sk-lore

[gray iris]

groal is such a cool dude he learned soul powers just to protect his people from grand mother silk

[edgy nebula]

theyre bsically the same story wise though

[chrome atlas]

I'm aware, just assuming the OP's logic from the genealogy posted on Reddit

[edgy nebula]

he STOLE soul powers and tortured a snail shaman

[gray iris]

good fuck em

[edgy nebula]

thats not nice

[fossil ledge]

This seems quite likely, yes

[gray iris]

kill snails

[fossil ledge]

It's also worth noting that many shamans in HK have a dedicated charm

[dapper willow]

Yeah
But most bugs being unable to use soul safely is just lame so I'd rather thing othervise until the games tell us more

[gray iris]

im on team grool

[fossil ledge]

Shaman Stone depicts the Queen's Garden's Shaman, the one that gives you the scream spell

Soul Catcher depicts the Snail Shaman in the Forgotten Crossroads

[rancid violet]

What is up with the snail shamans, do they have a pale snail mother

[fossil ledge]

Soul Eater depicts the buried Shaman found in the Resting Grounds

[edgy nebula]

if we go by hk theyre all related in some way

[gray iris]

the bile water people have immunity to maggots thats why they are able to learn soul skills they have the power to preserve soul

[dapper willow]

They died good enough to make charms

[fossil ledge]

This last one is called an artefact, which suggests the others might be too, tools used by the Snail Shamans to enhance their soul-wielding abilities

[chrome atlas]

they're just kinda like that

[edgy nebula]

e.g, every snail shaman in hk are cousins/aunts/uncles

[wanton finch]

given they have some relation to void, i doubt they have pale origins

[fossil ledge]

This is unfortunately directly confirmed in the game, though

[dapper willow]

Eh...

[fossil ledge]

It's explicitly stated to be the reason why Hallownest had such a large mining operation of the pink crystals

[edgy nebula]

if i could guess theyre probably descendants of the ancient civilization people

though there isnt much evidence to that

[dapper willow]

Game has lots of dialouges
Its easy to forget
I would like to see that piece of text

[rancid violet]

They're two void related peoples I suppose

[fossil ledge]

Lemme try to find it

[edgy barn]

Not really. You are thinking of Quirrel's quote but he doesn't state the crystals were being mined as an alternative to soul, only that their energy is less powerful but less lethan than Soul

[gray iris]

if groal could desolate dive he would be unstoppable

[edgy barn]

It is a possibility, but not the only one

[edgy nebula]

the best lore in silksong is the return of gruzzermilk

[fossil ledge]

Quirrel says this in his dialogue in Crystal Peaks:

The crystal ore is said to contain a sort of energy, not as powerful as the soul the city dwellers harnessed but far less lethal.
...Strange to know such ancient facts. I wonder from where my knowledge comes?

[gray iris]

when they make super groal in the dlc they gotta give hin sharp shadow and abyss shriek too

make him the hardest boss in the game

black groal

[fossil ledge]

Technically true, but why would this be the first thing he describes about them? Why else would they be mined in such large quantities for?

[fossil ledge]

Isn't Groal already black, though?

[rancid violet]

Give him flukenest but with stiltkin

[gray iris]

do groal become black if u fight him in act 3

[fossil ledge]

Or am I misremembering?

[dapper willow]

Yeah that doesn't really confirm or deny what people can and can't use it safely

[woven belfry]

Is there a lore reason for why cogflys are so goated?

[gray iris]

anyways the dlc should have a super groal called lost groal or something

[tiny socket]

Perhaps they contain souls

[fossil ledge]

Correct, but to what extent others can and cannot use soul, we have the Soul Sanctum to go back to

[dapper willow]

they are used by the highest ranking people so i guess they gotta be premium stuff

[gray iris]

and make it a hard fight but not bullshit with ads

kinda like lost silk

[woven belfry]

You should fight goal the great groal the mediocre and groal the worst all at the same time

[edgy barn]

Isn't the whole point of Soul Sanctum to show that using Soul is bad for most bugs? Even the ones that didn't turn into goop still sweeled up.

[tiny socket]

Groal of Christmas past

[rancid violet]

They should do the eternal ordeal with groal

[gray iris]

groal the extra great

[dapper willow]

The soul sanctum people sound like insane maniacs, so I wouldn't really say wether they are a good example of soul users
Then again the shamans are weird too so who knows really

I guess all magic users are evil except hornet and the knight

[fossil ledge]

I mean, part of the reason they went insane in the first place is misuse of soul

Said misuse being taking it from other bugs and soul totems and hoarding it

[woven belfry]

I could see that but is soul even allowed in pharloom?

[fossil ledge]

I suppose stuffing it in themselves using the machinery and equipment found there?

[dapper willow]

some of the choir enemies use silk, whcih is soul, so I guess yes

[tiny socket]

As in, the cogworks all have the souls of bugs inside, not soul energy

[fossil ledge]

Why use soul when you can just use silk in Pharloom?

[woven belfry]

Yeah that makes sense plus hornet probably upgraded them to be better at combat herself

[dapper willow]

silk seems to be a much safer version of soul
I guess its better to use processed than raw

[chrome atlas]

drone strikes do work even in pharloom

[fossil ledge]

It does seem to have a significantly lower mortality rate, anyway

[edgy barn]

On this, I do agree tha the crystals were mined for their energy, just not that it was specifically as an alternative to Soul.

[woven belfry]

Ohh you mean the lumaflys
I doubt it we dont see any come out when they break

[chrome atlas]

We do, in fact

[edgy barn]

This is my take too

[tiny socket]

The cogwork dancers have the soul of the green princes partner in them don’t they?

[fossil ledge]

What makes you think that? Not sure why else Quirrel would mention this if it isn't related to the reason for them being mined

[dapper willow]

I do think that raw soul could be used ethically by normal bugs, its just that its very easy to go wrong with it, and also all the people we have seen use it are maniacs so it clouds our vision of soul

[chrome atlas]

Each time you break a cogwork enemy there's a tiny lil fly that flies up, and you see big containers with them in Whiteward, where Silk's yoinked from folks

[gray iris]

robot bees are the weapon of the most powerful bugs in the citadel and u make cogflies based on robot bees thats why cog flies are so powerful because they are based on the weapon of the conductors the most powerful bugs in the citadel

[woven belfry]

Silk is a physical thing while soul is mental and its a lot easier to get better with something physical as there are limits to the average bugs mind

[woven belfry]

Wait wha

[fossil ledge]

Likely because soul in most cases is either too powerful if truly raw or stolen and thus "in agony", if I had to guess

[gray iris]

soul is kept in the shell it is magic juice

it is not mental

and hornets soul is solk

[tiny socket]

Soul is juice like how void is soup

[dapper willow]

we see the soul contained in the shaman containers
Soul seems to be more like a white goo than mental stuff

[fossil ledge]

I mean, we litarally see bottle of it in both games

[gray iris]

it is magic juice thats why u cant have a much when u die ur juice holder is broken

[tiny socket]

It appears gaseous though

It’s like the bottled air from the Lorax

[fossil ledge]

It appears to be a semi-liquid, semi gas-like substance

[gray iris]

it is like propane under pressure liquide but in atmosphere gas

[edgy barn]

Gases are still physcal

[dapper willow]

it can take many forms
gaseous soul
liquid soul
Solid soul
Soul plasma??

[woven belfry]

Yeah but you still need a strong mind to use it right? Other wise why were the soul sanctum scholars trying to go for a pure focus
Are they stupid?

[tiny socket]

That’s a true statement

[fossil ledge]

Some theorize the pink crystals are solid soul

[gray iris]

who says they need a strong mind they just need a big soul sac

[dapper willow]

to fight the infection?
They might be stupid too
Soul master seemed to be very arrogant

[dapper willow]

I disagree with some people

[rancid violet]

Invincible, Fearless, Sensual, Mysterious, Enchanting, Vigorous, Diligent, Overwhelming, Gorgeous, Passionate, Terrifying, Beautiful, Powerful GROAL

[gray iris]

maybe the soul master and groal are born with big soul sacs like the ghosts juice sphere

[woven belfry]

I thought they were using soul to fight the infection and needed pure focus to fully use soul
Soul master is very arrogant though

[fossil ledge]

Well, Soul Master mentions he learned about soul's potential in a dream, heavily hinting at the Radiance's involvement

[rancid violet]

Soul master tried to use soul to become immortal so he is an edge case

[dapper willow]

yeah something like that
Thats why we need a magic focus in the third hollow knight game

[gray iris]

the hollow knight is hollow thats why he can hold much soul

[woven belfry]

Imagine killing thousands of bugs because "it was revealed to me in a dream"

[edgy barn]

Soul Master thinks he is using Soul to fight the Inffection, but the Infection is the thing compelling him to use soul

In other words, he is getting played

[gray iris]

i didnt know soul master was infected

[vague fiber]

I want them to make a Colliseum of fools style area, but it's Trobbio' putting on "Shows".

