📚lore-discussion

[ember storm]

it’s not an entire race anymore

[exotic cloak]

Is the coolest part

[ember storm]

it’s just some thing

I’d also be hard pressed to believe the entire civilization was happy about the decision

[spiral crane]

I do like the witnesses voice though

It’s very cool

[spiral crane]

I think they killed the opposition

[ember storm]

we’re shown the process includes mountains of butchered bodies

so, yes, ritualistic mass suicide

[exotic cloak]

I mean I can buy that but I guess there were people who didn't wanted that

But I like the idea of an entire civilization going insane wanting meaning

And then one of them just suggest to commit massive suicide and they end in that

[jagged badge]

I still can’t believe who does the voice tbh

[spiral crane]

Who is it

[jagged badge]

Brett Dalton, who I know as Grant Ward from Marvel’s AoS

[chrome fog]

WHAT

No way

[jagged badge]

I believe he also voices a character in God of War

[chrome fog]

That’s amazing and unbelievable

[jagged badge]

Right?

I was like, “wait what”

[chrome fog]

But I’m guessing he’s just the male component of the voice, there has to be another actor mixed in with him right?

Shit I’m looking back and yeah fuck, the Witness sounds a bit like Ward

[dim minnow]

just wait until you hear who voices Banshee-44

[chrome fog]

https://tenor.com/view/grant-ward-shield-gif-7600441839194983967

This fuckin guy

[jagged badge]

Apparently Dalton is the only credited actor

[chrome fog]

THAT’S CRAZY

[spiral crane]

WHAT

[jagged badge]

Perhaps they just duplicate and pitch shift his voice and whatnot

[spiral crane]

GRANT WARD

[jagged badge]

Yea

[dim minnow]

don't we still have no idea who voiced Oryx?

[spiral crane]

WHAT THE FUCK

[chrome fog]

That would be fucking crazy if he’s also doing an effeminate pitch

[spiral crane]

HE SOUNDS NORHUNG LIEK HIM

[chrome fog]

Whomst

[dim minnow]

John Dimaggio

[versed orbit]

how many lines did oryx have again

[chrome fog]

I can see it

[dim minnow]

Banshee voiced by the guy who did Bender, Jake the Dog, Joker, General Grievous, etc.

[chrome fog]

He’s being real soft with his signature gravel in his voice, but there’s a little bit of him you can tell

[chrome fog]

My favorite example is Rath from Ben Ten because it’s just his voice up to eleven

[dim minnow]

LETMETELLYOUSOMETHING

[jagged badge]

Wait when did John DiMaggio voice Grievous?

[chrome fog]

Full stack DiMaggio buff
https://youtu.be/Ckw3pc0InKk?si=zufgV0vxJOwYuwL1

[dim minnow]

2003 Clone Wars (Specifically in the first volume, I believe they had someone else voice him for the rest of the series)

[jagged badge]

Ah I see

[dim minnow]

I must be the only mf who preferred Grievous' 2003 voice over his newer ones

[chrome fog]

I’ve barely heard that version speak

[dim minnow]

it's the only version where he had that sort of voice

ever since RotS his voice was kept on the more guttural side

[chrome fog]

Holy shit that voice is so different

Oh there it is

For some reason that first clip in the compilation was really high pitch

It’s a very good voice, he should get into more menacing autocratic officer roles

[dim minnow]

give us a General Grievous show already

make him commit warcrimes and look badass doing it

[chrome fog]

They keep robbing my man Gennedy Tartakovsky of his rightfully deserved baller shows

[smoky rose]

Nah I love 2003 grievous

[dim minnow]

Unicorn: Warriors Eternal was kinda mid

also he did kinda fumble the ending to Samurai Jack

Primal I thought was really good though (I can see how the ending could be a turn-off but I thought it was alright [could have been better but still decent])

[dim minnow]

who doesn't

but I'm referring ot his voice specifically

[spiral crane]

What are the scorn

[dim minnow]

Dead Fallen reanimated by Dark Ether

[chrome fog]

Oh my god it was, it was like, all build up no pay off

[dim minnow]

Dark Ether itself originated from Riven taking some Darkness that corrupted Uldren and combining it with a dying Fikrul's Ether

[chrome fog]

Which she did according to Uldren’s wish to save Fikrul

[dim minnow]

though it seems that the Witness is also capable of creating Scorn

[dim minnow]

plot was swiss cheese
pacing did parkour
Story was not one of the stories of all time
A shame too since I really did like the cartoony style used for the show

and Genndy said that he was sitting on this show for a long time

really I think the main issue here is that Genndy isn't very good with larger, overarching stories

at least with Clone Wars, he probably had to make sure what he did was approved by Lucas

most of the story stuff was probably done by Lucas anyways

and practically all of Genndy's previous works were episodic

Primal was for the most part until season 2

[chrome fog]

I also think it might have been partial pressure to release something instead of giving more time for him to cook up the series, it hadn’t been that long since he finished up Primal and it’s clear he put a lot of care into the aesthetics of the series

I had a couple ideas of where it could have gone but it’s been too long since I watched it

[shadow crypt]

Could have Uun been a disciple of the witness?

or any of the 3 hive gods

[trim grotto]

Savathûn nearly was. Uun? Probably not.

[shadow crypt]

What about Xivu and Oryx?

[trim grotto]

No and no - to our knowledge, anyway.

[shadow crypt]

Also who exactly is this fourth disciple I’ve heard about

in this lore book

I forgot what it’s called

[chrome fog]

At best Oryx got taught the power of Taking, but he did not actually receive the Disciple title

[shadow crypt]

Inspiral

that’s it

[shadow crypt]

Ah ok

[chrome fog]

Mael’s probably looking for the entry in question, but I’ve not read Inspiral, though I do know it’s a weird assortment of entries which give insight to multiple characters

I hate autocorrect

[trim grotto]

Probably referencing The Cave, but that Disciple is also stated to be dead.

A delusion of a being long dead, an idea of living only to serve, only for one purpose. It leaves behind a sharp-edged data fragment to mark its passing.

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/the-cave

[shadow crypt]

Ah ok

Also

Was Osiris ever an Iron Lord?

[dim minnow]

no

I believe Osiris was mentored by Felwinter though

[spiral crane]

Isn’t that the dude that got bitches by shaxx

[dim minnow]

yeah Shaxx beat his ass

[spiral crane]

Is felwintwr weak or is shaxx just that goated

[trim grotto]

Shaxx is just like that.

Felwinter was very, very dangerous.

When someone would commit particularly atrocious crimes... Iron Lord Felwinter would rack his shotgun and hunt them down. In an act that broke the Decree himself, he would put them down for good. Final blows, Ghost and Lightbearer together.

Such as when Iron Lord Dryden used a populated village as an ambush spot for Warlords.

[shadow crypt]

Are there Guardians who have used the light for the wrong purposes and what would happen to them?

[trim grotto]

Well there were the Dark Age Warlords. The Iron Lords happened to them.

[shadow crypt]

Any more recently?

[trim grotto]

Shayura, for example. As in Shayura's Wrath. A Praxic Warlock who... Well, she snapped, slaughtering and murdering any Guardian who had used Stasis.

[chrome fog]

Well, you could say the Shadows of Yor but I’m not even sure of their impact other than the distribution of Thorn copies; Hive Lightbearers are a better example but that’s given

[trim grotto]

Her mind had Light as Good and Dark as Bad.
So when the Hive began to use the Light...

Her worldview and denial shattered.

She turned herself in, and was imprisoned, underwent therapy.

[shadow crypt]

ah alright

[trim grotto]

She has since been given to the very strict custody of her old fireteam, given the universe-ending state we're in.
Remember the cutscene where Amanda and the ships attacked the Witness, and got carved up? That was her and her fireteam.

Reed-7's Ghost was killed, but Aisha and Shayura's Ghosts survived, and thus, so did they.

[shadow crypt]

Aren’t those all…

trials weapons

like the names

they crossed paths with saint surely right

[shadow crypt]

Wow

I had no clue that was them

[trim grotto]

Yes, they were a regular Trials fireteam.

[shadow crypt]

Do we know what Aisha and Shayura are up to today?

