sk-lore

[limpid summit]

She’s saying it was inevitable

That’s inconsiderate

But the matter at hand is that she’s probing his mind

So he’s not gonna be like “also what the hell man”

[stray grove]

Bruh

He feels personally responsible for the fall of Verdania

She’s saying you can feel bad that you weren’t there but the fall itself isn’t your fault

How is that inconsiderate

She’s not telling him to suck it up because it was inevitable anyway man she’s telling him it’s ok to feel guilty but you should also know there’s nothing you could have done

[limpid summit]

Well first of all it isn’t true

Devotion or destruction

[stray grove]

🥴

There’s no limit to the larp

[limpid summit]

It’s just not

[stray grove]

Reading comprehension devil

[limpid summit]

Do you think I’ll stop telling the truth because you throw buzzwords at me

[stray grove]

What do you think devotion or destruction means

I agree that it’s a badly written line

[limpid summit]

The rule of a pale being, direct or indirect, will eventually force bugs to fall in line or somehow die

[stray grove]

It doesn’t mean “fall in line or somehow die”

There isn’t a choice

Verdania did fall in line and it still died anyway so that would be incoherent

It’s talking about the downstream effects of centralizing power

[limpid summit]

Yeah that’s why I said it’s a stupid thing to say???

[stray grove]

But that’s not what it means man

[limpid summit]

His lover did devote

[limpid summit]

I don’t care what it means it literally doesn’t matter that is what she said to him and that is what he heard

It doesn’t actually matter what she meant by it

[robust wagon]

Somehow arguing while it looks like you both believe literally the same thing is actually very impressive

[stray grove]

What are you talking about man 😭

GP doesn’t have your level of reading comprehension

In the absence of further clarification the character she’s speaking to is presumed to have understood that in the way that line was intended to be understood when it was written

That’s how dialogue works

It’s how a script works

That the audience can misunderstand what the author was trying to convey is irrelevant

[limpid summit]

Sure

Regardless

Who wants to get lectured on their lovers deathbed

This is a weird thing to play devils advocate about

[stray grove]

Well yeah man that’s why he calls her out on it

[limpid summit]

Yup

[stray grove]

Hornet had no right to be there

But the dialogue itself isn’t the problem

It’s that she invaded his memories without his consent and refused to leave

[foggy fractal]

Hornet is a terrible person we should cancel her

[solar gale]

What's poppin chat

What are we loreing about

[stray grove]

She also had no reason to fucking kill the poor dude even if she felt it’s what he wanted she had no right to take matters into her own hands

And prior to his death he expresses a desire for her to leave him alone not for her to kill him

[foggy fractal]

dw I just don't kill him therefore it isn't canon :D

[maiden meteor]

isn't like whole point is Hornet not being a Good Person but trying to do better

She was fully intending to leave Pharloom be if it wasn't for possibility of GMS hunting her down again lest killed

it takes her billion quests and NPC storylines to finally empathize with people other than herself

[stray grove]

She’s for the most part presented as well-intentioned and generally helpful but there are few instances where she is kind of just a terrible person for no reason. It doesn’t make sense to call this a part of her character development because it’s pretty random, inconsistent with how she generally behaves, and she faces no consequences for behaving like that (nor does the game really challenge it)

[maiden meteor]

Hmm fair enough

[foggy fractal]

do I smell a slabfly journal moment...

[maiden meteor]

Although at least until act 2 she's just being ass in general

and only ever helps people for personal gain (except donation quests)

It takes her plenty of quests to finally challenge her pale nature

but yeah, imo TC messed up a bit with characterizing Hornet

Bilewater and Sinner's Road tribes? Eh, fine. Flies forced into eternal servitude because of unknown sin? I hope you and your entire extended family fucking dies.

[foggy fractal]

w hornet!

[maiden meteor]

I guess Groal's aura is just that powerful

[stray grove]

She’s not an ass

Hornet is still polite to most people she comes across and usually agrees to help people out when she can

A lot of the time it’s in her interest to do so but not all of the time

The whole thing with her pale nature is kind of just in the background the whole time it doesn’t meaningfully affect her choices throughout the early to mid game

[stray grove]

Also in her journal she is usually sympathetic or at least understanding the flies are just a big question mark

And even then she still acknowledges they’re literal slaves born into servitude

[solar gale]

Deadass

[limpid summit]

Well she is a eugenicist

When it suits her

Massive mossgrub

[stray grove]

Her being a eugenicist is inconsistent with how she’s typically characterized

[spark valve]

it's not like she says eugenics bad in the first game it just wasn't something people assumed about her

[oak mesa]

I’m not joking I want to know

[spark valve]

silksong fan be normal about children challenge

[oak mesa]

they arnt children twin

[sinful nimbus]

Lace is

[stray grove]

😭

On a real though even supposing she was a eugenicist this whole time my point was she isn’t presented as being uh fucking evil

[sinful nimbus]

Pretty explicitly

Look of a child and a mind to match

Silk-spun child possessed by the void.

Hornet: You always had the scent, child. You are no bug. Yours is a life born entirely from thread.
Lace: Life? You're too generous! This weak, wasting existence. This was not life, just a husk shaped to act as a child.
Hornet: Yours was life, pale one. Do not confuse your unique creation with its absence. I have seen others make the same mistake.

[spark valve]

scorn for flies born into servitude is definitely out of character

[stray grove]

That is to say her being a eugenicist can’t be reconciled with the fact that she’s generally a nice and helpful person

[stray grove]

That’s the only time she says anything like that

I think the mossgrub entry gets taken out of context

That’s not about eugenics

[spark valve]

it's different when it's about animals anyways

[stray grove]

Yeah

[twin dragon]

Im pretty sure they saw the kingdom's fading glow

[twin dragon]

For animals ig its not reprehensible

[twin dragon]

Tc wanted to convey something but went overboard

[stray grove]

That is true but it’s also not really the same

[twin dragon]

Eugenics is pretty broad

like selective breeding is eugenics p sure

[stray grove]

At the basic level that is what it is

But Hornet calls for the extermination of the flies

And says they just shouldn’t exist period

She also feels no remorse for killing them

[twin dragon]

The meaning of eugenics that was twisted by certain people yes

[stray grove]

In fact she hopes she’s hastened their end

[spark valve]

she probably doesn't actually know what genes are so eugenicist might not be an accurate description of her ideological position but she is a violent racist

[stray grove]

ig

[twin dragon]

Yeah, since what she wishes technically isn't eugenics

[stray grove]

I don’t think it’s necessarily a meaningful distinction, she identifies the slabflies as having traits she considers to be undesirable (nasty, filthy, smelly, whatever) and says they should stop breeding in order to prevent the spread of the characteristics she deems undesirable, exterminating a bunch of them to that end
She doesn’t know what genes are but this is basically the exact same thing

[twin dragon]

I don't think she wants them gone because they're stinky and hairy explicitely

[spark valve]

the result is the same she just doesn't have the same mechanical understanding

[stray grove]

That is why she wants them gone though

The only reason she has to exterminate them is that she finds them repulsive

[spark valve]

which isn't a pseudoscientific delusion it's just plain murder

[twin dragon]

I don't think so, she states that she hates how they treat prisoners i think?

[stray grove]

Well yeah she lacks that mechanical understanding as you said but it’s not like said delusion isn’t just used to justify murder anyway

[spark valve]

yeah

but eugenics is the delusion

she's just a normal ass racist

[stray grove]

No she finds them repulsive
They have no control over how they treat prisoners? She acknowledges this?

