showdown-teambuilding

[rapid glade]

Also glisray has 0 utility while ferrotar is running a clown ability instead of iron barbs

[dim jackal]

what league is this

[muted oar]

Start over from scratch no offense

[craggy sinew]

Please do not make everything mixed

Why are you flame orb facade on a special attacker

What is curse oblivion wing

What is curse boomburst infiltrator sylvern

Boomburst already passes through sub 😭

[jagged locust]

It's an off season

[tame blaze]

You could keep the Clefable Blaziken, but make it a recoil fast physical attacker using Magic Guard to avoid Bravebird, Highjumpkick if you miss, Flareblitz

But as said by someone else already, you have too many mixed attackers

[verbal sleet]

Syleon (Sylveon) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
Fusion: Vaporeon
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Blizzard
• Hydro Pump
• Hyper Voice
• Hidden Power [Fighting]

Donapex (Donphan) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Fusion: Toxapex
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature

• Earthquake
• Ice Shard
• Head Smash
• Knock Off

Scithorn (Scizor) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
Fusion: Ferrothorn
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def
Adamant Nature

• Roost
• Iron Head
• First Impression
• Toxic

Maybe this 3 are cool and functional?

[brisk cape]

What do you think about this team? Regicott (Registeel) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
Fusion: Whimsicott
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Leech Seed
• Stealth Rock
• Taunt
• Moonblast

Dragozor (Dragonite) @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
Fusion: Scizor
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

• Knock Off
• Bullet Punch
• Swords Dance
• Earthquake

Glispert (Gliscor) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Hyper Cutter
Fusion: Swampert
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Earthquake
• Crabhammer
• U-turn
• Ice Punch

Clefcune (Clefable) @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Magic Guard
Fusion: Suicune
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Calm Mind
• Moonblast
• Scald
• Rest

Jidos (Jirachi) @ Light Clay
Ability: Static
Fusion: Zapdos
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Reflect
• Light Screen
• Flash Cannon
• Volt Switch

Latiatei (Latias) (F) @ White Herb
Ability: Levitate
Fusion: Entei
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature

• V-create
• Earthquake
• Dragon Dance
• Dragon Claw

[muted oar]

@brisk cape @verbal sleet just use pokepaste you're needlessly flooding the chat

[gentle pine]

I would tend to agree

[verbal sleet]

Oh srry

[urban oar]

A bit annoying but any big weaknesses?

[gentle pine]

Sash on a Substitute setter seems a bit odd to me

[verbal sleet]

Yeah, maybe Leftovers?

[urban oar]

Missed that sick ty

Also put roost over spikey shield on skarm. That n defog is really all skarm is contributing by fusing

[red spear]

Some of the EVs feel a bit odd, not sure what the speed on the Skarm fusion is for, for example

[urban oar]

Ill clean em up. Atk there for sure

[void willow]

I don't know if it's the kind of advice you're looking for but as far as I can see, there's very little stopping an opposing Sylvern from ripping your team apart with Boomburst (and Flamethrower for Skarthorn) with the sole exception of your own Sylvern outspeeding it with scarf

[urban oar]

Thats a great point. Im gonna look for something to replace either the magnezone or more likely skarmory. Magnezone could technically come in on a sack and sleep powder but from there its still iffy

[plain stratus]

Does anyone wanna team build for fun

Just started so it looks fun

[urban oar]

Yeah man what you cookin with?

[plain stratus]

ngl idk

I just started

I've been trying to make an nat dex ou team

I think I have some good sets others idk

[urban oar]

Ah I've not played much nat dex cuz lack of sprites and so many options. What you got so far?

[urban oar]

Sorry i should reply and ping u

[plain stratus]

I have a Kyurem set that I like

Kyurem scyther

Technician loaded dice

Dual wing beat stab

[urban oar]

Hmm. So no stab on icicle spear then?

Scale shots is pretty cool there

[urban oar]

U turn or d dance both work

[plain stratus]

nah but with technician it makes up for it

[plain stratus]

I'm running d dance on it

[urban oar]

It does and i had forgot about scale shot

[plain stratus]

yeah it's scale shot

Icicle spear

d dance

Dual wing beat

And I'm trying to make a victory dance set now

With cinderance and hisuian liligant

[urban oar]

That could be cool, mimikyu is fun with victory dance

Ghost fighting and a free setup turn

[plain stratus]

oh that does sound good actually

Let me try it

Actually disguise doesn't work

[urban oar]

Dang

Annhilape?

Grass ghost or ghost fighting both good. Trop kick and quiver dance are dece.

Or if feeling ballsy, hustle

Rage fist banned, scam game

[plain stratus]

I'm trying ceruledge

[urban oar]

Does nat dex have tera?

[plain stratus]

no

[urban oar]

Buzzswole sends attack through the roof and gives beast boost. Grass/fighting

127 atk 117 def 87 speed. Sets up nice after victory and drain punch could give you sustain if u want it

[round bloom]

Is there a way I can make a team of six of these competitively viable?

[frosty garnet]

https://gitlab.com/pokemoninfinitefusion/customsprites/-/raw/master/CustomBattlers/241.177.png

[round bloom]

A full team of Just this Pokemon

[red spear]

Not in any of the formats we currently have

In custom game definitely

Actually if you used a team of 6 of those I’m sure you could get some forfeit wins

Also what is that thing

Miltank/Swablu?

[round bloom]

Natu

[red spear]

O

[round bloom]

But nice gas

*guess

[red spear]

Then maybe

Eviolite with milk drink, magic bounce

I don’t think you can make a team of em, but you can use it

Sash actually

Ok I just had a Quick Look at this thing and I think your best bet is the forfeit strategy

You can try a rocks set, I can’t think of much else for it

[snow pike]

custom game, eviolite + imposter and neutralizing gas at level 9999

[cursive tundra]

Lmao

[snow pike]

how good is this mon? ive been using it for a while and it feels p good

As a special wall

It countered latios jolteon very nicely ||apart from not being able to hit it with earthquake||

But you can always drop eq for body slam or something

[honest umbra]

me when taunt+flying type exists

also wtf is palossand for

also this is kinda bad

like I know normal kinda sucks resistance wise

but still what does using this achieve

also

why use snorlax over vaporeon or lapras

water ground is strictly better

[cursive tundra]

Depends on if it’s Gen 7 or Gen 9

Gen 7 Snorlax with most of anything is going to be solid

Gen 9 there are too many threats to play a Snorlax setup in OU

You want Immunity to stop Toxic from killing your long setup or from other walls to kill you

[cursive tundra]

It’s the way fusion stats are distributed that make Snorlax one of the best heads for more physically oriented mons

[honest umbra]

I was talking about typing

very strictly speaking, even considering thickfat, the type combo just

sucks

[cursive tundra]

The fusions stat wise aren’t great for sure

[honest umbra]

an there's bete

man

[cursive tundra]

Palo is doing the opposite of Snorlax

[honest umbra]

there's better snorlax fusions

[cursive tundra]

Water Ground for those two mons are also worse btw

There aren’t many good EP users

That typing is more for physicals

[honest umbra]

I was talking about defensive profile

[cursive tundra]

Still not good on them

You’d want Poison for those two more

or Grass

[honest umbra]

what're you even talking about

I was literally just saying that there's better lax fusions, by merit of ability or stats

[cursive tundra]

The Vaporeon and Milo

[honest umbra]

and that palossand doesnt even complement lax

[cursive tundra]

Palossand isn’t even worth using up there either

Let the man cook and lose

he loves his favorites

[honest umbra]

just because something is marginally better doesnt mean it's good

base 98 aint a special wall

even with 135 hp

I dont think that palossand is a good mon

flatout

[cursive tundra]

It isn’t

NU mon

Wait nah it went to PU Gen 7

💀

[honest umbra]

also both its stabs have immunities which just kinda

sucks

[cursive tundra]

He stacks no paper

just sandcastles

If it got Storm Drain like Gastro maybe it would instead of Water Compaction

[honest umbra]

why did you use it then

[cursive tundra]

That ain’t me bruh

You got the wrong one

@snow pike he’s saying your set ain’t shit

And that you should change to something better

[compact pebble]

what would be a good fusion partner for a offensive breloom? like 3 attacks plus spore

[cursive tundra]

Spore is banned :[

[stray snow]

[snow pike]

Only ground type with decent defenses reliable recovery

Also it's if dex

Also I needed a normal ground type more than anything else

My team lacked a ghost resist and an electric resist

[snow pike]

Ignoring gliscor here because we know it's good but snorcor isn't ground type

actually

Unaware might make this better it also doesn't have to run phazing

water absorb and thick fat are options still

1000waves, bodyslam/stealthrock, recover, toxic/yawn

Actually if you have 1000waves you probably want toxic to chip a setup mon down

[errant junco]

what website is this?

