sk-lore

[sterile jacinth]

Disguising itself as something helpful or benevolent

No wonder pk outlawed it

He could probably sense its intent

[upbeat star]

Its not a hivemind tho right? The infected by lifeblood arnt connected?

[sterile jacinth]

🔥

[sterile jacinth]

We have no evidence either way I don’t think

[lilac hedge]

Salubra calls it as something that should not be talked about when u buy lifeblood heart meaning at the time it could have been something insaive

Or smth else

[sterile jacinth]

Oh it’s definitely invasive

You see how it tore apart the wormways

[upbeat star]

It has the side effect of revitalizing the area its in but the major downside of lifeblood infection of normal bugs

[sterile jacinth]

Revitalizing is a stretch. It completely takes over and warps the area in.

[upbeat star]

It could bring back the sands of karak, youd just have very blue “water” instead

[sterile jacinth]

And horribly mutated creatures

I think this guy is another one of them lifeblood salesmen

[upbeat star]

What no shoves the plasmium viles off the table

should go up to groal see if he wants any plasmium

[sterile jacinth]

I think he would kill you

[upbeat star]

I mean he stole soul to become stronger why not throw plasmium at him for the immortality

[sterile jacinth]

Noooooooo

Yeah your soul

[upbeat star]

Kratt deserves death

[sterile jacinth]

Kratt is gonna be the only one left wdymmmm

I wonder if the little thief bugs are native to Pharloom

[barren beacon]

So do we know what the fuck was Mr. Shroom yapping about in the SS dialogue?

[sterile jacinth]

I wonder if they all have the same intelligence grindle has

[barren beacon]

I didn't bother to pay atention because I knew i wouldn't understand shit

[upbeat star]

Its mushroom most things he says are random

[sterile jacinth]

They’re purposely obtuse

Makes sense. I like grindle he’s silly

[barren beacon]

So no depth?

[upbeat star]

They are scavs they likely dont have much ties to pharloom

[sterile jacinth]

I say yes there is depth but it’s so purposefully vague

[barren beacon]

So no relation to other games this time around?

[sterile jacinth]

I’m sure there are but again it’s vague and hard to decipher on purpose

Yeah I like him lol. Hes just a thief doing thief stuff
-# I actually drew him like as a human

[sterile jacinth]

I’m saying idk either lol

[fallow spindle]

there was a weird dicussion before skong released with the map in the trailer telling about shellwood and i jokingly said zotes mom would be in there

[fallow spindle]

i didnt expect that to actually happen (somewhat as like a theory)

[upbeat star]

The mushroom (herald) reminds me of that creepy mushroom in tem village in undertale when it revealed its real eyes

[ionic palm]

Is there a lore reason as to why the High Halls music is so good?

[sterile jacinth]

And he embraces it. He knows what he is and I love him for that

[upbeat star]

The choir

[fast lagoon]

the high being christopher larkin favored the area deeply

trust

[ionic palm]

This being must have also favored the fight with Karmelita also, then

[fast lagoon]

indeed

[sterile jacinth]

And bilewater for whatever reason

[fast lagoon]

a fan of cogwheels as well

[ionic palm]

And Phantom’s theme is peak as well

[upbeat star]

I mean it has organ music

[sterile jacinth]

I think ducts got the music bilewater deserves but I really love the bilewater ost and think it fits the area very well

Song of despair and hopelessness and lost beauty🔥

[upbeat star]

Have you seen the blended mix of the mists leading into phantom fight?

[ionic palm]

I have not

[upbeat star]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6DC6xORVDj4&list=RD6DC6xORVDj4&start_radio=1&pp=ygURTWlzdHMgcGhhbnRvbSBvc3SgBwE%3D

[sterile jacinth]

Ok wait that’s fire

[upbeat star]

I know right

[ionic palm]

This hit harder than Pure Vessel🔥

Simply peak

I hope Phantom gets a modded version soon like First Sinner

[upbeat star]

Ive seen that first sinner mod, tons of blades

[ionic palm]

The only way I was able to beat Lost Sinner was with another mod that made Cross Stitch cost no silk

[upbeat star]

Lol so just parry spam

[sterile jacinth]

I would absolutely love this fight

[ionic palm]

Yep lol, yet somehow it was still difficult

[sterile jacinth]

Ooh would we get to see phantom in their prime for that fight

[upbeat star]

Before she got tossed away by gms

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah

I wonder if lace would even exist by then

Whelp this has been fun it is so late for me I’m going to go to bed yall have fun

[upbeat star]

Night

We need the hornet laying in her home bed emote

Cya

[abstract rivet]

Why the fuck are weavers in The Abyss and what are they doing there lmao

[lethal burrow]

they were looking for GMS solutions

[spare anvil]

is gms our grandmother

[lethal burrow]

depends how you look at it

[sudden ginkgo]

May be mother of herra, waiting for mossbag video because not enough proofs

[abstract rivet]

gms -> herrah (?) -> hornet

related in some way for sure

[spare anvil]

perchance

[fading shard]

What proof?

She's herrahs mom in the adoptive sense

[sudden ginkgo]

I don't believe it

[fading shard]

what

Wdym you don't believe it, herrahs a weaver

Gms evolved the pharlids into weavers

forced them into servitude eternal

[sudden ginkgo]

Gms stole silk from weavers

[fading shard]

she did so AFTER she got sealed

and they ran

[sudden ginkgo]

She got sealed because of that

[fading shard]

She got sealed because the weavers found out she lied about them being divine

and her daughters as in being birthed by her

T_T first sinner literally has this dialogue

Hell gms has literal needolin dialogue about that

[abstract rivet]

Why didnt weavers free first sinner after lowk getting grannie to sleep

[fading shard]

It's implied first sinner got sealed BY her sisters because she wasn't cool with them lying about their divinity to the cidatel bugs

[abstract rivet]

oh fuck oh lol

[fading shard]

yeah

[sudden ginkgo]

Hornet is hunter, she just hunts anything vulnerable.

[stone herald]

i hope the silksoing pantheon lets us fight characters you would otherwise love to fight but couldnt in the game, like how we got the nailmasters and PV fights

[stone herald]

i wonder who they'd be though

i doubt itd be your common warrior NPCs, since TC does give them fights in game

[abstract rivet]

pantheons should be called symphony and the whole thing about it should be themed about songs, itd be really cool

[stone herald]

i mean what the pantheons are called would depend on how you access them

[abstract rivet]

each boss a different orcestra frfr

[stone herald]

Silk can store memories in silksong, maybe the pantheon equivalent is hornet tuning into the past memories of pharloom

[stone herald]

so the excuse for "attuning" isnt that you gotta attune them, but you cant fight them if the memory isnt in pharlooms string

[fading shard]

As a undertale fan and lorehead alongside hollow knight I find it frustrating how we went from making chara a demon to making them a sweet angel that did no wrong T_T

[stone herald]

why did Chara make the fandom do that

[fading shard]

Like jesus the game calls Chara out to be a bad person

but not a evil demon

like come on now people

[abstract rivet]

ehh we're going offtopic but one final thing ill say is they dont care abt asriel too theyre just using him

anyways, back to silksong lore

[fading shard]

yee

[abstract rivet]

How is The Mist made

[fading shard]

exhaust organs

[stone herald]

yeah

[fading shard]

the moment phantom was killed

[abstract rivet]

tf they do tho exactly

[fading shard]

and she couldn't yk work on them

[fading shard]

the mist disapeared

[fading shard]

Waste

cidatels waste

[stone herald]

it expels all the unusable silk from the citadel

into bilewater, and that silk is FULL of suffering due to it being in bugs and all

[abstract rivet]

does that correlate to the creatino of muckmaggots

[stone herald]

bilewater being all stinky put the muck in the maggot

[junior heron]

i know this sounds dumb but what exactly are higher beings? what makes them so godly compared to normal bugs?