[twin dragon]

She hates the flies for what they are, not because she wants to filter out their characteristics

and considers them "impure" or some bs

[stray grove]

Yes she hates them because they have characteristics she finds repulsive the distinction is whatever imo but you’re right it’s not eugenics

[twin dragon]

Tc i loved the slab sequence but how did you mess up this badly

[stray grove]

The slab is actually pretty good aside from those entries

[twin dragon]

OP should be more visible

[spark valve]

also no that's just eugenics it's implied pretty directly from having that ideology

[stray grove]

Yeah

There’s no version of eugenics that isn’t that

[twin dragon]

If its applied to people sure

[spark valve]

eugenics is always applied to people

[twin dragon]

selective breeding for animals is technically eugenics

[spark valve]

it is not

[stray grove]

No

[twin dragon]

is it not?

Yeah it isnt mb

[stray grove]

Eugenics specifically refers to the belief/practice of improving the genetic quality of humans

But in fiction it can generally be applied to any sapient species if the basic mechanical understanding is present

[near jasper]

Flick will be the 13th architect when the citadel neeps repairs

[bronze mortar]

true statement

[near jasper]

Flick made a bench so good it lasts the entire game, a skull tyrant and the act 3 rapture

[bronze mortar]

the fact that its in the survivor camp

too bad he didnt bring the statue aswell

the one i payed for

but its ok

[foggy stratus]

He's a descendant of the original fleshy architects. Trust

[twin dragon]

when the hell have they been fleshy

[foggy stratus]

Someone had to have built the mechanical ones.

[twin dragon]

The weavers..

[near jasper]

Flick Is 1/32th weaver

[twin dragon]

im 0.0000003% weaver

[foggy stratus]

Nah it was a cast of unspecified bugs like the Menderbugs from Hollow Knignt, trust me

[twin dragon]

It was actually elderbug

[foggy stratus]

Tbh i always had assumed that they started as normal living bugs and eventually transitioned into mechanical forms like the Necrons kinda.

[twin dragon]

Chat did the architects get their body stolen by gods

[foggy stratus]

Not exactly like the Necrons, just swap their minds into mechanical shells. But totally yes they did

[twin dragon]

nuh uh

[near jasper]

What are architects even based off of

[twin dragon]

Architects

[bronze mortar]

menderbug

menderbug is their god

[near jasper]

I meant the shell design

[bronze mortar]

good question

[twin dragon]

A bug

likely

[near jasper]

Wait fr?

Thats crazy

[bronze mortar]

she brownish and she looks very similar to the other cogwork bugs

machine bugs

[twin dragon]

I mean

machine bugs are based off of the architect

[bronze mortar]

yeah

wait

she does look kind of weaver

big head, multiple arms

[near jasper]

Twelfth architect's ass is too fat

[twin dragon]

Yk, maybe????

but she has an abdomen

[foggy stratus]

I'd assume the original fleshy ones.

[twin dragon]

So they're based off of nothing...

[foggy stratus]

The Architects don't look like Weaver made devices. We see some actual Weaver automatons and they don't lool like the Architects.

[twin dragon]

They have been rebuilding themselves for 12 generations

out of available mats

[foggy stratus]

Are you just saying that or is it said somewhere?

[twin dragon]

The architect says this i think

and the quality of each went down

also yk, the name implies something

[foggy stratus]

I always figured that it just meant 12 archeticts were made and the one we see is lucky number 12 that lived, not that its the 12th archetict in a line.

Like I imagine the Sentinels were all made at once.

[twin dragon]

I think the architect talks abt

how each iteration was worse

so that implies something

[foggy stratus]

Yeah they do mention a line when you get Cogwork Heart.

But I also saw that when you get Architects Melody and come back they say something interesting

"Impressive-industrious... eternal... You have seen a glimpse, Bug-Red, of us-s-s, how once we were. The minds of Architects inspired. What majesty we did create..."

One could interprete this as them saying how they used to be a different forms.

[twin dragon]

I mean

this likely also ties to them just

being of worse quality each iteration

just longing and how the architect's lineage could've done such things

[foggy stratus]

Eh.

This feels like a semi-perpetual back and forth type deal to me.

[plain ruin]

Visually, the Architects haven’t changed

So they’ve always had this form

[twin dragon]

do we see all 11 in that secret room?

[plain ruin]

It honestly might be 12

[twin dragon]

it cant be 12

[plain ruin]

I counted 12 while looking at it

[twin dragon]

the 12th is outside

[plain ruin]

I know, but I count 12 corpses in this

I’d have to revisit it in game to double check

[foggy stratus]

I can solidly count 10 corpses.

There might be an 11th near the entrance.

[plain ruin]

I knew I wasn’t crazy, there’s a 12th corpse

At the very start of the arch

[twin dragon]

where

[plain ruin]

There’s a leg and a lower torso

[twin dragon]

i can count 10

ye ic

but still 10

[foggy stratus]

I found 11

I can just make out the antenna of it.

[plain ruin]

10-12 are easier to see in this image

[foggy stratus]

Holy shit.

13th Architect real.

[plain ruin]

Unless 10 and 11 are somehow the same corpse

But I don’t see how they could be

[foggy stratus]

They're an architect the loooong way

[plain ruin]

The thing that makes me think they must be two different corpses is the hoods

[plain ruin]

The lines on both hoods indicate they must be different hoods, there’s no way you could arrange one body and one hood to look like that

Perhaps the first architect was the Zeroth Architect

Wouldn’t be the first time something related to programming began with 0 instead of 1

[foggy stratus]

"I am Architect Prime..."-0th Architect

[plain ruin]

I just realized this is identical to the image I posted first, I thought I uploaded an ingame screenshot lol

[floral quiver]

Why is there a 12 in a spot where there's no Architect?

[midnight reef]

I can check later

The actual scene

[plain ruin]

It’s more visible in this image

[floral quiver]

Okay, I'm pretty sure the Architect on the far left isnt intended to "count" considering how difficult it is to discern compared to the ones in the main part of the room.

If you take the ones in the main part it comes to a nice 11

[foggy stratus]

Its probably 11, but might be 12.

[plain ruin]

How could it not count? Look at the antennae

2 full sets are visible, and one antenna of Corpse 2 is visible

Just barely, below the left antenna of Corpse 3

[floral quiver]

What I mean is that the ones that are directly visible in the main area are intended to be "real" while that one is unintentional.

It looks like antennae unintentionally, or came from a different iteration where there were Thirteen Architects and the art just wasnt changed

[ornate pollen]

I 100% SILKSONG

[plain ruin]

Maybe one of these corpses isn’t supposed to be here, but the fact is that there are 12 corpses here. TC would have to remove one for that to change

[floral quiver]

Or we can accept that there are supposed to be 11 corpses and a mistake was made at some point in the background/foreground art process. It's happened before.

[plain ruin]

It doesn’t matter if it is or isn’t a mistake until it’s corrected or commented on by TC.

There are 12 corpses here

At this time, there are 13 Architects/Architect corpses we can see

[floral quiver]

So you want to build fanlore off of that?

[plain ruin]

It isn’t fanlore or headcanon, it’s an observable fact that there are 12 corpses in this room

[floral quiver]

And anything you build off of that will be fanlore you made up.

Because there's no lore that mentions or covers it.

[plain ruin]

If I claim that there was an architect called the Zeroth Architect, that is fanlore, yes

But I’m just counting corpses

12+1 is 13

[floral quiver]

I don't see 12. Which was my original concern. Is it lying on its side next to 10's head? Cause it's not hanging by 8

[plain ruin]

Cross reference this image with the numbered one. The brightness is fickle, makes it hard to see the corpses at either end of the room

Corpse 12 is visible hanging behind the webs

[floral quiver]

I have, which is why I'm confused.

