sk-lore

[vague jasper]

The steel people were in coral area in the older trailer, I think that was scrapped

[uncut holly]

Im not sure we will ever go to the City of Steel, or it will just keep being a place where all these Steel Soul realted Steel bugs come from

[sinful nimbus]

You can sell them to a new NPC iirc

[vague jasper]

They also took out any platforming from the coral area

[lean temple]

So basically just the Jinn mechanic

[severe siren]

Sharpe is stated to have come from another kingdom in the old press kit correct?

[uncut holly]

I do think they are gonna do something with the Coral Caves cut stuff

[maiden meteor]

what’s with steel guys and buying gross stuff

[whole hawk]

Do we have all the exact dialogue about the Ciry of Iron yet?

[spark valve]

Yes

[sullen crown]

Also is it just me or are silk eaters like completely absent at the start of the game.

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah

[foggy fractal]

Act 5: Hallownest 🥶 🥶 🥶

[spark valve]

City of steel

[uncut holly]

I also think its likely they are gonna do something completely original like the Grimm Troupe, but not literally Grimm Troupe just something weird original and hopefully cool

[solid elk]

If they are actually void influenced beings, Act 3 might not be too bad for them

[maiden meteor]

Act 5 is about Hornet going to Hallownest to meet with her lil bro and chat

[severe siren]

I need to know more about the steel guys

They are too bizarre

[vague jasper]

I don't think grimm troupe would make a return

[spark valve]

of anything they're the most likely thing to get expanded

[severe siren]

In HK its like yeah you can tell something is up
In SS its basically ok i have to know more now

[vague jasper]

I would love a mention of the Grimm troupe tho

[maiden meteor]

Do you think Hallownest would still have some restaurant for Knight and Hornet to dine out

[vague jasper]

Where does shakra and the ring people come from?

[uncut holly]

I think the Steel Bugs are void constructs in a similar way to Kingsmoulds. We know the City of Steel has some stuff to do with Void, that a random servant bug learned how to do void rituals to summon void out of the abyss. I think the crime of the servant was probably not doing void but being too much of a lowly status and doing void

[sinful nimbus]

The fact that people who interact with the stuff are considered "Tarnished" makes me hesitant of that

[spark valve]

that is not what zi says though

[uncut holly]

Well its heresy they touched the dark

[solid elk]

The lack of as many Higher Beings active in Pharloom compared to Hallownest is surprising, tbh.

Unn & Radiance were pretty important to the history in the previous game

[spark valve]

The rite... The vassal is tarnished. They have touched the dark. By the Masters they will now be hunted... no matter the distance fled.
yeah these guys definitely employ legions of void touched things that's definitely what's implied

[sinful nimbus]

Hallownest is pretty wack yeah

[vague jasper]

GMS had the monopoly over pharloom

[maiden meteor]

I think it’s because PK is an ass

[spark valve]

hallownest is the land of gods

[maiden meteor]

Higher Beings in Hallownest seemed pretty chill before PK came along

[uncut holly]

It could be

[spark valve]

like it's an established detail from the first game that hallownest has an extraordinary concentration of powerful beings

[vague jasper]

Is green prince a higher being?

[solid elk]

Grimm Troupe coming back, but it is Trobbio coming across the Nightmare Lantern

[uncut holly]

The vassal is tarnished, but that could mean their tarnished because they know the knowledge. You cant erase knowledge from someone

[sinful nimbus]

Hallownest has more higher beings than normal this is because PK sucks

[spark valve]

no

[uncut holly]

So that vassal has to die they know too much

[maiden meteor]

Radiance just chilled with moth tribe and Unn was peacefully shaping Greenpath

[whole hawk]

Jinn's comments on the knight with void heart does make me think that the Steel Master are sentient void beings.

[vague jasper]

Palestag

[severe siren]

Pharloom is clearly not in its prime also
Tragic that all the places we were looking forward to were actually memory sequences 😔

[spark valve]

they say why it's tarnished and it's not that

[spark valve]

also not a higher being, that one didn't even exist in the form we see it

[uncut holly]

Isnt it tarnished because it touched the void

[whole hawk]

Maybe even descendants of the ancient civilization?

[sinful nimbus]

I hope TC puts everything in the overworld for their next game

[foggy fractal]

I'm not too familar with Zi's dialogue do they mention the city of steel too or does only that cradle message mention it ?

[severe siren]

Game took so long all those areas died out

[solid elk]

So the Pale Beings specifically have a habit of being assholes to the others, gotcha

[vague jasper]

Trobbio will prolly open his stage again

[spark valve]

only the cradle message

[lean temple]

That's interesting? Isn't Sharpe Void tho?

[sinful nimbus]

Imagine if Verdania connected with moss grotto and like the coral forest

[foggy fractal]

gotcha

[winter iris]

Also, the Wingsmould.
they look very steel like and the void makes them unkillable.

[spark valve]

there's no reason to think he is

[winter iris]

Trobbio 3?

[olive umbra]

Guys wasn’t steel or silk soul supposed to be different?

[spark valve]

silk soul was cut

[sinful nimbus]

thanks tc

[severe siren]

Im extremely confident verdania was supposed to be to the left of moss grotto until wormways spawned there

[uncut holly]

Other than him being black and also having a long stretchy nose which most bugs dont have stuch stretchyness but it could just be him

[winter iris]

Why not "Steel silk"?

[olive umbra]

What was the plan for it ?

[solid elk]

The Coral place having actual crustaceans and fish shook me.

[sinful nimbus]

Wormways could fit like below the marrow or something idk why its there

[spark valve]

we don't know but it was supposed to be a more in depth hard mode

[severe siren]

I still think silk soul is coming eventually

[vague jasper]

They prolly redesigned the game a few times

[sullen crown]

I really hope they add in a fools collo like in the dlc.

[spark valve]

wormways makes enough sense being below blasted steps

[maiden meteor]

Hornet now takes 5 masks of contact damage

[spark valve]

could be, would sure be cool

[severe siren]

Yeah that was a trailer from 6 years ago i wouldnt be surprised

[solid elk]

Idk what comes after the Depressed Emo phase for a 3rd Boss Fight

[sinful nimbus]

Sure but its still

[spare pendant]

some cut content is likely to come back in a future content expansion

[severe siren]

They gotta bring back Barnacle Bay though

[olive umbra]

Personally I think silk soul should give you a number of lives

[sinful nimbus]

Silk Soul DLC is my number 1 hope

[vague jasper]

A new beginning

[winter iris]

Everything does 3 mask damage and Hornet has a random change every second of randomly exploding.

[maiden meteor]

“Fuck it we ball” phase

[sullen crown]

Wormways is cool solely because of lifeblood lore

[spark valve]

that would be pretty lame

[vague jasper]

Yeah many things are differences

[spare pendant]

that is the whole point

[sinful nimbus]

Lifeblood lore and cool in the same sentence 🥀

[vague jasper]

How did groal know how to use souls

[spare pendant]

lifeblood lore is sick

[winter iris]

Its surrealist we are genuinely talking about Silksong

[sinful nimbus]

He stole it from a shaman like Soul Master

[maiden meteor]

Lifeblood confirmed to be heroin

[olive umbra]

I think it’s better than what steel soul is rn

[cinder swallow]

he eated it all

[severe siren]

Future content wishes:
-Steel Assassins/City of Steel
-Barnacle area
-Silk Soul Mode
-Endgame content akin to godhome, just a hub for refights would be more than enough for me

[spark valve]

steel soul is also pretty lame

[cinder swallow]

steel soul is a kind of lame challenge indeed

[whole hawk]

I just want a way to start a new game with a crest of my choice

[uncut holly]

There presumeably is gonna be something like Godhome but if I had to predict its probably very far off

[whole hawk]

thats all really

[spare pendant]

he literally ate one of the snail shamans. not their actual corpse i think but some of their power

[winter iris]

Steel soul is like Minecraft hardcore mode. One life.

[vague jasper]

There isn't much lore tablet or stuff in bilewater despite being a big area

[spark valve]

I think barnacle is just gone but silk soul and steel shit is plausible

[solid elk]

Lifeblood is honestly not all that bad compared to what Soul Master did. Maybe Joni was onto something.

[sinful nimbus]

One life challenges can always be self imposed

[neat sandal]

I just want to know why Lace laugh maniac at the end

[vague jasper]

Is that stated somewhere

[severe siren]

Barnacle looked like a whole town and im pretty sure a backer town was a stretch goal

[cinder swallow]

it's heavily implied he ate a snail shaman or something along the sort

[olive umbra]

Just wish it was a decent permadeath

[spare pendant]

the very next room is a snail shaman corpse and seeker soul

[uncut holly]

Godhome was kind of like a big huge wrap up of all the bosses and stuff with Hollow Knight update. To be fair Silk Song was gonna be a DLC of Hollow Knight so it wasnt the last update. But it was done when there was alot of DLC and updates already

[winter iris]

Could people tell me more about Joni? What did joni do? Why is the HK charm called "Joni's blessing"?

