sk-lore

[fresh badger]

Its power from mortals passed down over generations. Nyleth isnt a ruler.

[twilit crest]

Promo copy such as the official promotional text under the teasers for sos

[twin dragon]

EVERYONE will explode NOW

[whole holly]

okay Sea of Sorrows offerns TC lot of opportunities and there was cut spider so there is that

[twin dragon]

That are tied to their influence

[low oracle]

Nyleth is as much a ruler as Unn. I would even count her a higher being, since she created her own kin, in her own image.

[fresh badger]

Nothing says its tied to influence?

Nyleth cannot be a higher being, snail shamans explicitly say its the power of mortals

[twin dragon]

The kingdom decays once its ruler dies

[whole holly]

she is powerful presence

[fresh badger]

Nyleth is as much a higher being as like. Isma.

[fresh badger]

The kingdom doesnt, the environment sustained by their power does.

[low oracle]

But the memory crystal and stuff should definetely be poison.

[whole holly]

Higher Beings exist above all others, doesn't specify mortality

[twin dragon]

That's usually where their kingdom is located

[whole holly]

i don't know man

[fresh badger]

Nyleth had no kingdom vro

[twin dragon]

"Kingdom"

[low oracle]

It is meant to be passive after all. Wait, no please. Stop. Not another tool discussion.

[twin dragon]

Wherever their influence reached

[fresh badger]

And? Snail shamans still say its the power of mortals

[low oracle]

Idk, they say lots of weird shit.

[whole holly]

Mortal and Higher Being may not be mutually exclusive

[fresh badger]

Thats crazy cope vro

[whole holly]

they also decieve

[twin dragon]

You get the point

[low oracle]

True, they are only immortal by age.

[fresh badger]

They specifically distinguish the old hearts from like Hornet and GMS

[whole holly]

Pale King died, literally

[fresh badger]

Because its mortal power not god higher being power

[whole holly]

i guess that's right but to be fair they are Pale Beings

[low oracle]

They say the truth, but never all of it. It's never a question of what will happen after.

[twin dragon]

That would be uh

interesting choice of writing

[whole holly]

Nyleth is most likely mortal, very accomplished one though

[twin dragon]

The context needs them to say the truth

and so they do

[low oracle]

We only know for sure when getting Kingsoul. He might just be barely alive, relying on his few followers left alive. But the crack definetely confirms it.

[whole holly]

but i wanted Hidden Dreams like DLC for Memories in Silksong, called Lost Memories

[low oracle]

I know

[twilit crest]

PK died?

[twin dragon]

You may or may not get it in the future

[fresh badger]

Why do you say pk needs followers to live

[twilit crest]

Oh yeah I guess he did

[whole holly]

plus Higher Beings need to be sustained, Radiance, GMS, Unn, Nightmare Heart their power can wane, if not sustained by devotion

[low oracle]

Because almost every higher being follows this concept. Unn literally dies (not really) without her mosskin. Just look at her in P5.

[hollow crater]

"I want to see executions on TV. Imagine if The Citadel Corporate sponsored executions. That would be so Pharloomian, so patriotic. People would tune in. I think children at a certain age, as initiation, should be required to watch.
Public executions by guillotine are holy."

Citadel in a nutshell

[whole holly]

and Pale King is gone

[twin dragon]

Yeah but PK is visibly dead

[twilit crest]

I wondered if pale Kings corpse was yet another shell or some kind of motif but no it’s super literal. Kind of surprising that we still don’t know the method

[low oracle]

*Devotion or other means. GMS wants song, and Grimm feeds on fallen kingdoms (similar to feeding on old hearts in a way).

[fresh badger]

The mosskin only got infected because of Unn's absence. She was in decline/sleeping ever since that act of creation, which is why her territory and followers were taken without resistance.

[whole holly]

both are rituals facilitated by devotion

[low oracle]

Yes, after you hit him with the nail. Otherwise we can't tell for sure.

[narrow horizon]

i'll try not to start one but the damage is so bad it's never worth using, and it actively makes two pretty good red tools (flintslate and lifeblood syringe) many times worse

[fresh badger]

The song never sustained GMS, it was what kept her imprisoned?

Iirc

[whole holly]

did you watch Widow memory? Weavers used needolin to sustain her light

[twilit crest]

Yes

[low oracle]

The Radiance is far stronger than Unn. She is sleeping because she is on the brimm of death. All her followers were overtaken by infection.

[twilit crest]

Iirc the song is what keeps gms dormant and her seal intact, allowing pharlids to use her silk.

[whole holly]

not exclusively thought, watch needolin memory

[narrow horizon]

no unn is strongest being in canon alongside mr mushroom they both just too chill to give a freak fr

[hollow crater]

Considered Pharloom, We own the pale king an apology

[low oracle]

I thought she wanted the weavers to sing for her, before they sung her to sleep.

[twilit crest]

Idk about all that

[whole holly]

ehh, not really

[twilit crest]

The undead abortion demons is pretty wild

[twin dragon]

Both are shit

[low oracle]

I don't. I've always supported him .

[twin dragon]

we can have both

[twilit crest]

“No cost too great” is something you can only say when you win

[twin dragon]

Clueless ass king

[low oracle]

He did...in the end. Somewhat.

[twin dragon]

and abusive obsessive mother

[whole holly]

yeah, they sustained her light watch from 1:58 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NqzGknw45Q

[twilit crest]

Technical stalemate. We don’t know how long after the sealing his death took place

[twin dragon]

Chat why is silk hearts dialogue referring to "us"

[twilit crest]

Couldve been right after

[low oracle]

Somewhat
Probably not right after though, that'd be actually insane.

[whole holly]

idk

[twilit crest]

Cant say for sure in any case

The most likely cause of death is atrophy but it’s magic bug stuff so who knows

[low oracle]

The true assholes are the Weavers and the Moths .

[whole holly]

and Snails too

[twin dragon]

Weavers were fearmongered into doing what they did by gms

[whole holly]

and bugs in/with power in general

[twin dragon]

The conductors failed their mission AND were corrupt as fuck

[whole holly]

kinda, they wanted independence sure but they were bad group as well

[twilit crest]

I strongly doubt the weavers knew the conductors were going to turn pharloom into a megachurch when they left them in charge. But still their fault.

[low oracle]

I theorize that he dies when the Knight hits him with the nail. Until then he is just so extremely weak, he can't even move or talk. Which is why there are no real indications of death beforehand (no voided eyes, no cracked mask, etc.)

[twilit crest]

I like the idea of a weaver diaspora though. That’s super cool

[twin dragon]

Some of them remained

[whole holly]

me too

[whole holly]

Widow? aside from her who?

[twin dragon]

They wanted to grant their power to someone

but uh

only higher beings can bind/focus other beings into themselves

[twin dragon]

mummified weavers

[whole holly]

oh yeah, that's true

[twilit crest]

The ones who remained besides widow and sinner only did so to assist the escape attempt afaict

[twin dragon]

source

?

[twilit crest]

[low oracle]

They created capitalism and religion, with no one but themselves to gain something from it. The didn't care about any of the regular bigs they sacrificed, planning to do so eternally.

[twin dragon]

The megachurch was simplistic before

[whole holly]

i wish we got moth player character connected to dreams in HK3

[twin dragon]

any other hierarchy was established by the conductors

but yes they had immortal workers

slaves*

This kinda makes it sound like uh

[low oracle]

Only the buried ones remain. Widow was staked for supporting GMS, even having her mask brutally removed. First Sinner was imprisoned by the other Weavers, for a crime forgotten in time.

[whole holly]

Plasmium Communism is about to be fire

[low oracle]

?

