archived-modding-development

[midnight narwhal]

ok uh so how would i do this

[jolly oriole]

if you want that information inside of an FsmStateAction:

GameObject ownerDefaultTarget = base.Fsm.GetOwnerDefaultTarget(this.gameObject);

if you want that from outside (with pfsm being the fsm you want it from):

GameObject ownerDefaultTarget = pfsm.Fsm.GetOwnerDefaultTarget(ownerDefault);

[midnight narwhal]

k ty

[worn eagle]

I hope when tc said enemies in silksong were more complex they meant they're using smarter fsms rather than bigger fsms

[midnight narwhal]

https://paste.mod.gg/ebawodohaq.cpp anyone know why this is giving me a NullReferenceException?

For reference,

[ERROR]:[UNITY] - NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
[ERROR]:[UNITY] - SoullessMode.SoullessMode.SceneManager_sceneLoaded (Scene arg0, LoadSceneMode arg1)
[ERROR]:[UNITY] - UnityEngine.SceneManagement.SceneManager.Internal_SceneLoaded (Scene scene, LoadSceneMode mode)

[copper nacelle]

why

i would guess on that being it

that's just gonna end up being fsm.gameObject

[midnight narwhal]

oh

how would i fix this?

[copper nacelle]

I mean if you're just trying to increase the scale, fsm.gameObject.transform.localScale *= 5; seems fine to me

[midnight narwhal]

its readonly

fsm.gameObject

wait

[copper nacelle]

hmmm

[midnight narwhal]

nvm

i guess its no longer readonly?

or i did something wrong the last time i tried that

ty

[copper nacelle]

this is just a guess on the nre still, if you had the wrong action name that would also do it

[nocturne meteor]

Somewhat related, if I wanted to, say, replace every enemy X with an enemy Y, do I need to overwrite each attribute manually, or is there something like,
if (fsm.FsmName == "X") { // make this a Y }
which does it at like, an object level?

[copper nacelle]

destroy the old one instantiate a new one

[nocturne meteor]

Makes sense, thx.

[nocturne meteor]

Hm, okay, I'm doin' something wrong here. I'm going from the radiance api page, but I'm confused on:

GameObject aspid = Instantiate(Aspid.preloadedGO["Aspid"]);
...
...        
PlayMakerFSM fsm  = aspid.LocateMyFSM("spitter");

Is the object for the entire thing the first thing? And then, from that object, the actions and such are the PlayMakerFSM thing after?

[midnight narwhal]

nah you were right it was that line

[nocturne meteor]

Oh, wait, I think I get it --- I don't even need to mess with FSM here, I can just kill off the game object and instantiate a new one that I want --- that didn't click until now.

Or --- wait, do I need to use FSM, because I'm not sure how to get the enemy object. Instantiate and Aspid in that above code don't seem to be found, and I'm using ModCommon, PlayMaker, and PlayMaker.Actions. Hm.

[midnight narwhal]

what is the tiktik fsm called? I cant find it in FSM Viewer

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, I couldn't find it either and that's what enemy I wanted to manipulate. :'[

[jolly oriole]

done via the MonoBehaviour Climber

and they're called Climber

@midnight narwhal @nocturne meteor

[midnight narwhal]

oh ty

wait the fsm is called "Climber"?

[nocturne meteor]

That's kind of a cute name.

[midnight narwhal]

i still dont see it

unless im looking in the wrong place

[jolly oriole]

MonoBehaviour, not fsm

[midnight narwhal]

oh

[nocturne meteor]

Is there a nice way to "get" every object of type "Climber"?

Some sort of Object.FindObjectsOfType thing?

[jolly oriole]

exactly that

[leaden hedge]

GameObject.FindObjectsOfType<T>() iirc

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, nice. And is the type of these "Climber"? Or is that just the name of them?

[leaden hedge]

whatever is to the left of : MonoBehaviour

[jolly oriole]

the type is Climber, and the name

[leaden hedge]

findobjectsoftype is slow af

so dont do it often

[nocturne meteor]

Got it. And, maybe dumb question, but what if I wanted all of the enemies except climber. Is there a way to just say "general enemies"?

[leaden hedge]

HealthManager

[nocturne meteor]

I'm more exploring what I can do with a mod, not really making anything for production, so I don't mind.

[leaden hedge]

then manually filter climbers out

[nocturne meteor]

That makes sense --- all enemies should inherit from HealthManager. Okay, cool.

[leaden hedge]

even things that cant die, like the "flies" you pogo off in white palace have them

[jolly oriole]

well, technically they can die, you just need to deal over 999 damage in one hit

or 4 9s, idk

[leaden hedge]

instead of doing findalloftype

if it has an awake function

you can do On.Type.Awake += ...

[nocturne meteor]

Oh, interesting --- I just read something about looping over objects and seeing if they had certain methods, weird timing.

Once I have the HealthManager for an enemy, should I use myHM.getComponent() to return the enemy object (for me to destroy and put a new one in)? I'm not sure how to get to something like Crawler 1 from Crawler 1 (HealthManager).

Oh, or can I go right to .gameObject?

[vocal spire]

So you are trying to get the GameObject of the health manager?

[vocal spire]

Yeah

[leaden hedge]

and if its nested, you can do .transform.parent.gameobject

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, I promise that I'll quit bugging y'all: if I want to overwrite this game object, is it enough to create my own game object (or copy it from another GO) and do something like myHM.gameObject = myOtherGameObject? Is that gonna mess anything up?

[vocal spire]

You don’t overwrite it

You add the HealthManager component to a the GameObject and set all of the fields and stuff to the original health manager’s stuff

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, okay, it's readonly. Wait, I'm a bit confused by this --- so I've got a bunch of healthmanager objects (one for each enemy) and each of them has a gameobject --- is that game object a parent or a child of the health manager?

[leaden hedge]

a parent

[nocturne meteor]

Ahhh, okay. My mistake then. So, we're really looking for game objects which have a healthmanager child because those are enemies. Once I have a healthmanager, I look at the game object. I now want to make a change to what enemy this is: which requires modifying some attributes / child classes of GameObject.

[leaden hedge]

scene
-gameobject
--transform
---childgameobject
----transform
----spriterenderer
--healthmanager
-gameobject2
--transform

[nocturne meteor]

So I gott'a find the subclasses / attributes in "enemy" game objects, copy the ones from, say, Climber, and then replace all of them in the GameObject I'm trying to change --- is that mostly okay?

[leaden hedge]

is roughly how scenes look

[nocturne meteor]

Alright. I'm not sure what the transform is, but I know the rest.

[leaden hedge]

transform is like a required component

it says where it is, and how big it is

[potent dirge]

is GameObject things like the knight, or transtrans, or VK, or NKG?

[leaden hedge]

are you trying to replace gameobject a with gameobject b?

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah. Let's say, to be concrete: a crawler with a climber.

[leaden hedge]

get a reference to gameobject b GameObject b = gameobjectB;
copy gameobject a transform Transform trans = gameobjectA.transform;
destroy gameobject a Destroy(gameobjectA);
instantiate a copy of gameobject b gameobjectC = Instantiate(gamobjectB);
paste the transform onto the new gameobject gameobjectC.transform = trans;

[nocturne meteor]

Is transform what holds things like the sprite, etc?

[leaden hedge]

no

transform is position data

size,rotation,position

Instantiating something makes a 1:1 copy of it

but you want it where gameobjectA was

[nocturne meteor]

Ahhh, I see.

Alright, I'm tryin' this out now. :'] Thank you so far, it's been v helpful.

[leaden hedge]

im not 100% sure if gameobjectA.transform will return a reference or a value

you may have to do something more complicated to store it temporarily after the reference is destroyed

[nocturne meteor]

I'll check the value after destroy.

Is it myGameObject.DestroyAll()? The Destroy(myGameObject) doesn't exist in my context.

[leaden hedge]

its on monobehaviours

you'll need to do GameObject.Destroy(object) iirc

if you're not on a component/gameobject

either immediate or not will work fine

[nocturne meteor]

That looks like it'll be okay.

Alas, looks like gameObjectC.transform is read-only, on the last step. :'[

[leaden hedge]

you can just iterate over it

the values arent

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, cool.

[leaden hedge]

so you can do objectC.transform.position = temp.position

localscale, localrotation, localposition

[potent dirge]

is SceneManager child of something, or rather how do I use SceneManager.activeSceneChanged (with 1.2.2.1 as usual, so might be different from 1.4.3.2)

[nocturne meteor]

Alright, great, I think I've got a bit to dive into, I'll work more after work on it. :'] thank you all.

[jolly oriole]

i don't think unity changed that much, so

SceneManager.activeSceneChanged += whatever;
...
private void whatever(Scene from, Scene to) {
    // whatever
}

[potent dirge]

heck u code that is not working for a reason i do not understand

[jolly oriole]

try UnityEngine.SceneManagement.SceneManager

[potent dirge]

if this works your a genius pog

[worn eagle]

good

[fair rampart]

can i do a mod on Mac?

[leaden hedge]

yes

[fair rampart]

txz

[ornate rivet]

doing mods sounds hot

[vocal spire]

🤔

[safe hamlet]

why have you said this

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, I'm tryin' to make a bunch of enemies into TikTiks for coding practice. The plan, (from getting help above), was to foreach through the healthmanagers in a scene, put their transform stuff into local vars, then instantiate a TikTik ("Climber") gameobject and assign those transforms.

