📚lore-discussion

[thorny scarab]

In the Icebreaker Lore Tab

[slim girder]

Graviton lance was also found in Chicago and as the weapons perk says, It fires miniature black holes.
With all the time distortion for edge of fate it seems that a lot of work in that field might have been done in Chicago. Maybe that might even be where the Aion company is based in

[sick yew]

This is exactly what happened in witch queen

Chicago gets off handedly mentioned once and everyone starts theorizing we go there or sum

[trim grotto]

the format is your automod banning the word where the person sits in a ship

[hollow hinge]

Mael evading the filter smh

How far we've fallen!

[sick yew]

Bros 'bout to get banned

[slim girder]

I remember when bungie revealed witch queen with just a picture of the hunter helmet and everyone started shouting WE'RE GOING TO CHICAGO LOOK

[sick yew]

Or use that one pre d1 concept art of the swamp as "proof" they're making Chicago swamp like

[slim girder]

Ah yes we're also getting giant frogs in Chicago

[thorny scarab]

Do you have the image?

[slim girder]

Here

People thought the background buildings and what look like roads were clearly Chicago

[lyric karma]

Do we have any lore on wyverns? How have we never met em before and then they suddenly appeared

[next bobcat]

What

How in the

Why specifically Chicago??

[trim grotto]

There is not. At all.

They have had a single offhand mention, not even by name.

[lyric karma]

quite sad

[trim grotto]

We were getting some lore from Chicago at the time. We have actually had some since.

[ember storm]

tthe most violent vex lore in the BL year was actually about a goblin in splicer

telefragged an eliksni

[next bobcat]

Strange

[wheat flower]

No chance you could've missed the one book they where mentioned in?

[jagged badge]

And to clarify, Age-Old Bond does not talk abut the Vex unit

And the transcript is just someone noting that a Wyvern spawns, and not actual dialogue in game

[slow berry]

@slim girder Chicago was also one of the destinations in the original concepts for Destiny so a lot of people have always expected it to show up some day eventually

[hazy veldt]

let me clarify

so the nine are either one boltzmann brain divided into 9 parts

or nine of them

existing tied to celestial bodies in our solar system, also tied to every particle of matter within it

with their main goal is getting freedom in form of manifestation

into physical world

[trim grotto]

The physical aspect is more of a... Convenience. It's mostly about becoming independent, free from the bonds that give them their thought and form. I imagine if there was a way out of that, without becoming physical, they may still take it.

As for the first half, I'd say they're nine separate ones. The way they're described doesn't fit nine parts of one being.

[plain topaz]

Are fallen walkers manned or are they robotic

[slim girder]

Robotic

[plain topaz]

Ok, but i’m assuming the goliath tanks are manned though

[slim girder]

Yes I would assume those are manned but bungie probs didn't want to develop enemies popping out of them when destroyed

[plain topaz]

Yeah, it would make sense considering how big the tanks are

[slim girder]

The emblem for rite of the nine spire is named Seer. Wasn't that name in destiny at some point?

I swear Seer was a nme in destiny a long time ago

[slow berry]

A seer is a person that predicts or foretells the future

[slim girder]

Prolly just going crazy but what if this event actually ends up giving us big hints on edge of fate through the emblem names and stuff

[dim minnow]

Seer seems to directly correlate with the dungeon

Spire of the Watcher

we'll have to see the other two emblems

[little gorge]

not emblem names but there are cryptic cutscenes

[slim girder]

How does it correlate? Unless you're talking about soteria because wasn't she related to neomuna aka nefele stronghold?

[dim minnow]

Seer
Spire of the WATCHER

Soteria is also an AI made with Vex tech so she has predictive capabilities

[slim girder]

Ahh ok i get you now

I guess with ghosts maybe the emblem will be called navigator or something

Or revival?

[dim minnow]

I mean, we could just look it up on destinyemblemcollector

[next bobcat]

Ah

Interesting

[slim girder]

Thought that might be considered leaks so i didn't say anything since it's not in the game yet

[dim minnow]

well I didn't mention the emblems by name

I merely pointed out where you can find them for yourself

[native sequoia]

Are ghosts basically assigned their partners or do they get to pick?

[trim grotto]

Both, in a way. Ghosts can choose anyone in theory, but they have a feeling that they've got a Chosen just for them. They won't know until they scan them, however, so unpaired Ghosts have been searching for centuries.

[native sequoia]

Ok, thats what i thought. Thx

[sick yew]

Really? So Immaru could have resurrected Savathun either way?

Regardless if bro had the feeling or nah

[abstract pagoda]

What is Oxa?

[sick yew]

Thats is a question for another day I suppose

Jokes aside iirc its a Psion

[abstract pagoda]

Really? Cool

[sick yew]

I think they were losely mentioned years later in season of Chosen as part of the Psion collective that tried to kill Zavala and probably now work with the remaining Witness forces

Or was Oxa the one that was also on the Glykon?

[slim girder]

Oxa is a machine that could possibly predict the future.

[sick yew]

Wait fr

Oxa was the prediction engine?

[slim girder]

Otzot is the psion who used it back during calus rule. And even ghost says this during the insight terminus strike

"What is oxa and who is Otzot"

Sorry I made a mistake. The vex kept records of the machine but it's not actually made by the vex

It was built by the freeborn psion otzot and calus then used it.

[ember storm]

hueh

what is this thing

[dim minnow]

It primarily is meant to look into the past, but it does possess predictive capabilities

[uneven canyon]

Why are there classes to Lightbearers? And can they use powers from the other divisions?

[slow berry]

OXA also maybe sorta is related to the hive

And/or may have the osmium sibling's mom in it or something like that?

[slow berry]

It's a gameplay thing vaguely connected to lore

[blazing wasp]

Classes are more... Like ideologies

[slow berry]

There's warlocky titans and titany warlocks and people who don't do classes

[blazing wasp]

Schools of thought I think mael called it

[slow berry]

It's kinda just how the light most naturally presents itself to you and how you manipulate it

[blazing wasp]

A warlock doesn't become a nerd, a nerd becomes a warlock

But we are not restrained by classes and the class abilities even

You could go beyond both but, it's easiest to stick to a class.

[slow berry]

Then there's people like the Drifter

Who's out there doing his own thing

[blazing wasp]

In lore people also often main subclasses too

[uneven canyon]

My character is a Sentinel main but I wonder if she could do something like throw a pocket nova or some shit

So how hard would it be for a Guardian to learn the powers of the other classes?

[blazing wasp]

Maybe with enough training but we're not that adept with the light

[blazing wasp]

Unknown!

[slow berry]

With enough training but your titan would have to be a goat

[blazing wasp]

We just know its hard

And is rarely done

[slow berry]

I would assume THE guardian is one such goat and thus is everything, hence being able to pick?

[uneven canyon]

Hence, she’s The Guardian

[slow berry]

But in gameplay you just pick

[uneven canyon]

Yeah, balancing and all :p

[blazing wasp]

Even ikora sticks to warlock stuff

[slow berry]

Then again there's stuff other Guardians do that we don't

[slow berry]

Also Osiris

[uneven canyon]

But I assume she honed her craft for that

[slow berry]

Well

Did

[blazing wasp]

Yeah

[uneven canyon]

Womp womp

[blazing wasp]

Cause there's little reason not to

You got 3 good options but one option is also easier to do

[uneven canyon]

Well I don’t necessarily mean my Titan using a Rift and stuff. Just merging of her Light abilities with that of other classes typical expressions

[slow berry]

probably more reasonable to throw a shield that explodes

bit more titany

and in-keeping with guardians supercharging their abilities when necessary

[blazing wasp]

Not to fansplain but, given how we all play the same established character, and based on what we know, we don't really do that.
It's possible but unlikely

[uneven canyon]

It’s at least canon to use multiple types of Light at once

[ember storm]

the guardian is not three of your characters at once

[blazing wasp]

The Guardian is one of the classes, it's intentionally left blank which one it is

[slow berry]

The guardian is my three warlocks and they have three heads and nine guns at once

[blazing wasp]

If we genuinely have a preference is unknown but it's safe to say we are able to use all 3 subclasses

Wait no

6

[uneven canyon]

With Prismatic, yes

Not before

[slow berry]

I think we've only seen Osiris hotswapping live

[ember storm]

no you still could

[void depot]

Almost forgot about about the last 5 years there huh

[ember storm]

that's the entire point

[uneven canyon]

Ikora too

[ember storm]

red war had story reasons for acquiring each subclass

[dim minnow]

Lore wise, most Guardians are still trying to master their first subclass

But we're just that goated

[ember storm]

you'd find little artifact pieces related to each and have to go to the EDZ shard to reintegrate them

[uneven canyon]

Say I had a Warlock toss me their Dawnblade: would I be able to use it?

[ember storm]

not automatically

[dim minnow]

Red War subclass missions my beloved

[slow berry]

Ikora doesn't interweave her elements, right?