[spark valve]

ss has a couple towns I'm not sure I'd assume it was necessarily that

[spare pendant]

also it's implied in a lore tablet

[vague jasper]

Ohh I prolly didn't pay attention

[maiden meteor]

Joni is responsible drinker and Alchemist is an alcoholic

[sullen crown]

With how quickly you die in silksong steel soul is much more daunting

[foggy fractal]

damn reading Zi's dialogue and she really be calling Hornet old, stubborn and alone chill Zi

[vague jasper]

That makes sense, so the snail shamans had a 4th family member

[uncut holly]

I do think fighting some new NPC bosses in a Godhome like experience would be cool, like the Barkeep from Greymoor, we know he can fight.

[severe siren]

Well yeah but i dont know man let me cope
It just looked very unique

[uncut holly]

It would be weird though to have a reason to fight any of the NPC's like that

[whole hawk]

Steel Assassins are a guarantee just because Sharpe is a backer. Godhome equivalent is probably guaranteed too as a final update. I could see an update that lets you visit/explore more dream areas with your music in Act 3.

[severe siren]

Let me fight Vespa in a memory sequence

[sinful nimbus]

TC cut barnacle bay because it was competing with the dev resources for wormways and bilewater

[coarse sapphire]

Can someone explain the rebirth/parasite part to me? I dont really get it

[uncut holly]

That would also be cool

[spark valve]

I wanted it too I just don't think it's distinct enough to be a central part of a content update given that it's basically just greymoor

[solid elk]

I'm glad you're also against the Lifeblood prohibition

[spare pendant]

We're getting a God's Glory expansion yeah

[severe siren]

The deep update fr

[spark valve]

and it wouldn't make very much sense now that the crabs have been moved across the map

[vague jasper]

A shakra boss fight but she is in her prime and fights like the guy from the original Hollow knight dream nail fight

[spark valve]

all that water had to go somewhere

[severe siren]

I want my crabs.

[spare pendant]

I'd love a water expansion

[maiden meteor]

Hornet digs hellevator to Abyss and floods it

[severe siren]

I need more crabs.

[neat sandal]

to the bilewater

[vague jasper]

I believe all these places were destroyed to either create or maintain the citadel

[uncut holly]

Greyroot is a creature related to White Lady, they are probably the same creature as White Lady. While White Lady is obsessed with the creation of more Vessels or "Birth", Greyroot is obsessed with Rebirth which is the act of putting themself inside a bug to absorb their power and grow stronger, they have been doing this a long time.

[vague jasper]

That beauty of the citadel had to have come at a cost

[gleaming creek]

All spoilers are allowed in this channel, correct?

[whole hawk]

I also think it'd be cool if we got a new crest to play around with.

[spare pendant]

yeah

[uncut holly]

Yeah say any spoilers

[cinder swallow]

this is very likely for a DLC

[whole hawk]

And a late game item that gives you near infinite shards.

[coarse sapphire]

What...

[severe siren]

They evicted the barnacle area crabs to the moss grotto/wormways room 😭

[maiden meteor]

I think Greyroot is just some weird species

[whole hawk]

Like come on dont make us farm shards in Act 3

[solid elk]

Watch it be some Godseeker calling everyone Demons after the events of Act 3 and it's like fighting through Hells instead of a Holy Pantheon.

[uncut holly]

Greyroot is the parasite person in Shellwood

[cinder swallow]

honestly, I'd be totally happy if SK didn't get any DLCs
I don't have any sort of bar for DLCs personally

they can be anything

[spark valve]

at least they didn't fully cut them

[cinder swallow]

as long as they don't break the base game (which they obviously wouldn't)

[severe siren]

They also changed purple goop monster to void goop monster 😭

[uncut holly]

They are very likely related to The White Lady from Hollow Knight who was a god or Higher Being. Specifically they where a Pale Being, we dont know what Greyroot is

[maiden meteor]

Silksong will have fabled Abyss expansion, trust

[spark valve]

ss could be plenty complete without any content updates but they're fairly aggressively teasing steel

[solid elk]

Some plants being sapient is something I did not expect to be fleshed out

[cinder swallow]

that was pretty nuts

[ancient dock]

Red

[severe siren]

And also just removed the area that was initially in for trailer 1

[spark valve]

well yeah can't have that in the trailer can you lmao

[uncut holly]

The only plants we know that are Sapient and are really plants, are The Roots, as in White Lady, and Greyroot. And Mosskin

[gleaming creek]

I might be dumb, but what happened to Verandia?

• Coral land dried up and its culture collapsed since its denizens were so reliant on water.
• Ant culture seemingly lost its queen and now the ants are fending for themselves/serving the silk
• But what's up with Verandia? It seems safe and untouched, or did I miss something?

[solid elk]

Almost certainly a Root

[cinder swallow]

wait, does thi actually happen? wtf

[ancient dock]

Grey root is some sort of parasitic being

[coarse sapphire]

And what about the thing from bilewater is that also the same species or is it part of the same person

[uncut holly]

Bilewater?

Oh yeah it is, thats her "child"

[severe siren]

If it werent for how rarely they appeared they are definitely the toughest enemy

[solid elk]

And that memory from Shellwood

[sinful nimbus]

😔

[maiden meteor]

Greyroot probably has lifecycle similar to Nightmare Heart

[uncut holly]

Her "child" might also just be an extension of her, or its something weird required for her ritual.

[spare pendant]

and GG was datamined

[spark valve]

they're kind of nullified by where they are

[severe siren]

Wait what’s datamined? What’s GG

[spare pendant]

God's Glory

which is presumably a godhome gamemode

[foggy fractal]

GG as in jood jame

[spare pendant]

but it doesn't work

[vague jasper]

I think it's safe to say that greyroot' child is in yarnaby' hands

[solid elk]

For a game about bugs, the lack of parasites in Hollow Knight was quite unrealistic

[severe siren]

Interesting

[uncut holly]

So i played a song at the Weaver at Shellwood and it shows you secret messages. It was a prayer for the Weaver of the Shrine to protect against the people of Shellwood, protecting Pilgrims and passerbys saying "They will not be your prey any longer"

[foggy fractal]

whos dialogue is this
Ah.... your s-song. So long I've sat in silence. Tell me... are all songs played now as exquisite as this? Or has time made my hearing unrefined?[Hornet]:This art is new to me and my skill is limited, but your appreciation is not unwelcome.

[whole hawk]

Wait. Real? Is God's Glory just a few lines of code?

[spare pendant]

yeah for now

[uncut holly]

I believe that the Weavers deliberately tried to quell Shellwood for the Pilgrims. Which this was always Shellwood land

[severe siren]

Is there anything else datamined

[maiden meteor]

there were some in deepnest

[severe siren]

Praying for barnacle area

[solid elk]

Spiders and other carnivores literally will eat people, according to Midwife and Huntress, so it adds up

[spare pendant]

no idea

[crisp basalt]

No, Hornet says it's still inside her but weakened to the point she took control over it

[quartz flicker]

If there are DLC bosses added to areas around Pharloon, where would you logically expect to see them?

[solid elk]

Actually, is Huntress dead in Act 3?

[uncut holly]

Yeah it seems to be a statement related to the fallen Weaver as if that was their occupation, terrorizing Shellwood and protecting Pilgrims there.

[vague jasper]

A part of it is inside her which is not enough to take over

[foggy fractal]

where is silksong all sprites smh

[winter iris]

I think it got removed, but Hornet binded it's powers.

[spark valve]

ig they could just slip it into that weird spot in greymoor

[vague jasper]

Most of the other part is prolly with yarnaby

[foggy fractal]

seems so

[lean temple]

So wait is Jiji then the Vassal for Jinn? Sula tried summoning Void so it seems this is knowledge the Vassals may have despite it being frowned upon to use.

[uncut holly]

However I feel in reality that Weaver might have just brought down the hammer on Shellwood for the sake of bringing down the hammer of Shellwood

[foggy fractal]

I got her quest in act 2 I think and finished it in act 3
she was dead but there was one of her kids I could give the collected organs to

[crisp basalt]

Wormways

[solid elk]

This is called mutualism in the Animal Kingdom.

[coarse sapphire]

That psalm cylinder with the sounds of the "last operation" is super weird

[solid elk]

WHAT?

[foggy fractal]

yeah

[crisp basalt]

That's cool

[uncut holly]

RIP Huntress

[spare pendant]

THEY FUCKING KILLED ME

[uncut holly]

I didnt know if you ignored Huntresses quest they died

[crisp basalt]

I like how Team Cherry tough of all this

[uncut holly]

Or did you do the quest and they ate them anyway

[whole hawk]

Quesiton by the way. How do you get Garmond or Shakra to show up in High Halls?

[solid elk]

I knew she was getting food for her kids

[crisp basalt]

Except the Curse Quest apparently

[foggy fractal]

the kid talked about how her siblings ate the corpse of their mother living the kid with nothing to eat
so we give the kid the organs we were supposed to give to huntress

[uncut holly]

Did you do the food quest and they ate her anyway?

