Combat Overhaul

[brave canyon]

Huh. That’s probably an unintended fluke due to changes in the damage system?

[finite cosmos]

maybe it incorrectly calculates damage through multiple hitboxes?
like, it hits you once, but mod calculates it like it hit you in three different hitboxes, hence triple the damage

[brave canyon]

That might make sense actually

It's the same issue with the Wildcraft Bushes then possibly. The lack of invuln frames.

Apparently that's fixed in Vintage 1.21 though so

The Lightning might be fixed as well if it is the same cause

[hollow pasture]

If the lightning ever strikes twice, please do take a screenshot of the damage log!

[spring quiver]

hey so is it just me or do the long axes have like

absolutely awful hitboxes

[finite cosmos]

meh, kinda

usable enough and higher damage

[delicate ocean]

they have a sweetspot i believe which takes some getting used to

[finite cosmos]

the axe head

yes

[delicate ocean]

they are good statswise, though them not having a 1h mode is a drawback that made me not use them much

and yeah the axe head can be hard to hit with

[finite cosmos]

no onehanded battleaxes makes me sad and miserable

at least there is enough maces for me to play

[delicate ocean]

the falx kind of fills that niche

with the +1 damage tier

[finite cosmos]

yeah, but falx is not axe

[delicate ocean]

and short range

cant spell falxes without axes :)

i agree however, even if just as a reskin. the falx model doesnt look very good compared to other weapons

[finite cosmos]

i don't like "ready" stance/animation for some reason

i'll have to try to patch'em out

[nocturne shore]

Pierce

you wouldnt use pierce anyway

[hallow bolt]

Slashing is still 7 lmao

[nocturne shore]

well, having weapon that you need to constantly take care to swing with right animation is worse than just using reliable one

Interesting that slashing on enemies went up

i didnt notice that

A lot more 7's

[small tapir]

anyone know what the fix for this might be?

so far 4 different people have gotten this crash semi-consistently, and we can tell its something related to the quivers

it only happens when someones got a quiver equipped who doesnt need to be the one who crashes, since i can wear a quiver and everyone else starts crashing

personally i think its a version mismatch thing but they dont trust me on that and are saying its a weird interact with the Xskill's strong back and the quiver slots causing a crash from xskills seeing extra slots

but i'm also stupid so i cant tell if its actually a version mismatch or what

[nocturne shore]

I might check if unequipping quiver will my friends from randomy crashing around me

Wreidly enough, im the only person with quiver and im not crashing anywhere as often as they do

[small tapir]

same here

i don’t crash at all from this

idk what the fix is but it’d be nice since i wanna use javelins and not have em take up half my inventory

[restive cove]

I've tested it on my multiplayer server, it one shots players unless they're at 35 hp

One shots animals too

[upper ermine]

Can we get springy exoskeleton legs that remove fall damage so my clumsy, laggy ass can fly around with the glider with impunity? ||(Also a rocket pack)||

[hollow pasture]

They almost completely nullify fall damage in their current state

I be taking 2-3 damage at most from 80+ block falls

[upper ermine]

I didn’t know, thanks

Brb gonna zoom around

[hollow pasture]

Also I don't think glider damage counts as fall damage

[upper ermine]

Me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8rViF7V_oA&pp=0gcJCfcAhR29_xXO

[small tapir]

so we still can experience kinetic energy

[hollow pasture]

Yeah I almost died going pretty slow wearing full exo

[delicate ocean]

you can get elytra'd?
never made the glider so i didnt know

[upper ermine]

I never had a problem with the elytra even with rockets, the glider is a death trap

[delicate ocean]

Me either, but I knew somebody who would ram into walls with it and die every 30 or so minutes. He's very experienced with kinetic energy.

The glider seemed really slow comparatively, so I assumed it wouldn't damage you.

[uneven trench]

the trick is making sure you point upward as soon as possible when close to a floor, and make sure you're slow enough when about to hit a wall

[hallow bolt]

BRUH

that explains a lot

I suppose Copper rods are back on the menu 💪

(I keep making bronze rods and forgetting it MUST be specificially copper lol)

[restive cove]

yeah it one shots most players as well as every animal

[hallow bolt]

I get lightning is funny like that but man that kind of sucks

1-shot protection doesn't help vs it either :p

[misty steppe]

Curious, is it possible to disable CO on current save?

[hallow bolt]

I accidentally did and it was "fine"

the weapons and armor I was wearing were black squares which is more than fine

[uneven trench]

you'd get over-durable armor, your co:a weapons would become invalid items, etc.

[misty steppe]

Thanks. Can circumvent that.
Need to test something

[signal vapor]

is there a way for me to contact someone who works in combat overhaul?

because I wanted to ask a question that wasn't answered and it's been about 2 weeks.

[final garden]

Maltiez is taking a break, but @hollow pasture might know

[signal vapor]

gotcha, thank you.

I sent a message in the mod comments and here; never got a response back.

[hollow pasture]

What's up?

[final garden]

Mod comments wont get checked much

I remember Maltiez saying they rarely look at those

[signal vapor]

do you possibly know why ranged damage increase or decrease no longer exists?

even with the modifier it never made a change damage wise and I know combat overhaul does that.

[hollow pasture]

It's due to how Combat Overhaul handles the different damage types

[signal vapor]

is there a way to stop that? because it breaks some modded classes.

[hollow pasture]

Damage modifiers that are made to modify base game values would only modify the traditional hit system

[hollow pasture]

How so?

[signal vapor]

some mods have a ranged class like the Rnager, or an Archer class. it makes the class pointless.

[hollow pasture]

Also, the stats for all classes still include the damage boost stats if you look in the stats for your class

[hollow pasture]

Ask the mod author of that mod to add CO compatibility

[signal vapor]

for melee damage it works, but not for ranged. I tested this thoroughly.

I have made a class mod myself, so I was wondering on how it works.

[hollow pasture]

Probably because the mod author got the most complaints about melee damage or the fact that ranged damage is a little more complicated as it has to add damage tiers together with other damage multipliers and whatnot

[signal vapor]

I remember looking through it how it's multiplier, so is there a way to change that through a trait?

[hollow pasture]

But certain classes should have higher manipulation speeds with certain weapon classes to balance them in a more meaningful way anyways

[signal vapor]

I know the accuracy still works, same with the speed. it's the damage that never gets changed.

[hollow pasture]

Unfortunately I've only made the shape files for CO, no coding, so my knowledge of actually making mods compatible is limited

[signal vapor]

I see, that's unfortunate then.

[hollow pasture]

Maybe see if you can have a specific case where when you use a specific class that it increases the damage multiplier of certain bows by an amount instead?

[signal vapor]

I have a marksman class that takes a long time to pull back the bow, but does not get the damage bonus it should.

[hollow pasture]

I'm not sure how that would work without potential conflicts or lack of compatibility

[signal vapor]

that's what I was thinking, but I don't know how the logic behind that would work.

[hollow pasture]

Maybe lock a new recipe for improved bow types with higher damages to your class?

[signal vapor]

I wish, but I don't know how to do that. I can possibly just make a patch file showing that you need a certain trait to get the bow and change how the damage is.

But, it just limits people in my server of what weapons they can use.

I can probably make a great-bow or something like that for the marksman class.

[hollow pasture]

It would make sense to only allow characters with that trait to USE the bow rather than just craft it, otherwise you'll have people running around with bows crafted by someone else

Wish I could help you more in the coding department

[signal vapor]

I just really liked the idea on how marksmen take a lot more time to aim, but does a lot more damage.

[signal vapor]

I'm not exactly advanced on that type of field yet unfortunately.

I had an idea where marksman has way more accuracy and damage at the cost of firing speed, but I will probably have to change that then.

@hollow pasture do you possibly have an idea when Maltiez is back?

because I wanna see if I could ask for his help on how he did the weapons and damage.

[hollow pasture]

He's had some recent stuff relating to his health recently, though I believe it was intentionally cryptic. I don't think it appropriate for me to pry either, so unfortunately I have no kind of ETA for you.

Best thing you can probably do is lead your well worded criticism with kind words, and always make sure to leave your logs if you're having weird issues

[signal vapor]

alright thank you, I aprreciate you trying to fix the problem I'm having.

just please let me know when he is possibly available if that's alright with you or him.

[tall turtle]

Is anyone aware of any crash issues related to longbow/recurve?

It crashes so hard it doesn't even trigger the crash report, just get smited back to desktop

[wanton zenith]

Ran into the same thing but only on 1.20.11 rc1. Reverted to 1.20.10 and they work without issue

[small tapir]

can someone remind me what the steel tier club/mace are called?

[thin wing]

War hammer

Polehammer for the club

[small tapir]

ty

[tall turtle]

This fixed it, thanks dude

[jaunty willow]

Were you still open to doing more testing for CO?

[hollow pasture]

Depends on if you still have things going that need testing

[jaunty willow]

Was following up on our last conversation about Can Jewelry and Overhaul conflicts like you mentioned, but it seems you popped out of the server and I couldn't follow-up through DMs.

[hollow pasture]

Not sure why. I just sent you a friend request in case that's an issue

[dense cloak]

Is the meteoric iron greatsword based on the Scandinavian greatsword/ oakeshott XVIIIe?

[gaunt moon]

Not sure if its been mentioned, but the iron spear has less durability than the tin bronze spear.

[lyric marsh]

could be intentional

because sometimes bronze is stronger than iron

[sand folio]

is it possible to reenable offhand usabilty while using bows?

[hallow bolt]

not without messing with the code it seems

I couldn't find anything in the jsons

[sinful panther]

Nah

[gaunt moon]

From my looking, its the only weapon like that

[upbeat meteor]

does mod still work on lastest?

[gaunt moon]

Sorta, from my testing I only found the bows to crash the game, but they will 100% of the time crash your game.

[timid tangle]

works just fine for me other than firearms mod

[shut sequoia]

Happened to me right now. It took 3 crashes for me to realize I crash whenever I try to use my bow... No errors, just a brief freeze end the game close

I've waited so long for the stave to dry and wasted leather for the quiver sigh... Welp i guess I'll just /gm myself a javelin quiver instead

Just to be sure it's not other mods issue I moved all mods to another folder (except CO and overhaul lib) and did a test in creative world. Although it took a bit longer than on my usual save I did crashed anyways after spawning myself a recurve bow and shooting a few arrows

[wanton zenith]

20.11 issue, reverting to 20.10 fixes it , hopefully will be patched soon by John Coder

[shut sequoia]

hmm... I guess I'd rather give the bow for now, cause I like the performance uplift of .11. Map loading almost instantly feels very nice

[timid tangle]

yeah reverted back and definetely missing that sweet performance boost

[gaunt moon]

.11 breaks some pretty core mods weirdly. Biomes got hit with an even more fatal break. Big rip because 1.20 in general has been rather unstable. Numbers moving is enough to desync/hitch/rubberband players and the like. .11 is a good step forwards, but it doesn't solve the main issues honestly. Praying the VS devs fix it soon.

[crimson bloom]

CO works with 1.20.10? Had people crashing on my server whenever they wielded a bow, and unfortunately it appears to still be happening on .10

For those who have it working on 1.20.10, are you running latest versions?

[timid tangle]

played all day on 1.20.10 today, no crashes, co is latest version

[gaunt moon]

Its client based, if they upgrade to .11 it'll happen. The server being .11 won't cause it to happen. That said, .10 doesn't have this issue, might be something else messing with it.

