sk-lore

[halcyon merlin]

well thats because she's not a guy

:troll

[frosty gate]

Seriously Star, don't go around missgendering people

[inner torrent]

Sherma a good boy

But is he the ultimate good buy?

[sinful nimbus]

you don't think women can be part of the good guys? 💔

[spark valve]

in silksong they can't

[frosty gate]

Not in Pharloom that's for sure

[sinful nimbus]

TRUE

[foggy fractal]

how about Karmelita

[inner torrent]

Karmelita is bad tho, she is eats pilgrim

[frosty gate]

I lie, Gilly is a girl and I keep forgetting she is

[inner torrent]

Her favorites are scorched pilgrim organs

[sinful nimbus]

An easy way to remember is by memorizing the "Gilly is Gurr's daughter" theory

[frosty gate]

I

Wanna die

[foggy fractal]

what if father of the flame is the father of the forebrothers

[sinful nimbus]

true...

Is Wisp Thicket the forgehome

[frosty gate]

How is that a theory?

[sinful nimbus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0Qmj40QPFY

[halcyon merlin]

sounds like peak

[inner torrent]

I want to see father of flame real gorm

Form*

[foggy fractal]

I mean

[frosty gate]

That was the real form

[inner torrent]

I want to see grandfather of flame

[foggy fractal]

its not like another seperate entity exists that the father of the flame was based on
father of the flame is their god, it is also just a totem

but if you mean the bug's corpse in father of the flame here

[muted lantern]

Oh wow he really wasn't fully imolated

There goes someone else's argument from a while ago

[inner torrent]

I like to thing the father of flame was a higher being in process

[frosty gate]

Lots of words that mean nothing

Peak shit

[sinful nimbus]

Never diss El Chiefo

[north shard]

was zote the son of grey witch?

[halcyon merlin]

yes

indeed

[sinful nimbus]

no

[halcyon merlin]

yeah

correctly

sure

[muted lantern]

Zote is actually the pale king

[frosty gate]

Is he your Mossbag?

[sinful nimbus]

Zote just seems to be a regular dude

[inner torrent]

SHERMA is the pale king

[muted lantern]

Pk after downloading reddit

[sinful nimbus]

Yes

[frosty gate]

Zote is the Grey King

[sinful nimbus]

Mossbag's just regurgitating well known lore and misconceptions while El Chiefo is presenting new ideas

[halcyon merlin]

can you be the moss to my bag

[frosty gate]

Impresively, not a lie

The Idea is new

Good? No

But definitely new

[inner torrent]

Phantom is the daughter of gms and greyroot

[frosty gate]

Yes, she was concived in Pharloom's Bay

But her creation was so cool it had to be deleted off the map

[inner torrent]

Yep

Actually her birth sucked all of the life from pharloom bay

[muted lantern]

Mossbag killed my grandma... Okay??

[inner torrent]

And that's why they are destroying bilewater, to erase the evidence

[frosty gate]

DON'T

I CAN'T LAUGH IN PUBLIC

https://tenor.com/view/because-singing-killed-my-grandma-trolls-poppy-and-branch-sped-up-gif-27544223

[sinful nimbus]

It adds some much needed depth to the two characters

[muted lantern]

Didn't el chiefo say that herrah is a drapemite

[inner torrent]

Herrah is just a poor planned character

[sinful nimbus]

What...

[frosty gate]

Well right of course, who's the mother?

[sinful nimbus]

Might have to switch sides
i LOVE herrah drapemite theory

[sinful nimbus]

Another ant

[ornate pier]

Gurr and gillt daughter theory makes like

[lean osprey]

https://tenor.com/view/the-matrix-laurence-fishburne-morpheus-trinity-he's-beginning-to-believe-gif-18413151103009905935

[ornate pier]

No sense cause like

Her father is implied to be dead and the doll was like a gift from him right

[frosty gate]

Yes

[muted lantern]

Clearly gilly is one of these, not an ant.

[frosty gate]

Gilly was evolved by GMS new theory

[inner torrent]

Gilly is a bonefolk, not an skarrkin

[ornate pier]

Why would gilly be a caranjd specifically

She just has a mask

Or a bone face

[ember river]

The hell is a bonefolk, the skull crawler things?

[ornate pier]

Which is basically js a mask

[frosty gate]

People from bonebottom i assume

[ember river]

Pretty sure they just wear masks of dead bugs or pose as such

[visual glacier]

Those are just pilgrims I think

[inner torrent]

+marrow+far fields

[ember river]

Yeah, the bonelands or whatever they're called, there are few bugs endemic to them and none seem sentient

[inner torrent]

Are bugs from moss grotto Mosskins?

[ember river]

No

[inner torrent]

Grottkins

[visual glacier]

No

[ornate pier]

The mosskin are unrelated fym

[visual glacier]

They are mossgrubs and mossmirs

[frosty gate]

Not all moss is created by Unn

Just her moss

[inner torrent]

Unn is a fraud

[ember river]

Stop this unn slander at once

[visual glacier]

Unn>pale king

[ember river]

You'll be the next in the void if this keeps up

You have been warned

[inner torrent]

Better to be in the void than half-comatose

[ember river]

Unn isn't comatose

[foggy fractal]

wait... what if... frey... is gilly's.... mother.

[ember river]

It's just weakened and fading

[visual glacier]

Unn is just sleeping

Taking a quick nap

Even god rested on the seventh day

[inner torrent]

And Frey has an ant infestation down her store

It all makes sense now

[visual glacier]

You’re thinking of creige

[inner torrent]

Oh

Maybe creige is the father and they faked their death?

They have a reputation for being liars

[ember river]

When Hornet said "those who claim themselves a god can rarely match their title" she meant literally every other higher being except Unn

[visual glacier]

True

[ember river]

Trust me, when I played silksong I played as hornet which means I am actually Hornet

[inner torrent]

Do you think there is a lifeblood god?

Or is it more of a natural force like void

[frosty gate]

I want to believe Gilly's parents are both dead and this is not the case

[ember river]

There are hints that seem to imply that, or that there was something of that sort at some point at least

[visual glacier]

Abyss creature is our only candidate

[ember river]

I absolutely hate that it's called the "Abyss creature"

[visual glacier]

It’s a creature in the abyss

[ember river]

Lifeblood slug would be a better name than fucking abyss creature

[blissful harbor]

in what world does that look like a slug

what slugs do you see

[frosty gate]

And honestly, consisdering the fact that now we know Lifeblood can infest living things, it might just be a random creature infested

[hasty yew]

Even just lifeblood creature would be better

[hasty yew]

It could be

[inner torrent]

Just lifeblood beast

[ember river]

I don't want to claim that it looks like a slug, I want to claim that it's a better name regardless

[hasty yew]

But it could also be its source

[ember river]

Abyss is so void coded it's extremely disconcerting

[inner torrent]

True

[ember river]

Especially when there are other creatures in the abyss that aren't the abyss creature and are more implied with the abyss

[visual glacier]

Do you perfer “shade beast” for the shade cloak guy

[hasty yew]

Yeah, like the one holding the void bowl thing

[ember river]

It shows up in the godhome room and the lifeblood core room is also within a dream

[muted lantern]

John abyss

[inner torrent]

But also in godhome there is gruzzmother

[muted lantern]

Distant relative of Paul deepnest

[inner torrent]

At least we know it is powerful

[ember river]

No, in the godhome lifeblood room

Pantheons are uhhh

Dubious

It's seemingly not strong enough to qualify for a special godseeker room though, so they probably don't seek atunement

[inner torrent]

