windows 11

[jagged sentinel]

@dawn vale people still malding about how it looks different

[inland seal]

I like the way it looks.

[jagged sentinel]

Same. Glad they're moving away from the featureless hidden UI

I hated it then and I still hate it now

IMO W8 to 10 should be a case study of how to create an unintuitive interface. Hide buttons, little to no indicator of interactivity, morphing buttons, slow searching, lack of details, etc

While most of these are fine in isolation, the real killer is total lack of consistency

[zinc tree]

Same, as much flack as people give it I never had any problems personally.

[loud oxide]

I never experienced vista personally
my first PC was a emachines windows XP machine.
Then I think I got a windows 7???
Then a bunch of Chromebooks, that windows 10 netbook, then this PC...

...maybe I'll download the ISO.

[knotty solstice]

Yea again, as long as you were running it on a decent pc it was fine

[fathom epoch]

I went from win98 or smth around that time to win7, 8.1, 10, and now im going to 11

After the fact i was forced to work on xp more but never vista

Only ever had notable problems with 8. Which is why i reverted to 7 till 8.1

[jagged sentinel]

straight from 98 to 7?

i never had 8 or 8.1 on my desktop

went from 7 to 10

[inland seal]

How the hell did you go from 98 to 7.

You completely missed ME, 2000, Vista, and XP.

[inland seal]

8 was weird, but not completely terrible once you got used to the start screen.

[jagged sentinel]

i had a laptop with 8 and 8.1

[fathom epoch]

@inland seal @jagged sentinel My first laptop ever was win7. I just happened to play around with my parent's PC, which was win98, prior

I immediately regret the upgrade to win11. I cant reference network drive for my steam library so ive to shove everything into a vhd and i didnt size my game vhd to fit my steam library given the amount of games i had not supporting network drives on win10 was minimal.

[jagged sentinel]

The first OS i used when I was young was ME, although i have no memories of that. The first I actually remember using was XP, then we got a Vista machine and then more computers after.

[jagged sentinel]

I have heard there are some bugs related to network drives rn

[inland seal]

I forget sometimes how much older than the average bapo user I am.

[fathom epoch]

Hm. I have certainly experienced at least one OS in between 98 and 7, but i wouldnt be able to tell you what or when due to no memory

[fathom epoch]

the work around i have is using a vhdx but i need to recreate the vhdx with a larger max and move my 1.2TiB of games to it

[fathom epoch]

im young af and i feel old compared to a lot of disc users -.-"

[fathom epoch]

a lot of launchers dont like installing/playing games from network drives. Steam is my only launcher that had native support in win10 and it immediately stopped working with the library on network share when i went to 11. That said, my work around for other launchers is now confirmed working with steam which is just using a vhdx stored on the network drive

That said i still have to redownload everything bc my dumbass made the original vhdx at only 1TB and as mbr and it's faster for me to redownload than move them between the two vhdxs

[jagged sentinel]

Lol

Are you sharing it between multiple computers on the network drive?

[loud oxide]

I went: Win XP (barely remember it tho) Win 7 (Never had my "own" 7 computer though, I used my grandmas. if memory serves right, at least.) Then I had a decent amount of chrome-books, which were fine... just limited at the time. Then I got that win10 netbook, and then my current build

[fathom epoch]

Not at the same time

[jagged sentinel]

doesn't matter if it's at the same time

most the issues come from the fact that you're trying to use it on a computer that didn't install said game onto the network drive

[fathom epoch]

After some fidgeting, including getting steam to not need the vhdx bc i couldnt figure out how to access the vhdx from a pc that didnt make it, i successfully accessed the games on 3 diff pcs

[knotty solstice]

With today’s update, Microsoft has finally fixed a bug where taskbar icons were misaligned on devices with custom scaling settings. This bug also affected virtual machines and icons were cut off from the taskbar. After applying today’s update, this issue will automatically disappear.

so that is what caused it

[jagged sentinel]

Nice

[knotty solstice]

and that would be why my desktop I never noticed it, I run 100% scaling

[tiny vault]

imagine

boomer

[stuck oar]

Should I get Windows 11 in like 6 months? (Around the time I should probably reset my PC again)

[jagged sentinel]

@stuck oar if you want to

By then most the bugs should be fixed for sure

But can't tell the future

[stuck oar]

True true. Would it be worth it is the real question, even if most of the bugs are worked out

[jagged sentinel]

@stuck oar I mean what's the downside? Why does it need to be "worth it" lol

It's a free automatic update for W10 users

[stuck oar]

Yeah

[jagged sentinel]

So update whenever is convenient for you anytime within the next 5 years

[fathom epoch]

I wonder if itll be a free update indefinitely or if itll be limited time like the upgrade to 10

[jagged sentinel]

@fathom epoch windows 10 is still free to upgrade lol

They never ended it

[fathom epoch]

I thought thats not officially supported?

[silent rock]

a lot of things aren't officially supported by ms ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[fathom epoch]

What's important to me is that it's officially supported as my company will not allow me to utilize something that isnt.

I'm aware that older OS keys work for 10 as I did that for friends/fam, but im unable to do so at work w/o official support

[stuck oar]

Its not exactly an "upgrade" anymore but you can still use the keys from win 7, 8, and 8.1

[fathom epoch]

Refer to my last two messages

If its still officially supported i can go back to upgrading pcs to win10

[stuck oar]

I mean, its not "officially" supported but they still let you do it

[jagged sentinel]

@stuck oar @fathom epoch the free upgrade tool literally still works

You don't have to use some old key or anything

[stuck oar]

Huh, ok then

I tried using it after the date it was supposedly over and didnt work so

[fathom epoch]

Ic

[jagged sentinel]

afaik it works again

or i believe just enabling accessibility settings makes it go through

or hell just installing windows over it i believe even it can detect the old version

[stuck oar]

Installing it over the old version, for some computers, the key is actually stored in the bios

[jagged sentinel]

Yes, pretty much all OEM computers or laptops are like that since like W7

[tawdry valve]

Is it true taskbar will be centered

Or could i change it

[jagged sentinel]

You can change it

center is just the default

@tawdry valve

[tawdry valve]

Ahh

Can i change the 'frosted glass' theme roo?

[jagged sentinel]

No unless you download stupid tweaking programs i guess.