[timid tangle]

my musket does no damage to players, is there something wrong with it? crossbows do damage alright

[crimson bloom]

The people who were crashing from the bow/recruve, was it whenever they selected in the hotbar, when they fired, or when they hit an enemy with it? I'm crashing when I hit an enemy, and my log only says

29.5.2025 18:33:20 [Notification] Exiting current game to disconnected screen, reason: An action you (or your client) did caused an unhandled exception

soooo, i can't even tell if it's CO at this point

[timid tangle]

I crashed when selecting it

[crimson bloom]

Okay, I believe that's the bug we were experiencing with 20.11, but now we're back at 20.10 and having a slightly differnt issue with the bows.

[gaunt moon]

For me it was when the arrow landed, hitting an enemy or the ground.

[crimson bloom]

The issue was xskills. After updating xskills to the newest version, the problems went away

[tall turtle]

All of the above in my case, sometimes as soon as I rolled across it on my hotbar I'd crash, other times I could have it out just long enough to fire an arrow

[tall turtle]

Interesting, I don't use xskills.

[faint hearth]

Same behavior with the firearms mod. Maybe it’s the same root issue?

[final surge]

been playing with this mod finally on a server, actually loving it

noticed that throwing spears is weird not sure if thats this mod or a interaction with another

this mod + tool crafting + butchery is such a fantastic combo

[marsh iron]

Weird how so? In their flight path? Javelins were added as a more vanilla analogue to Spears cause CO Spears are also meant to be effective at melee.

That said, I can absolutely agree. CO+Toolsmith+Butchery is an amazing combo

[final surge]

adjusting length and the wind up to throw animation seem to not work together so you go from adjusting to suddenly the spear flying, if that makes sense

[fast light]

does this work for .11 yet? saw some stuff about it breaking the game over onthe mod page

[brave canyon]

-# I’m thinking of possibly getting to work on Weapon integration soon, maybe later today perhaps :P and of course the all-important CO integration as well haha.

[brave canyon]

As far as I know, it works fine with .11, I know a server that’s been running it on both the pre and now the release no problem.

Likely any issues are probably compatibility related.

[flat compass]

My people crash when holding a gun

From co

[austere phoenix]

How is damage quantified when wearing armor? I wish there was a minimum number that could be set. It's no fun taking .1 damage from drifters who deal 7 damage

[nocturne shore]

there is spreadsheet with all that

link on mod moddb page

[balmy tartan]

is maltiez alright?

[final garden]

Not sure, but I think they're taking a break. I hope they're doing well

[balmy tartan]

ditto

[brave canyon]

Same, he's poured a ton of work into CO and I absolutely love it

[timid geyser]

A member on my Dedicated server just got this crash log. happens only when they bring out their bow and it doesn't always crash them (others around sometimes get caught too). But it has caused many crashes.

[restive cove]

Yeah same

[flat compass]

I just asked the same question

[fossil belfry]

Yep, sadly the crossbows, and firearms as well as vanilla bows are causing near instant crashing when held in the hand or shot (if you get long enough to fire one) To anyone nearby and the holder of the weapon. Hoping this gets a fix soon since it so good!

[uneven trench]

I wonder which part of CO broke for 1.20.11

[crimson bloom]

running xskills by any chance? i would check server debug log and look at the startup processes. thats how i caught the compatability issues between CO and xskills

Running .11 on a server with mods is risky business rn

[timid geyser]

we don't run xskills been thinking about it but from some of the other reports i've heard xskills is causing problems too so i won't be adding it anytime soon.

[crimson bloom]

yeah i had to rollback to .10 to get them to play nice together.

[timid geyser]

i should probably roll back the server. also the screenshot does have a list of all the mods we run on the server.

[brave canyon]

Oh, it looks like there is a Pull Request to fix the rendering issues causing the crash on CombatLib. Looks like it was just a small issue with the rendering changes in .11, heh

[placid orchid]

Is that rendering issue gonna be fixed soon or should I try and roll back to .10? I feel bad for the hunter on my server...

[fading narwhal]

I'm pretty sure Maltiez is on a break, so for now it might be best to rollback

[placid orchid]

alright, thanks

[hollow pasture]

Meaning someone already did the work for @fallow surge ?

[austere phoenix]

X skills caused my performance issues

[fallow surge]

I will try looking into it this week, but I'm not in a good enough shape for modding right now.

[brave canyon]

Yeah, take your time Maltiez! There’s no rush.

[brave canyon]

Not exactly. The proper thing to do is verify it before merging, so that still requires a bit of work.

It just means that a possible fix was found, making it easier to do that.

[final garden]

Hope things get better!

[simple comet]

I hope whatever ails you, moves along quickly. Take care of yourself.

And now we have a post to point to whenever someone asks about an update!

[brave canyon]

Haha, exactly.

[marsh iron]

Real Life Always Comes First

[final garden]

@hollow pasture (Not sure if I should ping Maltiez). I think I've got a good first prototype for the silver helmet! I took a few more liberties than usual because I really wanted it to have a more unique shape from the meteoric helmet (Mostly just that the visor covers the whole face, including the eyes, requiring the wearer to look through the holes instead of over the visor). I imagined the impracticality was fine considering silver armour is decorative anyway. As always, I would love some feedback! Personally, I'll probably try different plume angles so that it's a bit more upwards rather than so far back. In keeping with the vanilla game's format, I'm going to make the gold helmet another armet using this design, but will change the plume more significantly

[languid solstice]

I noticed these cool helmets you've posted here before, what are they for if I may ask? :o

[final garden]

I saw Corat and Maltiez discussing adding visored helmets to OC, and Maltiez said they'd add 'em if somebody sent him the shapes/textures. I felt like getting into Vintage Story modding so it looked like a fun thing to do

[hollow pasture]

Historically there are a few examples of armets with visors similar to this, often referred to as "perferatora" referring to the many perforations in the visor. It was a pretty popular option as it offered solid visibility and breathing as compared to older visor types. I think the plume angle looks pretty fancy and flamboyant, but that's just my opinion. You definitely nailed the look of the armet with the visor up as well, covering the edges of the mouth and just barely leaving it exposed to breathe

[languid solstice]

well they look amazing.

[hollow pasture]

Oftentimes it's seen in sport harnisfechten because it's much easier to reproduce with modern tools as opposed to other traditional helmets

[final garden]

If Maltiez isn't feeling up to modding (I'm glad they're taking their needed break) then I'll probably try to figure out the coding myself, since I've written games in C# before and I've messed with the game's JSONs before

[final garden]

I'm glad to hear you like it! I think it turned out really well, so I'm pretty excited

[final garden]

Thank you! I'm so excited for how many people seem to like them

[hollow pasture]

On the right is pictured Dequitem, who is probably my favorite harnisfechten fighter. That style of helmet just so happens to be his personal choice, so I may be biased...

[final garden]

Oh yeah! Those! I wanted to make some of those at one point but felt like it wasn't flashy enough for silver or gold and I have already done the other metals, so I figured I'd go with a more stylized armet

[hollow pasture]

Oftentimes close helms are mistaken as armets because they have a very similar shape, but open in a different fashion. It was not until the early 16th century that the pronounced "mane" that goes across the top of an armet or close helm became prominent, but visor choices were very personal for most knights because something as simple as your own face shape can determine what's easiest for you to use

Dequitem's armor is based around the mid 15th century, so his armet will reflect the style of that time

He's also wearing an extra breastplate because the madman let himself get hit with a Lance in that video and used it for safety reasons

[final garden]

That's wild. The visor thing makes a lot of sense, too

[lofty owl]

Any idea when we get an update to CO?

[brave canyon]

Maltiez responded above. Hopefully this week, but he isn't doing well so he needs time.

[next saffron]

hey, I think you hit the level of detail just on the head! Nice stuff. I actually don't like the plume but yknow
Good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 💙

[brave canyon]

That helmet is goddamn amazing. Though the Plume could be fluffier maybe…

Some of those angles make it look a little flat hehe

[final garden]

I get that! Part of the downside of taking this approach is that I wish it could be more modular so that the plume could be removed/changed

@hollow pasture (Still not sure if I should ping Maltiez or not, so I'll err on the side of caution). Because vanilla gold is just a slight rework of silver, and in keeping with the style, I was able to create the gold helmet super easily! I might want to play with the plume a bit more (including the original silver), but I wanted to get some opinions and much needed feedback! As always, please give me feedback even if you aren't sure how to word it. I'd much rather find an issue that I missed or didn't think of than put something sub-par into the shape

[next saffron]

I do like that plumage more

[final garden]

I think it looks better, yeah

[next saffron]

oh, just noticed...whats with the asymmetry for the eyespots/slits/whatever

[final garden]

Mostly, I saw real world eyespots/slits were often asymmetrical and I thought it looked slightly better (in my opinion)

[next saffron]

or rather is this like, based on a design

i see!

[final garden]

Figured it made some sense possibly. Not sure if this is the real reason, but it would make sense to have one side be slightly less perforated if you're worried about attacks getting into the eyeslit. So in theory, you could have a main side for viewing/breathing on the right, but better protection on the left so that turning your head could save an eye. That's just me theorizing, somebody with real knowledge would probably think that's a silly explanation

[next saffron]

well don't forget that the facing is flipped

like I think I jsut did

[final garden]

I was referring to the wearer's left/right, but yeah

You can see a bunch of them have fewer or no holes on one side

This seems to be more common on the more decorative pieces from what I saw, which works fine since this is for silver/gold

[next saffron]

there's also probably some operating thought of keeping at least one half of your body extra safe just incase the worst happens to the other

[final garden]

Actually, most right handed sword users would probably shift a bit to the right and expose more of their left while blocking, wouldn't they? Not sure. Also might be just confusing people with my odd wording

[next saffron]

oh, if its decorative, its probably 'right is good' kind of thinking

[final garden]

No idea. Would definitely be a good question for somebody more knowledgeable on armours

[hollow pasture]

Historically in combat your left side is the one facing the enemy when holding a polearm or when on horseback in the joust, so there were often less holes to better protect the knight from blades or splintering wood

[hollow pasture]

@final garden I see that you were speculating too, this is the real reason

[next saffron]

right arm back, left arm front?

[final garden]

Oh sweet! That means my speculation was sort of correct

[hollow pasture]

It's primarily for horseback and being in the joust, but there are examples of English knights (who tended to prefer fighting on foot) having less holes on the opposite side

Unless you're stabbing into the eyeslit, which still often was narrow enough to prevent blades from slipping in, the even smaller breathing holes typically didn't need closing anyways

[next saffron]

I'm just asking because I've never had to gore a person (or animal) with a two handed stabbing implement

[final garden]

...so far...

[hollow pasture]

Well think about having to use a pitchfork or other pole-tool

[next saffron]

mhm

[hollow pasture]

Fortunately I haven't had to either, but I've done harnisfechten in the past using a friend's gear. Definitely recommend if you want to "gore" your friends

[next saffron]

speaking of polearms, would be cool to be able to brace with the pointier ones to help with the things that are more intent on charging you down than running

show that shiver why he should slow down for a sec...maybe one day (probably not)

[hollow pasture]

It's mainly that armor technology and ornamentation evolved as people had better and better ideas, and the well preserved armors tended to be owned by rich people who wanted to do tournament jousting

[hollow pasture]

Could be interesting against beasts like bears

[next saffron]

just make sure it's a boar spear before any hogs get funny ideas

[final garden]

Yeah, that makes sense. More of a feature of jousting and horseback, so it's not a surprise to see them in the possession of the people who would mostly sit on horses

[hollow pasture]

It would be hard to make it not overpowered I think

[next saffron]

presumably it would be a 'stance' that you have to actually enter or leave, with associated windup/down

[hollow pasture]

But it would be cool to have a weapon that would stop an enemy in its tracks

[next saffron]

like uhhhhhh

https://youtu.be/TIYh_ZUH-Qk?t=314

[hollow pasture]

I genuinely wonder how resilient the shaft of most polearms are...