[dapper willow]

he spews orange

[gray iris]

nah this game have too many ganks dont need more

[rancid violet]

This is why I say hollow knight is the battle of the goops, you got soul, infection, fizzy acid and void

[edgy barn]

He straight up has the orange eyes

[vague fiber]

GANKS with no reward!!

[gray iris]

i havent played hk1 in like 4 years

[vague fiber]

Don't forget lifeblood!

[rancid violet]

Oh yeah

[woven belfry]

Oh I think groal used the dead snail shaman to get their soul since its said he stole that soul

[rancid violet]

Milk, Fanta, sprite, gatorade and Dr pepper

[woven belfry]

1 void
2 infection
3 life blood
4 soul
5 fizzy acid

[gray iris]

yeah but he still have a big soul sac else he cannot store it

[woven belfry]

In terms of how powerful the goop is

[dapper willow]

Everyone says that but I think he stole more than just the soul of the shaman and I think that is an important distinction

[woven belfry]

What if the big soul sack is the mind

[gray iris]

like bugs are born with soul sacs with varying sizes but not necessarily produce soul innately

[woven belfry]

What else did he steal

[dapper willow]

The soul of other bugs

also possibly the spell of the shaman

[gray iris]

i mean like is wisp father fireballs from his mind

[rancid violet]

Best tier list yet, power scaling the goop

[gray iris]

or is it physical

[woven belfry]

I mean he is a dictator so I dont think its impossible that he sucksd the soul juice out of people who disobeyed him

[gray iris]

it doesnt really matter cuz it kills shit

[chrome atlas]

What the fuck even is Wisp Thicket, man
Like why is there this one fire cult that summons literal fireflies and is led by a wicker man

[dapper willow]

He had the citadel bugs right there
He didn't need to sucktion his own people

[edgy barn]

Groal and Soul Master having more soul in their bodies that they are supposed to is the whole reason they are so...round.

[woven belfry]

He could do both hes a dictator

[dapper willow]

who knows
Hoping for dlc to explain

[gray iris]

im pretty sure groal was doing the best for his people by preventing the encroachment of grand mother silk in bile water

[vague fiber]

I'm very excited for DLC>

[waxen forum]

Pantheon 5 Groal with ddark including the iframes

[rancid violet]

I have no idea but I kinda love it. Enough devotion to a thing and these bug can do anything

[dapper willow]

imagine the dlc is just bug fixes and qol

[gray iris]

groal is a hero all hail generalissimo groal the great

[tiny socket]

If they fix garmond the bug, I’ll be happy

[woven belfry]

Typical team cherry
makes something awsome and or overly confusing
doesnt explain
Repeat

[tiny socket]

He didn’t deserve it

[gray iris]

what is bugged with garmond

[tiny socket]

He’s a bug that needs fixing

[edgy barn]

I will go to sleep now

Goodbye

[gray iris]

garmond has the best voice lines in the game when he shoot black balls at u

[woven belfry]

Is there a lore reason why garmond and zaza are so goated?

[rancid violet]

Everything is a bug

[dapper willow]

yupp

[gray iris]

it is so sad garmond dies i wish u could adopt zaza

[wild zinc]

That’s what she said

[tiny socket]

He’s not dead he’s just resting his eyes

[rancid violet]

Forbidden boba

[wild zinc]

Why does lace get freed from the void but not garmond

[tiny socket]

He’ll get better with a bugfix

[dapper willow]

The gigachad effect
Some bugs are just born op, they live long, are much stronger than the average dude, and have special stuff going on with them

[dapper willow]

garmond gets freed too
He is just too weak to survive

[tiny socket]

The lore reason is he wisely manages his sleep schedule

[wild zinc]

Oh

[gray iris]

what is the lore reason fourth chorus is the fourth chorus are all the big mecha bugs near architect choruses too

[woven belfry]

Garmond is even more goated because hes just a normal bug
Small size no big muscles no soul or silk just goated

[dapper willow]

weakened from old age and pushing himself

[gray iris]

and the one we fight just happens to be the fourth one they made

[frigid owl]

Mister mushroom is the real main character?

[rancid violet]

Fr I think it's because he's bug Don quixote

[tiny socket]

Imagine fighting the entire song

[gray iris]

it would be silky

[woven belfry]

Mr mushroom is far too passive to be a main character
But he is probably the longest living but Im the game likely including the radiance and pale king

[dapper willow]

Styx is such a creepy guy

[gray iris]

my head canon is the hollow knights dads mecha was made by twelfth architect thats what the big shell in kingdom edge is his mecha he is a worm and the big thing is a mecha made in his image that he used to travel to hallownest to fight radiance

[rancid violet]

Oh I meant that Garmond is Don quixote

[gray iris]

but the mecha was too shitty and broke down thats why the events of hollow knight 1 occurred

[woven belfry]

I replied to the wring guy my bad lol

[rancid violet]

No worries

[gray iris]

if the architects were not shit at their job then the entire plot of hollow knight 1 could be prevented

[rancid violet]

Doesn't Mr mushroom just allude to TC other games

[gray iris]

tc has other games?

[buoyant salmon]

also why everytime I break the cocoon after Hornet died, it have sth like void juice falling out?

[frigid owl]

Mr mushroom is the most powerful being in hollowknight

[rancid violet]

Yeah like hungry Knight

[gray iris]

because hornet has void in her

[buoyant salmon]

his master: Am I a joke to you

[rancid violet]

Mr mushroom us a trans dimensional being connected to all worlds

[frigid owl]

He's beyond his master already

[gray iris]

but not as much as the hollow knight just little bit of void

[buoyant salmon]

then why he was called "Herald" then

[woven belfry]

I feel like the reason why the stilkin and the ants are still around while the coral guys and mantises are all dead is because theyre more underhanded in their fighting styles
We know from hollow knight that the mantis tribe is likely very honorable and the coral guys seem very straight forward in their fighting style
While the stilkin use literal guerrilla warfare war fair tactics and the ants hide away

[frigid owl]

They need to make a third hollow knight game about mister mushroom

[gray iris]

real

the coral guys are trash

[rancid violet]

The only damage you can do is spore shroom

[woven belfry]

Herald to a new age
Also he doesnt have a master

[buoyant salmon]

that not how it's mean lmao

[frigid owl]

That'd be such a big hit

[woven belfry]

Thats literally the definition of the word lmao

[knotty dome]

The coral guys all died off cus of their lands degrading and GMS awoken going after khan

[buoyant salmon]

ever heard Galactus? Silver Surfter is Galatus's herald

[rancid violet]

The coral died of being dry

[woven belfry]

Are you using marvel comics as evidence lmao

[gray iris]

the sands of karak and blasted steps are evidence of deforestation encroaching in previous habitats soon shellwood will also be sandy without the roots of plants to keep the soil regulated

[buoyant salmon]

did you know Hornet use "herald" as NOUN?

[woven belfry]

I think they dried after they died

[gray iris]

the plot of hollow knight 2 does not matter because the entire pharloom will be gone in the near future anyways due to the climate change

[woven belfry]

Yeah
Because Herald is a noun no matter how you use it

[buoyant salmon]

this is a verb

[woven belfry]

"As the Herald of spring" is that being used as a verb to you?

[buoyant salmon]

and that the same for Silver Surfer, who is Galactus herald

[rancid violet]

Who's Harold

[woven belfry]

https://tenor.com/view/ishowspeed-try-not-to-laugh-gif-7682731162751353849

This is embarrassing

[gray iris]

yeah u should learn english

it is pretty obvious herald does not refer to being subordinate to someone but indicating the arrival of some event

[woven belfry]

Yeah i dont blame you for thinking that at first but its clear Herald in this instance means something different then a Herald of galactus

[chrome atlas]

If we want to quibble over grammar:

Herald is both a noun and a verb. The verb 'herald' means 'to foreshadow', and traditionally means that something indicates the arrival of something else. Seagulls going inland can herald a storm coming from sea, for example.

Herald as a noun means that there is an object that itself foreshadows something. A seagull flying inland is a herald of a storm coming in from sea, for example.

Both forms are accurate, stop nitpicking.