[ember storm]

you would not know how to use it like a warlock

you'd use your best attempt at replicating it

[slow berry]

The TTK subclass missions were peak honestly that shit was so cool

[uneven canyon]

Well, she used a Nova Bomb then a Chaos’ Reach back to back in Witch Queen

[ember storm]

but because you're not literally a warlock you wouldn't automatically have the knowledge or school of thought to use it

[ember storm]

that's not interweaving

[uneven canyon]

Fair

[dim minnow]

Ikora is known to be a very powerful Guardian, it is very possible she can go rainbow on an mf

[slow berry]

when are we getting the void laser beam anyway

[ember storm]

that's using one thing and then another a short bit after

[slow berry]

or the void scythe that shit looks so cool mobile pls

[ember storm]

nah that's lame

[slow berry]

sadly i love scythes

[ember storm]

the only character to unironically look cool using a scythe is specter knight

[uneven canyon]

Also how did you get that D2 badge I instinctively closed the prompt when it appeared :m

[ember storm]

gone forever wallow in despair

[slow berry]

My assumption regarding "what if someone gives you their super" is that its like picking up the axes from void titans

[dapper kayak]

she canonically cannot, prism is just a specific thing the guardian got

[blazing wasp]

Osiris very much did, though ikora seems to main arc and void

[slow berry]

Prismatic is a different thing

[blazing wasp]

Literally Osiris' last stand

[blazing wasp]

He has arc souls up (plural), dual wielded dawnblades, used one to make a well and cast a nova

[ember storm]

prismatic is quite specifically the pink energy formed when using light and darkness mixed together

[blazing wasp]

In quick succession

[ember storm]

using different elements after one another is NOT interweaving

[uneven canyon]

So I could use the abilities of the other classes, just not to the same degree they can?

[slow berry]

There's a difference between being able to manipulate your elements simultaneously and prismatic which seems to be more like mixing light and darkness in and of itself

[ember storm]

go to space

[blazing wasp]

Aye

[ember storm]

without them literally teaching you how to do so, it would just be like a child trying to copy a superhero move

like, you could be a hunter and watch a sunbreaker, and try to wield a big solar hammer

you wouldnt be good at it because you dont act like titans do

[slow berry]

you wouldnt be able to fly around or create a well like a dawnblade if you grabbed the sword, you'd probably just have a very hot sword

or the axes

[void depot]

Prismatic is the combination of light and darkness, since Sagira is dead Osiris doesn't have any light and thus can't use prismatic

[ember storm]

l bozo

[slow berry]

🤓 ☝️ actually the light is within all of us

[blazing wasp]

Yes

[ember storm]

snooze you lose bird nerd

[blazing wasp]

I ment he could just cast different stuff back to back

[ember storm]

unironically though i really really want to learn how and when he decided to name himself osiris

[sleek matrix]

The light and dark are primordial forces

[ember storm]

did he quite literally read up on ancient egyptian mythology and decide "yes this is perfect for me specifically"

[sleek matrix]

But theres also the actual light and darkness powers

[ember storm]

that's not hard to do, people just arent good at it

imagine a new light randy trying to throw all light grenades at once and just blowing up

[slow berry]

Speaking of guardian names whats yalls take on Shaxx being billy shakes

[ember storm]

light and darkness are forces/energies, and there are also people who wield them as powers, yes

the way the traveler terraforms planets is different from me using a nova bomb on a single thrall

[void depot]

I must've misunderstood your message, I thought you were saying Osiris used prismatic. Apologies my friend

[slow berry]

me using microcosm to terraform johnny mcdreg

[blazing wasp]

Yeah

[blazing wasp]

Ahh, no, my rant was before prismatic was mentioned

[dapper kayak]

microcosm is pure light i think

it's like a mini version of the beam we killed the witness with

[ember storm]

and the beam that swiss cheesed ghaul

[slim girder]

"The might of the traveler" as one of the devs called it

[dapper kayak]

swiss cheesed ghaul?

[sleek matrix]

Most players dont even know

[slim girder]

D2 vanilla

[dapper kayak]

what do you mean by the swiss cheesed part, ik who ghaul is

[slim girder]

Just before he died it poked holes in him

[dapper kayak]

i started in lightfall so yeah

[ember storm]

https://youtu.be/3lAul2KRsfA?si=_5D7-3RVpPQEZby-&t=64

[void depot]

Turned him into a fondu fountain

[dapper kayak]

sounds funny

[slim girder]

Watch the above video

[slow berry]

that shit went insanely hard in 2017 btw

[dapper kayak]

i see

it's funny

[slow berry]

Ghaul would've been a banger raid boss, but I think until he's defeated youre the only one with light and thats sorta the whole point

[slim girder]

Weird opinion but I don't really like the lava looking ghaul in that cutscene.

[ember storm]

it was tainted light

a shoddy imitation at the radiance warlock super

self rez with the wings

it's not supposed to look good

its literally a bastardization of everything the traveler stands for

[slim girder]

Yeah I know it's supposed to be this abomination of the light since ghaul wanted it so bad.
Idk I just didn't like how he's basically a big floating liquid angel.

[ember storm]

do you think they want you to like it

erm guys i dont really like how the witness looks, its really offputting,,

not a total stud like oryx

[slim girder]

Man I remember first reactions to the witness design. Such drama queens

[ember storm]

the only issue is that we did not get to see it in context for like two years

the second it showed up in LF you very much got "yeah this is definitely main anatagonist material"

https://tenor.com/view/destiny2-lightfall-the-witness-darkness-black-fleet-gif-27606723

[sleek matrix]

Megamind

[slim girder]

Some folks thought it'd look better if its "suit" included a helmet covering its head.

[slow berry]

getting up the monolith in salvation's edge and seeing the guy with a thousand hands tweaking the last tidbits of the final shape while not even acknowledging that you're there is some of the hardest shit in all of destiny

[ember storm]

something i really like thats never mentioned is the witness' eyes

people are like oh lol like a big cat or whatever

only the sclera is an actual eye

the pupil is literally just nothing

no light reflects

[slim girder]

They're literally holes almost

[shy remnant]

I have a question about Aunor Mahal. I know theres the armor for the cormorant blade but would you consider that her usual look? Would she wear the wings of sacred dawn or any other armor?

[dim minnow]

maybe she would wear the wings, but she definitely wears the cormorant blade set

[shy remnant]

I was thinking that specifically the duster was something she wears when she’s on the hunt while the wings are like her formal praxic wear. They actually don’t conflict with the cormorant blade set at all.

[trim grotto]

I imagine Aunor sticks to the duster quite more often than the rather ostentatious Wings. I can browse Aunor's various lore tabs for references when I'm home in a few hours for you, if you'd like.

[shy remnant]

I was planning to skim along some of the lore tabs for myself. Just needed to see if it was something that’d work for a lore build I was making.

[trim grotto]

Fair enough. You're already familiar with the Ishtar Collective?

[shy remnant]

Yep. Gonna spend some time reading over there later.

[eager trout]

What was Akelous doing to the Minotaur?

[trim grotto]

Same thing the Consecrated Mind was doing to one in Garden of Salvation. We don't actually know what that is, though. Perhaps it is conversion.

[zinc escarp]

Whats a good hunter build. I keep getting these random suggestions but i need like final shape or smth for them. (I got witch queen, 30th anniversary, beyond light and some older ones)

[eager trout]

Wrong channel

[ember storm]

whatever the opposite of Cayde's build during forsaken was

loser used golden gun for add clearing

[dapper moss]

and a blade barrage for boss damage

[shy remnant]

Cayde-6 after fighting more than 10 basic scorn enemies with 2 whole supers

[slow berry]

have people ever figured out what the deal with the galaxy pools was

[slim girder]

It wasn't any of that
He just didn't wear a helmet so he was under level

[dim minnow]

@fringe lantern MARKED FOR NEGATION

[eager trout]

Isn't that how you're supposed to use it?

[sick yew]

I think it was initially an addclear super and morphed to boss damage today

[slim girder]

@sick yew what's up with your name colour?

Looking like a 7tv paint lol

[next bobcat]

Gradients for certain roles

[slim girder]

There's gradients now?

[next bobcat]

Yep

Apparently

Because I have one

[slim girder]

Very cool.

[sick yew]

I'm cool

It's a new function on discord, same as the little badge next to my name

[desert bolt]

How many different types of lore exist? Like books, lore entries or grimoires, i don't understand their differences

[sleek matrix]

Grimore cards are from d1 mainly

[desert bolt]

Ishtar Collective is kinda confusing

[hollow hinge]

Isn't it animated on desktop too?

It isn't on mobile from what I can see

[wheat flower]

Can i get a badge

Ooh

I have a badge

[empty fern]

Get badged

[trim grotto]

Lore exists just about everywhere, from item descriptions to lore tabs attached to weapons or armour, to lore books about subjects or stories. We've got physical, collectors edition stuff, and web posts made on Bungie's website. Ishtar Collective hosts it all, except the physical content.

The differences between them are mainly simply their source. Grimoire is mostly D1, lore tabs are usually attached to items, web posts were on Bungie.net, that kind of thing.

[desert bolt]

Oh thanks for the info

[eager trout]

Even pants have lore

[slow berry]

is there chocolate on post-collapse earth

or like, anywhere

[dapper moss]

yeah probably

[empty fern]

Probably yeah

[covert stone]

Assuming milk, sugar, and cocoa beans exist in some for then definitely yes

[frigid sparrow]

We make dark chocolate motes for Drifter during dawning

[agile panther]

Is the anomaly not involved with Kepler?