Probably on the frontlines helping the last city I would assume

[spiral crane]

What are the origins of the cabal

[trim grotto]

They reunited with Commander Sloane, a friend. And ate noodles together.

[shadow crypt]

Awesome

[trim grotto]

That's a tale I don't have time to detail I'm afraid
Perhaps @chrome fog or @dim minnow have time

[shadow crypt]

on a side note what do our fellow Guardians do for fun besides the crucible, gambit, and trials?

[spiral crane]

Maybe just normal stuff

Like game or watch tv

Or bike in the last city

[chrome fog]

We don’t get an actual “out the primordial soup” origin for their species, though they have very Roman-esque Origin Myths such as Acrius, their first Emperor.

Otherwise they’re just a imperialistic space faring civilization that bares a very close resemblance to Rome

[spiral crane]

What a weird coincidence

[chrome fog]

Like, it is uncanny how much they follow the development of the King, to the Senate, to an Empire again

[spiral crane]

That they’re so similar to an earth bound empire they’ve never interacted with

So weird

[trim grotto]

One bowl of your finest primordial soup please

[spiral crane]

So no “book of sorrows” for the cabal

[chrome fog]

Ah! So sorry, just ran out of Stardust, would you mind coming back tomorrow? We should be restocked then

[trim grotto]

Fine, but I expect a discount for the inconvenience

[chrome fog]

Yeah. They also don’t have space magic to help preserve their eldest or maintain an accurate record of their history

They only get involved because Xivu Arath fucked over their home planet Torobatl and chased the Hive all the way here

Very “Space Marines” and “Imperium” of them

[spiral crane]

It can’t that be that hard to preserve history for a spacefaring society

[spiral crane]

Why are they attacking us

[spiral crane]

Except unlike the imperium they got whooped

[chrome fog]

we were also space faring by the time of the Golden Age, but that don’t mean we magically got all the records we lost in Pre-History

[chrome fog]

Expand their empire

[chrome fog]

The Imperium of Man very much got its own ass handed to it during the Horus Heresy

[spiral crane]

But we had a pretty accurate portrayal of human history for a few thousand years

[shadow crypt]

Do the Cabal have a leader anymore?

[spiral crane]

Didn’t the cabal have sum similar

[shadow crypt]

Well the ones not on our side

[spiral crane]

I’ve heard that before

[chrome fog]

Still don’t mean we got records from Mesopotamia aside from that record of Hammurabi’s Law

[spiral crane]

No idea what it is

[chrome fog]

Straggling captains and other such officers down the ladder. Not really much actual leadership as of now

[chrome fog]

The God Emperor was betrayed by half of his sons through a convoluted series of events which can be summed up as him being a very neglectful dad to his Primarchs (the sons in question). His favorite son Sanguinius died, he was left crippled after disintegrating Horus from existence and forced to sit upon the Golden Throne to not only maintain his life essence but also prevent a giant warp hole opening in the middle of Terra. Now the corruption and ineptitude of Man leaves the Imperium to slowly decay from the inside despite even the best efforts of the Astartes

[spiral crane]

Wait so the emperor is in a coma

Who is running the empire?

[chrome fog]

Also humanity decided to make following him a religion against his wishes for a secular intergalactic human empire, and the machine people also kinda worship him/some inherent tech god whom they see him as

[chrome fog]

https://tenor.com/view/henry-cavill-smile-gif-23787170

[spiral crane]

Henry cavil?

They’re in good hands

[chrome fog]

A bunch of old croaks who’re self serving, various splinter kingdoms and civilizations across all the former colony planets of humanity, the Astartes have their own infrastructure

[spiral crane]

So the empire isn’t even being run the way he would’ve wanted it

[chrome fog]

It’s the grimdark future

All the bad ends are going on rn

[spiral crane]

Jeez I thought everything was going great for the imperium

Nvm

So who’s winning the war hammer war

[chrome fog]

https://tenor.com/view/death-note-kira-anime-light-laugh-gif-22099540

No one

[spiral crane]

There has to be a winner even if they’re decimated by the war

[chrome fog]

Also I’d recommend this lovely fan series to get more informed about the universe of Warhammer in general

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMyGtEQ-rWYylJiZ88D3aaNpztoAxtNmE&si=Ov1ZUWoTBAKNcNM-

[spiral crane]

There’s like 100 videos in that 💀

[chrome fog]

HAHAHAHAhahaha no it don’t. It’s mutual losses all around, legit all the factions are close to achieving their end times conditions

[spiral crane]

So why are they still fighting

[chrome fog]

84, and like the first 40 are barely 10 minutes each

[spiral crane]

Are they stupid

And on that note what are they even fighting over

[chrome fog]

https://tenor.com/view/hehehe-ghehe-reptile-laughing-gif-gif-26223253

[chrome fog]

It is like all dictatorships all the way down, legit the Orks, the funny fungus muscle guys who literally use their imagination to control reality but are just really stupid about it, are the best group and they’re just warhungry idiots

Oh shit that playlist has the Behemoth videos included

[spiral crane]

So what are they fighting for?

Just for nothing?

Glory?

Racism?

[chrome fog]

Those are interesting but skip em because it’s long

[chrome fog]

https://tenor.com/view/principal-skinner-yes-seymour-skinner-the-simpsons-enthusiastic-yes-gif-15806751

All the reasons

Legitimately

[spiral crane]

💀

So they’re all fighting to extinction for no good reason

[dim minnow]

I suppose the ulterior reason is so they are recognized

the whole "I see you" concept

[chrome fog]

I’m being sincere, tts helps explain and introduce a lot of the universe, but in summary yes the setting is purpose built so that all factions of aliens, demons, humans, and in between are fighting each other despite collectively approaching mutual extinction

[chrome fog]

I’m not kidding when alien racism is a legit reason for a significant part of the Imperium of Man’s campaigns

[dim minnow]

I was talking about Cabal

[spiral crane]

Ur very late to that convo lol

[chrome fog]

Oh. Yeah the Cabal are just doing it for the glory of their empire as well as each individual self, their whole culture revolving around proving one’s self but not in the same vein as the Hive

It is that ancient Roman ideal of glory, very much so

[spiral crane]

So for glory and their empire

Vs the hive doing it for proving their right to live

[chrome fog]

Yea

Less existential more idealistic pursuit of fame

[dim minnow]

Fallen do it for survival

Vex because they must

[spiral crane]

Scorn do it because they’re basically zombies at the whim of the witness

[chrome fog]

Just below instinct for them, they’re compelled to assimilate all just because that is how they are

[spiral crane]

And the fallen because whoever controls them tells them to

[dim minnow]

well, the Witness' Scorn do

[spiral crane]

Like Conways game of life

[dim minnow]

Fikrul's motives aren't fully clear yet

[spiral crane]

So are they just the taken 2.0

[chrome fog]

Well, at the whim of their carnal desire, but then it because due to the Witness exerting it’s will onto them, then Fikrul was able to liberate a sect of Scorn to develop their own society somewhat

[dim minnow]

ehh

[chrome fog]

He’s given a good amount of them sentience

[dim minnow]

not thematically

[trim grotto]

Some of them are, sure
But not all

[dim minnow]

Fikrul is likely largely motivated by revenge, but we'll have to see whats going with him to really get the full picture

my biggest hope is that Bungie goes all in on him being our antithesis

[chrome fog]

I want him to get a break

It would be interesting to see the Scorn genuinely develop a culture and civil identity

[spiral crane]

WHat happened to the old lightbearer warlords

Are they all dead

[chrome fog]

Kilt by Felwinter and the Iron Lords or submitted to their cause

[trim grotto]

Reformed, joined the Iron Lords, were abandoned by their Ghosts, died...

Depends on the person.

[spiral crane]

So they’re all gone

[chrome fog]

The Iron Lords made sure of that

[spiral crane]

Would be cool to see a non reformed one come back

[trim grotto]

Well, sort of. There's Warlord Shaxx.

[dim minnow]

a single one wouldn't really be an issue

it really becomes a problem if they are in a group with enough sway over others

[trim grotto]

"I'll take a hard projectile over energy any day. No better way to make sure the target is dead."

"Energy is for silencing barriers. Fists are all I need to administer blunt-force trauma."

"I forget you used to be a Warlord."