I've been trying to do the instantiate part, but I can't figure out how to just get a single Climber enemy to act as the "template" that I can copy from. If I do it by scene, the object will become null when the scene ends --- and it's really weird to deep-copy a class in C# it seems. So, I'd like to get a Climber object at the init of the code somehow. Like,

GameObject climberGO = Instantiate(GameObject.FindObjectsOfTypeAll(Climber)[0])

Or something like that. That does't work, though. Any thoughts or ideas? Code is here for reference: https://github.com/jsal13/TikTikTikTik/blob/main/main.cs#L17-L33

[jolly oriole]

do

UObject.DontDestroyOnLoad(climberGO);
climberGO.SetActive(false);

after the instantiate

[nocturne meteor]

That line (the one above I typed that defines climberGO) doesn't work for me at all --- I just was using it as an example.

But that's a good step to do after I figure out how to get a Climber game object.

[jolly oriole]

try

GameObject climberGO = Instantiate(GameObject.FindObjectsOfType<Climber>()[0])

or

// assuming climber has an awake method, idk if it has
On.Climber.Awake += OnClimberAwake;
...
private void OnClimberAwake(On.Climber.orig_Awake orig, Climber self)
{
    orig(self);

    this.climberGO = Instantiate(self.gameObject);
    UObject.DontDestroyOnLoad(this.climberGO);
    this.climberGO.SetActive(false);
    On.Climber.Awake -= OnClimberAwake;
}

[nocturne meteor]

For the first, I feel like this should work, but I don't have the unqualified Instantiate in this namespace. Is this the same as using GameObject.Instantiate?

[jolly oriole]

yes

[nocturne meteor]

okay, cool, then I get back to the similar problem as above: Cannot implicitly convert type 'Climber' to 'UnityEngine.GameObject'.

Trying to explicitly convert this, I get: 'Climber' is a type, which is not valid in the given context

[jolly oriole]

then try

GameObject climberGO = Instantiate(GameObject.FindObjectsOfType<Climber>()[0].gameObject);

i forgot the .gameObject

[nocturne meteor]

Insane. Haha, that seems to work. I cannot believe I forgot to do that.

Alright, cool, gettin' closer, just gonna debug later and see what's the goin's on. Thank you!

[sacred echo]

Hi everyone, i wanna make custom hk modes but i don' t know where to start. Any advice?

btw, i know how to code, but have never tried modding

[jolly oriole]

https://radiance.host/apidocs/Getting-Started.html

[sacred echo]

thx a lot

[mystic umbra]

I finished up programming my first mod, is it alright if I post some findings I had about the code/the intro docs?

[nocturne meteor]

Go for it.

Also, I question re: mods here and the etiquette of asking people about their mods. The work + field I'm in, there's a strong emphasis on open source contributions and making source open unless there's a strong reason to not. Is it bad form to ask people if their code is on github/whatever? I don't want to offend anyone or whatever, I just am not sure how people feel about it here. [Nothing happened, btw, I wanted to make sure for the future.]

[copper nacelle]

no

people regularly do that

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, sweet. The context here is that I was in another community a while back for modding which that wasn't looked on fondly [for whatever reason] and I just thought about that noise when I was about to ask someone if their work was on github. Thanks.

Okay, to make my stuff dev related now. I've got this short snippet: https://github.com/jsal13/TikTikTikTik/blob/main/main.cs and the gist is I'm just trying to do a dumb toy mod to make all enemies into Climbers. When I run this, it seems to successfully destroy the enemies, but it does not seem to Instantiate the Climber Game Object --- there are just no enemies.

Anyone see anything obvious or dumb that I'm doing here?

[INFO]:Okay, this is a Fly 2, destroying...
[INFO]:(11.0, 38.8, -4.0), (0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0), (1.0, 1.0, 1.0)

Here's some sample output, so it looks like the transstuff is being saved after being destroyed.

[copper nacelle]

this isn't going to work in any scene which doesn't have a climber

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, I need to figure out how to get a general climber game object, but for now I just try it in the first two rooms of crossroads.

[copper nacelle]

use normal position not localPosition

and set your newGO active

it'll keep the active state of your climber, which is false

so you need to set it true explicitly

[nocturne meteor]

Ahh! Okay, let me try that.

Is there a reason to not use localposition? Is that relative to the scene and position is relative to the world or something?

[copper nacelle]

i think it's relative to the parent but idr

[nocturne meteor]

Alright, cool. I'm goin' through unity lesson stuff now so I'll [hopefully] have fewer basic questions in the future.

[jolly jungle]

Hell yeah, please do
All corrections help

[jolly jungle]

I'm no expert, but I think preloading can do that
https://radiance.host/apidocs/ModdingAPI.html#preload-gameobjects

Hopefully that can help you

[nocturne meteor]

Oh, man, this is awesome.

[jolly jungle]

Yayy :D

[nocturne meteor]

How do I find the "full name" of a GameObject? I get the scenes, but they're usually called like, "Crawler 1" or "Crawler 6" or whateva.

[leaden hedge]

it is relative to the parent

but if you have no parent its relative to the scene

[jolly jungle]

I think they can be found in the scene dumps? I'm not sure

[languid goblet]

i think there's a list of scenes in pins

yeah

like you'd probably look in one of the crossroads scenes and then ctrl f for crawler

[nocturne meteor]

Ahh, okay, thanks Katie. Okay, so I should use the non-local versions of the transform stuff? And okay, lemme look at the scene dumpz.

[leaden hedge]

they both set the same variable

.transform just does whatever you did - parent.transform

[nocturne meteor]

Oh, I meant .transform.localPosition vs .transform.position.

[leaden hedge]

its apparently significantly faster

[jolly jungle]

Also their names usually appear in other places, like the fsmviewer and the sprite extractor (I think that's what it was?)

[leaden hedge]

use localPosition does the same as .position unless you have a parent

[jolly jungle]

They usually go by the same names I think

[leaden hedge]

except position has to recalculate more stuff

[nocturne meteor]

Ahhhh, okay, I understand now.

Okay, so in here it's like, _Enemies\Climber 1, which I'm guessing is the full name. :'']

[leaden hedge]

is there not a thing for preloading

that you just give a scene and gameobject name too and it gives you a reference

[nocturne meteor]

Is it what Godfriend linked above in the radiance api? I'm trying that out now.

[leaden hedge]

yeah

[nocturne meteor]

[WARN]:[API] - Could not find object "_Enemies\Climber 1" in scene "Crossroads_03"" oh no! Maybe it's just called Climber 1.

Okay, nm, copying the command from the rando mod. It's like, (SceneNames.Tutorial_01, "_Enemies/Crawler 1"), for anyone's future reference.

[jolly jungle]

Ah, thanks

I hadn't yet actually used this, I looked into it before I realised all the things I need are in the same scene I'm using

[nocturne meteor]

Haha, okay, it pulls it, but I still don't get anything to come up: https://github.com/jsal13/TikTikTikTik/blob/main/main.cs any ideas? Do I need to activate the new game objects? Do I need to have these not be local objects or something?

I am getting a legit climber object: Climber 1(Clone) so that works great!

[jolly jungle]

Ooh, it works?

[nocturne meteor]

The preloader thing does! Haha, but not the whole thing.

[jolly jungle]

Wait no you sent them at the same time so the second one isn't a progress update

Oh I see

So what's the part that isn't working right now?

[nocturne meteor]

I'm tryin' to see if it's maybe like a weird reference problem or something, idk.

[ERROR]:[UNITY] - UnityEngine.Object.Instantiate[GameObject] (UnityEngine.GameObject original)
[ERROR]:[UNITY] - TikTikTikTik.TikTikTikTik.SceneLoadedHandler (Scene scene, LoadSceneMode _mode)
[ERROR]:[UNITY] - UnityEngine.SceneManagement.SceneManager.Internal_SceneLoaded (Scene scene, LoadSceneMode mode)```

I'm getting this error, so it's making me think that it's "using up" the preloaded object or something when I instantiate it once?  I'm not really sure, but I'm trying to maybe pull it explicitly from the dict each time instead of making a single ref to it.

[jolly jungle]

Hm, this looks similar to something I had when I tried to spawn in hive knight spears

But I think I was just approaching the instantiation the wrong way

I took a step or two back and tried again, I think

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, I prob just have to think of how I'm doing it. I'm tryin' out a few things, maybe something will work nicely. :']

[jolly jungle]

Hopefully

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, I'm unsure which worked, but Object.DontDestroyOnLoad(newGO); and newGO.SetActive(true) worked!

[languid goblet]

were the tiktiks not moving?

[nocturne meteor]

they weren't showing up at all.

[languid goblet]

oh huh

do they move for you?

[nocturne meteor]

"yes", sort of. they usually move in a little circle in the air.

which i kind of expected.

[languid goblet]

ah

[nocturne meteor]

haha yeah, who knows. hoo knows. But it's good enough for what I needed it for, which was: practice. :'']

[leaden hedge]

yes thats the behaviour if they aren't on a collision box

[nocturne meteor]

yeah, it makes sense since they're little climber bois.

[leaden hedge]

if the green arrow doesn't hit ground it rotates 90 degrees

iirc

[nocturne meteor]

haha, this is the best picture of a climber. :''']

yeah i can mess around with it a bit, but im glad i could replace things at least.

[languid goblet]

i asked bc the last time i tried preloading (by spawning primal aspids everytime you swing your nail), they would appear but not move at all

[jolly jungle]

Hey, I was thinking
About reskinning enemies/bosses
We can technically reskin anything else, too, no?

[leaden hedge]

transtrans

yeah if stuff doesn't move its because its code isn't active

you need to activate the fsm/monobehaviour

[jolly jungle]

#hk-meme message
this is what happens when you get into special specific scenarios

[languid goblet]

i did setActive(true) though
is the fsm separate from that?

