And we don't even know if it was refreshment approved
#politics
near glen
I required a seal of approval on every wikipedia link to know if it's refreshment approved
loud flax
fox news sometime back came out with an article talking about biased fact checkers who had to retract statements and all that stuff
i'd assume a fact checker, regardless of party or news organization, ought to come to the same conclusion as the others
foggy fern
Problem is the fact checkers on facebook and such are trying to fact check breaking "news" (a lot of it is gossip trash and urban legend kind of stuff) so sometimes everything they can find within a day says one thing but a couple days later it turns out everyone was wrong
Then Fox News points at that and says we shouldn't have them at all
If people stopped spreading bullshit at such a high rate the fact checkers would be more accurate
News stories used to get a day or two to simmer so you can go more in depth and double or triple check everything
Now people are just saying random shit on cable news and it's instantly going viral on social media
near glen
Don't you guys have like a press codex or smth?
We got an independent board of all news orgs that watches over our codex and reprimand (?) all violations
There is one big org that collects violations like candy but its generally fine
faint radish
Who is on this board?
copper flower
tbf we also got the Bild so the board is not necessarily working perfectly 😄
No idea who is on the board tho. Its a self-control system, so I would assume journalists and publishers
warm ibex
keen swift
I think it is WAY to early to start opening up https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/map-international-travel-restrictions-covid-n1262372
faint radish
Do you mean on a world scale? Hardly any business Ive gone into in the past 2 weeks has required a mask and I haven’t worn one in almost that long
On a world scale, yeah, for some places sure. Where the vaccine density is still low
restive seal
Yeah! Let's go cough on each other as the founding fathers intended.
shy gulch
wait why is america talking about travelling
Give it some time jesus, you already got #1 priority for vaccines and now want to travel to places without such access
warm ibex
founding fathers went back on the "rights" they wrote about all the time btw
especially the monarchist federalist party
restive seal
Freedom to infect others!
To hell with being safe when you can have the freedom to spread a deadly virus and let it mutate into more effective variants and maybe even ones that the vaccines can't stop!
The fact anyone had to be forced to be safe really gave me doubts about our ability to keep our own species alive let alone the rest of the planet.
Do you consider "wear a mask while this deadly virus is spreading" or "don't cross this international border while a deadly virus is spreading" to be worrying signs of a dictatorship?
shy gulch
Are you actually stopped when trying to leave the US?
I remember for entering Canada, the US airports were more worried you would fly over here and get stopped from entering by our airports. But this was probably over a year ago
I'd assume you more need the rest of the world to open up and accept international travel rather then the US allowing you to do that travel.
warm ibex
that your appeal to "the rights the founding fathers have given us" doesn't really stand
they themselves broke these rights when it was necessary
restive seal
Ah, so you're a conspiracy theorist. Got it. Because it's a big, nonsensical leap from protect against virus to a brain chip.
tough cedar
you're not worth putting a brain chip in
shy gulch
I kinda doubt putting a brain chip will be enforced
restive seal
lol
restive seal
We shouldn't have needed to have any restrictions because people should have worn masks without being forced. But people are stupid as hell.
tough cedar
it'll be great
no i'm not trolling
it sounds like a great idea
im glad you suggested it
I will contact my representative, Ted Cruz that I would like him to implement your suggestion that every american get a Kim Jong Un Haircut
shy gulch
I did a quick search and I see a lack of kim jong un haircut restrictions, does seem like you're only allowed from a list of approved options tho
restive seal
Ah yes the classic "all baddies are lefties"
I'm going to bed. Enjoy living in your self constructed world of fear, Refreshment.
In America the right wants the federal government to have the power to control all women's bodies so... 🤷
shy gulch
no one answered if you're allowed to leave the US 
tough cedar
remember mbaxter, the chart!
the right and left in america are actually the same!
my bad, should've been more specific
"what we know as the right and left in america are actually the same!"
if we're taking mbaxters assertion to be true that is
tough cedar
you have to look at the chart for it to make sense
oh there it is
what we know as facism typically being a right wing position is actually a left wing position
shy gulch
ok so the left supporting freedoms around abortions is proper
ok but no one is going far left in the US
and why is that
tough cedar
but bernie doesn't want to put you in jail for having an abortion
i don't think aoc does either but i haven't brushed up on my aoc knowledge
shy gulch
US been funding human right abusers for awhile now
tough cedar
I see, thank you for providing me with this enlightening information
I hope to one day see the light as you do
well im sure glad i don't support bernie
probably not because of his socialist policies though, I just don't like him
tough cedar
if by outstanding you mean absolute worst president we could have ever possibly hand then yes i agree
damn!
i'll vote for whoever I think will make america a better place
if they happen to be in the GOP, I may vote for the GOP, if they're a Democrat, i'll vote for a democrat
Currently, very unfortunately, the GOP does not look like a group of people that can better america and increase america's influence globally
well, i guess it's the democrats turn to impress me, hopefully they can do the things I stated otherwise I might not have anyone to vote for
certainly won't vote for any member of the GOP that still clings to Donald Trump as he made America look weak
shy gulch
def been looking like a no good option vote
tough cedar
and implementing isolationist foreign policy weakens the American hegemony and I will not stand for it
Implementing isolationist foreign policy makes america weaker
any place where America decreases their influence allows for Russia and China to increase theirs
yea, he tariffed them directly but wouldn't partner with Europe at all
ok! cool you are for a weak america too
Quite unfortunate
being able to exhert influence on another country is a sign of strength
not working with allies makes you weak
yup, to get a man who was weakening the american hegemony out of office
we might actually get an infrastructure plan out of biden too
will make our country stronger if he can get it passed
yup, super happy
so happy
you wouldn't believe how happy i am, so happy in fact, you might say it's fabricated
they're people just like everyone else
what kind of question is that
I'm aware of what he has said
and what he has said years later as well
edit: in reality I do care, but for the sake of paying the troll toll we often say the opposite thing
I don't think 81 million other voters in america cared either
yea, maybe they can be saved one day because I'm certainly a lost cause
shy gulch
has trump not said anything racist?
Not like I remember racist things a president say
Research would give me that
tough cedar
no no, only biden is racist, and anything trump said is just being misconstrued
because... trump was an outstanding president, arnah
that's the only possible explanation
shy gulch
would need to put an age cap on positions in office to prevent racists from entering
Lotta racist old people
Never said young people weren't also racist
sadly people are born in a world where others are racist too
and learn from them
tough cedar
i mean there was 'pocahontas' and 'china virus' from trump
there we go, nice dismissal
no it's not
you've 'rebutted' these claims before i'm sure
and i've seen the 'rebuttals'
damn, the ancap is telling me i'm wrong
maybe tomorrow a commie will tell me i'm wrong
lol ancaps and commies are in the same basket in my view
they're equally delusional in their ideological beliefs
foggy fern
Remember when Donald Trump took out a full page ad calling for innocent people to be put to death anyway?
Looters got to the place before the government, such as it were, even knew it was empty
thorn crest
tell me an innocent or truthful or even honest politicians name...
oh wait there really isnt any...
but I mean it goes both ways, could talk about bidens "I dont want my kids growing in a racial jungle" statement. but I digress. Politics is a mess.
cant really trust any of these people. they're friends, history shows that, they in it for themselves. >.<
they also like to put on a show and rowel people up. They did it in both elections quite well, as well as everything else. too many distractions while other bigger issues are happening that nothings being done about..
pure jetty
I mean yes that's how politics works you need to get votes
What matters is what they do when they're finally elected
And Biden is currently ballin the fuck out so that's good!
thorn crest
Who's that?
restive seal
Just some troll
thorn crest
ah okay :p
loud flax
oh did the ancap get booted
well if so, that's a few days worth of out of context conversations as people will now be seen as arguing with a phantom, thanks for deleting banned accounts' messages, discord
restive seal
I think ancap is a generous way of simplifying their disturbing viewpoints.
rich sun
well if so, that's a few days worth of out of context conversations as people wi...
