showdown-general

[radiant rivet]

it loses to switching, such a thing is unexcceptble

[obtuse shoal]

yeah, especially for things like quiver dance celebi

mind if I try a game against you?

[radiant rivet]

sure

[obtuse shoal]

so yeah, very rarely do I get gliscor do something

[radiant rivet]

it gets forced out by jira very very easily

granted the suprise KO on alakazam is valuable ( unless its stast)

[obtuse shoal]

yeah, but i think jiragrowth and slowphan are just super hard to deal with

[radiant rivet]

are they?

they are meta staples for a reason

[obtuse shoal]

the things they're weak to, they're resisted by loads of other things

so you can try to dish a lot of neutral hits, but they don't care thanks to regen

and they resist rocks

I can't use a grass move, or you can switch in toxitar for free

besides, the only thing that I use with grass is alakazam

[radiant rivet]

its a give and take

[obtuse shoal]

dumbest game I've ever done
this went to 100 turns, simply stalling
https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=illusion911-nightmare17354-1741984318048

[obtuse shoal]

yeah

doesn't mean I can't make something better

btw, one of the pokemon I struggle the most with in this team is celebi clefable

[radiant rivet]

that makes sense looking at your team.

[obtuse shoal]

your slow also got downed by sand, but if you used slowphan instead

although I think you went with it for the sneak

[radiant rivet]

i liked the spectral

[obtuse shoal]

makes sense

[radiant rivet]

and i thogt sneak ohko zam

[obtuse shoal]

is it max atk?

[obtuse shoal]

my issue with doublade is that while it does have a lot of def, it doesn't have a lot of spdef

so it's not good about quiver dancers, it's good against physicals

but there's a lot that's good against physicals, like moltres

btw, which do you prefer, moltres or xatu?

[radiant rivet]

very different

[obtuse shoal]

I guess you're saying they can be used at the same time?

Magic bounce is just super broken
The thing about abilities like this is that you don't just have to consider what Pokémon you have in front
But also that at any time you can call that defense in

You now hesitate to put rocks because at any point, your opponent will not only block, but throw it back at you

[radiant rivet]

now I would just say they will different roles

you wouldnt compare ttar with zam would you?

[obtuse shoal]

Of course not

But yeah xatu can deal with status
Moltres can deal with physical attackers

So the only thing that's missing is dealing with special attackers

[wooden marsh]

hello! Sorry if I'm interrupting something, I just want to ask whether there's a list of rules for the metagames available somewhere or like ban lists, etc? I'm just completely new to this and only used to regular ladders with way fewer mons 😅

[obtuse shoal]

some moves are banned, those get red when you hover over them
v-create, shell smash, double iron bash, boomburst, baton pass, accuracy lowering, sun+chloro, rain+ss, sand and sand rush are allowed though

some ubers are banned, volcarona is one of them

[wooden marsh]

makes sense tbh lol

[obtuse shoal]

not really

[radiant rivet]

really?

[obtuse shoal]

volcarona would be only decent

imo

which is why I want a suspect test of it

[tiny wadi]

No they aren’t?

[wooden marsh]

hm, noted

[obtuse shoal]

it also means the meta is pretty much insane

[radiant rivet]

they are

[obtuse shoal]

we have ultra necrozma allowed and no one uses it

[radiant rivet]

you cannot use them in IF DEX OU

[wooden marsh]

oh wow

[tiny wadi]

Yeah they’re not allowed

[wooden marsh]

are there like viability ratings written anywhere?

[radiant rivet]

there is anaconyas tierlist

[wooden marsh]

and are usage statistics out?

[tiny wadi]

No

[radiant rivet]

some old ones

[obtuse shoal]

genesect fell down from ubers and I really don't see it

[radiant rivet]

it appearently is pretty decent with chomp

[wooden marsh]

got a link?

[radiant rivet]

I agree with most of their takes

[obtuse shoal]

we should pin that somewhere

also this one
https://infinitefusion.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_Move_Expert_Moves

[wooden marsh]

thanks! I'm very happy to see parts of the fusions I was already making high up there lol

[obtuse shoal]

forretress in F, oml

volt switch, with rapid spin in one

and a slow volt switch to boot

[radiant rivet]

it does kinda feel a bit passice

and struggles do spin sometimes

[obtuse shoal]

add tangrowth to it, with knock off

[radiant rivet]

well but growths best fusion is jirachi

[obtuse shoal]

and it gets regenerator

but why, because of uturn?

[tiny wadi]

Was this while boomburst was legal? I hardly see sylveon now

[obtuse shoal]

sylveon is uu

funnily enough

[tiny wadi]

Makes sense

[radiant rivet]

you would have to ask them

[obtuse shoal]

there's also the case that some pokemon just only work with one other pokemon

ursaring works well with dragonite
ursaring gives guts, dragonite gives roost and extremespeed

alakazam is mostly seen with electrode because the fusion gets access to mind blown, but without any recoil

[obtuse shoal]

sylveon can be used for rapid spin, or with dragonite for the fairy espeed

[radiant rivet]

chomp/ursaring is a menace and should never be underestimated

but I admit that ursa is quite limited in its options

[wooden marsh]

is there like any data on specific fusions?

commonly seen ones at least

[obtuse shoal]

no data, only vibes

[wooden marsh]

gotcha

[obtuse shoal]

well, we have some data, but old data

a bunch of changes happened

a bunch of ridiculous pokemon are underused

[wooden marsh]

with so many out there it's almost guaranteed lol

[obtuse shoal]

I will tell you a tip, and it's to watch out for burns

[wooden marsh]

hm noted

[obtuse shoal]

I'm using a steelix moltres fusion, for the flame body, because it stops so many things

[wooden marsh]

gliscor fusions will be getting a lot of appreciation then

[obtuse shoal]

uturn, all priority except vacuum wave (which only lucario fusions would have, and no one uses fighting type fusions)

or just general setup sweepers, with shift gear and swords dance. I just burn them, roost, roar them away, uturn out

weather is also infinite

[wooden marsh]

sounds quite nice, especially with such a slow uturn

[obtuse shoal]

and eviolite works with only 1 of the mons being not fully evolved

so enjoy your dusclops pyukumuku abomination, with eviolite

[wooden marsh]

explains the doublade being S tier

[obtuse shoal]

it also gets spectral thief

[wooden marsh]

oh that's nice

[obtuse shoal]

while it is pretty good, since the spdef is actually quite low, I think it's outclassed by moltres

it's got flame body, recovery, pivot, and wisp

[radiant rivet]

doublade is physically bulkier and can reverse sweep if you let it steal and SD for example

[obtuse shoal]

ok didn't think about the reverse sweep

it's got priority too

[radiant rivet]

it can do stuff moltres would dream of

[obtuse shoal]

they both can
moltres can handle knock offs

and uturns

[radiant rivet]

but blade can spinblock and force out physical attackers that moltres cant

[obtuse shoal]

yeah electivire is kinda scary for moltres

[obtuse shoal]

ok, the worst of both worlds

[radiant rivet]

a nightmare for 90 % of phys attackers I guess

but it is worthless against stuff like Ursanite and MeloPentei

[obtuse shoal]

ursanite still hates things like sand

just steels and ghosts give it a hard time

so if you bring in magnezone and pursuit...

[radiant rivet]

steels is a stretch

[obtuse shoal]

I'm feeling like
Tyranitar scyther
Alakazam electrode
Moltres
Sandslash

Is a really good sand core

[radiant rivet]

you mean regitres right?

[obtuse shoal]

You could go regitres
Or steelix for more defense
Or aggron, for some reason

[weary burrow]

Does anybody know if using amnesia or nasty plot in shield form, grant more spatk after switching forms?

[tiny wadi]

nasty plot iirc

[tiny wadi]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=scarletironfist-serpexnessie-1742075125627

pain

[obtuse shoal]

what do you think of the grass fairy fusion?

instead of fairy psychic

[tiny wadi]

the poison quadruple damage scared me off it

[obtuse shoal]

when's the last time you got hit with a poison move that wasn't toxic

steels are so everywhere, the only ones who use poison are stab

[obtuse shoal]

hey @odd kiln
As most likely the best player in this server
what do you think is a pokemon/fusion/combination most players are sleeping on?

[radiant rivet]

toxitar often runs pjab or gunk

[hexed umbra]

Thats a poison type

[radiant rivet]

indeed, and its one of the most common fusions in the tier

[obtuse shoal]

Yep
But it's the only Mon that does

[radiant rivet]

but a special attacker being Quadweak to one of the most common walls isnt great

[hexed umbra]

Poison Jab isn't that hard to switch into

[lost galleon]

In fact, it's extremely easy to switch into

Seeing as steel types and gliscor fusions are everywhere

[radiant rivet]

Yes but in the case of clefable/celebi being 4x weak to one of the best special walls stabs is a notable weakness

the equivalent would be a scarfer not outspeeding alakaode or a boosting sweeper that gets hard stopped by unaware.

[wooden marsh]

On a semi-related note, what are some other special walls you'd recommend?

[radiant rivet]

lets see...

Probably the trio of jirachi tangrowth, Toxapex tyranitar and slowking donphan.

Slowking hydreigon is also a threat and a nightmare for any sun team

[obtuse shoal]

I like tyranitar scyther with eviolite

[radiant rivet]

oh that thing eats special hits for days

[obtuse shoal]

It takes a nuke and then roosts it off

[radiant rivet]

what eviolite + sand spdf boost does to a mf

[obtuse shoal]

It takes more damage from hazards than from super effective hits

The other weather setters wished they had a way to be as useful

[radiant rivet]

Politoad does have scald

and torkoal is slower and has spin

but its tough competition

[obtuse shoal]

Yeah, but tyranitar I have a reason when I want to bring it in

The other ones are pretty princesses that can't get their nails chipped

[radiant rivet]

damn what are you fusing them with?

