sk-lore

[edgy nebula]

atleast tell us summin

[silk dirge]

one day we will break into tcs office and find the lore vault

with answers to questions such as:
-what happened to karak?
-why is hornet racist?
-was the knight just aura farming in sotv?

[warm elm]

It was because the citadel needed to power a lightspeed motorcycle to reach zote land (the place all higher beings are born at)

At hollow knight 3 we take the place of a random choral bug having to fight normal enemies that deal 3 damage and apply maggots

[silk dirge]

grand reed game 🗣️

ok tbh a fan game where you are a pilgrim could be interesting

like a pilby fan game or something like that

[warm elm]

Sherma as a protagonist could work i think

[silk dirge]

it could

pilby we dont see after pilgrims rest tho

so it would be more interesting imo

sherma we see his story arc a lot

but it would be an interesting game to have you start off in bone bottom as pilby and make it all the way to songclave

[warm elm]

He is a pacifist but that means nothing when his bells are stolen by Big aunt Grubfly and then by Big aspid that shoots lava

[silk dirge]

all pilgrims are

[unique canopy]

Sherma protag would be "what if TC made an Undertale fangame"

[silk dirge]

but sherma would not stand a chance against mucked beastfly

im sorry

its not happening

[warm elm]

Yeah it actually would be pretty nice, it probably would have a very different style of gameplay as pilby is not a fighter as we can see in game, maybe a dodge focused combat

[silk dirge]

yeah

[warm elm]

Mucked beastfly is enough to pack all of pharloom no diff

[silk dirge]

hornet could take it down

no one else tho

[warm elm]

Imagine hollow knight silksong but bilewater grows bigger after every silk skill and ancient art unlocked

[lone folio]

Knight

[warm elm]

Maybe a mod that makes all water maggot water, and make maggot water deal damage, and make every enemy apply maggots

Hmm

[unique canopy]

Go full completionist and the bile infects the void instead of the other way around

[warm elm]

Diseased lace final boss

Actually that is cool holdon

[silk dirge]

mucked lace

[warm elm]

One very sturdy kingsmould

[lone folio]

"act 4: Muck and Grime. The corpses littering the kingdom have allowed the muck maggots to reproduce uncontrollably and have taken over most of pharloom. Your job is to exterminate them and kill their queen."

[silk dirge]

grand mother muck

[lone folio]

Mucked lace

[warm elm]

Groal revives

In the abyss now

Groal, the greedy one

[silk dirge]

lost groal

[unique canopy]

Grand Mucky Groal

[warm elm]

What about the karak sea getting restored and now the water is all maggot water and you gotta fight khans 3 gauntlets (now 6) with no ground to step on and constant maggot water that threatens to drown hornet in maggots

And the reward for doing this is a frail rosary string

[silk dirge]

peak

[warm elm]

Fluke NPCs appear at pharloom and help you become the true maggot queen

[unique canopy]

Blue tool that converts your silk into rosaries.
(you have no use for rosaries at this point)

[silk dirge]

why cant hornet string rosaries herself

[lean temple]

Same reason why Kratos can't break open a wooden chest. Game mechanics

[warm elm]

She doesn't know how to count very well so she just hands money to people not knowing if its enough to buy something or not

[lone folio]

Hornet is just bad at making necklaces

[warm elm]

Also she did not learn how to make a knot

[lone folio]

She never had any friends so she never learned how to make bestie bracelets

[warm elm]

Sad story

[lone folio]

She was a bit too racist and no kid in the kindergarten wanted to talk to her

[warm elm]

Her only friends where buzzsaws

[warm elm]

The kindergarten had only 🪰 (she always hated them)

[lone folio]

Maybe a husk or two

[warm elm]

I sent the emoji because I don't know how to correctly type the collective of flie

Its just flies

?

Someone corrected me before on this but I don't remember

[lethal burrow]

those are valid things to make assumptions off of. I'd say no need to be so dismissive.

[silk dirge]

have you seen how the wiki describes hornet being racist

its really funny

[warm elm]

I have not lol, will look onto it later

[lethal burrow]

About as convincing as people saying she's from the city of steel

Although I guess, ironically, this actually has more evidence going for it

[warm elm]

Ppl

Now talking in all seriousness

[silk dirge]

"instinctive disgust" 😭

[warm elm]

Thats some next level racism haha

Actually thinking

She is part weaver

Spiders love eating random flying bugs

But i think she just had a bad experience with one and since then she always looks down on flies lol

Maybe the sin the flies of the slab committed against the citadel was to simply exist in the same planet as them, seeing how they would punish for anything and call it a sin it's not that far off

[silk dirge]

maybe sly did something to hornet

[lethal burrow]

except she can get the journal entries without getting kidnapped

[warm elm]

Yeah yeah, i meant in a flie back in hollownest or something

[unique canopy]

Fly singular, flies plural.

Fries if you're hungry

[warm elm]

Ok thanks

[sinful nimbus]

wiki just making stuff up to make her look better 🥀

[silk dirge]

are aspids flies

maybe she had a bad encounter in ke

[silk dirge]

its also really funny this is in the trivia section with that wording lmao

[unique canopy]

iunno, makes her look worse to me since it's admitting the disgust has no rational basis to it

[warm elm]

An aspid spit in her face when she was a kid, so she now takes her revenge out on every singular enemy that buzzes (except bees, she likes those)

[sinful nimbus]

Well none of the cited texts have any rational basis regardless

[foggy fractal]

hey guys

[warm elm]

Maybe hornet is just a og cod player

[warm elm]

Hello

[lean temple]

What page is that?

[unique canopy]

Hornet's own page on Silksong side of the wiki

[lean temple]

I'll check it out thanks

[visual glacier]

Hornet (Silksong)

[visual glacier]

It’s accurate

[craggy smelt]

hornet is a spider
the slabflies are flies
spiders and flies don't get along
that is the joke
if you put any more thought into it than that, you're over-thinking it

[gleaming pivot]

Jesus died on the cross so you can live forever

[visual glacier]

Ok

What does that have to do with silksong lore

[foggy fractal]

there's gotta be a bug jesus then

[lyric widget]

it's fine I changed it

[visual glacier]

It’s still accurate but whatever

[unique canopy]

I'll just headcanon that the slabflies are Pharloom's version of the Westboro Baptist Church, therefore all disgust is entirely rational

[visual glacier]

Even though they are an entire race put into slavery

Wow

[craggy smelt]

it's funny, like with the maggots in Hallownest

[sinful nimbus]

Well slabflies are portrayed a bit differently then maggots and it undermines most of their lore along with Hornet's for her to be overtly racist to them

Hunter isn't a great dude and no one is reading the maggot entry and going "Wow based" but many people are constantly defending Hornet's entries because like no duh we're expected to agree with her

[craggy smelt]

they're overthinking it

[sinful nimbus]

Not really it's pretty painfully obvious on a first read that the entries are kinda messed up

Team Cherry just didn't think of it

[craggy smelt]

they didn't overthink of it

[sinful nimbus]

Its not overthinking to read Hornet saying she doesn't feel bad for the slaves and think that's kinda messed up

Or saying they should stop breeding which if you think about it for more than 5 seconds is eugenics

[craggy smelt]

.

[sinful nimbus]

I know about the "joke" I'm criticizing it for being messed up

[visual glacier]

It’s not bad to like a flawed character

[sinful nimbus]

Its moronic at best to put slaves in your game and to treat them as actually evil

[ornate pier]

Gng what ever happened to nuance

[sinful nimbus]

Also Hornet's relationship with the flies isn't that of a predator/prey one

[visual glacier]

It’s not bad to create a flawed main character

[ornate pier]

I don't even necessarily agree with star but people should be allowed to analyse this

[sinful nimbus]

The game doesn't challenge Hornet's beliefs regarding this issue at all

[spark valve]

the narrative doesn't treat it as a flaw

[edgy nebula]

it isnt treated as a flaw, she doesnt overcome it, she's just racist'

[visual glacier]

That’s because the reader is supposed to figure that out

[sinful nimbus]

Are we

[visual glacier]

Yeah

[sinful nimbus]

The game consistently shows them as gross and plays heroic music when you beat them up because you are supposed to dislike them

And just making Hornet racist for funsies doesn't add to the narrative at all and frankly detracts from it so I have a hard time believing that is intentional

Its garbage framing at best

[foggy fractal]

all roads lead back to Slabfly entries discourse

[unique canopy]

The overall vagueness of the timeline makes everything more nebulous than it might seem. The Slab having the original stone architecture (which isn't by itself proof since there's no reason to gild a Citadel) and the dead choristers and choir pilgrims in the entrance implies that at some point the Slab just closed itself off from the Citadel at large. This might be backed up by Green Prince being imprisoned in Sinner's Road instead of in the Slab, even though Wardenflies are all over the place. So this leaves open the possibility that, obviously before the Haunting, the slabflies chose to close themselves off but just keep on doing what they were doing even though nobody would've been forcing them to.