[solid elk]

I thought getting the food meant they wouldn't eat her, but she dies anyway?

[severe siren]

If you go to act 3 without doing her quest her children eat her
If you do it in act 2 huntress uses the meat as a replacement so she doesnt die

[uncut holly]

Oh

[foggy fractal]

if you finished the quest before she dies she also talks about how she'll give her body up anyway

[crisp basalt]

At end Hornet asks and she admits she knows they will eat her too

[severe siren]

But either way she will die

[solid elk]

Hot damn

[uncut holly]

Man Hollow Knight world bugs are messed up

Grub Father

[vague jasper]

I am just glad tho, greyroot' cycle is over

[solid elk]

Girl, we got you 87 pieces of Ant flesh for you to still die?

[naive crag]

the malewife is fine

[edgy stone]

Same

[severe siren]

The seared, skewered, and shredded organs did look tasty lowk

[edgy stone]

I really thought she would eat the slaveman

[solid elk]

I like the implication that even the sapient bugs often have massive litters of offspring

[quartz flicker]

A Huntress boss would be sick.

[uncut holly]

He still needs therapy though

[foggy fractal]

tbf she does seem to have a lot of children to feed

[crisp basalt]

I gave her combination of her local fauna and some poor underplayed workers

[coarse sapphire]

How does she die if they didnt eat her

[naive crag]

he IS fine

[spark valve]

they probably ate her anyways

[coarse sapphire]

Lol

[severe siren]

She gives herself up anyways

[coarse sapphire]

Was it not enough?

[crisp basalt]

After I discovered that Architect Crest Charged attack counts a Shredding Tool for the organs

[uncut holly]

I thought she lived if you got the food?

[solid elk]

I was genuinely expecting a Leg Eater situation with Styx hopping on his Save a Ho' shit to let himself be eaten

[coarse sapphire]

Wait are there other characters dying in act 3?

[maiden meteor]

I mean there’s whole cannibalism club in pleasure tower

[crisp basalt]

Like most of them

[coarse sapphire]

What

[uncut holly]

What ever happened to the Bone Bottom builder bug in Act 3?

[crisp basalt]

Lmao

[crisp basalt]

They move to old flea spot

[severe siren]

They relocate to the room where you first find the caravan

[solid elk]

We don't see a corpse of her, IIRC. She could also have been killed due to the Act 3 Calamity

[vague jasper]

I found that out on accident

[solid elk]

Like the hillbillies in Sinner's Road were killed

[crisp basalt]

Same

[gleaming creek]

Is it possible that Zote visited Pharloom? His sword is allegedly made from shellwood.

[naive crag]

my other malewife is alive too

[uncut holly]

Also do we know where Pett the Bone Bottom shop keeper goes after you buy out their shop in act 1

[crisp basalt]

He might be From there

[coarse sapphire]

Ok I should probably start act 3 before reading all that

[solid elk]

Is it cannibalism if your neighbors aren't the same species?

[vague jasper]

Where is that said

[severe siren]

Did you guys know that instead of giving the broken tool to 12 or forge daughter, you can make it yourself at the top of Mt. Fay with another unique design

[spark valve]

shellwood isn't exclusively in pharloom

[uncut holly]

I want. A Zote DLC.

[lean temple]

"Wielding a nail he carved from shellwood"

[winter iris]

He was neglected, and thus, dead.

[crisp basalt]

Hey so you know how mid game of HK crossroads turn into infected crossroads? Yeah apply that to basically entire map

[ancient dock]

Kinda of explains why she still has the witch powers

[uncut holly]

It could happen, Team Cherry could hand wave it and use the sword as evidence we could get Zote.

[gleaming creek]

"A self-proclaimed Knight, of no renown. Wields a nail he carved from shellwood, named Life Ender." - Hunter

[coarse sapphire]

Ok that sounds cool

[solid elk]

Shellwood the wood is not necessarily only found in the forest Pharloom calls Shellwood

[severe siren]

If we see zote im feeding him to a sandcarver

[winter iris]

I think it means it is made of the material "Shellwood"

[solid elk]

Plenty of Woodlands are just called "The Woodlands" in many languages, for example

[naive crag]

zote wouldnt live a day in pharloom

he dies in fucking greenpath

[uncut holly]

Shellwood is probably Stickbug wood i have to imagine

[vague jasper]

Oh wow

[uncut holly]

Theres probably other sources

[spare pendant]

it's very likely that the two things both called Shellwood by the same three people are related though

[solid elk]

It is morbid how much infrastructure is overtly made from dead bug shells

[gleaming creek]

Fair, so it could just be a common tree type.

[lean temple]

I was hoping they'd add stick bugs and then they made them have deadly blades

[maiden meteor]

Zote’s special ability is to only get in trouble when main character is around

[vague jasper]

Zote has all his points in luck stat, we can assume he made it out safely

[solid elk]

Like, bugs are very okay with other people's bodies as tools

[uncut holly]

Its weird how Sister Splinter is a Sister

[spare pendant]

stickbugs aren't wood

[spark valve]

we know where the plants in shellwood come from, it's Nyleth, and Nyleth isn't a unique being we see another like her in hallownest. That's two for two, they're probably widespread

[uncut holly]

Yeah their "Shellwood"

[naive crag]

really deep thoughts

[uncut holly]

Hypothetically

[spare pendant]

stickbugs are imitation bugs

[lean temple]

Who is the other?

[ancient dock]

What type of Zote are we talking about here base Zote no but Grey Prince would eat Pharloom for breakfast

[spark valve]

isma

[uncut holly]

Unless there are shell trees somewhere

[lean temple]

Do we know what she definitively is?

[uncut holly]

Theres probably alot of different sources of shell wood in the broader Hollow Knight world

[maiden meteor]

Alas Grey Prince is a fanfic

[spare pendant]

isma doesn't create shellwood

[spark valve]

she does

[solid elk]

Isma just made a fruit from her body, somehow

[uncut holly]

I mean thats plant life, we dont know if its shell

[severe siren]

I love that TC added Hornet visibly changing the corpse sprite of enemies when grabbing items off them for quests and such

For roach guts, their underside is just gone
For pilgrim/choir garbs the corpses lie naked

[uncut holly]

It needs to be both a shell and a wood

[spark valve]

she's the same type of being as nyleth doing the same thing she just did it more recently

[uncut holly]

Do we know shes the same type of being as Nyleth?

They have different eyes

[spark valve]

look at them

[crisp basalt]

We also saw another Root

[solid elk]

Shellwood may well be chitinous tree bark, which is unsettling

[crisp basalt]

Altho looks like this one isn't a pale being

[naive crag]

theres the greyroot higher being theory and all

[uncut holly]

I mean we some how have shell ore, which is shell growing in a rock. Which could be a Chitin

[maiden meteor]

It’s weird how Five Knight are at least half not native to Hallownest

[uncut holly]

But we mine it

[solid elk]

The Twisted Bud being a baby higher being helps explain the Twisted Child ending

[spark valve]

no it doesn't

[maiden meteor]

I don’t think twisted bud is higher being

[uncut holly]

There are also Shell deposits we find in Shellwood that look just like those inactive shell enemies on the ceiling

[gleaming creek]

I am probably dumb, but I always assumed those are fossils.

[uncut holly]

Maybe

[solid elk]

It's beginning to seem like more than just the bugs are made of chitin in this world

[severe siren]

Hornet shouldve paid a visit to ze’mer instead of the whatever hearts 🥱

[uncut holly]

Them being fossils makes more sense than shell growing in the ground, that would be like if meat grew in the earth

[spare pendant]

pretty sure they are

[severe siren]

Just dump 100 flowers into the abyss

[naive crag]

it would take her weeks and the world is ending

no time to do that

[maiden meteor]

Dip Ze’mer into void

[severe siren]

its just one kingdom 🥱

[naive crag]

she shouldve visited lands serene

what could lands serene be i wanna know more

[spare pendant]

delicate flower quest from ze'emer to pharloom

[solid elk]

Between it and Greyroot, it has no business being able to do what it does in its ending if it is a normal creature.

[uncut holly]

Ze'mer is a moth, so i guess that kind of confirms moths in other places. Maybe they arent called moth but they look like moths

[spark valve]

sure it does

[uncut holly]

Faylon the giant Snow Yeti Moth at the top of Fae Peak is also a moth atleast in design

[spark valve]

ze'mer is not a moth

fayforn is also not a moth

[maiden meteor]

It’s a parasite, so it likely just does parasite thing but with GMS

[uncut holly]

Design wise they are a moth, in lore wise they might not be a moth

[spark valve]

lore wise they are definitely not a moth

[solid elk]

It has feathers, which is weird for an Arthropod.

But then again, some bugs have bones in HK

[spare pendant]

Radiance didn't create every moth, she created the moth clan in hallownest

[uncut holly]

There arent many winter adapted insects in the world, Snow Moths are one of them though.