[twin dragon]

Check isamor dialogue

I assume it has old citadel related lore

[twilit crest]

Was sinner imprisoned by weavers or by conductors? How do we know

[low oracle]

I don't get what you mean.

[twin dragon]

There was nothing they could benefit from in the citadel

aside from pilgrim worship

[lean temple]

Isamor mentions a Citadel of stone, not the ornate architecture we see

[twin dragon]

probably weavers

She hurt their religious image

What does this dialogue imply

I'd like to hear your takes

[low oracle]

Conducters wouldn't be powerful enough for an ancient Weaver, not even in their prime. And the since FS seemingly invented Rune Rage (speculative) , she must have been imprisoned far longer ago.

[twilit crest]

That seems speculative. But a strong enough theory I suppose

[lean temple]

We threw the burden of keeping up the Citadel on other bugs. We shall wait until someone powerful enough comes to free us from GMS for good

[whole holly]

1. they passed troubles and personally i think those weavers are ones we see in burial spires since words are similar and Silked Strength is about hornet they prophetized

[twilit crest]

I think chronologically makes more sense for sinner to be imprisoned by the conductors given her crime is apostasy. They likely were angry with sinner for assisting in the flight of the weavers

[twin dragon]

??

they cant be mad about the weavers fleeing

[twilit crest]

Cause why would weavers imprison someone who is seemingly on their side

[twin dragon]

the conductors enjoyed the shit out of their regime

[twin dragon]

She hurt the weavers divine image, which could bring the whole plan down

[sinful nimbus]

Weavers believed themselves to be divine and they were worshipped as such and so a weaver going "That's a lie guys" isn't good

[twin dragon]

She got witch triale'd

[twilit crest]

But she was right, reinforced by the flight

[sinful nimbus]

And the Citadel weavers didn't flee that was Cindril

[sinful nimbus]

Whether its right or not is irrelevant

[twin dragon]

Whoever is right is not always such in the eyes of the ones that are wrong

[twilit crest]

It just doesn’t make as much sense for the weavers to be like “oh we will imprison you for the thing you were always right about”

[twin dragon]

They didn't believe her

it's that simple

[sinful nimbus]

Or they were dishonest

[twilit crest]

It’s not like they had confidence in gms

[sinful nimbus]

It is propaganda after all

[low oracle]

The ancient weaver aspect just makes more sense to me. And FS is also sealed with silk runes, so idk if the conductors can do that really. Anyways gotta go now.

[sinful nimbus]

Weavers were worshipped as divine children when they were... not

[twilit crest]

That’s another thing. We don’t really see evidence of propaganda in weaver-era pharloom afaik

[sinful nimbus]

Weavers were worshipped as divine

[twilit crest]

Oh well that’s a good point

[twin dragon]

What's your interpretation of this rune harp

and how does it connect with burial spire weavers

[sinful nimbus]

They were hoping someone could come along and get their spells so that someone could finally take down GMS so the Citadel wasn't necessary

(Since ruling and running the Citadel is a burden for everyone)

[twin dragon]

Though i'd imagine only a higher being can bind/focus other creatures onto itself

also "silken strength", they expected it to be a weaver

So they expected a weaver higher being to finally end their curse?

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet is binding a spell here not a crest

Something all weavers might be able to do

[twin dragon]

They bind a weaver's corpse iirc

[sinful nimbus]

You don't bind the crest of keelal or wtv

[twin dragon]

you're still binding someone

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah but not a crest which is what is unique to Hornet

[spark valve]

there's no reason to assert that only a hb could bind or focus skills

[twin dragon]

They bind the corpse to get the skill

[sinful nimbus]

So

[spark valve]

ok

not specifically a god thing

[twin dragon]

They bind another creature to their shell

[sinful nimbus]

What is unique to Hornet is the ability to bind CRESTS according to Eva which is not what she does to the weavers

She gains a spell

All weavers can bind EG First Sinner

[twin dragon]

Bind silk to their shell doe

We don't see them doing much more

[twilit crest]

Is the corpse in temple of the beast a weaver?

[twin dragon]

No, but why does that matter

[spark valve]

ok so they do similar shit but you're just arbitrarily claiming that only hornet can bind skills and that that's specifically because she's a god

which she uh isn't but whatever

[twilit crest]

Just curious damn

Seems like ppl are on edge again so I’m just gonna back off lol

[spark valve]

weavers can bind which is the method hornet uses to gain skills from them

[cedar skiff]

wait i just realized isnt hornet binding essentially the same way the vessels seal the radiance

[spark valve]

most likely they can all do it

[cedar skiff]

binding the weaver corpses i mean, most notably eva

[spark valve]

it's probably a similar thing to focusing yes

[lean temple]

Speaking of whom, what do you think now of the FS is Atla theory?

[sinful nimbus]

Its pretty convincing

[cedar skiff]

binding could literally just be a weaver term anyway

considering its

silk

and she

binds it

or whatever

[twin dragon]

she's like

a big fan of it

[sinful nimbus]

All weaver effigies seem to correspond to the enshrined weaver in their region

[twin dragon]

Hereditary from gms

[lean temple]

It does seem FS was a corpse in a burial spire, no?

[spark valve]

also weavenest atla using blazing runes made of silk

[sinful nimbus]

Probably not before being imprisoned

[spark valve]

not in the same kind of spire as the others she's just dead like them

[cedar skiff]

only thing that sort of weakens the theory for me is why they'd worship an exiled weaver

unless its like, past remnants

[twin dragon]

It is mummified in the same way

[twilit crest]

I’m wondering that too

[spark valve]

well the worship would've preceded the imprisoning, the effigy is also found in the slab

[twin dragon]

Weavenest atla is likely pre citadel

since we see many tools that they tried to use to get rid of gms

[spark valve]

weavenest atla is pre citadel yes

[cedar skiff]

oh yeah i guess that totally makes sense. getting rid of the evidence too

[lean temple]

If she is Atla, a respected Weaver, it would make sense for her to have her own spire, which was forcibly removed and placed in the slab (or the cell was built around it). Thoughts?

[spark valve]

which means atla helped build the citadel then because she wouldn't go along she got locked away

[twilit crest]

Interred

[spark valve]

the spires probably didn't come until well after

the conductors probably didn't randomly decide this specific mummified corpse was a sinner

[frosty gate]

Oooh what's the topic

[stray fog]

Ayo the goat is back

[twin dragon]

I honestly kinda always thought that burial spires were established before the weavers passed the burden

[stray fog]

🔥

[twilit crest]

If Hornet can drink monster energy

[frosty gate]

Far from the goat

I've just been on Vacation and texting on phone is annoying

Good to be back tho

[twilit crest]

Wb brisket stranger

[frosty gate]

Yes, but it would change her like Lifeblood does it

[sinful nimbus]

Why would she have her own spire at that point in time

[lean temple]

Perhaps by reading the records they could've uncovered her history and decided to retroactively punish her.

[twilit crest]

Caffeinated hornet… so flea brew?

[frosty gate]

The one in the spire? Why the weapons tho?

[spark valve]

by... tying up a corpse?

[sinful nimbus]

Her sin 'lost to time' probably wasn't recorded in the citadel

[twilit crest]

I’m actually curious about your best guesses as to what flea brew could be made of

[spark valve]

why is this weird scenario worth considering when it's completely feasible that the weavers just locked her up because she was actively causing problems

[lean temple]

They know she's an apostate

[twin dragon]

Weird how her spire is also similar to the weavers that stayed in pharloom

[twilit crest]

Which adds credence to my theory that weavers are unlikely to be her captors

[sinful nimbus]

So she was ruled an apostate in the past, not given adequate punishment for whatever reason, then died, and then the Conductors read she was an apostate somewhere and decided to throw her corpse in jail?