But that's not a big deal honestly. you'll get used to it within a few days without doubt

every freaked out when W8's flat style came out and now that they're moving way from that everyone is freaking out again

[loud oxide]

Why do they bother with switching themes again... Flat was fine. I actually really hate Aero from W7 tho

I like flat. It's simple, and no bullshit. Wish the rest of windows was like that

xfce is like that too

[bitter bane]

Trends

[potent sparrow]

Aero was the best

All my homies love aero

[jagged sentinel]

It's still flat. Just has more transparency and rounded corners

Yeah it's a more fluid design inspired by modern web design for different sizes of screens

I will miss the tiles on the start menu on 10 though, I really like being able to customize it

[stuck oar]

Ok, so, for Windows 11, how much is just masked Windows 10 (or windows 7 because tbh, Windows 10 felt like a masked/bloated version of W7 imo)

[jagged sentinel]

W10 is objectively less bloated than 7 in terms of resource usage lol

And a far more efficient scheduler

11 makes even better improvements in resource usage and scheduling, although they're still working on optimizing it for games too @stuck oar

But also there's parts of w11 already inside of 10. Part of the reason that it's been even moderately stable is because they've already integrated kernel changes and modularity into w10

[stuck oar]

Windows 10 feels more bloated but I could be wrong. Ok, so basically Windows 11 is W10 but is being optimized. Is there any other major differences beside optimization and the visual layout?

[jagged sentinel]

There's some new features and support for ARM CPUs and big/little CPUs

And like generally better menus and personalization

[stuck oar]

I hope its still easy to turn off all the ad and personalized tracking stuff lol. Also, by big/little, do you mean its more optimized for multicore operations?

[jagged sentinel]

No, what Intel Alder Lake architecture is

They have big powerful cores and small efficient cores with less features

[stuck oar]

Ah, ok, so they may make it where the Windows run off the less powerful cores and Games and stuff off the 'bigger' cores

[jagged sentinel]

Pretty much

[stuck oar]

Cool, makes sense

[jagged sentinel]

Iirc you can

[stuck oar]

Also, the remote desktop with an Arm CPU could become a little more popular, maybe more in laptops. Where you can connect and have a massive performance boost or just stay offline and still use windows. Idk, kinda more like a virtualization of windows rather than streaming a window on another PC.

[fathom epoch]

Is there a way to have the old menu for right clicking files, folders, inside folders instead of the quick menu then more options?

[jagged sentinel]

i bet some regedit tweaks will come out soon enough

[knotty solstice]

the whole 2 tiers of right click menus is so odd now

[jagged sentinel]

Yeah it's terrible

[fathom epoch]

I already did a regedit to be able to mark trusted sites in internet options

I couldnt edit custom level or sites on internet options

[jagged sentinel]

Elaborate? Never heard of this

[jagged sentinel]

I though that was only for internet explorer settings

[fathom epoch]

I needed to add my NAS to sites under local intranet so uac didnt kick in every time i opened something

[fathom epoch]

I thought the same but it was apparently the fix to uac disliking my nas

[jagged sentinel]

Haha

[inland seal]

Lol, no. There's some stupid stuff in there that affects more than just Internet Explorer.

[fathom epoch]

Hey considering so many refer to it as internet explorer options it was a fair assumption of ours

[inland seal]

Oh, I know.

[jagged sentinel]

Oh I forgot DNS is in there too lol

[fathom epoch]

Wait really?

I always changed dns from adapter properties

[sleek basin]

5600x+b550 = 380-400$ keep old ram.

[jagged sentinel]

It should.

[cold pawn]

should I update?

I like how Windows 11 looks, so I thought I'll give it a try.

the launch is on October 5 either way, whatever

[jagged sentinel]

if you want to

personally i am gonna wait for bugs to be fixed @cold pawn

[coral harbor]

Ur a bug

Squash

[cold pawn]

talk about bugs being fixed

I just updated and I have some mix between windows 10 and 11

[jagged sentinel]

MSFT has been doing heavy A/B testing for W11

@cold pawn

so if you see some weird stuff like that it's probably part of a testing group

[cold pawn]

win 10 already has support for arm

[jagged sentinel]

Limited support and only on a specific version of it @cold pawn

And also things like x86_64 emulation still being in beta (x86 isn't afaik, just the 64 bit)

[cold pawn]

so do they have better x86 emulation or is there a version made specifically for arm chips?

[jagged sentinel]

So in W10 I believe it's made by Microsoft specifically for ARM

For W11 it uses an Intel software suite afaik

Not sure how much cooperation there is or shared code

(and the Intel stuff does work on AMD CPUs fully)

[cold pawn]

what is even happening

I have a W10 taskbar in W11, search doesn't work at all

and I can't even use Windows+S or other commands

[dawn vale]

for whatever reason, the upgrade goofed

do it over

[cold pawn]

I did it like 4 times

still the same

I just made a fresh installation, it's all good now

[vague sable]

Tell me how you accomplished this astonishment

[cold pawn]

I don't even know

I don't even want to know

I looked in the taskbar settings and I only had the Task View option

I couldn't even enable Search

[vague sable]

This effect is very desirable given how stupid collapsed tray icons are

[vague sable]

This was incredibly stupid to implement

[south heath]

dead

[slender pelican]

I don't think this makes sense

you're probably better off just waiting another year or two for a much better cpu from either intel or amd

since amd and intel are actually competitive at the moment

and hopefully intel

will get it's shit together power consumption wise

[fathom epoch]

I want to upgrade during second gen of ddr5

Never gonna early adopt new gen ram

[sleek basin]

I'll stick with my build rn for the next 3-5 years. No need upgrading when I don't need it

[fathom epoch]

I have a spending problem. Pls dont judge. cries in upgrading from 3950x/2080ti to 5900x/6800xt

[sleek basin]

Why....

[fathom epoch]

Sold the old hardware high enough to cover new hardware and there was a perf increase even tho i went from custom water to full air

[sleek basin]

You sold a custom water loop 3950x 2080ti for 5900 and 6800

[sleek basin]

Smh

[fathom epoch]

I still have the waterloop stuff

Just sold the parts

I gave info in #techdiscussion bc we are off topic here

[sleek basin]

is anybody upgrading to windows 11 yet

[analog ridge]

tomorrow

[jagged sentinel]

my laptop can't upgrade

4th gen i7

[dawn vale]

I'm just staying on prerelease Insiders permanently

Being ahead of the curve has generally been a rewarding experience

Quite stable, too

[slender pelican]

Busy?

