Aqua M + F uniforms

Hats
Fluffy Beard
Karate Headband
Ice Fox Hat
Nurse Joy Hat (not mine, the other one)
Head Spheal

Hair
High Puff Bun
Square Cut Bangs

[next cosmos]

Awesome! I know the spheal was in the hat contest a while back, there were two entries

aqua male/female

[hollow vale]

Added those in

[late sinew]

That is all

[next cosmos]

this is mystery dungeon, I'll try to make it smaller, but it'll be tough

if I cant, this cutie is adorable as is so it's not the end of the world

[snow escarp]

just put a single yellow pixel

[mild granite]

If I wanted to make a fully custom player sprite with its own pose in the trainer sprite, what are all the things I would need to replace in the files to avoid visual errors and random floating objects in the ingame display? Would it work if i just make one set of sprites for the battle sprite + the walk cycles that includes clothing, skin, and hair and replace /InfiniteFusion/Graphics/Characters/player/clothes/red/ with them, and then replace all the following sprites with empty sheets of the same size?

• .../base/trainer/trainer_default.png
• .../balls/[all ball pngs]
• .../hair/red/[any colour png]
• .../hat/red/[all hat pngs]

[hollow vale]

It really depends on what you're trying to achieve, but if you just want a custom trainer you'll probably need to replace all of those except the balls folder, just like we would to make an outfit normally

Obviously, no custom outfits will work unless you set up the trainer to be that way (i.e. no custom pose)

[outer basin]

Take a look in #custom-outfits-submissions at all the templates offered there
You would need to replace all of those templates in the game files with your custom version, and then replace one sheet of hair and all the sheets for one set of clothes with empty transparency

[hollow vale]

Any attempts to submit the custom trainer will be denied if the trainer sprite is altered in any way from the base we've provided

[outer basin]

I'm assuming you're trying to mod the graphics just for your own game

[hollow vale]

-# thanks for the slightly better wording i just woke up

I'm pretty sure that's what they mean,yeah

[outer basin]

-# All good

[next cosmos]

If I'm understanding correctly, they also want to change the actual base player template. If that's the case it won't work, due to the way its coded

[twin oyster]

it works is just replace the base

[snow escarp]

they could replace the base and make the starting clothes invisible?

like replace them with empty pngs

[twin oyster]

yup

[next cosmos]

ohhhhhhh they were asking only about the trainer sprite?

[twin oyster]

yes what where you thinking they where asking about

[next cosmos]

replacing all the move animations with a completely different body type I was wondering why they would go through the trouble, since it would be a pain in the ass

and there are inner workings within the coded to make sure that specific temmplate moves correctly, all the items are also attached to it in a certain way

trainer should be perfectly fine 👍

[twin oyster]

i mean is still posible since they want to change the trainer they have to make custom sprites for every animation

[next cosmos]

I dont mean clothes, but the body shape itself. If they want clothes to match their custom trainer, than the easiest way to go about it would to make clothes to fit our template, rather than replace the body completely

[twin oyster]

yeah if they body shape change they can only use the cloth they make

[next cosmos]

Good luck

Anyway, got to some gym leader hairs I started but didn't finish. Surge is done and working on RBY sabrina. dont know if anyone noticed, but we had the in game info for this specific sabrina hair filled out, but didnt have the files

my bad fam

[twin oyster]

lol

[hollow vale]

I was wondering where those were

[next cosmos]

her bangs are aggravating me everything always looks bad with the blonde. At least it's okay with the darker colors

[hollow vale]

I find that the blonde palette is very hit or miss depending on what you're doing

[next cosmos]

I try to sprite in blonde and then make adjustments in ginger and that usually works, but damn this is annoying

maybe I'll just wrap it up as is so it actually gets in the game

[lilac anchor]

Yeah, blonde is a pain hence why I avoid hair

[hollow vale]

We can always use more outfits and hats

[lilac anchor]

Indeed, I need to see if I ever verified my sludge hat idea

And I need to finish N's Clothes.... and the ORAS aqua male outfit....

[hollow vale]

What was your sludge hat idea? We could probably just give you the go ahead in here, Paya and Frog are both online

[lilac anchor]

I was thinking like literally just a gloop of grimer sludge plopped on the players head. This could be from showing the fashion person a grimer/muk but I also thought it could be found in the sewers somewhere. My original idea was to have a like pipe the player could investigate in the sewers and doing so resulted in the sludge on your head which erika would remark on but thats way too many extra things for a silly little hat

[hollow vale]

I don't see why it couldn't be found in the sewers

There's nothing quite like that in the game rn so go wild

[lilac anchor]

Alright, ill get to work on that then

[hollow vale]

You can leave the ideas you have for how the item is obtained on the google form, and ultimately Frog will decide how they're implemented

[next cosmos]

sounds familiar

[hollow vale]

A little

[lilac anchor]

Genuinely had no idea about that lol

[next cosmos]

haha you're fine! it was funny I was talking then how hard it would be to implement due to the skyview perspective of the game, but if we figured out something, it would be cool to have an animation used for both pokemon

[lilac anchor]

Skyview? That would be crazy definitely not what I was thinking of

[next cosmos]

no I mean, the perspective of the actual game is top to bottom. You never see the ceiling, so at best you see the top of the most north wall. There wouldn't really be a believable place for the goo to drop from

[lilac anchor]

See for the sludge specifically I wasnt thinking something as visual. Rather my idea was there would be a small tunnel or pipe would interact with. Doing so would make the character go in and disappear for a moment before coming back out woth the sludge on their head

[next cosmos]

oh I see! That could work

[lilac anchor]

The perspective of the game definitely makes adropping situation not particularly feesible as far as I know

[next cosmos]

There's actually a place in hoenn that has grimer in the area AND a big pipe that could work

[lilac anchor]

That would be sick

[next cosmos]

So, have you guys played the game and dyed your hair with the blonde hue? It looks really strange, and has been bothering me for a long time. On a scale of 1-10 would you guys be willing to have a different highlight shade for future projects, if I can get a script that would adjust all hairs already in the game?

