Fitness/Sport

[smoky needle]

but that's nerd stuff

you are confused with basics

yes

[gilded flume]

tbf my program doesn't follow any basics XD

i do twice a week full body, hour half - 2 hour sessions lol

that throws basics all out the window

[smoky needle]

that can work

if you cover all the basics

[gilded flume]

its been working for me :3

ima ride the program until i hit 100kg 3x5 on bench

[smoky needle]

surplus, protein, exercise

[gilded flume]

without outrageous bulking

[smoky needle]

for exercise you want intesity, frequency, volume

if you hit all these, you good

[gilded flume]

like i feel like i can hit it much sooner if i didnt mind being obese for a bit

[smoky needle]

don't be obese, it's bad, and doesn't make you stronger

[gilded flume]

but i do because being obese for jsut a 100kg bench is not worth it

[smoky needle]

just be at a small surplus, and slowly gain muscle

[gilded flume]

theres this guy benching 70kg with a massive belly and im left thinking why

[smoky needle]

fatness doesn't help

you can be strong or weak fat person

on average you are slightly stronger in absolute terms, simply because you have to carry a lot of weight, which is like exercise

but on relative basis, pound per pound, you are massively weaker

and quality of your muscles is weaker

[gilded flume]

being fat or even higher weight, definitely helps with moving weight

otherwise powerlifting weight classes would have the same values and distribution of lifts

[smoky needle]

it's not fat that makes them heavy/strong

it's muscle

[gilded flume]

i didnt mean to say powerlifters are fat >.>

[smoky needle]

they are heavier because they have more muscle

[gilded flume]

(well some of them are lol)

[smoky needle]

fat generally doesn't help much in moving weight

because it's fat.. around your belly, it doesn't move shit

[gilded flume]

we can test this theory pretty easily

just cut down 20-30kg and test your 1rm or for me i bulk 20kg-30kg more and test my 1rm

[smoky needle]

it's not even a theory, you would have to propose some mechanistic explanation

how fat tissue around belly/legs helps you with bench

[gilded flume]

the fatter you are the more energy you have and therefore you can move more weight

[smoky needle]

i wish it worked like that

i'm currently at 125kg 😭

[gilded flume]

sure but if current you had less weight then you wouldnt move as much weight

[smoky needle]

you can't use your fat energy like that

[gilded flume]

energy is just energy?

[smoky needle]

nope, fat is not easily accesible energy

[gilded flume]

power = energy * time

[smoky needle]

w..wat

[gilded flume]

fat is byproduct of consuming too much energy (calories)

[smoky needle]

fat is like cold archive in tape, in some basemenet in arizona

[gilded flume]

you necessarily have more energy when youre fat

[smoky needle]

sugar in blood is like ram

burning fat takes hours and days

so being fat doesn't help with having more power or energy

you are just.. more fat

[gilded flume]

you dont agree with this?

[smoky needle]

being properly hydrated, replenishing your glycogen reserves

not exercising on empty stomach

creatine

these things help

[smoky needle]

technically, if burned in the oven

but body is not perfect magical machine

that can trasform fatness into 1rm

takes hours to melt fat into energy

fat is high density, cold archive, very very high latency

it's like hdd

[gilded flume]

would you accept an argument based on correlation?

[smoky needle]

it's just not how bodies work

muscles use energy that is already present in muscle

sugars in blood (30s), and then glycogen reserves (5mins)

glycogen is just high density sugar storage

so that's 1s, 30s, 5mins (roughly)

fat is in hours

because only energy body uses is glucose

and to turn fat into glucose, it's some arcane alchemy called gluconeogenesis

[gilded flume]

yeah all this is going through my monkey brain, i still think the easiest way to prove / disprove would get the same guy and make him bulk/cut and test their 1rm

[smoky needle]

sure

i don't know where your priors are coming from, what convincede you fatness is important factor?

why would fat cells around belly help with benching?

[gilded flume]

because power = energy * time

so force production is determined by energy

and since fat people consume more energy, then they can produce more power

[smoky needle]

yeah, but they spend more energy as well

just to exist

so it's a wash

[gilded flume]

yeah i still need to find something which states that

because from tdee website, fatter people require less tdee so need less energy consumption

[smoky needle]

fatter people require much more tdee than light people

[gilded flume]

and because higher weight classes move more weight than lower weight classes in powerlifting

[smoky needle]

but for same weight, fatter person spends a bit less than same weighted lean person

[gilded flume]

where your definition of tdee is how much calroies you need to consume to maintain a weight?

[smoky needle]

yep

that's how that value is calculated

by definition

it's measure of how much you spend energy daily

if you consume that much, you maintain

[gilded flume]

ok you need to provide me the exact text you've read that states this since youre making an authorative statement

[smoky needle]

it's because they have more muscle, not because they are fatter

[gilded flume]

if it is by definition it should be easy to find the text

[smoky needle]

every, find me one that doesn't state this

[gilded flume]

what, i made no statements >.> im just trying to learn

[smoky needle]

i mean, just google it

TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure, which is the total number of calories your body burns in a day, including all activities and bodily functions. It is calculated by considering your Basal Metabolic Rate (BMR), activity level, and the thermic effect of food.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_expenditure

[gilded flume]

wikipedia hate!

[smoky needle]

but this number is based on our body, not other way around, if that makes sense

all it means is how much energy you spend in a day, total

if you match that with food, mainenance

most precise way to calculate it is not by some formula gesstimate

but by measuring your weight daily, and measuring how much calories you intake

if you maitnain, taht's your tdee

what is important is that you gain weight, if you are trying to build muscle

slowly

that's a sign that you are in surplus, and you are bulding muscle

it's needed to build muscle, in 99.9% cases

[gilded flume]

eric helms says this in his nutrition book

eric helms is phd big boy

[smoky needle]

yeah, he says that it's not true that fat people can't gain muscle effectively

[gilded flume]

and this

[smoky needle]

which is true, fat people can gain muscle

yeah, exactly, he is correct in both

and doesn't contradict anything I said

he states it's for logistical reasons, not for strength/muscle growth reasons

you don't want to get too fat because you will die

so you will have to cut more often

you don't want to be bulking for 2 weeks, and then cutting

because it interrupts your program

he is arguing against getting fat

explicitly states that allowing some small fat gain is 'fine', but for logisitical reasons, not muscle gain reasons

to avoid 2 week bulk, 2 week cut

it should be at least 6 weeks, usually few months

because you should be gaining only 100-200g wekly, 1kg monthly max

and first image just staes that fat people can gain muscle

which is true, all you need is surplus

and protein and resistance training

doesn't matter your bf%, it's irrelevant to muscle gain goal

fat or skinny, you can gain muslce all the same

[gilded flume]

do sumo wrestlers do bulking and cutting cycles?

