docs-website

[brazen moon]

That last bit

[pliant canopy]

Ah

I just saw it, must've been an oversight

Thanks, will update it

[brazen moon]

0 means 64 look at the rrview

[pliant canopy]

There, fixed

[brazen moon]

you forgot the wither?

[pliant canopy]

💀 fuck

okay before I do another commit, anything else that is still wrong?

[brazen moon]

can't really say rn but go ahead

[pliant canopy]

aight, thanks for making me aware

[viscid thistle]

Yay, previews work: https://feat-blog-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev/

I kinda like it, yeah. Riley says we don't need hero images for things but we can just have this be an optional image that can be manually inserted in a post if needed.

[hard quartz]

for DarkMode looks nice

[viscid thistle]

Yeah there's been pretty much no styling applied yet.

I'm not a designer, I'm just the unpaid intern for Riley 🙂

[hard quartz]

Same here.. im really bad for web things xd

[opal flare]

perfect

[viscid thistle]

[hard quartz]

. XD
In sun mode... The borders in all posts are missing and well cannot see

[pliant canopy]

@drowsy zinc I have gone ahead and documented (I think all?) the remaining commands on the page, does it look good now? https://github.com/PaperMC/docs/pull/652.

[drowsy zinc]

yes

going to wait for any comments, going to merge it tomorrow or so

[pliant canopy]

aight

Then we are going to be down to 5 PRs

Hehe small merge queue

The Paper repo should take an example of us!

[drowsy zinc]

we got it easy

[pliant canopy]

[vocal halo]

Neat

[opal flare]

I like this

[viscid thistle]

We would need cover images for all previous announcements, no?

[opal flare]

cover is optional

[viscid thistle]

Ope I need the avatar logo

[opal flare]

I like

[viscid thistle]

Hmm, why did Cloudflare not pick up the latest commit I just pushed to update the preview?

Oh nvm it just took a minute

It's still going to look wack on light mode, but, https://feat-blog-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev/blog/1-21-7/

[hard quartz]

[viscid thistle]

Nice nice. Just pushed a commit to make it somewhat usable on light mode.

[vocal halo]

I feel like the top line of the box looks a bit weird. Maybe because it needs some space between the header and the box? Or maybe leave it out completely?

[viscid thistle]

I'd agree

[hard quartz]

with the last changes the left-right border increase?

[viscid thistle]

A little bit

https://tenor.com/view/graphic-design-is-my-passion-designer-terrible-dont-quit-your-day-job-lol-gif-12274412

[fair river]

The Ui looks good a solid 9/10

-# would be 10/10 if paper chan is added

[pliant canopy]

Smh Paper propaganda

[brazen moon]

the contrast feels a bit weird for code block

[harsh yarrow]

Wait, the Paper JD link points to 1.12.2
https://papermc.io/javadocs/

For a second I thought 1.21.12 was out

[lean venture]

xd

I wonder, would there be interest in some "redesign" for the javadocs? Idid this for an "old" java verison already once...

In other words, a more modern design over the "old" one

[hard quartz]

only in firefox, currently glare has a PR for that

[vocal halo]

is this really supposed to have the dev guide label?

looks more like its touching the admin section

[drowsy zinc]

no

he had a stroke

[vocal halo]

😆

[pliant canopy]

Hey man, I was hired to write stuff, not label stuff

Otherwise I'd be part of the Label Team, but I ain't, ain't I?

[vocal halo]

Can we get a draft PR for the blogs?

[lean venture]

I assume no answer being no then 🥲

[vocal halo]

I think for that it’s best to stick to the default look

I was looking for javadoc of a library the other day and was so confused when I saw another design.

I think it was junit or something like that

[lean venture]

junit does have a slight different design (they changed like 3 colors and made some stuff bold)

[vocal halo]

Slightly different you say?

With the overall page only really having 4 colors, changing 3 of them is already a huge change

[pliant canopy]

-# Jeesh that looks horrible

[lean venture]

yeah it looks bad xD

This is an outdated version of the already archived project I was doing (only pic I found, it ended up being nicer)

this was for like java 17? or smt

javadocs updated a lot so I just archived the project instead of updating it

[vocal halo]

It was assertJ I was talking about

https://www.javadoc.io/doc/org.assertj/assertj-core/latest/org.assertj.core/module-summary.html

[serene vault]

I don't think something like this is really worth the effort, and it would be a bit of a ongoing maintenance effort too if default Javadocs ever change.
I also think there is a nice familarity to the default design

[lean venture]

besides shitty color, layout etc seems about the same

[west cedar]

looks like a toilet after a bloody piss, really not a fan of the color scheme

[lean venture]

I mean, I have been wanting to revive the project so this would just give me a reason to do so but your second point is valid.

[vocal halo]

Yeah it’s the same theme they use for their website

[lean venture]

Also, its not as much maintenance as one would think

[vocal halo]

Focus on the Hangar redesign

[lean venture]

I CAN'T

[vocal halo]

Why

[lean venture]

hangar is on a downwards spiral atm, mini is busy with life, it's been HELL reworking the frontend...

[vocal halo]

Oh

That’s bad

[lean venture]

Like, atm I don't even know if hangar will be a thing tomorrow lmao

I'd advocate to creating a proper dedicated team for Hangar, but yeah, not up to me

plus you'd need to find enough people to do that

(and possibly find motivated people to rewrite the whole thing preferably)

[vocal halo]

Im sure they give you push access and you just become the new hangar guy

[lean venture]

hell nha

I ain't touching that backend lmao

it's a mess

[vocal halo]

Haha

[lean venture]

Hangar is not a one man army type of project either, which is one of the reasons it is kinda dying atm

[vocal halo]

I mean there were efforts to redesign the db but I think mini said that he just tries it with views?

[lean venture]

mini is that one man army atm

[vocal halo]

Well yeah you are right, if mini is the only one who really can take a look on things it’s hard to get something done.

[lean venture]

yeah, I was helping out with the DB rewrite but then Mini saw that views and some other tweaks were good enough so we abandonned the idea

either way, the biggest problem in Hangar atm is not the DB structure

it's just the pure mess of code that needs to be maintained and can only be maintained by a single person essentially (mini)

(and that's ignoring the constant issues that have been happening that you can easily see in #hangar-help )

Hangar has tons of potential in my eyes, just create a team of people dedicated to hangar, rewrite the whole thing, be transparent about it, seek feedback from established plugin developers, try to meet their needs, etc.

The issue is that it would require tons of work and time investment, and specially motivation. Hence why I specifically mention a team and not a one man army. A team would motivate each others I think.

[vocal halo]

A Team only gets us so far. Ideally you need a team of jobless people working on it day and night. But oh well paper is open source maintained by volunteers so you have to accept time periods where nothing happens. Or at least nothing that can be seen by everyone.

And idk is hangar really in such a bad state right now?

It has some bugs but eh. What is a software without bugs?

[lean venture]

Yes, 100%, but I still think if you have specific people dedicated to working on it, you will get further than alone. Specially in an open source project where if person A is busy irl, person B can take over, etc.

[vocal halo]

Yeah of course it would be nice to have someone else besides mini that is able to make decisions about hangar.

[lean venture]

Some of the bugs are quite breaking, like projects not showing up at all, etc.

And overall, Hangar itself is not on a bad state, if you fix that 1-2 bugs, it's stable enough. The problem is that working on hangar is 5x more frustrating due to the mess it currently is internally. Hangar is also not that adopted at all, people see no reason to switch over to hangar, specially when SEO quite sucks xD

[lean venture]

Yeah, that is an example of what I find is not ideal, because hangar atm is stuck in time because mini is busy in life, which is totally fair and acceptable for an open source project, but it would be nice if every single decision or specially every single change in the backend, etc. didn't rely on a single person.

Don't forget, everything is temporary, imagine mini actually left paper tomorrow, who would stay to maintain hangar? Hell, who would be capable of doing that even.

It doesn't help that the most important person for the project, is also an important person in several other projects XD

[viscid thistle]

For the blog, it was requested we have a /blog route, the individual one, and a /all route. If we go that route, how many blog posts do we want to show on /blog? Or should we drop /all and just have the /blog and the slug routes?

I was also thinking about tags and filters, but I really don't think we have enough posts for that to be of benefit. We have like 21 dating back 2-3 years.

