#Rebalance Drop Pool For Grade System(Stop Diluting Content Reward Chests)

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

granite cipher
#

I feel the drop pools are insanely more diluted than I think is worth playing for. We get lucky every once in a while, but I think focusing on specific pieces of content for the gear we want would actually help release the diluted drop pools and allow for a more easily followable route. My suggestions would be the following, and I wouldnt mind anyone else coming in and perhaps filling in the holes, or arranging the idea to be better.

AHMs

  • Celtic: Common ~ Exquisite
  • Revenant: Common ~ Fine

Tech Normal

  • Celtic: Masterwork
  • Perseus: Common ~ Sturdy
  • Revenant: Exquisite ~ Masterwork
  • Demolition: Common ~ Sturdy

Tech Hard

  • Perseus: Fine ~ Masterwork
  • Demolition: Fine ~ Masterwork
    ~~Give some of the Temptation materials to Tech Hards to offload the drop pool and make room for Demo. ~~

Temptation's Path

  • Nightinger: Common ~ Sturdy
    -~~ Ruin: Common ~ Sturdy~~

  • Demolition: Exquisite

  • Remove Celtic and Pers Weapons from pool.

Crom Basic

  • Nightbringer: Common ~ Fine

  • Ruin: Common ~ Fine

  • Remove Celtic and Pers Weapons from pool.

Glenn Basic

  • Nightbringer Common ~ Fine

  • Ruin Common ~ Fine

  • Remove Celtic and Pers Weapons from pool.

Crom Normal

  • Nightbringer Fine ~ Masterwork

  • Ruin Common ~ Fine

  • Remove Celtic and Pers Weapons from pool.

Glenn Normal

  • Ruin: Fine ~ Masterwork
    -~~ Nightbringer: Common ~ Fine~~

  • Remove Celtic and Pers Weapons from pool.

Glenn HM

  • Ruin: Exquisite ~ Masterwork

  • Nightbringer: Common ~ Fine

  • Remove Celtic and Pers Weapons from pool.

If AHMs could be more specific in terms of which dungeons receive which weapons/armor that would be neat too. Ciar, Rundal, and Alby, would further diversify, and further increase power in the loot table.

Furthermore, armors can also be spread between the reintroduction of Tech hards, and if Theta should ever come back(RIP) then we can again, take some of the weight off of other content so the drop pools are not so diluted. Perhaps even just allowing only Ruin to be locked behind Theta. Or at least higher Grade Ruin locked behind Theta. Materials could still drop in other content for Crafting but, idk. I'd be just thinking out loud if I continue.

Imagine just going for one item and never getting it or seeing it. =/ Thats what we have now.

granite cipher
#

Rebalance Drop Pool For Grade System(Stop Diluting Content Reward Chests)

pale hornet
#

You want them to nerf rabbie phantasm vhm drops?

granite cipher
# pale hornet You want them to nerf rabbie phantasm vhm drops?

Not necessarily.

I left the idea vague as I do see a need to disperse drops between content. We are in a weird place where yes, they grant the content purpose with the drops included as we see it now... but we have a diluted and bloated drop pool in literally all content.

They either have not enough content or not enough worthwhile things to go for in content. Techs are dead right now unless you specifically want something that techs provide.

I am not saying remove Corrupted Apostle Leather, or passes, etc from Temptation, but there has got to be a reason to implement Tech hards again, and a drop pool that makes sense to run for should they do so.

Example: Before we had in Crom just NB mats and enchants. After the update we added Ruin Mats + [(14 Talent's weapons × amount of weapon series) x amount of grades each weapon series provides] + More enchants

Other content has experienced similar bloating.

As the post suggested, if anyone else has ideas to help undilute the drop pool as the prompt above has started in on, I am all ears. This isn't a fully fleshed out idea. How would you go about reimplementing Tech Hards and what drops would go into it? What can you do to remove bloat in Temptation and keep its worth and what can you give Tech hards to give it worth? Same with Tech normals.

cinder fulcrum
#

I could contribute but I am kind of confused about the premise.