[jolly oriole]

the fsm does have its own active flag, tho in the case of enemies it's more likely that the fsm "softlocked" and you need to set the state to some kind of init state

[leaden hedge]

it'll be copied in whatever state it was in

and that includes ai distance stuff iirc

[languid goblet]

oh ok
guess i’ll look into fsm stuff sometime

[leaden hedge]

it probably includes a "start state" variable

you can check to send it to the start state

[languid goblet]

is avalonia fsm viewer out?

[leaden hedge]

infact i think you don't even need to look it up

just turn it off and on, with the actual fsm enabled variable

and it'll go back to init

[jolly oriole]

well, i can say that some stuff i worked with (although almost all of it was monobehaviours, but i think an fsm was also among those), things on the behaviours would already start executing in the middle of my function where i copy that

[languid goblet]

do you mean turning the fsm off and on again?

[leaden hedge]

yes when it gets activated, it goes to its start state

[languid goblet]

alr, will try it out

[leaden hedge]

i guess when its instantiated it isn't enabled

so it just keeps where it was

[jolly jungle]

Wait were you referring to the "reskin anything" I asked?

[mystic umbra]

Super long feedback message coming in hot

Alright, here is all the stuff I noticed when making my mod. First the bugs:
-In the documentation and charm helper it says when making settings that just instantiating the lists in the class outside of the constructor is fine, this actually causes a bug with the json deserializer that the game uses. Whatever deserializer the game uses will deserialize the json and put it into the settings class, however, when the deserializer creates a new instance of the settings class the lists get filled with the defaults and then the deserializer will just append all the data from the save file to the end of the lists. This makes the lists gain one new default var in each list whenever the save is loaded. I was able to get around this by declaring the lists as normal, initializing them with empty lists in the constructor, and then in the NewGameHook I fill out the lists with my default data. This makes it so the deserializer only creates empty lists and the default data still makes it in at the start of the game.

• @jolly oriole I found a bug in the charm helper where if the player loads the save multiple times within one instance of Hollow Knight then the charms break and get unequipped. I looked into it on your Github and it looks like in OnCharmIconListStart charmIDs will get the custom charms added every time the save is loaded and the list is never emptied so the custom charms keep getting added to the list. I was able to fix this in my code by just clearing out the charmIDs in AfterSaveGameLoadHook. You'll probably want to do something similar in there or in OnCharmIconListStart.

Now onto the general feedback:
-The documentation mentions SFcore several times, but it never tells the user where to get it. Putting in a short blurb about where the github is or to grab it from the ModInstaller would be nice.
-The charm helper example and documentation are out of date a bit. The Mod<TSaveSettings, TGlobalSettings is deprecated, but both still use it in a few places which makes it slightly confusing for new users. There is also a section in the charm helper example that sets Settings to Settings when the save file is loaded which was super confusing and probably did something when Mod<TSaveSettings, TGlobalSettings> was a thing, but doesn't do anything right now.
-I was thinking about it and I think that all the get and set code for the charm data could probably just be moved into the charm helper. It's just a lot of extra boiler plate code that doesn't seem necessary for the user to write every time they want to make a new charm. I just don't see a world where a mod would do something funky and modify the charm notch cost of a charm dynamically and if a user wanted to then they could just make a child class of the charm helper and override it or just do it in their code without overriding. This feedback might need some more discussion from other people here, but I think it could work.

That's everything I can think of right now, let me know if you guys need any clarification on any of this.

[jolly jungle]

Woo, this is gonna be great to read

Thanks :D

[mystic umbra]

No problem

[jolly jungle]

Zal-

[mystic umbra]

The feedback was actually so long I needed to split it into two messages and I almost made it into three

[jolly jungle]

Hm, better three and overword than two and not enough

Anyhow, this is way too technical for me although I do understand around half to two third of it nice work, summarising your findings

[mystic umbra]

I was actually sitting on this for like two days because I was worried about insulting people with the info. I'm a programmer in my normal day to day which is why it's more on the technical side

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, I feel ya. I haven't done much of the charm stuff, and I'm just learning about C# stuff (from Python baybeeessss) but I think this was mostly the work of one or two people and so it's impressive but it's also nice to peer-review the docs, etc.

[mystic umbra]

Yeah, this modding api and documentation is very impressive. I know I couldn't have done this without the api

I tried once on a different game and programming in assembly makes me sad

[nocturne meteor]

100%, this is leagues better than most of the docs I've seen for other games I've tried to mod. :'] But it still can be improved and PR'd into etc.

[jolly oriole]

The documentation mentions SFcore several times, but it never tells the user where to get it. Putting in a short blurb about where the github is or to grab it from the ModInstaller would be nice.
https://radiance.host/apidocs/SFCore.html#add-a-reference

Add a reference
    After downloading SFCore from the ModInstaller, open your project and right-click References and click on Add Reference

though next time i update that i'll probably make that more obvious

The charm helper example and documentation are out of date a bit. The Mod<TSaveSettings, TGlobalSettings is deprecated, but both still use it in a few places which makes it slightly confusing for new users. There is also a section in the charm helper example that sets Settings to Settings when the save file is loaded which was super confusing and probably did something when Mod<TSaveSettings, TGlobalSettings> was a thing, but doesn't do anything right now.
personally i continue to use Mod<TSaveSettings, TGlobalSettings> as it makes accessing save and global settings easier

I was thinking about it and I think that all the get and set code for the charm data could probably just be moved into the charm helper. It's just a lot of extra boiler plate code that doesn't seem necessary for the user to write every time they want to make a new charm. I just don't see a world where a mod would do something funky and modify the charm notch cost of a charm dynamically and if a user wanted to then they could just make a child class of the charm helper and override it or just do it in their code without overriding. This feedback might need some more discussion from other people here, but I think it could work.
somehow didn't think about that 🤔 , although "modify the charm notch cost of a charm" is the main part of charm balancing mods, like charm overhaul

[leaden hedge]

and yes transtrans is the reskin anything thing

[jolly oriole]

and that i'll look into when i'm home from work

[leaden hedge]

it reskins a tiktik to a transtrans

so it has the code for reskining other things too

[jolly jungle]

Hm

[leaden hedge]

[jolly jungle]

So suppose I want to reskin some random object - a cart in the Crossroads, for example - how do I find what's the name of the sheet that needs to be replaced?

[leaden hedge]

dont really need to find it

[jolly jungle]

Also stop sabotaging my ability to type by making me melt from the cuteness of that creature

[leaden hedge]

find the object, find its tk2dsprite/sprite renderer

find its texture and dump it

[jolly jungle]

Oh, I see

So I find it through the object itself

[leaden hedge]

if you use godump

[jolly jungle]

Are the files in the HK Sprites drive already dumped like this?

[leaden hedge]

it'll be named

and you can just ctrl+f for object name

[jolly jungle]

Hm, this seems kind-of-maybe-complicated

I'll need to see it when I actually do it

Thanks

[leaden hedge]

its like a few minutes with godump

and most of it is afk

[jolly jungle]

Is this the way Customknight works or does that have a different way of doing it?

[leaden hedge]

customknight works the same way yes

it just replaces the texture on the knight

[jolly jungle]

So I can use this to have a mod, in addition to whatever else, reskin the knight, without using customknight

Lovely

Will they clash if they're enabled together?

[leaden hedge]

one of them will replace the knights texture

[jolly jungle]

And the other?

[jolly oriole]

won't

[carmine mauve]

hi , do you guys think they'll use vulkan for the linux port of silksong instead of opengl ?

[leaden hedge]

it will use the default settings for unity projects being exported

[jolly oriole]

@copper nacelle quote from <#archived-modding-development message>:

Whatever deserializer the game uses will deserialize the json and put it into the settings class, however, when the deserializer creates a new instance of the settings class the lists get filled with the defaults and then the deserializer will just append all the data from the save file to the end of the lists.
you probably know more about json.net than i do, but from what i looked at the code for loading save settings shouldn't append contents to existing savesettings

this.Settings = JsonConvert.Deseri...

at least i hope so

[copper nacelle]

yeah it really shouldn't append

That's a new instance

[jolly oriole]

but i tested it, and it for some reason does append

[copper nacelle]

[jolly oriole]

though the "only" things that are affected are enumerables

afaik

only tested now: lists are affected, arrays arent, dictionaries probably also arent

[prime urchin]

might have something to do with the default value handling setting?

er

[carmine mauve]

can't the default setting be changed to vulkan instead of opengl ?

[prime urchin]

object creation handling

[leaden hedge]

i mean you can set it in your project settings

tc will just use whatever is default

[carmine mauve]

will it matter if i send them this suggestion via email ?

i really want silksong to use vulkan instead of opengl

[leaden hedge]

your best bet is to probably bother graig

[carmine mauve]

i doubt he's the one testing for linux

but i'll try

[jolly oriole]

yep, from those 3 only the lists are affected (it would have been very weird if dictionaries also appended something)

[copper nacelle]

object creation handling - replace

apparently

[jolly oriole]

well, ig i'll just use arrays instead of lists

[copper nacelle]

why

terrible words

[jolly oriole]

make me not use arrays

[prime urchin]

might be able to do an OnDeserializing attribute and overwrite the list with a new one there?