[dim minnow]

the anomaly could have some relation to Lodi who we will meet on Kepler

but there's a lot of info we don't have yet

[agile panther]

I just thought that vesper was a direct teaser for the next destination and they didn’t mention it at all lol

[eager trout]

What were the Vex doing in Spire of the Watcher?

[next bobcat]

Imprisoning Rasputin’s subminds afaik

[ember storm]

searching for any results relating to golden age colonies to try and track down neomuna and locate the veil, stealing said data, and then destroying the complex to cover their tracks, on behalf of the witness

i'm not sure it's ever explained how the witness would've known the veil was in the custody of neomuna considering it had to get the vision from the traveler in the beginning of LF, but that's what happened

Osiris: The information stored here, the — could it be linked to my visions? Why else would the Witness be interested in these files?

Osiris: This was a clever incision by the Witness. A multi-front attack. Sabotage us, glean knowledge, and annihilate any trace of advantage. Extra-solar colonies…```

[frigid sparrow]

Plus, like Osiris says, it's weird that sol divisive were outside of the black garden (and by extension it's related territory), on Mars no less

[ember storm]

yeah idk what bungie had been doing with them lately

LF reiterated the fact that, at the end of the day, they were still uiltmately vex trying to accomplish vex specific goals

they held knowledge of the veil through the black heart and the witness tried sending taken to kill them for it

[frigid sparrow]

Plus eramis having been to the station too lmao

[ember storm]

but then they just show up in FS helping the witness again for exicison, for some reason

[frigid sparrow]

Iirc the reasoning is something along the lines of "these vex recognized that things are fucked so following the witness and aiding in the final shape is the best means of creating a vex-only system"

But it's difficult to determine motives when the most a vex has spoken to us within that time is quria

And the most it says is "I'M IN CONTROL OF THIS DOMAIN FUCKING TRY ME"

[ember storm]

see that's good when it's not literally minutes away from the witness ending all life in existence including vex

which is what excision is

[wheat flower]

The witness would've only wnded lofe in the universe no?

The vex could've just continue on in the many others rhey control

[queen swallow]

I don't think "ended" is the right word but rather "frozen". The cutscene in Transmigration of the Witness trying to complete the Final Shape show how everyone/everything turns into messed up cubes, but once the Traveler flexes its muscles, everything goes back to normal.

People still clearly retain memories of who they were and what they were doing prior to being "frozen" so they can't have been "ended".

[ember storm]

Vex are life and it would have affected the entire universe itself yes

[ember storm]

Life as a concept would be over, as per the Witness’ speech in its WQ reveal

All death would end, yes, but so would life itself because there would be nothing to start or end

[queen swallow]

I can see that but it's not necessarily how that's achieved. If something like the Traveler were to come along again, everyone would just be unfrozen. So yes, death in the sense that nothing is alive but life in the sense that nothing is dead.

[ember storm]

I never said death

Life itself would just be over

There would be nothing to live ever again

[queen swallow]

"All death would end..."

[ember storm]

The concept of death would never happen again

That was the point of the final shape

“No more life no more death” that’s the entire point

The witness thinks what it’s doing is delivering salvation

Life itself is a pointless struggle that sees everyone live and die for no real reason, so it wanted that stopped in its entirety

Vex are in fact included as life and would not just be given a pass to continue existing

[queen swallow]

In the Transmigration cutscene, they show exactly what the "Final Shape" is: Everything gets cubed. Nothing is alive anymore. This satisfies the "no more life" requirement of the plan. However, because of the fact that we see everyone come back, we know that they are not truly dead because they have memories of being cubed. This also satisfies the "no more death" requirement.

[ember storm]

That was only a temporary thing because the traveler was still fighting back

The moment the witness wrestled full control would leave everything permanent

I never said they were dead

The point is that everything is still permanently stuck living what the witness believes to be their pinnacle moment

The fact that no more life will ever be created and no life will ever end again is the point of the final shape, something the vex wouldn’t want regardless

[queen swallow]

I know it's temporary, but that does not stop it from being the reality of what happens to someone. But they're not "dead" even if it becomes permanent if all it takes to become "alive" again is another Traveler-like source of paracausal power.

[ember storm]

What exactly are you trying to establish here

I know they’re not dead

That part doesn’t matter

Life as a concept includes the vex and the FS isn’t what their ideal future looks like

[queen swallow]

My original comment had nothing to do with the Vex. I only pointed out that "ended" is, at least in my opinion, a slightly less accurate word for the Final Shape over something like "frozen". Otherwise, we're fully in agreement. Life does include the Vex and the Final Shape is definitely not part of their ideal future.

[hollow hinge]

Life wouldn't continue so by definition it'd end

[trim grotto]

Yes! Explicitly so, in fact.

[blazing wasp]

We do bake chocolate

[slim girder]

Chocolate is one of lifes vital foods. Might as well be the final shape if there's no chocolate

[hollow hinge]

A few of the dawning cookies have chocolate

[slow berry]

why DID the other factions leave after lakshmi became an omegaracist and where are they now anyway

Like it would have been interesting to see what the Dead Orbit is around to these days

[ember storm]

Dead orbit always promised to leave and didn’t want to deal with the fallout of the coup (they were aware of it and did not help or warn the vanguard)

New Monarchy supported Lakshmi and her efforts

[trim grotto]

Well, Dead Orbit finally decided to do what they've always wanted to do - leave the system for the good of Humanity.
New Monarchy joined them, because they had a devastatingly poor attempt at a coup to overthrow the Consensus, and realised they'd be exiled or worse.

Future War Cult, well, that's kind of obvious.

[ember storm]

To be fair a lot of the actually good FWC members resigned over the course of splicer

The ones that stayed were just rallying behind Lakshmi specifically

[trim grotto]

And yes, DO was aware of the coup, though they didn't partake. They did not, however, tell the Consensus.

[slow berry]

wild

Lakshmi fr fumbled the sickest drip for no reason

[trim grotto]

It was partially Savathûn's fault. She was directly influencing Lakshmi's mind.

[slim girder]

Savathun really shook the trust of everyone and with one of the faction leaders being the cause of a city threatening incursion. I think that the factions in general were done for.

Even if DO intended to leave anyway

[slow berry]

didnt help they were all super beefing and tryna separate the guardians

[ember storm]

Tbf since it’s never been referenced in any official capacity, I don’t think it’s as simple as Savathun messing with Lakshmi’s head

[trim grotto]

Well, it wasn't purely that.

But she did do it over numerous tabs

[ember storm]

Savathun’s song was found encoded in the prediction machine FWC uses which leads me to believe it was just influencing the futures she saw instead

I can very easily see it as Lakshmi just seeing those and getting too big for her britches

She was already flaunting the “I foresaw the red war and nobody believed me” thing for years at that point, and already had issues with the Eliksni and the vanguard

[queen swallow]

As a musician, Savathûn’s song is still one of the coolest uses of music in a video game I’ve seen.

Piano/vocal

[trim grotto]

A woman—an Exo—sits before me and sways, eyes vacant, but inside she is sinking as well… now her voice, her TRUE voice, humming, a gyre of sound, and the Exo sways faster and faster-
You're absolutely correct, but the direct, in-person influence was also there.

Lakshmi just made a prime target

[queen swallow]

I know a lot of songs. I graduated college as a music major, having done 12 years of piano and about 5 of vocal.

Don’t you have to be 13 to use discord?

[trim grotto]

Yes. Yes, you do.

[slow berry]

im gonna do the thing

for their safety

You'll find out in two to three business days

Is there anywhere I can read loretabs chronologically from the seasons?

I did miss like

everything from curse of osiris to the final shape

[trim grotto]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/releases
Ishtar has this tab

[queen swallow]

Given there are some truly horrific things you can find on here, yeah

[trim grotto]

I believe everyone here already has, yeah.

If by "they" you mean Discord, they did not.
And if they did, our report will do nothing, so you've nothing to fear... right?

[ember storm]

[trim grotto]

https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyLore/wiki/lorecompendium/
You may also be interested in this compendium

It does have release categories, so use whichever you find more comfortable

[young wraith]

Can anyone catch me up on the Edge of Fate/Rite of The Nine lore?

[wheat flower]

The nine want you guardian

[ember storm]

forgot to mention it earlier but this is totally Arach Jalaal

[empty fern]

So negative

But we still love him

[slim girder]

So what was dead orbits actual destination? Like were they set on being like a space colony? Or did they have some distant place in mind to go to?

Weird because as a DO supporter since D1 I never really knew the actual goal of the faction

[ember storm]

they did not have one in mind

[shy remnant]

Their goal was to just escape the earth before the darkness returns. So likely their ultimate goal was to leave the solar system. Which they did do after the fwc coup.

[empty fern]

Dead orbit returns as a frontiers
Trust me

[shy remnant]

Faction rallies return in frontiers

[slim girder]

Was just wondering that lol.
But I don't think bungie has any plans for faction returns.