Not saying that's definitively what happened, but it is a possibility with how vague the timeline is.

[visual glacier]

I’m confused why people are so upset about this cause hornet has always been racist

[sinful nimbus]

Doesn't really change anything when they are explicitly slaves and obviously brainwashed

[sinful nimbus]

No she hasn't

[visual glacier]

Vessels

[sinful nimbus]

She says she feels pity for them

And she doesn't hate them at all

She's killing them because she HAS to to protect Hallownest

[unique canopy]

Are you really a slave if nobody's holding your chains but yourself? Nobody from the Citadel was enforcing anything upon them, the closest thing to an authority figure was the Broodmother who only cared about reproducing.

[sinful nimbus]

Its said that scabflies are born into servitude so yes

[spark valve]

they are slaves yes

and prisoners

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet literally says she doesn't feel bad for the child slaves dawg

It is not that deep

[unique canopy]

Slaves to whom though? Not the Citadel.

[spark valve]

yes to the citadel

[sinful nimbus]

Not that it would be okay if it wasn't to them anyway

[unique canopy]

Again, there's evidence that they closed themselves off to the Citadel

[sinful nimbus]

???

[spark valve]

oh you're just like making shit up ok

[visual glacier]

They are literally citadel slaves

[visual glacier]

Didn’t read old petinent dialogue award

[sinful nimbus]

How do the corpses imply they sealed themselves off dawg

They're literally actively roaming Pharloom working for the Citadel

[foggy fractal]

instead of star shape its citadel shape

[muted lantern]

starpengus beloved slabfly discourse returns once more

[sinful nimbus]

It never left

[lethal burrow]

They get paid more than under workers at least

[lethal burrow]

The missing context is that this has been talked to death and it's been months since I've seen a single new thing that about the topic

if somebody wants to present something new we will be waiting

[ornate pier]

No evidence for ts but it is interesting that they do this because they believe they are sinful

[spark valve]

it's almost like it's a commentary on religion as an instrument of social control

[sinful nimbus]

Scabflies don't get paid at all and those are the ones Hornet says she doesn't feel bad for

[ornate pier]

Because the citadel is DEAD by now.

[lethal burrow]

(star cartoonishly chopping down all the signs pointing to other roads in the background )

[foggy fractal]

is she evil ?

[muted lantern]

Child labor...

[ornate pier]

Don't they drop rosaries I forgot

[silk dirge]

oh no

[sinful nimbus]

Other flies do they don't

[silk dirge]

slabfly discussion

[edgy nebula]

we should try to find more evidence for the karak timeline

[sinful nimbus]

Regardless getting rewarded with propaganda currency you can't spend on much of anything is

[lethal burrow]

Good luck with that

there was the stone civilization, and then they were existing, and then the citadel did their thingy and then the rest is history

[scenic shuttle]

Stone civilization is crazy

[foggy fractal]

Star painting over the signs so people always go towards Rome

[edgy nebula]

damn you weavers!

[muted lantern]

then theres stoner civilization, population: moss druid

[lethal burrow]

It does not make any sense

(they are also in wisp ticket by the way)

[scenic shuttle]

Ah the stone edifices?

[visual glacier]

Citadel of stone

[lethal burrow]

And the columns

[lethal burrow]

except for the karak architecture built on top of crumbled pillars

[muted lantern]

this is citadel architecture no? the statues all carry the plates that we deposit rosaries into for benches and stuff.

[lethal burrow]

The top middle image requires your attention

notice, karakian architecture built on top of it

[muted lantern]

interesting

I wonder why the parralel of the plates then

[edgy nebula]

yeah citadel had nothng to do with karak so alla that was 100% before the citadel

[muted lantern]

did the citadel take inspiration maybe?

[edgy nebula]

maybe it's void civilization or something

[lethal burrow]

But it also looks different from that

[ornate pier]

What about the crustcrags!

[edgy nebula]

https://tenor.com/view/skeleton-running-past-gif-3044631603201692058

[scenic shuttle]

And that one single citadel room on the edge of the sands of Karan

[lethal burrow]

Also the balcony under the slab

[foggy fractal]

must've been the wind ahh skeleton

[edgy nebula]

tbf that could just be the citadel trying to expand and then the coral expanding and ruining their plans

[muted lantern]

Oh chirst do we have another ancient civilization or are they the same?

[visual glacier]

They both make arcane eggs

Prob the same

[edgy nebula]

we know the coral still grows considering the weird pearl things, thats what im betting the slab and citadel stuff was

the damning evidence is the crustcrags

[muted lantern]

the arcane egg room is the same architecture?

I thought that was just an ancient civ room

[visual glacier]

Oh do you mean 2 ancient civs from pharloom?

[muted lantern]

talking about the stone guys mentioned above, if they are the same as hallownest ancient civ

[lethal burrow]

I forget what those are again

[muted lantern]

or a new lost civilization

[edgy nebula]

big crustcrawlers in the memorium

they also have unique needolin dialogue which mentions the river

[lethal burrow]

oh.... we need to examine shaman dialogue very closely

[edgy nebula]

?

[lethal burrow]

I wanna know if there's any possible interpretation where the big four lasted sometime after conductors

[visual glacier]

Probably? The timeline is confusing

[muted lantern]

doesnt ckk's corpses needolin dialogue imply he was fighting against gms not the citadel?

[edgy nebula]

maaaaybe

[visual glacier]

We have ancient civ, old hearts era, citadel of stone, gilded citadel, current day, ect

[muted lantern]

something about a pale light no? i don't remember the specifics

[edgy nebula]

but we dont see any corpses so we dont really have a clue, im pretty sure he died during the stone citadel era though, or maybe before that

[craggy smelt]

that's right, needolin dialogue in coral tower

Alone... against the pale light...

[lethal burrow]

maybe karak was fighting the citadel since the times of stone up until sometime in the conductor era. And they were just holding out for such a long time.

[edgy nebula]

possibly yeah

[craggy smelt]

though, they could have been fighting citadel forces and just have been aware that a pale being was behind it all ultimately

[edgy nebula]

i dont think the citadel took their water though, that im pretty sure of

[viscid ridge]

I think khann was probably at odds with GMS herself before the citidel or any other of the other hearts were with the weavers. We do get some indication that the coral kingdom seems to be much more primordial than the other bugs, and we knew khann controlled half of pharloom at one point, which probably wasn't good for a pale being wanting to establish a kingdom.

[river yarrow]

just finished the act 3 boss.
so apparently, it turns out, the last Pantheon 5 ending is the canon one? because the HK hero become the 8 eyes void in that ending clip?

[visual glacier]

Wow this confirms that pale king was in pharloom

[craggy smelt]

he and WL are the only pale beings, retcon retcon

[viscid ridge]

Not necessarily, Dream no More is most likely the canon ending, but its up to interpretation of which ending you like i gues

[craggy smelt]

we won't know for sure until THK shows up somehow

[edgy nebula]

i think none of the endings are real and hornet was just in a coma because she hit her head 10 years ago

[river yarrow]

yeah I actually prefer that one :(, but the problem is, the hero doesn't turn into shade lord on that ending, right? he only become that thing when fighting the absolute radiance? or I misunderstood something

[viscid ridge]

I think Dream no More is supposed to be the canon ending (even if team cherry won't admit it themselves). It perfectly encapsulates the story and characters of Hallownest, and is a fitting end for the mc, the hollow knight and the rest of the vessels. Godhome ending is in a league of its own. I see it personally more as a alternate universe.

[viscid ridge]

The same could be said about all the shades being in the ending, which wasn't in the godhome ending.

You also have to remember we do not know a lot about the shade lord still, like if the shade lord is exclusive to the knight, or if it is something that has existed in the void already

[plain gazelle]

the actual in-game name for that form is just "Void Given Focus". you can pretty easily headcanon that Hornet being in danger is giving the knight enough focus to briefly assume that form.