In real life i mean

[lean temple]

She looks like a silverfish

[severe siren]

Fayforn and Bellbeast and Mister Mushroom are the only SS characters that matter

[uncut holly]

Silver fish cant fly. Also the dirt carvers in Deepnest in the OG Hollow Knight look like Silverfish

[maiden meteor]

“This could only mean one thing… I have to travel even further.”
TO BE CONTINUED IN HOLLOW KNIGHT 3: ZOTEBOAT

[naive crag]

zemer looks more like gms than a moth

[uncut holly]

Silver fish also have this signature 3 tail thing and Faylon only has 2

[lean temple]

I meant Ze'mer

[uncut holly]

Which is what the snow moths have

Oh maybe??

[solid elk]

We need an ending where Hornet is infected with Muckmaggots and see what happens when the maggots get a taste of Grandma

[uncut holly]

oh scratch that snow moths dont have 2 wing tails, other white moths do though

[severe siren]

Reminder that HK doesnt follow real world biology

[maiden meteor]

they just eat her whole

[severe siren]

Doesnt have to be perfect

[uncut holly]

oh wait they do have wing tails

They break off when grabbed

[naive crag]

what are you tyring to get at

what if shes a moth

[maiden meteor]

Muckmaggots are the only creatures to match the might of void

[naive crag]

muckmaggot sounds like a slur

[uncut holly]

Faylon design wise is a moth, but lore wise all moths that we know where made by the Radiance. However Faylon could just be a cryptid.

[solid elk]

You act as though God flesh ain't some next level nutrients.

Huntress wouldn't have eaten holes if her kids had GMS as an option

[maiden meteor]

Bilewater kinda had it coming

[solid elk]

Fuck, I mistyped. Forget I sent that

[solid elk]

Bilewater is a clear victim her, tbh. The Citadel made it the way it is

[severe siren]

Bilewater did nothing wrong

[spare pendant]

the Radiance only created the moth clan, no reason other moths can't exist since she herself is a moth

[naive crag]

Bluewater ruined my life

[spark valve]

she is not one

[maiden meteor]

The hidden bench is clearly not citadel’s fault

[spare pendant]

in design she absolutely is don't even talk

[uncut holly]

In Hollow Knight all problems stem from the Pale King and Radiance, but the Pale King wasnt trying. In Silk Song all problems are started by the Citadel, and they where trying.

[solid elk]

BileWater seemingly would be normal if the Exhaust Organ wasn't around

[severe siren]

Who, ze’mer?

[spark valve]

design inspiration and actually being one are entirely different things

[spare pendant]

radiance

[severe siren]

Oh

[maiden meteor]

Radiance had a reasonable crashout tbh

[solid elk]

The Radiance is a Dream Deity that looks like a Moth and created moths, but is not a Moth, like how humans were created in God's Image

[spare pendant]

In terms of "actually being something" she's a fucking dream entity. She still has the form of a moth which is my entire point. What are you even on about

[naive crag]

everyone hates radiance but if you had that power and were immortal what else would you do

[gleaming creek]

Did the Silk Lady have a reason to become tyranical?

[maiden meteor]

I don’t even think PK had to convince moths to abandon her

[spark valve]

ok so you aren't paying attention to the nuances of what the conversation is about

[spare pendant]

radiance took over out of revenge

[maiden meteor]

like I don’t think Radiance really cared about stuff outside moth tribe

[solid elk]

The Radiance seemingly was very chill before the PK, which makes him look a lot worse

[uncut holly]

We dont know if Faylon is a race of beings, i mean they might be and probably are we have no reason to think their not. But they could just be a cryptid one of a kind entity, they also apparently impart wisdom.

[neat sandal]

No.
why?

[formal geyser]

She is seething because weavers she gave higher thought stole her power and ran away

[spare pendant]

You could try sitting down yk

[uncut holly]

Which is why their a good conversation partner for Mr Mushroom

[solid elk]

We know it is constantly being polluted by the Citadel

[maiden meteor]

PK really is an ass

[spark valve]

Protective garb lined with the soft down of a Fayforn
the determiner a suggests there are more than one

[solid elk]

The leader of the Stillkin particularly is quite upset about it

[naive crag]

hallownest without pale king is happy ending

[uncut holly]

Yeah so probably more than one

[naive crag]

i stand a pk hater

[solid elk]

Hallownest without the Pale King means no Hornet

[maiden meteor]

alternatively PK could just do his business without treading on other’s territory

[uncut holly]

Well that basically says it then they arent a moth their a "Fayforn", conspiciously not Moth looking Moth creature.

[spare pendant]

there is no hallownest without the pale king

[uncut holly]

Because im pretty sure their name is Faylon

[naive crag]

no hallownest is happy ending then

[solid elk]

No Hornet means 80% of HK Fanart is more SFW

[sinful nimbus]

What is the point of the hearts even

[neat sandal]

yeah. but why Exhaust Organ
it's just musical instruments

[naive crag]

love radiance forever

[spark valve]

macguffins to get you to see content

[solid elk]

Is it not contributing to the pollution via literal exhaust?

[uncut holly]

I dont blame the Moths for turning their back on the Radiance, Radiance didnt do squat for them.

[spare pendant]

exhaust organ is venting the citadel exhaust into bilewater

[maiden meteor]

In Hollow Knight 3 Hornet travels back in time to kill Pale King like in Samurai Jack

[solid elk]

Also, thr Mist, which idk if we actually get an explanation of it

[crisp basalt]

Exhaust Organ is how pollution was moved from citadel to bilewater

[uncut holly]

You look at all the things Pale King did, and then compare them to what Radiance did which is make them and said worship me

[spare pendant]

the mist isn't explained but seems to be phantom's creation

[formal geyser]

You can probs tie it in with nightmare grim since they feed on dreams of fallen kingdoms

[sinful nimbus]

Exhaust organ gets rid of the fumes and such through its pipes and its operated by playing the instrument

[neat sandal]

I thought because they dump thing throught this part

[uncut holly]

Mist is somehow related to the Silk, its populated by Silk Wraiths

[maiden meteor]

btw PK done the same but also tried to fuck over other gods like Unn and Radiance

[formal geyser]

its halucinaition mist

[uncut holly]

Did PK ever do anything to Unn?

[formal geyser]

there is a reason the ghosts look like the phantom

[spark valve]

he really didn't though

[uncut holly]

I thought Unn let them make a road through their land

[formal geyser]

no he was chill with unn

[sinful nimbus]

Unn was chill with PK, Radiance was screwed over by the moths not PK

[solid elk]

Unlikely, as they literally have aqueducts for wastewater they use and it would be weird to use that.

Also, the EXHAUST part of the organ is due to literal smog

[spark valve]

pk was chill with everyone who was there it's the moths leaving radiance of their own volition that started causing issues

[uncut holly]

PK really tried to not make problems for himself

[sinful nimbus]

PK is also married to another god so acting like he actively opposes other gods is absurd

[naive crag]

the pale king messed with everyone but some were fine with it

[uncut holly]

Had iffy ways of fixing problems, but happens to the best of us

[maiden meteor]

iirc some lore tablets imply mosskin weren’t too fond of Hallownest

[solid elk]

Also their name is Phantom and the Wraiths ate also Silk entities

[naive crag]

deepnesst straifht up kills the workers

[uncut holly]

Pale King kept poking Deepnest

[naive crag]

the void kills him?

[spare pendant]

they weren't

[uncut holly]

Deepnest bugs denied their "savagery being tamed"

[naive crag]

and white lady decided to take half of greenpath

[spare pendant]

mosskin didn't like hallownest but had no issues with it on a political level. as in, they weren't enemies of hallownest

[solid elk]

It is wei3d how much the PK wanted to try Deepnest, despite how overtly hostile the area is.

[spark valve]

that's in the context of failed tramway which failed because of actual animals

[sinful nimbus]

Mosskin lore tablets just say you have to face Mosskin law if you stray from Pilgrim's Way and that you should be wary of White Lady since she's foreign

[maiden meteor]

Deepnest had hot mommy Herrah rule them why would they want PK

[spark valve]

the actual intelligent bugs in deepnest ended up allied with hallownest

[solid elk]

She was not a mom yet, tbf.

[spark valve]

the only civilization in the realm that didn't end up having some kind of diplomacy was the hive and they just kept to themselves

[uncut holly]

Though failed tramway was killed by the sentient denizens of Deepnest, also is there a difference between the animal bugs of deepnest I thought they where all intelligent but just chose that

[solid elk]

There are not enough of them is the issue. Their wildlife is ostensibly uncontrollable, is seems.

[sinful nimbus]

Dirtcarvers and such were the ones meddling with failed tramway

[uncut holly]

They also got made intelligent by the Pale King, but still opted to be that

[formal geyser]

they seemd chill with pk also because hornet

[spark valve]

dirtcarvers are not intelligent

[sinful nimbus]

There are no spider corpses there

[spare pendant]

I'm somewhat sure the weaverlings were children of the weavers, like herrah?

[solid elk]

Dirtcarvers seem like they just breed to fast and kill too much

[naive crag]

its pk who gives sentience to hallownests savage bugs

[uncut holly]

Dirtcarver life span is weird

[sinful nimbus]

PK isn't the one you should be blaming its White Lady

[solid elk]

....is Herrah a child of Weavers?