"What do you mean 'used to?'"

"I thought you'd thrown in with Saladin and Felwinter."

"I did. But I never stopped being me."

"Then why—"

"'Warlord' is too many syllables."``` Drifter to Lord Shaxx.

[spiral crane]

What if a warlord comes back and convinces a bunch of guardians to do a coup/rebel

It’s a little unrealistic

But it’s a fun idea

[chrome fog]

We got the Praxic Order for situations like that

[spiral crane]

What’s that

[dim minnow]

the closest thing that actually could happen would be Lysander's return

and he isn't even really a Warlord

[spiral crane]

They could always make up a new warlord

It’s not like there’s a list of every warlord ever active

I think

[chrome fog]

Basically super vigil Lightbearer military police, super zealous about using the Light only and snuffing out Darkness usage, at least until a little after Beyond Light

[chrome fog]

It would just be another human Lightbearer, we take them down in Crucible every time we have free

[spiral crane]

That could work from the coup angle if we take out the warlord concept

The praxix order has a scism with the rest of the guardians because they disagree with the usage of dark

[spiral crane]

True

[chrome fog]

They work for the Vanguard and are pretty chummy with them, who are in turn chummy with us and also Eris and Drifter and Elsie/Exo Stranger

[spiral crane]

Wasn’t uldren also a humanoid

How did they handle him in forsaken

[spiral crane]

Nvm 😔

How zealous were they with purging darkness usage back in theur heyday

[chrome fog]

Awoken; he was never a boss battle, in fact we save him from a Taken Chimera before Petra and us kill him

[dim minnow]

Uldren was eaten by the final boss of the Forsaken campaign

we kill the meatball which spat him out

then we offed him in a cutscene

[chrome fog]

He was just an Awoken, nothing much special about him he wasn’t even a Techeun

[trim grotto]

His haircut gave him a +3 Stealth bonus and +12 Edge

So there's that

[spiral crane]

What a bitch

[chrome fog]

Again, he was driven insane

[spiral crane]

Also there’s chimeras in game?

[spiral crane]

By what

[chrome fog]

We have GOTTA make a list of what made Uldren insane and pin it

[dim minnow]

you know the big ball things with tentacles?

like the one in Lake of Shadows

[trim grotto]

Taken Servitors
Meatballs

[dim minnow]

also like Hefnd's Vengeance

[chrome fog]

I theorized the meat’s from whatever they produce Ether with

[spiral crane]

Like the thing from the blind well?

[dim minnow]

yeah

[spiral crane]

Oh that thing

[dim minnow]

they are officially called Chimaeras

[spiral crane]

That’s a serviter?

[dim minnow]

used to be

[spiral crane]

wtf happened to it

[dim minnow]

the shape and closer look at their models kind of gave that away

there also used to be one that appeared in Gambit

[spiral crane]

Why is it all fleshy and tentaclelly

[dim minnow]

called Primeval Ascendant Servitor

[spiral crane]

Taken enemies usually look the same

[dim minnow]

there's also Mithrax dialogue from the EDZ Defiant Battleground

[dim minnow]

probably why they are called Chimaeras

part Servitor, part something else'

[chrome fog]

Probably just the Ether-generating stuff

[dim minnow]

though we don't really know what this "something else" is

could be Hive biomass

since you can make out a bit of Ogre from them I think

[chrome fog]

Like think about it, they’re a machine which generates a biological resource which the Elisni needs to feed upon to not only be nourished but also to have enough hormones to develop their bodies

There was already some biological stuff hidden away in Servitors but we never think about it

[spiral crane]

Are the elisni poor or sum

[dim minnow]

Servitors are full machine I'm pretty sure

[chrome fog]

Immediately after their version of the Collapse - the Whirlwind for them - they were essentially forced to flee from their home system because the Witness and the Pyramids had destroyed everything already, then the Hive came along to continue wrecking their shit

[spiral crane]

Bro the hive be beefing with everyone wtf

[trim grotto]

They learned to be scrap workers because that's all they have

[spiral crane]

They’re such asshole s

[hybrid frigate]

how does the witness control the taken?

[trim grotto]

The Taken willingly serve beings of great willpower

[chrome fog]

Buuuuuuut how do they then generate a biological hormonal supplement and form of sustenance for the Eliksni unless the components for biological life were not present within them?

[hybrid frigate]

nice

[vestal summit]

if i were to guess, the Witness is the original source of the taken.

[hybrid frigate]

and i forgot where do the scorn come from

[chrome fog]

Zombie Eliksni

[trim grotto]

Quite possible

[hybrid frigate]

i think its oryx

[vestal summit]

Idk if the deep which Oryx comuned with is the same as the witness.

[trim grotto]

They're older than he

[hybrid frigate]

ah

[chrome fog]

Oryx communed with the Deep - really the Witness under a different alias - to learn the power to Take

[trim grotto]

Very likely, though not explicit

[hybrid frigate]

how old is the witness or how long has he been chasing the traveler

[vestal summit]

for millenia.

[hybrid frigate]

nice

[vestal summit]

since time immemorial.

[chrome fog]

Loooooong undisclosed period of time

[chrome fog]

Ehhh we don’t know this

[trim grotto]

The Witness is older than the Hive, and the Hive are older than Earth itself. Billions of years.

[dim minnow]

the being Oryx communed with lines up a lot more with the Winnower from Unveiling

[vestal summit]

i was about to say this. lmao

[dim minnow]

given what Entelechy says about the Witness and Winnower, it's either that wasn't the Witness or the Witness was pretending to be an ideal version of itself

[vestal summit]

reminder that the witness as an entity is older than the hive, but the witness is a mass of another even older race.

[chrome fog]

Still a proponent of the latter

[trim grotto]

IMO, the latter.

[hybrid frigate]

cant the traveler just transform into some autobot and fight the witness

[chrome fog]

That’s not its deal

[dim minnow]

latter is probably more likely at this point

[vestal summit]

btw, what do y'all think of the witness as a villain?

[dim minnow]

I actually really like the direction they are going

Entelechy does a good job of showing the Witness' flaws

[chrome fog]

Pretty sick when you realize the story of Destiny is like an allegory to combatting nihilistic pessimism and giving yourself a meaning of life, to “make [your] own Fate”

[hybrid frigate]

playing the game i hardly know anything about him, just that hes evil and wants to reshape reality, im not very worried about him as a character in the game

seems like alot of hype around the man but not alot of walking

[chrome fog]

Well the Witness essentially sets up all the present conflict, what with being the reason why the Hive are the way they are now - which then lead to the Hive wrecking the Cabal’s home planet - and also destroying the Eliksni’s homeworld

[spiral crane]

I wish they had put as much effort into light falls story as they did into the lore

Btw

Who is the speaker

[dim minnow]

indvidual given cryptic dreams from the Traveler

[spiral crane]

I hear about him but I never see him anywhere in the tower

[dim minnow]

they then interpret these dreams

[trim grotto]

He died at the climax of the Red War.

[spiral crane]

Oh crap

[dim minnow]

he was killed
murbered

[chrome fog]

They addressed not being satisfied with Lightfall’s story and that it’s essentially the broken starting end of the story they eventually will tell in Final Shape, they realized they couldn’t fit a new subclass and certain story beats at the same time

[spiral crane]

Was he like an established character?

[vestal summit]

welcome to destiny bud, where 80% of important info will never be seen by the avarage player.

[dim minnow]

yeah, from D1

[trim grotto]

Very

[vestal summit]

Cayde is every destiny players deary.

[dim minnow]

Consul stabbed him

[trim grotto]

He was basically In Charge

[hybrid frigate]

when you dig into the lore its really good, but they dont explain it in game very well, plus all the years that have gone by, alot of lore is just lost, before the final shape i will look into a history of destiny to be immersed in the story

[vestal summit]

although new lights probably wouldn't care much because he's been dead for the past 5 years.

[chrome fog]

The game does guide you toward the lore very much

[spiral crane]

I saw little of him in the time line mission

He’s not rlly that funny

[vestal summit]

people complain about that in relation to his writting in d2, apparently he was funnier in d1 but i can't confirm that.