[analog ridge]

eating

[slender pelican]

Nothing I own can upgrade except my one laptop I’m selling

[coral harbor]

Noob

[inland seal]

I'll upgrade my work laptop tomorrow.

Home computer has been on the insider preview for a while now.

[jagged sentinel]

will work like that

[analog ridge]

heh I give it a year before my work laptop updates

[sand bramble]

Yeah I only upgraded to Big Sur a few months ago. I only do it when I'm ready to deploy it to others.

I'm certainly not going to do 11 on the release date.

Well, I don't do upgrades either. Straight up reformat.

[analog ridge]

same!

[sand bramble]

I'm working on some stuff until end of the year on this "instance". I'll roll 11 around then with a fresh install assuming no major issues crop up.

At work we'll probably milk 10 until EOL. Just way too much other shit to keep up with.

[zinc tree]

My guess is that we'll start to upgrade within a few months. Moving from 7 to 10 when it went end of life proved that a more aggressive upgrade strategy was worth end-user pushback.

[analog ridge]

push the button

[dawn vale]

@analog ridge add this to ,ben

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mw-GxOLejTE

[analog ridge]

im not allowed access to ?ben

[dawn vale]

who has access

give them to me

[analog ridge]

people with admin

[tulip swan]

its out yay

[trail agate]

currently doing it right now....am at 81%

[sleek basin]

Ooooo

[sleek basin]

I wish you lucl

Luck*

[trail agate]

Managed to get through it

[zinc tree]

I've already upgraded one machine and will likely do the others later this week.

[cold pawn]

windows xp is coming out tomorrow, right?

[jagged sentinel]

yeah, wait for sp1 though

[cold pawn]

i'm reconsidering whether to stay with windows 98, or upgrade

[coral harbor]

Get windows 2000

[terse river]

Can't even upgrade to windows 11

feels bad man

[cold pawn]

i've checked this like every day the past week hoping for a sudden change LMAO

[jagged sentinel]

nope

[hallow aurora]

Cries in 9 year old 4 core

[forest prism]

Gross

[analog ridge]

Office wont install on 11. fuck

[half quiver]

if Windows 11 doesn't support my CPU now, it won't support it in the future as well right? i7-7700k

[analog ridge]

probably not, there are workarounds.

[half quiver]

any big drawbacks to install it anyway?

[narrow dagger]

Can you update to windows 11 withouth losing anything? Games , Drivers , Files?

[analog ridge]

might not be able to play online games...

[analog ridge]

you can, you shouldnt, wait for windows update or clean install

[narrow dagger]

wait for windows update?

[half quiver]

really, users mentioned that?

[narrow dagger]

What Windows update?

[analog ridge]

yea 11 will be pushed via windows update in time

[narrow dagger]

oh okay

[analog ridge]

anticheat is going to be tied into tpm.

[half quiver]

you can always check windows 11 assistant @narrow dagger

hmm, I'll wait for some feedback of people trying it without a supported CPU then

[narrow dagger]

How long will it take for the update to get released?

[analog ridge]

how long does it take to walk a road.

[narrow dagger]

.-.

But its going to be this Year right?

or this Month

or in a week

[half quiver]

if you're eager just go here https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows11

[narrow dagger]

yea i know

why wouldnt i download it there?

[half quiver]

license will carry over

[narrow dagger]

k

[analog ridge]

because its release day and you care about keeping your data.

these do not go well together

[narrow dagger]

Well thats kinda true.

But i dont want to wait another Month lol

[half quiver]

I assume if your device meets all requirements you'll get it this month eventually

[analog ridge]

so dont care about keeping your data

[tulip swan]

I think they start rolling it out automatically sometime next year

but for now you have to do it manually

[narrow dagger]

They already started rolling them out as far as i know

But its only for New Computers

I have an ryzen 5 5600x and a 3070 so i am expecting to get an updated to windows 11 This year.

[meager ivy]

how do you guys think W11 will affect compatibility of software, esp games and drivers?

[dawn vale]

none

absolutely zero

[analog ridge]

as someone who has just spent close to 6 hours troubleshooting windows hello on 11, itll be fine users are idiots

including me

[dawn vale]

i'm very confident in this release, actually

rolled insider months ago

still 100% stable

[analog ridge]

they seriously changed how hello interacts with azure, its impressive

[dawn vale]

[analog ridge]

also fucking pain, and you need intune to fuck with it

but for home its going to be nice, I see why they are pushing using an account

[narrow dagger]

@analog ridge I have a Problem with my Windows 11 update

The PC Integrity Test says that my pc is capable of installing windows 11 [i needed to enlable tmp 2.0]

But in the Update tab in the Settings it still says that i couldnt run Windows 11 how do i fix this does anyone know?

[analog ridge]

clean install

[narrow dagger]

no

i mean i have the update

The Auto Update

Under Windows setting.

But it still says that i couldnt run it.

[analog ridge]

so clean install.

[narrow dagger]

Altough the Integrity check says that i could run windows 11

[narrow dagger]

why thoe

[analog ridge]

so it works.

update is always a mess

[silk coral]

If you install windows 11 though the iso you would lose all installed programs right? I didn't get the update yet and was looking into that as a possibility

[analog ridge]

yes

[silk coral]

Ouch, then I guess I'll wait

Sucks they didn't make the update available to everyone on release day

[analog ridge]

they did

you just have to clean install

like you should be anyway

[silk coral]

Yea I guess but I would really prefer to keep my installed items

[knotty solstice]

@silk coral what does it show under check for updates

[dull raven]

did windows 11 came out

[analog ridge]

Yes

[dull raven]

should i upgrade?

update

[analog ridge]

No you should clean install or wait for Windows update to prompt you

[fathom epoch]

yall know how to get rid of the two tier right click menu yet?