[wooden marsh]

Oh noted, slowing hydreigon kind of surprises me tbh, what's its niche?

[radiant rivet]

a quad fire resist and a slow pivot

[obtuse shoal]

I'm trying a lot of things
Celebi, dragonite

[radiant rivet]

politoad celebi is great

[obtuse shoal]

Not as great as tyranitar scyther, that's the point

[radiant rivet]

honestly I dont think so

[obtuse shoal]

What moveset would you recommend for it

[radiant rivet]

Uturn rocks scald recover

[obtuse shoal]

Stealth rocks, scald, uturn, recover?

[radiant rivet]

wow we think similar thoughts

[radiant rivet]

its usually run with av

[obtuse shoal]

Well, if alakazam is gonna mind blow things, I don't know if I'd like to throw it at the thing

[radiant rivet]

the rain nerfed mindblown will do jack

[obtuse shoal]

Ok I'll give a try

Tyranitar scyther takes a volt switch from it and he's like "HIT ME HARDER YOU PUSSY"

I never thought I'd like a weather setter so much

[radiant rivet]

tbf what else would you ask from a weather setter?

brings in abusers, has longevity, switch in oppurtunities and it isnt even passive

the only "weakness" it has is rocks

[tiny wadi]

To die, please

[radiant rivet]

suicide leads are also a thing

[obtuse shoal]

They seem pretty hard to use here

You need to bring strong nukes

Interesting that when I thing of grass types in-game, I think of venusaur. But when I think of grass types competitively I think of celebi

It's so versatile it can do basically anything

Also tangrowth, because it never dies

[potent trellis]

@alxwes... nooo the guy I just faught isn't here :(

[tiny wadi]

Dragororus (Dragonite) @ Choice Band
Ability: Refrigerate
Fusion: Aurorus
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

• Extreme Speed
• Dragon Claw
• Superpower
• Waterfall

getting some success out of this but probably once the surprise factor wears off it won't work as well

[radiant rivet]

this thing looks like it hits hard

[radiant rivet]

since you sac a mon you can bring in sweeper that couldnt enter the field normally, meaning said sweeper can fully invest into its offenses

[obtuse shoal]

Like who
Zam electrode?

[radiant rivet]

was thinking more like jynx galvantula

[tiny wadi]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=serpexnessie-scarletironfist-1742174315105

suffering

[obtuse shoal]

really close game with fabian
https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=illusion911-scarletironfist-1742180847665

[obtuse shoal]

You came pretty close to killing

Twice

[tiny wadi]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=cheetosquid-0rc4n0s13-1700177335594&format=gen7&player=q
turns out you can go through older stuff and wow I wonder why geomancy is banned

[hexed umbra]

It turns out that being able to use 2 Quiver dances in 1 turn is really really good

[obtuse shoal]

I think this thing would happen with just 1 quiver dance too

[hexed umbra]

Not the triple rock

[tiny wadi]

Triple rock?

Also what are some good spinners

[hexed umbra]

Slowbro/Donphan

[tiny wadi]

how do I stop him I hate him

[radiant rivet]

depends on the set of his.

But using magic bounce to deny spikes seems like a good idea.

Jiragrowth threating the OHKO on it is also neat but it might not want to switch in.

Snorcor with curse does not care about anything this fusion can do.

[tiny wadi]

I have come up with a very stupid and impractical method

Lopchomp (Lopunny) @ Pecha Berry
Ability: Klutz
Fusion: Garchomp
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

• Switcheroo
• Earthquake
• Body Slam
• Crunch

Anyway back to the drawing board

[radiant rivet]

its hillarious ill give you that

[lost galleon]

I mean, I guess?

Why Garchomp tho?

[hexed umbra]

I guess just becaue its a physical ground type

It would probably work better as a steel fusion that way you can't get poisoned (frees up ability slot) and you bait gliscor in even more

Since this slot is kinda wasted anyway, you could run Dhelmise/Scizor for some (terrible) role compression; it gets recovery, passable bulk, priority, rapid spin, spinblocker

[odd kiln]

this strategy is less effective than knock + swap natcure or even knock + purify

bc if you get knocked youre screwed

[lost galleon]

It’s been a while but every Gliscor fusion I ever saw was running Protect specifically to stuff knock off

Do they not do that anymore?

[radiant rivet]

roost seems more usefull if you can slow pivot into gliscor to procc it

[radiant rivet]

AITA for purposfully stalling a choice looked opponent out of PP?

[hexed umbra]

Knock Off to remove the Toxic Orb, and then purify/skill swap to remove the current poison

[obtuse shoal]

interesting

[obtuse shoal]

also pivot

[radiant rivet]

https://pokepast.es/e09fb4cb8dd33f32

does this look like fun?

[obtuse shoal]

2 unawares, 1 magic guard with rapid spin, 1 defogger...

and hydrei only does spite...

with pressure!

[radiant rivet]

I think Scald is the play on suicune

[tiny wadi]

You should throw heal bell on Umbrigus

[radiant rivet]

good idea

[tiny wadi]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=scarletironfist-jamesrhee1208-1742329102907
comeback

[tiny wadi]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=scotty8-scarletironfist-1742334230411
it seems like parting shot doesn't switch if it doesn't lower stats

[tiny wadi]

never do this again https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=afjkooafafa-squidchuckswood-1742340172039

[radiant rivet]

considering that I won, i think I am on the right track no?

[tiny wadi]

not worth your immortal soul

[radiant rivet]

after you froze me for 8 turns straight, peace ceased to be an option

[tiny wadi]

oh that wasn't me I started observing on turn 114 or so

[trim ridge]

Watching 2 stall teams is a nightmare

[deft oasis]

only one of them is stall; the other one is sand balance

[trim ridge]

Watching a stall team is unpleasant *

[radiant rivet]

but you did watch it

[trim ridge]

Over the entirety of my lunch break, yeah

[radiant rivet]

was it worth it?

[trim ridge]

I know that I'll want to build teams exclusively to take down stall teams

[radiant rivet]

You are welcome to try

but stall is nothing if not persistent

[trim ridge]

I believe it,

I'm also extremely new to competitive, so I've got an uphill fight on that one

[radiant rivet]

best way to beat stall is to join stall in order to find out about its workings

[white elm]

peak teambuilding-

[obtuse shoal]

I'll be honest

I didn't understand what was going on

All I saw was like

Nobody can put up hazards
Nobody can boost sweep, it's all just tickling each other enough for it to matter once

"I wonder which one of these is modrift
The guy with some offensive mons, or the guy using pressure Moltres and spite as an actual move"

[radiant rivet]

i literally posted the spite team before in here

It is suprisingly effective.
Most players just instantly forfeit once they realized what my gameplan is

[orchid field]

quick question, whats better? download or adaptability?

[radiant rivet]

Depends honestly.

Adaptability boost isnt ignored by unaware making it good on mons fusions like typhlosion or blasttoise since they wanna click their stabs most of the time anyway.

Dowload boost applies to coverage as well, meaning its better if you have many attacking options.

Tld dr Adaptabilitty for breaking, download for sweeping

[orchid field]

i see

ty

[livid inlet]

can anyone give me a rough idea of how to properly use the showdown feature for battles and trade?

?tag showdown

[frosty yarrow]

Infinite Fusion's Showdown Server: https://play.pokeathlon.com/

[manic trail]

you can battle on that website. it's not connected to the game at all. there's no trading.

[wooden marsh]

I was looking for water-immune mons to fuse with entei and apparently flygon gets dry skin here??

I feel like I accidentally stumbled into gold

• this thing could have levitate so they have no idea which of your 2 weaknesses you're immune to (tho let's be real, it's almost always running the scald immunity)

banging sprite too

or damn it could also run levitate with this set in teams without good hazard removal

[radiant rivet]

it is decent on sand teams, but dry skin making your matchup into sun worse kinda sucks

[wooden marsh]

it does indeed kind of hurt, but on the flip side it's incredible vs rain

[deft oasis]

the sun matchup doesn't seem too bad imo; provided that you can pivot it in safely, you're still doing a lot of damage with sun-boosted, banded sacred fires even against resists

[wooden marsh]

To be fair that would have been the case even with levitate instead of dry skin, but yeah, it's not going to complain about a sun boost to its stab

[obtuse shoal]

So how does one punish knock off

the closest thing I've found was to use moltres' flame body

But then I found another issue in that I can't toxic those mons anymore, so if they have regenerator it's a pain

on top of that, knock off can still be a pain to deal with even if they're burned

[cedar mortar]

from what i hear its taken care of with rough skin and rocky helmet cause it takes a lot of health off of the mon. unsure how reliable it is though

[radiant rivet]

you dont.

or you have a designated knock absorber like poison heal gliscor or stick hold muk.

If you do not have a designated knock absorber you must sacrifice one item on your team and make that mon you new knock absorber.

