📚lore-discussion

[smoky rose]

In general yes

For some niche things no

[fading kiln]

im a very new player so i cant even experience the full lore

[tawdry mauve]

yes

a majority of people are up to date

[tawdry mauve]

of course you can

[fading kiln]

im not ;-; bruhhh

they got rid of red war and forsaken

[ember storm]

you never could unless you decided to buy the first game

[fading kiln]

my tired ass thought your pfp was a dog

[ember storm]

red war and forsaken are honestly pretty light on lore in terms of actual relevant events

[smoky rose]

All of the lore from those expacs is still in the game

[fading kiln]

how and where do i see them?

[smoky rose]

Well if you want a brief overview you can check the top right of the destination menu

[tawdry mauve]

its jonah hex

[smoky rose]

If you want more detailed stuff all of the lore books are still available and unlocked for everyone

In the lore tab of collections

If you don't particularly care I can condense both of those down to a single sentence each though

[tawdry mauve]

my personal favourite is the timeline on ishtar

https://www.ishtar-collective.net/timeline

[fading kiln]

thank you

[smoky rose]

Albino Cabal kicks our ass, traveler kicks his ass, accidentally wakes up the pyramids.

Funny robot man gets shot, we shoot the people who shot him.

[fading kiln]

my favorite activity: waking up pyramids

[tawdry mauve]

the pyramids are if humanity put engine thrusters on high rise buildings and rode them into space

speaking of which yall think the witness's race unanimously agreed on the plan

[jagged badge]

I don’t

I believe Ikora is on to something there and it’s my theory that we exploit this to beat the Witness

Undo the merge/fusion as it were, separate the Witness into weaker parts of its whole

[tawdry mauve]

yeah i think so to

i mean its the only actual way we have a stand

destroy the sum of its parts individual

maybe not person per person but like

a few million at a time

[ember storm]

i doubt that

[tawdry mauve]

so its an even further reflection of the way the neomuna veil thing was handled

i wonder if we are going to learn more from that entire ordeal

[outer dragon]

What if we have to excise the parts that are not supportive of the Witness's plan and have them merge and support us

[tawdry mauve]

or more likely excise the bad parts of it

kill those

bit by bit

[outer dragon]

That is possible too

[meager belfry]

So warlock rifts were like a work in progress during D1?

[outer dragon]

Of course those are interesting ideas so Bungoi wouldn't do that

[tawdry mauve]

or you know

"rift"

the gamemode

one we have in destiny 2

[meager belfry]

I have been absent long enough to not know such a thing

Honestly i didnt even read the title, the only thing that got my interest was that text

[smoky rose]

Ngl

Seems like next season has a lot of head-related things going on

[peak coral]

headbutt exotic helm plz bungo

[smoky rose]

Seasonal weapon perk appears to be Head Rush and one of the perks is called thanatotic tangles

[peak coral]

we need more things like monte cata

[tawdry mauve]

risen 2.0

imagine if they just do psiops again 💀

[grand jungle]

is it true that oryx is stronger then rhulk

[real ingot]

no

[sick yew]

Randal the Vandal beats both anyway

[fiery copper]

Powerscaling is stupid and you should feel morally ashamed for thinking about it (this is a joke but powerscaling is actually dumb imo)

[bronze crag]

Wait warlocks couldn't rift in d1

[meager belfry]

ik, i was just wondering if this hinted to it in d2

[bronze crag]

I didn't know

What else could they do then

I didn't play d1

[meager belfry]

It was just grenade and melee no class ability

[bronze crag]

Damn

[meager belfry]

And stuff like Phoenix dive or heat rises also didnt exist

And only titans had "icarus dash" in d1

[smoky rose]

Warlocks had a self-res super on solar

Which was exactly as broken as it sounds

[smoky rose]

On a specific exotic chest piece yes

And a dev got death threats for saying they weren't bringing it back in D2 earlier this year

[bronze crag]

Jesus Christ

But unnecessary

[peak coral]

pov youre 1 out of the 3 guardians staring at a dead ghost

(an opponent had selfres and you forgot which)

[fast tapir]

me and the boys aiming our snipers at the dead ghosts

[raven glen]

Season 22 coming who yall think gonna be the characters to help us tbh we all know obviously ikora cus eris is basically idk wat happen to her maybe crow could be a part of it i feel like and probably will see many others helping us but eris ofc she disappearing unless she dealing with the witness and everything

Especially ikora was worried of oryx revival. But hey i say let em cook let my man come back to life he wouldn’t be happy about it anyways let the hive cook

Thats the regirock gun, beep boop djsnedjdnsjsjdmsk

[dim minnow]

Ikora and Immaru are both seen in the teaser image for next season

by the way, I also found the spot that teaser was shot in

[raven glen]

I can’t wait to be verbally bullied by a floating ball of light 🙂

[buoyant maple]

trying to understand the lore is so confusing, there is so much

[tawdry mauve]

To be fair once you start reading it

There isnt that much

[little gorge]

a lot is also more important than others

[little gorge]

immaru just gives me major clovis from seraph vibes

[tawdry mauve]

At least clovis was intelligent

Maybe not wise

But definetely intelligent

[little gorge]

i feel even if savathun helps us immaru isn't gonna like it that much

[dim minnow]

Immaru is just a stress ball we aren't allowed to squeeze

AND BOY DO WE REALLY NEED TO TAKE THE LOAD OFF

[little gorge]

the season finale should be us going "wow this witness stuff has really taken a toll on me, i need a stress ball" and squishing immaru

[dim minnow]

I would like Savathun to have a proper sendoff

maybe she leaves our universe

or "the game"

[little gorge]

we all just lost the game

[wind belfry]

after tfs destiny 2 should turn into a dating sim

[rich veldt]

no

[south raven]

Hey why do those light guys on neomona call themself humanity?

Were they humans?

Also I had no idea those were the planets inhabitants till recently

Thought they were just light effects 😂

[daring iris]

imma sound like a tweaker for this but I think the biggest difference between the traveler and the veil are how they operate in time

the traveler is a tool to manipulate the past, the veil manipulates the future

type shit

[south raven]

I’m lost on the lore

[tawdry mauve]

there are humans on neomuna

those light things you see are like their avatars

[south raven]

I just know that the ghost did some bad shit and now the travelers got a hole in it

[tawdry mauve]

they are currently hidden and in simple terms use those avatars to continue day to day activites

even while the city is under siege

[south raven]

Oh

[daring iris]

the traveler isn’t a terraformer at all, it just places its servants (the vex) in the past in order to do its bidding, but once the traveler loses its control of them they go haywire

[south raven]

So are cloud striders just big humans?

Cause they are so tall

I’m jealous 😦

Like 7-8 feet

What would have happened if the player shot his ghost after calus?

Would the main character be dead and no issues left with the traveler?

[daring iris]

I was reading Unveiling and it said some shit about how the Worms and other primordial creatures in destiny’s universe feed off the gradient between what was and what might be

which I took to be synonymous with darkness and light

unveiling is crazy I think theres a lot more to think about with how it describes darkness and light and the final shape

[fiery copper]

iirc their bodies are in pods like the matrix and the glowy dudes are their vrchat models

[fiery copper]

It's actually talking about ahamkara and Wish Magic.

Ahamkara don't eat food.

They eat Change.

[daring iris]

I think it applies to both

maybe

[fiery copper]

The bigger your wish, the more it changes about the universe, and the more they get to chomp on

They also might get extra food from twisting the wording of your wish to be something you absolutely did not want, but I'm not 100 on that.