[next saffron]

presumably it would also be REALLY BAD for your durbability yeah

[final garden]

I'm not sure you would survive beyond the first charge from that bear. Looks like it was able to get some really good hits in

[next saffron]

yeah but your guy in that game is some schmuck, seraph got hands

[hollow pasture]

That almost gets 1 shot by normal bear attacks 😭

[next saffron]

like. do the drifters and all not just have

straight up basically rebar for bones lmao

though i guess them moving at all suggests that maybe it isnt working very well

[final garden]

Maybe, but the bears still nearly one-shot you unarmoured

And bears are a creature whose strength we can actually know

Hard to gauge the strength of weird rusty rebar/meat beasts

[next saffron]

probably a better idea for a long spear though

[final garden]

And piercing doesn't seem to work super well on rust monsters anyway :/

I do like the idea of longer spears, but have you seen the pikes you can make already?

[next saffron]

(pikes qualify)

[final garden]

Mechanically you can't stance them along the ground, though

[next saffron]

they probably would also need a modification like boar spears to prevent the whole, angry animal/demon charging down the shaft and killing you anyway, especially with rust creatures

straight tip is begging for trouble from anything sufficiently crazy

[hollow pasture]

My headcanon is that drifter are like Venom and that stabbing into them is just like replaceable sludge, but that Blunt force weapons have enough area to actually displace large chunks of matter at a time

[next saffron]

((also an excuse to make something fantastical like a spear that can hold back 4-legged cheetah-sprinting spidermen))

[misty steppe]

Ahh, Long Dark spear.
How much I hate you for being incredibly inconsistent.

[next saffron]

true...good thing its only in the story mode that I don't play!

[hollow pasture]

Sorry for randomly pinging you, but I must praise you for your ability to find solid historical examples and being able to represent it in a meaningful way in Vintage Story. Truly awesome work

[final garden]

Thanks! I try my best

[hollow pasture]

Big props for being able to do it without knowing a ton about it too

[final storm]

If I may ask. Are you using vs model creator or some other thing? I would love to start creating some models, but vs tool is very hard to work with.

[hollow pasture]

VS tool, this fella has perfected the horrid tedium apparently

[raw hollow]

How can I make the quarterstaff hit detection more forgiving? I get smoked by locusts because I can't hit them unless they are under my feet. Is it perhaps "collider" in the itemtypes folder or in the animation folder somewhere?

[final garden]

I've been using the Vintage Story Modeler tool. It's definitely tricky but there are a few tricks that can make it easier, such as using empty 'cubes' as parents to swap between local and global rotations, and playing with hierarchy of parenting so that you get the positioning you want before parenting the object the way it needs to be

[sullen mural]

Good to see your comment Maltiez. I was starting to get worried about you.
Best of luck to you going forward!

[glossy oracle]

just wanted to thank you for your hardwork! Especially when your not feeling to good and still looking into it!

[glossy oracle]

it's a lovely design my question tho what are the stats of that silver armor? What I dislike the most is the lack of good stats for the cool looking unique stuff I rather have the silver helmet from the visuals than normal iron helmet

[final garden]

I was just going to give it whatever stats the silver armour had. Not trying to rework the game's mechanics, just provide some aesthetics. That said, there could easily be a mod to change the values of armour

I've actually never had silver or gold equipment in-game, so I don't actually know their stats. Are they essentially just iron?

[glossy oracle]

their worse by usually 2-3 stats so they do make a difference especially the whole set combined. You could ofc make a slight grayer version matching the shade of iron and just reusing the asset if you wanted to! People would love that! Or make a special Iron set with different shades compared to the normal iron sets

[final garden]

Yeah, more modular designs would be pretty cool, but I'm not quite sure how it would be done. I'd probably take the approach that Starbound does where textures use specific distinct colours, then use a substitution while the intended colours of the set

I think @brave canyon might know Vintage Story modularity better than I?

[glossy oracle]

I don't know anything about how it's done but usually is it not just a texture swap / stat change? You ofc could name 1 set "Silver armor but Iron stats" where it uses iron instead silver

so you have duplicate armors but for different materials usage wait there is actually a mod doing that for vanilla silver/gold for steel stats lemme find it

[brave canyon]

And Maltiez as well haha. Since he got me looking in the right direction after all :P

But like, you mean for modularizing addons for the different armors, right?

[glossy oracle]

can't find that mod but either way it's up to you! You could ofc make a fancy version of iron anyone would like that

[brave canyon]

If it has a plume or not, and such

[final garden]

Yeah, I used Maltiez' examples on an unpublished mod before so there were modular textures on the swords/equipment

[brave canyon]

Oooh sick

[glossy oracle]

I mean more like you have the silver armor set visuals but the stats values and build path tweaked to use iron

like I could go into json file and make any armor have xyz stat ya know? And if there were 2 versions of your armor set i could make 2 different recipes / stats

correct?

[brave canyon]

Oh, yeah, you are correct Queenie

[final garden]

In theory, couldn't you use the same mesh but set the face rendering toggle so that you could choose to have plume or not at no extra size?

[glossy oracle]

So if you wanted you could add the second armor as Iron silver armor so it looks like silver fancy armor has the stats of iron

[brave canyon]

You could just likely make another armor entry and it’s like “Reinforced Silver” or something yeah

[glossy oracle]

but why not make a seperate helmet with and no plume?

[final garden]

Yeah I think so. Easy enough

[brave canyon]

You can do that Queenie but

[glossy oracle]

or having to add the plume in a extra recipe

it's not the optimized way?

[final garden]

That's an extra mesh that's not needed

[brave canyon]

The issue is that it’s going to bloat the item count very quickly

Then you have one item that is without the plume and one that’s with

[final garden]

So it can be done, but bloats item count and can cause RAM consumption

[brave canyon]

Yup.

It’s why the Weapons in Armory use the TexturesFromAttribute, the game sees them as the same item, and for all intents and purposes, yeah they are one and the same.

It’s just that one has that additional tag on it that says “I am made of oak” and the other says “I am made of Purpleheart”

Then the renderer looks at this tag and will assign a different texture based on it

So the “magic” kinda happens when the games trying to render that specific item

[glossy oracle]

wait so am i correct it says wood bla bla but visually it changeds tho depending on what material it uses which just a texture swap right?

[brave canyon]

Yeah

[glossy oracle]

I see could you not make the plumet helmet without the plumet just have no texture on the plumet part? if you wanted to fix it that way

some quirky stuff I know so you'd still use the same mesh

[brave canyon]

Yeah, that’s what we are saying

[glossy oracle]

ah I see

lmao

[brave canyon]

It’s very possible to do that yeah :P

[glossy oracle]

sketchy shit for the sake of optimization technically?

[brave canyon]

It just requires the system to actually understand it. It’s not sketchy at all actually.

[glossy oracle]

sooo I would kind of like to do some armour designs too but how hard is the actuall modeling with the tools provided?

well same reason why the texture blocks aint rendering all faces

[brave canyon]

That’d be Bronze’s area haha.

But my experience with the Vintage Modeler honestly isn’t that bad

Save VERY often.

Cause it sometimes crashes

But you need to be clever cause you can only ever use cubes

[glossy oracle]

i see i'd guess id have to see the structure of the combat overhaul armour just copy the stats and code and adjust them ?

well modeling would be my beloved and trust me I can work my way around pixels 😄

for the sake of the discourse those are the stat differences

and now each part adding stats to the body part it adds up

[brave canyon]

Yeah, if all you want to do is have armor that has the Silver visuals but stats of iron, just tweak the stats is the easiest way.

[glossy oracle]

where would I find the vanilla armour to import into the editor?

[brave canyon]

But something for modularity for the Plume and helmet would be reaaaally sick to add honestly

[glossy oracle]

it be but without having 2 different items kinda rough i guess?

[brave canyon]

Not really no

It’s how I built Toolsmith

[glossy oracle]

ah your the guy!

[brave canyon]

Oh! Haha, yeah

[glossy oracle]

i found the silver helmet its under head-silver what naming is that wtf

[brave canyon]

It’s likely vanilla’s naming scheme

Maltiez follows it pretty closely

But yeah, like… in game, each instance of an ItemStack is a separate instance of that item.

The JSON defines strict stats that are constantly the same between each instance of an ItemStack.

[glossy oracle]

so lemme get this right with the editor there are usually no textures applied or do I have to find the corresponding texture and apply it to the helmet?

ah there we go

so technically not to hard to edit to whatever one wants

[brave canyon]

Then each stack has Attributes that are unique to that specific stack

[glossy oracle]

what programm do you use to edit texture map?

[brave canyon]

It’s in the program there

[glossy oracle]

oh good to know i feel like a silly gooze but I'd figure it out 😄

[midnight tartan]

is there somewhere i can go to get a rundown on how them armour works? so i know what exactly i should be investing in

[final garden]

That's why I mentioned him! He'll understand modularity better than I for Vintage Story

[final garden]

I edit the texture maps using Clip Studio paint, but you can use whatever

[final garden]

Armour can be tricky, but certainly not impossible by any means, and once you get the hang of it, it becomes hard to resist making more Vintage Story stuff. At least, it's been tough for me to stay focused on my real job when I just want to make Vintage mods

[glossy oracle]

yeah just checked the mess what armor is lmao I say it as it is but opening the "body" json was like a jumpscare lmao

so the armor is inside each other so if I were to edit the torso i'd have to drag it out and put it back

[final garden]

You can hide things, too

If you push the little cube next to the object in your hierarchy, you can hide that object and all children

[glossy oracle]

good to know! Apparently from the screenshots i saw here :there seems to be a sphere or is it just a trick?

or is it just cubes placed like a blocky sphere?

[final garden]

That was a tricky piece of work. I'll send some pictures to explain it, but yeah, it's a few carefully angled cubes to replicate a rounded sphere

[glossy oracle]

yeah I can guess I was just messing around and using the silver helmet as a base but now that I see also how silly the helmet is in terms of eye placement

[final garden]

That crest in the middle is actually super important because it hides all the gross overlap and jank in the middle

[glossy oracle]

thats my thought how bad is having it clip?

like parts inside each other when I tested it if it where on top of each other it be bad i guess having a 0.1 difference is the trick

[final garden]

It's really up to personal preference. I try very hard to avoid clipping that is visible, but z-fighting is completely avoidable by just giving a tiny offset in the appropriate direction. Usually not something as big as 0.1, I tend to do something like 0.01

And clipping isn't an issue if it helps you

Like how I put the helmet overlaps clipping with the crest, since the crest hides the messier clipping it covers

[glossy oracle]

i see well time to mess around looking for helmet insp but why are helmets like roundish :c why are all the bad helmet blocky lmao

reflecting armour is sadly not blocky lmao

[final garden]

Yeah, the big struggle was deciding how round to go and how hard you want to stick to the game's original style

[glossy oracle]

i mean in terms of pixelatied art it fits anything if its just enough blocky

[final garden]

The copper helmet I did tried to stick to the original style as hard as I could, but it's also the ugliest of the helmets. The gold and silver were when I stopped trying to make everything too blocky and they look great

Ah

[glossy oracle]

the most infurating part is the fact that the silver helmet is off the grid

by my eye judgment 0.2

[final garden]

Ah, that's because you don't have the human base in

[glossy oracle]

so it doesnt clip with the human?

or should I drag the human in?