(FYI, that isn't Discord, that's Warship/Eraser, but it's useful especially when people are spamming links or smth)
loud flax
oh ok
foggy fern
Dunno why this guy thought he could spew antivaxx junk on LKML... http://lkml.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/2106.1/04596.html
loud flax
lmao, poor linus has to deal with all kinds of people it seems like
mystic ermine
Horrors of being big in this industry is that while few, there are people who fit the typical stereotypes of the basement shut-in who are often overly self worshiping and as such often vocal af
near glen
accurate 😄
foggy fern
From The Onion to reality in 10 years
stable sable
"news source"
daring locust
joke news but still news
warm ibex
pure jetty
0 chance of anything happening there
warm ibex
yep
pure jetty
Would be surprised a judge doesn't even dismiss it
faint radish
God I wish the media would stop reporting on lawsuits being filed
Anyone can file a lawsuit
But no, gotta get clicks
faint radish
no, its not worth mentioning. I don't give a crap about what any former president does
just like I also dont care about what any current or former first lady does
none of them were elected, or still have power to affect my life
I care what the current president does
faint radish
so are celebrities, I care even less about what they do
near glen
Some ppl do 🤷♂️
faint radish
sure, but serious media, who dont normally report on literally anything a former pres does, are doing that for trump
if he is actually considering running again, that might be a different story
but if he was, the media, who almost all of them dont like Trump, needs to learn from their mistake last time
they covered trump constantly, he always controlled the story of the day, even when he was running for election still
so I would think, if the media doesn't want trump re-elected, they would just mostly ignore his every move. But, people will still read stories about trump, and that means ad revenue for them
near glen
I mean, that's the market
If you don't like that, fight for a better system
Easiest way to do that is pay for a subscription, I do that for my local news paper to make sure they can continue to provide neutral and high quality news
faint radish
There isn't a better system. The government certainly can't be anywhere near regulating the media.
Yep, paid news is almost always better, but its a cultural thing too.
This goes along with how americans are looking for the cheapest thing now
like washing machines
are way cheaper now, but are just crappy, and break quickly, but its cheaper
shut vine
Well the last time he was elected was probably mostly because they couldn't stop covering him.
faint radish
I'd much rather pay for smth more expensive thats actually good quality
and that's a culture thing, not something a government can regulate away
near glen
I never said government
You decide what you consume
If you pay for stuff, you ensure the stuff you consume is able to stay at a certain quality level
shut vine
Too many idiots can't get enough of it 😛
The market wants it and cares for it, there's pretty much zero chance in that changing in a meaningful way anytime soon
foggy fern
Former presidents usually try to avoid getting in the news for a year or two after leaving office
As a courtesy to their replacement and as some time to unwind and reflect
shut vine
Hasn't been the norm for quite a few cycles.
Like back into the 70s, potentially more, I'm not overly aware of Carter and his predecessors public life post-presidency
foggy fern
Obama was fairly quiet until the 2018 election iirc
Bush was basically a pariah by the end so probably a bad example but I don't think he's done any partisan campaigning at all
I don't remember hearing much from Clinton after 2000
People were jumping on Obama for being as active as he was so soon
shut vine
Clinton did within the calendar year of 2000, he helped bolster Hilary's campaign for NY Senator in that year.
Also avoiding getting in the news is not the actual unwritten rule btw
The actual unwritten rule Trump is guilty of I don't think any of the others are 😛
foggy fern
iirc the main thing is not commenting on the performance of their replacement
But they do seem to try to stay out of the news entirely, probably mostly because for the first time in years they aren't being micromanaged and watched like a hawk so want to just enjoy the downtime
Obama pretty much immediately said Trump would do and was doing a terrible job but not directly, he was always vague or coy about it in the beginning
He didn't directly go against Trump or his policies until he was helping others with their elections iirc
Still broke the rule though
daring locust
whoops, could've sworn this was music
shut vine
iirc the main thing is not commenting on the performance of their replacement
yea that's it haha, the only question I have is if that's beneficial to the people or not - generally when career politicians do something like this I figure there is an incentive that manipulates people, however I am not sure how this particular element would matter if other politicians can be critical
shut vine
But they do seem to try to stay out of the news entirely, probably mostly becaus...
Yeah the motivation to stay out of the news is probably also the same questions are going to be asked of any defeated president
"How is your successor doing", "Your successor did this, what do you think" etc etc
warm ibex
could be a play on the word champion since he's congratulating on an achievement
drifting arch
Everyone is losing their minds in the replies
restive seal
Calls on the leading antitrust agencies, the Department of Justice (DOJ) and Federal Trade Commission (FTC), to enforce the antitrust laws vigorously and recognizes that the law allows them to challenge prior bad mergers that past Administrations did not previously challenge.
This has the potential to be interesting.
drifting arch
Make it easier and cheaper to repair items you own by limiting manufacturers from barring self-repairs or third-party repairs of their products.
Mega-pog
restive seal
In the Order, the President encourages the FCC to:
Prevent ISPs from making deals with landlords that limit tenants’ choices.
drifting arch
In the Order, the President:
Directs HHS to standardize plan options in the National Health Insurance Marketplace so people can comparison shop more easily.
This is going to help a lot
Assuming it gets implemented properly
near glen
I hate executive orders, no matter if they good or bad, they have no real democratical legitimation :/
drifting arch
i mean true, but congress has been approving a shitton of bills that the senate is just declining
so no progress has been made because the literal children cannot/will not stop being literal children
near glen
Wooo for broken systems
drifting arch
Yeah don't get me wrong, it's a shitshow
And while not optimal, this should kickstart some much needed things
restive seal
I hate executive orders, no matter if they good or bad, they have no real democr...
Unless I missed something in there, the order is a pile of "let's use the various powers that congress voted to grant the executive branch to make things better"
pure jetty
^
Executive orders are 90% just used to execute powers already given to the president
10% of the time its creative interpretation of what power is given to them
drifting arch
I mean yeah, it is constitutional of course, he was just saying it didnt have a vote or anything, it's coming directly from the president. so while the powers that granted him the power to submit EOs was democratic, that any EO is not democratic by definition because it came solely from the gov and not from the people
which makes sense, but i have no issue with this EO
v happy bout it
near glen
Oh I didn't care about the content
Just generally about the EOs as a concept
I don't think they should exist and be used that often
drifting arch
to some extent i agree, but the way the american government is set up we need them because the house and senate can completely halt progress by not working together
which has been going on for a while now
house is dem controlled, senate is repub controlled. house passes something, senate shoots it down
they're having a little war rn
pure jetty
an EO usually isn't to scary
if it's within the 90% I was talking about its because the president needs to do them
it's pretty much a formal way for the president to enact power given to him
hence why you'll see them reference laws inside the actual EO's constantly
foggy fern
house is dem controlled, senate is repub controlled. house passes something, sen...
Senate is basically no one controlled right now
Technically the Dems control it because they got the tiebreaker vote on "who is in charge" but since you need 60 people to do basically anything and neither has that no one can actually do anything
pure jetty
yeah only time stuff can get passed with a simple majority is during budget reconciliation (which has limits on the type of laws passed during it)
foggy fern
Specifically they can only do taxes and spending in those bills
They couldn't change the rules for net neutrality or voting rights or antitrust or anything like that in there
pure jetty
net neutrality and antitrust are done in the FTC and Justice Department respectively
FTC chairman can reinstate net neutrality themselves (or maybe a majority of the main council i forget)
foggy fern
FCC does net neutrality
shut vine
Last time either party had 60 was in the 70's.
remote oracle
it's pretty funny how stunted the american political perspective is
like, I spent years hearing about this socialist boogeyman who steals votes from the democrats and now that I'm looking into him and he's actually one of the few genuinely good people in the us gov rn
pure jetty
Most socialists are good enough to understand that voting dem is for their greater good
There are loud minority who are the Bernie or buster type who think not voting = better for the country so they can "stick it" to the DNC are the dangerous type. People like Briahna Joy Gray, Kyle, Jimmy Dore etc
near glen
How is not voting ever good, lol
pure jetty
it's not, but the people who advocate for it aren't the brightest
dusky raft
nothing is really stopping people from voting candidates who didnt get their parties rubberstamp of approval, however we are really stuck in the ways of if they arent on the ballot, they dont exist.
mystic ermine
I mean, not voting can be neutral?