Their story is pretty tied up now

[shy remnant]

Yeah factions are pretty much dead. A little funny as that was like a huge part of the political environment within the city.

[ember storm]

i mean they also might've gotten wiped out by the black fleet at some point

which is funny

[shy remnant]

lol immediately witnessed

They probably survived though. I bet they’ll show up in a lore tab or two.

[empty fern]

Atleast the skimmer one should

[shy remnant]

The concordat out there making cool ass hoverboards and whatnot. Mysterious.

[slim girder]

And eva just painting the "peace offering" with the GG colours because she didn't read the note that came with the shipment.

[slim girder]

Onto a different topic. I find it strange that Kepler was just hiding in the reef until now. Did bungie ever explain why we hadn't known of it until now or is it like a neomuna situation where it's just shrouded on purpose?

Was reading the PlayStation store description for the expansion

[dim minnow]

not the Reef, the Oort Cloud

which is basically at the edge of Sol

[slim girder]

Ok because the PS store says the reef lol

[dim minnow]

also, it's possible the Nine were hiding it

[shy remnant]

and whatever timey wimey shenanigans going on probably played a part

[slow berry]

More than the Nine, wasnt the solar system unobservable beyond a certain point?

[slim girder]

This had me so confused

Like the awoken literally rule the reef and there was a whole planet in there apparently

[shy remnant]

The reef is within the asteroid belt, no where near the Oort. Classic ps shenanigans.

[dim minnow]

Sony doesn't read the lore

[frigid sparrow]

first cutscene upon landing on kepler is seeing Hideo getting absolutely murdered beyond belief by Ikora

[empty fern]

Wild

Would watch again

[frigid sparrow]

she's earned it tbh

hideo was scared asf as to what ikora would do to him

[stark perch]

why did rhulk kill his people?

[frigid sparrow]

he was bored

[dim minnow]

there was a lot that went into it

for starters, the Witness goaded him into doing it

then there's the fact that he hated hypocrites and treachery which the people that surrounded him were guilty of

though this is an oversimplification of events

[stark perch]

is rhulk stronger than nezerac?

[ember storm]

He had daddy issues

nezarec is functionally a god, Rhulk is literally just a muscle head given power by the witness

it’s a lot of power, sure, but it’s literally the only thing he has going for him

[dim minnow]

well, we don't actually know who is stronger

and Nezarec just calls himself a god

[trim grotto]

You'd want to read his lore book for that, to be honest. The short answer is a lot of psychopathic rage issues, betrayal, exile, and the Witness fed his anger with strength.
https://www.ishtar-collective.net/categories/book-shattered-suns

[trim grotto]

We cannot answer that. Rhulk was the First Disciple, but we never knew Nezarec at his full, original strength.

[frigid sparrow]

Theoretically, Nezarec is stronger. He's beyond simple mortality, being "alive" so long as fear itself lives, alongside being able to be revived in some fashions through his body parts and literal dark spirit. However, he himself was also killed by savathun, unlike Rhulk who was a genuine threat in her own throne world.

[trim grotto]

The answer, like most power scaling, really depends on the context.

[frigid sparrow]

inb4 shadow and order is psions trying to rez nez once again

[dim minnow]

I swear Yrix is goign to try and do something with the Lunar Pyramid

[frigid sparrow]

"oh btw you guys forgot to get the left pinky toe of nezarec get fucked"

[ember storm]

nezarec is the god of pain and there's no greater pain than being a total self-proclaimed intellectual loser chump like rhulk

easy dub

[dim minnow]

https://tenor.com/view/dbz-discord-gif-24306382

[fluid peak]

Again this is a power scaling thing but rhulk was a threat to savvy because of THE UPENDED, not necessarily by his own strength

At the end of the day the guardian no diffs them so who cares

[hollow fern]

Do we know where the Nine's black hole is located

[little gorge]

it doesn't exist yet

[hollow fern]

I mean the one you enter for dares of eternity for example

[ember storm]

thats not the nine's

[jagged badge]

That’s just not true

[fluid peak]

yes hence the

we beat rhulk with the help of 5 other guardians and he hugely underestimated us

[hollow hinge]

That is an understatement but

[shy remnant]

For edge of fate, who else do we think was invited by the nine? Let’s say you had to make a list of nine people who you think were invited.

[hollow fern]

Possibly zavla because Lodi said commander

[shy remnant]

Yeah we got like 3 people we know are invited.
(Us, Ikora, maybe Zavala, Drifter)

[hollow fern]

Also what's that condition exos can have

Is it called D.E.M or no

[jagged badge]

D.E.R.

Dissociative Exomind Rejection

[hollow fern]

Oh I thought exomind was 2 word 😅

[jagged badge]

Nope

[next bobcat]

Upended?

Literally me tbh

[fluid peak]

i can see that

[next bobcat]

While I have you here

Where exactly was maya sundaresh when she got the echo

And how did it get to her

[ember storm]

the depths of nessus as a simple trace in the vex net

thats what the opening of echoes is

you find the echo's crash site

[frigid sparrow]

it was a race to whoever could get it first within the vex, and she won

[frozen pawn]

Will Episode content be vaulted when the next expansion arrives, like seasons?

[trim grotto]

Yes.

[snow oasis]

Nobody has been here for almost an hour

[trim grotto]

Quite.

[frozen pawn]

[tawny idol]

Coming back from a relatively long break, who the hell is The Conductor

[blazing wasp]

You familiar with Maya sundaresh?

[tawny idol]

No

[blazing wasp]

Ah, how much did you play prior to taking a break?

[tawny idol]

The TFS campaign and like the first week of the first episode

[blazing wasp]

Ah, ok so pretty new to D2 overall?

Then this is a doozy to explain-

[tawny idol]

Not really

I've been playing for 2ish years

[blazing wasp]

Ok so have played more than that?

[tawny idol]

Yes

Sorry should've specified

[trim grotto]

Well, Maya Sundaresh was a Golden Age scientist. Her and her team were simulated by the Vex and eventually released into the network.

The real, Human Maya Sundaresh and her team were aboard the Exodus Indigo colony ship that crashed onto Neptune, and ended up founding Neomuna.

The info following this comes largely from the post campaign content of Lightfall. The audio logs about the Veil from Osiris and Nimbus about Maya and Chioma.

[sick yew]

If you were around during season of splicer you know Maya as Lakshmi-2

[trim grotto]

*a variant partially made from Maya

[sick yew]

**Voice and face

[trim grotto]

The long story short is that the original Maya also ended up in the Vex Network.
When the first Echo crashed onto Nessus and interacted with the network, one of these Mayas floating about the network grasped this power and claimed it for herself, and formed an Exobody visually identical to Lakshmi

And then, bam
Echoes

[trim grotto]

Voice, yes. Face, not exactly.

The Exo wasn't designed with Maya in mind

[sick yew]

I meant Lakshmi and the Conductor, human Maya obviously had a diff face

[trim grotto]

I still think it's odd that masculine Exo just
Don't have lips like feminine Exo do

[sick yew]

What are you implying

Ask Osiris I think Saint is a good kisser too

[trim grotto]

two masculine exo kissing would be like slapping two action figures together

bonk

clank

[sick yew]

[next bobcat]

Foo fighters pfp?

Epic

[slim girder]

I've always thought an exos mouth pieces would feel more like a synthetic material or something to give the impression of lips. Since exos have to be as close to human as possible to avoid that condition I forgot the name of.

[trim grotto]

DER. Dissociative Exomind Rejection.
You're probably right, but this is a funnier way to imagine it.

Of course, Exo are well aware they're robotic and metal... the fact that masculine Exo have those weird missing cheeks is a big show of that.

[slim girder]

Always been curious about why exos look so different from humans. Like even today people can make some pretty life like robots but exos as you pointed are missing whole cheeks.
Their mouths light up when talking and some like cayde or Lakshmi have adornments like horns.

[trim grotto]

Either it was Clovis just not caring, or... it was the point. Exo weren't meant to be Human, they were meant to be the next step of Humanity, and Clovis felt they were shackled by the problem of DER.

Hell, he tried to give them extra limbs. He was quite happy to push past the Human image for the sake of "evolution".

[slim girder]

Maybe that was the issue then. Maybe instead of trying to "evolve" he could have just poured into keeping the human image intact but with the advancement of being robotic

Instead exos looked drastically different and often suffered DER and needed resets.

On the topic of exos/Clovis I wonder if we'll see any bray tech signs on Kepler. Probably not because this is definitely a nine focused expansion but Clovis hasn't been active since seraph so might be interesting to see if he's cooked up any schemes

[jagged badge]

I’ve always heavily preferred Elsie’s Exo look to say, Lakshmi’s

It’s why this is my ultimate preferred Exo head from the customisation

[slow berry]

My headcanon is that DER, while certainly related to appearance and general count of limbs in your body, is more related to the internals of your body

Like you can more easily reconcile looking different and having been put in a different body, but your synapses do NOT like not having guts and lungs and a stomach

There's that mental ailment where people believe themselves to be dead or "empty" which feels closely related to that

[ember storm]

They do all have lips it just depends on the exo’s face model having the colored bits in front or not

https://static1.cbrimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/cayde-1.jpeg

Exos that are rounder like Lakshmi just have it way more prominent

[static wind]

i just remembered something

so after clovis did his thing when rasputin died

hes been stuck in europa?

