NASIN TENPO KAMALU ★ a numberless toki pona calendar [DISCUSSION]

[sonic lily]

it would only be possible with one moli and if the sijelo began on suno kasi

GODDAMNIT IM A MOLI BIRTHDAY

FUCK

no that kasi counts as kasi sin

iirc

or is it idr

nvm that's not how its implemented and tbh fair enough

[errant comet]

NOOOI

[sonic lily]

ig like the alternative is making the whole previous mun namako just so you can have kasi be alone in weka. which fucks more shit up

it would follow that namako is just treated as being in sin of the next sijelo

[errant comet]

yeah

[sonic lily]

and moli skip la uh. ig my birthday just sometimes lands on toki instead

dude if this was like horoscopes anyone born on moli is so fucked all the time

you could totally do toki pona horoscopes with this shit

which is like. kinda silly and neat honestly

if you're born on pan or moku you will eat a lot
if you're born on lete then you're cold

and apparently i just fucking get death

[errant comet]

if you're born on moli you get a free pass to haunt a single location for as long as you want (everyone else has to pay rent)

[golden island]

nasin Kamalu lore just dropped

Your birth day (day of the week)

Gets you a superpower

/musi

[native stratus]

i do not believe that is true (nvm)

[native stratus]

your birthday is not on the same day of the week every year (nvm)

[golden island]

WAIT

Idea

We make up some lore behind the week names or smth

Create a myth

And then use THAT in horoscopes like

[native stratus]

[errant comet]

we're talking about if birthdays were centered around this calendar

[golden island]

Alright so

lore draft

[native stratus]

sona

[sonic lily]

yeah this is if you wanna have a seperate lunar birthday date (or any sort of yearly occasion)

[golden island]

"pini mun la, kasi li kama"
"ijo li pali e pan tan kasi"
"pan la, kule li kama lon pan"
"ijo li lukin e kule li moku e pan li toki mute"
"taso, ijo toki li kama lon kulupu li utala li moli. taso ijo li ken toki ante lon tenpo wan pi tenpo tu tu la, toki li pali ala e utala li pini e utala. ni la, moli li kama ala. lete li kama."
"lete li kama li pini e utala e moli"
"lete la ko lete walo li lon"
"ko lete walo la, ijo li sitelen e nimi"
"ijo li awen lon lete. ijo li pana e nimi tawa ijo lili ona. tenpo li kama, la seli kin li kama."
"seli la moku sin li kama"
"moku la ijo li pilin pona li lon kulupu"
"kulupu li pali e musi"
"unpa kin li musi. unpa li mama e ijo."
mama li pana e nasin tawa ijo lili ona
nasin li kama lon anpa mun

Alright uh

You can now toki pona horoscope

using the connections

The ones I missed

are connections IDK how to do

[native stratus]

n

are the connections in order

with the calendar

[golden island]

Yes

Yes

[native stratus]

because moku does not come after pan

[golden island]

I need some myth for why moli is skipped

[golden island]

The toki is in the pan thing

[native stratus]

kule comes after pan

[golden island]

There

See it

WAIT WHAT

[native stratus]

kule comes after pan

[golden island]

I MISREAD THE CALENDAR??
It's walo not kule??

[native stratus]

yer

tbh i did the same thing a few days ago when i was memorizing the days

[golden island]

Lemme just

[native stratus]

a a

oh dear

ok there

[golden island]

ni la o lukin

Anyways

Horoscope for kasi and pan lon kasi

"sina kasi la, ni li tenpo suno sina. o pilin pona!"
"sina kama pona lon tenpo ni. o awen."

[native stratus]

yeah nimi is challenging

trying to think of how to connect nimi in there

[golden island]

Also musi to mama

[errant comet]

sex

[native stratus]

sex

[golden island]

Added nimi connection!

[golden island]

Is your statement musi anu seme

[native stratus]

what exactly does that entail

[errant comet]

my original dooms day thing for remembering the name of the days is that nametags are usually white (at least in the part where you write your name) but that isn't very folklore-y

[native stratus]

were they writing things in the snow

or were they naming the snow

[golden island]

Writing in the snow

[native stratus]

perhaps seli could be the snow melting

[golden island]

nnn

Maybe

[native stratus]

ko lete walo la, ijo li sitelen e nimi
nimi li weka tan seli
seli la moku sin li kama

[golden island]

Alright uh

[native stratus]

now this is cool

[golden island]

Can someone write a horoscope

[native stratus]

still need to factor in the moli being skipped

[golden island]

Now that I finished the myths

[native stratus]

though idk how

[errant comet]

"ijo li ken toki mute la, moli li kama ala. moku ona li kama lete."

[golden island]

"taso, ken la, toki li pali ala e utala li pini e utala. ni la, moli li lon ala lon tenpo wan pi tenpo tu tu. lete li kama."

[errant comet]

maybe?

[native stratus]

yes

[golden island]

pona

Uh how do we decide between them

[errant comet]

i like yours we could merge them

[golden island]

Ooh

[errant comet]

"ijo li ken toki ante lon tenpo wan pi tenpo tu tu la, toki li pali ala e utala li pini e utala. ni la, moli li kama ala. lete li kama."

[golden island]

pona nanpa wan tawa mi

Maybe we could add this whole horoscope-ish thing as like

A sitelen sitelen note above some explanations of the calendar

[native stratus]

why did the pan become colorful

[golden island]

There's an official google doc, right?

[golden island]

They added colour to the bread

to make it look better

Lemme change the connects

[native stratus]

n

mi lukin

[errant comet]

ala 😔

[golden island]

Damn

[errant comet]

i do wanna maybe make a website for it to include most of the sona pona article and the ilo that jan jami made tho so if that ends up going anywhere we could add it there

[golden island]

ni la o lukin!

Anyways

Can someone write a horoscope with this stuff

it seems cool

[native stratus]

so they received the pan from the kasi

[golden island]

Yes

[native stratus]

how

[golden island]

Wheat

They harvested

I'm now gonna quickly add the skip explanation

[errant comet]

could work even better for corn and rice

[sonic lily]

ill host my page on miton.si and get decent CSS on it someday™️

[native stratus]

wheat is pan

but also kasi

[golden island]

It's also kasi

Yes

[golden island]

Yeah basically

[native stratus]

so the kasi didn't give them pan

[golden island]

THey harvested

[native stratus]

they made pan from the kasi

[golden island]

And made pan out of their harvest

Yeah

[golden island]

kinda did

But I'll rework it

[native stratus]

i'm gonna write the lore as i understand it

[golden island]

Oki

Please do :D /gen

[echo girder]

wait i need to know what i am now

jan jami ↩️

[Reply to:](#1266079793884041266 message) GODDAMNIT IM A MOLI BIRTHDAY

[errant comet]

what's ur birthdate

[echo girder]

mar 10 / mar 15

[errant comet]

what year?