[final garden]

There's a way to import the base model as a reference, hold on

You can use the set shape base path, which will do it every time afterwards for you in you set it up with the base game path, or you can set them manually

Using Set Backdrop

[midnight tartan]

is there somewhere i can go to get a rundown on how them armour works? does layering matter?

[final garden]

Layering does matter. I think it basically just adds the values together if they cover the same area

So ideally, you'd have gambeson, chainmail and plate

[midnight tartan]

ahhh so if i got a gambison+chain+brestplate all of the def stats are added?

[final garden]

But that'll slow you down, but you'll be super tough to hurt

I think so

Also, most gear targets something different

Like, Gambeson has bad slashing and piercing resistance, but good blunt

Plate has good slashing and piercing, but bad blunt

[midnight tartan]

so i can offset some of them by mixing and matching armour?

cus i notices there is armour segments i can make

[final garden]

So a fully plate covered soldier will take huge damage from a blunt source if they aren't wearing gambeson

[midnight tartan]

i REALLY like that

[final garden]

Yeah, you can set up different stuff. Basically, players can target specific areas, but most mobs I think have a random chance for which body area they hit when they attack you

[midnight tartan]

good to know

[final garden]

So it'll be like: %12 chance to hit head (not real value, but an example)

So if you don't have a helmet, you might not resist any damage because you got hit in the head

[midnight tartan]

but im assuming head+chest do more damage?

[glossy oracle]

I am kind of struggling to get the human with the helmet in the same scene so I set backdrop to seraph hairless and then how do I add the helmet without it scraping the project?

[midnight tartan]

so i really should armour em

[glossy oracle]

ah

i got it somehow

[final garden]

Not sure if head and chest do more damage, but I'd imagine so

Sweet!

[glossy oracle]

they should?

[final garden]

Now if you set up your base texture path, they should texture themselves

[glossy oracle]

thats the whole hitbox part of combat overhaul?

[final garden]

Yeah, combat overhaul has a hitbox part and I know players do more damage from hitting vital points, but I'm not sure how that applies with mobs. I'd imagine a headshot will do more than an anklebite, though

I just know that mobs don't actually use hitboxes for hitting the players, but instead will hit the player then randomly select which body part they hit

[glossy oracle]

lol so they can randomly hit your head? 😄

[final garden]

There are benefits to armouring different areas though! It's super cool. My brother, for example, is always an archer when he plays, so when I make us all gear, I only make him an open helmet, cuirass, and maybe boots or something depending on what he wants. But the important part is that he leaves his arms unarmoured and face free so that the armour doesn't put a debuff on his manipulation abilities and firing accuracy

He also frequently only wears a few pieces of armour because he values the speed more

[midnight tartan]

OHHH that is really cool

[final garden]

Yeah, a little crawling drifter has a chance to hit you in the head even though he can't stand or reach your head

[midnight tartan]

im loving this mod more and more

[glossy oracle]

for some weird reason it doesnt apply the textures when pathed to the texture folder 😄 thats the one i am using I:\Vintagestory\assets\game\textures\entity\humanoid\seraphskinparts

[final garden]

@brave canyon I had a question for you regarding the visored helmets. Originally, I planned to merge their textures as much as I could so that the number of textures being used in the mod was reduced significantly, and then the texture would actually be determined by the shape's UVs (making a texture atlas). But, I think doing so would make certain modularity harder to accomplish. For example, right now, the gold and silver helmets could actually easily swap their colour schemes by just choosing the different texture file, but if I merge them, they would no longer work that way

[final garden]

Are you doing set texture base path?

[final garden]

If so, then you actually want to just go to I:\Vintagestory\assets\game\textures

Because it'll search through the entire texture library using the directories associated with the textures

[glossy oracle]

I see I see it's now working fine I just redid it from scratch

[final garden]

This is how it'll be looking for them

Sweet

[glossy oracle]

that now also explains why the hell the helmet was on the left side of the ground :"D same with armor being inside each other

I gravely ignored the popup like a inteligent monkey

[final garden]

Yeah, I'd recommend looking up the wiki for the software and reading up parts of it. I'm still figuring stuff out myself

[glossy oracle]

first of all i gotta design / texture something worth the effort

still have to find a helmet shape i'd like to do or ornaments

[final garden]

Hah, best of luck to you then, have fun!

[glossy oracle]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-changing-the-clock-changing-the-time-kitty-cat-cute-gif-17202806

that helmet apparently clips in vanilla jesus 😄

i didnt even move it!

[final garden]

@hollow pasture I had a question for you: previously the idea was to send the shapes and textures to Maltiez, and I'm just about done now aside from some final cleanup and optimization. Obviously Maltiez is dealing with other stuff, but I'm not sure whether I should go ahead and try to mod the visors myself or not. Like, I doubt that Maltiez would care if I did the work, but I don't know them and so I don't want to accidentally steal their thunder if they really wanted to do that programming /implementation themselves. Basically, I don't want to bug Maltiez, but I'm not sure if I should ping them or not to let them know the shapes are done when I'd rather spare them the labour

[final garden]

Yep! This is what I was saying earlier: clipping is not a problem unless it is noticeable

[brave canyon]

Aah hmm. I’m going to have to consider this and respond in a bit! Busy cooking taco meat right now haha.

Also I think if you actually got the helmets working and stuff, in the end that just helps expedite things? It’s less stuff for Maltiez to do in the end, hah

He said similar of Toolsmith to me, he wanted to do modular tools but then he saw what I was doing and was like ah yes this is it, so he was glad he didn’t have to do it himself, heh

[glossy oracle]

is there a proper way to mirro ? or do i have to do the math myself 😄

eh close enough

[final garden]

Gotta math

[final garden]

Ah, that's what I figured, but I didn't want to accidentally take something they were looking forward to

[brave canyon]

Haha, fair and kind!

And oh my god I just realized your picture is a bulborb… the poor Pikmin :P

[hollow pasture]

Janky at best. Bronze has more patience than I with it, but I redid all of the current models in CO that all fit together. Before there was this horrid z-fighting when wearing them all at once

[hollow pasture]

Questions like these tend to go into #mod-development

[hollow pasture]

There is a spreadsheet that details the damage values and tiers of each enemy, as well as the damage received based on tier, but I no longer have it :/

[hollow pasture]

You can go all the way to 0.01, but any lower the editor does not accept

[brave canyon]

Actually you can go lower then that surprisingly

But the editor cannot display that :P

I believe it actually works if you enter it in there, I don't think it clamps it, it just always will round to the nearest .01

I had a model that went into the 0.005 and when I load it up in there it shows 0.01, but it appears to retain the actual value fine

[final garden]

Hah! Another pikmin fan! Don't worry, if you look carefully, it's a bulbmin with a purple pikmin plushie

[brave canyon]

Ooooh, good :P

Oh god it is... I completely missed the leaf haha

[brave canyon]

About the textures and stuff though, how are they now, and what would change if you merged them?

Cause I'm having a bit of trouble understanding. Is it kinda like the Minecraft Skin way of adding a texture?

[final garden]

Currently, they'

[brave canyon]

Uh oh, did it get cut off?

Aah, hmm. I had a look at the current textures in Armory, and yeah, it's like the exploded kinda playermodel.

[final garden]

they're all just modifications of the current textures

So they're exploded player model (sorta)

[brave canyon]

I don't think you need to really merge them into one big atlas cause the game already kinda does that for you automatically - and it's better to keep them separate as the game can then load only the ones it needs to into the memory

[final garden]

I could merge them together so it's just multiple helmets on one atlas

Ah, okay

[brave canyon]

It honestly might be more intensive to merge them, yeah

Cause like, if you load just one, you load all the variants

But with them split, it can load them piecemeal as required.

That also is how it can be easily dynamic too, like, if the heads are separate from the body, it can load less for each swap

Since I'm seeing that the textures in Armory now all have every part of that full set on one, it probably could be split into separate textures and loaded all separately... I guess it comes down to how it's coded really, and splitting the textures would also mean having to adjust the shapes to account for that, too...

That's my best guess at least, without investigating further and confirming it works like that, heh

[hollow pasture]

You'd be correct

[hollow pasture]

Yes. I tend to neglect leg armor almost in it's entirety

[hollow pasture]

The probability for enemies to hit you is also based on whether they are below, in front, or above you. Crawling drifters have 0 chance of hitting your head if you're at the same height

[hollow pasture]

Limbs are half damage, body is 1x, and any part of the head is 2x

[final garden]

No, because they're still full textures. Not any bigger or smaller, just different data instead of useless data

[brave canyon]

Like, it's just the helmet, or it's the full armor set?

[hollow pasture]

In Maltiez's current condition, I believe he'd see it as a gift to be freed of development burden, so you could probably develop it yourself. I don't really know the lovely fella though, that's just my opinion

[brave canyon]

Cause I see the current texture from Armory is this:

https://i.imgur.com/QP7TcNS.png

Which looks like the full silver armor set, legs, helm, chest, every bit all together here.

But if the helmet portion was split off from this into a smaller file (as small as can fit it) that contains just the helmet, that'd be able to load piecemeal easier and everything

And if I'm understanding everything correctly currently, right now if you load the silver Helmet, you are loading all of the silver plate pieces' textures (in this example at least)

[hollow pasture]

It is the default texture except all of the maille is removed. I think I made those actually 🤣

[brave canyon]

Ooh haha

That makes sense really, since it'd layer from the layers heh

[hollow pasture]

It also looked really odd when separated into different parts because you'd have random maille sections on the edges of armor that made no sense

[brave canyon]

If your current helmet texture is basically this same texture, but the only part of it that actually has any color or anything is the Helmet and the rest is transparent? Then yeah, merge more onto that same one so it uses less space to reserve for the helmet.

Or move it onto a smaller canvas that can better fit it. I believe it needs to be 32x32 pix or a multiple of that.

Trying to use all portions of the texture you do load is a good idea though, so if that's what you meant, yeah absolutely merge them or shrink the canvas for each

[brave canyon]

Yeaaaah, it does help to have it all together like this, it's also pretty likely you'd make a full set and not just the helmet or what have you, so it makes a lot of sense to keep it all together.

[final garden]

Just the helmet

[final garden]

Yes

Like, this is what the silver looks like

But I only need a small amount of that

[brave canyon]

Since that kinda looks like it's basically the same as the rest of the plate set, you could just replace the - Oh no that upper right bit is different.

I would say in that case probably just try putting everything you need for the helmet in it's own file.

For something like making the plume modular for changing the color or removing/adding it, it would likely need it's own unique texture file to make it somewhat easy to change on the fly.

Same goes generally for anything you want to kinda swap out in code. If it's set as it's own texture define, you can just set it to the Transparent texture and of course it doesn't render anything, heh. But you can also just swap out the texture source for any other texture file, it matches up the UVs and it goes fine

Ah, here we go

https://i.imgur.com/2BUzuvU.png

A bit of an example there

For the two handles on the right, you can kinda see the different texture sources in play

Any part you want to kinda swap out modularly it's easiest if you can build the model so that portion has it's own texture source or even it's own shape entirely.

Cause for those handles there it's basic, but the Grip around it is actually a different shape file from the handle.