And on the /blog route do we want to display them in a grid like it is now or just have a single column entries?

[random pollen]

I think a single column is better

[viscid thistle]

Do we want to backload a description field for all entries to display on the main page? So we can have the date, word count, read time, title, and a description of the blog post in that single column?

[lean venture]

Are there plans to use blogs more often?

Specially for other things besides new version announcements

[viscid thistle]

That's probably a Riley question

[random pollen]

I think that would be good

as far as tags I think that could be added later if we run into a use case

no need in blocking on it

[viscid thistle]

I think it would be cool if we had a more established blog process and put out posts from other people in the Paper community? Idk

By put out posts I mean they'd write a blog article for the Paper site

Okay instead of calling this blog can we call this like something with a play on newspaper?

There's a joke / solid name in there somewhere

[pliant canopy]

papernews

[lean venture]

lmao yeah

I mean, I'd love to read articles about general stuff

I love to read articles about minecraft

that actually reminds me of https://madelinemiller.dev/

like hell, these are very interesting blog posts

(hire her)

[opal flare]

it's replacing the forums completely, so it will have all announcement posts

[lean venture]

well what I meant with that was kinda in the direction of what glare went with "papernews"

[opal flare]

huh?

[lean venture]

.

oh shit sorry for ping

xD

[opal flare]

no plans for articles like that currently.

[lean venture]

I mean, I personally would just say.. "I'd consider it at least"

they are quite fun and make it looks less "corporate" in some way?

I'd say it would give Paper (the org) more of an identity

it also promotes interaction with users and provides valuable information sometimes

but either way, even if there is a slight possibility this may happen, the website should be ready to be used like that preferably

[neon atlas]

waiting for you to find out maddy has been on this team for half an eternity

[lean venture]

I know she is part of the team, I meant hire her to write the blogs hahaha

[neon atlas]

ah xD

I think some of our startup messages already link to her blog posts too

[lean venture]

isn't she quite literally the one (of many?) microsoft employees we have here

or was that someone else

[empty grove]

Yes, she is

[viscid thistle]

Playing around with the single column

[hot patio]

It’s probably best in mobile. I suggest to use the grid square thing with an image for desktop

To occupy the full space

Isn’t it a better idea ? Unless you want to add thing on the right like post timelines etc

[viscid thistle]

So the problem is that not all posts will have a cover image

But yes I do see what you're saying for the desktop

[hot patio]

You can then have a default image like papermc one for posts that don’t have an image

Or if you want to stay with column, fill the spaces with widgets like timeline etc

[viscid thistle]

Yeah true

I'm not the best designer but I can push this and let someone play with it

[hot patio]

Yeah you just set the basic idea, and someone will make the styling

[viscid thistle]

Exactly

[hot patio]

It feels empty like that

[viscid thistle]

I would agree

I could have herobrine pop out randomly across the page

[hot patio]

The styling is also easy since you pretty much do the same with the column

[hot patio]

Halloween mode

It makes me feel lonely and less engaging

[near ice]

@viscid thistle Your design is looks pretty good! might I suggest that, at least for the desktop version, you load the first paragraph or so from the article and put it there? then you could have a fading gradient on-top of it. that way it feels like there's a bit more content. having an image doesn't seem like a huge deal to me, what I notice is just the boxes have so much empty white space they feel kinda empty, but if you added a small snipped from the article itself (literally just a .slice() on the string from the article at 512 or whatever) that should fill in the space a lot more.
The reason the mobile versions look so much better is because the text is actually wrapping and filling up the box so it doesn't feel so empty

[viscid thistle]

I'll drop the descriptions and try it out tomorrow.

[peak torrent]

Why exactly does the Button for paper links you to the Version of 1.12.2

Just found out about the problem with firefox, my bad

[viscid thistle]

Just waiting on someone to merge the fix I opened

[drowsy zinc]

I could do it but idk if I'm supposed to

it's got two approvals and no one assigned /shrug

[hard quartz]

2 approves sounds fine to merge

[eager plover]

1 from kash, one from some random guy

[drowsy zinc]

idk what the sorting logic is for but given that it was there before it's probably fine

[eager plover]

I mean, our API in the past only really did insertion order

idk if the new one is more stable on that front

[drowsy zinc]

I mean, there's no build explorer anymore

and the most recent version should realistically be the latest

[viscid thistle]

Ty for merging. I know Riley approved but I don't like merging my own PRs

[pliant canopy]

This is a bit embarrassing, but I genuinely cannot reproduce the invalid JVM version error. I am running OpenJDK 25, haven't set anything, but paperweight works perfectly fine, even if I run cleanAllPaperweightUserdevCaches and then paperweightUserdevSetup. I figured out how to set the property, but I would kinda like to be able to reproduce the issues itself first too so that the documentation can be more targeted.

Is there any specific Gradle/userdev version I need to be on for the error to occur? I know I saw some people having issues in #build-tooling-help, so I know it exists, I just cannot reproduce it

[random pollen]

you need to try an older bundle

it's 'fixed' now in 1.21.10 but this is just a thing that will happen with new JVMs over time

[pliant canopy]

Oh yeah it breaks when I try it on the .8 bundle. I was using .10

Okay but yeah great, thanks

https://github.com/PaperMC/docs/pull/681.

Idk I am not really happy with the phrasing. Any imporvement suggestions?

[eager plover]

I feel that you're trying to add tense to something that doesn't need tense

Like, this is a general "the dev bundle needs to work with the JDK version it expects"

(bearing in mind that this applies forward and backwards, I guess just generally you can't build against J25 with J21 so that is not as huge of a deal unless you're already using toolchains for something)

[pliant canopy]

I did a thing, what about tihs?

[eager plover]

"might not support the JDK version Gradle is configured to use" ~ maybe

English is somehow my first language

[pliant canopy]

Yeah honestly I am just gonna do that, wait for the jmp approve, and merge

[vocal halo]

That page is the caelid of paper docs

[viscid thistle]

This what you had in mind?

[vocal halo]

The fade looks odd

[south thunder]

I like it

I think the borders on dark mode could use bit less contrast (this is 50% blended with the bg color)

[near ice]

yeah that looks awesome! nice touch of reducing how much text is shown in the mobile version versus the desktop version.
Having the publish date visible beneath the lower opacity where the paragraph cuts off does feel kinda weird visually.
Might I suggest moving that content to kinda be in a flexbox along with the title? Let the title be flex: 1 so it takes up as much space as possible. and then have the posted date be on one line and the amount of time to read be on a second line.

kinda like this, where the date is the dark blue and the time-to-read is the light blue???
The green is supposed to be the flexbox, and the red boxes re just arbitrary representations of the divs or whatever
idk it might look like garbage, but if you feel like messing with it more it might be worth a shot 🙂

that should also theoretically give that "fade out effect" plenty of visual room to "breath." I like to think that the reader's mind subconsciously decides that "ohh there's no more contentin this box after this paragraph because it's clearly being cut-off here" and so having more content after the fade-out kinda gives the viewer a sort of "mental whiplash" perhaps? that's at least how it feels to me, so that's why I'm suggesting that

[viscid thistle]

It feels weird with the spacing now

[viscid thistle]

How about this?

[near ice]

Yeah you’re right this isn’t the move, worth a shot tho

[near ice]

Yeah I like this one a ton!
How does it look when the title is longer than the metadata width?

[viscid thistle]

Hmm?

[near ice]

Ohh wait sorry I didn’t see the title with hard fork

[near ice]

Yeah it looks awesome, that gets my vote for sure

[viscid thistle]

Awesome. I went ahead and pushed that. Should be deploying soon and we can keep getting feedback.

I know the meta tags will need some work on the blog index page and the individual posts themselves.

[near ice]

Hell yeah! Thanks for letting me be a internet nerd 😉

[viscid thistle]

Thanks for the awesome feedback 🙂

https://feat-blog-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev/blog/

[near ice]

Sure thing, happy to help!

[serene vault]

I would make the blog content/overview as wide as the header content (e.g. the width from the paper logo to the twitter logo) personally. I always find a bit odd if those aren't aligned on websites. And the blog content is quite narrow right now.