[river yarrow]

isn't in that ending, all of the shades are just chilling in the abyss, but they just don't show us? because since it's in the pantheon world, abyss is not affected?

[craggy smelt]

it's ambiguous, since you only see siblings and the VGF flash briefly, while TK is mostly in their 'Void Given Form' state
the appearance of VGF might be an allusion to what TK is capable of

[viscid ridge]

Probably but i think focus refers more to the void taking on a singular identity or something. Its still not fully understood

[river yarrow]

ah yeah that make sense, I can use this logic

[plain gazelle]

yeah, i think it's pretty intentionally set up to be ambiguous exactly so that there is no "canon" ending

[viscid ridge]

The dream no more is also in a dream world, so i cant see why the vessels wouldn't join us there?

[primal linden]

Why was oni not reanimated like the two me thh dealers in sk

[viscid ridge]

What?

[visual glacier]

???

[plain gazelle]

"why was joni not reanimated like the xylotol and zango"

[primal linden]

The guy who gives you the lifeblood injecter

[visual glacier]

Ohh

[craggy smelt]

though that was another game's lore for a second

[primal linden]

Mb

[visual glacier]

Probably because she took it at a steady rate instead of all at a time

[craggy smelt]

the lifeblood progression in Hallownest doesn't seem as bad as the one in Wormways

[visual glacier]

Either that or retcon

[primal linden]

What are those names

[viscid ridge]

She probably was, but subsequently killed? We know lifeblood was taboo, and hornet mentions there were efforts to get rid of it

So maybe the pale king ordered her to be completely killed

[craggy smelt]

maybe Joni hadn't reached saturation like Zylotol did
and probably wasn't experimenting with it, just taking it

[primal linden]

Has anyone else noticed how groal is bloated like the soul tyrant

[plain gazelle]

yeah lifeblood needs to get pretty established before it can start zombifying people and hallownest explicitly tried to stop lifeblood from spreading

[viscid ridge]

Groal shares a lot of similarities with the soul sanctum bugs, its very interesting

[primal linden]

The corpses from excess soul consumption could be in the water, which the maggots feed off of

[viscid ridge]

Like they have the same frog like design, four legs on the bottom

[craggy smelt]

groal and soul master are brothers
(not really)

groal is very much meant to evoke sm though

[viscid ridge]

We do see a ton of citidel corpses right under the arena tho

[craggy smelt]

dirty swamp hillbilly soul sanctum

[viscid ridge]

I personally think the reason the lifeblood is not spreading in hallownest has something to do with that lifeblood abyss room

[primal linden]

Void's success in containing lifeblood could explain why the pale king wanted to use it against the radiance

[craggy smelt]

interesting thought

[viscid ridge]

Like its a similar process to trapping the radiance in the hollow knight, the pale king trapped the source of the lifeblood down in the abyss or something

[viscid ridge]

Yeah exactly my thoughts

[craggy smelt]

I lean towards the idea that since the Infection is so widespread, Lifeblood isn't able to find as many hosts or spread as easily

[primal linden]

It could also be why the vessels were imperfect, the lifeblood disrupted the process

[viscid ridge]

I doubt it, i think the reasons why its not widespread is because the pale king did a good job at keeping it from spreading

[viscid ridge]

I doubt it

[muted lantern]

the infection only needs the vector of dreams, so it can strike anywhere and spread undetected, it cant be contained

[river yarrow]

oh and about this ending. once again, they don't show us about Pharloom condition after the lace ending, but since the achievement description include "free Pharloom", they should be fine, right

[craggy smelt]

maybe in his day sure, but he's been gone for ages, and there's only a handful of cocoons scattered around

[plain gazelle]

yeah, if lifeblood is controlled by a higher being, it could be it favors biding its time until there's no other higher being around to keep it in check. hence why it sprouts rapidly in pharloom as soon as GMS goes down

[muted lantern]

lifeblood functions more as an environmental contaminant, spreading through creatures and plants infected being eaten by others, spreading and saturating the environment.

[viscid ridge]

Yeah but i doubt its because of the infection, i think its because whatever pale king did to limit it worked very effectively. But honestly its all speculation so game is game

[craggy smelt]

I feel like in the Wormways, it just reached a saturation point much faster because Zylotol and Zango were actively spreading it and injecting it into beasts

[viscid ridge]

Naturally it probably takes longer

[primal linden]

One of lifeblood's traits is that is capable of "false life" reanimation. The void attempts to consume the traits of anything it finds, which could be why "wills" could be imprinted on it, due to its maliablity . With so much lifeblood right above the abyss, it seems potentially plausable that it affected the void in some way

[viscid ridge]

How does those 2 connect in any way might i ask?

[primal linden]

The vessels are unborn children infected (or killed) by the void. Something capable of being reanimated

[viscid ridge]

Yeah but how does lifeblood make them inperfect vessels? It seems more likely it was due to some emotional factor

I still dont really see how lifeblood of all things would have any effect on void

[primal linden]

I meant that it couldve been absorbed by void, and that couldve transfered to the vessels, making them imperfect by making them more "alive" than intended

[muted lantern]

I wonder how many other entrances to the citadel exist, with those bridges in the background, is one of them the bridge to the slab?

[craggy smelt]

be careful Hornet, you only have one mask left

[primal linden]

The void absorbs other concepts, things, or bugs all the time, like the radiance, grandmother silk and all of the haunted bugs, the vessels, ect

Lifeblood right next to it would likely be absorbed as well

To at least some degree

[floral venture]

I'm personally very interested in how plasmium seems to make its host really like it

[visual glacier]

It’s addictive

Just like most drugs

[craggy smelt]

it's really, really great

I mean it

[primal linden]

Sure pal

[floral venture]

Understandable

[visual glacier]

Better than flea brew at least

Plasmium manufacturerers aren’t racist

[craggy smelt]

plasmium is for everybody

[visual glacier]

https://tenor.com/view/hollow-knight-gif-10811960779673220362

[heavy needle]

I love the drugs that slowly poison me called plasmium I can tank so many hits when I wanna fight them…. (Beastfly) also the said drug is plasmium also flea brew is healthier fresh made and is also environment friendly so I always prefer the non infecting drink in silksong

Also what would happen if you drank lifeblood?

[muted lantern]

Also, im pretty sure cogwork dancers have no silkflies, at least how i remember their death anim

could they have used a different process to infuse soul into a cogwork?

[primal linden]

The soul in them is supposedly spit into two, and splitting souls is a factor only mentioned for them, so its likely

[plain gazelle]

the conductors could also be souls transferred into robots, depending on how you read their last edict

[unique canopy]

Not hypothetically impossible, but it would require an explanation for why they need a drip-feed silk IV to barely stay alive, since it wouldn't maintain their robotic frames.

[elfin minnow]

Why is widow called widow

[unique canopy]

Spider

[elfin minnow]

Oh its a type of spider

You know it would fit the double pun if widow had a deceased husband

[unique canopy]

The reason why the Latrodectus family are called widow spiders is because the females eat their mates

[craggy smelt]

we don't know that she doesn't
but yeah, it's probably the spider thing

[sinful nimbus]

So that's why weavers have trouble breeding

[plain gazelle]

Yeah, it would mean their robot form is powered by/relies on silk, which is a bit redundant when we already know that silk infusion gives regular bugs immortality. But it would explain why team cherry is kind of coy about showing us what conductors actually look like, and I think the last edict is worded kind of strangely if all it's referring to is the cogwork core (and I don't know what else it would be talking about)

reference:
"And lo, is eternity sustained. By Architect's claw, we welcome that final form, of dial and rotor, and soul gladly given. The perfect, unfaltering voice."

[unique canopy]

Warded by fear,
No longer your meal.

[ornate pier]

It's definitely referring to the cogwork core

[muted lantern]

whats this being stored in the whiteward? just different types of pins, injectors, and other "medical" equipment?

[ornate pier]

I mean sherma got medicine from there so

Actually he says healing supplies which is more vague

[frigid belfry]

essentially other "healing supplie", medicine, vials, who knows

[visual glacier]

Blood samples or something idk

[muted lantern]

also, for any of you herrah drapemite truthers, apparantly drapemites don't have natural cloaks at all, their description seems to imply they just wear the cloth thats laid all over the citadel.