[spiral crane]

I’m gonna be honest I thought the lore of destiny was gonna be really bad

I didn’t even bother reading any of the lore books in the game

[chrome fog]

Actually we have most of our lore entries on record in collections, as well as them being present in Ishtar Collective and efforts from both Bungie themselves and fans of all audio and visual content. You buddy have to be motivated to dive deep into it and know to take it piece by piece

[spiral crane]

It just doesn’t seem like a game that would have good lore

[spiral crane]

Is d1 even still available to play?

[chrome fog]

Yes

[vestal summit]

Only ps4 and Xbox one tho.

[spiral crane]

Does anyone play it?

[vestal summit]

d1 was console exclusive unfortunately.

[spiral crane]

No way lmao

[hybrid frigate]

when i say lost i meant kinda gone years in the past, probably shouldnt have said it that way

[chrome fog]

Its successor to the Halo franchise, which itself is known for a fair bit for its lore

Oh got

[vestal summit]

i would compare Destiny to Elder scrolls.

[chrome fog]

The Ws

[rocky flare]

We need more aphelion lore

[chrome fog]

We do

[dim minnow]

there's a reason why Destiny has a dedicated lore community

[vestal summit]

Where theres a fuck ton of lore and background info but the majority of the playerbase wont even know its there.

[dim minnow]

where's my Aphelion hunt dungeon Bulgaria

[spiral crane]

What’s ya’lls favorite lore from any game or show or book

Like destiny lore or elder scrolls lore etc

[rocky flare]

Destiny

[dim minnow]

asking that in a Destiny discord lore channel

I wonder what responses you get

[spiral crane]

Yeah im realizing that might’ve been a very biased pool now 💀

[vestal summit]

marathon;

[chrome fog]

This is God in the Bionicle universe. And he himself is mortal

[spiral crane]

Isn’t bioncle that Lego thing

[chrome fog]

Yes

[vestal summit]

Marathon has the best lore i've ever heard in a 3 part video series from mandalore gaming.

and i can't bother to learn anything else.

[chrome fog]

Also the entirety of the first two years of Bionicle’s story takes place on the robot body’s face

[dim minnow]

I'm very invested in Destiny Lore
for my favorite entry specifically, it would have to be Vex Mythoclast

[spiral crane]

What is this story from

Is there a show

A book?

[vestal summit]

Durandal will forever be Gianni Matragrano for me.

[chrome fog]

Novels, comics, there was an online point and click you followed along with to learn more about happenings in the universe

Here’s what 10 years of lore looks like
https://youtu.be/HKgSMTON4fI?si=ubp8RTok6UnfQy1c

[spiral crane]

Why is there so much lore for a Lego

lol

[chrome fog]

Because Bionicle is fucking goated as shit

Genuinely it all holds up pretty well

[spiral crane]

I’m guessing that bioncle is ur fav lore

[chrome fog]

It’s so FUCKING COOL

THEY DO ELEMENTAL MAGIC

[dim minnow]

I gotta remind myself to get the lego Invisible Hand sometime

[spiral crane]

A lot of lore universes do that lmao

[chrome fog]

BUT THEYRE BIOMECHANICAL ROBOTS WITH NO REAL MAGIC SYSTEM EXCEPT THAT CERTAIN TRIBES HAVE ELEMENTAL ATTUNEMENT

[spiral crane]

I don’t know if I have a set favorite lore

But there’s some I like over others

Like Bloodborne

Or dishonored

[spiral crane]

Like avatar the last airbender?

[chrome fog]

There is a weird energy reserve system inside them but other than that it’s not really elaborated upon

Also Matoran have to turn into Toa in order to use their elemental powers

[spiral crane]

What are Martoran

Also isn’t there something to do with masks in that universe

Like a really powerful mask that two brothers made

I remember watching a show about that when I was younger

[chrome fog]

A more comprehensive made by Lego themselves
https://youtu.be/VrPt6nLTdfE?si=t7AhIq4vGQ1pKJkO

[chrome fog]

That was the reboot, but mask powers are a separate thing from elemental powers in the original run

[spiral crane]

Oh so are there no mask powers in the og

That sucks I thought it was a cool concept

[chrome fog]

There are in the og

But the elemental powers are a separate thing

For example

Tahu is a Toa of fire, and can generate or absorb fire/heat

[spiral crane]

So he doesn’t need that mask for the powers

[chrome fog]

His mask, the Hau, provides him a protective barrier

[spiral crane]

Is there still an evil dude who wants and evil mask

[chrome fog]

The little villager dudes

[vestal summit]

i wonder if this channel will become a bionicle lore channel next aprils fools.

[spiral crane]

It already is one

We’re revolting

This is the bioncle lore channel now

[chrome fog]

I wanted to but there was concern it would derail too much during this April Fools, but I’ll ask mods if I can go off next year

[spiral crane]

And making every single channel gambit discussion wasn’t too far lmao?

[chrome fog]

Bionicle also has some of the most thorough preservation of releases media by the fandom I’ve ever seen, they’ve even maintained the two flash games that were central to experiencing the story in the first two years of release

[spiral crane]

Should I play the games

[chrome fog]

I will ask Ven and the others if it would be feasible next year

[chrome fog]

They’re pretty enjoyable from what I’ve heard, point and click browser games

[spiral crane]

What are they called specifically

I’ll play them tmrw

[chrome fog]

I cannot recommend this summary enough, and then the 9 hour one only if you really want that deeper insight

[spiral crane]

Ill add it to the list of videos you’ve given me

[chrome fog]

First one
https://biomediaproject.com/bmp/play/web-games/mnog/

[chrome fog]

Second one
https://biomediaproject.com/bmp/play/web-games/mnogii/

[spiral crane]

Ok it’s like 1 am rn so I gotta go to sleep

Gn

I’ll play the games tmrw

Or today technically

[chrome fog]

Might even add Transformers lore as well, but I think Bionicle will leave my hands full for a single April Fools

Gn

Anyways, doghive

No I’ll also sleep it is the same time for me as well

[exotic cloak]

I guess is pretty obvius but I have doubts about it, the portal on the traveler is a triangle for any specific reason? Like just because of the pyramids, the triangle being a perfect form, some kind of religious reference?

[blazing wasp]

The witness is all about triangles and stuff

Like, it's their whole thing

Probably just cause triangles are simple, orderly, perfect

[velvet flax]

Triangles are the simplest shape that you can make with 3 sides

Whereas circles are the most complex since they have 'infinite sides'

[blazing wasp]

And the traveler is complexity, free will, stuff witness thinks is cringe

[velvet flax]

👍

[exotic cloak]

Thanks

[modern lodge]

My guardian is a bum, rezzed fuck knows where in the Cosmodrome just to slay a god or three

[exotic cloak]

4 actually

Well technically

We count Calus and Nezarec as gods?

Because Rhulk is considered one as far as I know and these two are also disciples

[blazing wasp]

it feels weird to call disciples as gods

especially when rhulk explicitly states he's not a god

and implies the rest of the disciples arent (probably excluding nezzy)

[exotic cloak]

I remember that after beating Rhulk, Ikora in the cutscenes says something like

"These things believe they are above gods"

Have not played Vow in a while so dont remember Rhulk saying he is not a god but probably was in that way

[sick yew]

Could be in reference to the Upended or Scorn experiments

Playing god/putting yourself above one

[exotic cloak]

Yeah thats why I say that

At the end they are the equivalent or directly above that

Well Calus is still a fat ass but Nezarec and Rhulk

[chrome fog]

Nezarec yes because he was genuinely worshiped as such, Calus is just an aristocrat and they deserve to be as far away from godhood as possible

Then Oryx and Savathun as well, and I guess Crota?

[exotic cloak]

So 5 gods

And 6 with the witness

[exotic cloak]

Indeed, honestly I don't know much about but what did Crota to get to god level

Like, his daughter

And any other Hive god descendant, if there are other

Aren't gods

[chrome fog]

It’s funny because there’s an explanation in Ishtar being made rn

[exotic cloak]

Oh

[exotic cloak]

[chrome fog]

For context, the discussion over there was about how underwhelming the Leviathan Eater was in Witch, which led to the question of “How is he fully dead? Is it because he died in Savathun’s Throneworld, which is still in the Ascendant Plane?”