But that also might just be my preference. It looks very nice otherwise. Though maybe a little bit of color wouldn't hurt, e.g. the same gray/blue scheme the main page has

[twilit fog]

I like the overall design.
Are there any special changes to new posts? E.g. a red border and or a NEW label or something

[lean venture]

yes. That's actually a design principle xD

and if you worry that the blog cards would become too wide

just make it 2 columns

[lean venture]

NEW label could easily be added either to only the latest post or based on date of publishment

[twilit fog]

my thinking was more in the latter

easily stands out when there is a new blog post instead of having to read if its relevant

[vocal halo]

maybe we want this to be stopped? https://github.com/PaperMC/website/runs/52091132535

[viscid thistle]

What if instead of New I just put a badge or something on the right that says latest?

If we do time based I probably have to do something with JS

[twilit fog]

I don't think thats a good idea since latest doesn't have a time limit where as new would be active for a week max for example

[viscid thistle]

Well then I have to do a client side date check or just assume a new build will go out to update it

[vocal halo]

i think removing a new tag after a week seems too soon. Latest makes more sense. imo

[spice temple]

🤷‍♂️

[vocal halo]

lmao

[viscid thistle]

I figured it's cause we switched from pages to workers so it just didn't know update on the GitHub side

[vocal halo]

also, i would suggest putting the blog button in the menu bar more to the left

like between forums and team

and, if its planned, remove forums completely and replace it with blog

[viscid thistle]

Forums are going read only

[vocal halo]

yeah but idk if you still want a forums reference in the menu bar or not

[viscid thistle]

So maybe just keep a link in the footer?

[vocal halo]

but if it goes away i would put Blog in its spot

[viscid thistle]

I can easily make some of these changes this morning. I'm traveling this afternoon through the weekend so if someone else also wants to work on styling, I'm all game.

[vocal halo]

and is there a reason why you decided against an infinite scrolling blog instead of the way it is now?

[viscid thistle]

There has been little to no styling done. I kinda just went off a few ideas from Riley and we're getting feedback from there.

[fair river]

infinite scrolling is disgusting

[vocal halo]

but its more user friendly to be able to scroll down and see all updates in one place instead of having to click back and look for the next post to read

[jagged pecan]

*benny hill theme plays, while trying to get to the footer*

[vocal halo]

yeah, if its not final decision i would suggest that. Also i feel like it could use a bit more space. I know there is a suggestion about a toc. I don't know how well this would work with an infinite scrolling solution.

i mean yeah, basically like it is on the forums right now

[viscid thistle]

I do want some kind of TOC off to the right

[viscid thistle]

Updated this locally on the main page, should be more consistent I think.

[near ice]

something I might throw out too. is that some platforms literally just set a max-width on their content because they know that their content being ultra-wide doesn't look great.
Soundcloud comes to mind but iirc X, Instagram, and I think Facebook all do this too

so you could have a defined width that you're happy with and make that the max width and keep the nav bar at that width and stuff. personally I like it because I realized that I don't even notice it when platforms do it, but I def notice it when platforms don't do it when they should be doing it

ohh wait I'm sorry I realized that the paper website already has that, sorry I just in my head forgot and thought it was just full-width

don't mind me getting ahead of myself 😂 - sorry about that

[mighty dirge]

Has a search/filter/tag functionality been brought up? Couldn't find anything.
Also I think a pr for dedicated discussion could be great.

Also IMO the "View all" could be a bit confusion maybe smth like "Go to overview" instead?

[pliant canopy]

Btw I think the border around it is a bit too strong, maybe reducing its brightness by one might ease it a bit?

[viscid thistle]

There's not point in a search / filter / tag system right now simply because we only have like 21 posts dating back 3 years.

[viscid thistle]

The border on the main page?

[pliant canopy]

This

So yes

[viscid thistle]

It's 1px atm, I can reduce it to 0.5, give me a second

[pliant canopy]

Or just make it a darker gray?

[viscid thistle]

Yeah I can do that

[near ice]

I find that white - 20% opacity (or the - gray equivalent) tends to look nice

[pliant canopy]

I ain't no designer, but I think that could help ease the look a bit

[near ice]

#333333 is the gray equivalent. might be a little bit to dark, but then again maybe not

I realized I could just draft that look in my browser

[near ice]

yeah that looks a lot better for sure!

[viscid thistle]

I could go a little more

Or too much

[near ice]

tbh I like it on the darker side personally

[viscid thistle]

Happy middle?

[near ice]

yeah I think either of those latest two are solid

@pliant canopy what do you think?

[pliant canopy]

I like the last one

Actually maybe the second-last one might be cleaner

[viscid thistle]

If I put a "Latest" tag on the right side do we want it just top right or lined up with the title but on the far right?

So either aligned with title or top right corner

[near ice]

without seeing it, I think aligned with the title will look best

you could always throw it in next to the publish date and read-duration 🤔

[pliant canopy]

So one more thing: why are the inline code blocks green?

I feel like some blue might be a cleaner fit

[viscid thistle]

So when Riley and I were first talking he said he wanted something like how the MC news does it with their inline code.

I'm all for trying out different colors and styles.

None of this is set in stone, we're just playing around to see what kind of fits.

[pliant canopy]

You picked a nice shade of green, don't get me wrong, but the only green thing I can find here is a very tiny part of the paper stack on the icon and the "Done" line

[viscid thistle]

I agree with that

I went ahead and pushed all these changes so far since I need to start packing in a little bit.

[lean venture]

this is actually wrong

From some UX classes I did in the past, they have proven this is actually not that beneficial

it overloads users with information, no clear bounderies and specially harder to navigate (imagine wanting to go from last blog to one in the middle, with 100+ blogs... lots of scrolling)

[lean venture]

ToC would be independent to each blog post

Also fy, for colors, I can provide the colors I used for the border in the hangar redesign

put that to some use at least

[viscid thistle]

Yeah I definitely want to do a TOC for the individual posts. I might take a peak at what Starlight is doing internally and just replicate some of that.

[lean venture]

Hangar also implements a TOC although starlight might be better yeah

[vocal halo]

I still think it should be an endless scroll instead of separate pages

[lean venture]

I mean, it's up to y'all, was just giving my input

it's also why I kept pages a thing in hangar

[hearty briar]

I hate endless scrolling sites in desktop

it is fine on mobile, not particularly my thing on desktop

and only place where it seems appropriate is social media, where you're mindlessly scouring for something interesting

[fair river]

I also hate endless scrolling. Footer is very important to have for me.

[near ice]

Yeah I don’t really get the point of endless scrolling, who is gonna be tiktok-ing through fucking paper version updates?

[fair river]

I think Apple started the trend and I really hope this trend dies.

[near ice]

I mean you could just put “next article” “previous article” buttons

That way people don’t have to go back to the home page. Cause I get that that would be annoying

[lean venture]

well it won't for social media

[near ice]

This is also a super good point, the footer is a very important component of any website, but endless literally makes it worthless on those feeds

[viscid thistle]

I'm a no for infinite scrolling but it's not my decision is final at the end of the day

[lean venture]

I wonder if something like this could be implemented for hangar 🤔

[viscid thistle]

I know the individual posts needs improvements. We need a back to overview at top or something and maybe a scroll to top button and then on the bottom go to next or go to previous, etc.

[lean venture]

you could implement something (that I am also gonna do in hangar) which is when scrolling down, there will be an island at the top for navigation, etc.

[near ice]

If anyone disagrees with me feel free to yell at me; but I would make the statement that I think we can all agree that the reason people like infinite scrolling is so that they don’t have to go back to the feed in order to read the next article. As such a next/previous article buttons would fulfill that while also not breaking behavior that most expect from websites.
It’s also significantly less dev upkeep for you.
But I think we’d all agree that forcing people to do things one way sucks, so I think this is a good medium

[viscid thistle]

Also you guys have to keep in mind we do like 1 post every few months 😂

If it was utilized more then I could see a reason to add more things

[near ice]

Exactly lol, it’s not like this is a CNN news feed lol

[lean venture]

hence why infinite scrolling is a bad idea

although (I do vote to have more posts like spoken about before)

[viscid thistle]

Yeah Riley said not planned for now, but maybe later down the road.

[lean venture]

yeah yeah

Also, I just realized, since ya are redoing the website, would be nice if we could keep everything consistent between hangar and the website 👀

[viscid thistle]

People are more than welcome to open a PR for the blog branch if you guys have some improvements to add in. I really shouldn't be putting in as much time as I have given things going on at work, but, it's fun to play with.

