sk-lore

[midnight zinc]

Lacenet had legitimately zero aura you are delusional

[edgy nebula]

and that theyre both related

[sinful nimbus]

Stern and cold meets playful and taunting

And enemies to lovers is tuff

[frosty beacon]

are trobbio bombs actually pimpillos? /srs

[sinful nimbus]

No

[edgy nebula]

no

[frosty beacon]

aww

[teal drift]

I think PK smells like a crisp autumn afternoon, Radiance smells like burnt leaves

[frosty beacon]

i wanted to talk about potential trobbio being a part of firebug cult but ok

[edgy nebula]

theyre probably like firecrackers

[fathom hill]

hornet was called the gendered child implying shes the outlier and not the norm

is ss woke?

[sinful nimbus]

they be smoke bombs

Gendered child probably refers to sex

[edgy nebula]

theyre smoke bombs/fireworks

[midnight zinc]

Okay but have you considered that this has been done to death and none of the promo material for Silksong established the “lovers” part of enemies to lovers?

[sinful nimbus]

Child with a sex isn't as auraful ig

[rain gate]

I've seen sentnet

[sinful nimbus]

Nothing wrong with a cliche and no one cares it would've been the plot twist

[frosty beacon]

smoke bombs that are as powerful as an ancient silk hb slapping you with full force lmao

[sinful nimbus]

kinda goated...

[midnight zinc]

“Auraful” I’m gonna inject lifeblood into my eyeballs

[quick geyser]

No way I came back to this

[frosty beacon]

sentnet >>>>>>>> lacenet but both are good

[sinful nimbus]

Slabfly genocide supporter meets Citadel Slaver and INSTANTLY falls in love

[tawdry flare]

it did but enemies to siblings is much more fun

[quick geyser]

Elaborate good sir

[silk dirge]

what if hornet was aroace

[frosty beacon]

sentinel x hornet is way better than lace x hornet

[teal drift]

I cannot give my lacenet take without erring

[frosty beacon]

me! :3

[silk dirge]

also me

[quick geyser]

Any reason sir 🤔

[sinful nimbus]

Do you prefer tuffalicious?

[teal drift]

Sentinel and Hornet is sooooo much better than that trash ship

[silk dirge]

i cant wait to start hrt and find out if it changes my sexuality bc apparently that can happen

[edgy nebula]

someone brought up mask maker x eva once and lowkey it's peak

[frosty beacon]

because robots are cooler than silk creatures don't @ me

[midnight zinc]

Holy fucking based

[teal drift]

Gas

[midnight zinc]

Yeah actually, run with that one plz

[quick geyser]

Acceptable opinion

[sinful nimbus]

🗣️ 🔥

[rain gate]

Plus the narrative parallels

[sinful nimbus]

Second Sentinel is actually a Hornet parallel so I could see it

Yeah you gets it

[frosty beacon]

hmm?

[silk dirge]

second sentinel x twelth architect

[teal drift]

Garmond X Shakra but as friends

[frosty beacon]

2 and 12 is an ok ship

[teal drift]

Ballow and Me, the player

[quick geyser]

Daily remind: Garmond and Shakra never interacted 💔

[silk dirge]

💀

[teal drift]

The only thing i need from dlc

[sinful nimbus]

It reflects Hornet's time as Hallownest's sentinel (Hence the name Second Sentinel) guarding a dead kingdom and testing vessels

[silk dirge]

ballow and forge daughter

[rain gate]

Both have the whole "Sentinel of a dying land" bit

[frosty beacon]

daily reminder that lugroali is the best ship in skong

[limpid summit]

You can’t even have them both fight in the gauntlet

[teal drift]

Repulsive

[frosty beacon]

oh wait that's clever

[rain gate]

And hornet sees herself in sentinel

[teal drift]

The gourmand x skull tyrant

[limpid summit]

Imagine a quintuple fight where Sherma gives healing buffs with his song

[edgy nebula]

lowkey i ship mottled skarr x the spears in his back

[quick geyser]

I thought that was obvious. Like Hornet was literally projecting when she activated the second sentinel 😭

[silk dirge]

im only saying this bc i saw a if ballow had whatsapp meme and the first message was this

[teal drift]

The only ship i actually support is now hornet and sentinel thats gad

[frosty beacon]

sentnet

[midnight zinc]

No unironically this is way more thematically rich, and also establishes a sufficient tragic element from the jump, sentinel lacks the ability to physically feel. But its robotic nature gives it the potential to last indefinitely alongside Hornet, being her first partner to not age out and die.

This is the first time a non canon HK ship has interested me holy hell

[teal drift]

Ballow is like my favorite npc and i love how not alone i am in thwt

[edgy nebula]

ballow is one of my favorites

[tawdry flare]

shawkra is literally canon tho

[edgy nebula]

i mustve missed the part where the two kissed

[tawdry flare]

yeah its pretty easy to miss

[midnight zinc]

Do you see the pale king and white lady kiss???

[frosty beacon]

i also may or may not be biased by this being one of the funniest images i've ever seen

[silk dirge]

ok but heres the question is second sentinel as cool when you realize its basically dating the soul of a dead person forced into eternal servitude

[pearl tinsel]

HOW EMBARRASING

[teal drift]

Mooshka and Grishkin have a thing on the dl

[pearl tinsel]

i post my rant to the wrong channel

[edgy nebula]

yeah you didnt see the secret pale king and white lady kiss scene after the 2nd path of pain?

[sinful nimbus]

Well PK hates his wife and probably only wanted her for the vessel project so its not really a couple

[silk dirge]

wl was a gold digger

[midnight zinc]

Whoever made this was steered by divine inspiration 😂

[pearl tinsel]

okay so.
plasmium.
ive done. SO MUCH FREAKING THEORIZING ABOUT IT
allow me to be on the defense of plasmium
allow me to summerize my claim;
plasmium is not like The Infection
lifeblood is not like The Infection
It isnt infectious, nor is it as malicious
this leads to my first analysis of lifeblood
it isnt infectious
the only reason it spread in the wormways was due to zango injecting plasmium in the terrain and creatures
none of the pilgrims are plasmified, only the landscape, creatures, and the alchemists themselves
direct consequences of their actions, not the nature of lifeblood itself.
hornet's contempt of zango may support this
"His final fate seems fair reward for those efforts, yet I feel some sympathy." - zango hunters journal
especially the alchemist himself,
he admitted that he injects plasmium into himself, which is most likely why he got infected
the case of hallownest can also serve as an example
lifeblood, despite hallownest being long fading, hasnt taken it over.
my second analysis,
lifeblood only has severe consequences when there if more lifeblood than bug
lifeblood only has severe consequences when there if more lifeblood than bug
this point is a bit more iffy, but i still think it has some evidence behind it
in hk, both salubra and the hunter admit to drinking lifeblood, neither have suffered any consequences
under90 Sarahj | gim troupe

— 9:28 PM
one may argue that it is because they only had moderate amounts, which i would say is completely correct
so, this establishes lifeblood is more or less safe3 when in moderation
but exceeding moderation is where consequences are
take hornets plasmification for instance
incase you forgot, having 9 masks of lifeblood plasmifies hornet
the number, being 1 less than the max amount of masks hornet has, i'd think if evidence of it being the tipping point to where there is more lifeblood than normal fluids/flesh/whatever
the bloated appearance of plasimified enemies may also serve as evidence

of course theyd be bloated if their innards were doubles before / after plasmificatoin

[silk dirge]

if radiance was smart she wouldve dated pk

[teal drift]

WL probably hust airmailed the eggs to the PK for fertilization

[sinful nimbus]

cuh I ain't readin allat 🥀

[pearl tinsel]

ALSO BY THE WAY SORRY FOR FLOODING CHAT

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet calls it an infection anyways so 🥴

Oh sorry not cuh I mean bro

[quick geyser]

3 original sentence left 💔

[midnight zinc]

I hate this server so much holy shit

[sinful nimbus]

Also Hornet notes she saw plasmification in Hallownest

[spark valve]

it's ok joker isn't watching

[frosty beacon]

...joni right?

[spark valve]

no

[pearl tinsel]

which completely makes sense,

[teal drift]

Is there a reason you keep doing the cuh bit pengu

[pearl tinsel]

bugs who dont know how it works would take too much,

[edgy nebula]

probably when tk beat her ass in p5 😂

[silk dirge]

joker should get his nickname changed to hoker

[teal drift]

I need to read the textblock hold on s sefond

[pearl tinsel]

perfectly in line withmy theory

[midnight zinc]

Historically accurate kingdom disputes

[sinful nimbus]

got crashed out on for saying it 🥀

[muted lantern]

Why??

