📚lore-discussion

[frigid sparrow]

Behemoth? it's the first one, it's us going to the behemoth of a land tank and fighting the commander there before they advance. Hailstone? Connects to the Deep Stone Crypt and how the cabal there wanted to appeal to Caiatl and gain her favor by finding it. Foothold? The cabal are actually getting super fucked over, and the boss there is someone trying to make a last stand in attempts to become a member of her war table, and Oracle is about a rogue psion who wanted to get in with Caiatl by utilizing vex prediction engines

like, it actually makes what we do feel meaningful by killing actual fucking characters, however minimal they may be

killing some wannabe house dusk baron means jack shit, killing some random shrieker doesn't mean anything

[eager trout]

What's the lore on the enemies with the elemental effects? (Such as Hypernova)

[slow berry]

Bungie needed to add spice into the game

I don't think we have lore on champions either etc

[dim minnow]

those are referred to as bane-empowered combatants

and those effects you are referring to are banes

as of yet, we don't have any actual lore on them yet

as Lith has said, they are like champions

both from a gameplay standpoint and from a lore standpoint

a way to shake things up in higher difficulty content

[trim grotto]

Correct
Unless you cound offhand text from a single bounty, which I do not

[slim girder]

If bungie wanted to implement lore for champions I think that would require giving us much more unique enemy types rather than just a normal enemy with a debuff on it. Something like LFD2/B4B enemy variants kinda.
Like what makes a hive champion a hive champion.

[ember storm]

drank too many redbulls

[slim girder]

Just wait until we get dread champs

[stable tide]

So i finally played Final shape. really liked it but i genuinly think that Zavala was a giant fucking idiot. The whole way through.

[trim grotto]

Well, Zavala's emotional journey had been building up for years.

Since Beyond Light, really. Four years of storytelling and stress, and a decaying trust in the Traveler. The man had been carrying the Last City upon his back, and it finally broke him for a time.

[slim girder]

The final shape was the last straw for him. You can even see in the liminality strike that he is now almost eager to give into darkness where 4 years ago he would have never once even dared thinking of doing such a thing.

[ember storm]

he was also completely right the whole time, so

we would not be able to kill the witness just by hoping the traveler would give us answers because it was literally incapable of doing so

his lack of restraint and running off on his own was an emotional response, not a logical one

but his plan was still valid and worked

you can't call someone unintelligent for letting their doubts and anxieties get the better of them, every single character has done this at one point or another

Savathun, who's proported to be one of if not the most intelligent beings alive, had all her reality-changing plans stopped just because we dangled the god wave lie in front of her face

[worn horizon]

OMG my old PS3 account avatar 🙊🙉

[slim girder]

Still is my avatar on PS5 and everywhere else.

[eager trout]

Thanks, I didn't know the English name.

[eager trout]

The effects on Champions kinda look like what the Dread and the Witness' disciples explode into when defeated.

[little gorge]

i always interpreted those as wires

as opposed to the resonance stuff which is more like branches

[candid idol]

Is there any lore why neither us nore our ghost have a name like I get that it would be hard and annoying to say our gaurdian and ghost name but they don't have to say it we just don't have a name

Wich is wierd cause everyone else does

[blazing wasp]

So you can make up your own headcanon for what the name is for you and your ghost

since we all play as the same character, "the guardian", "the young wolf"

[slow berry]

Isn't his name just Ghost

Ghosts tend to have funny and ironic names seemingly magically tied to their Guardian

It'd make sense if the Guardian's ghost was just Ghost

[blazing wasp]

ghosts are typically named by their guardian

[shy remnant]

favorite ghost name is pulled pork because it’s funny

[slow berry]

What about the named un-paired ghosts?

[blazing wasp]

They get renamed usually

glint used to be called pulled pork

like renegade stated

[ember storm]

I mean it just comes down to the individual

Some choose to be named by their guardians and end up doing so

Tyra Karn’s ghost always waited for their guardian to name them, but she wants them to have the self agency to do it themselves, leaving them to just default to ghost until they can pick one

Other ghosts sorta just name themselves like most of the ones in Micah’s flock

[candid idol]

That's cool I did naje my own head cannon wasn't sure if there was lore to why were called that

Can I show yall it and yall tell me if I messed up any official lore when making it

[ember storm]

I mean idk how you’d really do that

If it’s just names

[candid idol]

@ember storm I have a full blown backstory

[ember storm]

So long as it doesn’t directly contradict the events of the game I don’t see what the problem would be

[zenith bison]

What’s the selection process for being a Guardian

[ember storm]

There are no prerequisites or criteria

Ghosts only know how to look for someone with a signature of light they can connect to

When they find it they can rez

They don’t have a waypoint marker telling them where to go or anything

Lately the explanation seems to be more of a mental block than anything

Also ghosts only get one Lightbearer, no exchanging or upgrading

[candid idol]

Yeah I mean the only hole in the story there may be is they die in beyond light and get resurrected right before final shape I didn't know if they had to be dead for a certain amount of time or anything

@ember storm how do I get that blue ghost next to my name

[ember storm]

Paragon

[ember storm]

Nah you can be very fresh

Uldren wasn’t dead longer than a few weeks at most before getting rezzed

Also there was baby shin

[candid idol]

Cool

[ember storm]

but I hate shin

[candid idol]

Don't know who shin is and I hate uldren I don't care if he lost his memory and is a different person he still sucks

[ember storm]

Well the fact is that Uldren died over seven years ago so you don’t have any meaningful reason for it

Cayde himself is completely fine with Crow and crowned him as the new Hunter vanguard, you oughta just get over it

Shin died as an infant baby and got resurrected like an hour later, before his ghost died and made him a mortal person again

[queen swallow]

Shin Malphur, owner of the Last Word and killer of Dredgen Yor

[ember storm]

so he just grew up like normal

[candid idol]

@ember storm it's just this is the third show/game where they have killed my favorite character twice

[ember storm]

I mean there’s sort of a difference between getting shot at the bottom of a prison and willingly giving up your existence for a friend so I’m not exactly torn up about it

Cayde’s death was always going to be permanent, there was a 0% chance he’d just walk away from FS

[candid idol]

He lasted less than 8 hours of game play im just so sad

[ember storm]

His previous screen time was less than eight hours

[candid idol]

Fair

Moving on do you wanna see my gaurdians lore

[ember storm]

You’re free to post it

[candid idol]

KELL-12
Before he became an exo Kell was a single dad working a 9 to 5 barley being able to afford his house he had to participate in the exo program to stay off the streets but that didn't last long because Ghaul's troops killed his daughter and he suffered from dissociative exomind rejection many times so by his 12th reboot the only memory of his daughter was he had one during a fight between eramis Kell's troops and a fireteam kell was caught in the crossfire and killed to be revived 1 year before the events of the final shape by his ghost province

[ember storm]

Ok well

Exo production ended before the collapse

Which is a long time before any cabal or fallen were even in the solar system

[candid idol]

Ok

So yeah thought I may have screwed up lore

[slow berry]

The only forces of darkness that were around pre-collapse were Vex I'm p sure

By virtue of technically always having been there

And always going to be there

Even then direct interactions were limited to Braytech and Ishtar Collective memery

[candid idol]

Most exos lived to the collapse though right cause that can't die of age right

[slow berry]

Lots of 'em died

[ember storm]

All exos aside from Lakshmi and Ada were made pre collapse yes

There’s very few mortal exos around though

[slow berry]

Cause they did kinda throw them directly at the vex a lot

[jagged badge]

Yeah it’s very impressive to be a mortal Exo in modern Destiny

[ember storm]

People who don’t want to move to windows 11 be like

[slow berry]

Ironically Cayde was a rare mortal Exo in TFS

[candid idol]

Is that why she hasn't been reset

[jagged badge]

Not counting Lightless Guardians or shenanigans like that

[ember storm]

She was made with special black armory tech

And also a child when she was uploaded

There already wasn’t much of a full body to have previous experience with

[jagged badge]

I think it’s the latter part that matters more

[slow berry]

I kinda wish Cayde and Micah got to figure that whole thing out but I also think there was something beautiful about the missed connection

[jagged badge]

Her mind was more malleable

[ember storm]

Yeah but the fact she’s the only exo without an actual mouth implies she doesn’t suffer from DER at all (since there’s no way to simulate eating) and the body was made with that specific purpose

Ada being shoved into the body was a last resort when everyone else was dying

[candid idol]

Ok I changed it his daughter died of cancer I couldn't think of another deadly sickness im sure by then there was a cure so if you can think of one let me know and kell was murdered by vex while working for braytech no more plot holes

[ember storm]

That is fair

There’s like a million untouched dead exos all over Europa

[candid idol]

@ember storm is there like a deadly disease in d2 cause I would assume cancers cured

[slow berry]

You don't have to name it

"Rare incurable disease that even golden age tech can solve but what if maybe braytech money" is good enough

[slim girder]

Ada is interesting because she's a prototype exo I believe. So maybe during the golden just before the collapse there might have been some advancement in exo tech.
Also Ada was still missing a piece when we met her and only after going through the niobe labs did we get her that last piece. She didn't suffer DER at all supposedly despite missing a piece of her memory

[ember storm]

No it’s the exact opposite

She was a custom frame made by the black armory

[slim girder]

So like Elsie then?