[red spear]

The official Infinite Fusion showdown, http://play.pokeathlon.com

[spiral token]

Did I cook or did I burn the kitchen down (Natdex AG)

[quiet salmon]

no ur onto very little

[spiral token]

I need elaboration

[quiet salmon]

you dont have any hazards

at the very least that would help you beat shed and revivecats

second none of these mons are improofed

[spiral token]

The idea is to let the opponent set up hazards for me
Then hit them with Court Change

[quiet salmon]

what if the opp doesnt click hazards

revivecats doesnt click hazards

[spiral token]

Why wouldn't they

[quiet salmon]

shed with boots doesnt care about hazards

[spiral token]

Thats what Taunt and Wisp are for

[quiet salmon]

shed is paired with bounce

revivecats has imposter to block wisp

[spiral token]

I'll see if it can get imprison then ig

[quiet salmon]

then thats a wasted slot if the opp has bounce

or if they have a fire

or a dark

or a hazard setter that threatens this mon (very easy)

[compact pebble]

whats a good combo for scolipede? i wanna have a speed boosting poison type

[urban oar]

Offensivly I like fighting and ground to cover some resists

Fighting is decent defensively as well but not a ton of resists

[cursive tundra]

you gotta specifcy what mode, Speed Boost is banned in OUs

[compact pebble]

AG, no nat dex

[snow pike]

this team works, but I feel like some stuff is unnessecary
arcathorn dies alot but it beats sylvern and v-create and I don't have a really good other way to beat the latter

[cursive tundra]

Make your Arcthorn mixed bulk

You’re going to have to run the calc to see how much it needs

[snow pike]

for noiverns?

[cursive tundra]

Yes

I’d also not use Flare Blitz to preserve health

[snow pike]

I mean, it's not the sole check for those

I'm just really scared of Enfeon

[cursive tundra]

Remind me what that’s supposed to be a fusion up

[snow pike]

Entei Leafeon (in sun with chlorophyll) with V-Create, Leaf Blade, Swords Dance

Or banded? Some run that I think

Thing is when I see it they don't really see them using anything but those 3 moves

I think it has stomping tantrum 😔

[cursive tundra]

Jitei is what you’re more going to come across (Entei/Jirachi), if you’re worried about Sun I think you’re team is suited enough to play around it

[snow pike]

I've seen Jitei but not on sun

[cursive tundra]

Sun isn’t very common anyway

[snow pike]

i honestly think the best thing would be to ban v-create, it's kinda ridiculous

[quiet salmon]

regi should have max def

also arcthorn sounds like it has mid bulk

id rather choose a water steel regen mon

and then find a better fire check cause one that loses to ground coverage is suspicious

[snow pike]

I guess i could forego spikes, I do want to have will o wisp and or knock utility though

[quiet salmon]

slowthorn has almost the same utility

[snow pike]

Idk if that is tanky enough to beat Enfeon

And it's also electric weak

[quiet salmon]

arc loses anyway if its tantrum

and isnt taking common electrics anytime soon

[snow pike]

maybe chandelure/something? although it's not that bulky and i don't remember if the hp is good or not

I think that's the only flash fire mon that is dual type?

[quiet salmon]

id just use dragon

fire and electric resist

[snow pike]

And grass

idk maybe goodra / pex or slow

actually idk I don't think they have knock

Nvm pex does

[cursive tundra]

ou the pex

[compact pebble]

whats a good type combo with rock?

[keen dawn]

bug and grass are p good with it i think

[vernal vale]

for sure for sure

i think steel is the best tho

nah just joking

i think ghost is really nice

[red spear]

depends on whether you want it for offense or defense

Rock is a great offensive type, if you want to complement it, you could go with Fire, or Ground

both of which are terrible defensively

[cursive tundra]

Rock/Fight is good if you’ve got speed

[vernal vale]

everyone likes x4 weakness

[compact pebble]

is grass normal a good type combo?

[dim jackal]

not really

[compact pebble]

how about grass dragon?

[dim jackal]

Better but still not great

[compact pebble]

well then whats a good combo to mix with a slow physical grass type

[cursive tundra]

Steel/Water/Poison/Rock in that order

[snow pike]

Steel

Water

[icy star]

Hello everyone - Do Darkrai will stay in the meta or this was just for the tournament ? Just so I know how to anticipate and adapt further teams

[quiet salmon]

id advise against it

nidorai is very powerful

[red spear]

It was for the tournament, in order to gain some perspective into the relative power level of some of the Uber mons that don’t feel quite so strong. My thoughts at the minute are that Darkrai is staying Uber, the other three will likely be legal

[icy star]

Ok thanks ! I agree with this with some reserve concerning Schuckle - the mon could probably be broken if the team doesn’t have specific hard counter

[red spear]

Shuckle hasn’t proven to be particularly difficult to break in the tournament bar a few matches, I think there’s good enough options in the meta to deal with it, and the few options it’ll inevitably end up running. I think once it stabilizes it’ll be fine

And if I’m wrong, it’ll just get banned again

[sterile glacier]

Even I didn't have too much trouble with the Shuckle fusions I saw and I got stomped in short order

[snow pike]

Shuckle has ridiculous defenses but both of it's typings are terrible, and it doesn't have reliable recovery either

And the low hp basically requires you to use it as a body which means rock type

This might be ok

very slow and guaranteed countered by clefable fusions though

It gets flash cannon/sludge bomb too

Only special rock move it gets is ancient power, might as well run hp rock then lol (though it'd be really funny to roll the 10% chance to drop all your stats)

[icy star]

The close combat sets might be difficult to break tbh but I get all your points and I agree, to me the only menace for balance in OU is Darkrai

[snow pike]

yeah and considering how common unaware is shuckle should be fine

[snow pike]

is this a good natdex ag mon

reaches almost 1000 atk and has stab espeed

[quiet salmon]

no bc it doesnt hit shed

[snow pike]

not everything has to
but i can give it like toxic or something
or fire punch

or gastro acid but they can just switch

[sterile glacier]

I saw a Shuckle/Exeggutor in the tournament that seemed okay. Grass and rock is good typing and it was decently bulky with a big, nasty leaf storm. It wasn’t unstoppable by any means but it was a threat.

[honest umbra]

https://pokepast.es/d156388d741212fd was doing a fighting/dark/psychic core with the new unbans (alakazam)

dunno what to do with the last slots

[quiet salmon]

every attacker should hit shed id say

[glass vector]

Fire Punch instead of Volt Tackle sounds good

[quiet salmon]

except when you run into ghost shed instead

or shed teras electric/normal

[snow pike]

In case of tera, that's them using up their tera, in case of ghost
uhhh teeter dance (switch out)

[quiet salmon]

using up tera isnt an argument its one of if not the best tera users

and being forced out every time vs it seems v bad

[glass vector]

This mon's power doesn't require set up tho, so switching out due to a shed that it cant kill doesn't lose anything (like say unburden, booster energy, or Quiver Dance users)

Good luck finding a perfect fusion that can kill every possible shed

[quiet salmon]

its simple as mold breaker/moldbreakermove with hazard support

or ghost bounce wisp user

[snow pike]

Yeah shed is annoying for alot of stuff

[gentle pine]

Shed is also one of the easiest things to remove though

Any hazard

You can have boots, sure

But that’ll also limit what you can do to protect yourself from other things

[quiet salmon]

any hazard is bounced by any bouncer

which shed is always used with

boots is also the second best item for it (shield imo is the #1) so theres very little opportunity cost in running it

plus you have tera

[snow pike]

what about mold breaker + hazards

oh yeah this is natdex

frick

[quiet salmon]

what mold breaker hazard mon

you have to be able to maintain hazards while using a mold breaker mon or a mold breaker move mon that is essentially unwallable except for shed and has an improof

[prime barn]

so im pretty new to competitive teambuilding and have been tooling around with this hyper offense team for a while, I'd love any suggestions. aurorus is probably the weakest link especially given that typing but on playtesting strong fire type moves seem pretty essential, and they seems kinda necessary for the echoed voice strat given the lack of alternative move type swaps/special scrappy mons? also no idea what the sandslash/crobat should be holding.

[red spear]

What’s the idea behind all the Echoed Voice over more consistent normal moves like Hyper Voice or Tri Attack?

[prime barn]

the boosted base power available by chaining it between mons while switching it's type. 200 base power attacks take out a lot of things and aren't unlikely with all these choice items from what I've seen? it is a weakness though too, definitely

[red spear]

The main issue I see with the strategy (aside from the inconsistency) is that I don’t really see how you’re chaining them. Two out of your three users are fairly frail, definitely don’t want to be switching in. The Sylvios is the only I can see switching in just fine.