Ooooh

Okay, I see what you mean

I was looking further right on the image.

[acoustic flume]

Guys, do you think Sealed Siblings is the one of, if not, the only non-canon ending due to Silksong being real?

Like, no way Hornet just casually escapes the Black Egg Temple.

[twin dragon]

Maybe one's just

either a corpse split

or you miscounted

because there can't be 12

or tc doesnt know how to count

which could be ig

[stray grove]

Sealed Siblings is still possible

?jokerpsa

?tag info jokerpsa

[gleaming basin]

No tag jokerpsa found in category info.

[stray grove]

Sad

Basically there are seal breaking bugs that can break seals and dreamer seals are still seals so the choir could’ve broken her out

[lone folio]

But then how did the knight end upp in the abyss

Did it go on a crazy journey with the angry moth god inside of it and still somehow managed to get the void heart?

[foggy stratus]

Sealed Siblings requires Void Heart.

[foggy stratus]

All endings are Canon regardless.

[lone folio]

it does?

oh yeah

im an absolute genius

I am the peak of human intellect

[lone folio]

To silksong? Not really

[acoustic flume]

Wait fr?

[foggy stratus]

Not all roads necessarily have to lead to Silksong to be canon.

[gloomy plank]

Pharloom might be just a memory given to hornet as she dies in the black egg

[lone folio]

Nope, I ain't believing any of this for even a second

[grim silo]

You can’t access memories in memories

That makes no sense

[gloomy plank]

Just a silly Lil thought, but the void left from the knight could have broken the seal after all the void heart was still in the knight it might have destroyed the radiance while the void and radiance was in the same vessel

[lone folio]

I mean I don't want to give any hope to this theory but if your dream is crazy enough it could happen

But the game going in that direction is so unbelievably unlikely that any other explanation is probably more believable

[foggy stratus]

Hornet's just tripping balls on Spore Shroom in Black Egg Temple.

[lone folio]

😭

[foggy stratus]

That's how she understands Mr. Mushroom.

[near jasper]

And karakan and verdanian

[marble oasis]

Most incredible buddy road trip movie of all time

[swift needle]

Oh wait

The weavers could’ve taught her the harpoon languages

SON

Still doesn’t explain Mr mushroom

Oh wait

Maybe maybe the pk taught her

Hmmmmm

[swift needle]

Harpoon💔

[crystal marsh]

no?

[swift needle]

Pharloom*

[swift needle]

Imagine creating an entire kingdom in your mind

Kinda cool

And 3 acts

And tools

And quests

[stray grove]

There’s no limit to the larp

[swift needle]

And bosses

[swift needle]

https://tenor.com/view/larp-larping-mahito-jujutsu-kaisen-larper-gif-5475157444924658810

Hm if only silksong was a real game

https://tenor.com/view/eagle-reference-i-got-that-reference-baseball-caught-gif-4656907955966418579

[crystal marsh]

what does larp even mean

[plain ruin]

Went back and spliced together some screenshots to keep every corpse as illuminated as possible, I'm sure I counted right. TC placed 12 corpses here

[near jasper]

Multiple architects couldve been operating at the same time no?

[near jasper]

Widow sent this in the weaver groupchat after gms got sealed and they lobotomized her for it

[sinful nimbus]

dang can tc not count 💔

[near jasper]

New headcanon is that these are the same bugs

[sinful nimbus]

True

[stray grove]

Vaultborn have round, black bodies and hairy legs so no

[near jasper]

They dont shave

[wise sand]

They can fly kinda

I think

Unless i forgot

Its been awhile since ive played

[spark valve]

there's an interesting similarity to the keepers and they may just be young ones but the number of legs doesn't match so

I guess the born entry says destined to become scrollreaders

but those also have the wrong number of limbs

[stray grove]

We’re also told they’re raised to be Scrollreaders so we know what they grow into

[spark valve]

tc cannot count

[wise sand]

Never expect tc to keep limb/eye/wing count consistent

[stray grove]

They might undergo a metamorphosis or something

I don’t really understand the Vaultkeeper life cycle though they seem to start out as those spider things then grow into long centipedes? Idk

[spark valve]

are they the same species as pontiff and scrounge and cardinius

[stray grove]

They all have the same job title and are presumably all born and raised in the same place so idk why they’d be different species

[spark valve]

I guess bro

[stray grove]

They all have the same eyes

And the hairy legs

[spark valve]

cardinius is a normal vaultkeeper stuck on a worm

[limpid summit]

Maybe they grow into different forms like Eevee

Depending on the circumstances

[wise sand]

What if theyre just different but related species

[stray grove]

Threadraker

[limpid summit]

I don’t think they’ll just grow a long body

[wise sand]

Like they both do the same thing so they end up in the same job but they look different

[spark valve]

and yet

[stray grove]

Are the Vaultborn the Eevee

[wise sand]

Nah

[limpid summit]

Yes

No that was sfipid

Stupid

I’m not sure

[spark valve]

probably

[wise sand]

"destined to ascend to the rank of Scrollreader"

[stray grove]

Vaultborn > Vaultkeeper (spider), Vaultkeeper (centipede), Scrollreader

[near jasper]

"Just some bullshit with legs" ahh bug

[limpid summit]

Like

[wise sand]

Me and gng

[limpid summit]

Maybe it’s

[stray grove]

I like the upright Vaultkeeper it’s funny

Did they walk around like that normally

Considering their anatomy it can’t have been comfortable to do constantly

[spark valve]

it's funny but kinda retreading weavers from hk in terms of looks like upright guy but is actually a spider

[limpid summit]

Hacks omg

[near jasper]

Fact: every leg count discrepancy in the citadel is because the 11th architect added an extra 0 to the amount of scuttlebraces needed on accident

[wise sand]

The increased limb count can be explained by team cherry being inconsistent

[limpid summit]

Wait I don’t actually remember them doing that in game

Weren’t they all just like this

[spark valve]

you like initially find em all stanced up

[near jasper]

They do Stand up but in the background

[foggy fractal]

I wonder who that in the background is

[wise sand]

Like whenever a bug in hk get bigger they usually gain more eyes, limbs or wings

[stray grove]

The first Vaultkeeper encounter is stanced up then he jumps into the foreground and he’s a spider now

Thanks Andy

[limpid summit]

Maybe Cardinius was a foreigner like the Gourmand

Of Scrounge’s species

Who somehow made it big

[near jasper]

The room where you're ambushed by a vaultkeeper in vaults has one very close in the background which im assuming is where they got the sprite for the standing up vault keeper

[limpid summit]

Thank you andy

[foggy fractal]

man does team cherry crank up the blur to 11 and beyond

[near jasper]

Pontiff

[limpid summit]

Oh true

[near jasper]

Hornet needs glasses

[limpid summit]

My dumbass

[near jasper]

Shes like 5820 give her a break

[foggy fractal]

shes getting on in age I can't blame her

[spark valve]

maybe she's just senile that would explain a lot

[limpid summit]

Well I think we can say Scrollreaders aren’t part of the life cycle

And Lampbearers

I guess it goes Vaultborn Vaultkeeper worm?

[spark valve]

they're the thing the born are explicitly gonna become

[stray grove]

Dude Scrollreaders are literally the only ones who are explicitly part of the life cycle lmao

[limpid summit]

Am I stupid

[foggy fractal]

Young acolyte raised in the darkest vaults, destined to ascend to the rank of Scrollreader.