[ember storm]

No?

Custom in the meaning that every part was not made by braytech

[slim girder]

Elsies frame was custom.

[ember storm]

Her body shape was measured to her specific measurements as a person

The body itself was ordinary

Other exos just got stock proportions

Ada’s body was made by a third party using black armory tech, Braytech wasn’t involved at all

[slim girder]

Well yeah I'm just saying that Elsie's body was also custom built to fit her exactly. There's an audio log talking about this about a female exo who sounds a bit jealous of Elsie's frame pre collapse.

[ember storm]

That is not what I meant by that

The entirety of Ada’s hardware is custom made by the BA

The only thing unique about Elsie’s body is that it has her personal measurements

She still went through the same process at bray exoscience like everyone else, Ada was cobbled together in a bunker

[candid idol]

Yall thoughts do yall think your gaurdian sees destinys version of the afterlife when they die or just the same as you when you spectate

[queen swallow]

No

Spectating is not a lore thing

[candid idol]

So what do we think they see while dead nothing

[queen swallow]

The only Heaven or Hell space that I am aware of is Heaven/Hell in the Prophecy dungeon

That was created by the Nine

[ember storm]

It is actually

[queen swallow]

Huh

[ember storm]

Cayde describes what he saw in FS

[ember storm]

There are guardians who are able to see things when they’re dead yeah

It’s not a common trait but it’s there

[queen swallow]

But he wasn’t “real”. He was fully light. I would think that disqualifies him from visiting a Heaven or Hell space. Or is it that only Guardians can see/experience things similar to what Cayde did and everyone else would go to such spaces?

[ember storm]

He was real

What he was before FS started was what all ghosts and guardians experience

They return to the light

[queen swallow]

Then what about everyone who isn’t a Guardian?

[candid idol]

I meant while there waiting to get revived

[ember storm]

Yeah thats not what I’m talking about

Death spectating is a thing

When guardians die their final deaths and when ghosts die they experience what Cayde described

[candid idol]

Ok yeah that makes since

[ember storm]

These are separate concepts because two people are talking about different things right now

I don’t have the capacity to speak about any kind of actual “hell or heaven” concepts of afterlife and I doubt bungie would want to go into that territory

[queen swallow]

Real answer: whatever you want your head cannon to be. There’ll likely never be an official in game answer

[ember storm]

It would be like what Toriyama described his paradise as

[candid idol]

Fair

[candid idol]

Fair

[vital marsh]

does what we did in vog lead up to/correlate to anything in vesper

[jagged badge]

Why do you ask??

[vital marsh]

cause i sorta missed out on a lot of lore so idk whats rly going on

not sure what/why we did what we did in vog

[jagged badge]

Vault of Glass was us shutting down a group of Vex who were doing experiments intending to make the Gorgons work outside the Vault

[vital marsh]

okay okay

[dim minnow]

not just the Gorgons, but yes

basically the stuff the Gorgons could do

[vital marsh]

i can see why we wanted to stop that

[queen swallow]

Oh and whenever Atheon, in lore, kills someone they’re just straight up removed from Time™️ completely

[spice rain]

has anything happened to the shard of the traviler in the edz

[dim minnow]

no not really

[spice rain]

i remember getting an exotic from it but i cant remember it

[next bobcat]

Hawkmoon?

[ember storm]

that was a smaller piece of the shard savathun was attempting to steal

[zenith bison]

I feel like Osiris lost his Light for the same reason Gojo died in JJK; they were both killed to give the antagonist an actual chance at winning

[ember storm]

Really?

What scenario in the past couple years would’ve been made inherently different if Osiris had light

[north heath]

he could’ve gone n done spire himself

🔥

[frigid sparrow]

I mean he DID solo a bunch of Crota's kids

[ember storm]

Because he was under the spell of Xivu Arath and becoming wrathborn

It is not something he would ordinarily do nor would it really come in handy during the events of Seraph or LF

[trim grotto]

hmm
i don't remember this quote from final shape

[empty fern]

I do

Crow said it to cayde during the first 3 weeks of the final shape

[trim grotto]

Who is Crow's wife then

[empty fern]

Pork

Or whatever the ghosts name was

[wheat flower]

Jeff

[trim grotto]

Pulled Pork, now known as Glint

[empty fern]

Shiny pork

[trim grotto]

Illuminated Swine

[empty fern]

Enlightened pig

[wheat flower]

Eido Sjur

I think is her name

[trim grotto]

Other way around

But uh
She was Mara's partner
And is also dead*

[wheat flower]

Damn

Maybe that was mara ranting

[empty fern]

Watch eido somehow show up in frontiers

[wheat flower]

Eido is currently standing next to the alchemy station

[trim grotto]

Ah but that would suggest she has Light

[empty fern]

Hear me out
Mara makes a deal with Eremis and the fragment to wish herself another sjur

[wheat flower]

Does that fragment still work?

[empty fern]

Going to rebuild ris with it so yeah

[wheat flower]

Ooh eremis

Mot eris

[empty fern]

Bruh

Actually

[wheat flower]

Bungie really is creative with these names

[empty fern]

@jagged badge does your Little Rock still grant genie wishes?

[wheat flower]

Real john , Jones , Johnes type names going arounf

[trim grotto]

In theory, it could still grant some manner of Wish. I wouldn't recommend it though. It's why she went blind.

[empty fern]

An arm or a leg wouldn’t hurt

Just look at variks

[wheat flower]

Dhe got 3 new eyes for the price if 2

A bargain some would say

[trim grotto]

She also had to carve them from an Acolyte with a knife

[wheat flower]

Registered surgeon

[empty fern]

Thats like saying I traded in 2 USB C for 3 USB As

[wheat flower]

I mean

Depends

Are the hive eyes an upgrade or a downgrade

[trim grotto]

Props to Eris for killing an Acolyte and successfully extracting its eyes whilst both blind and Lightless by the way

[empty fern]

Wrong filter I’d say

[wheat flower]

Do they function like bug eyes

[empty fern]

Probably yeah

[wheat flower]

Is she actually looking at us in fly D vision

Does the top eye give her a better depth perception?

[empty fern]

I’d imagine Eris current vision is just like,

Mostly black and grey but everyone has a bit of light in them or something

But thats if the hive can see the light in a person

[trim grotto]

She's technically still blind, but sees in other ways. It isn't entirely clear how.

[empty fern]

Never will be

[ember storm]

weirdly her eyes do seem to interact with the world

and she does literally

cover them when there's a bright light so like

actually hold on this could be a sticker

shes saying hi

[slow berry]

There's degrees of blindness, and a relatively common one is still being able to perceive bright lights, so that makes sense

[ember storm]

yeah but that requires having your eyeballs still connected to your brain in your skull

eris doesnt have those

[dim minnow]

yeah yeah, I know you copied this from r/dcj

you ain't the first person to take a joke from there and post it in this very channel

[west tree]

What did I just witness

(Get it?)

[slow berry]

im sure the acolyte eyes are connected to her brain somehow

in some plane or another

[gray sinew]

hi

[trim grotto]

Hello. Do you have a question about the story or lore?