[lilac anchor]

With blonde? Now that I think of it no I have not ill take a look

Heres what I have so far, thoughts?

[next cosmos]

Right now its f5e28e, and I'm finding f7dea8 may work a lot better

[twin oyster]

that works and unlike ditto this one can be in the sewer

[next cosmos]

Hair shade 1

[lilac anchor]

Yeah, I usually use darker hair colors

[next cosmos]

Is it a hat? I wouldn't shape it so close the skill, since you have to account for the possible hairstyles it would sit on

[lilac anchor]

True, I figured Ill need to adjust after testing with some hair styles

[hollow vale]

I wouldn't mind

[next cosmos]

The left is how hair 1 dyes normally, my adjustment that I'm proposing would be on the right

[lilac anchor]

Oh yeah I definitely see it there

I would definitely advise a change, that it quite jarring

[next cosmos]

Doesn't even have to be this exact shade, I could have it a little more saturated. But this is is something that's been driving me nuts since I play with pink hair and have to look at it all the time

hair 2 gets it a little as well, but not nearly as badly

3 and 4 are perfectly fine

[hollow vale]

Oh the right looks much better

Does it change the color of the default blonde at all?

[next cosmos]

yep!

[bright crown]

the right looks much better

[next cosmos]

let me pull that up for you

[hollow vale]

what's that looking like 👁️

also I really need to get a save with access to the debug room, it'd be nice to test hair dyes if I ever make a special color

[next cosmos]

Base color with no dye, left is old, right is the edited. Only thing different is the highlight shade

[hollow vale]

Oooh I like the less-yellow blonde much better

It flows much nicer

[runic wagon]

holy crap joltik hat

[next cosmos]

It kinda takes a away some of the personality, but honestly I think its worth it since dyeing gets so messed up

Also amazing job on this hair, I forget who made it but it's the perfect example for testing this

[lilac anchor]

So heres with some hair styles. It does seem to pretty much cover everything. Maybe I should shorten it a bit off the bottom?

[hollow vale]

According to our handy dandy spreadsheet, it's @high owl!

[next cosmos]

She's made so many amazing things for us

[hollow vale]

can you test it with these?

-# yes these are all mine but i tend to get very anime with my styles

try this one too

[lilac anchor]

Yeah ill do that

[hollow vale]

Honestly even if it "clips" a bit, could always say that somehow the hair has managed to escape the wrath of sludge

[next cosmos]

Sure, just need a sec! I'm giving an important lecture on american bbq food

[twin oyster]

here are some of mine that i suspect arent going to work all to well

[hollow vale]

LOL the baby hair just barely sticking out

[lilac anchor]

I personally think it actually looks pretty good on the punktails

[hollow vale]

[twin oyster]

yes actually

[hollow vale]

Yeah it's super cute on them

[lilac anchor]

That is very important work, its all about the sauce

[hollow vale]

I sure am glad the dye kit doesn't have a saturation thing, come to think of it...

You could, um, easily make that white.

[next cosmos]

oof I'm discovering that blue is fucking horrible with the highlight we have now still putting it together

[lilac anchor]

[hollow vale]

[lilac anchor]

Okay so trying to export the torchic tuft versuon crashed my computer one sec lol

[hollow vale]

Brown and red are just gonna have to be something we deal with if we see them I guess

[hollow vale]

Oh geez, too powerful

[lilac anchor]

Its hard to hat clives wicked hair

[hollow vale]

Honestly it looks kinda cute with Torchic's hair

[twin oyster]

yeah but it actually kinda works it doesnt look like clives but it kinda make sense

[lilac anchor]

Im content with how it looks in general. A lot of the hairs that seem to cause issue are ones that most hats would have issues with

[hollow vale]

Yup, that's how it usually goes

But some minor updates: I've written a description for every hair that was missing one

[lilac anchor]

Yoooo

[next cosmos]

and the blue I was talking about, jesus christ

the row above is old, the bottom row is the edited highlight

[lilac anchor]

That definitely looks better

[next cosmos]

sorry it took a while, I had to edit these by hand and then go in and out of the game several times

[lilac anchor]

Understandably, no need to apoligize for quality testing and work

Im surprised I haven't heard anyone point it out before

[next cosmos]

Testing that same hue of blue with hair 2, the highlight here also needs to be adjusted, but 3 and 4 are perfectly fine

gonna experiment to find that perfect shade for hair 2, brb. Then we can get started with adjusting templates and guides, and I can ask frog about that script to change all the current ones

[hollow vale]

Oh yeah I noticed the blue was atrocious on the blonde...