[teal drift]

Is it a bad word?

[silk dirge]

the ultimate way to cause crashouts is nyleth wilted rose

[frosty beacon]

nyleth 🥀

have i succeeded in causing someone to crashout

[midnight zinc]

No it’s just cringe and is an ironic adaptation of aave

[muted lantern]

I got hit with a car 6 times the moment you sent that does that count

[pearl tinsel]

tl;dr PLASMIUM ISNT EVIL

[midnight zinc]

I’m about to move like the hulk

[frosty beacon]

ooh that was fun ragebait

[pearl tinsel]

we [YOU AND ME] should go eat lfieblood

[sinful nimbus]

No it doesn't we don't see any of that in Joni's Repose

Obvious retcons are obvious

[pearl tinsel]

joni is a special case.

[teal drift]

Tbh its more like an ironic adoption of an actual adoption of aave since people actually used cuh

[pearl tinsel]

FIRST OF ALL their blessing manipulates lifeseeds,

[teal drift]

But not worth discourse ooo

[pearl tinsel]

making mindless creatures scuttle towards the user, instead of away

[pearl tinsel]

SECOND OF ALL they obviously didnt lose their mind despite being COMPLETELY lifeblood

[midnight zinc]

An adoption on the part of white gen z kids, which is why it’s cringe, but yeah not the place for this discourse

[sinful nimbus]

First they came for ts then they came for 🥀 then they came for cuh

[silk dirge]

does hornet say 67 anywhere in silksong

[muted lantern]

Nyleth when she smells pie cooling on a windowsill

[frosty beacon]

oh my god i've never looked at this in a vacuum, why is this stagger so sad

[midnight zinc]

Ari cooked with this one

[pearl tinsel]

🥀

[quick geyser]

Is grass blue?

[muted lantern]

yeah its the scene where she brutally beats sherma to death

[frosty beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/simpleflips-gif-11142067914485832931

[teal drift]

Did you really not encounter the 67th vaultkeeper?

[sinful nimbus]

The species around her are not and there's no clear sign of plasmification... anywhere

[silk dirge]

is that cardinius

[sinful nimbus]

Like c'mon Lifeblood infection was clearly not the intention

[frosty beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/coney-coneyzz-guess-the-character-screaming-mr-streamer-gif-1328828352267649119

[pearl tinsel]

maybe they just. ate it before it could be pure plasmium. or something.

[sinful nimbus]

what?

[quick geyser]

Huh?

[pearl tinsel]

those vines arent matured lifeblood organisms[?]

[teal drift]

I mean lifeblood always has looked sorta like infection so i see it

[pearl tinsel]

im not really sure

[midnight zinc]

Yes the similarities between lifeseeds and lightseeds was intentional

[sinful nimbus]

Lightblood

[quick geyser]

I used to think light seeds were just lifeseeds but infected 😭

[frosty beacon]

why even rename it in the first place tho? surely zylotl could come up with a more original name than plasmium. is he stupid?

[muted lantern]

yes

[pearl tinsel]

why wouldnt he come up with plasmium

[midnight zinc]

Understandable mistake, though the journal entries make it clear that’s not the case

[teal drift]

Its worth noting that blue and orange oppose each other in the same way black/void and white/pale do

[dry bridge]

this is because the plasmified enemies are a result of injection rather than presumably normal consumption which probably has a more mild effect

[frosty beacon]

what even is "plasma" about lifeblood

[pearl tinsel]

YES THANK YOU

[sinful nimbus]

No Hornet saw plasmification in Hallownest

[midnight zinc]

Uh it’s gooey

[pearl tinsel]

ok so. you know blood plasma

[frosty beacon]

that's so lame

[teal drift]

It seems injecting urself with god substances has consequences in these games

[pearl tinsel]

actually now that i consider it

joni's area does have something nowhere else does

flying lifeblood[?] butterflies

[quick geyser]

Always

[teal drift]

Ur gi tract can handle lifeblood, but lifeblood injection… too far

[sinful nimbus]

That's not to do with plasmification

[pearl tinsel]

maybe it does.

[midnight zinc]

This is pretty easily explained by cases of plasmification being the cause of the lifeblood taboo, and obviously Hornet being the daughter of the king would’ve been a witness to this.

[pearl tinsel]

maybe all the lifeseeds fly away before the can be consumed

[midnight zinc]

And it makes sense that the copious amounts of lifeblood the knight consumed do nothing to it considering it’s not exactly a normal bug

[teal drift]

My “”why its called plasmium” theory is that they wanted the goofiest name so that we would know not to take xylotol seriously

[sinful nimbus]

But even in highly concentrated areas of Lifeblood there is no sign of plasmification so it was clearly not the original intent

[pearl tinsel]

No mind to think. No will to break.

[midnight zinc]

He already looks like he’d have been easy to bully in high school

[teal drift]

Xylotol x Mort

[edgy nebula]

id call him tylenol and take his lunch money

[quick geyser]

Totally lore related

[pearl tinsel]

the reason zango is a boss is so we can bully him

[midnight zinc]

I can’t tell if this is a joke about him being autistic or not but if it is that’s pretty funny

[edgy nebula]

??? no his name sounds like tylenol

[midnight zinc]

Nevermind then

[fathom hill]

layers in this one

[fathom hill]

I hear you

[midnight zinc]

That’s what I’m saying

[dry bridge]

Hornet: The effect of your Plasmium on the beasts here is all too evident. Great change has been inflicted upon them.
Hornet: There is an echo also of other infections I have witnessed. I wonder at the meaning of it all... or if I am perhaps imagining similarities where there are none.
"echo of other infections I have witnessed" is probably a reference to how radiance-infected enemies also grew bright glowing pustules and launched globs of the substance at enemies.
(unless there's another line I'm forgetting)

[sinful nimbus]

In my home caves, when once this substance was allowed to flourish, I saw similar aberrations. This is wonder tainted strong with revulsion.

[dry bridge]

ah feck how did I miss that line on the wiki

[sinful nimbus]

Its one of the journal entries

Don't remember which one

[dry bridge]

ahh I was looking at Zylotol dialogue

[teal drift]

Tbf the thing that could be the difference is having a willing participant spread it. Like it wont plasmify if theres no cult leader willing it and spreading their gunk.

Maybe the infection started off with a few gunk spreaders too.

[fathom hill]

the similar aberrations thing is where the confusion lies with this

[sinful nimbus]

Plasmification is just correlated with the spread of the substance Tylenol only merely accelerated that

[midnight zinc]

Plasmidas journal entry

[teal drift]

HK indicated people had done stuff like xylotol before. These people would be the conditions described as “flourishingl

[fathom hill]

though i still believe that having two junkies injecting lifeblood is not good

[dry bridge]

So, this is the journal entry for Plasmidas, the big hanging worm enemy. With that, and the line with Zylotol in mind, I have to wonder if it's actually in reference to Mawlurks, who are also immobile and (sometimes) hang from the ceiling and behave similarly to Plasmidas

[spark valve]

It may have accelerated things but it’s not necessary for it

[spark valve]

They aren’t lifeblood infected so it’s not about them

[silk dirge]

it wouldnt be the first example of tc writing weird journal entries

[limpid summit]

Yeah if she wasn’t referencing lifeblood specifically I would agree with you

[spark valve]

Wingmould 💀

[dry bridge]

and the line with zylotol in mind

[silk dirge]

and the forbidden ones

[sinful nimbus]

Infected mawleks are not correlated to the spread of Lifeblood

[spark valve]

But she’s not talking with zylotol in the entry she’s specifically talking about lifeblood

[dry bridge]

the line where hornet says plasmified enemies look very similar to HALLOWNEST'S INFECTION

[spark valve]

😐

[midnight zinc]

The wording makes it clear she's talking about "aberrations" of lifeblood, not Radiance infection.

[spark valve]

“this substance”

She’s not talking about similar infections she’s talking about lifeblood specifically

[eternal gazelle]

I actually think there would be a case that this was talking about infection aberrations if it said "where once" and not "when once"

[blissful harbor]

she says she’s seen similar lifeblood infections on her home caves
“ive seen similar (infections) where once this substance was allowed to flourish

[spark valve]

It would be terribly worded if that was the intent

[eternal gazelle]

this is true but it would technically scan

there's not room for ambiguity with the way it is though

[spark valve]

It also would’ve been easy to say where similar substances instead if it was the intent

[midnight zinc]

Again, the apparent taboo on lifeblood only makes sense if you assume there WERE these types of mutations, without assuming that we're back to square one of the past eight years, where there is no explanation for WHY there was a taboo anywhere in HK's text.