[fading shard]

Greek gods

they are basically like like greek gods

in some aspects

[fading shard]

Well their gods?

idk what else to say

Like you're either born a god or you aren't in the hollow knight universe

[sudden ginkgo]

What is silksong

[visual glacier]

They have higher abilities than normal bugs I guess

[visual glacier]

Sequel to hollow knight

[sudden ginkgo]

An item?

[junior heron]

i mean yea, but gods are called gods for a reason, they're immortal, have world changing power, and in greeks for example, they represent some sort of aspect in the world

[visual glacier]

It’s a game

[junior heron]

but the line for being a higher being or not in sk and hk is still unclear to me

[visual glacier]

Higher beings are usually associated with essence and pale beings are associated with soul

[junior heron]

essence and soul?

[sudden ginkgo]

Sylphsong?

[visual glacier]

Sylphsong is the item you get when you bind Eva

[junior heron]

then if pale beings are relates to soul, is gms related to soul herself?

[molten python]

That makes it sound like they're two distinct categories. The pale beings are higher beings.

[molten python]

Silk is made from Soul.

[visual glacier]

Pale beings aren’t associated with essence

[junior heron]

the only connection i have between higher beings are that they have the power to somehow evolve their follower, like how gms created the weaver and how pale king created an intelligent society

[sudden ginkgo]

But there is also silksong thing in silksong dlc?

[visual glacier]

There is no silksong dlc

[molten python]

So?

[junior heron]

that makes sense

[visual glacier]

Pale beings are also not necessarily higher beings

[molten python]

Was it ever mentioned that all higher beings are associated with Essence, or is that headcanon?

[visual glacier]

Hornet is called pale herself many times

[sudden ginkgo]

*But there is also silksong thing in dlc "hollow knight: silksong"?

[fading shard]

Well they are

The pale king, gms, radiance are immortal

[molten python]

The White Lady and the Pale King are higher beings at least.

[fading shard]

they aren't invincible

[junior heron]

pale king died bro

[visual glacier]

Yes

[fading shard]

Immortality doesn't mean being unkillable

[junior heron]

ah you mean age wise?

[fading shard]

Immortality means that you don't age

[fading shard]

that's what immorality means

[spare anvil]

is silksong real

[visual glacier]

Hornet also doesn’t age

[molten python]

Immorality means you lack morals and ethics.

[visual glacier]

It’s a typo

[fading shard]

I forgot the T T_T

[fading shard]

yeah

[craggy smelt]

[junior heron]

i thought immortality is the inability to mortal

[molten python]

Hornet may not be immortal.

[junior heron]

well it doesn't matter

[fading shard]

well she is only half higher being

[visual glacier]

She doesn’t age much as far as we’ve seen

[fading shard]

so she could just have a gigantic life span

thanks to her higher being self

[molten python]

She has a really long life span at least.

[visual glacier]

Yeah

[molten python]

None of her mates could match it.

[junior heron]

i mean do weavers age?

[fading shard]

and second higher beings have world changing powers

[visual glacier]

FS is called ancient and widow is called aged

[fading shard]

look at what they all did

[fading shard]

unn created an entire gigantic ecosystem and wildlife

[fading shard]

the mosskin, greenpath and all the flora and life in it was made by her

[junior heron]

ah gotcha, talking about FS, did we fight FS in the dream realm? not dream realm but like the realm you fight karmelita and others

[visual glacier]

It’s similar

[junior heron]

since the web pattern in the arena is similar

[visual glacier]

It’s called a memory internally

[fading shard]

or look at the radiance and how she created the moths, basically has domain over most of the dream realm

And how she was able to create a plague that was able to destroy and screw over an entire region

or nightmare heart who has control over the nightmare realm

[junior heron]

yep, i agree with you with that, then higher beings are just beings that can influence their surrounding, or evolve a civilization

still don't know what essence are tho

[fading shard]

I was saying that they have world changing abilities

by giving examples of what they did

Which all would classify as world changing

[fading shard]

because here you said that the gods tend to be immortal which in hollow knights universe they are

have world changing abilities and prowess

which yet again the higher beings of hollow knight do

[junior heron]

ah i meant greek gods my bad

i didn't imply that the higher beings are immortal, i implied that gods are

[fading shard]

And the higher beings are immortal

and they are GODS

they are called as such several times

In media "gods" have a different scale of power depending on what media they come from

but their core principles tend to stay the same sb

[visual glacier]

Vengefly king is a god

[fading shard]

and for hollow knight universe the higher beings do aswell

[visual glacier]

Stop using the word god in hk lore discussion

[fading shard]

No vengfly is not a god

God seeker calls everything a god

[visual glacier]

Hall of gods would like to say otherwise

[fading shard]

becuase they were looking for a new one

[visual glacier]

Not true

[junior heron]

well, i just wanted to know why they are called higher beings

[fading shard]

because they are gods

[visual glacier]

They are higher than most bugs

[junior heron]

why are the ancient civilization in the void called higher beings

[fading shard]

divine

[junior heron]

what makes pale beings different?

[fading shard]

They are not

[visual glacier]

We don’t know for sure

[fading shard]

T_T

[junior heron]

i think they are?

[fading shard]

glorkish no

[fading shard]

The ancient civilization are not higher beings

[molten python]

All we know is that pale beings supposedly have an instinctual urge to dominate and rule over other bugs.

[junior heron]

well, it's like saying air is invisible because we can't see air now is it?

[visual glacier]

Does white lady? I thought she only wanted to reproduce

[fading shard]

wdym

[visual glacier]

We know WYRMS want to rule over all bugs

[fading shard]

only wants to reproduce with the pale king

[visual glacier]

Not true

[fading shard]

she states as much

[visual glacier]

After he died she still has to put herself in bindings to no reproduce

[junior heron]

with the recent sk lore, is she related to greyroot? it would makes sense then

[fading shard]

Her love only goes to him

[visual glacier]

Not as far as we know

[fading shard]

no

Besides the two have very different interests

[molten python]

Maybe she experiences it slightly differently, I'm not sure. Apparently she feels the desire to spread her seed across the land and propagate herself.