[vocal spire]

Had this problem a while ago

[ornate rivet]

mods pls remove

thanks

[plush frigate]

dw ill remove the server

[jolly oriole]

pog

[ornate rivet]

delete main

[jolly oriole]

I was thinking about it and I think that all the get and set code for the charm data could probably just be moved into the charm helper. It's just a lot of extra boiler plate code that doesn't seem necessary for the user to write every time they want to make a new charm.
@mystic umbra looked at this, but i would have to let the helper put its values into a save hook, which i don't feel like doing

[worn eagle]

I probably shouldn't be offering this at its current state but I want to know how this works on other people's computers who don't have Qt installed

Windows only

[prime urchin]

Seems to work fine for me

[worn eagle]

oh god this thing is 161 MB

nvm a bunch of it is cmake stuff

[mystic umbra]

The documentation mentions SFcore several times, but it never tells the user where to get it. Putting in a short blurb about where the github is or to grab it from the ModInstaller would be nice.
Turns out you're right and I can't read. Linking to the github to install would be nice as opposed to having to look it up in the discord

personally i continue to use Mod<TSaveSettings, TGlobalSettings> as it makes accessing save and global settings easier
While it's fine for you to still use this way if this is meant to teach new users on how to mod we should be using the up to date, current, and non-redacted methods for teaching people.

somehow didn't think about that 🤔 , although "modify the charm notch cost of a charm" is the main part of charm balancing mods, like charm overhaul
For this I'm talking about changing the charm notch costs dynamically based on the game state instead of keeping the cost of the charm the same throughout the entire run of the game. You would still be able to change charm costs at game start up to what you want, but changing it in the middle of the game would be harder without making a child class of CharmHelper

[mystic umbra]

I could do a PR for this if you want so you don't have to do it, unless you mean you don't want CharmHelper to do it

[nocturne meteor]

For this stuff, just so that SF doesn't have to do a whole lot of extra work themselves, do you accept PRs into it, SF? I don't have anything off the top of my head, but it might make updating / etc. less stressful if you have a community behind ya.

[mystic umbra]

Or whatever it's called for changing your code. I don't use Github enough to remember

[nocturne meteor]

Haha, I was just about to ask that, W^2.

I had docs for one thing and every time people asked me to change it I'd just slog around and never do it, and then I started having people PR into it and I don't even have to do anything on it anymore. :']

[mystic umbra]

If you do decide to just do this instead of changing it then make sure to update the documentation so that new users are aware and don't fall into the two day bug fix pit I went into

[mystic umbra]

Nice, that's pretty good. I haven't done open source or Github since I've left school. Nothing I have currently is worth getting PR'd

That's actually kind of a lie, I just remembered that every year when I do the GGJ I use Github for it

[nocturne meteor]

Documentation is a great thing to PR into open source stuff because it's pretty easy, it helps everyone out, and it forces you to have good habits re: docs on other things. :'] But it's up to the maintainer usually. Sometimes they'd rather not deal with having to parse through a lot of PRs. And that's okay too.

[jolly oriole]

yeah PRs are fine

@copper nacelle i could PR it in like 8 hours if you don't want to do it
https://stackoverflow.com/a/29113182

var settings = new JsonSerializerSettings
{
    ObjectCreationHandling = ObjectCreationHandling.Replace
};

[copper nacelle]

bro that's what I said

[jolly oriole]

as if i know what you write

[copper nacelle]

this is so sad

[jolly oriole]

but ig imma pr it later, so i can also include language stuff

[jolly jungle]

What's all this PR mean?

[jolly oriole]

pull request, essentially you fork a repo from somebody else, make changes, and ask them if they pull your changes into their repo

[deep wave]

looking through a vanilla output log: is there any way this should be an error that exists?

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at iTween.RetrieveArgs () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at iTween.Awake () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
UnityEngine.GameObject:SetActive(Boolean)
Benchwarp.BenchMaker:MakeBench()
Benchwarp.BenchMaker:TryToDeploy(Scene, Scene)
UnityEngine.SceneManagement.SceneManager:Internal_ActiveSceneChanged(Scene, Scene)
UnityEngine.SceneManagement.SceneManager:UnloadSceneNameIndexInternal(String, Int32, Boolean, Boolean&)
UnityEngine.SceneManagement.SceneManager:UnloadScene(String)
<BeginSceneTransitionRoutine>c__AnonStorey13:<>m__2()
<BeginRoutine>c__Iterator0:MoveNext()
UnityEngine.SetupCoroutine:InvokeMoveNext(IEnumerator, IntPtr)```

[nocturne meteor]

https://guides.github.com/activities/hello-world/ is a good guide to the world of github, if you're interested in that! As SF noted, it's a way to make (with their approval) changes to code in someone else's project.

[deep wave]

(unless Benchwarp is just a namespace in TC code and im just pepega)

[jolly oriole]

itween apparently doesn't like it when stuff is instantiated, but i'd have to look at the code for itween to know what's causing a nullreference

[deep wave]

im more concerned about the fact that Benchwarp is appearing when this output log was from me playing on vanilla (replacing assembly-csharp to uninstall API)

[jolly oriole]

that sounds like you have 2 game installs, and used one with the modding api installed

otherwise benchwarp should never be loaded

[deep wave]

the last time i ran HK, i ran it on vanilla. I have one install which i switch assembly-csharp between modded and vanilla

or... not? apparently i launched it on modded last night

don't mind me

[oak idol]

how do i mod

[jolly oriole]

https://radiance.host/apidocs/Getting-Started.html

[hazy aspen]

A lot of things can be analyzed from a Hollow Knight save file just for statistics fun. 🙂 Here I'm playing with a function of counting Unbroken/Broken/Total discovered Geo Rocks in the game, as well as providing a list of the locations of all Unbroken ones (not yet available in release version of the tool)

[jolly oriole]

for the location: maybe instead of the scene name, map each scene name to a descriptive location, like Crossroads entrance, under the well, ...
but that would take a big chunk of time

maybe change the text next to Bosses to either 14/14 or 100%

[deep wave]

i have a dictionary for translating scene names actually

https://github.com/ManicJamie/HKTranslator based off an xml in saves folder, you can probably just modify to use the xml as embedded resource

rando also has geo rock names in rocks.xml i believe

[hazy aspen]

Wow, this is really helpful! Thanks very much for the advices, info and dictionary 🙂 In an ideal world, where financial support for such tool development actually exists, I have a wish to maybe show all these locations directly on a map (like using pixel or % XY coordinates), that would be awesome, and I would learn new things, but unfortunately extremely time-consuming, and at this point this idea remains rather in the dream world and is a total curiosity

[leaden hedge]

you could automatically parse that information, if you have a map

[deep wave]

I've been thinking about adapting modinstaller for some time now, especially for use with other patches/speedrunning, as well as handling multiple versions of the same mod. i guess my main question is: does this seem better than current modinstaller?

[jolly oriole]

tbh looks cluttered at first glance, at second glance ig downloading mods is done in the download mods sub menu?

[deep wave]

yeah, i felt it made more sense in terms of how i use it at least

[jolly oriole]

otherwise it looks nice

[deep wave]

this is just a mockup, my main gripe was with being able to enable mods without enabling their dependencies and the lack of ability to have presets, as i frequently switch between speedrun practice/randomizer/custom levels

[worn eagle]

is this wpf?

[deep wave]

yeah, just using the same as modinstaller... unless all of these are specific to .net 4 and im acidentally using that

[worn eagle]

windows only 😔

[potent dirge]

I like it. I could give smol feedback on word choices, but composition is clearly understandable imo

[proven cipher]

It looks at least as intuitive as the current mod installer

[deep wave]

cerpin feedback

[proven cipher]

Which is a start

I would use this

[jolly oriole]

don't forget to include something like https://github.com/Ayugradow/ModInstaller/blob/master/ModInstaller/ModManager.cs#L269 as mickely likes to have these kinds of people in #archived-modding-help

[proven cipher]

If it looked like this and functioned I would use it

[deep wave]

it will take me at current rate of me doing things about.... an undefined period of time to get this working

yeah SF i was planning on just copying over most of modinstaller code, i noticed that

[jolly oriole]

poggers

[potent dirge]

What's "install nickname"?
Change -> Select below that?
Launch (game?) to bottom left or top left, left aligned?
Preset -> profile?

[deep wave]

install nickname = nickname given to that specific install (i couldn't think of a better wording)

[jolly oriole]

"Current Installation: {}" ?

[deep wave]

also another thing: is it good or bad idea to have the right side collapse when vanilla is selected

[potent dirge]

Bad

[jolly oriole]

just grey it out, if possible

[potent dirge]

Maybe have as an option

[leaden hedge]

why would you make it say please buy the game

[potent dirge]

I know I'd check stuff like mods available when unmodded as well

[leaden hedge]

you need to make that error message cryptic af

so people incriminate themselves more

[jolly oriole]

good point

[potent dirge]

Also why tell me to buy the game just bc I downpatched

[deep wave]

but then we get more complaining in #archived-modding-help

[leaden hedge]

it wont on pc

it'll try to run it through steam, which should work

[deep wave]

but then again, funni

[leaden hedge]

and by pc i mean windows

also much better solution

is to require a steam oauth

that just checks if they own it

[deep wave]

gog exists

[leaden hedge]

what

[deep wave]

people use gog to buy hollow knight

[leaden hedge]

i dont speak polish

sorry

[deep wave]

[leaden hedge]

i believe gog also has oauth

[deep wave]

eventually i suppose i'll work on that, but unfortunately my brain very small currently

[jolly oriole]

apparently https://gogapidocs.readthedocs.io/en/latest/auth.html

[potent dirge]

What if you're not using gog galaxy

[leaden hedge]

then you use steam oauth

[potent dirge]

Drm free games needing drm

[deep wave]

gog is drm free, which presents an issue for us, attempting to do drm

[leaden hedge]

the game is drm free

doesn't mean you get access to forums or support for free too

[deep wave]

yeah i agree with that

issue is if you launch HK without gog galaxy, does gog do an oauth check?