[hollow vale]

Annnd that's everything with a description now. Wahoo

[lilac anchor]

[next cosmos]

okay think I got it! Also I know I said I wasn't going to change 3, but I found this also benefited if we're doing it for 1 and 2, may as well. 4 is actually good and not needed what do you think? Feel free to make adjustments and make suggestions if you see anything I'm missing
Hair 1 went from F5E28E to F7DEA8
Hair 2 went from C59241 to C6884F
Hair 3 went from C6884F to 855434

I may tinker with it more tomorrow, but at least for now this is where it stands

[hollow vale]

I absolutely think this is a change for the better. The reduction in yellow tones helps the coloring look nicer.

[next cosmos]

yesssss, its crazy how much it did

[hollow vale]

I think the difference in the base colors isn't really noticeable either. I doubt people will complain

[next cosmos]

~~god dammit, seeing them all lined up like this makes me see that 2 and 3 should be just a smidge brighter ~~

Yeah agreed!

[hollow vale]

i mean hey go for it

[next cosmos]

driving me crazy, sorry you have to deal with this

[hollow vale]

Mudkip flip

[hollow vale]

Nah you're good, I appreciate the improvements

[night mulch]

Hey, can I post my character sprite from my fangame for feedback here?

[next cosmos]

You may make a #1050404143807873157 thread with the non-if tag

[next cosmos]

I had a whole other version ready and posted, but I noticed that somehow the other base colors were off, so I have to start over Looks like blackbosom has her own custom palette that's not the officially used colors, or maybe all of mine are out of date without being told that the colors changed at some point. That's definitely going to cause problems, and a script won't be able to be made now since there are too many variables

We definitely need to get everyone on the same page for future hair submissions with one unified palette

[hollow vale]

[next cosmos]

if you're curious, here's the difference between our palettes. Hers is so much better tbh, I'm curious what you've been using, gummy. Ether way looks like it's going to be a bigger rework than I thought. I want to make this a priority for hoenn, so it'll get figured out

We can also figure this out in DMs, so the channel isn't spammed with me losing my mind

[hollow vale]

I use this one

[next cosmos]

Okay so the same as me~

[high owl]

Huh, I definitely thought I was using the given palette colors so I'm not sure how mine got off at some point

[twin oyster]

i use this one

[latent hazel]

wait, didnt mystery dungeon never get to gen 5? is this a sprite from the mystery dungeon fanmade resource sprite?

[twin oyster]

it doesnt really awnser since this one has 3d grafics but still there is gen 5 mystery dungeon

[latent hazel]

meant sprite-wise

[next cosmos]

Yep the fan made sprite source

[latent hazel]

asking because if it gets added to the game, we'd need to credit the artist who made that sprite

[hollow vale]

luckily everything at the pmd sprite repo is free to use for fan projects, so long as the repo or the artist is credited

[latent hazel]

yep!

actually one of my friends has a sprite there that cabine used as a profile picture lmao

[hollow vale]

that automod in real time

lmao

[latent hazel]

?

[hollow vale]

Someone posted something in here when I was viewing the channel and it got insta-deleted

[latent hazel]

oh

[snow escarp]

oh is that why I keep seeing this channel as if it got new message but there's nothing new when I check it?

[hollow vale]

yeah i guess spammers target it pretty frequently

[hollow vale]

Hey can anyone get me close ups of Florian and Juliana's hats? Thanks : )

[next cosmos]

I know. I'm a sprite manager, I personally handle a lot of the crediting for the game I've been crediting everything I do for a long time, including character customization

[latent hazel]

oh wait didn't realize it was you who posted lol

[hollow vale]

erm akshually payapon is the most notorious thief ever and she'll be losing her role soon my uncle works for frogman and he told me

(joke obviously, we love you paya)

[latent hazel]

well my uncle works at frogman and if you dont give me 20 sprites right now PIF hoenn will be reduced to ash

[hollow vale]

you heard them, john PIF demands 20 more character customization options

[next cosmos]

hahaha could you imagine? The fall of a admin, right in front of you

[next cosmos]

All good! Makes me happy you guys are dilligent in this. I spend so long trying to get the credits for the customization sheet last year. Got most of it, but god damn Gummy caught up on the rest I couldn't find and I appreciate it

[snow escarp]

well I have 2 outfits in the work for the elusive dex winners
a edwardian style paleontologist outfit and a chimecho sundress + chingling head ribbon

[latent hazel]

hell yeah

[hollow vale]

Cute! I did actually make a Chingling ribbon too but there can always be more than one

Yours looks different from mine anyway

Mine is not nearly as good

[snow escarp]

ah shoot I missed that
well it was requested by the winner

[hollow vale]

It's all good, I can always remove mine I'd prefer yours to be in the game anyway

[snow escarp]

why not keep both? bet yours is compatible with more hairstyle

[hollow vale]

Maybe

I can always change IDs around

[snow escarp]

how does yours looks on a base?

[hollow vale]

Mine is interally "chinglingbow" but since it hasn't been added to the game yet, I can always name it something else

[snow escarp]

I'll ask in case @next cosmos are these 2 different enought?