[daring iris]

but yeah the ahamkara are also an insane part of the lore I think theyre gonna be a big part of like whats revealed at the end of the final shape

[south raven]

Sounds like a mark Zuckerberg dystopian society neomona

[fiery copper]

It also re relates to the anthem anatheme, which is just the "O _____ mine" thing riven says a lot

[south raven]

But I guess what is there to do when you got two armys invading your planet 🤷‍♂️

[daring iris]

im lowkey hype I think the final shape is going to be like the marathon infinity of the destiny universe I know bungie has writers that love to fuck with time and causality and stuff

[south raven]

Just vr chat irl

[daring iris]

yeah

[fiery copper]

Ahamkara use it to "define" the universe to more easily quantify how much changes.

[daring iris]

interesting

perhaps the ahamkara are born out of the intersection of past and present (light and dark) like the awoken

I also like how the distributary seems to exist “out of time” as in their society evolved for thousands upon thousands of years before any of them returned to earth

I think the vex’ creation by the traveler is supported by their obsession with causality, they’re the soldiers of a paracausal entity made for the purpose of fighting/working in a universe of cause and effect

whereas the traveler and veil are like some alpha and omega type shit

[ember storm]

there’s a few sources that cite the ahamkara as originating in the garden

there’s actually somewhat of a parallel to the worms, both having access to the anthem anatheme as well as feeding off of the non-physical for sustenance

[buoyant maple]

What is or what are the Hive?

Are those Savathuns goons

[sick yew]

The Hive are an alien race

Like the Cabal, the Eliksni, The Witness, Tormentors etc.

[buoyant maple]

Are they just the culmination of those races or are they their own race?

[velvet flax]

There many different Sects of Hive that follow different leaders

[velvet flax]

Own race

You can find Hive in The Cosmodrome, Moon and Throne World

[buoyant maple]

Interesting

[tawdry mauve]

so the hive used to be called the krill

technically a different race all together

[buoyant maple]

What are all the enemy races? I think I only know of the cabal, vex, taken, the hive and the eliksni

[tawdry mauve]

scorn

[trim grotto]

The Hive? The Hive are a multi-billion year old species who exist to sharpen the universe on their sword - aka, kill everything. If it dies, it does not deserve to exist. Oryx, Savathun, and Xivu Arath are siblings, and were the original Hive to become what they are today.

They gain power through slaughter and death by feeding the tribute of death to the Worm Parasites within them, and exist in a pyramid-scheme of death tribute that fuels those more powerful than them, eventually reading the Hive Gods. Oryx, now dead, Savathun (who exorcised her Worm but was later resurrected by a Ghost), and Xivu Arath, who is still active and bloodthirsty.

[velvet flax]

There's also the Scorn (what Josmo said) who are zombified Eliksni basically

[trim grotto]

Literally, even.

[buoyant maple]

Where's Xivu Arath? Never heard of them before I don't think

[trim grotto]

She's sort of been the antagonist of this entire season.

[tawdry mauve]

so oryx, xivu and savathun before they became the hive gods we know today

they were actually 3 krill sisters

[trim grotto]

We haven't seen her physically, but she's in the system at the moment.

[tawdry mauve]

and the krill at the time were weak

and basically destined to perish

[velvet flax]

Xivus on the Dreadnaught rn (but we don't know that)

[trim grotto]

Well, at one point, at least.

[buoyant maple]

Can you explain what she was trying to do this season? I only remember the whale race being a victim of the witness and then Asha mind controlling Sloane through coral lol

[velvet flax]

The last lore entry of the seasonal book takes place at the end of the season with her on it

[trim grotto]

Trying to kill Sloane, us, and Ahsa.

Especially Ahsa.

Alright, let's provide some context

The three Hive siblings, Xivu, Oryx, and Sav, were once mortal beings on a planet known as Fundament. Short-lived creatures surviving on a deadly gas giant ocean world, fighting with other kingdoms and the fauna of the world itself.
Eventually, after the king went mad from a worm familiar that had washed up on their shores, and the being known as Taox (who raised the siblings) betrayed their kingdom, the sisters fled.

Savathun, then known as Sathona, had brought her father's Worm familiar with her, and it told her to bring her sisters (Oryx and Xivu Arath, then known as Aurash and Xi Ro), find a ship, and dive deep, deep into the planet's oceans. And so they did.

Eventually, they found a massive creature known as the Leviathan, who warned them about the danger that laid below. They disregarded its warning, and dived ever-deeper.

Eventually... they found the Worm Gods.

[buoyant maple]

Scary

Is that where Ahsa resides and where Sloane was chilling, in the oceans of that planet?

[trim grotto]

No, but I'll get to that.

The Worm Gods provided the sisters with a deal. Immortality, power, purpose, revenge. In return, they had to ingest a Worm Parasite, free the Worm Gods, and take their blades to the universe as the Sword Logic dictated. (Sword Logic is, tl;dr, sort of like Might Makes Right. Only that which deserves to live may live. You deserve to live by not dying. You die, you are unworthy.)

The siblings accepted, and took new forms. Sathona became Savathûn, Witch-Queen of Lies. Aurash became Auryx when taking the King Morph (and became male). Later in life, after learning to Take, he became known as Oryx, the Taken King. And Xi Ro became Xivu Arath, Hive God of War.

The siblings returned to the surface, recruited their species, warred with others, left the world, and began their war upon the universe itself. The Leviathan died, the Worm Gods were freed, and the Hive truly began.

As for why this is relevant?

Before the Worm Gods became the Worm Gods, they were something different. We're referring to them as Proto-Worms. This is what Ahsa is.
The Proto-Worms, however, were offered temptation by the Darkness. Many took it, were forever changed, corrupted, and much battle was had between them.
Ahsa, the last remaining Proto-Worm, fled Fundament.

For billions of years, the other Worm Gods and Hive seeked her death. And now, we found her on Titan, one of Saturn's moons.

[buoyant maple]

I see

So Xivu is a essentially a vessel doing the Worm Gods work?

To kill Ahsa

[trim grotto]

Well, not exactly.

The Hive Siblings became gods in their own rights, amassing enough power to manipulate reality itself. Auryx became Oryx by battling Akka, The Worm of Secrets, and slaying it. From it, he learned how to commune with the Darkness, and thus learned to Take, becoming Oryx.
He then used Akka's corpse to create the Dreadnaught.

The Hive, then, are not devout to the Worm Gods, though the Worm Gods still receive some Tribute.

No, Xivu hunts for Ahsa, because Asha is heresy incarnate to Xivu.

In her words...
THE COWARD FLESH BRANDISHES NO BLADE, NO LOGIC, TREASON INCARNATE!

[heavy vortex]

I’m curious to know how a proto worm is able to travel to a whole different galaxy / planet

[trim grotto]

By "diving" into the Ascendant Plane and "swimming".

Somehow.

[heavy vortex]

Oh, like Lane lines, but 1000 times bigger

[buoyant maple]

Magical space logic lol

[trim grotto]

We're pretty sure Ley Lines are involved with that somehow yeah

That is a hypothetical use to them, as per Mara Sov.

In fact, that's exactly what we stopped Xivu from doing with them back in Season of the Lost.

[heavy vortex]

Yeah I know, you’re speaking to a certified Realmwalker smh my head.

[trim grotto]

can't believe i just condensed an entire chapter of the Books of Sorrow and Deep lore into a few paragraphs

but that did skip over, like, a lot of stuff

[heavy vortex]

This just reminds me of that cursed traveler lore thumbnail

Y’know which one I’m talking about

[trim grotto]

oh

oh god that

why did you remind me of that it was buried deep in my mind

[heavy vortex]

You started it

[trim grotto]

[buoyant maple]

I need to read the lore in game but I'm still missing quite a few tablets lol

[trim grotto]

Tablets?