[frigid belfry]

most of their reasoning comes from the different in body structure and head shape

i just think herrah looks different due to birth

[muted lantern]

Oh i know, im just putting another small note because i remember weavers not having natural cloaks being a point of contention about the theory

[frigid belfry]

• having her natural weaver mask removed similar to widow

[graceful flicker]

Well Herrah likes to respect where she came from :) (I personally believe the whole herrah thing is just team cherry making a retcon + the whole birth thing. It's also possible that team cherry doesn't care about consistency and just lets us figure it out)

[muted lantern]

if she's a drapemite she wouldnt have a natural mask probably

[river yarrow]

since hornet is survive this time...will she go to somewhere else again, or we will get another main character next time? lace maybe

[muted lantern]

it can be both a retcon and something explained retroactively post retcon

[visual glacier]

If we get another hk game it doesn’t have to be after silksong

[muted lantern]

ie it can be a retcon and also still make sense in the new continuity

honestly the best points for herrah drapmite are the horns and the similar inconsistency of the amount of legs upon them, both have 6 in some sprites and 8 in others iirc

The large drapemite while it's sprite in the hunters journal only shows six legs, it has 8 in most other sprites.

It's been a while since i checked but I remember herrah having the same inconsistency

yeah, bugs having less than their intended legs is pretty common, however its rare we see bugs with more than the intended amount

so i imagine drapmite having 8 is on purpose

[graceful flicker]

Maybe all weavers have 8 or so legs but just don't choose to use all of them all of the time

for some reason

[muted lantern]

it more corroborates the idea that drapmites are too arachnids

and the similar appearance is why people think herrahs one

all mites are arachnids irl, but thats not neccesarily true in silksong, due to there being some mites who clearly are not.

[blissful harbor]

first sinner has sprites with six legs from the bottom?
most i can see she has 4 legs and 2 sets of arms

when she fully stands up in thst cutscene, she only has 4 legs again
i think those are arms being stretched into…wherever the fuck she keeps them

the real answer is weaver biology is cursed and weird

[craggy smelt]

they fold up real small

[muted lantern]

im curious about these benches, this one and the one chained behind it are the only ones i can recall seeing that look like this, are they something specifically built to accomodate the architect? like a recharge station?

[verbal rune]

idk

im pretty sure also they are only seen there

it cant be a seat for them ngl

because their tail would get blocked

and if they want to use the hole in the chair they would have to prob stand up anyways

[craggy smelt]

damn girl

[verbal rune]

also i dont see why they would need rest because they are a robot

idk they might need to conduct self repairs somewhere

[muted lantern]

its interesting to not e both benches are chained down

[unique canopy]

Maybe they're chained down so the underworkers don't steal them if they accidentally wander in

[brisk oriole]

Dark but makes sense

[lethal burrow]

tbf Weaver bodies are completely black so they could easily just have their limbs close to their body and make it look like they have less than they actually have

[muted lantern]

yeah it seems like they have 4 lower legs and 4 upper ones

[white hornet]

isn't a weaver supposed to have 8 legs either way ?

[lethal burrow]

upper legs are usually called arms

[edgy nebula]

arent they, on most organisms, called front legs

[white hornet]

what's the most creative idea of yours abt the next DLC ?

[lethal burrow]

if they're not by bipedal sure

[muted lantern]

also the meme you posted said 8 legs lol

[barren beacon]

Are plasmified bugs still Haunted

[unique tangle]

wait a secoond where do her 6 legs go then?

so she has 6 legs and 4 arms?

thats 10 appendages for a weaver huh

[muted lantern]

maybe weavers are just like gms and can spawn new limbs at will

[wintry plinth]

Maybe it's just made this way to look better

[muted lantern]

wait, why is the sprite called atlas1? Is that the filename?

ik filenames arent canon, but that kinda implies fs is atla

or is atlas 1 just the location of the file

[unique tangle]

Atlas is just the name unity gives to compiled sprite sheets

[muted lantern]

ah

[unique tangle]

It’s nothing

[craggy smelt]

fake lore

I think there's an actual argument to be made that FS is Atla though

[visual glacier]

Atlas is an actual word if you didn’t know

[muted lantern]

Im aware

lol

[muted lantern]

im just already biased to the atla theory and not familiar with unity so my spider senses tingled.

no pun intended

But the name atlas is why i asked if it was just the location of the file, like a directory or something

[visual glacier]

Atla theory doesn’t make sense because how would people know about her if she was locked away before the citadel

Maybe it was after it was made tho

[copper sable]

gms is atla

[muted lantern]

weavenests were likely pre citadel, as they contain failed plans to seal gms before the citadel was devised.

[visual glacier]

Gms isn’t a weaver or are you joking

[copper sable]

u have no proof of that

[visual glacier]

Not all of them

Cindril is pre citadel

Post*

Post creation*

[muted lantern]

im pretty sure weavnest atla at the least was concieved pre citadel, considering eva was likely made as a failed attempt to destroy gms

before they settled on the citadel plan

[visual glacier]

Rune harps are post citadel creation, except maybe the Eva one

[unique tangle]

The Atla lore tablet mentions the web

And the web is the weaver term for the citadel

So Atla was made after the citadel

[visual glacier]

Wrong

That’s the cindril one

[unique tangle]

I’m right

Atla mentions it too

[visual glacier]

Words of a Weaver from the nest beneath Bone Bottom.

"Hide her deep, the despised child, our shame shown in shell of iron. She is a wish cast vain, divinity mimicked in form too frail."

[timber pond]

She just looks like Spooder God when she reveals her true form in her 3 mask damage attack

[unique tangle]

That’s the rune harp

I’m talking about the lore tablet

[visual glacier]

Oh it does you’re right

[muted lantern]

when is that said, i always assumed the accursed web was reffering to their servitude to gms.

when is the citadel called the web?

[visual glacier]

Mask maker

[timber pond]

Yeah, thr totality of the system is the web

[unique tangle]

The mosshome lore tablet and mask maker

Caught in our web unknowing or something

Or web as they’d likely call it

Off the top of my head I think those are the quotes

[visual glacier]

“Aye. Devised by your ancestors that monstrosity, and their wicked, clever minds. A system, or a web they'd likely call it, a way to keep their mother sealed in slumber, and themselves free to lavish in their false rule.”

[muted lantern]

mask maker isn't a weaver, and the mosshome tablet refers to the faith they constructed. The term doesnt specifically mean citadel, though its referring to the faith of the citadel in that specific context.

[muted lantern]

ah he says thats what they call it

fair enough

i concede the point

[unique tangle]

It is equated with the citadel

And the entire system of the citadel

[visual glacier]

I think web is only used to refer to the citadel, the haunting, and what weaver queen hornet might do

[unique tangle]

Also the Atla tablet mentioning the web only really make sense if it’s referring to the citadel

[visual glacier]

Ok silksong trivia

Who says this line “If I breathe, if I live, I am displeased. Only the dead are satisfied.”

[lethal burrow]

bell hermit

[visual glacier]

Correct

[lethal burrow]

(by the way, I'm doing a full 20 question silk song quiz on the 28th)

so get excited for that I guess

[visual glacier]

Yall think bilewater shaman is his son?

[visual glacier]

Sick

[ornate pier]

Why the 28th

[visual glacier]

That’s so far from now

Ngl

[edgy nebula]

im pretty sure he's the caretaker's cousin

[visual glacier]

I’m aware

[edgy nebula]

so we need to know if bell hermit is caretaker's uncle

[visual glacier]

He is

[edgy nebula]

well then yeah probably

unless caretaker has another uncle whose died

[lethal burrow]

Cause that's long enough for people to forget certain things

like the questions that I'm going to reuse cause I couldn't think of any new ones

[unique tangle]

I got a trivia question

How many weavenests are in pharloom

[muted lantern]

does it have to be just the named ones?

[unique tangle]

I think the question would be too easy if it was just the named ones

[muted lantern]

6?

thats how many i remember

[unique tangle]

Yea it would be 6

[muted lantern]

moss grotto, far fields, bilewater, wormways, mt fay, and abyss.

[unique tangle]

Atla, Cindril, Murglin, Karn, Askar, and Absolom

Minus 2 points for not getting the names

[visual glacier]

Is Mt Fay weavenest named?

[stray fog]

Which one was askar

[unique tangle]

It’s a cut name so I’m just joking

[visual glacier]

I know all the other ones so it must be mt fay

[limpid summit]

Askar the cut name for the Fay one yeah

[visual glacier]

I see

[unique tangle]

But the mount Fay one would’ve been called Askar

[dusk kraken]

Is it reasonable to speculate that the ropes strung around pharloom are listening devices made by the bell hermit like cans on a string but for bells. There's about a dozen ropes leading to him and his bell which he could use like a listening device, he also seems pretty knowledgeable about what goes on around him while staying a hermit which pavo mentions as peculiar.