Now that you mention, her state as a separate room may mean it is more similar to unn, white lady and pk

Although different

[ember river]

The Nightmare Heart doesn't have a room either, but a travelling god doesn't really seem like what the godseekers are looking for

[inner torrent]

Yep.
Probably lifeblood animalistic behavior makes them not interested

[ember river]

Yeah, the godseeker doesn't mention it either

[hasty yew]

The nightmare heart has a room, it’s just also a boss fight room

[ember river]

Well, yeah, NKG's room does feature the nightmare heart and it's right before the Pale King's room so I guess that counts

It's a fitting place as well

[hasty yew]

The nightmare heart is one of the more active higher beings

[frosty gate]

Or scared

[ember river]

On one side I'd like to see its lore expanded with a DLC, but on the other I feel like it'd be quite repetitive

[frosty gate]

Or disgusted

[ember river]

I mean, they are trying to attune to the infection that breaks minds and pollutes dreams

[frosty gate]

Lifeblood clearly is worse, somehow

[ember river]

It also wrecks your body even if you are a demigod

[frosty gate]

And I say this because it's not that they "have it"

They lock it

[ember river]

Temporarily, in such a case, may I add

[frosty gate]

Behind the hardest challenge of the Pantheons

[inner torrent]

It's also one of the only rooms only the godseekers can watch

[ember river]

What do you mean?

[inner torrent]

The idea of a void overtaken and in ruins godhome is very interesting ngl

[blissful harbor]

some rooms have just the main seeker and no audience

[inner torrent]

In most fight rooms there is an audience.
In the last ones, there Is only the godseeker mommy alfa

[frosty gate]

Which means that, even in a Hive Mind, there's a hierarchy

Despite the fact that they don't seem all that different

For some reason our Godseeker is special

[blissful harbor]

shes the main body

[inner torrent]

Is it really locked tho?

[blissful harbor]

she gets say
id want more say if i had a bunch of folks in my head
this is my body

but really, shes the one with the crest to focus their thoughts

[frosty gate]

It's behind a door with like 12 notches only accesible after beating the pantheons without upgrades

It is locked

[inner torrent]

To me it seems more like they need to focus to reach it.
Altough, I guess it being locked so only a great fighter can make use of it makes sense

[frosty gate]

I don't think they wanted it to be used

Like, the moment you open that door it starts spreading, which is crazy

To spread within a Dream Realm

That can't be easy just like that unless you have some weird shit going on

[inner torrent]

Yep, lifeblood power is quite a powerful force, if given focus I'm sure it would overpass the troubles infection brings

[frosty gate]

Not even the void likes the damn thing

[inner torrent]

I like to think the abyss beast was closed into a dream realm inside the abyss so it would be disconnected to any other bug dreams

[frosty gate]

I'm not sure, that door is weird

[inner torrent]

If hallownest ever reborns I'm sure lifeblood will trouble them somehow

[frosty gate]

Somehow, I think it won't actually

The main problem with it is Zylotl being a bitch

[blissful harbor]

pretty sure lifeblood as already started to take over parts of hallownest, hornet implies it did

[frosty gate]

Lifeblood was quite normal in Hallownest

[frosty gate]

That probably means long ago, her father did make it a taboo

[lean temple]

Tbh Salubra may have undersold it. She isn't in the right state of mind after all

She thinks the village outside is still alive. She isn't a reliable narrator

[frosty gate]

Joni is called a Heretic

It is taboo

[lean temple]

"A bit of a taboo" is underselling it

Considering the pale royalty knows what it actually is

[frosty gate]

Oh ok mb

I missunderstood what you said lmao

[inner torrent]

I think it would be interesting to see a game about a future hallownest

[lean temple]

No worries

[lone folio]

Interesting but very low chance of happening

[frosty gate]

That's probably because she doesn't really understand what it does, she did say she drank it once didn't she?

[inner torrent]

Where the kingdom is now not even called by that name, and people have not only forgotten about the moth, but also tell myths about a "White Monarch"

[lean temple]

I don't recall

[lone folio]

TC would probably much rather make new kingdoms for us to explore instead of seeing how hallownest is doing

[lean temple]

She only says that it makes you feel much healthier, which basically everyone agrees on

[frosty gate]

"Have you ever drunk that bright blue liquid, 'lifeblood'? It's a bit of a taboo, but it makes you feel much healthier doesn't it?"

[lean temple]

I mean it's mostly just dead, even the Hive died out by the time of Silksong. We don't even know what others may have died out as well

[frosty gate]

The fact that she knows the effect would mean she's drank it

[lean temple]

Yea I suppose so

Salubra the Heretic or smthg

[frosty gate]

I'm n1 fan of the theory that lifeblood locked itself in that room

Although I haven't seen others talk about it

[blissful harbor]

i don’t imagine something else would be able to make a lock of lifeblood

[lean temple]

In the Abyss of all places

[blissful harbor]

abyss creature just wants to be left alone fr

[frosty gate]

PK Probably had something to do with it

[lean temple]

Which means the Void isn't hostile to it

[frosty gate]

Quite the opposite, it seems like it avoids it

[lean temple]

Probably bcz it isn't soul-based life?

[frosty gate]

I'm not sure, but probably

Well

I was going to say Radiance isn't soul based either

But that's a whole other beef

[lean temple]

Yeahh

[inner torrent]

I love radiance

[lone folio]

The void just hates everything and the lifeblood creature is good at hide and seek

[lean temple]

I mean dream nailing gives soul, for some reason...

[frosty gate]

Wait

The Plasmids give silk

Doesn't that mean they have soul?

Even if little

[inner torrent]

They are alive aren't them?

[silk dirge]

yeah

[lean temple]

Yes but they're mutants

[inner torrent]

The real question is if lifeblood seeds give silk/soul

[frosty gate]

Still, they have soul

[inner torrent]

Although if they don't that's probably due to their size

[silk dirge]

i dont think they do

[lilac hedge]

Everything but void gives u soul in the game brah

[lone folio]

I mean yeah but like.. Gameplay

[lean temple]

You mean the plamsified creatures right?

[frosty gate]

Yes

[lone folio]

Robots give you silk

[inner torrent]

Although small worms in broodnest seem to give soul so...

[silk dirge]

nah it makes sense to me

[lilac hedge]

Silkflies tho

[silk dirge]

wrong reply

[lean temple]

Well yeah they were originally soul based so they retain it

[inner torrent]

Robots work by silk tho

[lone folio]

Like I doubt Hornet is skewering the silkfly everytime

[plucky night]

How?

[frosty gate]

There's things that don't give soul

[silk dirge]

id assume the soul energy is distributed throughout the robot

[frosty gate]

Robots powered by silk and silkflies

[lilac hedge]

They work by silk tho right? So maybe shes just taking the silk outta them

[silk dirge]

they have glowing white eyes

[lone folio]

God dang I'm getting absolutely bombarded

My bad gentlemen I don't work at evil NASA

[plucky night]

Is there any phone players?

[lone folio]

I don't do robots I just thought it like.. Not sure actually

[lilac hedge]

Time to study cogs

[lone folio]

Yeah I play on my Gameboy

[silk dirge]

who tf is playing silksong on a phone 😭

[lone folio]

That's basically a phone

[silk dirge]

i mean ive seen people but im not sure if theyre memeing since that does not seem like the intended experience

[plucky night]

Actually I do and I am in act two

[lone folio]

Mate that's not awesome

[plucky night]

Why

[lone folio]

Did you pay for it?

[frosty gate]

So why would Void not seek out that soul?