All the theories that were made to explain it prior to Silksong were by necessity highly speculative and not conclusive.

[spark valve]

The reason people say it’s inconsistent is because in HK there are places where it’s still allowed to flourish but there aren’t aberrations which is an inconsistency but it doesn’t matter

[sinful nimbus]

"A bit of a taboo" is one heck of an understatement

ts is not a logical lore reveal

[spark valve]

It’s not but whatever

it's almost like tc can change things between games

[sinful nimbus]

That alone is kinda bad but its also just not interesting as an element to the world anymore and the quest makes Hornet look really really bad

TC can change stuff but it makes sense to be disappointed when almost every lore reveal kinda doesn't fit within the context of the first game

[midnight zinc]

Eh, I'd say that's more just because it exists in smaller quantities and in very different circumstances. The exact nature of Joni's blessing is escaping me right now but the Abyss lifeblood area is pretty easily explainable: there's only one type of living creature down there, and the source of the lifeblood is clearly more controlled and directly divine in some way due to the presence of the lifeblood creature/potential HB.

[sinful nimbus]

Atp just make a new IP

[dry bridge]

I suppose the options I see then are:
TC has added some past event wherein some bugs got plasmified, but bc silksong is a sequel this event isn't really extant in the original game, or:
Hornet is talking about the radiance infection, in which case that journal entry is worded really oddly.

[spark valve]

they added extra things that weren't in or implied by hk

[toxic quest]

the main retcons were herrah and lifeblood right

[spark valve]

and snails having a fascination with void that's another one

[toxic quest]

i feel like people canoned snail shamans being void or being related to void

[spark valve]

but they aren't and weren't according to hk

[midnight zinc]

Again, I think the established existence of a lifeblood taboo in Hallownest and Hornet's status as literal Hallownest royalty makes it pretty clear its the former; she'd have personal expiriance with the events that led to the taboo.

[sinful nimbus]

Snail Shamans now are known for their fixation on the Void
3 queens is now canon
The hive is now renowned for their... steelwork? (Minor but still weird)
Herrah is now a weaver
Void tendrils are hostile despite The Knight having Void Heart
Apparently PK's moulds didn't work according to Hornet
Apparently the pale family had no means of pacifying void
The Hollow Knight and Sealed Siblings don't lead into Silksong (No one cares about this one icl)
Hornet is now racist (💀 )

[dry bridge]

yeah, hornet was born before the kingdom's fall, it makes sense she would've been present and possibly even participated in dealing with some lifeblood cult

[toxic quest]

i mean 3 queens isnt like contradictory to anything in hk so its less blatant

[spark valve]

little weavers make no sense

[sinful nimbus]

The hive was isolationist and Hornet's fighting style isn't meaningfully related to the bees

[midnight zinc]

I don't think it has to have been a cult, its possible random citizens just found lifeblood coccoons, decided to drink it, and got absolutely FUCKED

[sinful nimbus]

Oh yeah little weavers

How it feels to replay HK and remember nothing in deepnest is canon anymore

[midnight zinc]

Actually microdosing lifeblood sounds pretty fun, it probably feels like taking heroin

[spark valve]

'surely we'll get deepnest lore expansion'

[midnight zinc]

FALSE! Deepnest lore reduction

[foggy fractal]

surely

[spark valve]

deepnest isn't even the only thing to get negative lore seth has less now than in the riddle

[sinful nimbus]

Sharpe 🚬

[midnight zinc]

Sharpe doesn't count

[sinful nimbus]

Copium

[midnight zinc]

Delusion

[sinful nimbus]

ig he still exists in universe

[dry bridge]

I feel like it would've either had to have been one big event (i.e. an organized group that caused a lot of problems) or many repeating small events to form a proper taboo, but either seems pretty possible tbh. Unless one small event was enough to get lifeblood on the PK's radar and he propaganda'd it into a taboo, I suppose

[silk dirge]

im convinced tc is playing 4d chess with us

[sinful nimbus]

Meet potential devs

[silk dirge]

i mean some of this shit seems too egregious to not be intentionally done

[sinful nimbus]

\🥀

[silk dirge]

wasnt lifeblood spire planned before hk was even done

[midnight zinc]

Actually what the king doesn't want you to know is that he had the kingsmoulds funnel lifeblood into low income neighborhoods in the city of tears

[sinful nimbus]

Everything wants to be a meta commentary nowadays

[silk dirge]

yeah 2017 they were already messing with lifeblood

[midnight zinc]

We've already discussed how silksong is feminist and anti capitalist, I'm now positing that Hollow Knight is anti reaganomics

[sinful nimbus]

"choral tower" ALUO WAS RIGHT

[silk dirge]

what

[midnight zinc]

Actually one thing about SS that has disappointed me is how long we were waiting to see the forest of bones and then the Marrow ended up being the worst area in the game

[silk dirge]

marrow is goated what

[midnight zinc]

It's one of the least interesting areas, there's not a lot to go back and do there after Act 1

[sinful nimbus]

The Marrow is tuff

But also the Forest of Bones is also Deep Docks and Far Fields

[silk dirge]

yeah

far fields is so nice

the lava and greenery is such a cool combo

[sinful nimbus]

true...

[midnight zinc]

I mean maybe that's where they came from but visually speaking, not really

[sinful nimbus]

OG Forest of Bones had some plantlife didn't it

[midnight zinc]

But if we count all three together then yeah its pretty expansive, and has nice variation in the colors

Also moss grotto should be WAY bigger

[sinful nimbus]

holy mother of ugly

[sinful nimbus]

It used to be

[midnight zinc]

It serves as this game's king's pass, but there isn't an equivalent Howling Cliffs, there's one extra long room with a bad bossfight, and the weavernest doesnt count because its visually completely separate

[lapis creek]

real quick what the fuck is a song eater lair

[sinful nimbus]

Bell Eater 🗣️

[silk dirge]

probably early first sinner concept

[sinful nimbus]

Bro used to be important

[frosty beacon]

wait marrow was gonna be an hk region?

[midnight zinc]

Yes

[frosty beacon]

damn

lava textures be damned

[midnight zinc]

Forest of bones was actually one of the original three areas they conceptualized for the game

[frosty beacon]

wait why does it have a better name too

[midnight zinc]

Along with the crossroads (which got expanded to the howling cliffs and crystal peak) and the fungal wastes (which got greenpath, queen's gardens, and fog canyon).

[sinful nimbus]

Nah the Marrow is tough

[frosty beacon]

forest of bones is an infinitely better name

[midnight zinc]

Forest of bones instead became the ancient basin and deepnest and the abyss

[sinful nimbus]

What would be tuffer though is if the Diving Bell took you to a deep lava area named Forest of Bones

[frosty beacon]

marrow is tuff but that name sounds more intense

[halcyon merlin]

just now i noticed how the second last boss in both games only have 1 arm

[frosty beacon]

make it work like an elevator true

[sinful nimbus]

Also the marrow has an insanely good theme

[lapis creek]

PEAK

[midnight zinc]

"it's like poetry, it rhymes"

[halcyon merlin]

🔥

[frosty beacon]

oh my god wait this looks genuinely god awful

abysmal dogshit

[silk dirge]

diving bell could be goated if it lead to a giant weavenest

one of my ideas is you could have lava combining with void

[midnight zinc]

Okay in TC's defense, that was developed so long ago it was when they were still coding in Stencil and hadn't yet switched to Unity.