[leaden hedge]

nope

you can just take the folder put it on a usb stick

and run it on a computer thats never connected to the internet

[deep wave]

so oauth checking only works if you have a steam install

[jolly oriole]

it can add achievements to an account tho

[leaden hedge]

no it works for gog, or should

gog has oauth

[potent dirge]

It doesn't do achievements if you only launch the exe from gog

[deep wave]

does gog galaxy need to be installed for hk to run?

im guessing no

[leaden hedge]

https://github.com/Sude-/lgogdownloader

no

you don't need it for oauth either

[deep wave]

oh that makes more sense

[leaden hedge]

you literally just load a webpage, they login, you can check what games they own

[jolly oriole]

the only option halfway left is the downloadable version directly from humblebundle (only half because you also get a steam key in the same purchase)

[potent dirge]

I'd expect humblebundle to have oauth support too

[jolly oriole]

but thanks to the steam key that can wait

[deep wave]

basically if the popular torrents are of the humblebundle drm version then this doesnt work?

also is there an easy way to check which version of hk is installed

[jolly oriole]

still works, as the game doesn't have any account information attached to itself

[jolly oriole]

one of the classes in assembly csharp has a version string, maybe that's also somewhere else, idk tho

[deep wave]

im guessing modinstaller currently assumes that the game you're installing it onto is vanilla?

[leaden hedge]

what

you ask them to sign into their account

and you then check their account details to see if they own it

[jolly oriole]

it checks SHA1 checksums of the current assembly-csharp to newest one in modlinks, if they don't match, newest modding api gets downloaded

[leaden hedge]

like once you have an oauth gog token, you can request /user/data/games/

and it returns a list of owned games

[deep wave]

ok that makes sense

[unborn flicker]

Tired: whatever that idea was
Wired: use reflection on the assembly to check if the version is 1424, and then delete system32

[deep wave]

ok now that is truly beautiful

do i feel bad if i delete all their save games and the install as well?

[leaden hedge]

i dont think loading unity dlls externally work well

[unborn flicker]

Yeah, that might be an issue

[deep wave]

simply load every dll for unity individually, then assembly csharp

[jolly oriole]

why

[deep wave]

i'd assume logic flys half out of the window when looking at decompiled TC code

[leaden hedge]

why is it in savegame?

[jolly oriole]

probably a const that gets optimized

[leaden hedge]

when it saves after an update it makes a backup iirc

[jolly oriole]

Constants.GAME_VERSION contains the game version (who would've thought)

[potent dirge]

I can tell you for sure its not in the assembly version field bc that would've made sense

[jolly oriole]

the version of Hollow Knight.exe is the unity version that was used to compile the game, so technically that could also be used

[leaden hedge]

if you want real 🧠

this string at the start will never realistically get used

write whatever you want in it

[deep wave]

permanently mark their install as pirated? very blessed

[leaden hedge]

if you want to permanent mark on their file

add a registry

[deep wave]

i was thinking of that, but what if they actually.... go buy the game

[leaden hedge]

once a freeloader always a freeloader

[deep wave]

so my idea ig is:
On first run, check for a registry key: if nonexistent, make key and ask to log in. If works, set key to true
(also make this key super obscure named and inside the TC root because why not)
if false, set key to false, and pretend to throw weird unsolvable error

these already exist

[leaden hedge]

just make it say something like "error unknown: please post error code 3T4R1P in modding help"

[jolly oriole]

or just "Error Code {insert something hexadecimal}"

oh wow, didn't notice it said that

[deep wave]

can even include a handy link 🙂

[vocal spire]

Even better: a random error from a list of them or something, preventing pirates from figuring it out for a bit longer

[deep wave]

take random number, encode into base64, make that the error code

[leaden hedge]

if you want to make a bunch of pirate themed easter eggs sure

3T4R1P | P1R4T3

[jolly oriole]

base64: cGlyYXRl

[leaden hedge]

kopiihou

ihoukopi is jp for illegal copy

[safe hamlet]

weeb ass mf

[leaden hedge]

smd

you're uninvited from modding dev sid

go back to the trashcan

[safe hamlet]

dcolonw

[worn eagle]

can someone on Linux test whether this works

oh I didn't think discord would handle 68 MB w/o nitro

[jolly oriole]

because the server is boosted, everyone here has 100 MB upload limit

which is why Pale court still can't be leaked lmao

[deep wave]

incorporating a few changes: i was also wondering if a TabControl would be more intuitive to switch between managing installed mods & installing new mods, and would also offer a neat and tidy place for a settings menu

[leaden hedge]

is randomizer/practice/custom levels the presets?

[deep wave]

yeah those are just some example presets i made

[copper nacelle]

winforms

[leaden hedge]

move download mods and check for updates out of its column

and make load/save take up half the column

[deep wave]

makes sense - if i do the tabcontrol thing then i can remove Download Mods button entirely

[leaden hedge]

infact get rid of check for updates

and just do it on open

[deep wave]

i actually did this specifically because doing it on open is one of my least favourite things about modinstaller

[leaden hedge]

i mean just do it automatically

if there is an update

[deep wave]

because i have lots of mods that i keep specific versions of (like rando), it takes an age to actually open installer because i need to click through 20 boxes first

[leaden hedge]

put some text at the bottom that says out of date

[deep wave]

i'll just do it async

(not seriously)

[leaden hedge]

i mean what does it even do

check of mod updates or installer updates

[deep wave]

mod updates

[leaden hedge]

you don't need a button for that

just put a thing next to each mod

that says it out of date, that you can click to update if you want

[deep wave]

that makes good sense

[leaden hedge]

or recolour it

and let you right click to update

and what do half the buttons on the left do, i assume vanilla/modded swaps the assembly-csharp.dll
does switch installs just do select path, but automatically
and what does select patch do

i'd probably have a list like you have for presets

but one for each install/patch you have

[deep wave]

[leaden hedge]

like this i guess

in seperate "window"

you select your install patch, then it changes view to mods/patches just for that install

[copper nacelle]

it does it on open because users suck is the thing you're missing

otherwise they'll just not update

[leaden hedge]

thats fixable too

just have a rightclick -> dont automatically update this mod

[deep wave]

had to redo all scaling because i forgot to open VS in 100% scaling 🥴

(left side still needs changing i realise)

the load and save preset buttons do feel very large atm

[leaden hedge]

load and save should be on the same row

[deep wave]

so this?

[leaden hedge]

yeah

[deep wave]

now there is copius space for every set of mods you could ever want

[nocturne meteor]

Just saw this, so I'll give some initial impressions (you don't have to answer my questions, they're just what a new user might see and ask.

1. What do the "Vanilla" and "Modded" buttons do? I'm scared to click them, I don't wanna mess up my game.
2. Switch installs? I am but a simple hollow knight user, what does this mean?
3. Okay, select path... and select patch... must be similar, they're on the same line. What are they and why do I need them?
4. Middle boxes seem fine, makes sense to me.
5. What is this upper box? Is this possible mods I can have? Or is this the kinds of games I can do?

(There might be context before this, or instructions --- this is just blindly looking at it.)

Having said that, I like the way it looks in general. Looks really professional 'n legit looking.

[deep wave]

left side is to be completely changed immediately

[nocturne meteor]

Haha, I'm just thinking about, you know, hanging out in Modding-Help and seeing the kinds of questions we get in there --- and trying to prevent everyone from asking the same questions over and over.

[deep wave]

other questions i may have: Should i use the space on right side when moddingapi is not enabled for an install just to say "hey you don't have moddingapi on so you won't be able to do anything", then move the "Vanilla" button to the right side as well?
Do I treat 1 install of the game in vanilla and modded as separate installs, and display them separately to the user?

im just assuming im completely stupid here and not going to make any final decisions until somebody's said they look good/feel intuitive

[languid goblet]

suggestion about the layout: maybe you could move the installs over to the right side, bc they're also kind of like presets in their own way
the only issue is that it might make it a bit cramped

[leaden hedge]

i would allow the presets even without modding api, disable save

and pressing load should give a warning that it will install modding api

[deep wave]

katie i'd like to keep the ability to launch into the game as vanilla

[leaden hedge]

i mean if you load a modded preset

[deep wave]

and not have to click through an additional message box to confirm that

[leaden hedge]

it should just install modding api

[languid goblet]

you could steal borrow from celeste's mod installer and have two buttons to launch vanilla or launch modded on an installation

[deep wave]

I'd like to keep mod management and api management totally separate ideally; merging api ver into the presets box feels like its separating too far from what's actually going on

(i've never seen celeste mod installer, should i?)

[leaden hedge]

theres no reason to disable the presets on a vanilla install, using them should just set install to whatever the preset is

im not saying have the presets be the api version

just if you make a preset with api ver x installed and randomizer

you should be able to click it to install the api and randomizer

[languid goblet]

the layout is pretty nice, but you can't manage mods from the main menu and instead has a news panel for modding related stuff which would probably be useless for hk

[deep wave]

So what if I treat the left side like a set of "Profiles", each relating to an install of HK that is either modded or unmodded. Switching between a modded and unmodded profile on the same path just replaces the assembly of that install to be modded/unmodded respectively. So for example, if I add a game install at C:/HollowKnight, I get 2 profiles: C:/HollowKnight Modded and C:/HollowKnight Unmodded. these profiles can then be renamed, deleted, whatever.

[languid goblet]

i mean, you could just have two buttons to launch that install as modded or as vanilla right?