[sick yew]

Bro was just saying hi to the gang
Smh Mael

Always so enthusiastic

[next bobcat]

[queen swallow]

In most cases, but not all, the flavor text in weapons is not canon to the lore, correct? Because if it was all, I'd imagine that the Spoiler Alert text "Someone is going to die" would be hard to reconcile forewarning that someone is quite literally going to die.

[ember storm]

I mean if it’s a quote it is

Also in some cases it’s related to the gun as a physical object

Descriptions of the DSC guns are telling you what’s carved into them

[dim minnow]

flavor texts can also have lore implications

like the Division flavor text implying that each member of the Nine's personality is based on the Enneagram

[trim grotto]

It can be. It depends on the context.
In this case, it's probably just a quote attributed to the gun. It shoots bullets at people, after all, so death tends to be relevant.

While on a meta perspective we could see it as a forewarning, in universe it's just a rather average Vanguard issue Sidearm.

The quote is just... Amusing, considering the name designation.

[queen swallow]

I'm imagining someone getting the gun and it comes with like a little sticker that says "Someone will die" and they're just like, oh, okay, I guess.

[ember storm]

That’s just

A joke

With the name

And the fact that it’s a gun

Because you’re using a gun

To shoot people

And they die

the gun is named spoiler alert so you’re prompted to ask what the spoiler is and the answer is that someone will die, because it’s a gun

[trim grotto]

Waltz is correct. However, on the topic of flavour text...
https://www.ishtar-collective.net/items/hawthornes-field-forged-shotgun

Thanks Hawthorne.

[shy remnant]

The most valuable Hawthorne lore

[dim minnow]

so basically weapons having flavor text is canon

[trim grotto]

At least some of the time, yes

I wouldn't say always

[vast kiln]

HI GUYS

It has been forever

[trim grotto]

A wild Zabbit

[gleaming osprey]

Ok here's my idea: We pile up all the dead bodies and skeletons we can find just outside the Last City on a big conveyor belt like at the airport. Then, all the ghosts can just run past in a big circle and pick out the people they want for Guardians. Then, new guardians get put on corpse truck duty until they figure out what's going on.

Round and round it goes, pretty soon we have optimal guardian production

[trim grotto]

I'm sure that the new Lightbearers won't develop immediate trauma from being on corpse duty.
Also for reference this is basically why Drifter distrusted Ghosts and the Traveler and the Guardians for centuries haha

On a more serious topic though we actually don't know much about Last City burial practices, beyond what happened to Amanda

[gleaming osprey]

Who can say? Until all the available ghosts have had a sniff of her dead body, she might just pop back up one morning. Her smoked corpse has tremendous potential value.

[trim grotto]

It's quite plausible. She certainly fulfilled the mantra.

[jagged badge]

I’m very much of the opinion that Amanda’s death will be permanent

[trim grotto]

Narratively, it would be fitting. But you never know.

[jagged badge]

I’m hoping so anyway

[gleaming osprey]

This is the kind of outside-the-box thinking you can expect once I successfully take over as Vanguard Commander from Zavala

[jagged badge]

Her becoming a Guardian would either really just be a boring narrative retread of Crow’s story kinda, or it’d just be an inconsequential “she’s back and someone immediately told her who she used to be so now it’s like she never died”

[trim grotto]

Or neither of those. People such as Zavala coming to terms with the fact that, despite new life, she isn't Amanda. It'd certainly be a more sorrowful adventure than people with Crow. And probably fewer hammers and hemorrhaging.

I would hope so, anyway.

[dim minnow]

Maybe we should put their ashes into a brick so they can keep the city safe even in death

Maybe some people will volunteer to be ammo for a new exotic brick launcher

[queen swallow]

That sounds like a nice sentiment but you just know people will be memeing about shooting.... Amanda's... Brick... at Oryx's face or something

[dim minnow]

It should be said I mostly meant this as a joke inspired by Andor

[trim grotto]

Well I haven't watched andor but the idea of a Ghost resurrecting someone and accidentally destabilising part of the wall is amusing

[slow berry]

"amanda gets revived and is a much different person and everyone has to learn from that" would be an interesting thing and with a strong writer a good foil to crow also being "its uldren but its not him anymore" but the opposite way i think

[sick yew]

I mean they already did that...with Crow

No real reason to run the same thing again imo

[slow berry]

Its destiny

you WILL go back to the cosmodrome

[sick yew]

I prefer the EDZ

[trim grotto]

Yeah I think there are definitely good ways to run it

[trim grotto]

The difference is that Amanda was much loved by just about everyone. Uldren was hated. Zavala saw her almost as a daughter, Crow and Amanda were very nearly romantic.

The baseline concept might be similar but it'd be very different execution

[sick yew]

So Crow came back as a decent guy
Amanda should come back as an asshole

[trim grotto]

Plus to be honest I'm always interested in exploring the ground level things of Destiny more

Well not necessarily but she very well may be significantly different

Destiny loves a mixture of nature and nurture

[sick yew]

Nah trust me im writing the lore rn

[trim grotto]

Haha sure yeah
Hit me with some upcoming topics of yours

[sick yew]

Shin Malphur returns

Uh DSC 2

Tex themed Destination and raid

[sick yew]

On that note actually

You think we'll fight a Nine in the EoF raid?

Or will it be Taniks again

[trim grotto]

I would be surprised, given that they don't have a body. But who knows what'll happen in the DLC?

[dim minnow]

probably Taniks, but I'm almost completely certain that the Giver is one of the Nine

[slim girder]

Call me crazy but what if we get a vex boss this time? We haven't had one since spire of the watcher.

[sick yew]

Oops, Taniks again
Would be hilarious ngl

But yeah Vex raid would be dope

[dim minnow]

we have 2 Vex raids rn

we could use another Fallen one

[sick yew]

Both being old as fuck

[dim minnow]

one being newer than the last Fallen raid we got

[trim grotto]

Funniest thing about Eater of Worlds is how little it actually had to do with the Vex

[slim girder]

Or what if we combined them? Start off dealing with the fallen and then as we go deeper finding a big vex threat.

[dim minnow]

elaborate

[trim grotto]

"guardians help my ship ate too much and has a tummyache ):" - emperor fatgoldman

"but fight my cabal on the way anyway"

[sick yew]

Calling Vog newer than DSC is a bit of a stretch
Like they came out just two seasons apart

[dim minnow]

well, he didn't ask us to help him until after we were fighting his men

EoW started purely as a covert op where we infiltrated the Levi

[trim grotto]

Yeah but even so it had basically nothing to do with Vex until we got to the boss

It was a Leviathan raid

[dim minnow]

then we got caught by Calus' forces and after fighting them off, Calus decides to instead send us to the Leviathan's stomach so we can clear it up

[trim grotto]

So it'd be nice to have a Vex raid be actually Vexy

yes i know i was there

farmed that bad boy for my Telesto Catalyst

[sick yew]

Had Argos showed up today Failsafe would have helped us catch it instead

Another pet for the Helm

[trim grotto]

i would be fine with that

[sick yew]

Oh same

[trim grotto]

anything for Failsafe

[sick yew]

Anything indeed

[slim girder]

Argos was honestly a scrap vex with a tongue. Don't think it actually did anything of note

[sick yew]

You mean apart from being the center of Nessus?

In a figurative and literal sense

The fact that Argos got beat up by us is probably at least in part catalyst for Episode 1

[trim grotto]

Apart from existing from the Raid it literally doesn't exist in lore, except for the one mention in the Chronicon which just has Calus say he was annoyed his ship got invaded by it

[sick yew]

I doubt Maya could have just established her little operation if Argos had still been around and kicking

[trim grotto]

Maybe, maybe not. The Echoes are powerful.

[slim girder]

At yet after "dislodging" the centre of nessus in the Leviathans mouth it didn't amount to anything. As far as we know it's never a singular vex running a whole planet and is more like a machine made with vex being the equivalent to mechanics.

[sick yew]

Let me give at least some tribute to my guy Argos smh

[trim grotto]

To be fair, Vex do have leader units. But I don't imagine it did much considering that the Nessus Vex never did much of note except for continue to terraform Nessus.

[slim girder]

Oh yeah. They absolutely have leader units like axis minds but as I said planets aren't really for living in to the vex, more like machines and factories to just make more vex like volantis or for predictions like the infinite forest.