[echo girder]

oh wait does it matter the year

[errant comet]

yeah the weeks fluctuate per year

[echo girder]

mar 10 2024 will do (formation anniversary), i don't particularly want to give out the year for the second

[errant comet]

ale li pona

ok it should be penpo weka luka pi waso tawa :D

[native stratus]

toki kon pi nimi suno

this is the lore behind the day names ☀️

_pini mun la, kasi li kama.
ijo li pali e pan kepeken kasi.
ona li kule pona e pan.
ona li lukin e kule li moku e pan li toki mute.

taso toki ike la, utala en moli a li kama lon kulupu!
taso toki ante li ken; tenpo wan pi tenpo tu tu la, ike en moli li kama ala.
utala li lon anu lon ala la, lete li kama li pini kin e utala e moli.

lete la, ko lete walo li lon.
ijo li sitelen e nimi a lon ko lete walo!
taso seli li kama li weka e ko e nimi.

seli la, moku sin li ken li kama.
moku ni la, ijo li pilin pona li lon kulupu.
kulupu li pali e musi a!

unpa kin li musi; ni la, mama li kama lon.
mama li pana e nasin tawa ijo lili ona.
nasin li kama lon anpa mun._

-# credit goes to @golden island
-# [original message](#1266079793884041266 message)

[echo girder]

awesome

meli Siliwa 💜 ⪩(ᐢᗜᐢ)⪨ ↩️

[Reply to:](#1266079793884041266 message) ok it should be penpo weka luka pi waso tawa :D 📎

[native stratus]

this lore is dope

[echo girder]

it is a!

that is really cool

[native stratus]

be sure to credit nanpa Walijo on sona pona a

[echo girder]

(what does this mean btw? i can't make much sense of it lol)

meli Siliwa 💜 ⪩(ᐢᗜᐢ)⪨ ↩️

[Reply to:](#1266079793884041266 message) ok it should be penpo weka luka pi waso tawa :D 📎

[native stratus]

should be mun weka luka pi waso tawa

[echo girder]

a i see

what's the weka though

[native stratus]

mun weka is the 5th mun of the month

it follows the large cycle used for the years

[echo girder]

oh right the weeks i forgot about those

[native stratus]

sin > kama > awen > tawa > weka

(> namako)

[native stratus]

i do still need to make sense of the last two sentences

are the mama giving the ijo lili a physical nasin or a metaphorical nasin

and why would that happen under the moon

[echo girder]

i would think metaphorical nasin

ona li pana e nasin ona tawa jan lili

like

nasin of understanding the world

maybe they use the night sky, with all the mun in it, as a reference, to show how the world is

[errant comet]

true

[sturdy lion]

mine is on tenpo suno kulupu tawa pi tenpo sijelo lawa :3

which ðis year would beeee

29/09

[golden island]

:D

[golden island]

Metaphorical

[golden island]

They're teaching the ijo lili beneath the night sky

[native stratus]

a

[golden island]

And then when the mun finishes
the suno comes, which raises the kasi

I'm gonna make a horoscope for the day

[golden island]

I feel like usually the mythology comes first then the names
But it was fun to make the like
Story

Also I love the fact that the last 2 bits are the most like
Reflective
mama to nasin and nasin to mun

[errant comet]

true

[golden island]

Also is this a suli enough thing to be acfed to the sona pona page

[native stratus]

ye i really like it

plus it provides a way to remember the days

[golden island]

:D

[native stratus]

what the fuck discord just made me jump all the way back to the beginning of the post

[errant comet]

rn the nasin tenpo penpo page is still linked to my personal profile because it isn't a big enough nasin yet but if we start spreading propaganda we could suli e ni

but that also means i can add whatever i want and nobody can stop me >:3

[golden island]

Going to start being a propagandist for penpo rn!

Seeing as we have like
A clock tied to nasin Kamalu

I’m going to make smth for that :D

[native stratus]

i'm already spreading propaganda irl by having the official sheets on the fridge

[errant comet]

the nasin tenpo (nimisin) alliance li wawa 💪

[native stratus]

[errant comet]

ironically i don't even have them printed out yet 😭 my home printer's out of ink bleh

i might print them at school tmrw

[golden island]

I must join a

What should I pali

[native stratus]

my mom thinks the calendar is very cool

[golden island]

So will the myrh be added anu seme? /genq /nf

[native stratus]

kin la o lukin e ni mi

[golden bay]

nasin tenpo jami 🤤

[native stratus]

[errant comet]

yea i'll add it :D

i think i wanna make it a su type image tho so there isn't just a block of text on the wiki page lol (also it'd look cooler :O)

[golden island]

:DDDD

[golden island]

Maybe sitelen sitelen it

[errant comet]

i do not know sitelen sitelen 😔

[golden island]

There’s renderers onlinr

[errant comet]

true...

i also wanna make little doodles in the su evan dahm art style because i really like it

[native stratus]

yuh

[errant comet]

ok what does "ona li kule pona e pan" mean i don't think i really get it

[native stratus]

decorate

with colors

i interpreted it as them frosting a cake

[errant comet]

ohh

[little phoenix]

jan ale o

I noticed smth

My calendar has penpo

Noooooo

[native stratus]

[little phoenix]

I still have the Drive link to the kamalus so

[golden island]

Ye that was my interpretation

[night timber]

Successfully created note nasin tenpo penpo day poem with ID #57c650!

nasin tenpo penpo day poem

toki kon pi nimi suno

tawa nasin tenpo penpo

this is the lore behind the day names ☀️

_pini mun la, kasi li kama.
ijo li pali e pan kepeken kasi.
ona li kule pona e pan.
ona li lukin e kule li moku e pan li toki mute.

taso toki ike la, utala en moli a li kama lon kulupu!
taso toki ante li ken; tenpo wan pi tenpo tu tu la, ike en moli li kama ala.
utala li lon anu lon ala la, lete li kama li pini kin e utala e moli.

lete la, ko lete walo li lon.
ijo li sitelen e nimi a lon ko lete walo!
taso seli li kama li weka e ko e nimi.

seli la, moku sin li ken li kama.
moku ni la, pilin kulupu ona li kama wawa.
kulupu li pali e musi a!

unpa kin li musi; ni la, ijo mute li kama mama.
mama li pana e nasin tawa ijo lili ona.
nasin li kama lon anpa mun._

-# tan nanpa Walijo tan telo Ipi
-# [original message](#1266079793884041266 message)

#57c650

[errant comet]

jupi

[native stratus]

neato

[golden island]

Any progress on them?

[errant comet]

i did a couple but stopped at kule because i didn't rlly get it and then i forgot to get back into it lol

i'll try working on them today afternoon or tomorrow

[golden island]

Ooh can you send the kasi and pan

[errant comet]

one sec

jupi

[native stratus]

oo

pona lukin

[errant comet]

k i'm leaving it at this for now bc i gotta pay attention lol 😭

pona

[errant comet]

ok i've got these rn (had to cut out the sitelen Lasina and shorten some of the phrases because i'd run out of space otherwise) i'll continue tomorrow after school

[burnt sky]

suwi!

[clever pilot]

could you perhaps make the day names bold or a different color

[errant comet]

yea i will i'm saving that for the end tho

[clever pilot]

pona

[golden island]

kulijo mute

[golden island]

sina pali ala pali sin?

[errant comet]

tenpo ni la ala, taso tenpo kama pona la mi ni

mi lon tomo sona lon tenpo ni

[golden island]

a, mi sona

[fresh plume]

Reminder for @indigo hollow

Reminder from YAGPDB

remind mun Satun (saturnb) to learn how to use nasin tenpo penpo

[native stratus]

tenpo sina li kama

[indigo hollow]

@tidal granite, here's your reminder to learn how to use this

[tidal granite]

mi o kama sona e ni lon tenpo kama lili

[native stratus]

currently says it's kasi awen when it should be kasi kama

i see why this happened

[errant comet]

ok lineart finished yay i might color it somewhat (also loje edition because i felt like it)

[clever pilot]

ijo Unpa

[golden island]

To quote ijo unpa:
"mu"

[errant comet]

true..