[woven belfry]

Thank you

[rancid violet]

Harold is so confusing

[gray iris]

anyways pharloom is fucked anyway due to the death of greenery making the land dessicated so the plot of hollow knight 2 does not matter

[edgy nebula]

itd be so cool if coral tower was expanded into a full area like with verdania

[woven belfry]

There is always a chance to rebuild

[gray iris]

verdania will be fucked eventually first shellwood then greymoor then verdania all bill become a desert

[edgy nebula]

mayhaps after our first bossfight khann couldve escaped/knocked hornet down, falling back through the hole and into the starting part where she has to head through the gate on the right that ws unused for some reason

[rancid violet]

Maybe that twisted bud can grow into a stabilising tree

[gray iris]

and the citadel is not gonna have any water so that will go to shit too

[woven belfry]

This is a terrifying thing to think

[buoyant salmon]

also it interesting that Hornet could undertand Mr Mushroom'

[gray iris]

the only thing that will survive is the weavenest robots

[tiny socket]

You hate children

[hollow aurora]

The goat

[buoyant salmon]

since the Knight couldn't without Spore Shroom

[cloud plover]

hasn’t verdania been fucked already for a long time

[woven belfry]

Yeah your right actually

[woven belfry]

Yes its been long long dead

[gray iris]

if hollow knight 3 take place in pharloom then it will be a robot game taking place in a desert underground

[edgy nebula]

i dont think she could, she wanted to get him to talk to her and when he did he spoke pretty plainly

[gray iris]

except the lifeblood which can somehow survive in dry environements like wormway

[rancid violet]

Look the blasted steps are miserable, it's not like some grey roots would make it worse. Atleast that's a living plant

[chrome atlas]

Pharloom still has greenery in the Memorium and Far Fields. Sinner's Road was used as a roach ranch and Moss Grotto just exists, so there's food, and water's still existing in Greymoor and in the High Halls. Desertification tends to require much less greenery than Shellwood and Moss Grotto provide. It's in a pretty poor state at the end of things, but it's hardly unsalvageable

[edgy nebula]

blasted steps used to be entirely overrun with coral

infact half the kingdom was, according to the shamans iirc

[buoyant salmon]

"Always my vision is too clouded by the present"

[gray iris]

yeah but clearly the coral bugs in coral tower indicate that there used to be water there so some climate change is happening

[buoyant salmon]

what does he meant

[woven belfry]

The grey roots sap things of strength
Thats everything the entire land of pharloom being sucked dry thats worse then the void

[edgy nebula]

was taken by the citadel probably

[gray iris]

and shellwood is right next to that so it will be next

[woven belfry]

My best guess is mr mushroom has long term memory loss and can only think of things as theg happen

[gray iris]

i mean if u go up to nameless town the entire thing surrounding pharloom is a desert

[edgy nebula]

so was the area surrounding hallownest

[buoyant salmon]

though this make him able to remember it

"Remarkable things all, though given their void claimed state it seems you and I may be the last to hold those memories."

[gray iris]

so like the entire setting of hk1 and hk2 are probably tiny desert oases

[woven belfry]

Typical mr mushroom making no sense

[chrome atlas]

Shellwood has too much rampant vegetation to desertify. Desertification requires a lack of root variety and water, which Shellwood absolutely does not have

[woven belfry]

Tastiest bug in pharloom?

[chrome atlas]

shakra

[woven belfry]

Second sentinal right there

[rancid violet]

Yeah in hk1 outside of hallownest is just super windy, where ever the god seekers are from is wracked by storms and outside pharloom seems to be equally windy and dusty

[gray iris]

but still it is right next to a desert

[woven belfry]

Should I make a tierlist by how tasty I think each silksong enemy is

[chrome atlas]

The Sahara is shrinking

[lethal burrow]

It would be a big tier list

[woven belfry]

Okay ill be back in like an hour lol

[gray iris]

and a previously wet area is now dry

hallownest is in a much better position because the big lake in the middle serves as an aquifer

[rancid violet]

Could always redirect the water from bilewater

[gray iris]

in contrast the only large body of water in pharloom is on the right side of the map

[cloud plover]

i wonder what would happen

[chrome atlas]

You're missing the gigantic fuckoff lake in Shellwood's background art

[gray iris]

that is a solution i guess

[lethal burrow]

This is what I say when somebody does something that's a turn off

[rancid violet]

Well getting the water flowing would be a good start

[chrome atlas]

Maybe not as big as Blue Lake, but still massive, and probably enough to keep the High Halls' water going

[lethal burrow]

I figured that's where the water is coming from to go into greymoor, all the putrid parts are too big to slip through the cracks in the rock, and so the water becomes purified and rains down

[gray iris]

i mean if they build a dam and artificial river they could probably save shellwood

but it would be an uphill battle

[rancid violet]

I doubt karak could ever support that much water again but you could get a good swamp/marsh going, whichever is the healthy one I can't remember

[chrome atlas]

They're both wetlands, and they're both pretty healthy

[lethal burrow]

what about a bog

[rancid violet]

Oh its the bog that's bad

[chrome atlas]

Eh, they're pretty massive carbon sinks, and they're pretty biodiverse

[gray iris]

the citadel bugs build memoria so they probably understand forestry to some extent they could extend shellwood to the left

plant some huge trees and shit

bone bottom seems like a buffer area but it is in decline

[rancid violet]

Getting the moss to spread upwards would make wormways far more pleasant

[shell jewel]

Guys Savage Beastfly got trapped in a glue trap will you help him?

[rancid violet]

I don't know what the biome between a mossy area and magma is called but bone bottom is that

Probably very humid

[gray iris]

do pharloom even have the combustion engine or do they just use geothermal energy from the deep docks

[edgy nebula]

i just got a real stupid crackhead theory

[lethal burrow]

and then it's one of those mobile game prompts that's like "help him" "leave him" with the flashing red text and the badly animated stuff in the background

[shell jewel]

what the fuck is that a mobile game ad

[lethal burrow]

speak

[shell jewel]

oh it is

[edgy nebula]

one second i just spilled water all over my bed im a stupid idiot

[lethal burrow]

lol

[edgy nebula]

ok

[rancid violet]

Bobbit is making their own swamp

[edgy nebula]

what if, the city of steel is located to the left of bonegrave, and reaches all the way up to karak, and thats why watcher at the edge is there, to watch incase they come fight khann

and maybe theyre part of the reason why khann is dead

no evidence for it, but i find it cool

[lethal burrow]

hmmm

I feel like we would see that if we went to the edge of the kingdom, considering that's where the entrance is

[rancid violet]

The access to magma has made a massive difference in metal forging, it would make sense for a whole city of steel to be using it as well

[edgy nebula]

could simply be too far away

[rancid violet]

Up in the cradle there are a bunch of cages used to catch silk makers, maybe one of the silk makers is from the city of steel

I don't remember what they say off the top of my head

[chrome atlas]

That's literally how we know it's called the City of Steel, one of the cages held a Weaver from there

[rancid violet]

Ooohhh

My dumbness still stands

I thought we found out from steel soul guy in hk1

[shell jewel]

what's this guy

[fallen hornet]

is this canon?

[torn lark]

Should I use spoiler warnings in this channel?

[rancid violet]

No

[edgy nebula]

nah

[rancid violet]

Spoilerless zone

[chrome atlas]

Seems like a statue that would've greeted pilgrims who got to the Citadel, probably cast down because the Citadel grew to favour the higher castes over pilgrims

[fallen hornet]

depends how huge of a spoiler it is

[chrome atlas]

krat goe punched in the face for peeping, I think the moment someone gets their junk out they're cooked

[fallen hornet]

theyre abt to be hit by 20 pimpillos

[rancid violet]

Hornet grows 20 extra limbs just to smack them

[chrome atlas]

my god, you actually did it

[tiny socket]

Groal does not deserve S tier tastiness

Also the Fay platforming enemies are made out of crystal, why are they so high?

[woven belfry]

1 moorwing hes one of very few bugs we see eaten and that meat looks good as hell. Itd be very fatty due to the fact moorwings been allowed to roam free eating anything
2 I feel all the craws would taste good and the craw father would be the most aged out of all of them
3 groal would definitely be the biggest risk (like pufferfish) due to his environment but it would be a very tender meat and i feel like the soal would add a lot of flavor
4 voltvrym would taste like grape jelly trust
5 the pale stag is born from legend and theres gotta be a legend of them tasting amazing. Plus regular clover stag would probably taste like real world dewr

[zinc pivot]

Because magic crystal energy

[woven belfry]

Salt

[torn lark]

I just realized the fleas aren’t celebrating one last time they are preparing for battle.

[woven belfry]

Grind them into a powder and use them as seasoning

[zinc pivot]

The power of fluff compells you
They did not say that

[tiny socket]

I feel the Karak enemies would taste pretty good, like crab

[woven belfry]

"We stand till the last" means theyll party till all of them will die
"Face the darkness" means theyll face demise with a smile

[zinc pivot]

Only the furm, the conchflies and driznits probably taste like sea snail

[woven belfry]

I feel like due to the fact their warriors the meat woukd just be far too chewy and tough to have any real flavor

But woukd still taste like crab which is why theyre in c

[zinc pivot]

Im surprised you put the flies that high

They are gross and unsanitary per hornet

[tiny socket]

I reckon the Conchflies, especially the great Conchflies would be good, they just spend all their time getting fat

[woven belfry]

True actually

[woven belfry]

I feel like if you clean the meat itd be atleast edible

[chrome atlas]

Could you actually eat the Mnemonids? Like they're rocks, and if you grind them down wouldn't they just take the powder and reform?