[little gorge]

what if it's one of the nine speaking through taniks

[jagged badge]

I love that shop

[sick yew]

[mellow current]

was it a queenbreaker that killed sundance?

[slim girder]

No. A thorn bullet from the riflemans improvised wire rifle.

I forget the actual name for the scorn weapon that they use for long range.

[plain topaz]

This might sound crazy but have we ever considered the seal symbols in beyond light. Maybe those have something to do with the dread or just witness language in general. I know it’s a bit far fetched but it’s something to at lease acknowledge.

[slim girder]

Seal symbols? Can you elaborate?

[plain topaz]

The symbols that were on the things we unlocked in the course of the beyond light campaign. The ones that unlocked the different paths and chests on Europa

[slim girder]

Ohh you mean those special pyramid locks?

[plain topaz]

Yeah

[slim girder]

Those are just pyramid tech sry to say. If you want symbology and language, the murals in rhulks ship would be better for that. The europa pyramid doesn't really have anything on that front.

[plain topaz]

Ok got it

I was just curious

I think the closest we have to a dread writing would be those tree looking symbols in witness related places like on the upended

[slim girder]

The dread don't write. The upended was a weapon of rhulks.
If you would like some lore from the dread you can find it in the flain armour set from sundered doctrine

[plain topaz]

Ok got it, I guess that makes sense they would probably communicate through their minds mostly because of the darkness energy

[slim girder]

They do talk and have an actual language we have yet to decipher but we have never seen texts in game made by them or anything.

[plain topaz]

Yeah I know but I’m talking about like a substitute for writing would be like conscious remnants or something like leaving messages inside of an object or something with their mind. Idk what I’m saying this is just my thoughts.

[slim girder]

You're not wrong in speculating. It's just we really don't have much on the dread atm because they're still very new enemies. I'm sure we'll get more as time goes and we might even figure out their language but it's all theories.

[plain topaz]

Yeah

[ember storm]

Queenbreaker is just a standard fallen wire rifle that vandals use

Scorn have their own makeshift weaponry, with the stalkers (like the rifleman) using crossbows

https://destiny.wiki.gallery/images/thumb/7/78/Crossbow.jpg/1200px-Crossbow.jpg

He only had one devourer round designed to kill Cayde by devouring his light, but made the last-second decision to just kill his ghost in extraordinary fashion to maximize the suffering

[empty fern]

Scorn queenbreaker ornament when

[lapis thistle]

About the new expansion i have some questions about the Lore, but i have a grand question, how is renegades canon and that means some how Destiny is conected to Star Wars

[empty fern]

It’s a Star Wars INSPIRED dlc
And we don’t actually have any lore on it

[lapis thistle]

it has a lightsaber, for me thats Star Wars, and you right we got no information on it but its a possibility

[empty fern]

Terraria has lightsabers

[hardy copper]

Guys how to get pristmatic subclass

[empty fern]

You play final shape

[hardy copper]

where can i find that raid or dungeon

[empty fern]

And welcome to the server, troll to be

[hardy copper]

ty

[empty fern]

On the traveler

[hardy copper]

k

[queen swallow]

LucasFilms, the Star Wars people, are a part of it. Their influence is likely two-fold. 1. Make sure nothing violates copyright laws and 2. Give them good models/access to behind the scenes storyboarding or something. Maybe a third to give it the official seal of approval. After all, Bungie did just get caught stealing art, again.

If anyone, anyone, is allowed to decide what is or what isn't Star Wars, it'd be the people that made it in the first place. That said, Bungie has already admitted, and frankly it has always been obvious, that Star Wars has been a big inspiration for them since probably even Halo. If you don't like it, too bad. It's happening anyway. None of Star Wars lore is necessary or relevant to enjoy Renegades.

[lapis thistle]

i know that destiny and destiny 2 is clearly a inspiration of Star Wars i am not that dumb, and you are right deals can be made and will be made and Star Wars is Star Wars, that said, you are wrong, it can have major implication on the lore of both franchises

[queen swallow]

I did not call you dumb nor was it my intent to make you feel that way. If I did, I sincerely apologize.

[empty fern]

Big paragraph=bad

[lapis thistle]

i didn't say you did, it was just a form of saying

[queen swallow]

Got it

There have been Star Wars inspired cosmetics that have been introduced, and likely more that they are planning for Renegades. However, none of them are actually called what they are in Star Wars, or at least what we would call them from a meta perspective. Darth Vader's suit, for example, is called "Obsidian Durasteel". Granted, durasteel is actually something from Star Wars but it's such a minor addition, I'm not bothered by it. Fortnite, on the other hand, directly calls it "Darth Vader". If Bungie were fully leaning into the Star Wars universe, especially given LucasFilms' seal of approval, [you would think] that the Darth Vader cosmetic would be called "Darth Vader". But it isn't. So we must ask ourselves, why?

[lapis thistle]

ye thats a good point, i dont know how i feel about this honestly

[queen swallow]

You can be conflicted, annoyed, and even disappointed. I'm not going to stop you from doing that. I am, however, going to show that Bungie is not planning on bringing Star Wars lore into the game and LucasFilms is not planning on bringing Destiny lore into its franchise.

[azure badge]

||you dont need a ghost to use stasis?||

im sure by now my question isnt a spoiler

however

I just got to the lightfall campaigh

campaign*

[lapis thistle]

I am mostly confused, but lets see more information before judging

[queen swallow]

Correct. Stasis and Strand are separate from the Light.

[lapis thistle]

Ghost gave you powers, so yes

[azure badge]

So he might be able to learn strand?

[lapis thistle]

Every single one is the ghost using the light and you are just a conduit

[ember storm]

[empty fern]

How dare you ping me

[ember storm]

Only one of the other characters in BL using stasis has a ghost (drifter)

[ember storm]

Kingmaker

[queen swallow]

Who is "he"?

[azure badge]

zavala

[empty fern]

Nuh uh, Thats awoken

[queen swallow]

Yes

[azure badge]

amzing

thanks

[ember storm]

It isn’t

[empty fern]

Fuck
Was thinking of the other one

My destiny knowledge has decayed

[ember storm]

It’s just a lot more volatile and dangerous to do

[queen swallow]

Gotta grind more Byf videos

[ember storm]

Osiris has used it before in the past but not to the extent we have

[lapis thistle]

But we are just the choosen one

[empty fern]

Holdon

Ikora tho

[ember storm]

She has a ghost

[queen swallow]

What about her?

[ember storm]

There’s no risk for her

That’s the point of the convo

[azure badge]

and if he dies he dies

[empty fern]

Oh, chosen one stuff, like 2 nova bombs at once

[ember storm]

Zavala could learn stasis but if he screws up once he literally disintegrates

[ember storm]

No she just pops them off constantly

[empty fern]

True

[ember storm]

Stuff she uses isn’t even real supers half the time

[empty fern]

https://tenor.com/view/destiny-destiny-2-final-shape-destiny-2-final-shape-ikora-rey-gif-1658628747359499287

[ember storm]

She just throws shit

[lapis thistle]

theorichaly you can pop your ult when you whant

[ember storm]

Yeah but it’s not infinite

[lapis thistle]

but its a game and that would be overpower

[ember storm]

There is either physical or mental strain or a mix of both

Cayde was physically exhausted after using blade barrage

[empty fern]

Feels like a “save your limited light for later” thing and a mix of “the cup only holds so much at a time”

[lapis thistle]

i would say its a mix of both

[hexed dock]

Is the power to take a part of sword logic or is it a thing on its own?

[jagged badge]

Its own thing

[hexed dock]

So could we for all intents and purposes actually have a subclass of taken power? Since I think we have that power now canonically?

[hollow hinge]

It'd be very limiting and boring

Would much rather just get a new concept

[slow berry]

Taken power is not a whole lot in and of itself

The power to take is different, and we actively rejected that, for obvious reasons

[empty fern]

Make it a strand aspect where we control the enemies again

Like that one iron lord artifact

[ember storm]

It is not a kind of energy that we can wield

[shy remnant]

Did elsie’s time travel ever get explained. Was that just a traveler moment or something else I forgot.

[eager trout]

What exactly is the Awoken's "arcane technology"?

How does Hive technology work?

[trim grotto]

No, but I think it's fair to guess it was Traveler related.