[sinful nimbus]

How so

[spark valve]

the burial spires are a hell of a lot more than just this

[frosty gate]

Why tho?

[twilit crest]

I genuinely believe the conductors are stupid enough to do this

[twin dragon]

yeah now that i see it again it looks a lot simpler

[twilit crest]

There’s no other way to explain a stationary mummy being behind bars

[spark valve]

this is a weaver burial spire

[lean temple]

The thing with her being Atla doesn't mesh well with being despised by the Weavers. So perhaps the Conductors are the ones who did all the punishing. Plus her cell is gilded and all which came after

[frosty gate]

The Conductors are stupid, but this is just not logical ngl specially because FS is caged and sealed

[sinful nimbus]

Weavers are not above hurting weavers that threaten the Citadel's regime

Kid named Widow

[twin dragon]

What do you think is the origin of these, considering that these weavers seem to tie to the ones that remained in pharloom

[lean temple]

True

[spark valve]

they built them then they died in them

[twilit crest]

I’m just wondering why the weavers would inter a corpse and then lock it up. The lower bugs were the fanatics

[frosty gate]

Gilded means Gold, her cage looks bronzey

[frosty gate]

THIS IS WHERE MY CRAZY THEORY COMES IN

You see how FS's arena is full of weapons?

[sinful nimbus]

What if she wasn't a corpse when they decided to punish her 🥴

[twin dragon]

how does that work

[frosty gate]

Also this

[twilit crest]

So they reentered her cell, interred her corpse, locked it back up, and escaped?

I mean I guess

[frosty gate]

I think that the Weavers basically pushed Atla here and killed her on the spot

[spark valve]

it doesn't seem to require elaboration

[frosty gate]

And then put her on the spire

[spark valve]

absolution denied implies they probably didn't kill her directly

[frosty gate]

FS has a shit ton of needles in her cages

[sinful nimbus]

They didn't have to reenter it they could've just mummified her after locking her up

[twilit crest]

How do you mummify a corpse from the other side of a locked cell door

[frosty gate]

That's the judgment, we don't know if there was a trial

[low oracle]

Can the conductors use silk runes? Because that seems highly unlikely, as well as them being capable of defeating a weaver in their prime. Besides, I thought that the most of Weavers left, hence starting the conductors age. The ones that stayed in Pharloom got proper burials, so I guess it is plausible. It just doesn't seem all to likely.

[sinful nimbus]

They could've not sealed it while they were actively chaining her...

[spark valve]

they're theocratic rulers they don't have to have trials they can just do it

[frosty gate]

They could've deemed FS a Sinner without her there and then decided to kill her

[twin dragon]

Oh yeah let me end my life in here, while also magically mummifying my corpse

[low oracle]

Huh?

[spark valve]

who says anything about magical mummification

[lean temple]

The thought was them going after her corpse, but yes the runes are a good point. The Citadel uses rune cages but I'm not sure how adept they are at making runes, especially the ones on FS cell

[low oracle]

I don't even know what this convo is anymore.

[twilit crest]

Seal her in with the bugs who interred her corpse? I guess that’s possible but I’m not totally convinced

[frosty gate]

"Who caged First Sinner" is the Topic

[low oracle]

The rune cages are something I did think about, but it doesn't add up to the specific rune chains. The Pale King made similar binding spell chains in the temple of the black egg, so it seems unlikely they are as simple as regular rune cages.

[twin dragon]

I mean other weavers could've sealed them inside but eh

[sinful nimbus]

That's not what I said

[spark valve]

they don't necessarily need anyone to seal them inside but even if they did they could've just commanded one of their slave society to do it

[twilit crest]

We know first sinner needed to be mummified somehow. Unless the weavers have some unknown ability to do it to themselves, that leads me to believe she was imprisoned post-mortem

[twilit crest]

It was phrased as a question

[frosty gate]

I doubt anyone but the Weavers were involved in FS sealing

[sinful nimbus]

-chain first sinner up - mummify her - leave the room - seal the room

It is not that complicated

[low oracle]

I say Weavers. Perhaps Weavers and Conductors, at the period of changing the high caste. While the cage is fitted with the citadel design, it also has special rune chains, the conductors likely couldn't craft.

[twin dragon]

Do they just carve stone around them and then lay inside of it

till death

[spark valve]

that is about the spires in general

[twilit crest]

That’s what I just said…

[twin dragon]

also the spires seemed objects of prayer

[frosty gate]

Wdym the Citadel Design?

The round spool?

[spark valve]

the spires are tombs for their gods of course they'd become objects of prayer especially for pilgrims

[twilit crest]

It also strikes me as strange that first sinner was mummified at all

If the weavers did it, at what point during their flight plan would it have happened

[sinful nimbus]

The message is still up and its not but ok

[twilit crest]

I’m sorry to break it to you but it is

[frosty gate]

They probably did it out of respect. I don't think they hated FS, I think they just had to judge her a Sinner before she blew the whole cover

[lean temple]

It is interesting that FS doesn't condemn the Weavers in her dialogue, and she's still in on the whole reclaim our kingdom plan. And we don't see a Weaver tablet addressing her near her cell. She says "our silk our rage". Who is "our"?

[twilit crest]

If weavers are the ones who interred first sinner, then that would mean they intended for a descendant to find her. If that’s the case, why? At the time of imprisonment, if they had known the plan to escape by that point, why conflict with fs at all?

[frosty gate]

Royal We perhaps

[twilit crest]

Unless mummification is somehow an older custom of weaver tradition

[lean temple]

Weavers don't use it afaik

[twilit crest]

Which is likely

[twin dragon]

Could have those spires been built before the weavers flight plan?

[spark valve]

no

the weaver flight plan was before the citadel itself

[frosty gate]

I don't think they do, you're right

[twin dragon]

Where did the rest go doe

[twilit crest]

This is possible but I’m a little biased in saying I hope this isn’t the case

[spark valve]

hallownest sandsea wastes blackbarrens city of steel etc

[frosty gate]

They didn't intend someone to find anyone until they were about to die at the very end of their plan. The descendant plan was very late in all this

The spire were probably made for relevant Weavers

[lean temple]

FS also says "I have waited" and "my strength". And it makes no sense for her to magically switch to Royal We

[spark valve]

they were just hoping some weaver eventually came back for no real reason and got lucky

[frosty gate]

And Hornet finding and using them was an extra

[twin dragon]

Isnt that part of their flight plan

[spark valve]

it is the flight plan

[frosty gate]

You are also right.

[twilit crest]

Right, so there are two possibilities on the top of my list:
1.) the weavers interred sinner as a customary ritual

2.) the weavers killed sinner at the end of their flight plan and left her there in a cell for a descendant to find… somehow.