[spark valve]

it's born > scrollreaders

[limpid summit]

Dude idk I avoided that area

Wow

[spark valve]

no this system is

[foggy fractal]

so is team cherry stupid

[stray grove]

Let’s larp

[limpid summit]

Hello hello Juliet

Okay okay

So

No I really dk

[stray grove]

Bro didn’t know about Vaultkeepers standing or about the Vaultborn entry or about the Pontiff

Did you even play the game or are you just larping

[limpid summit]

I guess the thread rakers and scrounge are unrelated then

To the keepers

[stray grove]

Scrounge is

[limpid summit]

I FORGOT about the pontiff

[stray grove]

idk about Threadrakers

But Scrounge is definitely the same species as Cardinius and the Pontiff

[limpid summit]

Her legs aren’t hairy though

[stray grove]

Actually Threadrakers might be too

[foggy fractal]

why does she have such a big ass head

[stray grove]

It doesn’t matter maybe she shaved

[limpid summit]

Maybe

So is she wearing a mask?

[stray grove]

The threadrakers don’t have hairy legs either ig she could just be one of them

That’s probably a mask yes

[limpid summit]

Yeah I think she’s a thread taker

But it looks just like a head on them

[spark valve]

every ss lore convo got me like benoit blanc at the end of glass onion

[limpid summit]

A difficult thing it can be to decipher

[spark valve]

https://tenor.com/view/no-its-just-dumb-so-dumb-idiotic-beniot-blanc-knives-out-gif-27358272

[near jasper]

Bellhome #14 in the background is a mask/hair stylist, you can't go there because hornet is bald

[spark valve]

vaultborn and vaultkeepers aren't related and neither is apparently related to cardinius despite cardinius's head looking exactly like a vaultkeeper body whereas scrollreaders are related to vaultborn despite having zero common shit with them

[stray grove]

Ok I guess Vaultkeepers are their own thing born and raised in the Vaults and Scrounge is a Threadraker which is a species native to Pharloom

[wise sand]

It literally says in their entry that they turn into scroll readers

[stray grove]

Scrounge’s legs and face look the same as the Threadrakers and her body is the same colour

She has different antennae

[spark valve]

and doesn't have the long fuzzy arms

[near jasper]

She was laid off after a muck roach ate her hands

[stray grove]

Threadrakers don’t have fuzzy arms

[spark valve]

but her antennae also don't match threadrakers

[stray grove]

Yes that’s what I just said

[spark valve]

yeah I'm sayin relative to vaultkind

[stray grove]

Why did they give her hairy antennae but not hairy legs

So she’s different to both of them

[near jasper]

Sex appeal

[wise sand]

I assume the masks are given by the citadels and not something built into their bodies but they have the same face too

[stray grove]

Those are masks we literally don’t see their faces

[foggy fractal]

hi we are the

[stray grove]

This game is srupid and I don’t care anymore

[foggy fractal]

gasp

[limpid summit]

Infected Balloons have dnd despite being pure infection while Lightseeds don’t despite being actual creatures

Sometimes they just don’t think

[stray grove]

Maybe they’re all just their own thing

Dude Lightseeds are single celled organisms

Do you expect them to have very complex thoughts

[limpid summit]

Yeah

[spark valve]

infected balloons might genuinely be an oversight

[limpid summit]

Never noticed how glossy the pontiff is

[near jasper]

I mean they made singing Plants in Silksong

[limpid summit]

I wonder what he was doing as he died

[stray grove]

Oiled up

[wise sand]

Its an indication that theyre meant to be different ranks of the same position

[stray grove]

Yes

But their anatomy is completely different

[wise sand]

Explain by tc being weird and the scrollreaders wearing armor

[stray grove]

It’s gotta be a metamorphosis or some shit

[near jasper]

Scroll readers are mutated from smelling the bilewater fumes that enter vaults

[stray grove]

Oh come on the armor does not explain the four extra limbs they have now

[wise sand]

Its just two

[stray grove]

They have four legs and two arms

[spark valve]

it's a mech suit

[wise sand]

Wait the vaultborn dont have armd nvm

[near jasper]

Vaultborn anatomy diagram

[wise sand]

Yeah it could genuinely just be something like metamorphosis

Hk bugs are weird and often dont have proper metamorphosis or molting tho

[stray grove]

Citadel up to some weird shit

Baby conductors probably look like hwurmps

[near jasper]

Citadel bug anatomy is when team cherry ran out of budget for the first time

[wise sand]

Its not just a citadel thing

[near jasper]

Why are There plants that can sing in Silksong

[sinful nimbus]

I mean that's just part of the setting there were plants with dreamnail dialogue in HK too

[foggy fractal]

spooky pfp

😨

[sinful nimbus]

happy halloween

[foggy fractal]

happy halloween!

[hollow heart]

Happy spooky

[near jasper]

I dont remember there being any

The 2 Plant enemies I remember Just have "..."

[sinful nimbus]

That indicates some level of thought though

Shellwood is on another level tbf

They all seem to be pretty similar to Nyleth in one way or another who could presumably talk

[floral quiver]

Looking at the keepers, I'm pretty sure the Scrollreaders arms are artificial.

[wise sand]

Hype and aura

[near jasper]

Eleventn architect made 10000 scuttlebraces instead of a thousand the citadel needed to dump them somewhere

[floral quiver]

The Vaultborn have two legs, the Scrollreaders have four legs and the Vaultkeepers have four legs

[edgy nebula]

havent been in here in awhile

[edgy nebula]

yeah it seems vaultborn grow limbs as they become scrollreaders

[balmy terrace]

Hey so I just got the everbloom…are the snail shamans dead????

They don’t appear very

Alive

[bronze mortar]

I think so yeah

[balmy terrace]

Aw man

[bronze mortar]

They needed tremendous power to cast that spell

[balmy terrace]

That’s a shame

I liked them😔

[bronze mortar]

Me too me too

Except the hermit

[balmy terrace]

True

Hella mean

[bronze mortar]

Calling us a slave and all that

[dapper willow]

What is the echonomic output of pharloom
Whats the gdp?

[dire lynx]

nah, hermit best shaman

[stark ocean]

might be a little better than hallownest

[dapper willow]

thats true

[dire lynx]

hallownest is a corpse, id hope so

[stark ocean]

*prime hallownest

[dapper willow]

most workers are fanatic slaves so I guess prime pharloom might be better than prime hallownest

[covert night]

gdp is high but people are slaves

pull out the gini index of pharloom

[tight jackal]

the economic output of pharloom is more for sure, but the people are, as has been said, slaves

[drowsy mortar]

I’m slowly getting ready for the end of Act 2 Steel Soul

Citadel is basically fully explored except for Vaults and Cradle, got the Ventricule for the Forum, just need some upgrades

[light mauve]

hell nah

uh

if we take white palace only and compare some part of pharloom it's size

[olive axle]

Yoo me too

[junior wren]

Bruh imagine if dreamers were in skong

[light mauve]

Uhh melodies are the replacement

[drowsy mortar]

I mean not quite the same

[pliant meadow]

People would call tc uncreative

[foggy fractal]

dw we already call tc uncreative

[pliant meadow]

[twin dragon]

no one hates hk quite like hk fans

[foggy fractal]

of course

[karmic crypt]

Guys

What in the fuck is that surgery cylinder?

[foggy fractal]

you can't hate hk to your full potential if you don't love hk as well

[karmic crypt]

This shi ain't outlast

[foggy fractal]

Last surgery of Conductor Mizello, performed in Whiteward's operating theatre.