i thought they just stayed at the same weight year round

[smoky needle]

who knows, I think they are prema bulking until they die

dunno how that sport works really

[gilded flume]

yea me neither lol

[smoky needle]

but they go both max fat, max muscle

[gilded flume]

i thought they just went to godknows xkg and then stayed at that weight for trainning

[smoky needle]

because being as heavy as a truck helps pushing other people

[gilded flume]

and for compeititons

[smoky needle]

because you can just lean on them

with your weight

[gilded flume]

sumo wrestlers also know some judo

[smoky needle]

ye, they are pretty strong too

but dunno, i know conventional strength sports and training styles

like strongman, powerlifter, bodybuilder

[gilded flume]

yeah i thought strongman also have a year round diet

[smoky needle]

ye, they can vibe it out

[gilded flume]

i thought both sumos and strongman did

[smoky needle]

modern strongman are pretty lean

they just look fat

[gilded flume]

but they're also building crazy strong muscles

[smoky needle]

some don't even look fat

nobody really cares about bf% except bodybuilders

on stage

you care about bf% to not die

being fat is terribly bad for health

[gilded flume]

for me i tried to eat like what i thought the sumos and strongman did, maintain a year round diet while being high enough bf% (not high to be obese)

[smoky needle]

you jusst have to eat at a surplus

[gilded flume]

and then since it worked for sumos then why wouldn't it work for me as smol boii

[smoky needle]

i.e you have to gain some small amount of weight over time

it's that simple

[gilded flume]

yea but i dont think sumos do that but not sure

i thought they mainted the same diet with the same high bf%, but still have very strong pound for pound muscle

and well, if they weren't building muscles, then they probably gonna lose an edge

[smoky needle]

poud of pound they are weak

they are strong in absolute terms

[gilded flume]

oh yeah sorry i mean absolute

absolute muscle mass

[smoky needle]

ye, they are just maxing out both strenght and weight

trun a car into a tank

[gilded flume]

so that was my basis for if you're fat you can build muscle

[smoky needle]

so it's immovable

you can build muscle at any size

sumo don't get fat for muscles

they get fat so they can sit on their enemies and crush them :lul

[gilded flume]

ye but still their absolute muscle mass is very high

[smoky needle]

ye, but it's unhealthy and doesn't help with bench

[gilded flume]

i wonder if people has done comparison between super heavyweight powerlifters, strongman and sumos with muscle mass

[smoky needle]

it makes squat and similar much harder actually

imagine having to squat 300kg bw (650pounds)

you wouldn't need any weight

dunno, prob

they are optimizing different things

but that's if you are advanced athlete

programs are same for normal people

[gilded flume]

i understand that, but still i think its an important example that if youre fat and maintain a year long diet you can still build muscle

[smoky needle]

you gain strength, size, power.. all at the same time

yes, I never said otherwise

it's actually my point

bf% doesn't matter

you can build muscle at any fatness

you just need caloric surplus

2500kcal or 8000kcal

[gilded flume]

you kinda did >.>

[smoky needle]

all the same training, same surplus

ah, key there is that if you are maintaining that weight

you can't maintain weight

you can buld muscle while fat

but as a result you will get heavier

your fatness will remain the same, but you will have more muscle

[gilded flume]

i think sumos maintain their weight year round?

[smoky needle]

nobody is mintaining weight

all strength athletes are trying to gain weight

that's what bulking is

(muscle weight)

nobody wants to stay the same, or lose muscle

bulking is gaining muscle, which is also gaining total weight

[gilded flume]

eh if it works for sumos it'll probably work for anyone

just more sport specific

[smoky needle]

they are not maintaining weight tho

all strength athletes are trying to gain weight

by weight usually muscle

they are all bulking at surplus

[gilded flume]

ig we need a pro to ask them lol

[smoky needle]

i mean, it's basic

you can't gain muscle without gaining weight

mucle is physical tissue with mass

all strength athletes are trying to get stronger

so they are in surplus

you probably seen 10.000kcal strongman diet, etc

[gilded flume]

yea

[smoky needle]

they diet only when they are dying from cardiovascular diseases

which is why they weight 200kg in pure muscle

check brian shaw dexa scan

he is at 12% bf at 200kg, unreal

you won't catch that guy maintaining or dieting almost ever

compared to him, i'm super weak

and I also never want to cut

why would I

well i cut now because it's unhealthy, and annoying to carry around

but you get the point

process of getting stronger is trough surplus, bulking, gainign weight

and it's one of the main proofs that you are building muscle

now you try to gain mostly muscle, so your surplus should be small

because fat is usless, unhealthy, decreases athletic performances

nobody wants to be fat

(except sumo people i guess)

even strongman don't want to be fat, because they compete in yoke, running with big ass stones

farmer carries, truck pulls

[gilded flume]

hmm for me proof of building muscle is progressively lifting something heavier

[smoky needle]

where cardio matters

that means you are getting stronger

but yeah, usually strength and mass correlates

you should be getting weight and progressing in gym

[gilded flume]

i only look at strength mass will come in due time if strong and not using dumbass technique

[smoky needle]

you also need surplus and protein

all 3

energy, building blocks, and stimulus

and recovery i guess, but that's automatic

[gilded flume]

i still think big protein is a thing XD

its been rigged from the start bro (put tin foil hat on)

[smoky needle]

plenty of studies, eric helms is one of the names on the biggest meta on the topic