[hollow vale]

I think I might have an idea, what if I add a headband to mine

[snow escarp]

otherwise I'll ask the winner if they want something else
I'd feel bad if you removed yours

[hollow vale]

nah don't, i think i can edit it to where it looks a bit different

[snow escarp]

what the

[hollow vale]

oh hi spammer

[next cosmos]

It's so funny that tout of all the channels we have on the server, this one is the only one I actively see this happen in

Ok let me think on this, my day is more or less getting started and having connection issues since I'm not home

[snow escarp]

I should put again my version so it's easier to see

[hollow vale]

Fairs, I could always edit mine to have a headband so it looks more like one of those that you see on anime characters

[snow escarp]

chingling ears

[hollow vale]

It's one of those happy accidents where I think we can make it work

[snow escarp]

I'm going to bed so I'll see the answer tomorrow

[next cosmos]

Could also have one of these in a different direction, like drooping downwards 🤔

[next cosmos]

@snow escarp @hollow vale Talked to Frog and yeah, they're too similar. One needs to be changed a lot. He said just an addition of a headband isn't enough

[hollow vale]

That's okay. I can remake mine to be something else or remove it

Chromaerym's was for a contest winner so theirs takes priority over mine, imo

[next cosmos]

okie dokie! sorry about that. we haven't run into a situation like this before, so I wasn't sure how strict he wanted to be with it I also talked to him about the hair palette situation too, and think we have a solution

[hollow vale]

Nah it's chill, it's one of those things that no one really anticipated happening For now I removed mine from the accepted folder + elsewhere, it'll probably be replaced with a non-chingling ribbon like the above

I'm not mad about it at all. Hats are relatively low effort, I'd be malding if it was anything else tbh

[next cosmos]

It's okay! We'll get it straightene out. Honestly the palette you have on yours is a lot better, and I'm reworking the colors anyway

Haha cool!

[hollow vale]

I do like Blackbosom's palettes a lot. c: What was the solution y'all came up with?

[snow escarp]

I can ask them first if they'd like to request something else instead

[hollow vale]

Nah you're good, I already removed them! It can always be reworked into something else

[snow escarp]

I haven't done the overworld yet

[hollow vale]

ooo... now you have to do the overworld....

[next cosmos]

So originally I was thinking of using a scrript that will mass replace all sprites from one specific hex code with another in one instance, and then people use the correct palette from here on out. With this realization that the colors are different, my suggestion before bed was to run a script that identifies all colors being used across all hairs, before going with the original idea of a color replacing script.
Frog ended up making the script that identifies all colors for me (which I included here, it may need some tinkering since it says there's green in my whitney hair??), but then he suggested the second script could be automatically run for all submissions from here on out to make everything the same shade, so we wouldn't have to worry about everyone using slightly different colors. There will be colors that it ignores as well as hair 5 files. I really like this suggestion

[snow escarp]

I'll do it for you too then 😔

[hollow vale]

Seriously don't feel bad, this was a huge coincidence

[snow escarp]

If you'd like I could use your palette so it ends up as a mix of both of ours? I was planning on tweaking it anyway

[next cosmos]

For real, its such a cute idea that it was bound to happen at some point

[hollow vale]

Sure, though mine was literally just from the BW Chingling OW

You're welcome to rework these, no credit needed 🫶

[hollow vale]

I like everything about this solution, no complaints for me. Shoutout to Frog for helping with the coding!

[next cosmos]

I put the poor guy to work so much, I'm glad he tolerates me one day I'll learn coding

[hollow vale]

I feel like we need to do a contest or event in appreciation of Frogman. Politoed rush maybe

[next cosmos]

Only issue is if people sneak another shade in there somewhere, it may get auto replaced with a color they weren't intending and they will lose a lot of detail. He said there's no telling if the script would change it anyway, or leave it alone if it's out of a certain range I guess that's the risk we're gonna have to take. I was planning a mass spriter announcement soon that actually mentions character customization (mostly the new vanity role to attract people), but I can include a mention with this too

[hollow vale]

We can also mention it in the new guidelines and FAQ.

Frog gave me the OK to post them once some top secret things ™ are rolled out

[snow escarp]

IK this is very late and will never happen but I wish there was multiple layers for hair and accessories it would make a lot more compatible combination possible

[next cosmos]

We're good friends so I often give him new food recipes to try. That's something otherwise he actually doesn't like recognition contests since it feels like the obama metal meme. He just really cares about the community

[hollow vale]

Oh really? Huh, didn't know that Honestly, that's pretty rad of him. I've seen a lot of devs of fan projects let the ego go to their heads or something so it's good to have a humble lead. He never gave me a bad impression in the first place either.

[next cosmos]

Trust me, me too. It's tedious and a pain in the ass on the coding end of things and not very user friendly either, that adds more factors and rules for volunteers

[hollow vale]

Though I do still wonder if Frog has any outfit requests or anything Just for funsies

[next cosmos]

Fun fact, there is a self insert in pif 1, but he honestly doesn't like it. He only added it since every pokemon game has a dev room. He just gave himself a shitty apartment with a joke on the pc

[hollow vale]

I've seen that It would be kind of cool if the sprite managers got their own room in PIF2 but that's up to Frog

Frog could also do the Toby Fox thing where he is just. A literal frog. In the game.

https://tenor.com/view/toby-fox-undertale-annoying-dog-toby-fox-gif-11674292814815309336

I don't think the annoying dog was originally meant to symbolize Toby, it just kind of became a thing

[next cosmos]

He's planning on making one for devs, but staff is more complicated since they come and go more often. He feels giving any special treatment isn't cool. We may do something neat with secret bases tough

[hollow vale]

That is also valid and understandable. Secret bases and contests are gonna be so hype if they all get added into the game

Honestly, that's where I'd want to have a dev easter egg if I was making a game... In niche side content

[next cosmos]

It's gonna be real cool, I can tell you that at some point we'll probably make a little dev helper team for furniture. It's pretty far in the future though

[hollow vale]

Might get in on making some furniture if possible 👀 It's another excuse to sprite little things, so

I just like seeing people use and appreciate my work, at the end of the day. Making people smile is what makes doing all this worth it.