[karmic crypt]

So why are we getting a torture tape?

Team cherry, what the fuck?

And the fact that you can just jam it for the whole bellhart to hear too

What crossed their mind when they make this decision I wonder?

[twin dragon]

its a banger

[frank dove]

I keep asking someone to make a 10 hour loop

[frank dove]

Nah bro it's negative

At least as soon as Loam dies

There are still ppl like ogrim and hornet in hallownest

Citadel at least is all useless except for loam and trobbio who probably is wasting the rest of the money buying bombs for his show

[low oracle]

Truly ASMR

[near jasper]

Some way of recording surgeries is good to train more doctors considering the citadel does not actually have many people in need of surgery because of silk

They just fucked up mizello because he changed tax rates dont worry about it

[low oracle]

Damn, the message was too long after all.

[frank dove]

Wait is dirtmouth technically even part of hallownest?

I just realized I'm not sure either way

[low oracle]

Definitely

[covert night]

hey it's an underrated song

[frank dove]

Greenpath was originally independent though right

And deepnest kind of didn't like them either

[low oracle]

Deepnest I said possibly, as it may go either way. Greenpath are good bugs though, I believe they would offer help.

[sinful nimbus]

Larkin too afraid to include it in the OST

[frank dove]

Ok then karak just take over the kingdom

Who cares if they kill anyone

Everyone deserves it

[near jasper]

act 3 should have a wish for sherma to free some slabbers

[dire lynx]

the only weaver who deserved to live was killed 💔

[acoustic basin]

act 4 should have had a sherma boss

by dream nailing sherma with the help of the shade lord

[near jasper]

i wish an act 4 wasnt impossible gameplay wise without a hundred compromises

[floral quiver]

Like, everyone?

All the Pilgrims and the residents of Deep Docks, Greymoor and Bellhart and Sinner's Road, and songclave?

What have they done to deserve extermination besides enact a pilgrimage and fealty to a place they think is near literally heaven?

[near jasper]

sherma deserves it

skull tyrant needed better aim

[frank dove]

Wait who

[frank dove]

No I was highly exaggerating lol

Mostly talking about citadel and kind of sinner's road

They imprisoned my poor cute muckroaches

[limpid summit]

@stray grove

Could GMS get infected

I’m almost inclined to say yes

[stray grove]

Probably not

Look I’m all for the agenda but come on

[twin dragon]

gms has too strong of a will to js surrender to the radiance

and is there anything that would make her do that voluntarily

[stray grove]

It’s not even a strength of will thing

[limpid summit]

Yeah okay

I just think it would be funny

Would she be orange

She’s pure soul

[stray grove]

You can’t submit to Rad “voluntarily”

[twin dragon]

Traitors kinda did didnt they?

or were they tempted too much

[stray grove]

It wasn’t voluntary they were still manipulated

[limpid summit]

Traitors were likely tempted to a degree

[stray grove]

They were just tempted

[limpid summit]

The infection turns you into a bloated monster TL probably wanted to just be strong

[spark valve]

or can you not do it involuntarily

[stray grove]

I don’t know how much is going on in a Lightseed’s mind

I guess that’s still technically voluntary if you’re looking at it that way

But yeah you get the point

[sick tinsel]

I may have terrible theories and explanations but wth do you mean cute muckroachs

[limpid summit]

How did Rad even approach infecting Nosk

I know this is HK

But people are here now

And idk we can always pivot to Skynx

[sick tinsel]

Nosk probably doesn't have that strong of a will

[stray grove]

Nosk is a random predator

Shut up about Skynx

[limpid summit]

Wdym

[stray grove]

Either way it’s clearly not very bright

[limpid summit]

You love Skynx Nosk

You just want to hate on me

[stray grove]

https://tenor.com/view/patrick-patrick-star-patrick-bottle-gif-6605208024845857705

[sick tinsel]

I mean skynx is the closest thing we get to a non infected nosk

[near jasper]

10000 light seed shoved down Its throat

[limpid summit]

We rich like we Boosie

[near jasper]

Maybe theoretically but I dont think so

[limpid summit]

Bro typing in both channels 💔

[light verge]

nosk mimiced an infected bug and got infected weew headcannon

[sick tinsel]

Mmmm seeds

[sick tinsel]

🤯

[near jasper]

Most higher beings can just Straight up conjure stuff from dreams, Weavers probably accounted for if that were to happen when they made the Spell to keep gms asleep

And by the time shes awake theres like 48 hours max to infect her before she gets void eaten

[sick tinsel]

What are these higher beings

Except radiance nightmare heart and unn

[near jasper]

Radiance nightmare heart and unn

[sick tinsel]

Nightmare heart and radiance are themselves dream essence

So only unn

[stray grove]

PK can conjure stuff from dreams

He’s pretty good at it actually

GMS can also probably split the veil because Weavers can and WL is clearly pretty powerful mentally actually conjuring shit from dreams isn’t even that special Shamans can do it

Yeah it’s hard to do but if you’re a deity with virtually limitless soul I would imagine it’s a great deal easier

[near jasper]

Fact: every time a higher being conjured something from dreams they actually bribed radiance 20 bucks to do it for them

[dry pendant]

🦐

[twin dragon]

from dreams or into dreams

[stray grove]

Both the direction doesn’t actually matter

He can move shit across the veil

[limpid summit]

Kirb

I asked

“Does WL talk half as if we don’t exist and half to us because she doesn’t see us as fully alive” in HK lore

[stray grove]

Oh my god man

[limpid summit]

But she does the same in Red Memory

[twin dragon]

Making shit from dreams and moving shit between realms isnt quite the same

[limpid summit]

She must have been annoying as hell to talk to

[stray grove]

If you can make shit inside a dream and move shit across the veil you can make shit and move it across the veil

[stray grove]

Sorry I don’t understand the q

[twin dragon]

when did pk make shit inside a dream doe

or from dreams

[stray grove]

Literally like half the shit we see in WP

[twin dragon]

Is the dream version of the wp specifically designed like that or is it just the byproduct of the pk wanting to protect himself

[stray grove]

It’s probably in part a manifestation of his subconscious but parts of it were for sure intentionally designed and either way it demonstrates a great deal of power over dreams

[limpid summit]

Switches from first to second

Person

[stray grove]

PoP, the buzzsaws and shit, even probably the retainers aren’t things that actually existed originally

[twin dragon]

Ive always interpreted it as the physical wp being warped with the fragment of pk's mind

[stray grove]

The seal on the Kingsmould

[stray grove]

I agree but that’s also not really the point

There are parts of it that are intentional and the parts of it that aren’t intentional are still proof that he can create shit from essence, if anything making shit like the Retainers subconsciously should be more impressive

[twin dragon]

what is explicitely intentional there

i mean we dont know if the one or the other is true

[stray grove]

You’re missing the point

It doesn’t matter

[stray grove]

The actual PoP is probably abstract but he did intentionally separate it from the rest of his memories

[twin dragon]

We never see another instance of something physical in the dream realm being altered by it

i think

[stray grove]

I don’t really understand how that matters either

[twin dragon]

We dont know if thats a property of dreams themselves

[stray grove]

You could make the argument that a lot of bugs are able to manifest shit subconsciously like Bretta but PK is clearly doing it to a greater degree and with more awareness and more importantly, he can for sure move shit across the veil unlike almost everything else

[dawn stratus]

whats the lore of the cameras in mount fay and the weavenests

[twin dragon]

Im not really denying that...