And same for how I got the tool heads also rendering in the same item with the handle. Just merging the meshes together.

It's hard to tell from the ground storage and the fact that picture was more laughing at the funny offset on the scythe lmao, but each of those is a single item that shows both the handle and the head.

Hopefully that helps any :P

I just mainly used vanilla textures for everything, so most of them are already loaded and stuff, but it also can work with just adding in your own and setting it to pull from that texture.

[final garden]

Yeah, that makes sense. There's a million ways to do anything game related. The way I'd be tempted to do it if I was programming it myself is do the Starbound method, as I mentioned earlier. Basically just swapping colours that appear in the texture map with the desired colours based on the material

[brave canyon]

Oh yeah absolutely haha

[final garden]

So what you make is like, one texture map, with multiple helmets, but they're all the same colour, then you replace that colour with the intended ones listed in tables as RGBA values

Not sure how well Vintage Story supports that, though

[brave canyon]

Aaah, it could be just tint-shifting it? Are things mostly grayscale?

[final garden]

No, they're not

[brave canyon]

Or do they have full RGB- Ooh okay.

[final garden]

It's full RGBA replacement

[brave canyon]

Interesting

Since it's a low-pixel game it probably can do that a lot faster

That's kinda wild though, huh

[final garden]

Yeah, like you can see here the human bodies

But they're made of weird colours and then replace them so that players get colour customization

[brave canyon]

Oooooh okay.

The weird colors are likely the Green Screen method

Similar procedure to a green screen use

[final garden]

Yeah, similar, but not identical

[brave canyon]

That makes sense

[final garden]

I've done it multiple times for various shaders, but I usually use pure RGB so that they're obvious

[brave canyon]

Yeah, fair

That's really cool

[final garden]

You wouldn't happen to be aware of a way to move multiple UVs at once, would you?

Because I really don't want to move all the tiny, overlapped UVs manually

Oh, and I forgot! I used the vanilla structures to build these helmets, which had the neck included. Does that need to be changed for the armour overlaps? @hollow pasture

[brave canyon]

Oh hmm.

Fuuuck, that does look like an absolute pain...

It might be the best to just bite the bullet, make the new texture first, load up two instances of the helmet model. One with the old, and one with the new and then just manually copy it over :<

I don't think the editor has that advanced of a function sadly.

[final garden]

Ah, dang. Was hoping there might be. Some of these UVs are just gross :l

[brave canyon]

Yeaaaah... :<

It's uh, unfortunately going to be a pain...

At least you only have to do it once and then like, any alternate textures are just changing that base file.

[final garden]

How's this instead? I'm a tad worried because it's so many extra cubes

[brave canyon]

Oooh, that looks wonderful honestly

[final garden]

I think it looks better than a single feather, though. Probably not much different than gold to be honest

And I think it's distinct enough from the gold plumage

[brave canyon]

I think having the lower ones really helps a lot to add some more thickness to the feathers and it doesn't feel flat

[final garden]

Yeah, it definitely looks way better than just one feather

[robust pond]

@fallow surge Was the Polehammer intended to have such a low durability btw? Just curious because some of the people on my server were complaining.

[final garden]

If it didn't have lower durability, there wouldn't be much reason to use a mace instead of the club

[robust pond]

ah

[ashen matrix]

hey, uh... any news on that "holding ranged weapons forces a crash" bugfix?

[shut sequoia]

Be patient
#1260976245374582886 message

[ashen matrix]

👍

[final garden]

You can rollback an update to when the bug doesn't occur if you don't want to wait, too

[misty steppe]

Or just don't use any ranged weapons and cosplay as an Olympic Athlete with Javelins.

[dreamy bridge]

hello, is there any way i can wear classic 3 parts armor from other mods ?

[icy thistle]

i could have SWORN there was another mod that did the same thing without the combat changes but i couldn't find it

[dreamy bridge]

il love the combat change and the mod that need it but i hate that i can't use vanilla or other mod armor

[icy thistle]

my main issue is just the fact that i can't use ranged weapons rn and i was literally just about to introduce friends to the game with the mod

and i was gonna use ranged weapons for that

😿

apparently it's just a rendering bug with the ranged weapons (idk if that's true or not) which hopefully could get patched somewhat easily

[unkempt kettle]

Hey, Im trying to make a compatability pacth for ElectricalProgressive:Equipment; but the patch isnt taking.
Is there anything code-wise that would need done to an object that already has a class?

[placid warren]

hey is there an existing guide to making compatability patchs?

just wanna read through it to get a better understanding before i try anything

[final garden]

I don't know about for Combat overhaul specifically, but I know of this https://wiki.vintagestory.at/Modding:CompatibilityLib#Mod-dependent_json-patch

[hollow pasture]

Most armors are automatically patched to use some kind of Combat Overhaul values in this manner

[dreamy bridge]

But I am enable to wear them

[hollow pasture]

It must be an issue on their end. Not sure why the autopatcher isn't working for that armor

You should be able to equip the armor in any of the combat overhaul slots

[dreamy bridge]

strange

[dreamy bridge]

well just checked and no, i crafted nomad armor from the mod tonwexp and vanilla armor and enable to wear them

[hollow pasture]

Sounds like a bug then. I've personally used and worn the armor from that mod on a Vintage Story server using Combat Overhaul and all it's supplementaries (besides firearms)

[dreamy bridge]

I manually uploaded all these mod, lost a lot of iron (I gave them not gonna lie) and it’s still not working

[next saffron]

So what's the deal with trying to play this mod in current ver?

[hollow pasture]

Rendering issue with bows is causing a CTD. Apparently there's a fix out submitted for it to the github, but Maltiez is currently on leave

[next saffron]

and this is prevented by?

[brave canyon]

You mean what is causing the bug?

[hollow pasture]

Downgrading to 1.20.10

Unfortunately there is no public fix out currently

[balmy island]

No rush but do we know when/if Maltiez is coming back?

[hollow pasture]

He sounds like he wants to return, but his health is poor

[balmy island]

ah i hope he gets better then

[next saffron]

we salute our hero

[white bear]

That explains things...

How does one downgrade the game

I wonder if simply swapping the executable would work...

[tall turtle]

I just downloaded 1.20.10 and installed it in a different folder, each install is less than a gig and they draw mods and saves from the same place so you don't have to configure anything.

[white bear]

Oh-
Ok then i mean yeah that's fair

I just hope backdating doesnt break other mods I had updated

Oh you can just download older versions of mods-

[fiery snow]

Looks like someone has posted a pull request that might fix the problem: https://github.com/maltiez2/vsmod_Overhaullib/pull/4

[next saffron]

yup. but maltz still died (this is fair)

[green kayak]

I feel dumb asking this because I cannot find a download anywhere at that link, but is there one?

[fiery snow]

As far as I am aware, no. A pull request is a request to modify the code made by someone other than the original creator, but the original creator (or someone else allowed to approve pull requests) has to approve the pull request.

However Maeyanie could alternatively post a temporary patched version of the original mod, but it doesn't seem like they've done that.

[green kayak]

Gotcha. Thanks for this.

[fiery snow]

Looks like they published a temp patch, they can be found here:
https://mods.vintagestory.at/show/user/1ce115e080771d04e4a5
https://mods.vintagestory.at/show/mod/25143
https://mods.vintagestory.at/show/mod/25140

I had some issues with some of the mods with dependencies on the original Combat Overhaul and overhaullib so I messed with it a bit to get them to work.
They can be found here:

[fallow surge]

Updated the lib with this crash fix, you can remove temp mods now

[fallow surge]

I'm alive and will continue to work on mods, it just that right now I'm quite ill and barely have energy to work on my first job.

[simple comet]

Oh, no! I hope you feel better soon, that's awful news.

[green kayak]

Thank you for this update, it is appreciated as your mods are fantastic!
I hope you feel better soon and wish you a speedy recovery.

[flat compass]

if you need help homes let us know and if you got a discord too

[brave canyon]

Yeah, take it easy! Get better and then you can come back and tackle things later!

Never any rush for those kinds of things, take as long as you need.

[near beacon]

ok hate to be that goober, but what mods do i actually need for CO to work again?

[brave canyon]

It’s on the mod page, you need just Combat Ovehaul and Combat Lib.

Any more then that is optional to add more content.

[red nacelle]

any way to remove spear throwing mechanic?

[hollow cargo]

As some who has major health problems. I understand personally, but you're my favorite modder, so please take care of yourself.

[uneven trench]

there's a config for that

[quartz orbit]

Loads of crashes associated with repeating crossbow

No logs

[red nacelle]

which one

[uneven trench]

CO is very configurable, you can disable the spear mechanics

[red nacelle]

where do I do that thoughbeit

[uneven trench]

do you have the mod that adds the mod options in the pause menu?

[red nacelle]

yea I tried using it and nothing changed

[uneven trench]

you usually have to set settings then reload the save

[red nacelle]

let me try again

it don work

[torpid smelt]

The game crashes for everyone around you, if you take your Upper Body or Upper Body Over slot clothing off and throw it on the ground. On the previous version of Overhaul Lib (the one before .11), it used to be the Shoulder slot that did this.

It only happens if the dropping player is in survival mode.

09/06/2025 18:34:32: Critical error occurred in the following mod: [email protected]
Loaded Mods: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
System.IndexOutOfRangeException: Index was outside the bounds of the array.
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.ShapeElementCollider.GetTransformMatrix(Int32 jointId, Single[] TransformationMatrices4x4) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityCollider.cs:line 491
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.ShapeElementCollider.Transform(Single[] transformMatrixAll, ICoreClientAPI api) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityCollider.cs:line 338
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.CollidersEntityBehavior.RecalculateColliders(ClientAnimator animator, ICoreClientAPI clientApi) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityBehavior.cs:line 360
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.CollidersEntityBehavior.OnGameTick(Single deltaTime) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityBehavior.cs:line 180
   at Vintagestory.API.Common.Entities.Entity.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryApi\Common\Entity\Entity.cs:line 1103
   at Vintagestory.API.Common.EntityAgent.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryApi\Common\Entity\EntityAgent.cs:line 481
   at Vintagestory.API.Common.EntityPlayer.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryApi\Common\Entity\EntityPlayer.cs:line 654
   at Vintagestory.Client.NoObf.ClientSystemEntities.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\Systems\Entities.cs:line 107
   at Vintagestory.Common.GameTickListener.OnTriggered(Int64 ellapsedMilliseconds) in VintagestoryLib\Common\Model\GameTickListener.cs:line 31
   at Vintagestory.Common.EventManager.TriggerGameTick(Int64 ellapsedMilliseconds, IWorldAccessor world) in VintagestoryLib\Common\EventManager.cs:line 174
   at Vintagestory.Client.NoObf.ClientMain.MainRenderLoop(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientMain.cs:line 825
   at Vintagestory.Client.GuiScreenRunningGame.RenderToPrimary(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\MainMenu\Screens\GuiScreenRunningGame.cs:line 161
   at Vintagestory.Client.ScreenManager.Render(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ScreenManager.cs:line 695
   at Vintagestory.Client.ScreenManager.OnNewFrame(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ScreenManager.cs:line 670
   at Vintagestory.Client.NoObf.ClientPlatformWindows.window_RenderFrame(FrameEventArgs e) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientPlatform\GameWindow.cs:line 127
   at OpenTK.Windowing.Desktop.GameWindow.Run()
   at Vintagestory.Client.ClientProgram.Start(ClientProgramArgs args, String[] rawArgs) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientProgram.cs:line 334
   at Vintagestory.Client.ClientProgram.<>c__DisplayClass10_0.<.ctor>b__1() in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientProgram.cs:line 130
   at Vintagestory.ClientNative.CrashReporter.Start(ThreadStart start) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientPlatform\ClientNative\CrashReporter.cs:line 93

[hollow pasture]

What "cape" slot are you talking about?