(Also I haven’t played with Echoed Voice too much, but wouldn’t switching break the chain, since that’s a turn where the move isn’t used?)

[quiet salmon]

you just spam it until you die

[prime barn]

right, to maintain that chain between them you have to go first and die. the other half of the team is there to try and set them up to do their thing

[quiet salmon]

issue is idet you break through steels w this

[prime barn]

right, steels definitely cause a problem. thousand arrows and a fire type were the best answers i was coming up with but it's shaky

maybe i need a magnet puller

[quiet salmon]

the idea just sounds too niche bc boomburst immediately hits 140 bp

[prime barn]

right, i just like gimmicks to build around ultimately

[quiet salmon]

ive seen echoed voice work but it was on a refrigerate kyurem who had sub

so it had bulk to spam it

i was also using stall so i didnt have enough firepower to force it out

so ultimately it fares badly against offense

[red spear]

If your only option is to spam it until the mon dies unfortunately, that gives the opp a fairly easy switch for each of these, especially considering they’re all choiced

It’s a fun gimmick, and like Conja pointed out, it can work if you run it on one set, but maybe relying on it on three mons is a bit much

[prime barn]

well or switch, they have other relevant moves ofc, though working boomburst in as a backup would definitely help when the chain isn't going to happen, just struggling to find space on movesets

[quiet salmon]

sylvern echoed boomburst flamethrower uturn

[prime barn]

i'll give em another try, that mon was actually the original slot, thanks!

[snow pike]

Is this doubles?

[prime barn]

no, this is a singles team. i could definitely try building a doubles team around the concept, but priorities would be different for sure

[snow pike]

I think the concept work a bit better in doubles since you can target a different Pokémon. It does mean risking stuff like fake out though, so you would probably need redirection or something else to go around that

[quiet salmon]

begs the q of why you wouldnt just use boomburst

[hallow axle]

is this a good set

was wondering if I could make a dynamic offensive glass cannon type pokemon and make it into a machine with this set

(I think I submitted this set into the ranbats sim)

[snow pike]

that's kinda broken for randbats, but not that good for regular

[sterile glacier]

What's the point of Drain Punch with those defenses?

You're not tanking anything once the sash gets broken.

Just run Close Combat

[hallow axle]

yeah this is for ranbats

[muted oar]

93/80 on the physical side isn't that bad

[quiet salmon]

as an ice type

[sterile glacier]

As an ice/fighting type with those defenses and that speed tier? You might as well be made of nitroglycerin and matchsticks

[snow pike]

Yeah I assume it's just for more damage on bulky steels

(Slow) bulky steels

I don't think loom has cc in gen 7?

Idr

Mamo has superpower I think

[sterile glacier]

...I could have sworn I had Close Combat on my Breloom in Gen 6 but no you're right it doesn't get that

But if you're running Technician anyway, Force Palm is still more damage with no drawbacks and a 30% chance to cripple with paralysis

[cursive tundra]

IF Dex OU like Showdown OU takes the mechanics and learnsets faithfully

According to PIF, any Pokémon Generations 1-5 will use their Gen 5 learnsets, and 6/7 will use their Gen 7 movesets in addition to any moves the creator added for fun like Recover on Jirachi

[muted oar]

The egg moves are gen 5, everything else is gen 7

And then additional shenanigans like quiver dance yanmega, tail glow ampharos, etc

[cursive tundra]

See you’ve got much better knowledge than I do

🙏

[muted oar]

On Marowak/Talonflame, should you run Gale wings for the one priority Brave Bird you get absent stealth rock, or rock head for access to the recoil-less brave bird?

[quiet salmon]

is this ag

[muted oar]

Yeah

[quiet salmon]

then why wouldnt you use rayquaza

[cursive tundra]

birds are very important

[vernal vale]

I would say he wants gale wings but he is asking if to use it so 🤷‍♂️

[teal umbra]

does Tailwind get boosted priority from Gale Wings?

[quiet salmon]

yes

any flying move does as long as you have full hp

[alpine wedge]

Hello, can you help me? I created this team and I need you to critique it so I can improve it, it's 9 gen OU.
Google Translate

[quiet salmon]

Google Translate

right off the bat curious medicine and hospitality do nothing in singles

ribombee doesnt make sense on the team because web/screen setters depend on a very offensive team who use the speed drop/bulk buff to set up and fire off big atks but your team has one attacker

id suggest you change it for a fairy resist because right now you have no switchin for say sylveonnoivern or sylveondragonite

great orus is a funny meme but seeing as you have no hazard setters rapid spin is disadvantageous over defog because it can get blocked by ghost

i prefer this set ```Landzwole (Landorus-Therian) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Ground
Fusion: Buzzwole
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature

• Earthquake
• Knock Off / U-Turn
• Defog
• Roost```
  because it has recovery

[muted oar]

What's the single best fusion in the game assuming anything is legal

In IF dex not Natdex

[dim jackal]

Nat dex is alomola doublade no idea for if dex

[quiet salmon]

why are you asking this in teambuilding youre breaking my flow

moving on to slowking its an alright mon but as mentioned curious medicine is very bad compared to regen because it doesnt do anything, additionally the spread is inefficient compared to 252 hp / 4 def / 252 spd with a sassy nature and 0 spe ivs to ensure a slow parting shot

[muted oar]

Trash SpD?

[dim jackal]

eviolite

Plus flip turn spectral thief wish

4th move varies

[quiet salmon]

clefblade is also not bad but it definitely needs softboiled for recovery and a way to hit dragoluna which play rough does fine

[dim jackal]

Yeah if your asking best mon to fuse is probably doublade or dragonite

Great tusk is up there too for hazard removal

Since no mon fits everything

each can do a job or 2

Drago luna is probs best sweeper

[muted oar]

Off like 50 SpD it still isn't gonna be that impressive

[dim jackal]

S teir mons are probs Doublade as number 1 mon then alomola then dragonite then great tusk then indeedee

[quiet salmon]

Ability: Unaware  
Tera Type: Fairy  
Fusion: Doublade  
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD  
Impish Nature  
- Play Rough  
- Spectral Thief  
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock / Knock Off

[dim jackal]

Bro asked for the best mon in the format then argues its bad bc low sp def

252+ Atk Choice Band Sniper Urshifu Wicked Blow vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eviolite Doublade on a critical hit: 381-450 (82.4 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This is 116 attack stab dark move on a ghost type that is critting banded and sniper boosted

252+ SpA Hydrapple Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Doublade: 246-290 (53.2 - 62.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

this is stab off of 131 sp attack

Still hits like 400 500 300 bulk when eviolite

[quiet salmon]

can u guys move this to general

[muted oar]

Yes? You're talking about a wall and are saying it's the best in the game when it has terrible SpD compared to the alternates

[dim jackal]

How many battles have you done in nat dex?

also move to showdown general

[quiet salmon]

for archaludon urshifu i dont find the combo effective because its easily walled by water types so id rather go something incredibly strong to fulfill the wallbreaking role on this semistall looking team

Ability: Sheer Force  
Tera Type: Fairy  
Fusion: Nidoking  
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe  
Timid Nature  
IVs: 0 Atk  
- Moonblast  
- Earth Power  
- Flamethrower  
- Substitute / Ice Beam / Grass Knot

this fits the bill

porytcha's bulk is kinda lacking and you dont have a good water resist so far so i like to throw this on a team

Ability: Water Absorb  
Tera Type: Poison  
Fusion: Ting-Lu  
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD  
Careful Nature  
IVs: 0 Spe  
- Earthquake  
- Toxic  
- Recover  
- Spikes / Whirlwind```
with water absorb and poison/ground it walls many mons rain which is a threatening archetype otherwise

seeing as the team lacks an ice resist im going to opt for ```Cresslossal (Cresselia) (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Psychic
Fusion: Coalossal
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature

• Heat Crash / Flamethrower
• Will-O-Wisp
• Spikes / Calm Mind
• Moonlight```
  heat crash allows you to hit calm mind users or you can use cm yourself to boost with them

https://pokepast.es/aa410f43d8496e04 so heres the final team

[alpine wedge]

Thanks!!

[quiet salmon]

np

[shrewd lynx]

how am i supposed to figure out what to add to the mons im picking like i wanna make a rain team but idk what to add to the water mons like ive added thunderous to kyogre cause hurricane is cool but besides that idk man

[cursive tundra]

ask the gay male lover in the Competitive Server

he exclusively plays rain

[shrewd lynx]

oke

[shrewd lynx]

whats his at?