As for the regen problem...
Spikes are probably your best bet if you can fit them in, otherwise having slower pivots means their regen tanks cant bring in their offensive threats safely making them kinda awkward to use

[obtuse shoal]

Spikes are kind of a niche option

You see it more on stall teams

[radiant rivet]

then the alternative option for you is stacking burn with sand and other chip like uturn.
If you deal more than 33 % to regen they wont recover that

Or you invest into a wallbreaker like togeking

[obtuse shoal]

Yup
There's also that turn 1 knock off

You might have to force protect on gliscor just for that

[radiant rivet]

it is an option.
Or you just have a mon that doesnt care too much bout losing its item

[obtuse shoal]

Another interaction that happened to me before was slowphan using knock off turn 1, I changed to my regitres, and burned it

But that made it immune to toxic, and since I couldn't make enough chip with sandstorm I couldn't damage it too hard

And it was still dangerous because of spin, knock and scald

[radiant rivet]

dont you have an alakazam electrode?

with a very strong eball

[obtuse shoal]

It was hard to switch in, because you don't want to eat a knock off, and I would need a very slow pivot

And I think it was vested

[radiant rivet]

it would still kill through vest

you could set rocks, predict the spin and switch zam in on the spin

[obtuse shoal]

They might have had a toxitar too

How's that for combos

[radiant rivet]

togeking

with nastyplot

and even against zam they have to win the 50/50 if you go volt or eball

except they cant afford to lose their slowphan so they always swap to pex, witch you volt and bring in slash as a response

[obtuse shoal]

it's this one
https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=vcbubdub-illusion911-1740338471559&format=ifdex&player=illusio

they also had tangrowth jirachi

alakazam was under a lot of pressure there

[radiant rivet]

i am flabbergasted you let your zam get trapped and got away with it

but on the turn gliscor got knocked couldnt you have send in clefable?

as for turns to procc poison heal.
the porygon z had no way of statusing you reliably

[obtuse shoal]

Clef is just anti sweep precaution

I didn't even know it was scarfed until the end

[radiant rivet]

no i meant that pory z cant knock nor can it status your gliscor in any way

meaning you could swap it in, take a hit and activate your orb

[obtuse shoal]

It's not the first time I did it
I knew it could live a pursuit and kill it back by spamming mind blown

[radiant rivet]

good call from you.

but yeah gliscor would have been vital here and it getting burned was a death sentence

do you not have recovery on gliscor?

[obtuse shoal]

No
I took it off to slot defog

[radiant rivet]

i dont think you can afford to drop roost on it

[obtuse shoal]

yeah, at min protect

because at least that will help me against those turn 1 knock offs

Honestly that seems to be the way here, turn 1 knock off spam

[spice moon]

You just lost The game

[obtuse shoal]

Well yeah, but was it a skill issue or a team comp issue?

[gray sky]

Uh quick question...... I moved my files from one computer to the next, and I now have no save file... Halp?

[odd kiln]

#tech-support

[gray sky]

Missed that channel, thanks

[quartz ember]

where is showdown link?

[obtuse shoal]

Pins

[radiant rivet]

dont know who wants to hear this, but it is possible for clefclops max def with eviolite to 1v1 a banded adamant max attack rampardos clicking headsmash. you take 60- 71 % dmg on the first turn, where you burn it afterwards the rampardos can deal 30 - 35% to clef meaning you might be able to survive and heal up via softboiled.

so if you want your physical attacker to be able to 2 shot clefclops it just needs to hit it harder than max attack adamant choice band STAB boosted Headsmash coming of a 165 base attack stat, easily doable

[radiant rivet]

and if one wants to get a clean 2hit on jiragrowth (with neutral dmg) they need to hit as hard as specs adaptability max spa modest hurricane porymoltres with an spa stat of 131, dealing 53-63 percent to max hp max spdf sassy AV jiragrowth

[wooden marsh]

wow lol

[radiant rivet]

i am starting to understand why people like HO

[umbral sable]

How do I get the game

[trim ridge]

The game with the story or showdown with the online battles?

[umbral sable]

Showdown with online battles

[trim ridge]

https://play.pokeathlon.com/

[untold rapids]

why did you not link Showdown? I am just confused

[radiant rivet]

because Infinite fusion isnt on showdown but pokeathlon

[untold rapids]

oh odd

I thought it was

[wooden marsh]

Nuh-uh (Umbreon) @ Eviolite
Ability: Prankster
Fusion: Murkrow
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Parting Shot
• Roost
• Haze
• Thunder Wave/Defog

I'm really liking this little guy

[radiant rivet]

wouldnt Umbreon klefki be a strict upgrade?
Why use murkrow specifially, Umbreon does get moonlight for recovery if you want it

[wooden marsh]

mainly for eviolite

[odd kiln]

murkrow has access to prankhaze

[radiant rivet]

makes sense I for some reason thought Umbreon got it

[umbral sable]

How do I get the regular fusion version?

[hexed umbra]

Wdym by regular fusion version?

[wooden marsh]

ngl when you said klefki would have been an upgrade I thought it got haze too and I just missed it lol

[umbral sable]

Like if I was playing omega Ruby

[obtuse shoal]

it's also got recovery

[radiant rivet]

still think screens are better than haze, tho
also fairy dark is a better typing than dark flying defensivly

[hexed umbra]

Do you mean how do you play Pokemon Infinite Fusion itself? Check #downloads

[lost galleon]

Well, Umbreon/Klefki can't bring Defog either, but I question the usefulness of a hazard remover weak to sneaky pebbles

[hexed umbra]

Klefki learns Defog

[lost galleon]

It does? I thought that was bird exclusive. Yeah then Klefki is probably always better

[radiant rivet]

grantend setting screens and then defoging them away alongside hazards does feel counterintuitive

[wooden marsh]

Imo they have different use cases, if you switch this in to set screens and parting shot they get 2 free turns to set up even further and overpower your screens. Haze shuts that down, no questions asked

[radiant rivet]

but is umbreon Mukrow good at taking unboosted attacks?

like what does an Ursanite Espeed do to it?
or a zam life orb mind blown.

A Thousand arrows from sandorous?

now you gave me the idea to combine screens with unaware.
thx for that

[snow cairn]

Pretty sure mind blown is a psychic move which does nothing to dark types

[hexed umbra]

Mind Blown is fire lol, it's the signature move of Blacephalon

[snow cairn]

Ah

Fair then

[lost galleon]

Also Alakazam/Electrode doesn’t Mind Blown it

It just drops a super effective STAB thunderbolt

[radiant rivet]

if it even runs Tbolt, but I was asking since Mindblown is stronger stan STAB Tbolt so I am curious if Umbreon/Murkrow can tank this, since it will roost with priority and lose its Flying typing

or theyll prankster parting shot out

[obtuse shoal]

thoughts on power trip?

only krook can learn it

[odd thorn]

combos good with krook's moxie

needs something else to help it set up, of course

[radiant rivet]

terryfing on Baton pass teams, but Krok doesnt have the bulk to naturally gain mulitiple boost in order for Powertrip to start dealing big dmg

I would much rather abuse Kroks intimitade alongside parting shot for a defensive pivot

[wooden marsh]

Ngl I'm not sure but I'll definitely run some calcs (soon ™️) cause these are very valid points

[minor bear]

Does anyone know if there is a way to add our own sprites in showdown before they are added in the game?

[hexed umbra]

No, there is not

[lost galleon]

It’s not stronger against a flying type, which Umbreon/Murkrow is

[rich turret]

is there anywhere that i could see the list of bans from Ubers, without having to manually search for what abilities are banned etc.?

[hexed umbra]

Theres some command that I can't remember, but it would be nice to have that list pinned in this channel

The question gets asked daily lmao

[molten mason]

I wasn't able to find Ubers, but /tier ifdexou works!
(Im working on a spriter event where we use Showdown, that why these people are asking lmao)

Wait, there is no ban on pokemon? Uh

[wooden marsh]

with split defenses (252hp/252def/4+SpD) (ursanite, alaode, lifeorb sandorus)

with specific defenses (252 hp / 252+ at relevant defense) the matchup becomes way better, but you're still quite hurt as a switch in by the rocks weakness

(I'd also like to note that it'll never be a good idea to switch into a +2 ursanite to haze it, as Espeed outspeeds prankster, so you wouldn't just take an unboosted attack there)

[radiant rivet]

you could tank a Tbolt from zam better since you could roost to lose the flying type with priority

meaning the opponent has to hit you with 5 mind blowns on zam to get the kill through you spamming roost

[wooden marsh]

certainly, but the only reason to switch this into alaode would be to haze any calm minds it's done, you'll eventually have to haze instead of roosting

[obtuse shoal]

Thoughts on tangrowth forretress?

I feel like it's better than jigrowth

[wooden marsh]

feels like a similar comparison to corv vs skarmory, imo

one is a better pivot thanks to wish + doom desire, one is better for the hazards with spin + spikes

[hexed umbra]

Jigrowth has u turn
Pivoting plus regen is worth it alone

[wooden marsh]

forre has volt switch too

[deft oasis]

I agree with Aevilok, they serve different roles: Jigrowth is quite common as an AV Pivot, while Tantress will have trouble doing that due to its considerably lower SpD

[radiant rivet]

its outclassed as a spinner by slowphan since slowphan treatens ghost more with knock scald and Ep/Eq.

But its volt will be harder to stop if it runs grass STAB

[obtuse shoal]

Tangrowth also has knock

[radiant rivet]

but not scald

[odd kiln]

all uber mons are banned

[molten mason]

I see... I was wondering why they didnt list it
I guess there is a separate list for them or something? sorry, im not that well versed with showdown

[unique pulsar]

guys do i run unaware or clear body

[radiant rivet]

for what purpose?
unaware is to stop set up sweepers.

Clear body is to prevent your sweeper from having their stats dropped (like from intimidate)

2 very different thingz

[unique pulsar]

nvm ima go with unaware

its on a bibarel/klinklang so i dont think i can do a lot with clear body

[brittle zodiac]

Does anyone want to do a cage lock or a Versus in pokemon infinite fusion Let me know if you're interested 🙂

[hexed umbra]

Have you tried asking in #playthrough-talk ?