[sinful nimbus]

Said "flight plan" came before the Citadel was even established

[frosty gate]

This

[spark valve]

yes

[sinful nimbus]

It was to flee GMS who would be asleep by the time of the Citadel

[spark valve]

the weavers still in pharloom towards the end of their reign over the citadel all died

[twin dragon]

Omw to play a game and miss every fucking detail in it

[twin dragon]

The others remained to establish it

[sinful nimbus]

Yea

[twin dragon]

and posteriorely hand it over to ze common bugs

[frosty gate]

Correct

[spark valve]

when the weavers in pharloom started dying out common bugs took over to keep the song playing so gms would stay asleep

[twilit crest]

It’s also possible* sinner’s body was moved into the cell at some point

[frosty gate]

It was given by Weavers, but yeah

[frosty gate]

That's also a possibility but I think Weavers fighting FS until she dies in the cage is badass

[twin dragon]

Fs was punished by the weavers

[spark valve]

I don't know why fs is a point of confusion
they tied her up then threw her in the cage and tossed out the key

[twilit crest]

That’s pretty peak cinema

[twin dragon]

rock

[spark valve]

they may have encased her in stone as a binding yes

[twilit crest]

Perhaps sinner wanted all out war against gms and the weavers voted against her, leading to violence and subsequent imprisonment

[twin dragon]

No, she hurt their image

[frosty gate]

Can't be, Atla was the one who made the Citadel

[twilit crest]

It’s just the mummification thing that still makes me scratch chin

[twin dragon]

They could just make her bound to the pedestal yknow

and then throw her in

[twilit crest]

I don’t see how these details conflict

[twin dragon]

it's not a hard thing to understand

[frosty gate]

Why would Atla, who decided to trick GMS into slumber, want an all out war against GMS?

Knowing full well they will all die if they try

[twin dragon]

Don't think she's the only one

Weavenests weren't inhabited by a single weaver

[twilit crest]

We don’t know if she believes this

[frosty gate]

Not the only one, but the leader

[twin dragon]

she could be leading the operation yeah

and research

[frosty gate]

Yeah that's what I meant

[twilit crest]

Why would atla be imprisoned if she was sympathetic to the flight?

[frosty gate]

She would've joined Murglin

[frosty gate]

How is that related at all?

[twilit crest]

Guh

Nvm

[frosty gate]

What does the Cindril Weavers have to do with Atla being imprisoned? They left

[twin dragon]

I'd say that cindril weavers weren't the only ones to leave

[whole holly]

Was Weavenest Karn just one Weaver?

[sinful nimbus]

Atla's sin is on her cell (Apostasy) and then elaborated onat the end of her fight (Claiming the Divine Children weren't divine)

[twin dragon]

They helped develop tech to help the non citadel ones escape aswell

[spark valve]

cindril weavers are the non citadel ones

[twilit crest]

If sinner is sympathetic to the flight plan I don’t see any reason for her to be imprisoned by fellow weavers who also left. Much less mummified.

If sinner disagreed with the flight plan it would, if nothing else, give us a motive for the conflict

[frosty gate]

The other failed factions probably joined one or the other, I just encompass it into Cindril and Atla who are the successful ones

[sinful nimbus]

Flight plan was already carried out

Why is she sympathetic to a past event she wasn't involved in

[twin dragon]

Yeah i'd say this is what most people mean

[twilit crest]

So sinner was imprisoned by the weavers who stayed behind?

[sinful nimbus]

Yes

[twin dragon]

when they refer to "cindril weavers"

[frosty gate]

No, idk, Karn is fucking weird, they didn't do nothing

[twilit crest]

What do we have to demonstrate this

[twin dragon]

They might've done shit but its sand now

oh well

[whole holly]

except sharp dart, i mean are we trying to piece weavenest memebers and their goals?

[sinful nimbus]

First Sinner is imprisoned in Pharloom therefore... her captors had to have been in Pharloom

Did they trap her remotely from the Blackbarrens or something

[frosty gate]

No no, that isn't the topic. We're talking about FS being imprisoned by the Weavers who stayed

[twin dragon]

Yeah

i was there

[twilit crest]

Also why would sinner even need to be locked up if the flight plan ended up successful as far as the weavers were concerned? The motive is still lacking

[twin dragon]

i saw it

[sinful nimbus]

Apostasy

[twin dragon]

I am, infact, one of the weavers that carried out the plan

[sinful nimbus]

Its literally on her cell dawg

[frosty gate]

Again, what does the Flight plan have to do with her being imprisoned??

[sinful nimbus]

"Guilty of the sin of apostasy"

[twilit crest]

Would an apostate deserve interment

[frosty gate]

Atla was imprisoned by the ones who stayed

[whole holly]

First Sinner, yeah i agree, but are those weavers ones in burial spires or Weavenest members? since Burial Spire is also in Weavenest Karn?

[twilit crest]

How do we know it was the ones who stayed and not the ones who left

[frosty gate]

I can confirm, I was the plan

[twin dragon]

I carried out twis?

[sinful nimbus]

She's not really placed in a tomb or wtv but she is mummified yes

[whole holly]

what are slab keys called i forgot, remind me

[frosty gate]

How could the one who left imprison her if she's IN Pharloom and the rest LEFT

[sinful nimbus]

That was presumably part of the punishment

[limpid summit]

The flight plan was pre GMS escaping because the Cindril tablet places the flight plan at a time when GMS has agency
FS was post GMS escaping because the Slab is an institute of the Citadel

[spark valve]

the flight plan was before she was even put to sleep

[twilit crest]

Ritual mummification/immortalization in the exact same manner as all the other weaver corpses in the kingdom is punishment?

[frosty gate]

I think there's more Spires than nests right? It wouldn't add up

[whole holly]

okay, i get it

[sinful nimbus]

Weavers build Weavenests to plot against Grand Mother Silk
Weavenest Cindril ends up fleeing the kingdom entirely
Weavenest Atla establishes the Citadel
Remaining weavers rule the Citadel for a time
First Sinner claims Weavers aren't divine and gets punished for apostasy
The Citadel weavers start dying one way or another

This is the timeline

[twin dragon]

Though how they would manage to escape her if she had still agency

[sinful nimbus]

Evidently

Well actually no

[spark valve]

by running far and fast from a place she can't see

[twilit crest]

Did you think I implied the remotely imprisoned her??? I’m asking if it’s possible they imprisoned sinner and then left

[sinful nimbus]

Its not in the same manner really

First Sinner is mummified she didn't get a spire or anything

[frosty gate]

Oh wait I read you wrong. I guess the ones in the Spires could've imprisoned her along with others

[sinful nimbus]

Nope because they didn't leave

[whole holly]

yeah, i guess

[twilit crest]

I’m asking a question about his interpretation wdym

[frosty gate]

I wanna add that I personally think Cindril and Atla carried their plans at the same time

[sinful nimbus]

If the interpretation involves the weavers fleeing after first sinner is imprisoned its wrong

[twin dragon]

I see no reason why cindril weavers couldn't have escaped directly after the citadel has been eshtablished

[sinful nimbus]

GMS would be asleep

[twilit crest]

How do we know

[sinful nimbus]

IE they wouldn't be running from anything

[frosty gate]

That can't be because Cindril Weavers left before this even happened

[spark valve]

once the citadel is built the weavers no longer have anything to flee from

[sinful nimbus]

Ballador rune harp saying the weavers all died

They didn't flee

[edgy nebula]

except their responsibilities

[frosty gate]

Their Weavers, the ones that stayed with them

[sinful nimbus]

yeah

[twilit crest]

So youre saying weaver was captured and interred by a group of gms loyalists more or less

[spark valve]

they didn't really mind shit early on, lavishing in their false rule and allat

[sinful nimbus]

No not at all

[jaunty brook]

I figured first sinner lead the rebellion

[frosty gate]

No, by a group of Weavers who didn't want the truth known to the public

[spark valve]

cindril was fleeing from gms

not responsibilities

[sinful nimbus]

She was imprisoned by the Citadel for saying the rulers of the Citadel (Her fellow weavers) weren't divine

[spark valve]

escaping her silken sight

[twilit crest]

If the flight was already successful who cares

[frosty gate]

Most likely, yes

[jaunty brook]

That makes a lot of sense

[limpid summit]