[stray grove]

So what’s the issue here

[twin dragon]

Servitors created by the weavers

[stray grove]

You agree that PK can manifest shit in the dream expanse and that he can move shit across the dream expanse

[dawn stratus]

why are they in mount fay

[twin dragon]

We dont know if pk explicitely made wp how it is or if that's a property of dreams themselves

[stray grove]

That literally doesn’t matter

Even if it’s a property of dreams themselves it’s still clearly reflecting HIS subconscious that’s how dreams work

Even the essence is white

[twin dragon]

Yeah it doesn't have to be exclusive to the pk

[limpid summit]

Tried to establish an encampment there didn’t work

Citadel didn’t try

[stray grove]

What’s exclusive to him is the extent of it and as I said repeatedly the fact that he can consciously move shit across the veil

That is literally the requirement for being able to manifest dreams into reality

[twin dragon]

would wp stay the same if pk were to move it again

wl what am i saying guh

[stray grove]

Well it’s shattered

If he moved it back across it would probably still be in pieces

But if he wanted to put it back together he also probably could do that

[twin dragon]

Though the physical form of it has been tainted by the dream

He can move shit across the veil sure, but you could point at any bug and probably bet their own set of dreams could also mess with wtv physical thing gets put into them

[stray grove]

I think you’re just missing the point on purpose

The important thing is he can move shit across the veil

That’s the limiting factor

Most people can’t do that, and as we see in Silksong even those who can (Shamans) find it very difficult

PK plane shifted an entire palace

[near jasper]

Weavers were there

[twin dragon]

if that's what you meant with conjure, instead of straight up creating things there sure

[stray grove]

Well he can do both

The latter isn’t hard to do

Anyone can manifest shit in their own mind it’s being able to bring that into reality that’s the issue

[twin dragon]

Right

Ye im not denying that im just pointing that out

[near jasper]

probably the teleporter to leave the dream realm id assume

[twin dragon]

created by the dream nail

im pretty sure it is look at the hue

[dire lynx]

https://media2.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExbG52cHh3ZG12ZWh3eXJ5eWZuNHh2MDhqYnpxZ3BjcnBxdGF6cTB4YiZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/z8AbjYTB1yiMgcQT72/giphy.gif

[sinful nimbus]

Honestly a contender for best boss

[near jasper]

Really good fight too bad she does litterally nothing outside standing around everywhere else in the game

[blissful harbor]

how

first sinner is right there
literally the better version of the fight

[near jasper]

How do memory sequences when you bind someone work

[sinful nimbus]

they play pretty differently while having a similar tempo

But yeah those are my top 2 picks

[near jasper]

I like that this implies hornet doesnt deserve to live

[blissful harbor]

half breeds don’t count

[foggy stratus]

The act of binding someone involves taking part of them into yourself, including memories in certain instances.

[near jasper]

Which instances is what i wanna know

[foggy stratus]

Wym?

[near jasper]

Like widow and first sinner get one and one of them isnt even alive

[sinful nimbus]

lowk true

[foggy stratus]

First Sinner is a weird case since she's already special. Having unique pre-binding dialogue and, ya know, jumping Hornet postmortem.

[near jasper]

With how many people dont understand what happens in weaver Queen when they first get it I think gms could have a binding memory there

Actually we dont even actually know what gms was trying to do thatd be a good place to explain that too if you dont do the first option I said

[twin dragon]

karm tops

[winter vale]

I'm not sure if this will in the slightest matter, but I was interested in sharing this Concept Taxonomy Chart of the many bug life in silksong

Credits to Szangg on Youtube

Watch His Video's, they're entertaining

[edgy nebula]

kai are likely bugs

[winter vale]

If the image comes out blurry, use this link: https://www.pasteboard.co/o2Z80jmn6JiD.png

[edgy nebula]

they have insect legs and hornet notes that steelspine kai have shellsacks

[winter vale]

The ideal characteristics of the bugs in pharloom are not so easy when it comes to real life biological research, so it isn't quite easy to categorise

And the video is more ideal to what kind of species they're are rather then what Latin names would fit them

Here's the video: https://youtu.be/WLeNOPyzpKM?si=YFQct3G7y1Zdcspe

[winter vale]

He might have missed some key clues, I'm just a spectator

[tardy marten]

woah

[frank dove]

Crust king khann deserved to live more than widow

(yes I know hes not a weaver this is unrelated)

[frank dove]

Look at this cute lil guy

They're so adorable

I was gonna do 100% playthrough but I skipped roach gut quest

And never finished journal bc I killed 0

I want one as a pet

Hopefully in dlc we can tame pets to put in our bellhome

[winter vale]

?

[junior wren]

I didnt get to sinners road but so true

[frank dove]

Bruh then what are you doing in in this channel

[junior wren]

I don’t know to be honest

[foggy stratus]

People who haven't beaten the game come into lore channels all the time.

[frank dove]

Well people talk about major spoilers a lot without spoiler text

I would reccomend beating the game first

If you have questions about lore mid-game likely they will be explained later

[sick tinsel]

That thing ruined my run like 7 times

That I was forced to go through blasted steps

[junior wren]

How did you get a picture of a muckroach in that position?

[frank dove]

Wiki lol

[junior wren]

I’ve heard a lot of people hate on muckroaches

[foggy stratus]

Annoying enemies to fight that swarm and deal double damage.

[sick tinsel]

I HATE them

I used to think sinners road is worse than bilewater

Because of thel

[junior wren]

You mean 1 damage but twice

[sick tinsel]

And I still suffer fighting them

[foggy stratus]

I mean double.

[junior wren]

oh

[foggy stratus]

Bilewater technically has Wraiths since Exhaust Organ is in Bilewater, and Wraiths are like flying Muchroachea that steal silk and dash. Prolly most annoying Act 1 enemy.

[sick tinsel]

Yeah but they are on like 1 area

[junior wren]

Im still really early game, don’t know much about sinners road. Visiting this channael cuz I love silksong lore

[sick tinsel]

But muckroachs are everywhere

[sick tinsel]

What act

[sick tinsel]

Also you get get wreath of purity before bilewater.....

[junior wren]

still act 1, only have 1 silk heart and 1 bell bench

[sick tinsel]

Then don't come here spoilers are crazy

[junior wren]

ok, cool avatar by the way

If this is the LORE channel, than will anyone talk about the LORE of muckroaches

[stark ocean]

the bugs that live in sinners road farm them for food

because they breed really fast

[junior wren]

[junior wren]

You use Steady Body? I do

[swift needle]

They were called dust roaches in development

The entirety of sinners road was different

The dust aspect is still present in the game though only in the ||Mist||

[dire lynx]

She does

Shouldn't have disrespected pale goat

[midnight reef]

Not really

[solar gale]

ball knowledge name

[midnight reef]

It was just dressed differently

[low oracle]

Nope, there would've been more. I like the current way it is, but there is a lot of cut stuff that should be implemented in new, different ways. I really like the way the Gloom looks, and cut content is always sad.

[midnight reef]

Not really? There is the dustpillo but that's about it

[low oracle]

Oh really?