[leaden hedge]

you can

[deep wave]

this was what i was thinking of

ignore 10/10 ms paint skills

[nocturne meteor]

what is the patch part? i legit dont know that one.

okay, so this kind'a looks like the minecraft thing, which i think is good ui/ux.

[leaden hedge]

its like .002seconds to swap modded -> vanilla

you should just have a vanilla.dll and modded.dll in each folder

[deep wave]

exactly, which is what i was planning on doing

[leaden hedge]

and just have a button to launch one of the 2

instead of having a vanilla/modded version

[deep wave]

i was planning on doing it on selecting the profile

[leaden hedge]

just have 1.4.3.2 / 1.2.2.1

and get rid of modded and just have a button to launch it modded or vanilla

[nocturne meteor]

^^ I like that.

[deep wave]

ok now i get it

yeah that makes more sense

[nocturne meteor]

It's building for the --- uh --- lowest common denominator user. :']

[leaden hedge]

although same row again

[deep wave]

1.4.3.3 remains

[nocturne meteor]

Honestly, these MS Paint skills are the most impressive part of this.

[languid goblet]

1.4.3.3 cracked

[leaden hedge]

although i'd have that left side on the window before

and just have a button to go back if you want to select a different install

[deep wave]

generally i feel like keeping it all in one window makes it feel a bit less fragmented: at least with livesplit and the like I hate having to traverse 20 different windows to change stuff (though at least livesplit has good separation of concepts)

[leaden hedge]

i mean its probably just less cluttered and same for average use case

99.9999% of users wont be managing multiple installs at once before loading

they will load installer, select their patch, do their mods click launch

[deep wave]

yeah but i'm the 0.0001%

i feel like having to navigate to a separate window to launch the game after you're done configing mods is a bit clunky

[languid goblet]

couldn't you autodetect patch when you select an install

[leaden hedge]

no

launch would be on config mods screen

[deep wave]

but then what if i don't want to change anything about my mods, and just want to launch the game?

i then still have to go into a separate window with nothing i really want on it apart from the launch button

[leaden hedge]

i mean if you don't want to change anything

you'd just run it from the exe probably

[deep wave]

my intention is to use this as a kind of launcher, similar to minecraft ig

[leaden hedge]

isnt minecraft the same way

[deep wave]

minecraft doesn't let you manage mods, you have to drag them into the install folder iirc

[nocturne meteor]

There's a forge thing that's an alternate UI thing, I feel it's a bit clunky but it gets the job done.

[nocturne meteor]

I don't think there's official mod support but I could be wrong?

Is that one layer?

[leaden hedge]

for run, run vanilla, open folder, config

[deep wave]

there isn't official mod support for even datapacks, which is what they've been pushing instead of forge/fabric mods

[leaden hedge]

config would open the mod and preset stuff

[nocturne meteor]

Oh, symbols, got it.

[leaden hedge]

hell if you want to be fancy

once you have that screen, you could have a dropdown of your presets

i would probably have your patch selector like minecraft yeah

[deep wave]

its been so long since i used mc launcher

[leaden hedge]

then clicking config i guess should do this

although i guess you could also have the name and game directory in there too

[nocturne meteor]

I like a really simple style, so this is what I mocked up, but it excludes presets (i'm not sure how popular these are or what they are in general) and managing multiple installs of the same kind.

Oh, prob should just do a screenshot.

[leaden hedge]

nice radial group

[nocturne meteor]

Radical, brahs.

[leaden hedge]

[nocturne meteor]

Thanks, but I know this doesn't have all the functionality that Jamie's does.

[deep wave]

mine has functionality?

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, LOOK.

[deep wave]

im just dragging and dropping stuff in windows forms

[nocturne meteor]

Actually, that's weird, it doesn't select both on my firefox. Huh. Haha.

No, I mean, like --- it doesn't have all the features, I guess I meant.

[worn eagle]

I believe in Qt supremacy

[leaden hedge]

any electron

[deep wave]

of course this installer will also support changing your background to be a waifu, as any good application does

[nocturne meteor]

Like, I'm excluding presets on purpose. I think they take up a lot of space for, what I imagine, is a slim number of people, and which takes a v short amount of time to do oneself. But obv if I included presets, things look more complicated.

I couldn't think of a way to do it nice.

(I might be wrong here re: presets. I'm one person, idk what people want.)

[deep wave]

ok so this was my "final" draft of the left/right version, im not massively sure what issues there are with this?

[nocturne meteor]

Yo, that looks great.

[languid goblet]

maybe make it symmetrical

[nocturne meteor]

Make it less symmetrical.

[languid goblet]

like, the right side looks squahsed compared to the left side
otherwise looks good

[nocturne meteor]

I actually kind'a like it like this, but it's not obvious to me what the right-hand side would be, so maybe a "Presets" title. That's all I can think of.

[languid goblet]

actually yeah it's fine

[deep wave]

issue with symmetry is that there's a large amount of whitespace left in the profiles box, since i can't shrink right side any more

[nocturne meteor]

I think that's okay, because the less side is "more important" than the right side.

[leaden hedge]

looks good

[nocturne meteor]

Also, the thing Jamie said above, haha.

[languid goblet]

yeah the right side isn't as important ig

[nocturne meteor]

Really good work on this, tho, it looks great.

[deep wave]

now to selectively steal open-source most of modinstaller code ig

another point: modinstaller now (i believe) stores mods inside the game install folder. If we're installing mods for use over multiple game versions, shouldn't they be stored centrally?

though that only becomes relevant if you have multiple installs on the same patch

[languid goblet]

i mean, maybe you could just have different mods for different patches?

or diff installs

[nocturne meteor]

I think it's probably easiest to have a "deactivated" or whatever folder in each install, which the installer moves things in and out of.

The mods are (usually?) small enough where this isn't an issue, so it basically behaves like node_modules.

Otherwise, you're going to have to deal with a central source-of-truth which is --- stick if 1) we ever change it, 2) they ever change it, 3) if there's permission issues for that, etc.

[deep wave]

cool that convinced me

[nocturne meteor]

whew.

[deep wave]

the use case of "i have multiple 1432 installs and i am annoyed i have to download mods twice" is very, very slim anyway

most people will only have one profile

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, I'm sure the number of people who know what's happening will be very small, and the ones that do are the ones who know how to fix it.

[deep wave]

dumb question: how do i get a NET app to open an application and not kill it when the form is closed? or do i need to keep a background worker open for the duration of the application running?

[nocturne meteor]

This, I have no idea. :''']

[leaden hedge]

god html is effort

[nocturne meteor]

Is that vanilla html? That's super fast.

[leaden hedge]

bootstrap

[deep wave]

truly elegant

[leaden hedge]

oh sorry

[deep wave]

(im probably missing something)

[leaden hedge]

im using a custom theme

so its not loading from a cdn

[nocturne meteor]

Nice. Bootstrap looks g o o d.

[leaden hedge]

thats why I used it

no reason to have mockups look like shit if you can just use bootstrap

[deep wave]

forms apps just have this charm

[leaden hedge]

the charm of looking like shit

[worn eagle]

I believe in semantic ui supremacy

[nocturne meteor]

I always forget I can just do mockups, and I'm like, "Okay, lemme start up nodejs, okay..." and then no one can see the work until I'm basically done coding. It's such a bad habit.

I think the .NET apps look like a nightmare that you wake up from and you realize you're in another nightmare, but, you know.

[leaden hedge]

semantic ui looks good too

but it also looks like more effort than a single include to install

[deep wave]

full disclosure: i am only using .net winforms because a) current modinstaller uses it, so i can just lift a fair amount from there, and b) it's the only thing i've used considering my considerable lack of time doing anything not for schoolwork

[nocturne meteor]

Wait, I thought semantic UI was like, a guideline for UI Frameworks. It's an actual thing you download? Wild.

Haha, it's all good, .NET is fine!

[deep wave]

just saying, since all i've seen so far is > winforms looks not nice and > winforms not available for everyone else

[leaden hedge]

do you know how to do html and css

[deep wave]

outside of what they teach you in year 9, no

[leaden hedge]

good time to learn then

[nocturne meteor]

I'm not even a webdev and learning HTML + CSS was prob one of the best time investments I ever made for my career.

The amount of times someone's told me to mock up a dashboard or make a quick webapp or something is significantly more than I thought it would be.

[worn eagle]

I despised my webdev internship :)

[leaden hedge]

pretty much the only way you're going to make it not look like shit and be multiplatform is to use electron

[nocturne meteor]

I love me some electron but that thing loves to eat memory.

You could use Python's GUI stuff. Kidding, that stuff is terrible. :'']

[leaden hedge]

i mean you could write your own gui stuff via opengl

[nocturne meteor]

1. Make your own GUI thing.
2. Write the installer in your GUI thing.
3. Distribute.
4. Wait for people to mess up and yell at you for how bad they think it is.

I haven't really ever found a "window-based" UI thing that I've loved, which is sad. Electron gets close but, ugh. It's a beast. That's why I always opt to do webthings, I just don't like any of the non-webbased offerings I've seen.

[leaden hedge]

wtf

electron needs node, and node needs windows 8+

fuck electron all my homies hate electron

[deep wave]

windows 7 theme for windows 10 when

[nocturne meteor]

Wait, that doesn't sound right --- I've built my electron things on Ubuntu. Hold up.

[leaden hedge]

it has seperate installers for mac/linux/windows

[nocturne meteor]

Oh, yeah, that is true. It has a LOT of requirements on Linux.

And it's really beefy on Windows, from what I remember.

[leaden hedge]

[nocturne meteor]

Well, get Windows Server 2012, what are you waiting for.