[ember storm]

i mean he was before that

putting a copy of him in the exoframe was specifically just to help get rasputin back in shape

he couldnt leave before then either

[static wind]

so the crazy mad scientist cant somehow get out of europa?

[ember storm]

well it is literally a head

he's not the real clovis anyway

[static wind]

is banshee the exo with most resets that we know?

[ember storm]

no, that would be echo

had over a thousand before dying

[static wind]

echo who?

[ember storm]

2625

[next bobcat]

Damn

That’s a lot of resets

How does an exo maintain any shred of personality or humanity after that long?

[ember storm]

didnt really have a fun or fulfilling life

so

suffice to say they didnt

and had to be killed by ana

[next bobcat]

I see

[ashen comet]

omg just like me

[trim grotto]

He sort of ended up becoming a cultist caveman. So he didn't have much.

[trim grotto]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/records/legacy
https://www.ishtar-collective.net/records/legacy-pt-2

Big reads, but totally worth it.

[trim grotto]

Thankfully not. For now, anyway.

[hexed dock]

so can someone give me a quick summary of the lore behind vespers? I just learned and completed it for the first time and it looks so dope

[dim minnow]

Vesper Station was a sister space station to the Morning Star (the one that crashed into Europa's surface during DSC)

the purpose of this station was to house Vex-related experiments that Clovis really wanted no one knowing about. One of which was an AI made with Vex tech that he wanted to use to infiltrate the Vexnet

he made sure to neuter Vesper Central's capabilities which preventer her from properly watching over the station and even kept certain details from her like the existence of her sisters (other AI like Soteria)

this was so he could let Vesper Station crash into Europa as to hide what went on there, but due to the Collapse, this never came to pass

[hexed dock]

and that AI is the girl talking to us during the dungeon, correct?

[dim minnow]

Vesper Central yes, though once you manage to fully unlock her systems and access to the station, she will be referred to as Astraea

anyways, so while the Morning Star ws on its collision course, it ended up colliding with Vesper Station which was why it was so damaged when we got there

when this happened, it is believed that a surviving copy of Atraks-1, Fallen Exo, would end up there, only to be possessed by something referred to as "The Corruption"

and so, she would become the Corrupted Puppeteer

it is also likely that the Corruption is Vex-related

then what happened was that a group of House Salvation deserteres stole a ketch and ended up on Vesper Station since they thought it would be an ideal place to settle in

however, as time progressed, they would be stalked by the puppeteer and would be assimilated into its hive mind

until eventually they were all made into "additional limbs" for the Corruption so to speak

with the entire crew under its control, the Puppeteer coordinated them into building the Anomaly which it would commune with

[hexed dock]

this is interesting. I appreciate your time to explain it all

[dim minnow]

eventually, the Spider would send an associate of his to investigate the station, and when she did not come back, he figure it would be a good idea to send us in

which is what leads us to running through the dungeon and eventually restoring Astraea's control over Vesper Station

[dim minnow]

no problem

[hexed dock]

so was "the corruption" further explained? and was that the source of the yellow arc energy we find there?

[dim minnow]

No and no

The Corruption is hinted to be Vex in origin, but that's it

The "solarc" is still not explained

I wonder if it has any relation to Kepler

[hexed dock]

Solarc? Maybe a combination of solar and arc energy? Or is that actually what it is and I’m looking too deep lmao

[dim minnow]

I mean, it exhibits qualities of both

[hexed dock]

I don’t recall ever hearing anything about it having solar qualities? Maybe I didn’t hear that dialogue yet?

[dim minnow]

I'm referring to its color and the fact that a flaming well is left behind wherever the bolts strike

[trim grotto]

It is explained as overcharged Arc. The "flames" seem to simply be wavy lines of lingering energy rather than actual fire.
I don't mean to be dismissive Dova but I don't think there's a deeper mystery to the Arc that was already described, albeit vaguely

[dim minnow]

I mean, what if it's related to the Dark Matter stuff we see on Kepler

[trim grotto]

Then I will be both wrong and surprised

[dim minnow]

Maybe it isn't Solarc, but the Anomaly already has ties to Lodi who has ties with Kepler

[slow berry]

What WAS the vesper lore with Lodi? I'm too ass at the game to get the quests done

[next bobcat]

Thanks 👍

[little gorge]

tbh i'm starting to think it's not vex

we got a message from lodi through it

might be related to kepler

[dim minnow]

according to the concept art, the Corruption is tied to the Vex

and we know Vex are going to be on Kepler

[little gorge]

the corruption or the anomaly itself

the anomaly looks more like vextech

[dim minnow]

both

[slim girder]

My theory is that the corruption isn't of vex origin but has hijacked vex tech for efficiency reasons.

Whether that was Lodis doing or something else we don't know

[little gorge]

i doubt lodi himself has any motives like that

he sounds like he's being corrupted himself in the trailer

[slim girder]

While I don't think Lodi is a bad guy we still don't actually know everything about him. Obviously he is being corrupted by something but who knows what he's like when not under control

[next bobcat]

Corruption?

Is that tied into dark matter?

[slim girder]

I'm talking about the corruption in vespers host that's taken over all the eliksni on the station and made them build that huge anomaly we see in the dungeon

[next bobcat]

Oh I see

[little gorge]

my theory is he worked for aion in the golden age before getting pulled to kepler by the nine/"the giver"/whatever

since they said he was "qualified" on the stream

we know from the arg that aion had discovered (or at the very least theorized the existence of) kepler

[pearl skiff]

who are the nine that xur keeps talking about

[trim grotto]

Would you like the long answer or the short answer?

[pearl skiff]

long answer

[sick yew]

Buckle up homie

[pearl skiff]

i thought it was just 9 devs or somethin

[trim grotto]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/categories/book-dust
The long answer... is this. Dust, a lore book following Cryptarch Lavinia, who dives into obsession as she follows and attempts to understand The Nine. The penultimate entry, aptly named The Nine, is the most key of this - but the full lore book provides the most context.

[sick yew]

[trim grotto]

Nothing like a bit of cosmic horror

[pearl skiff]

whats the short answer

[sick yew]

LMFAO

[trim grotto]

The Nine are swirls of Dark Matter, caught in loops by the gravitational forces of the Solar System, and as life came to be in the system, the Nine learned to think.
Gravity gives them form, life gives them thought. They seek to be free of the very shackles which give them structure.

[pearl skiff]

[trim grotto]

They are everywhere. In many ways, they are the Solar System.

[pearl skiff]

i thought they would be actual big figures but there more like an cosmic organism

[sick yew]

Well theyve been trying to become that

Hasnt worked out so far

[trim grotto]

Xûr is their Agent. He was their first representative, and the Emissary, once known as Orin, was the second.

[pearl skiff]

[pearl skiff]

whos orin

the horse?

[trim grotto]

No.

[sick yew]

Remember her?

[pearl skiff]

ooohhh

[sick yew]

From Prophecy

Yeah thats Orin

[pearl skiff]

i forgot destiny lore is kinda peak

[pearl skiff]

why she got the dogs out tho

[trim grotto]

The Nine do not understand life. Nor, uh... polite mannerisms.

[pearl skiff]

that checks out

also if cayde sacrificed his light to bring back our ghost is it possible to forcefully take someones light and bring another back to life

[sick yew]

It is possible to forcefully take someones light

[trim grotto]

...it is not... implausible. However, nobody but the Hive would know how to extract Light in such a way. It would probably get you exiled from the Last City as well.

[sick yew]

Shoutouts to my gal Taeko-3

[pearl skiff]

yo doesnt savathun have light of some kind

[trim grotto]

Just like us. She has a Ghost.

[sleek matrix]

She got a guardian

[trim grotto]

Ghost.

[pearl skiff]

matter a fact why dont they learn how to take light take the light from the ghost that savathun implanted into the random hive dudes and bring back hella people like targe

[sick yew]

Thats not really how it works

[trim grotto]

Light is Given. Forcefully taking it and transplanting it may well fail - the Traveler may even defy it.
Furthermore, Cayde-6 shows us that those who have passed are at peace in their "afterlife". Even could you do it, you'd be ripping them from their new existence. Cayde was not happy about this. He only stayed to finish the job.

[pearl skiff]

that does make sense

[trim grotto]

That, and many Ghosts have been totally shattered. And Targe was killed by the Witness directly - the shell is probably tainted with Darkness.

[sick yew]

if theres even a shell left

One would assume the Witness has a rather strong grip

[pearl skiff]

im not gon lie i would have taken the witness's offer on being a god after he took the travelers power cuz if we had the chance to manipulate the light which i doubt the witness would even let us do let alone be a "god" we could do mad stuff

[sick yew]

Siding with the Witness would have been the same as getting killed by it

[pearl skiff]

now that i think about it targe is probably dust

[pearl skiff]

😔 u right

[sick yew]

Once the Witness enacts the final shape youre still just eternally frozen like the rest of the universe

[pearl skiff]

nah why the witness had that much power anyway what even was his species

[sick yew]

They were a super advanced possible one of the oldest races in the galaxy yes

[pearl skiff]

oh

[trim grotto]

It used power from the Veil to create its current form.