[spare pendant]

no herrah is a weaver

[naive crag]

but they refused to be part of hallownest makes sense they're beastly

[sinful nimbus]

She came up with the vessel plan and selfishly stole Unn's land

[spare pendant]

but she might have had children

that weren't full on weavers

[maiden meteor]

yeah and PK enabled her

[formal geyser]

i still disagree with mosbagg "holy ground" interpretation i just think he tought them but didnt litterly bestow things on them

[sinful nimbus]

PK was desperate and manipulated

Just like how WL manipulates TK into sealing Radiance

[naive crag]

she's pretty im ok with her

[obsidian quail]

how do u teach higher consciousness

[solid elk]

The snails and slugs in this world can't catch a break.

[uncut holly]

I thought the Pale King had some power to teach them with Pale King power but didnt literally sit down with them and teach them how to read

[sinful nimbus]

No she's not

[maiden meteor]

exactly PK’s train of thought

[spare pendant]

Primitive bugs are everywhere in the world of hollow knight. Hallownest bestows them sapience, which would otherwise be limited.

[naive crag]

mad?

[obsidian quail]

GMS has the best Higher Being design

[sinful nimbus]

White Lady can be the cause of all ills in the world and pk haters will still find a way to blame him 😭

[naive crag]

i love wl

[maiden meteor]

GMS is kinda creepy because she resembles human a bit

[naive crag]

double standards

[maiden meteor]

like normal ass head with normal ass hair

[formal geyser]

it wasnt higher consciousness he just tought them like normal "person"

[sinful nimbus]

GMS has a wonky torso and ugly limbs I don't like her design

She looks fine in Lost Lace though

[obsidian quail]

he gifted them higher consciousness

[spare pendant]

barely

[solid elk]

The word bug is so broad as to be applied to nearly every animal we have seen in the games, including the Snail Shamans, IIRC

[naive crag]

i like that gms has hair

[formal geyser]

White lady litterly didnt do anything that didnt agree with pk they were both aware of how cruel it was of them and they both felt bad

[spare pendant]

monomon literally says that those who stray from hallownest will lose their gift of a mind

[maiden meteor]

I don’t think snail shamans are considered bugs exactly

[formal geyser]

he didnt

[maiden meteor]

PK agenda

[spare pendant]

why wouldn't they be

[uncut holly]

I mean Hollow Knight has, Insects, Arthropods(including crustaceans) jellyfish, slugs and slug adjacent, worms, and 2 roots.

[obsidian quail]

he literally did

that’s what he did

[sinful nimbus]

You can't make beasts sapient just through teaching them

[solid elk]

Nuu is a snail and is a bug, right?

[spark valve]

nuu is not a snail

[spare pendant]

i forgot we had jellyfish

[formal geyser]

yea to glaze the kingdom where knowldage is stored

[humble iron]

that's a backpack not a shell

[spare pendant]

nuu is a slug with a snail shell backpack

[formal geyser]

he didnt it was one lore tablet up to intepretation

[sinful nimbus]

We see a bug who loses their mind after leaving the kingdom

[uncut holly]

and mushrooms, and moss people. Which isnt actually that far off from mushrooms

[sinful nimbus]

Which is exactly what the tablets in Howling Cliff's suggest

[maiden meteor]

well, they aren’t explicitly referred as ones and seem to barely have any part in Hallownest’s business

[solid elk]

A slug is still a mollusk, so is Nuu a Bug?

[obsidian quail]

no

[spare pendant]

"interpretation" doing a lot of heavy lifting here

[naive crag]

she's truly so cute I love her mind

[sinful nimbus]

2 lore tablets and an actual example

[obsidian quail]

the power of headcanon

[spark valve]

2 actual examples you forgot quirrel comic

[sinful nimbus]

One of those lore tablets was PK's personal 'diary' so there's no possibility of propaganda or whatever

[obsidian quail]

i don’t think u know what sapience means

[foggy fractal]

qurriel 🤑

[spark valve]

nuu also isn't a slug she's a kissing bug

[uncut holly]

I mean reasonably we could get, Oysters, Barnacles, Clams, Scallops, Urchins, and Sea Stars.

[solid elk]

Crustaceans are obviously bugs now, given the Crust people.

[spare pendant]

really? lol

[uncut holly]

I mean Crustaceans where always bugs

[solid elk]

The worms might be bugs? Idk if they are ever referred to as such

[uncut holly]

Spiders are closer to crabs then they are bugs

[maiden meteor]

I think tablet telling bugs to not venture beyond borders is just King propaganda

[spark valve]

it's not though we see it happen multiple times

[sinful nimbus]

Was the corpse we see of a bug that lost its mind after leaving the kingdom propaganda

[drowsy mortar]

What exactly are the Wisp Thicket cultists?

[sinful nimbus]

Was PK's own personal record of the events in the kingdom also propaganda

[uncut holly]

Also back in the early backer days of Hollow Knight God Tamer originally rode a Lobster. So Crabs have always been around

[solid elk]

TC didn't want crustaceans in HK, cutting the carnival of crustaceans location, bevause they were Buggy enough IIRC?

[spare pendant]

that's not canon

[obsidian quail]

do u guys think the Ancient Civilization would hollow themselves out like Vessels? what did they mean by “Void cleanse us”, was it fading into oblivion or hollowing themselves out?

[sinful nimbus]

HK has pillbugs

[solid elk]

That is death

[uncut holly]

Yeah its not cannon but it was always on mind

[solid elk]

A layman does not know that those are crustaceans

[obsidian quail]

so u think it means death?

[spark valve]

the crustacean carnival was an example of how to format backer dungeon submissions not something they ever planned to make

[solid elk]

Like how the average person doesn't know that ants are wasps (taxonomically)

[uncut holly]

We already have 2 carnival type things, Grimm Troupe goes really far with the theme. Flea Festival goes with it in a different way. I dunno how many ideas they would have for carnival themed things if they did the Carnival of Crustaceans.

[sinful nimbus]

Average person doesn't know that humans are spiders 😔 American educational system has failed us

[uncut holly]

No human is crab

[solid elk]

Yes. Dropping your babies in the Abyss, if you are not a God, probably is death

[obsidian quail]

can any bug hollow themselves out or do u need a special constitution

[gleaming creek]

I assume they're possibly related to Grimm somehow?

[uncut holly]

Fun fact, crabs can grow their arms back

[spare pendant]

The term "bug" does not just mean insect. It means hemiptera (like craneflies) in taxonomy and, in colloquial usage, it refers to anything which resembles the common image of a bug which includes insects, arachnids, some crustaceans, and even shrimp.

[sinful nimbus]

Vessels were mini gods in very strong eggs they were probably an exception

[solid elk]

Lifeblood is fun for the whole family though. Nobody has been killed by it (yet)

[drowsy mortar]

No they only seem to worship the Father of the Flame

[uncut holly]

Crabs have the ability to regrow their arms and legs when they molt, aswell as healing any scarring on their main body

[drowsy mortar]

No mention of Nightmare heart

[sinful nimbus]

I do not believe bug is a taxonomical term

[uncut holly]

Lobsters and Crayfish cannot do this

[limber anvil]

OK I think the true ending of hollowknighy is embrace the void... Based upon the silksong ending... But once the knight shows up and the hornet sees glimpses of them. The void around is absolutly calm and still.

[obsidian quail]

so if u threw anyone else in the abyss or the lake of void they’re cooked?

[maiden meteor]

Quite the opposite, it brings people from beyond!

[humble iron]

in this world bug means animal yup

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah

[drowsy mortar]

Then they kill themselves when you kill their "God"

[spare pendant]

Bug is only a taxonomical term in reference to "true bug" which refers to the hemiptera genus(?)

[solid elk]

I think holometabolus insects are similar

[obsidian quail]

how were the AC worshippers so intimate with the Void then

[uncut holly]

Tarantulas also can regrow their legs just like crabs

[obsidian quail]

if it’s anti life to that extent

[maiden meteor]

admiring it from a distance

[gleaming creek]

True. While Grimm liked his flame motifs, you do point out that there is no mention of the heart, so I guess they're not a Grimm cult.

[solid elk]

Neither is Worm, or Fish, but it is what we got that the public understands

[obsidian quail]

they handled it a bunch and we know they were in the Abyss

[sinful nimbus]

Well they seemed to be jumping into the stuff to kill themselves so

[cold canopy]

Well they just couldn’t go swimming in it (if they wanted to live)

[gleaming creek]

Of course, that doesn't explain what they are.

[obsidian quail]

they were clearly in the Abyss for a considerable time

[uncut holly]

I feel like if we see different bug species and different animals its probably going to be used in a specific opportunistic way like the Flies in SilkSong. Where they have an area and theme and they just fit, for them to be called Flies by name.