The High Celebrant was similarly mentioned, as we had killed it in the Ascendent Plane but not in its Throneworld, yet Ghost notes that it is a final death

[ember storm]

remember that random hive soul crystal on the Dreadnaught

do you think he’s living it big

actually Dreadnaught or Titan I don’t remember

[chrome fog]

The one with a bunch of Ghosts in it?

[ember storm]

no

the one that was just a lesser hive who was a hard worker

[chrome fog]

No idea

[eager trout]

What's the lore accurate subclass to use for Witch Queen?

[jagged badge]

That’s not a thing

[eager trout]

I mean, like, a Light or Darkness subclass

Imma just use Stasis because that's the last thing we got

Plus, since Savathun is using Light, imma use the opposite

An encounter between enemies using power they used to oppose

[ember storm]

the point is just using what you want

stasis was never supposed to replace light

it just joins our arsenal

but the real answer is to never use stasis because it sucks

[jagged badge]

Real

[jagged badge]

Still not a thing

[empty fern]

This one?

[ember storm]

that’s my guy

my man

[empty fern]

Love me my dreadnaught pvp maps

[ember storm]

oh

then no

[empty fern]

Yea

[ember storm]

that’s not him

[empty fern]

Get reused asseted

[ember storm]

nah it’s a different crystal

[empty fern]

Oh

[dusty jolt]

How many people did we turn into guns

[jagged badge]

Not as many as people tend to believe

[dusty jolt]

Rip

[chrome fog]

You use any subclass, there’s a reason there is no cited “favored subclass” that The Guardian uses, because it’s meant to be open to whatever gameplay style the player has

[exotic cloak]

About that

There's any reason why every class has a specific subclass at the start

When new light, titans are always arc, warlocks void and hunters solar

[gentle geyser]

Pretty sure thats how it was in d1 which the opening is meant to somewhat mirror, but also its just to make each class have a different subclass to make them further different

To a new player it makes the class choice in that moment more unique

[blazing wasp]

well, we didnt turn anyone into a gun granted, did we?

but we do have one gun thats a sentient, living organic being

assuming necrochasm and weapons of sorrow arent sentient

and if we dont count 1k

[ember storm]

it doesn't mean anything

it's entirely arbitrary

subclasses are just basic schools of thought, not strict restrictions

[trim grotto]

Also I'm pretty sure Hunters used to start as Arcstriders

[ember storm]

D2 had the "new" subclasses as starters

for the red war, anyway

on the topic i am still upset about the class swords

bungie has had the chance to rectify it multiple times now but they haven't

[next bobcat]

What’s all the Crota oversoul stuff about?

[ember storm]

it’s an idea he stole from his sisters

they basically figured out a way to turn part of your soul into a defensive measure that would give you an additional leg up on anyone invading your throne world trying to kill you

the big shattered moon thing in the sky of Crota’s is his

[next bobcat]

How does it help him?

[ember storm]

he just turns it out and nukes you

[next bobcat]

Ah so

[ember storm]

it defends him by killing you

[next bobcat]

turns part of soul into nuclear weaponry

https://tenor.com/view/clg-clg-void-void-what-void-what-gif-15117004

Like, all the other raid bosses usually just have a super easy way of wiping you, like the Templar’s negation

[chrome fog]

In his Throneworld, in the Ascendent Plane, which has been described as being malleable to its owner's desires. Being able to derive the Oversoul ability as a defensive mechanism within the Throneworld is not that nonsensical

This is the same throneworld where Crota made it so he was immortal, but failed to realize he upheld the Sword as the only thing more powerful than him, which is why we're able to use his blades against him

A better way of looking at it is that each Throneworld is a Vault of Glass for their owner; Crota's sisters essentially just came up with the idea of implementing the function of Negation into one's Throneworld, figuring that it would require a part of one's soul

[eager trout]

What was the plot twist of Shadowkeep? I think I missed it

[jagged badge]

We thought we were studying the Pyramid ourselves but it turns out it wanted us to earn our way in the whole time

And it had been studying us

[trim grotto]

It had very little to do with the Scarlet Keep at all. The plot twist was that there was a Pyramid beneath the surface of the moon - the first Pyramid we had truly physically seen.

[next bobcat]

It’s funny - we though the pyramids were the darkness, then we thought the witness was the darkness, now we know the veil is the darkness

[chrome fog]

Mmmmmm

[next bobcat]

Also black heart

[chrome fog]

That's like saying the Traveler is the Light

[next bobcat]

You know what I mean

[chrome fog]

It's a misleading claim, it would be more proper to say the Darkness is the same as the Light, a paracausal force to be utilized any way a user wishes

[trim grotto]

The true darkness was the lights we turned off along the way

[chrome fog]

We have truly learned to embrace the Light (dunking volatile orbs of energy to power/unlock things) and the Darkness (destroying generators on so, so many things)

[next bobcat]

We guardians just love handling volatile energy

[eager trout]

Ok, thanks

[eager trout]

Actually, Darkness is the Darkness

[next bobcat]

I worded wrong

[spiral crane]

How do ya’ll think we’re gonna kill the witness

From what I can tel it seems invincible

[chrome fog]

Power of Friendship and Willpower

[spiral crane]

No shot

[chrome fog]

Burning Justice

[chrome fog]

What is a tactical strike force hitting multiple targets in a coordinated effort, if not the power of Friendship?

Also we used Willpower to bs being able to use Stasis without the Pyramid splinter

[fast tapir]

more friendship than willpower though, of course

[chrome fog]

Also this shit kills the big bad in fiction more often than you'd realize or like

Watch us Kamehameha or Great Spirit Ball the Witness in a cutscene at the end of the raid

It's even present in a somewhat rooted Sci-fi world like Transformers (though, there's also a big portion of the mentioned entries that originate from Japan, so the concept of superpowered robots is somewhat induced through them rather than being an inherent aspect of Transformers stories)
https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Burning_spirit

But back to lore, legit it will be the power of the belief of our allies as well as our determination which will lead to our defeat of the Witness

[eager trout]

The Witness is not invincible, it just wants you to think it is. But we're either going to forcefully show it the true meaning of life, separate it into its components, or take away the Darkness from it.

[fast tapir]

erm

i think ill just thundercrash it

but i do wonder what its weakness may be

if it has any

[gentle geyser]

Its most likely separating it

Honestly I think its pretty possible that the witness is the only actual boss of the raid and we just get various stages of em

[eager trout]

Is Xivu Arath male or female?

[gentle geyser]

Female

[chrome fog]

Oryx was the only one who morphed to male, out of the three Osmium Princesses

[jagged badge]

Might wanna reread that

[trim grotto]

[chrome fog]

Words

Autocorrect I spit on thee

Stop adding spaces when you correct meeeee iOS typing assistance settings you’re so fickllllle

[eager trout]

Then why did I read that there was a mistranslation with Xivu Arath's gender in Spanish?

[trim grotto]

You'd probably have to ask a Spanish person.

[gentle geyser]

Pretty sure there is a language that doesn’t specify between male or female

I don’t remember what language tho

[trim grotto]

I believe Spanish translations have some minor issues with certain genders. Nimbus is referred to with masculine terms, iirc, for example.

Not sure why Xivu would be a problem though

[shadow warren]

That’s common to multiple languages

[eager trout]

I play in Spanish

[eager trout]

That's because masculine terms are also the gender-neutral terms

Technically Spanish isn't divided in masculine and feminine terms, but rather neutral and feminine

However, for all the mistranslations, it actually has some names that are better than the original

Such as Glimmer being called Lumen

And the Awoken being called Insomnes

I mean, they're not that impressive, but they're more original and sci-fi/fantasy sounding

[peak coral]

ok this is cooler true

[eager trout]

He, they (singular), and it are the same thing in Spanish

[trim grotto]

I'm not sure why Xivu would be an issue here, then... unless there's some complications with her status as a Knight?

[dim minnow]

for the last time Lightbearer, our pronouns are they/them (singular) because we're multiple people in a singular being

[dim minnow]

is the Mael theme bit still funny?

[trim grotto]

I'm going to be honest I've only listened to it twice because mobile discord doesn't embed the file properly

[eager trout]

What- why are you saying this?