[torpid smelt]

Shoulder slot I meant

[surreal token]

I'm getting the exact same error in the exact same scenarios, though it also seems to just residually happen at random after the fact when your character does certain animations?

[torpid smelt]

Definitely getting those random crashes too but not too often

[fiery snow]

Having the same error a lot on my server, it seems to not crash those out of render distance though.

Game Version: v1.20.12 (Stable)
6/9/2025 5:56:58 PM: Critical error occurred in the following mod: [email protected]
Loaded Mods: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
System.IndexOutOfRangeException: Index was outside the bounds of the array.
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.ShapeElementCollider.GetTransformMatrix(Int32 jointId, Single[] TransformationMatrices4x4) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityCollider.cs:line 491
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.ShapeElementCollider.Transform(Single[] transformMatrixAll, ICoreClientAPI api) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityCollider.cs:line 338
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.CollidersEntityBehavior.RecalculateColliders(ClientAnimator animator, ICoreClientAPI clientApi) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityBehavior.cs:line 365
   at CombatOverhaul.Colliders.CollidersEntityBehavior.OnGameTick(Single deltaTime) in D:\Projects\VintageStory\Overhaullib\source\Colliders\EntityBehavior.cs:line 180
   at Vintagestory.API.Common.Entities.Entity.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryApi\Common\Entity\Entity.cs:line 1106
   at Vintagestory.API.Common.EntityAgent.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryApi\Common\Entity\EntityAgent.cs:line 613
   at Vintagestory.API.Common.EntityPlayer.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryApi\Common\Entity\EntityPlayer.cs:line 654
   at Vintagestory.Client.NoObf.ClientSystemEntities.OnGameTick(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\Systems\Entities.cs:line 107
   at Vintagestory.Common.GameTickListener.OnTriggered(Int64 ellapsedMilliseconds) in VintagestoryLib\Common\Model\GameTickListener.cs:line 31
   at Vintagestory.Common.EventManager.TriggerGameTick(Int64 ellapsedMilliseconds, IWorldAccessor world) in VintagestoryLib\Common\EventManager.cs:line 174
   at Vintagestory.Client.NoObf.ClientMain.MainRenderLoop(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientMain.cs:line 825
   at Vintagestory.Client.GuiScreenRunningGame.RenderToPrimary(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\MainMenu\Screens\GuiScreenRunningGame.cs:line 161
   at Vintagestory.Client.ScreenManager.Render(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ScreenManager.cs:line 695
   at Vintagestory.Client.ScreenManager.OnNewFrame(Single dt) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ScreenManager.cs:line 670
   at Vintagestory.Client.NoObf.ClientPlatformWindows.window_RenderFrame(FrameEventArgs e) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientPlatform\GameWindow.cs:line 88
   at OpenTK.Windowing.Desktop.GameWindow.Run()
   at Vintagestory.Client.ClientProgram.Start(ClientProgramArgs args, String[] rawArgs) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientProgram.cs:line 334
   at Vintagestory.Client.ClientProgram.<>cDisplayClass10_0.<.ctor>b1() in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientProgram.cs:line 130
   at Vintagestory.ClientNative.CrashReporter.Start(ThreadStart start) in VintagestoryLib\Client\ClientPlatform\ClientNative\CrashReporter.cs:line 93```

[hollow pasture]

Oh, you mean actual clothing, not combat overhaul slots

[final surge]

bro this mod makes combat so much better that i didnt even realize how much i hated vanilla until we added then removed this mod

like the volumetric hitboxes instead of the single ray cast is chefs kiss

i feel like i can actually fight and hit things versus playing a hit or miss game on click

[tall turtle]

Spears and pikes my beloved

[white bear]

Yeah vanilla should really have hitboxes instead of hitscan because it feels like ass otherwise

I think the issue is attacks have a wind up animation instead the hitscan being instant. Its why minecraft combat feels most alright but vintage story vanilla combat feels bad despite mostly being the same

Weapons using hitboxes instead pretty much entirely fixes the problem, on top of being mechanically really cool

[final surge]

Absolutely, hitboxes is a world of difference

[lofty owl]

does this work with bows now or is it still crashing peoples game?

[torpid smelt]

the bows work now

[lofty owl]

good

[surreal token]

Bows do work but half a dozen guys crashing in my server because someone took a shirt off kinda sucks

[faint hearth]

“Y’all wanna fight? Let’s go!” takes shirt off, everyone phases out of reality “thought so”

[final falcon]

I had the same issue fixed it by just simple updating the current overhaullib and updated to 1.20.12. All guns, bows and combat work with no clothing crashing the server

[surreal token]

I am using the latest update, and 1.20.12 as well so I'm not sure what it would be

[final falcon]

Could be another mod conflict that you have the overhaulslib latest update .2.9. I believe

[fallow surge]

I would recommend using 1.20.10 version of the game until radfast tells me what he changed in animators and transforms matrices and then fixes it or I fix it, or somebody make a pr request with the fix.

[final surge]

So is the expanded armor system designed the same way vanilla slots for equipment are? No right? Makes a lot of sense how there would be a item bug if the implementation is different there

Is the crash specific to render distance range away from other players? Or is it everyone on a server regardless?

Oh nevemind I see reading older messages

Seems really weird to me for it to be a rendering or collider crash if it's not caused from a creative mode character - versus a thing with modded equipment slots failing to translate to an item in the world

[fallow surge]

The matrices are tightly fitted to the actual number of animated elements now, instead of being based on MaxAnimatedElements. Any reference you still have to MaxAnimatedElements is probably a crash risk

For someone who wants to make a pr with a fix

But it seems complicated to fix, so I doubt that there will be any

[final garden]

@hollow pasture @brave canyon Hey, so the visored helmets are nearly complete, I'm just trying to figure out how to set up having a button to swap between open and closed visors. You guys know how to add a new keymapped button? I.E. press v to toggle visor. I can't seem to find this info looking it up :/

[brave canyon]

Aah, I'm not sure. I've not done a custom-mapped keybind before but

I do remember that there is uhhh

[full dune]

visored helmets? holy shit that sounds amazing, is it going to limit your view when the visors down?

[brave canyon]

I believe it's on IPlayer or EntityPlayer, there's a way to read inputs from the keyboard, but I think it has to be specifically from the Clientside

Since the Clientside gets the keypress, then it needs to be sent to the server though a set up channel for it to have the server sync it with everyone

I used it but only for uhhh, checking if Shift was held for a few things

[final garden]

Still, that sounds like a good place to start! Unless there's a better way you can think of for visors?

Easiest would be to "craft" them in the grid to open/close them, but that's super lame and requires removing the helmet

[final garden]

I was considering something like that, but after I've gotten the visors working

[full dune]

we need sallet helms

[brave canyon]

Yeaaaah, I think the button pressing is the best way to go honestly

[full dune]

germanic sallet helms

[brave canyon]

It's just unfortunately not something I can point at and say I have a working example for you unfortunately :P

The closest I have is uhhh... Check the In-Hand Crafting stuff for Toolsmith, ooor any of the interactions on the Grindstone or Workbench

That's where I believe I used the shift detection

And it might at least help you find the right part of the player API

As for the syncing with the server, I was terrified of approaching that so... haven't yet :P

It seems simple though. You just set up the channel and then can send and receive things through that

I believe I saw an example used in Hydrate Or Diedrate when I was looking at the code

[final garden]

Alright. I'll need to download toolsmith, then. Where'd you figure it out? Find a wiki entry or video somewhere?

[brave canyon]

I'm not sure what was being - Oh, no, I just looked at the code myself

[final garden]

Oh yeah, it has a piss button

[brave canyon]

I can't remember what exactly, but - Oh yeah!

That one mod!

Yeah, check that one, I think Chrono had all his mods open source, so pull up that source

[final garden]

I was thinking of looking into Xskills because they have a UI open when you push O

[brave canyon]

That's a good idea as well

Though, that one might not sync to the server, but it might send the stat data...

[final garden]

I did one!

[full dune]

can i see?

theyre easily my favorite helmet!

[final garden]

Sure, I posted some pictures of it earlier

Just on my phone at the moment so I can't send any immediately

[full dune]

i love it!

do you post these anywhere?

[final garden]

I've posted all of the visors in this thread, but I plan on releasing the mod soon. Basically as soon as I figure out how to get the visor toggle working

Then might worry about visor vision changes later

[full dune]

oh man i am EXCITED for that

visored helms are a favorite of mine, especially the german sallet

[final garden]

It was one of if not the first helmet design I thought of. It was also a huge pain and there are still things I wish were done better about it

[brave canyon]

They look absolutely amazing too :P

[final garden]

Thank you!

[final garden]

https://apidocs.vintagestory.at/api/Vintagestory.API.Common.EntityControls.html

I finally found what I was looking for! The API documentation!

[brave canyon]

Oh! Very nice! That helps a lot :P

[lofty owl]

so spears have a really oddly broken angle when using combat overhaul

[hardy pine]

hey my server is still experiencing the crash from bows and firearms after switching to overhaullib 0.2.9 on game version 1.20.12. does anyone have troubleshooting tips?

[crimson bloom]

Roll back to .10 maybe. Maltiez did caution not to update past .10 until he could take a closer look at some of the code someone submitted.

[hollow pasture]

I'd offer my skills in making the overlay, but honestly you're probably way better at it than I'll be 🤣

[hollow pasture]

Send a screenshot. Sounds like just a you problem

[hollow pasture]

A fella in here working on the visor system made a Sallet in a more italian/English style if that's close enough? 🤣

[final surge]

The bows feel fantastic to use, been going hard with a longbow as a hunter, good times

[final garden]

So I've nearly finished the visored helmets core mod aspects, but I'm trying to make it fully compatible with Combat Overhaul. CO changes the head armour slot by using a new slot, right? The head/face/neck slots?

[mint pine]

Anyone else think the firearms are seriously under powered and lack alot of range?

[brave canyon]

Yeah, it has its own 3 head slots. But I do know that you can set one armor piece to fill multiple slots.

I think you might want to take a look at the compat patches built into CO?

[hollow pasture]

Their range is pretty far, but there are often mod conflicts that make them do no damage. Most of the time you'll notice that the bows also don't do damage either in this case though.

My biggest issue is finding out where to hold because the sights aren't dead on

[mint pine]

Thats probably why i assumed the range was bad. Sights must’ve been bad or my aim just sucks lol.

[hollow pasture]

I've had multiple instances when updating my mod list where some things conflict and suddenly my stuff wasn't doing damage, so I figured it's good to share the knowledge

Also historical muskets were smoothbore anyways, so in reality they were pretty inaccurate compared to "rifles"

[graceful grove]

hellooo I might be a little dumb but could anyone offer any help making a patch for combat overhaul? I changed shapes used by armor but CO changes them

how it's meant to look

how it looks with CO

I'm using the Player Model lib

[final garden]

I have those working just fine. My problem is that my code searches the head itemslot, but CO doesn't use that slot, so instead I have to figure out what inventory CO uses and what the head slot is called

[brave canyon]

Aaah, it could be in any one of the three as well

There's likely an inventory attached to the player entity that holds all that, and you probably can find the key for it in the CO code somewhere... But I'm not certain where.