[visual glacier]

Yes

I believe when hornet says that her instincts to rule over bugs will kick in is because of wyrm blood

Wyrms pull bugs into their thrall

[fading shard]

my guy the pale king

[junior heron]

and pale beings are also related to soul?

[fading shard]

He wanted to create a kingdom

[visual glacier]

He did

[fading shard]

not necesserily

[visual glacier]

The ones we have seen, yes

[junior heron]

shamanism is also related to soul too no?

[visual glacier]

Yes

[junior heron]

and shamans worship the void? iirc???

[visual glacier]

Soul isn’t inherently related to pale beings

[visual glacier]

No

[fading shard]

SOme do?

The hallownest ones don't

The pharloom ones do have interest in the void

but worship no

[craggy smelt]

its not really worship, the Void is just a source of power to them that they are interested in

they don't worship Soul either

[visual glacier]

Agreed

[fading shard]

look at what I said

[junior heron]

ah gotcha, so only the ancient civilizations that worship the void?

[molten python]

It's mainly these for me.

You were mortal bugs, caught beneath a being pale... Devotion or destruction... these are the only fates my kind allow.

I'll not deny some part of me desires that outcome... Dominance, it seems, is baked deep in my blood, as too, no doubt, for the one up top.

[junior heron]

based on the tablets and such

[craggy smelt]

so far they're the only ones we know of that worshipped the Void

[fading shard]

All the bloody tribes in hallownest say otherwis

[visual glacier]

I still don’t think white lady has a desire to rule

[fading shard]

he literally went out of his way to respect all the tribes and left them alone

[visual glacier]

Gms and pk yes

[visual glacier]

He wanted to create a kingdom

[junior heron]

i saw somewhere that the ancient civilization bug in hallownest was named "higher being" in the in game file, is that canon or nah?

[visual glacier]

That’s true

[craggy smelt]

funnily enough, Hornet's desire to be different might actually come from her dad

[fading shard]

Yeah he created a kingdom

but he didn't force anybody to join it

[visual glacier]

It’s in his instincts

[fading shard]

those who weren't interested were left alone

[visual glacier]

Alliances were made*

[fading shard]

in fact he wanted to have good relations and be chill with people

[visual glacier]

Not left alone

[craggy smelt]

file names aren't necessarily canon
that particular bug is the big creature holding the Shade Cloak
I think they're just a big bug, not like a god-tier higher being

[fading shard]

Wrong again

[molten python]

He did have a bit of beef with the creatures of Deepnest when he tried to expand in there.

[junior heron]

gotcha

[visual glacier]

Alliances were made about them being left alone

That’s not the same thing as leaving them alone

[junior heron]

how related are soul with void?

[fading shard]

The hive asked to be left alone and they were

[visual glacier]

Not much

[craggy smelt]

Void wants to eat it

[fading shard]

the mosskin had no interest in the pale king and they did absolutely no deals with him

[craggy smelt]

so, 'predator and prey' maybe?

[molten python]

Indeed. They had to hold the beasts of Deepnest at bay.

[visual glacier]

Pilgrims way.

[fading shard]

they just wanted to be left alone and he did

[junior heron]

is that why the void appeared when hornet used the soul trap?

[visual glacier]

Pilgrims way

[fading shard]

I heard you the first time

[visual glacier]

Pilgrims way

[craggy smelt]

possibly, it seems like the Snails figured out a way to use Soul to summon Void, maybe part of that method is basically using Soul as bait

[fading shard]

It wasn't a alliance

[visual glacier]

It was

Pilgrims way was a safe path

[fading shard]

a union or association formed for mutual benefit, especially between countries or organizations.

[visual glacier]

Yeah

[fading shard]

the mosskin did not

[junior heron]

that's cool actually

[visual glacier]

They let pilgrims go to the city

Besides, the mosskin were not left alone, queens gardens was taken over

[junior heron]

then did pale king created the vessels with the white lady because of the nature of pale beings deeply connected with souls?

[fading shard]

that was the queens actions

[molten python]

Those who stray from the White King's roads shall face the law of Unn.

[fading shard]

it was STATED that the queen did so

[visual glacier]

She’s part of the monarchy

[junior heron]

or did he just went with the 2nd strongest being he can find

[fading shard]

it was heavily implied to have happened before the pale king arrived

[visual glacier]

When

[fading shard]

Context and the lore tablet mentioning it by them

it has no mentioning of hallownest the pale king, or his authority

[visual glacier]

Quote it mf

[fading shard]

which they always do when mentioning him

[craggy smelt]

possibly it was because he wanted strong bodies to become vessels
possibly it was because he was married to her, and she'd already let him fool around on the side a little

[fading shard]

"Though once our lands, a pale being lays claim to the caverns ahead.
It may appear benevolent but it does not share our dream.
Be wary to wander that place"

[visual glacier]

That doesn’t say anything about the time period

It could be at any point

[fading shard]

I never mentioned a time period

[molten python]

He made like thousands of vessels, do you think any other creature could handle it? It makes sense.

[fading shard]

I said with how they phrased it

[visual glacier]

“Before the pale king arrive”

[fading shard]

it sounds to have happened before the pale kings arrival

[fading shard]

.

I am not wrong

it does not

[visual glacier]

It could be before or after the pk arrival

[fading shard]

yeah

so you can't really say if it was his fault or not

[visual glacier]

Ok

Anyway they still made an alliance

[fading shard]

The hive?

The hive asked to be left alone and they were left alone

[visual glacier]

That’s so out of the way pk doesn’t care

[junior heron]

it's still weird to me how the vessels could contain the void and still have wills of their own

yes they're both created by 2 pale beings, but strong genetic probably isn't the only thing that affect this

maybe it was the fact that they were born in it?

[visual glacier]

Source?

[junior heron]

like those that can adapt to the void shall become the vessel kinda thing?

and what the hell is everbloom

[craggy smelt]

your guess is as good as anyone's

[junior heron]

nice, it's only description that i remember is "flower with pale light"

[visual glacier]

Flower native to Ze’mer’s home land

[junior heron]

and that somehow related to the fact that it can ward off the void

[molten python]

We know the Hive was sealed off from the rest of Hallownest, with only patrol bees outside.

[visual glacier]

Yes

[twin dragon]

Vessels are most likely the only way pale king could grasp the void without it eventually turning to chaos

[junior heron]

mmmmmmm, well that complicates things, will we go to her hometown in the next game holy hell

[visual glacier]

Kingsmould and wingsmould a?

[craggy smelt]

I think the Void itself has something like a will - feeding it the children basically created a shade of them, the 'Heart of Void' contained in the pale shell
really a vessel isn't a pale child at all, they're a chunk of Void with the form and instincts of a pale child and wearing their corpse

[visual glacier]

Her

[junior heron]

ah my bad

[craggy smelt]

White Lady calls it the 'first light' and the 'only defense against the Void', so it's a pretty big deal

[twin dragon]

They were active for a short period we don't rlly know

[fading shard]

wrong thing sorry

[twin dragon]

Plus collector is a thing

[visual glacier]

Yeah

Collector has an insane willpower

[fading shard]

"Though this hive exists within Hallownest, we play no part in its attempt at perpetuation."