[sinful nimbus]

Bright lights can repel void which is probably how they made void idol

[obsidian quail]

all their shit is down there

[uncut holly]

We have a lot of mosquito like things but none of them are misquitos

[maiden meteor]

I think arcane eggs are made of void too

[humble iron]

not to mention the flames aren't the same color

[obsidian quail]

so is that one bug holding the fountain a statue

it can’t be cuz it thinks

[maiden meteor]

perhaps you need special instruments to liquify outer layers to reveal insides

[obsidian quail]

that thing is hanging on

[solid elk]

Remember that unintelligent species can give birth to intelligent offspring too. Like with Flukemarm and her daughter

[spare pendant]

when is flukemarm ever implied to be unintelligent

[humble iron]

if it was just bright light then Hornet wouldn't have needed to go to such length and could've just grabbed a lumafly lantern lol

[sinful nimbus]

Flukes are infected so

[uncut holly]

Im pretty sure the Fluke are Nematodes

[sinful nimbus]

Lumaflies aren't bright

[uncut holly]

Or maybe flat worms?

[maiden meteor]

you need really bright light

[uncut holly]

Flat worms when you cut them in half split into two different creatures.

[sinful nimbus]

But for the record the lighthouse uses magnified lumafly light to repel void

[uncut holly]

They are also adorable

[maiden meteor]

PK needed whole ass lighthouse to calm void down

[sinful nimbus]

And hornet uses the "first light" to repel void

[humble iron]

Delicate flower's light isn't hat bright

[solid elk]

Uh....I would need an argument to see her being intelligent more so than the other way around.

Homegirl only breeding and cannot speak or anything else

[uncut holly]

Very unlikey Flukes

[spare pendant]

She's infected

[solid elk]

Plenty of infected bugs were clearly people beforehand

[humble iron]

that's fair

[uncut holly]

I mean the Fluke hermit becomes the Flukemarm.

So they probably are intelligent

Its also nice to know that even though the Flukes are absolutely disgusting, atleast their next generation has a good leader

[maiden meteor]

Maybe flukemarms just devolve to mindless breeding machine

[solid elk]

Being an intelligent creature, but also being sessile and a breeding factory, is....hell

[uncut holly]

I mean we dont really know what its thinking

Yeah Fluke Hermit is Fluke Hermit

[spare pendant]

Absolutely nothing suggests that the flukemarm wasn't sensible before the infection

[obsidian quail]

are we positive Ancient Civilization weren’t frolicking in the abyss or hollowing themselves out

[spare pendant]

Fluke Hermit suggests the opposite

[maiden meteor]

Unlikely

I think it was like Ancients in Rain World

[obsidian quail]

but they were clearly down in abyss for a lot of time

[uncut holly]

They wore giant masks and bumped their heads on doors

[maiden meteor]

they built religion around the stuff until decided to dip into it at once

[obsidian quail]

no sign of using any light source

[obsidian quail]

that’s a theory

[solid elk]

I will simply repeat this

[spare pendant]

vespa

[solid elk]

Vespa is long dead, is she not?

[spare pendant]

vespa was clearly intelligent and was a queen bee (who spend their lives as breeding factories)

[maiden meteor]

why did vespa even grew that large

[sinful nimbus]

Multiple sapient bugs seem completely fine with laying a ton of eggs

[spare pendant]

yes but i mean when she was alive

[maiden meteor]

she was fine when training Hornet

[quartz flicker]

Do you think there's lore significance to Grand Mother Silk being a lot weaker than Radiance?

[uncut holly]

If we do see a Vespa fight, I hope it shows that she got bigger, not the huge size but their now way taller and generall just bigger

Maybe Hive Knight is there

[maiden meteor]

She was put to sleep by Weavers and basically have just awakened

[quartz flicker]

In particular she's a lot less resilient, outside of her ability to use her silk to fend off the Void.

[drowsy mortar]

Genuinely what is Wisp Thicket I'm so confused

[obsidian quail]

also definitely not true because we know their ruin came from something else

[solid elk]

Every anthropomorphic entity we have seen is a sapient person, fair

[quartz flicker]

Radiance was also trapped in the Hollow Knight's skull.

[uncut holly]

Whisp Thicket is a strange situation where some bug wished to burn in flames, and their wish was granted real and they become a god of the flames.

[solid elk]

This is fair. Biology is notable unfair to women

Pregnancy is a bitch

[uncut holly]

They have a very small cult and are strange. The Father of the Flames idol seems to be either a depiction of the deified version of that bug or maybe it was where they where burned?

[maiden meteor]

Frenzied Flame

[foggy fractal]

uh oh

[quartz flicker]

I hope that Wisp Thicket get fleshed out in DLC, but it has such a damn amazing aesthetic.

[lean temple]

It's like folk horror stuff tbh

[solid elk]

Wish Thicket giving us the equivalent of Glowing Womb was a disappointment, but the ambiance is great

[maiden meteor]

Radiance just was constantly angry

[uncut holly]

Yeah, i have no idea what the heck they are in the broader sense of the timeline, they just have their tiny bamboo grove where they are fantasizing over burning the world

[maiden meteor]

while GMS was probably half asleep

[solid elk]

I wish hidden charm interactions returned so I have have poop flame

[obsidian quail]

nobody got the Ancient Civilization answers i need

[uncut holly]

Is the Father of the Flames a god? They have been deified seemingly? They where once a bug that got burned and wished to burn in a massive fire

[obsidian quail]

TC make an AC DLC please

[uncut holly]

For some reason their wish was granted and they became a deity

[maiden meteor]

We see what GMS can do when locked in when she creates a giant cocoon to fend from void

[severe siren]

Wisp Thicket gave us Pinwheel

[solid elk]

God as in Higher Being or just being worshipped?

[uncut holly]

I have no idea

We dont know anything about the Father of the Flames

[quartz flicker]

what now

[lean temple]

Worshipped yes but HB idk

[neat sandal]

"Hate for their light. Hate for their pins. For their waste poured thick and endless"
I mean. it say they poured
and poured often mean liquid
I'm familiar in english enough to know if it can apply to gas

[maiden meteor]

Father is probably some lesser deity

[solid elk]

Cogwork Wheel says hello

[uncut holly]

Just that they where made by a guy wishing to go up in flames and then they became a deified entity in the form of The Father of the Flames

[maiden meteor]

Maybe if enough bugs pour their faith into something it can manifest somehow

[uncut holly]

I mean supposedly The Father of the Flames is probably behind the Whisps

probably

[regal rover]

Okay so the first ending you get, the basic one, whats the deal there

[solid elk]

Ah, Citadel

[maiden meteor]

Like Godseekers’ focus can turn thou cringer into god of gods

[solid elk]

The literal Exhaust Smog Organ remains, so I cannot deny it is a factor.

They may well also put their wastewater elsewhere

[lean temple]

Hornet binds the power of Grand Mother Silk and replaces her as silk goddess

[maiden meteor]

Well, “putrified” ducts

[uncut holly]

If they do do a boss refighting system, i feel like its going to be based off of memory instead of real like Godhome

[solid elk]

Hornet being Silk Goddess is what justifies all the Mommy Dom artwork

[regal rover]

Thats badass

[uncut holly]

Where Godseekers just yank people out of what their doing with their focus and put them in their dream

[solid elk]

This person was talking about the connection from Bilewater to Whispering Vaults

[regal rover]

I mean the whole silk thing could make it more real than god home

[maiden meteor]

tbh I feel like Memories and Dreams aren’t dissimilar in nature

both seem to be related to higher being’s power

[quartz flicker]

I still really really want to see what Weaver Queen Hornet is like.

[uncut holly]

I mean Godhome was real, it yanked people into the dream world. And used the dream ghosts or echoes

[regal rover]

Same dude

[plain coral]

Dont wanna spoil someone but did someone already find this place ? ( No name village)

[uncut holly]

Memory would probably just be Hornet remembering and fighting their memory of the foe

[maiden meteor]

I think Godhome and White Palace are weird borderline realms

[solid elk]

Genuinely, she might be better as a HB than the previous. Hornet has a decent sense of justice

[quartz flicker]

White Palace was an actual physical location

[uncut holly]

whats this?

[maiden meteor]

I feel like it’s implied Hornet cannot control Silk power

[solid elk]

Hornet would need a Shaman or other to access her own memories, right?

[regal rover]

She has silk skills tho

[foggy fractal]

Sans Nom 😱

[uncut holly]

oh its the Nameless Village

[maiden meteor]

I mean like amount of power GMS has

[spare pendant]

hornet absolutely can control her silk

[quartz flicker]

I'd kinda prefer we don't get pantheons like in HK. I'd prefer something different, or else just simple boss replays

[maiden meteor]

It almost looks like in this ending silk just exploded all over Pharloom

[spare pendant]

i think we will get pantheon of pharloom

[foggy fractal]

yes btw lots of people have found this place
you can use the needolin to watch a memory of a random bug, this place is also part of the mister mushroom questline

[solid elk]

You mean she wouldn't have like fine control over the Silk, thus ending up doing the same as GMS in practice?