[sonic lily]

wait should it though

the last week was week #2, no

so sin is all the days before/including the first mun (this also can roll over to the final days of the previous sijelo)

kama is all the days till the second mun

[errant comet]

yeah

[native stratus]

suwi

[native stratus]

the long cycle is simply meant to replace the prior numbering system. today would be kasi nanpa tu because it's the second kasi of the month, so that correlates to kasi kama

[sonic lily]

ok then we just fundementally have different ideas

[native stratus]

with your system, namako days wouldn't even exist

yet we agreed they would occur on days that happen 6 times in a month

under your system the first and sixth occurrence would both be sin

[sonic lily]

yes, hence why namako exists

[native stratus]

so then you're also saying that the final two days of this month are both namako days

or are they sin

[sonic lily]

they're sin
namako only happens if you have a duplicated date

[native stratus]

whatever the case, i don't like the fact that the month can end on sin days because that goes against the very meaning of sin

[sonic lily]

i consider it a seperate cycle

i think it's easier to mentally figure out mun than it is to count the occurences of the day

[sonic lily]

it's anticipating to the first mun of the next month

i also kinda was working based on the week colors on Siliwa's calendars

[native stratus]

indeed i did notice the colors favor your system

[sonic lily]

weeks don't suddenly split between months either usually

[native stratus]

also truthful

whatever meli Siliwa says is what I'm gonna do so I'll wait for her to say something

[sonic lily]

both options feel weird just in different ways i suppose

[native stratus]

indeed

numbering the weeks was initially discouraged anyway

now that i think about it i like your system more anyway

[errant comet]

i like it too

[native stratus]

i like this word

[native stratus]

mi wile toki e ni · lipu ni li pona mute a

[sturdy lion]

ðis feels wrong ðough @_@

[oblique garden]

2 things

What is "sike lili suli" here?

Why mun instead of penpo?

[native stratus]

penpo has been phased out in favor of moon as the calendar doesn't exactly line up with tenpo penpo

and the sike lili and sike suli refer to the small and large cycles for the years

[oblique garden]

I see we have also replaced the numbers with sin-kawa-awen-tawa-weka for weeks. How does that work?

[native stratus]

the cycle simply repeats every 5 weeks

ignoring what month a week is in

so the first week of the month is sin, as well as any days that bleed over from the last week of the previous month

[oblique garden]

In the toki kon pi nimi suno why ijo and not jan?

[oblique garden]

What does sijelo refer to? It's always just sijelo. Is that supposed to be year?

[oblique garden]

Nvm. It refers to the month (lawa-sijelo-luka-poki-noka). mi pakala

[errant comet]

dejanification for people who don't like being called jan (technically this is a fictional population so we could've called them jan but. idk we just went for ijo instead and nobody disagreed so it stayed lol)

[oblique garden]

Now we just need a way to remember the little year cycle

[errant comet]

the animal words were ordered by approximate evolution if that helps

[oblique garden]

So kala-pipi-akesi-soweli-waso-kijetesantakulu ?

[errant comet]

yep

[native stratus]

yer

[oblique garden]

Why is nimi Ijo's name Unp? (uta nasin palisa)

[errant comet]

ijo Unpa (using ssk pi linja lili because i wanted it to be compact)

it was originally Unwa (with wan instead of palisa) but the unpa joke was funny so i changed it

[oblique garden]

What is ssk pi linja lili?

[errant comet]

nsk* my bad

[[nasin sitelen kalama pi linja lili]]

[fresh plume]

https://sona.pona.la/wiki/nasin_sitelen_kalama_pi_linja_lili

[chrome mortar]

so sitelen seli kiwen pilled

[pale river]

does anyone have a link to the nasin tenpo penpo converter?

[errant comet]

it's pinned here and linked on the sona pona page

[pale river]

oh cool thanks

[golden bay]

i was born on toki tawa luka pi kijetesantakalu tawa

[errant comet]

pona a

[ashen moat]

pona a

[jaunty surge]

How do the cycles work, I'm confused

[errant comet]

every year the small cycle goes up by one, and every time the small cycle completes a rotation the big cycle goes up by 1

2001 - kala sin
2002 - akesi sin
2003 - pipi sin
2004 - soweli sin
2005 - waso sin
2006 - kijetesantakalu sin
2007 - kala kama
etc.

first word is the step of the small cycle and second word is the step of the big cycle

[jaunty surge]

I see

[golden bay]

people gayify the cakes? count me in

[clever pilot]

what day is today?

i see

[chrome mortar]

mi kepeken nasin Kamalu lon About Me mi!

(i'm not actually on holiday yet, i still have 24 hours of Oseja time)

[errant comet]

aaa pona

[snow wraith]

@sonic lily toki! I was using your ilo tenpo penpo and I noticed that it orders the months by lawa, luka, sijelo, poka, noka but @errant comet's page on sona pona gives the order lawa, sijelo, luka, poka, noka. Is this a bug or was the order changed at some point?

[errant comet]

ooh wait do they?

that's odd

[sonic lily]

is that a miscopy on my part?

[snow wraith]

Can test the tool with October 19-20 this year to see it go from lawa to luka

and then it goes to sijelo 73 days after (or however many)

The official sheets do appear to give the same order as the sona pona page (sijelo and then luka)

[errant comet]

that is the intended order yea

[sonic lily]

oops! I'll correct that later

-remindme 6h o pona e ilo tenpo

[fresh plume]

Set a reminder in 6 hours from now (<t:1726888904:f>)
View reminders with the reminders command

[snow wraith]

Cheers! I love the tool by the way. I actually think this calendar is extremely cool and, after having looked more into it, I want to see about using nasin tenpo penpo for that novelty passport design I was working on.

Has there been any exploration on how to write dates before 2001 (or after 2030)? I was thinking you could do like "before/after [nanpa] generations" and treat it as relative to this generation

My Toki Pona is very rusty but would "before/after" be expressed with, say, monsi and sinpin?

[errant comet]

monsi and sinpin are discouraged from being used for time metaphors, as the "the past is behind and the future is ahead" idea of time is pretty west centric and other cultures don't think about it like that

but yes, past & future generations are expressed with "(year name) from the past" and "(year name) from the future" if they need to be distinguished. though i'm not entirely sure how yet

i've see people use "(year name) majuna" for past generations and i think that or "(year name) pini" are good

rn i don't have a good solution for future generations because "kama" is part of the progress cycle and could confuse things, but i guess that'll only become a problem in 6 years so 🤷‍♀️ /

[snow wraith]

I see! Well, and while the whole point is to minimize numbers as much as possible, I think the outermost layer necessarily has to be expressed or expressable with numbers so you can select an arbitrary period. And that would be necessary in my case for folks born before 1971, for example

so it would have to be… how many generations in the past, how many generations in the future, I imagine

It would be absolutely unhinged but it would be amusing to use lukin for the past and oko for the future

[errant comet]

lol maybe

i mean 30 years is a pretty sizable gap and pretty observable in human ages so maybe you could get away with not specifying

[snow wraith]

… Wow, that's actually a really good point

[errant comet]

do you also have people's ages listed? because if then that makes deriving cycles pretty trivial

[snow wraith]

Nope, no ages since the booklet should ideally last several decades if they take care of it (and if they still care about it for that long)

[errant comet]

alright makes sense

[snow wraith]

but, as you say, you could take a look at someone and make a decent guess as to whether it was [given day] in the current 30-year span, the previous 30-year span, or the one before that (or the one before that for overachievers)

[errant comet]

yeah !!