[plucky night]

I don't have mony

[lean temple]

In game its so you don't have both Voided and plasmified enemies ig

[silk dirge]

bc the enemies arent haunted after getting plasmified

[frosty gate]

I would be terrified

[silk dirge]

are wormways haunted

i dont know if they are

[frosty gate]

Yes, i believe so

[lone folio]

Well you are disrespecting the effort put into the game and the fact that it's as cheap as it is for a 60+ hour experience

[lilac hedge]

Haunted by what

[silk dirge]

do groms freeze when you play needolin

[frosty gate]

I would cry if that happened

Still, I think there's a lore reason behind that game reason

[plucky night]

I am Egyptian......

[lone folio]

Hell probably more if someone isnt as good at hollow knight

[lone folio]

Awesome

[silk dirge]

yeah i think plasmium probably fucks with the haunting

[frosty gate]

But why not??? That's the question!!!
Why would the threads let go after Plasmium takes over?

[lilac hedge]

Brochachinonator the devs dont gaf if you pirate it

[half zenith]

Well the black threads are the result of two higher substances, one commanded by an angry goddess, mixing very poorly with each other

[lone folio]

They don't?

[frosty gate]

Also, Plasmium only takes over after the Black Thread

[half zenith]

So I think the being voided thing is a unique case

[silk dirge]

i mean it probably fucks them up

[lone folio]

Haven't heard of this yet!

[lilac hedge]

Not rlly

[frosty gate]

Like, it only happens when you access Act 3

[noble reef]

What are they talking about?

[lean temple]

Could just be time passing

[foggy fractal]

this reminds me of the pirating debate that happened before silksong's release, good times

[frosty gate]

Which is when GMS gets taken over by Void, hence the black thread

[lilac hedge]

Its still illegal ig

[lone folio]

I don't think so

[silk dirge]

people threatening to pirate silksong over team cherry being silent?

want to bet how many of those people had a lot more bark than bite

[foggy fractal]

something like that, I don't remember too well lmao

[lone folio]

That's like another way of pirating which I'm like 98.56% sure is illegal

[silk dirge]

also andy yeah you were right about the merch unfortunately

only 3 new items

i bought that poster instantly tho

[frosty gate]

Wdym

[foggy fractal]

a drop of a wopping 3 items

[lilac hedge]

24 dollars wild tho but worth it

[foggy fractal]

Lace plush though

pretty cool

[lean temple]

Enough time has passed since Zylotol injected the place that the Lifeblood matured and began taking over

[frosty gate]

I mean yeah for sure, I agree with that, but why let go of the thread is the question

If they still have soul

I don't think Void can get picky

[lean temple]

No clue

[silk dirge]

i mean the thread needs to wrap around their insides and make it in or smth

plasmium probably makes it harder for the thread to make it in

[frosty gate]

But the thread was already in

[noble reef]

What are they talking about?

[silk dirge]

it could disrupt it

[frosty gate]

Fair, but even then, most places in Pharloom, even if not affected by it, have Black Tendrils in the background don't they?

[silk dirge]

does wormways

[frosty gate]

I think it does, until you reach the Plasmium side

The Plasmium caves don't have none

[silk dirge]

interesting

[frosty gate]

Lifeblood and why void avoids it

[frosty gate]

I swear the void is avoiding it for some reason

THE VOID ITSELF
KILLER OF ALL BEINGS HIGHER

Is not going near whatever the fuck that is

[inner torrent]

Probably wormways are just too secluded

[lean temple]

Hmm

[silk dirge]

it could also be that yeah

wormways is a pretty isolated area

[lean temple]

Maybe the Lifeblood can hide from being detected by Void?

[tepid mountain]

Are wormways enemies haunted before the plasmium takeover?

[frosty gate]

Yes, but things were still Haunted there

[inner torrent]

Tbh I dislike how fucking big is bilewater when it's so fucking boring

[lone folio]

I feel like installing the game on your phone will first of all give your phone a virus that will make it grow limbs and it will run towards the nearest black market and second is that its just kind of disrespectful for how cheap it is for how good the game is. Afcourse they did say they are Egyptian so maybe Egypts economy just sucks but I am no expert in Egyptian economy. One Google search later it does seem pretty bad so maybe the poor guy really does deserve to experience it. He did get to act 2 which is hella impressive if you are on a phone

[silk dirge]

i actually havent seen do groms have strings

[frosty gate]

I believe so, someone would have to go there and needolin some things

[lone folio]

Sorry for clogging upp the discussion

[lone folio]

It's not boring it's amazing

When you are atleast 6 kilometers away from it

Or if you have wraith of purity then it's probably better

[inner torrent]

I just think it lacks variety in most of the trajectory

[lone folio]

That's fair

[frosty gate]

That could be the case, it isn't there during the Birthplace cutscene

[lone folio]

It isn't very unique in most of its rooms

Just green and maggots and stone walls and some wood maybe and those wierd explode balls

[lean temple]

Since Lifeblood itself isn't soul-based, maybe it can hide the soul of plasmified creatures from the Void, avoiding its detection?

[lone folio]

I mean it can clearly alter soul

Being overdosed changes your crest

[lean temple]

Maybe we're onto something

[lone folio]

Which is somehow related to soul. Enough for Eva to notice atleast

[frosty gate]

Maybe. It's also somehow able to do dream shit, who know how

[inner torrent]

Can vessels develope crests?

[lean temple]

Good question

They don't have soul, they're animated by void

[silk dirge]

probably not

[frosty gate]

They have soul... Kinda?

[lean temple]

"No soul, long shadow"

[inner torrent]

They're soul is usually literal soul, recollected and contained from other beings

[frosty gate]

Who said that one

[inner torrent]

Maybe that would mean they can get a crest from other bug's soul

[lean temple]

Steel Soul Jinn

[inner torrent]

But... I'm not sure if focus can really work as a bind to absorb a crest

[lilac hedge]

I thought yall mfers didnt believe steel ppl because they said crazy shit

[frosty gate]

But PV uses soul

[silk dirge]

i wonder if shade lord gets the crests of gods it kills

[lilac hedge]

Pv literally uses silk skill and focus

[inner torrent]

pV is a weaver

[tepid mountain]

Tbh there’s not much in the HK world that can change and mutate things the way Lifeblood does. The Radiance, GMS. It’s on par with Higher Being stuff. So I wouldn’t doubt that it can mess with Silk haunting and Void.

[silk dirge]

like did shade lord get radiance and gms crest and just not care

[lean temple]

So does the Knight but they can siphon Soul from outside sources

[silk dirge]

idk what a void focus would look like

[frosty gate]

Wait

Wait a fucking second

[silk dirge]

id assume to get a crest thats what a soul based being would do

focus it in

[frosty gate]

Was Path of Pain just the road to PV's fucking bedroom?

Hence why he was statues of infinite silk

soul sorry

[lean temple]

No?

[silk dirge]

no

[lilac hedge]

Wha

[lean temple]

It's a protected memory

[silk dirge]

path of pain is just a very elaborate dream defense system

yeah

[frosty gate]

I mean yes but still, that room

And the statues

[lilac hedge]

Its a seal of binding to see the a memory you are not supposed to se

[lean temple]

Idk if the statues are canonically infinite

Like infinite soul seems busted

[silk dirge]

i mean pk could probably make infinite soul

[frosty gate]

I don't think there's a reason for them not to be

[silk dirge]

yeah pk was extremely powerful lol

[lean temple]

Vast amounts sure but infinite? Even GMS can't do that

[lilac hedge]

So kingsoul is not a thing

[silk dirge]

the only reason radiance was as powerful as she was is she was a dream being

[silk dirge]

gms has infinite silk she just has a limited spool bar like hornet

[frosty gate]

Maybe the Statues aren't infinite but are just like, super full?