[next cosmos]

We need a broken laptop for sure I will fight for that little easter egg. Fun fact, pif 1 was developed on a shitty broken laptop that needed a peanut butter jar to stay upright

@sour juniper

[bright crown]

I'll be sure to notice any errors when they get in game

[hollow vale]

That is an awesome fun fact I hope Frog kept that jar as a sentimental thing

[next cosmos]

OH I KNOW YOU WILL

[hollow vale]

we love our porygons 🫶

[next cosmos]

For real, they've found so many things ~~to frog's stress ~~

[hollow vale]

Oh, y'know, I might as well ask this. Is Hoenn on the same ver. of essentials as the original? I always wondered if there would be any upgrades as more games are produced

[bright crown]

same version

[hollow vale]

Makes sense The folks who were hoping for any mons past Gen 7 are gonna be disappointed, but eh.

[bright crown]

newer version would require a full rewrite of the game

[hollow vale]

That's a LOT of stuff to re-code, yeah

[next cosmos]

We can't really upgrade without frog getting paid, he rewrote a lot of essentials code and the game isn't comopatble with recent versions. He's tried converting, but it didn't go well and it would take so much time and energy to rewrite a whole different thing of code. He also wants both games to be compatible with each other, so they have to be the same

[next cosmos]

Don't even get me started, people love to argue about it it could be possible for the future maybe, but for now frog is happy with how the game is, and it's too much effort and work

[bright crown]

could drive him more crazy with the incredibly minor grass issues I've seen that I don't think anyone else will see

[hollow vale]

Honestly, I respect the amount of effort he's put into PIF as-is. I don't think an upgrade is really necessary, per se, especially when you consider there are boons to keeping things as they are now. That said, I do wish there was a way for people to support Frog, but Nintendo wouldn't like that

[next cosmos]

It drives me crazy, rpg maker is a pain in the ass to retile for those, especially with the exact grass tiles we use

[hollow vale]

RPG maker is a pain in the ass in general. I tried to make my own Essentials game a while back and ough

[bright crown]

yeah thats why I don't really report the grass tiles, unless its really noticeable

[next cosmos]

At least I was able to go in and fix some of these so he can focus on actual bugs

[hollow vale]

It's usually people who don't know how difficult games are to make or even edit. I've messed around with Essentials and a lot of older hacking tools, it's not easy to just pick up. God forbid you try to add things and don't know what you're doing

[sour juniper]

My beautiful laptop

Sad fact, it's broken for real now. It doesn't turn on anymore

[hollow vale]

how did it even get that way in the first place

[bright crown]

its just trying to become one of those tablets that have a keyboard

[sour juniper]

They hinges gave out

[hollow vale]

that's how i lost so many of my laptops when i was in middle and high school

[bright crown]

had to use an ipad like this for school, it sucked, they knew it sucked and would let us bring our own laptops in instead eventually

[lilac anchor]

Woah, I have missed a lot in here

[twin oyster]

Hey i was trying to remember does copycat girl has a composite sprite (like the type experts) or does she uses the regular lass sprite?

[next cosmos]

regular sprite

[twin oyster]

Ok ill do her hair then, the card one not the one from the anime

[next cosmos]

sounds good!

[hollow vale]

Oh those are so cute

I want to make Lisia at some point so that was also a good reminder especially if she has a shot in being in PIF Hoenn

[next cosmos]

She's the contest girl with the blue ponytail, right?

[next cosmos]

Also update on this script, it's not working too well some shades are too close naturally, and gets eaten up. And changing the range messes with other things and doesn't pick up on other shades. This may be be a manual endeavor

-# if that happens I'll need help of some volunteers to go through EVERYTHING in the accepted folder to change all hair colors

[hollow vale]

correct!

She's Wallace's niece

[next cosmos]

I would love to do something with her, I was thinking of making custom npc that could possibly show up in a contest with you, from the games and anime

[hollow vale]

Yeah, I was going to suggest that to Frogman as well. I'm happy to make the sprites for her

[hollow vale]

And I can help with this!

-# honestly it'd be kind of cool if customization worked with APSA

-# or if Frog's tool had APSA features

[next cosmos]

No clue, he's currently trying a new approach, so I'm curious what that is going to entail

[hollow vale]

Interesting We did talk a little about CC in contests (which is why that one sheet has those tags now) so I wonder what else he has cooking

[twin oyster]

Whats apsa

[hollow vale]

https://fiddlekins.github.io/aio-pif-sprite-analyser/

[twin oyster]

Dont know what's apsa with you dog

[hollow vale]

mods, can we ban malxire

[next cosmos]

Absolutely not keep them coming

[next cosmos]

Also I checked, and blackbosom's colors were actually the same! Turns out only her hair 2 palette was different. It's odd, but I'm actually super thankful for it

[hollow vale]

[next cosmos]

Okay, we're in business! I don't know what frog did, but the script is working and here is the finished palettes with two different hair styles. The second shows the highlight in the more normal cases. I also updated the second shade on some of these hairs, and all 4 got highlight updates. Also included the new script pdf that shows the before and after of the script. I'm still going through it, but so far so good

[hollow vale]

[next cosmos]

All the ones with an ❌ (besides black) either needs to be manually fixed or frog will have to keep on adjusting the script. So far it looks like the script ignored them, which is great. Hope it keeps on doing that, since accessories fall in this category. Once I finish looking through this, I'll give the ok and use it for real

Let me know what you think been workng on those shades all night last night and all day today lol

[bright crown]

I like them

[latent hazel]

i missed out on the convo waaaugh

[hollow vale]

I am infinitely curious as t how so many people ended up with different colors

[latent hazel]

"spriter dev room" that's a moshpit
"fashion designer room" that's an empty room with a "gone fishing" sign

[hollow vale]

It looks like it got most of the issues though

[next cosmos]

I asked if we could have the errors have a different symbol for searching purposes and black be ignored, so he did the stuff and things.