[snow wraith]

Thanks so much! sina pona 😊

[errant comet]

sina pona kin ! o pali pona :D

if you have any other questions feel free to ask

[fresh plume]

Reminder for @sonic lily

Reminder from YAGPDB

o pona e ilo tenpo

[snow wraith]

That reminds me, I also wanted to ask if the tool correctly calculates dates outside of 2001-2030 lol

[errant comet]

it does not currently 😔 i think before august 2001 it starts saying undefined bc it doesn't have that data

i'll try calculating the last 30 year cycle and i'll relay it to jan jami to add to the ilo when i'm able

[sonic lily]

it should calculate it dynamically. it's probably broken because of poor testing

[errant comet]

ohh

last time i checked it said undefined, i'll try checking again

oh nevermind it does work

@snow wraith o mi pakala, it does calculate dates outside the range :D

[snow wraith]

I've been telling all my friends, and my mother over dinner, about nasin tenpo penpo even though absolutely none of them are tokiponists lol

It's such a neat system, very fun

[errant comet]

lol thank you

[sonic lily]

It does it on VERY far dates i think

Probably an issue of integer precision or overflows or something

it seems to cut off at 100 AD?

msa but really unimportant

[sonic lily]

also, i'll have to set up some kinda calendar generator for sure

[sonic lily]

fixed this

[errant comet]

yay :D

[golden island]

Wait, I have an idea
Turn the leap day into "namako", no month or day, betwwen luka and poka

It'll be closer to the leap in Gregorian, making it easier to convert

Also, it not being a weekday would make every 3rd year start with the same day, allowing for easy conversion

[errant comet]

ehh that'd probably be confusing

anyways hi nanpa Walijo

[golden island]

Hiya!

[golden island]

Less confusing than like
The system we have rn, the weekday system for dates in a month is hard to remember

[errant comet]

is it?

[golden island]

Kinda imo

[pale river]

would it be a bad idea for all future changes to not affect the current year so that people don’t have to readjust dates

would that just confuse things more with irregular years and stuff

[errant comet]

yeah we've made sure they don't

everything is anchored on the already released kijetesantakalu tawa calendar

[pale river]

oh cool

[golden island]

I feel like anchoring this to the gregorian calendar was a nasa idea because we didn't go all in

As a result, the only time there's a full cycle of all year names, and leap years, is 1200 years

Also the moli skip is kinda weird now that we weka'd penpo

I can't make a doomsday rule as a result

[errant comet]

i mean we made it there's technically an explanation for it

[golden island]

Ye buttt

There can't be a doomsday thing as a resut

[errant comet]

fair

[golden island]

Or maybe...

toki nasa mi
We restructure the weeks

Maybe 19 days by default
18 when leaped

It would make it just a bit closer to like
perfect day structure

[errant comet]

why that many

[golden island]

19*3+18=75

75 days in a cycle

74 days in a month, usually\

Roughly corresponds

It's not PONA tho

Alternatively, we could make it leap every 5 weeks
And then we'd have perfect alignment

Save for leap-poka

[pale river]

why is it 1200 and not 120

[golden island]

400 years is when the leap year cycles

There's this one rule

If they year is divisible, it leaps!
But if it's also divisible by 100, it doesn't.
BUT if it's divisible by 400 it does!

[pale river]

oh interesting

so 1900 wasn’t a leap year and 2000 was?

[full fog]

yes

[pale river]

ahh i see

[sonic lily]

this disaligns it with the actual moon

the whole point is that it's moon based

[sonic lily]

what does this mean

[errant comet]

i guess xe means that know that tenpo penpo isn't on the line we could just not have moli be skipped at all and just have every week be 15 days

(too late for that now tho)

[sonic lily]

mun still falls on tenpo penpo

it's just not that name

[worthy tree]

it's already non-pona, forgive me for saying

5 month/seasons of 73 days

15 day weeks, and skipping one day every 4 weeks

unless it's changed significantly since then, this system is not simple

[golden island]

Wait, what if...

12 days.
Leaps every 6 weeks to add an extra day

Every month EXCEPT a leap month will start with the same day!

[worthy tree]

I've actually worked on a system with 5 "bonus" days in it

which is still a little unpona, but I think there is a cap on getting 365 to play nice

the system is:
6 days to a week
5 weeks to a month
1 day + 3 months to a season
1 day + 4 seasons to a year

(not to shill my own calendar in a different person's calendar thread)

and the way it works out, every season aligns with the gregorian weekdays the same way (91 / 7 = 13)

[golden island]

I feel nasin penpo li kulijo mute EXCEPT the week system

I'm gonna draft my new week system

[worthy tree]

I do like the 5 divisioned year

it doesn't make much sense from a weather perspective, not being even

but it is cool

big agree on the week system too

[golden island]

Here in India, it kinda gets the weather right

Absolutely right

luka is meh, poka is hot, noka is hotter, lawa is rainy, sijelo is somewhat cold

[worthy tree]

my feeling is, "once a week" should be an amount of time that is somewhere between "often" and "an occasion"

and that once every 7 days hits that pretty well

so bumping that up more than a factor of two is a little much

you can say "twice a week" but 15 isn't divisible by 2, you could say "three times a week" but then you have to keep 3 days in your head...

and also you have to memorise the order of 15 words, that don't even have a throughline

they're mostly just like that because several months ago someone picked them at random, and no one changed it

[golden island]

Having 7 days is ike lili tawa mi

No twice a week

No thrice a week

No 4 times a week

Just once a week

or 7 times a week

[worthy tree]

yeah

another benefit of a 6 day week is how divisible it is

similar to a 12 day week, but I say: just do it on a 2 week cycle

this is a chart of everything a 12 day week has that a 6 day week doesn't easily have, and the best way to express it

12 day week      |  6 day week
-----------------+----------------------
once a week      |  once every 2 weeks
3 times per week |  once every 4 days (cycles every 2 weeks)

plus 6 day weeks with 5 week months gives you a nice 30 day month to divide even nicer :3

(ignore the extra day every 3 months and once a year)

alright I'm gonna try to lape for the second time tonight

[golden island]

oki

[sonic lily]

calendars aren't pona

also see relevant xkcd

[sonic lily]

the weeks aren't really weeks

i think week is just applying english nomenclature to a system that doesn't really match a traditional calendar

[sonic lily]

this is false. they're based on the titles of lipu tenpo in chronological order

[sonic lily]

i like this system because it challenges a lot of preconceived notions about calendars and is really in touch with toki pona culture

the only reason "penpo" isn't a day name is because it sort of was out of place in a serious proposal, but it's still named "mun" and matches, hence i think it works very well because tenpo pi toki pona taso marks the end of a mun

ultimately though this went through a lot of thought and i think it's harmful to the adoption of the system to keep changing it (this partially is because this got rushed to meet the deadline of being presented on sptp)

[errant comet]

yeah i agree

[worthy tree]

what are the titles of lipu tenpo based on?

[sonic lily]

the.. their contents?

[worthy tree]

so I am wrong that they were picked months ago

but I am right that there's no throughline

lipu tenpo articles' topics are not related in some way

[sonic lily]

okay and find me any set of 15 words that would have a logical order

[worthy tree]

well that's my qualm

15 is a huge number for a toki pona system to try to handle

so just make it a smaller number

[sonic lily]

that's why IT DOESNT USE NUMBERS

????

that is LITERALLY the point

[worthy tree]

[errant comet]

i mean we can't really do that now can we

[sonic lily]

this too

[worthy tree]

it has 15 days, which is a number

it handles those 15 days with a sort of number relex

[sonic lily]

yeah because it lines up with a natural cycle

[worthy tree]

not really?

the moon cycle averages to about 15 days, but it's far from consistent

[errant comet]

the calendar's already in a usable state and people are actually starting to use it for stuff (like the lipu jan pi tawa ma), changing stuff now would be detrimental

[sonic lily]

yeah and that's WHY MOLI GETS SKIPPED

it is designed to line up with the lunar cycle. this was all thought out

the lunar cycle is ~29.5 days so every 59 days a day gets skipped

[worthy tree]

no

the length of time between moon cycles changes throughout the year

[sonic lily]

by like. seven hours

[errant comet]

in theory it should've been, but the moon cycle is very erratic and so the calendar desynced incredibly quickly

[worthy tree]

by kind of a lot

[errant comet]

hence the penpo to mun switch

because for it to actually represent every tenpo penpo accurately it would have to be a full lunar calendar and lunar calendars cannot be consistent because the moon isn't consistent