[near ice]

We all appreciate your help and time!

[fair river]

Appreciate all you did, Glare

[near ice]

I’ll PR a Dynamic Island

[lean venture]

I agree with the above statements. ❤️

[random pollen]

I think we should try and get it merged soon and have further changes target main

it's already in a very good state

[viscid thistle]

If Riley is fine with it, we can do that.

I think probably want a ToC before we merge it but I won't be able to do that today

[random pollen]

I think that can also come later if it's generally ready to merge, the most recent post is what people will look at, and we want to get a new one out soon

I think I fixed the lint action

yep

@viscid thistle would you mind opening a PR (that way I don't become commit author by opening it myself )

[viscid thistle]

https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/174

Lmk if that looks right. Doing it all from my phone.

Some of the styling does need updated on the individual blog posts but if it's good for now, it is what it is.

[random pollen]

@viscid thistle is there a specific process you used to convert the forum posts, going to need to do one more for the 1.21.10 post

[lean venture]

Wouldn't it be nice to post already on the new website?

[random pollen]

we have a forum post pre prepared

needs to be ported

[viscid thistle]

Riley dumped the bbcode from the database and I had GPT clean out the bbcode syntax and convert it to markdown

[random pollen]

yeah I did the same thing

[viscid thistle]

Could just give GPT one of the ones already converted and give it the raw from xenforo and it'll probably do it

I'm out planting some flowers for my mom. I'll check back in in a lil bit

[random pollen]

yeah had zed againt do that basically

it's merged btw

[viscid thistle]

Oh nice

Looks pretty solid. There's some components we should make like a warning for the backups and whatnot to catch their eye

[hot patio]

Small fix of color, the build and dropdown must be black

We don’t see

[viscid thistle]

How the heck did you get that color for it

[random pollen]

it's beta now

[viscid thistle]

I don't know what channel that would be

Ahh

Yeah that should be an easy fix for whoever wants to get that

[hot patio]

Alpha, beta then stable ?

[pliant canopy]

I made a small PR to fix a few issues, if somebody could take a look, I'd appreciate it: https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/176.
That fixes the unreadable text in the yellow downloads button, the weird unstreching on smaller displays, overhauls the inline code blocks on the news page, and adds some color to links in the news page

[random pollen]

seeing it all together the link and inline code colors are very close

[pliant canopy]

Yeah that's true, they are both sampled from the main site color

Should I make the link a bit lighter?

[random pollen]

maybe inline code can base on the beta channel color or something

/the red from the logo

[pliant canopy]

hmm

That would look something like this

Idk

making the link a lighter blue looks like this

Also unsure about that

I think I like this

[random pollen]

I actually like this

[pliant canopy]

You do? Hmm

[random pollen]

maybe toned down slightly

[pliant canopy]

Lemme play around with it

[random pollen]

but I think not blue is the way to go

for the inline code

[pliant canopy]

So kinda like this?

[scenic gull]

I'm not convinced pee is the right color.

[pliant canopy]

I think it could be fine tbh

What about something more into the orange?

Stronger orange

I like the orange

purple

Tbh purple kinda rocks

opinions on purple?

[vocal halo]

is it easy to make the space between Get Paper and the download button the same for stable/experimental builds?`

[pliant canopy]

Not really, that's just text wrapping

Maybe a small margin can be added

Just so the text has some space to wrap

[random pollen]

orange or purple look fine, what about light mode

[pliant canopy]

light mode I haven't put in values yet, lemme get some screenshots

[vocal halo]

what about just gray?

[random pollen]

boring

[vocal halo]

but colors look a bit overwhelmingimo

or not overwhelming but unnecessary .

at least so strong colors

[random pollen]

purple is better

[pliant canopy]

So we doing this?

[vocal halo]

can we make the background on lightmode darker?

[pliant canopy]

Okay one last change to the light mode variant: I made the code blocks clearer

[pliant canopy]

I think it's fine like that tbh

[random pollen]

yeah I think it's good now

[pliant canopy]

pushed up the changes

Btw out of curiosity, why do we have an empty AGENTS.md file in the repo

[south thunder]

.

[pliant canopy]

Ah it's a symlink

GitHub just cannot display those

[random pollen]

symlink

short for symbolic link not simulated link

[pliant canopy]

Yes, I know

[random pollen]

[pliant canopy]

I've been coding for a good 14 and a half hours at this point

my brain is fried

[hard quartz]

In a few places but not the content... GitHub design things xd

[vocal halo]

Blink 2 times if you are in trouble

[lean venture]

rookie numbers

wanna add 2 hours to that number?

[smoky granite]

rookie numbers
wanna add 2 hours to that number?

[spice temple]

Just saw that the announcements are now on the website, nice!
But is it just me or is the font really big on mobile? This is fine for the normal site, but for content heavy stuff it makes it really hard to read stuff. I would decrease the font size and line spacing to make it easier to read

Oh there's also a double margin

Plus I would add a download button somewhere, lol

Also, somebody broke the sitemap

https://papermc.io/sitemap.xml

https://papermc.io/robots.txt

Also broken

A custom 404 page would be nice too

[trail jasper]

the readability of the white text is very bad on yellow
its alright in light mode but not in dark mode

the text should probably be black as well
the dropdown button too

[pliant canopy]

There is a branch which fixes it already

[timid cedar]

I wonder if it might be nice to have a tag system on the news page? To separate e.g. velo vs paper vs adventure etc. (assuming we're gonna use it for more than just paper, would be nice to e.g. post about Adventure 5.0 when it's out)

[vocal halo]

Perfect

Also nice. Generally I think I agree with mini. The text is a bit too big on mobile.

Like just to compare forums and news.

[spring vine]

that white line must be changed too

[pliant canopy]

I will be perfectly honest, yesterday I straight up couldn't find the tailwind class which sets that, so I just gave up. I might take a look at it today when I continue on it

[slate arrow]

in my opinion the bigger text looks a lot better

it makes it “easier” to read instead of scaring off with a huge wall of small text

[vocal halo]

It looks messy and out of place in my opinion. Basically like pressing ctrl+ in a browser a few times

[viscid thistle]

There are some tweaks to be made, am traveling home today so I might have some time to work on some things.

[scenic gull]

Can we have the Powering X players bit go through our own domain instead of bstats, so it can't get blocked by users adblocking stuffs? Or maybe have a reasonable default like "thousands of" before switching to the number?

[lean venture]

I actually thought paper had its own analytics, didn't know it fully relied on bstats

[viscid thistle]

Yeah I know that got added to a default pihole list awhile back.

Idk if Riley wants to proxy it though a fill domain or something? Or if we do have our own analytics expose an endpoint for that.

[opal flare]

open an issue for it on the website repo for now

next up: we need to put some sort of banner on the forums saying that they are going read-only

[viscid thistle]

That's probably going to need to be someone who has XF Admin access

[opal flare]

I do, just need to draft a message

[viscid thistle]

Kk

[viscid thistle]

Am home. Time to look at a few things.

@random pollen Quick question for Fill. In the backend / in the API response how is it determined that a version is promoted as experimental / beta?

[random pollen]

I didn't really change that code in the website if thats what you mean

[viscid thistle]

Well I'm just trying to figure out if we want to detect that experimental went to beta and have it say "Toggle beta builds" instead of experimental.

[random pollen]

I don't think so

[viscid thistle]

Left is stable, right is beta. At least fixed some of the text color.

[opal flare]

it is all based on the channel

ALPHA, BETA, STABLE, RECOMMENDED

[random pollen]

https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/181

that should lower the worst case load time quite a bit

[viscid thistle]

Cool cool

I think https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/176 is also good to merge in to fix a couple things.

[viscid thistle]

@random pollen Your PR lgtm, is it ready for merge? I'll go ahead and do it.