[cursive tundra]

konodirt

[shrewd lynx]

Magnetoed (Magnezone) @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Politoed
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Scald
• Ice Beam
• Parabolic Charge
• Thunder

Kingrai (Kingdra)
Ability: Swift Swim
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Darkrai
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Waterfall
• Aqua Jet
• Knock Off
• Dragon Dance

Milolix (Milotic) (F) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Marvel Scale
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Steelix
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Scald
• Earth Power
• Toxic
• Recover

Azumaxorus (Azumarill) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Huge Power
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Haxorus
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature

• Aqua Jet
• Liquidation
• Outrage
• Poison Jab

Gyaramence (Gyarados)
Ability: Moxie
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Salamence
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Dragon Dance
• Waterfall
• Dragon Claw
• Earthquake

Lapslash (Lapras)
Ability: Hydration
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Aegislash
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Perish Song
• Ice Beam
• Hydro Pump
• Shadow Ball

doing a rain team but ive never made a competitive team for this fusion showdown b4 so any advice or tips would be great

[sterile glacier]

Best advice I can give you is to try it out a bunch and see what you can answer and what you can't

[shrewd lynx]

ah so u dont know any like moves or items i should add

[red spear]

Huge Power on Azu is banned in both OU formats, also the Aegislash without stance change means that Lapras will be doing barely any damage, if you really want to use it with Perish song I suggest making it perish trapper with whirlpool

Kingdra/Darkrai as a physical mon is certainly interesting as well, but I feel like it would hit harder as a Nasty Plot Swift swimmer

Your rain setter should probably be carrying momentum, it’s one of the most important things for setters to have, so probably volt switch over parabolic or thunder

[sterile glacier]

Isn't Darkrai banned in OU too?

[red spear]

Not in NatDex

It’s a very low power team for NatDex, it looks like an IF Dex team

[shrewd lynx]

Magnetoed (Magnezone) @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Politoed
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Scald
• Ice Beam
• Volt Switch
• Thunder

Kingpardos (Kingdra) @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Rampardos
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Waterfall
• Aqua Jet
• Swords Dance
• Stone Edge

Milolix (Milotic) (F) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Marvel Scale
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Steelix
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Scald
• Earth Power
• Toxic
• Recover

Gyaramence (Gyarados) @ Choice Band
Ability: Moxie
Shiny: Yes
Fusion: Salamence
Alt: a
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

• Waterfall
• Dragon Claw
• Earthquake
• Outrage

Toxthorn (Toxapex) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
Fusion: Ferrothorn
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Scald
• Spiky Shield
• Recover
• Toxic

Laplax (Lapras) @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Fusion: Snorlax
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Hydro Pump
• Hyper Voice
• Perish Song
• Whirlpool

ive changed it a little and i just had my first fight but i got stalled by a slowking/dusclops fusion and i wanna use it but idk what to replace?

its now for if dex ou

[red spear]

Laplax looks like the most replaceable if you really want to

I’d also suggest changing the gyarados from band to scarf, or making it a ddance set

[shrewd lynx]

i was thinking that

ill go scarf

[shrewd lynx]

i won a match! https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=ernestogaming1-herobrinesans-1707215675511

[sterile glacier]

Nice.

[shrewd lynx]

whats the move that uses ur defence for the power of the move cause i cant remeber it and im trying to use it on my regitrio

im drawing a major blank

aww its a gen 8 move i swore it was earlier

ugh

[sterile glacier]

Body press

[red spear]

Yeah it doesn’t exist in IF Dex

[snow pike]

its not meant to be a special wall anyways

I need a fairy/steel type (IF dex), can't be Registeel or Clefable though because I already have them on the team and there's species clause

[dim jackal]

Sylveon ferrothorn

[shrewd lynx]

ferrothorn?

eyyyyy

twins

[dim jackal]

This is probs bad lol

Random steel fairy

[snow pike]

i need immediate recovery :p

i think maybe togekiss/something

[shrewd lynx]

uses heal pulse on myst

ur welcome

[alpine wedge]

What would be a good dark/ghost fusion?

[quiet salmon]

in ou or ndou

[alpine wedge]

Ou

[quiet salmon]

i like umbreon/cofagrigus

hydreigon/dusclops ive used too

[alpine wedge]

Is it worth using flash fire on a Fairy/Steel Pokémon or any other ability?

[quiet salmon]

depends on what it is

[alpine wedge]

In case of a physical attacker?

[quiet salmon]

what is it exactly

[alpine wedge]

Iron Tran (Iron Valiant) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
Fusion: Heatran
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Magma Storm
• Earth Power
• Aura Sphere
• Destiny Bond

[quiet salmon]

definitely ff here but this mon looks real bad otherwise

esp cause it has no stab

[snow pike]

I've used umbreon/doublade alot but it doesn't feel as good as it used to

[quiet salmon]

No Ability?

[red spear]

I believe it's No Guard, actually

[quiet salmon]

My Bad.

[snow pike]

it does play like that essentially

no guard is completely useless on it so I run inner focus because I died to a jirachi fusion that kept spamming iron head and flinched my umbreon 6 times in a row

[alpine wedge]

https://pokepast.es/1d416eeda0002493
what do you think?

[jaunty geode]

There are better hoopa fustions and don’t use dragon rush

[alpine wedge]

what would be a good fusion with hoppa

[jaunty geode]

Indeedee

[dim jackal]

He is right. Indeedee is 1 of the best

Scarf expanding force

[quiet salmon]

team is too slow for veil

veil is used to protect your mons as they spam setup and try to win the game fast

otherwise its a pretty dead slot and an easy way for your opponent to gain momentum

[lethal onyx]

is this good for gen9 doubles uber?

[quiet salmon]

very unlikely

[lethal onyx]

suuggestions?

[quiet salmon]

idk doubles but annihilape has no ghost stab and is thus walled by ghosts

p sure dondozo wants rest somewhere

oricorio wants qd somewhere

rayquaza definitely wants dd over bulk up

and presumably youd want more redirection/spread moves somewhere

again i dont know doubles so i cant help you specifically

[cursive tundra]

These 1s and 3s are throwing me tf off

[red spear]

that team needs a lot of work

you should not run leftovers on every mon, few mons in doubles will generally want leftovers at all, preferring berries over them

You don't need to run 4 attacking moves on all your pokemon, as Conja said, you want some better role distribution, look for some damage reduction, speed control, and/or redirection to replace some of these

Protect is vital in doubles, you'll want that on a few of these for sure

[sterile glacier]

I don't pretend to be a doubles player but even so I know that making sure your enemies act after you and strategically negating their attacks with protect are crucial parts of succeeding in doubles.

[snow pike]

Why do you put 1's and 3's in stats, that doesn't do anything

I didn't know rayquaza had bulk up

[lethal onyx]

I don't like I to be empty

[snow pike]

But you can use the remaining 4 for a higher stat, 3 abd lower does nothing

[lethal onyx]

smogon

[snow pike]

smogon

[dim jackal]

Huh???

What does this repley even mean

Your just wasting ev's

[patent hatch]

Smogon

[gentle pine]

I’m pretty sure I called this guy out for trolling before ngl.

[snow pike]

smogon

[paper pelican]

does fling work with golden nugget in this showdown?

[patent hatch]

That’s a Gen 9 change so no

If you’re talking about IF

[snow pike]

can we unban light ball if the holder isn't a pikachu cuz i like fling light ball shenanigans

[quiet salmon]

just use twave

[snow pike]

i know thats much better but it isnt as funny
and idk what else to fling with my sceptile fusion

[cursive tundra]

a berry

[paper pelican]

the bone

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=tanksaregood-rudihrtd-1707854912056 has anyone else come up with this combo?

[snow pike]

the opponenet really got screwed with the magic bounce parting shot lol, thats a funny gimmick

[wheat viper]

can someone help me practice for a battle i have on friday?

[prisma marsh]

Does no guard completely not work with mankey's paw or does it still increase accuracy in some way

[dim jackal]

Not work

[prisma marsh]

Ty

[humble heart]

i wish it worked bcuz it'd be really fun to use

but alas

it does not

[paper pelican]

https://pokepast.es/114b558283524742

[quiet salmon]

average set

[paper pelican]

what item tho

[gusty burrow]

You forget 4 evs btw
Lum berry would be good.

[void willow]

Leftovers is also great for longevity, especially when your opponent has priority moves or passive damage like Iron Barbs/Rocky Helmet to wear you down

[paper pelican]

https://pokepast.es/aa7254a381ef6fd9

same problem as before but I was considering just using a figy berry, but I already have two other pokemon on my team with different healing berries, idk if they count as different items tho

[quiet salmon]

this channel is more for if fusion showdown teambuilding than vanilla ou

[finite lily]

Any tips for changes I can make and/or what the 6th pokemon should be?