[ember storm]

Stuff like the Oracle engine

Technology infused with magic or magic mechanisms accessed through tech

[ember storm]

Essentially the same thing

Ana said at one point that “magic is just science we don’t understand” once during Warmind but also that was incredibly stupid because they are literally magic

Eris has a floating green fireball encasing a sentient dragon bone on her person at all times

[trim grotto]

Says the girl able to harness the concept of absence into a bow of pure energy

[queen swallow]

The magic quote from Ana is actually a misquote from Arthur C. Clarke: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

[trim grotto]

True! Which makes Ana seem even more silly.

[ember storm]

Unfortunately she was raised by Clovis so it is in character to misconstrue actual smart things

[queen swallow]

No, as in the magic quote is a regular misquote by us humans, not Ana making a mistake, though she did

There's shitty "inspirational" posters with the misquote on it even

[eager trout]

And what magic is it?

From where?

Powered by what?

[eager trout]

I mean, Ahamkaras are called glitches in reality or something like that, which would be their scientific denomination, and their powers are considered magic because they have no logical explanation. However, something that doesn't belong in reality is not bound by its rules, therefore, it makes sense that it can do illogical things.

[eager trout]

The quote is pretty different from the misquote tho, both in meaning and wording

[queen swallow]

That's... that's what a misquote is?

Arthur C. Clarke never said "Magic is just science that we don't understand yet."

He said "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". That got muddled and misheard and misinterpreted and misremembered into the quote above.

[queen swallow]

It's definitely not falsely attributed to him, like "Into the woods I go to lose my mind and find my soul" is to John Muir. It's just been confused over the years, as things are wont to be.

[eager trout]

I mean that it's too different in every way to even have come from the other.

It looks more like two separate quotes that just happen to be similar enough for people to correlate them

[shy remnant]

It’s weird to know the traveler can just do that for some reason.

Guess there was just no time to explain

[little gorge]

well that's true in real life

at least unless the traveller pulls up to mars irl there is no magic

[lapis thistle]

Ahamkaras are literly just magic dragons (not the band)

[sick yew]

I do be imagining some dragons right about now

[jagged badge]

[ember storm]

actually my personal theory was that it was from the black fleet/witness

something something the witness wanted a failsafe to ensure they'd never be in a universe where the traveler was completely dead so somehow set up the whole groundhog day situation

[jaunty wing]

@queen swallow Any sufficiently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science.

Agatha's law.

[shy remnant]

Ya know that makes me think why the witness even let eris kill the traveler as she would’ve been able to contact him through savy or the pyramid. I feel like the dark future lore book suffers in hindsight.

[ember storm]

a big point of contention is that nothing explicitly confirms that the warsats could’ve actually destroyed the traveler

the traveler did not go into orbit to leave, it left the upper atmosphere and then just stayed there, because it wanted to confront the witness head on and protect the city from unnecessary damage

The Witness never wanted the traveler destroyed in any capacity, it has always needed it alive to enact the final shape

What it did was simply manipulate Eramis and her wishes for revenge to orchestrate a scenario where the traveler would be forced into direct confrontation

Eramis very much wanted to destroy the traveler but it wouldn’t have happened

At most it would’ve damaged and incapacitated, forgoing the need for the fight at the start of Lightfall

[shy remnant]

Technically the witness fails in every timeline other than ours because the traveler gets destroyed by its forces before it’s even there lol

Or I guess forces it influenced rather than belonging to him

[ember storm]

That’s a misunderstanding of what the dark future is

They’re not alternate universes that exist alongside our own

It was a branch off of this timeline that stopped existing the moment Elsie looped back

[shy remnant]

My fault specifically every Elsie loop

[ember storm]

and again this is what my personal theory is about

the witness sets up the loop to ensure the traveler will always be alive by the time it enacts the final shape

[shy remnant]

probably not what’s intended by bungie. Most likely it’s just a traveler last minute failsafe.

[ember storm]

I mean if that’s how you feel about it

[shy remnant]

But its a cool theory and the irony of the witness setting up his own death technically

[ember storm]

I wouldn’t assume things on bungie’s behalf

If the witness wanted to it could’ve manually ran around the universe killing everything but it wanted to enact the final shape

that’s the entire point of its existence

a civilization couldn’t cope with the idea of not having a specific purpose and so they made their own and tried forcing everyone else to be part of it

Nothing would’ve happened if they had a good life coach

[shy remnant]

If only the traveler gave life advice alongside paracausal power

[ember storm]

well the point is that it doesn’t

it doesn’t want to make any choices for anyone

[shy remnant]

I wish we got a little more on the travelers origins in tfs but I still like the mystery of it

[blazing wasp]

If something that's effectively a god propels your entire civilization into a golden age, dramatically improving every aspect of your life, then you'd zealously follow just about anything it says.

[queen swallow]

Except it doesn't say anything, it just does

[blazing wasp]

Any advice would be received like laws you must abide by

[blazing wasp]

Exactly

The traveler doesn't say anything because the traveler is very supportive of free will

The option to choose

[queen swallow]

If that is the case, then why does it do anything? Is that not taking away the option of free will by doing something? Free will is often seen as someone choosing to do something "good" but people can just as easily choose to do something "bad" with their free will. If the Traveler creates a Golden Age of "Good", does that not inherently remove bad choices from free will?

[ember storm]

All it’s ever done is offered assistance

People have taken it all of their own free will every time

We could simply not have started the golden age

Never tried making contact with the traveler

Never followed it to the planets and moons it terraformed

[blazing wasp]

The option for free medical checkups is not the same as government mandated medical checkups

[ember storm]

the traveler is a gardener

it cultivates

It doesn’t control

[queen swallow]

Valid points

[ember storm]

Everything we’re given is something we choose to deal with

[blazing wasp]

It never does anything to oppose those that reject the travelers gifts

[ember storm]

Guardians don’t asked to be rezzed, sure, but nothing is forcing them to continue acting as a guardian

You can completely avoid any obligation and live forever

Or also choose not to live at all

[blazing wasp]

To add to that, ghosts also have freedom of who they revive

[queen swallow]

That'd cover a No Resuscitation

[ember storm]

If I were a ghost I’d choose Al yankovic

[queen swallow]

lmao

[ember storm]

Who would you choose

[queen swallow]

Jacob Collier

[velvet hawk]

Zavala at one point left is training and had a wife and son... we have free will unlike the witnesses chosen

[lapis thistle]

And don't forget Cayde 6 was forced to be a guardian but he choose to stay as one

[ember storm]

that is literally every single guardian

[lapis thistle]

I mean you have a point there indeed

[static maple]

Why does ikora hate her ghost w that long ass name

[slow berry]

They don't hate eachother, and have begun speaking again

[static maple]

Yeah ik that

But what happened

Why didnt they before

[slow berry]

Ikora got into being a Thanatonaut and that sort of started it

[eager trout]

A what

[queen swallow]

Researcher of death

[eager trout]

Why?

[queen swallow]

Why not? Especially as someone who can be resurrected practically infinitely

"Thanatonauts are Warlocks who voluntarily die in order to experience insightful visions before being revived by their Ghosts."

[slow berry]

You know how guardians revive

You know how people see things right before they die

Well

Thanatonauts sit in a desk with a book and a pen and a gun and some rounds

[queen swallow]

Shaxx just thinks it's an excuse for insomnia if that helps

[slow berry]

And get to writing

[eager trout]

Ah, ok, thanks

[trim grotto]

Ophiuchus. We do not actually know exactly what caused their falling out.

Some theorise it's related to her Ahamkara Wish, but that's mostly just guessing.

[trim grotto]

Visions! Some Thanatonauts glimpse something in the void of death, and they seek to document all they may. It's a rather unusual and macabre practise, but fascinating.

[static maple]

Who yall fav

And why

[queen swallow]

Of what?

[static maple]

Character

[trim grotto]

Unnamed Tower NPC who keeps talking about random shit like movies such as The Constant Guardian

[ember storm]

Shadow the hedgehog

[static maple]

Great pick

But why

[ember storm]

Why not

[static maple]

Good poijt

[trim grotto]

Real idle dialogue

This is my favourite goober

[static maple]

Where do we find this character

[queen swallow]

So, like, there's this guy I've heard rumors about being in one of the upcoming expansions. He's got this wild name. You'd've never heard of him before. Goes to all these crazy bars and tries to drug people for fun. A real, I dunno, sleazebag. A sleazebaggano, if you will. Elan Sleazebaggano.