[inner torrent]

The 4 forces

Void, lifeblood, infection, and haunting

[lilac hedge]

Nope i hit them for 30 minutes with quick slash and they did not run out

[silk dirge]

like gms probably has a fuck ton of silk hearts

[lean temple]

More like Void, Soul, Lifeblood, dreams

[silk dirge]

id assume pk is probably similar but has a much much larger bar of soul

bc gms is a fraud being

[frosty gate]

I mean for us yes, but in canon

[lean temple]

I mean Pale Wyrms are probably busted op

[frosty gate]

Essence!

[silk dirge]

it would make sense to me pk can hold infinite soul at once while gms can generate silk infinitely but not hold infinite at once

[inner torrent]

Do you think pk has kingsoul?

Like, he naturally generates soul

[silk dirge]

yes

[frosty gate]

Yes

[lean temple]

Hornet says she will stretch her soul too thin if she keeps up the cocoon. She cannot produce infinitely. We see her weakened and faded. She gives the last of her power to Hornet at the end

[frosty gate]

I think whatever power is it that Godseeker says lingers, is keeping the statues full

[inner torrent]

Gms kinda hot

[lilac hedge]

Hes a king and has infinite soul, so ya tell me

[silk dirge]

i think that just means she is using a bunch of silk but isnt regenerating any

[frosty gate]

Which is kind of a special case, she is being consumed by antimatter and all

[silk dirge]

yeah

gms having silk hearts makes sense

[inner torrent]

I doubt gms speciliaty is silk production, but more of silk holding.
As she is searching weavers for their silk

[silk dirge]

but theyre probably all at capacity

gms has used as much possible silk she can hold at once

[lilac hedge]

You can see how much silk and shit she has just by binding her, look at your stats

[lean temple]

Well she is at the bottom of the Abyss which may have stifled her production

Hmm idk

[inner torrent]

Do you think lace "Face" is like, hard? Like not silk?

[lean temple]

Or the rate at which the Void consumes is faster than what she can produce

[frosty gate]

Also a fair assumption

[silk dirge]

yeah i think this is likely

[inner torrent]

Ir would be fun if Lace was made onto a Spool, and what we see as a face is actually part of the spool with silk eyes over

[lean temple]

It meshes well with the "see her consumed with insatiable efficiency"

[frosty gate]

But back on the topic, if the Vessels can't generate their own soul, the statues in the Palace were probably for PV

The ones in pop at least

[silk dirge]

hornet also says this in response to shamans saying they didnt think anyone can survive the void

[inner torrent]

That actually explains a lot

[inner torrent]

When gms charges hornet with silk, she would be basically "Killing" herself

[frosty gate]

"Straining her soul thin" kinda does imply she can run out of it

What even is a souless being?

The only thing similar to it are Vessels

[inner torrent]

Maybe that's what pale king corpse is

[frosty gate]

But Vessels are like a very extremely special exception

[lean temple]

Yea, she's giving the last of her life force away

[inner torrent]

That could be the solution to the question of how did the pale king died, overuse of his soul, in a punny attempt to keep an eternal facade

[frosty gate]

But using it on what?

I also can't remember if void did kill him or not, I don't remember how that discussion went back then

[inner torrent]

We don't know

[frosty gate]

That was a cool theory

[silk dirge]

i think whats going on is yeah the void is eating the cocoon faster than gms can generate it but also since the silk is actively being used that means gms silk hearts arent making more silk

[inner torrent]

There are void particles in his room, but also, he doesn't show anything that means he was affected by void, he lacks those black tears other voided bugs have

[frosty gate]

That is true, but it's still weird

[silk dirge]

i think pk just committed suicide

its the most likely to me

[inner torrent]

Do you think he actually died?

As an old bug once said, for higher beings, dead is more like transformation

That's why I think Sherma IS THE PALE KING

[lilac hedge]

He already transormfated his ass

[muted lantern]

"and i'll do it again" -pk probably

[inner torrent]

For what other reason would Sherma face be completely white? That's something mostly only pale beings show

[silk dirge]

what

[lone folio]

[silk dirge]

so many bugs have white masks

is this guy a pale being now

[visual glacier]

Could be their face

[lone folio]

I feel like it's a joke

[silk dirge]

shermas face does kinda look like quirrel tho

quirrel but with smaller eyes

[visual glacier]

They are both wearing hoods

[silk dirge]

yeah thats probably it

[lone folio]

He has a round face with two eyes

This description applies to both

[visual glacier]

Quirrel’s isn’t very round tbh

[lone folio]

Squary circle

Shape thing

[silk dirge]

ok wait more needle durability discussion how the fuck does hornets needle survive the beginning of act 3 without any damage but thk's nail got messed up by literally nothing happening

is hivesteel that cracked

i doubt its better than pale ore

[foggy fractal]

the hollow knight was just in there for a really, really, really long time

[sinful nimbus]

What happens to the needle during the start of act 3

[silk dirge]

it falls far

and doesnt get damaged at all

where thks nail just

stood still for like 100 years

and somehow broke

[sinful nimbus]

I mean different circumstances

The needle cracked because of an infection explosion or something

[silk dirge]

honestly i could see that

[sinful nimbus]

Whatever got rid of THK's arm cracked it too

[silk dirge]

yeah i think the nail probably got cracked at the beginning of hk

in that cutscene

[unique canopy]

Metal gets tarnished and rusted over time just from exposure to the air. Over the course of centuries, yeah that can build up to cause cracks, plus we don't know the properties of the air in the egg itself beyond "Hornet can't stay in there long for reasons."
And I don't even think we know how THK sealed Radiance in the first place, just that they did and were subsequently sealed.

[silk dirge]

i mean considering its a pure nail i think youd basically need the power of a god to cause any damage to it

[unique canopy]

Think we should remember the nails are still forged by mortals, regardless of how much pale ore is put into them

[silk dirge]

i think thks nail probably was made by pk

idk

[stark ocean]

I think they used focus to draw all the infection in the entire kingdom to themselves

that's how the knight does it

wait this is silksong lore channel

[silk dirge]

yeah

and hk lore is relevant to silksong lore

[trail wagon]

wha

[silk dirge]

is the bone forest getting cut from hk equivalent to coral gorge getting cut from silksong

[trail wagon]

Pretty much all piligrims..?

[trail wagon]

ohhhh

it sounded like "is boneforest the hk coral gorge"

which would be the opposite

Coral Gorge in game 3??? xd

[silk dirge]

steel city coral gorge

honestly idk why i am so certain but i am the steel city dlc/hk 3rd game will be called steelheart

[tepid mountain]

Wasn’t Bone Forest kinda reconfigured into the Marrow for Silksong? I feel like I read that somewhere.

[silk dirge]

yes

but before then it was completely cut from hk

i think bone forest got split up into multiple parts tbh

[tepid mountain]

So maybe a similar thing happens with Silksong’s cut areas, who knows.

[silk dirge]

marrow is the most obvious "bone" one

but deep docks and far fields def still have that vibe

especially the skull cave in far fields

what is the lore of that actually

[tepid mountain]

Yeah, I can see Far Fields and the Marrow being meshed into a “Bone Forest.”

[silk dirge]

deep docks is just marrow but developed

anyways what is up with the far fields skull cave

like surely theres some lore other than cool natural formation that tc added bc they wanted to use the rising lava in a place other than the abyss

actually wait i havent researched which came first skull cave or abyss climb let me look at acmi maps real quick

[half zenith]

Are silkflies just silk-corrupted lumaflies, or are lumaflies unrelated to silkflies?