Unless you're one of those who supports "one of the two big parties" in which case me not voting is LITERALLY stealing a vote from your fave party and do you WANT their not fave party to win?!
near glen
Well, I bet there are more than two options
Voting is a civil duty and not voting gives extremist the edge
pure jetty
not voting only helps the other side
near glen
That assumes there are side and you picked one
pure jetty
Well I mean sure
mystic ermine
I mean, in my city, there is literally 1 option
anything else serves to stand as nothing more than a "i don't like you" vote
on the basis that I don't like that 1 option, and on the basis that all the other options are basically tories or "no namer promising out of their ass", it's entirely an eeeeee situation
shut vine
Realistically every person on the ballot is an actual option, the establishment would prefer everyone thinks they only have a choice between the big parties and if you don't vote for them you're throwing away your vote however.
foggy fern
The lawsuit was thrown out in October 2008 because a subpoena notifying God of the lawsuit could not be delivered to God, who has no listed address. Chambers countered that, because of God's omniscience, God had been notified, but decided not to pursue the suit further.
No context for posting that, it's just hilarious
Found it while looking for this:
In 2015, Chambers introduced LB268, repealing the state's death penalty. The measure passed the legislature over Governor Pete Ricketts's veto. Following the veto, a petition drive was undertaken to reject the bill and maintain capital punishment. Enough signatures were secured to suspend LB268 until the November 2016 general election; in the election, 60% of the votes cast favored rejecting the repeal and keeping the death penalty.
tough cedar
oh boy, the texas dems are fleeing the state again to prevent the special session from voting on the voting bill
now they're going to D.C
restive seal
The two new priority voting bills for the state's Republicans would ban drive-through and 24-hour voting, make mail-in voting more difficult and give partisan poll watchers more authority at voting sites.
Another provision, which would increase criminal penalties for voting mistakes, has garnered additional attention after the arrest last week of a Houston man, Hervis Rogers, for allegedly voting while on parole, which is illegal in Texas.
Charming
tough cedar
yea, democrats haven't fled the state in a real long time
i think the last time they did it was in the early 2000s
oh look the article mentions the last time they did that lol
restive seal
In addition to the voting bills, a walkout would block passage of other GOP priority legislation, including a measure that would make it harder for people accused of crimes to bond out of jail.
Ah, good ol' punished until proven not guilty.
foggy fern
Voting in a primary 3 months before your parole ends? $100,000 bail
waxen spoke
why does a minecraft plugin discord server have a politics board lmao
did it really get thay bad on #general
faint radish
Politics is where the real paper dev work is done.
waxen spoke
plus 95% of you all are probably left leaning anyways so not much room for debate
wouldnt be surpised if i get banned over this statement
faint radish
🤡
near glen
You would get banned for obviously not having any intention to participate in this discussion channel outside of trying to ridicule it's existance
waxen spoke
thats a discussion, whats the point of a politics board on a minecraft server client dc server
near glen
This is a channel for the regulars, a group of friends, to discuss all kind of topics, while giving everybody else a chance to hide this channel by muting it, if they don't want to see these topics
dark crystal
wouldnt be surpised if i get banned over this statement
it depends, are you an anarchocapitalist?
waxen spoke
anarchocapitalism is too extreme in my opinion, but im leaning somewhere there.
loud flax
my position is i believe in moral constants that are independent of people, which i think is far more than anyone in here takes a position on
dark crystal
I believe that the invisible hand of the free market should not have a hand on what is morally correct for our society
waxen spoke
to dumb it down, government regulation can smd and wheres my guns?
loud flax
i wonder about the gun nuts tbh, they probably trust their guns more than their speech
dark crystal
to dumb it down, government regulation can smd and wheres my guns?
nah
i meant more like
fuck the guns and give me socialized healthcare
which i already do in my country actually
waxen spoke
Im my opinion everyone has the right to guns, just that not everyone has the intelligence to properly use them
loud flax
yeah
i think that's fair to say
it seems to me though that people would sooner go to war over their gun rights being taken away than their speech being taken away
and that makes me puzzled
but it takes speech to fight for gun rights...
waxen spoke
it seems to me though that people would sooner go to war over their gun rights b...
yeah
they would give back their guns
starting with the bullets
loud flax
my belief is that words are way more powerful than any gun is
not in the immediate sense at least as far as destruction is concerned
waxen spoke
yeah yeah, but a government that takes away the peoples right to own weapons isn't a good sign
waxen spoke
my belief is that words are way more powerful than any gun is
and of the uses those guns do are there to ensure that doesn't get infringed
waxen spoke
defeatist? I don't feel defeated, I feel angry that this has been a problem for 50 years with no substantial action
if we find better ways of producing energy, or if we decide to go more nuclear then it won't be a problem for long
@drifting arch
near glen
There are way better ways of producing energy
And there have been for decades
They just have been sabotaged by lobbying
Like always
drifting arch
Of course if we find better ways of producing energy, the problem can reverse itself. But not forever. We're approaching a critical point from which we can't stop the chain reaction.
waxen spoke
They just have been sabotaged by lobbying
nice government yall have there lol
drifting arch
Ok heading to appt now. Be back.
near glen
Well, Germany is rather progressive in this area compared to other countries
waxen spoke
dont know shit about its politics so not gonna try to comment
near glen
Well, don't need to look at the politics if you can look at the results
Renewable share for electricity was 45.5% in germany last year, 20% in the US
waxen spoke
also the worst polluters are usually countries that are still developing due to them usually having outdated equipment and these dirty ways of producing energy also being the cheapest
near glen
also the worst polluters are usually countries that are still developing due to ...
That's whataboutism. Everybody has their share to contribute
And as developed countries, it's our duty to make our technological advances available to the rest of the world
waxen spoke
those countries gonna get rich they also gonna become more efficient
if they don't screw up their economy in some way
near glen
They need to fix it now, not in the future
restive seal
We're all living on one planet, is the problem here.
near glen
And we have to help them
waxen spoke
I'm sorry but if you are working at the speed of government the word "now" doesn't exist
near glen
That's false
waxen spoke
might be exceptions here and there
tough cedar
i mean the speed of government can be now if they're motivated enough
near glen
So we the people need to motivate them
pure jetty
iirc Biden's infrastructure package will have some climate change shit in it
near glen
Without us, they are nothing
pure jetty
plus recently, one of the big pipeline projects we had got canceled
waxen spoke
plus recently, one of the big pipeline projects we had got canceled
that ain't that good
that gas is gonna find one way or another to get out
near glen
iirc Biden's infrastructure package will have some climate change shit in it
Which is the right way, EU is doing the same thing, the covid relieve stuff is connected to restrictions, you only get it if you also invest into the future
pure jetty
also i believe he's also looking to remove our remaining fossil fuel tax credits and replace them with tax credits for renewables
waxen spoke
iirc Biden's infrastructure package will have some climate change shit in it
wish yall would reduce regulations n cut spending for once, Americas national debt is gonna kill it one day if it doesn't stop gowing
near glen
Regulations are really important
restive seal
Regulations are written in blood. Let's not remove them and have to learn the lessons again.
pure jetty
wish yall would reduce regulations n cut spending for once, Americas national de...
that's a very reductionist way of looking at deficit spending
near glen
Without them, market is gonna ruin everything
restive seal
Cutting spending is easy, though. Just cut defense in half and we'll still be the most powerful military by far and have tons of leftover cash!
waxen spoke
Without them, market is gonna ruin everything
how so? i think free open markets are a good think
pure jetty
history would like a word
waxen spoke
just get the government out of peoples lives
near glen
Free markets never were a good thing, lol
tough cedar
sounds a bit like anarchy
near glen
Without government intervention we would have so much issues
restive seal
history would like a word
I'm sure we'd have only five, maybe six, triangle shirtwaist a year, tops! Per state, that is.