[viscid thistle]

I need inspirations for banners. These would have default variants and could be overriden with class names. Think bootstrap's warning, info, error, etc. These would be used for side-notes or warnings like the "Backups are mandatory"

Here's what I had in mind for the contributors list for each update

<Contributors
  contributors={[
    { username: "jpenilla", sponsor: "https://github.com/sponsors/jpenilla" },
    { username: "Lulu13022002" },
    { username: "lynxplay" },
    { username: "Spottedleaf", sponsor: "https://www.patreon.com/Spottedleaf" },
    { username: "Owen1212055", sponsor: "https://github.com/sponsors/Owen1212055" },
  ]}
/>

Pretty easy to create now

[hard quartz]

if any dont wanna use more than one sponsor link (?

how looks for more contributors? like 12 (1.21.7 has that)

[viscid thistle]

Wdym by this?

[hard quartz]

nah just a random idea if any wanna add two or more sponsors urls (like patreon and github sponsors)

[hard quartz]

maybe use columns?

[viscid thistle]

Ahh, I can add support for that.

I had considered making it a grid but jmp said he wanted it still kind of like a list.

We can try it though just to see.

[hard quartz]

yesterday when read that, my first thing was like the github release contributors just the avatar in grid

[viscid thistle]

That's one option if we drop the name and sponsor link

Grid would look like this, kinda meh.

[hard quartz]

much space xd
the columns can be more close maybe, but not sure

[hard quartz]

looks good

[viscid thistle]

I like it too. I'll roll with this for now.

[hard quartz]

okay.
now i notice... why my PR for remove the folia description not throw a preview? exists a rule for that in PR?

[viscid thistle]

Unsure tbh

[hard quartz]

passing this to github for keep if can be or not xd

[viscid thistle]

It looks like Astro generates it as https://papermc.io/sitemap-index.xml which is linked in the header tags. I can confirm the robots.txt is missing and I'm opening a PR to fix that.

[spice temple]

Index sitemaps suck ass

Can we disable that and just generate a proper one?

[viscid thistle]

I'll check!

[spice temple]

Both for hangar and at work we have made terrible experience with index sitemaps and just ship one giant one now, at least Google properly indexed that and visualizes it properly in the search console

I guess else I'll just submit sitemap-0.xml to Google, lol

I can't find stuff in the docs

[viscid thistle]

Give me a few

[spice temple]

Idk why it just doesn't ship a normal one until the limit is hit

[burnt ice]

This looks sick

[spice temple]

this is the best of the screenshots tho, but the idea is really nice, ye!

[viscid thistle]

Yeah the last screenshot I sent was what I rolled with for now

[spice temple]

(I still think the update posts need a big download button)

[viscid thistle]

Damn yeah they really like the sitemap index

[spice temple]

I just saw the hover on the news index page, why is it green? lol
our brand/accent color is blue ^^

[viscid thistle]

I opened a PR for the missing robots.txt based off the way that the sitemap-index is currently generated.

TLDR I went off what Riley originally asked, there's still changes to be made 👍

We may just have to submit the index for now unless someone wants to write the sitemap generator as a static endpoint that gets generated on build.

[spice temple]

oh yeah, this is just all minor iteration and improvements, not trying to take away from aynthing you made, its a great first iteration

[spice temple]

nah, its good enough

[viscid thistle]

What kind of download button were you thinking?

[spice temple]

a BIG one 😄

idk, like, just usecase wise, I get a ping in discord, wooo, new version ready, I read the post and then I am stuck, no way to jump to the release

like, just a prominent link to the paper download page is enough I think

I assume you rescused the robotos.txt content from the old one?

[viscid thistle]

Yeah

With updated sitemap link

[spice temple]

this is whats always worrying me about index sitemaps

and its not just the visual there, I had indexing issues at work that got fixed with a proper one

but I just submitted them both now

[viscid thistle]

Yeah I see what you're saying. Let me see what I can do for a download button rq.

[hard quartz]

not bad for a 404 page... not?

[spice temple]

needs more space up top

and idk about the img

[hard quartz]

was a placeholder but can be good keep

[hard quartz]

like this?

well all this was a test im bad in the style things xd

[odd harbor]

404.astro by @hard quartz: https://pastes.dev/7Sx3dVCxQZ

[hard quartz]

ups xd

[spice temple]

theres only one thing thats worse than tailwind

inline style 😄

and ye, hotlinking an image like that is also a big nono, needs to be in the repo

[viscid thistle]

Maybe?

[lean venture]

Looks nice

Download buttin looks a bit out of place imo

[viscid thistle]

Idk where it should go in the actual blog post

[lean venture]

What if it isn't provided inside the post content but instead in the header/hero/title of the post?

Aka on the top right of your picture

Where there's empty space

[viscid thistle]

We'd have to probably do something in the schema for if the type is a version release announcement or not to only show it on those entries

[lean venture]

Yeah

I mean, just an idea either way

That empty space could be used

[viscid thistle]

For sure, it can go anywhere, I was just making the component.

I'll add it to this branch and then we can decide where it goes.

[hard quartz]

and i broke my try... need learn more about the classes 🙁

[ruby comet]

Is that text grammatically wrong on purpose

[pliant canopy]

I was wondering the same thing

[lean venture]

Holy now I can't unsee it

[hard quartz]

another try... with classes but was most a copy-paste from another components xd

[odd harbor]

404.astro by @hard quartz: https://pastes.dev/y9qLAuBrdT

[viscid thistle]

For banners, do we like the Aside component that starlight uses? I could look at porting it over.

[lean venture]

I'd say, make it roundy, everything else is already roundy

[hard quartz]

Its the preview just ignoring my PRs? U.u

or just works with prs using branchs from the org

[viscid thistle]

I don't think it will do a preview for a PR from a branch outside the org without an approval

[pliant canopy]

lol

that's really based tbh

[viscid thistle]

You're making it from the repo though so idk why tbh

Wait lol it did make a preview

https://fix-javadocs-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev/

[pliant canopy]

CF hates Doc confirmed

[pliant canopy]

Isn't that mine ?

[viscid thistle]

Oh maybe

[pliant canopy]

I did that from a repo branch

[viscid thistle]

Oh yeah that's why

Yeah Doc it hates you

Oh that's ironic

The preview is 404 and your PR is about adding in a 404 page. It kinda makes sense.

[hard quartz]

time for apply to the website team and make branchs in the base repo xd

[hard quartz]

or maybe the app not has perms to all repos and cannot access to forks (?

[viscid thistle]

Might have to be an approval thing in the dashboard

[random pollen]

the first party integration only does previews for same repo PRs

docs uses a third party one to make outsite PRs have previews, but I don't think it's updated for workers

[hard quartz]

[viscid thistle]

I dropped the Aside for now, wasn't happy with it, didn't feel like it fit properly.

[vocal halo]

What?

[viscid thistle]

These are called Asides according to Starlight.

This is ready for review btw. https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/188

On the preview site it generated I tested across different devices in my house and I noticed a decent improvement with loading speed of download pages after the first device had loaded, the rest didn't have the small delay on the first load. I think this tweaks the edge cache a little to ensure it gets pushed to the region in a faster manner.

[lean venture]

Guys, hear me out... still gotta see what mini thinks but I was thinking on making hangar's components more abstract and actually create a separate component library, which could technically be used in other projects too etc, thoughts?

[viscid thistle]

How does that play into the site? I get the uniformity aspect but different frontend frameworks here.

[lean venture]

Yeah that's a good point

Although I thought astro supported vue?

[viscid thistle]

It does but if we don't need interactivity for something, there's no point in introducing extra JS just for a look.

Most of the pages are just static HTML now after migrating from NextJS. We dropped 85%+ of our JS across the site.

[lean venture]

I mean, I can easily generate static elements from it but yeah I see your point. I didn't think much further than the idea. I just know it would be quite beneficial since everything would be separated and abstracted from hangar

[viscid thistle]

For sure

[lean venture]

I mean, I'd say (with mini's approval) that I'd create the component library and if there is interest for its usage outside of hangar I could easily generate static html elements for each.

[pliant canopy]

I don't see how that would be an efficient use of time, plenty of frameworks and similar to choose from already anyways

[lean venture]

Well hangar has it's own design anyways, so I wouldn't be doing anything new, I would just be doing it abstractly in a separate project instead of inside hangar.

This would actually make my life easier to work with the components since they are all abstract

[opal flare]

No vue. Svelte.

All other sites use svelte already

[lean venture]

Well hangar is using vue xD

And tbh DX in Nuxt is way better than sveltekit

Doubt mini wants to redo hangar in svelte xD

[vocal halo]

Yeah I don’t think this justifies wasting time by rewriting the whole thing in Svelte

[lean venture]

Yeah, it does not. Unless a rewrite is going to be done anyways.