Search ### to find them!

[hollow vale]

That's honestly not too bad even then, since most of what shows up is white or grey

[next cosmos]

right? I noticed that it ignored my two shades of gray with accessories, but whatever I guess it didnt overwrite it at least

[hollow vale]

true

i think the only thing worth addressing aside from the odd colors is the non-whtie accessories im seeing in some of the hairstyles

where did you come from

[next cosmos]

whoops, that last update to the script messed with detecting hair 2's highlight there's a lot more errors than there should be

[hollow vale]

I noticed that

[next cosmos]

okay should be fixed, hopefully it didnt fuck with anything else took away like 50 errors

[hollow vale]

Looks like most of what remains is relatively small

[next cosmos]

[sour juniper]

Ran the script, all the hair palettes have their updated palettes on the drive now!

[hollow vale]

wahoo

[lilac anchor]

[hollow vale]

can we get a picture of the new palette for convenience btw

[sour juniper]

@next cosmos please double check for me though

[next cosmos]

Can in a few minutes, I just stepped away from the computer

[next cosmos]

only one that had an issue lining up with the hex codes were a couple for hair 3, I fixed it. @hollow vale You may update the stuff ad things now!

[hollow vale]

[hollow vale]

everything template with da right colors

[next cosmos]

Awesome! How about the faq and guide (if you have access)

[hollow vale]

I have added the new color codes to them as well

[next cosmos]

updated this image for frog, may as well drop it in here too

even though it's the same image as the big canvas

[outer basin]

Yummy colors

[next cosmos]

its so delicious and the best part is, players won't even notice or care

[outer basin]

The players who use dyed blond hair will notice and care

I think it's a fairly significant improvement for those

[twin oyster]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-press-x-la-noire-meme-x-button-gif-19259237

[twin oyster]

thanks anyway i use the other templates so i wouldnt want the big one just for hair colors

[next cosmos]

awesome, than it's worth it!

Also seems there was an issue with your naveen. Hair trainer 3 had half pixels and transparancy, and hair trainer 4 was a corrupted file. I've fixed it, but giving a heads up. Lance's hair trainer 4 was also a corrupted file, but I don't know if that was you or not. Also fixed

[twin oyster]

lance wasnt mine wierd that the file corrupted tho and only one color had transparency

[hollow vale]

I'm not entirely sure who made the Lance hair, it was just accredited to game freak

[hollow vale]

With the new hair palettes out, I wanna make some more hairstyles... Anyone have any suggestions?

[twin oyster]

colres :v

[hollow vale]

perhaps

[lilac anchor]

Overworlds are still proving to be my bane, any tips?

[hollow vale]

needs shiny

[lilac anchor]

I also just realized I completely flipped it other than which eye its drooping over

How do people do this on little sleep

.

[next cosmos]

there are a couple hairstyles that we could really use for diversity if you're up fofr it

[hollow vale]

I was wanting to try my hand at some. Show me what you've got in mind!

[next cosmos]

alright, I think these would make a lot of people happy!

[hollow vale]

Oooh the buns. I definitely wanted to do some half up half down ones

I also wanted to do these

The rest look like uh... Locs, box braids... natural hair....

I am extremely white so I do not know the names off the top of my head

[next cosmos]

I've been trying to think of options that we don't have that would make all players be seen

yesss! I know we have a couple space buns, and I was working on a spiky bun too (based on kate from popkemon rangers), but not a half updo. Also was working on a Todd too, as well as the rocker girl from gen 5 (if we don't already have her)

[next cosmos]

omg those are so cute!!

[hollow vale]

Oh that's so funny I was going to make Kate at some point

I could probably switch gears and go for Kellyn, I think all the rangers would be fun to have

We do have space buns, but do we just have the basic ones?

[next cosmos]

If you like I can scrap mine!

[hollow vale]

I did the big poofs forever ago but I don't see any that are just the two dumplings

[hollow vale]

Nah I didn't even start it. Yours is looking great!

[next cosmos]

also had these two from gen 5 in the works too

[hollow vale]

Funnily enough, when I was spriting the Mudkip flip, I noticed it looked like Blue Eyes from GS...

Just a little bit, anyways.

[next cosmos]

I can see it, yeah. She's cute, I don't recognize her 😮

[hollow vale]

She's from the 3rd ranger game.

I absolutely adore her design, Red Eyes looks good too

[next cosmos]

Ahh ok! I've only played one of them, but I dont remember which one

[lilac anchor]

I didnt even know there was more than one

[hollow vale]

I cannot recommend the first Ranger game to any sane person. Shadows of Almia and Guardian Signs have so many better QoL features.

[next cosmos]

Also her hair is cute too

[hollow vale]

omg... venonat cut...

This is the last of the Eyes, Purple Eyes. I want to make all three of them at some point..

Like, for outfits

Michael and Wes are also on my to-do list.