[foggy fractal]

unrelated

[half zenith]

Ah okay

[foggy fractal]

think the wiki page would explain it better https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Silk_Flies

[half zenith]

Like I got the lore that the silkflies are souls of the dead created through horrid experiments, yeah

But I couldn’t ignore the visual similarities to lumaflies and needed to ask the question ya know

[trail wagon]

yeah it was, it has exactly the same sprites

[half zenith]

HK doesn’t exactly ever explain what lumaflies are to be fair and neither does Silksong

[trail wagon]

Btw, why do the plasmified bluds look like Zylotol?

[half zenith]

Disturbing question! I don’t know!!! Do I want to know

[trail wagon]

or like Zango

[heavy gyro]

Zylotol probably already mutated a bit

[trail wagon]

Good idea actually

[half zenith]

Ah that’s a good point

[trail wagon]

But why didn't the Abyss creatre do the same thing?

[half zenith]

Could be a coincidence

[trail wagon]

where are cute white horns 🙁

Although it was probably black from the start, since it's the ABYSS creature, but still

[half zenith]

…should I be redesigning my lifeblood afflicted hornet? Horns growing in ways they shouldn’t couldn’t hurt to add (I was gonna add mutations anyway but hadn’t visualized what those are)

(This is a joke lol)

Anyway it’s actually someone else’s horrifying AU that has me asking if Lumaflies are potentially also souls of the dead except not corrupted by silk

[trail wagon]

Oh wow

Are you doing an afflicted Hornet design?

Is it like a skin or just an art?

[half zenith]

Just art

I’ve got a whole AU

[trail wagon]

Ohhhh cool cool

Can I see? :3

[half zenith]

Yeah

Hold on this might take a minute cuz most of the images are saved on another device

This was in response to being asked what silk affliction does mixed with lifeblood

Answer: not a question I ever thought of, but it’ll probably come up later!

[trail wagon]

hahahahaha it looks like Hornet is crying

[trail wagon]

That's interesting btw

[half zenith]

…she has many reasons to. She died in fucking Bilewater for one, so she’s stuck with the maggots

[trail wagon]

Lifeblood maggots?

[half zenith]

Yeahhhhh

[trail wagon]

That's cooool

[half zenith]

Mutated by being in her body and exposed to that much lifeblood

[trail wagon]

You wouldn't normally heal in the muckmaggoted water

[half zenith]

She’s basically a lifeblood zombie, like Zango

[trail wagon]

how would it work now?

ahahahah

now you can't unheal

[half zenith]

How it works now: She has constant plasmium regen on, i still recommend against going in the water for other reasons. The lifeblood is a walking ecological hazard lol

The maggots are in there because she’s dead and corpses do tend to have maggots, they’re passive because of the lifeblood’s influence and don’t eat her silk, instead eating at anything ELSE that shouldn’t be in there or being able to be dispatched on an enemy. Symbiotic relationship(?)

Heres a pencil and paper doodle

Btw Sherma found the body, tried to heal her, accidentally raised her and boy did she come back Wrong. He feels immense guilt over that and is Coping Very Well <3

In this timeline the Whiteward quest happened already, Sherma was there for the haunted hospital level and the horrors within, and yet. And yet. The irony

I have a new doodle from like today that I was told is a mischaracterization. May as well show it because it’s the best and most recent example of what she looks like

Here

I was informed Yarnaby has zero interest in plasmium because she only sees sick. And that’s true. BUT. I think there’s a big difference between Hornet overdosing a little, and what’s going on in my AU

Yarnaby seems interested in medical curiosities and/or anomalies (that’s how I took her default door dialogue), and you’d think someone bringing in a zombie and asking how to make them a little less… dead would be at least MILDLY interesting

[inner torrent]

What am I seeing?

[inner torrent]

Woaaaah that's peak

I have a oc of a Ladybug that has lifeblood on it's body, and I'm thinking over how to make her more "Corrupted" although I'm not sure how corrupted I want her to be

[frigid belfry]

from what we see they are unrelated, lumaflies are their own bugs, silkflies are the souls of pilgrims turned into a different form

[inner torrent]

The real question is what are the monarchflies?

Maybe souls of bugs with a powerful soul affinity

[inner torrent]

Actually, most bugs have a specific hex code for the white faces that isn't purely white, although I think this is not the most consistent thing in the game

[silk dirge]

yeah but like are we fr saying sherma is a pale being

like that is just blatantly wrong 😭

sherma is too innocent to be a pale being

[inner torrent]

Yep, tbh the most likely thing is team cherry just discarded that leit motiv, if it even was a motiv In s start

[muted lantern]

shermas lulling us into a false sense of security, hes actually a nosk and ate all the judges that blocked his way.

[frigid belfry]

balright

[inner torrent]

I just remembered nosk can actually take a prey body size, not just the head

[muted lantern]

Oh that is a cool detail, him potentially already mutating is a cool idea too.

[trail wagon]

Yeahhh

[sinful nimbus]

But PK is more innocent than Sherma

[unique canopy]

That would be an interesting concept, a young pale being who just innocently wants to be friends with everyone

[silk dirge]

act 4 silkpost video flashbacks

sherma is a god whos using us to eliminate any opposition to him

you know those stories of like gods transforming into poor people to see who helps them and then annihilating everyone who doesnt afterwards

[frigid belfry]

sherma the star

[silk dirge]

what if sherma is like that

since hornet helped sherma in whiteward

shes safe

everyone else tho...

[trail wagon]

sherma is the Master Zi warned us about

[silk dirge]

the secret sherma - mr mushroom connection

fun fact mr mushroom literally exists only bc of the empty nook where cornifer is in fungal wastes exists

[trail wagon]

Slab files?

[lunar wagon]

||do we have an explanation for how this bih fades in and out of reality for aura points when shes voided||

i forgot spoilers r allowed

[sinful nimbus]

Not really

Kinda similar to Phantom's wraiths though

[inner torrent]

Hornet is going crazy due to the void fumes

[halcyon merlin]

its clearly because hornet got the silkheart from lace

[narrow horizon]

what a cutie pie he's so real for that

[narrow horizon]

Lace has evolved so far past the common bug in the art of ragebaiting Hornet that she is capable of astral projecting her soul to torment and ragebait Hornet wherever she goes

it's her favorite activity

[dawn sluice]

and she can only do this to hornet in particular

no one else

they developed this in 3 minutes out of sheer spite and hate

[pseudo raptor]

Maybe that and a mix of how threads keep memories?

[narrow horizon]

perhaps she could have done it with others, but she has no desire too

[narrow horizon]

i wouldn't say hate

[dawn sluice]

yeah
hate is a strong word

[narrow horizon]

she does it for the love of the game

[lunar wagon]

i genuinely cant tell if lace hates hornet or if shes js a cutie pie tsundere

[dawn sluice]

genuine malice

[pseudo raptor]

Envy

[narrow horizon]

https://tenor.com/view/silksong-spoilers-silksong-hollow-knight-lace-hornet-gif-1369488558298384028

[dawn sluice]

NO

[narrow horizon]

(lace has been doing this for the past 5 minutes every time hornet stops at a new floor)

[sinful nimbus]

lace evil af dawg

something something sundowner

[dawn sluice]

lace is mentally ill?