[vocal halo]

And I also don’t think an extra project is needed for hangar components

[lean venture]

In that case it can be considered. But we will see what mini says next week

[vocal halo]

Like that seems unnecessary.

[opal flare]

Other sites are not moving to Vue, just to be clear

[lean venture]

It's more to abstract it really, it has its benefits, plus I would gladly use some components in other projects of mine so, abstracting it out would be helpful

[vocal halo]

Yeah

[lean venture]

Would be a waste of resources and time, svelte is perfectly fine

[vocal halo]

What components are you talking about? There’s already a good component library for vue (doesn’t mean you aren’t allowed to make your own, just saying it might be unnecessary)

[lean venture]

Buttons, dropdowns, etc. And if I wanted to use others then hangar would look like your standard vibe coded website imo. Hangar (redesign) is basically fully custom.

So, I'd be doing those components anyways, question is if I do them in the hangar context or in a more abstract context in a separate project that allows me to use them in other places

Workload wouldn't change much rlly

[vocal halo]

I don’t think using a component library implies the website is vibe coded. Using a component library is just convenient. Not AI vibe coding

[lean venture]

And even if there was interest in using the components in the website/docs to keep it all uniform (which I am not sure y'all have interest in), it can easily be converted to svelte and support both.

[lean venture]

Yeah ofc not, was just an example, my point is that hangar's redesign is essentially fully custom made already.

[vocal halo]

But yeah, idk, just my opinion. I don’t think someone’s stoping you from just copying the component out of hangar and republish them as your work since you mostly did the redesign but ianal

[lean venture]

It doesn't add any extra work doing it separately or not.

[lean venture]

I mean, there is a different approach between building components specifically for hangar and making them abstract in a component library. In your case it would be 2x workload instead of just doing one

[vocal halo]

Well it kinda does add another dependency to the whole thing. What if someone wants to change them. They’d have to change it in that project. What if you want to change them but hangar doesn’t but later decides they want to change another component etc etc

[lean venture]

Yeah that's a fair point.

[vocal halo]

You can make them abstract anyway, no? Just in the hangar project. And then you can copy that directory into your project and you can use them there. I think it’s better to keep the hangar ones separate.

[lean venture]

Yeah, might be better then.

I will check with mini.

[vocal halo]

👍

[lean venture]

Either way, there are no plans to do this, I am just curious, would there be any interest in making an uniform design across all websites?

[random pollen]

the main site style could use some refinement, maybe the starlight stylesheets from docs could be used as inspiration; fill-ui is going to stay with shadcn-svelte

reminds me I need to disable webm on safari because it doesn't support transparency 💀

[lean venture]

Not sure if that answers my question but I guess

[random pollen]

ok mp4 transparency is also broken in safari

but the gif is 10x the size

(the gif is half the entire page size)

ok apparently I need it in h265

and I have to encode it on my mac...?

[vocal halo]

i knew it looked familiar

that what i use for vue

shadcn vue

[random pollen]

why does ffmpeg -encoders just hang and do nothing on my mac

ok it worked this time

[lean venture]

I have nightmares of it, there was a very specific issues that was breaking stuff with shadcn vue when I installed it in an old project I had done

Shadcn is nice

Imo a bit overused but yeah

[random pollen]

isn't it based on a deprecated lib for react

or something like that

[vocal halo]

the vue port?

[random pollen]

on svelte it's using bits-ui which is very nice

no the original

[lean venture]

Radix UI

That is the old one

Now called reka UI

That's what it uses behind the scenes

If I were to rewrite hangar's frontend, I'd most likely use reka ui for the ui components

It's hella nice

Oh wait the original

This was for vue

Oh wait no, it did use radix before apparently

[vocal halo]

i only understand trainstation

[lean venture]

?

[vocal halo]

thats what i'm saying

[lean venture]

Shadcn uses Radix (nowadays partially it appears, but before it was fully)
Shadcn-vue used Radix Vue but it's now RekaUI

Hopefully that makes it understandable

[viscid thistle]

Well the nice thing about primitives is you can kinda just switch them out. You could just move shadcn and base it on a different lib and just make some style changes to your liking and then you're on a lib again. I really like his registry system.

[lean venture]

Radix?

[viscid thistle]

The shadcn components themselves that he styles on top of the base primitives.

[lean venture]

Ah yeah

[viscid thistle]

I like browsing here https://21st.dev/

[vocal halo]

Oh that’s interesting

I just have some issues with line charts…

[random pollen]

the apple codec didn't seem to work well for pixel art so now i'm compiling x265 with alpha enabled 💀

and it also doesnt work I guess thats why its off normally

guess I need to try harder with the apple one

[viscid thistle]

jmp whenever you get some time can you review my latest PR and merge it if it's good to go?

[random pollen]

link?

https://supergeekery.com/blog/transparent-video-in-chrome-edge-firefox-and-safari-circa-2022 I got it to work by converting to prores with ffmpeg and then using version 17.1 of shutter encoder mac

https://github.com/PaperMC/fill-ui/commit/713ac224699d9909a2c8fe08ca3827cb81917c11

the edges around the sniffer aren't as clean in safari as chrome-based but this is good enough

[viscid thistle]

https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/188

[random pollen]

merged

[viscid thistle]

Appreciate it

[viscid thistle]

Did you give any more thought to the news post components?

[random pollen]

no is there a pr

[viscid thistle]

Nah just a branch for now

[random pollen]

are there previews without making a pr

[pliant canopy]

What's the branch name?

[viscid thistle]

Uh

Yeah

[pliant canopy]

Assuming it is mdx-improvements, there is a URL: https://feat-mdx-improvements-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev

[viscid thistle]

https://feat-mdx-improvements-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev/news/1-21-9-and-10/

On the downloads page for Paper, is there a reason we are fetching builds for 1.21.10, 1.21.9, 1.21.9-rc1 + pre 4 3 2 + 1.21.8 when the user loads it?

[pliant canopy]

Okay so that's cool, but I kinda dislike how badly it wraps. I have no suggestions to improve it, but it's kinda ehh

[viscid thistle]

Oh nvm that makes sense

[pliant canopy]

Idk owen being on a new line triggers me somehow

[viscid thistle]

I suppose we do have builds across all of those.

[pliant canopy]

Can we remove owen from the news post thx /s

[viscid thistle]

Okay we're already doing cloudflare cache hits and etag so that's good at least

Well actually, we only have 1.21.8 and 1.21.10 builds for download so why are we fetching everything in-between?

Oh is this the thing jmp was talking to Riley about for filtering better but needed some changes done in the fill api?

[random pollen]

again it's probing for what the stable and experimental versions are based on available builds

and this is jroy code in the site I'm just fixing it

we can skip pres/rcs there

I'll do that

https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/189

[viscid thistle]

Ahh gotcha yeah that makes sense. I don't think I was fully aware of it all.

This speeds things up a bit as well. It's like 5 less requests that it has to do.

Went ahead and merged that in. Love how we keep finding places for speed improvements. We're getting really close to first load being on-par with NextJS ISR.

[random pollen]

(without loading skeletons :p)

[viscid thistle]

Also true

[random pollen]

the other thought I had was we can add them back, but they will only be shown to an uncached visitor; i.e. return the page immediately and prime the cache after so the next request has cached data

idk how realistic that is though

maybe it wouldn't be too bad, I'll give it a try tonight

[viscid thistle]

Hang on, I have a theory to test.

Maybe not. I'll play with it in a bit. I think the delay is between the worker serving the page and the download now.

Because that all happens on the worker side not client

Edit: Okay it looks like we do a fetch in the client component too.

So need to figure out how to see logs for that.