[buoyant maple]

Pages

[trim grotto]

Ah, that.

[buoyant maple]

In the lore section in collections

[trim grotto]

In that case, welcome...

https://www.ishtar-collective.net

To the Ishtar Collective

[buoyant maple]

Does this have the entire lore of the game lol

And can I read it in order of the timeline

[trim grotto]

Everything in the API, yes. So very nearly.

[trim grotto]

Well, it doesn't really work like that, per se.
Dyno has created a Timeline, but there's so much new lore that expands upon old lore, that it's really not something you can read reliably if you're simply going by release.

And if you're only looking at the timeline, then you're not looking at all of the lore that doesn't fit into specific timeframes (or is relevant to the timeline)

Generally, one reads by topic or relevance.

[buoyant maple]

I see

[trim grotto]

There's a lot of lore.

[buoyant maple]

Just about to go on YouTube and watch a 10 hour lore video lmao

[heavy vortex]

That 10 hour lore video will become outdated the second a new season launches

[trim grotto]

however that does exist

byf has made a... four? hour long video that covers lore up to... Shadowkeep. and is also now easily outdated.

and even then it left out a lot of stuff and skipped over even more

[heavy vortex]

Man, Shadowkeep. That was 4 years ago.

[trim grotto]

yeah exactly haha

[buoyant maple]

Wish they kept forsaken and red war campaign content

[trim grotto]

i ought to follow up on that "Lore For Dummies" idea i had for a video haha

[buoyant maple]

Do it lol

[trim grotto]

We all do, but sacrifices must be made for engine updates. Destiny's an old game.

So old content had to be cut so that they didn't have to recode and remake literally everything

A lot of people forget that engine updates were the main reason for Vaulting in BL

[heavy vortex]

And some of the codes were also in possession of Visceral

[buoyant maple]

Hopefully they don't vault any other campaigns

[heavy vortex]

Example being warmind and majority of forsaken

[trim grotto]

They already said they won't

Same with locations

[heavy vortex]

Vaulting was discontinued right before WQ came out

[trim grotto]

Seasonal content being an exception

[buoyant maple]

Ah okay

[heavy vortex]

The only thing that gets removed are the annual seasons when a new expansion comes out

[buoyant maple]

Bring back forsaken lol

I wish to start at the beginning

[heavy vortex]

Forsaken was great but the campaign was boring

Like, very boring and repetitive. People seem to forget that the campaigns were shit before WQ came out

[jagged badge]

Hey, what a coincidink we’re talking about the same thing across two different channels

[buoyant maple]

I only played beyond light, I thought it was just okay, very confused as to what was exactly happening lol

I think the whole story with exo stranger, ana and the Clovis's are pretty cool but I don't understand a single bit of it lol

[heavy vortex]

Beyond light’s campaign was okay, Bungie started to actually put effort into their campaigns with WQ. Forsaken’s campaign literally consists of you doing adventures (yes, adventures) where you’d kill the barons and then head over to the watch tower to kill a large meatball

That’s it

[jagged badge]

Yeah the actual structure of the WQ and Lightfall campaign missions is so much better

[buoyant maple]

and then watch cayde die only for him to return in tfs lol

[heavy vortex]

It’s unfortunate that Lightfall’s missions are just very mediocre to me

[jagged badge]

Fair enough

[heavy vortex]

But the structure of them is way better than anything before Y5

[jagged badge]

I get that

[buoyant maple]

Yeah I hear a lot of criticism for lightfalls campaign

People say it's terrible

[heavy vortex]

It’s not that great compared to its predecessor and the other stuff that was added in Lf

[jagged badge]

Personally I’ve genuinely been a Lightfall lover since day 1. I have some criticisms, but overall I found it fun

[buoyant maple]

It looks pretty cool

[jagged badge]

I understand why people don’t like it, but I do wish people were nicer about accepting different people’s opinions on it

[heavy vortex]

I’m not going to treat my opinion like it is a fact, but it certainly was a big critic for the large majority of the people. If you like those 70/80s type of superhero training movies you’d definitely enjoy LF

It had some good moments I guess, just felt a little disappointing for me. For an expansion that is the turning point of us losing it certainly didn’t take itself seriously

[buoyant maple]

Yeah there's a lot of toxic folks out there, let people enjoy what they enjoy and to each their own

[buoyant maple]

Yeah that remind me a lot of people said the same thing, with it not taking itself seriously, especially nimbus lol

[heavy vortex]

Pretty much everything about Nimbus irritates me, except for the Black Garden quest

The last thing I wanted in a somewhat serious setting was a half baked comedy character that is somehow worse than vanilla Cayde

[smoky rose]

My problem with it is that bungie didn’t set the stakes

They dropped that info 4 1/2 months after the campaign

Like the ending was good but at the time you just had no idea what was happening

[empty fern]

Still can’t get over how these are the same people, why did light affect hive like that

[wind belfry]

major glow down

[empty fern]

Indeed

[slim elk]

Sum of the problem with Lightfall:They chose the absolute worst tone for a story where we lose

Even ignoring key points where you think would make sense
(Shadow Legion bombing the Cloudark reactor building in a big escape sequence)

..
Think would have some impact on the Cloudark but.. it didn't

[pearl basin]

acc to our nomal irl timeline , destinys story is about 10 years long ( including FS )

we got ressurected , did all the shit , and then fs happens next year

but in destiny's timelines , how old are we ?

how old is the gaurdians story leading up to fs ?

like are just a 10 year old gaurdian ?

[slim elk]

Pretty much yeah

It seems that destiny's story has progressed in "real time"

[smoky rose]

Give or take a little

Like canonically the Red War was months

[slim elk]

Puts into perspective just why the Player Guardian is such a big deal

[smoky rose]

I'd say we are between 11-13 accounting for stuff like that

But everything does canonically happen on tuesday

[slim elk]

Under 5 years old and we started slaughtering a pantheon

With luck, we will do a total elimination of the Hive God's with Xivu

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=He6CO2osqnU&pp=ygUcZGVzdGlueSAyIGV4Y3VzZSBtZSByZWFjdGlvbg%3D%3D

This cutscene puts it best

[pearl basin]

that we did ALL of that in such a ahort amount of time ?

[slim elk]

Yep

[pearl basin]

damn

[slim elk]

Don't let the way Bungie treats the Player Guardian fool you.
We ever decided to assert ourselves, we would get an entire army of guardians behind us pretty much instantly. Including the Big names like Saint or Saladin

[pearl basin]

hmm

[tawdry wigeon]

Hey lore wise what do y'all think follows after the darkness saga?

Vex right?

[ember storm]

Vex, Clovis, the factions, the nine, aphelions

anything really

[empty fern]

The darkness again

[ember storm]

the veil gets up

[slim elk]

It'll be cleanup of loose ends honestly

[ember storm]

“where’s my man oryx”

[slim elk]

Hive God's all dead or defected, means will go into big chaos as they all Duke it out for leadership

No consistent power bloc, but will be a pain till every one of them is dead

Just as example

[tawdry wigeon]

Oh lord theres a ton i cant wait to see

[slim elk]

Lore terms: We finally go beyond Sol and see the universe at large

[tawdry wigeon]

Whats the aphelions btw?

[mystic fern]

Just with our base Light powers, are we stronger than Zavala and Ikora?