[jagged sentinel]

WinAeroTweaker latest version has an option for it @fathom epoch

Also, first signs of bigger issues: MSI GF63 laptops seem to be getting crashes/bluescreens after updating to W11. Source: 100% of users on Reddit with the laptop, sample size of 2

[fathom epoch]

i had windows go unresponsive on my desktop while rapidly organizing files and folders

[jagged sentinel]

Windows file system manager has always been iffy ngl

For example there are repos on github that can copy files way faster than normal Windows can

[fathom epoch]

How did i not know winaerotweaker existed

[jagged sentinel]

i feel like you are the kind of person to be all up in that

[fathom epoch]

I will be now

im starting off with this, got tired scrolling through after realizing how extensive these options are

[terse river]

imagine disabling smiley

[jagged sentinel]

How dare you

[fathom epoch]

Can you change the error code of a manually initiated bsod?

[jagged sentinel]

Good news, Windows 11 ISO is immediately downloadable

Does this mean MacOS users can make a install media fucking finally?

[terse river]

hey that's new

[summer meadow]

I gotta enable this to get my pc prepared for Windows 11, but I'm afraid I might mess everything up...

Any ideas?

[cold pawn]

this is nearly impossible to mess up

as long as you follow the instructions properly and don’t touch any other options

you’ll be good

[summer meadow]

Very well. 👍

[jagged sentinel]

@summer meadow it's just checking one box, pretty easy.

[cold pawn]

https://youtu.be/NQPDe_eSQRo

this video fairly sums up windows 11 from what i’ve seen

idk why i expected the public release to suddenly be better

well now i’m gonna invest my processor savings to a new monitor until windows11 finally feels NORMAL

[jagged sentinel]

this video was aggressively stupid

they intentionally went into the oldest menus in Windows and took screenshots and claimed inconsistency

when really it's way fucking better than Windows 10

The only sore points are probably the start menu, right click menu, and action menu in the bottom right... nearly everything else has had major improvements

[cold pawn]

yeah but you’d expect they at least do a better attempt to make the old menus look more modern

for a billion dollar company, windows 11 YET AGAIN feels rushed and leaving out little details

sure windows 11 has some MAJOR pros over 10

but it’s the little things that give me such an ICK when it comes to using it

[jagged sentinel]

yeah but you’d expect they at least do a better attempt to make the old menus look more modern
They literally have been, constantly for the past several years

the issue is the Windows code base is fucking gigantic and archaic

you can't introduce or change things without breaking several other things

For example, the simple Format menu. It was written in 1994

To rewrite it could introduce lots of bugs and be a massive, frankly worthless effort when there's better things to tackle

[cold pawn]

i’m aware of that, but doesn’t that mean you’d expect they hire people or assign people towards making them more fluent with more modern designs

we’re gonna keep moving forward in time, so they might as well start enacting change now

[jagged sentinel]

I mean they do, and more menus get converted every update

The settings menu is finally nearly unified from the control panel

mixer is finally brought in

battery power plans brought in

[cold pawn]

yeah and that’s good

[jagged sentinel]

etc

[cold pawn]

i just wish they had done more LMAO

and ik eventually they will

but for a whole new OS w these shit requirements

i expected more

[jagged sentinel]

And also, not going to lie, converting old shit is boring and hard

Few people know how to do it

Few people want to do it

[cold pawn]

yeah i’d assume so, even w wii homebrew which is something i’ve been investing my time into recently, it is too much effort to make better forks of original software used for it

but still, billion dollar company should = billion dollar effort

and i’m not seeing that effort throughout 😞

anyways that’s my daily rant😇

[jagged sentinel]

what exactly is billion dollar effort to you

think of it this way

a) Change how the entire operating system works, you end up repeating the failures of Vista and 8 again

[cold pawn]

better than what 11 currently is

[jagged sentinel]

b) Overhaul all the systems to Windows 10 as we know it now, spend millions of dollars with 0 new features and 0 fresh looks or redesigns, people complain about lack of progress and move to other systems that add new features like Mac or ChromeOS

c) Spend most effort on new security features to reduce crashes and bluescreens, which is the biggest source of headaches for users, introduce new features and support for new hardware, and make a fresh UI to attract new attention from rising competition

C is obviously the best option.

[cold pawn]

LOL chromeOS should be replaced w linux

[jagged sentinel]

Let's be real, Linux does not compete with Windows in the slightest.

They are two different targets

It's getting there incredibly slowly, but it barely makes a splash

On the other hand, ChromeOS last year sold more systems than MacOS did.

[cold pawn]

yeah clearly it is, but i want 11 to look and feel better in those little aspects

they should have a seperate team fixing those small things (even if it is boring), and then putting them into developer releases of the OS, and slowly overtime making win11 as a whole very good from my pov

[jagged sentinel]

that is precisely what's happening, and frankly that video cherry picked nearly everything. Day to day usage is very consistent apart from the stupid two layer right click menu

[cold pawn]

yeah but the audience of chromeOS is mostly 12-21 year olds i’d assume due to its educational association (google docs etc)

[jagged sentinel]

aren't you literally in that age bracket

[cold pawn]

YES but i wouldn’t switch to chromeOS

[jagged sentinel]

And yes, ChromeOS has been widely adopted in schools.

Adults use what they used growing up

They graduate and buy what they know

Also why adobe aggressively gets schools licenses to its applications

[cold pawn]

ipad adults incoming😳😳

[jagged sentinel]

lol

[cold pawn]

7zip needs to step their game up and fix their context menu for win11

they can make it work w the new menu right?

i think so

[jagged sentinel]

There's I believe early support for adding things to the menu

https://blogs.windows.com/windowsdeveloper/2021/07/19/extending-the-context-menu-and-share-dialog-in-windows-11/

I don't know the extent that it can be changed but i'm hoping it's more customizable

[cold pawn]

by ‘unpackaged win32 apps’ it means microsoft store apps right?