[final garden]

That looks great! Have you tried opening up CO's armor models and seeing what changes?

[final garden]

Yeah, that's what point I'm at

[graceful grove]

I poked around the files and they use the "game" folder for their armor shapes

not sure what I can do about that

[final garden]

Well I know it patches the armor-models and the player-model

The armory mod also adds a bunch of its own shapes

[final garden]

So you may be able to find the shapes you're looking for in the armory mod

[graceful grove]

I'm only using the combat overhaul mod, also, the library I am using already gives you a way to replace clothing and armor per player model, not sure why it isn't working when CO is enabled

[final garden]

Ah, odd

Sadly the developer is taking a break, so it's unlikely to hear from them

[graceful grove]

I figured, pinged them a few days ago

[final garden]

I'll let you know if I figure anything out that might help you, but I'm pretty unfamiliar with CO's code. The only people who might know that I'm aware of would be JonR or Corat, but I think neither is super well versed in the code

But I think it was @hollow pasture who helped with a bunch of the original armor tweaks?

[final garden]

https://mods.vintagestory.at/koboldplayermodelport

These guys accomplished something similar. Maybe contact them? It has CO compatibility with minor issues due to load order. So they may be able to help or tell you if the issue is beyond what you can fix

[hollow pasture]

You may need to do something like a harmony patch

[final garden]

Also, found some shapes you may be able to examine in the combat overhaul files

[full dune]

yeah i agree that the guns are pretty underpowered, its a good deal of effort to make them and you cant even one shot a surface shiver, the blunderbuss is quite good until you can make a musket, but i dont like having one shot and that one shot only does 16 damage

should be configurable though?

[lyric marsh]

underpowered? lacking range?

bro a musket can oneshot every special except bellheads

and i can reliably hit 100 meter shots with it

the only gun that lacks range is the pistol because of its exaggerated spread, you should not ever fire it further than 50m

bossi is more like 70m

everything after that is very accurate

the guns are not underpowered by any stretch

wheellocks can oneshot wolves and severely injure most things

matchlocks oneshot most things and blunderbuss is great for direct combat (can oneshot a corrupt drifter)

and the musket is just stupid, ticket to god that can reliably hit at 100m due to the accuracy and huge projectile

[mint pine]

Your experience isn’t everyone else’s and as stated above it seems as if mod conflicts cause damage redundancies 👍

[lyric marsh]

we're talking about facts, wdym experience

[keen veldt]

they triggered that ur right bro

u spitting straight facts

and people also crying the guns aren’t powerful enough while using incompatible mods lmao

[midnight tartan]

or complaining a mod is underpowered when comparing it to mods. like bruh everything should idealy be balanced to fit vanilla

[keen veldt]

Legit

[midnight tartan]

that way its balanced by default

[keen veldt]

No wonder maltiez ain’t as active here

[midnight tartan]

its just a thing that comes with being a coder/modder

[keen veldt]

I rmb seeing people ask him to change so much stuff just because it doesn’t suit their needs for the mod

truth nuke

[midnight tartan]

when i talk to a modder i dont say "chage this cus i dont like it", i ask "what is your vision of what this is supposed to do"

[keen veldt]

Lmao ye

[kind epoch]

lmao saying underpowered is crazy you can look in the damage log and see it doing 86 damage even with blackguard range nerf I was killing anything that moved. you can just shoot with musket and then finish off anything with the pistol

[lilac fulcrum]

not sure if reported (thank you discord for making it impossible to search threads), but when you try to run w/o the lib and it offers to auto-download it, it fails to find

[keen veldt]

“nah man it’s underpowered because I installed a furry player model mod that removed my hitbox with the guns so I took 0 damage…”

“the gun dev guy has to fix this!!!”

[kind epoch]

i wasnt even thinking of multiplayer, if it removes your hitbox for pvp thats crazy lol

[torpid smelt]

I made a small bandaid patch for anyone who wants to run this mod on 1.20.12 and not crash when people around you change clothes

https://mods.vintagestory.at/show/mod/25388

[uncut mauve]

@fallow surge I have a modding question. The reason why I ask in this thread is because I have seen animations for items in your combat-overhaul related mods. Like crossbows for example.
My question is: How do you go about animating held items? I'm working on a drill for my jonastools mod and I was able to use animations already present in the game for the holding animation, but now I want to make just the drill head rotate separately from the whole drill tool. Do you have any tips or pointers on how I should go about this?

I know about programatically rotating the whole item for example, and I can develop an animation in the model creator for the item, but I am just unsure on how to proceed in applying the animation utilizing whichever method to the item

I would greatly appreciate any assistance that you may be able to provide.

[simple comet]

You'd be better off asking in #mod-development .

[uncut mauve]

I was just in there asking about animations and the response I was provided is that you can't do animations with items, just modify their rotation programatically, but I have seen animations with mods that Maltiez has created so I figured I would ask him as well to get his feedback. It seems that the common response when browsing via google is that you can only utilize the programatically modified position method, so I wanted to know in particular how Maltiez executed his animations for his modded items like his musket and crossbow for example.

[simple comet]

I misunderstood, then. He's not in the best health if I recall right, so it may take awhile to hear back.

I think, so far, Maltiez is the only one to accomplish that particular animation in VS.

[uncut mauve]

That is a-okay. I understand that modding is on a volunteer basis so there is certainly no rush

I'm probably going to delve into the API documentation in the meantime to see if I can find anything there.

[simple comet]

Perhaps there's something on his github?

https://github.com/maltiez2

[uncut mauve]

Oooo, thank you! This will very likely help me!

[simple comet]

It's maddeningly easy to miss the "source" button which appears at the top of some mod pages.

[uncut mauve]

I've found that it looks like Maltiez does store model creator animations within the item shape json file, so the next question is how does he get them to play via the class file. That's what I'm looking into currently

[simple comet]

AnimLib is the likeliest place to look.

[uncut mauve]

I completely missed the githut source button, I'll be looking into the source for his mods that are animated

Thanks so much for your help @simple comet

[simple comet]

You're very welcome!

[uncut mauve]

Looks like he uses a custom coded animation system from OverhaulLib 😁 👍

[simple comet]

Sounds like you're puzzling it out, then! Good deal.

[lofty owl]

That sounded rude but sure lol. Ill hop on in a bit and show the odd angle of spears and javlins

[ashen matrix]

can the long axe be used for lumber purposes or is it strictly combat only?

[ivory charm]

I don't think you can chop wood with it

Which is also in line with how long axes work

They are, simply said, designed for combat

[robust pond]

Wait is this a mod for CO?

[graceful grove]

The idea is I make it comparible with CO

The player model lib mentions it can work with it

[robust pond]

so wait, is it kemono, but a patch for CO? or a separate mod entirely?

[graceful grove]

separate mod using the player model lib

[robust pond]

oh neat

[final garden]

If anybody knows how to access the custom slots in combat overhaul from C# code, or knows any mods that add unique compatibility for CO, I would love to know. I am so close to finishing my mod, but I just need to access the head slot in my patch for CO (don't want to release the mod until it works with CO too)

[hollow pasture]

What specifically do you need to know about the slots?

I want to say all of the armor types are defined like vanilla, but there's a small section that shows what area and layer the armor covers

[final garden]

I need to know how to call the slot in code so that I can access the item. For example, with vanilla I used globalconstant.playerinventory and enum.armorhead

[hollow pasture]

Is that how vanilla armor is referenced?

[final garden]

In my mod at least. Not sure if Vanilla ever tries to access the armour from the armour slots like that

[final garden]

I'm trying to change this line to be compatible with CO

[tall turtle]

I inadvertently discovered an issue with ranged weapon rendering if using reshade, even if no effects are active. For some reason ranged weapons, vanilla bows, crossbows, or firearms, don't render at all when both combat overhaul is active and reshade is installed. If CO is off, or reshade is uninstalled it works correctly. I don't think it's a real problem because reshade does basically nothing for the game but it's very peculiar.

[final garden]

This is so frustrating. I feel like I'm at the door with key in hand but can't find the lock. If I could just figure out how to get the player's helmet with CO installed, this mod would be done. Every single other thing is functional now

[lilac fulcrum]

Is it possible to add iframes back to contact damage stuff like cactus (and stuff from mods that damages the player in a similar way)

[storm adder]

So no matter what I do, or what version I use of this, the game just hardcrashes without a crash report whenever I try to use ANY ranged weapon. I've tried multiple versions of the mod, and overhaul lib, is there -any- workaround other than downgrading the version of the game?

[tall turtle]

Update overhaul lib

0.2.9 specifically patched that crash

[storm adder]

it's throwing an exception on trying to start the game, is that normal for this update?

[tall turtle]

What game version are you using

[storm adder]

The current version

[tall turtle]

Stable or unstable

[storm adder]

Stable

And can confirm that using any ranged weapon causes the game to crash still, despite having latest overhaul lib

[tall turtle]

And CO version 0.3.9

[storm adder]

I do not have that version of CO, let me try that

So it does allow me to use vanilla weapons without crashes, but now crossbows and firearms are no longer in my files? Not sure what happened there

yeah for whatever reason, despite having them installed, all of my crossbows/firearms have disappeared in game world and I can't spawn them in creative.

[tall turtle]

Are those mods also up to date?

[hollow pasture]

Make sure you're installing using the 1 click install. Using external apps like winrar can sometimes cause weird behavior with CO

[vagrant vapor]

it still does, Javelins work though.

[brave canyon]

I can try to take a peek later today at the inventories for CO and see if I can’t find the right one to try grabbing. It might not be until the afternoon though.

[final garden]

The help would be greatly appreciated. No rush, though

[final garden]

I think I might be close to finding a solution by looking through the exoskeleton code. Looks like it has a light that activates when you press L, so if I can figure out how it accesses the player's armour, I can probably use the same method

[brave canyon]

Oh that's a good idea yeah

I can try taking a peek at things as well in a bit

If you still are having trouble at least! And damn, did you see that other armor mod that got posted?

[final garden]

I did not, no!

[final garden]

Where? (I hope my work wasn't made obsolete)

[brave canyon]

Oh I don't think your work is obsolete at all, but they just also have really nice looking armor models! I'll grab a link

https://mods.vintagestory.at/show/mod/25550

[final garden]

Oh woah!

That stuff looks great!

[brave canyon]

Yeaaah, it's kinda sick as hell, I'd kinda love to use it with yours :P

I'm a sucker for armor-weapon variety hahah

[final garden]

That icon art they did is incredible, too

Oh! And I found where in the overhaullib the armorinventory and other assorted stuff is. I could actually be done if I could just figure out how to go from the inventory manager to armorinventory

[brave canyon]

Aah, I believe you just need to find what the ArmorInventory is named, and you can request it from the Inventory Manager

[brave canyon]

Oh, okay, it looks like CO might just override the player's armor/clothing inventory fully with it's own.

https://i.imgur.com/f1Ju6HB.png

This is in the CO ModSystem, checking if the CO ArmorInventory is the player's InventoryCharacter

Which I believe holds the clothing and armor slots in vanilla.

https://github.com/maltiez2/vsmod_Overhaullib/blob/master/source/Framework/ArmorSystems/ArmorInventory.cs

Then that ArmorInventory is defined in OverhaulLib here, and it looks like there's helper methods to find the specific slots you are looking for

[final garden]

Hmmm. The previous method I was using was by accessing the inventory through vanilla global constants

[brave canyon]

... Oh hey.