[ember storm]

What

[queen swallow]

Star Wars reference

The guy who tries to sell Obi-Wan and Anakin drugs in a bar in Attack of the Clones

[ember storm]

I don’t think that happens because he thinks it’s fun

[queen swallow]

Eh, semantics

[ember storm]

Also obi wan made him quit that profession forever so

[dim minnow]

he only tried to sell them to Obi Wan

[queen swallow]

Poke holes in my fun why don't ya

[static maple]

Poke fun in my holes

[queen swallow]

It's called dyslexia, okay, and I don't have it

[eager trout]

Chat, I figured out why one of the Nine is missing

[queen swallow]

Why?

[plain topaz]

does anybody know what these orange things at the bottom of the ketch are?

[eager trout]

Because seven ate nine

[trim grotto]

The only way we could figure that out is if it was described in visual concept art. As far as I am aware, and I'm aware of a fair bit, these weren't specifically described in dialogue or writing.

[plain topaz]

so we have no idea

[queen swallow]

Not at the moment

[plain topaz]

ok

[trim grotto]

Why say few word when many word do trick

[queen swallow]

fewer words = less typing

[slim girder]

If i had to guess they're probably so the ketch can hover or something. Idk that's just what I'm getting from them..

[queen swallow]

Then what's the massive circular thing on the side?

[dim minnow]

big ass thruster

[queen swallow]

I guess it's for horizontal movement only then

[dim minnow]

maybe it's where skiffs emerge from

would match with how skiffs deploy troops

[ember storm]

big microwave

keeps the walkers toasty

[slow berry]

Oh my fucking god do you reckon the whole thing with the nine is this joke

With bungie's obsession with 7

[blazing wasp]

It might just be because 7 is like the magical number

3, 7 and 9

[trim grotto]

I'd be amazed if this decades long joke was built on that haha

[sick yew]

Lmao

Would be funny tho

[slim girder]

Wouldn't be surprised if through this fate saga we do eventually have the nine being reduced to 7 lol

[queen swallow]

The Nine are actually a homage to Bungie's Myth series where there is another similar group called The Nine that help the Light.

[hexed dock]

Is there any in-game lore on “The Architects” besides it being a joke that Bungie built the game

[blazing wasp]

the architects is indeed just a joke, they do not actually exist

[ember storm]

buildings arent real

wake up sheeple

[slow berry]

inb4 the architects are a group of sentient energy that was once the singular thing in the universe and they created the big bang thus putting everything everywhere into place as part of their design

[empty fern]

Architecture is just architectural

[covert flax]

Are the destiny grimores worth buying? I want to get more into the lore and they seem like a good route

[slim girder]

I'd say so. You can obviously find the lore online but it's still nice to have it in physical form if you're a fan of the lore.

[dim minnow]

Plus the second, third, and seventh ones all have exclusive entries

The first one only has an exclusive entry in the ebook version

And the fourth just shoes a scrapped story concept from Forsaken

[iron mortar]

Dude I am watching the destiny rising closed beta stuff and the story is already leagues above d1 and d2 vanilla story

The guardian actually has a personality and all the characters have clear thing that set them apart they all aren't just stoic soldiers

[little gorge]

the guardian in d2 is not supposed to have a personality

[dim minnow]

Due to the way Rising is set up, the characters you play as including the main protagonist are allowed to have their own distinct personalities

In D1 and D2, your character is custom made and is pretty much who you want them to be hence why they appear to have little personality to them.

[eager trout]

The Guardian is literally called Guardian

And Ghost is called Ghost

Doesn't get more basic than that

[ember storm]

Wrong mine is called Wheatley from Portal™️ 2

[little gorge]

ive made this joke before but your ghost is a MORON

[ember storm]

Could a moron do THIS?

He is perfect at his job

[slow berry]

Also makes sense because its a gacha, and gacha games tend to be very character-focused in their narratives because they are tryna sell them to you, so they want you to get attached to them and make them noticeably different from one another

[iron mortar]

So kind of like a halo 1 master chief type character

I vibe with this in destiny rising since I feel more attached to the characters and since it is so early in the lore(legit right at the beginning of the city age) they have so many stories to tell

[queen swallow]

Question for you: who made Halo 1?

[jagged badge]

Me, next question

[queen swallow]

https://tenor.com/view/sus-fry-futurama-gif-4691459

[queen swallow]

Who made Halo 2?

[jagged badge]

Me, next question

[queen swallow]

Damn it, they’re good

Uh

[queen swallow]

Halo 3?

[jagged badge]

Me, next question

[queen swallow]

What, exactly, is your favorite breed of cat?

[jagged badge]

Me, next question

[queen swallow]

I-

[jagged badge]

Those are ears under there you know

[empty fern]

Nuh uh

[queen swallow]

Eris cat girl confirmed?

[queen swallow]

Halo 4?

[jagged badge]

That was my dad

Next question

[queen swallow]

Favorite type of cheese?

[jagged badge]

Brie. With that, we should probably end this bit and get back to lore lmao

[queen swallow]

But… but… I’m the number one bit endorser ;-;

Yeah yeah yeah fine

Anyway, the original question was meant to be rhetorical. Halo 1 was also made by Bungie. They just took even more lines off of our character this time around.

The whole motto is “Become Legend” as in you become a legend. If they gave your player character a personality, that’d conflict with a lot of people’s viewpoints of what makes someone a legend.

[plain topaz]

If the witness is dead, who’s flying the pyramid scales in onslaught

Some sort of powerful subjugation or somethingv

Subjugator*

[sick yew]

The Pyramids are controlled by the central statue

Not the Witness

Also imma be real I think Onslaught specifically is a simulation anyway so it doesnt count

[plain topaz]

Oh ok, also I was talking about onslaught salvation, sorry I should have been more specific.

Wait so the dissenters are still alive, or are the statues something else

[sick yew]

The statues dont have to be dissenters

It wouldnt make sense for the Witness to put those who directly opposed it in charge of the fleet

The statues are just vessels of sort

[plain topaz]

Yeah makes sense. Maybe their some other witness follower(s)

Or something completely different

[sick yew]

Part of the Witness likely yeah

It was never like specifically said but something along those lines is most plausible

[ember storm]

Central statue?

Did I miss something?

I thought the idea was that they were all somewhat sentient but still beholden to their master

[trim grotto]

Yeah pretty much
There wasn't a problem putting dissenters in valuable positions because up until Final Shape they were completely controlled by the Witness regardless

That said, I'm pretty sure they'll be dead. The Witness worked on Egregore logic - despite not being connected physically, they were whole mentally. A shared mindspace spanning across even dimensions.

I'll ping @plain topaz for that

[plain topaz]

So who controlls the pyramids?

[trim grotto]

Currently? Nobody. They are yearning for a new master.

[plain topaz]

Oh, what about the scales.

[trim grotto]

I expect they're the same.

[plain topaz]

They were flying in onslaught salvation which was after the death of the witness, was it the echo?

[trim grotto]

The Dread - and presumably the Scales - were seeking out the power of the Echo at the time, and by the following Episode, were under command of our good friend Keith

The Scales were not specifically mentioned as far as I know, though

[plain topaz]

Mysterious, so are the scales like, alive kind of.

[trim grotto]

Well, the Pyramids are, insomuch as they desire a new master. The Scales haven't been described with such autonomy. They may simply be Darkness tech, or perhaps not.

[plain topaz]

They might be controled by the big pyramids since they come from them. But they could possibly just be ships.

[eager trout]

What are the Scales? First time hearing of them

[queen swallow]

The music scales? In Western music there are 12-

[dim minnow]

Pyramid Scales

they're like small Pyramid scout ships

[eager trout]

Example?

[dim minnow]

one can be seen right after beating the Sanctified Mind in GoS

they can also show up during both versions of Onslaught whenever a Tormentor or Subjugator spawn

I think they can also be seen flying around the sky in Dual Destiny

here's a picture of one

[eager trout]

Ah, those

[eager trout]

Dual Destiny is literally Destiny 2

[ember storm]

Sorry Savathun… but it’s our Dual Destiny… and your Destiny 2

[dim minnow]

no, it is 2 Destiny

[eager trout]

So it's Destiny too

[frozen pawn]

since it seems "Earth" is included in the NINE, do we know what side it's on? 4 or 5 ?