7zip is in the store now i believe so eventually they will i assume

[jagged sentinel]

I believe that means just normal exe's

[cold pawn]

OH LMAO

[jagged sentinel]

Also the store can now support any type of application, not just UWP apps

[cold pawn]

exciting

[jagged sentinel]

It's powered by winget under the hood

[cold pawn]

i’m still looking forward to amazons android store

[jagged sentinel]

so now instead of having to deal with sketchy download sites and ads and shit

you can just do "winget install firefox" in the command line, or type in Firefox into the store

and it will download

No fucking kerfuffle or scams

[cold pawn]

THIS^^ when i was younger i got some viruses trying to find apps for my family pc online

the fake download buttons always got me

[jagged sentinel]

Hell even reputable applications used by the community often have ad-filled sites with fake download buttons

so infuriating

[coral harbor]

3000 download buttons

i fucking hate it

[jagged sentinel]

Even our beloved hwinfo

has several download buttons

half of them are not for what the user wants to download

[coral harbor]

i've clicked on way too many of these fake download buttons because i just click the first "DOWNLOAD" button i see

@steady scaffold

am i dumb or is this thing dumb

oh, --id

im a genius 😎

[silent rock]

winget is nice, but very dumb

[cold pawn]

should I upgrade to windows 11

[dull raven]

how do i get windows 10

window 11

[analog ridge]

,win11

[fair pier]

This method only works on Windows 10/11 PCs. Please ask for other methods if using a Mac, Linux, or earlier versions of Windows.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows11

1. Insert an 8GB or higher USB stick into your PC. Format the USB to NTFS before installation. Formatting will ERASE ALL DATA on the USB. (Right click the USB > Format > File System: NTFS > Quick Format > Start.)
2. Download the Windows MCT (Media Creation Tool) from the link above, titled Create Windows 11 Installation Media.
3. Run the MCT. Follow the prompts to select your USB flash drive as your media and create the installer.
4. Once complete, your USB is now ready to install Windows on another PC. Power down that PC. Insert the USB installer. Boot the PC.
   WARNING: When installing Windows on a new PC, ensure only one drive (the drive you want the OS on) is plugged in. Unplug all other drives prior to installing Windows.

[jagged sentinel]

@analog ridge why are you only suggesting fresh installs when you can do an in place upgrade

[analog ridge]

experience.

its a major update, take it as an opportunity to get a decent backup and clean install and not have left overs from an upgrade

[inland seal]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

I did an in place upgrade on my work laptop.

I'll likely wipe/reinstall on my home computer this weekend.

[analog ridge]

p.s. you should have a good backup before upgrading anyway

[sand bramble]

I don't even upgrade feature updates often.

[analog ridge]

I reinstall for feature updates too

[sand bramble]

And I don't install the summer ones.

[inland seal]

Although, the official release still doesn't have the hidden taskbars fix, so I might wait to wipe/reinstall at home.

Honestly, this is going to irk me at work.

[jagged sentinel]

That sounds awful

[sand bramble]

this is why

[inland seal]

I had my taskbars in different places on each monitor.

[sand bramble]

@jagged sentinel Not when you have a workflow. It doesn't take that much time for me to reinstall.

[analog ridge]

a clean install takes about 40 mins, to all apps installed and ready to go.

[inland seal]

Now they're all stuck at the bottom.. And I can't hide them. 😭

[sand bramble]

I've got a chocolatey script ready to go with most of my apps

So I usually wipe after the Fall update and review what apps I still want and newly published ones available

[analog ridge]

I have a ninite and a powershell but im going to move to winget and powershell just need to clean up the scripts and test it a few times

[sand bramble]

then go from there

I do the same with macOS but brew

[jagged sentinel]

Solidworks takes a solid day to install lol

[analog ridge]

and It gives me an opportunity to test my backup in a controlled environment

[jagged sentinel]

I have my data and configurations backed up but I have never had to use it

[analog ridge]

it really doesnt.

[sand bramble]

You should test that.

[analog ridge]

a backup isnt a backup till you know you can restore it.

[jagged sentinel]

Well yes but if I were to test it now I would be down for like 3 days minimum which I don't really want to do

[sand bramble]

You can test it to a VM

[analog ridge]

what ssd you running on.

[jagged sentinel]

It's not issues with drive speed

[analog ridge]

i know.

[jagged sentinel]

Just SW and things like Vivado take aaaages to install even with decent network speed

[analog ridge]

I mean use this as a grab a 1tb ssd, use it to test your recovery and install scripts, and have the old drive ready to fail back to if you know you fucked up

[sand bramble]

Since I don't care about my config restore I just test my data backups. Mostly just includes ordering a drive from B2 and making sure it has my data that I can move some of it.

then sending it back

[analog ridge]

I think I bought a new drive for every version of windows till now.

but I know my backups are good at the moment

[jagged sentinel]

If direct storage requires C: being an NVMe I will have to buy a new drive

I was considering it anyways because I'm desperately running out of SSD space

[analog ridge]

then that is what I would do If I was you.

1tb nvme for the c, and start clean but document how you get back up and running and try to automate as much of it as possible

[jagged sentinel]

My C/C++ shit is going to be the worst to get back running

Mostly cause C++ development in Windows is awfuuuuuuul

I also have a significant amount of things added to my PATH that is not typical for even an advanced set up

[cold pawn]

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZSeRXWWeV/

this ad is dumb

[summer meadow]

Good news: I can upgrade to Windows 11.
Bad news: doing so will nuke all of my files, so it'll take an eternity and a half to back everything up.

[jagged sentinel]

you can do an in-place upgrade

but you should still back everything up

[summer meadow]

Noted

[coral sleet]

Hey am I able to clean install Windows 11 from an External Hard Drive? To upgrade from Windows 10?

[analog ridge]

no

get a usb stick

[coral sleet]

I don't have one

and why not?

[jagged sentinel]

you can, microsoft provides a downloadable ISO now

[analog ridge]

and putting that on a hdd not a usb is a fucking pain

[coral sleet]

I have a new 4TB external hard drive but no USB stick I know it's weird but it's complicated

[jagged sentinel]

should be the same, i presume they mean using the HDD as the install media

[analog ridge]

yes stupid idea

its not the same

[coral sleet]

Nothing on the drive

[jagged sentinel]

it might take longer but hey doesn't really matter

[coral sleet]

it's very new

[analog ridge]

but it does

because its not the same

[jagged sentinel]

if it's an external drive it should show up to windows as an normal removable drive and the media creation tool should work.