waxen spoke
Free markets never were a good thing, lol
you have a smartphone, you have a computer, you're using discord
all of this free markets to thank for
competition makes shit better
near glen
My smartphone uses waves assigned to it by the government, the computer uses a power frequency defined by the government and discord implements child protections designed by the government
waxen spoke
you look at communist countries, all they did was try to keep up with western countries
near glen
Regulations don't hinder competition is done right
And nobody is talking about Communism
pure jetty
well, in countries worth mentioning that is
near glen
They are still generally free tho
And competition is important, I agree
Just as important as regulation
restive seal
The implication that regulations prevent competition is... interesting.
near glen
Regulations create a fair playing field for competition
waxen spoke
Just as important as regulation
but some of that regulation is useless, cause thing is, alot of the time politicians dont know what they are doing
near glen
Go educate them then
pure jetty
but some of that regulation is useless, cause thing is, alot of the time politic...
what regulations are you opposed to?
near glen
That's what we call lobbying
waxen spoke
Regulations create a fair playing field for competition
bullshit, big corporations can lobby for regulations that restrict small business from flushing
waxen spoke
what regulations are you opposed to?
minimum wage would be an example
restive seal
Oh no.
near glen
Oh this topic again 😂
restive seal
They did say they're a griefer
waxen spoke
i didn't way i was ancap
i say i was leaning somewhere there, but ancap is too extreme in my opinion
restive seal
Do you support child labor?
waxen spoke
Do you support child labor?
if they want to work? let them
near glen
Oh god
warm ibex
...
restive seal
What about company scrip?
waxen spoke
some lil extra cash never hurt nobody
near glen
Kids belong in schools
waxen spoke
never said i'd take em out of schools
weekend jobs and summer jobs exist you know
and not like i would be forcing them to work
if they want to they can so choose
near glen
Well, that's different to child labor, lol
restive seal
You would, if you're taking away their parents ability to earn enough to live by dropping minimum wage.
Or do you in addition to dropping minimum wage support the creation of a massive social safety net to offset the change?
waxen spoke
You would, if you're taking away their parents ability to earn enough to live by...
market should decide what their work is worth
restive seal
Otherwise you're condemning people to suffer.
waxen spoke
big companies can afford a 15$ wage, smaller ones cant
near glen
The market doesn't give a shit about humans
waxen spoke
The market doesn't give a shit about humans
it cares about their money, thus the people who have it
near glen
If you can't afford to pay your employees enough to make a living, maybe you should have less employees
waxen spoke
If you can't afford to pay your employees enough to make a living, maybe you sho...
are you saying unemployment is better than employment?
you know what unemployment does? it makes some people leech of government handouts
near glen
Nobody should work under slave like conditions
waxen spoke
Nobody should work under slave like conditions
well they are not forced to work there
tough cedar
what is your solution to giving the people more purchasing power similar to what they had in previous years?
waxen spoke
don't like it leave
near glen
you know what unemployment does? it makes some people leech of government handou...
It's proven false that this is an actual issue, studies for that exists on mass
near glen
Any full time job should earn you enough to make a living
tough cedar
cutting hours is the better option anyways
waxen spoke
minimum wage = entry level
near glen
I don't understand why that is so hard to understand
waxen spoke
well then, guess you just have to wait for a better opportunity, and not like a big oll monopoly can take over since in an open market competitors can setup
plus monopolies never last
near glen
plus monopolies never last
Cause government destroys them
waxen spoke
Cause government destroys them
wtf you mean, goverment and big business work hand in hand
restive seal
I don't understand why that is so hard to understand
You view everyone as worth living, which is the first thing you have to let go if you're going to drop minimum wage. 😛
waxen spoke
they give tax breaks, handouts and make regulations take make it hard for newer business to grow
near glen
Idk my government tries pretty hard to destroy monopolies
rich sun
China doesn't have a minimum wage and they have workers being paid 30 cents an hour or less
waxen spoke
lets take the american politicians beloved countries: sweden
near glen
We just fined the big car makers because they did make illegal arrangements
waxen spoke
they dont really have a minimum wage far as ive heard
tough cedar
they have strong unions though
near glen
Sweden doesn't need it, they have unions
warm ibex
because they have strong unions
tough cedar
as i learned 2 weeks ago
waxen spoke
We just fined the big car makers because they did make illegal arrangements
"you make too much money, now give us some"
-government
near glen
No, you broke the rules, now you pay
waxen spoke
i really like the fact that its a thing
since local governments know better
- the fact that its a federation you can try out policies and see which ones work and which ones dont
waxen spoke
It's proven false that this is an actual issue, studies for that exists on mass
links pls
oo
my favorite pro gamer bashar al assad
near glen
links pls
Just google welfare abuse or whatever, iirc even wikipedia linked some studies
No am lazy and don't need to educate ppl, am not a teacher
waxen spoke
No am lazy and don't need to educate ppl, am not a teacher
source: educate yourself
near glen
They can either believe me or look it up
potent canopyBOT
Requested by MiniDigger - About 202,000,000 results (0.48 seconds)
near glen
Home shit the bot is useless
waxen spoke
theres a video called bashar gaming or some shit like that
blazing junco
adjusts chair
near glen
Most important quote from that article
"The German government has estimated that the amounts lost through welfare fraud were 6% of the amounts lost through tax avoidance and subvention fraud."
blazing junco
but that still means he's done bad
near glen
Assad literally attacked his own citizens with bio weapons, lmfao
Syrians fled the country from Assad, lol
He's a war criminal
waxen spoke
Syrians fled the country from Assad, lol
along with the rest of the middle east apparently
near glen
If you just created this discord account to chill for some war criminal am happy to show you the door
waxen spoke
shill*
near glen
Idgaf
waxen spoke
If you just created this discord account to chill for some war criminal am happy...
happens all the said war crimes happen like all the fuckin time in that region
like tupac once said
"thats just the way it is"
near glen
We got rules here, I suggest you to read them
near glen
Supporting war criminals and oppressive disctators is a form of hate speech that we don't tolerate here
blazing junco
Supporting war criminals and oppressive disctators is a form of hate speech that...
Who's the one qualifying who's a war criminal and who isn't? Would talking about the U.S's drone strike "collateral" be hate speech?
near glen
There is no free speech here
waxen spoke
Who's the one qualifying who's a war criminal and who isn't? Would talking about...
yeah exactly lol
you only say it if the current situation at your place supports your opinion
look at china for example
see the people living there
thats the shit that happens when your free speech is taken away
i mean like china china
blazing junco
Something like that
near glen
China also thinks they own Taiwan 
blazing junco
China? Do you mean Western Taiwan?
waxen spoke
people can think a lot of things
if some state like the PRC tried to take over my country you bet id be mad as hell
blazing junco
Not just there
They've started in the Balkans too
I think Montenegro got fucked i don't remember
They had to give an entire port to China or something
waxen spoke
if i know my history right no empire lasts forever, i doubt china will last in the long run if it don't change
if people know what civil liberty like tastes i doubt they'd be willing to give that up
and hell, humans aren't some redditor hivemind, we have differing opinions, just look at how polarized america is
blazing junco
I think they have a very low birth rate and very unstable population
Because of the whole one child policy
And that could potentially lead to trouble but i'm not sure lol
waxen spoke
I think they have a very low birth rate and very unstable population
the whole western/developed world has a low birth rate
warm ibex
if people know what civil liberty like tastes i doubt they'd be willing to give ...
isn't the chinese government insanely popular among its people though
waxen spoke
like they have a choice lmao
and ofc, if you grow up seeing only the shit the chinese government feeds you, how could you not like it?
near glen
Well, chinease government lifted the whole population out of poverty
There is def stuff to like
And if you don't grow up knowing human rights, I can see how you like the government
Chinease ppl have a way different mentality, it's hard to understand
waxen spoke
There is def stuff to like
wait till you hear about their stance on Muslims and gay rights lol
near glen
I am well aware, lol
Their population isn't
Or they don't care
Their surveillance tech is actually really impressive too
waxen spoke
if i know my populations a combination of both
near glen
If you run a red light, they automatically fine you 😂
waxen spoke
thats bs
near glen
In a few big cities that actually works
waxen spoke
wouldn't want to live there
near glen
They have giant facilities in the big cities called the brain
Which houses the surveillance machinery
waxen spoke
They have giant facilities in the big cities called the brain
shit sounds like it was pulled from a dystopian sci fi
1984 to the Z
near glen
Red light was only an example, the other one I know is litter, they detect that too
And can reduce your score for that
It's not sci Fi tho
Its just sci
waxen spoke
whatever still sounds like something id find in bladerunner 2077 or some crap
i shall now declare #politics my primary domain in this server, however dumb the idea of a channel like this is, some people just can't help themselves but argue w strangers online
near glen
If you don't want to argue, you know, just go away?