Fresh:

[DEBUG] getProject START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper
[DEBUG] getProject END 200 115 ms
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.10/builds/latest
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild END 200 502 ms
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.9/builds/latest
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild END 200 496 ms
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.8/builds/latest
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild END 200 498 ms
[DEBUG] getVersionBuilds START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.8/builds
[DEBUG] getVersionBuilds END 200 480 ms

Cached:

[DEBUG] getProject START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper
[DEBUG] getProject END 200 69 ms
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.10/builds/latest
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild END 200 49 ms
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.9/builds/latest
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild END 200 43 ms
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.8/builds/latest
[DEBUG] getLatestBuild END 200 42 ms
[DEBUG] getVersionBuilds START https://fill.papermc.io/v3/projects/paper/versions/1.21.8/builds
[DEBUG] getVersionBuilds END 200 54 ms

[random pollen]

only when toggling experimental

i’m not home rn but i will play with it later

[viscid thistle]

Okie dokie

[hard quartz]

not comments for the 404 PR?
-# any suggest for the image or keep xd

[viscid thistle]

I couldn't find it

[drowsy zinc]

@pliant canopy no pr previews today

[pliant canopy]

Ohhh bruhh

Okay I suppose that also means no deployments in general, not even on main

So no point in merging that today

Also I kinda did not apply the suggestions from jmp because I wanted it to be just one commit, so please manually add this to the extended commit description for the credit:

Co-authored-by: Jason Penilla <[e-mail]>

I believe that should be the correct email?

[viscid thistle]

I think that might've been related to the Microsoft outage that started, but I think it should be mostly stable again?

[pliant canopy]

Lemme try re-running

Still dies

One last try and then I will give up for the day

[viscid thistle]

Pretty happy with this. The accessibility stuff is just complaining about some of the footer text in light mode not having enough contrast.

[fair river]

Has been a great fun watching you did the work. Nice job Glare

[lean venture]

always fun to watch other people work xD

But indeed, very nice job glare

[jagged pecan]

does diff-viewer/diffs.dev support loading a patch-from-url from the url?
ie https://diffs.dev/?github_url= equivalent for this

in particular, i was looking for vineflower's diff-machine, which just dumps the raw patches
https://jaskarth.com/vineflower/diffs/a0d5c2058abc02e92c634bcdbaf4392e53abd98c.diff
(ik its currently not working directly due to cors issues)

also tried with the firefox extension, but that just seems to use github_url, which fails

[lean venture]

Also just checked the docs with this, and it's all green and high up too!

[spice temple]

not from the looks of it but seems easy enough to add https://github.com/PaperMC/diff-viewer/blob/master/web/src/routes/OpenDiffDialog.svelte#L53

[random pollen]

for vf just use the github commit link instead

[jagged pecan]

diff machine is something else, its running vineflower against a fixed set of libraries
https://github.com/Vineflower/regression-listener
the output isnt on github

e.g. https://jaskarth.com/vineflower/diffs/14bd94a3d70651f3212827f9ae0902592ca4a66c.diff
also the cors issue is now resolved, so you can paste it into diffs.dev

[random pollen]

oh yeah forgot about that

[last bear]

No paperchan in my town

[pliant canopy]

Not your decision

[neon atlas]

Good to know docs team members can be banned

[hard quartz]

The alternative is a Paper logo crushed but i dont know how to use MS Paint

[last bear]

Watch me ^_^

[empty grove]

Make it an animation of the paper airplane taking off, but then immediately falling down /s

[hard quartz]

Why two times?

[last bear]

you can use

or

||/s||

[hard quartz]

From where are that? xd

[last bear]

essentialsx

[pliant canopy]

essentialsx has their own discord server?

I thought they were at MOSS

[last bear]

there's a separate essx dev one that like 2 people are in

[pliant canopy]

lol

[fair river]

There is one for normie and one for cooler people

[hard quartz]

another try.... if only has that image a better resolution xd

[vocal halo]

wold be nice if it looked like it crashed into the ground.

like it being bent or something.

[fair river]

Time to ask AI

[pliant canopy]

@random pollen a few notes:

1. The older builds explorer has white text over yelow for beta builds.

2. I like the hover changes you did to the download button(s), but at the same time I kinda dislike the toggle-button's text being white and centered. Maybe reverting the text styling back could be nice? Idk I just think it looks nicer.

3. I like the borders you did around the server download buttons, but I think they might be a bit "agressive". Idk how to really say it, but perhaps slightly subtler colors in relation to the background (maybe adding some alpha)?

[random pollen]

it's draft for a reason I am still working on it

[pliant canopy]

I know, I just wanted to give an early review

[random pollen]

I will mark it ready for review when it's ready

[pliant canopy]

Is the PR description AI generated lol

[random pollen]

yes

ready for review now though

[pliant canopy]

Right, so point 2/3 still kinda stands, but after looking for it for a while, it seems fine tbh

[random pollen]

there's more I want to do but this is enough for one PR, also known issue with the nested buttons on the big download button causing everything to dance

but thats pretty minor and very annoying to fix

[pliant canopy]

Lol fair

epic css load fail

(Not your fault)

Actually

Maybe might be your fault

Yeah

[random pollen]

firefox issue?

[pliant canopy]

When I click the downloads button from https://misc-style-improvements-papermc-website.papermc.workers.dev/software/paper/, it fails to load the css

I am on chromium

[random pollen]

does not happen for me

[pliant canopy]

Weird

[random pollen]

maybe disable cache in network tab and try again

[pliant canopy]

Yeah disabling cache fixed

Lemme enable it again and try again

Okay fixed

lmao

Okay it screwed itself over again

Hmm

Does not happen with the main site though

[viscid thistle]

For some people on GitHub there's a button you can click when you go to open a PR and it generates an overview for you.

[pliant canopy]

Gläre, mind trying clicking around here a bit to check if the css fails for you as well?

[viscid thistle]

I've been testing changes with jmp on each commit and haven't ran into this at all.

[pliant canopy]

Weird

I am failing to reproduce this now either

weird...

[random pollen]

cloudflare hiccup on your edge node

[pliant canopy]

Fr

Damn I just lost a star on one of my projects

[random pollen]

@viscid thistle do you know if there's a reason the navbar doesn't have a bg color until the page is scrolled? it causes glitches when scrolling fast on mobile and on the waterfall pages with the eol banners

I feel like we could just always have the bg color, and then adjust the scroll condition to > 1px instead of 64, so it whenever you're scrolled at all

(need to use >1, not >0, otherwise it doesn't work with overscroll bounce back in mobile)

[viscid thistle]

I do not know off the top of my head

[random pollen]

ok, I'll open a PR with that change later unless someone else beats me to it

[random pollen]

https://github.com/PaperMC/website/pull/198

[viscid thistle]

https://tenor.com/view/chop-approve-cop-approve-lulus-jalan-boleh-gif-9606558

[mighty dirge]

ah yes the shattered paper plane

[opal flare]

I like

[hard quartz]

yeah?
i prefer the PaperChan option xd but can send this

[opal flare]

no paperchan

[hard quartz]

ok i send that changes

[twilit fog]

why not a crumpled papermc plane?

[last bear]

Crumbled would look nice too

[hard quartz]

i dont like this xd

[fair river]

Yeah I think it’s a bit too much. The original is good enough hard to control what AI really do.

[vocal halo]

Can you send the original image?

I have an idea

[hard quartz]

the original its the icon of the Docs Team xd i get with the inspector xd

[spice temple]

make it the brand color instead

ye

[opal flare]

actually

here

enjoy

[vocal halo]

Just as a general idea something like that maybe?

[twilit fog]

I was thinking something like this

[lean venture]

I like that

Gonna steal it for hangar 😂

[spice temple]

The button on the download page should prolly say alpa/beta builds nowadays, not experimental

In case somebody wants to work on that

[scenic gull]

Relatedly, I wonder if we should consider changing how promote or, rather, barely promote the beta builds. Alpha, sure, make it much less visible. Like, maybe change the same-as-background color of the button to the beta color? To distinguish a bit more between the three types of build we can be at

[serene vault]

I would just show the beta builds in the normal list of builds tbh. I don't think there is any reason to hide them. Just a little disclaimer about them being potentially more unstable than the normal builds

[vocal halo]

^^

Maybe even display them by default and provide the button to switch to stable, previous version builds?

[half dune]

Does anyone have a compiled version i can have

[scenic gull]

Of our docs? The compiled version is viewable by looking at any docs page I guess? 🤔

[half dune]

I need it downloaded

for offline use

ik its weird

[scenic gull]

You can build our docs yourself by reading the directions on the readme.

[half dune]

I was hoping someone else would have had them compiled

[viscid thistle]

Just clone the repo and build it and use it offline?