[frosty beacon]

isn't the abyss weavenest the second largest next to atla

[silk dirge]

yeah but it has like 2 things in it

[spark valve]

atla also is tiny and a huge portion of it isn't even a weavenest

[frosty beacon]

weavenests in general tend to be tiny

[frosty beacon]

yeah ts

[silk dirge]

yesterday we were coming up with a cool idea for improving act 3 and if the whole act was based around crafting the snare you could make weavenests important and add like fast travel between them

[frosty beacon]

bro imagine if all of hk had a hungry knight artstyle like ts, how it would impact the game feel

[silk dirge]

i like how in silksong acts 1 and 2 kinda have fast travel dedicated to them

act 1 has bell beast act 2 has ventrica

there is lots of overlap ofc

you dont unlock all bellways in act 1

[edgy nebula]

the weavenest travel could be silk teleportation like first sinner

[lapis creek]

act 3 has beastling call

[silk dirge]

but now that ive thought of having a teleporter between expanded weavenests

[silk dirge]

oh yeah true

[spark valve]

which perhaps should be in act 2

[silk dirge]

weavenest teleportation would be so fucking sick tho

[frosty beacon]

wow this is what scrolling does to you, it's crazy how much of this was kept in the game

why was the kingdom named loomland that's so goofy

[lapis creek]

anyway i like old hearts a little more for taking down gms in alt act 3

[midnight zinc]

It would feel less serious lol

[lapis creek]

morally ambiguous! also more pharloom lore

[silk dirge]

its interesting to me how spiral sanctuary and bone church were separate before

now theyre all one in the ruined chapel

[frosty beacon]

nothing moss at all

[spark valve]

gms not being the true final boss actually is or at least could be good

[sinful nimbus]

I unfortunately don't really see a way to tie old hearts into the story in a thematically coherent way

[frosty beacon]

wow slab was on the right that's crazy

[sinful nimbus]

You could bring back tuning forks ig

Well no that's not really different

[foggy fractal]

idrc so long as they bring back the bugpipers

[sinful nimbus]

🗣️

[spark valve]

bring back the skarrscrapers

[silk dirge]

my idea is you would have them in the real world ofc and they would be a big sacrifice to save pharloom contrasting with pk making a big sacrifice that in the end failed

[sinful nimbus]

Give the skarrs anything 🥀

[frosty beacon]

dude the ants are already so annoying i don't want another one

[sinful nimbus]

Back in my day we fleshed out our neighboring factions and DIDN'T retcon them out of existence

[spark valve]

wdym they showed big fucking ant towers in early trailers then just said actually no

[lapis creek]

im not giving it to first sinner

[frosty beacon]

they also promised us coral gorge and pharloom bay so

[spark valve]

even in the game as is first sinner fight is basically an evolution of gms's

[sinful nimbus]

Hmm

[spark valve]

also fs would make sense especially if she is atla

[lapis creek]

it's not a retcon it's just a con

[sinful nimbus]

I'm not sure I'd have the heart to kill coral gorge

[frosty beacon]

how do we tell her

[sinful nimbus]

?

My goat wouldn't be washed

[silk dirge]

i mean would you have the heart to do vessel project

[spark valve]

as true final boss

[lapis creek]

flip it

[spark valve]

no ew

[sinful nimbus]

I don't have such a strong will like our glorious Godking

[silk dirge]

i cant believe your a fraud

[sinful nimbus]

Anyway rewrite GMS to be not like Radiance

[silk dirge]

i expected more from you

[sinful nimbus]

Like even making her fight differently would be tuff

[frosty beacon]

you know, this was the good aspect of not being truly attached to skong leaks or developments, because i didn't get attached to betas delivering false promises

[silk dirge]

i think it would be cool if gms was a "heavy" duel type fight

[sinful nimbus]

Silksong leaks were all garbage

[frosty beacon]

i also didn't know a lot of stuff about the game in general tbf which added to the experience

[sinful nimbus]

Thank god they were there to prevent me from getting fully hyped

[silk dirge]

i think that would work for a true final boss

[frosty beacon]

ips the longest i looked at gameplay wise before launch excluding trailers was the treehouse

[silk dirge]

so like instead of a floating in the bg goddess youd have like an actual duel

[sinful nimbus]

Tough

[silk dirge]

i think that would feel meaningfully different than rad

[spark valve]

gms not being the final boss makes thematic sense because a big idea in silksong is that it's not just any one entity that's the villain it's everyone to ever take power and who better embodies that role than the one to first wrest power from gms and build the citadel

[frosty beacon]

that was back when lace 1 was unlocked with the diving key, yall remember that

[sinful nimbus]

Make her use runes and stuff too

Silk HB doesn't use silk for anything interesting 🥹

[spark valve]

she barely uses silk

[frosty beacon]

she has the hype moments and aura 3 damage attack wdym :monksilly:

[spark valve]

she uses it for discount radiance swords and a discount prince of persia boss attack that doesn't even have as cool a cinematic when it lands

[silk dirge]

i mean all her needle attacks are silk otherwise idk how shes animating the blades but yeah

[frosty beacon]

well i mean

in all senses of the word, she really is a great value radiance

[sinful nimbus]

[silk dirge]

also i dont think i ever realized the lost lace phase 4 attack is triple damage

[frosty beacon]

tc cooked too hard with hk and needed to try and match the energy

[silk dirge]

that does not look like a triple damage attack telegraph tbh

but its super easy to dodge anyways

[frosty beacon]

only 3 attacks in the game, tlj kamikazee, gms aura farming attack, and ll phase 4 flurry

[silk dirge]

i think most people struggled more with the void slams that come after

[silk dirge]

tlj suicide attack is super funny

[midnight zinc]

"Silksong is coming out soon" lying ass

[silk dirge]

oh yeah the fact they had an act 3 item as a fucking demo item is really funny

[frosty beacon]

i'm super used to fake outs, so i luckily was smart enough to instantly move out of the way when i saw the steam indicator, my controller didn't go down until i saw the act 2 screen

[silk dirge]

which act 2 cutscene is better last judge or phantom

[frosty beacon]

bro

[lapis creek]

this theme is for the conductors

[frosty beacon]

tlj

[lapis creek]

we were promised an awakening

[frosty beacon]

duh

[silk dirge]

theyre both cool af but phantom cutscene gives more shots of the citadel

[spark valve]

it's not just for the conductors tho

[silk dirge]

i love the window shot https://youtu.be/wjo-dICMPmM?si=2CtJ-9vrWJAw6-OO&t=136

also tlj cutscene having a cut part bc they changed the door design is really funny

[lapis creek]

too bad it is now

[spark valve]

nuh uh

having it just be about conductors would actually be internally inconsistent

[lapis creek]

yes it would

bold of you to assume this is the extent of my rewrite

[spark valve]

careful you might get some bathwater with that baby you're chucking out

[lapis creek]

what the fuck exactly does that mean

[spark valve]

you know
don't throw out the baby with the bathwater

[lapis creek]

you've become too first sinner pilled and now you're telling me to stop throwing babies

how else are they supposed to get from point B to point A

[spark valve]

the beastling booster seats

get your head in the fucking game cheese

[foggy fractal]

do y'all think we'll see another alive weaver in dlcs

[spark valve]

the hallownest ones are weirdly absent but eh

[midnight zinc]

It's possible, there's still a living weaver in Hallownest during the first game, but the choir seems to think they're all gone

[spark valve]

weavers globally seem to be going extinct from the cradle texts

every one is last of their line and in bad circumstances

[foggy fractal]

living weaver in hallownest seen by tk and never again 💔

[spark valve]

it's so funny that the sequel bait just evaporates

[foggy fractal]

look look weaver pristess in the left page

(ignore brumm/nymm)

[midnight zinc]

I mean they usually cant reproduce so this isnt shocking

[midnight zinc]

I want to inject Ari's sketchbooks into my bloodstream

[limpid summit]

“Forms dreamed” like brumm isn’t just wearing a big ass costume

[fathom hill]

ill never do that

[regal crow]

Why’d Gms help us escape the abyss? You’d think she’d hold a grudge

I didn’t pay as much attention to the dialogue as I should have

[unreal nimbus]

she cares about lace too much

[regal crow]

Ah

[regal crow]

Even after what she did? damn

[unreal nimbus]

i dont understand parents

[regal crow]

Guess it makes sense. They’re still related

Can’t wait for the dlc, it’s gonna be DOPE

[unreal nimbus]

Groal The Hygienic

[regal crow]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-macska-cica-vomit-oklendez-gif-14738230240638170539

[unreal nimbus]

(the groal refight in palewater/clearwater)

[regal crow]

What’s Clearwater

[unreal nimbus]

not bile bilewater

[regal crow]

Meme or real?

[unreal nimbus]

not confirmed but not meme

[timber pond]

You know the pale lake where the fleas settle down? That is what bilewater USED to look like all over. Same with where you find shakras master.

[timber pond]

I mean like. Mabye as an ally or something? Idk where you go after First sinner for a bossfight. Since she's like, implied or at least framed, as the "First Weaver" or old enough to be the first.

Like bro we broke in and killed the wiser of the weavers who else is there💀

[regal crow]

Ahhhhh

[regal crow]

Speaking of which, how’d bilewater come to be? My headcanon is it’s basically the sewers of the citadel, the Silksong version of royal waterways

[silk dirge]

exhaust organ

[timber pond]

Thats it that's bilewaters lore. The tablet outside of groals areana and by the bench say. "You put microplastic slop and shit down our throats, we now Ragebait you and the world"

[regal crow]

And the serious answer?