That channel would have more people interested in playing the actual game

[keen summit]

So is multiplayer a thing now?

[odd thorn]

not in game

you can pvp online, but it doesn't directly interact with the game at all- you just plug in data and it works

[keen summit]

Oh

Is there any word on if that's coming

[odd thorn]

it is not

the engine does not support multiplayer features. A player has shown that trading- while finnicky- is technically possible through a third party server, but in it's current state it's unlikely to be added as an actual feature

[keen summit]

Damn alright thanks tho

[pure breach]

While this is technically true, there is an NPC on the top floor of Pokémon Centers that allows you to export your current team to Showdown

[wooden marsh]

I feel like someone must have found this already because it's the only way to boost speed + attack with simple outside of smeargle or ddance, but it actually seems pretty ok:

• Outspeeds alacaode after a flame charge,
• Hits like a truck after a power-up punch,
• Recovery with assault vest and not-horrible bulk,
• Mew's swiss army knife of a moveset (and 3 priority move options)
• Spectral thief immunity (as with every bibarel fusion)

typing sucks aside from spectral thief immunity and it likely prefers non-stab moves, but it seems surprisingly ok for a bibarel fusion

(on paper)

[odd kiln]

seems comically weak

gets chopped by intim and setup blocked by ghosts and even at +2 is probably walled by general physdef mons

[hexed umbra]

Complete lack of stab on an offensive mon is wild

[deft oasis]

One of the biggest appeals of using Mew as part of an offensive fusion is its access, among other things, to Photon Geyser, which lets you ignore Unaware; this fusion is still pretty bad regardless but you can make it better

[radiant rivet]

also mew got QD

[wooden marsh]

honestly yeah, I have no doubt mew has better use cases, still think this is noteworthy

[wooden marsh]

unrelated, but asking since I'm still very new here, is automatic timer considered bad sportsmanship here? (since most people likely won't be next to their pc when the match starts in a long queue time)

cause like I've played 6 games till now, 2 of which have ended before the first round due to my automatic timer

[deft oasis]

Your time is worth just as much as your opponent's; if they don't make it in time then it's not your fault

[obtuse shoal]

volcarona suspect test when

[mossy violet]

🙏

[manic trail]

had some fun randbats today

[obtuse shoal]

Personally I feel like the meta is at a good place rn

There's some broken wall breakers, but they're checked by broken walls, or they get trapped

[obtuse shoal]

Aren't walllbreakers here really dependent on not getting knocked

Nidoking, alakazam

[brittle zodiac]

Does anyone want to do a cage lock or a Versus or a lock out or a soul Link in pokemon infinite fusion Let me know if you're interested 🙂 :0 Text me And If you don't know what Some of the stuff are, I will explain it 🙂

[sharp lake]

how do i battle people

[odd kiln]

?tag showdown

[frosty yarrow]

Infinite Fusion's Showdown Server: https://play.pokeathlon.com/

[sharp lake]

ok thanks

[radiant rivet]

I would like to give my takes on the meta in the survey but my winrate is too ass

[faint bluff]

y is the download hack io

[brittle zodiac]

Does anyone Want to do a VS Nuzlock in pokemon infinite fusion Let me know if you're down And if you don't know what it is I will tell you

[tranquil spear]

How do I verify myself in the Pokéathlon?

[radiant rivet]

what are the chances of zapdos regaining Static?
I do believe that it could help stopping Uturn chains of Regenpivots better than Moltres ever could

[delicate gull]

In the Pokeathalon discord server there is a verify channel where you can put in your showdown username

You can find it in latest news on pokeathalon showdown

[obtuse shoal]

I guess it might be a better way to punish knocks

The full paralysis chance is so uncompetitive though

Neither you nor your opponent will know when it happens

[hexed umbra]

Theres always gonna be rng in pokemon

[sharp lake]

how do i battle after ive got my team saved on website

[wooden marsh]

go to the home tab, choose a format, choose your team and click the big "Battle!" button

[radiant rivet]

https://replay.pokeathlon.com/#replay=aevilok-dfigsr-1743365081945 could they have won this?

[wooden marsh]

honestly I don't think my team had what it takes, at some point I felt like my only hope was to literally just cheese an important KO with murkrow's prankster destiny bond that I hadn't revealed

also I'm surprised you saw this whole thing, it was so huge lol

[burnt gate]

#verify

Hey anybody feels like doing a battle?

I just wanna try out my team 🙂

[obtuse shoal]

You see in the first ones how knock off completely screwed you over

[radiant rivet]

i saw that cause it was me you were fighting

[tranquil spear]

https://pokeathlon.com/, it says Invalid Invite

Broken link?

[delicate gull]

It’s definitely not broken all of the links on that works rn for me

[wooden marsh]

Makes more sense lol, wp

[obtuse shoal]

Yeah that makes sense
You have so many alt accounts. Do you keep forgetting passwords or what

You're also the best xatu user I've ever seen and a good way to show its power

[wooden marsh]

For real, the only way for me to have kept stealth rocks there would be to somehow constantly threaten xatu

(Or so it felt)

[obtuse shoal]

Having volt switch on your rocker to counter xatu in specific is funny

Huh
Stunfisk is interesting

Btw, how good do you think lando T would do in this meta

[radiant rivet]

Jirachi/lando sounds fun

96/93/93 bulk with intimidate recover, uturn, knock and rocks?
Could also go scarf with its 94 base speed and raqequit many players with serene grace Iron head.
Or it might just be a doom desire/ wish pivot

On the other hand you would have Landaxorus with 146 attack, 95 base speed further boosted by Dragon dance that Unaware cant ignore thanks to moldbreaker

[obtuse shoal]

So haxorus

I thought landorus was useful for the utility though

And role compression

[radiant rivet]

it is usefull for that, but it also has 146 base attack EQ

[obtuse shoal]

I don't think it's enough attack for regitres to be scared

[radiant rivet]

you realize 3 things :

1.Not every team has regitres

2 if regitres is so ubiqutos the user of landoxorus can use teammates to get rid of you.

3 Regitres needs to survive either 2 boosted attacks or 3 with a lum bevor it has shut lando down. (How much would a stone edge do to it?)

[brittle zodiac]

Anyone want to do a Versus or a cage lock in pokemon infinite fusion Let me know if you're interested please 🙏:]

[fallow slate]

am i trippin?

[wooden marsh]

thoughts on this fusion? magic guard fire type seems incredible for a pivot, with decent SpA burn up, and great knock absorbing capabilities

it's unfortunate that you lose access to a good flame body mon for fusing, but not every team will want one

[obtuse shoal]

what makes that better than normal clef?

[wooden marsh]

just the goated typing and better offensive pressure for a pivot

oh and u-turn lol

also the perfect switch in to enetta

unrelated but I just hit top100 for the first time

(first time in any ladder lmao)

not that I've been in many ladders

[true wedge]

What are the stats?

Also, Clefcune seems like a generally more reliable Clefable fusion if your goal is to deal with Enetta specifically.

[weary burrow]

Why dont alts show up on Pokéathlon?

[wooden marsh]

basically sliiiiightly above clefable bulk with 115 SpA

[wooden marsh]

Clefcune is certainly an incredible fusion, but it's also not a pivot, unlike this one

[true wedge]

Hmm - well it seems pretty decent, but also I’m having a hard time seeing it be very productive in battle. The bulk is good but not great, and it doesn’t offer a ton of utility outside of pivoting. Idk, I think I’d have to see it in action lol

[wooden marsh]

very valid

[hexed umbra]

I would run Flamethrower or Overheat over Burn Up

[wooden marsh]

imo having the ability to become a pure fairy type when you're expecting something with ground type coverage to switch in is a bonus, and you don't get the 10% miss chance from overheat either

[hexed umbra]

Ground immunities arent too hard to come by

Though it does lock you out of Regitress lol

[wooden marsh]

yeah, i'd say not having moltres available for a flying type is one of its main drawbacks imo

good pairing with gliscor though, gliscor can cover its ground weakness and this covers its ice weakness

and now you have 2 status immune knock absorbing pivots

[wooden marsh]

unrelated: how do y'all deal with thousand arrows? I've started using a sandslash and basically haven't seen a single defensive answer to it yet, only being outsped by a scarf mon really did anything against it

[manic trail]

i wonder if there is a bug with destiny bond or i'm just missing something. opponent used dbond and i ko'd him but it didn't kill me. forgot to save replay tho

[true wedge]

My team’s normal answer is Drifblim/Gliscor with Strength Sap, Wisp, Knock, and U-Turn. It’s only neutral to Thousand Arrows but that’s enough to avoid a 2HKO from Thousand Arrows. Outrage is a little scary if it’s choice locked but it makes for easy predictions. I can also go my hail setter Milotic/Aurorus to take Thousand Arrows and reset weather if I need to. It’s not perfect but it gets the job done most of the time.

252+ Atk Choice Band Sandslash Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Drifblim: 222-262 (48.8 - 57.7%) -- 54.3% chance to 2HKO after sandstorm damage and Poison Heal

252+ Atk Choice Band Sandslash Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Drifblim: 168-198 (37 - 43.6%) -- 99.5% chance to 3HKO after sandstorm damage and Poison Heal

Oh, and I have Ice Shard on Mamoswine/Garchomp if they’re SD and I read the switch

[opaque inlet]

clefclops or Clefblade with unaware would stop it but most other physically defensives unaware mons should be able to stop it as long as it doesn’t get statused and/or chipped by hazards before hand

[maiden solar]

Is anyone else running into situations where the movesets they build in Showdown are impossible in the game?