1.6g per kg is referenced everywhere from that point

1.6 is not much tho

[gilded flume]

for optimal growth, not no growth

[smoky needle]

yeah

[gilded flume]

as long as i can see my numbers increasing steadily then i am happy monke

[smoky needle]

maintenance is around 1g

under 0.7g you will be losing muscle, training or not

[gilded flume]

ig i will find out in due time

[smoky needle]

because muscle cells die, and need to be replaced

and there is no protein to be found to replace them

but 1-1.6 is roughly gaining, but optimal growth from >1.6

[gilded flume]

if there comes a time when i see myself not progressing then yeah i'll increase protein

[smoky needle]

ye, when you are beginner it's cheat codes

you can even gain muscle/strength at maintenance

beginners and obese people are two categories that can do that magic

[gilded flume]

i will ping you and say you were right all along :3

[smoky needle]

because you have natural steroids

as beginner

your muscles are so sensitive to stimulus

that's why people can progress so fast

and even gain muscle with improper nutrition

doens't matter how you train

you will improve

simply because it's that op

[gilded flume]

but im not beginner anymore >.>

[smoky needle]

<2 years is beginner

[gilded flume]

according this https://strengthlevel.com/strength-standards i am well into novice and progressing to intermediate

[smoky needle]

it's not exact science

well yeah, beginner/novice is the same category

[gilded flume]

no?

[smoky needle]

research doens't differentiate between them

[gilded flume]

they have different strength standards for beginner and novice

[smoky needle]

ye, that website

but science is not that precise

[gilded flume]

and this is also for 1rm not 3x5

[smoky needle]

it's muddy categories, you know, what someone considers beginner or novice

[gilded flume]

no?

people have weight classes

your progress depends on how much you lift and in what weight classes

[smoky needle]

beginner is not an objetive measurable cateogry

what's a beginner to you?

i might disagree

[gilded flume]

otherwise for me to be considered an intermediate and above i will have to be bulking to obese level for my height

[smoky needle]

there is no commonly used definition

what's a beginner programmer?

people will disagree

[gilded flume]

literally by just strength standards lol

[smoky needle]

you can do that, sure

[gilded flume]

someone who's mastering the fundamentals of programming so things like osdev, compiler dev, concurrency, networking, architecture ect

[smoky needle]

some will base it on strength, some will base it on experience/years

doens't matter

for me <2 years is a beginner roughly

[gilded flume]

i based my programming level of exp like drawing where its how much you know of the fundamentals

[quaint musk]

I think the divide of "beginner, intermediate, expert" is an inherently flawed way to look at it

You only have three buckets

Even if everyone agreed what those buckets were, it's less and less useful the further you get from "week 1"

Also things like "the fundamentals' - what is fundamental, exactly?

Or "core Java" - I was unaware we have a Java subset called "core Java"

[smoky needle]

yeah, they are vague categories

so whatever

but the newer you are to exercise, more sensitive your shit is to stimulus

[quaint musk]

There is only swole and not swole

[smoky needle]

it's like drugs, that first hit is hard to beat

you get desensitized with each exposure

and there is natural limit of muscle you can carry, genetically

doesn't really matter, the point is that the only two categories that can gain muscle tissue in deficit/maintenance are untrained people and obese people

all others need to be in caloric surplus to gain muscle

if you are in deficit, cutting, you are losing weight and losing muscle (small amount)

so that's pretty basic stuff

[gilded flume]

what if effort wasnt there for the 2 years?

[smoky needle]

ye it varies from person to person

it's just a ballpark category

some has been programming <2 years, 2-10years, 10+ years

there is a difference

on average

just for illustrative purposes

[gilded flume]

i think some people can progress a lot quicker within the 2 years to the point where they get to intermediate in 1 year for some definition of intermediate (definitely not me)

[smoky needle]

yep

the variance is huge

[gilded flume]

oh i mean lifting not programming

[smoky needle]

some people get there in few months

good genetics, proper nutirtion, recovery, frequency, volume, intensity

[gilded flume]

for me it helps to keep me grounded and gives me direction for what to learn

[smoky needle]

you can be 4x more effecitve than average person

when you are a tryhard, dedicate your life around getting stronger

but that doesn't matter, irrelevant crap

my point was when you are new, you progress fast, you gain muscle easily

my first year of lifting, i progressed +70kg on bench

my last year of training i progressed maybe 5kg at best

15x slower progress

quite a debuff lol

or well, starting is op

[gilded flume]

yea i understand that, the stronger you get the slower gains in strength

[quaint musk]

Macros on canned salmon are nuts

600 calories, 90g protein

[chrome terrace]

recently i've started biking in a trail just outside my house It's been fun, on the second day of doing it and I am already enjoyinmg the exercise and the connection with nature

I am really unfit, so I cant go for long, but I want to be consistent and get better

[mellow fog]

You'll get better soon.

Keep Up!

I have been going out for a walk nowadays too.

[gilded flume]

Hehe I got neck and quad doms today 🩷

[chrome terrace]

thank you!! I want to, because it's nice connecting with nature

[mellow fog]

Haha, yeah, today I woke up early and went for a walk.😋

[mellow fog]

Don't fully understand it but I'm happy for you.

[chrome terrace]

nice!

I just got back from biking, I try to go a little further every day, might take a break tomorrow and then go again on saturday

[mellow fog]

progressing is fun.

I'll go get some sleep since I woke up early today.

[chrome terrace]

I didnt sleep enough yesterday, just went to bed too late... very silly of me

[chrome terrace]

yeah, and I enjoy it more because my muscles hurt less when actually biking

[mellow fog]

Yeah, it often happens. For me, I am trying to fix my sleep schedule and for that getting physically tired is important or else you don't fall asleep quick even when on bed

[chrome terrace]

that's true

I am a teenager and that makes it worse because when you are a teenager you are supposed to sleep late and wake up late but school doesnt allow for that

[mellow fog]

😂 eh? What books state the rule of such a sleep schedule for a teenager?

I'd say, just go by your heart not by the trend. In the end a healthy body and mind will lead to a bright future.

And I am no one to say such cuz I myself have a broken schedule.

[chrome terrace]

when you are a teenager, your body produces melotonin(which is the thing t hat makes you sleepy) later at night than usual, so you actually need to sleep later and wake up later

my mother is a professional in this stuff, she has a degree and everything and hse knows a lot

[mellow fog]

Woah, never knew that's a thing during teenage.