[quiet salmon]

cofagrigus krook is pretty frail considering lack of recovery and mediocre bulk

id rather use umbreon cofagrigus and find another sr user

is there a reason why youre jolly toxapex

luster purge is a very bad nonstab attack bc it doesnt synergize with dragon at all and is 70 bp so id much rather use flash cannon to hit fairies

facade is not effective on heracross as opposed to sd or even bullet punch

and poryvern would rather have flamethrower over tbolt or ice beam bc it hits steels which normal and dragon are resisted by

with something like roost/taunt/uturn as the last move (dont use life orb with uturn though)

the team is pretty weak to ground and special attacks so id look for a special wall but also you dont have a fire resist so id find a water type over toxapex

[gusty burrow]

The teams also very knock off weak, nothing likes having their item removed turn 1

Sylvern clicks boomburst once Toxapex/Doublade gets knocked

[fathom hare]

https://pokepast.es/c8e1349517e25003 its not on the fusion but rate my team plz

[minor cradle]

its pretty bad even for standard gen 9 ou...

the mons chosen are completely unsuitable for the current gen 9 ou meta lol, i suggest using samples

with that out of the way i cooked https://pokepast.es/4c45e8ded4813e0f

[shut dagger]

This is my first attempt at a team, it's been serving me well on the ladder so far https://pokepast.es/f9f2b3f3c6931ecc

[gusty burrow]

The amount of webs teams just tripled with shuckle being unbanned lol

[red spear]

Poison heal makes you heal health instead of taking damage from poison. You should run toxic orb on it. Moves that are the same type are you gain a power boost (x1.5), so you should usually try to prioritize them. I suggest going with earthquake over gunk shot, and roost, or protect over Crabhammer to give you a bit more longevity and in most cases more turns to stall out the toxic

The EV spread feels really specific, is there any reason for it?

Ah right gen 9 OU, then you can run protect over it, and I’d personally switch sub out for knock, spikes, or uturn

You need to be careful what you’re sending it out against, it’s great at walling some mons, but will die quickly to some others, like ice types, and frankly most special mons

Gliscor isn’t a fast mon, that’ll happen very often

If the torkoal is setting sun I suggest an abuser for it

Also keep in mind that your team is incredibly ground weak rn

[jaunty geode]

What the low elo hell

[nocturne eagle]

I believe hes referring to the other person’s team

[jaunty geode]

Yes

Get out of their so can actually tell what going wrong

Basically you can’t tell we’re going wrong because low elo play just doesn’t exist and teambuilding also doesn’t do you can’t tell if you playing bad and where

Ah I see why gen 9 ou

I see well best of luck

You should try past gen their generally* easy to get into

This is why I don’t play Gen 9

That’s fair you playing for competition or useing your favourite

Let’s um go though this

Why curse on gengar

Yeah you should dragapult is just better

[sterile glacier]

Unless you need your ghost to beat fairies exactly

Gengar isn't useless in OU, but it's a lot more niche than it once was.

Well, I hear Kingambit just wins games out of nowhere with its broken ability and unfair stats if you keep it alive until it's the last Pokemon you have left

Swords Dance, Sucker Punch, Kowtow Cleave, and Iron Head with leftovers is probably going to get you there

It's not a complicated Pokemon. It's bulky AF, it hits like a train, and it gets a 10% damage boost whenever a teammate gets knocked out

Bisharp was already very strong. It did not need an evolution, and it really did not need to be able to run eviolite.

Instead of throwing random Pokemon at the wall to see what sticks, I'd strongly suggest working from a concept. What does your team want to do in order to win, and what do you need in order to get there?

[red spear]

Why is the Moltres-G holding a Draco Plate?

Also not all your mons should be running substitute

The Electivire has 3 electric moves, you don’t need all of them, think of which you want

It’s difficult to start off from scratch

This is also definitely not the best resource for learning

I’d suggest other discord servers more geared towards competitive vanilla

And looking at Smogon resources, or test teams

That’s totally fair

A very sane decision

All Pokémon players have lost their minds at some point, it’s sorta something you gotta do

[red spear]

Teambuilding is honestly the hardest part

I’d suggest taking a premade team and running with it while you learn the basics

Obviously you’re free to ask us any questions

|| https://www.pokeaimmd.com/teams || is a good place to get teams from, they feature a Pokémon they were built around, and are generally really good

[slim mesa]

Has anyone cooked up something with Aegislash, Alakazam and/or Shuckle in IF Dex OU?

First thing with Shuckle I saw was combining it with Entei for Contrary V-Create

[dreamy lion]

Alakazam/Electrode for fast magic guard Mindblown shenanigans

[quiet salmon]

shuckle entei is mid af

id even say its bad

[primal aspen]

Hey guys I'm new to messing around with the teambuilder here, what is a good entry hazard setter? I play AG :]

[quiet salmon]

gen 7 or gen 9

[primal aspen]

I prefer gen 7 but rn I have a team that's valid for both since I get more matches on g9 rn

I'm probably gonna switch to gen 9 fully just to make it easier

Unless people here think g7 is better

[quiet salmon]

chansey/blissey fusions set rocks decently but ideally you want something that can beat mbounce users

[primal aspen]

Rn I have a Blissey/Dragonite but I was hoping to find something that can set spikes or somethin'

This is what I have rn

[quiet salmon]

hooh ferrothorn or shed ferrothorn are good

[sterile glacier]

Breloom/Klefki. Spore is legal up there and IF Breloom gets Strength Sap. Prankster is a hell of a drug.

As far as the new mons go, I’ve been using Typhlosion/Alakazam. Magic Guard is pretty nice for preserving your full power Eruption from entry hazards, and the great speed and special attack helps you spam the funny button.

It’s working so far.

[quiet salmon]

total noobtrap bc mbounce exists

[sterile glacier]

What, people are running that much Xatu and Espeon in Ubers?

[quiet salmon]

yes

because its the best support option for shed

and also because there are a shitton of people spamming hazards smeargle and w/e

[primal aspen]

Haha I have no idea what that means

[sterile glacier]

Huh. How do they keep the magic bouncer from dying? Because I tried it in OU , tempted by how powerful Magic Bounce is. But Xatu and Espeon are pretty fragile and don’t have great moves. They kept getting crushed by the hazard setters they were supposed to sit on.

[sterile glacier]

It means that Wonder Guard is obnoxious and Smeargle fusions are good for vomiting hazards around since it’s AG and you can thus use Moody.

[primal aspen]

Oh right of course why didn’t I think of that pfft

[quiet salmon]

giratina xatu works

[primal aspen]

I’ve encountered one xatu fusion in the form of Xatu Ho-oh but I absolutely ruined it

It didn’t even really clock what it was supposed to do on the team it switched in on my Sylv Noivern and got eaten alive instantly

[sterile glacier]

If you want to rock with that lot floating around, Zekrom/Garchomp at least seems plausible to me. I’ve had great success with Garchomp rocking in OU, and Zekrom brings EVEN MORE FIREPOWER with Teravolt to rip through wonder guard and magic bounce.

[quiet salmon]

good luck improofing it then

[sterile glacier]

I think I’m showing my age because I have no idea what you’re trying to say.

[quiet salmon]

when imposter switches in what do you do

[deft arch]

i made a natdex ou monster

Ting-Clops

Ting-Lu/Dusclops

[pseudo heron]

It’s only recovery is rest

[dim jackal]

No that good imo

Pecheruant and ting lu gets p shot and recover

[deft arch]

It absorbs damage

It’s so funny when they can’t kill it lmao

[robust rapids]

I also made something foul

[muted oar]

Flamethrower:

[sterile glacier]

Forget flamethrower, you could disintegrate this thing with an Ember

[quiet salmon]

would much rather use defensive with recover

[upper granite]

no recovery

[muted oar]

Best ferrothorn fusions?

IF dex

[robust rapids]

registeel makes it the same but better, chandelure is probably decent too

[gusty burrow]

Clefable/Ferrothorn is pretty good

[sterile glacier]

Latias/Ferrothorn also does work. Dragon/Steel typing is very good, and Latias adds a lot of things to the movepool that Ferrothorn really wants

Plus you can fake people out with the "Does it have Iron Barbs or Levitate" question.