[molten python]

Also it's mentioned that the Hive rejected the Pale King's rule and existed separate from their society.

[visual glacier]

Yes, they weren’t related with the dreamer plan

[twin dragon]

Just like the mantises and mosskin

[fading shard]

and he accepted that

[junior heron]

ah gotcha, that clears up a lof things

[twin dragon]

And deepnest

[fading shard]

And he respected them

and their refusal

[twin dragon]

Kind of interesting that PK let half of his territory be on their own

[molten python]

Also the fact that Hive Queen Vespa trained Princess Knight Hornet, daughter of the Pale King.

[visual glacier]

When?

They sealed off the hive

[twin dragon]

Contrasting GMS who just took over everything on her arrival

[junior heron]

so this "only defense against the void" is a flower that came from Ze'mer's home land has no more lore behind it yet? damn it TC

[visual glacier]

Not everything

[fading shard]

no the hive sealed themselves off

[twin dragon]

almost

[fading shard]

not hallownest doing it

[visual glacier]

That’s what I meant

[fading shard]

T_T the everbloom is the delicate flower

it's the same thing sb

[visual glacier]

Yes

[fading shard]

We just got a namedrop for it

[junior heron]

can we safely assume that this flower is related to a higher being or nah?

[fading shard]

that isn't just "delicate flower"

[visual glacier]

No

[fading shard]

the land of serene

is where it comes from

[craggy smelt]

could be something even more incredible

[junior heron]

yea, if it can ward off the void

[fading shard]

they did get infected though

[visual glacier]

Yes

[fading shard]

we both know that

[craggy smelt]

the Void isn't necessarily related to any higher beings either
light and dark could just be these forces in the world

[twin dragon]

And they only died out because their queen died herself

[visual glacier]

I haven’t read the book sorry

[molten python]

This was written before that.

[junior heron]

i know, names are unnecessary, I'm simply discussing its nature

[visual glacier]

Not true

[molten python]

What do you mean?

[fading shard]

It's the first light so that's lore

[twin dragon]

is ts wanderer's journal book?

[molten python]

Yes.

[fading shard]

it was T_T

[junior heron]

first light? can you say more?

[visual glacier]

It takes place at the same time as the game

[twin dragon]

We see it teleport something something in the delicate flower etv

It might've just vaporized the shade lord aswell we don't know that

[fading shard]

the white lady literally talks about it

and how it's the only thing that can thwart the void

The flower from the mourner is the everbloom T_T

[craggy smelt]

Witness, the first light. The only means we possess to resist that void with which our family is forever linked.

[visual glacier]

“Our family is forever linked” bruh she trying to lowkey take credit for ze’mers flowers

[junior heron]

mhm, I'm asking here because i don't know

[junior heron]

if there is a source for it where i can read it myself, i would be more than happy to do so

[visual glacier]

Because the knight is made of void

[fading shard]

serene

[twin dragon]

Exactly

"To hold it so close, one must surely be unaware of its nature"

[molten python]

My bad, I haven't played Hollow Knight in over a decade, I forget.

[craggy smelt]

nah, she's talking about being linked to the Void, not the flowers
either talking about the Hallownest monarchy, because they tossed their kids into it
or Pale Beings in general, who have got some kind of 'Pale v Void' thing going on

[visual glacier]

For example she sees bretta in both fungal wastes and dirtmouth, also hk released 8 years ago

[craggy smelt]

https://hollowknight.wiki/
got the dialogue in all those character pages

[twin dragon]

It is referring how the PK tried to use the void for his own gain

[molten python]

Well technically the original HK released in 2014.

[twin dragon]

And most of their offspring were yeeted into the abyss

[junior heron]

thanks

[twin dragon]

It was barebones

[craggy smelt]

maybe
'our family is linked to the Void because we tossed our kids into it'
kind've a dark connection, but it's there
TK is Void God now and cares about his sister at least, wonder how they feel about mommy

[visual glacier]

It was like 1 area

[twin dragon]

He did all sorts of experiments in the void

The fucker even built in the abyss

[twin dragon]

Not necessarily the void god, but something the void can answer to

[craggy smelt]

Void Fucker

Void Given Fuck You

[fading shard]

Wow wow

he didn't do anything bad

until

vessel incident

[twin dragon]

He did something stupid

Which spiralled into something bad

[visual glacier]

Hallownest is implied to have had slave labor

[fading shard]

they didn't have slaves

[molten python]

Maggots?

[visual glacier]

Maggots

[fading shard]

and maggots weren't slaves

they were discriminated against

[visual glacier]

They were forced to do menial labor

That’s like the definition of slavery

[twin dragon]

Isn't City of tears promoting segregation

[molten python]

"Weakest members of the kingdom of Hallownest. Generally looked down upon and forced to do menial labour."

[fading shard]

I am aware arvin

[craggy smelt]

they weren't 'slaves', they were just 'low caste'

[twin dragon]

they kinda just segregate the rich from the poor

[molten python]

And were forced to do menial labour.

[craggy smelt]

need a 57 precepts of PK
'it isn't slavery if you don't call it slavery'

[molten python]

We have a 57 precepts of PK's son at least.

[visual glacier]

W joke

[craggy smelt]

PK fooled around with Greyroot
"Baby, I thought she was you!"

[fading shard]

The rich had it better then the poor of hallownest yeah

but they still lived off pretty well

[visual glacier]

Maggots were slaves

Don’t deny it

[fading shard]

I am talking about the bugs

[visual glacier]

Maggots are bugs

[fading shard]

not maggots

[fading shard]

when I say bugs I don't mean the maggots

[visual glacier]

What

[craggy smelt]

'maggots aren't really people' the speciesism is real

[visual glacier]

He’s racist and he’s glazing the pale king

Pale kkking

[craggy smelt]

probably on board with Hunter's attitude

[fading shard]

oh are you kidding me

[visual glacier]

Maggots are bugs too

[craggy smelt]

#maggot lives matter

[fading shard]

yes they are

but I was talking about the bugs that aren't the maggots

[molten python]

The rich had it better than the poor? That's crazy, Hallownest is such a terrible kingdom, I can't believe this.

[visual glacier]

“Everybody except the slaves had it good”

Perfect

[fading shard]

okay that is a better explanation I suppose

[fading shard]

that is sarcasm right

[junior heron]

what is a "root" again in hk and sk? like do they have some kind of special ability or unique nature?

[craggy smelt]

the White Lady is also called 'Root'

[visual glacier]

Only white lady is ever called “root”

[craggy smelt]

no idea what connection if any she has with Greyroot

[edgy nebula]

the greyroot in question

[visual glacier]

Greyroot is probably just blackwyrm situation lowkey

It’s literally the same thing

[junior heron]

how about the greyroot and the witch? and maybe twisted bud?