The “Service eternal” they speak of fleeing is sustaining GMS through song

[whole holly]

yeah, she knew origin story of weavers

[frosty gate]

Because the truth isn't about the flight, the truth is that the Weavers aren't divine at all

Let's tackle this from the core

[jaunty brook]

Weavers were just evolved pharlids

[edgy nebula]

howd first sinner know the weavers werent divine

[frosty gate]

Weavers built the Citadel on the pretense that they were divine

[twilit crest]

Hmm I guess that makes sense

[twin dragon]

I'd assume there was some sort of communication between them but eh

[frosty gate]

FS was going to tell the rest "We are not divine"

[jaunty brook]

She probably saw the creation of the others/knew how she was made

[twin dragon]

Like if one faction knew that they planned to build the citadel

[frosty gate]

And the other Weavers said "Shut the fuck up you're going to ruin our entire operation" and locked her

[twilit crest]

I thought the idea was that sinner was the first pharlid to ascend and thus got to witness the others

[spark valve]

if cindril knew about the citadel and was on the same page as the other weavers they wouldn't need to flee from gms's sight

[frosty gate]

We don't know how she discovered they were just Pharlids, but she knew

[limpid summit]

If the pilgrims knew the Citadel wasn’t built on divinity then worship and service might wane, and GMS might return

So FS’s revelation presented a danger to the Weavers

[jaunty brook]

Im saying thats why she knows they aren't divine

At least that's what i think

[twilit crest]

Yeah I’m agreeing

[twin dragon]

As long as gms exists they're cursed

[sinful nimbus]

What?

[spark valve]

if gms is asleep they don't need to escape her perception

[jaunty brook]

Hornet was meant to be a new ruler instead if gms right?

[twin dragon]

By the burden of gms being an obsessive parent

[spark valve]

her existence being negative doesn't change that

[jaunty brook]

They wanted someone to take her down and take her place

[limpid summit]

Metaphorically yeah but silken sight implies she’s up and watching

[spark valve]

they're specifically escaping her perception

[twilit crest]

Idk about meant to, but she felt an urge

[spark valve]

not really but kind of

[twilit crest]

I think it’s just that first prt

[twin dragon]

True

[sinful nimbus]

The Hallownest weavers wanted her to be their own queen in Hallownest

[jaunty brook]

Pale beings have dominance baked into their shells

[sinful nimbus]

She wasn't intended to take down GMS or anything, Weavers fled to "start anew"

[twin dragon]

So weavers were split up i'd imagine

[twilit crest]

Weavers wanted a descendant to take gms down but we don’t rlly know what their after plans were, or if they had any at all

[twin dragon]

Where did the other weavenest weavers go though

[spark valve]

joined the citadel

[twin dragon]

I'd assume they'd join one faction or another

[frosty gate]

Around

[jaunty brook]

Ohhh i get it

[frosty gate]

They did

[twin dragon]

We don't see many weavers in pharloom

[spark valve]

some of the citadel weavers went back to their weavenests to die

[twin dragon]

i mean i'd say there could be more

[twin dragon]

The one in bilewater seemingly fled as there's no spire nearby

[sinful nimbus]

Weavenest Murglin became an influential pro-gun organization in the Citadel

[limpid summit]

Cindril weavers left, after GMS was sealed we don’t know of any weavers who didn’t join the citadel

[spark valve]

not every weavenest produced silk skills or abilities that would merit the weaver going back

[jaunty brook]

They wanted an oppen carry law

As part of the faith

[twilit crest]

Is cindril the only weaver faction to have left?

[sinful nimbus]

yea

[jaunty brook]

Why is first sinners mask broken?

[sinful nimbus]

Cindril was leaving Murglin was making guns Absolom was studying void Karn was doing ??? and Atla was devising the Citadel

[frosty gate]

Yes, the other factions beside Cindril and Atla failed and joined one ore the other

[jaunty brook]

And why did they do all that stuff to widow

[spark valve]

tbf most weavenests probably worked on multiple things but yeah

[frosty gate]

Karn was making sand castles

[edgy nebula]

didnt form correctly

[twilit crest]

I see

[frosty gate]

Cus she was a bitch

[edgy nebula]

we dont know

[jaunty brook]

So its more of a birth defect

[sinful nimbus]

Weavenest Atla when they have to make an artificial child because they're bored

[spark valve]

widow is currently loyal to gms which would be ample reason for citadel weavers to do shit to her

[jaunty brook]

How much of a bitch do you need to be to get 2 big rods in your spine

And demasked

[twilit crest]

That’s a good question, where is widow’s cell?

[twin dragon]

We don't find many weaver remnants around them, only a single weaver bound to a spire

[spark valve]

I mean ultimately their failure to do so is probably what cost the weavers their reign

[twilit crest]

If she was pinned and broken by weavers, wouldn’t she be imprisoned up until the haunting?

[frosty gate]

Imagine you are a German during ww2, lose and still pay respects for the funny mustache man

[edgy nebula]

“demasking” scared speed gif

[jaunty brook]

So widow

[frosty gate]

Exactly

[jaunty brook]

🤔

[sinful nimbus]

"funny mustache man" we losing our tongue with this one

[jaunty brook]

I get it now

[twilit crest]

Charlie Chaplin obviously

[jaunty brook]

The diddy blud mustache man

[frosty gate]

Im scared mods will react to the name LMAO

[edgy nebula]

i think it’s fine to say hitler

[frosty gate]

I never know when I say something out of rule

[edgy nebula]

it has been said before

[twilit crest]

Wait what wrong with saying funny mustache man

It gets the point across.

[frosty gate]

What I don't get about Widow is why she is alive and other Weavers aren't

[jaunty brook]

He was a bad comedian

[frosty gate]

Why is she more long lived

[twilit crest]

Empowered by the haunting I guess

[stray fog]

Gms might be keeping her alive

[jaunty brook]

Gms knew widow was a simp

And wouldnt do anything

[spark valve]

I mean a prominent difference is that she was unable to continue to cast spells using her own life force

[frosty gate]

Well yeah

[spark valve]

it seems maybe possible that had something to do with it

[twilit crest]

Widow is haunted and we know that let’s gms control people past their natural life span. So maybe there’s something to that

[frosty gate]

Who would've thought that not using your life force for spells would result in you not dying

[twilit crest]

It’s possible that might play into yet another reason anti-gms weavers mummified themselves. To avoid haunting

[twin dragon]

They died out

[stray fog]

Why does gms never acknowledge her most obedient daughter

[twin dragon]

widow can't use her lifeforce to produce silk

so she actually lived for a while

[twilit crest]

Some of them

[spark valve]

it would be funny if citadel weavers got drained by clawmaidens but probably not what happened

[frosty gate]

Well, gotta leave, watch the Spoken For video with lace in it is really good!!!

[twilit crest]

My thing is, if widow is already loyal to gms why would she be haunted

[twin dragon]

all

[jaunty brook]

Do you think a clawmaiden would kill lace?

[twin dragon]

in pharloom

[twilit crest]

Haunting her is the key

[spark valve]

it might try

[twilit crest]

That’s what I said

[edgy nebula]

a clawmaiden would solo lace, trust

[twin dragon]

Yeah that doesn't work

[jaunty brook]

Daughter of a pale being

Vs

Silk eating robot

[spark valve]

lace probably has enough in the tank to kill a clawmaiden before it devours her

[twilit crest]

A hunters journal in lace POV would be fun

[jaunty brook]

She'd beat it extreme diff

[edgy nebula]

do we think lace would continue to live after silksong or do we think hornet’s silk wouldnt be enough

[twilit crest]

Lace is fully autonomous afaict

[spark valve]

could really go either way idk if it matters that much

[jaunty brook]

Lace drives hornet insane so she just puts her on the same machine that conducter was on

[twilit crest]

Unless her imminent death is a story beat to come

[storm ice]

didn’t gms give hornet all her silk?