[tiny socket]

It must be considered that everything is a bug, thus it’s likely not the most sanitary of stuff

[woven belfry]

No clue lol

[tiny socket]

Put them in drinks to keep cool

[woven belfry]

[torn lark]

It was mainly a joke, but they are pretty powerful and seem trained in how to use armor. Imagine the flea dodging, but they put spikes on their helmets.

[zinc pivot]

Ngl based af, mnemonid in my nectar brew

[woven belfry]

Yeah a few of them could fight mainly vog

[zinc pivot]

Kratt can be bait ig

[tiny socket]

Floating puppies vs the inevitable onslaught of the infinite abyss, who would win

[tiny socket]

Floating puppies who have an ability to remain so perfectly still that vines have time to grow around them

[torn lark]

8 fleas (without vog) can take out moorwing

[woven belfry]

Dawg what

[noble thunder]

I feel like flintbeetles could totally go in S tier, they're basically made of (highly volatile) pop rocks. I'd bet they're already a little well done thanks to their explosive nature anyways.

[woven belfry]

I feel like their meat would be perpetually burnt tasting

But the pop rock point is true

[wispy phoenix]

I'm not eating anything from bilewater or Putrified Ducts idk about you

[woven belfry]

Groal would taste amazing gotta trust

[torn lark]

If you don’t fight moorwing before traveling with them the first time they will rest in the moorwing arena and you will see dead moorwing on their caravan later.

[woven belfry]

Glitch

[tiny socket]

I cannot accept this

[zinc pivot]

Are you Crull and Benjins room mate? Or a disciple of Ass Jim?

Cuz seriously girl what the hell

[woven belfry]

Risky like pufferfish but worth it

[steep ridge]

why is this the first thing I see upon opening this channel

[tiny socket]

I need disciple of Ass Jim on a nametag

[woven belfry]

Very fatty and tender the soul would add flavor

[steep ridge]

incredible discussions going on here in ss lore

[lethal burrow]

I vividly know what dried salted seaweed taste taste like despite being only 50% sure I once ate it many many years ago

[tiny socket]

He lives in maggot water, in a region with bile in the name

[wispy phoenix]

I thought that's only when you defeat moorwing and move the caravan? If you don't defeat it, it will just spawn after the caravan moves on no?

[woven belfry]

This is why ss lore is amazing

[steep ridge]

an acquired taste I'd say

[lethal burrow]

yes, except if you find vog beforehand

[tiny socket]

I wonder how the gourmand would taste?

[torn lark]

Ok then my game was buggy

[noble thunder]

He already spends all his time steeping in muckmaggot broth lol

[wispy phoenix]

Wow, does vog kill it for you?

[zinc pivot]

I reckon his liver is like foie gras

[lethal burrow]

Yes, but it's off camera

[woven belfry]

Look I know it sounds bad but you just need to clean it

[wispy phoenix]

That's an insane interaction, is it actually possible to find vog before that point?

[woven belfry]

Absolutely Delicious would be in s tier
Rich diet (very important) very very fatty and juicy and a ton of meat to eat

[lethal burrow]

ye i mean the group just doesn't move if you don't get enough fleas

so

[torn lark]

But just imagine fleas with spikes on their heads dropping from all directions

[zinc pivot]

As long as you don’t talk to the caravan before you meet vog

[wispy phoenix]

But how are you gonna get to bellhart? Is it from the other side ig?

[steep ridge]

vog did some off-camera grinding

[zinc pivot]

You talk and it triggers their moving

[tiny socket]

Shellwood?

[woven belfry]

He comes pre brined

[tiny socket]

Through wormways

[wispy phoenix]

Oh with the simple key

[lethal burrow]

I don't know the exact triggers for it because like what even is this interaction but it's cool

[fallen hornet]

yall im pretty pretty sure this IS canon unlike yall told me

[wispy phoenix]

Yea no one is finding vog before moorwing without deliberately going for it.

[steep ridge]

how do you enter shellwood through the wormways I keep seeing people talk about that and I always assumed you were locked by a wall-jump

[lethal burrow]

no you can just sort of go through it.

[zinc pivot]

Oh god someone brought that fake hornet picture again

[fallen hornet]

(:

[steep ridge]

mmm

[lethal burrow]

also you're the coolest person in the server btw

[woven belfry]

Yall cant tell me this isnt taste asf definitely the best meal

[zinc pivot]

Just pogo the bell enemy

[steep ridge]

aww thank you

[whole estuary]

Is it just me or does Nyleth feel like a very late addition/rework, she’s super hidden compared to the other two bosses(the shaman hint doesn’t even point the right way) and doesn’t have similarly interesting lore

[edgy nebula]

this is just bug chicken since it's from moorwing

[steep ridge]

nyleth felt very similar to unn in terms of lore honestly

[woven belfry]

Nah but moorwing is extremely fatty and has a rich diet

[steep ridge]

just without the whole higher being thing

[torn lark]

The wiki says: If Moorwing hasn't been defeated yet when the Flea Caravan moves to Greymoor, they will defeat it and tie its corpse to a carriage, skipping the boss fight entirely.

[zinc pivot]

So very fatty bug chicken

[edgy nebula]

prolly just fattier chicken

[zinc pivot]

Which is good since you cant overcook that shit

[lethal burrow]

I know the other two are backer characters so is she also a packer character or is she just an addition to leth stuff?

[edgy nebula]

i feel like itd be bitter at first but the bitter taste could be roasted out or drowned out via adding crustnut

[woven belfry]

Which would be delicious

[woven belfry]

Send the link

[lethal burrow]

Salt makes most things taste better

[steep ridge]

nyleth isn't a backer character as far as I know

[noble thunder]

You could potentially go through the exhaust valve, which would allow you to go through the Citadel and get any movement abilities you need to reach Vog without entering bellhart.

[steep ridge]

put too much salt on something earlier and it sucked checkmate

[zinc pivot]

Nope, moorwing tries to fuck with us in act 2 in greymoor bellway

[whole estuary]

I don’t think the other two were backer characters either but I could be wrong, definitely feels like she was made after Seth though

[zinc pivot]

It only got tied up if you beat it before hand

[edgy nebula]

they were

[torn lark]

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Fleamaster_Mooshka#In-game_Events

[steep ridge]

khann and karmelita are backer characters yeah

[whole estuary]

Oooh ok

[edgy nebula]

khann is made by brandon lieu and skarrsinger karmelita is made by some guy whose named i forgot

[lethal burrow]

lost lace dream nail dialogue still isn't on wiki

[woven belfry]

0 source im not trusting the wiki on this

[steep ridge]

what's her needolin dialogue I'm interested now

[edgy nebula]

holy shit karmelitas on wikipedia

[zinc pivot]

I wonder concept of skarr comes before or after karmelita

[steep ridge]

that's crazy, I had no idea she was real

[lethal burrow]

idk it's not on the wiki yet. you could be the one!

[noble thunder]

Oh I forgot about the simple key wormways entrance, I was worried the Wisp Thicket act 2 skip wasn't possible without going through shelleood to get sharp dart in there.

[torn lark]

I could make a new save files and try it

[woven belfry]

Nah im just saying I dont trust that this isnt a bug

[wispy phoenix]

Yea the wiki is not accurate all the time "Once both Kratt and Vog are found and join the Caravan, and the Pale Lake at the edge of Putrified Ducts has also been discovered, Hornet can inform Fleamaster Mooshka of its location, prompting the Flea Caravan to move to it." This is also just not true, in my first save my caravan was at fleatopia before I ever knew vog even existed😭

[edgy nebula]

just checked and indeed nyleth is not a backer

[whole estuary]

nyleth’s hint not being helpful at all is the biggest issue I have with her I think lol

and her fight being kind of a nothingburger but it could be worse and the other two were peak fights anyway

[steep ridge]

brb I can test rn

[tiny socket]

I think wisp thicket isn’t skippable without double jump cause of a world state barrier

[steep ridge]

gonna try and write down all of it maybe get a screenshot or 2 in there

[zinc pivot]

Shame, i was abusing beast crest momentum storage

[chrome atlas]

False. If you go back to Greymoor after the fleas have moved on, Moorwing can be fought in the area outside the Greymoor bellway that's how i beat it in my playthrough

[zinc pivot]

Skipped my way to memorium for the lols

[lethal burrow]

ye same

[torn lark]

there could be more then one Moorwing

[tiny socket]

Why does it only appear if the other hasn’t been killed then

[zinc pivot]

It is confirmed they do not kill moorwing, when you skip it in fleatopia they will be roasting a muckroach

[woven belfry]

There isnt

[whole estuary]

moorwing mitosis

[torn lark]

Maybe a different Moorwing was send to replace the dead one idk

[woven belfry]

"Winged mite-beast, bred large to catch workers who once tried to flee their tasks."
Only one of them exists

[steep ridge]

moorwing is literally an attack dog for the citadel caste just when you think you don't hate them enough

[lethal burrow]

unless hyper specific vog interaction that only exists because they've spent seven years on the game

[zinc pivot]

Its amusing that Citadel did a lot of breeding programs for unique species

Yet they cant help the weavers bear children easily

[lethal burrow]

I think the genetics were through weird breeding stuff, but you can't really do the breeding alterations if there's no generations to do it through

[woven belfry]

I mean they were also forced to work if you think about it
Its clear they hated their job and wanted out

[torn lark]

Makes sense when you know how weavers where created

[zinc pivot]

Well you do it then

Since you are the one who want answer after all

[lethal burrow]

huh

since when did I say I wanted an answer? Since when did I even have a question?