[chrome terrace]

yeah, it's unfortunately not taught in schools

[mellow fog]

For me it has always been constant, sleeping early because I can't stay awake anymore bwhahaha. And tbh when I am asleep there is nothing that can make me wake up. You gotta jump on my belly to wake me up.😂

[mellow fog]

Yeah. sad.

[chrome terrace]

imma try that, be prepared tonight

[mellow fog]

😭 noo, ion wanna die so soon.

[gilded flume]

glute bridges at the gym today 🤗 🤗

[mellow fog]

Yay!

[quaint musk]

Missed a week from travel + hotel I was staying in only had a treadmill

[gilded flume]

1 more week left on this cut and then im gonna bulk back up to fatty weight 😊

my body craving that improved recovery

[open sluice]

I fasted all 30 days of ramadan and I went to the gym in that time

I lost only 2 kilos but in that month I made an in body

and compared to the in body before that my body fat went from 19.5% to 11.8%

keep in mind I lost 2 kilos

so I lost way more weight but I actually gained muscle too

I think that's good :D

[mellow fog]

Woah! That's crazy dude you went to the gym while fasting.

[mellow fog]

It's indeed a good thing to lose that extra fat in exchange of muscles haha!

[open sluice]

not gonna lie it wasn't hard because I went at Asr time
and when I come back, the sun has already set and it's time for me to eat

but the first day of the gym I actually had to go earlier

because of a gathering of my family and relatives

it's not hard especially when you get used to fasting

[mellow fog]

Oh, I see. What's Asr time?

[mellow fog]

Yeah, you gotta adapt slowly.

[open sluice]

Basically we have 5 prayers and Asr is the afternoon prayer

Maghrib (Evening) is when we break our fast

[mellow fog]

I see, i get it now.

[open sluice]

Ramadan is over now so I get back to my regular meals

[mellow fog]

Well now your muscle growth will boost even more right?

[open sluice]

pretty much because I have a lot more room to eat and get my protein in

also when fasting I don't even drink water so my performance will definitely boost a lot haha

[mellow fog]

Yeah, sounds great! Well Keep Up with em pumps.

[open sluice]

thank you! :D

[open sluice]

wait so if I sleep at 9pm or 8:30pm then am I doing it all wrong? xD

anyways guys today I'm going to try to hit a new leg press PR and possibly a bulgarian split squat PR

[mellow fog]

Aye, I remember you had the OG profile pic with cat, headphones on drinking cola.

[open sluice]

my bulgarian split squat PR was 44kg added weight at 8 reps
my leg press PR was 140kg but honestly this doesn't count because I did 15 reps of 140kg and it wasn't even that hard

[open sluice]

playing CS2 btw if you noticed

I have a friend who has a modified photo of it

[mellow fog]

😂 lol yeah I have seen that one too!

[mellow fog]

No, I didn't. 💀

[open sluice]

the more you know 😂

[mellow fog]

: p lol i lack context most of the time but yeah I am aware why the cat has the hood on. XD

[open sluice]

Anyways what are you up to today for exercising?

[mellow fog]

A walk in the evening. : p

[open sluice]

That's pretty good

I'm training leg day but also I'm going to the free weekly boxing session in my gym for the first time xD

[mellow fog]

Yess!

[mellow fog]

Wow, that'd a bonus treat.

Beat em up!

https://tenor.com/view/despicable-me-minions-cute-boxing-punch-gif-17824676

[chrome terrace]

Well you are a bit different. I am pretty sure it's waht usually happens when you're a teenager, but not every body is the same

[regal jay]

you russian?

[open sluice]

To be fair my sleep schedule has basically been through it all

Basically ive slept at every hour from 8pm to 9am in the span of 4 years 😭

[chrome terrace]

that's not a good thing 😭

[open sluice]

It is not

😭

But alhamdulilah I adjusted my sleep schedule

So I wake up early and sleep early

[open sluice]

Nope

[gilded flume]

why cant i find a pastel pink pullup/dip belt 😭

[quaint musk]

a random old guy at the gym has offered to train me

[open sluice]

old guy?

yeah man you are set for life

these old men may not have the brawns but they got wisdom 🔥

[mellow fog]

https://tenor.com/view/dragon-ball-z-dbz-angry-transforms-muscles-gif-12171358

[quaint musk]

this dude is prepping for a bodybuilding show

[open sluice]

brawns and brains

[smoky needle]

you guys for real

[peak ember]

I go out with my cycle since 3 days from now

[smoky needle]

cute

[oblique hull]

helloo

[smoky needle]

hai

[oblique hull]

what's up coach

i forgot about this channel my bad

i thought it was deleted archived

[smoky needle]

nah, we will always care about fitness, getting healthy and strong in here

at least while I'm admin, that is

[oblique hull]

sure

pretty good

[smoky needle]

so ye, you can post your routine, and we can optimize it

[oblique hull]

now let's get down to business

[smoky needle]

if you want that

[oblique hull]

that's what ive been doing in #chit-chat

Warmup

• treadmill :
  • time: 15 mins
  • speed 5 kmh
  • distance: 0.5 km
  • inclined: 6%
• Leg swinging: x10 each leg
• Lunges x10 each leg
• Bodyweight squats x15
• Plank 40 seconds
• Stepper 100 steps with speed at 1

Body strength work

• Barbell Squat 4 sets :
  • empty bar x1
  • 10 kg x3
• Seated Leg Press 4 sets x10 reps
• Leg Curl: 20kg weight, x3
• Leg extension: 15kg, x3

Cardio

Treadmill for 2 km distance, speed at 6kmh, and inclined 3%

last time was on tuesday (2 hours)

last time I worked on chest, arms, back and belly

today before i enter the gym ive ate the following:

• a small chocolate to start the journey
• 0.5L water
• 2 half-boiled eggs
• sandwitch: sardine, olive oil, chilli sauce, steamed chickpeas, half baguette

during the workout, ive drank around 2L water

after gym, ive ate another half-boiled egg

and drank 0.5L water

what do you think ?