And Jovi!

The spin-offs have SO many good designs.

[next cosmos]

Yesssss!! That's the perfect name and needs a purple version too from the gen 5 palette or something

Frog says we have plenty of hair. NOPE everyone deserves to have a character that they identify with

[hollow vale]

There will never be enough hair

I can safely say that my IRL hair is NOT in PIF.

You can get VERY CLOSE. But not quite.

[next cosmos]

Oh I blocked her out of my brain, that haircut is adorable~ Looks like marill

[hollow vale]

Therefore, not enough hair

[hollow vale]

Oh absolutely! Or Swablu.

[next cosmos]

MAKE IT

[hollow vale]

Eventually

[next cosmos]

I forgot, I also have iris in the background too

[hollow vale]

It's somewhere in-between these.

Kinda like Ramona's hair in Scott Pilgrim too. It just is

[next cosmos]

Oh hell yeah, that's gorgeous

[hollow vale]

I love it. It's becoming a really popular hairstyle again too

[next cosmos]

Do people still use the word edgy? Or is that now considered not cool of a term

[hollow vale]

I will always use edgy to describe myself

One of my really-bored plans is to add more trad goth and other subculture stuff to the game also. We don't have enough.

[next cosmos]

Millennials are always being made fun of, I don't know whats cool or not anymore

[hollow vale]

So are older Gen Zers

[next cosmos]

Oooooh, could you imagine mid 2000's scene hair?

[hollow vale]

YES. I need it.

[next cosmos]

[hollow vale]

So yeah. Not enough hair

[lilac anchor]

Please do, I would greatly appreciate

[hollow vale]

I want to do some 80s big hair too.

[lilac anchor]

Its hard to find good goth representation

[hollow vale]

true and real

[next cosmos]

Now that we have the forms, frog wont care as much the form does the tedious work for us now

[hollow vale]

More period outfits are also a plus, I think Chromaerym was making an Edwardian outfit earlier and I love

[hollow vale]

true...

[lilac anchor]

Hey, can someone suggest some hairs to test the sludges overworld sprites?

[outer basin]

AH
Blue Eyes jumpscare

I scrolled past quickly
"Hey, was that Blue Eyes? Wait, do I even remember what Blue Eyes looks like anymore?"

[hollow vale]

She's honestly so iconic.

A queen.

[outer basin]

I think edgy is one of those slang terms that is becoming integrated into the common vernacular rather than going out of style

Sometimes slang terms arise from a need for a word, and once that need is filled, it doesn't empty easily

I feel like edgy and cringey are here to stay, like "neato" and "get over it"

Perhaps one day we will be the only ones left that remember when they were new
"Back in my day, 'edgy' was considered new slang!" 👵

"Okay, grandma, let's get you to bed"
"And Netflix was mail-order!"

[next cosmos]

😂

[twin oyster]

Kinda look like shielbert without the point

[twin oyster]

Mine is because i made it myself it's the mohawk

[hollow vale]

against all advice we are redeyesing now

[hollow vale]

oh btw: uva and naranja academy uniforms have been added, though without their hats atm

[lilac anchor]

I think ill widen the back a little on the side facing ones but if no one else has any comments is this good to go?

[hollow vale]

yeah i'd say so

you didnt tell me that PIF hoenn was orre all along

-# or that wes was actually finished

[hollow vale]

@next cosmos not me pinging the wrong paya 🤣

[next cosmos]

Hahahahahaha yessssss

[twin oyster]

hey guys we got a request

[hollow vale]

clothing requests still go in sprite requests tho

[snow escarp]

isn't there one already?

[hollow vale]

It might just not be added into the game yet, I think @outer basin would have done it as part of their BW items though?

[snow escarp]

yes that's what I was thinking about

[outer basin]

No, I didn't make a trumpet because there's no normal way to wear a trumpet around your head

[hollow vale]

ez

They presumably want it just for Pokemon but it don't work like that

[next cosmos]

This is the one

@sour juniper

Look

We need this

[snow escarp]

realthree won't do it 😔
maybe I'll do but I have 2 outfits and 3 hats to finish first

[sour juniper]

Lol amazing

[next cosmos]

I can, I haven't gotten much sleep so I wasnt feeling well, but I need something small to do to to keep me busy

[sour juniper]

What if we make it so that whenever you wear the hat, it's the trumpet versions of the music that plays instead

[next cosmos]

Cat sitting and I have my laptop. Can't do anything big since I'm not at my normal pc, but I don't have anything small to do since I took care of the pack and April fools stuff. Apparently I cant function without working on something pif related, it feels weird

[next cosmos]

Let's do it!!

[hollow vale]

I saw some YT comments asking for some way to get that OST in the game. Good thinking.

[next cosmos]

Pory did an amazing job, for real. Both real and silly trumpet versions

[hollow vale]

[next cosmos]

how's it looking?

actually, @vapid gyro @tulip jetty is this a believable trumpet? I know you guys are musicians

[vapid gyro]

It is

Fuck, I guess I have to make a hat myself

[next cosmos]

Do it

[tulip jetty]

very

[next cosmos]

[tulip jetty]

its the most accurate way you can depict a trumpet in pixel art prolly

oh wow angri paya

[next cosmos]

That's great to hear, I took this BW asset and shrunk it down, and then redrew it and changed the palette

[tulip jetty]

yours have better proportions imo

[next cosmos]

I'm so malicious

[tulip jetty]

the mouthpiece is inexistent in the bw sprite

[sour juniper]

It's perfect! 😂 😂

[tulip jetty]

and the bell is extremely big compared to the body

in yours is way more balanced

love it

[sour juniper]

Where shouldwe get it in game?