There are very different answers to what this is afraid of depending on the ability

[teal obsidian]

https://pokepast.es/e0dd1d54de3270f7 I made this nonsense

[zenith owl]

0

[agile lodge]

Orthworm+Ho-oH

[agile lodge]

With earth eater btw

[patent hatch]

That’s part flying though so why would you have Earth Eater? Unless you meant the reverse

[agile lodge]

yes

[agile lodge]

i meant the reverse

fire steel with earth eater gives a suprise earth immunity to alot of people and only weak to fighting after that

I run it with V-create, recover, shed tail, and sunsteel strike

[agile lodge]

just run supquaza but even that gets shut down

[pallid beacon]

What do y'all think about a Basculegion with kartana fusion that runs last respects for IF gen 9 anything goes. It should be able to sweep a game if something should go wrong with the rest of my team

[quiet salmon]

just gets walled by shedinja

[agile lodge]

Basculegion should be built into your team, not a backup

if you just have him as a back up you are basically playing a 5v6 with a dice roll on your last pokemon

[red spear]

Soak Bascu goat

[compact pebble]

Hey Im trying to make a good sandslash build for my pokemon team

and a good azumarill

[quiet salmon]

sandslash haxorus w tarrows dclaw/pjab superpower sd is p good

azumarill is outclassed by most other waters

[compact pebble]

Hes a tank

[quiet salmon]

unless yr talking about ag

milotic is a better tank

[compact pebble]

good point

Shedninja or Ninjask?

[quiet salmon]

for what

[compact pebble]

Attack

[quiet salmon]

probably neither

90 atk is not high

[compact pebble]

Whos better tho

[quiet salmon]

ninjask ig

[compact pebble]

wait a just realised something about fusion

if you combine golurk and snorlax your only weakness is dark

[pallid beacon]

yeah, but there are other better combos for ghost + normal

[agile lodge]

Erm actually golurk+Snorlax is Ground normal

• Slaking + Golurk would just be better

[pallid beacon]

while if you arrange them in different orders (snorlax as head and Golurk as body)

[fading shadow]

I ran into someone using that yesterday was that you

[pallid beacon]

I doubt it, I wasn't online much yesterday

[muted nimbus]

first rain team any improvements?
https://pokepast.es/87592709681ca79e

[candid panther]

I need help making one of fusion Version of my team in pokemon Violent

I know most mons are not in the game but I wanna make something close to it my team was a bulky hazard team with a fast physical sweeper to finish off anything weak and have Pivot

[muted nimbus]

you could just do natdex then you get all of your original mons

and enhance em with fusions

[snow pike]

Pokémon Violent

[sly thicket]

Does anyone know off hand how the interaction with a fire type that holds a flame orb works in IF showdown?

I read via google that it apparently powers up fire type Pokémon but I’m not sure if that’s real or not

[quiet salmon]

huh

that isnt what it does in vanilla showdown

[snow pike]

that must be a fangame thing

but not this one

[sly thicket]

Aight bet just wanted clarification on if it was a thing or not. Thanks lmao

[candid panther]

Gonna need some help with teambuilding

https://pokepast.es/30d4e02d376fb5e2

I'm trying to make a hazard stack team with one fast attacker, one strong special attacker and a tanky physical attacker while everyone else is tanks

I'm also just experimenting with different fusions to see what works

[void willow]

Don't use Metronome on your Poryvern—both of your STABs have immunities (Ghost and Fairy) and it's not worth it to spam the same move over and over again when you can instead go for more immediate power with specs, outspeed stuff with scarf, or have more flexibility with Life Orb or Leftovers. Also, you should use Draco Meteor over Dragon Pulse most of the time for the far greater power. Flamethrower should be used over Air Slash to help you break through Steel types.

[candid panther]

I have a idea for a tank I'm thinking shuckle Sableye or Shuckle whiscoot

[void willow]

I wouldn't personally recommend Shuckle due to its poor typing, low HP, and lack of recovery; Shuckle is okay as a lead hazard setter but it gets worn down quickly over the course of a match

[candid panther]

Any suggestions for a better Lead hazard setter?

I did with Whis and I actually do get a Grass rock type with prankster

[void willow]

I think it's totally fine as lead hazard setter, it's just that you shouldn't expect it to have much longevity beyond that

[candid panther]

Do you also have any suggestions for a fast physical attacker??

[void willow]

the problem is that most physical attackers above 100 base speed don't actually have that high of an attack stat except maybe Weavile and Garchomp, and both the Attack and Speed stats are weighted more heavily towards the body fusion

you could consider using someone with Dragon Dance, Shift Gear, or just use Choice Scarf to make up for lower speeds

I think your Hawlucha/Weavile fusion is okay, but you should swap out Drain Punch for High Jump Kick for the much higher power

[candid panther]

Yeah just saw the fusion Dragon ice with over 100 atk and speed

And ice shard too that's actually pretty good

[void willow]

I didn't actually mean Garchomp + Weavile as one fusion, I just used them as examples of fast physical attackers with high attack stats

Weavile does have a problem in that its strongest Ice move is Ice Punch, which really isn't that strong with its base 75 power

[candid panther]

Oooh

True

If only triple axel was available 😔

The fusion does pack alot of coverage

[void willow]

if you don't mind the lower speed you can also consider pairing Entei with another fast physical attacker: Entei has access to V-Create, allowing you to nuke anything that doesn't resist Fire

[candid panther]

Ooo

Actually

Entei septile seems to be pretty good

Speed and atk are high plus unburden and D dance

Plus I'll be only weak to rock, flying and poison

Then I also get Earthquake to help deal with other fire types and outrage for dragon types so I don't get walled either

[void willow]

I used Entei/Garchomp some time ago because it had great stats and Fire/Ground is an amazing typing even though you die to a single drop of water

reversing that very same fusion also gives you a Dragon/Fire type that is Water-neutral, but honestly Dragonite or Salamence are better picks for Dragon/Fire due to their access to Multiscale and Intimidate/Moxie

[candid panther]

What I got now is Normal/Dragon, Ghost/Fairy, Grass/Fire, Steal/Fariy, and Poison/Dark

Just need to make one more money to round out the team

[sterile glacier]

Entei + Klinklang is fun. Steel/fire typing give you enough bulk to get a Shift Gear or two, at which point you can ignore the stat drops from V-Create for at least one or two uses

[candid panther]

Anyone wanna help me figure out how I should build this fusion?

I already know I'm taking SG as the ability but I have access to both Nasty plot and Dragon dance now

As well as ESpeed

Then Fairy dark is a pretty nasty Combo but it just sucks that Grimsnarl is pretty iffy

[quiet salmon]

it doesnt get any relevant secondary moves though

and unstab espeed aint good

[candid panther]

Any suggestions for some strong ttar fusions I heard a few but I would like some other ideas

Actually I found a pretty good one

Dusknoir Ttar bulky and hits hard I can also do the pre evo of Dusknoir and hold Evolite

[agile lodge]

why are you running V create on a rain team first of all

you need more flying moves to help cover your grass type weakness, fire is at half power in rain

[sly thicket]

I have room for both but if I had to pick one to support a slower Mon would it be better to use the first one or second one? (Espeon/galvantula is supposed to have focus sash btw. Extra context the Mon in question has 306 as its speed. Suggestions on building these two better is also appreciated )

[minor cradle]

really depends on the team, do you really need a webber

[sly thicket]

It’s a sun team that I’m using it on to enable charking. The SR Is really for the idea of allowing breaking points to happen while the web setter is to allow it to outspeed important matchups it otherwise loses. I’ll try to get a pokepast of the current team version I’ve been using (https://pokepast.es/0f149c0c80ccc0db
The weakest two in terms of impact I’ve had so far on this team are aegitops and togegon-z. Aegitops is there for hazard removal but he doesn’t seem to do much else and togegon was for fairy stab, though I’m thinking of going for e-speed pixilate in its stead)

[minor cradle]

k

is this regional or nd

[sly thicket]

Regional dex so gen 7

[minor cradle]

screens sun is interesting

[sly thicket]

It actually enables charking surprisingly well

Honestly really want torkoal to be in the bf format cause eruption just seems scary on this team as well

[minor cradle]

first time i've seen a sun team

without entei

[sly thicket]

I’m sure entei does a lot more but from my experience v-create kinda doesn’t do too much for me lol

[minor cradle]

are there any real reason between some of these spreads

[sly thicket]

Which spread made you ask that specifically?