[edgy nebula]

greyroot is the witch

[fading shard]

greyroot is the witch

[edgy nebula]

jinx

[visual glacier]

(Color) (type of pale being)

[fading shard]

Man

[craggy smelt]

'Root' might be a type of creature, with White Lady being a 'Pale Being/Higher Being' version of them, but that's speculation

[fading shard]

I'd agree

honestly

[fading shard]

what glazing

He was a good king

[visual glacier]

“Pale king did nothing wrong except the vessels”

[fading shard]

I'm not gonna blame the bloody maggots that were hated by seemingly everyone on specifically the pale king

listen if everybody hates the maggots is it really the pale kings fault at that point

[molten python]

Greyroot's parasite is sometimes called "roots".

[craggy smelt]

'everybody hates the maggots, so there's probably a good reason for them being downtrodden'

[molten python]

The White Lady, however, is Root not root.

[visual glacier]

Is it? Interesting

[junior heron]

alright, since it's interesting how some random bud in some random chapel that are usually filled with random bugs have the ability to absorb pale beings

[fading shard]

Listen if everybody hates them there has to be a reason XD

[visual glacier]

This is literally logic racist people use irl

[fading shard]

okay why

[molten python]

Root vs roots is probably similar to Wyrm vs worms.

[craggy smelt]

yeah, I don't know what's going on there
it does start out with Hornet, and builds up to nomming GMS

[junior heron]

if silk is made out of soul, then it would imply that the root can absorb soul to some capacity

[visual glacier]

Maybe

Or just overtake it

[junior heron]

if their nature is silk/soul absorntion, it would make sense if it could consume a weakened gms

[fading shard]

To be fair it is said that hornet was meant to be a host

to strengthen the bud

"a suitable host"

and the bud in question was zapping her strength

and she's both weaver and higher being

[craggy smelt]

she's a pretty good choice - got that Pale bloodline, but still enough regular bug to be vulnerable
a stepping stone to GMS in the end

[fading shard]

so it would make sense that the buds unnatural power came from hornet being its host

[junior heron]

which is deeply rooted with silk and soul

[visual glacier]

Say that again

[craggy smelt]

Rootsong

[junior heron]

[fading shard]

yeah exactly

you get it chef yak

still wish butterfly was here though

or blue, blues a cool guy on the server

[junior heron]

hornet makes her own silk right?

[fading shard]

Weavers naturally do

[fading shard]

but she did get severely weakened

since she got to pharloom

Like seriously weakened she states so several tiemsi n game

she lost a lot of her weaver abilities that she had normally

and lost a lot of strength

[visual glacier]

Trobbio is canonically a butterfly

[fading shard]

hmmmmmmmmmmm anyways-

[craggy smelt]

Trobbio will return...

[molten python]

Silk, not silk.

[junior heron]

well, maybe that's why she's a suitable host

[fading shard]

okay can you mention something that isn't the maggots

[junior heron]

since the twisted bud seem to consume then

[fading shard]

no

[visual glacier]

https://tenor.com/view/trobbio-hollow-knight-silksong-never-forget-who-was-there-for-u-at-ur-lowest-green-gif-10038706922124382739

[fading shard]

they just needed a strong host

[visual glacier]

“Mention something other than the slavery”

[fading shard]

Goddamn it

[fading shard]

Mention something other then the maggots please

[visual glacier]

The vessels

[fading shard]

DAMN IT

[junior heron]

how do you know?

[fading shard]

I mean it's kinda obvious

[fading shard]

I'm gonna be on this forever aren't I

[junior heron]

like how the maggots are slave?

jk

[fading shard]

ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

😔

[molten python]

Back in the day, many travellers acted as hosts. However, later, presumably after rumors of the dangers spread, travelers stopped visiting Greyroot.

[fading shard]

(in all seriousness this is a fun conversation)

[junior heron]

ah ok that makes sense, it just happens that hornet stumble upon it

[fading shard]

hey arvin

got a question

[molten python]

This is mostly headcanon, but I feel like the others before Hornet weren't able to resist the parasite like Hornet and they became brainwashed.

[molten python]

Yes?

[fading shard]

uhhh I assume the answer will be no so I apologize if that is the case but can I add you

I apologize for asking this yet again, and putting you in this situation

[molten python]

Sure, it doesn't really matter.

[fading shard]

anyways

uhhh greyroot is a interesting case

really makes things more confusing in all honesty

[junior heron]

i mean, in the twisted bud ending, even gms herself couldn't resist, so maybe it was a matter of time before hornet fall too?

[molten python]

Possibly. She said that the parasite was trying to take control of her body.

[visual glacier]

The parasite also seems to hate void

[junior heron]

idk how different their "hate" be compared to other bugs there

[visual glacier]

Yeah

Just the best word I can think of

[raven notch]

Grey root is GREY prince zote's mom

[hidden crater]

The parasite is a piece of shit that hates everyone equally

[dense willow]

It is certainly possible there is some relation

Zotes lack of woodiness is a bit of a problem though

But the nail being made of shellwood does support it

[stray fog]

I wonder if the pale king made the white lady show Hornet an everbloom

Because he could see the future

He would know that hornet would need it in the future

[maiden cypress]

given how much the dude worked with void i wonder if the everbloom stuff was like basic first aid for working with void type shit

[craggy smelt]

interesting thought...

maybe he had some on-hand when harvesting and experimenting on the Void

[abstract rivet]

my mind kinda thoughtless

• an silksong husk

[fresh badger]

Good thing grey prince zote is a fanfic writer's delusion of zote and not real zote

[lean temple]

He also knew Hornet would need LoS Knight to save her. PK playing 6d chess

[fading shard]

Oh hey blue :d

good seeing you here

[lean temple]

Hey man

[fading shard]

Pale king actually secretly knew that the hollow knight would turn out to be ruined

and that the knight would randomly show up to save the day

and kill the radiance

[charred nimbus]

So Pale king is actually a good guy, he's basically Gandalf/Dumbledore of Hollow knight world

[fading shard]

Well Pale king is a DECENT guy

[lean temple]

He was never a villain

[fading shard]

he's a decent guy I'd say

[lean temple]

Sure he did some dumb stuff, but he's not malicious

[fading shard]

I think you can agree

[fading shard]

did he though?