Cause I’d assume we’re definitely stronger including our Darkness powers

[jagged badge]

They have centuries of experience and practice on us

Like, the Young Wolf is most assuredly a prodigy with how fast we’ve picked up multiple subclasses, but that doesn’t mean we are masters with them and it doesn’t mean we are instantly on the level of these Guardians who have lived, fought and died for centuries

[velvet flax]

Ikora can cast back to back supers and we cant

We are better in terms of variety probably but in terms of depth of each subclass probably not

[tawdry wigeon]

Isnt osiris the strongest warlock?

[empty fern]

Used to be yea, now it s ikora or something

[tawdry wigeon]

I see i see

Locks are still not united like hunters and titans correct?

[ember storm]

what makes you say that

[tawdry wigeon]

Me? Well i believe its said before that they are not like the other classes and are in conflict or something idk

[ember storm]

I’ve never heard anything like that

[tawdry wigeon]

Really? Nvm then i must have heard wrong

[ember storm]

it was even a thing for a while that the hunters were all just scattered and barely ever visited the tower due to Cayde’s death

[fiery copper]

Not just due to caydes death

They didn't wanna get stuck with vanguard by default

Speaking of

I would LOVE a vanguard vs drifter quest but instead it's a hunter vanguard election

Crow, Ana, Eris, and a 4th option I just had in my head but now I can't remember

[velvet flax]

Honestly I see it between Ana and Crow

And Ana doesn't want it

[tawdry wigeon]

Ahhh yea it was the hunters

[velvet flax]

Even though I think Ana would be better

[tawdry wigeon]

My bad waltz

[fiery copper]

I mean what else is she gonna spend her free time on now

[velvet flax]

[tawdry wigeon]

The sister of ana, the girl in mars, is she a titan?

[ember storm]

what

Ana’s sister is Elsie Bray

[tawdry wigeon]

Oh shit

[ember storm]

The exo stranger

on Europa

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea

Confused them

Yeyeyeye

[rich veldt]

zavala knows not to even try offer ana vanguard

[ember storm]

what exactly about her says “Titan” to you

[tawdry wigeon]

Idk

I thought she had like beefy armor in europa but im way far off

Both are hunters

[ember storm]

she’s not even a guardian in the first place

[velvet flax]

Elsie isn't a lightbearer

[tawdry wigeon]

No?

[velvet flax]

No

[tawdry wigeon]

Im mad confused.

[rich veldt]

elsie isnt even a lightbearer she has no class

[ember storm]

what is there to be confused about

[tawdry wigeon]

Idk nvm

I thought her lil qs fish was a ghost in my dumbahh

[ember storm]

that's a poulka

[tawdry wigeon]

I forgot her pet

[ember storm]

they're from neptune

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea a poulka

Ik

[jagged badge]

“Elsie has no class” how rude

I’m sure she has class in spades

[ember storm]

she hoards toilet paper

[jagged badge]

Pouka. No l

[ember storm]

do you know how inconsiderate it is to variks

[fiery copper]

She looks like she smells

[jagged badge]

She does?

[fiery copper]

Waltz and polka, name a more iconic duo

[fiery copper]

She looks like she absolutely reeks imo

[ember storm]

misspelling the thing i misspelled

no class

[jagged badge]

I won’t pretend to understand how you’ve reached this conclusion about a robot tbh

[fiery copper]

Ermm actually I play warlock? So actually your wrong sweaty 💅

[mystic fern]

But their feats are a shadow of ours aren’t they?

[mystic fern]

And that’s just in terms of balanced gameplay right

Im sure lore-wise we probably could

[rich veldt]

i mean no ones as good as cheesing as we are

[jagged badge]

I mean, we’ve been involved in more current events. But they aren’t typically evidence of our raw strength or anything

Take Oryx

We beat an incredibly weakened Oryx with the Corrupted Light he’d stockpiled or whatever

That’s a feat, certainly, but that does not make us necessarily stronger than other characters

Not to mention there were 6 Guardians there

[mystic fern]

So if someone like Zavala, Ikora, or Saint were in our shoes for the whole ride, they would’ve been able to accomplish all the same things?

[jagged badge]

Probably

There’s a reason why Zavala and Ikora aren’t in our place though. One reason of course being “it’s a video game”. Second reason being, they’re the Vanguard. You don’t typically send your commanders and leaders onto the front lines where they might be lost

[mystic fern]

That makes sense

Im just so used to seeing them on the sideline that I forget how powerful they are too

[jagged badge]

Fair

It’s a shame that gameplay can’t properly display how skilled and powerful these characters are

I’d love to get a TV show that could give us some amazingly choreographed Guardian fight scenes

[mystic fern]

Aren’t we getting one in a few years

[jagged badge]

[rich veldt]

rumours keep getting thrown around

if they did one would have to be animated to do characters justice imo

[jagged badge]

Yeah, as kinda interesting as it would be to see the Destiny universe portrayed in live action, it’d be so limiting

[rich veldt]

all the enemies and abilities would be so limited in live action

[jagged badge]

Exos could end up looking dodgy if done wrong too

Overall, big risk unless they had an immense budget and very talented people working on it

[ember storm]

the live action trailers really don't make me feel confident about it

[jagged badge]

There’s definitely a reason those trailers used all human Guardians lmao

[velvet flax]

Live action trailer 💀

[ember storm]

i've said it before, just make it something a-la love death + robots or that one star wars series

[velvet flax]

The live action cayde oh dear

Why has his face so... compressed

[jagged badge]

That live action trailer for D1 was one of the coolest things to child me though

[ember storm]

destiny has a really big universe i'd honestly not really like a series confined to one specific thing

i want a bunch of different characters across a bunch of different timeframes

[velvet flax]

Yeah 1-2 episodes per thing

[jagged badge]

Something I’d really love about a TV show is if it exposed more people to the IP and the world of Destiny

I want more people to appreciate it, because Destiny has so much cool things about the story, world, characters and lore

[velvet flax]

Yeah me too

[little gorge]

never before have i thought about the face of live action cayde

but you're right

[mystic fern]

They look pretty nice but all the exos looked so scuffed

I still have the original disc of the game with the live action guardians on the cover

[tawdry wigeon]

Between the 3 siblings which one is the strongest?

[real ingot]

Depends on the time

[tawdry wigeon]

Cuz we've heard that oryx and sav killed each other so many times but personally i have seen that type of interaction with either the two siblings against xivu

[real ingot]

They all killed each other many times

[velvet flax]

Also depends on how you define strength

Mentally savathun but in terms of power she is the weakest

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea true each one is powerful in their own way

In terms of physical strength

[real ingot]

Also keep in mind Xivu is constantly getting stronger

[velvet flax]

^

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea that

So

[velvet flax]

Any act of war empowers her

[tawdry wigeon]

Could xivu be the next chapter after fs?

[velvet flax]

Probably

Alongside the Vex I imagine

[tawdry wigeon]

Oh she is that big dang

[velvet flax]

Not working together ofc

[real ingot]

I’m waiting to see what’ll happen with Xivu

[tawdry wigeon]

Yeye fighting both at the same time ik season and dlc

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea same cuz we have the deep dives and she is being mentioned as someone extremely powerful

I imagine she is the strongest between the 3?

[velvet flax]

I mean Xivu and the Vex being separate post final shape antagonists

[velvet flax]

Oryxs true strength is hard to pin down

Because by the time we meet him face to face the first time we had killed Crota who provided a massive amount of strength and tribute

[real ingot]

And before we went up against Oryx we eliminated most of his court

[velvet flax]

And the second time his whole Court was in tatters and even if he won that battle he would've died anyway to his Worm

[tawdry wigeon]

Crota is being mentioned and a raid is possibly coming

Whats up with that?