Like I mentioned in chitchat earlier, my main issues are:

• I want to improve insuline resistance in my body since my father, his brother and even my grandfather, all of them had diabete, and I learned that doing body strength workout helps to balance body resistance.
• my belly is big and it makes me look like a pregnant

that's all for now, what do you think guys ?

thanks

[smoky needle]

so for losing weight, you need to be in caloric deficit

you need to eat less than you spend

there are a few ways to do this, but it's the most improtant thing to get right

so that's the first thing you should focus on

on the workout, you can skip the whole warmup section, it's kinda not doing much

you can save a lot of time that way

i generally suggest doing stregth work only

and cardio later, or on other day

not a huge deal, but cardio interferes with strength work

when you do strength work, your muscles are cooked, and they need rest and recovery

and food, protein

last think they need is some crazy cardio session

but I mean, if you enjoy it, it's fine

so basically, your leg day could look like this

do you have any questions so far, do you understand what you need to do nutrition-wise?

[oblique hull]

hold up, if I skip initial warmup, there might be risks to get injured if I jump into machines or benches or whatever

especially at the belly level

[smoky needle]

you warm up for the exercise you want to do

so if you do leg day, you might do squats, SLDL, calf rises

you do 2 warmups for squats, and then you do your working sets

[oblique hull]

alright and how to warmup ?

[smoky needle]

how heavy do you squat, 40kg?

[oblique hull]

i only do 25 for now, on V-Squat

it's difficult

the other Squats machine, have bars, when i use the empty bar i feel it's too heavy already

body squats is easy though

and barbel squats (firs time today) was nice

[smoky needle]

so you can't squat a bar, 20kg?

or it's heavy?

describe me the experience

[oblique hull]

10 kg today and it was exhausting to me

ive started with empty bar

and it was ok

then i ve done 3 sets with 5kg / 5kg

[smoky needle]

how many sets and reps

[oblique hull]

3 sets; 10 reps

[smoky needle]

at 10kg DB or BB

(dumbell vs barbell)

[oblique hull]

barbell

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/tNUq6b5t11Q?feature=share

like this

[smoky needle]

and would you be able to talk during those squats?

[oblique hull]

barely

it was a bit difficult

since it's first time

[smoky needle]

so like breathing heavy

okay

why did you stop at 10, you couldn't do 11?

[oblique hull]

coach told me

i followed his tips

[smoky needle]

ah, if you have a couach, then hopefully they know what they are doing

and listen to them

often they kinda don't, but it's not a big deal

ask him for help with nutrtion

[oblique hull]

he told me to get creatine

monohydrate

but im not sure about it

[smoky needle]

you probably don't need that

what you need is to fix your nutrition

since i'm almost sure it's not good

[oblique hull]

indeed he told me that nutrition is the key

workout is the tool

alright, he didn't specialize what i should eat but i think i know ive done some searching about it

i even reduced eating sugary stuff like wafer, chocolate, and the likes

as for drinks, since 2 weeks ago, i only drink coca cola zero and natural juice

there is a lounge like caffee nearby where i work they make cool fresh drink

but bread here in my country, has drawbacks

[smoky needle]

there are two ways to do this, precise and controlled approach

and kinda more intuitive, easier, less precise, slower approach

both are kinda fine, the most important thing is that you can execute it consistently

[oblique hull]

👍

[smoky needle]

which one you think better suits you?

[oblique hull]

what do you mean by precise and controlled approach ?

[smoky needle]

you would learn about calories, and start counting them

you would calculate your TDE

and then you would create diet at like -500kcal deficit

I can teach you how to do it

it's not hard when you get used to it

but it's annoying to start with it

but has guaranteed precise results

for example I know I will lose 8kg in next 2 months

not 7, not 9

just 8

around 8.4 +- 400g

[oblique hull]

how u do that ?!

[smoky needle]

so to lose weight you need to be in caloric deficit

which means to eat less than you spend

it's energy

let's try to estimate yoru tdee

https://tdeecalculator.net/

so that will calculate how much energy your body requires daily for maintenance

and you do -500kcal, for example, and that's your diet

let me know what the numbers say

[oblique hull]

hold up

[smoky needle]

you made a mistake somewhere

make sure you fill out metric, like weight 80, height 180... and calculate

or gimme the numbers if you are comfortable

[oblique hull]

i think ive done a mistake yes, ive put light exercices rather than moderate

i didn't put anything in bodyfat btw

[smoky needle]

can you give me the numbers

you can dm me or whatever, idc

this is not correct, not sure which values you input

[oblique hull]

oh my bad the height was wrong!

[smoky needle]

yeah, that's better

[oblique hull]

i don't get what these details mean

[smoky needle]

I will explain, no worries

so if you are maintaining weight currently

your are consuming around 3000kcal

[oblique hull]

damn

[smoky needle]

so what you want to do is to be on calorie deficit, diet

let's say 2600kcal

and monitor your weight on a scale

at least once a week, ideally daily

all foods have different amounts of calories

so for example chicken breast is aroudn 140kcal per 100g

rice is 110kcal per 100g

bacon is 600kcal per 100g at least

peanuts are 660kcal per 100g

vegetables are basically free, at like 30kcal per 100g

[oblique hull]

oh boy

then I shall focus on that

vegetables

[smoky needle]

1 apple has like 80 calories

1g of protein and carbs is 4calories, 1g of fat is 9

which is more than double

so you can have same meal, chicken and rice

but if it's prepared in fat, it's much more calories

calories are imo the easiest ones to cut out from your diet

you need want to be on 500-600kcal deficit

[oblique hull]

i see

[smoky needle]

if you eat small bag of peanuts daily, that's 660kcal

fats explode

[oblique hull]

no more nuts

[smoky needle]

nuts are healthy, but in moderation

so you should count calories, your meals

everything you put into yourself

[oblique hull]

i just focus on cashews and almond

[smoky needle]

and aim to get 2400kcal for example

that's your goal for the day, and plan healthy meals that fit into that budget

so 200g of chicken breast is 280kcal and 150g of rice is 160kcal

that's a full plate of food, and 44g of protein

and it's only 440kcal total

if you think of a plate, you should have 1/3 meat, 1/3 carbs, 1/3 veggies

or something similar

i do 1/2 meat on my cats, because i'm on high prot diet

and you want to intake about 2g of protein per kg of leanish body mass

let's say 160g daily

[oblique hull]

https://klipy.com/gifs/confused-cat-math-aint-mathing

this is too much to learn

i appreciate all of those details marko but let's go step by step

what do you suggest me to do today for dinner

[smoky needle]

and with 600kcal deficit, you would be losing around 0.5kg weeky, or 2kg montlhy

[smoky needle]

just try to remember these concepts, and then you can slowly incroporate them

what's your typical dinner?