Only genuinely bad thing he did was regarding the vessels

And the queens garden fiasco is all on his wife

[charred nimbus]

i would consider workshoping with the void a dumb thing, but i think Pale King was kinda doing good with it

[fading shard]

cause the game very much so words that lore tablet in that way

[fading shard]

is it?

he made those void constructs affectively

[charred nimbus]

yeah, that's what i meant by he was doing good haha

[lean temple]

PK managed to work well with Void, tho in general the Void shouldn't be messed with

[charred nimbus]

Yeah, true

The weavers of Pharloom were also studying or tryin to workshop with the void too

[fading shard]

Should it be messed with no

[charred nimbus]

I just have no idea how that went for then

[fading shard]

but did he make it work for him affectively? YES

pretty decent guy

[lean temple]

Who knows what the Weavers were doing with it

[fading shard]

being horrible bugs that's what

[lean temple]

Maybe something against GMS, but that would only create more problems

[charred nimbus]

They seen like nerds, i would bet on studying it or trying to find a way to control it to kill GMS

[lean temple]

You can still be smart and not wise

I doubt the Void would've worked well for them

[fading shard]

hey blue

Got a hypothetical question for you cause we would never know the answer of

[lean temple]

Sure

[fading shard]

What do you think monomon and pale king did when they did stuff together that wasn't to do with inventing stuff together

because they had a friendship of sorts

And were canonically pals

[lean temple]

Chronicling the kingdom's history

Doing research

Things like that

[fading shard]

Honestly they had a kinda wholesome friendship

she even made a whole poem for him

[lean temple]

I mean he's her king

It's her job

[fading shard]

True

either way wholesome friendship either way

You think the pale king felt a bit saddened to have made her a dreamer

[lean temple]

No cost too great

[fading shard]

I mean yeah he says that yet he still feels a immense guilt about the vessel fiasco

[lean temple]

I mean yeah he could've felt saddened by it, but he knows he had to

And she was willing to take part

Same goes for Lurien

[fading shard]

yeah

Can't believe pale king lost his second lover 😔 /jk

[lean temple]

At least Monomon was smart enough to admit that the plan had failed and THK needed replacement

[fading shard]

Yeah

[lean temple]

If it was up to Lurien he would've remained stubborn until Radiance broke free

Monomon even took failure into consideration

Lurien fully believed they couldn't fail

[fading shard]

well to be fair monomon while biased and friends with the pale king, she was one of the smartest minds in all of hallownest and even in other kingdoms, LURIEN on the other hand was just a obsessed megafan

obviously monomon would yk actually be smart

[lean temple]

Well yeah, but exercising caution doesn't take a genius

The point is that Lurien straight up refused to even acknowledge that THK was failing

[fading shard]

well yeah

true

[chilly mesa]

Hornet is two years old it’s true

[fading shard]

no

[charred nimbus]

I think honestly she just has nanism

...

[vestal swan]

The only one in the group that wasn't science or magic smart

[plush spoke]

why did the watcher at the edge attack us when we needolin

[vestal swan]

We woke him up

He's basically a a guard for the edge of the Kingdom

[silk dirge]

how would you react if you were enjoying sleeping for a very long time and someone woke you up

id be pretty angry too

[plush spoke]

just bc of that?

bro he didnt defend nothing 🥀

his entire kingdom is gone

i dont think he will ever wake up if not because of us

[vestal swan]

They didn't enter from that border apparently

[blissful aurora]

will this guy become a lifeblood monster like the one in the abyss?

[sterile jacinth]

He’s waiting until rebirth and that is a long time coming

[plush spoke]

whats gonna happen during rebirth

[sterile jacinth]

You probably set his soul to rest along with Kahnn allowing rebirth to actually happening

Just for the kingdom to regrow

Like Verdania

[plush spoke]

oh

[dusty sparrow]

i doubt it, that would mean that all creatures killed by lifeblood become like that

i think the abyss creature is a higher being

[twin dragon]

He just gets reanimated further into the game

[lean temple]

Ig his devotion to Hallownest was the selling point

[upper copper]

So I just saw a post on reddit and now I’m convinced lord fool is related to crust king khann.

DUDE THEY LOOK SO SIMILAR!!

And now I just saw another post on reddit where GMS is blind, seeing how she doesn’t have autoaim attacks and needs you to be trapped so that she can use her special 3 mask move

[lean temple]

I mean they look pretty generic

[sinful nimbus]

GMS orients herself to face you constantly which seems a pretty good indicator she has some form of sight

[lean temple]

Yeah

[olive stag]

no, that's the alchemist himself, not his assistant

[lean temple]

And the Weavers mention her "Silken sight"

She can see

[sinful nimbus]

That doesn't seem very literal

[silk dirge]

maybe she cant physically see but she can like sense soul around her

[sinful nimbus]

More analogous to Grimm's "scarlet eyes" and the Masters "long gaze"

[silk dirge]

or smth like that

[lean temple]

It's some form of special vision. The Masters have their "long gaze" as well

[twin dragon]

Does he know about plasmified zango

[sinful nimbus]

Magical sensory abilities aren't analogous though

[lean temple]

Point is she can see in some form

Or sense, whatever you wanna call it

[sinful nimbus]

Yea

[twin dragon]

Interesting how lace has visible eyes while gms doesn't

[upbeat star]

Well a being made entirely out of silk probably dosnt need eyes

[limpid summit]

She’s got “silken sight” which is probably some world sense type thing

She may be physically blind

[lean temple]

As Star said she does orient herself towards Hornet

[upbeat star]

She knew about hornets silk

[lean temple]

So she can "see" somehow

[twin dragon]

Lace wouldn't need "eyes", if that's the case

Phantom doesn't seem to have them but that might be due to deterioration

[upbeat star]

Probably just a fashion thing gms did for lace

[lean temple]

Why would her mask have eye holes tho

[twin dragon]

Also true

That might be something else's mask though

[upbeat star]

To fit the phantom of the opera vibes

[lean temple]

It fits her very well, aside from it falling apart. I doubt the daughter of GMS would need to steal

[twin dragon]

we see it is fragmented

[lean temple]

Bcz they're old

And deteriorating

[upbeat star]

She probably got the mask maker to fashion one for her after gms tossed her away

[twin dragon]

She's deteriorating, not the mask

[lean temple]

It doesn't even stay on on its own

[twin dragon]

I mean it could be but there would be more visible wear around the face

[upbeat star]

The mask is chipped

[plush spoke]

how do the phantom control the mist? does she switch the locations or what

[upbeat star]

I think its just the silk dregs from the exhaust organ causing it

Once the organ is stopped the mists are no longer a thing

[stone yarrow]

Really?

[vestal swan]

No they don't

[plush spoke]

the silksong are the friends we've made along the journey

[visual ibex]

That’s the secret ending

[small gate]

Do you think hornet looks like midwife beneath her mask

[plush spoke]

no

[small gate]

I cant imagine the spiders are pretty bugs

[visual ibex]

Can someone list all the civilizations in silksong

[plush spoke]

hornet doesnt look like midwife
however she looks quite like mywife

❤️

[small gate]

All your wives are midwives

[plush spoke]

are you saying hornet is mid

[visual ibex]

Bro what is this 😭😭😭

Can someone list all the civilizations in silksong

[sinful nimbus]

This is true

[small gate]

You have access to the wiki

[plush spoke]

[small gate]

The weavers are supposed to be something analogous to orb weaver spiders right

Despite not actually looking like them

[visual ibex]

There is no list on the wiki

[small gate]

Have we ever seen an unmasked weaver, sans widow?

[small gate]

But there is a wiki with which you can search

Do it yourself

[visual ibex]

Brochacho

[plush spoke]

sensibooo

[lean temple]

Skarrs, Verdanians, Craws, Ladybugs, Stilkin, Splinters, Judges, Karaks, Flies, Fleas, Snail Shamans, Weavers, Ancient Background Creatures

[small gate]

Axolotls

[visual ibex]

Are the whips thicker bugs one?