[velvet flax]

Crota is Oryxs son with D1

[tawdry wigeon]

Sooooo yea his strength is not easy to determine

[velvet flax]

We kill him in the D1 raid Crota's End

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea i know that

[velvet flax]

There's speculation the returning raid next season is Crotas End

[real ingot]

Crota was one of Oryx’s 3/4 children

[tawdry wigeon]

And the strongest one i imagine?

[velvet flax]

If it does return its non-canonical in D2

[real ingot]

Alongside Nokris and the Ir twins who started as one

[velvet flax]

Physically yes

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea like kings fall

[velvet flax]

Mentally God no

[real ingot]

Physically

[velvet flax]

Mentally Crota was stupid

[tawdry wigeon]

Oh so the musclehead

[real ingot]

Crota got shoved into a Vex portal and told “come back a champion or not at all”

[velvet flax]

He almost got the whole Court of Oryx destroyed

Thanks to Savathun bamboozling him

Nokris was the 'nerd' child

[real ingot]

Also do we have a name for Oryx’s firstborn or just his daughters?

[velvet flax]

But was excommunicated for practicing necromancy which to the Hive was forbidden

[velvet flax]

???

[tawdry wigeon]

Wait nokris. Wasnt he a wizard?

[velvet flax]

Yes

[real ingot]

Haluk and Anuk were born as 1 being

[velvet flax]

Oh

[real ingot]

Oryx split them into two

[tawdry wigeon]

The dude from the strike in old mars underground

[velvet flax]

That was a larvae

Idk if it had a name

[real ingot]

Likely didn’t

But yeah

Crota was physically extremely strong

[velvet flax]

But mentally moronic

[real ingot]

Anuk and Halak were amazing in terms of magic

Creators of the oversoul

[velvet flax]

Ir Halak and Ir Anuk were just there for the funnis

[real ingot]

And they piloted the Dreadnaught pretty sure

[velvet flax]

Yes

[real ingot]

Nokris was the femboy son

[velvet flax]

They allowed it to jump between worlds

[tawdry wigeon]

So oryx had very potent kids. What about savathuns and xivus kids? I remember being one that was straight up dogshiih

Idr which one

[velvet flax]

Savathun has 2 daughters and a son

[real ingot]

Dul Incaru and Malok for Savathun plus one more

[velvet flax]

Dul Incaru, Malok and Balwur

[real ingot]

Keep forgetting Balwur

[velvet flax]

Malok was sent to Oryx

Dul Incaru was caught in a time loop in the Dreaming City

And Balwur was sent to exist in Oryxs court

And Xivu's children 💀

Xivu has a lot

[real ingot]

Also another note of Oryx’s children Alak-Hul was his adopted son

Who tried to overthrow him

[velvet flax]

Half of Xivus children are Taken Knights or Wizards

And then theres a few others

[tawdry wigeon]

So savath kids were done for fast i see

Oh i see yea makes sense xivu has taken kids

[velvet flax]

Dul Incaru lasted the longest and is technically still around due to the Dreaming City time loop

[tawdry wigeon]

So he is still there?

Bro is unlucky

[velvet flax]

She

But yes

[tawdry wigeon]

She oop

Sorry lmao i cant determine genders

[velvet flax]

It's ok Hive names are... ambiguous at times

It's hard to tell a masculine from a feminine name

[tawdry wigeon]

So oryx has the most potent kids except if xivus kids were as strong or even stronger

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea exactly

[velvet flax]

If you don't know what type of Hive unit they are

Oryx actually cared for (most) of his children, he was a good father by Hive standards

Savathuns children were just pawns in her schemes

[real ingot]

Except for Nokris

[velvet flax]

And Xivus are just chattel

[tawdry wigeon]

Lmao

[velvet flax]

Powerscaling isn't easy in the destiny universe

[tawdry wigeon]

Are there any hive stronger than these three?

[tawdry wigeon]

Yeaaa i know unfortunately

[velvet flax]

If you count the Worm Gods but even that is very questionable

As Oryx killed Akka

[real ingot]

Considering Oryx killed Akka

[velvet flax]

We killed Xol

[real ingot]

Xol was a strike boss

[velvet flax]

'Killed' lmao

Leaving Eir, Ur and Yul

Who are doing who knows what

[real ingot]

My theory

Xivu is learning to ride them into battle

[velvet flax]

💀

[real ingot]

The rule of cool

[tawdry wigeon]

So the worm gods arent that special then?

[velvet flax]

They're all bark

They're subservient to The Witness

I still think Rhulk is the most powerful entity we have killed thinking about it

[tawdry wigeon]

Exactly yea

[real ingot]

Rhulk or Nezarec

[velvet flax]

I'd say Rhulk > Nezarec

[tawdry wigeon]

And then the witness if we actually beat the shit out of him

[real ingot]

Hard to factor Nezzy is the thing

[velvet flax]

Since Rhulk gave Nezarec his Disciple-ship

[real ingot]

Since we fought him right after he was reborn

[tawdry wigeon]

No witness first my b

[real ingot]

Though I feel Nezarec has to be pretty powerful if he was trusted with the Veil

[velvet flax]

Yeah

Rhulk was too busy babysitting Savathun

[tawdry wigeon]

We know of four disciples right?

[velvet flax]

And obviously was not doing his job

[real ingot]

Mhm

[velvet flax]

4 yes

Plus 1 who was in training and

2 'assets'

[real ingot]

Unnamed, Nezarec, Calus, Rhulk

[tawdry wigeon]

Rhulk nez calus and the one we dont know about

Yea

[real ingot]

Though Calus seems to have been more of a backup plan incase we didn’t join

[tawdry wigeon]

We could be fighting them soon lmao omg imagine

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea true

So

With the we are your salvation part we were meant to be a disciple

[velvet flax]

I hope we meet the unnamed Disciple next season and they're an antagonists for the next seasons and a raid boss for the final shape

But it won't happen lmao

[tawdry wigeon]

Yes same here

[real ingot]

Calus’ biggest strength was his army

Otherwise

Not much

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea and these stupid ass tormentors

Ffs

[velvet flax]

What Tormenters are is up for debate

[real ingot]

Tormentors are a replication of Nezarec it seems

Very

Disfigured

[velvet flax]

It's just that Xivu had one

[real ingot]

But that’s the closest thing I can get to

[velvet flax]

Which kills off the Calus cloning tech theory

Or bungie is inconsistent

[real ingot]

Calus was likely giving them to the witness

[tawdry wigeon]

Xivu has a tormentor?...

Oh no

[real ingot]

Wicked Implement

[tawdry wigeon]

I thought fs would be the end of them.....

Fuck

[velvet flax]

Omen, Blade of the Black Terrace

Why do i remember all the named Tormenter names lmao

Kavauust, Toniq, Vereziia, Omen

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea what hahaha ive never heard of their existence

[real ingot]

Based off everything I’d say Calus clones are the explanation of the tormentors

Gifted to the Witness

[velvet flax]

Probably but then Omen's existence goes against that but it could be a bungie funny

[real ingot]

Witness therefore gives Xivu access to these things

[real ingot]

In what way?

[tawdry wigeon]

So torms are not from the witness?

But hive dark shit?