Plus their civilisation was full of Light artifacts.

[sick yew]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0CKckjryVI

[trim grotto]

you got this Alex I'm gonna go have a shower

[sick yew]

I gotchu man

[pearl skiff]

so they cooked themselves by greed

reminds me of humans

[sick yew]

I wouldnt say greed

They just fell to nihilism

They wanted an answer to the meaning of life but got none

And got so pissed at the Traveler for not giving said answer that they concluded that life has no meaning at all

[pearl skiff]

cooked

also whats the veil

i forgot

[sick yew]

And then they applied this conclusion to the entire universe and set course to freeze everything

[sick yew]

We dont fully know

At this point its strongly believed to be a part of the traveler itself

One that was required to enact the final shape

[pearl skiff]

also

when i was speedrunning destinys campaigns and allat i saw crow turn good

how did that hapen

i wasnt paying attention

[sick yew]

Well he was never evil to begin with

After we shot Uldren clean in the face a ghost named Glint resurrected him as a lightbearer

He obviously lost all memory of who Uldren was

[pearl skiff]

OH I RECALL

[sick yew]

We then started working with him around the Beyond Light days where he slowly started being more and more integrated into the Vanguard

[pearl skiff]

would be fire if that was different alignments and we could align with evil

[sick yew]

Then he got curious about his heritage as an Awoken and went to the dreaming city

Savathun was there too during that season and she zapped all of Uldrens memories into Crow

But he didnt turn evil

[pearl skiff]

that is insanely suprising

[sick yew]

And hes basically just a homie now, Hunter Vanguard actually eversince final shape

[sick yew]

Well during Forsaken he was mostly misguided

Working under the assumption that Mara Sov aka his sister was telling him what to do

[pearl skiff]

oh i thought he was a straight coldblooded bounty hunter killing whoever with any means possible

[sick yew]

Hell nah

[pearl skiff]

he kinda goated now

i still will eternally hate him for popping sun dance

[sick yew]

After Mara "died" back in Taken King the bro was just really sad which Savathun (who was working together with Riven) took advantage of

[pearl skiff]

she was my favourite ghost

excluding mine

[sick yew]

Technically that was the rifleman but yes

[pearl skiff]

matter a fact

actually wait nevermind i was bouta ask a stupid question

also did the traveler make the light or was it just there

and if the traveler made the light where did the darkness come from

[sick yew]

Most likely

[sick yew]

So theres Unveiling

A lorebook from the Shadowkeep days

How legitimate it is has been called into question a few times over the years but it seems mostly believable now

In very simple terms, before the universe existed there was the Gardener and the Winnower and they played a funny little game

Whether life would prevail or not

And the Winnower who said that one pattern would always establish itself as the only thing that remains stood corrected each time they played

And then the Gardener got mad and "changed the rules" which also included involving both itself and the Winnower in the game

This is believed to be the creation of the universe where the Gardener now existed as what we call the Traveler and the Winnower as uh "something" (we dont really know what the Winnower looks like)

And the Gardener just started running around creating life through the light

This is very heavily paraphrased but yeah

[trim grotto]

The other way to look at it is that Light and Dark, the Traveler and the Veil, simply always existed, as far as we know, which is limited - if you want to avoid the tumultuous topic of Unveiling.

[sick yew]

But cryptic as hell possibly Winnower propaganda that mentions Conways Game of Life (my beloved)

[trim grotto]

I will further clarify that we spent multiple years enforcing that Crow is not Uldren and that this is, as well, the point of being a Guardian. You aren't your past life.
Crow, thanks to Savathûn, does now know his past life and has those memories, but that doesn't make him Uldren.

Hating Uldren is fair and reasonable, but to hate Crow is to ignore what makes a Guardian a Guardian.

[sick yew]

But but Uldren killed the funny robot man Mael

And where else should I project my hatred for a video game character

[slim girder]

At Lakshmi

[sick yew]

Lakshmi killed Cayde fr

[slim girder]

Lakshmi is def in my top hated destiny characters. And that's because they're actually bad not just because I don't like them.

2nd would probably be calus after I read the unforgiven lore tab

[ember storm]

calus killing the family dog after seeing one positive interaction between it and his daughter

[slim girder]

Exactly

[slow berry]

Is what the Ahamkara did to Venus still happening on Venus and we just dont go there (understandable apparently) or did they clean it up

[ember storm]

its never been elaborated on

[slim girder]

Venus has been absent from destiny for almost a decade.

Honestly wouldn't be surprised if some peeps forgot about it

[ember storm]

erm vog

[slim girder]

Right.

That's definitely all of Venus

[void depot]

I definitely forgot about Venus. It was such a cool destination, now I really want them to bring it back

[slow berry]

I hope we get venus back and we go into the mindfuck lair part of it

[slim girder]

Venus was actually huge. You had the ishtar labs region with the labs, vex structures and jungle vibe, and then on the other side was the biome with the geysers and the caves with fallen banners and the massive ketch inside one of the caverns.

[pearl skiff]

is he the sniper?

[sick yew]

No thats the Rifleman

Pirrha is their name

[pearl skiff]

whos lakshmi

[sick yew]

Did you play season of splicer?

[pearl skiff]

KOS list

[pearl skiff]

nah i didnt know that existed

well i might have but not have remembered it

what was in that season

[sick yew]

Did you play Episode 1

Of this content year

Aka remember her?

The Conductor

[pearl skiff]

nah ive never seen that person in my life

[sick yew]

Okay well Lakshmi-2 was the leading figure of the FWC (Future War Cult) one of the factions present in the last city

Well formerly present, they all bailed

Who you see in the picture is not technically Lakshmi-2 but someone who looks like her

Maya Sundaresh

[eager trout]

What are the visions Osiris mentions in Spire?

[jagged badge]

Osiris’ memories were entangled with Savathûn’s. He had a vision of Neptune, and a city set against the waves

But when the Hidden investigated Neptune, they found nothing there

[eager trout]

Ah

[jagged badge]

Osiris was desperate throughout Seraph to prove his usefulness despite being Lightless

And as he says in the dungeon, prove his visions had merit

[eager trout]

How tho?

Did they even go there?

[jagged badge]

Yes

Neomuna was hidden until the Witness/Calus exposed it

A Vex simulation I believe

[slow berry]

Worth remembering that it do be entire planets worth of shit we don't know

[slow berry]

A mix of the vex and the veil iirc?

It shielded them from external observers but also stopped all their communications out, and then the surfboard people explored and found warlords and decided to hide forever

[next bobcat]

So where are we in ghosts of the deep? It looks like the dreadnaught, but that’s still in space, and it has lucent hive architecture?

It befuddles me greatly

[ember storm]

The depths of Titan

Lucent hive just set up infrastructure

[ember storm]

JUST REMMEBER I HAVE TO DO THIS

[slim girder]

"set up"

[ember storm]

do you want me to explain in detail how hive grow their buildings

its gross and i dont feel like it

[slim girder]

It wasn't grown. The hive crashed a ship into it. I'm sure as it sat down there things grew but it definitely seems originally the lucent brood just copied the skyburners and crashed their ship into the methane ocean

[ember storm]

i will clarify

i have never done gotd

so

[slim girder]

Ahhh ok then.
Yeah in the dungeon you're going through the wreckage of a crashed ship. You even see part of it split in half.
At the time savathun was dead so aside from immaru the lucent brood had no leadership. So they got desperate and tried to resurrect oryx.

[shy remnant]

Oryx? Resurrected? Imagine that

[lofty badge]

yeah but as a hive Guardian

with the light

[little gorge]

this was a ritual to resurrect the taken king... by force?

[sick yew]

[lofty badge]

if you consider using a ghost to bring someone back forced, yes?

[little gorge]

first of all i'm not asking that's a quote from the dungeon

[lofty badge]

huh

[little gorge]

second of all ghosts choose their guardian you can't just do that normally

[lofty badge]

i did't know you were quoting something

[little gorge]

third of all oryx did not want to be resurrected

[little gorge]

sloane says that at the end

[lofty badge]

ok

[next bobcat]

On it

I’ll get back to you soon

[next bobcat]

It looks exactly like the dreadnaugjt

Coincidence or on purpose?

[dim minnow]

that's just what Hive ships look like

[next bobcat]

I see

[little gorge]

https://destiny.wiki.gallery/images/thumb/4/4e/Battle_on_Saturn.jpg/1280px-Battle_on_Saturn.jpg

not the clearest photo but the small ones are the normal hive ships

[slim girder]

Tomb ships are what you see dropping hive in. I've forgotten the name of the bigger ones though.
One of them from that very fight is in the reef after crashing there.

[eager trout]

Why are there piles of dead Ghosts in Ghosts of the Deep?

[empty fern]

Failures to resurrect oryx ig

[blazing wasp]

ready player one looking ass strategy

[empty fern]

Real

[eager trout]

How would they fail?? And why are they normal Ghosts?

