Do you want to see more of S.H.I.E.L.D.?

[worn goblet]

Which cast would you like to see return most?

[golden niche]

It's honestly kinda surprising how little SHIELD was actually used in the MCU

[warped pollen]

The OGs

[toxic axle]

Same

[pallid pollen]

Coulsen...

[bleak talon]

Skibidi

[fringe matrix]

Because cool 👍

[robust wraith]

i need to finish aos first

[worn shell]

quality in story sorta drops off but it's a really fun watch overall yk

[turbid apex]

I wanna see my boy fitz again

And Big Mack

[soft nimbus]

No

[proud cloud]

same

[jolly hamlet]

I want Maria back 😭

[elder vector]

No. Secret Invasion ruined both SHIELD being interesting and Fury

[languid zinc]

even though they weren't my absolute most favourite of the bunch, i'd love to see more adventures with Mack, Yo-Yo, Piper, and Davis

everybody else (aside from Daisy + co) have a far more settled-down life

[limpid imp]

AGENTS OF SHIELDD

I want them ALL to return

[bright saffron]

Fr

[elder basin]

100%

[stray ore]

All of them

[muted blaze]

i miss fitzsimmons

[hybrid gulch]

I feel like this is a good way to bring Old Man Cap back

[opaque timber]

I don't think so... With present Marvel situation they won't do that

Cap character has been one of the finest characters and they won't disturb that character. Chris Evans mentioned that too..

[drowsy bronze]

I love AOS so I wish they’d done more with that cast other than just the show. I know it was 7 seasons but I feel like they sort of deserved more from the MCU, even though it technically wasn’t “canon” because they went to another timeline, but because of what’s been introduced in the recent mcu movies, isn’t it technically canon now?

[hybrid gulch]

I absolutely love Cap and respect that, but they need to stop pretending like Steve is dead.

[opaque timber]

They mentioned Steve after end game in fatws that people speculating that he is on the moon. But they haven't neither he's dead nor he's alive.

[elder vector]

They should’ve started FATWS off with Steve Rogers’ funeral

[elder vector]

I kinda hate the moon stuff TBH. They’ve done absolutely nothing with that and I know this was something the higher-ups pushed onto the FATWS director because they didn’t want to commit to him being either dead or alive but it sucks

Really should’ve started FATWS off with Steve Rogers’ funeral making Cap America’s legacy weigh that more heavily on Falcon and Bucky

[languid zinc]

lmao I never interpreted the moon stuff as anything more than an in-universe conspiracy

It's literally the same kind of reaction that people would make irl if a very public figure is announced dead with no further details

People are gonna start theorizing shit and some people are gonna start believing it and suddenly you have a conspiracy

I didn't see that moon comment as anything more than that

[hybrid gulch]

Same here bro

[elder vector]

I know that and I think that’s what the creators are going for. But what I’m saying is that they probably would have actually said he was dead and began the show on his funeral if they weren’t prohibited from doing that

[hybrid gulch]

Steve shouldn’t die though

He can be talked about

[elder vector]

Dead people are talked about too

Do you know how many Hitler memes there are on the internet?

Do you know how many people still say “RIP Chadwick” when talking about Black Panther?

[languid zinc]

I mean honestly that's not the creators' faults, it's the fault of the whole subsection of the internet who reads so deeply into everything that they don't realise that not everything is supposed to hint towards something

[opaque timber]

True... It's jst a conspiracy even in the mcu only people believe that no one correctly knows nothing and they just left it with ambiguity

[languid zinc]

Imo they probably should have talked about his funeral to make it more clear, but like they really didn't need to in order to tell their story

And again anybody believing that Steve's actually on the moon based on that one off-handed comment really didn't get the joke

[elder vector]

I say it’s the fault of the higher-ups who didn’t allow them to say that he was dead. They caused this.

[opaque timber]

The similar thing is after Steve woke up, we don't know what happened to Peggy but they did show it in the next movies.
She's someone who showed a way through Steve's situational trouble at that moment.
May be they will use him as a background person who guides falcon through his tough time being captain America.