[real ingot]

Give us a minute

[tawdry wigeon]

Sure

[velvet flax]

Wicked Implement takes place in the Titan Pyramid I believe and from how it's described the arena and the Tormenter have been there for a while

[real ingot]

Depends how long Calus has been at his experiments I’d say

[tawdry wigeon]

Titan pyramid? Mars?

[velvet flax]

Also Osiris saying 'it's the result of an unholy alliance' of the Witness and Calus is stupid since this is the first time he's seen one so how can he know its a clone nezarec since no one about knew nezarec was relevant at this point

[real ingot]

Keep in mind the Witness had Nezarec’s head for a while

Back in haunted

[velvet flax]

Yeah it can work but Osiris' dialogue doesn't

[ember storm]

what unnamed disciple"?

[real ingot]

Inspiral

[velvet flax]

From the Root of Nightmares lore book

Yeah Inspiral

Specifically 'The Cave' entry

[real ingot]

Inspiral made me question my reading ability

[velvet flax]

And we know it's a different Disciple since they refer to Rhulk and Nezarec in it

[ember storm]

the best lore books always do

[real ingot]

“Am I reading that right? Wait I did it’s just fucking weird”

[fiery copper]

Osiris calls them fusions of cabal cloning and pyramid technology so I personally believe they're clones of Nezquik

[fiery copper]

Theyre explicitly stated to be the products of cabal stuff as well as darkness

[fiery copper]

I was wrong, they don't bring up cloning

But yeah it is cabal related, and implied that they are possible BECAUSE of calus' alliance with the witness.

[smoky rose]

Something similar to them existed during the collapse

[wind belfry]

Bo wonder humanity fell

Tormentors are scary af

[smoky rose]

most of Humanity getting fucked up was gravity weapons and environmental manipulation

Titan was stretched into an egg by a pyramid gravity weapon and then released causing a massive earthquake and tidal wave that wiped out a large portion of the arcology

Earthquakes, volcanoes, disease, tsunamis etc

[wind belfry]

scary

[tawdry wigeon]

Quick question abt the titan that went into the portal

If he died how will we do it?

Like you seem to go through crazy mental pain and then you get crushed

[cyan monolith]

Apparently savathun knows

so i guess we are gonna get her to tell us how

[tawdry wigeon]

Ohhh right right savathun will be revived

[cyan monolith]

Im assuming shes gonna like dip after we get her to tell us

And shes gonna go cause mayhem

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea thats what I expect too

Or

She speaks with asha

And idk something happens?

[cyan monolith]

Maybe not

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea unlikely

Hmm

[cyan monolith]

Shes has a ghost now

hmm

[tawdry wigeon]

She probably sees the shit sol goes through currently and maybe she'll be nice

I really dk

Oh shit idea

Sav doesn't know that shes been deceived by the witness right?

[smoky rose]

She does

[tawdry wigeon]

Or now she knows?

[smoky rose]

That's how we beat her

[tawdry wigeon]

She does exactly

We get her to our side

[smoky rose]

I believe bungie narrative leads confirmed she wasn't an ally per se

[tawdry wigeon]

Ally to him?

No i dont think so

She did her own thing

[smoky rose]

This is what I am talking about

Not a friend

But an enemy of my enemy type thing

More of a "Xivu is about to do (REDACTED) to you, and if you don't help us none of this matters anyways" type thing

[tawdry wigeon]

Yea yea exactly

Btw what could happen if xivu reached her peak?

[cyan monolith]

death

Probably

[smoky rose]

There is no peak

What needs to be understood is that Xivu is in an endless death loop

She has to keep waging war

And as she does the need for war increases

So to give an example, if we dropped a fat nova bomb onto her entire army it would give her a massive power spike but her hunger for war would also spike and the army needed to give her that sustenance is now gone

That's part of the genius of the Hive from the Witness' pov

[cyan monolith]

if we dont fight at all we die

[smoky rose]

They are death machines that self-destruct when there is nothing else to destroy

[cyan monolith]

but if we do fight she gets more power

[smoky rose]

This

It has been proven in lore that killing them really hard is highly effective

[cyan monolith]

Considering guardians are literally killing machines

Just tell them that xivu drops a new gun and boom

Dead

[smoky rose]

The reason we can't kill them really hard in Seraph for example is because they staged in the AP over earth, so a power spike would cause tens of thousands of hive to drop directly onto the last city

[cyan monolith]

Ap?

[smoky rose]

Ascendant Plane

[cyan monolith]

Ohhh

I gotchu

Are there big shields in d2

i forget

Like city size

[smoky rose]

The Ecumene for example literally just completely overkilled the hive and it nearly wiped them out

[cyan monolith]

That we could just throw over the last city

[smoky rose]

Like using a nuke on an ant

Every time the hive popped up they got completely overkilled and sent back to their throne worlds

And they were dying

Quickly

[cyan monolith]

Ecumene? (Sorry im not educated on alot of lore)

[smoky rose]

Okay so the Ecumene is a civilization that the hive (spoilers) eventually managed to overcome and kill

Wiped out

But as I said the hive were getting absolutely browbeat and were on the verge of death

[cyan monolith]

Would you say the best way to take out the hive is to kill them on the throne world itself

[smoky rose]

Yes, that's a permakill

The Ecumene didn't (to our knowledge) have any concept of throne worlds

So the hive gods would pop up, get absolutely fucking obliterated, and then pop up again somewhere else

Rinse and repeat

[cyan monolith]

Yeah but with us its more fair

Since we can just respawn

[smoky rose]

Just to clarify the Ecumene were winning, really hard

[cyan monolith]

Aslong as our ghost isnt put out of commission

[smoky rose]

Like Oryx Sav and Xivu were about to just die due to lack of sustenance

Then they all got together, oryx killed xivu and sav and then went and killed a worm god and then used the power from that to commune with the witness who taught oryx how to take

So how did xivu and sav come back

Well the Ecumene couldn't do shit about the Taken

So through massive slaughter Oryx just summoned Xivu back via an act of war

[cyan monolith]

I hate taken

but yeah

How would you summon sav back

Though

[smoky rose]

And then he managed to convince the ecumene govt to hold a meeting with them and then killed them all, which brought back savathun through an act of great deception

[cyan monolith]

Ohh

Makes sense

Is that how we bring back sav

through an act of great deception

[smoky rose]

No she just has a ghost now

Like deadass

We just ring up Immaru and is like "hey you want bug lady's body back"

[jagged badge]

That’s for if they died outside their Throne World

And didn’t have a Ghost

[dim minnow]

Witch's Echo, final room (where Altar of Reflection portal is), center, to the right

[cyan monolith]

Gotchu

[cyan monolith]

Yo bro heres her body brin her back bud

[jagged badge]

Are you doxxing Immaru

[dim minnow]

more so if they died in someone else's throne world

[dim minnow]

yes, I have identified where this cutscene takes place

[jagged badge]

Oh nice

[cyan monolith]

5 bucks if you bring her back without her memories

Wait no

She needs those

[tawdry wigeon]

Jesus Christ thats op. So as long fights are created she will be more op. Now will she be op just from any war or just war with her army?

[trim grotto]

Also that already happened

It's half the point of the campaign really

[dim minnow]

what I'm thinking is that we just kill a shti ton of her own forces

like really cripple her military

what happens is that she gets a lot of power really quickly and also gives her worm one hell of a feast

[tawdry wigeon]

Tbh theres gotta be a limit

To her growth

[dim minnow]

now, it won't be good for us at first

but all we need to do is last long enough for two reasons

[smoky rose]

Nope

[tawdry wigeon]

Theres no way its just infinite powerups

[smoky rose]

It's by design

[trim grotto]

Worm Hunger. As she and it grow in power, it grows ever more hungry.