I don't see any problem

[analog ridge]

because it doesnt

because its not a flash storage

its a hdd

[coral sleet]

How do I see if it'll work

[analog ridge]

,win11

[fair pier]

This method only works on Windows 10/11 PCs. Please ask for other methods if using a Mac, Linux, or earlier versions of Windows.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows11

1. Insert an 8GB or higher USB stick into your PC. Format the USB to NTFS before installation. Formatting will ERASE ALL DATA on the USB. (Right click the USB > Format > File System: NTFS > Quick Format > Start.)
2. Download the Windows MCT (Media Creation Tool) from the link above, titled Create Windows 11 Installation Media.
3. Run the MCT. Follow the prompts to select your USB flash drive as your media and create the installer.
4. Once complete, your USB is now ready to install Windows on another PC. Power down that PC. Insert the USB installer. Boot the PC.
   WARNING: When installing Windows on a new PC, ensure only one drive (the drive you want the OS on) is plugged in. Unplug all other drives prior to installing Windows.

[analog ridge]

run the tool

it wont

[jagged sentinel]

Why would it matter if it's flash or not?

[analog ridge]

because thats how installers work.

[jagged sentinel]

The storage controller abstraction should make none of that matter.

[analog ridge]

but it does.

[jagged sentinel]

And install media used to be on fucking DVDs so I still don't get the issue

and before that floppies.

[analog ridge]

because it doesnt work.

[coral sleet]

can I put the MCT onto the drive and see if it'll accept it

[jagged sentinel]

@coral sleet You need to run the MCT from your downloads folder

[analog ridge]

no.

you run the mct

and select the drive from within it

[coral sleet]

ok

[analog ridge]

it wont show up

[jagged sentinel]

@analog ridge I can understand the technical aspect of it if you were to just tell me what the issue is.

[coral sleet]

do I need to format the drive first?

[analog ridge]

there isnt one, its a artificial limitation

but its still a limitiation

[analog ridge]

you shouldnt

but honestly just buy a usb

[coral sleet]

i can't

i dont even know what size

[jagged sentinel]

8GB or higher for Windows

[jagged sentinel]

Then shouldn't just burning the ISO to the drive through Rufus work then?

Rufus also has support for Windows 11 in the drop-down menu too.

They added it in the latest update

[analog ridge]

no because rufus shouldnt be used for windows.

because MCT exists

[jagged sentinel]

Yes but you can use it

and the whole previous complaint of MSFT not easily distributing ISOs is gone now so you can just use that instead if other methods don't work

[analog ridge]

yea so lets just fudge the install media onto an unsupport drive for an os.

just do it properly

a usb stick is fuck all

[jagged sentinel]

You know as well as I do that nothing wrong would happen lol

[analog ridge]

but it can

[jagged sentinel]

Such as?

You said it was an artifical limitation

[analog ridge]

its like the fuckwits that try to make a usb stick off mac

just do it properly

[jagged sentinel]

They should be able to do it from any computer, frankly

which is why it's nice that the ISO is available easily

[analog ridge]

no you shouldnt

there is a thing called ntfs.

macs dont have it

[jagged sentinel]

I know that, the file size thing is dumb.

[analog ridge]

fuck me im wrong, windows updated,.

you can use ssds as install media.

[jagged sentinel]

I hope that the ISO being available means that other operating systems can more easily create windows install media

[analog ridge]

no point.

[jagged sentinel]

Like yeah Windows is ubiquitous, but being able to do it from any system is nice.

[coral sleet]

can it be a USB-C flash drive

[jagged sentinel]

sure

[analog ridge]

not really its an installer you make once every 6 months for a windows system,

[analog ridge]

yes

but not a phone.

ive seen someone try that

[coral sleet]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SanDisk-Ultra-Flash-Drive-Type-C/dp/B01EZ0X23W/ref=sr_1_9?dchild=1&keywords=usb+c+stick+32gb&qid=1633538720&sr=8-9

[jagged sentinel]

And how often do people come in here with only a mac trying to set up a new gaming desktop

[analog ridge]

and how often when told to go find a windows pc do they manage it

[jagged sentinel]

I've seen a few not have one.

The whole point of modern software development is to encourage interopability between systems

[analog ridge]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07YYJ63VF this is what im using now

[jagged sentinel]

Even Microsoft themselves have been making a point of that in their own endeavours

[coral sleet]

If I already have a NTFS drive do I need to wipe it to install windows from it?

[analog ridge]

yes

[coral sleet]

My 4TB one isn’t NTFS it’s GPT

[analog ridge]

gpt supports ntfs

but yes it needs wiping

[coral sleet]

So I’d be able to wipe my new drive and put the install media onto it?

[analog ridge]

yes

[coral sleet]

Ok

[analog ridge]

just run the mct and select it

it should do it all for you

[coral sleet]

Will it wipe it for me?

[analog ridge]

yes

[coral sleet]

Ok Ty

[inland seal]

Should, yes.

[coral sleet]

Do I choose USB Flash Drive or ISO File for which media to use on the external hard drive

[jagged sentinel]

Try using the media creation tool and select usb flash drive on the external hard drive for now, see if it lets you do that.

[analog ridge]

usb

[coral sleet]

also what about hidden files on the drive

[jagged sentinel]

those disappear when formatting

[jagged sentinel]

Yes, those will all go away.

And they will probably be destroyed

[coral sleet]

are they crucial to the operation of my hard drive?

[jagged sentinel]

No

[coral sleet]

well I'll copy them to my PC hard drive so I can put them back after

well the Spolight folder is to do with Mac's Spotlight search

I have plugged it into a mac in the past so

[coral sleet]

When I'm booting from the installation media, and get to the where I want to install it to, am I able to differentiate drives? Because my SSD has no files I care to keep it's pretty much only the Windows 10 install, but my HDD has all files I wanna keep.

[zinc tree]

@analog ridgewe started to deploy 11 at work, thus far no issues (either with upgrades or fresh installs).

And while fresh installs are ideal, it's good to know that we can push 11 out if needed.

[analog ridge]

unplug all apart from the one you are installing on

[coral sleet]

but it's in my computer

[analog ridge]

ive had soooo many auth issues with azure

[analog ridge]

and.

[coral sleet]

i dont know how to do that

[zinc tree]

Huh, interesting - thus far we haven't had any problems.