[jaunty brook]

Nah

[edgy nebula]

she spent it all on the silk soar, presumably

[twilit crest]

Used it all to get out of the void

[sinful nimbus]

No they're setting up a Phantified Lace bossfight

[storm ice]

oh yeah

[jaunty brook]

Lace will become another phantom

Emo teenager phase

[edgy nebula]

plasmified lace

lost lace but constantly healing

also has 2500 hp

[jaunty brook]

Savage lace

[storm ice]

blue lace

[foggy fractal]

why are you blue

[jaunty brook]

Baby lace

Does absolutely nothing

[twin dragon]

plasmified lost infected haunted savage fallen absolute pure lace

[storm ice]

baby blue lace

[sinful nimbus]

Anyway I like the idea that Hornet can sustain Lace because it makes her a mother in a sense

[twin dragon]

but NO! you get people SHIPPING them

[edgy nebula]

mother to your forever child aunt

[jaunty brook]

Im ngl i kinda liked the idea of the ship till i found out she was a kid when the game dropped

[twilit crest]

Nah it creates a type of codependency imo

[spark valve]

the rare reasonable response to new information

[twin dragon]

I don't think hornet would really stick much with lace considering she's unstable as shit and tried to kill her 2.5 times

[jaunty brook]

2.5?

[twilit crest]

I like the idea that their next venture will be finding a power source for lace

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah that's part of being a mother dawg...

[storm ice]

so a 400 year old made to act like a kid is a kid

[twin dragon]

The void imprinted onto her so i guess..? but it's just void being void

[edgy nebula]

yeah

[spark valve]

which is about how many times she tried to kill her other sibling these things can be moved past

[edgy nebula]

she has the mind and body of a child, regardless of how long she’s been around, that’s a kid

[jaunty brook]

Lace woulda probably fought her without the void too

[twilit crest]

I like the idea that lace was in arrested development until act 3

[edgy nebula]

but lets not start lace age discussion

[twin dragon]

Tk is mad patient for not desintegrating hornet into shreds

[jaunty brook]

What on earth is arrested development

[twilit crest]

Like mentally stuck

[jaunty brook]

They like her

All the siblings do

[sinful nimbus]

She's always going to be mentally stuck and she has to accept that her life has value regardless of that

Kinda the point of Lace 2 dialogue

[jaunty brook]

I thought she died after the 2nd fight tbh

[spark valve]

so does hornet, she plays dead

[foggy fractal]

Grand Mother Hornet ! 🗣️ cue GMS' theme

[jaunty brook]

Wasn't until silk and soul i found she lived

[twilit crest]

Or she was told she was forever going to be one thing and now has to take hornet’s advice and learn to grow into something without mommy’s guidance

[sinful nimbus]

Not consistent with her dialogue

[jaunty brook]

Hornet gives off the vibes of that aunt you only see during the holidays

[twilit crest]

Consistent with the themes

[twin dragon]

She also sees the knight in her, lost lace hunter's journal text, so she could treat lace as her sibling

[sinful nimbus]

Not really

[twilit crest]

Plus, static characterization is l gains

[sinful nimbus]

What you like and what is canon are different things

[edgy nebula]

mind and body being static and character being static arent the same thing

[sinful nimbus]

No children can't have character arcs apparently

[edgy nebula]

lace grows throughout the story by learning lessons and learning how to live

[spark valve]

so true

[twilit crest]

We have no reason to believe any of the propoganda told to or about lace is 100% truthful or aligns with the themes of the game

[sinful nimbus]

Ever met a child who can change their views?

[spark valve]

still being a child doesn't mean she can't grow or learn things

[twin dragon]

Doesn't justify 2 jumpings

[edgy nebula]

not by growing in inches

[sinful nimbus]

What propaganda

[jaunty brook]

Tbf hornet had it coming

[sinful nimbus]

This isn't portrayed as a false thing

[jaunty brook]

She "jumped" the knight twice

[sinful nimbus]

You just think its better if its false because uh

[twilit crest]

Citadel signs and etchings aren’t portrayed as lies?

[sinful nimbus]

The Citadel being exploitative is in fact focused upon

[jaunty brook]

Children are easily persuaded

[twilit crest]

Right. It’s likely that lace will believe whatever gms tells her.

[jaunty brook]

At least the ones i encounter are

[sinful nimbus]

Lace being a child is a consistent stance the game takes right up until AFTER you've beaten the game

[spark valve]

I think you'd have a hard time convincing parents of that

[twilit crest]

Not really

[sinful nimbus]

"Silk spun child"

[jaunty brook]

How so?

[spark valve]

ll journal entry still calls her a child

[twilit crest]

Created with the intent of staying one. But name one parent who successfully conceived a child who stayed such forever

[limpid summit]

I think Hornet calling Lace a child in her last line of dialogue is fairly telling

[sinful nimbus]

If you can point to a piece of dialogue where the notion that she's a child is challenged I'll change my mind

[jaunty brook]

Baby hornet vs base lace

[twilit crest]

I doubt that lowkey

[twin dragon]

Testing the vessels' strength to see if they can challenge the hollow knight

[limpid summit]

She never said that!

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah but for the sake of strengthening your argument can you point to a piece of dialogue that does that

[twin dragon]

But murdering them is ehh

[sinful nimbus]

If you don't have any evidence that'd be really funny

[jaunty brook]

Her mind could probably mature but she's gonna be stuck in the body forever unless they can rebuild her with some silk or something

[spark valve]

she's not testing the vessels' strength in general she's just doing damage control

[twilit crest]

Oh that’s a novel idea actually

[spark valve]

the only actual encounter she intended as a test is ke

[jaunty brook]

Why let thk kill them if you can just do it now

[twin dragon]

Lace is a child that has been exposed to the worst kinds of shit there is, but she's a child nonetheless

[edgy nebula]

i feel like if hornet rebuilt her itd take alot, if not all of her silk

[twilit crest]

But yeah I don’t think lace is going to physically grow up, it’s more about her characterization

[twin dragon]

No they aren't touching thk lmfao

they aren't getting past deepnest

[jaunty brook]

Get lost kin past base gorb

[edgy nebula]

is anything about gorb or anything gorb-esque found in silksong

let us theorize about gorb

[limpid summit]

Gorb fell off the cliffs lost his mind and died trying to climb back up

Ascend ascend

He was high INT low WIS

[sinful nimbus]

Bell Hermit's humongous brain and high levels of intelligence are reminiscent of Gorb

[edgy nebula]

then why is he called the great mind

[twilit crest]

Intmaxxing is fun lol

[twin dragon]

gorb is, infact, crust king khann

[limpid summit]

Because he was smart in life

[twin dragon]

slave

[limpid summit]

Probably

[sinful nimbus]

Aren't we all

[spark valve]

(or at least claimed to be)

[twin dragon]

slave

[limpid summit]

He just didn’t believe PK or got cocky

[sinful nimbus]

Well at least I'm not a nuisance... begone.

[limpid summit]

Maybe he got infected and Rad pushed him to defy PK because he was so smart

This beacon aint shit

[edgy nebula]

i wish we got different characters quotes for the lower hunter journal dialogue like we did with hk

itd be cool

[twin dragon]

slave

and you ARE a nuisance

slave to your IGNORANCE

begone

see? i just gave you the bell hermit experience

[sinful nimbus]

Exactly what a slave would say. Begone!