[smoky rose]

There is no limit

[dim minnow]

1. Her worm's hunger will go up abnormally
2. She alone can't keep up that hunger especially without a lot of her own forces

[smoky rose]

You keep growing in power and hunger until you can't sustain yourself and then you just die

[tawdry wigeon]

Bro what is this destiny powerlevel system

[dim minnow]

exactly

[smoky rose]

This is the design of the hive

[trim grotto]

This is how the Hive have always worked

[dim minnow]

what I'm getting at is that we let her get so large in pwer that she will collapse on her own weight

[smoky rose]

I concur

[tawdry wigeon]

Yes that

The limit

[trim grotto]

If she ever stops earning tribute, stops warring, if we dismantle her tribute system like we did with Oryx? She's done.

[smoky rose]

So long as she has violence to commit she will not stop growing

That's the idea

[dim minnow]

unlike Oryx however, dismantling her tribute system will still give her more power

[tawdry wigeon]

Ohhh so its been a theme for the hive i see

[smoky rose]

We cut off her tribute from her army by killing the army and then she just dies

The Hive are a genius idea on the part of the witness

[trim grotto]

Indeed

[smoky rose]

Killing machines that self-destruct as soon as they stop killing

So there's zero issues

[trim grotto]

Only temporarily

[dim minnow]

yes, at that point, it is only a matter of surviving long enough

[trim grotto]

Objective: Survive

[dim minnow]

but that's not going to be easy

[trim grotto]

Objective: Run Away

[dim minnow]

that ain't viable

we could just keep her distracted

[trim grotto]

Objective: Dance Off

https://tenor.com/view/xflixx-grnd-dance-off-gif-25090758

[slim elk]

Nah
The best way to handle Xivu is hitting her with the Worm Truth

[trim grotto]

Just because you can't dance

[dim minnow]

I wonder if Xivu Arath even cares

liek we show her the truth about the Syzygy and she is just like: "so?"

[slim elk]

She does
She cares deeply about her family. (In the Hive way of course)

[tawdry wigeon]

She does?

Ive never seen her mention her siblings

[slim elk]

So knowing that Savathun "found the truth" and its why she defected in the our of the Witness victory

[slim elk]

Did you not play the Dungeon this season?

Xivu was literally mourning Oryx big time

[tawdry wigeon]

Nah i didnt man

My bad

Ill play it just for that

[slim elk]

It's all the collectible lore bits in there

[dim minnow]

I knwo she cares about her family, but I'm wondering if she cares about the truth behind the syzygy

[tawdry wigeon]

Oh perfect then

[slim elk]

Just assuming seeing your entire world view was based on a lie would be pretty shattering to one's sanity

[jagged badge]

You’ve got the moves Mael

[dim minnow]

https://tenor.com/view/epic-win-gif-18390652

pov: Xivu Arath when we hear her crying about how we killed Oryx and left his throne vacant

[tawdry wigeon]

Lmao you really like Pratt huh

[slim elk]

Worm truth just seems like the best route Bungie has to handle Xivu anyway. If they keep up the "She will win in a straight fight" bit she has going

Convince her to kill the true enemy she has (her worm)

[dim minnow]

not really, it was just that the dance gif he posted reminded me of this one and I knew I could do something funny iwth it

[tawdry wigeon]

Perfect timing

[tawdry wigeon]

What's the best person i can watch for lore?

[jagged badge]

Me

[tawdry wigeon]

Lmao you have yt or something? I dont wanna take up too much of your time in here

[real ingot]

Byf is decent

though Ishtar is the best source

but that requires reading

and as the saying goes

Destiny players can't read

[arctic iron]

this is true lore

[wind belfry]

byf will dumb it down a little which is perfect for destiny player brain

[rich veldt]

byf will also include dumb theories people take as fact from time to time

[fast tapir]

all people need to do is listen but they can't even read so I'm not expecting them to.

[tawdry wigeon]

Bruh damn y'all know youre destiny players yourselves right?

[rich veldt]

nah half of us just dont wanna leave

[real ingot]

My least favourite part of this game is the community much to no ones surprise

[tawdry wigeon]

Eh i mean you aint wrong

Its annoying when the community is like this

[little gorge]

this is lore chat which is infinitely better than anything destiny related on the internet

[real ingot]

Infitinitely better till we have a guy yelling about how Clovis is stronger than the traveler and starts using MHA terms to prove it

[little gorge]

still

have you seen genchat?

[real ingot]

yes

[little gorge]

or god forbid, dtg?

[real ingot]

I've seen dtgcord

never again

[jagged badge]

I’ve been on DTG for 6 months

[real ingot]

not worth it

[velvet flax]

😔

[outer dragon]

Clovis WANTED(may still want) to replace the Traveler

[fiery copper]

Probably still does given that he got super cautious and retreated to europa in Seraph after we uncovered it

Think about who Clovis is, if he'd changed his mind he'd say something like "The past is dead, we can only look to the future. Variables have changed, and the Traveler is currently valuable to the survival of humanity."

[outer dragon]

The question is do we think Rasputins tech could have actually damaged/destroyed the Traverler

[jagged badge]

Not exactly what happened. Clovis was partitioned. A sort of part of him in the H.E.L.M. and part of him on Europa. When Ana purged the one in the H.E.L.M., it sent an encrypted message back to the version in Europa

[fiery copper]

Yes, rasputin could have harmed the traveler, otherwise he wouldn't have committed sudoku

[jagged badge]

Honestly, not sure. However, the general destruction and risk to the City probably would have been enough to trigger Xivu’s ritual

[fiery copper]

Yeah, and there's a lore tab somewhere that says the message is literally just something like "they know"

[outer dragon]

He unalived because his weapons would have been used as a tool to power up Xivu

[jagged badge]

I don’t see why the Witness would actually have the Traveler destroyed then considering it clearly needed the Traveler in Lightfall

[fiery copper]

He speedran it because the traveler was in danger, though.

iirc he was just planning to go back to sleep for a bit until we sorted out xivu

[jagged badge]

Not just “they know”. It was a full message and those two words were all Ana could decrypt from it

[fiery copper]

But then Eramis forced his hand

[outer dragon]

I wonder if destruction of the Traveler is the Witness's ultimate goal

[fiery copper]

Ahhh that makes more sense

[jagged badge]

Well the Traveler’s dead now so

[fiery copper]

The witness' ultimate goal is "the final shape" and we do not know what exactly that entails. The hive think it's one single entity existing after all others, proving its right to survive.

[fiery copper]

Not quite. iirc according to ghosts, it feels like it did before it woke up at the end of Arrivals.

I could absolutely be 100% wrong about this one though

[jagged badge]

Ghost says he no longer feels the Traveler’s presence at all, and that when he draws on the Light for us, it doesn’t come from the Traveler but instead someplace “deeper”

And that it’s harder to do so now

[fiery copper]

Oh wow that's actually a lot cooler

I like that a lot

[outer dragon]

So not quite like when the Traveler was caged during the Red War?

[jagged badge]

Yeah. In that case, the Light still technically came from the Traveler. Just, it was from the shard

Now the Light comes to us from an unknown source, and every Guardian still has it

Which is intriguing

[wheat latch]

How did eris become the way she is? Like what's her backstory with the hive

And she's Ikora's daughter right

[jagged badge]

No?