More textual evidence about his listening abilities

[dusk kraken]

Why would the hermit know more about yarnaby's location than one of the residents who expelled her in the first place

[craggy smelt]

magic!

[hushed crater]

Cool theory actually and makes sense for them to communicate that way with eachother

[viscid ridge]

Isn't the ropes just found around places were a bug makes a camp?

[viscid ridge]

I just think snail shamans are more in touch with the world than common bugs. They are kinda like higher beings in that regard, but much less powerfull. I think they have their ways of knowing the goings on around them

[twilit pecan]

What ending of the first game is cannon since I got the true ending and I’m still confused

[hushed crater]

The true ending and godhome endings are both canon I'm the first after we see the knight in the second

Hk spoiler || he survives both of them by becoming void and because we don't see thk's shade we aren't sure with one is cannon tho I prefer to think the normal true ending the godhome is a possibility||

[lethal burrow]

This is a head canon I'll subscribe to because it's cool

[lethal burrow]

dream no more or embrace the void are equally possible, although we don't see the hollow knight shade in sister of the void and we do see the shade lord.

sooooo

[craggy smelt]

I believe it will be ETV

because that is the weirdest ending

think about some of the shit TC did with silksong

the choices they made

you think they won't have THK show up at some point?

[stray fog]

I want it to be etv

Because its cooler than dnm

[hearty hinge]

wouldn't it be possible to get ETV ||with Herrah still alive||?

[stray fog]

Maybe she dies when the seals break in the end and thk comes out

Maybe she just keeps sleeping even after thk comes out of the egg

[snow sonnet]

Gameplay-wise you can technically complete PoH without killing any of the dreamers (tho I feel like this could be a bit of an oversight)

[craggy smelt]

feels inauthentic

even for ETV

something something 'Godseekers can't attune to THK/Rad with Dreamer seal active'

[hearty hinge]

yeah i just don't see ETV as something that makes a great amount of sense plot wise

[visual glacier]

I think world sense should somehow be required for voidheart ngl

It would just make the progression a bit better imo

[hearty hinge]

Kinda feels like a more out of character non canon ending you get for being a god gamer

"my sibling did a boss rush in the dream realm and radiance died irl"

"hornet what are you talking about"

[visual glacier]

Tbf radiance is a dream entity

[hearty hinge]

Made up ahh higher being imagine losing your kingdom to that

[granite sky]

whats sk

[visual glacier]

Silksong

Because SS is a bad acronym

[granite sky]

does that also cost money

[visual glacier]

Yes

[granite sky]

if so how much

[visual glacier]

$20

May vary depending on region

[craggy smelt]

holy shit, is that why they changed it?

i thought it was because everyone calls it skong

[visual glacier]

Probably

[craggy smelt]

oofdah

[granite sky]

alright can i borrow $20

[visual glacier]

No

[craggy smelt]

lol

worth a shot

[stray fog]

What does ss mean

Nvm I googled it

[ember river]

I thought it was because skong was the actual name and team cherry made a typo

[vivid kernel]

ITS MY BIRTHDAY idk if i already sent this here but it is

[stray fog]

Happy birthday

Why did bro post this in every channel

Has he been hacked

[stray fog]

I wonder if hornet ever figured out what happened in etv

From her pov, the infection just fucked off on a random Tuesday

Maybe she checked the abyss and all the shades were gone

[twilit pecan]

Ah thanks, I was going to refight LL because i thought i missed something

[stray fog]

Even then, that's not enough information to figure out wth happened

[twilit pecan]

Thanks

[stuck nymph]

Very much seemed intentional

[cobalt coyote]

His birthday will for sure impact silksong lore

[frosty gate]

It's either Dream no More or Embrace the Void, there's a debate

[frosty gate]

Of course it will, he's a bell

Silksong DLC, Bell's Birthday

Or is it birthday bells?

[hearty hinge]

if godseeker is still alive, probably could just ask

[frosty gate]

If

[hearty hinge]

if.

[frosty gate]

(She's very fucking dead)

[hearty hinge]

Everbloom moment

[frosty gate]

The Everbloom vanished her along with the void

[safe acorn]

Imagine ur sibling who’ve you’ve been told is like destined to stop the infection and you KNOW is meant to be a zombie breaks out of the “egg that no one can enter until 3 people die” without 3 people dying as decidedly not a zombie
No wonder she was getting ready to fight

[frosty gate]

For all we know, it obliterated her

[hearty hinge]

Yeah that's what I mean lol

No clue what happened there

[frosty gate]

Oh i thought ypu meant the Everbloom saved her, nah

[frosty gate]

Actually, can you access Godmasters without killing dreamers?

[hearty hinge]

Junk pit is right there

[frosty gate]

I mean, yeah, but I can't remember if you could do all content without killing dreamers

If so, Herrah might as well just be sleeping still

[hearty hinge]

Need a bunch of bosses done

[safe acorn]

Nah
People are too busy taking infection
Lifeblood is a gateway drug

[hearty hinge]

But none of the dreamers blocks access to a required boss

[stray fog]

Does hornet even go to the sewers

[frosty gate]

I mean, she would technically be alive I guess, so i'm guessing killing dreamers is what happened in canon?

Even if you don't need them for ETV

[hearty hinge]

Does godmaster stay there forever

[stray fog]

If the everbloom teleported her somewhere hornet might go, then hornet would have found out what happened

[hearty hinge]

Yeah but they die for absolutely nothing if the knight kills them then goes "" (no voice to cry suffering) and goes into godmasters head to remotely delete radiance

Godseekers.

[stray fog]

We also don't know how much ruckus the shade lord caused in etv after coming into the real world

[hearty hinge]

These names are too similar

[stray fog]

It could have been enough to the point where hornet noticed it

[hearty hinge]

Considering silksong act 3...

[frosty gate]

We've got no reason to think it telepored them somewhere honestly

[hearty hinge]

there's probably like yknow a minor commotion

Somewhat suboptimal occurence

[frosty gate]

I don't think that much honestly, I feel like that was a red herring

[hearty hinge]

The everbloom is there for nothing then

[stray fog]

I believe that the shade lord just went to chill in the abyss

Maybe hornet eventually checks the abyss, and sees the shade lord

[hearty hinge]

Honestly the idea of the knight giving her the everbloom then getting blown up by it is really funny

did all this no hit bullshit just so the flower can poot them

aight

[frosty gate]

I mean, we don't know how Shade Lord behaves, but Void is relatively uninterested most of the time

Chances are it just stayed where it is

Or it went to the void

[hearty hinge]

go up the infection tendrils

[frosty gate]

Can't, they dissolved

Plus, not soul

[hearty hinge]

Did that happen?

I remember them just going dim

[stray fog]

Yes

[frosty gate]

Let me check, but I remember them going away

[hearty hinge]

That'd be fucking funny

Hornet watches black threaded hollow knight emerge like "um well that just happened"

[frosty gate]

I mean it wouldn't make sense for it to affect THK

[hearty hinge]

that's gonna do 2 masks

[stray fog]

Maybe the white lady could figure out etv

She knows the most about lore

[hearty hinge]

The infection blobs get voided

void on top of void

[frosty gate]

Oh yeah they just get dim

[frosty gate]

But THK is already Void, I don't think it would mean much

[hearty hinge]

Well yknow not entirely

That was the problem wasn't it

[frosty gate]

I mean it was the problem with the infection

Because infection is like a third party

He was also the most infected thing in Hallownest

Considering they had the source inside

[hearty hinge]

THK didn't unite the void like TK did and before TK does that the void attacks em

[frosty gate]

Attacks who

[hearty hinge]

The knight

No reason to think a bigger version is any different

[frosty gate]

I don't get what you're trying to say

[stray fog]

void tendrils attack the knight

Having void inside doesn't harm them

[frosty gate]

Okay, the Tendrils, now I understand what we're talking about

[hearty hinge]

The Hollow Knight isn't literally just the void wearing a shell, it's a distinct enough entity for the void outside them to try to get them so i wonder what's the result of having theoretically voided infection all over that

[frosty gate]

I mean, TK still has soul in their shell.
But TK is getting their physical form attacked by void, if you fill them with more void it wouldn't mean anything

[stray fog]

I thought the vines going dim was them dying, not them having void

[hearty hinge]

Yeah it probably was

[frosty gate]

Same, but I mean, seeing the black thread makes it a possibility, kinda, i guess

[hearty hinge]

But also like has silksong changed that? I'm wondering what the difference is

[frosty gate]

Soul

[stray fog]

Void latched onto threads because it was soul

[hearty hinge]

I got that by hitting radiance

[stray fog]

And void loves soul

[frosty gate]

Actually fuck it, Void didn't even do that on purpose

Void isn't trying to take down Pharloom

[hearty hinge]

I didn't get it from the collector or iirc siblings, did get it from broken vessel and THK

[frosty gate]

Or to take soul from other things

[hearty hinge]

So like there's soul in that isn't there?