[oblique hull]

sure, im rereading

[oblique hull]

random

[smoky needle]

search online for calories for all ingredients and add them up

[oblique hull]

sometimes i want something creamy like a small bowl of spaghetti with cheese, sometimes 2 eggs and some sauce

or if I cook something like a rice or couscous

i get 1 dish

[smoky needle]

okay measure out how much spaghetti you put, and how much cheese

and calculate calories

[oblique hull]

sure

im doing reductions

but slowly so i don't feel bad

that's my strategy

[smoky needle]

you have online databses, so you can find nutritional tables for food

you can see this text table on back of all foods you eat

or drinks

that you can buy in the store

[oblique hull]

that's right

im following a bit on those

[smoky needle]

so 100g of cooked spaghetti is 158kcal

if you look at uncooked, on the barilla package or something, it shoud be around 400kcal

so you can measure before cooking, or after

but if you eat half of the package of sphagetti, which is 500g

[oblique hull]

i was dumb

[smoky needle]

250g translates to 1000kcal (uncooked weight)

[oblique hull]

i wasn't reading these before at all

[smoky needle]

yeah, each thing has it

[oblique hull]

it's the time to change

[smoky needle]

these are american, so they don't have per 100g, like european ones

which is confusing, but american people can't do metric

[oblique hull]

I know what i should do from now on

[smoky needle]

this is gauda 100g

you can see it's 356 calories per 100g

because it's fatty

so if you eat half of package of sphagetti + 200g of cheese

that's almost 2000kcal, and you gonna be fat

so what you do is split your budget, you have 2400kcal

your meal should be maybe 600 to 800 kcal max

if you have 3 meals equal sizes

so you either reduce your portion of pasta and cheese, calculate how much you can eat

or you make meals that are better suited for your diet, less fat, more protein

because you also want to intake 160g of prot daily, and you currently probably eat maybe 50

or 100 best case

but you know, you have a lot of freedom to figure out what you will eat, and it will work

you just make sure to take roughly 2400kcal daily, and focus on protein rich foods

since they are needed for muscle, and they are the healtest and most useful macronutrient, epsecially if you are pre-diabetic

if you eat more than 3000kcal, you will gain weight, and become more fat

if you stay around 3k, you will maintain

if you are in deficit, you will lose weight

1kg of fat is aroudn 8800kcal

and every day you are in deficit 600kcal

so means 0.5kg weekly roughly, and 2kg monthly of lost fat

and no muscle loss, because you train and eat protein

consistency is the most imprtant thing, you can have 1 cheat meal in a week, if that keep up your morale

or you can eat a bit more on your sisters wedding

but it's a weekly budget

monthly and yearly thing

so make a plan, and pick food thats are sustainable and realistic

hopefully that's all clear, and you managed to absorb all that info

ask me if something is not clear

[oblique hull]

That’s more that enough ! I guess it’s clear master

Thanks again for taking the time to analyze and answer me

I think about some fasting days

It can help me out reduce the meals number

But also, im going to take closer look at what im consuming

Protein is important i know, i shall focus on veggies

Eggs, meat, fish and some nuts that can enhance it

[smoky needle]

if you are serious about training and strength, protein powders can help a lot

or those milky protein shakes

low calorie pure protein snack

just to help with your training and recovery

and to make sure you do not lose muscle mass while on diet

[oblique hull]

Ah not creatine

[smoky needle]

because reaching 160g of protein daily is not trivial

that's almost 1kg of meat daily, 800g

and other sources have less protein, so depends on your diet, lifestyle.. etc

it can be hard to reach

[oblique hull]

Hmm

[smoky needle]

so you can supplement with whey protein powder

basically 2kg of pure protein, and you can make shakes with fruits or whatever you like

after training

to supplement your diet with bonus +50 prot

it's usually also cheaper than meat, and it's healthy

for me on 220g it's basically a must

but i'm serious about strength sports, and train for years

[oblique hull]

im not in a hurry

[smoky needle]

ye, you figure it out

as a beginner you will improve a lot anyway

[oblique hull]

i prefer to avoid any supplements for now

[smoky needle]

i'm just giving you tips what might help, especially if you want to be more serious about your training

protein powders are just protein isolated, in powder form

from milk

has nothing else, so it's just food

it's nothing weird or unhealthy

[oblique hull]

I see

i'll take a look at the nutrition store nearby

im afraid this will need additional important expenses

which isn't ideal since im not really saving much

im also worried about something, ive heard that good nutrition along with workout requires important amount of money monthly

BTW how much u pay for yourself ?

[smoky needle]

nah that's not really true

i mean, it depends, but healthy food is usually cheaper than unhealthy food

for example rice, potatoes, veggies, chicken

you can make a meal for a whole week for very little money

let's say for 10$, you can have 1 week of lunches

or you can doordash/order food once

if you cook your own meals, you will save a lot

now yeah, I have to eat a bit more because i'm larger, and I have to be on high protein diets

but it's not drastic

depends where you live, and what's your income

if you are barely surviving and can't pay for food

that's a different story i guess

[oblique hull]

nah i have enough for food

[smoky needle]

i think i spend around $100 more monthly because I eat more, and because I require a lot of protein

but, i save like $300 by preparing my own meals, and not ordering food

so eh..

it's pretty cheap and sustainable

i have my own gym in my flat, so I don't pay for gym membership

so I have no additional costs, just a bit more food than average person

and protein supplementation

it's probably the least expansive and healthiest hobby you can have

• you look awesome

• it can be a ton of fun if you find something you like

for me strength training is cool, I genuinely enjoy the process of training, and getting stronger week by week

i mean, i have 2.2m olympic barbel and 200kg of weights, rack, bench, dbs

in very small flat

so what i'm saying, it's obviously worth it for me, otherwise I wouldn't live like this

[oblique hull]

I live in a small flat and can't afford to buy workout machines because they're pretty expensive

in the other hand i like going to gym, cuz i meet people there

[smoky needle]

yeah, of course, almost nobody has a gym in their flat

it's not as expansive as you might think, to get a very basic setup, bar, some weight, bench..

investment is like 2 years of gym membership max, and it last a lifetime

and of course, I don't have fancy machines, and variety of toys

but i don't need them anyway

[oblique hull]

what do you have ?