[analog ridge]

do you use hello

[inland seal]

Turn off the computer. Unplug it. Open it up. Unplug the sata data cables from all of the drives except the SSD you want to install Windows on. Plug computer back in. Turn it on. Install Windows. Power off. Unplug. Plug drives back in. Close computer. Plug in. Turn on. Tada.

[analog ridge]

,after if you need a video guide of how to unplug a drive

[fair pier]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYYoCXh2gtw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYYoCXh2gtw

[zinc tree]

I don't think the machines that 11 has been deployed to thus far do, although my personal machine does so that'll be interesting.

[analog ridge]

its been the main source of my issues

[sand bramble]

We're so far away from being able to deploy 11.

Just keeping up with 10 is enough.

I'm hoping we can start working on it after we deploy 21H2 next Summer.

[steady scaffold]

Threads are bad.

No one reads them.

Channels only gang.

[jagged sentinel]

No

[dawn vale]

I will be deploying it at work since machine count is like 10.

Or not actually they're not supported.

Fuck.

21H2 time.

[jagged sentinel]

@dawn vale I'm upgrading to 21h1 soon

[dawn vale]

That being said

I want winget on them for obvious reasons

Easier setup

by several orders of magnitude

[slender pelican]

No

[inland seal]

You're bad.

[slender pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-jackson-bad-whos-bad-80s-music-mj-gif-18917942

[steady scaffold]

🖕

[vagrant notch]

is this on fire?

https://www.techpowerup.com/287539/amd-processors-lose-15-gaming-performance-with-windows-11-l3-cache-latency-tripled

????

welp i guess not upgrading

'''Thankfully, both issues can be fixed via software updates, and AMD is working with Microsoft to push fixes for both issues through Windows Update, in an update rollout scheduled within October 2021.''- will wait then

[zinc tree]

@vagrant notchinteresting, I haven't seen that behavior but the one system I've upgraded that is used for gaming is also at 4k and so the CPU performance isn't the main determining factor.

[vagrant notch]

i guess this is offical so i guess i will wait lol

tbh i was not plan to upgrade until closer till end of the year anyways

[jagged sentinel]

@vagrant notch It seems to be pretty rare

I've seen 0 reports of it reading lots of peoples' first hand experience in gaming

[zinc tree]

@vagrant notchreportably there is already a fix in the dev build so that's probably why I didn't run into the issue because I just switched away from that.
Although that likely also means the fix will be deployed to the main release soon.

[vagrant notch]

yea they said this month

so i guess we will know lol

[jagged sentinel]

most likely just issues with the scheduler switching in such a way that triggers flushes to L3

[sleek basin]

Anybody daily driving windows 11 have any big issues? Might switch

[zinc tree]

Personally I haven't had any issues at work or at home.

[sleek basin]

Ok

Do you know if any drivers would be affected by switching?

Or is the base remaining the same

[silent rock]

haven't seen any issues on mine either

[zinc tree]

From what I've seen it hasn't needed to pull over any new drivers so long as you're reasonably up-to-date.

[tulip swan]

not really, some things don't work

[sleek basin]

Like what

[silent rock]

it's just a reskinned win10, not much changed beyond looks

[zinc tree]

There are some nice additions, though most of those haven't been rolled out yet.

[tulip swan]

some mods for gta, transferring files from win 10 - win 11 sometimes don't work

[sleek basin]

Anything besides that

[silent rock]

android app emulation is what I was hyped for, but MS pushed w11 out half-baked

[tulip swan]

not really

internet explorer is gone ):

[silent rock]

oh, the horror

[zinc tree]

That in itself makes upgrading worthwhile. 🤣

[sleek basin]

What a tragedy lmaooo

[tulip swan]

tragedy for teachers

[sleek basin]

Lol

I wouldn't worry too much, they will upgrade after a while

[fathom epoch]

Im still getting stupid high framerates but im playing on 5120x1440 which is nearly as hefty as 4k

And thats with stock 5900x, jedec ram, stock 6800xt

[jagged sentinel]

As i said earlier, it seems to be very rare.

or under very specific circumstances

[dawn vale]

this requires context

this used to be equally broken on 10, where the CPU would actively modify CPPC2 data at runtime in order to fool the scheduler into providing CCX locality

My assumption is that they simply didn't catch the fact 11 has a significantly reworked scheduler and modified their behavior accordingly

So that'll get solved quickly

[vagrant notch]

idk i just thought is a article lol

[mint lark]

Guys

Am I gonna have any issue with win 11 but TMP fixed

As my has no TMP

[cold pawn]

what

you can technically run windows 11 without TPM 2.0. i think BUT there is risk you won't get updates for win11, meaning it's not worth it

if your processor is one of windows 11's supported processors, i believe you can turn on virtual TPM for it in the BIOS

[terse river]

any processor that's compatible with windows 11 has TPM

[mint lark]

It is i5 6600

[cold pawn]

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/design/minimum/supported/windows-11-supported-intel-processors

i checked through the above list but i dont think your processor is supported for windows 11, you can correct me if im wrong but i dont think it's there

meaning you shouldnt be considering upgrading to win11

[mint lark]

Ohh I'll upgrade next year

Whos gonna buy ddr4 platform

When DDR5 is on the way

[cold pawn]

what

[mint lark]

Nvm

[tulip swan]

woahh

[cold pawn]

oooh maybe bing will actually become good😳

[tulip swan]

this is on win 11 so maybe its just my pc

[inland seal]

Bing is good for certain... things.

[analog ridge]

[sand bramble]

yeh, bing's tube section is great

[stark vortex]

bing is wack

[sand bramble]

you just haven't used it for the right things

[sleek basin]

bing has good things?

[sleek basin]

me bc its cheap

[sand bramble]

certain video searches it excels at

[sleek basin]

youtube?

[analog ridge]

no.

[sand bramble]

youtube does not have the videos I am talking about

[analog ridge]

more obscure content.

[sand bramble]

dunno if I'd call it obscure, in fact it might be the top content on the internet

but it isn't allowed on youtube et al

[inland seal]

more obscure obscene content

[ripe saddle]

so if you have amp cpu its bad to update to win 11

atm

[jagged sentinel]

Seems to be very rare or only under specific circumstances

I've seen tons of posts on reddit of people with AMD CPUs that don't have any performance issues whatsoever

[ripe saddle]

okay I guess I can try

Can always roll back to win 10

[fathom epoch]

i just noticed a MASSIVE diff in the L3 cache perf of my 5900x in benchmark though idk how much it effects real world usage bc im still getting killer numbers in games and such

Even on stupidly high CPU intensive games

[inland seal]

I'm not a heavy gamer by any means, but I haven't noticed any drop in performance.