[next cosmos]

I took inspiration from this fantastic sprite, too bad it didnt fit lol

[lilac anchor]

There should just be a room of trumpets, hail the trumpet

[next cosmos]

Lets have pory pick since he did all the music! maybe a quest or something

it's gotta be special, especially with the effect it'll have in game

[lilac anchor]

Also sludge hat submitted!

[sour juniper]

Is there a place in hoenn that's known for music?

[next cosmos]

I'd think lilycove, or the contest hall

[lilac anchor]

The most iconic hoenn song is the champions theme imo but thats too late

[hollow vale]

i think any of the battle themes are the most well known for trumpets, even in orre

[next cosmos]

We'll think of something, if you want to squeeze it into the demo

[sour juniper]

I do

[hollow vale]

-# please have more orre content in the final PIF Hoenn game I beg

[next cosmos]

-# I would love to, in the wayyyy distant future. Colosseum needs more love

[hollow vale]

-# colosseum and gale both do!! i would absolutely adore a mini-orre update

[lilac anchor]

Never played either, are they good?

[hollow vale]

-# i will even make cipher grunt uniforms. please i beg

If you want a Pokemon game that both does and does not feel like anything else in the series? They are AMAZING.

Honestly, I mourn what 3D Pokemon is even to this day becuase of the Orre games.

[lilac anchor]

Maybe its time I finally find a way to play one of them lol

[hollow vale]

I believe they recently were added to NSO for Switch 2

[bright crown]

I put an idea of how to get it for the demo in the bug testing chat, if outfits work with ot

[lilac anchor]

I dont have a switch 2....... or internet

Ill find something

[hollow vale]

[lilac anchor]

Thats actually cheaper then I expected

[hollow vale]

CIB + with bonus disc is much pricier

same with Gale

[lilac anchor]

Gotta fix my GC controller first though

[next cosmos]

oh yeah that reminds me, I used a free source and semi converted it to our template as an outfit, but it can totally be polished up and released as an actual outfit with more modifications. Eventually it would be cool to make it its own thing eventully

[hollow vale]

Idk how easy GCN games are to reproduce, but I hope they do manage to get that eventually

I will always support buying repros considering disc rot + absurd prices for legitimate copies

[next cosmos]

I can say that I am a proud owner of the game and bonus disc

[lilac anchor]

Neat

I have a copy of pokemon red somewhere

[twin oyster]

I dont think theres a place that related to músic but theres the cave with only whismur a Pokémon very related to sound

[lilac anchor]

Rusturf Tunnel, they do explicitly say that that place getting too loud is bad for the pokemon there

Maybe there could be a quest that somehow involves a whismurr fusion that has trumpet aspects

What that could possibly be is beyond me

[next cosmos]

Hmmm interesting. We're discussing a few different options, but this is something I could work with

I was thinking a quest with someone bothering the whismur, and you just straight up take his trumpet since he's a dick but we may take this in a different direction altogether

[lilac anchor]

That would be pretty funny too

Pokemon Infinite Trumpets

[sour juniper]

Ohh I actually really like that too 😂

[hollow vale]

My cousin used to own Gale, but his ex-girlfriend stole it and sold it on eBay 😔

We poured so many hours into it..

[next cosmos]

I hope she subs her toe and it turns out she had an ingrown nail

Also I'll have you know, that acquiring this trumpet has become a whole thing behind the scenes

[hollow vale]

Ahh I love that Miniun emote

That base is so good. I made a smug one out of it.

Damn a lot of spambots today

Braided buns has been submitted, as has Red Eyes's hair

[next cosmos]

Gastly has been at war with them lately

[hollow vale]

Oh, here's the down version of the braided buns btw - I hope they look like braids...

[next cosmos]

I think so! At least its a great start, I think the only thing I would say is that the braids on the top of the head look a little stiff since they are perfectly vertical. It might be good to put them at an angle to follow the shape of the head

[hollow vale]

I tried, but it did look a little strange... Let me try it again

[next cosmos]

I believe!

[hollow vale]

It may work better for a hair down version instead of a hair up one so

it still looks a bit straight

[next cosmos]

Actually lets try this, here's the cornrows hairstyle we have by blackbosom, tied back wicks that I made off of a free use project, and game freaks dancer trainer class hair. Maybe it'll help seeing how they handled this

[hollow vale]

hmmm..

here we go, hows this?

[next cosmos]

that's looking a lot better I think

[hollow vale]

i agree

it worked for the shorter one but this is better for the longer one

[next cosmos]

It might benefit from making them i pixel row thickness less and giving enough space for one more, but I think this is a big improvement

[hollow vale]

I tried that, but it looked a little too close together for my taste

[next cosmos]

ahh gotcha!

[hollow vale]

actually i dont hate it

[twin oyster]

I did had modify the dance hair or else the player would have a 5head

[hollow vale]

teeny tiny lil braids

[next cosmos]

Yeah I like it more! matches the tighter braids better while not looking too different

cuuuuute!!

the buns mayyyy need to be brought forward a little bit on the side sprite, but this looks so good!!

[hollow vale]

eh I think it looks fine where they are

[hollow vale]

i also did the trainer sprite for jovi while im at it

[next cosmos]

it looks fantastic! exactly the same