" I think focusing on specific pieces of content for the gear we want would actually help release the diluted drop pools and allow for a more easily followable route. "

Most useful weapons are to my knowledge made at the masterwork grade by putting together pieces acquired via content or the market. If so-and-so wants to make a NB Cylinder instead of NB Dual Guns, besides the Condensed Fragments it's simply possible to use the materials the Guns would use if we were making that to make the Cylinders instead. The CB armor sets share many of their materials too.

And, anything that's not on here but can be bought or sold on the market such as Enchant/Set Effect Scrolls, can be targeted by simply acquiring an amount of gold that is equivalent to their market value and then buying it.

EDIT: If the concern is something along the lines of "Can I NOT get a lance drop when I am playing an Elf and have zero interest in Lances at all?" that's another story.

granite cipher
cinder fulcrum
#

You might want to think this through a bit more. Ciar dropping Mage gear is a somewhat ambiguous concept because Magic encompasses two Arcana, HS and DD. Someone could run Alby for a staff and get a healing wand. Similarly, making Melee gear drop in Alby could mean someone playing an EK could get a Lance that they do not have a use for. These are fairly minor things in and of themselves but considering other Arcanas such as Forbidden Alchemist may not have to do any sharing if they have a dedicated gearing space....

"Why do I have to do a 50/50 on my drops in Ciar while someone playing Fury Fighter ALWAYS gets knuckles in Fiodh?" would conceivably be an issue to a player, no? I don't see the point in causing another problem trying to fix a problem.

brittle cradle
#

I completely agree. Like, someone running Crom has no need for Celtic gear. It's a "trash" drop.
There really isn't much use for the refined crystal shards either that you get from disassembling equipment. I haven't touched it, the items there are basically useless.

granite cipher
# cinder fulcrum You might want to think this through a bit more. Ciar dropping Mage gear is a so...

The questions are not to be taken literally or at face value. They are a concept that I am expressing that I feel needs to happen in order to reduce drop pool bloat.

To address your concerns...

Lets grant that Lance and Swords drop respectively in Alby. All Celtic of Course... And lets Grant that Knuckles and Bow/Cross Bow also drop in Alby as well. Removing Staves, Control bars, etc etc fromt he loot table greatly increases your chances of finding the weapon you want in Alby, specifically. Want a Sword? The likeliness you will run into a sword greatly increases.

Go to Ciar for Mage gear? A couple wands... A couple Staves... And lets also grant Scythe, and Cylinders. Having the Melee drop table, and Control Bars removed from the Loot table greatly increases the chance with a run in with the gear you want to get.

Go to Rundal? Control Bars, Shuriken, and Dual Guns. Again, Focused drop table.

What you are implying is that it is worse to have Lance, and Swords be the only drops int he loot table, when I am saying that having EVERYTHING in the loot table is actually taking away from the messaging we are getting.

"Get everyone to end game"

So why are we making this more difficult to find the gear through drops than it needs to be?

Consider, this has mostly to do with the fact they have these weapons running in AHMs and I am using AHMs only to suggest with. I wouldnt take this to Fiodh, or Barri where there are no AHMs to run, and where these weapon series do not exist as drops.

Techs have Celtic tier weapons in them as well... that should be removed, unless its high Grade. Masterwork chests open by the way, FYI. You can get a Masterwork weapon as a chest drop but it's bonus damage is weaker than crafted.

Crom has Perseus and Celtic as well as Glenn. Why?

As @brittle cradle pointed out, we dont need Refined Crystal Shards beyond mor Shineseekers. Once you get a Void Robe + a Diadem, you are done with Shine seeker beyond passively running for Enchant + Scrolls.

Regardless of this discussion, which actually emboldens the idea, AHMs are ran for profit through BME's and that is something that will not change. So slecting which AHM you run for which gear you want seems reasonable to me.

AHMs = Celtic/Revenant

Techs = Perseus/Demo

Crom/Glenn = NB/Ruin

Shineseeker can be as is, its meant to be a huge Pool

cinder fulcrum
# granite cipher The questions are not to be taken literally or at face value. They are a concept...