[timber pond]

A more poetic version of what i just said

[silk dirge]

exhaust organ deposited all the good stuff in bilewater

[timber pond]

Like if you read the tablets its just "we hate you go die, and now that groal choked a snail shaman like a chicken we will kill you"

[timber pond]

Citadel poluted bilewater with the exhaust organ. And then everything else i siad

[regal crow]

What exactly is the exhaust organ? What’s it do other than make wastewater

[sudden aspen]

this might be a strange question but what do u guys think is the main message, theme, purpose behind the hollow knight games? or is it just a cool story in a bug world.

[regal crow]

“Billionaires are evil and liars”

Hk1 def took inspiration from dark souls

[timber pond]

Smog From Machinery

[sudden aspen]

idk if that was the case why is grand mother silk not written that way, and that msg is only rlly tied to the underworks

[regal crow]

The weavers were overthrown by the citadel, gms isn’t the real villain here

[timber pond]

Something About What Life is and its origins.

How Life evolves under different angles ,viewing Each Civilization after the fact.

[sudden aspen]

yea i can see this making more sense

[slim tree]

silksong is motherhood and what family is

hollow knight is similar to it but im not sure

[regal crow]

So, the organ pumps all the smog and shit and of the citadel so all the rich ppl don’t have to suffer pollution, at the expense of everyone else. Yeah, sounds about right for a real world parallel

[slim tree]

i will not budge on silksong being about motherhood there’s so much symbolism

[slim tree]

The weavers all being female, the moss mothers, hornet is the gendered child, and also the child of three queens

[sudden aspen]

i thought the weavers ran away and gms enslaved the other bugs in anger

[slim tree]

and GRAND MOTHER SILK

[regal crow]

Not the version I heard. I heard the architects and that other group are in control

[slim tree]

As far as i know the weavers fought back and the reason the haunting happens is because gms is trying to free herself from her cocoon

[timber pond]

Not necessarily Rich Pepole. The Citadel Was made, or perhaps, Repurposed By the weavers To Lull Grandmother silk to sleep

[regal crow]

Ah

[timber pond]

And then Essentially the Prospect of Its upkeep was Foisted on to Normal bugs

[regal crow]

And they invented this whole religion to make them more amenable to slavery

[timber pond]

Thats what The First tablet you Can activate Under silkspear eludes to yes.

[regal crow]

Oh?

[sudden aspen]

if thats the case why not set her free instead of trying to kill her

[timber pond]

There is a physical tablet MAde by pilgrims that Reveres the weavers. and then you Play your needolin and reveal what the weavers wrote. Basically saying "lol These guys don't know (what a buncha losers), caught unknowing in our web, use them so Silk cant do shit"

[regal crow]

Ah

[regal crow]

I really need to go back and read those tablets

Are they like the tablets in hk1 where only higher beings could read them?

Secret messages

[sudden aspen]

that makes a lot of sense, ig the normal bugs just cant do anything right

[timber pond]

well Those tablets IN HK1 are likely to be read by other bugs, and Pale king is just Telling other bugs that they have become "higher beings" (Lie, at least in the way we use it)

But to answer your question No

They need The weaversong to be played to read them, so only those who can play a song with silk can

Aka The needolin song

[timber pond]

Not really Thier Fault Because Basically The Weavers Constructed a system where they are raised on lies to Keep silk asleep.

Both The Pontiff of the vault keepers and Conductor ballador have actually realized the whole citadel is a sham. The Vaultkeepr Pontif Died As he just figured it out , and balador I think was able to read a rune harp.

Architects were "machnies" (actually Bugswhose souls were extracted and turned into Silkflies by whiteward) So they could only do as Comanded

[sudden aspen]

man that whiteward record was crazy

[sudden aspen]

do we ever know what happened to conductor romino (the guy who wrote pharloom’s folly)

[timber pond]

He Either Doesn't exist in game OR is Old penitent, an NPC from The Slab (In my Opinon) Because he sings a broken version of the Conductors melody if you play the Needolin to him.

[sudden aspen]

damn theres sm stuff i missed and i even 100% the game

[timber pond]

He's in a seemingly innocuous jail cell room with no gameplay items in it where you can hear werid noises coming from the wall. You play the needolin to make him come out

[regal crow]

Last architect seemed pretty aware

[humble peak]

why would that make him Romino? If he were a Conductor, he could be any one of them, no?

[sudden aspen]

ye i c that now, maybe his sin was writing pharlooms folly as it seemed to speak against the citadel and gms

[timber pond]

Yeah because they are half alive pretty much. Cogwork core sentinels and The architects were made by conductors to keep the citadel going in the weavers absence. They are aware but they cant do anything outside of thier edict. There's a secret room in whiteward where bugs souls are extracted with silk. They then become silkflies and stuffed in the automatons to bring to life. Its why a silkfly flies out when you kill one.

[timber pond]

Idk really. Mizello and balador are accounted for and there are no mention of other conductors. So im just assuming because romino is unaccounted for.

[humble peak]

It seems naïve to assume there are only as many Conductors as we see named.

[timber pond]

Sure, but i assume team chery only presents ones that are actually relevant to an aspect of understanding them.

Plus 3 conductors would be enough anyway based on what thier role is.

Which is purely political stand ins.

[sudden aspen]

i think the dots connect so it just makes sense

[eternal gazelle]

there's also a dead conductor in the background of blasted steps, at the entrance to the kingdom

[silk dirge]

yeah

that is likely romino

theres also the theory old penitent is romino

[timber pond]

Screenshot? Its not like I don't believe you

But I just never noticed it guess

[silk dirge]

its very bg blurred

[muted lantern]

its hard to see without unblur mod

[silk dirge]

someone here probably has it on hand

[eternal gazelle]

yeah it's basically impossible to see unmodded

[silk dirge]

its very funny bc its basically just an unravelled death sprite they placed here

[timber pond]

Actually wait. We don't know its his corpse. That seems like the hollow veil. See on the left side? Its head pice is hollowed out and broken

Romino could have just thrown the Cowl off the ledge

Its only half of the headpiece of the conductor uniform

[humble peak]

Yeah this has been said

[humble peak]

They use a similar sprite for Ballador's body

[silk dirge]

oh yeah when he dies in act 3

[regal crow]

Wya

[granite grove]

Pls just answer this question with yes or no I don’t want any spoilers

In the ||underworks|| the layout is very similar to the ||choral commandment||, are they digging out more areas of the ||citidel||?

[muted lantern]

No, i don't think so.

[hardy inlet]

just realised something
you know how the grimm troupe uses masks to essentially brainwash their members
what if those are crests? like they bind with a different crest which consumes their old identity

[sterile jacinth]

The way I saw it the crests are basically the essence of a bug or a group of bugs and Hornets nature as both weaver and wyrm lets her basically switch to another bugs nature (Hunter is her nature)

[stray fog]

Why would they want to return to pharloom if they fled from it due to the haunting

[stuck berry]

did they return to pharloom? i feel like after the infection they fled elsewhere

[muted lantern]

"fuck this noise im moving back in with my mom"

/j

[visual glacier]

I need help with extremely important needle lore

[quick geyser]

What is the reasoning?

[muted lantern]

lets us have it

[visual glacier]

Is this a needle or a nail?

[muted lantern]

needle it has the ring at the end, I would call it a great needle

like a greatnail

[visual glacier]

Seems pretty useless for sewing ngl

[stray fog]

They fled pharloom because gms started waking up and controlling everyone

[muted lantern]

I mean any needle with a sharpened edge would be bad for sewing bc it would cut the threads on the side, its only meant to be sharp at the tip

[stray fog]

So why would they return

[visual glacier]

Yeah fair

[quick geyser]

Can you send the link to the source of that image

[visual glacier]

Hollowknight.wiki

[stray fog]

Yes

[stuck berry]

were they stupid

[visual glacier]

Probably

But also probably didn’t wanna get caught up in the infection, idk why they didn’t just immigrate again

[robust wagon]

Pale nails spell has rings on the end of the nails.

[muted lantern]

I think thats more to do with it becoming hornets own spell

[stray fog]

Maybe herrah and the others came to hallownest before the weavers of pharloom fled to other kingdoms

So they had no idea what was happening in pharloom

[visual glacier]

Nobody falling for ts bro ✌️

[muted lantern]

lemme guess, kai cenat scam?

[lethal burrow]

why is cardinius worm and the other vaultkeepers not?

[dire lynx]

?

[lethal burrow]

ye he's also weird

[dire lynx]

whats weird?