I have a lot of weird logic that went into these spreads so it’s easier to pinpoint which one you mean . Sludge wave was to hit fairy types if you’re asking about that

[minor cradle]

aegitops and hytales

[sly thicket]

Aegitops is basically for hazard removal but he doesn’t contribute much else. Hyraxes is for the defensive typing to allow sun to set up a lot easier while knocking out a Mon with overheat/solar beam

Then getting out with u-turn or burning something with will-o-wisp

[minor cradle]

is there any reason you gave hytales that speed

[sly thicket]

To ensure it outspeeds anything it can tbh. U-turn I’m sure works a lot better as a going last move but I’d rather it not get blasted lol

Aegitops definitely should be a lot more physical though but I’m at a loss for a good rapid spinner that fits the team lmao

[void willow]

Just my 2 cents but I would probably run Thunderbolt instead of Sludge Wave to hit Water and Flying types, since the common defensive Fairy fusions are usually immune or neutral to Poison (Steel/Fairy for example)

[cursive tundra]

Uzako is what we call a ladder fiend

they know every ugly combo

it's what happens when you're in the trenches

[sly thicket]

Steel fairy still gets hit by heatwave so I didn’t think too much about flying types. Thunderbolt I’m sure would work better in some scenarios but poison from my experience works more consistently against water types and the ones that resist it gets hit with other options I have on him. I’m sure I can be wrong with that logic but would it really be that much more important to use over sludge wave? (Update: I found out earlier today that poison is not super effective against water. T bolt it is )

[cursive tundra]

Estula wants a coverage move over T-Wave 100%

[sly thicket]

I’ll brb gotta finish up some work, appreciate the feedback so far everyone

[cursive tundra]

and I think Aegicor is a mid Gliscor fusion since Gliscor is already prone to 4MSS

and you're using a worse ability for it

PHeal is just, chef's kiss

Stance Change is better off for a more bulky offensive mon that can shoot a moon, a ball, a sword, Spectral Thief whatever

[sly thicket]

Ah okay so then snorlax/aegislash is just a better idea in general?

[minor cradle]

tbh i've been seeing a few snorlax doublades lately

[cursive tundra]

yeah he works

I see you're drawing from PIF ingame

[minor cradle]

kinda annoying for my team i actually have to properly use my brain to pivot around it sadly

[cursive tundra]

Regislash is another one if you want to keep Toxic immunity

he's the counterpart to Regitube

[minor cradle]

regitube!!!

[sly thicket]

in Regitube we trust

[minor cradle]

honestly i still dont get why your team is a mix between sun webs and screens......

[cursive tundra]

sounds like a hot day on the beach

[sly thicket]

Just a lot of pivot points and starting points to work off of depending on what kind of team I’m going against. If there’s a starter I notice works better over another on team reveal I use it instead of the other then find a way to pivot into the other to snowball further

Probably not the best strat but one that I feel can work consistently if done right. Was originally suggested to use webs to enable charking but I find screens enables the strat a lot easier along with webs

[quiet salmon]

having THREE enablers for a sole wallbreaker is crazy

and more likely than not will set you up to fail if they have something like prio or scarf or a fast flying or whatever

[sly thicket]

I won’t lie the strat loses hard to speed I’d really like to find better speed control than what I got. I’ve tried to find a good chlorophyll abuser to get around scarfs but those get dunked on by e-speed users. Prio is honestly this teams bane if I had to say anything about it lmao

That being said the togekiss/porygon-z was supposed to be a backup if anything goes wrong but it doesn’t do much in the end anyway. Trying to rattle my brain on a good sweeper that works with the team and make charking a revenge sweeper since he seems to work a lot better mid game

[quiet salmon]

you just use entei leafeon

• ghost for ursanite

you really dont need 3 leads

[minor cradle]

use 4 leads instead

[muted nimbus]

for other weather teams. Also true I need more grass resists

[sly thicket]

What would you recommend then for the ghost type? I’m thinking on snorlax/aegislash but if snorlax/duoblade is as good as what I just heard I might give that a shot

[minor cradle]

snorlax doublade better imo

[sly thicket]

I’ll do it dont tempt me lmao

[minor cradle]

Can give it eviolite

[quiet salmon]

no recovery

[minor cradle]

bulky as shit

use rest talk frfr

[quiet salmon]

ive used flygon doublade in ndex

[cursive tundra]

I don't even think you'd want to waste your time recovering on a sun team

[quiet salmon]

you do when if the ursanite breaks through with crunch it sweeps your team

[sly thicket]

I actually can’t tell if this is sarcasm

[quiet salmon]

its a bad idea you dont want to burn turns of weather

[cursive tundra]

burning turns in a bad way

[sly thicket]

Aight bet 👍

[quiet salmon]

rain setter should almost always be defensive bc without recovery you get chipped and then die and then lose your weather

but also wheres your swift swimmer

[cursive tundra]

took a look at the sun team in question and it didn't have a Chlorophyll user

[muted nimbus]

told ya its my first rain team

[quiet salmon]

if ur running a rain team you need swift swim

otherwise no real reason to run rain

[cursive tundra]

at least 1

[quiet salmon]

this is nd you can only have 1

additionally everything thats not the rain abusers should be pivots to bring the rain abusers in

Ability: Regenerator  
Tera Type: Steel  
Fusion: Tangrowth  
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD  
Sassy Nature  
IVs: 0 Spe  
- Giga Drain  
- Poison Jab  
- Knock Off  
- U-turn