[empty fern]

Dunno, havent played in a while

[blazing wasp]

Every ghost is a normal ghost

Only difference between lucent brood and ours are the shells they wear

Which any ghost can change at any time

Additionally, dead ghosts tend to revert back to their base shell

(see the final shape)

[ember storm]

iirc lucent ghosts rezzed their respective hive first before being equipped with new shells

[eager trout]

Ah, ok

[eager trout]

Immaru though

[ember storm]

Because he willingly planned it out with Savathun beforehand

That is the sole exception

[slow berry]

doesnt the witch queen trailer show a bunch of hived up ghosts ghosting up hive

[vital marsh]

Can zavala no longer wield light?

[jagged badge]

Correct

[vital marsh]

Who else has lost their light in the story

[trim grotto]

Depends what you mean by story, I suppose.
Eris Morn lost Brya in the Hellmouth.
Tevis Larsen lost his in the Black Garden shortly before we arrived.
There's Osiris, who lost Sagira in the depths of the Hellmouth when she saved him from Xivu Arath and her High Celebrant.
The Red War had everyone lose their Light for a while of course

[vital marsh]

Eris had a ghost?

Thank you btw

[trim grotto]

Yes, she was a Hunter.

[vital marsh]

I am now learning this 😭

[stark scaffold]

so in edge of fate, are we going out of the solar system?

[queen swallow]

Yes

To the Oort Cloud

[stark scaffold]

so how is that gonna work for the director screen? are we getting a seperate screen for each system?

[queen swallow]

I doubt it. It'll likely be another circle to click.

[stark scaffold]

dang alr

still cool to leave the solar system

[queen swallow]

The Oort Cloud is not another system but instead a giant cloud of stuff that surrounds the heliosphere and heliopause.

[stark scaffold]

ah i see

[queen swallow]

Technically, we're not actually leaving the solar system, as the solar system is defined as things that orbit the Sun or are affected by the Sun's gravity over that of other stars which the Oort Cloud is. However, since we are leaving both the heliosphere and the heliopause, something which Voyager 1 (the probe in the trailer) did back in 2012, and we're passing through interstellar space, I think it counts as leaving.

[blazing wasp]

sorry, to clarify, how do we know its in the oort cloud?

we cant determine that based on the destination being keplar

sure theres a keplar in the oort cloud, but theres like 5+ planets called keplar

[jagged badge]

They said so in the dev stream iirc

[blazing wasp]

ahh

[gleaming osprey]

How much good needs to be left of Amanda Holliday for a ghost to turn her into a Guardian? Is a greasy smear enough? Do you need meat?

[dim minnow]

we can see that her body was intact enough to be covered by a veil

not quite sure how much of the body is needed though for first rez

but presumably, even a pile of bones in enough

[gleaming osprey]

I smell the potential for an exciting new chapter!!!!

[dim minnow]

could be ancient bones as well

[gleaming osprey]

Oh I hadn't thought of that, it would be cool to have a ghost roll up and resurrect Pharoah Kufu

[dim minnow]

it is possible

there actually is a Guardian named Sen-Aret who was from the Qadan culture. She ws presumably killed 13k years ago and buried at Jebel Sahaba

[gleaming osprey]

Or Abe Lincoln

[trim grotto]

The bare minimum is, frankly, unknown. As Dova said, bones are enough - bit of a given - but we can't say much more.
What we do know is that DNA degradation or atomisation can halt the process, though.

[slow berry]

it's somewhat vaguely implied half fanon that lord shaxx is william shakespeare

[trim grotto]

I would say there isn't any level of implication at all and it's pure fanon on all fronts.
A fun fanon, though.

[dim minnow]

Shaxx's love for poetry does not mean he is Shakespeare

I personally like to think he is

[trim grotto]

The reading of The Tempest was rather relevant to his friendship with Sjur Eido, whom he had called a tempest once before. He's just a poetic fella.

[trim grotto]

...tigerman?

[slow berry]

Shaxx was gonna be a Tigerman once upon a time

So there also exists the idea that he IS a tigerman and the helmet stays on

[dim minnow]

yeah

[queen swallow]

12:47 is the relevant time stamp from the Reveal Event stream on YouTube.

The real Oort Cloud is weird and is really only a theory. I’m interested to see if they do anything else with it in-universe.

There’s a really neat image of the Oort Cloud on its Wikipedia with the location of all the planets and Voyager 1 on it.

[slim girder]

Since we're fighting a dredgen in renegades i am praying they're using a weapon of sorrow. A new one would very cool to see.

Not just a thorn replica like a lot of dredgens use

We haven't had a new weapon of sorrow since osteo striga

[queen swallow]

Darksaber from Star Wars but it's the Darkblade from Alak-Hul instead

[slim girder]

A sword weapon of sorrow would be cool imo

[queen swallow]

Logically speaking, most destinations within Destiny 2 have 2 different enemy races and not often more, if at all. Edge of Fate has Fallen and Vex in it. Renegades I can see as Cabal and Hive. Hive with the Dredgens and Weapons of Sorrow and Cabal with the whole empire theme from Star Wars.

[queen swallow]

Would mesh nicely with the sword logic and having a literal sword Weapon of Sorrow

[misty halo]

Are there any Hunters who did something insane in the lore? We always here about Titans and Warlocks doing crazy things (splitting mountains with a headbutt, blinking across a planet) but I feel like the only think we hear about Hunters is how they went rogue and started blasting other Guardians with Golden Gun

[trim grotto]

Well, neither of those first things happened, so there's that.

But, yes. We do have some cool Hunters.

[misty halo]

Oh so I was lied to 💀

[trim grotto]

It sounds like a misremembering of Wei Ning punching a mountain - which, in response, had a microscopic tremor - and of Ikora Rey in her epic, Mars-destroying battle with us, in Emperor Calus's official, in-lore fanfic.

[misty halo]

Oh yeah probably

[trim grotto]

On the topic of Golden Guns, you've got Shin Malphur, with the title The Man With The Golden Gun, who certainly popularised the technique in the City Age. While he is a bit of a rogue Guardian (insomuch as he's a lone wolf, and doesn't work directly with the Last City, but he isn't evil or whatnot), he's most famous for hunting down Dredgen Yor, the most infamous Ex-Guardian Guardian slayer and mass murderer of our history. Their duel on Dwindler's Ridge is famous.

We've also got Ana Bray, whom you may be familiar with. The strength of her Golden Gun is also legendary.

Ana, though. When she fired the Gun, where her Golden blasts hit home, she left behind the pools of light. Like splashes of sunlight that burned and burned."

—Lord Shaxx```

While we're talking about Hunters represented in game, I would like to offer an honourary mention to Eris Morn, a Hunter who lost her Ghost and Light in the Hellmouth. While her feats as a Lightbearer were not insignificant, it was her Lightless time that put her on a pedestal, mastering Hive techniques and magic to not only survive, but earn the title of Crota's Bane.

[misty halo]

Lol, W Eris

[dim minnow]

there was the instance where Ana Bray fired two golden gun shots that traveled for light years

[trim grotto]

Lady Efrideet, a Hunter of the Iron Lords (I am ignoring Saladin's "hurr durr no classes existed in the dark ages" rhetoric here) features in a rather amusing story wherein she tosses Lord Saladin like a javelin at a Fallen Spider Tank, which the community likes to imagine is how the Thundercrash first was conceptualised.

[dim minnow]

which happened when her Ghost overcharged her with Light, which was something so badass that was only ever mentioned in lore once

[misty halo]

AT the tank? LMAO

[trim grotto]

It's our version of Marvel's Fastball Special

[misty halo]

Lol

Okay, last question, has there ever been in "incidents" in the crucible where someone accidentally destroyed a ghost, or maybe even on purpose?

[trim grotto]

ATOP A DUSTY CLIFFSIDE

Saladin looks down the mountainside at the tank, then to the village. His fists tighten at his sides as the air around him begins to crackle.

"If you miss—"

He stops speaking as Efrideet grabs him by the metallic collar, pressing him over her head. Arc energy from both Lightbearers coalesces in a roaring storm around them—Saladin's crackling, barely contained, Efrideet's flowing, guiding. The mountain rumbles beneath her as she steps forward. Waves of gravel and dirt blast up behind her as she hurls the armored man off the cliffside like a javelin, their combined Arc energy singing like a drawn sword. Saladin's gilded form becomes a cannon shot, tearing holes through three layers of clouds as he rips down toward the Fallen Walker.```

[misty halo]

I highly doubt it, but...

[dim minnow]

during a Trials of Osiris match right when the Cabal put the cage on the Traveler at the start of the Red War

[misty halo]

That is so anime I'm not gonna lie

[dim minnow]

a Titan accidentally killed a Guardian and their Ghost with a pulse grenade

[misty halo]

Oop-

Ofc it was trials 😭

[dim minnow]

Ana's crushed bones reforge. Light fills her eyes. Her grip, still holding against the seizing Exo's bladed thrust, liquefies its plated hand to scrap. A glorious crown of Solar flame erupts from her visor and she cracks her forehead into the Exo’s face. It reels, tufts of flame extinguish in the vacuum. Ana kicks away.