[dire lynx]

different species

[stray fog]

What even is a forebrother

I googled it and there was no definition

[dire lynx]

play on foreman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreman

[naive lake]

why are the wisp bugs so strong willed against grandma's influence, is it literaly because fire burns silk or is their god actually doing something

[cobalt coyote]

Yeah even in act 3 there arent any void threads

They just burning the silk up

[naive lake]

dang

wisp thicket would be a cool dlc expansion, smth like "Flame and Ashes" i dunno

[obsidian gale]

Seems all the lore keeping guys are worm based, the one in bellheart and the other collecting the music are both long bois

[primal ruin]

Does anyone know the name of the world from the hk games

Hallownest and pharloom are places

[atomic widget]

I don't quit think there is a name for it

Closest you'll get is probably "The Wastelands"

[primal ruin]

Why?

Where can that name be found

[atomic widget]

The bugs were all probably to concerned with what was happening in their own kingdoms

to bother

[obsidian gale]

Iirc the lifeblood guy reffers to the wastlands, when talking about how no life can survive there

[viscid ridge]

Ive also been wracking my brain about the new mister mushroom dialogue. To me a large majority of his dialogue seems to correlate to different or new features in Ss that wasn't in Hk.

For example

First dialogue talks about going down, but going up is another thing. Like in silksong we ascend to the top of pharloom, but in Hollow Knight we descend down

The second dialogue talks about long strides and small steps. This i think refers to how Hornet is able to sprint and run fast, while the knight had to take tiny steps to get anywhere

The 3rd dialogue talks about elements. This i think refers to how silksong has a bunch of new elemental environmental hazards (lava, frost, muckmaggots, wind) while in hollow knight we only had acid

The fourth dialogue talks about communication. As apposed to the knight, who had no voice to cry suffering, Hornet can speak

The fifth. This dialogue is very beautiful, but i dont know how to interpret it.

[atomic widget]

Yea, he definitely is a very intriguing character

I chose to instead look at his dialogue in a more literal and philosophical lense

[viscid ridge]

The 6th dialogue talks about the past. I think this is referring to the Red Memory and the Birthplace.

[atomic widget]

Even though it most likely was meant to be interpreted in a meta sense

[viscid ridge]

And the last dialogue speaks for itself i feel

[viscid ridge]

Honestly people can think whatever they want about him. I am pretty confident that my interpretation of his dialogue is correct, but there are a lot of other pieces of his dialogue that still intrigues me

[atomic widget]

I think everything about is kinda correct

He kind of just, is

[sweet flume]

So I've been reading a lot of the dialogue and I have come to the conclusion that being a moor bug would be absolute hell

They're expected to process silk endlessly for a citadel that they'll never see. They can't flee or they'll be killed and they live off of disgusting roach meat

It feels like the more I read silksong stuff the more I see how it was all just one prison for everyone involved

[terse warren]

<@&283547423706447872>

[charred nimbus]

I mean, after the haunting the mechanism of ending noncomplient workers wasn't working anymore, not that it was necessary since they were being mind controlled

Moorwing said: "fuck that shit"

[stray fog]

Basically every bug in pharloom and their next generations got fucked by the weavers

[atomic widget]

I mean the conductors are the ones who essentially ruined everything

[stray fog]

The weavers made up the entire religion though

They convinced everyone that their entire life was a sin and forced them to climb to the citadel

[sweet flume]

oh god damn it

<@&283547423706447872>

[stray fog]

Why does gms give us pale nails

Why nails specifically

Aren't nails hallownest's thing

[proper plover]

hmmmm, you get it from her arm, and her arm has her hands, her hands have nails

💅

otherwise i have no clue

[fossil ledge]

Not sure why the ability calls it nails when they clearly resemble needles

[lean temple]

They're described as talons

So they are "nails" in the hand sense. GMS herself has claws as well

It's also possible Hornet affects them to be Nails like in hallownest

[lament gate]

yeah, i'd say the ones hornet weaves resemble a channeled nail while grand mother silk's resemble needles

[stray fog]

This explanation makes the most sense

[lilac hedge]

Though when you defeat her you get an ability call “pale nails”

[wintry flame]

i losrt my steelsoul run to lace two after doing everything in the game fuck my life

wrong chat

fuck it right chat

[lilac hedge]

And the ability resembles gms attacks too

[rough lava]

How did the pale king know || Lifeblood was a threat, did he see it's affects in another Kingdom while traveling as a wyrm? ||

[unreal estuary]

Either that or he witnessed its effects early on in Hallownest with people like Joni or people who got addicted to Lifeblood

[proper plover]

why is gms's arms around her chest pretty much all the time? is she protecting it?

[rough lava]

Perhaps from still slightly being bound?

|| she was only unbound from her cocoon by hornet, maybe after being bound for such an incredibly long time would still weaken her ||

[radiant badger]

Little theory i thought of

[rough lava]

Hmmm

[unreal estuary]

Nightmare Heart would also be in the green category, since it controls its own portion of the Dream Realm, were Lifeblood Beast would likely be in the red category since it doesn't seem to have anything to do with dreams while it does affect the environment

But that's definitely an interesting theory, and it makes sense

I think a lot of our initial perceptions were separating Pale Beings from Higher Beings, nobody else has really thought of other categories for Higher Beings

[rough lava]

I feel like || lifeblood beast and radiance are much more of a physical thing than nightmare heart, nightmare heart just does a constant ritual to rebirth it's vessel, but it itself is just something that controls the Grimm troupe instead of actually altering the lands, meanwhile lifeblood and radiance actively alter the land and infect it's inhabitants, especially lifeblood ||

|| so only change really is nightmare heart position, canonically it is literally just a mirror dream realm basically no?||

[unreal estuary]

Radiance is an incorporeal being, she only exists in the Dream Realm and her effect on the land is the effect of her dream

Yeah it basically is

We really don't know about Nightmare Heart that much

[radiant badger]

Otherwise infection like power could also work. But we don't know what the nightmare heart exactly is. But we know the radiance and lifeblood are lepidoptera and they both infect so that's a pattern

[rain gate]

unn seems to be an outlier, she created the mosskin and they follow her seemingly through their own will rather than the sort of mind control cult stuff the nightmare heart does

[unreal estuary]

That makes more sense, yeah. Do we know if Lifeblood Creature would be Lepidoptera? I feel like we barely see it so we can't be fully sure

[rain gate]

there are so many butterflies wherever it is

less in the infected creatures more in the substance itself

[unreal estuary]

true, lifeblood does have a butterfly motif

[limpid summit]

Mister Mushroom where

[radiant badger]

Otherwise the lifeblood beast isn't the higher being and it's one of the ancient abyss civilizations guys on lifeblood

[unreal estuary]

Oh no its definitely a Higher Being, I just wasn't sure if we could fully put it into that entymological category

But now that I think about it with all the butterflies around lifeblood it makes more sense

[unreal estuary]

like where to find him or what

[limpid summit]

Where does he fall on this list

[rain gate]

nowhere because hes not a higher being

[limpid summit]

Hmm

[rain gate]

he is a very important individual but not a higher being

[limpid summit]

What’s the qualifications for being a higher being

[rain gate]

have followers

[unreal estuary]

being a God or controlling some domain

[limpid summit]

Cause like iirc all tc said was they had to exist above all others

[unreal estuary]

Mister Mushroom is just a crazy guy, potentially a former Mask Maker, who has magical sight and enjoys exploring

[rain gate]

mr mushroom does not have followers (the mushrooms in hallownest are different probably)

[limpid summit]

The mushrooms do follow him

[rain gate]

hes not just that though
hes recognized as the Herald, the end of an age

[limpid summit]

And there were mushrooms in Pharloom that followed him too

But that’s not really like a qualification

[rain gate]

they were following him as the Herald, not as a mushroom

[limpid summit]

There are lots of common hb traits but none of them are defining traits besides “existing above all others”

But if that doesn’t satisfy you the mushrooms speak the wish of the master herald so they do follow him

[unreal estuary]

That's I think where the distinction is then, because he doesn't. He's the same size as everyone and deliberately puts himself on the same level as the other bugs

[radiant badger]

Draw bugs to worship you, or make bugs

[rain gate]

so did PK

[limpid summit]

Pale king in bug form is not a higher being

?