[sonic lily]

right lunisolar is inherently gonna be like that but it's more or less accurate

and like it's generally synced up

i was a very mean earlier though my bad

[errant comet]

besides, gregorian weeks were based on the moon cycle too (4 divisions of a loop instead of 2) and were standardized to just 7

[sonic lily]

what exactly is your proposed alternative other than just changing week length

[worthy tree]

I'm being sorta mean too, because I'm sorta criticising the idea behind this calendar

in that a calendar can not be synced with the lunar phases because the sun and moon don't line up

[sonic lily]

okay but like. i don't understand the criticism other than "it's not actually truly synced to the moon" because lots of lunisolar calendars exist

[worthy tree]

it's not synced to the moon exactly anyways, so why not make a more memorable, like, 5 day week

and then you can have 6 weeks to a full moon cycle

and then do moli skipping anyways

[errant comet]

ok what about the months then

with the current 5 month system now you'd have to count like 30 weeks per month

and if you add more months that are shorter well then you have to name those too

[sonic lily]

that is defo wrong math but im assuming hyperbole x3

[worthy tree]

well yeah, with the current 5 month system

but why is there a 5 month system?

[sonic lily]

okay so all you're doing is adding more months

[worthy tree]

does that link up to the moon phase in some way

[sonic lily]

you're just changing the thing that is a long list to memorize. you are not solving your own problem

[sonic lily]

no, but it links up to the body parts which is VERY memorable and works well

[worthy tree]

I am making one of the lists longer, but not way way longer. 15 day week + 5 day month = 20 words, 5 day week + 12 months = 17 words. also, the months can be divided further for easier memorization

like, into seasons, or something

[sonic lily]

okay but also we have week names

[errant comet]

tbh no i just wanted some sort of unchanging division of the year (since tenpo open la we only had the weeks) and didn't wanna go with a 4 month system since that's season-coded and seasons are nasa

maybe could've done 6 but whatever

[sonic lily]

i think the other thing is you're stuck thinking that this is a traditional calendar, it's not

[errant comet]

5 evenly divides 365 so i went with that and nobody stopped me lol

[sonic lily]

a "month" isn't actually a month it's just the closest english word

[errant comet]

yeah that's true

[worthy tree]

a 4 month system gives you ~91 day months, which approximates the moon pretty well

[errant comet]

yeah that was originally what i had planned but it just didn't end up happening idk

[sonic lily]

i'm going to be honest this feels really unproductive and i'm not going to persist in this conversation

[worthy tree]

so the decision is between something that actually fits the moon cycle (but is similar to the gregorian calendar), and something that is unline the gregorian calendar (but doesn't fit the moon cycle)

[errant comet]

fair

[worthy tree]

fair

and I 100% agree with not changing the system

now

[sonic lily]

there's literally no reason for anything it's all made up. calendars and time systems are made up none of it is real

[errant comet]

frankly idk what we're talking about anymore i'm just talking about this because i like it

[worthy tree]

but I'm saying that I don't think this thing has a clear vision in every part of its design

[sonic lily]

yeah no shit

[worthy tree]

sometimes it wants to fit a moon cycle, sometimes it wants to be simple

[sonic lily]

i think wanting to fit a natural cycle and being simple are both very pona goals

[worthy tree]

and sometimes it just wants to do anything other than the gregorian calendar, even if it conflicts with both those other goals

[errant comet]

i mean i don't entirely disagree but yeah

this calendar was a collaborative effort from the top so a lot of people's ideas crashed into each other

i only really consider it mine because i had the beginning idea it's not like i was really leading it lol

[sonic lily]

this. it's kitbash. the fact that it's got no distinct design philosophy shows that it was a group effort and a compromise between lots of different ideas

[worthy tree]

I just wish that something named "the toki pona calendar," that was going to be spread as much as this, wasn't so rushed

[errant comet]

i think given the circumstances (and my very prominent mistake of thinking this would even be remotely ready for sptp), i consider the final product to be adequate

that was a mistake on my part i'm not gonna deny that

[sonic lily]

everyone agrees on this

it's what it's

for an event that comes yearly it's hard to decide to not participate and i don't think i can fault the decision

[worthy tree]

the year is divided into 5 months because... 365 is divisible by 5. but that doesn't add any simplicity into the system because there's now 73 days in a month, with a 15 day week length

it doesn't have anything to do with the lunar cycle, and in fact makes it harder to follow

generally I feel like the principle idea of toki pona is simplicity

and it seems like this calendar doesn't really attempt to have that aside from whatever happens to crop up

it is cool

to have a system with so many ideas in it

but it also makes it so much harder to use

[sonic lily]

the simplicity of it is in that it avoids numbers. that's the big win imo

[worthy tree]

it's not simple though

and, it kinda doesn't avoid numbers

it uses relexes

instead of "1, 2, 3" it uses "kasi, pan, etc"

it still has ordered lists of words

[sonic lily]

okay but this is a meaningless point. every calendar system will do this

[worthy tree]

which, of course it does

yeah

[errant comet]

monday tuesday wednesday

[worthy tree]

but it doesn't make it "simple" just because it doesn't have arabic numerals

[sonic lily]

why do we have to justify any of this what is even the point

[worthy tree]

if I make a system where every day in the calendar year is given a unique name, that isn't simple

[sonic lily]

go make your own calendar if you hate it so much. i'm done this is stupid

[worthy tree]

1. I have
2. I don't hate this system, I just have problems with it as a "pona" timekeeping system.
3. that's as fair as it was 15 minutes ago

not to get into "I'm numbering my responses now" levels of pissy

[errant comet]

ok i think we should cease this conversation but for one final thing: uhhh the name "the toki pona calendar" was just chosen by me because i genuinely didn't know about any of the other ones lol

but also calling it "a toki pona calendar" sounds like the jack black minecraft movie

[worthy tree]

?

oh like: "a goofy movie"

[errant comet]

ni

[worthy tree]

yeah

but there are other minecraft movies too, so don't tell the big corpos but I think that's a fine name

(they can't know I like anything that they do)

[errant comet]

this definitely isn't the toki pona calendar but (definitely biased opinion alert) i prefer this over the fully numbered gregorian calendar system

though obviously i don't expect this to ever come close to replacing it lol

[worthy tree]

oh, for use in tpt texts I prefer this

I'd even prefer my exaggerated example "every calendar day gets a name" nasin

[errant comet]

i can't wait for palisa nanpa tu

[somber lodge]

palisa?

[errant comet]

you'd have to use every nimi up to ku suli a little under 3 times each for that to work

[worthy tree]

just saying "tenpo Sentenda pi mute tu tu pi nasin Kekolijan" makes me want to never speak another word and go live in the woods

[errant comet]

d

[worthy tree]

I'm a big fan of the "day is represented by 4 characters" feature

especially cool in sitelen pona

[errant comet]

i agree

we even got it down to 3 sans the year

[worthy tree]

yeah

I was wondering, and I swear this is "wondering" and not "I'm trying to criticise again"

where does the year cycle come from

specifically, the animal changes from year to year, instead of its adjective

[errant comet]

i think jan lili Enta suggested the additional progress cycle so the amount of possible names would go up to 30, though their original idea was to have both cycles progress and just go through all the permutations that way but i misunderstood his pitch and we ended up with the current function

the animal cycle was made first though so that's why the progress cycle modifies the animal one and not the other way around

[worthy tree]

I guess one can think of it as like a "calendar ends world ends" type of prediction

the animals are born, the animals age, the animals... leave...

rather than one animal popping into existence, aging, leaving, another animal, etc.