[smoky needle]

just a bar and 2 db that i can load with same weight

bench and rack obviously

i can do whole body

today is push, so will do some benching, seated overhead pressing, some flys

and tricep overhead extension

[oblique hull]

BTW i debated about something with a friend about how to manage workout, he said that there are 3 things: Push, Pull and Legs

he told me u shouldn't do 2 or 3 at same session

while I agree on not combining legs and arms, but i can do push and pull together ?

and what about belly (abs)

[smoky needle]

you can do whatever as beginner

focus on technique, learn the movements

progressively overload

so each workout +1 rep, or a bit more weight

that's why i asked you if you could do 11

if you can do 16, but you do only 10 reps

you gain nothing

you want to be close to failure

you are goofing around and moving weight without much purpose

you want to be few reps to failure, or even failure

so RIR, reps in reserve 0-3

as a beginner you are mostly learning the movaments in safe way, so it's fine to go easy

just saying for later

[smoky needle]

see, exactly happened what i say happens

i tried to short cut my workout

was benching relatively light, and decided 45s rest in bench was enough for the last set

i wasn't

was going smooth until i hit the wall

and im alone, benching 120kg

that's not ideal

all because i deviated from training and done something slightly reckless

[oblique hull]

woah

you have long journeys

interesting adventure

so i can do push and pull

for example cable lat pulldown, chest press

[smoky needle]

it's not interesting, people die this way

i mean, im experienced, i could've slid the plates

but that would be very inconsiderate to my downstairs neighbours

im soft like a feather

so i just did roll of shame

where you kinda roll the weight down your tummy, and then in yiur lap to deadlift it

but it's kinda scary to get stuck in bench, unable to move weight off you

ofc if you bench alone and aren't prepared, that's suicidal

but the point is, my injury risk increased because i decided 45s is enough, instead of a proper 3-5min break

[oblique hull]

Oh I see, that's crazy. But tell me what u think about what i told u ? !

[smoky needle]

you can do that, yeah

doesn't matter much in your stage

you can do full body in one session

or split it however you want

[oblique hull]

i usually focus on top + abs

or bottom + abs

abs is always a matter for me

i need to fix my belly size

[smoky needle]

training abs does nothing to your belly size

losing weight does

i don't even train abs

[oblique hull]

huh

[smoky needle]

and they are pretty strong

[oblique hull]

u mean it gets fixed automatically?

[smoky needle]

by losing weight, yeah

[oblique hull]

oh great

[lunar shadow]

Yes yes. So folks say.

[oblique hull]

no gym today

https://klipy.com/gifs/spongebob-glass

[smoky needle]

rest day? ^^

rest days are awesome

[oblique hull]

my legs are pretty heavy

[peak ember]

hi chads

i dont do gym

just planning to start a walking routine

1. cycling
2. walking chores

[oblique hull]

https://klipy.com/gifs/sore-spongebob

[peak ember]

remember

[oblique hull]

sounds good

[peak ember]

if legs are heavy then:
  body is weak
  therefore "you can be powerful"

legs feel heavy when you are weak

[oblique hull]

MyWorkout workout = fetchWorkoutByUserId(userId); 

if(workout.legs().hurt()){
  throw new IllegalStateException("legs hurt, consider to rest today, GG");
}
// some code

[peak ember]

at least thats better java than mine

[oblique hull]

im stronnng

[peak ember]

then your high on ego or smthin else

[oblique hull]

im just trying to keep being positive

[peak ember]

ok

exercise your legs more

theyll loose fat

[oblique hull]

ye. my main problem is my belly

i should find a faster way to burn its fat

starting from yesterday, im more cautious with calories

thanks to mister Marko

[smoky needle]

not how that works ^^

yes, it's all about nutrition

[peak ember]

ate healthy food daily, occasionally ate junk food but still skinny.

maybe blame my metabolism

[peak ember]

call him sensei

[oblique hull]

https://klipy.com/gifs/nice-NbA

there is a point i wanted to discuss with u guys

it's true that I'm interested in rebuilding my body, by doing gym workout, and having good nutrition

but that's not all actually ! im interesting in fighting

[smoky needle]

yeah, it's about energy balance, calories

not how much you eat, or food types

[oblique hull]

i want to become a strong fighter, by learning good philosophies or ways of thinking when having an opponent

even though, in case of any opponent, i just want to have the reflexion, and the speed to deal with some possible serious situations

like escaping from a danger or saving someone

do you understand my point?

even since childhood ive been a big fan of strong characters in animes and movies, like Bruce Lee, Jackie chan, Goku (Dragon ball), Spiderman and others

IMO training alone doesn't make sense if it's not employed in something else

[smoky needle]

sure, you can become a fighter as well

[oblique hull]

alright and how ?

i mean what strategy i should follow

for now

[smoky needle]

train for strength and train fighting

[oblique hull]

concurrently?

[smoky needle]

you can do them at the same time

or cycles of strength followed by fighting

[smoky needle]

i mean, by concurrently i mean other day of the week, or later in the day, am and pm

not the same training session

you wanna join mma/boxing club

[oblique hull]

i talked to the manager in gym

they don't have that

but there are some punch bags

[smoky needle]

yeah, it's somewhere else

[oblique hull]

they said , they had it in the past

they added, they're going to add 1-2 punching bags

[smoky needle]

yeah, that's a fine warmup

[oblique hull]

hmm that means i should look for another place

[smoky needle]

but someone has to teach you the fundementals

[oblique hull]

yeah and im old

[smoky needle]

and you have to train it

[oblique hull]

it's gonna cost me more

[smoky needle]

yeah, another place if you wanna be fighter

you should have basic phisical capacity before joining imo

[oblique hull]

ah

[smoky needle]

so lose weight, stick with gym for a bit, until you are fit, kinda strong and kinda well conditioned

fighting is incredibly physically demanding

especially cardio-wise

[oblique hull]

how long

it's gonna cost me more

damn it

[smoky needle]

life is tough

[lunar shadow]

In that case, me boy, better train your ahh to be slim so you move faster.