[wheat latch]

Huh, idk why I thought that then

[jagged badge]

Eris was part of a fireteam that sought to assassinate Crota after the Great Disaster. However this attempt went horribly wrong, several of her fireteam died and Eris became stranded in the Hellmouth and her Ghost died

She used an Ahamkara bone to wish to know the way out of the depths, but the monkey’s paw was she lost her eyes

So she replaced them with an Acolyte’s

[wheat latch]

Can she actually see fine?

And why is she still so in tune with the hive and stuff

[jagged badge]

I dunno what you mean by “in tune with”. She learned Hive magic for survival and it has continued to be incredibly useful

[jagged badge]

Seemingly yeah

[wheat latch]

Just means having a good understanding of something

[jagged badge]

Well she learned a great deal about the Hive so she could work to be their undoing

[wheat latch]

Doing a bit of googling is says she was part of the hidden and the vanguard's expert on hive lore

[jagged badge]

She is indeed part of the Hidden

[wheat latch]

What exactly was that or was it simply just a group with their main focus on killing crota

[jagged badge]

The Hidden is Ikora’s spy/intelligence group basically. They are involved in investigations, research, scouting and intel gathering and such. Nothing to do with Crota specifically

For example, one member of the Hidden investigated Cayde’s death, even investigating whether we may have been responsible

[wheat latch]

Oh that's cool, how many are left?

[jagged badge]

Loads

[wheat latch]

How would we be responsible?

[jagged badge]

As in, we could have killed him. No one knew what happened down there except what we reported. Aunor had to be certain of every possibility, however remote

Aunor also investigated the Drifter. She ain’t a fan of him

[wheat latch]

Can the crow not recall? I thought he was remembering what he did, or was it just him learning of what he did. Ik Uldren and Crow are completely different people in terms of their actions already

[slim elk]

Savathun gave Crow Uldrens memories back after the fact

It's why Crow is keeping distance from Mara

[wheat latch]

So do we know what actually happened down there from him yet?

[jagged badge]

This was before Crow. Also, no Crow would not have been able to testify for Uldren’s memories anyway

Not until Savathûn restored Uldren’s memories in Season of the Lost

But by that point Aunor’s investigation had been for years

[slim elk]

Not much a story to tell anyway
Player Guardian and Petra later executed all parties involved in Caydes death... for the most part anyway

Fikrul just doesn't stay dead

[wheat latch]

Who dat

[jagged badge]

Fikrul, the Fanatic. First of the Scorn

He is uniquely capable of self-resurrecting

[wheat latch]

But how tho

[slim elk]

Wish dragon bullshit

[jagged badge]

Uldren had come across Fikrul as dying Eliksni. He wished to be able to save Fikrul, and Riven preyed on this wish

Fikrul was restored to life using Darkness to create Dark Ether. From there, Fikrul is able to distribute Dark Ether to resurrect fallen Eliksni as Scorn

[wheat latch]

That's just cheating

[smoky rose]

He physically can't die until we do

[jagged badge]

Hm?

[smoky rose]

iirc he wished to be there at our death

And so now he's immortal until we die

[jagged badge]

Oh? Where’s this? I thought his self-resurrection thing was purely due to him being the first Scorn

[dawn escarp]

Was it an Ahamkara wish though? That would make the number of wishes too high for the lore

[slim elk]

Not sure where that's coming from..
Doesn't make sense either... we die all the time lol

[jagged badge]

Wdym?

[jagged badge]

I mean, the wish would account for intent, and the intent would be “our final death”

[dawn escarp]

We know there were a certain number of wishes made. If Fikrul made a wish that would be +1 to the tally

[slim elk]

You are dealing with the ahahmkara here. They like to twist wishes

[jagged badge]

I mean, yeah, but clearly she didn’t so

[jagged badge]

Where do we know this from?

[smoky rose]

This was the first time we killed him

Can't remember where it was specified that this is why he keeps coming back

But now he just keeps respawning

[dawn escarp]

I don't know the name of the lore book specifically. But the Guardian's wish to kill riven was the 14th wish

[wheat latch]

This is a strike right?

[slim elk]

Never was sure why we never extracted the corpse and dumped it in a crucible map..

[jagged badge]

No, that’s from the final mission of Forsaken’s campaign

It mentions the Watchtower

[slim elk]

Shaxx:Bonus Round! Kill Fikrul for double score Guardians!

We decapitated Taniks and put his head on a wall as a trophy

Savthuns corpse was recovered and Drifter has it in his freezer

(The man has eaten Hive God..)

Why not grab Fikrul and keep him contained via similar..

[dawn escarp]

Pretty sure Fikrul has been MIA since the Glykon

Plus his escape would be a matter of when. Scorn can turn into a cloud of dark ether to move. All he would need to do is find a small hole in his confinement.

[velvet flax]

I think it's The Hollowed Lair strike

[velvet flax]

It was Witch Queen when Mara began cleaning up the Shore, Fikrul fled and hasn't been heard from since

[dawn escarp]

Wasn't Fikrul the Locus of Communion?

[tawdry mauve]

no?

the locus is a completely different scorn

[dawn escarp]

Ok

[tawdry mauve]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LorWoHUs8U8

[velvet flax]

Yeah the Locus was a Scorn named Akriis

[wind belfry]

The dead hunter in presage still creeps me out

wtf happened to him

[smoky rose]

Read the Captain’s Log lore book

I think it’s more effective that way rather than me giving you a tldr

[wind belfry]

ok

[peak coral]

the one at the end got|| go read the lore book||

[echo fjord]

[safe galleon]

is 'saint' saint's ACTUAL name or is it an alias of some kind?

or a former alias i mean. think how banshee's name originated as a title given to him by the exos, that he took on as a proper name

[empty fern]

I think saints name is Saint

[tawdry mauve]

saint is his name

[jagged badge]

Good question tbh

[ember storm]

banshee is really the only exo to have his memory banks sabotaged

every guardian exo's name is programmed into them

their ghost just reads it and tells it to them

i am tired

[jagged badge]

However I don’t believe every Exo chooses to go by their own name

Their are some outlandishly named Exo Guardians and I refuse to believe that’s their honest-to-God name lmao

Well, at least their past live’s honest-to-God name

Whatever name they choose for themselves is what’s most valid for them

[ember storm]

unless they're like Felwinter and don't use a number, then they're still taking from the original that their ghost called them

[safe galleon]

yeah this is more or less why i was asking

because like

who names their kid 'saint'

[ember storm]

i would argue it's still the name he had as a mortal exo

plus saint is a real name for someone to have

[jagged badge]

Saint is apparently an actual name

[ember storm]

given destiny's whole thing with it it doesn't surprise me

people are naming themselves after gods the first king of the franks

[safe galleon]

i have never once heard of anyone called saint as a legal name. im sure it happens, i dont doubt that

[ember storm]

saint is a pretty standard name in comparison

[safe galleon]

ive just never seen it firsthand

[ember storm]

and how many of destiny's other character names have you seen firsthand?

[safe galleon]

elsie, for one

you have a point, but like

most the other names could be explained away with the old 'oh well those are chosen names, since guardians don't have memories when they wake up'

for exos, what they're called is more than likely their legal human name from whenever they last lived a normal-ish life

[ember storm]

not necessarily

[safe galleon]

yes, but more than likely

[ember storm]

i would argue a lot went through with it specifically because they'd practically just be a new person

[safe galleon]

their name is hardwired into them iirc

[jagged badge]

Sure. Doesn’t mean they are obligated to use it

[safe galleon]

unless a bunch of people just did what clovis did when he reset as banshee and chose to overwrite their old name

[jagged badge]

They don’t need to overwrite it, they can just go by a new name