[dim minnow]

just a joke with the Witness

[trim grotto]

Pretending to be the Witness

[dim minnow]

and that one picture of Venom

[eager trout]

Let me check what it said

[chrome fog]

Spanish is very much not one of those languages

[gentle geyser]

Your late to the conversation

[chrome fog]

We call that Filipino time

[trim grotto]

They backtrack a lot

You get used to it

[chrome fog]

They should’ve been around long enough to have seen me apologize for not scrolling down

But also I don’t think there’s that many languages who don’t default to the masculine and have gender-neutral terms

[eager trout]

Ok, it says that, due to a translation error, they refer to Xivu Arath as female, when it should be as male.

[chrome fog]

Whermst

[eager trout]

Yeah, basically every language except English either has masculine and feminine forms, or none

[trim grotto]

Well that's a mistake
She's definitely female and always has been

[chrome fog]

English itself isn’t exempt, the inclusion of gender neutral terms has mostly been a recent development and uses plural terms, which works, but it’s not universal across other languages

[gentle geyser]

Especially since she has a female voice actor as well

[jagged badge]

Singular they/them has existed for yonks

If that’s what you mean

[gentle geyser]

Words like They has always been gender neutral

[trim grotto]

I love that word
Yonks is so much fun

[jagged badge]

Indeed

[eager trout]

Except that in that case they just use words that already existed, while in every other language you basically have to invent new words.

[chrome fog]

Wasn’t it informally used as a singular? I remember getting lectured about not saying they/them when referring to someone else as a kid, and I was a single digit bab

[gentle geyser]

Well yes, its a term you can use but its informal, doesn’t mean you can’t use it

[chrome fog]

Then I’d like to clarify that it hadn’t been formally recognized as a individual term until fairly recently, or at least that was my understanding from what I was taught as an elementary scholar

[eager trout]

Depends on how old you are

[chrome fog]

Which I don’t really care about, Británica can eat my shorts sometimes for the various words they do and don’t recognize

[eager trout]

I mean, it is kinda rude to refer to someone as "they/them" if you know their gender.

[chrome fog]

Especially hate them getting on stuff Urban Dictionary was meant for

[chrome fog]

But wouldn’t the fact it’s gender neutral mean it’s applicable in spite of the presented gender? It’s not dependent on a gender like he/him or she/her so on reference to an individual that’s all it does, acknowledge that other individual without the assumption of gender

[ember storm]

Google says it originated in a medieval romance novel

so

if you count 700 years as recent

[eager trout]

It's still weird to, for example, refer to a girl as "they" even though everyone else calls her "she".

[chrome fog]

American education system

[chrome fog]

But it wouldn’t be gendering them as non-binary, it’s just referring to them as an individual without identifying their gender

[ember storm]

I mean it’s just needless at that point if the proper pronouns have already been communicated to you

either way, Xivu has always been a female, but hive don’t really have strict gender roles to begin with

[chrome fog]

I don’t use it in place of preferred pronouns, like I’ll use he/she, but the point is that it is a pronoun with no gender attached to it, so it’s perfectly fine for referring to someone of you don’t know the pronouns of or someone who identifies as outside the gender binary, which has thankfully been formally recognized more recently with the acknowledgement of non-binary individuals

[chrome fog]

And also still curious what the source of this was, it seems like a major oversight to clarify that Xivu is male when that's not the case

[eager trout]

Doblaje Wiki, in the errors section

[trim grotto]

Ah, the Curse of publicly editable wikis that don't require hard sources

The bane of credible facts

[ember storm]

ok gang

here's a lore question in the form of a riddle

[trim grotto]

[chrome fog]

This is a real difficult riddle

[empty fern]

Extremely

[dim minnow]

uhh shit uhh

OK, THE ANSWER IS UHH

FUCK SHIT UHH

[empty fern]

UHH WAS WRONG DOVAH

BANNED

[dim minnow]

THE ANSWER IS Some legends live forever. Others are overwritten—reshaped by the sheer will of those who believe that any ordeal can be conquered, any foe vanquished, any god cast down.

[empty fern]

Speaker?

[eager trout]

Why did Clovis Bray give rocket boosters to a Roomba?

[hoary knot]

Clean faster

[chrome fog]

I think they’re actually headlamps if you look at them more closely

Like on the other end where the thrusters would be open if they were

[eager trout]

Pretty sure the part I'm aiming at is the front part

Is there a lore reason why the Witness needs the Veil despite already being able to control Darkness? Is it stupid?

[empty fern]

https://tenor.com/view/bh187-austin-powers-spotlight-search-light-busted-gif-19285562

This is why

[empty fern]

If it controls the veil then it should control the traveler (which is why it existed)

[spiral crane]

Was the speaker a zealot

[dim minnow]

the Veil is inherently linked to the Traveler and for a reason currently unclear to us, this means that the Witness needed the Veil to create the Pale Heart portal

Osiris suggested that the Veil and Traveler were once one

[exotic cloak]

Didn't Traveler ran away from The Witness because they wanted to unite the Traveler and The Veil

[dim minnow]

yes, because the Traveler knows what the Witness will do if it succeeds

[thick sierra]

Random question are ghosts like metal or are they something else since their like from the traveller but the shells look like metal and the ball inside also looks like metal

[dim minnow]

Sentient energy signatures housed in a metal shell

[thick sierra]

guess that makes sense

[trim grotto]

Nyoom

[trim grotto]

I wouldn't say so by any stretch. Except the comic version. Which we usually don't count.

[spiral crane]

I heard he banished anyone who showed any lean toward the dark

[thick sierra]

Then theres the hive who just decided one day "bad guys use light, we want light, we take light, we use light"

[eager trout]

Nyoomba

[trim grotto]

Well, the Consensus as a whole did. And that was entirely justified for a long time - bar, I'd argue, Ulan Tan.

The Speaker was simply a member of the Consensus.

Remember, the Speaker died in the climax of the Red War - long before we even considered Gambit or Stasis.

[spiral crane]

So would the speaker be chill with how dark friendly we are today

[spiral crane]

Shame he feels like he would’ve been a cool character

[trim grotto]

Well, he may have learned to be more accepting. Many folks are still coming to terms with it.

But I'd say that if Zavala can come around, which he eventually did, then the Speaker could have too.

[dim minnow]

shame Consul killed him

[trim grotto]

It is a shame

[chrome fog]

Much more complicated than that but yes

[abstract rover]

Any of the characters in destiny been seen using strand?

Or just us?

[trim grotto]

Osiris, Ikora, and a bunch of random Guardians.

[abstract rover]

I knew about osiris but not ikora

[exotic cloak]

Ikora needlestorm must be enough to covert the entire Cosmodrome in an army of Maurice

She used strand in books or in an actual cutscene?

[trim grotto]

Lore book.

[exotic cloak]

Which one

[trim grotto]

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/ii-theory

[exotic cloak]

Thanks

[worthy raft]

i keep seeing something called "VanNet" being mentioned lately is it like the vanguard version of internet or a forum

[trim grotto]

Yep
That's about right

[dusty jolt]

So if the vanguard were to use darkness subclass, how broken would they be

[wise gust]

Isn't that just stasis?

[dusty jolt]

And strand ye

[empty fern]

Don’t know
They haven’t been in any fights I know of recently

[ember storm]

I mean the vanguard aren’t naturally stronger

they’re not in their position because they’re the best fighter

actually Ikora and Zavala are only there because the previous two were exiled and abandoned their post

[empty fern]

And cayde was there cause of a hunter dare
Actually are any of the vanguard qualified for their post?

[ember storm]

I mean they are qualified but like

the system was not designed for just them to be running everything

it’s a miracle the city survived this long

[blazing wasp]

Also to add to this, strength doesn't substitute for leadership

And the vanguard is a leader role

[open saffron]

Has any major lore been uncovered this season? I haven't played much since the beginning.