[half dune]

I didnt want to take the time, but i guess

[random pollen]

@spice temple when you get a chance could you look over the MDX improvements PR again? should be ready now

[spice temple]

looks good now

[pliant canopy]

Syntax highlighting for flags and named arguments ✨

I've also finally understood the tmLanguage file format. The previous syntax highlight file was made with ChatGPT (💀), this one is hand-written though

Actually I need opinions. What about making the tag name render as a keyword, so that the tag name and the named argument name are colored differently?

[spice temple]

I will never get used to these, lol

[pliant canopy]

Sorry for fucking up your beautiful format

[pliant canopy]

Actually doing it this way around looks much cleaner, so that's what it will be

[opal flare]

what is that format?

[pliant canopy]

Named arguments. I've got a PR for that in #1304. The original issue was this: https://github.com/PaperMC/adventure/issues/1296.

[hearty briar]

too much color for no particular reason

it just adds noise imo

I think it looks better if the tag name and argument names are the same color but I am not the one doing the syntax highlighting so ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[lean venture]

I love this format ngl

html like xD

[pliant canopy]

I mean, I'd be down for something like this

[lilac edge]

my opinion matters and i say i'm fine with both 😌

[random pollen]

added as patch_url

[scenic gull]

I tried finding info on our per-world difficulty changes on the docs and couldn't. Am I blind, is search bad, or is it missing?

[pliant canopy]

all of it I think it is genuinely undocumented, it certainly wouldn't surprise me

Maybe at least adding it to https://docs.papermc.io/paper/vanilla/#further-considerations could be great for people who aren't aware that gamerules and difficulties are per-world and for Vanilla they'd need to apply those in each dimension

Or actually, is there some setting in Paper to make those global in the first place?

[scenic gull]

Are there other commands we've changed? May be worth documenting those on the commands page.

[pliant canopy]

I believe those are the only ones, the remaining Vanilla commands should be the same

I can't think of anything at least

[vocal halo]

Per world difficulties are a bukkit thing?

Bruh

[eager plover]

Well, the difficulity is tied to the save data which is global in vanilla

[turbid plinth]

Whoever makes these docs is awesome. I didn't even know most of them existed. The amount of depth that https://docs.papermc.io/paper/dev/particles/ has alone is just incredible. Thank you Paper team 👏

[drowsy zinc]

no problem

(a contributor made that)

[twilit fog]

❤️

[pliant canopy]

@drowsy zinc do we have any interest in switching from pnpm to bun to match the website, or no?

[pliant canopy]

Also I think setting up some sort of caching for some of these things could be nice, because I am getting rate limited from re-running the build

[lean venture]

bun is poggers

[pliant canopy]

Bun is great, yeah

[drowsy zinc]

is there a performance benefit in our case?

I don't mind switching for the ci and whatnot but I don't want to require bun for people contributing, everyone has node but not bun

[pliant canopy]

Seems like it has basically no performance benefit whatsoever. Nevermind then, we can stay on pnpm ```q

time pnpm build
pnpm build 20.10s user 4.80s system 61% cpu 40.187 total

```q
> time bun run build
bun run build  20.61s user 5.23s system 96% cpu 26.803 total

I should've maybe tried that before suggesting the switch; I kinda just ✨ expected ✨ it to be faster

[lean venture]

40 to 26s is a decent time, also, did you run it after first run?

I find bun to be faster after a few runs

it's like the whole maven vs gradle thing again xD

[pliant canopy]

I ran both things twice

So those stats are the second run

[lean venture]

hmm yeah not sure

but I do usually have better experience with bun

tbh I don't think it hurts nor is it hard to switch lol

[pliant canopy]

Actually wait, yeah, 40 vs 26. That's kind of a big difference

[spice temple]

There is a difference in using bun as a runtime and as a package manager

[pliant canopy]

I was only looking at the first 20.XXs seconds

[pliant canopy]

Preferably we'd do both, but runtime would require changing the cf pages setting, which only one of you red bois can do

[spice temple]

You demonstrated the runtime, which is faster, but try deleting node modules and comparing bun install to pnpm install

Does cf even support bun?

They have their own runtime

[pliant canopy]

Actually idk for runtime tbh

Nvm I am stupid

They do as package managers though

Dude I feel like an LLM rn with the amount of "Oh yeah you're right" I am doing

It's late, give me a break

[hard quartz]

https://developers.cloudflare.com/pages/configuration/build-image/ (?

[pliant canopy]

Anyways... I am not sure if this is a good benchmark ```
bun i 0.10s user 0.10s system 129% cpu 0.147 total
pnpm i 1.99s user 0.36s system 317% cpu 0.741 total

[spice temple]

Bun as a runtime still has tons of issues, they just recently fixed a big memory leak

[pliant canopy]

I mean I guess it's fine

[spice temple]

But Hangar has been using it for a while as runtime

[pliant canopy]

I guess we can switch to bun as the "primarly" package manager for the docs though

[lean venture]

laughs if this is the reason why it sometimes crashed

[pliant canopy]

I don't see any issues

keep support for pnpm, but discourage it maybe

or something in that area

Might speed up our CI times as well, which would be nice

[spice temple]

Pnpm as package manager is fast enough and less of a barrier for people, especially since core pack doesnt support bun

[pliant canopy]

As I was saying, keep it supported and running

[spice temple]

I cant run bun at work because of issues, especially around instrumentation

[vocal halo]

Why change a running system? If it’s still there there is no benefit of adding bun

[drowsy zinc]

cf pages runtime doesn't matter for us because we're serving static assets and the builds are in github actions

so the only things to be considered are DX and CI speed

[slate arrow]

hey, just wanted to ask before making a pr, would it be a welcomed change to also include the commiter's profile picture in the Last updated: footer? like in this picture

[drowsy zinc]

we already have the id so why not

[neon atlas]

Can't wait for contributor Alice to change their profile picture to a swastika after merging their commit.

[pliant canopy]

I mean we already have a page will all contributors' profile pictures, so not like it would change a whole bunch

[neon atlas]

Yea it's fine xd

[neon epoch]

Has this happened before?

[neon atlas]

Not on paper I don't think.

Other projects I worked on however

[neon epoch]

lol

Off to change my work slack pfp

[grand dew]

the shadow core team let you do that?

[neon atlas]

[vocal halo]

Maybe because he is part of the shadow core team

[fair river]

No. He’s atomic

[slate arrow]

a pr has been opened then

from the pr branch

i think it looks good enough, i opted in to using the Image component from astro:assets as it was poking me about it during dev time saying that its more performant lol

https://github.com/PaperMC/docs/pull/687

[pliant canopy]

Ayyy

[lean venture]

Ew

who put strokkur's pfp there

[pliant canopy]

Imma await the scorp approve and then we can prolly get this merged already

[lean venture]

W

[slate arrow]

dont hate my man strokkur

[lean venture]

hate is a very distinct word.

I have a love/hate relationship with strokkur

more love than hate though

[pliant canopy]

Damn

[lean venture]

strokkur finding out I am his secret admirer

[neon epoch]

Awww

Didn’t realise #docs-website had descended to a dating app

Bring back the steam scams?

[wispy python]

I believe this has been deprecated

[hard quartz]

docs point to 1.21.8 then "not" deprecated in that time xd
but yeah i think need to be removed or mention this is the default bahaviour since 1.21.10

[drowsy zinc]

if you could PR a fix for when 1.21.10 becomes stable, that'd be great

[twilit fog]

question, how many PRs are there in the backlog for 1.21.10 rn

[drowsy zinc]

for docs? just yours really

[pliant canopy]

The docs are a dead project

[hard quartz]

Me or 3add?

[drowsy zinc]

🏎️

[random pollen]

@drowsy zinc is that a custom component for the resizable panes and tabs on slicer or where is it from?

(sorry for wrong ping)

this new ui is horrible if I type ping and then try to send without a space after it will ping someone with no-ping in their name

how can I disable pings without an @

[serene vault]

"show suggestions for user mentions when typing" in the chat settings, you can turn it off

[random pollen]

thanks

[drowsy zinc]

it's just resizable from shadcn-svelte

https://www.shadcn-svelte.com/docs/components/resizable

[lean venture]

where is this being used?

[random pollen]

where in the code are you managing the tabs

https://slicer.run/

[lean venture]

wth is that, looks cool