[stray fog]

?

[hearty hinge]

In the infection

[frosty gate]

THK and BV have soul because they're vessels

They're both Soul and Void

[stray fog]

Shades don't give soul
Vessels do

The collector is pure void too
He doesn't give soul

[hearty hinge]

Indeed!

[frosty gate]

Your point being?

[stray fog]

That the soul part is in their shell

[hearty hinge]

I don't really see the infection having no soul for the void to try to gobble up

[stray fog]

What was the discussion about
I think I'm misinterpreting this

[hearty hinge]

If the game is consistent about what gives me soul and what doesn't

[frosty gate]

This can easy be cleared up

Does the Infection blobs give soul?

[hearty hinge]

And radiance gives soul upon being hit

[frosty gate]

You know which ones

[stray fog]

No

[frosty gate]

There

[hearty hinge]

"Single cells of infection" do though

[stray fog]

Infection blobs are some weird biological fluids

[hearty hinge]

I guess it's not consistent after all lol

[frosty gate]

But Radiance is a bug, of course she has soul

Well, Higher Being, but still

[stray fog]

Lightseeds?

[hearty hinge]

Infected balloons

[stray fog]

Oh

[hearty hinge]

That's their hunters journal text

[frosty gate]

Still, Void wouldn't use the infection, it doesn't make sense

It's different from what happened with the Black Threads

[stray fog]

Thats a living creature ig

[hearty hinge]

If it is then i want to understand how

[stray fog]

Also, the radiance is dead
Gms was still alive in the abyss

[hearty hinge]

That's what im wondering about

[hearty hinge]

That might be it

If the infection straight up just dies

[frosty gate]

It partly is

The Black Thread wasn't intentional

Pharloom was already Haunted by GMS

Which means GMS had threads on everything, or mostly everything

[hearty hinge]

Noone's saying void traveling up infection would be intentional

[stray fog]

Intentional by whom?

[hearty hinge]

It's connected to the radiance

[frosty gate]

But it can't travel up the infection, it's essence not soul

[frosty gate]

Rad is dead, not even consumed

[frosty gate]

Void

[stray fog]

Oh

[frosty gate]

Void was just trying to swallow GMS's soul

But since she was haunting and sitll grabbing unto things

The Void just consumed the things GMS was grabbing onto

[hearty hinge]

All in all i literally just said it'd be funny if void did that

[frosty gate]

And GMS at the same time

[hearty hinge]

Not that it has

[frosty gate]

Fair

[hearty hinge]

Because it's all so vague that there's really nothing stopping the possibility which would make the last bit with hornet seeing thk come out of the black egg really funny

"aw man"

[frosty gate]

Hornet probably did say "Aw man" regardless of it

[hearty hinge]

"oh hi sib"

[frosty gate]

She definitely was like "Oh come on this is not my job" just for THK to fall down to their knees

God please let THK be alive

Hornet seeing THK was probably so confused, Infection gone aside

That said, THK was probably even more confused

[hearty hinge]

Unless thk knew what's happening

The entirety of godhome frankly makes little sense lol

[frosty gate]

They probably do

[unique canopy]

Grimm knows what's happening, and Hornet is at least aware of what's going on even if she thinks it's a dream and not real (ambiguous either way) so I don't see why THK wouldn't realize what happened

[stray fog]

Im not sure if this goes in the lore channel, but it is story related https://youtu.be/hDKpzFHeLcE

[lean temple]

Very interesting interpretation

[frigid belfry]

i find it curious that grimm is completely aware even without directly being endowed by the nightmare heart

[unique canopy]

Makes sense with his associated with the Nightmare Heart, even when he's not fighting with its true strength

What's really interesting is the idea that the Godseekers consider the Pure Vessel to be in the same category with the Nightmare Heart and Absolute Radiance, since those three are the only fights where the singular Godseeker is watching alone without the crowd. A big fat "what could have been" born from two higher beings and empowered by the void.

[stray fog]

He frequently uses the nightmare realm

So he probably has awareness in dreams because of that

[frigid belfry]

now is grimm apart of his own species or was he a vessel made by the nightmare heart itself?

the latter seems more likely seeing how grimmchild was created

[blissful harbor]

his species is the grimmkin
but yea hes his own thing made by the heart

[flint fjord]

Does anyone knows if the snail shamans die after the getting the Everbloom, or did they just flee.

[foggy fractal]

<@&283547423706447872>

anyway

seemingly they just died

[lean temple]

The spell seems to have consumed their souls, killing them

[foggy fractal]

we see them like dissapating when they cast Hornet into red memory

[lean temple]

Although if they like dipped last second it'd be very funny too

[stray fog]

If they ran, why would they leave their shells behind

[lean temple]

I mean I do believe they just got consumed by the spell

I'm saying if TC pulled a "they lived!" it'd be very funny imo

[stray fog]

Same
I was just presenting another supporting argument for that

[sinful nimbus]

Anything to see my goat Bell Hermit again

[lean temple]

Even a retcon?

[sinful nimbus]

Yes

They could make all of act 3 a dream and i wouldn't really care if i got to see him again

[lean temple]

<@&283547423706447872>

Atp just permaban everyone who does this

Bad WiFi

[lean temple]

The evidence to them being dead is pretty substantial, though it's fitting for them to try saving themselves above all else

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah but it wouldn't be substantial if it was retconned

[lean temple]

This isn't the Star I know 😔

[mystic fiber]

mask maker in HK

then there's the Weaver Queen crest

that's some crazy foreshadowing

[stray fog]

Idk if thats foreshadowing, but it definitely fits what we know about masks

[lean temple]

Not really "foreshadowing" just building off of pre established concepts

[stray fog]

This can also be due to a crest change, rather than a mask change

[unique canopy]

Herrah

[lean temple]

I just noticed the one pointing vertically down looks like GMS's needles lol

[stray fog]

Because we dont know if hornet's physical mask changed

[mystic fiber]

true

[cedar skiff]

i thought this was always in reference to the dreamers

[stray fog]

Dreamers, grimmkin, etc

[mystic fiber]

looks more like half piece of scissor than a pin

[lean temple]

GMS must've picked them up from the cradle floor or smthg

[stray fog]

Its even got the notch thing that scissors have

The circle

[mystic fiber]

yea that's what i meant

[lean temple]

It's possible they were used to harvest her silk when she was asleep

And she just picked them off the floor

[stray fog]

A pin?

[unique canopy]

It's possible she uses them to harvest her own silk if she needs to use it for something. Like uplifting pharlids.

[lean temple]

Scissors

[stray fog]

I thought we were joking about the scissors

But then again, greymoor people have scissors, so its not far fetched

[lean temple]

Well yeah the cradle itself looks like a giant loom

[mystic fiber]

i kinda disagree since GMS's "legs" looks similar to the pin

[lean temple]

Yeah that's true

[mystic fiber]

it's just a bit more curvy and doesnt have the notch part

[frigid belfry]

when was this a theory?

i assumed it was the same thing as the radiance where their legs simply look different

[dreamy isle]

What happened to the Snail Shamans after i came from red place and with everbloom ?

where did they go

?

[sinful nimbus]

They used up all their power in the spell

You can see em dissolve into soul while chanting

[whole holly]

if Godhome will take place in memory expanse, how is hornet going to accomplish that without shamans?