Specifically, I'm pretty sure you can't get Umbreon to learn Foul Play in IF. I had a few more, but that's the only one I remember off hand.

[manic trail]

it's because technically umbreon can learn foul play from a tutor, it's just that there's no such tutor in the actual game

[maiden solar]

Oh. I don't suppose there's a plan to add that tutor in a future update?

[manic trail]

no idea but i would guess probably not. there are a lot of tutor moves that don't have a tutor.

[maiden solar]

That's disappointing. Thanks for clarifying.

[fast elm]

I think the reason those moves are in is bcos they can be obtained in the randomizer

[wooden marsh]

Honestly if anything they should be added to the game lol

Foul play is one of umbreon's most common moves in the main games, and I assume the same is likely for other tutor-only moves that IF is missing outside of randomizer

[hexed umbra]

For any potential Sheer Force action, shouldn't it be Nidoking instead?

None of the other Sheer Force users are good enough for discussion (except potentially Nidoqueen, which is slower and weaker)

[odd thorn]

The humble Rampardos:

I think Feraligatr could also be a good choice, a sheer force STAB Waterfall isn't bad

[hexed umbra]

Other Sheer Force mons exist but they aren't nearly as good

[odd thorn]

care to explain why you think that?

Like I don't disagree that some of them aren't very good

[radiant rivet]

I think its because Nido just has insane coverage between Boltbeam as well as fireblast and the fantastic ground typing.

It makes walling nido far harder than the physical Feraligator and Rampardos, both of which can be ruined by burn.

[odd kiln]

thing is if you ban nidoking nidoqueen is basically the same thing but with a little less speed

[radiant rivet]

and a lack of power.
For example togequeen needs to go modest to oneshot Max HP Max Spdf AV jiragrowth, while Togeking can do so while timid

[runic oak]

I get that ability clause is helpful for more generic abilities like Regenerator and Toxic Heal, but it could really hinder more restrictive abilities like Serene Grace, Technician and Guts

[radiant rivet]

I honestly dont see it.
Regenerator is special since its so synergistic with itself.
The same goes for magic guard.

Meanwhile Technican guts and sheerforce are just dmg buffs that dont really benefit from being stacked on a team.

Like why would you run 2 techinican mons over 1 technican and 1 adaptability for example

[wooden marsh]

Exactly, and for toxic heal you basically have to run breloom to get a second one and that's it

[runic oak]

Weather teams are a pretty good example where you often have to run a few Swift Swim/Chlorophyl Pokemon.

[wooden marsh]

Those are banned, unless you're using manual weather for a team

[runic oak]

True, but that's only because weather is unfortunately still permanent in IF

[cinder acorn]

I really hope they don’t ban quiver dance. My fav mon to use is Clefew

[runic oak]

Now that I'm thinking about it, I could probably leverage Beat Up + Stench as a replacement for my second Serene Grace user. Will probably make the team a lot worse off in UU though

[cinder acorn]

I suppose I agree with that. Regenerator and magic guard definitely need action. But more one-off abilities probably don’t need the hit

[cinder acorn]

Referencing this

[runic oak]

Its definitely one of those cases where the existing framework for Smogon bans doesn't work well at all.

[cinder acorn]

How so?

Can’t it just be considered a complex ban?

I know there isn’t a restriction in normal showdown play but it needs one here due to how teams can be optimized

And unpredictable

More so than usual

[runic oak]

You could add complex bans, but its not something we've never seen in normal Pokemon since it would only limit specific abilities. Would actually like that quite a lot honestly

[odd kiln]

lack of power is overestimating the difference of 3 spa

its also just not true 252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Togekiss Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Jirachi: 380-452 (94 - 111.8%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

[odd kiln]

clefew is one of the reasons why qd is being scrutinized

[cinder acorn]

Oh well

The meta is terrorized by steel types anyway

Shift gear is a thing

[odd kiln]

clefew has two coverage moves for steels

[cinder acorn]

Plenty of steel spam teams running rain

[odd kiln]

and shift gear is limited to a bad mon

[cinder acorn]

People just use priority moves like they have been. Im bad at team building but I still don’t see how clefew is so bad

Explain this

[odd kiln]

clefew has the bulk to live neutral prio

at +1 there are very few mons who can take a lor + ep + fire blast besides unaware (who can get techd by photon) and regenvest/eviolite

[cinder acorn]

I run a fully defensive set that uses light of ruin, draining kiss, plus a third move usually being flamethrower

And ofc Qd

[odd kiln]

thats just a worse set

[cinder acorn]

Oh I’m sure

I also don’t see people using it much when I play

The Mon

[radiant rivet]

found the difference :
Togeking can run timid and OHKO Jiragrowth with rocks and flammethrower.

Togequeen cant

[odd kiln]

is this supposed to be a convincing argument for something

[radiant rivet]

nope

[odd kiln]

blunderstandable

[radiant rivet]

i just wanted to prove that I didnt lie.
But I shouldve been more spefic

[odd kiln]

i didnt think you were lying lol

but i dont see a reason to use timid in the first place for either fusion and if it needs to run fire blast over flamethrower to hit an ohko it will so the point is moot

[radiant rivet]

But timid means you win the 1v1 vs other nidos so king being able to run timid and threaten a crucial ohko (rocks arent uncommon in my eyes) while Queen cant is a noticable difference

Since the against queen the Jiragrowth can be used as a damage sponge once to allow another regenarator to recover enough to tank a hit and then KO it back whilst allowing you to keep both regens.

The king forces an excecution

[odd kiln]

what is more important, winning a 1v1 when you could just use your own check (assuming its prevalent enough where youd have to run your own check) or getting valuable 2hkos/ohkos on actual walls

youre also still restricting both to using flamethrower

if flamethrower doesnt ohko then itll use fire blast

[radiant rivet]

I do think guarenteed losing the mirror match up is a big deal with such an unstoppable sweeper that importantly gets OHKOd by itself, meaning the opponent after losing one mon can force the 1v1 which the slower nido has to run from/or get Revenge killed, meaning you now have to survive its nigh uncountrable onslaught.

Fireblast over Flamethrower is also unique for togeking, since the target fireblast is supposed to hit, Jiragrowth can absolutly ruine it if it misses (either knock of leafstorm Ohko ) whilst also being a vital target to hit means its the worst time to be clicking an inaccurate move

[radiant rivet]

that is a cost tho

[odd kiln]

it doesnt get ohkod by itself

and i already said if the mon is prevalent enough to consistently cause mirror mus then presumably youre smart enough to have a check in the back

[radiant rivet]

do most nidos not run Icebeam?

[odd kiln]

i dont see any reason for running ice beam

[radiant rivet]

yeah my fault, stuck in the past, when snorcor and rhycor were more common Ice beam was also more present

[odd kiln]

if youre arguing that fire blast missing is some genuine point against nidoqueen when any move into flamethrower still 2hkos so the only situation where its relevant is when jigrowth is full hp on a slow pivot/sack then idk what to tell you

just hit ig

[radiant rivet]

that sounds like the thought process of someone about to be 1v5d by a lone toxapex

[odd kiln]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/510822432802734080/984227735306113024/kurdupelek.GIF

[lost galleon]

How is fire blast or flamethrower going to help against a Toxapex? Pretty sure either way it's gonna eat it up.

[wooden marsh]

They were talking about jiragrowth, not toxapex

On an unrelated note:

What's your favorite breaker? I'm looking to change things up in my team and want to see fusions I haven't thought of

[radiant rivet]

Probably Mew/Machamp.

The combo of guts boosted photon geysers and Close combats was scary to face

[obtuse shoal]

Alright so for quiver dance.
I noticed it can be matchup dependant.

There's no general quiver dance counter, and any unaware can be broken with the right dancer

[radiant rivet]

Most QDs share a weakness to priority

except for chandebi

but that one gets smoked by tyranipex

[obtuse shoal]

Priority can be countered with Moltres though

[radiant rivet]

it means switching and giving up your boost

so a win for the priority user

the dificulty lies in getting the priority user onto the field safely.
As most QDs can punish a raw switch hard with immediate power from light of ruin or lovely kiss

[ivory lantern]

Hey, is there any way for me to see how y'all added stuff to showdown?
I'm trying to add mons from another hack for us to play on showdown ourselves, and I'm not entirely sure how to go about that.

[odd kiln]

thats not a counter

[radiant rivet]

i didnt say it was, i said most QD user are vulnerable to priority since it ignores their speed boosts, if we do want to suggest counters I wouild put ttar pex up there as one of the best ones since does beat celebi/chandelure and any clef/mew that arent modest pretty easily. It does lose to jynxgalvs lovely kiss with enough bad fortune tho

[odd kiln]

do you have to ping me when ur replying to the most recent post

[radiant rivet]

fair enough

[odd kiln]

jynx galvantula is mid af bc even with sleep turns you still dont do enough dmg

toxitar loses 1v1 to hymega and jynx nidoking

[radiant rivet]

i agree with these statements

[wooden marsh]

Honestly I've been having a lot of success against QD with prankster haze, and it's also been an incredible tool for many other setup sweepers there's good reason it's common in hackmons after all

[odd kiln]

the problem is that the best prankhazers are frail and/or passive

[radiant rivet]

you are using aegislash/murkrow right?