[errant comet]

yeah that works

[snow wraith]

Having a progress cycle that works nearly the same way in two places is extremely based

and I think the system is perfectly pona at giving general/vague ideas of time, even if specific days are difficult to relay.

len suno li kama tawa ma Kanata tawa ma Mewika lon lawa pi pipi awen

I think it's sufficient to say the format is like DWM-YY (day-week-month-year) but it would probably make more sense to think of the "months" as seasons and the "weeks" as months in their own right and just have 14-15 day "months"

The more I think about it, that sounds a lot better actually 😅 and doesn't actually change the system at all, just how we talk about it / translate it in English

but maybe I overlooked something about it

[golden bay]

what date is "nasin kama noka pi kala sin"

[errant comet]

june 17th 2002 (assuming it's this generation's kala sin)

[golden bay]

hmmmm

what if you made a generation marker

e.g. kala sin pini for the previous generation kala sin

[errant comet]

this technically exists but i don't have it standardized because kama is already part of the progress cycle so idk about the readability :P

#1266079793884041266 message

[golden bay]

another addition: 5 pini become a majuna and anything past 5 majuna could be considered weka/jaki

[errant comet]

hmmm wait i just had an idea

lukin? for the future

maybe

[golden bay]

mabye lukin for the next generations, and nasa for the next few and then ken

[pale river]

that sounds kinda arbitrary

[golden bay]

i mean nasa as in unknown and ken and possibility

like ken because the world might not be here jn tenpo kama

[snow wraith]

I still vote lukin for past generations and oko for future generations haha

[wicked seal]

Where's þe website for þe

þingy

[errant comet]

check pinned messages it's there :3

also on the wiki page i thmk

[chrome mortar]

@errant comet

[errant comet]

sina nanpa e tenpo seme

[chrome mortar]

just yyyy

[errant comet]

a

[chrome mortar]

but also

really low numbers do this

[errant comet]

weird

anyways jan jami li pali e ni, mi ala li ni :P

sina ken toki tawa ona

[chrome mortar]

ah, i see

@sonic lily

[sonic lily]

yeah i just don't care

[chrome mortar]

🗿

[lunar canyon]

🗿

[vestal nebula]

undefined

[errant comet]

do you need to know anything about the year 30 though like do you really

[vestal nebula]

i mean i don't

[worthy tree]

I will, in 30 years

[somber lodge]

why would informationa about 30 AD be useful in 2054

[clever pilot]

history

[somber lodge]

okay but why would it be useful in toki pi toki pona

[worthy tree]

oh, didn't read up

thought it was based on 0 = pu release

actually, this system still breaks after 30 years, so

why is kasi bot here now

[errant comet]

it doesn't really

[clever pilot]

tenpo penpo li lon

[somber lodge]

when does the next year start in this system again

[errant comet]

august 8th

[somber lodge]

oh okay

[amber wharf]

is it right that october 31st of this year would be 'nasin sin sijelo pi kijetesantakalu tawa'?
(or would it be 'nasin sijelo nanpa wan pi kijetesantakalu tawa'?)

[errant comet]

yea (also both ways are possible but the current one is the first one)

[amber wharf]

aa that makes sense

that is this date on the calendar right?

[errant comet]

the top part is just the name & year in sitelen pona (nasin tenpo penpo - kijetesantakalu tawa)

[amber wharf]

n yep

so the segments are:
nasin (the first one/sin)
of the sijelo group
in 'kijetesantakalu tawa'?

thanks btw, I really like this system

[errant comet]

yea :D

also i just realized you circled the actual day on the calendar i did not realize that lol

yes that is the date

[amber wharf]

aa ale li pona :3

[pale river]

are you using nasin to refer to the 15 day week?

[amber wharf]

nasin is the name of one of the days within the week, sona mi la the 'sin' part refers to which week it is a part of in the greater group (in this case, it is in the first week)

[pale river]

ohhhh yeah that makes more sense looking back on it

i just misunderstood you sorry

[pale river]

are the ntp sheets linked on accurate?

i wanna make a physical calendar

[errant comet]

yep

[pale river]

pona

[pale river]

ilo tenpo penpo pi jan Jami li pona Y? mi alasa kepeken ona taso pilin mi la ona li pana e sona nasa

ona li toki e ni: tenpo Oct 17 li suno mun weka pi kipisi lawa. taso la ona li toki e ni: suno kama li suno kasi weka

seme la ona tu li ken suno weka???

[errant comet]

i'm not sure anymore honestly 😭

[pale river]

pakalaaaaa

i've been using it for dating my journal and assuming it'd be correct lmao 😭

[errant comet]

it was correct for a while idk if it desynced at some point or if it ever worked at all 😭 sona mi la ona li wile ala awen pali e ni

[pale river]

ikeeee

lipu sina li pona ala pona?

i might just base it off that and recalulate all my own dates if i can

[errant comet]

pona

[pale river]

pona

[pale river]

would i be correct in saying today is the first suno kule of kipisi sijelo?

also, how does the sin/kama/awen/tawa/weka work when it comes to counting the muns

[errant comet]

basically it's the color coded rows on the calendar

[pale river]

so is white always "sin" and so on?

[errant comet]

yea

if there's a day that appears 6 times (so there'd be 2 "sin"s) the second sin is namako but apart from that, that's about it

[pale river]

ooh right

[errant comet]

this happened on like 3 specific years from this generation i don't remember the ones but yeah it's pretty uncommon

[pale river]

oh right lol i see

[pale river]

today is suno kule kama pi kipisi sijelo right?

[pale river]

i just remembered time zones exist, for me it was the 4th of november when i asked that, forgot to clarify

[wispy wraith]

oh I thought musi also doubled as interesting (as in, entertaining to ones intellect rather than humor)

become Chinese and name it after ur country's government at that time. (I think in feudal china they called their years not just after the zodiac, but also their emperors to distinguish)

(not a fully serious suggestion)

[wispy wraith]

sina toki ku la, sina ken kepeken "kipisi" anu "kipisi suli"

[errant comet]

we have already made a solution to this lmao

now you only have to distinguish kala sin 2001 and kala sin 2031, which is much more reasonable :3

[wispy wraith]

why /gen

[swift wigeon]

because your birth isnt an event you witnessed or remember

you dont even know when it is apart from what others tell you

its a day that is fundamentally only special for your parents, and then they force its specialness onto you

[wispy wraith]

mi sona

[errant comet]

this is probably true

[wispy wraith]

mun pi ante toki li seme

[errant comet]

toki pona "holiday" in february where people translate literally anything they want

i'm genuinely not sure if it's real i haven't been through one

but it's apparently a thing people do

[wispy wraith]

lol

also did I miss something, but like where did the leap year thing come from

when do leap years happen?

[errant comet]

chat
i'm gonna doing

i'm printing out the sheets for my own calendar now (^0^)/

somehow took one and a half kipisi sijelos but i'm doing it

[little phoenix]

toki a

I need opinions on this

If somebody would be interested in helping me improve this (preferably on the looks of the calendar), any help is welcomed :3

[chrome mortar]

wrong mama glyph i think

ah, that font may not have the current one

unfortunate

[little phoenix]

oh sorry

the lights at my house went out

[little phoenix]

yah maybe

[near kiln]

Curiously, when I encountered this glyph I thought on a dad with beer belly and a big moustache

[worthy tree]

isn't that the current one?

[chrome mortar]

no

this is it

[worthy tree]

ah, I thought that was the old one

looking on the website, it's the new one

[chrome mortar]

the one that is actually the old one stems from a time when jan Josan Kapo thought mama = feminine

[worthy tree]

yeah

[chrome mortar]

but the new one is just ripped from sp

[worthy tree]

I got more "feminine" feelings out of the new one

[chrome mortar]

i wish there was a newer newer one

[worthy tree]

because it's the glyph for meli, minus the triangle, plus a sitelen pona for mama

old mama looks more abstract (but on closer inspection, that is not a "lip" like I thought...)