[dim minnow]

I'm not sure, but I am interested on which personality it is

[sick yew]

Well it talks about Nutrinos thats what we know

[slow berry]

Do you reckon earth-nine was super fucking smug that it had the only life in the solar system and thus was basically the brain

[sick yew]

Lmao

[frozen pawn]

"So Theia lived - until misfortune - led it here - caught - by my gravities"

So, if Theia is the one crashing into Earth and create the current Moon

which mean Earth is the one who has "-" between his/her line?

"I told you - this story - was a bad idea" It seems to be more caring than the others

[slim girder]

Still up to speculation tbh. We need more information but so far we just know that each speaks in a different form and who's on which side of the current argument being had between the nine.

[little gorge]

you'd think but in the earth cutscene from rite the nine speaking is the one who uses ...

so we can't tell for sure

[frozen pawn]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/categories/book-anamorphosis
ah no I mean in this lorebook

this should be from the rite of the nine event

[little gorge]

yes i know

what i'm saying is the cutscene we got of earth contradicts this

[frozen pawn]

ohh

hmmmm

[little gorge]

https://youtu.be/dUy66oHAaeY?si=c3pqr480MWG3l-Kz

if i had to choose i'd assume the cutscene one is earth since those seem more like they're made intentionally for us to be able to tell which is which?

but it's definitely not certain

[frozen pawn]

hmmmm

so

it mean Theia cause by others gravity and crashed into Earth ?

oh wait

in the lore look

there's no one using "..."

[fluid peak]

... and - are both pauses grammatically speaking so i suppose its consistent that way

[plain topaz]

I seems earth is desperate for help, maybe referencing pollution or something. Idk this is just a theory

[slim girder]

It was the nine that broke xurs back right?

I'm just speculating on what the nine are capable of if we were to make an enemy out of one of their members or something and how they might behave if they attempted to retaliate in some way.

[plain topaz]

Xur’s back is broken?

[slow berry]

It was Erin actually

[sick yew]

Erin?

You mean Orin?

[queen swallow]

Yaeger?

[sick yew]

Jäger*

Please

[queen swallow]

Nein

Danke

[sick yew]

Doch

Arsch

[queen swallow]

h

Yes, Orin did it

'Xûr asked Orin to "forgive them" while she crushed his windpipe...'

[sick yew]

I think we gotta start seperating Orin and The Emissary at this point cause they are for all intends and purposes different people atp

Which reminds me

I havent watched the new mini cutscenes for the gotd collectibles yet

Gonna get on that rq

[queen swallow]

They always were. They were just incapable of physically separating themselves until now.

[sick yew]

Yeah well we didnt exactly know of their struggles until recently iirc

At least not to that capacity

I personally doubted Orin was still in there

[eager trout]

With the mention of neutrinos, it's probably Taken.

How can there be pollution if there's only one city with no (known) factories?

[plain topaz]

Good point, yeah it’s probably the taken.

[sick yew]

Okay we got a whole different theme for these recent two

[eager trout]

What two?

[queen swallow]

The collectable cutscenes

[queen swallow]

VI is Saturn

[sick yew]

Odd that it only shows images of the Dreadnaught tho

The other one is obviously Mars

[plain topaz]

I think I got confused (This could be considered unhealthy) because I like to combine irl with the destiny universe(I know I’m crazy)

[queen swallow]

Makes sense. It's the only location we have there

[eager trout]

Ah yeah

Sounds big when it talks

[queen swallow]

It also just shows Saturn in the background

[sick yew]

"We appeal to your commanding gravity"
The Traveler?

[queen swallow]

For the record, II is Venus and III is Earth as well

[eager trout]

Not even the Traveler could make Saturn habitable

[sick yew]

Those were obvious yeah

[plain topaz]

Wait, so is I the Sun or Mercury

[eager trout]

Maybe breathable

[queen swallow]

V is likely Jupiter and I is Mercury.

[trim grotto]

It never tried. It didn't get to every planet - Io was left half finished.

[eager trout]

I want to see how Mercury talks, being a Vex computer and all

[sick yew]

Well we got Venus which was also very vex-ified

[queen swallow]

Those aren't confirmed but if we're going by planets, well, Earth is the third planet, Venus is the second. Stands to reason that I is Mercury.

[plain topaz]

Wait if mercury is 1, counting through the planets, what would be IX

[queen swallow]

It's all on Destinypedia, which one talks how

[eager trout]

Yeah, but Mercury basically got turned into a meat rock puppet

[queen swallow]

Yes, and since Pluto isn't counted (meanies), that means IX is likely the Sun

[sick yew]

Also imma be real, for a brief moment I completely forgot Spire and Hellas Basin are on the same planet lmfao

[plain topaz]

That makes it weird, because counting from the sun it would be. 9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

[sick yew]

What if its 012345678

[queen swallow]

We only know for certain 4 of them. We will likely know 2 more when Prophecy's cutscenes drop

[sick yew]

Its also interesting that they only aded the number for the most recent two cutscenes

[queen swallow]

as for the last 3, idk

[slow berry]

Typo but yeah orin

[sick yew]

The ones from Spire aka Venus and Earth did not have a number at the start

[plain topaz]

🤔

[queen swallow]

Base 9? Yeah, that'd make sense

[sick yew]

(Im just saying things btw)

The Nine are probably the aspect I know the least about lore wise

[queen swallow]

Cheese

[plain topaz]

Said literally ever destiny player

[slow berry]

By the way I know rasputin is dead/a dog but also is every warsat just gonezo now

[plain topaz]

That’s a good question what are the warsats been controlled by now. How are they being launched?

[slow berry]

Like are the physical parts of Rasputin's systems still operational and just "empty" or did all of it stop

[trim grotto]

The Warsats self destructed. The rest of it... not so clear.

[plain topaz]

Perhaps it’s some sort of automated launch program that keeps going after the warminds “death”

Idk

[slow berry]

all im saying is failsafe in charge of the warmind operations would go absolutely insane as a mirror to rasputin being a man-made, carefully crafted and raised AI vs the onboard ship ai that developed attachment issues and anxiety disorder on its own

Bungie loves their nature and their nurture

[trim grotto]

Failsafe also nearly murdered us after we abandoned her on Nessus. I love Failsafe, but that's a lot of power to give to a malfunctioning shipboard safety AI.

[plain topaz]

Yeah, recipe for disaster.

[slow berry]

The lore tabs where Failsafe speaks in first person and they describe trying to work through their permanently damaged body and steadily decaying power generators are some of my favourite writing in the game

[trim grotto]

Oh fully agree

[slow berry]

Yeah but that's what makes it fun

Just dont leave her alone!!

Also because the idea of failsafe having a trillion times more energy available but still not having enough energy to use the politeness filter full time would go great

[plain topaz]

Hypothetical
Failsafe: literally going insane
Lith:

[slow berry]

Like I just adore Failsafe and I think there's a lot to work with her in the future

And the fact that they specifically focused an entire episode around her makes me think she'll be involved in our future

[slow berry]

that was the thing with rasputin anyway and we woke up that guy every twenty minutes!!

[plain topaz]

Fair enough

[sick yew]

Remind me

[trim grotto]

https://youtu.be/htH1OBXOpfs?si=oBz1Gi9Q6NO6JOtS

[sick yew]

How do I not remember this

Poor Failsafe

[queen swallow]

I block out all of those screen messages

[sick yew]

I do most of them too but some stay in memory

[slow berry]

How specifically was the Deep Stone Crypt hidden and how did Eramis find it? Was it just "we hadn't had a reason to look on Europa"?