[worn eagle]

Imagine having a whole browser in your framework

[leaden hedge]

ill just download the binaries

[nocturne meteor]

I think there's a docker image I used for it somewhere.

[leaden hedge]

i mean yeah it makes sense to use a whole browser

browsers are constantly updated, and designed to look and feel good

[nocturne meteor]

Okay, they seem to have updated electron to fix some of the memory things I ran into a few years ago, maybe I'll give it another spin.

I just remember it: being SUPER memory aggressive and taking up a ton of space (node_modules), but I think the production build isn't too large, space-wise.

[copper nacelle]

there's also react native and such

[mystic umbra]

I don't know if it's something I did, but I have another bit of feedback about the documentation. First, in the custom assets section you recommend adding an embedded resource by modifying the .csproj which in general I find to be rather dangerous to do for new users. I would recommend having them do it the simpler way by adding the file using the Add Existing File in the context menu on the project. After adding it you can right-click on the file and click properties and change the build action to Embedded Resource. That should get everything loaded in fine. Second, in the Utility Mod SFcore it mentions you should know how to embed resources into the mod, putting a link to how to do that in the custom assets section would be nice. Finally, I would add to the note in the Load embedded images section to mention that the user needs to have the UnityEngine.ImageConversionModule.dll reference in their project since for some reason UnityEngine.dll doesn't include it and I didn't see anywhere else where it's mentioned that users should have that dll referenced

[nocturne meteor]

UnityEngine dll stuff seems to have split out from just using the UnityEngine.dll and sometimes it uses the other ones --- I found this out after a bunch of googlin', and I don't know why they did it. It's weird. And yeah, I agree with the former thing: I tried to modify the proj file when I was just starting, screwed it up, then spent some time googling around to figure out the resource thing. These were def holes in my C# and Visual Studio knowledge, and idk to what extent the API should be documenting C# / Visual Studio stuff --- it might be better to just link to some pages and be like, "Read this." Idk tho.

[mystic umbra]

That is true, teaching C# things might want a link. However, most programmers don't do embedded resources in VS so I feel like the mod could teach that since it's pretty niche. It's also like two lines of explanation. Also, in my first job I had to go through a bunch of the company's .sln files and manually modify them to fix a minor annoying bug that programmers would encounter when loading up the file. I had to be so careful when handling that thing because I really didn't want to break the .sln file

[nocturne meteor]

Yeah, C# isn't my forte, so I'll concede any pedagogical points to anyone who knows it better than me, haha.

[jolly oriole]

Pyqt, though that requires python

[vocal spire]

Idea for the new mod installer: save file management

[jolly oriole]

then maybe with integration for rezno[R]'s analyzer

[fluid steppe]

Here me out, HK except all the dialogue has no context

[potent dirge]

Save file manager yes pls

I was thinking about that anyway lol, but if someone does all the hard work I'd be happy bc I have so much else I'm also thinking about doing

[jolly jungle]

Ooh, thanks

Coincidentally, I was planning this week to give these kinds of things a try again so I can finally pick up some good working habits

[deep wave]

idea 2: figure out why moresaves keeps randomly not displaying all of my saves
(but yes save management is a good idea, i'll add it to doc)

[merry marsh]

Does anyone have a suggestion on a simple-ish mod to develop as practice? (It can be something that exists, it's just learning how I want to know.)
I already have a lot of programming experience, it's just modding Hollow Knight that I need to know not coding itself

[mystic umbra]

Something simple @merry marsh might be to make a mod that makes a new charm that makes the player deal double damage

But that damage is only doubled if it's a spell

So Shaman Stone, but with some numbers changes

[merry marsh]

@mystic umbra thanks, I'll try that!

[mystic umbra]

No problem

[merry marsh]

My problem with this stuff is that I get too ambitious and jump to another project on impulse before finishing some big project I imagined.
If I just finish something, I'll at least remember how to mod somewhat if I do start another project before making anything useful

[mystic umbra]

I'm in a similar vein. Starting is easy, finishing is hard

I'm hoping to unveil to everyone my first ever finished and polished mod tomorrow

[merry marsh]

ooh, nice!

I do have an idea for an actually practical mod I may try later on tho. I came across a video on youtube about the parry mechanic, and I thought it'd be cool to make a mod that offers more reward to parrying. Like just double damage after parrying would be the easiest thing, but stunning them for a second would be nice too. I've played a lot of dark souls recently, so that stuff is on my mind

...let me guess, that's the mod you're releasing tomorrow, isn't it? XD

[mystic umbra]

That does sound interesting. I don't even know where the parry code is so that would require some investigation. No, I'm releasing a much simpler mod. Once that's released though I'm going to work on a slightly more ambitious mod and if that works then I've got one more idea up my sleeve

[merry marsh]

nice, I hope they go well!

[mystic umbra]

To give you a hint about the next mod, I got the idea from Apex Legend's Sentinel sniper rifle

[merry marsh]

The other idea I have, which isn't really a mod, is just to make a mod loader with a better UI.
Like, no offense to the person who made the current one, I don't think it's hideous or anything. I just really like designing GUIs and other graphic design stuff. So I just think it could be a fun project for more experience that may actually get used by other people

[merry marsh]

oh, that sounds like it could be pretty good!
I like the mods that experiment with different weapon types

[deep wave]

i might be already working on that

[merry marsh]

lol!

[deep wave]

though if you can make something with similar design semantics in something that isn't windows-only that might be useful

or along the lines of what katie was saying last night, give people a choice

[deep wave]

reference

[merry marsh]

oh, that looks cool! I never really thought of making apps like that in html

[deep wave]

i think katie did it mainly as a mockup, but i'd ask <the people who know what they're talking about with this stuff> rather than me about it

[merry marsh]

lol!

[worn eagle]

what frameworks are you planning on using for the redesign

[deep wave]

.net 3.5 winforms, same as modinstaller

[worn eagle]

I should've replied, but I was talking to cosmic

[deep wave]

[worn eagle]

But on the topic of your rewrite, why don't you upgrade to like .net 5.0?

[deep wave]

because then katie can't degrade provide constructive criticism on all my code because she can't open it

also because HK is on .net 3.5 already, so it's guaranteed the user at least has 3.5 installed

(i also don't think there's anything I really need on higher versions of .NET to finish this app)

this was written at 5am last night, some things are probably stupid

[deep wave]

thoughts on this mockup of downloads page?

(if nothing else needs to be added here I'll just extend the mod google drive button)

realised that only allowing double-click or right click to start a download is probably a little unintuitive, added download button too 🙂

[potent dirge]

(screw bootstrap and modern UI btw 😤 )

i like

[jolly oriole]

(fuck webapps, at least those that try to distinguish themselves as an offline gui program)

[leaden hedge]

like visual studio

fuck vs

[jolly oriole]

visual studio isn't a webapp, vs code is though

[leaden hedge]

yes im talking about the visual studio on electron obviously

[deep wave]

also extensions of functionality i realised while eating food should probably be a thing:
Custom level manager & downloader for DecorationMaster
Custom skin manager for CustomKnight
Save file manager

(just writing these down so i dont forget )

[worn eagle]

Rewrite custom knight to not be bad while you're at it

[deep wave]

🥴

[leaden hedge]

put all that on the same screen too

[deep wave]

idea is to have level manager, skin manager, save file manager all be in separate tabs, and ofc only show tabs you can actually use (eg if customknight isn't downloaded don't let me try to look at customknight skins)

[worn eagle]

custom trial manager when

[deep wave]

looking something like this

[leaden hedge]

you would probably not want to hardcode that

[deep wave]

this is just mockup central right now, i'll make it not terrible later

[leaden hedge]

but a plugin system is probably too complicated for you to program

[worn eagle]

You just gonna take that

[deep wave]

actually yes, im not into pretending im more experienced than i am

[worn eagle]

What gripes do you yall have about custom knight besides ig modcommon dependency and broken geo?

Might take a look at it

[jolly oriole]

the preloading

after looking at it for a tiny amount, maybe instead of preloading stuff to edit the textures, possibly that could be changed to be during on hooks or something

[worn eagle]

It seems that there's a setting for preloads but that just makes it so those textures don't change

[deep wave]

if there's some way to stop customknight causing invis thk then that would be amazing

though as invis thk also seems to happen in vanilla anyway, and I get it even without customknight it seems like it's unlikely to be fixable

[jolly oriole]

that's maybe a vram issue

[deep wave]

it most likely is, but then i think somebody reported it happening on a 3080, which shouldn't be running out of vram in hk 🥴

[jolly oriole]

i mean, its nvidia

[unborn flicker]

I think the idea is it's an issue with the software not allocating enough vram, rather than hardware

[jolly oriole]

does unity have 64 bit for mac/linux and only windows gets 32bit?

[steady comet]

So uhh..... stupid question because I'm stupid
https://radiance.host/apidocs/Hooks.html should it say GetBoolInternal rather than InternalBoolGet? I only ask because visual studio complained when I did the second and not when I did the first

[copper nacelle]

yes

[steady comet]

Thanks

[jolly oriole]

https://github.com/fifty-six/HollowKnight.Modding/pull/9 pr made

[copper nacelle]

.done

[jolly oriole]

pog

[untold nebula]

Anyone know if there is any way to change the path the game saves to? AppData\LocalLow\Team Cherry\Hollow Knight\ it seems the game uses the same folder for all the saves even if you are using different steam accounts. Using the launch argument "-savedatafolder=save directory" works in some Unity games but it does not seem to work for this one.

[copper nacelle]

yeah

[untold nebula]

Nice, thanks so how do you use it? just Install via HK mod manager?