[sinful nimbus]

Well she enters memories without their help

[lean temple]

Yeah she already has the elegy of the deep

[sinful nimbus]

The shamans and old hearts are needed to manifest the everbloom

[lean temple]

And that's assuming it'll be memories

[deep latch]

We all are saying that Greyroot is very similar to The white lady
But a key feature in white lady i havent seen in Greyroot is that she can blink while Greyroot cant
I dont know how much this contributes to the theory
It could just be a feature to make Greyroot scarier by not blinking

[lean temple]

We're analysing blinking now. Too bad I didn't actually pay attention if Greyroot does at any moment

[dreamy isle]

ohhhhhh sad

[deep latch]

I think she doesnt and im pretty sure

[whole holly]

they are same type of creatures but clearly species can very

i wonder if Greyroot kept consuming plasmium, would she become blue lady, lifeblood version of white lady

[deep latch]

Hold up you cooking
Especially because lifeblood is buds and Greyroot has a twisted bud

This is just headcanons at this point these arent even theories

[radiant badger]

Would shellwood's nature go away after nyleth's passing or would it get replaced with the foreign plants? Asking for a project

[lean temple]

Well Nyleth is long gone and look at Shellwood. It seems the presence of the splinters expanded but some of Nyleth's nature can still be seen in shellwood

[radiant badger]

So its more of a unn situation?

[whole holly]

guys there are beings like Father of the Flame, Fayforn, Palestag that are mysterious and unique, do you think we will get more information about them or play bigger part in DLC?

i think we lack lore about them and they are not regular bugs we see in Pharloom, we saw nothing like that in Hallownest, unless you count higher beings

[barren beacon]

How did the Skarr fall?

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t think palestag needs more lore. It’s a legend manifest. I also think it’s very little screen time is more thematic for Verdania as a whole. It’s how green prince remembers it

[sterile jacinth]

Karm got old and her song stopped and with that so did their resistance to the haunting

[barren beacon]

So Karm was the one protecting the Skarr from the Haunting?

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah. Her song was giving them the strength and will to resist

[barren beacon]

Kind of how Vespa's death condemned the Hive to The Infection?

[barren beacon]

Damn

[sterile jacinth]

Didn’t make that connection that’s neat

[barren beacon]

Karm is really strong

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah she is an old heart lol

[barren beacon]

Yeah

[whole holly]

I mean they could get lore in Godhome DLC if there will be one

[barren beacon]

A Hornet fresh out of beating GMS said Karm could match her

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah lol. And she’s a regular bug too

[sterile jacinth]

Godhome doesn’t give that much lore

[whole holly]

Still

[sterile jacinth]

Thematically palestags story is over. It’s legend remembered by one bug and then forgotten alongside his own death

Plus I don’t want a new godhome arena that would suck ass

[whole holly]

Sure but it can be explained and expanded, maybe godseekers will find original memory

[whole holly]

I loved fight honestly, I also loved nyleth fight most

[sterile jacinth]

I’m sure it was originally a much less mythical being. Green prince remembers a legend. Hornet isn’t even sure if it’s real. I don’t think it would be able to teleport and throw the leaf boomerangs

[sterile jacinth]

Pale stag is one of my least favorite bosses lol. Nyleth wasn’t bad but she wasn’t my favorite either

[whole holly]

Which is why it should be expanded to find original version

[sterile jacinth]

I’m saying the fight would be less cool

[whole holly]

Really , when you learn to dodge it becomes easy, arena wasn’t ideal though, you should take advantage of environment

[sterile jacinth]

Easy? Yes. Fun? No

[lilac hedge]

Its fun wdym

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t like pale stag as a boss

[unique canopy]

Godhome Palestag which is the actual historical palestag instead of the legend Green Prince remembered, and it's just a normal cloverstag with pale colouring

[blissful harbor]

it’s just ghost eyes 2.0, but even more waiting for the projectiles to leave to go hit the boss

[whole holly]

I mean regardless of how you think about palestag it will need to be included in boss rush

[whole holly]

When you do that it will be fun as well

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah I agree. I’m saying fighting the original thing that gp fought would probably be a lot less magic

[sterile jacinth]

Lmao my point exactly

It’s just one of those big hardbone hoppers you find in far fields

[whole holly]

I don’t think team cherry will lean towards that, that’s just me personally

Team cherry never takes magic out of anything, they might add more, they might reveal forgotten higher being who knows they got options

[sterile jacinth]

At least no eyes is creepy lol

[blissful harbor]

lmao just realized i said ghost eyes

[dry bridge]

there was an actual historical pale stag that was hunted, though the question is then if it was really the stag of legend (and thus some sort of special being) or just like, a leucistic stag

[sterile jacinth]

The issue with that is the magic is likely misremembered. It’s a creature of legend and the bugs of Verdania were highly into prophecy and legend. Green princes actual experience was probably a lot less… magic. He just remembers it that way both because of prophecy and time

His memory is not perfect, as he doesn’t remember his lover nor the capital of his kingdom at first

My theory is pale in universe is a label bugs give to things they associate with divinity

Which is why it’s pretty inconsistent with its usage

[whole holly]

Something being misremembered doesn’t make it less magical, less fun, it could be that memory was watered down because how elusive palestag was

[sterile jacinth]

Watered down? Wdym? Are you suggesting it was more powerful than the bug you fight?

I think it’s more akin to a legend of like a white deer that showed up occasionally and the people there just didn’t know what albinism was

[whole holly]

It is possible

[sterile jacinth]

I doubt it

[unique canopy]

Speaking theoretically, it is possible that the focus on pursuing and hunting the Palestag could have caused its other traits to be misremembered in favour of its grace and elusiveness. Like maybe it was also responsible for the purity of the waters, or the lushness of the forests, or some other aspect.

[whole holly]

I don’t think team cherry will introduce albinism with palestag

[sterile jacinth]

It’s a comparison. I don’t think pale stag as it existed was really magic

[whole holly]

I mean it is more doubtful team cherry Will add weaker pale clover stag in godhome

[sterile jacinth]

That could be possible but I believe green prince is remembering it as much more powerful and grand than it was

Yea that’s why I don’t think we’re gonna fight the original one lol

[whole holly]

Both are possible

[whole holly]

I agree with this

[sterile jacinth]

He’s looking back remembering the good. Verdania was very legend based so I think gp is remembering the legend more than the actual event

[whole holly]

Legend has to be sourced from reality kind of how citadels religion was sourced from GMS divinity without pilgrims worshipping GMS

[sterile jacinth]

A legend is a story that’s been warped over a very long period of time. Legends are often exaggerated

The text seems to imply it wasn’t as powerful as it is when you fight it

If it existed at all

[limber anvil]

do we know if muckmaggots eat silk or if hornet just losses it due to becoming yucky?

[opaque pier]

They grow fast so they gotta take nutrients from somewhere so id say they eat silk

[whole holly]

It really doesn’t,it doesn’t imply real one was less magic, plus this is hollow knight universe , it is more likely memory loss to impact palestag to be less magical in memory

But it is your opinion, but I disagree

[limber anvil]

implied they eat eachother... They also eat roseries and shell shards it seems

[sterile jacinth]

Myth tends to exaggerate and make things that are mundane magical

[opaque pier]

Even pale rosaries? 😦

[limber anvil]

dont think those drop in the area... unless roach catchers or chests drop them but yes I think... you cant get roaseries or shellshards from muckmaggot water back. I think maybe im wrong

[halcyon merlin]

you also can't get rosaries if it falls on spikes... do spikes eat rosaries

[whole holly]

That doesn’t strictly have to apply , especially in already fictional world, it’s just not in team cherry’s vision to water down things in godhome and original version is too interesting to skip

[sterile jacinth]

Why would myth be more powerful in reality than it is in myth?

[whole holly]

Myths don’t strictly exaggerate that’s why, in fact knowledge of palestags full glory could be lost to time and people might have limited information

[unique canopy]

Unlike real life, HK/SK is a setting where supernatural things actually exist for real, so myths can be less powerful than "reality" in that setting due to misremembering traits, forgetting some while emphasizing others

[sterile jacinth]

They can but I think gp is misremembering

[whole holly]

Doesn’t strictly have to apply in hollow knight universe

[unique canopy]

This would parallel real-world mythological developments where some gods or other mythical figures had certain traits dropped from what they were originally known for, due to either syncretism or cultural shifts

[sterile jacinth]

That’s the word used so it’s the definition I’m going to follow

[whole holly]

Nobody says you can think that but others have their own opinions

[sterile jacinth]

Yes. I am aware.