[spark valve]

hunter's journal in hk in general is cooler since that section is not restricted to interactions the player has seen so it's like all superficial shit in silksong

[limpid summit]

Quotes for the hearts at least

[twilit crest]

I’m hearing his voice as I read this

[limpid summit]

Or the memento bosses

[twin dragon]

No, that's EXACTLY what someone that thinks a slave would say, would say

[twilit crest]

Yeah it’s more a diary

[limpid summit]

Like how would we know about Gulka venom

Hornet would have never tried that

[sinful nimbus]

I'll waste no more words on a slave

[twin dragon]

Slave

[sinful nimbus]

Grnk

[jaunty brook]

Begone!

[twilit crest]

Perhaps it’s something she heard in the offscreen time she spends with docile pharlids

[sinful nimbus]

And you can get away with its author being evil

[foggy fractal]

guys its 2026...

we need new topics...

[edgy nebula]

lace age discourse in the big 26…

[limpid summit]

“I feel no remorse to see them felled” Put on a shirt hornet
“They have nothing to offer” Empowering

[twin dragon]

Gettin shit in hornets perspective is cool so id take that

[sinful nimbus]

Lace age discourse is over. Its time for Nuu age discourse.

[twin dragon]

better than uh

[jaunty brook]

Do you think hornet actually tried walking on water

[edgy nebula]

prolly a child

[twin dragon]

nuu explaining shit to you..

[limpid summit]

Well she’s like SS year - HK year

Cause she’s Unn’s daughter

Or reincarnation

[jaunty brook]

A kid or a woman in her early 30s

No debate

[twilit crest]

Hornet lowkey thinks she’s invincible so maybe

[sinful nimbus]

Nuu is a child

But guess who has had to explain that Nuunet is not based actually

[spark valve]

nuu calling hornet a grown up means nuu is probably not an adult

[edgy nebula]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1301135914680188981/1452877339959754852/attachment.gif

[jaunty brook]

Nuunet?!?!

[twin dragon]

there are ships?

[jaunty brook]

We just shipping ANYTHING

[twin dragon]

hornet x needle phial

drugs

[twilit crest]

Damn people will ship ANYTHING these days

[jaunty brook]

Phantom x death in battle

[edgy nebula]

phantom x phantom gender discourse

[jaunty brook]

🤔

[spark valve]

silksong fans speedrunning every single shitty fandom trope

[twilit crest]

Crackshipping daughter or pilby murder fic writer son

[sinful nimbus]

Girl Phantom x Enby Phantom

[jaunty brook]

I wonder if people ship phantom and hornet

[jaunty brook]

Isnt this like

Selfcest

[sinful nimbus]

we have NO good popular queer ships its heartbreaking

[twilit crest]

That’s not the worst idea

[jaunty brook]

Sheo and nailmaster has NO rep

[foggy fractal]

🤔

[twilit crest]

Shakra Hornet is super popular wdym

[frosty gate]

COLLECT MY PRONOUNS

[sinful nimbus]

I don't fw shaknet sorry

[jaunty brook]

I saw some art about hornet wielding phantoms mask to her face

[twilit crest]

You don’t have to

[jaunty brook]

And it made me ponder

[sinful nimbus]

Second Sentinel x Hornet is ok though

but idk if that's queer

[frosty gate]

I like em at all

[jaunty brook]

Thats a niche ship

[edgy nebula]

i wouldnt consider it queer

[frosty gate]

They're so good

Not the best

[jaunty brook]

I narely see any of that

[twilit crest]

What’s wrong with shakra hornet

Hornkra

[jaunty brook]

First sinner x last judge

[limpid summit]

The only canon gay couple in SS sucks 💔

Bum inclusivity

[jaunty brook]

They do nothing

And die

[edgy nebula]

is it even really a gay couple anymore his husband is desd

it’s a gay guy

[twilit crest]

Is a widow no longer married

[sinful nimbus]

Green Prince is okay storywise but its not really a ship since the other character doesn't really have anything

[frosty gate]

Gay people can't live a Happy life, TC confirms

[spark valve]

tc burying their gays 😔

[jaunty brook]

speed trying not to laugh gif

[limpid summit]

Say that again

[twilit crest]

That again

[edgy nebula]

married to the pins in her back maybe

[jaunty brook]

💔

Here's something to try

Second Sentinel x twelfth architect

[twilit crest]

But yeah idk the dynamic between shakra and Hornet while not the most romantic is still great

[jaunty brook]

Not sure about that

[twilit crest]

You can assume they’re best pals if you don’t wanna ship

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet is a bad person she doesn't deserve Shakra

[jaunty brook]

Mapper x buyer dynamic

[limpid summit]

Architects created the sentinels right

That one’s eh

[jaunty brook]

Hornet is evil

[frosty gate]

Me x Twelfth Srchitectv

[twilit crest]

I’ve been on dates with people who come to my job. Big whoop

[frosty gate]

Me x Phantom

[jaunty brook]

No

[frosty gate]

🥀

[foggy fractal]

then who does?

[sinful nimbus]

Second Sentinel

[frosty gate]

Star does

[jaunty brook]

What makes HER bad

[sinful nimbus]

How dare

[twilit crest]

Maybe Shakra likes em bad who knows

[jaunty brook]

Shakra would want another warrior

[edgy nebula]

liking em bad is different to liking em evil

[sinful nimbus]

Part of its job was to capture slaves for the Citadel

[jaunty brook]

Unlike isadela

[jaunty brook]

Oh

[twilit crest]

Plus, when has canonicity ever stopped a crackshipper

[jaunty brook]

You want a crackship?

Garmond x the bar guy

Creige

[sinful nimbus]

I can't enjoy a ship if its not canonically viable

That's why Soul Master x Emilitia is the best one

[edgy nebula]

ive seen ckk x karm alot

[jaunty brook]

Soulmaster and Who?

[twilit crest]

This got a lil flavour to it.

[edgy nebula]

they dont make sense together at all imo

[sinful nimbus]

The crazy flower lady in City of Tears

[jaunty brook]

The laughing one?

[light mauve]

Wdym

[twin dragon]

A lobotomite mass murdering maniac versus some crazy lady

yeah its viable

[twilit crest]

I see it. Royal wedding. Betrothed at the behest of two rival nations, maybe they don’t like each other, maybe they even have to leave their true loved ones behind for the farce. It’s classic yearning.

Tc give me a pen

[jaunty brook]

Hemgol x dryya

Crackship 2

[sinful nimbus]

Emilitia is a bad person too

[jaunty brook]

What did she do

[sinful nimbus]

She'd probably be complicit in the mass murders

[limpid summit]

Star this is a bad sign

Shipping the GOAT SM with a nobody

[twin dragon]

i don't think you uh realize

how much of a gap there is

[sinful nimbus]

'I'll outlive you too little grub, as I did all the others' 🥀

[twin dragon]

robber and genocidal maniac gap

[warm tide]

Twelfth Architect x Second Sentinel - Hornet as a semi third-wheel? "Cogs don't shed tears, it rust"

[twilit crest]

Crazy man vs crazy lady. Doesn’t sound too far fetched

[sinful nimbus]

She's a crazy narcissist she also got cast out by her neighbors

[foggy fractal]

speaking of soul master

[jaunty brook]

Broken vessel x infection balloons

[foggy fractal]

does he have aura

[jaunty brook]

It smells worse thay dung defender

[sinful nimbus]

Also they have matching outfits btw

[twin dragon]

Unhappy and miserable ass old fart vs genocidal lifeforce addicat that's also lobotomized by an angry god

[edgy nebula]

royal weddings are lame, if it isnt true love i dont want it

[sinful nimbus]

Their personalities would mesh

[jaunty brook]

Emilita x bell hermit

[sinful nimbus]

But they'd eventually start secretly hating eachother and then there would be drama over Emilitia liking PK

[twin dragon]

soul master's quite literally an evil genius

[sinful nimbus]

Absolute cinema

"genius"

[limpid summit]

Does Emilitia scale above Greyroot

[twilit crest]

A loving relationship that doesn’t spawn from any circumstance isn’t compelling. I’m cooking here get out of the kitchen.