[ember storm]

depends on what you’d call major

and by lore if you also include overall story

[fiery copper]

The final shape collectors edition lore got shipped

But that's not technically part of this season, I guess

[open saffron]

Whole lotta nothin

[chrome fog]

If you want it from the start, I can summarize Season of the Wish, Warlord’s Ruin, and the Wish-Keeper mission

Because we haven’t had a new season since the beginning of winter last year, Bungie having faced with the layoffs as well as granting remaining and new members of their dev team time to get Final Shape to the quality they wanted

The explanation is gonna depend on how much you already know, though, which is what we were trying to gauge

[analog torrent]

Did new cayde lore drop

[empty fern]

Not yet

[dusty jolt]

Lore may not have but he did

[empty fern]

Nah don’t worry he got back up

https://tenor.com/view/cayde-return-gif-6048822464058950061

[chrome fog]

AAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHA
https://youtu.be/UchfadQhX7w?si=TqDSYcfFlCHth_fB

PINK AND YELLOW AS WELL AS SUBCLASS MIXTURE

OH MY GOD LETS GO RANDOM HAIL MARY THEORIES CONFIRMED OUT THE WAZOOO

[eager trout]

Imagination Subclass

Finally, the subclass of random bull

Titans: "You're saying I can punch in every way at the same time?"
Warlocks: carefully crafted build with ability synergy
Hunters: Batman

[gentle geyser]

We won

You know just yesterday I was wondering if they would just give us a mixed subclass and then thought “nah that would be too broken for gameplay”

[dusty jolt]

Can't wait to break the game

[gentle geyser]

I just realized

Icarus dash on all subclasses

Time to play warlock

Les go

[chrome fog]

Oh fuck yeah that’d be cool

[eager trout]

We can finally have Stasis and Strand grenades of every kind

[shadow crypt]

Wait lemme get this straight

Is this subclass crossing a subclass?

Or will every subclass be able to do it

[eager trout]

Yes

[frigid lintel]

I havent played since start of season of deep
Is the lore from that season actually relevant

[chrome fog]

Moreso the implications of it are significant and have greater consequences later on, but otherwise it’s mostly Xivu and the Witness’ forces trying to stop us from getting Egregore-adjacent coral that we’re using to communicate with Ahsa, the proto-worm that saved Sloane from succumbing to being Taken in the long time Titan had been, well, Taken from us by the Pyramids. We also get the origins of the Witness from Ahsa, in a cutscene about one or two weeks before that season’s finale I believe

[frigid lintel]

Might just watch on yt then and skip to witch's story

[chrome fog]

Witch's story is a bit more interesting, a lot more cooler stuff happening there opposed to Deep being resource gathering to get intel

Aside from Deep's mainstory, we also catch onto the Lucent Hive's attempts to resurrect Oryx's corpse which had fallen through Saturn and landed on Titan's methane ocean bed; recovered his remains and in studying them, learned that his body is being unnaturally preserved and he seems to be in a state akin to a coma

And that's about all from Deep

[spiral crane]

Wait

So oryx isn’t dead

[eager trout]

Somehow, Oryx returned

[chrome fog]

He’s dead

But his corpse is weird

[spiral crane]

Was oryx stronger than his siblings

[chrome fog]

You can argue that with his ability to Take that yes, he'd be more powerful than his sisters, but they too know the power to Take as Oryx shared the instructions to that power via the Tablets of Sorrow; there's also the fact that compared to Xivu Arath's nature of War and Savathun's nature of Cunning, Oryx's nature of Discovery - which this is in reference to each Hive God sibling's additional way to feed their Worm aside from Death, a Nature they have to fulfill - might seem more finicky to grasp and a lot harder to maintain as opposed to either Savathun disgusing herself as someone else for almost an entire year and overfeeding her worm, or Xivu Arath becoming empowered by any action of war, meaning that even mounting an assault against her gives her tithe as Hive God of War

The power to Take may supplement Oryx's nature even then it's difficult to visualize him garnerning Ascendent power through Discovery/Navigation other than reading a lot of texts and learning about multiple individuals, or just. Traveling through space.

[spiral crane]

So is feeding the worm directly tied to their power

Like more worm fed = more power

[chrome fog]

In the end, there's nothing really edging one Hive God sibling over the other, as they're fairly overpowered in their source of tithes

[chrome fog]

So remember how worms feed off of the ontological concept of Death? As well as how that synergizes with the Hive's Sword Logic? Well, in agreement with their worm, a Hive can provided it enough Death to feed, and in return, the Worm leaves a little bit of Ascendent Power for the Hive to use themselves and empower their selves; their worms sort of allow them to also consume and digest the ontological concept of Death to empower themselves

Instead of making the worm bigger, it make Hive bigger

[spiral crane]

So if everything is going well then the hive god is gaining ascendant power and the worm is fed. If not then they both starve and die

[chrome fog]

Yes, and this is the same for other Hive as well

[spiral crane]

So let’s say xivu wrath feeds his worm a ton

And savathun doesn’t rlly feed ur

It

Does xivu become stronger

[spiral crane]

All hive have worms?

What are natures of those worms

[jagged badge]

Except Lightbearers

[empty fern]

Feed and make hive stronger?

[jagged badge]

Her

[chrome fog]

But, as the Hive Gods are much more powerful and with their Worms also being able to feed on other ontological principles like Discovery/Navigation, War, and Cunning, they also require supplemental tithe from subordinates of their brood

[empty fern]

https://tenor.com/view/destiny2-gif-23697522

[spiral crane]

So the more all hive fulfil the wants of their worms the more strong they become

[chrome fog]

All worms feed on ontological Death, which includes literal death (as well as, say, ego death when you prove to your opponent you are stronger than them I think? It would explain why they are able to establish tithe chains without outright killing those they accept into their fold, and tracks with Oryx when he supplemented the original Darkblade into his tithe structure)

[chrome fog]

The Hive Gods are the only exception, being able to feed their worms through fulfilment of their nature as mentioned in this previous message

The original concept for the Hive would have made it more obvious, but all Hive have a worm interred within their body around the time they start to grow out of the Thrall phase I believe

I believe some of this is retained in-game by some Hive dropping their worm upon death? I'd need that fact checked but I vaguely remember seeing worms pop out of Hive after rapidly killing a bunch

[jagged badge]

Nope, Thrall have worms

[chrome fog]

Neato

[jagged badge]

The Thrall has to feed its worm in order to progress to an Acolyte

[spiral crane]

Why are they called thralls

Also what’s the highest u can get in the pecking order as a hive

Starting out as a thrall

[jagged badge]

Ascendant Knight I suppose

Or Ascendant Witch or whatever

[chrome fog]

Ascendent Hive; a big Knight or Wizard with special abilities, Crota being the ultimate example of this and the Hive Gods being exempt because they kinda started out overpowered compared to their kin

Uh Eris, do you remember which lore tab that has a Thrall being told by a Knight or Oryx - can't really remember - which demonstrates how a Hive moves upward in the Hive hierarchy?

[eager trout]

I wonder where the misconception on Xivu Arath's gender came from

[chrome fog]

I can ask Ishtar later if you can't

[spiral crane]

Wym

[chrome fog]

There was a bit of yesterday discussing about Xivu supposedly being misgendered as female in the Spanish translation for Destiny (notedly this being from an unheard of wiki that's probably not regulated), when it's been fairly apparent that she's presented as female in basically all her mentions, which is coincidental with you referring to her as 'he'

[spiral crane]

I didn’t realize I called her a he

I always knew she was a female

Mb

[chrome fog]

Yeah, I was thinking it was just a mistype

[empty fern]

Y’all have you seen it yet?

Cat murder a ghost?

[chrome fog]

What?

[spiral crane]

Huh

[chrome fog]

Huh?????

[empty fern]

[chrome fog]

Oh wait is that new Into the Light stuff that launched today?

[empty fern]

https://vxtwitter.com/chibirobo12/status/1777754950497394877?t=W3xIBec4gAwJTtQ-g1MXwA&s=19

[spiral crane]

https://tenor.com/view/shocked-shocked-cat-silly-cat-cat-kitten-gif-7414586676150300212

[chrome fog]

WHAT

[empty fern]

Think so

[spiral crane]

WHAT

[chrome fog]

Damn kitty what do them claws do

[empty fern]

That’s all, I’ll take my leave now

[spiral crane]

the car is the winnower

Confirmed

[chrome fog]

krat is a taken agent

[exotic cloak]

The only misgendering we have in Spanish is Nimbus

Is he because we don't have an actual neutral pronoun, but apart from that

[eager trout]

I mean, technically he is the neutral pronoun

Spanish pronouns are basically: feminine, and everything else.