For that, street works great.

You must be fit more than strong.

To run away, not to fight back. Rule #1 of street fights: you never fight. )))

[oblique hull]

Will use this song during my next gym session

https://youtu.be/cJfNz8csSTk?si=7TkbseqD5sO6j_6-

[lunar shadow]

God forbid someone didn't alienate themselves with music during sport.

[smoky needle]

lately im on ortodox chants

[lunar shadow]

That's actually cool.

[fallow cape]

Gym stats not included

My personal record 😄

[visual cedar]

I use Payday 2 OST as gym music. I kinda like that in songs there is calm phase and active phase, so I can lower or increase speed on my cardio

[peak ember]

guys

my new schedule went too wrong

1. hard to drink hard water,
2. overexhausted,
3. forgot a cap,
4. got chased by dogs

[umbral crag]

Do you live in Detroit?

[drowsy rain]

Back in school I was always running one train station before I actually get on the train on the second station. Was doing that every single day with no excuses. After I finished school and started work(duales-studium) I stopped that discipline for a year. Now I finally got my mind back together and restarted that grind, but now daily 3 train stations(6.8km). First run was yesterday. In like 30 minutes goes the second run

[smoky needle]

based

great way to start your day, if you are into it

[drowsy rain]

Tbf, it sucks... and that's why I do it

[smoky needle]

pain is our friend 😌

[oblique hull]

https://klipy.com/gifs/no-pain-no-gain-workout

[peak ember]

@smoky needle sensei marko, other than my sufferings. I did 10 pull ups on two horizontal poles. both legs on one pole, my hands holding the 2nd pole

[smoky needle]

oh, neat

you couldn't do 11 or 12?

how many sets have you done?

[peak ember]

did more but forgot to count from the starting

[peak ember]

i wasnt in a gym though, that was a park. the poles were for childrens to hang on

i try to make best use

[smoky needle]

ye but could you do one more if you wanted

or 3 more

or you stopped when you couldn't do more?

also how many sets?

you want at least 3

so 3 times 10ish

[peak ember]

yep, but lost the urge to go back there due to that freaking dog

[smoky needle]

right..

[peak ember]

i also did a different pair of pull ups for 6-7 times

[smoky needle]

yeah, those are sets

[peak ember]

like going down and then pulling our head upto the pole

[smoky needle]

first set 10, second 6

[peak ember]

yea like that

[smoky needle]

we write it as 2x10 @60kg for example

[peak ember]

and my body is so skinny that i could already feel my muscles buffing

used to think that i wasnt suitable for this things cz im skinny

[smoky needle]

ye, just make sure you do at least 3 sets, 2 bare minimum

and that you try hard to do as many as you can

also try to find some protein and calories so you can get stronger and bigger

[peak ember]

my parents wouldnt allow, i just wanna do it the normal way

and yeah thats a bit compromizing

but im too young to use one

[smoky needle]

protein is in meat

and a lot of other stuff

[peak ember]

that type of protien i can eat

[smoky needle]

like nuts, legumes

[peak ember]

i thought u talked about the powder

[drowsy rain]

That's something I need to focus on more too. I've been training since im 14, but visually my physic has barely gains

Strength wise on the other hand im very happy with

Guess I'm just eating weird. Like when I want a snack I'm typically just eating randomly a raw tomato or cucumber

I've also heard that visible muscle is harder to achieve as a tall guy(Im about 1.92cm), but I guess I'm just looking for an excuse

[smoky needle]

ye, you want to be in small caloric surplus to be able to gain muscle

and to progress with strength

and 1.6g-2g of protein per kg of body mass

those two are really important

with proper nutrition you will see results fast

[proud flame]

This is my workout

Monday:
10–12 reps of band chest press (floor version)
6–10 pushups
10–12 reps of band shoulder press (stand on band)
20–40 second plank

Tuesday:
10–15 reps of band rows (stand on band, bent over)
10–15 reps of bicep curls (stand on band)
10–15 reps of band face pulls
30–60 second side plank

Wednesday:
10–15 reps of band squats
10–12 reps of Romanian deadlifts
8 each leg of reverse lunges
12–15 reps of glute bridges
10 each side dead bug

Thursday (Recovery):

• Band Pull-Aparts — 15 reps
• Band Pull-Aparts — 15 reps
• Band Face Pull — 10 reps
• Band Shoulder Pass Through — 15 reps
  5–10 minutes of stretching or an easy walk

Friday:
10–15 reps of band squats
10–12 reps of band chest press (floor version)
10–15 reps of band rows (stand on band, bent over)
10 each side dead bug
20–40 second plank

Saturday:
Rest

Sunday:
Rest (or repeat Thursday's recovery routine if you feel good)

And my food:

25 grams from breakfast Huel - 250 calories
15 grams from Greek yogurt - 100 calories
40 grams from lunch huel - 400 calories
20 gram bar - 200 calories
48 gram 2 cups whey with milk - 360
30 grams minimum from Trader Joe’s - 400 calories
15 grams from Greek yogurt - 100 calories

Protein: 193 grams
Calories: 1800

[smoky needle]

woah, pretty cool to see someone take it seriously enough

especially nutritional tracking

[proud flame]

It works pretty well, resistance bands are pretty hard to keep up though

[smoky needle]

also creative, when all you have is a band.. :D

[proud flame]

So I have to do 3x-5x

I push to failure each day so I think it helps

(I also do 5g of creatine in my morning shake)

Genuinely it has changed my life, my diet was SOOOO bad before, and having a supplement in the morning boosts my energy

[smoky needle]

cool stuff

[proud flame]

The protein part kind of sucks though because I weigh 210 so it fricking requires SO much protein

My initial plan is to do resistance bands until my body gets pretty strong, and after I’m going to hit an actual gym. In high school I went straight to a gym and really messed up my tendons

[smoky needle]

yep, it's a whole thing

if you are seriously overweight, you can use your relatively lean body mass