[steep ridge]

making an entirely new file for this one specific interaction

[lethal burrow]

it's probably not worth it but would be cool

[hidden crater]

This game has way too many missable interactions

[woven belfry]

Typical team cherry

[zinc pivot]

Yeah, i didnt know sherma can show up at grand gate

Glad he didnt stay

[torn lark]

Do you know what the easiest fleas to get to are?

[lethal burrow]

so can seth

[lethal burrow]

#sk-help

[hidden crater]

Would sherma get torn to shreds by last judge

[steep ridge]

fighting lost lace trying to get needolin dialogue if it exists in the code I'm not sure if it's in-game lol

[lethal burrow]

he can also show up at the hot spring

[steep ridge]

got a decent needolin in and nothing showed up

[woven belfry]

Sherma would get crushed instantly

[zinc pivot]

Nah, its implied he passed safely since we met him in citadel post phantom

[steep ridge]

does kinda add to the idea that lost lace is no longer lace, basically just acting on instinct alone

[zinc pivot]

I made a savefile for that

[chrome atlas]

Canonically the judges don't attack him

[lethal burrow]

damn. well, they should at least put on the wiki that it doesn't exist if it doesn't.

That's only fair

[woven belfry]

Wait really

Thats why hes the goat

[hidden crater]

Dont voided enemies not react to needolin (at least I havent tried that out enough yet)

[steep ridge]

sherma is too sweet even the corrupt cops won't kill him

[zinc pivot]

Well, he got in citadel when you go through the exhaust organ entry

[chrome atlas]

Yeah, he mentions it in the Blasted Steps, the judges just let him past

He's free of sin by their standards

[lethal burrow]

I remember them doing so, but that might be wrong

[steep ridge]

oh if that's the case then it's DEFINITELY not in-game

[hidden crater]

Idk i havent experimented enough with voided enemies to see if they react to needolin or not

[lethal burrow]

void enemy have needolin dialogue I'm pretty sure

[cloud plover]

voided enemies do react to needolin

[torn lark]

I don’t know how trustworthy the information in this video is https://youtube.com/shorts/-t0gJMT7v8s?si=nzCT8zCK02CLRJ_v

[steep ridge]

alright I guess I'll just keep

bashing my head against lost lace

[chrome atlas]

Not

[steep ridge]

until she says something lol

[lethal burrow]

anyone who draws fake evil eyes is definitely not trustable

[austere coral]

even the void strings themselves react to needolin, which is cool

[chrome atlas]

The fleas do cook and eat Moorwing if you killed it before they move up, but they don't kill Moorwing themselves

[hidden crater]

Isnt GMS the only enemy who doesnt react to needolin

[chrome atlas]

Moorwing's part of 100% completion anyways, and that's never missable

[torn lark]

How do they kill it?

[flint relic]

where does the citadel symbol come from??? it has something to do with the cutscene after killing widow, right??

[steep ridge]

if gms doesn't react maybe lost lace doesn't either considering she's also a final boss

[chrome atlas]

They don't, they just scoop up its body if you did it

[hidden crater]

Its supposed to be GMS cocoon I think

[lethal burrow]

The Citadel symbol seems to be a weaver head and a harp?

[flint relic]

that is very reasonable

[lethal burrow]

idk it could also be the cocoon

[torn lark]

But what if you travel before moorwing

[flint relic]

alr thanks guys

[chrome atlas]

Then you can fight Moorwing after they move on, and they're roasting a muckroach instead of a giant Moorwing hock

[austere coral]

would make sense, since she’s the only one 100% completely ”free” of controlling silk for hornet to interfere with, even the npcs probably have at least some even though they’re not yet under the haunting

[steep ridge]

okay lost lace definitely doesn't react to the needolin I got like 5 seconds in, not sure how long it's supposed to take but that seems long enough

[hidden crater]

I mean

[chrome atlas]

That's how my run went, I moved the fleas up before killing Moorwing, and after they travelled again Moorwing came back

[torn lark]

Are you in act 3

[chrome atlas]

I have finished the game with true 100% completion, yes

[torn lark]

Can you send a screenshot of the meet at the Festival of the Flea?

[cloud plover]

you’re in the lore chat right now

[torn lark]

How strong the fleas are is a lore question

[lethal burrow]

can they beat goku

[cloud plover]

i think you can figure that one out on ur own twin

[chrome atlas]

Not very, with the exception of Vog, who's an at least decent fighter. They're mostly revellers, and they tend to depend on Hornet travelling with them to not get attacked by Haunted enemies

[hidden crater]

Every flea is strong enough to beat goku expect kratt

[lethal burrow]

are they small town level? Universal+?

Fuck, what are the other stupid power scaling terms?

[torn lark]

Imagine flea dogging but all the fleas attack at once and they have spikes on their helmets

[zinc pivot]

Outerverse

Galaxy

[hidden crater]

Multiversal outerversal something something something im not a power scaling guy

[chrome atlas]

i can imagine savage beastfl

[hidden crater]

Power scaling is stupid

[torn lark]

Imagine 30 at once

[steep ridge]

the fleas could easily defeat grand mother silk is all I'm saying

[hidden crater]

The fleas will make GMS their new mother flea

[steep ridge]

okay I am like 95% sure lost lace does not react to the needolin

[hidden crater]

Wiki says she doesnt respond to needolin 🥴

[steep ridge]

going at it with the spider strings there's one window I found in phase 1 and nothing happened multiple times

okay well I came to the conclusion on my own so eat that wiki

[hidden crater]

You 1 wiki 0

[cloud plover]

the wiki is copying you…

[lethal burrow]

someone should put that on wiki

[steep ridge]

[lethal burrow]

What does spider strings actually do besides give you a bigger range

[cloud plover]

🤩

[lethal burrow]

it did not say that last I checked

[steep ridge]

I think it stuns enemies longer

[torn lark]

I mean it’s not even that unrealistic because GMS has almost no attacks that can reach above her

[lethal burrow]

greyroot is cool

[cloud plover]

ya

huge debate yesterday if she was related to wl

[steep ridge]

was a consensus reached or

[cloud plover]

most agreed their designs are similar for a reason

but it’s too speculative to reach a conclusion

[steep ridge]

I saw something about that vaguely forgot where, might've been here

yeah that's what I'm thinking just looking at the connection between the 2

[cloud plover]

the eyes are really what give it away for me

[hidden crater]

I thought greyroot was cool until they put a parasite in hornets body

[cloud plover]

that’s even cooler tho

just not very nice

[steep ridge]

greyroot is the most morally unambiguous character in this series since radiance

[hidden crater]

Also doesnt greyroot react really slowly to needolin

[cloud plover]

i disagree

if you were greyroot you would want to save your lineage

[chrome atlas]

I thought she was uncool when she did that until I got a sick crest afterwards :)

[steep ridge]

and radiance didn't want to be forgotten

[cloud plover]

i feel like there’s a moral difference between the two motives tho lol

[whole hawk]

At least Greyroot isn't a higher being. White Lady is one bad day away from initiating a cordyceps infection. Thank the heavens she's just a freak in bondage.

[steep ridge]

I mean I guess but greyroot is very deceptive basically tricking hornet into becoming a host for who knows what

[cloud plover]

it is to birth a higher being

[lethal burrow]

they are the witch of the woods

[steep ridge]

not much to say about there morally speaking besides "she kinda sucks"

[hidden crater]

Im curious as to what the hell could have possibly come out of that crack at the end of cursed child cutscene tho

[lethal burrow]

she is the witch of the woods

[steep ridge]

considering it basically took the lifeforce from a pale being and a half pale being it's probably something that could be on the same level as white lady given the time

[flint relic]

guys how old is skarrsinger this is important

[steep ridge]

old

[cloud plover]

that was my theory

[lethal burrow]

very

[steep ridge]

🤝

[zinc pivot]

As old as pharloom

[flint relic]

ok ok good....

[lethal burrow]

why?

[zinc pivot]

If you think you can revive a dying star
You are nuts in the head
(You know what im referencing)

[steep ridge]

she might be as old as lace, maybe older

[cloud plover]

karmelita was there before gms iirc

[steep ridge]

does that mean pre-haunting or even further back cause if it's the latter that'd make her OLD

I'm assuming just pre-haunting

[cloud plover]

haunting happened after gms came so even further

[steep ridge]

well gms was locked up pre-haunting no?