[copper nacelle]

oh this is what i use

like the code

have anything specific in mind?

or can it just be any other folder

this puts it under Team Cherry/1432

[untold nebula]

😮 that's awesome, going to test it right away.

[fair rampart]

How do I add my mod to the mod installer?

[jolly jungle]

What's your mod?

[fair rampart]

https://gamebanana.com/maps/214312 This.

I already uploaded it to Gamebanana but I'd like to add it here as well.

Since I'm not sure how many people actually use GameBanana.

[deep wave]

upload to google drive (ideally ask for it to be uploaded to the shared drive) and submit a pr to https://github.com/Ayugradow/ModInstaller to update modlinks.xml

[fair rampart]

I uploaded it to Google Drive.

Now what?

And who should I ask for it to be uploaded to the shared drive?

[deep wave]

have you read the opening comment in modlinks.xml

(on a side note, are there mods on the drive that still require switching out Assembly-Csharp @ green names? if so i may be able to add them to hkmanager as a scuffed api)

[fair rampart]

If I do a pull request, will that add it automatically to the shared Google Drive folder as well?

[deep wave]

no: i'd recommend uploading a zip file here containing the dll and a readme describing the mod

[fair rampart]

Is this good?

[untold nebula]

Hi man, I finally managed to test it but it seems it is not saving, I installed it with mod installer, when starting a save all saves are clean but when you reach a bench to save if you close the game and open it again no save is present. Any ideas why?

Seems it is not creating any new save path, it is supposed to save to AppData\LocalLow\Team Cherry\1432\ right?

Tested on latest steam version of the game.

[deep wave]

proposing some adapting to the structure of modlinks.xml for new version, the separation of ModList into ModList and APIList is breaking but should probably be made

Description is shown on hovering over a mod, FullDescription shown on downloads menu.

[jolly oriole]

twitch prime

current modlinks has a link to the zip, should that be in the new one as well?

[deep wave]

yeah its at the top

[jolly oriole]

yea, the api has that, but the examplemod doesnt

[deep wave]

ah i did miss that

[jolly oriole]

ah ok

[deep wave]

apart from forgetting to add a way to download the mod, any other glaring issues/improvements?

[jolly oriole]

optional is for optional dependencies i guess?

[deep wave]

optional already exists in modlinks, i just grandfathered it over

[jolly oriole]

oh

[deep wave]

it's for "author recommends you install these mods too"

[jolly oriole]

ooh

[deep wave]

so like I could make it so if you try to install randomizer, it suggests you also install randomapmod

[jolly oriole]

damn, watch me add all of my mods to my other mods as optional :^)

[deep wave]

while it silently installs all the other dependencies as well

i wouldn't recommend it, current modinstaller does seem to have it implemented so you might start annoying people

[vocal spire]

Grenade mod pack

[untold nebula]

Anyone know if there is any way to make the mods config files of mod installer/modding api save somewhere else other than AppData\LocalLow\Team Cherry\Hollow Knight? I tried using @copper nacelle change save directory mod but the mod files still save to the default Locallow path.

I'm working on a splitscreen mod and I need each instance of the game to have different mod files cause it seems the second instance does not load any mods cause the first is already using them from Locallow.

One workaround I found is to open each instance of the game under different windows users, that way each instance has its own Locallow path and each have their own mod config files there but this solution is not ideal and too bothersome to use.

Uses @vocal spire Multiplayer mod to connect the instances.

[vocal spire]

It’s not mine, I’m just editing jngo’s original work

[vocal spire]

Did you look into editing the ModdingApi like I said?

[untold nebula]

Yeah I'm looking at the github page you linked right now thanks, just posting here too to see if someone has more ideas.

[vocal spire]

K

[untold nebula]

https://github.com/fifty-six/HollowKnight.Modding/tree/master/Assembly-CSharp

Hmmm can't seem to find an easy way to change where the modding api saves the mods config and json files.

[fair rampart]

I submitted a pull request at https://github.com/Ayugradow/ModInstaller/pulls.
Anything else I should do?

[vocal spire]

Did you look in the mod class?

Do you see where the global settings path is set?

Just set it to something different based on something like what instance it is

[untold nebula]

https://github.com/fifty-six/HollowKnight.Modding/blob/master/Assembly-CSharp/Mod.cs

This one right?

[vocal spire]

Yes

[jolly oriole]

i haven't checked it, but (watch fire rn) does decorationmaster have a memory leak? i heard from some people that the game starts to lag after a while with decorationmaster edited levels

[ornate rivet]

any reason why when I switch scenes, I get placed at (0,0) even though I have the proper gate and name

the scene switch works in the reverse direction and puts me in the right spot

[jolly oriole]

middle of transition is more than 10 units above ground

[ornate rivet]

hmm where is that checked for

[vocal spire]

I’d assume when the knight is spawned

[ornate rivet]

is it supposed to be 10 units above ground or not?

[vocal spire]

Not tmk

Like 10 is the limit or something

[jolly oriole]

idk, let me check quickly

HeroController.EnterScene

but imma sleep now

[ornate rivet]

gn

[ornate rivet]

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

this game hates me

[vocal spire]

F

Feel the same way

[deep wave]

same 🙂

hk is bulli

[ornate rivet]

HeroController.EnterScene does nothing

[vocal spire]

F

[ornate rivet]

the hook runs but the gate is blank and stopping it from doing anything doesnt change anything gameplaywise

[vocal spire]

Huh

[ornate rivet]

manually setting the gate myself also does nothing

ok not entirely true

[vocal spire]

[ornate rivet]

ok figured it out

my custom floor spawns too late

[vocal spire]

F

[ornate rivet]

or it could be that it's not counting my custom floor as floor

hopefully not that because I have no idea why that would be

[leaden hedge]

just needs to be a collider on the correct layer

[ornate rivet]

It's both of those as I just instantiate a preexisting floor

the floor is also made at the same time as the gate is placed

so not sure what the problem is

wait no I have a yield return null

ok cool that was it

my past self trusted yield return nulls way too much, this is the third time removing one has fixed glitches

[ornate rivet]

prepare for pale court spoiler

[vocal spire]

[ornate rivet]

darn it shows the color

sigh

[vocal spire]

I see where it fits in

You — so you can go to — and —

[jolly jungle]

Damn, nice

[leaden hedge]

oh speaking of ui for mod installer stuff, cdda has a good one
main page for game version/folder selection and updating/launching the game

and a mods tab for installed, repo, and details

[jolly oriole]

i have no idea what cdda is, but it appears to have a big modding community

[floral furnace]

CDDA gang

[leaden hedge]

cataclysm dark days ahead, its a zombie survival sim roguelike
steep learning curve but pretty easy after you learn how to not be stupid af

xhuis author of the exaltation mod contributed to it occasionally

[jolly oriole]

neat

[floral furnace]

aka "apparently starting a fire inside the sewer is a death sentence because the smoke has no way of going out essentially suffocating you" the game

[deep wave]

👀

[steady comet]

I would start a fire in a sewer if it means no more flukemons

[deep wave]

but flukes are so cute uwu

[leaden hedge]

hmm fire should be fine underground and in enclosed spaces

you can do it in lmoe shelters, evac shelter basements and in labs

dunno why sewers would be different

[floral furnace]

i dont remember much of my old run (that was like years ago) but i basically tried to cook food in the sewers and ended up coughing then dying/suffocating to the smoke

[leaden hedge]

it might have been the type of fire, some spread more smoke and you can choke just by being next to a contained fire on the surface

[jolly jungle]

Woah woah woah what is this discussion

Fire?

Who's making fire and what are the mechanics of it

[copper nacelle]

meme

[jolly jungle]

Royal Zombie Coward

[vocal spire]

Unity explorer cool

[ornate rivet]

woah what is this

[copper nacelle]

https://github.com/sinai-dev/UnityExplorer/

[ornate rivet]

did you use the standalone version?

[copper nacelle]

yeah

i wrote the wrapper if you want it

[ornate rivet]

nice thank you

[ornate rivet]

what's the third dll for

yay

[copper nacelle]

leaked

[vocal spire]

Fun to mess around with

Also fun for positioning new rooms in the correct position in among us

[ornate rivet]

this is so cool

I dont have to open and close hk 5000 times anymore

going to cry

[vocal spire]

Yee

[copper nacelle]

what

why the fuck were you closing and opening hk 5000 times

[vocal spire]

Because steam

[copper nacelle]

there is literally a console

I am taking fucking psychic damage

[vocal spire]

F

Is that a new type of damage in a mod?

[ornate rivet]

I'm always too lazy to install the console mod

[vocal spire]

Same

[ornate rivet]

plus this shows the stuff in the scene too

[vocal spire]

Yeah

[copper nacelle]

I can't believe saleh is pepega

I changed my mind

I can believe it

[vocal spire]

🤔

[ornate rivet]

sorry 56

does the console let me import stuff

[copper nacelle]

yeah

[ornate rivet]

how

[copper nacelle]

using

it auto references everything

[ornate rivet]

it makes the using red

[copper nacelle]

at least mine does

[vocal spire]

Cool

[vocal spire]

Haven’t tried the console

[copper nacelle]

use a better console

qed

[ornate rivet]

fine fine I'll install your console too

[copper nacelle]

easy

[ornate rivet]

not like it can get worse than a 15 second loading screen

[copper nacelle]

what

i gotta say I don't preload anything

[worn eagle]

prelads

[copper nacelle]

TRUE

so fucking true

I'm crying rn

[lofty zenith]

Hey I need help replacing the game's sound files. I saw the pin but I'm not entirely certain how to go about it, also one of the links is dead

I'd like to replace some of the NPC's dialogue/fight sounds if it matters