[midnight reef]

And the muckmaggots

[midnight reef]

Raptured Citadel, Aspid Hatchling, Aspid Hopper, Grove Pilgrims, Needolin Memory, Widow Memory, Vespa sheet 1, Vespa sheet 2

:3

[twin dragon]

tc otw to cut good shit from the game for seemingly zero reason

[midnight reef]

It didn't fit their vision

[foggy fractal]

yeah I think the answer boils down to that they just didn't like it

[twin dragon]

their vision of keeping the timeline more confusing than jojo's abilities up to part 6

[midnight reef]

It's a hollow knight game, to be expected

[heavy gyro]

Aspid cloverland wouldve been so much better than verdania

[low oracle]

I can't post more than ten pictures at once, but I've got a lot of stuff. I know we'll get Sharpe eventually, but as of now they and the other Steel Guys are cut. Coral Gorge in its full beauty is missing. The special needle strike identical to the Pintress would've been much cooler for the Pintress Badge to do (in addition to the other stuff and maybe more damage). Unless Reed and Pilby return, they were cut from Act3 for literally no reason either. In addition to the Gloom area and an additional tool is always cool.

[low oracle]

the fully animated Reed that is literally in the game

[low oracle]

Nope. It would've been better if we got both.

[twin dragon]

this is cut right?

cut for zero reason aswell

like youve made the sprites how do these NOT fit at all

[low oracle]

Even worse is the fact that it can be re-enabled IN GAME. Unless they put him in SoS.

[twin dragon]

how?

[foggy fractal]

I think theres unused code from tc

but you still have to mod it in

[low oracle]

It's on the wiki, there are videos of someone re-enabling stuff using a mod console thing. The musicians can be brought back with this too. The channel name on youtube is Ivvy.

For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkVWOQekJkM

[floral quiver]

Is there some cut content that would have put them in Act 3?

Like, Pilby especially, he's an extremely minor character that can be entirely missed.

[low oracle]

Well Reed has a cut house and fully animated behaviour in Act3 Bellhart. Pilby is just gone.

So speculatively they are most likely to be in SoS, Pilby probably not though.

[low oracle]

I don't think Pilby was missed, the skull tyrant hit him pretty spot on.

[floral quiver]

Ha

I do kinda wish we could've gotten a Vespa fight

[foggy fractal]

maybe in godhome esque dlc

[edgy nebula]

they should put him in sos ngl

he’s literally a fisherman

[tight jackal]

do we any updates on sos?

[whole holly]

me too guys

[whole holly]

not really no

i kind of want Pharloom Bay to be connected to Land of Stroms in a way

[tight jackal]

ooh yeah that would be cool

maybe the pharloom bay is the docking area for the submarine and we go to various locations outside of pharloom

like the land of storms

[low oracle]

Good Godhome fights would be:
-Vespa
-Shakra's Master
-Pintress in the Ducts
-Seamstress
-Fourth Chorus version that I proposed yesterday, or basically any kind of a better Fourth Chorus fight
-all four Sentinels
-a third Weaver fight with another unique style
-Savage Beastflies
-Lost Zaza
-Sisters of the String / Sisters of Silk (Phantom and Lace 1/2)
-the Beastmaster
-Green Princes for real
-Lovers Quartet (Cogwork Dancers and Green Princes)
-Xero as a confirmed lore-wise Karak
-Garro as a confirmed lore-wise Karak

[whole holly]

Lost Zaza doesn't make sense

[random aspen]

if we get pantheon of pharloom we wont get vespa cus shes hallownst

[tight jackal]

ooh what if we get to fight the first weaver who was brought up from the tiny spider guys

[whole holly]

i mean we still could fight hornet's memories in general

[whole holly]

First Sinner?

[random aspen]

i think that might be why they scrapped her tbh

[foggy fractal]

also who knows how the godhome of silksong would work if we even get it

[random aspen]

cus we playing silksong and we're fighting someone from hallownest

even in red memory they probably just didnt like that

[whole holly]

Xero doesn't make sense to be Karak

[tight jackal]

i don't think the first sinner was the first weaver brought up

was she?

[random aspen]

i dont want another lace fight in any shape or form and would rather get prime phantom

[low oracle]

-Zoat
-Xero
-NKG
-Grimm

And?

[whole holly]

i am not sure, who knows

[random aspen]

doesnt prove anything cus theyre not from another game

[low oracle]

At the end I was mostly just saying random shit cause I forgot the other good ideas.

[low oracle]

THEY'RE LITERALLY NOT FROM HALLOWNEST NOBODY EVER SAID GAME

Also, Vespa is literally in Silksong dumbass.

[whole holly]

caspian and magnus strong makes more sense to be karak than xero

[random aspen]

are you purposefully ignoring that one dude

thats clearly karak

[whole holly]

who?

[random aspen]

i cant be bothered to explain man

[whole holly]

i don't disagree that this could be karak

[random aspen]

literally the most karak mf ever

[whole holly]

Xero is too generic, only color palette matches

[whole holly]

which i don't disagree with?

[low oracle]

Just saying shit bro...
Xero has:
-black armor lines
-white eyes inside an open helmet
-identical colour scheme:
•black armor parts
•mainly red armor
-is proven to not be a moth in case someones arguing this shit

Contradictions:
-Mothwing Cloak
Explanation: Literally just a cloak that you can put on
-Nail weapon
Explanation: He served the Pale King, why wouldn't he use the common weapon of Hallownest?

Additionally:
It's an extreme double standard to claim Garro is more of a Karak than Xero, when they both don't match the Karak in Silksong to the same degree.

[midnight reef]

I mean, she's called First Weaver in the files... doesn't mean it's still the case, but

[whole holly]

you don't have to be rude, wth

people have right to disagree

[random aspen]

https://klipy.com/gifs/speed-ishowspeed-23

[low oracle]

With actual arguments and not "x and y are more similar" when they are objectively not.

[whole holly]

i am arguing that physiology and anatomy design is more important that color scheme

[random aspen]

xero looks like that other guy and that other guy looks like the soldiers

[low oracle]

She also has an Atla memorial in her proximity, who is speculated to be the past leader of the Weavers and possibly the first.

[whole holly]

none of arguments are objective, though, it could end at design inspiration

[low oracle]

So here is what I mean visualized.

[tight jackal]

xero's weapons and the other karak soldier's weapons don't really match up though

[whole holly]

for Xero, horns contradicts

[low oracle]

This is cut content from the first game, now in Silksong. They definitely took inspiration from already existing designs. Given the large amount of similarities I believe it is safe to say they are likely inspired by these two. Hence the theory can be made that they are Karak.

[random aspen]

im sure they can just change weapons, plus its not a real weapon like galiens

[whole holly]

Cut Content being reused and Karak design being inspired from existing ones are different

[low oracle]

Nope. Both the Horns are different, you just view Garro's horns as more similar. In the end though they both don't match perfectly. However there is easily a possibility for unique Karak.

[whole holly]

also i really don't want to argue about this, i JUST got here

[low oracle]

I used it to explain my point, I know it's different.

[tight jackal]

yeah xero is also supposed to be like a strong warrior so maybe he developed a different fighting style

[low oracle]

Fine by me.

[low oracle]

God Tamer stole it!!!
/s

[balmy hull]

yea i'm pretty sure xero has no choice but to use the dream lance thingies since he died

[whole holly]

good, i just stated my opinion, i didn't want to get into this because frankly it is useless argument and most likely will never be confirmed

[low oracle]

Serving the Pale King would mean he uses the weapons that the Pale King equips his soldiers with, so nothing wrong with that.

[random aspen]

90% of hk lore shit is not deep cus team cherry is not that serious

[low oracle]

Yes. Burning Bugs and Grimm theory? Nope, just a joke about Fireflies.

[random aspen]

sometimes i ask myself why im even speculating when i know for a fact team cherry did not think through any of what im trying to speculate

some stuff are just coincidences

[whole holly]

this is genuinly true, like actually, they are pretty much just having fun so why do we have to argue over it anyways

[random aspen]

or random stuff they decided to do cus why the hell not

[whole holly]

but i do think Pharloom Bay may be related to Land of Storms

[midnight reef]

What's really funny? All the Moor Bugs got inspired by Grimm

[low oracle]

Because most of us want to push our own narratives and interpretations of what we see.