I don’t think he has to physically exist above all others

[unreal estuary]

He still put himself higher than everyone else, he didn't treat himself like a common bug

[limpid summit]

Like bardoon is bigger than most of the HBs but he isn’t one

[unreal estuary]

Mr. Mushroom doesn't seem to act superior, he just wants to explore

[limpid summit]

MM has extremely potent awareness and his whole shtick is outliving HBs

I think he’s a HB

[rain gate]

"caps and shells will fall to dust"

[slim tree]

is the mount fay birb a hb

[limpid summit]

Eh

Probably just a powerful bug

[rain gate]

probably not

[slim tree]

its weird looking so i say so

[limpid summit]

She doesn’t really do that much

[slim tree]

thats a beast mx

[rain gate]

that line is on both tablets

[limpid summit]

Yes

[radiant badger]

This also questions what the hell the black wyrm is

[rain gate]

and we see no mushrooms in pharloom at all

[unreal estuary]

I mean she might be the same as Unn, a weaker Higher Being who doesn't do much, she might be controlling the weather on Mount Fay or something

[slim tree]

void

[limpid summit]

Maybe they left

Tablet suggests some were there

[slim tree]

Battle of the blackwyrm was thr pk vs void

[rain gate]

it was the Blackwyrm not the Black Wyrm, it may be like the Voltvyrm where it's something different with the same name

[slim tree]

wtf even is voltvrrrom

[unreal estuary]

big slug

[slim tree]

its weird and gross

[limpid summit]

Voltvyrm should have gotten mkre

It’s so easy to miss

[slim tree]

Snail shamans better

[unreal estuary]

true

[slim tree]

Wait whats ur guys’s like favorite moment in silksong this isnt lore i need to know tho

[unreal estuary]

the moment when you're escaping the Abyss and Enter Pharloom kicks in

We needed a Void escape sequence after Lost Lace and I will die on this hill

[limpid summit]

Finding Seth

[unreal estuary]

Coral Tower too, and Seth obviously, there are too many to pick

[slim tree]

eh.. idk how to feel bc gms giving up her life for hornet and lace was really awesome

[rain gate]

ah yes, fighting the Final Boss then having to do parkour immideately after

[unreal estuary]

Yeah but what if she used her life force and silk to make platforms like we see in the Silk Heart sequences, there was a way to do it

[slim tree]

my favorite was in lace 2 that cutscene that perfectly transitions into the fight made me pause for a whole minute

[rain gate]

surely there would be a checkpoint in between so you don't have to refight LL if you fuck up

:clueless:

[slim tree]

that would work

[slim tree]

if u die there you just go straight to meeting the knight lmao

[rain gate]

[radiant badger]

Would this make sense?

[rain gate]

oh yeah where would shade lord fall under the chart?

[radiant badger]

Still working on it but would this make sense

[rain gate]

maybe "other" could be Domain higher beings?

since they have their domain

[radiant badger]

Yeah but wouldent the lifeblood creature too, or is that just infection

[rain gate]

i mean more like unn

she has greenpath as her whole thing

[radiant badger]

Also got any idea's for the "power given mind" or "void given form" for the cult higher beings or the infection higher being

[radiant badger]

True, tho

[rain gate]

love how other is just "given form"

[radiant badger]

I mean that's all they do for what we've seen lmao

[rain gate]

maybe "devotion through creation" instead?

because the mosskin worship her and the godseekers worshipped the gods of thunder and tain

[radiant badger]

Good idea

[rain gate]

and then the cult could be devotion through subjugation

maybe instead of "x given x" it could be "devotion through x" since that seems the most accurate division of HBs

[slim tree]

Where is mount fay bird

genuinely wtf is this lmfao

[radiant badger]

Debatable but it could be in the other, considering they made a entire area snowy. I don't see any other way it could be thay way

[slim tree]

it looks like a bird but why that body

[unreal estuary]

That's the standard bug body in this world

[unreal estuary]

Most bugs have that striped body and then thin legs

[limpid summit]

Glidey Glidey Glidey

[slim tree]

but it doesnt have bug limbs and its also a blirb

[rain gate]

it not birb it bug

[slim tree]

NO

[rain gate]

all things are bug

except shroom

[slim tree]

cawfather

[rain gate]

still bug

[radiant badger]

Arachnid

[rain gate]

well arthropod you know what i mean

[slim tree]

WHAT

[rain gate]

"bug" as the term they use in game

[unreal estuary]

Aren't shrooms also bugs in the laws of this world?

[rain gate]

thats tallcraw but still

[slim tree]

Im killing tc

[rain gate]

from crawfather

[unreal estuary]

Yeah technically none of the flying bugs are birds

[slim tree]

I WANT MOUNT FAY BIRD TO BE A BIRD PLEAAASE

[rain gate]

nope

[unreal estuary]

The Craws fly using the silk dregs in greymoor, they just turn it into a flying coat

[slim tree]

PLSS

[rain gate]

bug

[slim tree]

NOOU

[rain gate]

it has feathers but its still a bug

[slim tree]

its half

can we settle on half

[unreal estuary]

The Fayforn is unique, but it is still a bug, it just happens to have feathers and wings and shit

[radiant badger]

What about this

[slim tree]

Power given by devotion is better imo

Also whos that chump in other with unn

[unreal estuary]

The gods of Thunder and Rain from Godseeker dream sequence

[slim tree]

Ah

also wth is lepidoptera

[radiant badger]

I'd say light would be how many bugs they can get worship them. So light given control meant the being made beings they control

[slim tree]

ah ok

[radiant badger]

Butterflys and moths

[naive lake]

moths and bitches

[slim tree]

Oh i thought it had a second meaning nvm lol

cus i was like yeah radiance moth duh but what about lifeblud

[unreal estuary]

there are butterflies all over the Lifeblood vines

That's the main connection

[naive lake]

we dont know much abiut lifeblood tbh, only know that johnny was a follower of the drugs

Why did i write johnny

[rain gate]

and the plasmium in silksong

thats it

[slim tree]

Everyone says lifeblood is evil but i dont think it is

[naive lake]

tbh i think manually injecting it like everywhere in wormways is what caused those mutations

[unreal estuary]

Something I was talking about yesterday in this chat was that Lifeblood is an invasive species in Pharloom. It's a weed that corrupts and twists bugs if left unchecked. In Hallownest and the place where Zylotyl found lifeblood it has natural predators. It just also happens to be a drug that is ruled by a Higher Being

[naive lake]

And/or that scientist fucked up by experimenting

[slim tree]

it just minds its business in little corners of the world in hallownest and in pharloom stupid xylopholotol injects it everywhere like a dumbass

[sinful nimbus]

"In my home caves, when once this substance was allowed to flourish, I saw similar aberrations. This is wonder tainted strong with revulsion."

[naive lake]

damn

[slim tree]

LIFEBLOOD ISNT EVILLLLL

[naive lake]

Lifeblood is just doing it's thing

[sinful nimbus]

Lifeblood is a substance its not evil but it is harmful

[naive lake]

Its a malign substance

[radiant badger]

Definitly connected to void tho, it only really spread alot when the abyss went up. We can probaly guess why it spread around hallownest, bc of the kingsmould walking around

[rain gate]

maybe its symbiotic with the void

[slim tree]

Lifeblood and void cannot interact with eachother the just kinda slosh around but dont mix yk

Thats my hc

[rain gate]

void maybe carries it around

[naive lake]

i believe void and lifeblood are like oil and water

[rain gate]

exactly

[kind cairn]

guys i just killed ||grand mother silk|| and i wanna know what happend after in lore

[naive lake]

hornet became grandma silk and rules over pharloom now

[kind cairn]

what was she? was she a vessel like hollow knight and hornet took her place?

[naive lake]

"rules"

[kind cairn]

oh

[naive lake]

nope she was a pale being, like pale king but not a wyrm

[slim tree]

go talk to greyroot again

[kind cairn]

why was she doing the things to the people in citadel and pharloom

[kind cairn]

greyroot?

[slim tree]

thats actually the weavers they made the citadel to contain her

[foggy fractal]

a pale higher being of which is the primal source of silk

[naive lake]

Cant tell you further from tgar, i might say misinformation

[slim tree]

yeah in shellwood she’ll give you something awesome to do

[limpid summit]

Hornet absorbed her strength which caused her to lose control and become like her

[kind cairn]

wait so shes also got contained?

[slim tree]

hornet could not handle based mother silk’s aura and lost her identity

[limpid summit]

Well we don’t really know what Weaver Queen is

[kind cairn]

is that the one that gives me the cursed crest?

[limpid summit]

Could be GMS in her body could be an insane Hornet could be a mindless combination of both

[slim tree]

yes

[kind cairn]

wait fr?

so like its a bad ending?

[slim tree]

kind of

[kind cairn]

like when hollow knight took the place of the hollowknight?

[naive lake]

it feels like a neutral ending

[slim tree]

crests are basically hornet taking a part of ones identity and absorbing it into herself without it taking over

[rain gate]

as evidenced by the greyroot quest

[slim tree]

thats why the cursed crest weakens hornet so much its trying to take her over

[kind cairn]

ohh alright i'll give her a visit

[slim tree]

and then she binds gms and she just cant handle the new power and loses control

[slim tree]

beat gms with it for a secret, and then once ur done immediately go get it fixed because thats not pleasant at all

[naive lake]

fuck cursed crest

[rain gate]

it actually wasnt that hard for me tbh

it took me a few tries but it wasnt that frustrating

[kind cairn]

if i go to her again she'll again try to take controll of me?