"What you are implying is that it is worse to have Lance, and Swords be the only drops int he loot table" Show me where it says that. What I have simply argued is that if this isn't sufficiently though out, that in your example of AHMs and drops that there's the potential for unfairness if the implementation of your ideas fails to heed certain considerations that I think are apparent and reasonable enough to account for. I can't really contribute to a discussion if no one's actually sure what mechanism they are trying to design, what they are willing to mess with in that process and the things they cannot allow.

granite cipher
pale hornet
ashen silo
#

I think something like this would be great. I'm already considering giving up on grinding for gear because it feels so bad... Grinding doesn't feel fun.

mossy vault
#

idk whats so difficult to understand about this.

the current drop pool for gear is poorly thought through. you got all weapons types, all seires and all gear sets in the same pool for all content that drops them.

the chances of getting something you want are much lower.

what op is trying to say is separating them (like ehcostones), where a certain content (like echo stone color) only drops certain types of gear (like echostone effect roll of that color).

so when you do a certain content, you get rewards from a much smaller pool thus increasing the chances of getting something useful. it doesnt affect material drop yet as they are probs seperate pools

pale hornet
#

I don't know if you were responding to my message, but if you were that's irrelevant to my questions. OP suggested that phantasm vhm should only drop common to sturdy ruin and nb weapons when it currently drops common to exquisite weapons. That is strictly and in the most literal sense a nerf. If you were just saying that to others, I'm not disagreeing with changing pools as much as I am questioning nerfing the only content that's spammable.

granite cipher
# pale hornet I don't know if you were responding to my message, but if you were that's irrele...

Yes, in that sense its a nerf.

Why when Crom is arguably more difficult, put the same level of gear in Temptation where it is easier?

Aren't we trying to funnel people through Crom?

Crom is for NB and Ruin

Glenn is for NB and Ruin

Shineseeker has NB and Ruin

Why is Temptation also for NB?

I question the very essence of this. Why not lower the gear grades in Temptation to incentivize Crom and Glenn? Or is the messaging to make Crom and Glenn obsolete?

I.e. Most people with VIP and many characters will find it more time efficient to run Temptation than Crom. Eventually, we could argue that Crom should be dead content for those seeking NB, as Temptation is literally way easier, and more cost effective mats for sale.

Its like saying Techs vs AHM except in this case, both are viable for profit.

At the end of the day, lowering Temptation seems reasonable and at worst it pushes people to do the grade up system anyways.

What is Temptation? Mid game? What is Crom? Mid game?

Why Mid game content with the same rewards? Why is one limited by entry and the other limited to how many characters you have and your VIP status?

Is Temptation the P2W dungeon?

I have more questions than answers for this.

Crom and Glenn seem to be what we funnel players toward... if we want to keep that... we shouldn't add another thing to diminish the hunt from those places if that is the intent.

If the intent is to use Temptation Solely for NB then my b on that.

I will still stand on that I don't agree with the drop pool situation, and I dont agree with how they are handling where they are funneling players. Not 100% anyways. I think Temptation is great, but balancing the game would be better, and without removing the Charm for running Temptation as well.

I did ask for expansion of my idea, do you have a way you can improve the idea?

pale hornet
#

crom basic is below temptation's path in difficulty, tempation path only goes up to exquisite and crom normal goes up to master tier. You'd be fine putting crom basic at the Fine tier of quality if you were trying to lower accessibility. It doesn't make crom and glenn obsolete as Crom normals give 600k checks, doesn't cost 200k to enter, give crom mats and ruin mats, and let you get up to master tier drops. Glenn gives enchants, 1m checks and master tier drops. Temptation doesn't replace those, the rewards are noticably worse. You're coping for erg mats and can't get master tier NB drops like in shineseeker, crom and glenn. It doesn't have Glenn enchants either, the enchants are noticably worse. The erg mats are the main reason to run Phantasm VHM, as well as having content that is actually repeatable.

granite cipher