[cloud plover]

no i don’t think so

[lethal burrow]

it only happened after she started to wake up after she was put to sleep

[cloud plover]

put to sleep?

i’m missing smth lol

[lethal burrow]

grandmother silk, yes

[steep ridge]

in the cocoon, by the weavers

[lethal burrow]

The Weavers put her to sleep. ya

So that they could rule instead

[cloud plover]

i see

[whole hawk]

Well Karmelita is an ant queen. Colony queens might have way longer lifespans in the HKverse. Like Vespa.

[steep ridge]

Karmelita: "I'm Old!"

[cloud plover]

the real question is how old is green prince and if he’s as old as the others why hasn’t he grown in size

[steep ridge]

timeline with the whole citadel thing is a bit weird considering weavers established it but first sinner seems to be imprisoned by the citadel and her transgression is "lost to time"

how long was green prince stuck in sinner's road jesus

just thinking about the timeline

[cloud plover]

fr

[whole hawk]

Green Prince is a mantis. I just assume he's old because all strong mantises are all like that. (ie. Mantis Lords)

[steep ridge]

yeah that's fair

[zinc pivot]

They have a grasshopperlike shape though

[cloud plover]

if he was as old as verdania suggests he would be massive by now like karmelita

[zinc pivot]

Yet have the mantis claws

[steep ridge]

well karmelita is an ant queen those are pretty big no?

[zinc pivot]

Maybe only queen bugs got big

Thats the usual trend seeing we got 3 massive queens

[steep ridge]

someone mentioned the specific type of mantis green prince is once but I forgot lol

[zinc pivot]

And in a sense aspid mother is the queen of them

[cloud plover]

she is much bigger in the real map then in her memory

[cloud plover]

this would make sense

we see vespa and karmelita balloon in size

[whole hawk]

Female bugs do be huge.

[zinc pivot]

And white lady maybe

[steep ridge]

well white lady isn't a bug so she's a bit of a special case

[cloud plover]

we also see ancient civilization corpses in hk that are huge, but it’s not known whether that’s due to time inflating them or if they were just massive creatures regardless

[lethal burrow]

Green Prince is NOT a mantis

[manic pewter]

i think wyrms are just massive

[steep ridge]

yeah if we start thinking about how only queen bugs get big we'd probably go down a rabbit hole of crazy insinuations

[narrow sky]

Maybe only colony queens get big

[lethal burrow]

He's like a grasshopper or a cricket or something

[steep ridge]

choir clapper is a queen bug

[lethal burrow]

harrah

as well

[steep ridge]

green prince looks more like a mantis than a grasshopper or whatever, and considering mantises have been established to be warriors in hollow knight it would honestly track

[cloud plover]

google say he’s a mantis but i have no idea where it got that

[lethal burrow]

it would if we didn't already know mantis look completely different

[steep ridge]

artstyle change could explain the difference

also aren't there multiple types of mantises I feel like that could explain it

[lethal burrow]

google ai?

[zinc pivot]

It would’ve spelt him as mantis in game
But it didn’t so the verdanians are a different species

Maybe a hybrid of mantis and grasshopper

[lethal burrow]

He could also be a cricket

[steep ridge]

do crickets have sharp claws like that

[zinc pivot]

Crickets aren’t known for jumping around though

[cloud plover]

yes lol

[zinc pivot]

Which is why i think they are grasshoppers, they leap around super fast

[cloud plover]

i was trying to find the source everywhere says it’s a grasshopper tho

yea

[steep ridge]

hollow knight wiki says he and his lover were mantises with no citation thanks wiki

[cloud plover]

that’s where it got it from then

[manic pewter]

also we love gay insects

[cloud plover]

lol nice

[narrow sky]

the mantis lords also jump around

[zinc pivot]

Just them
The rest of verdanians zip around too

[manic pewter]

god i DESPISE some of the little verdanians on the ||clover dancers runback||

[chrome atlas]

haha grasshopper go zip

[steep ridge]

looking at some of the little dudes they really do seem like a mix between grasshoppers and mantises

grasshoppers don't really have claws like that

[manic pewter]

Yeah but grasshoppers little spikes can definitely scratch you up

[zinc pivot]

They might be even more powerful that normal mantis tribe

Like they can fly AND have claws

[steep ridge]

definitely

[manic pewter]

oh no i dont want to start powerscaling mantis vs verdanians

[chrome atlas]

so do baby mantises

[narrow sky]

too late

[steep ridge]

seeing these mantises(?) do stuff hallownest mantises couldn't even DREAM of doing like flying past a young age

[zinc pivot]

They only have the tail sting, grown up mantises got claws

Not sure what happened to mantis lords’ though

[chrome atlas]

yeah but which group is still around in the present day

[buoyant salmon]

Can I ask, why Hornet cocoon have void in it

[zinc pivot]

Not this again, not all black particle are void

[buoyant salmon]

Then why is it a black particle

[narrow sky]

they're more like dark gray

[zinc pivot]

Yeah, so not void

[steep ridge]

it does not have the properties of void

[high violet]

wait thats actually a really interesting suggestion

[narrow sky]

it's probably just old skin or something

[lethal burrow]

idk do mantis have horns and pale white faces

[high violet]

they even have similar functions in terms of rooting around n whatnot

[steep ridge]

I believe act 3 and sister of the void shot down hornet being void pretty hard lol

[zinc pivot]

Unless its not void, but regret, like Confessor Jiji used to tell us in HK

[lethal burrow]

some people subscribe to their interpretation.

Some people try to say it's a fact.

Don't be the second one

[buoyant salmon]

Technically it's their mask, most bugs have a mask, besides Grand Mother, Lace, and Radiance, etc

[zinc pivot]

Void and regret have ties together

[steep ridge]

I feel like green prince being gay is pretty cut and dry idk

[lethal burrow]

steel soul is canon again don't worry about it

[buoyant salmon]

Old Civilization: I have so many regrets, anyway let's jump down to the void

[manic pewter]

wait how can he not be gay

[chrome atlas]

Confessor Jiji says that ghosts are stains from past regrets. My assumption is that the black gunk in the coccoon is that metaphorical (and then literally manifested) 'stain'. Act 3 confirms ||that it's definitely not void, given the fact that the only reason you survive the end boss fight is because little bro came to help you out||

[narrow sky]

sula does suck void out of dead bugs

[buoyant salmon]

Little bro? Who?

[zinc pivot]

Jiji is the one behind simple key door in dirt mouth

[steep ridge]

some people try to say the other prince is his brother

[zinc pivot]

Who literally function as our silk eaters

[steep ridge]

I feel like that's an intentionally bad faith interpretation to erase their queerness

[buoyant salmon]

Steel Masters suck

All hail Shade Lord

[manic pewter]

doesnt he literally have a line about calling him his lover...

[steep ridge]

yeah

[zinc pivot]

The issue here is some people have zero reading comprehension

The clear cut dialogue saying they were born apart

[narrow sky]

i think i've hear people say that they're both lover and brothers💀

[steep ridge]

the way they loved each other does not seem platonic so them being siblings would be really fucking weird

[buoyant salmon]

And so many ppl still saying we're making headcanon or support incest

[zinc pivot]

Lover yes
Twins FUCK NO

[buoyant salmon]

Idk where the game said that they are twins

[steep ridge]

people taking the conjoined heart too literally 🥴

like I said, bad faith interpretation

[chrome atlas]

||The Knight from game 1, after I think the Godhome ending?||

[buoyant salmon]

Ah I understand now

[chrome atlas]

They look very similar, but the commentary is that that's probably a sign of vanity, rather than them being literal brothers

[buoyant salmon]

Also if the delicate flower godhome ending is canon, Shade Lord can survive the whole blast from it

[steep ridge]

basically any void heart ending sans sealed siblings

and maybe delicate flower

so basically just normal etv and dnm

[chrome atlas]

I figured it's ||Delicate Flower Godhome, since that's the only time we see the Flower's anti-void capabilities||

[buoyant salmon]

Actually, the base game ending can not be canon, 1 of them Hornet is trapped with Ghost, and Shade Lord does not exist in any base ending

[zinc pivot]

Thing is WL and Hornet through WL knows about its void repellent properties

[manic pewter]

when does hornet actually encounter the delicate flower in order for it to exist in her memories?