[naive lake]

Oh!

You can go check

it will be a cool surprise

[kind cairn]

alright

[slim tree]

Wont spoil but something different happens

definitely worth the struggle

[kind cairn]

k

thnx

[slim tree]

No problem ^^

[rain gate]

also some npcs have new dialogue!

[slim tree]

god what even is greyroot’s deal

[kind cairn]

after getting the first ending?

[rain gate]

no with the greyroot thing

[slim tree]

shes so weird and has weird ties to the white lady

[rain gate]

i saw a theory somewhere that greyroot was actually a flatworm

[kind cairn]

ohh

[rain gate]

same head shape

[kind cairn]

shes not here

[kind cairn]

cool theory

[slim tree]

OH you have to go to somewhere and get her little item

honestly if i were you i’d just look it up

[kind cairn]

alr bet

the silksong wiki has alot of unfinished things so i dont use it alot

yep the page about greyroot is unfinished

oh wait theres another website of hollow knight wiki

[rain gate]

yeah use the wiki.gg

not the fandom one

[kind cairn]

i was using hollowknight.fandom.com

it says nothing about where i got to go

[kind cairn]

are you talking about twisted bud?

[kind cairn]

i have already cured the infestation and have her crest can i just use that to get the secret?

[limpid summit]

Unfortunately no

You can only get the secret when you’re infested

[supple plover]

Hope?

[edgy nebula]

implied yeah

every biome we destroy has a lingering hope

far fields will regrow with the help of gilly, gp's death implies verdania will one day regrow, shellwood? uuuuh,.... karak has the ice on mt. fay possibly melting one day, etc

there's also watcher at the edge's memento implying new life will one day come

[mighty parcel]

How intelligent are the Skarrlids? It seems like they're feral, given they don't drop any rosaries on death

[supple plover]

they're like babies afaik

[mighty parcel]

ah

[twin dragon]

Shellwood seems to already show early signs of decay

due to nyleth's presence fading and splinters taking over

[supple plover]

oh i didn't know about the ice on mt. fay melting one day part

where's that coming from?

[edgy nebula]

it might happen, it isnt outwardly shown to happen ingame but it's possible

[twin dragon]

Maybe khann himself being in stasis kept sands of karak in stasis

[edgy nebula]

it's just a theory

[supple plover]

oh i see

[edgy nebula]

but watcher at the edge still implies new life will come for karak one day

[edgy nebula]

possibly yeah

[twin dragon]

Hornet kinda dooms far fields in the first place

But we would've seen the signs of decay if karmelita died before we visited it

So maybe she's speeding up the cycle

[hushed viper]

i just realised didn't zylotol said that lifeblood grew normally in areas with salt water so he grabbed some and just started injecting it in the wormways? Then (assuming in universe reasons, chances are it's because the devs didnt think of this back then) how did the lifeblood in HK just grew basically anywhere, and why are the ones in Pharloom have wings

[sinful nimbus]

He doesn't say it grows only in salt water he just found it near salt water

Or his master did

The actual reason he brought it to wormways was to test if it could grow elsewhere in the answer was yes

Highly unlikely! The grey and barren soil of the mainland could never produce something as singular as this, and that is undisputable fact!
Plasmium was discovered by my master at the farthest edge of Pharloom, hidden deep in salt-stricken waters. I brought it to these caves under her direction, to study how it flourishes in a foreign place.

[hushed viper]

Eh yea close enough, anyway still why did they just grow randomly in Hallownest

Also this made me realise maybe Pharloom Bay is gonna be in the game later on because not only will it return cut content but it'll continue the Plasmium storyline

[sinful nimbus]

I mean lifeblood is a plant so it could just spread naturally in Hallownest but there's also the possibility that the Lifeblood Beast had something to do with it

[mighty parcel]

How smart is Sister Splinter?

[limpid summit]

Probably smart

[edgy nebula]

decently smart

was able to take over shellwood and rule it decently well, her needolin dialogue hints at solid intelligence

[mighty parcel]

thanks!

[upper copper]

This is creepy… plays while zylotol is asleep. This basically proves there is a higher being beyond this “plasmium”

[eternal gazelle]

I don't think this is really the case

[upper copper]

Plays while he is dead**

[eternal gazelle]

this is probably either talking about hornet or his master

referring either to giving hornet the plasmium organ or the experiments as a whole

[abstract rivet]

Plasmium is basically cocaine and infection without a higher being fr

[upper copper]

I wonder I can meet up with the physical incarnation of alchohol

[abstract rivet]

This shit really opens up alot of shit for us for a second lifeblood dlc lowkey

[upper copper]

The way “zylotol” speaks just sounds like a higher being giving stuff to lowlives

I think you can needolin him while he is awake, it shows dialogue but he doesn’t seem to be singing (iirc)

[hardy inlet]

does elegy of the deep transport you to the past or into the memories of the boss

[sinful nimbus]

memories

[sinful nimbus]

Is this the voice

[whole marsh]

Hornet implies that there may have been an outbreak in the past and that it was suppressed. What we see could either be remnants from the outbreak, or lifeblood starting to pop up again since there's no one around to keep it in check.

[radiant badger]

Made a description of all the higher beings capabilities

[rain gate]

The bottom right is the Gods of Thunder and Rain

At least were 90% sure

[hard widget]

What does Lepidoptera mean

Oh butterfly

[mighty parcel]

Are Craws sapient?

[mighty parcel]

missing Sister Splinter (I will not elaborate)

[hard widget]

I mean they have a court and build things

[mighty parcel]

they what

is that like a metaphor

[hard widget]

No

They have an actual court and justice system

[silk dirge]

its an irl phenomenon crows do

[hard widget]

You unlock it in act 3

[mighty parcel]

so they're smart animals?

[hard widget]

I’d say so

[mighty parcel]

thanks

[hard widget]

They also make tools n shit

Full on society goin on

[mighty parcel]

mhm

I thought they carried rosaries because they're crows and crows like shiny things

[lyric rose]

Because she’s still possessing them. From the other direction.

[silk dirge]

yeah

court of craws is based on an irl crow phenomenon

[mighty parcel]

So are they sapient or not

I'm getting mixed messages

[silk dirge]

they are

they can write letters in the game

[mighty parcel]

They do?

[silk dirge]

the craw summons you get has shit written on it

[mighty parcel]

ah

[hot talon]

i'm legit crashing out bro😭

[jaunty sundial]

Yo gng

I have a question

so if pharloom is haunted by gm silk

why did the citadel bugs kidnap hornet

Did like gm silk drive them to her or smn?

[half zenith]

Probably

[grand star]

probably

[drowsy vessel]

https://tenor.com/view/silk-song-silk-issue-holl-gif-9288325397154120358

[grand star]

there are still some sane people left anyways so they could’ve been unhaunted

[half zenith]

So uh… where exactly do Hornet’s organs go? She’s a literal stick figure. She and her weaver kin are spiders but she doesn’t seem to have any sort of cephlathorax (the big round spider ball), which is where real life spiders have most of their organs. How is there any room for her organs in that stick figure body

Like. How is there room for a whole parasite when there looks to be barely enough room for herself

[silk dirge]

i mean realism is not exactly something tc is going for here

[fresh badger]

She's the baby of a freaky maggot and a god wyrm

Ofc she's a lil freaky

[edgy nebula]

carton logic

[hot talon]

cant u tell me what to do instead of this

[fresh badger]

Go to #hk-help

[drowsy vessel]

git gud

[half zenith]

Stick figure logic I can accept for how bug limbs work, since the real life explanation is “very tiny muscles”

But the organs have to go somewhere

[fresh badger]

Dawg its a game

[edgy nebula]

it's a cartoonish art style

generally bugs dont shoot sawblades out of their ass in real life either

[silk dirge]

wdym youve never seen moorwing irl

[half zenith]

I know it is, I’m just immensely curious. I don’t know enough to count as a bug nerd but I do think bugs are cool

[vague narwhal]

Uhh you should prioritize ||killing the balloons first and also something that helped me I let him make the first move and then striked back||

Lol

[edgy nebula]

it's really just team cherry not following real life laws and their artstyle

[drowsy vessel]

XD

[hot talon]

ohk

[edgy nebula]

the organs are there it's just a cartoon, and tc rarely uses actual bug biology

[spark valve]

<@&283547423706447872>

[vague narwhal]

Are we deadass 💔🤞

[silk dirge]

bro what