[solid elk]

Please don't lock the true ending behind a 50+ Boss Rush

[maiden meteor]

Well more like, amount of silk GMS had just turns out to be way too much for Hornet to handle

[spare pendant]

there is no true ending in either game

[quartz flicker]

Boss rushes in Silksong would be extremely painful

[spare pendant]

"every ending is canon"

[uncut holly]

I mean the Godseekers wouldnt really have much reason to come to Pharloom, i dont think we are getting Godseekers in Pharloom if there is a rematch its probably something different

[maiden meteor]

After all she is only half-god

[solid elk]

You know what I mean. The ending that is the hardest and most rewarding and the fans love the most

[vague jasper]

I did not wanna do the mr mushroom quest and saw it on youtube and found out there's this whole secret area 😭

[uncut holly]

If i had to guess it would be Weaver memory related

[vague jasper]

What is it even about

[spare pendant]

more like 75% and that's being generous to the idea that you can actually be only partially hb

[vague jasper]

I hope they don't add another ending with a dlc

Either a continuation or side story

The current true ending is good

[maiden meteor]

I think True Ending is perfect as is

[vague jasper]

Yes

[maiden meteor]

Knight basically goes “☺️”

[vague jasper]

Sister

Don't attack my sister

[quartz flicker]

Don't have much to go on here, but I think a boss replay realm would most likely be a thing that Hornet does after the end of Act 3. Since that would also let us see Pharloon in a post-Void state.

[solid elk]

I have the urge for more Silksong story as a whole, but I am also never satisfied and TC eventually needs to make other games in other franchises

[plain coral]

Ain't gonna say that that's an whole area bcs it really empty here there's nothing there

[obsidian quail]

just not base ending or sealed siblings

[maiden meteor]

“What the fuck is all this noise in abyss is about? I’m gonna find whoever the hell is doing that and- Oh, hey sis! Wrap it up guys, I think we got the wrong person.”

[spare pendant]

no, those are canon

[obsidian quail]

bugs forever

[plain coral]

Who tf is mister mushroom don't tell me this guy is back

[spare pendant]

every ending is canon but not every ending leads into silksong

[obsidian quail]

not canon to silksong

[plain coral]

Only one

[maiden meteor]

“all endings canon” appears to be long outdated idea

[spare pendant]

team cherry has literally said the first part

[obsidian quail]

but u can look at silksong as a branch of the possible timeline

[eager marsh]

ik this is obvious for most of you prob but i just realized the ||first sinner's sin was disobeying grandma silk||

[spare pendant]

it has never been outdated

[eager marsh]

thats why they were caged

[solid elk]

I would be fine with a joke ending, like Sharma ascending to godhood or Trobbio taking off his mask and revealing he was Nightmare King Grimm all along

[spare pendant]

yeah the weavers rebelled at some point

[plain coral]

Where did the hollow knight go tho?

[maiden meteor]

“It was truly our song… of silk.”

[eager marsh]

didnt beat the game still (||lost lace killed me in like 2 seconds||) so i dont know some stuff ig

[plain coral]

This guy traumatised us in his pure vessel form and disappeared?

[plain coral]

There are 3 phases of it be ready

[neat sandal]

probably devs would put bunch of statues at memorium
access to those memories for boss rush mode

[solid elk]

All endings are canon, but not all endings continue the best possible timeliness (the one in which Silksong occurs)

[maiden meteor]

They probably had a little fight with Hornet but then realized they have literally no reason to

[spare pendant]

Widow(?) calls her the "daughter of those who dared to rebel"

[eager marsh]

what 😭

[solid elk]

Lost Lace is the hardest boss in the game, it's fair

[plain coral]

Yup she basically spams everything at this phase it's like playing against radiance

[eager marsh]

what hk ending is the one that happened in silksong tho? i would guess godmaster

[eager marsh]

ye it should be cus its the last boss (i hope at least)

[plain coral]

God master with the little flower I think

[quartz flicker]

I think it's cool, but the story of Act 3 boils down to "Hornet did an oopsy and made the situation way worse, then she averts a cataclysm." I think there's potential for something more, especially if that means we get a True True Final Boss that is entirely unique.

[maiden meteor]

I really don’t see the reason to consider Silksong “alternate timeline”. All endings are canon statement was made waaaaaay back, even before Silksong iirc, so it might as well be that TC have since ditched the idea

[solid elk]

The Apostate is also the best boss in the game, BTW. We love a rebel with great lore

[eager marsh]

the everbloom 🗣️ 🔥

[plain coral]

Goated sh ngl carried all of act 3

[spare pendant]

there's zero indication they ever retconned it

[solid elk]

Did nobody tell you about Grandfather Milk?

[plain coral]

Who's the apostate?

Where can I find him

[spare pendant]

first sinner

[eager marsh]

what????

[maiden meteor]

Silksong itself is indication enough for me

[eager marsh]

i believe you 100% that he exists

[spare pendant]

that doesn't follow

silksong doesnt contradict the idea

[obsidian quail]

u can just look at silksong to hollow knight like Nier to Drakengard

[spare pendant]

the world keeps going after every ending, regardless of which one. silksong is just what happens in the world after a specific ending

[obsidian quail]

it’s a possible timeline spin off

[solid elk]

Tbh, I do not care what is Canon. I care what leads to Silksong and beyond that we actually interact with.

[plain coral]

Godhome everbloom ending i think

[obsidian quail]

i want to go back in the past and see wtf the Ancient Civilization were about

[maiden meteor]

I just think “alternate timeline” thing is way lamer than just certain endings being explicitly more likely

[spare pendant]

team cherry could release another game that takes place after sealed siblings and it wouldn't contradict silksong

[quartz flicker]

which one lol

[obsidian quail]

no one knows what happened to them so let’s play as a bug that soloed them

[obsidian quail]

there’s only one, the Void civilization

[spare pendant]

because timeline theory is a boring way of conceptualizing it. they never said anything about timelines

[plain coral]

I just wanna solo sum more gods we only got 3 god bosses ain't enough

[solid elk]

Sealed Siblings is actually the worst ending though, as it means Silksong never happened in that timeline, which means an alternative timeline of ours has 2025 without Silksong

[spare pendant]

we got zoteboat instead

[vague jasper]

Yes I would be fine with that stuff too

[plain coral]

Maybe they have Pablo instead

[vague jasper]

I would also be happy to see a returning character in the dlc

[plain coral]

The knight

Or the hollow knight

[vague jasper]

We already saw The knight

[solid elk]

The returning character is Cloth, who didn't die to the Traitor Lord

[plain coral]

When ?

[vague jasper]

Another appearance of him is highly unlikely

[plain coral]

Nah i would love that

[vague jasper]

She died in my playthrough

[plain coral]

Pure vessel was so tuff

[quartz flicker]

and then it's just Elderbug

[solid elk]

Or Leg Eater, who was turned down by Divine and hangs out with Styx as a pair of simps

[vague jasper]

In the True ending, I hope that's not a spoiler for you

[plain coral]

Wanna see more of this little guy to

[vague jasper]

That's the knight

[plain coral]

Yeee wanna see more of him not just sum aura farm

[quartz flicker]

or, like, those hot spring bugs

[solid elk]

Them being an individual form and not a mass of the Lord of Shades is something

[plain coral]

Wanna use his godlike powers or even fight him

[solid elk]

I don't want to fight our brother. Let's be friends

[vague jasper]

Hornet would not win a fight against shade lord

[tawdry flare]

hornet is like half-hallucinating during this

[plain coral]

I think those are 2 different beings bcs the knight couldn't control himself when the void tried to kill hornet

[solid elk]

Lord of Shades has yet to shown itself as a threat. They could be kind

[tawdry flare]

TK flashes into the shade lord for a few frames so it's implied to be after DNM and ETV

[vague jasper]

It is a threat

[solid elk]

Are those two endings mutually exclusive?

[plain coral]

Dk how to explain that but the knight didn't controlled the tentacles who tried to kill hornet he "killed" them instead

[solid elk]

Not confirmed yet

[vague jasper]

Only with the knight' resistance did the void stop

[tawdry flare]

Shade Lord is just the Knight as a Higher Being basically

[vague jasper]

Shade lord is not just the knight

[sinful nimbus]

It is

[tawdry flare]

It is

[maiden meteor]

I think the Knight didn’t fully form into Shade Lord

[vague jasper]

More like a hive mind

[sinful nimbus]

Controlled by The Knight with Void Heart yes

[maiden meteor]

probably because of everbloom explosion

[tawdry flare]

No, it's just the Knight

[solid elk]

Shade Lord also included all the Shades, including the Hollow Knight, right?

[maiden meteor]

nope

[obsidian quail]

it’s the Knight Shade but on steroids

[maiden meteor]

Hollow Knight is still Hollow Knight

[plain coral]

Rq if the shade lord and the knight are the same person why did the void tried to kill hornet ?