Solar might engulfs 18 Kelvins. Ana hammers off two rounds of celestial annihilation. They melt straight through the Exo, puncture the station plating, and scream through space for light years.

The Exo slumps, a molten heap.```

[trim grotto]

Speaking of Trials, there was Shayura's Praxic, zealous violence that eventually drove her to mental break and imprisonment.
https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/pyrrhic-ascent-bond

[dim minnow]

probably one of the coolest things a Guardian does and I pray for the day Bungie lets us pull it off ingame

[misty halo]

Never piss off a female guardian. Noted.

[dim minnow]

works for male Guardians as well

Osiris went apeshit on Crota's remaining lineage

he was spamming all three Light subclasses

[misty halo]

I now feel like reading a bunch of trials lore

[trim grotto]

Shayura's arc, which has happened over multiple years, is a bit of a doozy.

[misty halo]

Yeah, I moreso wanna know about the whole stasis part

[pulsar goblet]

does anyone know where i can find me to help me get the barrow dyad

[trim grotto]

Shayura is a Praxic, a Warlock order which... well, to be simple, their entire philosophy was "holy shit Darkness is evil burn it kill it don't try to understand it, burn it"

[pulsar goblet]

i cant get in the nether im so confused

[trim grotto]

You want #❓destiny-questions. That said, you need to own Episode Heresy to access the Nether. Do you own that?

[pulsar goblet]

howw do i know

[trim grotto]

I would generally expect someone to know how they spent their money, but give me a moment

If you bought Final Shape very recently, it would come with the active Episode. At the moment, that's Heresy. Alternatively, purchasing Heresy individually through the Eververse store or by purchasing the Annual Pass will also provide access.

[misty halo]

Oh.

She better be glad she doesn't know us 💀

..Now I want the guardian to end up in a fight with another guardian.

More on darkness - is there anything in particular that makes Strand of the darkness?

It feels like it's just an Energy Source we found on Neptune that we could use, kind of like Knack and the different relic types (if you know what that is)

Correction, Neumuna mb

[pulsar goblet]

i bought the final shape a week or 2 after it came out does that wwork??

[trim grotto]

Well, that particular lore tab was some number of years ago.
Shayura escaped the Last City and began hunting down Darkness users. She killed... many Guardians. It was a mess.
But when she saw the Hive with the Light, well... her entire worldview shattered and she had a full on mental breakdown. Darkness was evil, Hive were evil. Light was good. To use Darkness was evil. But when she saw Hive using Light, the force of Good™️...

In the end, she turned herself in. She was imprisoned, and was undergoing therapy. When the Witness was trying to murder us all post-Lightfall, she was tentatively released into the care of her old Fireteam, as we needed all hands on deck.

[trim grotto]

No, that gave you the active Episode of the time, which was Episode Echoes.

[pulsar goblet]

oh

are the episodes permanent

[trim grotto]

No. They are removed every major DLC, which means they're going in about a month and a half.

[trim grotto]

As you may know, Light and Dark are... essentially just parts of the universe. Strand is our wielding of the underlying web of the Weave, a connecting thread between all conscious beings. Darkness is very closely tied to such concepts of consciousness, memory, thought, and so on.

The reason why we discovered it and began harnessing it as Strand was due to the presence of the Veil at Neomuna, a possibly-conscious artefact of primordial Darkness that the Precursers once used to turn themselves into the Witness. The Veil was essentially... thinning the boundries, allowing us, as paracausal beings, to see the energy.

[misty halo]

Oh.. yeah I could imagine that being pretty mind-shattering

[misty halo]

Oh okay

[trim grotto]

Shayura also had to undergo a bit of extra therapy because...

https://tenor.com/view/destiny2-lightfall-titan-ghost-light-gif-27606637

remember this

[trim grotto]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/valiant-memory

[misty halo]

Good lord...

[trim grotto]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/aishas-embrace
ah here it is
kept browsing over it

This is all a bit out of order but I can probably list it all if you want to do, like, a whole big thing of it

[misty halo]

Okay, this one wasn't TOO bad

Wait hold up, let me look at it again

[trim grotto]

she's a very mentally stable young lady

[misty halo]

Okay, I thought they were talking about Aisha the whole time... I'm playing iron banner so I had to skim through some parts

That's not as "not that bad" as i thought

[misty halo]

So, where exactly was she? I was getting the impression she was in the Helmouth

[trim grotto]

In the Last City, turning herself in, and having a complete and utter mental breakdown after seeing Lightbearer Lucent Hive at some point very recently in the past

[misty halo]

I'm not sure if I should feel bad or what...

[trim grotto]

It's a bit of a funny one yeah haha
On one hand, she was completely broken here
On the other...
"Her jumpship was full of dead Ghosts. Some of them were just pieces. We haven't determined how many dead, yet." —Vanguard Security Report Excerpt
"We believe she's also responsible for the dead Guardian and Eliksni we found on Venus. We haven't identified which dead Ghost belongs to the Guardian." —Vanguard Security Report Excerpt
"Jumpship logs indicate she visited Venus, the Moon, the Reef, and several locations on Earth. Her last position before surrendering herself was Mars." —Vanguard Security Report Excerpt
"We're notifying fireteam members and life partners as we identify the Ghost remains. It's going to take a while." —Vanguard Security Report Excerpt

[trim grotto]

those actually answer the other half of this question
she saw the Lucent Hive on Mars

[misty halo]

Oof.

Had her whole journey leaked

[misty halo]

Is there any cool lore tabs about us?

[trim grotto]

Probably not in the way you're thinking. Our lore is our actions. Slaying the Hive God Oryx, venturing into the Black Garden, conquering the Vault of Glass, so on.
We do not often feature in lore tabs because we're... blank slate characters. You're who you want to be.

We got drunk with Crow and Savasiris once though.

[misty halo]

What-

LMAO

I like to think "I'm too broke to afford this DLC, so I'm putting the entire universe at a halt"

[misty halo]

Well, I thank you for your time sir

[trim grotto]

lore is fun!

[misty halo]

Agreed

[jagged badge]

You’re fun

[trim grotto]

[ember storm]

Their name is Osusris

[slow berry]

The Gjallarhorn lore tab has us use Gjallarhorn to destroy Randy's rocket that he angrily threw over the ledge of the tower then hand it down to him

Which is just a really nice and pretty representation of the decade-long history of the community helping new players

[ember storm]

I would never

[blazing wasp]

Also randy isn't new is he?

[queen swallow]

in what sense?

like recently resurrected or recently added to the lore?

[slow berry]

Randy finally reaches the Tower. It was a long road from the Cosmodrome, but Shaw Han had given him some good directions. His ship had only exploded twice on the trip from Old Russia, and while he defended his Ghost's second (and much better) repair job, he even found some loot!

During the Gjallarhorn lore tab, it's implied he's fresh to the tower from the Cosmodrome, given that he's supposed to mirror the Guardian's origin as well

[ember storm]

It’s just two separate characters named Randy yeah

Or maybe not who cares

[queen swallow]

Randy has been in the lore since Warmind and his story says that he's a recently resurrected Guardian who follows the New Light story

[blazing wasp]

Ahh

It is a stretch but, since or guardian does not do the new light quest, is it possible that randy is the one who does new light?

[ember storm]

It’s not a canon story either way so it doesn’t really matter

It only works under the pretense that there’s no other guardians besides Shaw and one other even though it’s canonically spilling new lights constantly

[blazing wasp]

Ah yeah

That's true

[ember storm]

It also doesn’t work storywise assuming both Randy’s are the same since the Throwing Knife one was a new light during the forsaken era back when the Cosmodrome was still completely quarantined following the siva crisis

[hazy veldt]

What’s the name of the strike where we go to mars and fight hive then infiltrate rasputin bunker to fight off hive knight

[slim girder]

Heist battleground mars

[frigid sparrow]

any of the post-chosen battlegrounds (excluding Echoes) are just gonna be [Season name] (Battleground) {Location}

chosen is actually cool and gave them actual names (Behemoth, Hailstone, Foothold, Oracle) and since Echoes has all its battlegrounds in the same location it gives them unique names as well (Delve, Conduit, Core)

[slim girder]

Something I liked about echoes battlegrounds was that they all linked together into one big mission. I really want big missions like that in Destiny.

[frigid sparrow]

real, and the chosen battlegrounds all had their own unique mini plots

like, technically the defiant battlegrounds escalate with the sky prison but they're still ultimately "GUARDIAN SAVE THESE PRISONERS FROM A NO-NAME CABAL), risen has a sort of connecting tissue but it's still ultimately "GUARDIAN TAKE DOWN THIS NO-NAME LUCENT HIVE BEFORE THEY EXPLOIT THE LIGHT," but Seraph battlegrounds are actually total non-story bullshit things that can happen one after another with no connecting tissue and an overreliance on similar mechanics and latter locations

meanwhile, Echoes has us actually plunging into the depths of nessus even deeper each week to find out what's going on at the core, seeing house dusk and the shadow legion continue their search (even though they are kinda nameless and the bosses are also no-name losers without any lore)

and Chosen battlegrounds actually have their own lil subplots going on