[zinc pivot]

Told as above, White Lady gave it to her first time

[steep ridge]

shade lord is the knight with void heart

[buoyant salmon]

She existed long long ago before the Ghost came

[steep ridge]

so yes dream no more can absolutely work

it's the one I think has the most pointing to it with the knight's base design and all the siblings in the void

[zinc pivot]

To be honest the truth can only be known if the pure vessel show up one day or not

[buoyant salmon]

No since that ending, HK has also become a shade, which doesn't appear in the Act 3 ending

[steep ridge]

etv could work too if the siblings are also put to rest in that ending

[manic pewter]

For hk ive only got 107% so was wondering whether there is actually something in one of the other endings that i just didnt see

[zinc pivot]

That will be the final key

[steep ridge]

that doesn't deconfirm it

the appearance the knight takes in sotv is PRIMARILY from dnm

[buoyant salmon]

And again, Shade Lord does not form until Godseeker attuned in Hallownest

[steep ridge]

it only flashes the final form from etv

shade lord is the knight with void heart

not the specific form from etv

[zinc pivot]

Ngl we should give void given focus a proper name other than shadelord

[buoyant salmon]

That Void Given Form

Shade Lord is Void given Focus

[steep ridge]

shade lord is both

[narrow sky]

the thing where you get void dash does call the knight the shade lord after getting the void heart

[manic pewter]

yeah pretty sure shade lord isnt only the knight

[zinc pivot]

Because ghost is shade lord when we dream nailed the abyss worshipper

[steep ridge]

the chozo statue dude says so when you dream nail with void heart

[narrow sky]

bill

[steep ridge]

makes it so confusing lol and some people talk like it's a separate entity from the knight when it's not

[buoyant salmon]

But the “focus” form can not exist until Godseeker's interference

[steep ridge]

question, does the knight actually take the form of void given focus in sotv or is it flashed on screen

there's a correct answer here

[zinc pivot]

I still think its possible given enough time for ghost to learn how to control his power

But again, we need confirmation through Pure Vessels survival or not

[steep ridge]

yeah the knight has the potential to reach that state I believe that is what is displayed with the void given focus flash

[fossil ledge]

It's flashed on screen

[buoyant salmon]

It flashed, which means it exists, and Knight can change form

Also, all the vessels behind Knight disappeared after the flash

[steep ridge]

not 100% confirmed HOLLOW KNIGHT WHERE ARE YOU WE NEED YOU FOR CONFIRMATION

[fossil ledge]

Given it's not there, that's confirmation enough, no?

[buoyant salmon]

He mirmir in the black egg

[chrome atlas]

The fact that it's flashed on screen at all is meaningful. My interpretation is that it is Void Given Focus/Shade Lord, it's just in its regular shade form instead of Big And Mean

[steep ridge]

oh yeah thk just WENT BACK into the prison it was locked up in

[buoyant salmon]

Um why would Citadel bring a tall void being to their place

[chrome atlas]

That's speculation, of course, but that's my take :)

[fossil ledge]

Is it though? The EtV ending implies that without the Radiance the seals and binds kind of fall apart

[steep ridge]

I think it's just showing that the knight has the potential to reach that state like I said

[buoyant salmon]

In Godhome, HK just walks out and that's it

[fossil ledge]

No reason of course, but the Knight wasn't brought by the Citadel either, it presumably travelled through the void sea

[buoyant salmon]

We don't know what happened to them after Hornet got captured

[chrome atlas]

I'm dumb as a sack of bricks, Local Person got The Knight and the Hollow Knight confused

(where's that one mem photo of lebron being washed)

[steep ridge]

we're probably never gonna get a definitive answer with this, they probably wouldn't show us thk lol

[fossil ledge]

This is true, but what makes you think it's sleeping in the Black Egg?

[chrome atlas]

well, bro's sure as hell not doing crochet in there

[buoyant salmon]

What would he do now? Killing stuffs? Radiance is gone, bugs are return to normal

[fossil ledge]

Hard to say. We've never seen what a vessel looks like without its purpose driving it forward

[steep ridge]

he/himming the vessels in big 2025 🥀

[buoyant salmon]

Broken Vessel, the one Hornet killed, those killed by Nosk, Knight:

[zinc pivot]

Maybe he will wander around the world he has no chance to see before

[buoyant salmon]

Also, HK have a solid mind to think for themselves

[fossil ledge]

But those are all broken, and were broken before their purpose was fulfilled, with the exception of the Knight

[steep ridge]

is there even confirmation hornet killed the greenpath vessel

[hidden crater]

Is there any reason as to why they made baby hornet so adorable

[steep ridge]

because they wanted the players to die of cuteness

[fossil ledge]

Not definitively, no

[zinc pivot]

Because everyone likes a baby version of an already charming character

[hidden crater]

"Charming character"

[fossil ledge]

Lol

[chrome atlas]

me ahnding back my woke card after calling someone who isn't masc bro:

[chrome atlas]

She's plenty charming, she likes big and floofy

[steep ridge]

no that just means you're only level 1 woke

it's okay we all start somewhere

[buoyant salmon]

Also, is Hornet wearing the same cloak since the day she was born?

[lofty otter]

To what level does it go

[chrome atlas]

me ragequitting after being not-woke twice costs me my geo:

[hidden crater]

Whats lvl 0 then

[narrow sky]

homophobia?

[lofty otter]

That’s -1

[narrow sky]

shit thats true

[chrome atlas]

It's probably the same cloak but modified

[hidden crater]

Lvl 0 should be neutral

[buoyant salmon]

TC sure loves doom yaoi and yuri aren't they

[chrome atlas]

level 0 woke is supporting your gay friends but listening to joe rogan on the side

[silk nova]

I feel like the white lady saying their family is inextricably linked to void in red memory implies that they were doing stuff with jt before the vessels and THK

[chrome atlas]

Tbf not all the yaoi/yuri is doomed, Nailsmith and Sheo lived probably

[fossil ledge]

I mean, this much is true considering the Pale King was experimenting in the Abyss, had Kingsmoulds and Wingmoulds and such

[buoyant salmon]

They lived, but the smith pretty old so

[narrow sky]

they had to check if it was chill before their threesome

[steep ridge]

sheo also seems pretty old honestly

it'd be like that one episode of tlou tv show

[buoyant salmon]

Eh I think they can lived like 10 more years

[chrome atlas]

All yaoi is doomed under the relentless march of time 😔

[buoyant salmon]

Beside Hornet

[chrome atlas]

Tbf I don't think Hornet is doing much yaoi

[buoyant salmon]

And Knight if they decide to love someone

[steep ridge]

ah yes hornet yaoi

[lofty otter]

[hidden crater]

https://tenor.com/view/bro-just-typing-shit-bro-just-typing-shit-gif-18336060238854257551

[steep ridge]

did you just enter the channel and see that I'm so sorry

[buoyant salmon]

I mean she has partners, we don't exactly know if it's the same gender or not

[narrow sky]

hornet is ultra lesbian

[steep ridge]

lmao

[chrome atlas]

hornet is female, so any same-sex relationships with her would technically be yuri

[buoyant salmon]

Hornet may try many stuff

After all PK lays eggs with a tree

It runs in the family

[chrome atlas]

consider:
hornet canonically avoided the hell out of cornifer
hornet beelines towards shakra

conclusion:
she wants the tall wasp? lady

[steep ridge]

speaking of yuri incredible transition there what're the implications with second sentinels apparent autonomy this is not motivated by anything

[buoyant salmon]

I doubt that White Lady is a female

Trees have no gender

[zinc pivot]

Why would hornet beeline toward a guy who sells map of HER OWN HOME

[narrow sky]

pls don't start shipping hornet with greyroot

[chrome atlas]

consider: me when i get you

[lone nimbus]

Why is there clean water in swamphell? ||shakras masters death area||

[lofty otter]

Consider:
silksong lore channel

:conclusion
Say gex

[steep ridge]

that's probably what bilewater was like before the citadel

[chrome atlas]

hornet and her two automata roommates; lace and second sentinel

[buoyant salmon]

I HATE GREYROOT KILL THAT WORM

[steep ridge]

so that's the last haven untouched by the citadel's corruption

[chrome atlas]

Bilewater only went to goop when it got polluted by the Putrified Ducts, it's likely that that's the last vestige of what it was before

[steep ridge]

same goes for putrified ducts and pale lake

[zinc pivot]

Correction : root

[buoyant salmon]

Wait how Lace even alive

Grand Mother Silk is dead

[fossil ledge]

Just like what Hornet describes, it would seem certain automatons were designed with greater intelligence and autonomy while others were labourers meant to maintain things like the cogwork core

[chrome atlas]

If I died tomorrow, my calculator would still work

[lone nimbus]

So, British colonization? (Mb if this is not allowed)

[buoyant salmon]

Nah she not deserved to be called a root

[steep ridge]

I don't remember anything implying grand mother silk was required for lace to stay alive

[narrow sky]

i mean.... technically greyroot does put their baby in hornet

[buoyant salmon]

Did you make it from your flesh and bone

[chrome atlas]

nah, the citadel didn't steal all of the stilkin's relics before shitting up their home

[steep ridge]

does that mean a child dies if their parent dies too

[chrome atlas]

depends on if you're a cop or not

[buoyant salmon]

That baby is not even at the same place with Greyroot

[lofty otter]

I’m going to make you fight 1000 primal aspids for the rest of eternity

[lone nimbus]

Fair enough

[fossil ledge]

This chat y'all

[buoyant salmon]

Lace is a silk construct made purely from silk so

[narrow sky]

it look like them

[steep ridge]

grand mother silk dying would also fuck up hornet considering she's half weaver by this logic

[urban zephyr]

Do we have any insight on what this is referring to? The haunting or something else?