[maiden meteor]

idk about other Siblings tho

[solid elk]

Wait, I forgot the Hollow Knoght was still around to face Hornet at the end

[obsidian quail]

sigh

[whole hawk]

Need that greyroot dlc

[vague jasper]

Becuz the knight is a part of it

[tawdry flare]

The Knight seems to have a limited range of control over the Void

[maiden meteor]

Because Shade Lord isn’t omnipotent

[vague jasper]

Not completely it

[sinful nimbus]

TC can't write well

[timber pond]

The shades can probably all become shade lord under controlled of the knight whenever they want, the animation that's used for deflecting the void tendrils in the last cutscene is the shade lords claws

[plain coral]

Ye im a dumb guy

[obsidian quail]

i wish they didn’t do that

[obsidian quail]

no ur not dumb, UR ASKING THE RIGHT QUESTIONS

[solid elk]

Remember that the Shade Lord is also the PK's fault, as he dropped his babies into Shadow Chernobyl

[obsidian quail]

IT SHOULDNT BE LIKE THAT

[sinful nimbus]

Shade Lord is the one that saves hornet from the void tendrils

[vague jasper]

It's like you as a person having multiple personalities and one personality resisting to save hornet

[solid elk]

Everything wrong in the world can be traced back to the Pale King

[sinful nimbus]

As for why the void tendrils are malicious who knows TC is stupid and they retconned a bunch of stuff

[plain coral]

Tough it was sum dumb question

[spare pendant]

void tendrils lash out at anything nearby

[sinful nimbus]

They shouldn't after being unified

[spare pendant]

the void consumes all nearby soul

[plain coral]

Wdym a part ? Why did he become the shade lord in the godhome ending then ?

[timber pond]

Void is power without unity unless shade lord is near

[vague jasper]

It is never stated that the knight is completely the shade lord

[solid elk]

They are literally trying to kill anything with soul as a force of nature, aren't they?

[maiden meteor]

I think it’s more that when shade lord doesn’t explicitly control void it just does own thing

[sinful nimbus]

Godseeker identifies them as the same person

[green yoke]

I mean, don't go calling them stupid just because you don't like the direction they took with the story after having a bunch of time to mull it over

[maiden meteor]

which is to attack anything with soul

[vague jasper]

All the vessels combined make shade lord, giving the void focus

[solid elk]

Wasn't the entire Abyss united in the Embrace the Void ending?

[plain coral]

So why did he kill the tentacles that tried to kill hornet instead of controlling them ?

[solid elk]

The achievement said so, I think

[sinful nimbus]

I don't like the direction they took with the story because its stupid and that makes them bad writers by proxy

[vague jasper]

Becuz they are

All the vessels make up shade lord

[maiden meteor]

also Godseekers feeding Knight faith steroids

[green yoke]

I wasn't aware you were the arbiter of such things, my apologies

[spare pendant]

same thing, the tendrils are just void, they don't actually die

[solid elk]

All vessels except the Hollow Knight, which is out and free

[plain coral]

Seems Logic knowing that the hollow knight transforms into sum void being to

[sinful nimbus]

You weren't aware that I was the arbiter of my own opinions?

[vague jasper]

Yes

[timber pond]

The abyss in hallownest mabye. If the abyss spans the entire world and instinctively seeks out and consums soul, void heart can only control what is "near" sorta like how pale king has a range on his beacon that is the span of hallownest.

[plain coral]

Ye but he could just control them why did he kill them instead

[green yoke]

You keep phrasing your opinions like facts, is the thing

[spare pendant]

because it's the same thing with void

[vague jasper]

It is the knight tho that unites all the vessels to become shade lord so you can call him the leading personality I think

[sinful nimbus]

Statements about the quality of a work of fiction are always implied to be subjective because that's how subjectivity and conversations work

[vague jasper]

But he is not completely shade lord

[maiden meteor]

It looks like tendrils almost got Hornet when Knight appeared, so there was no guarantee it could stop them in time

[solid elk]

The Hollow Knight being free just means that we get a 3rd game with our big brother (little brother?)

[spare pendant]

bad writer is implied to be based on intersubjective standards, preference is not

[sinful nimbus]

No its not

[timber pond]

Yeah that would be sick. Him in the Steel city where the masters are

[spare pendant]

read a book man idk

[sinful nimbus]

"Bad" is a subjective term that is my own opinion

[obsidian quail]

The Knight should not have to slice the void tendrils, it should be able to just stop it

[sinful nimbus]

Also multiple people agree with me that the story is bad so

[vague jasper]

Who would be the next protagonist

[spare pendant]

"x is a bad writer" is normally an intersubjective statement

[obsidian quail]

dude there’s an invisible “i think” before everything she says it’s clearly an opinion

[sacred heath]

do you think the wisp gardens above Greymoore have any connection to the Grimm Troupe?

[solid elk]

Is the Steel City actually confirmed to exist or is it just a fan term?

[spare pendant]

multiple people also think that's stupid

[quartz flicker]

It's possible that the unification of the Void has faded, and the Knight now mostly just has influence over the other Vessels.

[vague jasper]

Isn't Hollow knight like a bit too big in size for a metroidvania

[plain coral]

Im tk fused with it it's like stopping ur hand from hitting someone u just can bcs u have complete control of it uk

[obsidian quail]

WE WANT BIGGER

[vague jasper]

You'd have to make very large rooms for him

And big enemies

[timber pond]

It's a place that one of the cages in the cradle describes, might be where hornet was captured.

[plain coral]

Depends on the perspective

[vague jasper]

Not everything is big in Hollow knight

[sinful nimbus]

My point is that the majority opinion does not influence subjective quality

[solid elk]

No, but I also think that Trobbio has a connection to the Troupe due to also being a queer coded red flaming bug, so I am not the best judge

[sinful nimbus]

That's how opinions work.

[vague jasper]

Small characters work in this world as protagonists

[half dirge]

Is the steel soul ending even a thing?

[green yoke]

This is a very subjective statement phrased as objective.

You don't like the story (opinion) BECAUSE it's stupid (questionable intent) and that makes them stupid by proxy (assertion)

[vague jasper]

So far most bugs are smaller

[sacred heath]

multiple people also agree that the earth is flat, or that megalodon is alive
doesnt make them right

[lean temple]

She was captured from Hallownest. The City of Steel is where they captured another part Weaver

[obsidian quail]

how does trobbio have any similarity beyond an initial color scheme

[full swan]

hey so i just did the second needle upgrade and hornet said that ||the hive is long dead or something|| does that mean a signifigant amount of time has passed since hk or was it already in hk

[sinful nimbus]

See my statement about how qualitative assertions are already implied to be subjective

[sinful nimbus]

Congrats you got my point

[plain coral]

Most bugs but u forgot that the pale king was sum big ahh sh before

[solid elk]

The great gay energy

[lean temple]

Appeal to popularity

[maiden meteor]

Knight likely has to want to control void, and when it doesn’t void just does own thing

[sinful nimbus]

Congrats you got my point

[sacred heath]

homosexual theater kid

[obsidian quail]

this is a false equivalence fallacy though

[green yoke]

Implication doesn't work in a format without any means to gauge intent

[plain coral]

Great argument

[vague jasper]

Yeah but you can't make a Hollow knight game based on big wyrm PK

[obsidian quail]

those are not at all the same

[timber pond]

Depends on if we consider hornet quarter or half weaver. But ,it dosent matter anyway, confirming it exists is interesting enough.

[sinful nimbus]

If you assume I'm a rational person (which is how meaningful discussion takes place) you can deduce that I'm aware of how subjectivity works

[spare pendant]

"this is a false equivalence" is not rly how you should object to a false equivalence

[vague jasper]

Grimme has flare, not gay energy

[lean temple]

The PK isn't a normal bug. He's a god

[vague jasper]

Finesse

[solid elk]

He has Tumblr queer icon energy, so he counts

[vague jasper]

A game based on Hollow knight wouldn't work in my opinion becuz of his size

[sacred heath]

I’m just trying to make the point that
“just because multiple people agree with you on a point doesnt mean that point is correct or even well-founded”
-# probably could have used some better examples but those were the first things I thought of

[vague jasper]

You could make a prequel with small Hollow knight tho

[full swan]

considering the fight a performance? idk

[lean temple]

She's half. They all call her half.

[solid elk]

What kind of game?

[maiden meteor]

Also I don’t really think Knight can instantly confirm person that falls in void and has to be there semi-physically

[vague jasper]

Someone said a sequel with Hollow knight would be great

[plain coral]

U cant but u can make a bigger kingdom like pharloom for hornet for it to be playable hornet was to big for hallownest so they just created a new place

[obsidian quail]

what? disagreeing with an actual fact is different than subjective judgement of something

[sinful nimbus]

I agree with this, my point is that "intersubjective standards" (Which is word salad) don't influence subjectivity

[solid elk]

I mean....it could. Idk if Team Cherry wants to spend another decade on this series when they literally said they have so many games they wanna make

[spare pendant]

yes but not meaningfully so to their point

[vague jasper]

It'd have to be one large kingdom, and hornet isn't that much bigger from the knight

[spare pendant]

"you should assume i understand subjectivity" and "this is word salad" lmao

[obsidian quail]

one is something u can actually have an opinion on and the other isn’t, ur trying too hard