You are here, so you just described yourself
dark crystal
the last dude who was banned was an ancap who didn't even use any of the other channels except this one
they came to a minecraft-related discord server to talk about politics
so like
i would try not to be like him y'know
waxen spoke
they came to a minecraft-related discord server to talk about politics
I'm also a minecraft server admin on the side, said server runs paper, thats why im here
dark crystal
I'd say that's alright then
the other dude was either a heartless piece of shit or a troll anyway
near glen
Yeah we don't ban if you only use this channel, that's dum
We remove ppl that don't contribute anything meaningful and are just here to cause drama
waxen spoke
Yeah we don't ban if you only use this channel, that's dum
if i know my discord mods right some of them can be pretty touchy
question anything you gonna get banned
one time all it took was to question why a person got banned lmao
pure jetty
when was that?
near glen
Well, duh, when you cause drama like that ppl clean up
It's not your business why somebody got removed
waxen spoke
It's not your business why somebody got removed
lol what, so if a guy i was talking w suddently got banned for some fckn reason, and if i kindly ask, my i know why that person got banished, its somehow wrong?
dark crystal
I'm with griefer on this one
waxen spoke
when was that?
eh some random server a while ago, but this is just an example, its common all over this app
dark crystal
if you just outright ban the dude that's kinda stupid lol
near glen
It all depends on the situation obviously
But you shouldn't question staff decision on another person
If the affected person finds they are treated unfairly, they can appeal
waxen spoke
But you shouldn't question staff decision on another person
thou shall not question the all mighty... discord power mod!!!
near glen
Yes.
Deal with it
It's something between the moderation team and the affected user
Not random bystanders
waxen spoke
he was like a brother to me.... 😢
a brother, that i knew for only 5 minutes, but still, like a brother!
waxen spoke
eh
the constant fuckin republicans vs democrats shit
literally team fortress II
team blu or team RED
near glen
I don't give a shit what side you on, but that decision is stupid
waxen spoke
I don't give a shit what side you on, but that decision is stupid
it could be argued so, that if the kid is healthy, they are not in risk, thus the vaccine could be given to an adult who is
near glen
Even ignoring covid, vaccinations for kids are extremely important
near glen
They didn't just halt covid, it's for every vaccine
pure jetty
if you want one you can get one
waxen spoke
ok i get if they don't vaccinate kids for covid or whatever, but all vaccines wtf?
reads like a Babylon bee / onion article
loud flax
i'm going to have to ask a simple question: why is marriage a right? and why would people want to get married?
unless there's some things I don't fully understand that would require marriage, it doesn't seem to be something anyone needs to do, so i at least think my question is fair
my question comes from looking at the first sentence:
Democratic legislators in New York are opposing plans to open Chick-fil-A restaurants at rest stops in the state, citing the fast-food chain’s past donations to groups accused of opposing same-sex marriage.
shy gulch
setting aside homosexuality, marriage offers some legal advantages
waxen spoke
my question comes from looking at the first sentence:
```Democratic legislators...
new york
waxen spoke
setting aside homosexuality, marriage offers some legal advantages
and a whole lot of disadvantages when you want to end it
loud flax
so infamous, are you a Christian too?
waxen spoke
yeah, i guess you could say that
though, according to the church, you can only get married once from my understanding
warm ibex
i'm going to have to ask a simple question: why is marriage a right? and why wou...
culture and tradition
restive seal
Legal benefits and recognition of the union. Why shouldn't it be a right for some people? 🤔
restive seal
and a whole lot of disadvantages when you want to end it
Advantages, actually. Trying to separate a couple who aren't legally married but have been together for years, have children, shared assets, whatever, is way harder than a married couple in the legal side of things because there's laws and precedents for divorce.
near glen
Marrying has tax benefits ^^
There is just no reason to exclude some people
Marriage also doesn't have anything to do with religion, you can marry without any church or whatever brain washing group
near glen
Last I check some ancient fantasy novel like the Quran or the bible wasn't law
At least in sane countries
Maintaining chastity is literally middle age mindset and just dum
Do whatever the fuck you want with your body
waxen spoke
Marriage also doesn't have anything to do with religion, you can marry without a...
calling us brainwashed? hh-hate speech!
near glen
That's not what I said
I said these organizations participate in brain washing by painting fiction as truth
waxen spoke
Marriage also doesn't have anything to do with religion, you can marry without a...
marrige was sorta invented by religion
near glen
Well, in some cases it works, in many cases it directly contradicts
near glen
marrige was sorta invented by religion
And now it's more than just that
Am not saying religion never did anything good, am just saying that for me it has no use in the 21th century anymore
Well, that's the thing, you have to interpret those ancient writings to be able to apply them to the modern world
Which is a flawed concept cause everybody will interpret it differently
If the thought of a afterlife is the only thing that gives you hope in your life, you sure living a sad life, lol
Everybody twists those writings, lol
waxen spoke
Marriage also doesn't have anything to do with religion, you can marry without a...
plus youre equaly as ""brainwashed"" just on other topics
near glen
Of course I am
Everybody is influenced by something
I at least acknowledge that that is possible and reevaluate my stances on stuff all the time based on new information
waxen spoke
plus it usually gives them a moral guide, its more likely they wont live off their urges and instincts
near glen
Well, just alone that quote that you posted earlier, its pretty misogynic, it denies homo couples the right to marriage, etc. Not much interpretation needed, that quote has no place in our current society
We are way past such dark ages
What did I interpret wrong?
In your mind, anyways, there is no right and wrong
Well, where does it ever talk about the other cases?
There is no right or wrong interpretation, it's subjective, unless you can get the original author to confirm, lol
Well, if it does say, eat A B and C but doesn't mention D, that sure says something?
Don't put this out of context
When you talk about everything else, but gay marriage, it's pretty clear that you don't acknowledge that that is a right
Well, ppl already interpret it by translating it
Am reading Quran 4:34 and everybody translates it differently 😂
Some of these translations are really fucked up
Talking about women needing to be obedient and shit like that
Well, I see how some Muslims treat their wives 😂
Don't blame this on western ppl, it's far worse in the middle east
reads Quran 2:191
I was in Egypt twice and saw how they treat women
Publicly
I don't wanna know how they get treated in private
193 specifically goes on to fight till everybody believes in Allah
If I read this wrong, please enlighten me
I read the surrounding few verses
Its not all bad, I know
But it still doesn't change the fact that it says to continue fighting until everybody believes in Allah
Yes, it talks about agressors not being loved by Allah
How do you interpret 2:193?
Yes
Well, the other part of the sentence is what's troubling
And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah.
Am looking at quran.com and this isn't my first time
We even did it in school ^^
It's part of the Catholic religion class here to look at other religions, I find that really important
Germany
No I don't
You think ppl here aren't qualified to teach that?
waxen spoke
i gotta say, this got alot of people disagreeing within your community and it was the cause of a few civil jihads recently
near glen
Because Christianity never had their jihads, don't turn this into finger pointing
waxen spoke
namely shit like isis and the taliban
waxen spoke
Because Christianity never had their jihads, don't turn this into finger pointin...
they did, then dont really have them now
near glen
That's obviously not representative of the majority of muslims
If you say every Muslim is IS, I'll say every american is as dum as trump 😂
waxen spoke
like trump or not it takes more than luck to turn a million into a billion and become the president
though maybe forget i said the last part
yeah, from what i heard during the golden age of islam there was something about ppl who arent muslim living there
restive seal
like trump or not it takes more than luck to turn a million into a billion and b...