[sinful nimbus]

Soul Master is a moron 🥀

[warm tide]

what if i want to do the opposite of shipping?

what if i want to seperate the two gay princes 🤔 what would that process be called

[twin dragon]

what would emilita even be interested in

[twilit crest]

Homophobia perhaps

[jaunty brook]

Greyroot x white lady has nothing to go off of except the fact they are plantlike

[edgy nebula]

landing

[warm tide]

fair enough

[twin dragon]

Evil genius-like, he got nowhere

[foggy fractal]

who isn't tbf

[limpid summit]

Soul Master isn’t stupid

He just wanted to try out the scientific method

[twilit crest]

On himself

[jaunty brook]

Lurien x kings idol

[edgy nebula]

then explain why groal did what he did but better

[twin dragon]

Pale king's also hella dumb

[jaunty brook]

Soul master x the lifeblood scientist

[twilit crest]

More like desperate

[twin dragon]

n dumb

[edgy nebula]

lurien x his lover whose never mentiojed ingame

[twin dragon]

oh yeah let me usurp a bunch of gods i'd win

[jaunty brook]

He had a lover?

[twilit crest]

“Good work son—aw DAMN it”

[edgy nebula]

iirc yes

[jaunty brook]

Also

How young is sherma

He's like a toddler right?

[foggy fractal]

we don't know

[sinful nimbus]

Bell Hermit

[foggy fractal]

we have no ages for anyone

[jaunty brook]

Hornet is just ancient

[edgy nebula]

https://www.reddit.com/r/HollowKnight/comments/audrcm/who_do_you_think_lurien_was_in_a_relationship_with/

[twilit crest]

Idk about ancient but she’s pretty old

[jaunty brook]

She spent 7 years walking to pharloom

[twilit crest]

Hornet is basically a vampire when it comes to age

[jaunty brook]

In a cage

[warm tide]

What about a love who spends a thousand years apart? Only to be together a day.

Better yet. What about a love who spends a thousand years apart? And the other can never find the final piece to complete them?

Better yet. What about a robot, made with passion and the ignite of an ever-burning love? Yet the robot never understands to love?

Better yet. What about a love who spends a thousand years apart? No they don't be together, the robot finished itself and continue to rust as it rest aside the long decayed corpse

Better yet. What about a love who spans a thousand years apart? One's love of passion yet regret to never be whole, and one's love of regret with its only passion is to have its only lover stay close?

[jaunty brook]

What about

Yarnaby x

30 to life

[twilit crest]

Holy shit two cakes

[limpid summit]

Groal did NOT do what he did better

SM actually handles soul better

He can teleport and move quickly despite being bloated

Groal can barely fly

[warm tide]

two cakes...?

[edgy nebula]

thats cause he misuses it

he’s bloated because of how much he does allat

groal isnt

[whole holly]

both Soul Master and Groal are bloated, Soul Master is superior in every way

[edgy nebula]

groal isnt

well, he probably is, but it isnt from soul

it’s from bile

[whole holly]

no Stilkin are like that, Groal is bloated and only explanation is soul, because that's the major difference

what would happened if Hornet Binded Soul Master, would she gain new Crest or Silk Skill?

[jaunty brook]

Do you think the thk's shade is just chilling in the void now

[whole holly]

yeah

[jaunty brook]

I wish we saw them in sister of the void

[whole holly]

it is okay he is somewhere but in some endings he is dead, like all shades he likely descended down

[twin dragon]

Maybe it follows up from dnm but eh

also it could not follow TK due to him having a will of his own

[jaunty brook]

The knight dies

Wait wait

[whole holly]

would his shell make him independent?

[jaunty brook]

So when the vessel gets taken by radiance

They lost the shade?

[twin dragon]

I mean if sotv follows dnm

He has a will of his own, not needing voidheart's guidance

[whole holly]

SoTV is ambiguous but if it does follow DNM it makes sense why THK isn't there

[whole holly]

yeah but all siblings do though

[twin dragon]

siblings are willless

[whole holly]

Fragment of lingering will

[twin dragon]

They have barely any

I think that's enough for them to be under the guidance of the voidheart

[whole holly]

how can we quantify to say that?

it is easier to say that THK is independent because he is alive

[twin dragon]

Because it is uh

stated as such??

[whole holly]

really, just because they are fragment it doesn't matter, they still have will even if it is Fragment

[twin dragon]

Vessels are already hollowed out when born

the siblings have already decayed and became part of the void thingy

even though the void seems to encompass a few things

Plus THK has some sort of autonomous agency in the radiance fight

[narrow horizon]

THK is still alive, unlike the siblings

In EtV, THK is even moving freely from the black egg temple without the infection

[twin dragon]

"Alive"

His outta his shell

[narrow horizon]

In DNM yeah

[twin dragon]

yeah

[narrow horizon]

but in EtV you can see it moving freely, in it's shell, without the infection

it is alive

[twilit crest]

Thk is alive and ghost isn’t? That doesn’t sound right

[narrow horizon]

I didn't say that lol

[twilit crest]

Rlly makes you fink…

[whole holly]

Do you guys think that Cursed Ending results in Higher Being?

[limpid summit]

The bud?

I think that’s how it’s framed

I guess we don’t really have a frame of reference for anything after

But probably

[whole holly]

Some think that it is not pale or higher being which I can’t understand why, I hope Twisted Child turns out to be better than GMS and Racist/Casteist hornet

[twin dragon]

it won't dw

[whole holly]

It will, Pale Parasite will be like Shade Lord but kind and gracious, and transcend biological limitations of being parasite

[twin dragon]

Uh

No

roided greyroot

[whole holly]

well greyroot isn’t evil just trying to propagate, but All that power will sustain her

[edgy nebula]

she's a witch she's probably pretty evil

[whole holly]

She is good witch and rewards hornet, but even she has to be reborn, hornet pretty much consents and she is racist anyways

It’s like saying Grimm ritual is evil but they go to dead kingdoms and hornet consented to ritual

[gentle aspen]

well it’s not really the same
Grimm Troupe doesn’t detriment anyone

[twin dragon]

Hornet plays the saviour doe

[gentle aspen]

Greyroot detriments the ritual aid

[limpid summit]

Greyroot’s propagation does depend on the life of another bug while NMH is sort of feeding off scraps

[twin dragon]

thats a big difference

[whole holly]

She dooms everyone in main ending and act 3

[whole holly]

For pilgrims cursed endings is best because greyroot ascends and is most likely immortal

[twin dragon]

that's lace

and uh shamans decided to make it flashier

weaver queen is ambiguous

[twin dragon]

She's gonna suck the lifeforce out of EVERYTHING

maybe

[whole holly]

Lace and Shamans are symptom of GMS

[twin dragon]

i'd expect that happening

[whole holly]

I wouldn’t not after you consume pale being

[twin dragon]

what makes you think that that thing has a satiable hunger

[whole holly]

GMS had to be fed to void to die and parasite is better choice

[twin dragon]

parasite's worse for basically everyone in the verse

you now have a life sucking god parasite

congrats