[wooden marsh]

Yeah, it is unfortunately passive as described

Though foul play has been doing wonders, most QD mons are either weak or neutral to it either way

[odd kiln]

but they min atk so thats doing little dmg

[wooden marsh]

Definitely, but it's usually doing more than their photon geysers are doing in return

[odd kiln]

why would they use photon on a steel

0- Atk Aegislash-Shield Foul Play vs. 0 HP / 0 Def clefmew: 62-73 (18.6 - 21.9%) -- possible 5HKO

[wooden marsh]

That's the point, aegikrow resists both of clefew's STABs and the other common QD's are ghost type

[odd kiln]

clefmew uses coverage for steels

[radiant rivet]

what if they have flamethrower?

[wooden marsh]

I usually just destiny bond tbh

[radiant rivet]

i guess that works.

could lose to taunt hymega sets

[wooden marsh]

Very likely, good thing I've never seen one yet

[obtuse shoal]

yo someone made a really cool sprite of steelix moltres

how do I make it exist in the showdown

#sprite-gallery message

[hexed umbra]

Wait 2 months

[obsidian ember]

how do i battle my friend with our fusions

[obtuse shoal]

btw would shaymin sky be broken if it fell down from ubers?

[lost galleon]

I don’t think it’s about it being broken I think it’s about it being really, really annoying with the 60% flinch chance on something that is nearly impossible to outspeed

[hexed umbra]

It can sometimes beat checks by flinching them to death

And as usual, regular Shaymin sucks

[odd thorn]

[radiant rivet]

could someone explain how beat up works here?

Like does each hit use the attack stat of each individual member of your team or is it just 5 hits with low base power?

Does Stab apply? (from the user of beat up and the other mons)

[wooden marsh]

Reading its Bulbapedia entry, the way I've seen it play out in game seems fitting for the gen5-9 description:

• Uses the user's Attack stat
• Affected by user's modifiers (swords dance, choice band, technician, everything)
• BP reliant on each party members' base attack stat

[radiant rivet]

thx

[wispy folio]

Guys, anyone to test my ou team?

[wooden marsh]

So, I've been trying to get the 6th mon for my sand team right, and I'd like to get a lot of role compression with it, currently looking for a sanity check on the concept most of all:

The mon I want should:

• Defensively: Be a good switch-in to ground moves, not have much issue with hazards, and preferably also be cabable of pivoting
• Offensively: Improve the stall matchup

I'm currently looking at this:

luster purge is for taking care of unawares that would want to take care of it after boosting, it resists or is immune to the stabs of the most common special walls, but I'm not sure whether it's good enough

for example toxitar can probably tank its dragon pulse without much issue and dragon tail it away

(oh leftovers should have been soul dew)

I'm also considering uturn instead of recover (in which case it should indeed get leftovers), but I'm not sure how pleasantly it would double as a pivot (in games where I don't need it for stallbreaking)

another mon I'm looking at is this:

Cons:

• 12% hazard chip
• Reduced healing due to moonlight + sandstorm,
  Pros:
• Hits toxitar super effectively (will it even matter enough though?)
• Better unaware answer
• Insane bulk with natural defense and +50% SpD from sandstorm

[deft oasis]

Toxitar is Poison/Dark, so it is neutral to Fairy; even at +6 this thing only barely does 30% max with Dazzling Gleam to max SpD AV Toxitar, who in turn always deals more damage with Knock (even with no item) than you can heal with Moonlight in Sand

[wooden marsh]

oh whoops somehow got it mixed up with dark/ghost lol

so yeah that's probably not a very good mon for the things I want

[odd kiln]

some unaware mons have cm so thats not feasible and even if they dont luster purge is a 70 bp nonstab move with only 8 pp so youre not breaking through unaware anytime soon with it

[wooden marsh]

Hm very true unfortunately

[lost galleon]

This is Gliscor. You've just straight-up described vanilla Gliscor

It pivots. It doesn't care about hazards. It's immune to ground even if the ground has Mold Breaker. It can make stall miserable by refusing to die, ignoring toxic, and having Knock Off.

[wooden marsh]

That's gliscor in the base games but I'm not sure stall really minds it much here there's almost no way for it to break stall, especially if it has u-turn

[hexed umbra]

SD Snorcor

[wooden marsh]

If the stall team you're facing has no unaware facade resist it's likely a bad stall team lol

[hexed umbra]

Snorcor is still extremely valuable as a status/knock absorber with great longevity and a wide movepool

Though if you aren't running SD/Facade there might be a better gliscor fusion

[carmine tiger]

Hello I wanted to ask for some advice. Me and my friend are playing as rivals fighting each other once per week on fridays before we take on each gym. We're currently at Ceruleon city gym and this is my team

My current team is
Carbink / Umbreon (Rock / Dark)
Mawile / Dhelmise (Fairy / Ghost)
Shedinja / Lucario (Bug / Steel)
Azumarill / Hitmonlee (Water / Fighting)
Magmortar / Tangrowth (Fire / Grass)
Electavire / Shiny Yanmega (Electric / Flying)

I got screens and stealth rocks, wish passing and rapid spin
We fight before we take on each gym, once every week
And next up is Misty, so I can't really go anywhere
Ah we're playing remixed

Can I have some advice how I can make this team better? I feel like right now I have a tendency to have pokémon who are too slow. And take into consideration that this is all before 2nd gym.

We don't have a lot of rules other than keep to the level caps in the game. And try to not exploit the game, since its pretty easy in its current state to get things you are not quite supposed to have

Like Sun stones, but DNA level manipulation a phanpy to level 31 and getting sun stones on pickup

Level cap is 25

[lost galleon]

Level cap 25 and you already have Magmortar, Tangrowth, and Electivire?

[carmine tiger]

Yeah!

Magby and Elekid have 5% drop on magmarizer and electrizer

Tangrowth can learn ancient power by being fused with

ugh

Bonsly? I think I used

Since we are hyper optimizing this game till it bleeds we gotta get everything we can get

Which is also why yanmega also could evolve

I used a sudowoodo in the first fight by getting mimic from mime jr.

[hexed umbra]

Thats an absolutely cracked team for the second gym

[carmine tiger]

I know. But im still scared I've missed SOMETHING

Having shedinja on before the gym is scary, but since I have a wonderguard pokemon who is only weak to fire

but Im scared of the counterplay, especially since we have entry hazards on the table now

[hexed umbra]

If you run Shedinja, defog is mandatory

[carmine tiger]

Does Rapid spin work on a sheer force pokemon?

[hexed umbra]

Or magic bounce, which is technically possible to get but good luck HA hunting

[carmine tiger]

I lost the previous battle cause I had a leviate poison type to soak up the toxic spikes..

How would I get magic bounce? Only espeon has it right?

Anyone else?

[hexed umbra]

Eevee which is in the secret garden and xatu

[carmine tiger]

I can only get a sun stone by glitching a phanpy to level 31 and using pickup

since we are at 2nd gym

[hexed umbra]

How would you glitch past the level cap?

[carmine tiger]

DNA manipulation, you take a slow leveler and a fast leveler and slice them together

Sometimes, one ends up at a higher level

Not sure how it works honestly. It only works sometimes

But I have an Espeon already with that method just to see if it worked >_>

Just took a few hours

and yes im very dedicated to this xD

[tiny wadi]

mega pokemon :3

WAIT

@carmine tiger XATU

[carmine tiger]

Yeah but there are no xatus before 2nd gym right?

[tiny wadi]

Tru

[carmine tiger]

Or natu

[tiny wadi]

And the only others are

The hatterene line

And

Mega absol mega diancie mega sableye

[carmine tiger]

Same fusion twice sometimes make a mega?
I know its mostly aesthehtic but im thinking if the abilties are affected at all

[tiny wadi]

I WISH

[carmine tiger]

Sableye is accessable afterall

I think double gyardos fusion makes it water dark?

[tiny wadi]

Does it???

[carmine tiger]

I could remember wrong though

I think i read that somewhere

[tiny wadi]

itd be cool if fusing two pokemon that can become mega

[carmine tiger]

I only have access to one gyrados. Could you try it out for me?

[tiny wadi]

become mega pokemon

[tiny wadi]

Im at work :p

[carmine tiger]

Do it anyway <3

[tiny wadi]

no <3

[carmine tiger]

<3 :[

[tiny wadi]

go to smogon

[carmine tiger]

It does not :I

Thanks good idea

[tiny wadi]

@carmine tiger Combine espeon and gyarados for fire blast espeon

[carmine tiger]

I would but I still cant get espeon :I

2nd gym only

I can only get a sun stone by glitching

[tiny wadi]

get Xatu

[carmine tiger]

From? T_T

[tiny wadi]

@carmine tiger Get. hatterene (:

[carmine tiger]

From? T_T_T_T_TT_T_T_T_T

Im stuck at 2nd gym, I CANT GET ANY OF THOSE T_T

[tiny wadi]

combine gyarados and geodude

[carmine tiger]

Why? xD

[tiny wadi]

graveller for defense! and intimidate

isnt water ground nice too

what type is the second gym

[carmine tiger]

Oh I think we might be on a different page than each other

Im at 2nd gym, the game isnt the problem here

My Real Life Rival is my problem

[tiny wadi]

Huh

[carmine tiger]

Each friday we fight each other before we take on the gym

[tiny wadi]

ohhh

[carmine tiger]

See this

[tiny wadi]

I USED TO DO THAT AS A KID

[carmine tiger]

Thats my team

[tiny wadi]

WTF

LMAO

[carmine tiger]

I KNOW ITS SO MUCH FUN

[tiny wadi]

i thought i was the only one

waow

[carmine tiger]

The reason I needed Magic bounce is to protect my Shedinja Lucario

[tiny wadi]

Yeah

No u not gonna get it

So simply

Send out shedinja lucario first

[carmine tiger]

I have rapid spin on my Dhelmise Mawile

However, it is Fairy Ghost so it has a few weaknesses

and sadly, no ghost moves

I think the Dhelmise Mawile is currently my weak link

Dhelmise is non negotionable though since it has rapid spin

[tiny wadi]

yeah

idk uhh

Since lucario shedinja has only

One weakness

u should send it out first

Just to weaken ur rivals team

[carmine tiger]

True. It has some really good moves as well

sadly its slow, but power up punch and fury cutter can be a lot to handle this early on in the game

since it gets it snowballing

[tiny wadi]

what other moves do it got

[carmine tiger]

I sent you a pm with pictures and abilities

[true wedge]

Out of curiosity, is there a reason you want Rocky/Fairy for Carbink/Umbreon instead of Fairy/Dark? The swapped version has better bulk and (imo) a better defensive typing.