[elder vector]

Again the moon thing was probably the furthest they could go in-terms of addressing Steve’s whereabouts because they didn’t want to confirm him being dead or alive. They wanted it ambiguous in-case Chris Evans ever decided to return as Old Man Cap

[elder vector]

”May be they will use him as a background person who guides falcon through his tough time being captain America.” I would be totally down for that and not just for Falcon but for the New Avengers as a whole. He could be like an adviser/mentor/guy-in-the-chair figure for them. But my problem is that you have it one way or the other, don’t say “He might be on the moon but he might also not be on the moon” and move on. That shit’s annoying, pick a lane

[opaque timber]

He can be mentor for the successor he chose.....
What I say is that iron man brings spider man to the table and mentors him. He didn't mentor every young person or new person in the team. Likewise Steve who chose falcon to be his successor helps him not lose who he is rather than meeting everyone's expectations.
If he's plays the guy-in-the-chair figure it doesn't stands for Steve.
who knows
They might never touch Steve's character ever.......
Ambiguity.....

[elder vector]

They might never touch Steve’s character ever. Ambiguity.

It’ll just be one of the many other things in Phase 4 & 5 that was introduced and immediately forgotten

[languid zinc]

I imagine that a lot of these types of things aren't actually forgotten

It's just that from a storytelling perspective, they don't see much point in clarifying a lot of it

[elder vector]

That’s even worse

[languid zinc]

Considering clarifying it doesn't really do much for the character's story nor the story that they'd be trying to wedge it into

[elder vector]

Steve being alive or not doesn’t matter to his story. Cool…

[languid zinc]

For who? Steve's story is already complete, it doesn't matter if he's dead or retired or whatever else because his story is done and finished

[elder vector]

If he’s alive, it shouldn’t be the end. And if he’s dead there should be an open acknowledgement of it

[languid zinc]

Whatever they might choose to mention will impact his story but considering his story arc was already completed in Endgame, it's not going to contribute any significantly positive addition to his story

I think what they've done is that his story was the end and it doesn't matter what he does later because he's already reached his conclusion with his involvement in these stories

Acknowledgement would be nice but I can't see the necessity of it

The point is that he's reached his conclusive end within these stories

[opaque timber]

Absolutely true 💯. Good point☝️

[elder vector]

Iron Man 3 was written to be a conclusive end to Iron Man’s character in-case RDJ didn’t sign on for more movies. By that logic is it now a mistake that Iron Man came back for AoU, Civil War, Homecoming, Infinity War and Endgame?

[elder vector]

No. Not a good point. Character’s stories can be concluded but that doesn’t mean it can’t ever be continued in any meaningful ways

[languid zinc]

Hardly a mistake, just simply that if he didn't return there wouldn't have been any issues

I don't feel like Steve needs to be given an unambiguous future at the moment

They can simply just never bring him back and there's really no problem because his story is complete

And they still leave the door open for him to return but not with any promise of it

But like they don't need to make a decision now and making a decision now isn't going to improve his conclusion in Endgame in any much manner

[elder vector]

It isn’t going to affect him in Endgame but it’s going to effect lots of future projects badly. It already has.

[languid zinc]

I really don't see how it has

There has been absolutely zero indication of his presence affecting any of the stories

[elder vector]

Because if he’s alive he should have been given something to say about Falcon giving up the shield or Bucky’s guilt about being the Winter Soldier or Falcon reclaiming the shield by the end of the series and if he’s dead lots of missed opportunities for both Falcon and Bucky to talk about that

[languid zinc]

I mean that would have been a great opportunity to have him there

But then again was he even needed

[elder vector]

Yes he absolutely was

[languid zinc]

It isn't his story and he's already left his legacy

[elder vector]

The actor left

The character is part of the universe

And still is part of the universe

[languid zinc]

Well yes clearly he did

But it wasn't Steve's story anymore, it was Sam's

And there was definitely a place for Steve to continue being a part of it

But I didn't ever feel like Sam was needing Steve to tell his own story

[elder vector]

Yes and Steve has a lot that he should’ve contributed to that story

[languid zinc]

could've, not should've

[elder vector]

Steve wouldn’t be telling his own story. He would’ve been helping Sam’s

[elder vector]

No should’ve. Definitely should’ve

Steve not being there for either of his friends when they needed him damages his character

[languid zinc]

Sorry I didn't word that right - I didn't feel like Sam was needing Steve for Sam to tell his own (independent) story

[opaque timber]

Why does sam and Steve get together in the first place it's their way of thinking that Steve saw himself in falcon so why does falcon need Steve for him to correct
That's what FATWS does right
Showing what falcon and bucky are without Steve.