[buoyant salmon]

Theory: that baby is void

[narrow sky]

that's fair

[fossil ledge]

Seems like it's referring to the haunting, yes

[buoyant salmon]

It talking about silk inside anyone near the Citadel

[steep ridge]

she was made by gms but nothing implies gms is required for her to live

[fossil ledge]

Especially considering you fight a gauntlet of silk-haunted pilgrims right above it

[chrome atlas]

and technically krat does get hornet to bounce on it...

||'it' is the huge flea, of course. What were you thinking of?||

[urban zephyr]

Yea that'd make most sense with current lore knowledge, it is just vague so i wasnt certain

[lofty otter]

[lone nimbus]

Did ||shakras master die recently or long ago? ||

[visual glacier]

sounds like the parasite ngl

[fossil ledge]

I mean, you could've said "him" and it would still be true, cause one of the fleas you can pogo on in his game is Kratt himself, so

[urban zephyr]

Interestingly the moss druid also makes similar allusions to faint heartbeats like this and im curious what she means if it isnt also somehow tied to the haunting

[buoyant salmon]

Tbh the worst kingdom is probably the Storm land

[visual glacier]

could be silk tho

[lofty otter]

She just look pretty dead so idk

[steep ridge]

seems to be pretty recent considering her weapons are still in the area

[lone nimbus]

Fair enough

[urban zephyr]

Yea i also was thinking this tho idk if it makes sense with the first screenshot about in the air and water

[visual glacier]

no spoilers nessasary here

[lone nimbus]

And dead bodies

[lone nimbus]

Alr

[fossil ledge]

It's likely quite recent considering the water hasn't washed or pushed her away yet

[manic pewter]

Oh yeah ive seen the screenshot of hornet talking about having partners but where is that, i never found it

[steep ridge]

yeah this is the lore channel if anyone's coming here they probably already beat the game

[steep ridge]

the great conchfly hunter's journal entry

[fossil ledge]

It's part of the lore entry for either of the conchflies I think? Or was it the Green Prince?

[lofty otter]

I didn’t do act 3 yet but I enjoy the lore

[manic pewter]

ooooo thanks

[urban zephyr]

Now that i am looking close at the tablet it is also using the citadel note-script which lends to the idea of it being about early signs of the haunting

[steep ridge]

that'd make sense

[fossil ledge]

I mean, even Yarnaby likened the parasite to the haunting and double checked to make sure it was indeed not the haunting before concluding what was affect Hornet was something else entirely

[lofty otter]

Does whiteward have any interesting lore

[steep ridge]

yeah

basically the entire key to the haunting is in whiteward

[fossil ledge]

It might be one of the most lore-rich places for its size in the entire game ngl

[lofty otter]

Do tell

[narrow sky]

basically frankenstein

[lofty otter]

I didn’t pick up on any of it on account of being scared to shit

[urban zephyr]

Plenty yea. In a silksoar room there is an old statue from the earlier days of the citadel becore they were made of gleaming brass thst seems to be one of the earliest campaigns for the silk infusion experiments

[steep ridge]

also the boss in it is absolutely the conductor being worked on in the whiteward psalm cylinder

[frank nymph]

Why are some bugs and NPC's not controlled by silk

[steep ridge]

they wouldn't have silk infused in them ig

[fossil ledge]

It is a fairly creepy place

[urban zephyr]

Ye tho the unravelled seems to be implied to be made of far more souls thsn just the conductor based on the hubters journal

[frank nymph]

And also why in act 3 are all the mobs still controlled by the silk even if gms is in the void

[steep ridge]

considering the body spit attack yeah

[narrow sky]

does bells scare the silk away?

[frank nymph]

Is there a lote reason or just gameplay mechanic

Lore

[steep ridge]

gameplay mechanic probably

it'd suck if EVERY SINGLE enemy was void infected

[frank nymph]

Fair

[narrow sky]

nvm i just remembered bellhart

[hidden crater]

You can see silk covered in void at the act 3 ending so

[urban zephyr]

I think it is because since GMS is still alive her threads hold sway over anyone already haunted. Only a guess but it is the vibe i got. All the abyss tendrils we see in the world backgrounf are apparenrly her silk corrupted by void which i think is how bugs are getting void possessed. Could be mistaken

[frank nymph]

Makes sense

[steep ridge]

this is probably it yeah

[scenic stirrup]

What do u think are the lore implications of hornet having greyroot powers now after being cured from the curse

[hidden crater]

Unethical surgeries work I guess

[urban zephyr]

I couldnt begin to speculate but witch crest is fascinating

[steep ridge]

well she says it right

the parasite is still in there but under her control

[narrow sky]

does anyone have a picture of the map you can find in one of the weaver den things?

[scenic stirrup]

Ye she says she has claimed the power as her own

[urban zephyr]

Mhm. The surgery basically weakened the parasite so much but didnt extract it. So it is basically like... hopefully dead but now a part of her that she can control to a limited extent

[steep ridge]

this means abortion makes a woman stronger

[urban zephyr]

Idk if it is ACTUALLY dead tho as like.. a conscious entity

Hopefully it is dead cuz cursed ending has terrifying implications lmao

[steep ridge]

well parasites aren't necessarily conscious in the first place

[scenic stirrup]

Maybe she can turn white lady now

[urban zephyr]

Well. In the capacity of whatever creature greyroot is can be conscious

[scenic stirrup]

Or in the future ig

[narrow sky]

i mean that parasite was crying

[urban zephyr]

Considering it is still an infant basically it doesnt have a lot of explicit full sapience but given greyroot being able to think and ask things it definitely would. Especially aftter being formed from gms and hornet's essence

[steep ridge]

this only strengthens the abortion metaphor lol

[urban zephyr]

Ph right i keep forgetting people speculating thst greyroot and white lady have similar origins which is wild but i totally see it

[hidden crater]

You can get an abortion and 2 terminal diseases in silksong

[narrow sky]

babies are already basically parasites

[steep ridge]

too woke...

[urban zephyr]

I mean technically plasmium is the opposite of terminal 🤓

[steep ridge]

estrogen overdose

[urban zephyr]

Wait tho what is the other terminal illness

[hidden crater]

But look at the bab OH GOD I CAN HEAR ITS CRY MAKE IT STOP

[chrome atlas]

get the crest from the child
crest's special thing is sucking the life from everything around it
what did team cherry mean by this

[urban zephyr]

Estrogen confirmed to give you the ability to dash AND life regen

[hidden crater]

Bowomp

[narrow sky]

when i first found it i was like "oh shit hornets adopting a child?"

[steep ridge]

if you can hear this image you have a terminal silksong addiction (I have a terminal silksong addiction)

[urban zephyr]

This was genuinely so fuckin funny cuz it isnt even that loud it is just a silly little effect in menus. It is hilarious

[manic pewter]

ITS SO FUCKING LOUD AND ANNOYING

i will crush it with a brick

[urban zephyr]

Am i crazy it was not that loud for me

[narrow sky]

i was very disapointed when it almost killed her

[urban zephyr]

Maybe cuz im using a speaker that also maybe isnt the best

[steep ridge]

oh my god caretaker shut the fuck upppp

[chrome atlas]

unfortunately the neurons that noise would've taken up have been replaced with the white palace spears

[hidden crater]

oiiii, ahooooy, oiiii, oiiii, ahooooy, ahooooy

[narrow sky]

does caretaker make noises when you're not talking to him?

[chrome atlas]

chk-CHk chk
every 1.3 seconds

[chrome atlas]

yes the fuck the whiny jagoff does

[steep ridge]

whenever he has something new to say yeah

[urban zephyr]

If he has something to say to you and you dont talk to him he doesnt shut thr fuck up lmao

[narrow sky]

i forgor about that

[urban zephyr]

Speedrunners/elder bug skippers HATE his ass

[steep ridge]

what are the lore implications of caretaker being an annoying little bitch

[urban zephyr]

Sealed sibblings ending canon

[narrow sky]

most snail shamans are kinda dickheads

[steep ridge]

chapel maiden was kinda chill

then the bell hermit just calls hornet a slave most of the game

[urban zephyr]

Fucks me up that i didnt realize all the shamans sing the same song from neddolin

[steep ridge]

oh shit that's cool

[urban zephyr]

And also they reference "spiraling"

[narrow sky]

she's the only kind of good one

[hidden crater]

Bell hermit is a moron

[steep ridge]

I only ever did the maiden I never bothered with caretaker and forgot about hermit until silk and soul

speaks volumes about bell hermits impact

[urban zephyr]

Dumbass "we live in a society" type guy lol

[narrow sky]

you "did" the maiden?

[steep ridge]

[urban zephyr]

Making him grumpy is always worth

[steep ridge]

only ever used needolin around the maiden