Granted, I'm GPU limited, not CPU limited. My poor 1080 struggles a bit at 1440p.

[ripe saddle]

I hope my ryzen 7 3700x will be ok with windows 11

[jagged sentinel]

How are you testing it specifically?

[jagged sentinel]

almost certainly

[fathom epoch]

aida

[fathom epoch]

#overclocking message

[pliant perch]

is win11 good enough to upgrade a main pc or are there a few bugs that i should be wary of

[jagged sentinel]

no major bugs. mostly minor glitches. there is a known issue on new AMD CPUs that seems to occur in specific circumstances that can drop performance, but an update should be coming out for that very soon. It is rare.

@pliant perch

[pliant perch]

so updating is recommended?

[cold pawn]

it's up to you

[jagged sentinel]

I personally am waiting a few months at minimum to not get the majority of the bugs and annoyances

Lots of people are excited for it and overall I've seen positive reception of W11.

But it's up to you if you are OK with dealing with occasional messed up menus or buttons being askew

But I haven't seen any wide reports of crashes or instability or incompatibility

[pliant perch]

so only problems are weird little ui errors so far

[jagged sentinel]

Basically, and the rare AMD performance issue I mentioned

[pliant perch]

👍 thanks

[jagged sentinel]

There's also some issues with networking local network drives but I know you don't have any of those lol

[fathom epoch]

fr?

[jagged sentinel]

Wasn't it you that had issues with that?

I saw some other reports on Reddit about it.

[fathom epoch]

That was steam being fucked

Steam gave me issues readding a game library located on NAS

[jagged sentinel]

I'm not sure it was the same exact issue but I saw some complains about network drives being fucky

[fathom epoch]

For me it was steam rather than w11

[jagged sentinel]

Yeah this was a W11 thing

[fathom epoch]

I'm glad i didnt run into that ig

I can see the perf drop on benchmarks for my ryzen cpu but i didnt watch game fps prior to upgrading to compare to now

[jagged sentinel]

From what I'm reading on one of the larger threads, people that are seeing changes in Aida aren't seeing changes in games.

I'm really curious where AMD's mention of esports games come from

[fathom epoch]

disappointing, i woulda looked forward to another 15% fps when shit gets fixed

[jagged sentinel]

hah

just download the XBOX FPS Boost

[fathom epoch]

Hopefully all this oc'ing im doing gives me at least 1.5% fps instead

[jagged sentinel]

OC the W11 scheduler

[urban cove]

is it possible to install w11 on ryzen 5 1600 pc?

or is it that once it says you can't it's done

[jagged sentinel]

@urban cove it's not officially supported. You can install it but you are not guaranteed updates

[frosty siren]

been trying to get windows 11 but these 2 problems are stopping me. It wants me to switch my boot option from legacy to uefi but when I do that my computer doesn't recognise a boot device.

[jagged sentinel]

@frosty siren yes, that is expected

You have to convert your windows install with a command

@frosty siren https://youtu.be/NivpAiuh-s0 skip to 5:10

[frosty siren]

@jagged sentinel I can update now thanks for the help

[inland seal]

Gross. Videos. Use this handy article that walks you through it instead: https://www.windowscentral.com/how-convert-mbr-disk-gpt-move-bios-uefi-windows-10

[jagged sentinel]

Can this be a pin or a command

Like ,uefi

[loud oxide]

does anyone with Intel HD 4000 graphics have windows 11
is there still like a massive performance decrease from windows 10 like I experienced
since I'm almost certain that was driver related

gonna try it again.
maybe even download modded performance drivers if there is no drivers present when I check

[loud oxide]

Okay, im on windows 11

after finding the leftover driver install file i had

and installing an actual driver for display

it feels very good

maybe a little snappier than 10 even

[ionic dew]

How do I get Windows 11?

[loud oxide]

,win11

[fair pier]

This method only works on Windows 10/11 PCs. Please ask for other methods if using a Mac, Linux, or earlier versions of Windows.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows11

1. Insert an 8GB or higher USB stick into your PC. Format the USB to NTFS before installation. Formatting will ERASE ALL DATA on the USB. (Right click the USB > Format > File System: NTFS > Quick Format > Start.)
2. Download the Windows MCT (Media Creation Tool) from the link above, titled Create Windows 11 Installation Media.
3. Run the MCT. Follow the prompts to select your USB flash drive as your media and create the installer.
4. Once complete, your USB is now ready to install Windows on another PC. Power down that PC. Insert the USB installer. Boot the PC.
   WARNING: When installing Windows on a new PC, ensure only one drive (the drive you want the OS on) is plugged in. Unplug all other drives prior to installing Windows.

[jagged sentinel]

alternatively you can wait for the automatic update for you

[fathom epoch]

Anyone on dev build?

Someone recommended i go from beta to dev for the ryzen l3 cache fix

[loud oxide]

Unless your CPU is technically unsupported (like mine)
then fucking SUCKS to be you

[dawn vale]

I am

Can't say that you're liable to get anything more stable in Dev than elsewhere, though

[fathom epoch]

Im just hoping its not noticeably worse.

[dawn vale]

Shouldn't be

Just follow the usual guidance

No Insidering unless you can burn the machine at some point

I have that workflow down so I daily Dev

[fathom epoch]

Burn it?

[dawn vale]

Reinstall

[fathom epoch]

O

Shit i used to reinstall every like 3 months and i dont even remember why.

[inland seal]

I am, too.

[dawn vale]

Yeah should be fine, just have to be aware it is a preview

So y'know.

[inland seal]

Because Dev fixes the hidden taskbars.

[dawn vale]

Explorer crashed often for a few builds...

[fathom epoch]

Im already on beta so I was aware of the risks

Ive noticed it crash once on me

Though i haven't had to do any major windows troubleshooting in quite some time, Im not unfamiliar with it

[mossy grove]

Fuck windows

Linux p

O

[cold pawn]

hi

[fiery ruin]