Whisp*

[lean temple]

Ig so

[plush spoke]

groal's tribe

[visual ibex]

Yeah

[lean temple]

Stilkin, said them

[plush spoke]

oh theyre called stilkins?

[visual ibex]

I like the craws

And the flies

[plush spoke]

bro they spit shits at u

[heavy gyro]

Shakras tribe

[plush spoke]

sherma

wait the pilgrims

[visual ibex]

But they’re interesting

[plush spoke]

interestingly disgusting

[visual ibex]

And broodmother boss fight was fun

[upbeat star]

Not to hornet, she wants all flies dead

[plush spoke]

no it wasnt

[visual ibex]

Well am I hornet didn’t think so

[visual ibex]

Yes it was

[visual ibex]

Well the craws are cool

[plush spoke]

why cant they fly normally bruh

they all acting like flappy bird

[visual ibex]

Maybe they’re a little tired?

[plush spoke]

hell nah

[upbeat star]

If they had actual erratic bird like movement they would be a pain in the ass

[vestal swan]

Frog guys, weavers, citadel, crabs, crows, mosstown, bonetown, verdania, nyleths forest and kin, splinter tribe of wood imitating bugs, snail shaman family, citadel "employees", slab slaves, pinstress family, Bellhart city, flea nomads, mad doctors, snitches(?) (thieves and scavengers), moortown and their workers, sinners jailors, former farmers of that area, high society citadel bugs, steel city agents, deep dock workers, citadel architects, citadel cogwork robots, ruined surface village, possible ancient civ remnants, the order of judges, disgraced chef group

I tried listing all the groups former and current that I could think of

Oh wait I just remembered two more

[plush spoke]

did we forget about the muckmaggot

[heavy gyro]

Who are the frog guys

[visual ibex]

Why isn’t there any craw stickers in this server

[plush spoke]

they arent cool

[vestal swan]

Nobody has made a good one yet

[vestal swan]

Stilkin(?)

[visual ibex]

Is this rage bait

[upbeat star]

Craw father should be one

[vestal swan]

Those are farm animals not a group of people

[plush spoke]

maybe

[plush spoke]

they became muckroaches

[visual ibex]

I like my craw bois

[upbeat star]

What about the beetles on the surface?

[vestal swan]

They were not people before what?

[plush spoke]

ok bro

how about the wawawa bugs

[vestal swan]

Yeah that's very helpful

The what

[heavy gyro]

Those are judges

[visual ibex]

Ok I’m sending you to the court of craws

[vestal swan]

Ohhh judges good one

[plush spoke]

see he gets it

[visual ibex]

They’ll judge you there

[lime osprey]

Uh i don’t really think so, i think being “Pale” just describes being “of soul” in a significant way

Also my favorite juxtaposition; the PK risked destroying his child to save his dying kingdom, GMS risked destroying her kingdom to save her dying child

[heavy gyro]

Yeah gms or wl werent ever described as light, right

[plush spoke]

and ppl said greyroot's a bitch

[upbeat star]

Pale king was

[plush spoke]

greyroot barely killed anyone for his child

[olive stag]

can't really tell, but it does seem like it wanted to overtake the world

[heavy gyro]

Well yeah, but emitting light doesn't make something a pale being, like the radiance isnt one

[upbeat star]

King soul only came from white lady and pale king not just pale king

[plush spoke]

is your named inspired by karmelita's theme's lyrics

[heavy gyro]

a 🎵🎶

[lime osprey]

Speaking of greyroot. Has anyone every brought up how she and her quest were likely to be in the coral area before it got changed

[plush spoke]

oh why tho

[lime osprey]

That and that Root creatures are animals similar to coral who propagate themselves with spawn released in form of polyps

[upbeat star]

Speaking of higher beings, wonder how Unn is doing

[lime osprey]

Polyps, especially in the context of reproduction, are associated with coral strongly, as that is how coral reproduces

[plush spoke]

oh i really hope they add a coral area in the new dlcs

turns out their light aint even that great

groal the great is greater fr

[lime osprey]

Also the purple crust those purple mosquitoes hang around looks like coral

[upbeat star]

Why did widow stick around? Was she just ensnared by gms?thought pretty much all weavers wanted to get away

[lime osprey]

She stayed loyal to GMS it seems

We don’t really know why but i don’t think it’s hard to imagine why

[heavy gyro]

Hmmm but still, radiance is light and she isnt a pale being so those dont seem to be correlated

[upbeat star]

I think just a lot of higher beings get referenced as light as just something akin to saying godly

[lime osprey]

Higher beings and their allure is articulated as light by common bugs

[heavy gyro]

Radiance and pale king are literally light tho

[lime osprey]

Neither of them are just light, what’s glowing in their shells are likely a strong concentration of essence and soul respectively

Or what causes their shells to glow

[sinful nimbus]

Well Rad is entirely made of essence, being in the dream realm and all

[lime osprey]

Tho essence and soul both emit and are light sources

[upbeat star]

Radiance just has the bad side effect of cursed orange juice

[lime osprey]

Silk probably

[vestal swan]

I love this idea, silk gloves

While that works hilariously with The pale King fraud theory, he glows

[upbeat star]

Being made up of the same thing that everblooms are? I assume pale king has a natural resistance to void

[lime osprey]

Actually no, the void only goes along the strands of silk and are only destroyed when GMS stops pumping soul into it

[vestal swan]

They're not made of the same thing???

[lime osprey]

Well presumably lol

[vestal swan]

And where did you get that idea

Because they are flowers that grow in the ground

[lime osprey]

But the silk is still under the void strands, and we know that because we can see the void shed off them at the end of act 3

[upbeat star]

White lady makes one in hornets memory

[sinful nimbus]

She doesn't conjure it what

[vestal swan]

The void in pharloom would not be doing all that if it didn't have the silk to climb up yes, it's kind of blocked off by volcanoes and doesn't normally possess things

[sinful nimbus]

She literally just gives Hornet a flower presumably given to her by Ze'mer

[vestal swan]

It's a memory, white lady has a flower, they pull it out. The spell is the only thing responsible for creating anything here

[charred fern]

is gms a weaver

[vestal swan]

They basically traded three snail shamans and 3 old hearts for a flower

[sinful nimbus]

AFAIK she's never considered one in game, Weavers are her creations*

-# *altered Pharlids

[charred fern]

but she has silk

[vestal swan]

She shared her ability of silk with the creations she mutated, that does not mean she's the same as them

[upbeat star]

She uplifted the weavers

[vestal swan]

We also don't see the homunculi do any binding or anything similar

Well phantom is doing some kind of magic

[charred fern]

what makes a weaver what it is

[vestal swan]

Weavers are spiders that were uplifted from lower level bugs and mutated by gms's power

[charred fern]

only spiders?