[shadow wyvern]

Funny, in my language all pronouns are gender neutral lmao

[chrome fog]

Well that’s moreso an issue of Spanish being extremely dependent on Masculine and Feminine forms

[exotic cloak]

Masculine is also our neutral from most of the time but no one though on actual neutral pronouns when shit evolved from latin lol

[chrome fog]

Etymology is so entriguing

[eager trout]

We can finally make a Children of the Warlock build

Threadlings, Stasis Turret, and the Souls of Void, Arc, and Solar

[exotic cloak]

And I was wrong, I think

Did not saw the stream just the trailer

[chrome fog]

The moment I unsubscribe from Byf and he infests my shorts smh

[exotic cloak]

Damn

[chrome fog]

I can give Fallout Play’s reaction if you’d like

[worldly river]

Yall got any idea what kinda creature this skull from the TFS press pics comes from

[jagged badge]

That’s my doggo

[worldly river]

He looks like a nice well behaved good boy

[exotic cloak]

Nah it's a dinosaur

[exotic cloak]

Thanks but nah

[dusty jolt]

I think he needs a walk

[worldly river]

Bro left him in the hot car for a bit too long 💀

[empty fern]

(It’s just another ahamkara) (either that or the remains of another species the witness touched)

[fresh zephyr]

Were the brave weapons technically removed because they violated the Geneva convention

The non brave variants

[broken quartz]

Yo I think I'm going insane. I swear there's an image of the syzygy on fundament but I can't for the life of me find it

[exotic cloak]

Right, now sunset is canon

[pliant widget]

@trim grotto what are the ramifications

[trim grotto]

"Stop using these guns"
"Fiiiiiine"
"Except here have these back"
"Yaaaaay"

There you go

[gentle geyser]

They had to rebrand them with cats you don’t understand!

[pliant widget]

no i

i meant of tfs

[chrome fog]

What does that even mean

[pliant widget]

[chrome fog]

Ramifications of beating the Witness? Less literal existential threat

[trim grotto]

Spoopy
Kill floaty head or universe turns off

[pliant widget]

i meant subclass stuff

how that connects to what we’re doing

[trim grotto]

Guardian masters the power of multitasking

Amazing

Real answer though

Think back to the Shard of the Traveler

Darkness and Light existing together

[ember storm]

the guardian has the self agency of a brick and has to have literally divine intervention telling them to try doing something new

[shadow crypt]

In the lore couldn’t Guardians basically already do what’s coming in tfs?

Do combined stuff from different subclasses

[trim grotto]

We'd never seen someone use them at the same time, nor combined. Closest we had was Osiris rapidly "subclass switching".

[exotic cloak]

That and Ikora in WQ

[shadow crypt]

Ah ok

[short badge]

What’s this?

[arctic iron]

superblack

[worldly river]

Superblack

[short badge]

???

[gentle geyser]

Its the superblack shader

[short badge]

Mid

[gentle geyser]

Its the final reward for doing both vendors to max

[short badge]

They should have made it a taken shader

[exotic cloak]

Wait

[gentle geyser]

No, and people asked for all black, they got all black

[pliant widget]

a taken shader requires so much effort

[exotic cloak]

Some of the Brave Arsenal weapons are still obtainable, any theory of how that works?

Like, we can still get one of those two weapons in raids

[pliant widget]

nostalgia level ig

[trim grotto]

There isn't much lore to be said here
Shaxx just gave us some guns

[exotic cloak]

I mean is a cool explanation but I think they pretty much shoot themselves with that one

Like banned but four of them are still obtainable

[trim grotto]

Obtainable is relative

[exotic cloak]

True

[gentle geyser]

Plus technically we have one

The dreaming city set with that one consumable

[chrome fog]

This dang community and falling for the same trends (all black/white, edgy hunters, Titans in nonsense)

Still mad about Hunters not getting the Good Guy Wizard set

[pliant widget]

yes it was made to work with that one

[gentle geyser]

Hunters on their way to choosing a set that looks similar to normal legendary drop gear but too different so it doesn’t match with anything

The good wizards were far better, I think people just forgot shaders existed

[exotic cloak]

Once again Crayon Logic shows how Titans are superior

The only ones who got good wizard

[gentle geyser]

Wild how warlocks, the wizard class, didn’t get the wizard outfit

[still kiln]

Hidden: hey we found out that oryxs corpse can still like, grow and learn shit, we should probably destroy it so we don't risk oryx coming back

Ikora: I got a better plan...hides his body in closest next to savathuns they'll never find it hehe

Closet*

[trim grotto]

Despite the... activity in his body, Oryx is nevertheless well and truly dead. If they failed to resurrect him with a Ghost and Necromancy, then inside of a Hidden vault ought to be quite safe.

[trim grotto]

Yeeep

Would've been nice

[jagged badge]

Who’s excited to see a billion evil wizard Hunters with Superblack

[trim grotto]

You
Don't lie, I know

[jagged badge]

[empty fern]

It’ll be like the anti witness

A mass of all black guardians

[eager trout]

When is the all-black shader coming?

[jagged badge]

#❓destiny-questions

[raw hazel]

https://tenor.com/view/al-pacino-tired-michael-corleone-godfather-fed-up-gif-17501226

[trim grotto]

Halllyyyyyy

My favourite Hally to ever Bo

[raw hazel]

They pulled me back in Mael

I'm reinstalling as we type

[chrome fog]

Hallo

[hardy anvil]

[jagged badge]

HALLY BOOOO

[eager trout]

Is there a lore reason why Lord Shaxx is allowed to keep banned weapons?

[hardy anvil]

who said he was allowed

(I also want to know)

[shadow crypt]

Why are some weapons considered “Banned”?

[ember storm]

who's going to stop him?

[ember storm]

i mean generally speaking the vanguard doesn't permit the use of some

for example, the original thorn would definitely be banned

[dim minnow]

Red Deah is banned too

[ember storm]

there are also others like red death which was, yknow

[dim minnow]

and given its potential relation to it, Crimson as well

[ember storm]

if you cant tell why just by looking at it

[dim minnow]

for an unknown reason, it can kill guardians

seems like Crimson could too

I like how one of Crimson's exotic ornaments is called "Silver Bullet" as if it is a silver bullet for guardians

[shadow crypt]

Interesting

If you kill a Guardians ghost and then you kill the Guardian, the Guardian stays dead right?

They can’t get another ghost or anything like that

[dim minnow]

pretty much

if you want a detailed explanation on all ways to kill a guardian, refer to the pins

there should be a link to a message I composed on the matter

[shadow crypt]

Ah ok

I will check that out

[chrome fog]

I think it’s moreso infamous in its use to kill Guardians? But also I never played D1 and haven’t read the Red Death lore tab

[still kiln]

To be fair we never actually let them complete the process both those times

So we don't really know if either would've worked

[trim grotto]

There's a good chance it wouldn't have. If that Ghost felt the Spark, it'd already have happened.

That said, the body is sequestered and hidden. Neither can reach him now.

[prime anvil]

When did Shaxxs get married??!??!!

Should have been an in game event or something

[trim grotto]

Years ago, when an event called Crimson Days existed. It was 2 v 2 PvP. If you were dedicated enough, you would earn The Vow.

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/entries/the-vow

[prime anvil]

Oh cool

[trim grotto]

Arcite releases the doves. Someone screams. Doves have not been seen in the Last City for a long time.```

[prime anvil]

That’s wild

[trim grotto]

Valentines day PvP event, haha

Good Times

[prime anvil]

lol

[thorny scarab]

Hey wait I thought we turned that worm guy into Whisper of The Worm, so how come we just end up getting it from this random vex place

[thorny scarab]

MARRYING SHAXX?! YES PA-LEASE!

||only mildly joking||

[thorny scarab]

@dim minnow you’re smart (and still awake). Could you help me understand?

[dim minnow]

Xol ended up on Io after we killed him

there were Taken there which served him

[chrome fog]

That’s the thing,

You’re already married to him
(In lore that is; technically not since they haven’t brought back Crimson Days as an activity in forever so you can’t get that bow no more)