[midnight reef]

I think Ari just liked Grimms design and wanted to do it more

[low oracle]

How do you mean? Greymoor?

[midnight reef]

All the enemies in it

[low oracle]

I guess?

I don't see it.

[midnight reef]

Ari drew their concept art in poses like Grimm

I'm pretty sure

[whole holly]

most is understatement, we all seek validation to extent

[low oracle]

Like this?

Credits to Kroal the Kreat

[robust wagon]

I mean they vaguely look like Grimm ig?

[low oracle]

This guy

is weird.

[random aspen]

hornet stands like that

[low oracle]

No wizard hat though.

[random aspen]

that MIGHT be hornet

[whole holly]

so they form Grimm Reaper concept, which is why we got Reaper Crest, interesting

i wish there was synergy with Wispfire lantern and Reaper Crest, like more Blue Tools and More DPS

[low oracle]

Hornet if you pull her through the silk syphon maybe

[random aspen]

kinda cool that pharlooms destruction happened literally while the game is developing cus coral gorge turned into sands of karak and greymoor was much more lively

[low oracle]

Not the shitty wisps spawning but all attacks are ablaze. At the expense of one silk every time you hit something.

[whole holly]

interesting concept, i wish Wisps could be used as actual spell attack too

[robust wagon]

Wait so how would u gain silk lol

[whole holly]

doesn't this look a bit like Pale Nails spell, one we get from GMS

[foggy fractal]

idk it just looks like a cone

[whole holly]

true

[pseudo narwhal]

also reaper's dash attack is basically Grimm's uppercut

[whole holly]

yea Hornet + Scuttlebrace + Wispfire Lantern + Reaper Crest = Grimm Reaper

[pseudo narwhal]

NKG cosplay!
also delver's drill to mimic his downward attack

[whole holly]

yea, true

Sharp Dart is kind of like his Scarlet Flame Dash attack

[pseudo narwhal]

so we are lacking only flame columns attack

[late goblet]

@formal drift It's assumed that Hornet got captured because she was just overwhelmed by the number of bugs there were, also because they have the special runes and rune cages that supressed her strnegth and abilities

[low oracle]

I've theorized this too, since they are also the earliest known form of automatons. Hence there is the possibility that Weavers took part in their creation, enabling them to use silk skills. They also resemble Weavers somewhat, with their many legs and round core.
Most other automatons also have inspiration from real bugs, the Fourth Chorus being most likely inspired by GMS or just nothing at all.

[whole holly]

pufferinfish attack

[whole holly]

it is weird how Automatons and Servitors look so different

[low oracle]

Also Claw Mirror for red particles.

[low oracle]

What are Servitors again?

[formal drift]

👍

[whole holly]

creatures in weavenests

stone robots with runes

[pseudo narwhal]

well you can float in the air and release wisps
but poor substitution I agree

[whole holly]

yeah, Claw Mirrors are something

[pseudo narwhal]

(there should be some crazy conspiracy theory that NKG is Hornet's grandpa or something)

[low oracle]

Ah, those. Personally I think it's quite logical. The Citadel changed rulers, which can't happen overnight. Some Weavers also stayed when the others fled. With each new Architect, the technology would improve, hence technology Weavers designed also changing. Clawmaidens still follow the concept of using silk for attacks, as well as being a ball.

[low oracle]

Claw Mirror is the best substitute, as well as Pimpillow.

[whole holly]

Servitors look similar to Weavers in my opinion

vaguely but still

[low oracle]

"I've got a theory"
—the theory in question

[pseudo narwhal]

agree
on the other hand, claw mirrors and pimpillos are more like Trobbio cosplay

[low oracle]

Weaverlings, the things from the Weaver Charm in HK are probably silk runes too. At least it makes sense in most ways that they work.

[low oracle]

Trobbio and Grimm aren't similar inherently, they just both perform.

[whole holly]

Cut Content in Mount Fay is weird, there was supposed to be Rune Crest there

[low oracle]

Also these things

[whole holly]

i wanted actual weavenest there, why did they ignore askar weavenest

[low oracle]

Seriously....?

Literally moves until I send it

[pseudo narwhal]

but Trobbio performance definitely sounds like he was inspired by Grimm!
so that makes using claw mirrows and bombs for NKG cosplay kinda valid

[whole holly]

what is it supposed to be

[low oracle]

A Fayhorn animation where it appears, but discord only plays it until I send it.

[whole holly]

sometimes Animated PNGs are not supporten, probably a discord thing

[low oracle]

For some reason not all wiki animations are gifs annoyingly. Seth dying gif works though.

[whole holly]

GIFs renders but Animated PNGs don't it is propably a format thing

[low oracle]

Are there any good websites where I can reformat them?

If I change .png to .gif it doesn't work.

[whole holly]

you aren't supposed to change extensions yourself, you are supposed to convert then with online converters, can you send me a link to that cut content asset?

[pseudo narwhal]

well I was a veteran of asoiaf forums
I know some shit about crazy conspiracy theories xD

[low oracle]

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Cut_Content_(Silksong)/Graphics
This is the main one, but there are a few other categories under the Cut Content for silksong.

[whole holly]

Yeah but where did you get that png that doesn’t animate, is it in mount fay section where is it

[low oracle]

It's in Miscellaneous

[whole holly]

okay thanks wait a minute

experienced some quality loss but this is it

[lyric widget]

that's the reason why we used animated pngs and not gifs on the wiki sometimes, gifs don't support transparency so it will look really bad on sprites with transparent pixels

[whole holly]

i mean yeah, i know but on mac i don't have good way to turn it in video to maintain quality and GIFs lose quality but are supported on discord

webm should load?

it does

[eternal cove]

It's interesting how Grand Mother Silk's body is pure black
Like a void creature
And it's interesting how there are other random creatures floating around that are pure black with white eyes

No idea if it means anything, just an observation

With some of them you could explain it as "It's just their face being concealed in shadow by their carapace"
But there are creatures in Far Fields for whom that cannot be true because their entire body is exposed

[narrow horizon]

Being black doesn't make something void lol

[edgy nebula]

it actually does, this is how i can say for certain that hornet is void

[plain ruin]

If you rearrange the letters in “Zote”, you get “Void”, so this is true

[narrow horizon]

"Your honor it was okay for me to attack that man he was overtaken by the void"

[narrow horizon]

Slowest "facts" react of all time 😭

💀

[low oracle]

Silk is black when dense enough.

White eyes are an artistic choice for creatures with covered faces. Just like Black eyes are an artistic choice for brightly coloured faces.

A black body is literally just black, no void. Even the Vessels follow this logic. Proof is Broken Vessel, where the body remains without the shade.

For anyone wondering how vessels are void, their soul is. Soul is life energy, and void is essentially negative life energy. The vessels are already dead, but live through void anyways. Until achieving Voidheart, the shade and the mask/shell/face are separate entities too.

Also, masks ARE faces very often, they're synonyms. Sometimes there are also organic masks, and sometimes even an organic face and an organic mask. There are also literal masks that are masks. Nosk can also create masks/faces to such accuracy that it even seems durable to the extent of a pale shell.

[light verge]

no no go ahead put your facts again

🙄

[dire lynx]

zote created the void and abyss. he also founded the ancient civilisation

my source is that his body is black, just like void being hornet

[near jasper]

zote is the