He got over 400 million from dad (2018 prices). Doesn't even take luck to make that a billion, just dumping it into moderately safe investments.
A 2016 analysis of Trump's business career in The Economist concluded that his performance since 1985 had been "mediocre compared with the stock market and property in New York".[14] A subsequent analysis in The Washington Post similarly noted that Trump's estimated net worth of $100 million in 1978 would have increased to $6 billion by 2016 if he had invested it in a typical retirement fund, and concluded that "Trump is a mix of braggadocio, business failures, and real success."[15]
Could have been 6 billion, instead his net worth is estimated currently around 2.4 billion. 🤷
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_of_Donald_Trump
tough cedar
Oops
loud flax
Do whatever the fuck you want with your body
i have such a problem with this
is it fair to let teens do whatever they want and don't tell them that there are consequences to their actions?
the bible has things that i'd consider objective by nature, and swaying outside of that will only lead to issues, and yes, this comes from teachings that are over 2,000 years old, but until someone can convince me that Jesus was not the most influential person in the world, I'm going to rest assured his message was the most important that has ever been said at any time, ever
so @near glen what's your take on age of consent?
near glen
Oh I was talking about adults there
near glen
But if teens wanna have sex, you also can let them be
Just need special protection, so that older ppl don't exploit teens
Germany got a pretty complex matrix for that
But if both are teens it's fine
Obviously sexual education is really important and needs to happen before any of that
That's the rule in Germany
Green is ok, yellow means illegal if done for money or favors, orange is illegal when you take advantage of their low age or if for money or favor, red is always illegal
loud flax
that's interesting
near glen
I guess the first one is only Green because if you are younger than 14 you can't commit crimes legally or smth
mystic ermine
UK has a similar setup with Romeo and Julliet exemptions and I pretty much agree with it
loud flax
cannot commit crimes legally?
near glen
Idk what the proper term for that is
loud flax
as funny as that sounds, i imagine that means you can't be charged at such a young age?
near glen
But they can't really be held responsible or whatever since they are kids
loud flax
oh right
mystic ermine
Theres a general age in which it's deemed that your parents are generally legally responsible for you but you can't really expect that children will understand the law, etc
ofc, if a 13 year old butchers somebody, there are often provisions to try them as a higher age bracket more or less
near glen
So like, of course we don't particularly want to encourage sexual activities between 13 year olds, but there is also not much you can do
But yeah, i think our age of consent laws are sane
mystic ermine
over in the UK, 16+ is age of concent, but, iirc, there is an additional 18+ barrier if it's with somebody who could be deemed as in control of you, e.g. teachers, doctors, boss, mentors... technically you can be criminally punished for anything under the AoC but 13-16 there is a weird general understanding of romeo and juliet given that teens are stupid, and so you're unlikely to be punished as such if it's not a huge age gap in there
There are some areas where many will agree our rules don't work but I think that in 99% of cases it's fine and I don't got anything wrong with it
broken raven
hey i dont usually use this channel but can someone explain to me that is it just me or is USA getting more and more fucked by the day
near glen
can say that about many countries actually
pure jetty
define "getting more and more fucked"
minor folio
crap wrong paste
anyone can explain why are they protesting against mandatory vaccinations?
mystic ermine
the principle of it
as well as there are people who don't want the vaccine for various reasons
some people are tin foil hatters, some people have valid concerns
foggy fern
In France it's Bastille Day, in the US it's Nude Day
I think we got the better holiday?
shut vine
anyone can explain why are they protesting against mandatory vaccinations?
I mean in this particular instance it's only health care workers who are required to so I agree it's a bit silly. However the right to protest should be protected and exercised as people see fit (undeniably violence, vandalism, and other specific criminal actions is not a part of that) even though France as of late has been doing everything it can to restrict those rights.
In fact if a person or group of people see unjust laws being implemented I also argue they have a duty as members of society to protest that law in some way.
icy fiber
What are your thoughts on BLM?
Apparently the actual founders themselves declared themselves Marxists soo yeah lol
icy fiber
I just searched blm to find someone relevant in here but ye lol
shut vine
I generally support BLM's right to protest as long as it falls within peaceful parameters, regardless of what I think of their individual ideas.
Though not sure if that's what you were asking.
I do believe there are images of Tometi with Maduro though from memory.
loud flax
i agree with the phrase "Black Lives Matter" and have a fairly good understanding of why it's used
but the protests last year were another thing... should have been consistent in the news and called them terrorists, put them in the same light as the insurrectionists, but that's not what the narrative was
i mean, the rioters anyways
everyone else were fine to protest, just the people that wanted to be violent, break windows, set fire to buildings, well that's something else
problem is, i get that they were frustrated and felt enough was enough, I just wished their anger could have been used in a better way
pure jetty
there is a difference between the people who rioted and people protesting last year, very small portion were ones actually rioting where as the insurrectionists were a majority of rioters
loud flax
were they a far lesser number than the people who came to the capitol?
loud flax
ah i think you misunderstood me, I was actually saying what is the % of people who came to the capitol that were rioters
yeah there were a lot of them
broken raven
define "getting more and more fucked"
idk i'm seeing more and more unrest in usa on reddit
pure jetty
idk i'm seeing more and more unrest in usa on reddit
you're always going to see extremes on the internet
broken raven
I see
near glen
Oh I finally found somebody who is able to describe my thoughts about crypto
Good read
Twitter
Only thing missing is the obvious wastefulness for me
mystic ermine
officer shoots an unarmed white guy, BLM, silent
Officer shoots a black guy with a knife, BLM rages
Black guy shoots a black child, BLM, silent
BLM leader in the UK gets shot in the head, then we have people like Dianne Abbott shout to the world about how nobody should fear being killed for their beliefs
as soon as it turned out she got shot by some gang bangers who where tryna take somebody out at a party she was attending, it's gone silent af, had to google to find out that a 2nd person was charged related to that
near glen
Idk it you guys noticed but Germany is flooded serverly right now
And our conservative party who is in charge (and has been delaying action on climate change for 2 decades, every since they got in charge), is acting surprised and saying this is a one off thing, as always
Now their website went offline and I though somebody got angry and ddosd them
But no
Their sub company that manages the data center flooded and has no power 😂
mystic ermine
if it makes you feel any better, more flooding is expected across the world with a peek next decade
near glen
Well, my geographical position in the city means am fine, the house of my parents is fine too (all basements but theirs flooded, they the highest in the road 😂 ) so am lucky
mystic ermine
near glen
But this is gonna get much worse, polar temperature rise, the jet stream gets less powerful, thus these high and low pressure areas get stuck above Europe and don't move for ages
This isnt flooding caused by sea or moon or whatever cat
It's literally just normal rain
mystic ermine
I know...
am just saying, world wide it's gonna get worse
there are natural cycles which cause this type of shit
near glen
But normally the rain is spread over whole Europe, now we get it all in one spot
mystic ermine
and climate change just makes it oh so much worse
near glen
If we manage to kill the jet stream or the gulf stream, man we so fucked in Europe
Ppl need to realize that climate change is real, is now, is here
And this is only the start, it's gonna happen more often, and more serverly
If you post that on Twitter, conservative apologists come swarming and complaining that you emotionalize the debate
That's their current tactic to distract from the facts
(only some conservatives do that to manipulate the debate, I sure hope it's not everybody or we fucked)
mystic ermine
It's a complex issue and both sides of the debate lie
if you ask the deniers it's all hocus pocus attempts to take over the world
ask the climate evangelists and we're 10 years from 12 years from 10 years to the end of the world
near glen
Yeah, everybody desperately tries to get attentions I guess
It's just, only one side is on the side of the facts
mystic ermine
No
The facts are complex, one side try to spin the facts to make the disaster movie scenario, other side uses the facts and questions left to over blow the "we're fine" stance
near glen
Well, on side says nothing is wrong, one side says everything is wrong, in reality we are at something is wrong, so I think it's fair to argue that the everything wrong side is closer to reality, especially since their actions will have an actually good impact
But I agree this it's bad to paint everything so extreme, but I guess that's just how society is now
foggy fern
Did someone ever figure out how likely it is that Europe ends up having a climate more like Canada?