[languid zinc]

That's a fair point, but I thought I remember the whole point of TFATWS was Sam and Bucky growing out of Steve's shadow and figuring out who they can be without always depending on Steve

[elder vector]

But the entire story revolves around Steve’s legacy and Sam’s doubts about being able to carry that legacy. Don’t you think Steve should have a say in helping encourage Sam that he’s worthy?

[languid zinc]

Steve already did, in Endgame?

[opaque timber]

He didn't leave them in crisis
He gave him a responsibility to lead the way

[elder vector]

And it didn’t work. Well tried once, it’s about time he abandoned them

[elder vector]

And because of that he shouldn’t help them in any way anymore even though something clearly went wrong. If they fail, they fail

[languid zinc]

I do get your point, there's definitely a place for Steve within that story

But if Steve was present, they'd be telling a rather different story, because Sam then isn't independently undergoing his own character development if Steve is just always going to hold his hand the whole way through

[elder vector]

He’s not. He’s has to be there when they need him. It’ll still be about Sam taking on the shield and independently becoming Captain America. Just don’t make Steve an asshole who abandoned his friends

[languid zinc]

Honestly really still did not get that impression that Steve's being "an asshole who abandoned his friends" - it feels almost the same as asking why other Avengers et al aren't present to help their friends in other stories, it's just simply that he can't be present so he's not involved

It would really only feel like a betrayal to the character if it was an express intention that Steve is now avoiding them

In the show it seems pretty clear that both Sam and Bucky have made peace with that Steve isn't able to be present for them anymore

[elder vector]

In analogy terms, imagine a student who had tutoring sessions and because of that by the end of the semester they succeeded with flying colors and got honors. That’s still their achievement. Just because Steve would try to help Sam doesn’t mean that Sam doesn’t earn the title of Captain America

[elder vector]

Okay. Why can’t he be present?

Is he dead? They don’t say he is

Is he doing something? They don’t say he is and if he is wtf could be more important than his best friends?

[languid zinc]

From the siloed perspective of the story of TFATWS, there's really no reason why they need to explain it

[elder vector]

But there is though

He impacts this story majorly

[languid zinc]

I feel like we've just circled back to the beginning of our discussion

[elder vector]

We have because you still don’t understand that Steve’s whereabouts is very important to this story. Him being here changes the events drastically and him being absent creates a giant rift that he should’ve been able to help fix

And plus him not being here creates damages to his character for not caring enough to help his best friends

It’s like Doctor Strange not being in Wandavision but much worse

[languid zinc]

I understand what you're saying but I just simply don't agree that the story is lost without it

[elder vector]

…
Then I think we’re done

Waiter! Check!

[languid zinc]

And when juggling characters like these, I don't feel like ignorance towards something like Steve's presence is irrevocable damage to his character (compared to intentionally pushing for these ideas)

[elder vector]

It’s irrevocable in the sense that there will always be that stain there. Of course you can always add more information (in-this-case squares) in the future to help draw attention away from the stain but it’ll always be there because of their unwillingness to commit to what happened to Steve

[cosmic mantle]

timothy3156 has been timed out for 2m
Reason: Similar-Messages Spam

timothy3156 | 684289982860623980

[elder vector]

Dammit message editing. Noted.

[languid zinc]

Sorry, not sure how to get the bot to differentiate between frequent edits and just sending multiple messages

[autumn swan]

Bobbi, Hunter and Mack.

[lusty sinew]

Who the f voted for no you don't want more context

[jovial spindle]

Coulson

[whole mulch]

I think it would be very interesting to see more S.H.I.E.l.D story lines.

[turbid apex]

they should make AoS canon

dont know how that would work with Bobbi being Clints husband but oh well

[languid zinc]

Bobbi's with Hunter in the show

The Bobbi x Clint thing is only in the films

[turbid apex]

Bobbi x Clint was revealed in the Hawkeye show

Laura's real name is Bobbi

[languid zinc]

That... what?

No it's not that

Laura Barton's SHIELD codename is Agent 19, which was Bobbi's in the comics

But Bobbi in AOS is never referred to as Agent 19, only as Mockinbird

But Laura's name isn't Bobbi

[turbid apex]

oh alright

[hybrid gulch]

I think it’s probably time to just let SHIELD die

There’s too many organizations doing exactly what they did in the MCU

[bright saffron]

Bring back Coleson!