[carmine tiger]

Yeah.. but the sprite is so good

[true wedge]

That’s a fair reason, I was just curious lol

Do you have sets decided on for your guys?

[carmine tiger]

I can send my sets in a bit. But most of them are close to final.

I'd be supet happy if you could take a look in the remix page and tell me if dhelmise has any better fusions that work with my current team.

[carmine tiger]

Sorry for the wait

[true wedge]

Alright, I’ll try to sit down and take a closer look at what’s available to you later today after I’m done with work.

[odd kiln]

yes

in gen 8 it wouldnt get the speed boost but in all gens it removes hazards regardless of sheer force

[odd kiln]

idk ingame but your team does indeed look too slow to take full advantage of screens
if you can learn qd on yanmega or sd on shed thatd take it to the next level

also if you dont have light clay its probably not worth the effort of setting screens

[carmine tiger]

I can't get qd on yanmega yet. But sd I can get. Which move do you reckon i should remove?

I can either use Dhelmise or Donphan fusions for rapid spin. Im not sure what to do :I

[odd kiln]

over uh pup probably

well it is your fighting coverage actually

can you get stronger moves

[carmine tiger]

Nope. Im at 2nd gym stuck until me and my IRL rival fight :)

[odd kiln]

oh

then remove fury cutter probably

[carmine tiger]

Are we still talking about the shedinja lucario?

I dont think I have any better options. and with an SD the fury cutter should stack up decently

[odd kiln]

i figured bug isnt a good offensive typing but maybe you can get rid of sneak instead

[mellow mural]

hiii anaconja

[true wedge]

I'm a little curious on how you got some of these moves (specifically Giga Drain and Light Screen) on your Pokemon, from what I'm seeing they're outside your level cap.

Also, I'm gonna strongly recommend you swap the head/body of Dhelmise and Mawile. The other is Steel/Grass and has the option to double up on Steel STAB with Steelworker if you want. Keep the moveset though, it's fine.

[carmine tiger]

Me too. Im also curious. Sometimes when you unfuse and fuse shit just seem to appear. My jirachi lost its psychic and then it came back. I got giga drain on the tangrowth somehow and im so fffing scared of unfusing it or reversing it

[carmine tiger]

I know it would be a great idea if jirachi or dhelmise actually got any steel moves. And im already dipping into the fire weakness

[carmine tiger]

I think im going with this for my last pokemon

[carmine tiger]

I had a Yanma that after fusion could learn ember from the relearner. Im honestly completely lost how the system works.

[manic trail]

it's a bug with unfusing

after unfusing the other pokemon remembers which moves it had before and the relearner can give them back. then you can fuse it again with something else and keep the bugged moves. basically you can give any move to any pokemon.

[wooden marsh]

My goofy ass just ran this pokemon in a match:

clicked curse trying to set up

was very unhappy

though I guess it can be an ok combo with shore up if you don't forget how ghost curse works lol

[true wedge]

Doesn’t Mawile already give Iron Head?

[carmine tiger]

Sorry i think i meant ghost type move

[odd kiln]

holy crap if bh

[gritty anvil]

That fusion was in the Big Boss finals, it was one low damage roll away from winning the whole thing iirc

[frail inlet]

Does Stance Change function in Showdown? Aegislash/Shuckle seemed to be dealing a lot of damage but when I hovered over it its stats weren't changing.

[wooden marsh]

damn rly? what are the Big Boss finals? I assume it wasn't run with curse tho lol

[wooden marsh]

it does yeah, not sure if it's displayed

[hexed umbra]

It was one of the tournaments to decide one of the new batch of mons

Basically you had one 'boss' fusion, and then the rest of your team had to contain a prevo of the boss

It was not well explained

[wooden marsh]

oh nice sounds interesting

[obtuse shoal]

thinking about xatu

and where it fits in all this

it's good because it basically makes the whole team status immune

within reason

so it can make bulky mons not fear toxic, or fast mons not worry about hazards

[obtuse shoal]

it's not that good for bulky sweepers that aren't immune to toxic though

[radiant rivet]

its biggest strenght is denying hazards imo

[obtuse shoal]

thoughts on quiver dance volt switch

[radiant rivet]

so you boost up, only to pivot out and lose your boost?

if the last 2 slots dont have perfect offensive synergy it might seem like a waste.

[soft wedge]

don't play pokemon showdown, but that is an absurd sp def stat

[radiant rivet]

it is absurd.
hence why it isnt even allowed

[polar atlas]

oh theres rules on certain fusions?

[hexed umbra]

Once again we really need the banlist pinned

Off the top of my head the banned pokemon are chansey, blissey, regigigas, slaking, regular uber mons (except genesect)

[polar atlas]

yeah those bans make sense lmao

[wooden marsh]

and a volcarona that has been unjustly banned 😔

[obtuse shoal]

Because I quiver dance, and then they bring in an answer and I feel like I wasted my boost because I can't even pivot

[obtuse shoal]

Don't worry, there's plenty of broken stuff here

[polar atlas]

oh im sure lmao

like im sure aegislash/shuckle after a couple shell smashes is totally balanced

[obtuse shoal]

Shell smash is banned

And stance switch only turns base stats, not boosts, which is why aegi runs sd

[polar atlas]

fair

anything about this combo banned?

metagross/dhelmis
ability: steelworker

using anchor shot and iron head, its boosted by stab, boosted by steelworker, and have it hold iron plate, making it effectively base power 216 with eiither iinability to escape or 30% flinch chance as secondary effects

or maybe even heavy slam (not sure how weight wworks in fusions)

considering its slow speed gyro ball could also do work

between it having rain dance and its fire weakness itd work insanely well on a rain team

though it doesnt get any physical water moves from what I can tell

im honestly curious if theres anything banned about that, cause if not, itd be REALLY mean

[opaque inlet]

This combo is perfectly legal

It’s just outclassed by Jirachi+ Tangrowth Defensively

[polar atlas]

yeah its definitly a not a ssuper bulky mon, but I think inn trick room itd be a really solid swweeper

[hexed umbra]

It's a mon I've seen before, it also gets Bullet Punch

It's bulky enough to set up an SD on bulky mons comfortably, but suffers from 4MSS (it really wants Synthesis, SD, Bullet Punch, Anchor Shot, Power Whip, Knock)

[obtuse shoal]

Well one of the mons I like to use the most is steelix moltres

[radiant rivet]

why not use a move that helps you get past your checks?

[hexed umbra]

Then they aren't checks

[radiant rivet]

then i guess the best qds dont have checks?

[hexed umbra]

Theres no catch-all move here, we would need to know the mon

[soft wedge]

just for the fun of it, what would be the best fused mon to just self destruct and wipe out the entire team in doubles

[polar atlas]

probably electrode/porygon-z for adaptability stab explosion. it has 250 base power then adaptability STAB doubles it to 500, and depending on if it uses gen 6+ mechanics or not, it may half defense.

[hexed umbra]

It doesn't halve defense, that was changed in BW

[wooden marsh]

I just saw this thing in a pinkacross video:

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/showdex-an-auto-updating-damage-calculator-built-into-showdown.3707265/page-25

does anyone know if it also works on pokeathlon?

cause like this seems incredible in mainline games for reducing the barrier of entry, but in pokeathlon it is even better cause I won't have to take 10 hours adjusting stats for a single calc

[manic trail]

i tried adding support for IF to showdex and it kinda works but it's pretty scuffed and the showdex devs haven't responded

[wooden marsh]

Ooh "kinda works" is probably a good start

How can we access it? Just adding showdex normally?

[manic trail]

https://github.com/doshidak/showdex/pull/222 the code is here. for now the only way to use it is to build it yourself.

[wooden marsh]

Nice, will definitely do!

[wooden marsh]

I want an opinion on my latest fight against Modrift's triple regen stall, it is the closest I've come to beating that team:

https://sim.pokeathlon.com/replays/aevilok-dfigsr-1744474254162.html

They forfeited (I assume due to real life responsibilities) but I think there was a real possibility I'd win legitimately

Could have I? Or do I need an adamant Sandslash for that?

[radiant rivet]

you lost once the slash went down

like your gliscor and murkrow dont do shit to me.
your celebi will forever be hard walled by my xatu.
Your hydraking will never get past my two AV slowtwins
and the jirachi is just free turns for me.

I do like how well you grinded down my Gliscor with rocks and constant switching.
well done (although it didnt work)

[radiant rivet]

I do understand why you use scizor (to hit clefclops i guess?)