[lime osprey]

The WL remembers one for Hornet to pull out as Hornet’s memory of it appeared to be fading

[vestal swan]

They weren't spiders before but that's what they are considered afterwards

[charred fern]

ok i get u

[upbeat star]

Those little fuckers that snipe you for 2 damage

[vestal swan]

Those are the most telegraphed things to dodge in the game don't tell me you're eating that damage

You can throw a trap out and they will land in it when you run by

[upbeat star]

Once i know they are there yeah sure but first time playing

[lime osprey]

Yeah, he could also easily just use soul to conjure light as well

[vestal swan]

"it could easily do this thing that we don't see anybody doing besides the flies trapped in lanterns"

[lime osprey]

This dude thinks soul itself can’t emit light on its own

[vestal swan]

Who

[upbeat star]

Lumaflies are just bioluminescence right?

[vestal swan]

As far as we know yes

[lime osprey]

Soul emits light also

[vestal swan]

And don't we have examples of jars of the stuff all over the first game, they slightly glow iirc

[lime osprey]

Yeah they do, soul glows inside of Groal also

And also, more powerful silk seems to emit a faint light as well

[upbeat star]

Yeah when he does vengeful spirit

[vestal swan]

He doesn't do vengeful spirit

His spell if you can even call it that is basically just a ball of soul

[upbeat star]

That shit looks like vengeful

[vestal swan]

It doesn't actually

Soul belch™

[upbeat star]

Its the exact same spell effect minus the eyes

[lime osprey]

They’re tangentially related obviously, and TC obviously meant to draw similarities between it and vengeful spirit, but the form it takes clearly shows that it is not vengeful spirit

Anyways, there were people here earlier who didn’t know that silk was, more or less, another form of soul. I’m wondering then, what was the reason they thought GMS was considered pale in the first place if it weren’t for the soul in her silk

[vestal swan]

Silk shes wearing

[lime osprey]

Truthful, I’m wondering what those who didn’t know soul was in silk thought of why GMS was considered pale

[vestal swan]

Appearance

[lime osprey]

Yeah i suppose lol

[vestal swan]

It's literally a description

[lime osprey]

Pale is a descriptor but it doesn’t just describe appearance

[vestal swan]

Pale one pale shell

It hasn't been used to describe anything else?

[lime osprey]

GMS isn’t even pale, that’s just the silk around her body

[vestal swan]

Yeah but she appears pale

[lime osprey]

Pale isn’t just a physical descriptor tho lol

[vestal swan]

Except that it is never used for anything else besides fan definitions

[trail wasp]

Question: Is it stated somewhere that the Weavers were unable to have offspring?

[lime osprey]

There are bugs with shells as light as the vessels and hornet yet no common bug has ever been described as pale

[edgy barn]

Not unable but extremely difficult. It is stated by Eva

[vestal swan]

In conversations with Eva it is stated that it is difficult to have children for weavers, and that the bloodlines are cursed

[trail wasp]

So Hornet is an irregularity of birth to Herrah

[lime osprey]

The weavers have the same tone as Hornet yet only Hornet is singled out as pale amongst them

[trail wasp]

Probably due to being a Pale Being

[vestal swan]

Nobody matches the vessels paleness, people have taken up a color chart and proved it several times

[lime osprey]

Pale is obviously just just a physical descriptor

[trail wasp]

The Pale King was also visually describing by being surrounded by a pale light. Makes sense that Hornet might have inherited that trait.

[vestal swan]

No, she was a difficult child to have not an impossible one

[trail wasp]

Pale Beings just have aura built into them

[sinful nimbus]

In other words an irregularity of birth

[vestal swan]

This would make some kind of sense if anybody ever addressed a glow on hornet or TK

[lime osprey]

Pale ore and pale oil are not entirely white, certainly not as white as the shells of the vessels

[trail wasp]

I mean, they probably do, but it probably looks special to bugs and normal to us

We only see Hornet and Hollow Knight from their start

we aren't aware if there is a way they'd look without their "paleness"

[vestal swan]

If a bug walked up to you glowing they would mention it, characters mention all other kinds of things

[lime osprey]

Even still, if pale is just a descriptor of appearance, a pale appearance is a byproduct of the nature of the pale entity

[vestal swan]

Yeah that's called genetics

[lime osprey]

Nah

[vestal swan]

Literally yes

Evolution and genetic traits are things that are confirmed to exist in this game

[sterile jacinth]

There are some white bugs who I wouldn’t consider pale

[vestal swan]

And they aren't considered pale they don't match the same shade

[sterile jacinth]

I think it is partially a title or description of power

What about Palestag?

[lime osprey]

Lace does not have the genes of GMS in her

[vestal swan]

It's not a description of power because nothing about them is different, pale stag is pale looking, it's also apparently an inconsistent memory and it has control over plants not soul

[vestal swan]

She's made out of thread, the the same thing that would have somebody look at GMS and assume she is pale

[lime osprey]

Nobody is assuming tho, GMS and lace are pale

They are not fake pale or whatever lol

[vestal swan]

It is a assumption based on appearance that characters have made yes, because if they saw her take off the silk she would not be called pale that seems pretty obvious

Her body is pitch black her face is also black? She has the weird scissor things which are gold

[lime osprey]

GMS is pale regardless of how much silk she has around her body lol

[silent pollen]

Can someone say whats the debate here

[lime osprey]

Being pale is inherent to her nature not her appearance

[vestal swan]

Group of people who think pale means something other than they look pale

[silent pollen]

Higher being 2.0

[vestal swan]

When I have just proven it repeatedly that it has never been used for anything else

The only person to ever say anything about a pale being being better is a YouTuber

[trail wasp]

Higher Being DLC Edition

[silent pollen]

I mean its just higher being but strongher and rarer

[lime osprey]

Whether if the pale descriptor is arbitrary or not

[vestal swan]

It's not that's a baseless line from a YouTuber lol

[lime osprey]

A pale being, it seems, is a being related to soul in some significant way

[silent pollen]

I mean bell beast is white and isnt a pale being but i guess it doesnt match the color

[trail wasp]

Pale Beings are just certain forms of Higher Beings

[vestal swan]

Except pale stag and white lady

[lime osprey]

Pale being ≠ higher being

[vestal swan]

Can't just keep ignoring literally everything that goes against your theory

[trail wasp]

Where did you come from, where did you go?

[lime osprey]

White lady is related to soul as her union with her PK created a charm that can generate soul and her children can wield soul

Also pale stag isn’t even real lmao

[silent pollen]

It is tho

[trail wasp]

Palestag is real

[silent pollen]

Atleast was

[trail wasp]

It's dead, but it was real

It's the entire point of why the Princes were chosen

[lime osprey]

No palestag isn’t real and has never been real

[silent pollen]

I mean its not exactly as powerfull maybe its just related to the white thingys in green verdania

[lime osprey]

“Myth made real in memory. The creature seemed completely at one with the flora around it. Did it ever truly exist as I have seen it?”

Palestag doesn’t exist

[lime osprey]

Nothing goes against this theory lol

[vestal swan]

Hornet doesn't believe it exists, it's what got the princes their throne

[trail wasp]

Hornet is just in marvel at the creature

[lime osprey]

And where is this stated lol