[whole holly]

It doesn’t strictly or inherently means that myth can only be exaggerated, like points you ignored knowledge of pale stags might could be lost to time which is also possible , I said this before already

[sterile jacinth]

In not arguing it’s not lost to time

[whole holly]

I am aware, but you should take points as possibilities in consideration of your arguments

[sterile jacinth]

I am. I just don’t agree with you

[visual glacier]

What’s the arguement

[sterile jacinth]

I think palestag is gp misremembering the being as a much more powerful and magical being than it really was

[visual glacier]

It’s implied, not confirmed

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah that’s what I think

[unique canopy]

Actually I'll bring up examples from Celtic mythology's beliefs on white stags, since Verdania seems to have a major Celtic theming to it. White stags were considered messengers from the otherworld who appeared to either signal that a quest should be pursued or when a taboo had been violated. The two princes were born cursed and lived at a time when the Citadel was massively encroaching on their lands. The appearance of the palestag could have been a signal from the spiritual realm (whatever it would be in the setting) that they should be fighting against the Citadel or finding a way to protect their realms from its aggression. Had they done so, the palestag could have been a source of strength and authority against the Citadel. But instead they broke the taboo by ruling together and spending their efforts trying to hunt the palestag, then violated another taboo when the other prince tried to work with the Citadel in exchange for Verdania's safety, resulting in its destruction instead.

[whole holly]

You insinuated that it was unlikely but none of us have decisions in next DLC my theory is as likely as yours

[whole holly]

This is extremely interesting

[whole holly]

I mean it is possible regardless

[sterile jacinth]

It is possible

[unique canopy]

In short, the Green Prince misremembered the Palestag because he wanted it to be a reflection of their authority and divine right to rule, but in doing so could have ignored all of its other traits that could have made it a powerful ally, or a messenger from a powerful ally, had they done what was right instead.

[sterile jacinth]

I can see where you’re coming from

[whole holly]

Plus it is extremely unlikely for TC to skip original form of Palestag and downright ridiculous to make it regular, they have creativity for reason

[sterile jacinth]

lol I don’t think an altered version of ps would show up in godhome

It’s not important enough j don’t thin

[whole holly]

Everyone is altered to be stronger in godhome, however different forms of bosses always shown up whenever they had lore to justify it, pale stag does

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t think it will. Verdania as a whole is forgotten. That’s kind of the whole deal with it. I don’t think we’ll ever get an elaboration

It’s time for a new kingdom and new growth

[whole holly]

That is lame point to argue against it , and unlikely of Godhome will reside in memory

[whole holly]

Both can happen

[sterile jacinth]

It seemed to me that Verdania died with gp. So did all of its stories. Tragic yes but it’s gone

[whole holly]

This is not opinion and has been case in Hollow Knight, will likely be case for silksong

[whole holly]

I don’t think Godhome will care

[sterile jacinth]

I’d prefer if it would follow the themes of the bosses

[whole holly]

Unlikely Boss Rush DLC is comming and Palestag is likely to be stronger than ever, it is unlikely for that not to be case because of previously argued points

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t care if it’s stronger it’s godhome

[whole holly]

Can’t wait for it in godhome

[sterile jacinth]

Godhome does not really completly reflect reality which is fine

[whole holly]

I mean Team Cherry hasn’t made anyone weaker in Godhome which I am pretty sure

[whole holly]

It most likely will for pale stag for lore reasons, it is boss rush DLC after all

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah I don’t think they’re gonna make it weaker

Which is completely fine with me lol

Fighting a pre legend palestag was a joke

[whole holly]

This is lame ragebait atp, can’t wait for absolute palestag

[sterile jacinth]

Can’t believe ps was secretly radiance

[whole holly]

Lazy way to ridicule point which has more arguments

[sterile jacinth]

I was joking

That was a joke

:P

[whole holly]

Joking aside palestag will likely change if it debuts in original form, I don’t think combat will be same I think it will be reimagined thematically

[sterile jacinth]

It definitely could be

[whole holly]

I don’t think we will be parkouring for paletouched being

[sterile jacinth]

Ough palestag with no floor

[limpid summit]

Palestag will not be a pantheon boss like pale lurker

[mild adder]

I dread the pantheon of Pharloom

[lone folio]

Hey atleast no enemy arena before groal

[mild adder]

Doing PoHN was hard enough, and now with even more bosses the rush is gonna be even longer

[scenic shuttle]

There is only 33 so far in silksong

[lone folio]

Oh and don't forget the bonus bosses that will be added

[mild adder]

So to retry the last 5 bosses will probably require an hour long grind

[lone folio]

Like they will defently add more bosses in the pantheon

The pinstress sisters are my bet

[scenic shuttle]

Only 2 of them are alive tho

[mild adder]

Ye

[lone folio]

Stilkin pinstress boss fight

Trust

[mild adder]

And? Not like godhome cares

[lone folio]

So is like moss mother

[mild adder]

In order to do the pantheons in HK you had to kill the bosses anyway

[lone folio]

And 90% of the bosses

[mild adder]

And didn’t need to fight the nail masters

[scenic shuttle]

She’s not like the last nailmaster though

[mild adder]

Would be funny if we fought vog instead of the green dead pinstress

Or the flea spirit

I do look forward to being replay my favorite boss fights though

First sinner my beloved

[scenic shuttle]

Inifinite skarrsinger karmalita

[lone folio]

Yeah that's why I have lost motivation to play

[mild adder]

What?

[lone folio]

I do not want to start another save file when I want to fight a boss

[mild adder]

I want to replay the entire game just to fight all the bosses I like again and because I really like the game in general

[scenic shuttle]

Real

[craggy smelt]

i would like to get gud at her

for a memory/boss hall DLC... what about an area added to Weavenest Atla? You can access a tank like Eva's or something that lets you get 'insight' into your past battles

I feel like that's a reasonable enough point to be able to access a boss hall

[mild adder]

Just add another godseeker lol

Sitting in bilewater

[craggy smelt]

good idea, just what we need - an excuse to return to bilewater

[unique canopy]

Bileseeker

[lone folio]

Hey I wouldn't be too mad if another godseeker is just chilling somewhere

[mild adder]

Or a captured godseeker in the memorium just sitting in a cage lol

[lone folio]

Though it would need to be a different godhome otherwise it messes with the endings of base hk and confirms either dnm or etv to be the correct one

And I feel like they want to keep that a mystery

[mild adder]

Frankly I’d prefer if they just picked an ending an ran with it. It’s clear they already discarded two out of the five endings

[modern phoenix]

hey,is there some silksong lore summary here?

[mild adder]

And now we have it confirmed that the delicate flower etv ending doesn’t kill ghost

So it’s really just two endings

[modern phoenix]

now imagine infinite groal

with the runback

[median monolith]

Question, since lace is an entity made of purely silk, could she be corrupted by the radiance infection? Or would she resist it?

[mild adder]

I’d say yes

The only thing that can resist the radiance seemed to be the void

[median monolith]

So what about lost lace? Would the void act as some kind of armour?

[mild adder]

Nah, it would just eventually eat her and kill her

Void that is

Silk is infused with soul and void loves eating soul

[median monolith]

This is true

[lone folio]

Mossbag has an alright video last i remember

[mild adder]

Yea though he massively misunderstood the red memory

[median monolith]

Fr

[mild adder]

Which made me instantly tune out of the video

[modern phoenix]

imma check it out tomorrow i think

[mild adder]

Because like, how do you fail basic reading comprehension

[lone folio]

Did he like misunderstand the message of red memory or what kind of revelation Hornet came upon in it?

I don't remember it that well

[glossy sail]

I saw someone say we ascended in Hallownest and instead, we could descend in Pharloom, final boss could like idk, maybe be Lord of Shades in a friendly battle ig, or AbsGMS like with Radiance

[mild adder]

He somehow thought that hornet was criticizing and admonishing white lady and pk, which is extremely funny because it’s the exact opposite

[lone folio]

I mean her idea of her dad is not the best

[mild adder]

The only thing we get from her on her dad is “only fools think they can control the void”

And from red memory

[lone folio]

She calls him a fool and depending on how you see a piece of dialogue refers to him as not matching the title of a god

[mild adder]

We know she fully understands and agrees with what both him and white lady were trying to do

This “hornet hates her dad” is just a fanfic

[sterile jacinth]

What? Where did you get that?

[median monolith]

I mean I personally also agree with what they were doing, what else could you do after all

[mild adder]

People memory hole the red memory so fast it’s so funny

[lone folio]

I mean the plan was alright but just making a trap like the snail shamans do would of sufficed

[sterile jacinth]

How do you trap a dream?

[mild adder]

Uh uh and how do you set up the trap without melting?