[sinful nimbus]

No the dope cyborg

[dawn sluice]

the one who's INVINCIBLE

with a RED SUN

[pseudo raptor]

I mean she's definitely mentally ill

[sinful nimbus]

no WAY

[visual glacier]

Silk snipper

[frigid belfry]

silk can do fuckall in this universe hornet conjures a fucking flower from her dreams

[dawn sluice]

they definitely live in a CLOCK TOWER

[frigid belfry]

makes sense that lace can astral project too

[inner torrent]

Silk is silky

[lunar wagon]

yeah trvthnvke but that required like 3 level 1000 boss' powers right

seems like more than crude oil and some silk

[dawn sluice]

the snail shamans probably refine that stuff

[inner torrent]

Although, isn't the red memory like, a shaman thing, so wouldn't it be soul?

[lunar wagon]

shii twin idk twin

[lunar wagon]

? crude oil and silk would be the shi theyre going against in that instance

oh im stupid i thought u were tryna answer lore

[dawn sluice]

did they just unsilk the soul

[stray fog]

I don't see the similarities

Sorry

[trail wagon]

Prolly just hallucinations

Also, I think is' pretty sad we don't really get to see how big Bellhart actually is. Look at how it used to look, the background was much more pronounced and we can see so many bellhouses and their shining windows, now it's just blurred, and we can only see from the outside

[muted lantern]

Are these guys the same species (the hunters journal doesnt show it but these guys have the same back shell covered in bumps) Are the huge ones the older ones, or is it a form of sexual dimorphism?

[trail wagon]

Honestly, I feel like Silksong has one small visual problem, the backgrounds are a bit too blurred. Quite often we don’t even get a clear sense of how big a place is unless we pay closer attention to the background. I unfortunately didn’t, since I was more focused on the foreground, breakable walls, and enemies, so only recently have I started noticing it

[muted lantern]

blurry backgrounds are an interesting stylistic choice but i do find myself wishing they werent blurred

it might help with gameplay though so the bg doesnt distract

I know rain world had a huge issue with background elements being mistaken for platforms you can stand on

mainly watcher dlc tho

[trail wagon]

They're probably not, some dialogue suggests the Sentinels were used to kidnap some bugs to make them work in the Underworks, so they're probably different species

[trail wagon]

I mean I don't mind them being blurred, they've done it in the first game too

[muted lantern]

their shells look exactly the same though, the only difference is the back bumps are less pointy on the small one

[silk dirge]

yeah its for gameplay purposes

[muted lantern]

lemme get a screenshot

[silk dirge]

i think they should allow you to turn it off tho

[trail wagon]

But sometimes a lot of people miss out on the entire picutre, imo

[silk dirge]

like have a bg blur slider

[trail wagon]

Yeah, that's understandable

[trail wagon]

Ohhh, wait, the small one also does the shell shield parry?

[trail wagon]

I mean just look, it's gorgeous

[muted lantern]

heres a shot of their shell

[trail wagon]

And also very massive and cool

[trail wagon]

But we don't actually really see that in the game

[muted lantern]

they curl up into the shell too and skitter around like the big guys

[trail wagon]

Idk not sure, perhaps

[muted lantern]

god that looks awesome

honestly silksong is such a step above the original in its level and enemy design imo.

[trail wagon]

Yeah, that's for sure, it's like million times better

[muted lantern]

enemies are way more persistent and dynamic, harder to just run past too

and a lot of the region designs i find more interesting, though hk has some standouts that are hard to beat

[trail wagon]

As Jack Vine said "I think the bosses in Silksong are much more agressive. In HK they would attack the player based on their position, in Silksong they do it based on their own position"

Or something like that

Basically, in Silksong they analyze if they can pull off a certain attack and do so depending on their own position

[solar tapir]

Yeah, it's awesome looking, but really hard to see full surroundings from Hornet perspective, especially when it's all blurred. Sometimes i even didnt understand where i am.

First game also have this. It was hard to tell the scale of city of tears on the first entering and even see the spires too

[trail wagon]

Yeah, like I didn't even notice the giant pillars before

[real torrent]

in some videos it looks less blurred

not sure why

maybe some kind of mod?

[visual glacier]

You can turn the blur down in settings

[real torrent]

what.

[lapis knoll]

just blur quality

[visual glacier]

Oh

[foggy fractal]

there's only like 2 blur qualities you can select though
and even the smallest amount of blur is still a lot

[lean osprey]

any validity behind the idea that pale beings seem to be distinct from other essence based higher beings in the way they seem to need to "elevate" pre-existing bugs for worship, rather than birth them from their essence in the way that unn, nh and radiance did, i suppose lace and phantom may be counterexamples but they seem to me to be more "constructs" than bugs in the way the mosskin, moths and such are

[visual glacier]

Don’t think so

Pale beings actually seem to have an association with soup

Soul*

[lean osprey]

yea ive heard and believe that, was just wondering if this could somehow be a result of that or something

[visual glacier]

White lady doesn’t elevate anyone

It’s a wyrm thing

[lean osprey]

grandmother silk also does it

[random harbor]

Mister Mushroom - General - Dream Nailed

...Wyrms pull bugs into their thrall,
Till ages pass and kingdoms fall,
Caps and shells may fall to dust,
But Mr Mushroom readjusts...

@glorkishjames used /npcs wanderers name: Mister Mushroom category: General dialogue: Dream Nailed

[lean osprey]

and the white lady is in cahoots with the pale king anyway

[visual glacier]

Not in mass

[lean osprey]

eh i suppose not but i feel that isnt particularly relevant

[visual glacier]

“Cahoots” it’s not a secret bro

She’s literally the queen

[lean osprey]

we really gonna focus on random word choice here

[visual glacier]

Yeah

[lean osprey]

anyway

the line of thought could also be used to tenuously justify the lifeblood beast as a higher being by the same vain

if u consider the lifeblood creatures in the same sense as the mosskin and moths

but idk bout that one

[lean osprey]

the fact that phantom seems to be unraveling/unable to sustain herself for long independent of gms seems to lend evidence to this idea

[stray fog]

You could say that the pale king elevated the bugs of hallownest

By granting them higher thought

[lean osprey]

@sinful nimbus wait u kind of cooked with the hk masculinity thing

saw someone mention it the other day to discredit u and started thinking about it

[visual glacier]

???

You think hk is about toxic masculinity?

[lean osprey]

not sure

whether its intentional or not it is definitely a valid interpretation imo

i think it could for sure be an intended theme yea but i don't think intentionality is especially important

[real torrent]

why did the pale king only elevate some bugs and not primal aspids or the other wild bugs

[visual glacier]

I guess some bugs are to beastial to be fully elevated

That’s why bug and beast are commonly differentiated

[dire sinew]

wdym elevate

[visual glacier]

Pale king giving them minds

[real torrent]

"enlighten" like evolve

[lean osprey]

perhaps they didnt have the potential to be elevated in the first place

[visual glacier]

“For none could tame our savage souls yet you the challenge met”

[dire sinew]

?? they had minds beforr

[visual glacier]

They were savages

Base instincts

“Under palest watch, you taught, we changed, base instincts were redeemed”

[dire sinew]

i get that

[visual glacier]

By giving them minds I meant giving them minds like people, not animals

Some more proof “The Wyrm becomes beacon, minds expanded, to yield, to devote. Eternity in promise and charge in progeny cursed”

“...No king... No mind... Release...”

[lean temple]

Well they still needed some bugs as animals to eat and stuff

[lapis knoll]

Are the bugs that captured Hornet sentient or haunted?