[worthy tree]

actually (and I know this is 2 or 3 steps off-topic), I think I'm gonna stick with my gut and use old mama as the "less feminine one" for this reason

it's as feminine as the glyph for sitelen pona

hairstyle ni

[chrome mortar]

no, because it's the glyph for mije, minus the weird bubble, plus the sp for mama.
no, because it's the glyph for tonsi, minus the weird bubble, plus the sp for mama.

hrmmmm maybe it's a gender radical

[worthy tree]

tonsi and mije both have to add the surrounding circle too, but meli has it already

along with the precedent of being "circle with shape inside" that mije and tonsi don't have

[chrome mortar]

well it'd be weird to stick an unconnected shape just there

it's meant to be just the gender radical

[worthy tree]

why is there a gender radical in the "gender non-specific" mama

[chrome mortar]

because it can be for all genders

idk

good question

i never thought of that

[worthy tree]

hopefully from this graphic it's clear that one of the gender glyphs clearly undergoes the least change to get to mama

and that it is indeed derived from a gender glyph

someone who doesn't know any of the glyph origins (me, an hour ago) would easily conclude that new mama is meli

anyways, I'm procrastinating a school assignment

[heady needle]

the old mama looks more like my dad than my mom :P

i don't really see the moustache tho

[wicked seal]

me too

But no it's boobies

:(

[heady needle]

i've probably said this before but like

it could be moobies

mreasts

but i guess they're not usually that circular

[ashen moat]

hello, just got back and saw this calendar

looks nice and revamped, but one question, what makes a day namako? :<

[errant comet]

essentially, if there were to be 6 repetitions of the same named day in one month (which requires both a leap year and very convenient timing, so it's super rare), that day will be namako

[ashen moat]

so for example, the last kasi is kasi nanpa luka kipisi sijelo instead of kasi namako kipisi sijelo?

[pale river]

no, days aren’t called by the number
instead, it follows the same cycles as the years with sin, kama, awen, tawa, weka
so it would be “kasi weka” afaik

[errant comet]

yes (or kasi weka if you're using the newer system (it follows the same pattern as the progress cycle on years, sin-kama-awen-tawa-weka))

[ashen moat]

I see, pona tawa sina a :>
I am making a calendar for the next year, and I want to include nasin tenpo ni in it 😄

heres a trial for this month 😄

[pale river]

yes! finally my calendar is accurate lol, i always worry i mess up the dates and that i’m out of sync but i think i’m aligned

[ashen moat]

also it is quite a concidence that 1/1/2025 is both the Gregorian new year, new month (kipisi luka) for nasin tenpo penpo, and also new month for my personal calendar 😄

[chrome mortar]

what's your personal calendar

[ashen moat]

its a lunisolar calendar, I used it often in my worldbuilding :3

I just called it the Jakallian calendar

[errant comet]

lol yeah the fact that the months managed to perfectly line up with the beginning of the gregorian new year genuinely surprised me when someone found it out lol i did not plan that :3

quite cool

[ashen moat]

indeed 😄

[pale river]

january first is going to be suno pan sin pi kipisi luka, right?

[errant comet]

yep! the first day of kipisi luka is always jan 1st :3

[chrome mortar]

what is march 21 2025?

(the day upon which the sun will set upon the british empire)

[errant comet]

let me check

[pale river]

pakala

i’m three days off

every time i check to see if my calendar is aligned i’m always off 😭😭

[errant comet]

it appears it will be suno nimi sin pi kipisi poka :3

i think i counted that right

[chrome mortar]

suno pi nimi sin ale

jan Tepo's least favourite day

[errant comet]

real

[ashen moat]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FbV1XcUejg1HEMl45jLztoADS_pmaRZ9/view?usp=drivesdk

my calendar has the gregorian-tenpo kamalu together, so you can check

but it'll be ike lili tawa sina ale since I use nanpas to identify the weeks, since tawa mi la, nanpa li pona

[pale river]

how are you calculating your dates? do you have a particular reference point on the gregorian calendar? i keep messing up so i need to find out how to keep accurate 😭

[ashen moat]

oh yeah and the primary nasin tenpo in this calendar is my personal worldbuilding calendar, so dont get sidetracked :p

[errant comet]

first day of kipisi luka is usually a good start. then just use an online date distance calculator and then just get counting :P (if the numbers >73 you can skip & count from the next month)

for keeping count daily i'd say definitely start from january 1st because that is a suuuuper useful coincidence

(jaunary first is always first day of kipisi luka)

[ashen moat]

pona

its really a coincidence, but one that is nice

[pale river]

are there any other coincidences in the calendar or is that the only one?

[errant comet]

doesn't particularly seem like it

or at least not many that are (as) easy to remember (as january 1st)

anyways i am finally installing this calendar on my wall and using it for some reason i hadn't done that already

[pale river]

wawaaa

mi ni lon tenpo pini

[ashen moat]

wawa a
i may use this calendar and my personal one more next year, its good for worldbuilding and stuff

[crude stump]

nimi pi li tan seme a a a

[chrome mortar]

tan musi

[wicked seal]

mi o sona e nasin tenpo ni

[errant comet]

o ni :3

if it helps, tomorrow will be january first AND the first day of month luka so it's a great time to start

:3

[wicked seal]

:3

[wicked seal]

[[nasin tenpo penpo]]

[fresh plume]

https://sona.pona.la/wiki/nasin_tenpo_penpo

[wicked seal]

ni li wile e pali mute aaaaaaaaaaa

taso mi jo e tenpo

I can't find weka in þe weeks am I missing someþing

[errant comet]

that's the week numberer

last week of the month

[wicked seal]

weka is þe last week?

[errant comet]

ya

sin kama awen tawa weka

like the year cycle terms but again

:3

[wicked seal]

I don't þink I get it

Why isn't it in þe list of week names

[chrome mortar]

the list you have highlighted is the weekday names

[wicked seal]

Wait no

I don't get it

Oh

Þat's why

And it has 5 weeks just like þe progression of þe animal cycle

So it's moli of þe 5þ week of þe 2nd kala year

[errant comet]

yes!

[wicked seal]

and þe animals move in packs so all þe animals become weka first before kala becomes sin

[errant comet]

indeed so

[wicked seal]

See þis is easy

[errant comet]

yay

[chrome mortar]

"move in packs" is toki pona

as in the non-lexed version of that

good description

[wicked seal]

Þanks

mi toki pona lon tenpo mute a

RIP penpo

So now I just gotta memorize þe order of lipu tenpo magazines

[errant comet]

penpo li moli o7 (it didn't actually line up with the tenpo penpos and it went wildly out of sync super quickly so we had to put it down)

[wicked seal]

o7

Yk making a real version of þis calander like þose block/notch ones would be cool

[errant comet]

yeah this is basically the biggest hurdle after this it's pretty golden

[errant comet]

ooh wait true

that'd go hard

[wicked seal]

Me adding þis big ass rotating disk to for þe years

I should start a journal and have to write þe date in þis system to help me memorize it

[errant comet]

wawa

tomorrow is pan sin luka >:3

[wicked seal]

"pan sin luka pi kijetesantakalu tawa.
Nou eigenlijk ik heb deze journaal begonnen om mn Nasin Tenpo Penpo te versterken, maar ik eigenlijk weet niet wat ik wil schrijven. En omdat ik altijd Toki Ponas praat, ik dacht: "Hey nou, misschien ik moet een Nederlandse journaal beginnen!" want ik moet mn Nederlands ook versterken..."