It looks like Maltiez actually has a class made for you perhaps :P

https://github.com/maltiez2/vsmod_Overhaullib/blob/master/source/Framework/ArmorSystems/ItemWearalbeArmor.cs

Scroll down here and there's a https://i.imgur.com/PRsrL3G.png

https://i.imgur.com/4e5J8wS.png

[final garden]

Oh woah. He already did the work, and looks like he used the better method

[brave canyon]

Yeah, haha. I just came across that :P

It looks like all you need to do is get the playerEntity, then follow a similar call like the GetGearInventory he uses here and there, check that it's the ArmorInventory and you can cast it to that (or vice versa)

Then you just need to have the ArmorType for your helmets and you can get the fitting slot IDs from that

[final garden]

Yeah, might end up redoing my script to use the better method. Currently opened and closed are variants of the same helmet (with separate stats, too), but I'm sure I can use the attributes bool method to switch it around

[final garden]

Not entirely sure how to keep the stats connected to the attributes, though. I.E. Closed having different stats from opened

[brave canyon]

It miiiight need a bit of editing to keep the stat difference but hmm

[final garden]

Well, would I be able to essentially add more attributes to this part here?

Basically have a PlayerStatsClosed and a PlayerStatsOpened alongside the VisorStateAttribute?

Then when it switches the shapes, it also sets the PlayerStats = PlayerStats{Opened/Closed}?

[brave canyon]

Uhhh

Is it currently - Yeah okay you said it above

It's a separate variant

I remember seeing there was ArmorStatsByAttribute so

If you look at that, you can probably figure out how to add different stats based on if it has the opened or closed attribute perhaps?

It might need more code work perhaps but it probably would be easy to just have a toggle between two sets of stats based on one attribute.

Since if it's like the other stats-by-attribute for weapons, those are attributes that determine the stats... Which, actually, come to think of it you could just utilize even that to like, when you press the button to toggle it open/closed, get the state and then just apply the proper stats as needed to the respective attributes.

[final garden]

Which weapons are stats by attribute? I hadn't realized that was a thing

[brave canyon]

Oh, I haven't fully looked into it yet myself haha

But I know that Maltiez added stats from attributes

And I saw there was the stats from attributes set up for armor as well haha

[final garden]

Ah

[hollow pasture]

These are stunning!

[keen veldt]

Use dnspy and look at the mod

If you can’t get the GitHub source page

but I’m p sure it’s in this chat

[robust pond]

Thought I recognized that art in your pfp. Good artist

[final garden]

Yeah, I was looking in the GitHub, just kept missing all the useful parts

[final garden]

Well I still can't seem to get it working and now I have this bug whenever I try to use combat overhaul as well: The items aren't visible in the UI anymore

Wait, why is the data listed twice...?

[ashen matrix]

joking response: to make sure you saw the info

[final garden]

Apparently I need it. Though this might imply somewhere that the data got messed up in the JSON

I had my bird with me when I was programming, so now I worry he jumped on the keys and messed something up that I missed...

[final garden]

Alright, I figured out the cause of that bug... UI and data duplicate is fixed

Still not sure why this code keeps returning that SlotWithVisor is empty...

I even checked at one point if CO was null, and it isn't, so it has to be getting the player's armor inventory, right?

[balmy tartan]

ooooo you gonna be able to flip up the helmets and whatnot?

[final garden]

You already can, just not with Combat Overhaul compatibility. I didn't want to release it until it had that compatibility, though

[balmy tartan]

oh?

[final garden]

The current state of the mod is that nearly everything works except if you have combat overhaul, you can't press V to open/close the visor like you can normally, because it doesn't seem to find the helmet

But even I myself play with combat overhaul, so I don't want to release it until it works even with CO, since I imagine most armour enthusiasts would also use CO

I probably just need to look over the stuff like Maltiez' exosuits and see if they ever access the itemslot

[brave canyon]

They might, yeah... But I've not used it myself, so I dunno :<

[final garden]

Using the HelmetsWithVisors class would require a huge rework of my mod, too. So while I do plan on doing that, I wanted to get this working first

Since the HelmetsWithVisors class method looked pretty complicated and I am quite unfamiliar with what it does

[balmy tartan]

ooooooo, is there any reason to put your visor up/down besides RP?

[final garden]

Mechanically, a raised visor gives you lowered debuffs on aiming and bow speed, but a lowered visor protects your face while raised does not. I'd also like to add sounds for the visor in the future and have toyed with the idea of making an config option that causes visors to hinder visions similar to a minecraft jack o lantern

Also, you will not get hungry as quickly and will heal a bit faster if your helmet is raised

This encourages players to keep their helmets up unless in combat

[slender ice]

Hi, has anyone tried using https://mods.vintagestory.at/show/mod/25550 these armor mods with CO? I am wondering if they are still usable even if no manual compatibility exists yet. I think CO did some kind of auto-patching for non manually compatible armors i am just unsure how well that works for this.

[stray chasm]

I just tried it

I can post the stats it auto generated for me in a sec

[slender ice]

that would be super cool thanks 😄

[stray chasm]

Iron / Meteoric
Piercing: 11
Slashing: 11
Blunt: 5.5
Walk Speed: -5%
Manipulation Speed: -5%
Steady Aim: -5%
Healing Effectivness: -5%
Hunger Rate: 5%
Durability: 6000

Steel:
Piercing: 14
Slashing: 14
Blunt: 7
Walking Speed: -5%
Manipulation Speed: -5%
Steady Aim: -5%
Healing Effectivness: -5%
Hunger Rate: 5%
Durability: 6000

The helmt, chestpiece, and leggings all share the same stats

The regular steel plate only has 7 in pierce / slash and 6 in blunt

So the greenwich stuff is pretty strong

[slender ice]

Thanks for taking the time to post the stats 😄 , yeah they seem pretty strong but i am happy it works to begin with so ill just take it being a bit op until a manual patch happens

[stray chasm]

Yeah, hopefully the manual patch is soon or someone makes an unofficial patch

[ivory charm]

I mean 14 is insane, there's nothing that can get through that

I'm looking forward to the continuation of the series till the Landsknecht armour

I'm really interested in that one x3

[lofty owl]

I had forgot to take a screenshot pf the spear issue

[hollow pasture]

Yeah, I'm a huge fan of everything I'm seeing on that person's content list

[red ginkgo]

help! the crossbow keeps crashing my game is there anything i can do?

[tall turtle]

Is your overhaul lib up to date?

[red ginkgo]

ill check

ok so i updated it and i think that fixed it

thanks for the help!

[fallow surge]

It is recommended to use 1.20.10 version with same game version for multiplayer, and 1.20.12 for singleplayer.
1.20.11 and 1.20.12 broke some stuff

[lilac fulcrum]

what broke?

[final garden]

Some stuff. (People seem to have had some issues with crossbows and other things. Crashes using bows, etc)

[final garden]

Don't mean to bug you, and if you're not up to it then don't worry about it, I'm sure I'll figure it out eventually, but I nearly got the visors working with CO but have been having trouble getting the itemslot for the head armour with CO's new slots.

Likewise, I saw that there was a helmetwithvisor class (after I wrote most of my code) so I plan on using that once I do a rewrite of my code for optimization

[stray chasm]

I thought that was fixed?.

[final garden]

Not sure on the specifics, to be honest

[fallow surge]

Look into ArmorInventory class

[final garden]

Yeah, I have been

[fallow surge]

IndexFromArmorType should work

[final garden]

It always tells me that the slot is empty. Maybe I'm getting the inventory wrong or something

[fallow surge]

Dunno, cant debug it remotely

[hard dirge]

Yeah I'm crashing whilst holding a crossbow, game doesn't even give me a crash log 🙃

[final garden]

I don't want to waste your time, though. So I'll keep trying to figure out where I'm going wrong! The picture I shared should have the issue in it, and I think the problem lies in how I am trying to access the armorInventory. Thanks for your help, though, it's good to know I am on the right trail

[hard gale]

Hi, im the author of the mod... More and more people are asking about the compatibility. And as @final garden says, it makes sense that armor enthusiasts will be using the CO. So im slowly shifting my focus on it.

Right now i want to finish Templar part of the series, with the CO in mind regarding the size of the shapes. Then i might to look back on Greenwich And Gothic to reshape them a little so they fit the middle and lower layers and make an official patch that will allow to (hopefully) use all three parts of the series in combination with CO. While also being somewhat balanced.

@fallow surge can i turn to you if i have some questions while patching?

[hollow pasture]

I don't mean to speak for Maltiez, but given his current pattern of continued appeared preoccupation, you'll be hard pressed to find help from him. The best thing with regards to patching would be to look at mods that already have an armor patch and copying whatever they do (I believe whatever mod adds the rust/scrap armor did it quite well)

[hard gale]

Thanks man, i will look into it ⚔️, right now i deconstructed AnMiTech Compatibility mod from propanenko, its good to have more references to study.

[brave canyon]

Yeah, it should be relatively easy enough to add compatibility, I tried my hand on it before but it was for a super outdated mod really.

I hope you can get it done though! The armors are sick as hell, haha.

No rush though, certainly :P

[final garden]

I've been working on adding compatibility for my own mod, Visored Helmets, if all you need in a basic JSON patch, then it's quite simple. The part that has been giving me trouble is just the C# code for custom functionality

Happy to help with that

[austere phoenix]

I find armor to be way too effective at negating low teir mob damage and only kind of decent at negating high teir damage. How can i change this?

Like, drifters deal .1 damage when wearing full forlorn and steel chainmail

and bell head shivers deal 15 damage

[final garden]

That's mostly because of damage type. Proper armour mostly negates damage, but a bellhead does blunt, so unless you have padded under armour, you'll take lots of damage

[austere phoenix]

Is there a way to make it so proper armor dosent negate all damage?

like, having it capped out at 60% damage resitence

would make it so drifters arent dealing .1 damage

[final garden]

You could try configlib

[next saffron]

i don't see why you would want this but ^

[hollow cargo]

Anyone else having issues with overhaul lib?

[hard gale]

@final garden Thanks for the offer, i manage for now. Honestly, i spent whole yesterday meddling with shapes to make them fit all the CO layers and im just ... not a big fan of the bulkier model ... like really, maybe its my OCD but with all the decorations, there is so much more clipping etc... The seraph model inside is just too skiny to not feel weird. Especially around the hip area. I wonder if there is a way to disable textures of the Middle and Skin layer, maybe through the "disableElements" attribute. But i have no idea how to figure it out.

I might honestly just go with the compromise in compatibility, and make my armors fit all the layers at once. Im really not sure yet.

[brave canyon]

You could just not worry about it, and recommend people grab the Vanity Mod to hide the layers

Or even check out how the vanity mod did do it.

[hard gale]

Oh i didnt know about Vanity mod! Thats exactly what im looking for! Thanks @brave canyon !

[brave canyon]

Haha, no worries! Glad it could help :P

I know it has integration for hiding the CO layers, so yeah you could just say things will clip and to use that to prevent it haha

Cause frankly, your armor covers everything anyway

It's not like you need to see the gambeson underneath

[hard gale]

True! I will do my best and try to automate it, so the players dont have to do it manually even if there will be Vanity mod dependency. But if i cant do it, i will do just what you say.

[final garden]

Yeah, and I actually find it annoying to see the chainmail sticking out from under helmets but over my breastplate

It makes more sense, though

[brave canyon]

Totally fair