But this fusion does make your sand v sand matchup much worse

[wooden marsh]

Hm I think you're right for most of these, but I feel like I could have managed to kill gliscor if I didn't let it heal to full before starting the constant switches. The nido had nasty plot so if gliscor was dealt with the twins would be very unhappy against 3 mons with knock that can constantly switch

[wooden marsh]

You're also right about the sand vs sand matchup but I feel like the rest of the mons can handle it decently, though the main reason I chose scizor is the 130 attack + U-turn access (steel type is a bonus for resisting most common priority moves)

Honestly, I just hope I actually manage to pull off a win some day against that team, it will feel incredible lol

Especially now that it's threatened by the looming ability clause, time to get revenge is running out

[radiant rivet]

what makes you think I would let the twins out against anything that wasnt nido?

As for the constant Uturning, thats what I have spikes for

[wooden marsh]

Hm very true, unfortunately for me

[radiant rivet]

tbh the biggest issue seems to be the xatu for you.
Nearly half your team cant touch it.
Most importanty your rockers cant

[wooden marsh]

100% yes, but at the same time they're already suffering from 4mss

I wonder if I could/should perhaps fit a probopass fusion for magnet pull volt switch and make it outspeed the xatu

Or somehow find a different tyranitar fusion that can actually deal with that without being horrible in everything else

Cause like ever since the addition of the nido the team has gone completely unbeaten before this match so the basic formula is definitely working

[obtuse shoal]

Yeah it's why I talk about xatu in the same way as moltres

but honestly I think it's just modrift

you could try to trap it

steel is just the best typing rn, too many good things

So magnet pull is absolutely worth a slot

[wooden marsh]

definitely considering it tbh

[obtuse shoal]

thing is, xatu isn't limited to steel

It can go dragon, it can go diancie

btw nice on that gliscor diancie fusion

[wooden marsh]

oh I shouldn't take credit for that, awakensmash (pokeathlon handle, dunno discord) took my team with permission after we fought and made a few changes, one of which was this fusion

completely different set but it is indeed a great find

[obtuse shoal]

Idk about great, I feel like it's a better use of diancie than gliscor

simply because gliscor is op by nature

[wooden marsh]

I'm really enjoying its bulk, it can sit and tank nonstab scalds and ice beams for days

[obtuse shoal]

like you don't really improve on it, you just customize it

[wooden marsh]

oh for sure

[obtuse shoal]

I'll be honest, without trapping I have no idea how to deal against modrift, except for freeze dry

and even then it's pretty hard with clef and toxitar

you can try nidoking articuno

[wooden marsh]

dunno if that would change things much tbh, and it sacrifices a lot of speed for access to that freeze dry, might drag down other matchups

[obtuse shoal]

that freeze dry is like super busted

a lot of types rely on it not existing

ground water, dragon water

grass water

also is it just me or the power level of the server has gone bonkers. I was like top 10 and now I'm losing every game

Alexa play viva la vida

also, the ice type is mostly countered by the water type (since the only things that resist it are ice, water and steel)

but a lot of the times steel is worried on the physical side, water becomes a weaknesses and no one uses ice

the only things left become eviolites, but with some rocks or knocks it's manageable

[wooden marsh]

I'm now top 4 tied for 3 despite only being here a month so dunno how it was before 😛

honestly, I've done very well with scarf hyking in the past

perhaps it's time to try scarf articuno nidoking

cause it truly is unwallable by most common walls

[obtuse shoal]

You were able to wall me

By a celebi

[wooden marsh]

well, rock/grass is definitely not a common wall typing in infinite fusion lol

[odd kiln]

it is when the best uturner to pair with ttar is celebi

[wooden marsh]

just means you need some other way to deal with tyranbi

[radiant rivet]

thank you?

[obtuse shoal]

https://youtu.be/bNzBAWdkWfw

You're the server's great wall

[hexed umbra]

Glory to big stall!

[radiant rivet]

Ive realized the problem with that one.
It is very very weak.
Base 91 spa for a nidoking fusion is abysmall here

Even at modest it can barely managa a 2hit ko against a phys def clefclops

[obtuse shoal]

Yeah nidoking doesn't have that high of spatk

One could try tailwind nasty plot

Or webs nasty plot

[radiant rivet]

neither articuno nor nido learn nastyplot

not even Calm mind

[wooden marsh]

I'm thinking nasty plot grass knot togeking might be interesting

walled by xatu but since it doesn't get whirlwind or something perhaps that's not too big of a deal

[radiant rivet]

why not put flammethrower/fireblast on it?

oh right plot.
doesnt it get walled by jiragrowth then?

[hexed umbra]

What does Grass Knot hit? It's not sheer force boosted

[wooden marsh]

the ground waters, and it's 120bp against slowphan, higher than even sheer force earth power

[wooden marsh]

not sure how well jiragrowth tanks earth powers, but likely yeah

[deft oasis]

If there's anyone seriously thinking about using Articuno/Nidoking (please don't, it's pretty weak), you should at least consider using it in Hail so you can use Blizzard over Ice Beam to make up for the lower SpA compared to other Nido fusions

[radiant rivet]

the goal is to use freezedry tho

[deft oasis]

Freeze Dry is incredibly weak against anything it's not super-effective against; it's better to consider other scenarios because otherwise using a Nido fusion slot just to be a Freeze Dry bot is too much of a waste (hence why I recommend against it)

[hexed umbra]

Tbf you aren't clicking Freeze Dry if it isn't super effective, with ice/ground (fire/electric) coverage to hit the majority of mons

[manic trail]

guys is palossand/spiritomb supposed to be type swapped? it's ground/ghost ingame but ghost/dark in showdown

[hexed umbra]

If you have in-game screenshots, post it in #1175117403219308654

[lost galleon]

I think Nidoking-Articuno is probably not the best freeze dry attacker you could get? I don’t know who the best would be but my gut says it’s not this.

[wooden marsh]

The available options are Articuno glalie and aurorus, imo aurorus is good only in case you're building a hail team. Articuno is either good for a bulky pivot (in which case freeze dry will get incredible value as a threat) or it's going to be used as an answer to common walls

Artiking is probably the best you'll get for the last case

[polar atlas]

I was actually wrong here, an ursaring electrode fusion with guts and flame orb does more, though it requires helping hand to ohko the training dumby I used for dmg calcs ((arceus max HP max DEF)) it gets normal stab, and its atk sstat is 33 higher, and guts is decent work, so basically youd want it to come out, protect for a turn, get burned, and blow up 2nd turn, youd also maybe want a ghost type mon beside it with possibly helping hand or something like that so it can increase the dmg and not die itself

then ofcourse spent everything not spent in atk EVs for electrode in its bulk so it doesnt get outsped and ohkd

[wooden marsh]

why electrode instead of a stronger explosion mon like metagross?

[polar atlas]

honestly I wasnt sure what other mons had explosion so just went with electrode mostly for speed

but yeah its probably a different think, ill brb

((btw Im using ursaring cause I presume regigas and slaking are banned, theyd def be better than ursaring))

Ursaring is still better unlesss im missing something

(first is ursa, 2nd is porygon z

wait

forgot to give the porygon one proper typing

thats better

porygon-z/metagross is the strongest explosion user I could find

though since if you bring it its such an obvious play its liable to do 0 because people protect

but it has plenty of room for other super good moves, aslong as its not a normal type move ((dont wanna prematurely eat the normal gem)) it should be unlivable to your enemies unless they have a defensive MONSTER

and it gets power up punch or sharpen to raise its physical ATK to make it even less livable

at plus 6 atk and helping hand, I dont think even a super bulky ssteel type could live it

[radiant rivet]

loses to lv1 gastly, Unviable.

No but fr you might wanna pair it with a wobuffet ghost fusion to trap the opponent and punish protects with encore

so you need a ghost that has helping hand and maybe feint?

[polar atlas]

funnily enough ghastly line is in the running for half the mon to run beside this

[radiant rivet]

wait what about imprison protect?

Will it work?
Probably never.
But damn if it wouldnt be funny that one time

[polar atlas]

Dusknoir/hitmonlee has Feint, helping hand, imprison, and protect all as moves lmao

wait, actually, gallade by themsself gets all those moves lmao

[radiant rivet]

But you need a trapper.
So wobuffet or dugtrio

so wobuffet/Galade?
Youll die to your own explosions tho

[polar atlas]

Chandelure/ chesnaught, together they get all the moves, shadow tag, and are bulky, with ghost yping

so turn order itd be first turn protect with nuke, chandelure/chesnaught use imprison on one of the mons, second turn, nuke sharpen and chandenaught imprison the other pokemon, turn three helping hand explosion

leaves a bit of an opening into the nuke, but you could replace turn 2 with feint on second mon and detonate there

not to mention, if you end up deciding to run one of the parts of the chandenaught moves, you can give it a solid ghost move to hit the pokemon immune to the nuke

it honestly feels pretty similar to the perish trap strategy lmao

[warm salmon]

snorlax + wailmer + explosion

[polar atlas]

what makes it good?

[obtuse shoal]

stab explosion with high attack?

[polar atlas]

both of the things I described have higher attack and stab

[obtuse shoal]

Honestly I don't think it's a good idea.
It will never kill anyone important

[ebon zealot]

What happens exactly when you knock off a mega stone/red orb?

[odd kiln]

nothing

[ebon zealot]

Okay, just wanted to make sure cause I haven't seen that happen before in non fusion formats

[wooden marsh]

I've built it and it somehow works on regular showdown but not infinite fusion, do I have to do something different to get it to show up on pokeathlon?

[wooden marsh]

so uh unrelated (I assume) but I just joined three battles in a row where my client wasn't making sound and didn't give me a notification, has this happened to anyone before? am I doing something wrong to cause this?

losing above 100 elo to not knowing I got a battle wasn't very fun