[errant comet]

real

[chrome mortar]

toki ponas

[wicked seal]

Þe Fresh Arm Bread, of Moving Ferrets

[chrome mortar]

they are multiplying

[errant comet]

TUki pona

[chrome mortar]

TUki tiki

[wicked seal]

In Dutch a lot of natlangs are kinda like [country/people]s, even þough it doesn't do it wiþ conlangs or more recent langauges (recent as in when did þe Dutch find it) I still feels weird to me so say Toki Pona and not Toki Pons or Toki Ponas

[errant comet]

toki POna

[wicked seal]

Swedish - Zweeds
German - Duits
English - Engels
French - Frans
Spanish - Spaans
Japanese - Japans
Dutch - Nederlands

Well ig þose all end in consonants

China - Chinees
Ma Pona - Ponees

hmmm

[wicked seal]

Insane scribblings

[pale river]

this is what i do

it works somewhat

i also printed out the calendar, which helps even more

[wispy wraith]

are leap days going into poka still a thing? when would a namako day occur? (do you know a specific date off the top of your head? i wanna check the date calculator as well) 31st Dec 2024 is kasi namako according to https://codepen.io/thurm64/pen/LYKBoOr is that correct? I've seen it as kasi luka (which should just be kasi weka, right?) in the Gregorian-Kamalu mix calendar that was posted here.

[errant comet]

leap days do go into poka, namako days occur in the rare circumstance where there's 6 kasi days in a singular month which has only happened twice or thrice this generation (2001-2030). that specific converter was made by jan jami and i have no idea of it's accurate anymore since she doesn't update it anymore. also 31st december 2024 should be "kasi sin sijelo" and jan 1st is "pan sin luka"

[wispy wraith]

thx for the answers on the other stuff.
does the sin in kasi sin mean that its the first kasi of sijelo?

[errant comet]

ala

Its is important to mention that this system follow the color pattern in the official sheets and aren't an exact 1-to-1 replacement to the numbers. For example, if a month starts on toki, "kule sin" would refer to the kule at the very bottom of the month before it rolls back into the next month

[wispy wraith]

ah, so the sin-kama-tawa-awen-weka weekday cycle is completely independent from everything?
because the month started with toki sin, kule sin is at the end of that month.

if we were to use nanpas, we refer to the days position within the month itself, correct?

also, the first day in kala sin (august 8th 2001). what weekday was it?

[errant comet]

let me check actually i'm not sure

[wispy wraith]

oh, weekday as in, kamalu lunar weekday

[errant comet]

kulupu!

that's fun

[wispy wraith]

indeed. is there some kind of fixed starting point for the lunar kamalu days?
since the moon is kinda inconsistent.
we do have very "fixed" (well, fixed to the greg calendar) dates for start of the year cycle

[errant comet]

yeah we figured this out the hard way with the old sptp version. now it's entirely consistent but the moli skip is still there :P

[wispy wraith]

i assume it goes in and out of sync with the moon now?

better question, if the fixed starting point for lunar days exists, when is it? (essentially just one point in time where we say, "this day is kasi sin" and then you can work your way backwards and forwards from that)
what reference did you work off to find that first day in kala sin was kulupu?

also, the kulupu in kala sin. what is it in the day-cycle progression (sin-kama-awen-tawa-weka)

[errant comet]

we based all of the calculations on the original kijetesantakalu tawa sheets from suni pi toki pona just so anybody who had already printed them wouldn't have to reprint them to use the proper calendar

[wispy wraith]

so, suno pi toki pona 2024 was toki sin day, fun

[wicked seal]

It is

pan sin luka pi kijetesantakalu tawa

[wicked seal]

Þis is technecally my first entry

ig I'll just copy it

Also I keep þinking þe Mymyangst is like 🚼 or someþing

[wicked seal]

kule

[pale river]

seme

is today not toki

[errant comet]

today is indeed toki it might've been kule when jan Majeka posted that tho

[wicked seal]

I write all my entries after 12:00am

[errant comet]

i seee okay

[wicked seal]

toki sin luka pi kije tawa

ah sin is þe week

[errant comet]

indeed

also this is a moli-less week so tomorrow is NOT moli :3

[wicked seal]

Because it's luka

[wispy wraith]

tenpo kamalu ni li lete sin luka anu seme

[errant comet]

walo sin luka a (lete sin luka was yesterday)

[wispy wraith]

got it

[wicked seal]

I fell honk mimimimi before I could make my entry

lete sin luka pi kijetesantakalu tawa was yesteday

my punishment: 10 lines of writing þe day order by hand

[wicked seal]

Þis is so hard because I have "kasi pan toki nimi" drilled in my brain from years of Tokirap

kasi pan kule toki

It is so close to it

Let me try it from memory

kasi pan toki nimi moli lete walo nimi seli moku kulupu nena nasin mama mun

Close enough

[wicked seal]

lete

kasi pan kule toki moli walo lete nimi seli moku kulupu musi nasin mama mun

Nooo so close

I find þe idea of doing þis wiþ þe Greg (omg Kekan San reference) calandar very funny, like drilling monday-sunday into your head and þen mixing up Tuesday and Wednesday after drilling it like 100 times

[errant comet]

NASIN TENPO PENPO ★ the toki pona calendar [DISCUSSION]

pali li pini
toki li kama >:3

pinned the top message since i thought it'd have something more interesting 😭

oh well

[wispy wraith]

today is nimi sin luka

[wicked seal]

I wanna use þis for someþing

But idk how to make peak fiction

[errant comet]

wawa

[wicked seal]

Me when þe arm's new word of þe fleaing raccoon

[chrome mortar]

me when the moon's day

greg's calendar isn't much better

[wicked seal]

Maybe I should write someþing like Maya's dagboek and use NTP

Fictional ofc

Ig it's more of a weekboek

[crude stump]

NASIN TENPO KAMALU ★ the toki pona calendar [DISCUSSION]

ni li nimi ona anu seme

[wicked seal]

NOOOOOOOOO ME PENPO

PENPO LI WEKA TAN SEEEMMMMEEEEE

[crude stump]

jan li toki e ni: nimi Kamalu li nimi suli ona

ni li lon ala lon?

[wicked seal]

jan seme??

[ashen moat]

o tenpo

[kind wedge]

What's the notation for the leap day? Like if it was the leap day and I had to write the date, what would I write?

mi kama sin ala e suno moli weka, anu seme?

[errant comet]

none of the days are specifically the leap day poka just gains an extra day lol

[wicked seal]

Does it get a name

[errant comet]

no

you just talk about it normally

kipisi poka la suno namako li lon a

[wicked seal]

How do you keep þe calandar þen

Like
“kasi, pan, kule, toki, moli, lete, walo, nimi, seli, moku, kulupu, musi, nasin, mama, mun” but þere is one more

So for þe whole monþ of poka, it could be kasi or pan, pan or kule, kule or toki, toki or moli, moli or lete, lete or walo, walo or nimi, nimi or seli, seli or moku, moku or kulupu, kulupu or musi, musi or nasin, nasin or mama, mama or mun, or mun and mun 2: even munier even 2ier

And nobody knows

[kind wedge]

a, sona

[wicked seal]

someone please help me understand 😭

[errant comet]

poka goes on for one day longer before it switches to noka

[wicked seal]

Is it at þe end of þe monþ? Like it goes mama mun namako?

[errant comet]

i mean i guess

it isn't any specific day but that makes the most sense ig

[wicked seal]

But like how would one go along like counting þe days?

like imagine it's mun luka and þen what is tomorrow?

It could eiþer be namako or pan

[errant comet]

kasi

[wicked seal]

kasi

oops

[errant comet]

namako is only for when there's 6 kasis in one month (which does happen on only a leap year but also requires a specific alignment of moli skips so it's very rare)

[wicked seal]

Oh so it is just anoþer kasi

[errant comet]

yea

[wicked seal]

OH