[dire lynx]

pretty sure theyre haunted

ill try find the dialogue

[craggy smelt]

haunted

Hornet mentions them being guided by a will

under the Envoy journal entry

Bugs like these crossed the caves to bring me to Pharloom. I cut down many before my capture. Then I had thought them minded and cunning. Now I see the singular will that haunts them all.

[lapis knoll]

Ah thank you

[dire lynx]

yup thats the one

[frozen hornet]

But is the beacon an actual magic or just a metaphor for schools or something like that? The second option makes sense to me too.

[visual glacier]

It’s probably both magic and teaching

After all, elevated bugs lose their memories when leaving the kingdom

[lethal burrow]

am back

what da topic

[craggy smelt]

the magical beacon would give them the capacity for higher thought, the kingdom would provide culture and knowledge and so forth

[stray fog]

So the haunting can reach all the way to hallownest

Like the envoy didn't disconnect from the hive mind even when in hallownest

Or maybe it has nothing to do with range and I'm comparing it to Bluetooth too much

[craggy smelt]

once haunted, it seems like distance isn't an impediment to Silk's will

[inner torrent]

Why are mask makers do isolated?

[visual glacier]

So nobody interrupts them probably

[narrow horizon]

😭😭

[hushed crater]

They want to constenrate better on their craft

[lean temple]

To concentrate more. They get distracted easily because of their sight so being isolated helps them stay focused.

[frosty gate]

Surprisingly, Failed Tramway goes straight to where MM in HK is

[cobalt coyote]

Maybe he set up there after the tramway well.... Failed and used to make masks somewhere else?

[silk dirge]

i think its interesting both mask makers reside in eggs of some kind

[lean temple]

I still don't know what the purpose of it could've been lol

It would've cut right into the fungal core

[stray fog]

Mask eggs mentioned 🔥

[silk dirge]

egg

[dreamy isle]

can anyone share yt video which correctly explains hk silksong story

[stark ocean]

mossbag

[silk dirge]

mossbag is pretty good

[dreamy isle]

alr

ty

[lean temple]

No video is 100% accurate just keep in mind

[whole holly]

which is more powerful higher being? GMS or Radiance?

[dreamy isle]

oh , why??

when we will get clarity?

[lean temple]

shrug
The Radiance's power is less restricted ig

[stray fog]

Some things are debatable

[whole holly]

yeah, i agree Void needed to be unified to Defeat Radiance, but Regular Void consumed GMS and her Silk

[lean temple]

Some things are vague, incomplete, or unclear. Open to debate and interpretation. It's also possible for the video presenter to state assumption and headcanon as fact.

They can misinterpret things or straight up miss details. Humans are prone to error.

[lean temple]

I wasn't saying Radiance is outright stronger. Powerscaling HK is very dubious. I just feel Radiance is less restricted since she needs thoughts to infect, not silk like GMS needs to haunt.

[whole holly]

yes, that's also true

[copper fiber]

on one hand, gms fought of the void for a long time while radiance was consumed quite quickly
on the other hand, radiance was up against the knight and the hollow knight who were both focusing the void, while gms was against the void in its raw form

imo they're about equal

and hornet would beat the shit out of the radiance just as easily as the knight did

[silk dirge]

i think its worth noting gms just woke up

[tepid mountain]

Crack theory that I’ve been thinking about: GMS didn’t just wake up when Hornet challenges her.

The reason she seems to conveniently wake up right when Hornet arrives is because that’s what GMS does every time a weaver is brought to her. She comes out of the cocoon to absorb/bind/whatever the weaver, then goes back into the cocoon until the next one.

And she’s just been waiting to build up enough power from absorbed weavers before actually revealing herself to the kingdom and taking over again.

[lean temple]

She's already doing that

It's stated that Hornet's presence increased GMS's stirring

And the whole "come child, witness our waking"

And Widow cheering her on to wake

[pale narwhal]

Some of mossbag's points are speculation and interpretation of implicit lore

[tepid mountain]

Hm. I guess “witness our waking” does kinda make that fall apart, doesn’t it? Outside of it just being deception on GMS’s part for some reason, but that feels like too much speculation.

[lean temple]

Also that Widow has tried and failed to wake GMS before

[tepid mountain]

I wonder what the process for binding the previous weavers brought to her was then. It was just contactless?

[frosty gate]

What are we talking about

[frosty gate]

You mean GMS? She can still control Silk outside her cocoon

[tepid mountain]

Yeah, but I figured there would need to be something more direct for actually binding a weaver to herself. But I guess if there’s someone that could do it through just Silk control, it would be GMS.

[frosty gate]

The same way she made them, she unmade them probably

We don't even see corpses

Wasn't someone theorizing about Weavers each having a Silk Heart?

[honest sun]

every bug can like, bind silk or focus soul to heal?

[heavy gyro]

Do we even know if gms is fully awake when she leaves the cocoon

You get the journal entry after defeating her and it says she is "desperate to wake"

But idk

[honest sun]

why couldnt hornet like, pick any weapon thats on the ground rathe than her needle? idk if it has smth to do with the crests

[frosty gate]

She is fully awake, just a bit weak, idk why it says that

[frosty gate]

We are not sure. Binding silk is definitely a Weaver thing, but Focusing... We just don't know

Focusing isn't always healing either

Nor is Binding

[frosty gate]

Why would she fight with anyother weapon rather than her own?

[sinful nimbus]

God bless

[frosty gate]

I'm afraid to ask

[lean temple]

No. Focusing includes using manipulating soul which not many bugs can do, and binding similarly seems like a Weaver thing. Shamans and soul twisters can focus to cast spells and manipulate Soul, they're not shown to use it to heal.

[frosty gate]

Don't think I didn't see that message

[frosty gate]

I'm still unsure if focusing is need to cast spells

[lean temple]

It is. Soul Sanctum bugs and Shamans need to focus

[honest sun]

then groal the great doesnt focus but manipulates soul??

or

[frosty gate]

When do we see Shamans focus

[lean temple]

He does. The skull on his head acts like a focusing crest

[sinful nimbus]

Come back when you're feeling courageous

[lean temple]

When they cast spells. They have a special type of focus too (spiral focus)

[frosty gate]

The only thing we know about Spiral Focus is the name

We don't really know what it does

[lean temple]

Focus lore is pretty vague but my understanding is that it is a technique used to manipulate Soul and perhaps thoughts as well

[frosty gate]

I will give it to you though, Soul Sanctum ones do seem to focus

[honest sun]

this isnt hk lore channel but if wyrms/pale beings can see the future/predict (could they?) then thats why hornet and tk respawn in a bench when they die?

[frosty gate]

We can agree on that, but Focus looks so specific

[lean temple]

That's one interpretation but it isn't canon (not verified or confirmed in game)

And only Wyrms are known to have foresight

However the nature of it is also unclear

We consider respawning to be not canon

[frosty gate]

Like, when either PV or TK focus there's soul all around them
Focus is also considered a spell and not the casting method

As TK we don't Focus to do spells, we only Focus to heal

But PV focuses to cast a massive rune rage

[lean temple]

You focus soul to achieve different outcomes

Focusing is the act itself, the outcomes vary

THK focuses soul into spells, TK focuses soul to heal its shell

[stray fog]

Another detail to support this is that when they respawn, they jolt up as if waking up from a nightmare

Its a cool theory but idk if we'll ever get more info about it

[lean temple]

Dying doesn't undo what you did in the world. It's not a vision

[honest sun]

its a........ hollow knight theory?