Flygon @ Eviolite  
Ability: Levitate  
Tera Type: Ground  
Fusion: Doublade  
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def  
Relaxed Nature  
IVs: 0 Spe  
- Earthquake  
- Spectral Thief  
- Roost  
- U-turn
``` like these

[cursive tundra]

from all the rain teams I ran into natdex they ran a Steel/Flying Drizzle user, Bridge, and Thunder Clap

[quiet salmon]

steel flying is overrated as a rain setter imo

bc being fire neutral is very helpful to be able to switch into fire moves

[sly thicket]

Was looking into entei/leafeon actually for that. Should I try to go for an assault vest build or should I go for swords dance/morning sun?

[cursive tundra]

Bando

[sly thicket]

…I’m sorry I don’t know what that means lol

Choice band you mean?

[cursive tundra]

yes

[sly thicket]

Ah gotcha makes sense

[cursive tundra]

your mission is to click V-Create

[sly thicket]

Exclusively?

[quiet salmon]

personally prefer sd bc you can get walled by fat waters/dragons if you get predicted

[cursive tundra]

probably the only thing that doesnt is Miloslash

if Alomoblade was taking 30% then who knows what less fatter resists are taking

[quiet salmon]

salablade

quaglix/slowlix

salalix

[cursive tundra]

the latter 2 would be subject to the 50/50

maybe the opps are afraid

252+ Atk Choice Band Entei V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Salamence in Sun: 133-157 (23.3 - 27.5%) -- 75% chance to 4HKO

[sly thicket]

Unsure of what movset actually works for this thing, is this fine or should I swap out the bottom two?

[cursive tundra]

Knock Off/Stone Edge or Knock Off/Sacred Fire

you put immense pressure being out that you can take out items as a side progress option for other members

like how Kartana would do

[sly thicket]

Wait how did I miss this learns knock off that’s actually insane lmao

[snow pike]

Knock off or Stomping Tantrum (you probably won't use them but the rare Pokémon that don't get 2shot by your stab combo will get destroyed by ground or dark)

Personally I like to run sd lorb on it
It is really stupidly strong with any set though

Sacred fire is nice for better accuracy and against faster, less bulky teams so you can still spam

and for the burn chance

[minor cradle]

"Better accuracy"

if its not 100% its 50%, also its the same as vcreate accuracy wise anyways

[sly thicket]

I ended up swapping to a knock off sd set it definitely seems a lot more consistent than the choice band set

I’ll need to play more to see but I think v-create is the play I’ve swept a lot with this entei set thanks again for the help to those that gave advice!

[snow pike]

Foe some reason my brain was thinking create was 85 accuracy but it's indeed the same as sacred fire

[paper pelican]

any thoughts on my doubles team? https://pokepast.es/d13327fb7c807fb9

[paper pelican]

I changed the electrify for discharge

[quiet salmon]

looks a lot like a singles team

[minor cradle]

seems very gimmicky, this hurts me as i play vgc

[patent hatch]

Where Protect

[minor cradle]

would a moveset like

Playground (Toxapex) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
Fusion: Jirachi
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe

• U-turn
• Stealth Rock
• Recover
• Toxic

this be better for a more bulky offence-balancish team

or av

(dont have any hazards setters outside of this, unless i go out of my way)

reg dex

[paper pelican]

what is it's typing?

[patent hatch]

Poison/Psychic

[quiet salmon]

worst mon on team i fear

use jirachi pex instead with av scald flash cannon koff uturn

though flash cannon might not be that necessary now that sylvern is effectively dead

[minor cradle]

ngl i wanna do this

but it conflicts with my team a decent chunk

but ehhhh

i'll jsut replace the other thing

[quiet salmon]

how does it conflict

[minor cradle]

tbh i just didnt want the typing xd

weaknesses since my current team is weak to a specific thing lmao, but its fine i'll just make more changes

my main problem is fitting hazard control tbh

i guess it could also be solved if i didnt use this stupid mon but it works

whats a good fusion for gliscor

will probably

solve my problems

probably

i think

[quiet salmon]

idk what your team is to say

[minor cradle]

fair

i think im just gonna remove this stupid dragonite fusion for hazard control

[quiet salmon]

you should post your team if you want specialized help

[minor cradle]

fair

i'll post the team once i

fix it

enough

too be not complete garbage

[minor cradle]

https://pokepast.es/e64008e4e9ebcd97

decided to make a new team, too tired of the last one

screens

i probably need another steel type or a ground immune, maybe a steel type fusion with latias?

i dont really know yet

[paper pelican]

https://pokepast.es/d88eae8cd8fbea77 I made some changes

[minor cradle]

saying this rn

dont use baton pass

its bad

[paper pelican]

no

I want to

[minor cradle]

this is way too gimmicky

[paper pelican]

in what way?

[minor cradle]

you lack protect, you lack speedcontrol, you lack a proper way of breaking

i havent built for IF doubles yet but i can see issues using just basic fundamentals from standard doubles teambuilding

just please dont use baton pass its completely horrible in a doubles format

thats the biggest issue i see, but the entire team is full of issues all around sob

I would drop electrode skarmory for a different pokemon, if you want hazards there are way better options overall and if you want tailwind combine it with prankster

mimikyu lopunny and blaziken ninetales is the complete definition of gimmicky, no attacking mvoes very inconsistent

very weak to steel types

i would say more but i dont have the time to do so

Overall i suggest learning more standard doubles teambuilding xd

[paper pelican]

how bout now? https://pokepast.es/c99351ab6d53d5ee

[minor cradle]

I Really suggest learning about how the doubles formats work normally and the teambuilding

I'll try and find resources

[paper pelican]

best way to learn is to play no?

trying to figure out what works is more fun anyway

[minor cradle]

you do you, i'll still try finding resources, finding one for doubles and not vgc is very hard

[paper pelican]

https://pokepast.es/0291b3646c1408a2

how bout now?

[paper pelican]

https://pokepast.es/5c2c61929339ab12

now?

[dapper raven]

would this thing have 645 attack after stance change?

[paper pelican]

the defense ivs stay on defense

[dapper raven]

so its just the base stats that change

?

[paper pelican]

yes

stance change only switches the base stats

[dapper raven]

is that affected by eviolite?

[paper pelican]

anything that effects attack or defense will keep effecting it, stance change only changes the base stats

[dapper raven]

or would eviolite just increase the new defense?

so yes

[paper pelican]

yes

[dapper raven]

awesome

thanks :)

[paper pelican]

np

[minor cradle]

essentially it only switches base stats, anything that boosts defense/attack will only boost that, evs dont transfer

its just normal stance change

[red spear]

It is not normal stance change

PIF changes how it works

it will transfer the whole stat, IV and EV included (but not stat boosts)

[red spear]

So this pokemon would have 430 attack

eviolite boosts defense after this, so wouldn't affect it. Band would

[minor cradle]

oh it does?, i suppose the original message i've read it from i misunderstood

[paper pelican]

IF gotta be different yo

[void willow]

Hang on, so it also transfers the +10% stat boost from nature? In this case, running +Def nature will give it +Atk on Stance Change?

[red spear]

Yes

[candid panther]

Okay

I'll keep that in mind since I plan to use my Snorlax agei fusion

[robust rapids]

so you're telling me this thing would have over 1000 spatk after weakness policy?

[red spear]

Yes

[cursive tundra]

this is the first thing everyone thinks of when they hear about Stance Change

[normal orchid]

I asked chat gpt and this is what it said to do

[quiet salmon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/792490609058381834.gif?v=1

[minor cradle]

never let chat gpt cook

[open zodiac]

1. AI didn't even get the type right, packing ddance on a mostly special attacking set? bruh
2. Quite literally use base Alakazam instead. Has that exact set and basically has better stats in every department (unless Levitate is that useful to you - which if so good for you)
3. Just use base Blissey. Thick Fat + higher defense isn't worth it.
4. Triple types don't exist for that fusion - Just use base Scizor. Literally no benefits except a slightly higher speed stat.
5. Again triple types that don't exist - Better off running either Gallade or Gardevoir (though I dunno if Gardevoir gets CC)
6. AI might actually be cooking with the combo and ability (A slightly weaker salamence with multi scale might actually be worth it) - the set is albeit usable, not that good (again, a special attack on a ddance mon)
   I rate this AI team a 9/10 on the "you're just better off not fusing things" scale and a 3/10 on the "make a good team" scale

[paper pelican]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=rngfallen-rudihrtd-1710163770079 I like The steam

[snow pike]

Lol, better than when I tried it

It's just combining popular Pokémon, not even competitively good ones

[sly thicket]

We need to get ChatGPT on the meta Fr Fr

[paper pelican]

https://pokepast.es/df095836d0c2d808 I actually put in more effort this time

[vital musk]

Question: How do I make a page like that? I want some help on a team but don't want to post it all here

[frail pendant]

pokepaste is the name of the website

[vital musk]

Okay, I found the website

[vital musk]

https://pokepast.es/361fafe337ac8f30
So I need help for a tourney.
The restrictions are that all pokemon must be fused, and I can only have 4 OU pokemon.

Also there's this point system which is why I'm not using all UU with it

[cursive tundra]

We need the full full details of the tourney to comprehend

[sly thicket]

If you want us to help we gotta know what the restrictions are and how the point system works

[vital musk]

sure. Here's what I've got
Since teams will have 12 Pokemon fused together, the total of the 12 must be less than or equal to your assigned budget.
OU = 5
UU = 4
RU = 3
NU or NFE or below = 1
Max of 4 OU pokemon, and the budget is 50 points for a team

[modern bear]

what tourney is it?

is it open to people joining?

[vital musk]

It's a collegiate event at the University of Wisconsin Madison

[modern bear]

gotcha lmao

[vital musk]

I mean I can check if it's open to other people joining

[modern bear]

nah dw about it

time zones dont match up

[cursive tundra]

damn you're not gonna let me the tier leader join?

I can build this w for you no problem

[modern bear]

no attacking moves on the whimsicott?

[cursive tundra]

@vital musk and are these tiers you're picking from the ones currently on the site?

[vital musk]

Yes.

I forgot to mention it's Gen 7 IF OU

[cursive tundra]

ez

[vital musk]

Okay they said anyone can join but I don't think they know I asked the actual IF server

[cursive tundra]

coolio

give me some mons you'd like to use

[vital musk]

My main pokemon I'd really like to use is Electivire and Swampert.

As for OU pokemon, I was looking at Gliscor as I love the poison heal mechanic, and Porygon Z because funny glitch pokemon

[cursive tundra]

uh together or just those two on a fusion regardless

[vital musk]

on a fusion. The only one I was really looking at fused was Electivire and Swampert because I love the art

[cursive tundra]

https://pokepast.es/4f9e80f728af20a5 https://pokepast.es/63f44212fffd96fe https://pokepast.es/1bbd92156a844f62 @vital musk

top 2 on each are the best options/most used and the rest are ones that have something decent/unique about them

[vital musk]

Thank you so much

So, who wanted in on the tournament? I'll dm you a link to the server it's held on

It would be Saturday, 6pm - 9pm cst

[quiet salmon]

is there a prize

[cursive tundra]

yeah

[sly thicket]

If I didn’t work this weekend I’d be super down

Hope all that joins in on this a great time!

If you guys could I’d like to see replays on this to see the teams that get made

[vital musk]

Sure

[quiet salmon]

is there a prize

[vital musk]

No

It's a pretty casual tournament. Winner gets bragging rights at best

[quiet salmon]

oh ok

[vital musk]

Okay, a question about poison heal fusions. I have a gliscor/toxapex fusion, and I'm trying to get it poisoned for poison heal, but it can't get poisoned because it's a poison type. How do I remedy this?

Or should I just use a different ability in this case?

[minor cradle]

if your gliscor fusion is steel/poison it sont work

wont*

u could switch abilities but just use a diff mon at that point

[vital musk]

I just made regenerator Gliscor/Toxapex

[quiet salmon]

you used the wrong fusion order just swap it

[snow pike]

pex head brings with it poison type iirc
you probably want the reverse for poison heal, water ground iirc
pex heads bring with them low hp anyways so bodies are usually better

[paper pelican]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=popueo11-rudihrtd-1710409835114 I think I finally made a good team

[sly thicket]

Strong feeling that regenerator would just be better on this thing but i feel this would be funny to run too