iirc there was some talk that Greenland melting could do that
Apparently there is a 15% chance something like that happens in the next 100 years
near glen
if the golf stream goes poof, which happens when the artic gets too warm, europe is fucked
foggy fern
Latest models suggest the currents won't be completely disrupted though
near glen
well, todays catastrophe here is caused by a slightly less stronger jetstream, and it already fucks us over hard
any small changes has drastic consequences for our weather
near glen
Shit, climate change is attacking our freedom, I mean, out Autobahn now, now it's personal 😂
10 minutes from me
brisk cradle
daring locust
hooooo boy this is spicy
brisk cradle
The wording of the title suggests an unconfirmed leak of unknown provenance, so a grain of salt is needed. But it seems consistent with what happened in ‘16.
brisk cradle
Translation: “fundamentally different” since the cause is one the GOP supports, specifically regime change in Cuba https://apple.news/AjVD_VzWrToO2mDsqOR-8Hw
I’m pretty sure if it was a QAnon rally, same reaction
But god forbid that Black Lives Matter to do the same thing!
shut vine
there is a difference between the people who rioted and people protesting last y...
Taking a single event vs a large group of events doesn't seem like a very reasonable comparison. Between May 26 and June 8th 2020, there was between 1 and 2 billion in damages caused by riots. Compared to the LA riots that's potentially double.
shut vine
The wording of the title suggests an unconfirmed leak of unknown provenance, so ...
Also Russia. They are not new to leaking disinformation.
I wonder how much disorder would ensue in America if Russia leaked enough to get Trump and Family and Co put away for the rest of their lives, especially if it later comes out that Russia fabricated it.
brisk cradle
Also Russia. They are not new to leaking disinformation.
That’s true.
shut vine
Also if they did do it, they most likely did it for destabilization anyway.
brisk cradle
They already succeeded, by electing a president who, when losing his re-election bid, effectively attempted to perform a self-coup to retain power.
shut vine
It could also be China, trust them as much as Russia. 😛
brisk cradle
Comparisons to the Nazi Party are pretty apt. Ashli Babbitt is the Trumpist equivalent of Horst Wessel.
I usually shy away from such comparisons, but the moves being made as of late have me worried. We dodged a bullet, but the GOP is trying again.
shut vine
Comparing most of anything to the Nazi party is one of the worst things people could say. Not to mention that his ideas were contrary to many Nazi ideas.
brisk cradle
Of course Trump does not share the political beliefs of the Nazis. I did not imply that all Trumpists are Nazis.
shut vine
Taking authoritarian control of the banking and economic system for example is a complete opposite of his ideas, he was predominantly for deregulation of those things.
brisk cradle
However, the similarities of how the Nazis took power and the Trumpist road to a right-wing authoritarian state taking root in the U.S. are becoming startlingly similar.
The (at least theoretical) unequivocal support for free markets is one way in which Trumpism is unique.
shut vine
What aspects of his policies appeal to socialists though?
brisk cradle
What aspects of his policies appeal to socialists though?
Very few. Also, Nazism's primary supporters came from German right-wing voters. The left was divided amongst communist and social-democratic lines.
shut vine
To really see why Nazi Germany became a thing you probably have to look at the methods they used to get the power. When Mussolini came up with the framework that is Fascism he was observing that socialists in WWI were motivated by national interest, thus he used that to further his interests. Hitler's model was heavily based on it.
Yeah, because of the nationalism married to socialism.
I can't really speak to their particular political leanings though.
Really isn't relevant for the most part anyway.
Ideas have a very wide range on both sides of the isle, even in the fringes.
brisk cradle
In any event, discussing the potential fusion of socialism into the Nazi political program is irrelevant to the conversation. My view is that Nazi economic policy was largely syncretic in nature, being anti-capitalist (in theory) and anti-communist (in theory and in practice). Discussing that is out of the scope of this conversation - there is plenty of academic literature out there to help you out there.
shut vine
Many of the ideas today would be considered left-wing even 10 or 20 years ago, as the perception of the center changes, so do those definitions.
brisk cradle
Syncretic, as in, if Hitler felt that a certain policy would advance his overall goals, he'd adopt them.
shut vine
Yeah makes sense, Nazi party ideas were very strict at controlling the economy, I'd agree that in practice it was anti-capitalist.
Yeah exactly the same model as Mussolini, wasn't really about the ideals, it was about furthering his own interests.
Would give up any ideal to appeal to the masses.
brisk cradle
As such, I do not define Nazism or fascism as socialist or capitalist, but rather their own unique creatures.
shut vine
I'd argue that Trump wasn't like that, in fact he was pretty stubborn about his ideas.
Obnoxiously at times..
More often than not 😛
brisk cradle
Trumpism may support a free market, but it also desires (1) control over the press (the Trump administration targeted the press while in office using the official organs of government and quasi-state actors like Fox News, OANN, Newsmax, ..., and also wanted to prevent Twitter and Facebook from moderating their platform, and for Google and other search engines to elevate their political content in search results) and (2) at least in theory, support of government welfare programs that their voters rely on (the dead ringer here was that Trump ran on preserving Social Security and Medicare in 2016, although in office he appointed ideologies who'd rather want to see these programs abolished, as Republicans had prior had run on).
In 2016, openly wanting to preserve Social Security and Medicare as they were was a rather radical position to take in the GOP.
shut vine
Yeah I can agree with it not being a normal idea for a republican. He was disliked by many republicans for many of his ideas. I think the question is was that for appeal or did he just have his own ideas. He evidently didn't care much for political cooperation.
That was in my opinion the main appeal he had with people. So it's plausible that was for popularity.
brisk cradle
(1) is where the GOP's dominant political faction merges with certain factions of the American left the GOP had spent years deriding before it paradoxically wound up becoming their position!
Yes, I'm talking about the "snowflakes"
In addition, Trumpism is highly authoritarian. (1) derives from that trivially, they don't want anything bad being said about them. The desperate attempt to overturn the 2020 election was another. And now looking at the election bills the GOP is missing in many states, they aren't willing to leave anything to chance. They failed in 2020, but they didn't really pay a political price, and they want to succeed in 2024.
This is despite the fact they lost the Senate during the Georgia U.S. Senate runoff elections - Georgia was an epicenter for Trump's attempts to overturn the election.
shut vine
Yeah politicians will do anything to win, so it's potential things were orchestrated in this way.
brisk cradle
I know because I was there.
I live in Georgia and voted for Biden, Ossoff and Warnock.
shut vine
Well they lost the 51+ seats, they still have party majority.
Rep 50, Dem 48 (plus Harris), Ind 2
Even if they had 51, it's not control. No one has really had control of the Senate since the 70s.
Well no party.
brisk cradle
Incorrect. Republicans have 50 seats, Democrats have 48 (excluding Harris, your math is wrong), 2 independents (all of which caucus with Democrats: Bernie Sanders and Angus King), and then Harris tie-breaks votes in the Senate, meaning a 51-50 majority in the Senate for Democrats.
brisk cradle
I am saying you're off by one. I'm aware that the Senate is split 50-48-2, with 48+2=50, the full Democratic caucus, and Harris tiebreaking votes. The problem is that Harris is not in those 48 Democratic senators - she's Vice President, not the junior U.S. senator from California.
brisk cradle
I read this as 48 senators, including Harris in the tally.
shut vine
brisk cradle
No need to assume I don't know basic math.
Okay. Semantics aren't worth arguing over.
shut vine
There's also no need to be dismissive.