[frosty gate]

I just wish we had more info on it

[lean temple]

It's one of those things intentionally kept vague

[frosty gate]

I don't think that Manipulation and Focusing is the same thing

[stray fog]

I remember one of the mask makers saying that a mask is needed to focus

What was that about

[frosty gate]

Let me check first but i think i know what they mean

Which one? Silksong o rHK

[stray fog]

Idk

[honest sun]

mmmm sinner does bind too but for spells and '''''''''heal''''''''''

[lean temple]

Weaver ability. Hornet does the same

[stray fog]

Yeah

Rune rage is a bind

[honest sun]

she binds for both of them

[lean temple]

Since Weavers don't use soul in its native form and instead use silk, the technique they employ to use it is different, binding instead of focusing

[frosty gate]

It was HK's
"A mask! A face! Does it need one? Does it not? To define. To focus. To exist."

I don't think it means to Focus like we do, but to literally focus as a person

[lean temple]

Yea it seems misleading

[frosty gate]

Mask Makers need their masks to focus in their work, for example

[lean temple]

To focus your identity or smthg

[stray fog]

The other definition seems more like the intended one

[frosty gate]

Yeah, but what's interesting is that she does the full binding thing in order to heal and cast spells, which is different from Focusing, I think

[frosty gate]

Wdym?

[stray fog]

The focus we were talking about earlier

Not focusing as in paying attention

Focusing as in using soul

[frosty gate]

But they don't use soul

[stray fog]

Maybe focusing has more uses

Like the godseekers giving focus to the void to make the shade lord somehow

[lean temple]

Focusing thoughts is a thing, and we know masks are painted with pale lacquer

[frosty gate]

Attunement is its own thing afawk

[lean temple]

Godseeker masks have focusing crests on them

[stray fog]

Do we know that those things are for focusing?

I thought that was a theory

[frosty gate]

Honestly, that's a term never used in game iirc, but i could be wrong

It is an oddity for sure

[random harbor]

Hunter's Journal: Weathered Mask

Description:
Strange mask from a godless land, passed down over time. The design suggests the wearer's thoughts were focused through the crest.

Hunter's notes:
"Gods of Thunder, Gods of Rain! Why forsake thy servants? Will Our minds be left suffering, to ache alone? What God remains to deliver Us from this woeful silence?"
- Lament of the Godseekers

@blue14113 used /journal name: Weathered Mask text: Full Text

[stray fog]

🤔

[lean temple]

"The design suggests the wearer's thoughts were focused through the crest"

[frosty gate]

Fair enough

So attunement is just another fancy way of focus?

[stray fog]

I'm honestly lost on the exact lore behind masks, focusing, and crests

[lean temple]

It's some of the more cryptic lore

It's understandable to feel lost

[sinful nimbus]

Focus is a word that means to concentrate something in one spot I don't think these two instances are related

Like how Silksong likes to use the word essence independent of Essence Essence

[frosty gate]

Before we change the topic, I wanna clear this, the Focus MM talks about isn't Focusing soul

I made the MM example because masks seem to literally change a Maker

[lean temple]

Yea we agree on this

[frosty gate]

They are literally not in their right mind while wearing a mask

[frosty gate]

Dhruv didn't seem to

[honest sun]

wait who made the godseeker's masks

[stray fog]

What is the "to define " part about? To define itself / it's own identity?

[lean temple]

Unknown. Probably themselves (most likely, they made the tuner as well)

[stray fog]

Yeah

[frosty gate]

Probably yeah

[frosty gate]

Yeah you agree or yeah you dont agree?

[stray fog]

I don't agree, but let's agree to disagree ig

[frosty gate]

Maybe another Maker? They seem to be everywhere

[lean temple]

They are unlike MM masks

[honest sun]

mmmmmmm mask maker god

[lean temple]

The Godseekers likely made them themselves or at least commissioned them

[frosty gate]

I just say it because of this dialogue in Silksong:

"Ahh. Old One. Your kind should know it's rude to expose me such. Unmasked, the task becomes heavy
Hornet: I had the desire to hear you lucid, Maker, though you may protest."

[stray fog]

Oh

[honest sun]

wait so to who the mask makers do masks? the bugs? i though bugs didnt have masks and it was part of their face

[frosty gate]

Unmasked, the task becomes heavy
They need the mask to work

[stray fog]

This dialogue convinces me to switch sides

[frosty gate]

Also, Makers change personality when they don't have their masks

[honest sun]

so it IS to focus

[lean temple]

For bugs yeah. Sometimes mask refers to your actual face, sometimes not. It gets confusing

[frosty gate]

When wearing masks, they only work and talk about masks

When you drop them, they speak to you clearly

[frosty gate]

Yes, but not Focus soul, just like, concentrate on the task

[honest sun]

so what if i have a mask but i put another mask over it

[lean temple]

You'll gain the effect of the added mask

[frosty gate]

If anything this gives us a clue that mask really make a personality

[honest sun]

so vessels have vessels as heads or is it their masks

[stray fog]

No idea

[stray fog]

They're born with a mask, I assume

[frosty gate]

Huuuuuh

Vessels have like

[lean temple]

Hornet refers to her face as her mask so do with that what you will

[frosty gate]

Grown masks

[honest sun]

its their head

[frosty gate]

Their head is a mask

[stray fog]

Have we seen anyone unmasked? (except the mask makers)

[honest sun]

because i dont see a vessels taking its head of for a more larger vessel when it grows in size

[frosty gate]

The commission theory feels correct

[honest sun]

their vessels/heads grow too

[frosty gate]

Midwife?

[honest sun]

i think its part of her body

[lean temple]

False mask

[stray fog]

Nymm has his own mask (presumably), but with the grimm troupe mask, he changes personalities

Quirell also has multiple masks

[frosty gate]

Still a Mask, she doesn't have anything below it

[lean temple]

And yet Monomon's mask doesn't change his personality much, just lets him live long and stay sane

[frosty gate]

Quirrel doesn't wear Monomon's mask

He just has it on him

[honest sun]

sometimes

[stray fog]

Her unmasked face is different from the unmasked mask makers for some reason

[frosty gate]

I mean, it's a different species

[lean temple]

She doesn't have the sight

[stray fog]

The mask makers have swirly eyes iirc

[stray fog]

True

[honest sun]

i dont think herrah or lumien can take off their masks, maybe yes, if yes, then what would happen if quirrel had the 3 dreamers masks

[frosty gate]

You know what I think it's interesting?

[honest sun]

masks

[frosty gate]

Who made the Dreamer masks?

The Maker doesn't say anything about them

[lean temple]

Pale King commissioned them most likely

[frosty gate]

You'd think MM would say something about it

[lean temple]

Well PK had to be involved some way

[honest sun]

therefore IT MEANS that somehow somehow hornet could wear her mothers masks like quirrel

[stray fog]

Why did the dreamers need new masks anyway?

Does the mask let them sleep eternally

[lean temple]

To concentrate on the job?

[honest sun]

pk has a work shop and its an certified enginier so maybe he creates powerful masks idk

[stray fog]

They probably had another mask already

[lean temple]

Monomon seems fine without it

[pale narwhal]

who even says they did
those could have already been their masks

[honest sun]

wait then pk head its just their head right¡

?

[stray fog]

Herrah is confirmed to have had a different face5

[lean temple]

They aren't. Herrah's real face isn't the Dreamer mask

[frosty gate]

It seems like they're seals

[honest sun]

why cant we see her then

[lean temple]

She installed some sort of extra protection on herself

[honest sun]

thats why she has a piece of clothe on her head

[stray fog]

The other Weavers were wearing red dresses too

[lean temple]

When Hornet attacks Monomon's mask it gives off a bright glow

[frosty gate]

Actually, Masks are seals, not the thing that puts them to sleep