I remember my theory for the location of the DSC ten years ago was that it was hidden inside some asteroid in the asteroid belt

[sick yew]

The crypt itself wasnt really hidden as you can see considering its just one sparrow section away from Eventide itself

I assume most if it is "underground" thought so its not exactly recognizable as "the deep stone crypt"

[slow berry]

I guess the snow storms don't help either

[sick yew]

It might be an area where storms are mor deadly but I doubt it

Its most likely rather well guarded tho, considering the numerous defence mechanisms we saw lateron such as the seraph towers (no not the worthy ones) and the laser traps and whatnot

[sick yew]

But funny that you mention Elsies monologue at the start of dsc because looking at it now she was just a tad overexaggerating with "prison for something sinister"

Its not like the Clarity statue was really imprisoned

[ember storm]

Well there’s the fact of first knowing that there’s anything left on Europa at all and then trying to find its exact coordinates

Then there’s the issue of searching around all the different Bray facilities

Most would probably look into Bray Exoscience and just get completely lost, since that’s only where the final stages of exomind production happen

That and the security system is designed to kill intruders

[ember storm]

She could’ve meant Clovis

[sick yew]

But Clovis isnt in the crypt

[ember storm]

His ai was completely inactive until the crypt systems reactivated him

Did you think he was just awake staring at the wall for the entire collapse and dark age

[sick yew]

Yes

[ember storm]

Elsie shut him off when she left iirc

[sick yew]

im joking but im sure theres a diff way he could have been booted back up

[ember storm]

Nah

[sick yew]

And even then its a bit of a stretch

[ember storm]

House salvation poking around the exact facility he was housed in did nothing

But the moment they accessed clarity control he started spouting about godlike judgment

He simply wasn’t awake

[sick yew]

I still think we should have just let Europa get blown to bits

[slow berry]

Question: what is happening to Morgeth

I think he has like

Ahamkara bones on it

[sick yew]

The guy we blow up in Kings Fall?

Wait no Last Wish guy

[sick yew]

Where exactly

[ember storm]

That’s just normal chitin

He’s a taken ogre with blighted cysts

Bad hygiene

[sick yew]

Typical Ogre shit

[ember storm]

Not as bad as golgoroth

He barely even looks hive

[sick yew]

Hes owning it tho

Disgusting? Absolutely but damn

[ember storm]

Which makes sense as he was literally unnaturally spawned by Xol somehow

[eager trout]

There was a statue?

[ember storm]

That’s like the defining characteristic of the deep stone crypt

that’s the entire point of the facility

that’s the secret Clovis wanted guarded from everybody

[eager trout]

I don't remember seeing it

[ember storm]

Literally how

[sick yew]

This thing?

[ember storm]

It is the biggest statue that exists

[sick yew]

Between 1st and 2nd encounter

[eager trout]

Ah

I haven't done most of the raid

[ember storm]

its literally after the 1st encounter

[sick yew]

Never knew that theres a whole bunch of additional Luzaku conversations if you rerun her lost sector

Huh she was an Acolyte before she died

Interesting

[queen swallow]

Huh? How can an acolyte become a wizard?

[sick yew]

no one knows

Thats the main thing of said conversation

Ikora is very confused and so is she

[dim minnow]

Acolytes can become either a Knight or Wizard normally

however, Luzaku was originally an Acolyte Ligthbearer before entering the Pale Heart where she became a Wizard

[little gorge]

you know, like, clarity control, the answer to humanity's eternal struggle, la fontaine du jouvance

[slow berry]

our trans queen,,,,

[sick yew]

Are all Acolytes male?

[jagged badge]

No

[sick yew]

I was about to say yeah

[kind lichen]

I need some help building warlock builds and doing raids.

[sick yew]

Then you came to the wrong place

This is about lore

Head to either #📘pve-playbook or #1135936155527946280

[empty fern]

BANISHED

[next bobcat]

Don’t forget oryx as well

[queen swallow]

Bungie really said what if we made one of the best/most iconic villains ever a transman?

[sick yew]

Best homie aswell

As of this episode at least

[ember storm]

the nature of acolytes is that of one without predetermined destiny, just at the edge of exploring their new life

this can apply to hunter characteristics

plus classes are largrly conjecture anyway

[plain topaz]

Do attendants/weavers speak the dread language or some other language

[hollow hinge]

They are fully Dread

So yes

[slim girder]

More gross hive please. Popping maloks head was the last gross hive moment imo.

I want hive to drop from the ceiling from egg pouches

[slow berry]

wouldnt they be larvae bsicaly

[slim girder]

Nah they can be thrall.

Like a masive horde of thrall

Idk i just want more gross aliens.

[rugged compass]

Someone pls hel

Doing final shape

Need a lore drop

From newlight all the way here

[dapper moss]

ok wow so uh

theres the traveler which is the light

and then the witness which is the darkness

the darkness arrived in beyond light and gave us stasis

and then the witness arrived in lightfall and used the veil (which is just like darkness incarnate) to get into the traveler and mess around inside it

on neomuna we discovered strand which was a manifestation of darkness from the veil

and now we have to go inside the traveler and stop the witness from combining light and dark to create the final shape essentially freezing everything in time

im skipping a lot and oversimplifying even more but thats kinda all you need @rugged compass

[rugged compass]

Thanks

Great stuff

[rugged compass]

didn't we basically do the exact same thing

[dapper moss]

we blended darkness and light harmoniously to create prismatic

the witness seeks to use it for much more of a visceral intent

[rugged compass]

hmmmmh

[trim grotto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om28A9hTST0
Well this is a good starting point

but exactly how much lore are we after here
because there is ten years of lore

[queen swallow]

Is the new light experience meant to be a retcon of our actions in D1?

[ember storm]

No

It is entirely non canonical

[queen swallow]

Bold move to introduce players to a game with 10+ years of lore with something entirely non-canonical

[ember storm]

As opposed to just doing the exact same first mission from D1 that sets up a campaign they can’t play?

[queen swallow]

That is a fair point

[sleek matrix]

[eager trout]

Fun fact: the Prismatic fragments you get from the hidden chests in the campaign missions correspond to the Guardian tennets (minus death)

[dim minnow]

Devotion

Sacrifice

[ember storm]

facet of

[slim girder]

I hope we get some meaning behind the symbol of the nine.

[queen swallow]

There is some. Three circles divided into nine parts.

[slim girder]

Right I knew that but I'm curious as to if the way they're divided makes sense. Like could it be related to the size of each celestial body that the nine are tied to.

[queen swallow]

That is a possibility

I almost want to say it's a perfect map of the solar system read right to left where the biggest portion of the rightmost circle is the Sun and the smallest is Mercury but I don't think the proportions or numbers work out for the rest.

I definitely think that they could/can be mapped in order of size (i.e. Sun is the largest slice and Mercury is the smallest) but it would not produce the map of the Solar system. What it may produce is the 4 - 5 split we know the Nine have. The middle one is split into four sections and the other two circles add up to five.

We're learning the numbers and general tones of the Nine through the Rite of the Nine collectable cutscenes. Once we get all of them, it should be pretty easy to figure out if that theory is true or not.

What I find interesting is that Mars has still not been returned to us, yet it "speaks" in one of the Rite of the Nine collectables.

And now that we know that Kepler is beyond the heliopause, the entries about nine Ghosts studying it is suddenly much more interesting, even more so that they talked to Orin/The Emissary and said nothing to her.

[slim girder]

Mars has been returned. Presumably thanks to savathun back during witch queen. We were also there during season of the seraph and spire of the watcher.

Mercury is the only place apparently left to be returned

[queen swallow]

You’re right

[slim girder]

I'm surprised we really haven't heard almost anything about Venus to my knowledge. Bungie seems have completely forgotten about anything related to it aside from obviously the intro to VoG.

No lore about what's going on over there with the vex or anything, no interesting events needing to be investigated and nothing from the old ishtar facilities.

[frigid sparrow]

Io also hasn't really been returned since we're in a weird space when it comes to that

As for Venus, I think the stuff with shayura might be the most recent stuff there, where it's just the odd guardian or so still being there every so often for either loot, data, or whatever else, but we haven't needed to go back

[trim grotto]

oh yeah no Venus is fine
still patrolled, just not by us specifically

[ember storm]

Io is still just in the ascendant plane or somewhere related

[civic quarry]

Facet of ltg speech

[slow berry]

Plot theory: Something or other is going to kill the Drifter at some point in the future, sending Goddess of Vengeance Eris Morn into absolute gigaoverdrive, and setting this up is partially why Bungie is aiming to sideline Gambit as an ongoing game mode

[ember storm]

naw

bungie doesnt intentionally do anything with gambit

it's always going to be there