Also I agree the independents vote with the Democrats, that doesn't make them members of the DNC.
brisk cradle
Fine, I didn't read closely enough.
shut vine
I also overreacted a bit, just irritating to be talked down to then when I point out it wasn't read the same thing occurs. Water under the bridge hopefully.
brisk cradle
Anyway, I have work to do, so can't continue this conversation.
shut vine
Okay, good luck.
shy gulch
wow tux is extremely based
brisk cradle
👏 Getting 👏 paid 👏 $7.25/hr 👏 is 👏 CRIMINAL! 👏
restive seal
Yeah! That's far too much. Remove minimum wage so people can be paid a fair wage of $1 per hour!
brisk cradle
even $15/hour is a compromise
the minimum wage, adjusted to inflation, should be something like $22/hr
faint radish
wasnt that literally posted like 4 messages up?
restive seal
Oh god. I'm losing my mind.
red valve
wouldn't a higher minimum wage just lead to more people getting fired from their jobs?
so companies can save money
foggy fern
It's not like they're keeping people on payroll out of the kindness of their hearts and will fire them once it costs too much
restive seal
Hopefully you get more soon! 🙂
torn wadi
near glen
Hey, that's here 😂
It's worse at the surface mine Inden
Above view
Turns out, if you relocate a small river to build a surface mine, and you get a big flood, the water is gonna take back what belongs to mother nature
torn wadi
Good thing someone will take responsibility. 
near glen
That's google maps, can see the river in the lower middle where it curves to the left
You can also kinda guess the original path but the curved tree line around the building in the middle
deep ravine
the minimum wage, adjusted to inflation, should be something like $22/hr
I do not actually know, but wouldn’t a change like this cause rapid inflation in the price of products? If grocery stores need to pay workers more, won’t they raise the price of goods to meet their mark?
Don’t get me wrong, nobody can survive on minimum wage, but will raising the minimum wage do more good than bad?
If there is anything I know about the rich, if they don’t like losing money.
Though I suppose some companies like Amazon had to raise their wage for pure necessity, perhaps because they couldn’t find workers for minimum wage
pure jetty
There was a really good study about minimum wage, testing a bunch of different scenarios for increasing the federal minimum wage
For example, $15/hr by 2027 (iirc that year) didn't cause layoffs like people like to point to as the biggest boogie man
However what it does lead to is a HUGE amount of people entering poverty compared to our current rate
It's an absolute waste (and likely harmful) use of political capital to focus so much on minimum wage which is something that should be linked to local cost of living (not federally)
It's so much better to spend that political capital on stuff like federal social programs which are means tested and would actually have a greater effect on people and the economy in general.
and those social programs are actually something that we can pass with our current congress makeup via reconciliation (as minimum wage doesn't quality for that and isn't popular among certain dem senators)
restive seal
Surely by 2027 15/hr is too little and we're still in a rough state? (obviously better than staying at half that...)
pure jetty
Constant Inflation ensures that people don't sit on capital, ensures investment
pure jetty
Surely by 2027 15/hr is too little and we're still in a rough state? (obviously ...
I don't remember off the top of my head what effects were at higher wages or if they were even calculated
restive seal
[Area I'm unfamiliar with... ] but what impact does that have on the folks who don't make enough to be able to invest anyway, when their salaries aren't going up with inflation?
pure jetty
at the surface I think it tends to have a negative effect but makes up with either increasing value of your assets (house) or in the form of being at the receiving end of said investment
In general maintaining a stable inflation rate is a trade off that has more upsides than the alternative
mystic ermine
Do we have the same amount of raw wealth as we do now as we did in the 1920s?
Or, has wealth been generated through the means of finding new resources or developing new tech which makes obtaining the stuff which represents trade value easier and more efficient?
warm ibex
wouldn't a higher minimum wage just lead to more people getting fired from their...
that's how the free market works, if you can't afford the necessary expenses you don't get to stay in business
although there is evidence that it won't be too drastic
pure jetty
Again won't kill jobs, but will stunt hires and vastly increase poverty rate if done on a federal level
restive seal
at the surface I think it tends to have a negative effect but makes up with eith...
Your assets? House? I said folks who don't make enough to invest!
pure jetty
Ah then likely just benefit them in the form of received investment. This is one of those lesser evil things
foggy fern
People have been bringing this drug up a lot lately as an alternative to getting vaccinated, apparently because Tucker Carlson keeps talking about it
Apparently the data was completely fabricated and parts of the paper are a copy/paste from the drug manufacturer's press releases
near glen
Foreground: germanys president, delivering a speech, currently mentioning the extreme high number of loses of human life and all the destroyed buildings and infrastructure
Background: the guy who wants to replace Merkel as our next chancellor in September, laughing
https://twitter.com/josefheynckes/status/1416401177680531456?s=19
You can't make this shit up
foggy fern
On a similar note https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1416489123364458501
This shit sounds like a TV show
Their excuse for flying on their chartered flight to DC without masks was that they were all vaccinated iirc
Oh, they still say they were vaccinated
Either they're lying or it didn't take
glossy sandal
Oml
All that's gonna do is give antivaxxers "evidence"
House reps are literally from a different universe I swear they're all so dumb
foggy fern
I suppose the vaccines are only 94% effective, someone notable had to lose eventually
faint radish
💯 % guaranteed to prevent sex between some of the most attractive people ever
shut vine
Also it's not like people don't have sex standing up.
Or on hard surfaces
They'll be lucky if that deters 10% of those who'd do that
near glen
Meanwhile those beds will crush all the time anyways
If there sits like a giant weight lifter ok it 😂
shut vine
Lol yea, imagine waking up to find your bed has collapsed because you made a sudden movement
near glen
Man, Japanese culture is weird
shut vine
The intent behind them was recycling motivated btw
near glen
Smth smth reduce reuse recycle is the chain
Recycle is the least important one, just build beds that can be used for more than just this occasion, lol
restive seal
This is the environment that forcing the olympics during a pandemic sets
mystic ermine
I mean, they're literally saying, "We can't trust people to follow the rules and so we're gonna go stupid levels of insanity into creating fucking beds which will collapse under some weight"
Don't get me wrong, allowing the olympics is stupid but the level of babying towards grown adults is moronic
if you can't trust people to not sleep with each other, tf
near glen
I mean, they already got the first covid case in the Olympic town or whatever
At least the Japanese is taking this serious
looks at ma boi Boris
foggy fern
They'll definitely be banging no matter what the Japanese try to do to stop them
mystic ermine
I was gonna do the joke, oh no, i sure hope that theres no showers, etc, there
part of why I say "covid panic" is not because it's really gonna fix anything, sure, now you can't use the bed, but like, not like there aren't other places people do that stuff
foggy fern
They're all very athletic and most of them are quite flexible, they'll make it work 😄
loud flax
it'd be a whole different situation if the olympics were in brazil
foggy fern
Not really, they'd still bang
near glen
There wouldn't be any protections against covid tho 😂
dark crystal
the way I am when sleeping, I'd make a sudden movement while on my third dream and hit my head on the floor
loud flax
Not really, they'd still bang
the bed situation I mean, they wouldn't be flimsy and prone to breakage
near glen
I don't know what happened in the US again (and at this point, I am not sure I care anymore, since nobody seems interested in fixing anything), but this tweet just washed into my timeline
That's the once great america in 2021 everybody
Oh Den retweeted a quote tweet, that's why I saw it
near glen
In other news, the floods have been detected by the EUs pre warn system, authorities where informed Monday, they did a task force and Tuesday and then
Nothing happened
Nothing at all
It's now monday and neither the federal nor the state minister for interior have resigned yet
Death toll still rising, we over 150 now
150 preventable deaths, if warnings would have been issued
faint radish
nobody seems interested in fixing anything
Well, it’s not exactly the simplest problem.
The solution isn’t to prevent me, a law-abiding citizen from being able to defend my life, someone else’s life, or my property.
And then you get into line drawing, but that doesn’t work in judicial systems that pretty clearly state that rights can’t be taken away without due process.
near glen
Can at least require proper training and stuff where you can vet for mental problems
near glen
Kek the press spoke persons of the ministries can't even answer the question who received the warnings from the warn system 😂
This truly is the best timeline
brisk cradle
That's the once great america in 2021 everybody
correct
pray for us
it won't do shit and it will make you think you did something
we won't do shit and are incapable of doing shit
I'm surprised we're not yet (formally) a failed state
1/6 dragged us real close to that